And I18 guess the languages -- you know, as more19 and more languages come in, I assume you20 might not have a person that can speak to21 Iraqi people right on hand, right? How22 do you handle that?23
We don't have that.24 In our office, we have people who speak25 226 4/15/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET1 approximately eight or nine languages.2 We use the language line, as all City3 agencies are required to do, including4 this body.5
And we use the8 language line. And, depending on the9 dispute, there's often neighborhood10 people -- we have contacts in every11 single neighborhoods and in every single12 ethnic community for -- that we can reach13 out to and help us in any way they need.14
I guess15 this is sort of a loaded question, but16 would you say the kind of work you do in17 the end saves the City a lot of money --18
-- because20 people don't have to go to other avenues21 and spend a lot more money and --22
There's no doubt23 that our conflict resolution -- we are24 very successful. With our mediations and25 227 4/15/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET1 all of our conflict resolution, we get to2 issues before they arise and escalate to3 the level of violence.4
If violence never9 happens, how do you quantify something10 that didn't happen? But we do that.11 We also -- by the way, our12 mediators have been intervening more in13 landlord-tenant disputes, including14 subsidized-housing disputes.15 (Timer bell rings.)16
Okay. Where we19 have property managers who now call our20 office and say, "I'm going to give these21 folks one last chance. If you can help22 to resolve this case, it will keep from23 going to landlord-tenant court and being24 evicted and going through all other25 228 4/15/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET1 avenues in our system."2 So we've gone and we've3 successfully mediated a lot of4 landlord-tenant disputes before they even5 got to court.6
And, Madam10 President, that's the first time I got11 buzzed.12 (Laughter.)13 Thank you.14
Councilman19 Greenlee, that's because Charlie20 McPherson likes you.21 (Laughter.)22
And23 congratulations and welcome to the fold.24 I want to ask the question I25 229 4/15/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET1 asked the prior folk that testified. How2 many discrimination cases, both sexual3 and other forms of discrimination, have4 been filed on behalf of City employees5 against their --6
I don't have the7 City employees number. I can tell you --8 I can get that to you.9 You would have to look at if10 they filed with us the, Pennsylvania11 Human Relations Commission, and the EEOC12 directly. When somebody comes to us,13 they dual-file with the EEOC. So I can14 check on that.15 I don't have the numbers exactly16 for the City, but I can tell you the17 overall numbers of the cases that we18 receive.19
And the20 second part of that question, which I21 asked prior, was: Has that number gone22 down over the past couple of years?23 And I harp on that because one24 or two things is true: Either we're25 230 4/15/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET1 getting better at training our workforce2 as to what discrimination actually is,3 what sexual discrimination actually is,4 and maybe that's having a positive5 benefit. Or, the opposite is true:6 We're not doing enough.7 But I would like to look at8 those trends over a period of time to see9 if we're actually kind of engaging our10 staff in a way that's helping them to11 proper behavior as opposed to improper12 behavior.13
Sure. I can get14 you those numbers for the past couple of15 years, and I'll contact the Pennsylvania16 Commission and get them for you as well.17
I would also18 say, are you -- you mediate private19 disputes between residents in the City of20 Philadelphia often?21
Can you give24 us a breakdown of where some of those are25 231 4/15/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET1 by Councilmatic District? because I think2 that there may be a correlation. We're3 getting calls about things that we really4 have no qualification in resolving, one5 neighbor versus another neighbor, and6 they've had a serious situation for7 years, one child versus another child.8
And those10 kinds of interventions and those kinds of11 early interventions can stave off serious12 crimes that are a result of minor, minor,13 minor situations.14
Right. First of15 all, please send all of those cases our16 way; that's exactly what we get involved17 in and what we resolve every single day.18 We resolved 386 neighbor disputes last19 year alone.20 The second thing is, I'm sure,21 like many people who are testifying to22 you, we have a very antiquated computer23 system. I've already been in24 conversations with Allan Frank of DOT to25 232 4/15/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET1 get us a better system.2 I -- we can't run reports based3 on certain criteria. I'd have to go by4 hand to -- I'd have somebody go by hand5 to find out where the cases fall in6 Councilmatic Districts but it's not --7 unfortunately not something that I could8 just push a button on.9 In FY '10, I'll be able to do10 that for you, I promise you. It's very11 frustrating for us as well.12
