COUNCIL OF THE CITY OF PHILADELPHIA2 COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - - -3 Room 400, City Hall Philadelphia, Pennsylvania4 Wednesday, May 6, 2009, 10:33 a.m. 5 Res. 090226 - Revised Five-Year Plan. 6 Bill 090212 - FY 2010 to '15 Capital Program. 7 Bill 090213 - Adopt FY '10 Capital Budget. 8 Bill 090214 - Adopt FY '10 Operating Budget. 9 Bill 090215 - Re increasing amount to be paid in response to certain code violation notices.10 Bill 090218 - Revising Real-Estate Tax Rate.11 Bill 090219 - Revising Rate of Sales and Use12 Tax and Hotel Occupancy Tax. 13 Bill 090220 - Re. Fees Charged by Records Dept. 14 Bill 090221 - Require waste-hauling fees for certain businesses and property owners.15 Bill 090244 - Revising Rate of Sales and Use16 Tax and Hotel Occupancy Tax. 17 COUNCILMEMBERS PRESENT: Anna C. Verna, Chair Curtis Jones, Jr.18 Marian B. Tasco, Co-Chair Jack Kelly Jannie C. Blackwell James F. Kenney19 Blondell Reynolds-Brown Joan L. Krajewski Darrell L. Clarke Donna Reed Miller20 Frank DiCicco Brian J. O'Neill Wilson W. Goode, Jr. Frank Rizzo21 Bill Green Maria Q. Sanchez William K. Greenlee22 - - - V A R A L L O Incorporated23 Litigation Support Specialists 1835 Market Street, Suite 60024 Philadelphia, Pennsylvania 19103 215.561.2220 215.567.267025 2 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441
Good2 morning, everyone. This is a continued3 public hearing of the Committee of the4 Whole. I would ask Mr. McPherson to5 please read the title of the bills that6 will be before this morning.7 MR. McPHERSON: Resolution8 090226, a resolution providing for the9 approval of the Council of the City of10 Philadelphia of a revised Five-Year11 Financial Plan for the City of12 Philadelphia covering Fiscal Years 201013 through 1014 and incorporating proposed14 changes with respect to Fiscal Year 2009,15 which is to be submitted to the Mayor and16 to the Pennsylvania Intergovernmental17 Cooperation Authority (the "Authority")18 pursuant to the intergovernmental19 cooperation agreement authorized by an20 ordinance of this Council approved by the21 Mayor on January 3, 1992 (Bill No.22 1564-A), by and between the City and the23 Authority.24 Bill No. 090212, an ordinance25 3 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 to adopt a Capital Program for the six2 Fiscal Years 2010 to 2015, inclusive.3 Bill No. 090213, an ordinance4 to adopt a Fiscal 2010 Capital Budget.5 Bill No. 090214, an ordinance6 to adopt the Operating Budget for Fiscal7 Year 2010.8 Bill No. 090215, an ordinance9 amending Chapter 10-700 of the10 Philadelphia Code, entitled "Refuse and11 Littering," to increase the amount that12 must be paid in response to certain code13 violation notices to avoid initiation of14 further proceedings, under certain terms15 and conditions.16 Bill No. 090218, an ordinance17 amending Chapter 19-1300 of the18 Philadelphia Code, entitled "Real-Estate19 Taxes," by revising the real-estate tax20 rate, under certain terms and conditions.21 Bill No. 090219, an ordinance22 amending Chapter 19-2700 of the23 Philadelphia Code, entitled "Sales and24 Use Tax and Hotel Occupancy Tax," by25 4 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 revising the rate of tax, under certain2 terms and conditions.3 Bill No. 090220, an ordinance4 amending Section 10-1001 of Title 105 ("Regulation of Individual Conduct and6 Activity") of the Philadelphia Code7 relating to the fees charged by the8 Commissioner of Records by modifying the9 amount of such fees, under certain terms10 and conditions.11 Bill No. 090221, an ordinance12 amending Chapter 10-700 of the13 Philadelphia Code, entitled "Refuse and14 Littering," to require certain businesses15 and property owners either to pay a fee16 for City waste hauling or demonstrate17 that the business or property owner has a18 private provider of waste and recycling19 disposal services, all under certain20 terms and conditions.21 Bill No. 090244, an ordinance22 amending Section 19-2700 of the23 Philadelphia Code, entitled "Sales and24 Use Tax and Hotel Occupancy Tax," by25 5 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 revising the rate of tax, under certain2 terms and conditions.3 (Witnesses come forward.)4
Good5 morning, Mr. Armbrister and Mr. Dubow.6 Good morning. Please identify yourself7 for the record.8
Good morning,9 Council President. I'm Clarence10 Armbrister, Chief of Staff to Mayor11 Nutter. And I'm here this morning to12 present testimony on behalf of the13 Administration's proposed revenue14 changes.15 As a part of the plan to16 balance the FY '10 budget and the FY '1017 through '14 Five-Year Plan, the18 Administration proposes two temporary tax19 increases. The Administration proposes a20 temporary increase of the City's portion21 of the sales tax from 1 percent to w22 percent for three fiscal years, FY '10,23 FY '11, and FY '12. The effects of the24 sales tax rate in Philadelphia will,25 6 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 therefore, rise from 7 percent to2 8 percent for those three years. And3 beginning in FY '13, the sales tax rate4 will revert back automatically to5 7 percent.6 Our revenue projections show7 that this temporary increase will8 generate $341.7 million in revenue for9 the General Fund.10 The Administration also11 proposes a temporary increase in the12 City's portion of the property tax. We13 propose a temporary increase of 16 mills14 for FY '10 and a 12 mill increase from15 the FY '09 level for FY '11. The rate16 will increase from 82.64 mills to 98.6417 mills for FY '10 and decrease to 94.6418 mills for FY '11. Beginning in FY '12,19 the property tax rate will revert back to20 82.64 mills.21 Our revenue projections show22 that this temporary increase will23 generate $271.6 million in revenue for24 the General Fund.25 7 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 The Administration also2 proposes fee increases in certain3 departments. The Streets Department4 requests a commercial trash fee.5 Currently, approximately 15,000 small6 businesses receive City trash collection7 at no cost. These businesses will pay a8 $500 fee each year, generating $7 million9 in revenue for the Streets Department.10 The Streets Department is also11 requesting an increase in the initial12 fine for a code violation notice from its13 original fine of $25 to $50 per citation.14 This original fine was enacted in 1986,15 over 20 years ago. Correcting for16 inflation, $25 in 1986 equates to about17 $13 today, which is hardly a deterrent to18 comply with the laws as stated in the19 Philadelphia Code.20 The Records Department is21 requesting a fee increase of $30 for22 every document recorded in the23 department. This $30 fee increase will24 enable the City to ensure that the25 8 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 document recording fees accurately2 reflect the City's cost of document3 recording and ongoing support. The4 Records Department estimates that this5 will generate another $2.4 million each6 year for the department.7 I'm joined at the table by8 Finance Director Robert Dubow and Budget9 Director Steve Agostini, and we'll be10 happy to answer any questions that the11 Council may have regarding my testimony.12 And I look forward to working with the13 Council on the FY '10 budget and the14 FY '10 through '14 Five-Year Plan.15 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:16 Mr. Armbrister, I see that we have17 testimony before us from Miss Tolson.18 May I suggest that she come up and read19 her testimony.20
And22 then Joan Decker.23 And then if there are any24 questions regarding any of them, then we25 9 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 could address them.2 (Witness comes forward.)3
5 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Good6 morning. Good morning, Council President7 Verna and members of Council. I'm8 Clarena Tolson, Commissioner of the9 Streets Department, and I'm here today to10 present testimony on behalf of the11 department in support of Bill No. 12 This bill point amends Chapter13 10-700 of Philadelphia Code, "Refuse and14 Littering," to increase the fine to be15 paid for violating various City codes16 relating to the creation and17 proliferation of litter on our streets18 and sidewalks and throughout our19 neighborhoods. 24 Litter is a major threat to25 10 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 neighborhood appearance and2 sustainability. Our city must not allow3 litter to become an acceptable and4 tolerated behavior, and we must take5 proactive measures to eliminate it before6 it is allowed to grow into a more serious7 condition, leading to blight and8 neighborhood decline. 12 In FY '09, funding was13 increased for additional SWEEP officers14 to help meet these goals by increasing15 both education and enforcement of the16 laws prohibiting the behavior and17 conditions that create and spread litter18 on our streets. The Streets Department19 issued 26,746 litter-related code20 violation notices in FY '08, and 4021 percent of the total citations issued by22 the Streets Department. 24 For FY '09 through November,25 11 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 the Streets Department wrote and issued2 13,662 littering-related code violation3 notices, about 30 percent of the total4 citations issued to date. 6 The proposed amendment7 increases the initial fine from its8 original $25, enacted over 20 years ago,9 to $50 per citation. 13 The Streets Department's14 uniform enforcement unit known as SWEEP,15 which stands for Sidewalk, Education and16 Enforcement Program. 20 With a small force, SWEEP21 officers patrol the entire city and not22 enforce not only litter laws but also23 laws and regulations regarding recycling24 and rubbish collections, litter baskets25 12 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 and the use of rubbish and construction2 Dumpsters. 6 Some may disagree, but we all7 believe that our efforts are making an8 impact in the fight against the9 proliferation of litter on our streets10 and in our neighborhoods. 21 The Streets Department is also22 in the process of acquiring electronic23 handheld units for writing and issuing24 code violation notices. The devices will25 13 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 provide many benefits to the issuing2 officer, including property ownership3 information, enforcement history, and4 data-entry safeguards to prevent entry5 errors. Data entry via these devices6 will also improve upon the current manual7 system that contributes to excessive8 delays before citation recipients receive9 official notices. 16
