And that was 23 60 million total, and there are 54 libraries? 24
That's correct. 25 And I do want to mention that the 120 11/29/00 PUB. PROP. PUB. WORKS - RES. 553 William Penn Foundation money, if we were to add that William Penn Foundation money, it was part of that 35 that went beyond that because it had purposes that were beyond the mere renovation and the putting the technology in the branches.
Now, is it also my recollection that in that same transaction -- and I think there was maybe a little bit of controversy with it but I think we ultimately worked it out. Some of the City dollars, did they end up over at the Foundation as a way of speeding up the work? I mean, it's a fairly significant amount of work that was all done pretty much at the same time, at least according to general City standards. Is that correct?
Yeah. There was a special arrangement that was made, worked with the -- out through the -- of course, with the City Solicitor's Office help whereby the Library Foundation was able to manage those monies, both the private money and the public money together. And as I said earlier, we believe that that is one of the reasons why the projects were able to be done as quickly -- and, again, using union labor. 121 11/29/00 PUB. PROP. PUB. WORKS - RES. 553
Yeah, I understand. And I think we used somewhat of a similar model to help speed along renovations for the new U.S. Airways terminal out at the International Airport. It's about a $500 million project. With regard to the $60 million, I'm sure you've heard on more than one occasion that we are starting to reach our debt ceiling limit on how much money the City can borrow. We've had a lot of that discussion earlier this year with the City capital budget and discussions about Veterans Stadium repairs and the like. In that context, have you explored the prospect of utilizing financing tools or mechanisms by outside quasi-governmental agencies or authorities for them to do a bond offering on behalf of the library, and then the City would then be in a position to pay the debt service on that and not have the $60 million go against the City's debt capacity? 122 11/29/00 PUB. PROP. PUB. WORKS - RES. 553
Councilman, we haven't begun to support that. It's my sense that once there is a commitment that we have to find a way to go ahead. Then the path is clear to begin those discussions with the various quasi- governmental organizations. But there needs to be a commitment that this is something that the City government wants to do.
Thank you Mr. Chairman. Good afternoon now. Mr. Shelkrot, in the earlier chart, I noticed the disparity in terms of the number of facilities in the various Council districts, and unfortunately, I was kind of low on the totem pole. Can you give me a history of how or why that happens and continues to be as such?
Well, to be honest, although I've been here 13 years, I don't know exactly how the history evolved. 123 11/29/00 PUB. PROP. PUB. WORKS - RES. 553 I will be quite frank with you. In a meeting I had recently with now-Secretary Augusta Clark, she explained to me the political aspect of very powerful people in different Councilmatic districts over the years who -- what can I say -- made it happen through the processes of Council and the Administration, that there were additional branches built in their communities. The -- there certainly is an imbalance but --
We used to have a pretty powerful Councilman in the 5th District.
The reason I asked you about the history of it is 'cause, you know, it's clear that some of the facilities are older than the others and, I mean, it could potentially be that some of these were built 20, 30, 40 years ago, before any of us were here.
That's correct. 124 11/29/00 PUB. PROP. PUB. WORKS - RES. 553
Well, I think from a historic perspective, you know, in the last -- in the last years, the last years since I have 7 been here, there has been one new library built, 8 and that's the one up on Ogontz Avenue. 9
There is now to be 11 another one that will be opened in Councilman 12 DiCicco's area, and that is -- that will be opened 13 in January. But that's all. There have been no 14 new libraries built in that length of time. I might -- there may be somebody on the staff who can testimony how long it was before that that we opened a new library. How long? (Discussion among Mr. Shelkrot and colleagues off the record).
Okay, 1978 was the library before the one that opened on Ogontz Avenue. So it's been a long time.
So -- and I know, 125 11/29/00 PUB. PROP. PUB. WORKS - RES. 553 you know, you probably can't answer that because you weren't here, but I'm trying to get a sense of the policy associated with facilities, I guess, in the past. Is it determined more by politics or by some set of guidelines as it relates to the population or the need? Or as we move ahead, you know, I'd like to get that number up 'cause that's a little embarrassing over there. And I just need to know, should I try and exert some level of politics or influence with my friends and my colleagues on this Council to get that number up? Or should I look from a policy perspective?
I believe that it would be from a policy perspective, not the library, but within City government, within Council and, of course, the Administration. The task has -- you know, when I arrived in Philadelphia, the policy of the Library Board had been for many, many years no new libraries because, and simply because -- it's not that they didn't believe that there was a need for libraries, but simply because the operating budget was being trimmed again and again and again. And what it meant was, there were facilities out there 126 11/29/00 PUB. PROP. PUB. WORKS - RES. 553 but they were not really providing library services. I mean, my predecessor told me once it was, in his mind, a sham that we were calling these "libraries" because they were so poorly staffed. We have been able to staff our libraries now, as you know, and provide what I think is high-quality service. The challenge of building new libraries is a challenge of making sure that there's no only the capital money but also the operating money year in and year out in the future to provide those services.