I should say, you15 know, we get calls and complaints16 throughout the City. There's obviously17 certain areas that we get a little bit18 more, we get more calls. We don't get as19 many -- for example, we get very few20 calls from Roxborough and Manayunk, but21 we'll get a lot from Southwest22 Philadelphia.23
You get fewer24 calls from the 4th District, you say?25 233 4/15/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET1
The other4 thing is, and final point, is that if you5 are finding patterns of discrimination6 with companies, we would like you to7 forward that to the President of City8 Council to distribute to its members,9 because if we're doing business with10 companies that have a pattern of11 discrimination and providing them access12 to our procurement, maybe we should13 cross-reference those cases to make sure14 that there isn't a discrimination problem15 that might preclude them from doing16 business with the City of Philadelphia.17
So cross-19 referencing that with both the EEOC and20 this body would be helpful information21 going forward.22
That's wonderful.23 And they -- I think they'll start coming24 in reverse, as well as Council President25 234 4/15/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET1 Verna already sent a case to us that2 we're investigating, which is -- there's3 been a class action south filed in it4 because it's so egregious.5
Well, that6 information would be helpful to us,7 particularly as we engage companies in8 long-term contractual relationships --9
-- whether11 concessions or services rendered. We12 need to know that kind of information,13 and if they're bad neighbors, maybe we'll14 pass them by.15
You're22 welcome.23 The Chair recognizes Councilman24 Green.25 235 4/15/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET1
Thank you,2 Madam Chair.3 One quick question. Your4 testimony mentions a bunch of different5 revenue sources, reimbursements from6 EEOC, et cetera, but none of that shows7 up in your budget as it -- and your8 budget just shows all money from the9 General Fund. Is there a reason for10 that?11
Oh, our -- we only12 get -- the only source of revenue at this13 current moment -- and hopefully I'll tell14 you something different in a year or15 so -- is from the EEOC, and it goes16 directly to the General Fund.17
So, really,21 this is an unfair characterization of the22 size of your budget because you're23 reimbursed for some of these expenses,24 and it's not reflected in the budget you25 236 4/15/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET1 presented to us. Is that -- in other2 words, you're spending fewer of the3 City's resources than this represents.4 (Mr. Agostino comes forward.)5
Councilmember, if6 you were to read the budget and7 particularly the detail, you will see8 there were a number of departments where9 that has been the case, and not just this10 year, but for years, where they generate11 revenue from a variety of permits from12 fees, L&I being a very good example of13 that. They come into the General Fund as14 departmental revenue. They're broken15 into some detail, the pages are in the16 detail budget.17 So it is not that Rue has done18 anything different than we have done in19 years or is not displaying the budget in20 any particularly transparent way.21
Well, my only22 point was that it's costing us less than23 this shows.24
And my point --25 237 4/15/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET1
And my point is4 that you need to read the budget5 correctly to see that.6
Steve, I read7 the budget; you should be most aware of8 that. And I really, really am tired of9 the tone that you -- and disrespect that10 you approach this body with.11
Madam President,12 in deference to you, I won't respond to13 that.14 Thank you.15
Can we18 finish with this witness, and then maybe19 there could be a little debate afterward.20 Please proceed.21
Very well.22 So I think you testified that23 you have an average annual EEOC24 contribution of $200,000 for the past two25 238 4/15/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET1 years. Why is the expected FY '092 payment so much lower?3
Oh, sorry.6 That was last year's testimony. I'm7 sorry.8
So why is10 this year's payment so much lower than11 last year's?12
Last year, I saw --13 last year's testimony. Last year, we14 didn't receive $200,000. I'm not sure15 why.16
Okay. Last21 year, PCHR testified about its continuing22 effort to qualify for a contract with23 HUD, and so this was last year, and a24 Charter change is required, and we can25 239 4/15/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET1 apply for something called a "substantial2 equivalency" and offset another $120,0003 of the cost of PCHR. Why haven't we done4 this? What Charter change is required5 and how can we proceed with this?6
