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Minutes

Stated Meeting, October 4, 2001

Philadelphia City CouncilOct 4, 2001

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Legislation acted on in this session

From the City of Philadelphia’s legislative record (Legistar). Each file links to its status, roll call, and official documents.

Bill 000586ORDERED PLACED ON THIS DAY`S FIRST READING CALENDAR
Revising parking regulations on Ninth street, both sides, from Bainbridge street to Fitzwater street.
Bill 000586SUSPEND THE RULES OF THE COUNCIL
Revising parking regulations on Ninth street, both sides, from Bainbridge street to Fitzwater street.
Bill 000586ORDERED PLACED ON NEXT WEEK`S SECOND READING CALENDAR
Revising parking regulations on Ninth street, both sides, from Bainbridge street to Fitzwater street.
Bill 000587ORDERED PLACED ON THIS DAY`S FIRST READING CALENDAR
Revising parking regulations on Fitzwater street, both sides, from Tenth street to Eleventh street.
Bill 000587SUSPEND THE RULES OF THE COUNCIL
Revising parking regulations on Fitzwater street, both sides, from Tenth street to Eleventh street.
Bill 000587ORDERED PLACED ON NEXT WEEK`S SECOND READING CALENDAR
Revising parking regulations on Fitzwater street, both sides, from Tenth street to Eleventh street.
Bill 000588ORDERED PLACED ON THIS DAY`S FIRST READING CALENDAR
Revising parking regulations on Fitzwater street, both sides, from Eighth street to Ninth street.
Bill 000588SUSPEND THE RULES OF THE COUNCIL
Revising parking regulations on Fitzwater street, both sides, from Eighth street to Ninth street.
Bill 000588ORDERED PLACED ON NEXT WEEK`S SECOND READING CALENDAR
Revising parking regulations on Fitzwater street, both sides, from Eighth street to Ninth street.
Bill 000629READ
Amending Title 14 of The Philadelphia Code, entitled "Zoning and Planning," by amending Chapter 14-1800 entitled "Zoning Board of Adjustment" by amending Section 14-1807 entitled "…
Bill 000629PASSED
Amending Title 14 of The Philadelphia Code, entitled "Zoning and Planning," by amending Chapter 14-1800 entitled "Zoning Board of Adjustment" by amending Section 14-1807 entitled "…
Bill 000644ORDERED PLACED ON THIS DAY`S FIRST READING CALENDAR
Revising parking regulations on Watts street, east side, from Ritner street to Porter street.

+67 more substantive items

Ceremonial resolutions

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People mentioned

Names our system found in this transcript. Automatically extracted, so it can include anyone named in the record, not only officials or parties.

COUNCIL OF THE CITY OF PHILADELPHIA STATED MEETING Thursday, October 4, 2001 10:16 a.m. Room 400, City Hall Philadelphia, PA PRESENT: COUNCIL PRESIDENT ANNA C. VERNA COUNCILWOMAN JANNIE L. BLACKWELL COUNCILWOMAN BLONDELL REYNOLDS BROWN COUNCILMAN DARRELL L. CLARKE COUNCILMAN DAVID COHEN COUNCILMAN FRANK J. DICICCO COUNCILMAN W. WILSON GOODE, JR. COUNCILMAN JAMES F. KENNEY COUNCILWOMAN JOAN L. KRAJEWSKI COUNCILMAN W. THACHER LONGSTRETH COUNCILMAN RICHARD T. MARIANO COUNCILWOMAN DONNA REED MILLER COUNCILMAN MICHAEL A. NUTTER COUNCILMAN BRIAN J. O'NEILL COUNCILMAN ANGEL L. ORTIZ COUNCILMAN FRANK RIZZO COUNCILWOMAN MARIAN B. TASCO PATRICIA RAFFERTY, Deputy Chief Clerk VINCENT VARALLO ASSOCIATES, INC. Registered Professional Reporters Eleven Penn Center, Suite 600 Philadelphia, PA 19103 10/4/01 STATED - GREETING/INVOCATION

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Rabbi Winokur

I want to thank you for this opportunity and this privilege to address you. There is a line in the -- in the beginning of the prophet Isaiah, Isaiah says that he's prophesied through four different kings, he's outlived four different kings. And so the Talmud takes that and says, "Oy, the burdens of leadership, they kill you." Your critics -- it may be the press, I don't know, they'll decide. Your critics outlive you, the burden of leadership is just too much. So there is a recognition in our tradition of just how difficult this burden is and how much work you put in. And it is really something that I hope that people will be grateful for. In coming new to 10/4/01 STATED - GREETING/INVOCATION Philadelphia, I certainly am. You are here in this beautiful building that -- that I just -- is absolutely gorgeous. And we're here during the Jewish holiday of Sukkot, which is all about the fragility of buildings. And unfortunately, we in this nation know about the fragility of buildings like we have never known it before in our history. Sukkot is a holiday in which Jews built a little structure that is supposed to be temporary, that is supposed to be fragile, that recalls our days of wandering in the desert, when Judaism was originally formulated. I think we have all learned almost the obvious lesson, and that it is not our buildings that count but it is what we do inside them that counts. I repeat the obvious because I think it is also important. Sometimes we overlook the obvious. In this beautiful, beautiful building, it's your work that really counts, and it is your work that is in many ways the response to those who would tear down this country. I want to conclude with the blessing that is found in the Talmud. Blessed are You, Lord, our God, who 9/20/01 JOURNAL APPROVAL commands us to engage in the needs of this community. And blessed are those who are so engaged. Amen.