I'm17 sorry? You have two bills?18 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Yes.19
Would20 you testify on the other, please.21 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Surely.22 Again, I'm here to testify with23 regard to Bill No. 090221, an ordinance24 amending Chapter 10-700 of the25 14 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 Philadelphia Code. This bill amends2 10-700 of the Philadelphia Code by3 authorizing the City to assess a fee for4 City refuse for small commercial5 establishments that qualify under the6 Streets Department regulations for refuse7 and recycling collection services.8 The Streets Department9 currently provides curbside collections10 of rubbish and recycling to approximately11 550,000 households on a weekly basis.12 The Department also collects refuse from13 commercial properties that meet the same14 residential household setup requirements15 of weights or volume, the type of waste16 generated, and the number of receptacles17 placed out for collection.18 These properties, located along19 residential collection routes as well as20 neighborhood commercial corridors, are21 typically small stores, retail22 businesses, and professional offices.23 While the fee is a departure from the24 longstanding policy of allowing25 15 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 commercial properties to receive the same2 curbside collection services as3 residential properties at no charge, we4 believe that the proposed fee represents5 only a modest charge that still offers a6 less expensive alternative to the7 private-collection services that most8 businesses in the City must secure.9 The proposed amendment would10 assess properties, housing, and small11 commercial establishments that qualify12 for City collection under the Streets13 Department regulations at an annual fee14 of $500 for the curbside collection of15 rubbish and recycling. The proposed fee16 approximates a unit cost to the City for17 providing this service.18 The Department, with the19 assistance of the Bureau of the Revision20 of Taxes, the Revenue Department, and the21 Department of Licenses and Inspections,22 has identified approximately 22,00023 properties with at least one commercial24 establishment and also meeting the25 16 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 Department's guidelines for eligibility2 for curbside collections.3 It is further estimated that4 about 15,000 of these properties are now5 being serviced with City curbside6 collection of rubbish and recycling at no7 charge.8 The total revenue generated9 from this service is estimated at10 approximately $7 million annually. The11 Department has been incurring these costs12 while providing collection services to13 commercial properties throughout the14 City.15 While the Streets Department,16 like every other City agency, has made17 significant cuts to many of its services18 during these difficult times, this is one19 service this can by sustained by20 assessing this fee, thus avoiding a major21 degradation of service to our business22 community.23 With the successful24 transformation to weekly single-stream25 17 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 recycling and such innovations as2 solar-powered litter and recycling3 receptacles and incentive-based4 recycling, the Streets Department has5 succeeded in making great strides towards6 the Healthy, Sustainable Communities7 championed by the Mayor.8 The progress is evident in both9 the residential and commercial10 communities despite the current economic11 challenges. And despite those12 challenges, approving this fee will allow13 this progress to continue and to propel14 this great city to even greater and15 greener heights.16 Thank you very much.17
Thank18 you very much.19 We will now hear from the20 Commissioner of the Department of21 Records.22 (Witnesses come forward.)23
Good24 morning welcome. Please identify25 18 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 yourself for the record.2 COMMISSIONER DECKER: Good3 morning. My name is Joan Decker, and I4 serve as the Records Commissioner.5 Well, good morning again,6 Council President Verna and members of7 Council. I'm here today to ask for your8 support for Bill No. 090220, which9 requests an increase for the recording10 fees collected by the Department of11 Records. The Department requests a fee12 increase of $30 for every document13 recorded. This $30 fee increase will14 enable the City to ensure that the15 document recording fees accurately16 reflect the City's cost of document17 recording and ongoing support.18 Recording fees are not a19 regularly-recurring charge that citizens20 will face, and the recording fee increase21 represents a very small portion of the22 total settlement and closing costs.23 Since most individuals do not submit24 deeds and mortgages and other land25 19 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 records for recording more than a handful2 of times, the financial impact of this3 fee increase on the individual is4 minimal.5 To provide an example of the6 cost impact of the requested fee7 increase, the current fee to record a8 deed is $156.50, and the cost to record a9 mortgage is $126.50. If the requested10 increase is approved, the new fee to11 record a deed will be $186.50 and the fee12 to record a mortgage will be $156.50.13 Direct and indirect recording14 costs have increased since the last15 recording fee increase, which occurred in16 2005. An accounting of the current costs17 incurred for recording documents was18 prepared, and those costs were projected19 to include over a five-year period20 resulting in a $30 increase.21 This requested fee increase22 will enable the City of Philadelphia to23 cover the cost of recording a document24 and provide for the maintenance of the25 20 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 infrastructure that supports the2 recording function.3 Thank you for your support.4
Thank5 you.6 The Chair now recognizes7 Councilman Jones.8
Thank you,14 Madam President.15 Just a question for the Streets16 Commissioner.17
Why18 don't you just sit up front here,19 commissioner. Commissioner, just sit up20 front so that you will be readily21 available.22
Thank you.23 Commissioner, your testimony24 indicates that a request is for an25 21 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 increase from $25 to $50 for code2 violation fines?3 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Yes.4
Why are we5 going only to 50? Why aren't going to a6 rounder number of 100 or so, which would7 generate more revenue and, I think, be8 more of a deterrent for the actions of9 some of these folks that think that the10 City streets are their trash basket?11 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: I agree12 with you that these types of violations13 are very, very important, and we do need14 to deter the behavior that is at hand. I15 think that we tried to provide some16 balance for the level of the ticket.17 Certainly people don't -- if18 they proceed through a process of19 nonpayment or a processing with their20 violations, the fines are higher, but we21 thought that initial base of $50 was a22 reasonable amount to start with.23
I would24 urge you to consider it at a higher fine,25 22 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 but if that's the process you'd like to2 follow, that's fine, but I think a3 hundred dollars is a much more rounder4 figure, a much more identifiable figure,5 and may be more of a deterrent the.6 Other thing is, I would like to7 know what your SWEEPS people have written8 in the way code violations for the9 deposit of household trash in commercial10 corridor trashcans. We recently -- or11 last year raised the fine to $300 for the12 deposit of the little "presents" that13 people who live in apartments or live in14 surrounding houses like to leave in15 commercial shopping strips.16 As a matter of fact, the one17 shopping strip in South Philly had to18 recently remove their street-level19 trashcans because of the overflow of20 household trash that gets put in there on21 a daily basis.22 So could you give me, not today23 necessarily, but a report how many fine24 have been written and where they've been25 23 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 written at.2 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Yes.3
'Cause I4 really think that that -- if we started5 down that road, that practice would stop.6 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Yes.7
Okay?8 Thank you.9 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: And10 wanted to say I thank you and I11 appreciate your leadership relative to12 that matter because it is a big problem.13 The abuse of litter baskets is a travesty14 because where we need litter baskets,15 sometimes we can't have them because16 they're abused by residents in apartments17 or in homes. And the people who live18 near to cans have to live with the smell19 and the odors and the vermin that may20 result.21
And you can22 respond to me after the budget process is23 over. I know you're busy. So thank you.24
The25 24 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 Chair recognizes Councilman Green.2
Thank you,3 Madam Chair.4 Miss Tolson, I understand that5 CLIP people write some of these fines for6 trash and things like that; is that7 correct?8 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: We have9 SWEEP officers that work with CLIP.10
