Committee Hearing, April 17, 2007

COUNCIL OF THE CITY OF PHILADELPHIA COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - BUDGET - - - Room 400, City Hall Philadelphia, Pennsylvania Tuesday, April 17, 2007 10:15 a.m. - - - PRESENT: COUNCIL PRESIDENT ANNA C. VERNA COUNCILWOMAN JANNIE BLACKWELL COUNCILMAN DARRELL L. CLARKE COUNCILMAN W. WILSON GOODE, JR. COUNCILMAN WILLIAM GREENLEE COUNCILMAN JACK KELLY COUNCILWOMAN DONNA REED MILLER COUNCILMAN FRANK RIZZO COUNCILMAN DANIEL SAVAGE BILLS 070114, 070115 and 070116 RESOLUTION 070128 - - - V A R A L L O Incorporated Litigation Support Services Eleven Penn Center 1835 Market Street, Suite 600 Philadelphia, Pennsylvania 19103 215.561.2220 215.567.2670 2

Good morning. This is the continued public hearing of the Committee of the Whole. Mr. McPherson, who is our first department? MR. McPHERSON: Department of Licenses and Inspections.

Good morning, Commissioner. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Good morning, Council President Verna.

Please identify yourself for the record and proceed with your testimony. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: I'm Robert Solvibile, Commissioner of Licensing and Inspections.

And, Commissioner, if you can abbreviate your testimony, we will give a copy to the stenographer and it will be transcribed in full. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Thank you. Yes. 3 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. Good morning, Council President Verna and members of Council. I am Robert D. Solvibile, Sr., Commissioner of the Department of License and Inspections. Accompanying me today are key members of the Department's management team, including Deputy Commissioner Fran Burns to my left, behind me Deputy Commissioner Eileen Evans and Dominic Verdi, and our Administrative Services Director to my right, Bridget Collins-Greenwald. We appreciate the opportunity to present our Fiscal Year 2008 Operating Budget to City Council and to provide you with our plans for the upcoming year, as well as our recent accomplishments. Fiscal Year 2008 budget request: The Department of License and Inspections is requesting a total Fiscal Year '08 budget of $45,925,020, of which $29,295,545 is in the City's General Fund and $15,865,950 is in the Grant Revenue Fund and $763,525 is in the Community 4 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. Development Fund. For the General Fund breakout, we are requesting $17,204,191 in Class 100, $11,506,856 in Class 200 and $293,450 in Class 300 and $291,048 in Class 400. The General Fund budget represents a total overall increase of $690,622 from Fiscal Year '07 estimated obligations. This reflects the four percent contractual wage increase and an increase of two million in Class 200 for demolition funding and an additional $220,069 in Class 100 to transition the NTI program back to L&I, and an additional $92,333 in Class 100 for the enforcement of Act 39 and is offset by a 2.5 general budget cut. The Fiscal Year '08 request will fund 374 General Fund positions and includes a total of $10 million in demolition funding. As always, we will continue to prioritize emergency and public safety concerns and will maximize productivity with current resources. 5 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. After years of talking about automation plans, I can finally come before you and say that L&I has achieved its automation goal. Specific improvements that LICA, License and Inspections' Concerted Approach, include the ability to view full property history, which includes all complaints, licenses, permits and violations; The ability to print violations from any desktop or portable device; A professional quality to all documents; An enhanced integration between units. The Permit Service Division is electronically impeded from issuing permits if contractors are not in the system or not legally licensed. On the same note, the issuance of licenses and permits is withheld if there is existing dangerous building violations; Reinspections are automatically sent to inspectors. Prior to Hansen, reinspections were printed by clerical 6 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. staff and assigned by managers on paper, making it challenging to manage and track the workload; Violations get to the public faster; Employee work assignments are on the desktop; Fast form building permits are available online for credit card purchase; L&I and the Revenue Department have two electronic interfaces. As the public makes payment through the Revenue Department, the payment automatically updates our Hansen license records. As business privilege tax, BPT, numbers are obtained by the Revenue Department, the numbers are sent to the L&I Hansen database and a business privilege license bill is mailed to the business privilege applicant; Management reports are more accessible and user friendly; and Our data is in an Oracle 7 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. database, making us better poised to technologically advance. That concludes my shortened version and I welcome your questions.

Thank you, Commissioner. Your Class 100 budget was increased by $92,333 for Act 39 enforcement and $220,069 for NTI transition. Can you tell us the number of employees associated with each of these increases? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Act 39 is one -- it's a service representative who will help process the paperwork of the expected hearings that we'll have and help us manage the workload, the hearings that will happen in front of a Board that we've asked the Mayor to appoint.

Did you say one service representative? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: And also it will help with the

Yes. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Four employees, inspectors and a clerical procurement specialist.

I'm sorry. Do you mind repeating that? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Part of what we've asked is for a procurement specialist to work with the Contractual Services Unit to better prepare their documentation to procurement and to have better tracking of what we bid and how we bid it, the dangerous buildings. And the others will be inspectors to help us support the workload of inspecting dangerous buildings.