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The Clerk

To the President and Members of the Council of the City of Philadelphia: I am pleased to advise you that on October 3, 2001, I signed the following bills that were passed by Council at its session of September 20, 2001: Bill No. 010269, 010274, and 101369. And I am returning herewith as disapproved Bill No. 010527 passed by Council at its session of September 20, 2001. And I am returning herewith as disapproved Bill No. 010523. Council passed this bill at its session on September 20, 2001.

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The Clerk

A resolution authorizing the Council Committee of the Whole to conduct hearings for the purpose of receiving testimony from INTRODUCTION OF BILLS, RESOLUTIONS representatives of the restaurant, hotel and hospitality industry and the Greater Philadelphia Chamber of Commerce in order to assess the impact of the severe downturn in the national and local economy on these industries in Philadelphia and the impact on the state and local taxes of these industries, and also asking that the General Assembly explore any options to enable the repeal of the Philadelphia School District's liquor sales tax by the enactment of a new revenue source that will replace the revenues raised by the liquor sales tax in order to help and improve the business climate and promotion of the restaurant, hotel and hospitality industries in Philadelphia.

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The Clerk

A resolution directing the Department of Public Property to serve as the lead agency to coordinate a survey with all the City departments and agencies of all the facilities owned or operated by the City of Philadelphia to determine and provide for the capability of such facilities to display flags of the United States of America and the City of Philadelphia and to ensure the prominent display of such United States and City flags at such locations.

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The Clerk

To the President and Members of the Council of the City of Philadelphia: The Committee on Streets and Services to which was referred: Bill No. 000586, an ordinance revising parking regulations on Ninth Street, both sides, COMMITTEE REPORTS from Bainbridge Street to Fitzwater Street; and Bill No. 000587, an ordinance revising parking regulations on Fitzwater Street, both sides, from Tenth Street to Eleventh Street; and Bill No. 000588, an ordinance revising parking regulations on Fitzwater Street, both sides, from Eight Street to Ninth Street; and Bill No. 000644, an ordinance revising parking regulations on Watts Street, east side, from Ritner Street to Porter Street; and Bill No. 010265, an ordinance revising parking regulations on Carlyle Street, both sides, from Erie Avenue to Butler Street; and Bill No. 010266, an ordinance establishing parking regulations on Gravers Lane, east side, Germantown Avenue to Shawn Street; and Bill No. 010290, an ordinance establishing parking regulations Hicks Street, east side, Ritner Street to Porter Street; and Bill No. 010291, an ordinance establishing a parking regulation on Porter Street, both sides, 15th Street to 16th Street; and Bill No. 010292, an ordinance establishing a parking regulation on Rosewood COMMITTEE REPORTS Street, east side, Jackson Street to Wolf Street; and Bill No. 010293, an ordinance establishing a parking regulation on Rosewood Street, east side, Shunk Street to Oregon Avenue; and Bill No. 010294, an ordinance establishing a parking regulation on Shunk Street, both sides, Broad Street to 15th Street; and Bill No. 010295, an ordinance establishing a parking regulation on Shunk Street, both sides, 15th Street to 16th Street; and Bill No. 010296, an ordinance establishing a parking regulation on 15th Street, both sides, Ritner Street to Porter Street; and Bill No. 010505, an ordinance authorizing Irvin Berskin, owner of the property 2551 South Fifth Street, to construct and maintain a fence for a Dumpster enclosure on the east footway of South Fifth Street; and Bill No. 010525, an ordinance establishing a parking regulation on Murdoch Street between Pickering Avenue and Cheltenham Avenue respectfully reports it has considered the same and returns the attached bills to Council with a favorable recommendation. COMMITTEE REPORTS

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Councilman Cohen

It's with a great deal of sadness that I address this action, which has no SECOND READING - BILL 000629 business coming before this City Council. For this great city's council's legislative body to even think of taking away rights of citizens in favor of the rights of developers is an absolutely wrong principle. We're supposed to be representing the people. This bill by Councilman DiCicco has so many flaws in it that every newspaper in the City and media outlet has been in opposition to this bill. Every community organization, save perhaps one or two, are overwhelmingly opposed to this bill because it takes away rights. For someone who says he's interested in building the City and getting growth, this is the wrong way to do it. What this bill says is any developer from anywhere in the world -- he doesn't have to be a citizen, he doesn't have to be a resident, anybody can go into any neighborhood and propose a bill to develop something, put up a billboard, do anything that's harmful to the neighborhood. Anybody from outside the City can do it, but only those very close by will ever have a right to oppose it. What a travesty of justice to say developers have all the rights and the people SECOND READING - BILL 000629 have none. This bill has so many flaws on it. It's been the subject of many editorials in the newspapers and many articles by the people. I urge my colleagues to put an end to this once and for all and by voting no on this bill. It ought not to have come to this because it is an insult to the people of Philadelphia that this body's even compelled to vote on this bill. Thank you, Madam President.

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Councilman Ortiz

We got a new Councilperson. Organization after organization have asked the members of this council to reject this bill. It's a bill that pretends to be something that it is not. It is not about neighborhoods; it's really about taking power and rights from citizens across Philadelphia. We are a city; we're a city of neighborhoods but we are a city. We're not a Balkanized city. Sometimes we are a segregated city, and that is something that we have to struggle against, the segregation that keeps people apart with different barriers, invisible or not. This bill does not take us to that ideal of us being Philadelphians, of us being a city. In fact, it drives us back into our little enclaves and prevents people who have some rights, the citizens of this city and other individuals, from expressing their thoughts on something that might blight our environment. SECOND READING - BILL 000629 It is a wrong bill. It is a bill brought forward by the powerful, by the people with money. It is not a bill brought forward by community because the community groups, as present here and in writing across the City, have said to vote no on 629. I ask this body to reject it and to give people -- because we were once known as "the people's body" -- to give people back their voice and make this a city, not enclaves. Thank you.