It's on my agenda.7 I've got an elaborate five-year plan8 myself. In order -- back in the '80s,9 HUD had -- didn't have certain10 requirements in order to work with11 entities like the Human Relations12 Commission in order to reimburse us for13 cases. At some point, they raised their14 standards and said -- I -- my15 understanding is that they then told all16 of the entities, You have four years to17 come into compliance -- come -- raise18 your standards to our level, and then19 you'll be substantially equivalent, and20 you can keep a contract.21 We did not raise our standards.22 It was many years ago. And ever since23 then, I don't know that anybody's taken24 the -- how much of an initiative they've25 240 4/15/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET1 taken on this.2 I've already had some3 discussions with people in the Mayor's4 Office and around, that we are -- it's5 definitely on the agenda. We would like6 to become substantially equivalent. We7 are losing out on HUD funding.8 It's -- when somebody would file9 a claim with us on a housing10 discrimination case, we -- there's is11 almost -- there is very little incentive12 to file with our agency versus the13 Pennsylvania Commission because the14 Pennsylvania Commission can get them much15 higher fines and penalties and damages,16 and we can't. So it's -- they have every17 incentive in the world to go to the18 Pennsylvania Commission.19 It's serious, it's significant.20 We do housing discrimination cases but21 not as many as we would do if we were22 not -- if we were substantially23 equivalent.24
So do you25 241 4/15/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET1 know what Charter change is required?2
I have a memo from3 the Law Department, from their analysis4 in the previous administration, and I'm5 submitting it to this administration to6 make sure that they agree with what the7 analysis was. I don't have an exact8 answer for you.9
It's a -- it's --12 'cause you have to make a State13 legislative change as well.14
Okay. Could15 you -- well, that wasn't reflected in16 testimony last year, but the point is, it17 wasn't your testimony.18
However,20 there's no excuse for a department -- and21 I know you weren't there, but there's no22 excuse for a department not doing --23 taking an action or a simple thing like a24 Charter change that would get us $120,00025 242 4/15/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET1 a year, you know, in this time. Now2 we're past the point where a Charter3 change would be effective in FY '10.4
So let's not6 be here next year and not have saved this7 $120,000.8
I have more11 questions, but I can defer unless there's12 someone else.13
Thank14 you.15 The Chair recognizes Councilman16 Sanchez.17
Thank18 you, Madam Chair.19 Welcome, Rue. Your first20 testimony.21
Going23 along the line of the questioning -- or24 the comments from Councilman Greenlee,25 243 4/15/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET1 let me say on the record how very helpful2 the Human Relations Commission has been,3 particularly in the 7th Councilmatic4 District, the most diverse district in5 the City. And I know Councilman Jones6 appreciates that statement.7 But to the value of the early8 intervention as it relates to changing9 neighborhoods, as the commercial will10 say, it's priceless. And, unfortunately,11 we can't document those types of12 activities and prevention and13 intervention activities.14 But, you know, for the record,15 our office works very closely with the16 Human Relations Commission and17 appreciates the proactive role that it18 takes through our (indiscernible) and19 other community relations activities.20
I wanted22 you, Rue, for the record to speak to the23 Human Relations Commission's uniqueness24 as it relates to other efforts in similar25 244 4/15/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET1 cities, 'cause I think sometimes we2 forget how proactive the City is with the3 creation of the Human Relations. So for4 the record, I wanted you to speak to how5 many other cities, if other cities, have6 similar commissions.7
Thank you. Thank8 you for accolades as well.9 I have to tell you, this is -- I10 have found myself in the greatest job in11 the City. I love it. It's a fantastic12 staff; they're so hardworking and they're13 all incredibly committed to the mission14 and the goals of the PCHR.15 We were actually the first human16 relations commission in the country and17 the first commission -- you know, the18 first city to have it codified -- you19 know, put in our Home Rule Charter, which20 I find historic and significant.21 When I meet with -- the few22 times I've met with various people mostly23 around the region, not around the24 country, for other commissions, I think25 245 4/15/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET1 we're unique in the ways in which we've2 handled some of our community relations3 and outreach. And not every human4 relations commission has an arm that does5 soley the community relations work;6 sometimes they're only doing7 discrimination cases over and over and8 over again. And other times, sadly,9 they've had budgets cuts and had to cut10 that program out.11 But particularly with our12 Dispute Resolution Program, where we're13 actually going out and resolving neighbor14 disputes and resolving some of the more15 significant intergroup tension cases,16 when it's coming race against race or17 ethnicity or various other things, we are18 unique, and we do stand out, and we19 are -- people really see us as, you know,20 the leaders in the community.21 I'll also say -- I should say22 that the Pennsylvania Commission also23 does quite a good job, but they can't24 focus on Philadelphia like we can.25 246 4/15/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET1