Okay.11 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: So they12 are Streets Department officers who are13 working with the CLIP Program.14
Okay. I15 just wanted to make sure, if we provide16 additional revenue, that, you know, we17 can be assured that CLIP is going to18 continue in the next fiscal year.19 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Yes. Our20 officers continue to write tickets across21 the entire City, including the areas22 where CLIP may be providing a service as23 well, so we support them however we can.24
Okay. And25 25 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 as Councilman Kenney said, you can get2 this back to me after the budget process,3 but I'm very interested to know how much4 revenue is associated with the activities5 of CLIP in terms of fines they write, to6 get a sense of how much they're paying7 for themselves and whether there's8 something we can do to sort of help that9 flow.10 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: We can do11 that, yes. Thank you.12
Thank16 you, Madam President.17 Good morning, Commissioner.18 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Good19 morning.20
In21 theory, I understand why we want to do22 this, but in practice, I have a serious23 concern because of our current process24 when people wants to appeal these. And25 26 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 particularly, in my district, as you2 know -- and I must thank your department3 for working with me on the equitable4 distribution of public trashcans5 throughout the City, but I'm concerned6 about people's ability, particularly7 seniors, to appeal a ticket that is given8 to them because of their neighbors or9 other folks.10 Right now, the Bureau of11 Adjudication is the only place they can12 go. And we have been very unsuccessful13 other than people taking the time to come14 down and appeal them and appealing15 particularly at bus stops, where people16 cannot control the fact that they live in17 front of a bus stop.18 So, in theory, I understand19 where we're going around changing20 behaviors. But, as you know, in my21 particular district, there's not a22 equitable distribution of public23 trashcans.24 So what are we going to do to25 27 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 ensure that when people need to appeal2 them because it's not their trash?3 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: We work4 closely with the Bureau of Administrative5 Adjudication, which handles all appeals6 and reviews of tickets.7 In our writing of tickets,8 tickets are written when people, what we9 call, abuse a litter can, and it's not10 just because there's a litter can in11 front of someone's house that has12 household rubbish, but that bag of13 household rubbish in the can has14 something that's connected to that house.15 So oftentimes, we find people16 who say that though they don't feel like17 they abuse the can, from time to time,18 they take out their trash at night and19 put it in the litter cans because they20 know the litter cans are collected daily21 versus trash being collected weekly.22 So, if a can is in front of23 somebody house and it's overflowing, that24 homeowner would not receive a violation25 28 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 for the litter or because the can's2 overflowing. However, should there be3 trash in the trashcan that is household4 rubbish, you know, they may have their5 mail in there or some other things that6 identify them, then that person would7 receive a violation.8 And anybody else who -- not9 necessarily the adjacent property owner,10 but anybody else who has materials in11 there.12
But how13 are we going to make the appeal process14 easier? We have not been successful in15 any of our appeals when we've tried to16 assist folks.17 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Right.18 The appeal is handled through the19 finances of the agency called the Bureau20 of Administrative Adjudication, as you're21 aware, so that that portion of the22 process, I'm really not quite the best to23 answer that, and maybe our Finance24 Director can answer it.25 29 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441
Rob Dubow.2 The Commissioner's correct.3 That's handled through the Office of4 Administrative Review, which is in5 Finance.6 This issue is new to me. I'd7 be happy to sit down with you and talk8 about, you know, what the problem is and9 think about how we can try to solve it to10 make that more --11
I guess12 my problem is, I still don't have an13 equitable distribution of public14 trashcans, and I understand the issue15 around the can and stuff.16 But I'll give you -- even in my17 own home, I'm in front of a church. We18 have a wind mail, and every single day19 when I come home, I have to pick up some20 trash. It's not my trash; it's in front21 of my house. I've gotten several22 tickets, which I pay, because it's easier23 than trying to go down there.24 I'm very concerned because,25 30 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 again, in our appeals, even when we've2 done written appeals for seniors and3 stuff, we have not been successful, so4 I'm really reluctant to -- while in5 principle, I agree on this -- to support6 this because $50, in my district, is a7 lot of money.8
Right. I9 understand your issue and would like to10 be able to work with you to figure out a11 way to make that appeal process more12 meaningful so that, you know, you don't13 say "We never win."14
And, you15 know, with the recyclables -- and if16 Councilwoman Krajewski was here, she17 would give you the story. She doesn't18 have a lot of recyclables so she puts19 them in her neighbor's recycling can, and20 she gets cited, and we were having this21 discussion the other day.22 Again, we have seniors -- I23 have a lot of seniors who have very24 limited trash or are not able to take25 31 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 care of the fronts of their houses. And2 so, that's a concern when we're doing at3 50 when we haven't kind of figured out in4 some of these cases.5 And I'm all for this. I think6 we have to change behavior. You know, I7 have the largest litter index in the8 City, I have to own it. I just feel like9 doing that, without us really looking at10 all this stuff, when we're doing all the11 other fees and all the other increases,12 it's hard for me to support at this time.13
Madam17 President.18 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:19 Councilwoman Tasco.20
I think21 it's important that -- the issue about22 cleanliness and the trash is very23 important.24 And I understand where the25 32 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 Councilwoman is coming from. I live on2 the corner, and every day I come home,3 there's trash in front of my house. It's4 not my trash.5 And so, your comments about6 people changing their behavior and being7 responsible for their trash -- I pick it8 up because it's in front of my house.9 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Yes.10
But I11 don't want to be cited because I'm not12 responsible for the trash. It comes from13 whoever is passing the house and decides14 to throw a bottle out or throw a15 McDonald's bag out or something, but I16 pick it up.17 What we need in this city --18 and I've said this before -- is a19 campaign about litter. We're fining20 people but we're not trying to change21 their behavior through a sense of, Let's22 keep Philadelphia clean.23 When Ladybird Johnson wanted to24 keep the people from littering in the25 33 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 '50s or whenever they were -- and2 planting flowers, they went on a 'Let's3 Stop Litter" campaign all across the4 country, and it really got to people5 that -- it made them think if I -- "I6 don't really want to throw this down7 'cause my thing is to help America be8 beautiful."9 So we and the Administration10 have relationships with businesses and11 maybe some companies that can help12 contribute to a massive campaign, 'cause13 you are not going to fine your way out of14 keeping the City clean; that's not going15 to happen.16 You're just going to get more17 tickets and then maybe from the tickets18 you write, you can do a publicity19 campaign about trash and litter and20 keeping Philadelphia clean. And then21 once we do that, and you try and change22 the behavior that way, but you're not23 going to change the behavior by fining24 people, 'cause you haven't done it yet.25 34 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 There's still trash.2 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Correct.3
Thank you,7 Madam Chair.8 This is -- I have just about9 three or four questions for the Finance10 Director.11
Councilman16 Green, I've asked the Streets17 Commissioner not to leave because I have18 a question for her.19
Thank you.22 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:23 They're going to remain until the hearing24 is over.25 35 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 Councilman Green.2
Thank you,3 Madam Chair.4 By way of background of these5 questions, it's my understanding that6 we're going to try to get a budget out of7 Council not this Thursday but next8 Thursday, and we have a number of9 questions that I think are important to10 have answered prior to our doing that;11 otherwise, at least in my view, we have12 to make educated guesses on our own, and13 the Administration are really the people14 with the information that's necessary in15 order to allow us to make informed16 decisions.17 So on April 14th, President18 Verna asked, during the Finance19 Department's testimony: Of the 5820 percent of the budget the Administration21 says is non-discretionary, please provide22 a chart showing how much has been cut23 from this part of the budget since July24 '09.25 36 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 Is that chart available?2
Okay, great.5 We asked for -- I guess, on the6 7th of April, we asked for specific7 detail regarding contingency Plan B cuts,8 including cuts from savings, cuts in9 every department, what's going to be10 closed, et cetera, for every department.11 Are we expected to get that12 information shortly?13