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Councilman Dicicco

Thank you, Madam President. I will try to be brief but to the point. In June of this year, I was asked by a couple of my colleagues if I would hold the bill until they had time to meet with the various community groups who had some concern for the bill, and in respect to those colleagues, I tabled the bill for the better part of, I guess, about four and a half months. SECOND READING - BILL 000629 But it's interesting what my colleague Councilman Cohen is saying, that if this bill passes, it will allow developers from all over the world to come into the City of Philadelphia and do development without any public input. I wish we could get developers from all over the world to come into the City of Philadelphia and develop our city to make it a better place, to create jobs and economic opportunities for the citizens of this city. My dear friend and colleague Councilman Ortiz made a good point when he says we are a segregated city. I don't look at it as a segregated city; I look at it as a city of neighborhoods. And in my opinion, that is what the heart of this bill is all: Allowing the uniqueness of the individual neighborhoods that make Philadelphia unique in this country, of the diversity throughout the neighborhoods throughout this city to allow individuals in those communities and organizations and community groups and advisory councils to make decisions that will affect the quality of life in their neighborhood. This is not going to, as Councilman Cohen SECOND READING - BILL 000629 says also, that this will allow developers to come in and do as they want. The bill, as it stands today, allows any individual who pays a single tax in the City of Philadelphia, regardless if he or she lives in this city, the ability to stand in front of the court and ask for an immediate appeal and get an immediate appeal on a zoning decision that had been granted by the Zoning Board and with the approval of the community group after many weeks, and sometimes months, of negotiations with that developer or developers. This is not about silencing the people. I came from the bolt of cloth that created three nonprofit groups in the last twenty years: The Italian Market Civic Association, the South Broad Street Beautification Committee, and Citizens Alliance for Better Neighborhoods. All of those groups or organizations were formed with the intention of empowering the people in the various communities even before I became a Councilperson, so it was before my district, but people in my community, empowering them and bringing them into the political process so that they would have the say in what goes on in their community that affects the quality of life for them and their children. SECOND READING - BILL 000629 This is not about -- select enforcement is what we're dealing with today where some advocacy groups purport to be against certain things unless the situation suits their needs. We all know about the half a million dollar payoff -- I don't want to belabor that point. If I would have done that or any other member of this Council would have accepted a half million dollar consideration to withdraw an appeal on a zoning, you would be having a hearing with me at Sixth and Market in federal court today. This is really about empowering people. There's been a total misrepresentation of the facts, I think everyone understands that. And I will say this publicly: If any of the dire consequences that have been purported over the last four months should occur in any community with any community group, I'll be the first person to ask to repeal this bill. This is not about -en -- enfranchising communities, I think it's about enfranchising them even more so, 'cause that's where I came from. And as to -- again, with all due respect to Councilman Ortiz saying that he's never seen such an outcry, I can recall in the six and a half years SECOND READING - BILL 000629 that I've been here three very controversial bills.

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Councilman Dicicco

I remember when this chamber and the gallery were packed with police and firemen, many of whom are my friends and neighborhoods, urging me to vote for the pension bill, the first pension bill, and I voted against it because it was a bad bill, and we created a bill that was even better for them. I remember the Archdiocese spending about a quarter of a million dollars to defeat me and colleague Councilman Kenney by putting ads in local newspapers saying that if the domestic-partner bill would pass, it's the end of the world for civilization as we know it. We voted for that bill because it was the right thing to do. That was about peel and empowering people. m. in the morning, when my colleague Councilman Cohen stood up and told me I had no right to make a motion on the floor of this chamber when we were dealing with sidewalk behavior, and it was his opinion at the time that if that bill passed, everyone's human rights in the City of Philadelphia would be violated, people would be taken off the sidewalks, their rights as citizens would be violated, they SECOND READING - BILL 000629 would have no say. The bill passed, we did the right thing by doing that bill, and no one's rights have been violated. It is not the end of the worlds if 629 passes. I would encourage my colleagues to vote for the bill. And you have my word: If any community group or District Councilperson, who are engaged in every zoning application that comes through our respective districts -- at least I know I am. We're there all the time. I don't need somebody from Bucks County coming in to fight a zoning application for a supermarket at Tenth and South, when the community wants that supermarket. Let the people in the community decide what is right for them. And I did this bill and I didn't use any geographical boundaries. I said that the request of Councilman Cohen or any community group or organization would have standing on the appeal process in the Court of Common Pleas. Thank you, Madam President.