Can you tell us what impact, if any, City Council will have on both of these issues? 9 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: The idea to transition back in the NTI, as I've testified in the past, is to take best practices that L&I always performed and the best practices that we learned from the NTI program. And obviously the Council input is always available to us for direction as to pointing out from your constituents which buildings are falling as we -- as you know, we're complaint driven in most cases. Sometimes we find it ourselves. And also, there will be a planned demolition in the sense that if we're on a block with an imminently dangerous building -- and this is still being created, Council President. It's not in stone yet. But if we're on a block with an imminently dangerous building, we would look at the whole block to make sure that we're not leaving something that should be treated by us, and it may even be as simple as a clean and seal or an additional demolition or two on that block. 10 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC.

Thank you. Can you explain how the Act 39 enforcement unit will operate? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Basically the Act 39 -- our 990 inspectors, the business compliance inspectors, when an appeal takes place, when someone appeals the designation and there's a posting requirement, we'll give out the paperwork to people who come and apply for a hearing and we will spot check about 30 percent, maybe 40 percent to make sure that it's properly posted. In some cases -- then the public has an opportunity to again protest, as you are aware, the application. And we will have hearing dates that will be online, the location that the hearing is for, the time and the place. And we anticipate the need for at least three days a week full time. The Board that will be appointed should be a full-time Board that at least three, maybe four days a 11 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. week will have hearings from morning to evening, and basically that's the way we anticipate it working. And, again, we're still putting that together. We have the Board part down and a pretty decent plan that was created by a lady who just retired. We asked her before she left if she would put the Act 39 -- she was the Administrator for the Board, Claire Gatzmer. And she did that for us and we have a pretty good plan. Now it's to get the kinks out and get the implementation going. I think that we'll have a good program for it, though.

What will be the salary of the service rep? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: The service rep, it's about 40 counting benies.

I beg your pardon? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: It's about $40,000 counting the benefit 12 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. package, 40,133 counting the benefits package.

Point of information.

The Chair recognizes Councilman Rizzo for a point of information.

What's the value of the benefit package? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: I'm sorry, Councilman. Council President, I misspoke. It's not counting packages. It's not counting the benefits package. I'm sorry.

What is the value of the benefit package, just for knowledge? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: I'm told between and 40 percent is the 22 benefits package, the cost of each 23 employee. 24

So the value 25 of that job is 40, plus the benefit 13 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. package? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: That would be correct.

Thank you. Thank you, Madam Chair.

You're welcome. Do we know who the three-panel Board will be -- COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: No. 12

-- at this point in time? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: We have not been told that. I believe the way it's worded, it will be appointed by the Mayor.

And what will their payment be? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Pardon me, sir -- I'm sorry.

What will their salary be? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: I believe they get paid a hundred dollars a 14 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. session.

And you said they would work probably four days a week? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Yes. And a session, I'm not sure what will determine a session. I know what our Zoning Board of Adjustment, a session, there's a morning session and then there's an afternoon and evening session. So each separate session you get an additional hundred dollars for. And I'm not sure the hours we'll have this Board, if evening hours will be needed at this point.

Thank you. You mention on of your testimony that L&I will construct planned package demolitions of a smaller scale. Please explain what this means and what impact will City Council have in determining these packages. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: The 15 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. smaller scale -- with NTI, they did packages of 60 to 100 in some cases. It varied. What we mean by smaller packages is two or three on a block. And basically where the Council involvement would be, that we always notify Council offices when there's a problem building in their area and, as I said, especially in the case of your office, we find out from Maryanne more often than we do from ourselves. And we would then see that there's additional properties and we would find out -- try to make sure there was no additional plans for rehabilitation on that block, and then treat the whole block in total. The lesson of NTI would be to treat it as not a cut and dry, it will be demolished or it won't be demolished, but how best to serve that block to make a better product at the end of the day for everybody.

So these demolitions in fact are not limited 16 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. to the imminently dangerous properties? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: There will be cases where we would treat properties that are not imminently dangerous, but obviously with the level of funding, we would have to make sure that we can treat the imminently dangerous structures, as is everybody's priority.

All right. Your department took a 2.5 percent reduction in Class 100 of $433,123. What is the position equivalent of this reduction and what is the operational impact to your department? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: The impact would be nine positions, and we intend to lose them through attrition, not in any other way. One of the things that started for the last several years in the Department, when we have a vacancy, we bring the manager -- and since I've been Commissioner, myself, the 17 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. Administrative Services Director and the Deputy, and sometimes the manager will call the person in and see do you really need this position filled, because we have completely revamped our department with the new system, the new LICA system, and can we put it better with an inspector versus, say, a clerical or a manager. And we put ourselves through that on every person, every position we hire.

So of the nine positions, how many inspectors do you think there are? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: I would anticipate none.

None? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: No 20 inspectors. Council President, for the last several years -- when I say "several," probably going back to the last eight years to ten years -- we have made it a challenge, a personal challenge, is to make sure that the 18 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. majority of the new positions that are filled creating additional inspectors that we didn't have before are in fact either building inspectors or housing inspectors.