I thought what we14 said about Plan B was -- actually, we15 gave -- yeah, we gave you -- there was16 the items that were in the Five-Year17 Plan, there was the testimony that every18 department gave, and I think that was19 what we talked about how we were going to20 handle the Plan B.21
Most22 departments came before us and said that23 they knew that they had Plan B cuts, but24 didn't know what they were. For example,25 37 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 Health didn't know what health center was2 closing; Records didn't know how they3 were saving 2.4 million. And I could go4 through every department.5 So what we're asking for is6 exactly what are the Plan B cuts,7 including savings from cuts, personnel8 impact, impact on other budget classes,9 impact on other service delivery -- for10 every department.11
We can go back and12 look at the departments that didn't13 answer those questions during their14 hearings and get you the information.15
Okay. I'm16 not aware of any department that's17 provided a full answer to that question,18 and I do think we need that prior to the19 callbacks on the 11th.20 Councilman Kenney, on the 14th21 of April, asked for a chart showing the22 number of homeowners that would be23 impacted from different alternatives with24 respect to taxes, and I'm also interested25 38 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 in that chart.2
That's5 great.6 We have sent this to your7 office. We'll send another updated copy8 today and will look forward to working9 with you on this after we get answers to10 questions.11 Thank you very much.12
Thank13 you.14 The Chair recognizes Councilman15 Clarke.16
Thank you,17 Madam President.18 I actually had a question for19 the Records Commissioner, and maybe, I20 don't know, Mr. Dubow may need to stay21 up. It's somewhat of a policy issue.22 (Commissioner Decker returns to23 witness table.)24
Good25 39 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 morning.2 COMMISSIONER DECKER: Good3 morning.4
I just had5 a question, and I actually think I6 mentioned it in earlier testimony, about7 the recording fees and the understanding8 that a portion of the recording fees was9 to go in earlier agreements,10 arrangements, or -- I don't know, I11 thought it was legislation, but12 apparently not.13 That in this particular14 increase, it's my understanding that the15 increased portion will not go to -- none16 of that will go to the Affordable Housing17 Trust Fund?18 COMMISSIONER DECKER: That's19 correct. The original legislation really20 was passed in two parts. One was a State21 legislation, then it was followed by City22 implementation and legislation, but the23 original legislation provided for the24 establishment of the fund from the25 40 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 recording fees.2
Right.3 COMMISSIONER DECKER: But that4 no further increases -- it would not be5 automatic. The legislation did not6 provided for an automatic increase in the7 portion that goes to the Housing Trust8 Fund when a recording fee is increased.9 That's correct.10
But, I14 mean, wasn't it an agreement?15 COMMISSIONER DECKER: It was16 actually formal legislation passed both17 by the General Assembly and --18
I19 understand that. And the advocates were20 essentially the primary moving force21 behind getting the legislation passed,22 and I thought this was a cooperative23 agreement that put us in a position to be24 able to provide that opportunity for the25 41 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 Affordable Housing Trust Fund.2 And now, we've going to3 increase that fee, and, to my4 understanding, there has been no5 discussion with the advocates. And we6 just essentially raise the fee, which I'm7 not opposed to.8 But if we had an earlier9 agreement that a position of that would10 go to the Trust Fund, I would think that11 any expansion of that program, since the12 advocates were the primary moving force13 in actually getting it implemented, at a14 minimum, there should have been a15 conversation. And from my perspective, a16 percentage of that increase should17 actually go to the Trust Fund, not to18 mention the fact that the amount of money19 is dwindling dramatically.20 COMMISSIONER DECKER: Yes, I21 understand, Councilman, but I --22
And that23 probably wasn't your call, I understand24 that.25 42 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 COMMISSIONER DECKER: Right.2
That's why3 I said Mr. Dubow probably should stay at4 the table.5
Right. I6 understand your point. We would need a7 change in State law to do that, to have8 a -- the State law that was passed with9 the increase --10
-- set the amount12 that would go into the Housing Trust13 Fund.14
I think it was an17 amount, wasn't it?18 COMMISSIONER DECKER: It was --19 yes, that's correct. It was equal to20 whatever the recording fee at that time21 was.22
It's a fixed rate25 43 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 in the legislation as opposed to a2 percent.3
So what's4 the rate?5 COMMISSIONER DECKER: It was6 equal to the recording fee at that point7 in time.8
Right. Yeah, so it9 was -- right, the fee that was put in10 place when that legislation was passed.11 So that's $72, I think?12 COMMISSIONER DECKER: That's13 correct.14
We did not have25 44 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 those discussions.2
You know, I7 --8 (Indiscernible; parties talking9 over each other.)10
We need11 revenue, but we also -- I mean, a part of12 what our mission is to provide affordable13 housing opportunities.14
So, if16 we're going to increase the amount, I17 would like to think that a percentage of18 that should go towards affordable19 housing.20
Our General23 Fund is important, but that can't be our24 only mission in life.25 45 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441
And we do4 have a lot of people that need to have5 some --6
Right. And if we7 did take a portion of this increase and8 move it to the Housing Trust Fund, we9 would have to find some other revenue to10 replace it or expend it through --11
Well, I12 understand that. I mean, but had that13 conversation happened early on in the14 process, we would have accounted for15 that.16
And you18 think we definitely need State19 legislation to authorize any additional20 --21
All right,23 okay. I would like to revisit that24 later, 'cause I want to, you know -- all25 46 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 right. Thanks, thanks. That answers my2 question though.3 Thank you.4
Thank7 you, Madam Chair.8 Commissioner Tolson, just9 quickly. I don't want to belabor the10 point of the trash violations, but I11 think Councilwoman Sanchez raised a good12 point, and I support this bill, and I13 think Councilman Kenney's idea of even14 making it stronger makes sense.15 But I wonder if there's any16 kind of -- Councilwoman Tasco talked17 about education of the public -- sort of18 an education of the enforcement officers19 to, in the sense of, if someone lives,20 like, right at a bus stop or maybe a21 couple doors away from a restaurant that22 has a lot of takeout, is there any23 thought to -- do the officers consider24 that when they look at -- like, if you25 47 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 live two doors from a McDonald's and2 there is -- you happen to walk down at3 2 o'clock in the afternoon and there's4 McDonald's wrappers on somebody's5 sidewalk, it seems to me that it doesn't6 take a lot of intuitive thinking to7 realize that that -- probably somebody8 dropped it on the way by, and that person9 may not have gotten home yet, you know?10 You know where I'm going with this?11 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Yeah.12
I'm just13 wondering if there's any thought of that,14 'cause I hate to see people just get15 fined because they haven't gotten home --16 you know, they're working all day and17 they haven't gotten home in time to clean18 their pavement, if I'm making sense.19 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: We are20 sensitive to that issue, Councilman.21
Uh-huh.22 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Our23 charge is that we also have so many24 people who are insensitive to the fact25 48 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 that they're responsible for their2 properties.3
No, I4 hear you.5 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: And most6 of us who are sweeping up litter are not7 sweeping up our own litter, we're not8 making it.9
Mm-hmm.10 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: But we do11 have those in our communities who don't12 care about the environment, who would13 choose to just throw their debris14 anywhere.15
Mm-hmm.16 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Or people17 who have properties who choose not to18 pick up ever. You know, the newspaper19 circulars that, you know, are -- you20 know, three months' worth of circulars21 are on the sidewalk.22
Right.23 And I'm okay with all of that.24 I guess what I'm thinking of --25 49 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 and you raised it -- is something like2 the extent, if you see something, like3 the example I gave of the McDonald's bag,4 is maybe to come back the next day or two5 days later and see if it looks like the6 same kind of refuse is there, you know?7 I just hate to see people get8 fined because, you know, obviously, they9 can't be looking out their door or even10 home every waking moment, you know.11 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: You're12 actually --13
Like, if14 you see 18 pizza menus sitting on the15 step, obviously, the people haven't been16 paying attention for quite a while, but17 if you see a bag from a Chinese takeout18 restaurant or a McDonald's sitting there,19 isn't it kind of reasonable to think,20 well, maybe that person hasn't had a21 chance to get to it yet because maybe it22 was dropped today and they're working or23 something. You know what I'm --24 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: That25 50 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 level of litter would not usually warrant2 a --3