If I could just add. When I first joined the Board of Trustees, one of the earliest debates we had was, because there wasn't enough money, how do you pick which branch libraries to close? I hope I never, ever have to participate in such a debate and discussion again. We were able to then initiate the Changing Lives Campaign so that we were able to keep them all open and, in fact, renovate them through the wonderful public-private partnership that was developed with the City Administration 127 11/29/00 PUB. PROP. PUB. WORKS - RES. 553 and our fund-raising efforts. I don't ever want to ever see this city debating again which libraries to close.
Okay. Can I ask you a similar question that I asked Mr. White earlier about -- because of, you know, our operating budget and our limitations on the capital side that we look at some creative methods of assisting the individuals who head up these libraries throughout our various communities, that are not necessarily -- definitely are not run by the City of Philadelphia but are staffed most of the time by volunteers but simply don't have the materials to have a productive facility. So, you know, I would like to ask you to give me some help on that.
Sure, absolutely. And we -- Councilman, we have programs that are designed to help with that, and we'd be very pleased to talk with you about some of those community locations and organizations who need additional support with books and the kind of things our library services can do. So I'd be happy to talk with you or a member of your staff 128 11/29/00 PUB. PROP. PUB. WORKS - RES. 553 about making sure that those community centers and those entities that are not, you know, libraries have those resources.
Thank you very much. Certainly, it is obvious, I'm sure, to you that the Council supports the library renovations. Of course, as you know, knowing my area, Mr. Shelkrot, I have to mention Walnut West or they will tie me to a tree and light me up. So could you comment on Walnut West, please.
Certainty. The Walnut West Library, as Councilwoman Blackwell knows very well, has been closed for several years now. It was planned to be renovated quite a few years ago, but when the work began, we found that there were structural issues there, that the workmen came out and said, We cannot continue to work there, there are things that -- it just was unsafe. 129 11/29/00 PUB. PROP. PUB. WORKS - RES. 553 We are now -- I won't go through the whole history, but we are now at a point where -- where we are awaiting a final report with the dollars attached to it which, will let us know from a financial point of view whether it is best to tear the existing building down and rebuild or whether the existing structure can be saved and we can build within that existing structure. That report is due this week, that final report. We've gotten preliminary information, but without the dollars, which of course, are critical. We will then take that and work with the Space Allocation Committee and the City Administration, and we have had preliminary discussions with them, and we will move ahead and meet with you and talk to the community, if you suggest that we do that, about the next step. Whether it is a -- if we can financially and responsibly keep the existing building, that's exactly what we want to do and just renovate the insides and fix those structural issues that were identified when the project came to a halt several years ago.
Thank you very 130 11/29/00 PUB. PROP. PUB. WORKS - RES. 553 much. And as you realize, the community wants to preserve that Carnegie building.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman Mr. Kerr, you outlined for us very neatly the formula that you are going to use that will move you towards the 120 million, with the anchor piece being public-private partnership. Much is to be learned from how other like-cities are addressing this type of challenge. Could either you or Mr. Shelkrot let us know how some of the other cities have met the challenge that you are now confronted with.
I can start. It's -- and I'm going to let Mr. Shelkrot primarily answer your question.
I think what we've established here as a public-private partnership 131 11/29/00 PUB. PROP. PUB. WORKS - RES. 553 is quite unique because, as I understand it, in many other cities, either libraries have their own ability to issue bonds or they have their own independent tax stream that's dedicated to the library or whatever. So it's extraordinary, as I have met with other chairs of libraries around the country, how different the financial challenges are that each city has faced. And I'm sure there is some creativity that can be used here, as was suggested before. But I have not heard of anything quite like the public-private partnership that we were able to put together. And what was also unique here was doing the neighborhoods first. And that's something we're very proud of. And I'll let Mr. Shelkrot --
I have a list of a variety of main central library projects that were done over the last five to ten years across the country, and almost every one of them were done with predominantly public money. Again, it's -- you know, other cities are not faced with the bonding limitations that we are in Philadelphia, and it creates a different kind of challenge for 132 11/29/00 PUB. PROP. PUB. WORKS - RES. 553 us in Philadelphia than it does in other cities. So, you know, the simple answer is, yes, many other cities used for the bulk of the construction and renovation bond money. But our situation in Philadelphia is different, and we have to figure out a way to solve the problem for Philadelphia.