Thank you,7 Madam Chair.8 You testified that Human9 Relations Commission is instituting a10 case-prioritization system that will11 allow you to close more cases next year,12 underwent work in a refinement process --13 that's the Community Relations14 Division -- and that the Fair Housing15 Commission has streamlined its internal16 operating procedures.17 Can you describe these internal18 efforts, including whether any of them19 involved the utilization of technology?20
Sure. We are very21 eager to have a new computer system. 4 I've had meetings with the5 members of the EEOC to talk to them about6 their case-prioritization system, and7 we're going to do something relatively8 similar. There are cases that get filed9 with our office, discrimination cases10 that are -- early on show that they're11 great cases, very obvious discrimination12 definitely happened. They would be13 con -- it's a basically an A, B, C14 system, 'cause we considered eight cases15 and should be streamlined as quickly as16 possible. Let's find probable cause; if17 we're going to find probable cause, let's18 get to a public hearing. 22 There's also cases that, pretty23 early on in the case, look like there's24 just nothing there, there's not enough to25 248 4/15/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET1 substantiate discrimination. There might2 be absolutely no witnesses; maybe, you3 know, the person wasn't even working the4 week that he or she said the5 discrimination happened. Those should6 also very quickly be closed on the other7 end. 9 And there would be the B cases10 in between. 18 We do it in a very good job of19 investigating our cases; we're very, very20 thorough. And what I's like to do is21 speed up the agencies a little bit more22 to move them along. 25 249 4/15/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET1 At the Community Relations2 Division, we went through an entire3 retreat process of looking at priorities,4 including -- we currently have the 75 field workers down from approximately 166 just in 2004. 12 So we're in a reorganization13 process of shifting around who's in what14 area and streamlining that. All of the15 internal letters that we do, all of our16 form letters that are going out, they're17 all going redone. There's going to have18 more information on them. There might be19 fewer letters. 24 We're certainly doing more25 250 4/15/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET1 outreach to more communities, especially2 more immigrant communities, to make sure3 that they know of our services. We've4 got our -- all of our brochures5 translated into seven languages, I6 believe. 9 And then, finally, with the Fair10 Housing Commission, we're working --11 we're streamlining that process with more12 legal updates. 25 251 4/15/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET1 Our agency has been working2 without a lawyer for twenty years. And3 as the only lawyer there, with only an4 expertise in landlord-tenant law, we're5 really reaching out. 11
Well, that's12 terrific.13 So can you -- are there any --14 once you go more paperless, eliminate the15 paper forms, will that eliminate data16 entry if people are --17
No, partially18 because our office is -- it's more like a19 little law firm. You know, we have the20 cases -- we have a computer system for a21 case management system; it's just22 antiquated. So there are -- but there's23 a lot of input. Most of the work does24 happen in the case management system.25 252 4/15/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET1
I'd say that we3 definitely -- it just has to be a better4 system.5
Okay. Thank6 you.7 What would the impact -- are you8 -- what's the impact on your department9 if Contingency Plan B goes into effect,10 where the State doesn't approve some11 funding or sales tax increase or pension12 thing? Do you know what kind of cut13 you'd get in Plan B?14
Thank24 you.25 253 4/15/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET1 Are there any other questions2 from members of the committee?3 (No further questions.)4
This8 committee will stand in recess until9 Monday, April the 20th, at 10 o'clock.10 Thank you.11 (Proceedings end at 2:55 a.m.)12 * * *13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 254 C E R T I F I C A T E1 2 I HEREBY CERTIFY that the3 proceedings of the City of Philadelphia4 Council Committee of the Whole are contained5 fully and accurately in the stenographic notes6 taken by me on Wednesday, April 15, 2009, and7 that this is a true and correct statement of8 same.9 10 11 12 __________________________________ 13 JOSEPHINE CARDILLO Registered Professional Reporter14 15 16 17 18 (The foregoing certification of19 this transcript does not apply to any20 reproduction of the same by any means, unless21 under the direct control and/or supervision of22 the certifying reporter.)23 24