With that being said, can you tell us the number of field inspectors that you have presently? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: I'll break it down between building and housing.

That would be fine. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: And business compliance. In our business compliance, which is the inspectors who do the vending and also some zoning enforcement, there's 21 inspectors. In our commercial and industrial, there's 15 inspectors. Commercial/industrial does obviously fire violations in high-rise buildings, residential and also in commercial 19 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. buildings. In our Housing Enforcement Unit, we presently have 27, but I believe April 23rd there will be a test that will be announced, and we anticipate as soon as we have a list from Civil Service, to hire five more inspectors in our Housing Division. In our Weights and Measures Unit, there's 11 --

Excuse me. And those five are in the budget? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Yes.

I'm sorry. I didn't mean to interrupt you. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: In our Weights and Measures Unit, there's 11 positions that we have. There's 49 in our Building Division. And as an example, in Fiscal Year '97, there was 31. So I'm pretty proud of the fact that we're able to build up our Building Division the way we've been. 20 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC.

You say today you have? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Pardon me?

Today you have 40? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: 49. And I believe that takes care of all the inspectional force.

Do you believe that you have a sufficient number of inspectors to meet the Department's demand? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: I believe that if we continue to be aggressive in filling vacancies with inspectors, that, yes, we can meet the Department's demand. We have been, and I see no reason why we can't. With the increase in the building activity in Philadelphia, our inspectors have done a tremendous job in staying on top of that, and I've received compliments on the amount of time, with as busy as our 21 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. district offices are with the construction industry, it's taking to get our inspectors to make an inspection. And also, the Contractual Services Unit, which is the imminently dangerous building, is separate from the district's where there are construction, and we've kept that fully staffed. So I feel comfortable that we can meet the demands. In our operations in the Housing Division, we're current in school inspections. Every year we, as you're aware, we give you a report. We're 100 percent the last few years. We just put additional people in our special cares inspection program to ensure that that's fully 100 percent. So we're pretty well poised to go into the future with our workforce, our trained workforce. And part of -- a little bit of -- I don't want to call it a problem, but a little bit, it's natural when you go to a new system that you need to spend more time on training. And with 22 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. all of our inspectors, we've had to give them refresher courses on how to use the new system, because we went from a 100 percent paper operation to completely electronic. I mean, they get their workload electronically, their building permits, and it's just -- it's a totally different -- I like a pencil and paper, and now we have to pick our work up off a computer. So it's a lot of time we're spending on training this workforce that we have. But I'm comfortable that we can carry out our mission.

So I'm getting from your testimony that if you have vacancies, you have no problem whatsoever in filling them almost immediately? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: If there's a list. We've been always since I've been Commissioner, we've been very aggressive in making sure that we fill our vacancies. Our problem is that like 23 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. with housing, there's no list right now and we need to wait for the Civil Service system to give us a list of people.

Well, has the test been given? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: It will be given on the 23rd of April. And I believe it takes about 30 days after that, 30 to 40 days. End of the fiscal year we should have a list that we can hire people off of.

So how many vacancies do you have presently? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Five. Five in the Housing Division to fill. And then with people retiring, there's probably about three more that we will sit down and decide where we want to put these people.

All right. I received a letter actually complimenting your department. However, in the letter it says, All too often this department is unable to immediately 24 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. inspect sites due to a shortage of inspectors. As you know, time is of the essence in catching contractors, individuals or others in the act of performing work without permits or without proper oversight. And they talk about a recent collapse on the 500 block of Washington Avenue. Now, do you have a shortage of inspectors or not? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: That collapse -- a majority of these collapses working without a permit goes on -- that was a Saturday.

There was a permit? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: There was no permit.

There was no permit. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: They were working without a permit on a Saturday when people -- people tend to do that, work on days that they know the 25 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. City inspectors aren't available. But what we do in the spring, in the beginning of the spring and we'll do throughout the summer is, on weekends we'll put inspectors on overtime per district to go out looking for people working without a permit just to stop things like that. But as far as any kind of a work without a permit, when we get that call, we'll be out there right away. We take that very seriously, because most of the building failures that we hear about and read about are because people are working without a permit, which just it's very serious. As a matter of fact, we list the people who can pull permits on our website now, people that have a contractor's license. It's all available on our website for anybody to see that ABC Company is in fact licensed as a contractor. So, I mean, on weekends we're not going to catch people working without 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. a permit normally unless in the springtime and the summer we go out and do the special inspection program.

Well, what does the weather have to do with inspections? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Not that it has anything to do with it, but people tend -- in the springtime there's more people doing it, so it's easier for us to find the people.