And work within those limitations. One final question. In one of your slides here, you mentioned several constituencies. One of them was tourists. Share with me and for those of us who may not be aware of the kinds of ways that you engage tourists at the Free Library, which to me sounds a bit remarkable, that you've been creative enough to find a way to attract tourists to the Free Library Main Branch.
Well, I can tell you that our ability to do that is very limited because of the -- again, because of the physical structure. We have done some things. We bring in, for a speakers series that we have, about 6 to 8 in the spring and 6 to 8 in the fall, we bring 133 11/29/00 PUB. PROP. PUB. WORKS - RES. 553 people in from New Jersey, we bring people in from certainly the suburbs. The restaurants in our area are delighted because they're always full that evening. But the opportunity for reaching out to tourists has not been met because the -- those things that we have in the Central Library that would attract tourists from all over the region and beyond, you can't get to. I mean, I think, for example, of -- we saw a picture of what that automobile history collection is. I mean, that has, as was stated earlier, the finest collection of shop manuals, owner's manuals, advertising literature, pictures, photos, designs. A car buff, whether it be a youngster who's working on a car or a person who collects fancy cars, across the board, that would be a major attraction to people if we had a way to make it visible and available for people to see. If we look at our theater collection, because, as was mentioned earlier, our theater collection -- you know, musical theater especially started in Philadelphia. There was a day when Philadelphia was the mecca of theater, just as New 134 11/29/00 PUB. PROP. PUB. WORKS - RES. 553 York is now. And we have the pictures, the photos, the play bills of those days. And to be able to show those, it would be a draw for people, you know, from hundreds of miles. And it can go on and on. But the potential for tourism is there, but it just hasn't been --
If I could just add, we have one of the, I think, the finest collection of Beatrice Potter outside of the United Kingdom; people come to see that. We have an extraordinary prints collection, Arthur Rakum (ph.), really first-class, one of the finest children's collections. People would love to come and take more advantage of those treasures.
Thank you very much, gentlemen. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Thank you very much. Are any other questions? That brings 135 11/29/00 PUB. PROP. PUB. WORKS - RES. 553 us -- I'm sorry, Councilman -- almost to the end. Councilman Nutter.
Thank you. Mr. Shelkrot, I do want to strongly encourage finalization to the Walnut West Library. Now, that is obviously in Councilwoman Blackwell's district and she has talked about it. I do want to lend my voice in support to that particular library. I've used that library in my younger days of my life, when I was actually, you know, kind of doing homework from time to time, when I wasn't at the Cobbs Creek library, but also when I was in college. That library has been closed for some extended period of time, and I know that there are some unique situations with a couple of libraries that are not completed. We've also talked about one in my district as well. It seems to me, though, that with the incredible amount of construction activity that is literally surrounding that library as it sits on the University of Pennsylvania campus, and with some of the recent things that we heard about the University project that I think for the moment has 136 11/29/00 PUB. PROP. PUB. WORKS - RES. 553 stalled, it seems to me that between the City of Philadelphia, the Library, and the Library Foundation, and the University of Pennsylvania working with Councilwoman Blackwell, there is really not much reason for that library to be closed much longer. And the people out there, whether residents or students, should have an opportunity to go to that facility.
Thank you very much. That is -- that concludes our witness list. If there's nothing else from anyone in the audience, that will conclude our public hearing. - - -
We will now enter into our public meeting, and the Chair recognizes Councilmember Nutter for a motion on Bill No. 585, with a suspension of the rules.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I move that Bill 000585 be reported out of committee with a favorable recommendation and a further recommendation and a 137 11/29/00 PUB. PROP. PUB. WORKS - RES. 553 further recommendation that the rules of Council be suspended so as to permit first reading at our next session. (Duly seconded.)
It's been moved and seconded. All in favor, aye. There are none opposed. Bill 585 will be reported out of this committee with a favorable recommendation and a request be made for a suspension of the rules to allow for first reading at our next Council session. Thank you very much for your attention. This concludes the business of the committee. Thank you. (Adjourned at 1:00 p.m.) - - - 138 C E R T I F I C A T E I HEREBY CERTIFY that the foregoing proceedings of the Council of the City of Philadelphia of Wednesday, November 29, 2000, were reported fully and accurately by me, and that this is a correct transcript of same. RE: COMMITTEE ON PUBLIC PROPERTY, PUBLIC WORKS BILL NO. 000585, RESOLUTION NO. 000553 __________________________________, JOSEPHINE CARDILLO, Registered Professional Reporter