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Councilman Cohen

Thank you, Madam SECOND READING - BILL 000629 President. Let's deal with some facts. First of all, Councilman DiCicco has attempted to spread this story that he tells us now all throughout the City for many months. In the June meeting, when he held up the bill for the first time, he said, "I'm going to campaign all over the City because I know all community organizations are in favor of this bill." The community organizations are very much interested at every step of the way in empowering their communities, but the community organizations see that this bill takes power away from them, it does not empower them, and so they've rejected the misrepresentations made by my colleague Councilman DiCicco. With respect to that 2:30-in-the-morning effort on my part to prevent Councilman DiCicco from making a motion, it was because the motion was to cut off discussion, to take away the rights of Councilmembers from further discussing the sidewalk bill, just in line with his effort now to take away the right of discussion from the people in the City of Philadelphia. There are many issues that come up that SECOND READING - BILL 000629 there may be no local organization prepared to fighting it, the millions, sometimes the hundreds of millions of dollars of developers. Therefore, you need citywide organizations available to represent the interests of all people. This is not a city of fiefdoms, this isn't a city where one local group has the right to build barriers and keep the rest of the City away, saying, It's none of your business. This is one city; we've got to make it so. Just a couple days ago, the Pennsylvania Supreme Court issued a ruling against the major supporter of this bill, the billboard operator. It was a case that went from the Zoning Board to the Common Pleas Court to the Commonwealth Court to the Pennsylvania Supreme Court. And the Supreme Court dismissed the appeal, indicating it was absolutely right that the organization, the citywide organization -- in my judgment, a great organization -- SCRUB, which fights on behalf of all people everywhere in the City with respect to the environmental questions, the Supreme Court said they were right and this developer was wrong. The Supreme Court of Pennsylvania stands fully behind RECONSIDERATION OF BILLS 010523, 010527 the rights of citizens to be empowered, not disempowered. I urge all of my colleagues to vote no on 629. It is a terrible bill from every point of view. (Applause.)

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Council President Verna

At this time, we're going to delay the vote on this bill. We're going to go into special business now. Council will now proceed under a special order of business to reconsider Bill No.'s 010523 and 010527. Bill No. 010523 was passed by the Council at its September 20th session and was returned disapproved by the Mayor to today's session of Council. The Mayor's veto message has already been read into the record, has it not, to the chief clerk -- by the clerk?

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Councilwoman Blackwell

Thank you, Madam President. Madam President, I was very happy to be in the 15-2 vote with regard to Bill No. 010523. I rise to speak on this bill today because I am ambivalent, as has been evidenced all morning, and I've talked to almost everybody in this body, and, of course, to ascertain what their opinions were and to talk about the various issues as we see them today. RECONSIDERATION OF BILLS 010523, 010527 City Council should, and must, make its own decisions. As separation of powers, the executive legislative and judicial bodies, it must be done. We as legislators, however, should not feel torn between representing some segments of our respective communities who feel they have been disenfranchised and ourselves as a legislative body. Madam President, I support you, I always have and I always will. I add, however, that I feel that my role as majority leader in this Council dictates that I appeal for a compromise, which, the public, I believe, has the right to expect from reasonable leaders such as we have in this body today. Madam President, I finally feel -ultimately, I feel that a mere three divisions in our whole city, a mere three divisions, should not dictate that we have the problem that we have today. Therefore, I move that we, City Council, hold this bill for one week to try to work out a solution that would be acceptable to all sides.

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Councilman Clarke

Thank you, Madam President. Madam President, I concur with Councilwoman Blackwell's statements, but I'd like to say this has been -- obviously been somewhat of a troubling time over the last two weeks. I have had a great relationship with every member of City Council, have seen some level of that relationship deteriorate over the period of the last month. It is clearly something that I did not want. But as I sit here and I listen to the various speeches about empowerment, I cannot not speak about the fact that there are a number of individuals in the City who don't feel that they were adequately empowered as a result of this particular legislation and its process. RECONSIDERATION OF BILLS 010523, 010527 I think about the people in the Latino community and particularly the representatives that came here during the Council hearing on this particular bill who were not comfortable with the ultimate outcome of this bill, who spoke of the fact that they were not able to have their representation present because of the tragedy that happened on September 11th and were adamantly opposed to the outcome of this bill. I speak of those individuals in the 8th Ward, which I represent, who, it is my understanding, have sent more than 200 letters to Councilmembers, indicating their support for me as their Councilperson and wishing to continue that level of support. I'd like to speak also of members of the 2nd District, who have seen an opportunity, based on what I have been told, to at some point in the near future -- and mind you, that they have voiced their sincere and continuing support for their Councilperson, their concern that as we move ahead in the years forth that they will not be able to elect a Councilperson of a minority race. So I just ask the members, as we talk RECONSIDERATION OF BILLS 010523, 010527 about empowerment, that we take into account all of the many citizens of the City of Philadelphia who have asked to be empowered during this trying process. And as Councilwoman Blackwell has indicated, this is an issue that I have always wanted to work out as a District Councilperson for the 5th District, continue to want to work out, 'cause I think the worst thing that can happen as a result of the passage of this bill is that we have some lingering effects of this very trying process, particularly my relationship with you, Madam President. So I ask the members to consider what Councilwoman Blackwell has said, and hopefully we can resolve this and we can continue to be the good friends that we have been over the years. Thank you, Madam President.

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Council President Verna

This bill having been read on two different days, was duly approved by City Council on September 20, 2001 and returned to Council by the Mayor as disapproved at today's session of Council. The question is, shall Bill No. 010523 pass, notwithstanding the Mayor's disapproval? Please note that a vote of aye is a vote to override the Mayor's veto, a vote of aye is to override the Mayor as veto. And a vote of nay is a vote to let the veto stand. Is everybody clear on RECONSIDERATION OF BILLS 010523, 010527 that? The clerk will please call the roll.

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Council President Verna

Aye. The votes are 10-7. The Mayor's veto has been sustained. We will now move to reconsider Bill No. 0105 -- oh, I'm sorry where, are we? We now move to reconsideration of Bill No. 010527, which was passed by Council at its September 20, 2001 session and was returned disapproved by the Mayor to today's session of Council. The Mayor's veto message has already been read into the record by the clerk. At this time, the chair recognizes Councilwoman Blackwell.