Okay.7 'Cause I do know somebody in my area who8 lives close now -- he's deceased, so9 doesn't get it anymore, and I haven't10 heard from other neighbors. But he was11 an older guy and sometimes he just12 couldn't get out in time.13 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Mm-hmm.14
He lived15 close to a very high-volume Chinese16 restaurant. And, you know, it was a17 constant problem for him. And, you know,18 and he did clean a lot, but there were19 times -- and it didn't seem like20 sometimes -- and this is a while ago when21 the officers wrote the ticket that. You22 know, it seemed like they were not giving23 him a lot of time to clean up -- or not24 realizing his situation.25 51 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 I'm not saying they were2 supposed to know he was a senior, but3 anybody, just a homeowner.4 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Right,5 right.6
So that's7 the only thing I'm getting at. And8 you're saying that a little bit will not9 generate a ticket anymore?10 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: That's11 correct.12
'Cause it13 did at one time, but maybe --14 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Well, we15 will -- I will certainly take this back16 and try to look at reinforcing and17 reeducating the officers.18
Okay.19 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: 'Cause I20 think that there's always an opportunity21 to, you know, resensitize them to issues22 at hand and the job that they have at23 hand.24
Right.25 52 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 And I know -- I'm not trying to be2 critical. I think most of the violations3 are good violations, they should be4 written, but I do hear this occasionally,5 and Councilwoman Sanchez gave the example6 of living near a bus stop, and there is a7 problem for the homeowner too, you know.8 COMMISSIONER TOLSON:9 Absolutely.10
All11 right. I appreciate it.12 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Or the13 windy side of the street.14
Pardon?15 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Or the16 side of the street that receives the --17
Yeah,18 wherever the wind blows, right, exactly.19 All right, thank you.20 Thank you, Madam Chair.21 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:22 You're welcome.23 The Chair recognizes Councilman24 Jones.25 53 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441
Thank you,2 Madam President.3 Commissioner Tolson, I think4 it's safe to say that the reality for5 most taxpayers in the City of6 Philadelphia, when it comes to sanitation7 and pickup, has changed dramatically.8 Our policies have, based on budgetary9 constraints and realities of where we10 are, changed radically.11 What would be helpful -- and I12 don't know if you've already produced13 this, but a one-page outline of what has14 changed dealing with issues like15 commercial trash fees, bulk pickups, your16 policy for block captains, cleanups of17 blocks and lots, and how we're going to18 operate going forward.19 It would be helpful for me and20 my staff to communicate that to block21 captains, particularly every year -- and22 this year, on June 22nd, at Philadelphia23 University, we have a block captains boot24 camp, where we try to disseminate as much25 54 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 information as possible as to these kinds2 of changes.3 So if you could do a one-pager4 that kind of highlights the salient5 points, everything from leaf pickup to6 street-cleaning during snowstorms,7 plowing, and things like that. If we8 could get a better sense of how to9 educate the public, that would be helpful10 to us.11 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Thank12 you. Very good.13
Thank you,14 Madam President.15 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:16 You're welcome.17 The Chair recognizes Councilman18 Rizzo.19
24 Commissioner, I had this25 55 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 conversation with you a couple of years2 ago, and you weren't too supportive of my3 request. Lots of communities -- and I4 don't know all -- have adopted a rigid5 container requirement to put out your6 trash. 21 Do you think there's a area, a22 pilot program we could consider? 'Cause,23 Commissioner, I think if we could24 eliminate a lot of this being put out in25 56 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 plastic bags -- in some cases, that don't2 even belong to be put out. 25 57 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 Many people have their trash collected in2 the front of their homes, which means3 that they are taking their trash out4 through the dining room, through the5 living room, to the front. And because6 of that -- and they also don't have front7 yards or breezeways. 16 COUNCILMAN RIZZO:17 Commissioner, that was one piece, but you18 actually sent me a study that was, like,19 Part B, the efficiencies of the20 collectors. 5 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Yeah. 9 The point I wanted to make now10 is that I think we're looking at11 innovations that might even go past12 having a small can or the bag issue. 19 COUNCILMAN RIZZO:20 Commissioner, I want to add on to the21 ticket issue that I witness all the time22 contractors and other folks actually stop23 in front of a person's home that's got24 their trash out and clean out their truck25 59 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 with plastic bottles, and they don't care2 whether they put it in the recycling can3 or the trashcan. 8 And I know that's tough for9 your folks to figure out, but I think10 that you have to be sensitive that that11 really happens. I mean, I've watched it12 happen. 17 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Yes. 19
Thank you.20 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: In part,21 that's the purpose of the Office of22 Administrative Review and what they can23 hear. We may not know that. When we see24 the condition of the sidewalk, we don't25 60 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 know if somebody cleaned out their house2 or that somebody, you know, came by in a3 construction truck and dumped it, 'cause4 I too have seen the same issue occur.5
Thank11 you. Thank you, Madam President.12 Good morning, Commissioner.13 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Good14 morning.15
You know,16 I pretty much support most of the efforts17 to make Philadelphia a cleaner city,18 'cause when you ride around, the litter,19 the trash, the weeds, the high grass, I20 mean, it just drives me crazy, but I do21 have some questions.22 I don't think that the public23 -- I think the public pretty much knows24 that they should, of course, sweep their25 61 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 sidewalk and shovel snow and whatnot, and2 whether they do it or not, and when they3 don't do it, they should get a citation.4 But does SWEEP have a schedule,5 or do they just pop up in a neighborhood,6 because -- and I'll tell you one reason.7 A person that doesn't live far8 from me, his house is up high steps,9 so -- and he's been doing this for years.10 He has a backyard. He doesn't have,11 like, a ally way, so he has to go through12 the house. So he brings his trash to the13 top of the steps, close to the house, on14 trash day, or the morning that he can put15 the trash out, I think Wednesday -- trash16 day is Thursday.17 So he brings the trash to the18 front of the house, from the back, and19 puts it up near his house, and he's been20 doing that for years. It's in a bag,21 it's neat.22 And the other week, he got a23 SWEEP ticket. SWEEP came by and gave him24 a ticket. He wasn't littering. It's25 62 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 still up on his property. And, I mean,2 up; it's not street level.3 So I did talk to the SWEEP4 officer. And, actually, I think that may5 have been the first time SWEEP was on the6 block. And so, we're going to have a7 community meeting, 'cause other people8 got tickets too, and they called our9 office.10 So we're going to have a11 community meeting to educate people about12 the rules of trash, that it's not just a13 everyday, normal rule, 'cause she said to14 me that when he put his bags out, it15 could cause litter. It's not litter16 there, but it could cause litter. It's17 on his property, it's off the street. I18 still can't figure out why he got a19 ticket.20 So whenever we have this21 meeting, maybe we'll gain a better22 understanding. So that's why I wanted to23 know if there's -- we do -- and she's24 agreed, I mean immediately agreed, to25 63 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 come out and do a community meeting so we2 can inform the residents about SWEEP and3 what they gave you citations for and what4 you can do and can't do. I mean, we know5 the basics that they can and can't do.6 And I do think that an7 important part of any program is to make8 sure that the public is educated as to9 what they can and can't do.10 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Yes.11
Because,12 you know, because when you talk about --13 and we do have people who live at bus14 stops, we do have people that live near15 any kind of retail establishment, like16 the example that Councilman Greenlee was17 talking about, a McDonald's.18 So if they put a trashcan on19 their sidewalk so that they can collect,20 hopefully, people will deposit it in the21 trashcan versus throwing it on the22 sidewalk, don't they get a ticket for23 that also, for having a trashcan?24 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: No. We25 64 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 at one time had that as an issue, but now2 we work with the residents who kind of3 have like an adopt-a-basket, where they4 place the can out for public use. The5 problem comes up when the -- sometimes6 residents choose to use that can for7 their household waste.8