Well, apparently at this location in the 500 block of Washington Avenue the work was being done without permits and consequently the building collapsed. So I think if we had inspectors -- you don't have to have a full force of inspectors, I'm sure, going around on weekends, but I think that it doesn't matter whether it's spring, summer, winter or fall. People are doing work without permits. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: And we agree, and usually during the week we're 27 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. very aggressive. On weekends we have an emergency duty inspector who is always on call, and when called, we will go out and stop the work. In this case, we were out there before the building collapsed, but it was too late because the damage was already done by the contractor digging lower than the foundation that was beside him, which made the building fall.

Thank you. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Fail. I'm sorry.

I don't want to dominate the hearing. I see my colleagues have questions. The Chair recognizes Councilman Greenlee.

Thank you, Madam President. Good morning, Commissioner. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Good morning.

If I can 28 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. just start out by thanking you for all these years we've worked together in your various titles and mine. You've always been very helpful, and I appreciate that. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: That's why we're both gray now.

Absolutely. First, you talk about the NTI transition back to L&I and you mention a couple of things, the dangerous buildings, I think, and the clean and seals. Are there other things that L&I will now be doing again that NTI did? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: We always were a part of the NTI program. The management of it and the interfacing with Council was done out of the NTI office, but as far as the inspections, we still had all the powers of our inspections and so forth. What will not be in this will be the lot treatment.

I was going to ask about the lot. 29 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: We will not have that money. There's obviously not enough with the money to be able to do the lots. But that's about the only thing I can think of. One of the things in-house what I did was, working with Dominic Verdi, was took five inspectors from the Housing Division and put them in our Contractual Services Unit to take away the complaints of the vacant buildings from the 990 force and let them concentrate on the occupied buildings and have this force of people there available to us to do all the inspection programs for vacant buildings. And they'll work right with the Demolition Unit hand in hand, and that should work out rather well.

Okay. Talking about the inspections again and the time frame, and I know it varies according to caseload and all that kind of thing, but often times what I used to hear was that the original inspection 30 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. might be done reasonably quickly, but sometimes the follow-up inspection would take a while. What kind of time frame do you work on both in the original inspection -- and I'm talking more about, I guess, if there's such a thing as ordinary violations, not the emergencies. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: If it's affecting you, it's never ordinary. Basically, we attempt for -- I'll use dangerous buildings as an example.

Okay. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: We may receive a complaint on a dangerous building and be out there in hours, if not an hour or as soon as humanly possible to get our inspector there. But we attempt to do it the next working day. If it's -- but on a weekend, we do have an emergency duty inspector, and we have no problem in sending the emergency duty inspector to make sure that the building 31 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. is safe. As I mentioned in my testimony, we used to have a paper trail to get inspectors out there, which was very cumbersome. Now inspectors get their workload electronically and enter the work themselves electronically. So each violation -- some violations are ten-day notice to comply. There's 30 days and then there's immediate time. So it varies per inspection.

According to the violation? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: According to the violation. And the inspectors as a whole always triage, and the more critical inspections get done in a more timely manner.

Okay. And I think you referenced in one of your earlier statements about the inspectors are now learning or the computer system is working better. Because I know we heard from -- I can think of one 32 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. inspector -- I won't mention his name -- who said, Geez, I don't even know how to get the stuff for the reinspection. So I'm waiting for it, but it hasn't come to me on the computer. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: You have to understand that they went from literally -- and I'm not exaggerating -- only using pencil, and a computer was unheard of, to having computers they carry with them.

Right. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: And it's a whole -- and there's inspectors that take to it that love it. They just fall in love with it and have adopted it. And there's inspectors, like anything new, are taking longer to adjust.

Sure. I understand. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: And what we've done is, Deputy Commissioner Burns and Bridget Greenwald to my right and left, who head up and were a major 33 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. part of this to get us to become computerized, we have set up where we bring refresher training to our inspectional force, and if you need it, you want it, you'll get it, and we won't criticize saying you already had it, you don't need it anymore. As an example, it's online. When inspectors go to the first class they've ever been trained at, we give them a booklet on how to use the system. And then it's also online. If they lose it, they can download it, plus it's updated. If we find a better way to do something, we instantly put it out to the managers and bring our inspectors in and train them. So it's a matter, I think, Councilman, of just getting our workforce adjusted to this new modern -- we went literally from the 18th century to the 21st century overnight. It's not an easy task.

As somebody who is not exactly a computer 34 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. techie, I can relate. I understand what you're saying. And the last part of that inspection piece is when it gets to enforcement, and a lot of that, I guess, sometimes is court backlog. It's kind of out of your hands, I guess. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Well, Municipal Court takes a good two months, I believe, but that's all electronic now too, whereas before it was paper and then somebody entering it in. Now electronically the inspector advances it to the Municipal Court, and then there's also Equity Court, which is controlled obviously by the courts, and there's like procedure to get notice to the owner. And that takes a good 30 to 40, sometimes 50 days to get service. So it really -- obviously L&I gets blamed because we're the beginning point, but when we turn it over to the courts, we're at their mercy.