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The Clerk

An ordinance providing for the submission to the qualified electors of the City Philadelphia for an amendment to the educational supplement to the Philadelphia Home Rule Charter which would establish a process which would authorize the privatization of the administration, operation, and management of the School District, as approved by resolution of the City Council, fixing the date of a special election for such purpose, prescribing the form of ballot question to be voted on, and authorizing the appropriate officers to publish notice and to make arrangements for the special election.

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Councilman Cohen

Yes. I just wanted to report why it's so important for the Gas Works to be part of the City of Philadelphia. Last night, about 7 o'clock, I received a call from a block captain in the ward in which I'm the Democratic leader, telling me that a quadriplegic person had had the electricity turned off, which she needed desperately for breathing since she has a severe asthma case, and PECO -- she owed a bill of $600. She's on Social Security, disability, has no other income. She was told she SPEECHES had to have $400 in by the end of the day. Using her check and every available resource, she put together $350 and delivered it to the office that they had requested, the Thriftway market at 22nd and Lehigh. Through the intervention of our Managing Director Joe Martz, PECO was contacted and promised to put her electricity on. It was clear it was a humanitarian matter. She was only $50 short. Her life was at stake with her severe asthmatic condition. I have to report to you that PECO did not do so. If it were a City agency, there is absolutely no question that the lights would have been turned on. I want to mention that because I think people so misunderstand the role of public service. They think business is efficient. I don't think that's necessarily true because of all the bankruptcies that take place, but business seems to have no feeling for people, no humanitarianism. I call this to everyone's attention when we consider the plans for PGW in the future. I think it was a shameful action that PECO took last night in refusing to put the woman's electricity on. SPEECHES Thank you, Madam president.

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Councilman Ortiz

Madam Chair, I wanted to speak before, when the bill was being considered. Ten years ago, I stood up in this Council, myself and Councilwoman Tasco. At that time, the Latino community had a problem: We were divided into four different districts. The bill today that we considered, this Council had a very good opportunity if the Latino issue was the priority two weeks ago and a few weeks before that to really create a Latino district. But this Council didn't do that. We went, we did not bad, not good. There was a lot of dissatisfaction. I voted no. It was 15 to 2. The Latino issue has been brought up as a reason for this, for this veto. I don't think so. I think the people who spoke on the bill to try to delay the bill really couched it correctly. This was about Center City, some divisions, but it was not about creating a Latino district. I would hope that now that we're here, we will come up with a 45, 46, 47 percent Latino SPEECHES district. I would hope that the reason given for the veto is made to stand, but I don't think that was the reason. And that's why, knowing that the Latino was being used, I was not going to go along with it. But this was -- this vote was not about creating a Latino district. This vote was about Center City. That's all it was, this veto. Thank you, Madam Chair.

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Councilman Mariano

Thank you, Madam President. You know, I probably shouldn't say this and that's how I get in trouble around here, but I just can't help myself. That's probably one of the biggest untruths I ever heard in Council. You know, I mean, the Councilman fought all along for a district, and then when it comes to a chance to do something for the people that he's supposed to represent here in Council, who he's been telling me he represented for the six years I've been sitting here, then he changes the vote and then cops a plea afterwards. In my neighborhood, Councilman -- I SPEECHES don't know what that's called in your neighborhood, but in my neighborhood, it's just no intestinal fortitude. Sometimes you just got to do what's right. Thank you, Madam President.

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Councilman Clarke

Thank you, Madam President. Madam President, all due respect to the Councilman, at least in my mind, this was not just about Center City. This was about a dilution in votes in the most densely populated portion of the 5th District that required that I then move northward and eastward and acquire a substantial amount of wards and divisions that were populated extremely highly by the Latino population. If I had not had to move as far northward and eastward, those divisions could have been put in the existing 7th Councilmatic District and increased the percentages as it relates to this particular bill. So it was not just about Center City, in all due respect, sir Thank you, Madam President.

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Councilman Ortiz

Madam chair, I've been in this Council many, many years. The words that I use, I use very carefully. I don't think that I have ever used a word to question someone else's intellect, valor, whatever. It's about ideas, it's about concepts. Some people may not understand that. But I stood on this Council many times by myself on the issues that I believe in. Again, people had an opportunity, the representative from the 7th District had an opportunity to really advocate for a district during the term that we used to create the redistricting plan; he did not use that. He did not create a plan, he did not go forward and say, We need a 45, and I will not accept anything less than that. He didn't say that. He voted for the plan. He voted for the plan. I didn't vote for the plan. However, when the override comes, I look at this body, and this is (indiscernible), which I've grown to respect, which I've grown to understand over the last 17 years. We're a legislative body, that's all that we are. I do not SPEECHES believe that this represented what I thought it represented and I voted accordingly. Let's see what happens in the following weeks when we create a new map. Let's see what happens and who supports what, because I would like to see that. I would like to see a commitment of at least a 45 percent district in the 7th Councilmatic, because that's where it grew and that's where it should be.