Right,9 right. I know that, right.10 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: And then11 the problem goes awry.12
Right,13 right.14 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: So15 instead of it capturing the wrappers from16 the fast-food store, it's now capturing,17 you know, somebody's bag of fish from18 dinner last night.19
Okay.20 Now, do the SWEEP officers also go out on21 business corridors, or there's another22 that does that?23 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: There are24 SWEEP officers on business corridors as25 65 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 well.2
Okay,3 because I was on a business corridor the4 other day, and I saw somebody just take a5 whole pizza box and just throw it on the6 ground and keep walking. And, you know,7 I would hate to see the owner of the8 store fined for that because that was9 actually a pedestrian just walking done10 the street, who didn't care about using11 the trash disposal.12 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Right.13
How they14 disposed of their trash.15 So, you know, the persons that16 called me when SWEEP was in their17 neighborhood -- and I don't think they18 came back. So is there a schedule, or do19 they just come? I mean --20 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: The SWEEP21 officers work on two bases. One, by a22 complaint because people -- a neighbor23 complains about other neighbors who have24 their trashcans out not on trash day,25 66 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 they're open and overflowing or open such2 that they're smelly and, you know, vermin3 can get in them.4 And also, we have tours and5 routes along commercial corridors and by6 communities. And we kind of cycle7 through the City and just cycle back8 around again.9 We don't have an enormous10 staff, so we don't have the opportunity11 to stay in any one place very long.12
Okay. So13 are the majority of the people paying the14 citations? Well, it said about 4015 percent of total citations. What is the16 pay rate -- percentage, rather?17 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: I think18 we're at approximately 51 percent.19
Oh, okay.20 That's good. So what happens when you21 don't pay; do they just keeping adding up22 or --23 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Yes. The24 fines can escalate, and you may wind up25 67 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 in court, or they may be dismissed at the2 Office of Administrative Review.3
All4 right, okay. Thank you.5 Thank you, Madam President.6 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:7 You're welcome.8 The Chair recognizes Councilman9 DiCicco.10
Thank you,11 Madam President.12 And good morning, Commissioner.13 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Good14 morning.15
How many16 SWEEP officers do we have?17 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: We18 presently have 57 budgeted.19
You and I23 have had this conversation on a couple of24 occasions. In the South Philadelphia25 68 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 part of my district, aside from the2 handbills that are left at either3 someone's doorstep, stuck in between the4 railing, or in someone's windshield,5 probably the biggest contributor to6 litter in South Philadelphia is the South7 Philadelphia Review. 12 Since it's such a prized13 commodity, our constituents just can't14 wait to see that Review. 18 And in the process, the bundle19 becomes loose, a little bit of wind20 happens to come by. And before you know21 it, literally dozens, if not hundreds, of22 newspapers are being strewn throughout23 the streets. 4 And I've talked to them for the5 last ten, twelve years about maybe they6 should put these bundles in a clear --7 and you're going to consider me crazy --8 plastic bag. 12 I don't think they've ever13 gotten any fines. They are, again, the14 biggest contributor. 21 I heard earlier testimony, or22 questions, about it's not fair for a23 homeowner to receive a citation for trash24 that was not their trash. 13 So if I come home from work14 tonight, and there's litter, at least I15 know that I should clean it before I16 leave for work tomorrow morning. 20 So, on the one hand, I'm21 suggesting that maybe we give some22 leniency to folks who may have litter on23 the sidewalk, by providing them a24 significant amount of time. I mean, on a25 71 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 slow day, it takes you five minutes to2 clean the 16-foot of curb in front of3 your house and your sidewalk. 17 So I'm trying to get some18 balance of fairness here. 20 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Sure. We21 can certainly -- I'll start with one, the22 Review. 5 With regard to the warnings, we6 can certainly take that back and examine7 our ability to do that. 15 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: And not to16 take any work away from your department,17 but I think we might want to look at18 discussing the possibility of having the19 Parking Authority play some role in20 either notification and/or issuance of21 citations because they're out there. 10 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Yes. 14
I thought15 we did that bill. I thought Councilman16 Mariano -- I thought we passed that.17 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: No, I18 don't know that it was passed. I think19 it was under discussion, but I don't know20 that it passed.21 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: Well, I'll22 go back in the archives. For some23 reason, I thought we passed it, but I24 could be wrong.25 74 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 And the other thing is with2 trash being put out. A lot of commercial3 properties -- delis, small little4 restaurants -- and this happens in my5 neighborhood -- who have a commercial6 trash pickup, but they do put out their7 trash not only in paper bags -- plastic8 bags, but they also do cardboard boxes9 and other materials that are not bound.10 And on 11th Street, there's a11 famous hoagie shop, the guy's a friend of12 mine. On a windy day, those bread boxes13 are everywhere, they're all over the14 place, so I think we need to educate the15 business community a little bit better16 about their responsibility.17 And they, I think, should at18 least be required to put their trash in a19 container. You know, directly across the20 street is a restaurant; their trash is in21 a container. Around the corner is a22 deli; it's left out in paper bags, boxes23 half broken down, just left there. Not24 only is it unsightly, but it does pose a25 75 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 problem and exacerbates the litter2 problem that we all have to deal with.3 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Mm-hmm.4
And some5 of that trash winds up on somebody else's6 pavement, and they may get a ticket for7 that, a citation, and that's not fair.8 So I think we need to step up9 education and enforcement with commercial10 entities as well.11 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Very good12 point.13 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: Thank you.14 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: We will15 follow up on that.16 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: Thank you.17 Thank you, Madam President.18
Thank19 you.20 The Chair recognizes Councilman21 Clarke.22
Thanks,23 Madam President.24 Real quick. I was having25 76 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 difficulty hearing you when you were2 responding to Councilman Greenlee's, but3 I did hear this issue about people4 walking past your property and dropping5 trash.6 And I have, from a personal7 perspective -- I don't like to bring my8 personal situation into the debate, but I9 happen to live near a el stop, and all10 day long, the people go to and from the11 el, and there are, like, two stores at12 the el stop, and they just drop trash all13 day long.14 So every night, I come home, I15 got to clean the trash off my sidewalk,16 which I'm okay with.17 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Right.18
But as it19 relates to SWEEP officers, exactly what20 are they going to do when it's obviously21 not trash from the person's property who22 lives there? I mean, how is that going23 to be handled?24 'Cause, I mean, I don't get25 77 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 home till 8, 9 o'clock at night 'cause2 I'm working.3 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Sure.4
And I don't5 want to have to --6 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: We've7 asked the officers to be sensitive to8 people who live near conditions that9 might create extra debris on the10 sidewalk.11 But on the same hand, when it12 starts to accumulate at a level that it13 appears that the property owner is just14 ignoring it --15
I'm having16 trouble hearing you.17 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: When it18 appears that the property owner is19 ignoring conditions on their sidewalk so20 that it starts to accumulate more than a21 day's worth -- you know, circulars, two22 months' or three months' worth of23 circulars, you know, are left on the24 sidewalk, that those are conditions that25 78 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 we will be issuing the tickets for, but2 that we have to encourage our officers.3 And we will do more to encourage them to4 be sensitive to people who live near --5 on the windy side of the street, near a6 bus stop, near an entity that might drop7 materials, near schools.8 Those are the kinds of things9 that we see as being problems, and we10 will try to --11
All right.12 So they will be properly schooled in13 understanding the nature of the trash and14 its origin.15 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Right.16