No. That 35 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. happens. I remember making that argument to constituents many times. Just a last comment. You talk about the Concourse reconfiguration, and I know that's something that we received complaints about in the past a lot, about people didn't quite know what they were doing, where they were going, what line they were standing in, all that kind of thing. And I see in your statement that you found that the customers are much more happy with how it is now? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: We invite you all over. I'll give you a personal tour. We made the front end really nice where -- you're right. People would wait in, let's say, license issuance line for an hour and then find out, no, you need to go to revenue.

Or permits. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: So now you can't even get in. People complained about the line to get in, but they forgot 36 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. that we saved them an hour in the wrong line. And it's a lot nicer. Now our goal is to get the back end where the workers are in a more -- to make it more professional for the engineers, and we're working on that now. But it's a real improvement in the front end. You can get a number and come back in an hour and hopefully we'll be ready for you then.

Sounds good. All right. Thank you, Commissioner. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Thank you.

Thank you, Madam President.

You're welcome. The Chair recognizes Councilman Rizzo.

Thank you, Madam Chair. Commissioner and the entire L&I organization, I think you guys do a great 37 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. job. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Thank you.

When I first came to Council, I got numerous complaints, and it's rare today that I even have to contact you to discuss a constituent's concern. So I think you guys do a great job. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Thank you.

I got a question. Recently we realized that we were supposed to be -- the patrol of the roadways, the State Police now do that. Is there anything that the state does in the County of Philadelphia that you're doing now that a state agency should be doing? I think elevators, aren't elevators inspected by the state? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Yes.

Is there anything else like that that you do that you could point to and say, We shouldn't 38 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. be doing this, that it's really a state responsibility? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: The state does boilers and we don't. I'd have to give that some thought and get back to Council President. I'm really not sure what else the state would do. I mean, they are responsible for elevators, which sometimes causes us problems in issuing a Certificate of Occupancy, because they're the only ones that can certify the elevators, handicap accessible, and we can't issue a temporary CO even without that being done by the state. But I'd have to give it some thought and get back to you.

In other words, what we're doing is, we're looking at opportunities with the tight budget, if there are things like whatever we're doing, like we patrolled the Expressway for all these 40 years and now we realize that -- we always realized that we weren't getting our fair share there. 39 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. So if you could come up with anything else that you believe that the state should be doing that you're doing and spending your money to do it when it's really a state responsibility, I think getting it to the Chair would be appreciated. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: I will do that. I'll go back in my staff meeting to discuss it with my staff and we'll give the Council President a list.

The other question, tell me about -- it's interesting. I can always tell when somebody is preparing to do some work at their home. On a Thursday when the dumpster shows up, it's a real signal to me that something is about to happen. Tell me about the proactive work that inspectors do. Do inspectors ride down the street on a Thursday, see a dumpster at the curb and that being a signal to the inspector that obviously they're not cleaning -- they may be 40 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. cleaning out the attic, but there may be some construction going on. Do they ever check to see if there's a permit? I remember the days -- and I guess it still occurs -- where the inspector on the street was the one that really kind of kept an eye on their area to make sure that things weren't occurring without permits. How proactive are the inspectors to -- and I don't want to use the word "police" their area, but do the inspectors physically look for what I just described, the dumpster out front, meaning that there's something cooking there? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: In two ways, Councilman. The inspector who has the district, it's his or her area -- and note I said "her," because now we have at least, I believe, two or three female building inspectors, which we never had before, which I'm very proud to be able to say. They have it on their computer 41 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. if there's a permit, so they'll know instantly if there's a permit that they'll be able to do the work there, because their wireless connection. We also have a new class of inspectors called inspector trainee, where under the State Code you need to pass certain modules to become a full-fledged building inspector. So what we do is hire inspector trainees who need to within months need to pass nine 13 certs, plumbing, electrical, plans 14 review, to stay on the job permanently, 15 and while they're in the trainee status, 16 we use them to go out and check sites for 17 just that, working without a permit, are 18 you licensed, things like that. It's very effective, that force. And also the inspector who has the district, as I said, has it electronically if there's a permit or not. So, yes, we do have a program for that.

Good. My last question or 42 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. observation, as you know, we have a dumpster regulation now in the City of Philadelphia. L&I has a piece of it and I believe the Streets Department has it, but in my travels throughout the City, especially Center City, I've noticed a lot of dumpsters that are parked at meters, that are dumped at meters, that are in no parking zones. One particular recently, I was at an event where the dumpster was obstructing the view of the people that are coming out of the street. And, again, I don't expect you to have all the knowledge of what the law is in reference to placing a dumpster in the City of Philadelphia, but could you just briefly tell us what exactly is required if you bring a dumpster to your location, especially in the inner city, that they need to be licensed, et cetera. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: One of the things to be proactive I recently did, Center City District, I sent them a list of all the dumpsters that are 43 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. licensed dumpsters in the Center City area, and we'll use them to go out and make sure that the dumpsters that are there are in fact licensed. As for the other part, we'll have to get back to you through the Council President and the members of Council as to what would be legally. But as my memory serves me, you need to have it on your property. You can't have it outside the property. So somehow the dumpster has to be there on your property, a location that needs to be licensed.