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Councilman Mariano

This could probably go on and on all afternoon but, you know, sometimes enough's enough with the rhetoric. When both Latino groups came to me -- and I'm sure all of the other Councilpeople in this room, I said to them, I know what I said. I said, what do you need? what do you want? how big of a district? They said, Councilman, we're looking 43, 44 percent. We have 38 percent citywide. I said, You may be selling yourself a little short; it may be higher than 38 percent. They said, We'd be very happy with a 40 percent. One of the young men in that group, I said, Let me understand what you're SPEECHES saying, and there was other people from my staff and some other people present. I think Ed Nielson (ph.) was in the room from the Electricians Union. And we said to that group -- I said, now 40 percent, right? And I said 40 percent in my mind is 39.6 percent, 39.7, 39.8, 39.9, that's 40 percent. Okay, that's 40 percent. Are you clear with that? And they said yeah, both groups. If 45 percent was what someone wanted, they should have said it. Now, I don't want to -- you know, I saw what went on here today and I'm personally offended by it. And I'm sure everyone in my district that looks around and tries to use the at-large people for what good they're good and they're good, and that's one of the reasons. The Councilman is the one that hangs by -- that hides behind that banner all the time, not me. I'm the one with the district that's 40 percent, maybe 45 percent, and I'm okay with that, I'm fine with it. But I think everyone -- if we're going to give speeches, let's tell the truth, you know, let's not say one thing to the press and in private say something different. Thank you, Madam President. And I'm SPEECHES willing to go on all day if he wants to go on. I have my yogurt and I'm happy

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Councilman Goode

Thank you, Madam President. Needless to say, this is a difficult day in City Council; it's a day which didn't have to happen, and actually, I wish it happened next week. I believe that had it happened next week, the outcome might have been different. It was my every intention to vote to override the veto. I can say that as much as people want to frame this as a duel between the Mayor and yourself, I'm not choosing between you and the Mayor. As much as people want to make this a duel between the Mayor and Senator Fumo, that's not even -- the senator does not represent me. In the end, what happened today, which shouldn't have had to happen, was a split in Council leadership. I think that's what we need to consider and we need to mend whatever has been broken today. Thank you.

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Councilman Cohen

Thank you, Madam President. As a follow-up to what Councilman Goode just said, I think the Council made a terrible error on Bill 629, for which it will suffer and the citizens of Philadelphia will suffer, because there will be no peace in this Council until 629, if it gets signed, by the Mayor is repealed. That's number one. Number two, today, in one sense, was a very great day for City Council. I regret the fact that the Mayor's veto were not overridden, but at least we got started on acting like a legislative body. I think it's dead wrong that the Mayor should try to control Council as well as the mayoralty. He did that when he was president of City Council. He operated very closely, never shared information with the other members of Council. For him to attempt at this stage of the day to control City Council, I think, represents a very bad judgment call by the Mayor, and I hope he understands that. But today, this City Council, I believe, began to reassert itself and began to reassert its SPEECHES responsibility to the citizens of Philadelphia to act as an independent legislative body. And I believe, Madam President, that before we're done, the redistricting bills 0and the bill with respect to the public schools will show that Council is an independent body. This is a mayor who plans on throwing away the public school system in Philadelphia. This is a man who, without any consultation with any member of City Council, urged the governor to take over the public school system in Philadelphia. I've never heard of such a single disgraceful act for a chief executive of the city to do as the Mayor has done. Today City Council has really begun to act independently. We had a majority in City Council today who believe that City Council ought to make the decisions, because in both cases, the majority voted to override. It did not -- the majority did not vote to sustain the veto. The Mayor won a technical victory because of the fact that to sustain a veto, you need only approximately one-third of the City Council. I congratulate the City Council on its actions with respect to the two bills that were put SPEECHES before it on the question of overriding the Mayor's veto. I think we're going to work that out ultimately in a way that respects City Council. I do regret again, as I say. The action taken on 629, but the will of the people on 629 will assert itself, and it will assert itself at whatever cost it takes, at whatever price has to be paid, and under any form; as will the people's will to maintain a public school system in Philadelphia and not permit its privatization. Thank you, Madam President.

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Councilwoman Blackwell

That's all right. Thank you. There is no break in leadership. I believe in my president, I believe in Council, I believe in the value and the leadership abilities of everybody here and in their sincerity in not only leading their districts but in trying to do the best for all of the citizens in our city. Certainly, I believe even now that the best will come out of all of this. And I believe that leadership dictates that we have to find a way to make everybody feel that they're included. I heard my colleague talk about there's been some debate about Latino districts, about all of that, all of that. We a city made up of all ethnic groups, and certainly that is as it should be. And I believe that out of this, good will come so that all people will feel that they are included. Let me say that from the inception of our president's term, when the Mayor was president of Council, our city with a in economic straits, and we worked very hard to support him and the former mayor because we had to to bring our city to a certainly economic stability. When President Verna came on SPEECHES board, we were ready to be our own body, and we are. I believe in this body. I believe in the value and the abilities of everybody here. And, again, I will reiterate that I believe the best will come out of this because it gives everybody a chance to work it out. I don't believe that we can't work out issues that only involve a few thousand people in a city this size. You mean we can't work it out, we can't be positive, we can't show that we can feel, make everybody feel that they're included so that John and Jane Q. Public realize we care about them, that we are not -- that the debate is not about who wants or who doesn't want certain communities, but that the debate is about everybody feeling they have a place in redistricting, that we are proud to represent them, and that we can do it in a way so that we're all satisfied? I don't think it's worth a debate, I don't think we should walk out of here with ill feelings about one another over -- because of a few thousand people. We love our citizens in this city, we certainly respect that -- at least we respect one another. I respect each and every one of you, I SPEECHES support each and every one of you, and I'm looking forward to us working this out to the betterment of all. Thank you, Madam President.