And the17 cumulative aspect of it.18 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Right.19 Surely.20
All right.21 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: So when22 it looks like it's accumulating and23 people just aren't addressing because24 it's just --25 79 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441
All right,2 I'm okay with that. I mean, I have a3 situation on my block with a person.4 It's an industrial site, and they don't5 ever do anything. As a matter of fact,6 they have weeds on their sidewalk about7 this high (indicating).8 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: No.9
So I agree10 with you.11 One last question. How many12 departments in the City have either13 enforcement or regulatory powers with14 respects to property maintenance code?15 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: How many16 agencies, um...17 I would say there has to be at18 least three, but there may be four or19 five. Police, Streets, and L&I all have20 the ability to write that. And then we21 may be able to include something with22 regard to the Health Department; I'm not23 sure about them --24
Okay.25 80 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: --2 regarding property maintenance, property3 maintenance relative to certain4 establishments may be (indiscernible) as5 well.6
Thank you,11 Madam Chair.12 Commissioner Tolson, just -- I13 had one quick question, and that is, I14 think you gave us numbers when we did15 budget stat in, like, in January or16 February that showed how much we would17 save if we went to trash collection three18 days a month or two days a month.19 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Mm-hmm.20
Are those21 numbers still good?22 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Yes.23
Okay, thank24 you.25 81 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441
I want4 to be helpful, 'cause I realize the5 bottom line is the $7.5 million that we6 need for our budget in terms of this7 stuff.8 But I also want there to be an9 understanding, going back to what Tasco10 says, is that we really do need to do a11 campaign. And if we're going to increase12 these fees, I expect the Administration13 to do a massive campaign, and I'd like14 the Administration to review how many15 citations are being issued, who's paying16 them, and the correlation between our17 litter and our citations, because I want18 to look at my numbers to date, and I want19 to see if I'm unfairly being targeted in20 particularly the areas that are hit21 around the citation, so that we can make22 sure that in the cases, as Councilman23 Clarke mentioned, where -- and I know24 this is an issue that Deputy Mayor25 82 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 Cutler's looking at because it's a2 discussion we've had around bus stops and3 SEPTAs and all of that and doing a better4 job.5 You know, again, I'm just6 concerned about the ability to protect my7 seniors and my folks on fixed income, but8 I do want to work with you on the litter9 collection.10 And I agree with Tasco: We're11 not going to cite our way out of this.12 So, if the Administration is13 going to guarantee me that we're going to14 do a campaign around this -- as you know,15 we've been working on this as it relates16 to the store owners and everybody else --17 I'll continue to do that, but I want to18 make sure I'm not -- that my folks aren't19 paying a higher amount of money and that20 we're not working with them.21 So there has to be agreements22 by the Administration to work with me on23 that.24 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Absolutel25 83 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 y. And we certainly agree. Education is2 the first piece of this. And though3 we're talking about enforcement tickets,4 that is not the focus for us; it's got to5 be education.6 And what I've heard here today7 is that we need to do some more of that,8 and we will we will.9
Okay.10 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: We'll11 make a major effort to focus on education12 for the coming weeks and months.13
Thank17 you.18 The Chair recognizes the19 Councilman Clarke, if he's in the room.20 (Councilman Clarke is not21 present at this time.)22
Do we23 have any other members that would like to24 be recognized?25 84 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 Councilman Kenney.2
Thank you3 very much.4 Picking up on Councilwoman5 Tasco's suggestion relative to6 educational programming. Maybe we ought7 to look at hiking the fine to 100 or 150,8 taking the balance that we would receive9 and doing some kind of educational10 campaign either on cable television or11 some other methods, and that may be a12 source of revenue for you to provide that13 or to create that type of Ladybird14 Johnson type of program she was alluding15 to, to get the message out.16 Cable TV's pretty reasonably17 inexpensive compared to network, it does18 get good penetration, and I'm just19 wondering whether or not that might be20 the way to find the money you need,21 increasing your fines from 25 to 50, but22 then doing the other 50 and putting it23 into an education program.24 COMMISSIONER TOLSON: Okay.25 85 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441
Are3 there any other comments or questions4 from members of the committee?5 The Chair recognizes6 Councilwoman Sanchez.7
I would8 suggest, going to what Councilman9 Kenney's saying, that that be a10 multilingual campaign. I think the11 importance of that --12
Thank17 you.18 Any further questions or19 comments by members of the committee?20 (No further questions.)21 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:22 Seeing none, thank you very much for your23 testimony.24 The committee will stand in25 86 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 recess until 1:30, at which time we will2 have public testimony.3 Thank you very much.4 (Lunch break taken at5 11:37 a.m.)6 (Proceedings resume.)7
Good8 afternoon, everyone. Thank you so much9 for your patience. This is a continued10 public hearing of the Committee of the11 Whole.12 I would ask Mr. McPherson to13 please call the first witnesses.14 MR. McPHERSON: Al Perry.15 (Witness comes forward.)16
I17 believe everyone was told that we have a18 time limit on the testimony because we do19 have a number of witnesses, so if you20 could speak for three minutes.21 We do have a timer, and we will22 use the timer. When you hear the bell23 ring, just try to conclude your remarks.24 Thank you.25 87 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 Good afternoon, Mr. Perry.2
Good afternoon,3 Madam President.4 Thank you for having us here5 today and giving us the forum to talk6 about this. I'm here on behalf of the7 Philadelphia Greater Philadelphia8 Association of Realtors. I serve as9 their president, and I am a real estate10 broker in the City of Philadelphia.11 And I'm here today to talk --12 it started as a position where we were in13 opposition of the real estate property-14 tax increase, when Bill No. 090218 came15 out, and what it's turned into is,16 actually, an opportunity for us to talk17 about a program called SCOPE, Selling18 City Owned Properties Efficiently.19 We've been following a lot of20 the Council hearings and a lot of21 questionings regarding the City-owned22 real estate. And just in a very quick23 opportunity I had, I printed up pages and24 pages and pages of property, public tax25 88 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 records of -- there's 36 properties on2 each one of these pages, over 5,000 owned3 in the name of the City of Philadelphia,4 over 3,000 owned in the Redevelopment5 Authority, over 5,000 owned in6 Pennsylvania Housing Authority --7 Philadelphia Housing Authority.8 And many of these properties9 are blighted and are not serving any10 common good. And I understand that a lot11 of these properties may be in functioning12 use and may also have a higher and better13 value down the road and may be worth14 land-banking, but a lot of this real15 estate is just depriving neighborhoods16 and bringing down values of streets.17 So, when I look at the City's18 budgetary problems, and our organization19 talks about, you know, where everybody's20 being looked to cut back, and many21 businesses and families have had to do22 that as well, we look at these assets and23 say, This is something the City of24 Philadelphia can bring forward now,25 89 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 presently, to get a dedicated funding2 source to the City.3 None of these properties are4 bringing positive tax rolls, I would5 assume. They're not bringing transfer6 tax, they're blighted, they're driving7 property values down.8 We're doing presently a pilot9 program with the Redevelopment Authority,10 where we actively have nine properties11 listed in the MLS that were Redevelopment12 Authority-owned properties, and we have13 four -- well, two of them presently under14 contract, and we've demonstrated quite a15 bit more power that we can bring 2516 percent over what the RDA evaluated those17 properties to be, currently under18 contract.19 So we look for City Council to20 consider giving more properties to the21 Realtors to sell.22 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:23 You've indicated that you've been24 watching the hearings, and I'm sure that25 90 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 you did hear several of the Councilpeople2 sharing the same concerns you have. And3 I see to my left is Councilman Clarke,4 and I think he did go into great detail5 about the issue at hand.6 And I really want to thank you7 for coming in. Are you going to share8 that list with us?9