Well, Commissioner, I think you will probably agree with me that when you do travel our city, you see, especially in Center City -- and I'm not suggesting -- probably it's very difficult to do construction in Center City without having dumpsters, but I've been in situations at night where you're coming in a running lane, an actual operating lane, and there's a dumpster left, no 44 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. lights on them, no reflective material, no cover on it. The material is, especially with this wind, blowing out of it. I would appreciate it that you could reconvene -- and I think the other partner in this is the Streets Department -- to really if we have a regulation on the way dumpsters are supposed to be placed, that it really be revisited, especially -- most of the material that was in the dumpster at Sydenham and Locust or one of those streets, the material was blowing down Locust Street because it didn't have any cover on it during this wind. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: I will make sure that we do that. I will call Commissioner Tolson and ask her to have Dave Perri, who used to be with L&I as our Chief Code Official, now is the engineer for the Bridge Division and also traffic, work with us on that to make sure that we're doing between both. 45 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. I know that Streets Department makes it pretty easy on somebody to get their license, because it's free. It's a free permit to have a dumpster on the street. They just want you to apply. But we'll figure out for the enforcement and get back to you on that.

A free permit in the City of Philadelphia? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Yeah. It's not L&I. We don't do anything for free.

Nothing for free. But that's interesting to know. I guess we'll have to put that on the list of these to look at after the initial go-around. I didn't know there was anything for free. So that would be appreciated, because, again, the dumpsters need some management. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Absolutely.

Thanks 46 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. again, and, again, congratulations on the good work that your organization provides. Thanks. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Thank you very much, your kind words.

Thanks, Madam Chair.

You're welcome. The Chair recognizes Councilwoman Miller.

Thank you, Madam President. Good morning, Mr. Solvibile and staff. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Good morning, Councilwoman.

I have just a couple of questions. One of my staff members wants to know can we get read-only access to the new L&I violations database? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: We're working that out, because we just 47 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. completed the total system, the last phase of it, at the end of January and now we're looking to do read-only access to not just Council but to other City departments. It comes to mind L&I and Fire work hand in hand on enforcement of the Fire Code and we want to be able to get to the point where I would love -- I don't know how soon we could do that, but a fire truck going to a scene, be able to look up on the computer that our inspectors have, the same type of thing, what's there. And it would be, again, read-only access. So we're working on that and should have an answer shortly, and we'll notify -- we'll have the read-only access. When we're capable of getting on everybody's system, we can have it installed.

How long do you think that will be or how soon? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: A month or two. We're that close. We 48 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. think we're that close.

Okay. That's good. I think L&I does a good job and I also want to thank you, but I just want to discuss a little bit about the fact that L&I is going to take over the NTI activities, correct, according to your testimony? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Yes. We're taking over best practices of the NTI program and the L&I program and combining both best practices, and it will be managed through L&I through our Contractual Services Unit, which has been involved with NTI from day one.

So does that mean we won't be meeting with the Managing Director's Office and NTI to create the demolition packages? I mean, how will this change? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Well, the packages -- there's $10 million in our budget, and the packages will be 49 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. smaller. NTI packages, I remember one in your area, it was like 80, I believe.

Right. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Around Temple Medical School.

Right, Tioga. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: And the days of having an 80 package will not come back as far as this budget is concerned. It will be smaller packages. Like I told Council President Verna, we'll go to a street with an imminently dangerous building and there might be other things that need to be done on that street, maybe a building sealed or another building demolished, and we'll treat the block more in total of a total concept than just dealing with the imminently dangerous building and walking away from it.

But who will Councilpersons actually deal with on the demolition, whether it's a small 50 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. package? It's now going to be L&I and not NTI or MDO? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Yes. It will be L&I working with the same people we've always -- with the Managing Director, the community groups, Councilpeople and doing the best job to make it as safe as possible for everybody and to treat the block wholly versus individually.

Well, I think that the approach for doing whatever needs to be done on a block is really good. You just said that if a house needs to be demolished, that will happen, but if one needs to be clean and sealed, that will also happen, and that's really good, because then we don't have to call you back and say, Can you clean and seal this house. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: It makes us look like we -- it makes us all look like we care about that block, which we all do, except we just looked at it 51 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. with sort of blinders before. Now we'll look at the whole block.

Well, that's really good. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: And one of the things that our Clean and Seal that I'm pretty proud of, since I've been involved with and charged with Clean and Seal, which is for the last ten years, if they go to a block, they'll even sweep the street if they need to. If it looks totally out of place, they'll -- and the workers really feel good about this, because you can leave and it looks better than when they got there. They just won't deal with the one house. They'll deal with -- if there's a house next door, they'll deal with both.

Okay. Well, that's really good. This Decision Maps, can you tell me what that is exactly? I know it has something to do with the database of vacant properties, but what is this 52 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. Decision Map? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: I'm going to ask Deputy Commissioner Burns to answer that, because she's been in the forefront of that.