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Councilman Kenney

Thank you, Madam President. I just finished reading a book called "All Politics Is Local," written by Tip O'Neill. It's a very short book and it has in there a number of statements and stories and little anecdotes about his career. And one of the top things that he says that makes legislative bodies work and that makes people have collegial attitudes toward each other, open-mindedness towards each other. The one mantra that he has is that your word is your bond, your word is your bond, and without that simple tenet -

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Councilman Kenney

-- and will never be a SPEECHES force, will never be a part of the process that we have in this government. This -- the framers of our charter understood that they were creating a strong mayoral form of government, and that's what we have, and that is a good thing. But we as a legislative body have a role. And if we allow, after we've expressed our vote, 15 to 2, 17 to 0, if we allow ourselves to be manipulated, if we allow ourselves to have our arms twisted, if we allow ourselves to be intimidated, if we allow ourselves to be moved from one side to the other willy-nilly every other day, we will never have the credibility that's necessary to do our job. Not to beat the mayor, not to be the top dog on the ladder, but to fulfill our duties as legislators, to be able to do our jobs in an independent and careful and responsible way. And unless we decide, 17 of us decide, that we are going to work as a body, we are going to allow our leadership to lead us, 'cause let me tell you something, I voted for all three members of leadership, all three members of leadership against men. A male voting against men to break the glass ceiling, to have this kind of leadership. And if I SPEECHES can't depend on people's word and people's bonds, if we're being allowed to be whip-sawed in this chamber on this issue, on stadiums, on whatever it is, we might as well mail our votes in and allow a single branch of government to run this city. And if that's the case then fine, let us all say that's what we're going to do. But I'll tell you what, in the last month, up until today, I felt proud to be a member of this body, I felt proud that we were actually sitting there across the table from each other, going to people's offices, talking to them, even if they didn't agree with you. I was trying to get Bill 505 passed; I had nine votes today, I had nine votes today, but I held it because some of the votes changed, and I understand the pressure that a lot of people have been put under, and I think that pressure is unfair, because this is a debate about ideas and issues. And if you can't express yourself and then not be put upon, pounced upon by various interests and then have your vote change -- see, to me, I think that's what our real problem is. And until we decide as 17 members of this body to stand up and do our jobs and to work SPEECHES together and to support our leadership, then we're not really going to be a part of this process. And every major issue that comes down this road, we're going to have the same problem with. And I'll tell you the truth, I was going to give a speech today about how proud I was to be a member of this body, how I felt for the first time in ten years this January that we really did stick together and do the right thing by everyone, with the exception of Councilmember Cohen's position on 629, which I will give him his due, he has his purpose, but when it -- he has his right to express his view. But I've sat across the desk of many people in this body in the last month -- maybe for the first time sometime, and that's my fault, I should have reached out and branched out and tried to do better to get along with my colleagues. But in the last month or so, I have had the opportunity to sit across a desk, look in people's eyes, and say you know what, I can respect where you're coming from, you can respect where I'm coming from, and we will try to get ourselves where we want to be as a legislative body, and then we allow ourselves to SPEECHES have our arms twisted up our back over -- not the Latinos, this has got nothing to do with the Latino district, absolutely nothing to do. This has got something more to do with the control of development and campaign dollars in Center City. This is what it's about, this is what it's always been about, and that's why Bill 505 is absolutely and totally necessary. If we had passed Bill 505 some time ago, we wouldn't be arguing about the 8th Ward, we wouldn't be arguing about the 5th Ward.

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Councilman Kenney

We wouldn't be having people in the Administration trying to manipulate the one role that is soley our role. The districts created so we represent them, it's our business. Other issues that come before this City Council, there are economic-development issues, there are other important issues, and we have to work with the Mayor to do these kinds of things. But this is our business, and if we allow our business to be disrupted, to be manipulated, then we get what we deserve. And when issues come down the pike that we're concerned about that you need our support for, we should stick together, but we're not sticking together, and until we learn to SPEECHES stick together -- 15 to 2 means 15 to 2. It doesn't mean, Well, maybe it's 15 to 2 and I'll change and I'll get a couple phone calls and maybe I'll change, and if somebody grabs me in the hallway, then maybe I'll flip it. It's 15 to 2, 17 to 0. If you can't stand by your vote, you should have voted no in the first place. So I am -- I feel badly today, not because we lost. We didn't lose. It's an issue -- we'll resolve it. Councilmember Blackwell's right, we'll figure out a way to fix this. But what we lost today was our independence, and unless we get that independence back, there's no reason for this body to exist. Thank you, Madam President. )

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Councilman Cohen

Well, I'll tell you where I'd like to take it because I think Council acted wrongly two ways on the substance, we've discussed. But before there was even a hearing on this bill, I was informed that an overwhelming number of Councilmembers were committed to support Councilman DiCicco for one reason or for another. They hadn't heard a single argument about 629, but they were for Councilman DiCicco. When you say your word is your bond, that means -- that's a good thing, but it also carries with it a responsibility, that when you begin to understand an issue, you open your mind up and you say if you believe you were wrong, I believe I was wrong, and a number of members did that today and voted to defeat Bill 629. But if this Council is to maintain integrity. Let's not just accuse the Mayor of making little political deals. A political deal was made for 629 to permit developers to run rampant throughout the City. Now, that's what hurts, because our responsibility is to the people of SPEECHES Philadelphia. That responsibility was not met today because of a failing of City Council. This crazy notion that issues don't count but that I give my word to somebody when I don't even know the words. I take umbrage by District Councilwoman Miller for voting against the communities in her 8th Councilmatic District today. I don't understand how she did that, to say to them that you're going to be excluded from having your right.

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Councilman Cohen

Oh, I'm sorry, okay. I thought she was here. I'm opposed to all of these District Councilmembers. Richardson Dilworth was right when he said a majority of the membership of City Council ought to consist of Councilmembers-at-large because they have an overall view. Well, each district tends to be very narrow, selfish about its own particular interests. There's nothing wrong with a District Councilman being selfish and wanting things for his district, but a District Councilman has the same responsibility as Councilmembers-at-large to SPEECHES think of the whole city. And this notion of just getting a commitment to take away the rights of Philadelphians is dead wrong. And this is why I disagree with Councilman Kenney. There's no way to be proud of a body that takes its responsibility so loosely that it makes commitments without concern for the issues. So when we talk about changes, we've got to include our own procedures in City Council. Thank you very much, Madam President.