I'd be more than10 happy to leave -- I was going to make11 copies of it, but I didn't want to kill12 another 30 trees, so -- but I -- you're13 more than welcome to these.14 This is not everything.15 Unfortunately, our public record database16 will only let us print out 5,000 at a17 time. So it actually exceeds 5,000 in a18 number of these ownership pieces, but19 it's a good representative start.20 And we would love to help City21 Council, as an organization, determine22 which of these properties may be23 marketable, what you might be able to do.24 And if I could just mention,25 91 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 Baltimore -- this is a program that's2 been running in Baltimore, and I have3 statistics: They've sold 242 City of4 Baltimore properties through the end of5 2008. It's generated over $6 million in6 net revenues to the city from blighted7 properties, and that's after commissions8 have been netted out, that were paid to9 the real estate community. And it's the10 highest and best value for the11 properties, the investors, the owners12 have to buy.13 It's advertised on the MLS, so14 you know you're getting market rate.15 There's no inside track to the real16 estate, so you know you're getting market17 rates on the properties. And it's18 something I would strongly suggest.19 HUD does it presently. You20 know, let it out there for everybody to21 see, let it out there to get competition.22 You know, that's something that the City23 doesn't always get. When it does sell24 real estate, it's competition to sell it.25 92 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 So I'd love to see competition 'cause2 that raises the values.3 And they have presently 714 active listings over there, with 18 of5 those pending. And they anticipate that6 the revitalized real estate -- 'cause7 they have an 18-month deed restriction in8 there that the -- whoever buys this real9 estate has to develop it within 1810 months. And there's a deed restriction11 that would revert back to the City of12 Baltimore if it doesn't work.13 And they estimate that the14 property is now worth in excess of $3615 million.16
And many of those18 properties were then resold because19 there's an owner-occupant contingency in20 there as well, has to become owner-21 occupied.22 And that money's generated23 additional transfer tax and property tax.24 And, of course, whoever's going to live25 93 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 there's got to pay wage tax and sales tax2 and so forth and so on. And so it's a --3 it's a boulder rolling downhill at that4 point.5 And that's what we'd like to6 see, is additional tax revenues, where we7 don't have to raise anybody's taxes as8 much as we can take what's already9 stagnant and bring that into productive10 use.11
Thank12 you, thank you very much. We appreciate13 your coming in.14 I see that Councilman Green has15 his light on.16
Just a quick17 question.18 Did you add up the total amount19 on all of those pages for the properties?20
What I have here is21 about 13,000 properties. I don't believe22 it's representative of the actually23 amount.24
No, no, just25 94 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 on the tax rolls, what it's worth.2
I'd love to get7 back to you with that; I could probably8 do so.9
Thank you.14 We have been talking to the15 Administration about the SCOPE Program16 since January of 2008, and we're very17 hopeful that they will adopt it.18 In questioning before Council,19 many of us have mentioned Baltimore's20 SCOPE Program specifically, and there are21 questions on the record where the22 Administration is supposed to study that23 and get back to us. Hopefully, they'll24 get back to us favorably.25 95 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 Thank you.2
Thank5 you.6 Are there any other questions7 from members of the committee?8 (No further questions.)9 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:10 Again, I thank you. And thank you for11 sharing that information with us.12
I'll leave this13 with the Sergeant-at-Arms.14 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:15 You're helping to make our job a little16 easier. Thank you.17
Money in is better18 than raising additional funds.19 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:20 Right. Thank you so much.21 MR. McPHERSON: Our next panel22 consists of Jim Heller, Mike McCrea,23 Claudia Sherrod, Ed Pereles, Tom Henry,24 Jeffrey Bond.25 96 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 (Witnesses come forward.)2
Hi,6 Claudia.7 Please identify yourself for8 the record and proceed with your9 testimony.10
Good afternoon. My11 name is Jeffrey Bond, and I'm here12 representing the Nicetown Tioga section13 of the City. I'm actually the President14 of the Community Advisory Council at Stem15 Park Playground.16 And I just want to suggest to17 City Council and to Mayor Goode -- Mayor18 Nutter, the Administration, that I was19 one of the people from the City. I20 didn't fall through the cracks; I21 actually walked through the crack and22 ended up in the state correctional23 system.24 Now that I'm home, representing25 97 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 a new type of leadership, working with2 youth, and not just at-risk youth, and at3 the recreation facilities, not just in4 the Nicetown Tioga section but throughout5 the whole city is very, very vital to the6 health and welfare of our youth in the7 City, because without the playgrounds,8 the rec centers, PAL, and those type of9 places for the youth to go and10 participate in sports activities and some11 other craft activities, there's nothing12 left for them to do but actually go out13 on the streets, where that bad element14 is, and then they become a part of that,15 you know.16 So I'm here today to really ask17 and appeal to City Council and the Mayor18 Michael Nutter Administration to please19 do not continue to cut the budget from20 the Recreation Department because that21 is, like, one of our last hopes for22 children.23 And I'm saying this out of24 experience, not out of no theory or25 98 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 nothing like that, because I grew up in2 Philadelphia all of my life, except for3 the time that I spent in the state4 correctional institution, and recreation5 was important.6 And the thing about recreation7 is that it let the youth use they energy8 in a positive way, and it really tires9 you out. So after you finish playing10 your sports and activity, you don't have11 energy enough to get involved in12 destructive things.13 So my encouragement to City14 Council is to please, please, if you can,15 do not cut the budget from the Recreation16 Department so that our youth can have17 somewhere to go and some structured18 activities with persons like myself who's19 willing to come back to the community and20 contribute to them in that light.21 And I thank you all for letting22 me speak today.23
Thank24 you very much thank for coming in to25 99 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 testify. And continue the good work.2
Good afternoon,7 Council President Verna and all of the8 City Council members. My name is Claudia9 Sherrod, and I am the treasurer of Smith10 Playground, and I would like to submit11 before I go into my testimony that12 Mr. Hellman is indisposed; he was not13 able to be present, but I have submitted14 all of his testimony.15 The budget has been a16 conversation among conversations in our17 community. The fact that Philadelphia's18 in a crisis is understood. The manner in19 which the facts have been presented20 targeting the recreation centers has21 disoriented many of the community to the22 point that they're turning way from the23 team we thought would build our beloved24 city through the communities.25 100 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 The children in our communities2 are the most precious, humble people that3 we know. To totally disrespect, limiting4 children's activities in the recreation5 centers is disrespect for the residents6 that work so hard to support this7 administration. I am glad to hear that8 more pools are opening. However, we are9 suffering with the fact that the only10 pool in Point Breeze will be eliminated11 the.12 Prior to Mayor Nutter being13 elected mayor, we did have his support14 for a recreation center at Chew15 Playground. Since his election, that has16 become null and void. Now we are told17 that the pool at Chew Playground will be18 closed. I assume the children of Point19 Breeze are expected to use the Marian20 Anderson Recreation Center.21 Children have barriers that22 they cannot cross. Likewise, summer23 programs that use two playgrounds are at24 a loss at what they are supposed to do25 101 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 for these programs. Please give us some2 answers as to how to overcome.3 Solid Rock Baptist Church is4 furious about this situation. They are5 one of the summer camps that are at a6 loss to what can be done to fulfill their7 summer camp experience for their8 children, without a pool. The youth9 depend on the community, particularly our10 recreation centers, regardless of their11 parents. The parents nurture from the12 inside; the community help with the13 outreach.14 The community knows that there15 is a need to raise taxes, which will be a16 burden. However, we are prepared to work17 with solutions that are sensible -- not18 anything that will kill the spirits,19 hopes, and dreams of our youth.20 The children and family is our21 purpose and cause. Please minimize any22 further cuts to the Recreation23 Department. The Recreation Department24 has taken a serious blow from the get-go:25 102 5/6/09 - WHOLE - 090212-215, 218-221, 226, 2441 16-and-a-half percent, $6.5 million2 deducted from their budget.3 Following several town house4 meetings in January, we were informed5 that the deficit had increased by an6 additional one billion. This new crisis7 increased the Administration's need to8 take additional dollars. The Recreation9 Department cannot continue to take the10 burden of the entire city. I urge you,11 City Council, to take charge of this12 matter --13 (Timer bell rings.)14
--15 find ways to resolve this problem with16 increases, if need be, such that it will17 not stifle our young people.18 We hope Point Breeze, among all19 other communities, will not lose anything20 else that affects our children's growth.21