Okay. DEPUTY COMMISSIONER BURNS: Hi. Good morning. My name is Fran Burns. I'm Deputy Commissioner for Administration for the Department of L&I. We actually -- and this is one of the practices we adopted from NTI, is the use of data to identify vacant property, and NTI actually used this practice at the very beginning of the program. And since then, they've worked with the consultant and MOIS, the Mayor's Office of Information Services, to develop a prototype that uses data across departments, and I'll give you an example, to identify vacant properties. So we're using different indicators, like real estate tax liens, water revenue liens, water service termination, 53 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. electricity termination, building violations, our vacant properties, vacant lots, our permits for rehabilitation and permits for demolitions. And what the mapping does is, it takes each of these indicators, layers them in a GIS model and gives you a map at the end that says, Okay, this is the area of the City that has the highest density of vacant properties. And then what we're going to do through L&I is say, Okay, we're going to send our inspectors to that area, and we'll confirm by an actual foot, an inspector, that those properties are vacant and then make decisions on resources based on that. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: And that's one of the things that the map is -- when the first days of NTI and I saw the first map, they used a brown color, and then it would lighten -- and I'm sure you've all seen them in your decision meetings that they had. It's really an effective way of bringing you 54 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. right to where you want to be and putting your inspectors in the right place.

I do remember the maps, but I guess I just never realized it was called Decision Maps. If we wanted to use that now to see -- because sometimes I get a feel that we really don't know, at least my office really doesn't know, where the majority of vacant properties are that were not demolished, just for planning purposes. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: That's the reason we -- in a meeting that I had with the Managing Director when we first started talking about the transition of the process to L&I, it's the first thing we wanted to work on, was the Decision Mapping. So just for the reason we'll know what's out there, we'll know our volume of work that we need to go forward to work on.

Is L&I going to have someone go back through the 55 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. neighborhoods like they did in the very beginning of NTI? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Yeah. I envision to go to the most densely populated area and look at that first and then span out and then, at the same time, I think to go to the areas on the fringes and look at them, because as you and I, we all know, if we can stop one vacant and be pretty forceful, then we won't create another vacant next door to it. It's going to be a challenge, but it's something that we never really had the availability of before. That's why the term "Decision Map" is really better than calling it a list of all the vacants. We'll be able to do just that, to go to areas that are -- if we see a block that's one dot and everything else occupied, we'll want to go there first to make sure that we treat that house properly and make sure that it's Code compliant. Because keep in mind, there's Councilman DiCicco's doors and windows 56 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. ordinance that Council passed where if the block is more than 80 percent occupied, our inspectors would write "order doors and windows" on the property versus just sealing it up.

You don't mention curbsides in your testimony, so I'm assuming it's just going to remain the same for emergencies? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Well, the advancement we made, we brought in some additional training for the inspectors, the building inspectors in the Department who would write the violation of imminently dangerous, to have them realize that the word "imminently dangerous" means that a building is in a state of imminent collapse and if anything declared imminently dangerous will be treated, not just written up and then reinspected 30 days later. We send out a notice immediately as soon as the return mail comes back. In most cases the return 57 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. mail, if it's an off address, we'll then curbside the property, whereas before we didn't work that aggressive with them.

One of the things that drives me a little bit nuts in my district is the fact that speculators are buying properties, whether there's a lot or dwelling, and then they go wherever it is they go and they just leave the property. They don't cut the grass. They won't do anything. And so I thought maybe we needed a bill 14 to do stronger enforcement, but everybody seems to think that we have laws in place that can deal with these abandoned newly purchased properties or lots. What can we do? I mean, what do we need to do to make them stop these Code violations on these properties? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: More intense enforcement. The reason that, talking with staff, that we took five inspectors and put them in contractual services, they will inspect only building 58 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. or outside violations, nuisance type violations, to allow the rest of the inspectors at 990 to concentrate on the occupied buildings. And we'll even do some occupied buildings, but just the outside, with this group of five, just to really be proactive in letting people know you got to take care of your property, period. We're not going to take your nonsense.

Well, that's -- COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: But the Property Maintenance Code all covers the type of violations you just mentioned. There wouldn't really be a need for additional.

Well, then maybe we can get some of them in Equity Court, because this is really a problem. It's really a big problem in my district. It seems like people have purchased these properties and lots that don't live in Philadelphia, so they don't 59 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. really know what they were purchasing and where, and now they're just sitting. No 4 one is buying them. They're just sitting, and no one provides the maintenance to them. And I hate calling the City all the time to ask them to come and clean the lot when, clearly, there is an owner. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: I agree, but keep in mind that every time we clean that lot, we'll put a lien on it, and the lien is like a first mortgage. We get that money. As I sign off on a lot of buildings that we clean and sealed years ago because of the 17 development going on in the City, that 18 people are paying them bills. It's all 19 coming home to roost. 20 So eventually we get ours. It might take a while, but we get it. I mean, it's there. It's the first lien. And our interface with Revenue really works well, and that happens almost automatically. 60 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC.

Okay. All right. Thank you. Thank you, Madam President.