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Councilman Clarke

Thank you, Madam President. I'll be real brief. I promise. Madam Council President, I cannot sit here and listen to references about the Mayor and the Administration putting pressure, as if that is the only body or the only entity that does that. During the hearing on the redistricting bill leading up to that particular hearing, I thought I had it, which was nine votes. That morning, I no longer had nine votes, and it was -- and people were pressured. They were not pressured by the Mayor, all right? They were pressured by outside sources. And I SPEECHES understand that. You know, people told me -- at least they told me to my face that they had to do what they had to do. So I think this goes on across the spectrum; it's not just the Administration. I'm not acknowledging that the administration did that in this particular case. So, you know, to sit here and to imply that somehow that that particular arm-twisting was only on behalf of the Mayor, I think, is disingenuous. Thank you, Madam President.

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Councilwoman Tasco

Thank you, Madam President. I think there's been a struggle today. There's been some victories and some disappointments, but I think it's good that we can do, that we live in a democracy where people can have their view and have their say. Sometimes your view will prevail and sometimes it won't prevail. I do regret, though, that this issue of the redistricting reduced itself to a power struggle, and to say that it was anything else would SPEECHES be disingenuous. We all know what it was all about. However, I question where do we go from here, 'cause the discussion and the debate was not about the Latino district; it was about three divisions. And how do we resolve that. And I ask each of my colleagues, when we go back to the drawing table to address this issue, if I decide that I don't like what I get, do I get a veto? Does Councilwoman Blackwell decide when she doesn't get what she wants that we get a veto? How often will we veto this bill? Because I believe that nine District Councilmembers agreed upon the plan that was presented, and none of us voiced any opposition to the districts that we got. I did not particularly like moving my district further northeast; I would have preferred it to go in another way, but I sought to compromise to accommodate the Latino district. So as we deliberate in the next few months -- because I don't believe the issue will be resolved very quickly, because the issue was not about the redistricting; the issue was about who the power. And to say anything other than that would be disingenuous. SPEECHES I do hope we come to a resolution on it. I agree with Councilwoman Blackwell that we may not always be together on everything. As leadership, we should struggle and try to be together. I do agree with Councilman Kenney: Your word is your bond and that's why I ended up voting for Bill 629 because early on, I supported Councilman DiCicco because I understood the problems. I am a District Councilperson who spends a lot of time, I have a staff person who represents my office before the Zoning Board. We struggle with this and we talked about this based on the experiences we've had with zoning in our district, and we talked about examples that I've had in my district where this bill would be very beneficial. And if you had 67 counties, 66 counties in the State with the -- that has the same legislation, I mean, I was puzzled about Philadelphia and why we were left out. So, you know, while we -- some people voted for it, some people voted against it. Some people voted for another bill so -- it was just really wonderful to see how people voted different interests so you don't come down on one side or the SPEECHES other. I think we voted based on how we believed in the issue. But I do hope that we -- and I believe we will continue to exercise a democratic process that is so important in this country and that we are sending our people across the country to fight for. Thank you very much.

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Councilman Kenney

Thank you, Madam President. Just quickly. I know a number of people speaking today SPEECHES are trying to minimalize the issue by talking about three little -- minimize the issue, thank you, about three little divisions. Council technical staff knows quite well that those three little divisions could cause, and have caused, when you try to move them, a domino-like affect, affecting not only the district involved but the district to the east, the to the west, the district to the north. I mean, I've seen the Council tech staff go through months and months of hard work and energy, trying to make everyone as happy as possible. Obviously, everyone wasn't as happy as possible. But to cull it down to three little divisions is understating the problem that we face, because as we change these three little divisions other divisions and other areas of the City and other districts change with them. And those District Council people may or may not be happy with those changes. So I know it may amount to three divisions in what people appear it to be, but it could be 60, 70, 80 divisions by the time we start moving these lines around again. So three little divisions is an understatement, SPEECHES thank you.

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Councilman Cohen

I see it's merely noon. Councilman DiCicco referred to a Council meeting at which he and I had differences of opinion at 2 in the morning. As far as I'm concerned, this can last until then, because I think it's very important to get some things resolved. I disagree strongly and vehemently with Councilwoman Tasco's votes on 629, but I think she's right about one thing: I think this is going to be a very difficult thing, a very, very difficult thing to resolve. And, therefore, I think we as members of Council ought to be planning ahead financially to see how we're going to live, because none of us are going to get paid until this is resolved. And in my opinion, this is going to be an enormously difficult period of time for us financially. Thank you, madam President.

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Council President Verna

It has been moved and seconded that Council stand adjourned until Thursday, October 11th, at 10 o'clock a.m. All in favor will say aye. Those opposed? The ayes have it and Council will stand adjourned until October the 11th. Thank you. (Proceedings end at 12:05 a.m.) CERTIFICATE I HEREBY CERTIFY that the foregoing proceedings of the Council of the City of Philadelphia of Thursday, October 4, 2001, are contained fully and accurately in the stenographic notes taken by me upon, and that this is a true and correct transcript of same. RE: STATED MEETING _______________________________, Josephine Cardillo Registered Professional Reporter and Notary Public (The foregoing certification of this transcript does not apply to any reproduction of the same by any means, unless under the direct control and/or supervision of the certifying reporter.)

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