You're welcome. The Chair recognizes Councilwoman Blackwell.

Thank you, Madam President. Like everyone else, I would like to thank L&I for performing all the miracles they do, and we know they really, really try to address all the miracles citywide. And I heard Councilman Rizzo talking about dumpsters, and I think citywide that's just become an issue, and we've been calling, because I think they can get -- I think they get permission for a year by the Streets Department, isn't it? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Well, yes, the Streets Department to be in the highway. And I'm going to go back and do some research and we'll give you -- we'll 61 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. give Council President and a copy to members of Council a briefing on how that system works.

What we've been doing is -- because at one time I called in four or five at once a few months ago, and Deputy Commissioner Williams went and told the people straighten up or else, when it comes time for renewal, we won't renew it. So that's how we've been trying to deal with that, because I know it is an issue. And I have an issue with Brad Ingerman. I hope he knows I'm talking about him. Brad Ingerman at 55th and Christian, who has just decided to leave -- he moved the dumpster from behind the property in front of it on the sidewalk across from a rec center, and he keeps trashing garbage all over the place all the time, and every blue moon I'll beg somebody to clean it up for me, who won't do it, not even when I've talked to him. So I know that it can be a 62 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. problem, but that's what we've been doing, trying to get Deputy Commissioner Carlton Williams to deal with him and threaten him and threaten to -- I guess they can clean it up and lien him in that area, too. Anyhow, they have -- COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: I'm not sure how they do it, but I'm sure --

But anyhow, that's what we've been doing, reporting him, and it seems to be better at least. But I really wanted to take the mike to thank you for all the miracles you perform. We know we call you every day, and we want to do better, but obviously the people who approach us all the time don't make that possible. But thank you very much. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Thank you. It's what helps keeps us young, all the input we get from Council.

Thank 63 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. you.

The Chair recognizes Councilman Kelly.

Thank you, Madam Chair. Good morning, Commissioner. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Good morning, Councilman.

First of all, let me just follow Councilwoman Blackwell in thanking you for all the hard work that you and your staff have done throughout the City. I know working with my office you've done wonders. And I see Commissioner Verdi there, who has also worked on numerous problems that we've had from constituents. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Thank you.

I also want to commend you on the development of the EZ Permits. It seems to me that that's the way to go. It would help in your backlog. That's something -- I don't 64 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. know how long you have had that. How long have you had that system? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: About two years, Councilman, and we're looking -- we have a little piece of -- they call it a portal, a portal into our system, and we'll soon be able to issue plumbing and electrical permits that do not require a plan online, and even if they require a plan, they can drop the plan off and then apply online. Our Permit Manager, Mr. Murray, who is full of Vim and Vinegar and a lot younger than I am, is working on training our frequent users that bring plans to the Department, to have a drop-off for them where you take this training from Mr. Murray and then you can just leave your plans there and then we'll get back to you in the same amount of time than if you had waited in line. Our goal is to put everything online that we possibly can as soon as we can. That ongoing will be the 65 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. Department's goal with this new system we have.

As you, I'm sure, are aware, we have too many City Halls. We have one in North Philadelphia and one in Northeast Philadelphia. Do you have any plans to reinstate the L&I services at these facilities? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Not at the present time. Everything you can do in a mini City Hall I believe that involves L&I, you can do online. It was a simpler service there. So at the present time, we have no plans to staff the two mini City Halls.

Well, let me just say that there have been numerous people, especially small businesses and whatnot, that really relied on that service in those facilities and I think they're greatly missed, and that would be something that I would like you to really look at in the future. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: We 66 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. will.

I don't see anything wrong in having a person assigned there possibly two days in North Philadelphia and two days in Northeast and the following day in MSB. I think that would help greatly, and I think that would help you reduce the backlog in MSB. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: We will look into it, Councilman. Thank you.

Okay. Could you tell me about the accelerated processing of permits? What's the difference in the amount of time an applicant receives on that? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: With an accelerated permit, the applicant will have an answer within ten working days.

Within? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Ten working days. The regular process I believe is 30 days, 30 working days, which is obviously more -- 67 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC.

What's the cost of an accelerated permit? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: The cost of the overtime for the examiner, it's about -- it's 540 for the first four hours.

Okay. And you're still sticking to that? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: And $420 for a zoning review in an accelerated --

So the accelerated permit would take you roughly about ten days then, two weeks? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Roughly ten. I mean --

I'm not trying to keep it -- I mean, it could go longer. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: I understand. I'm hoping I'm saying the right thing here, but I'm pretty sure I am, because I experience it every day. They do a really great job 68 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. downstairs in our Concourse. It's sort of like a MASH unit that you see the MASH show on television. They bring a professional atmosphere to a very busy place and they do a really good job.

Madam President, did you address the billboards issue?

No. 11

Was that addressed already?

No, it was not.

I just wanted to get back to something in previous hearings that we've had here on the issue of permits for billboards. I know there's quite a lot of them that were put up throughout the City that did not have permits. I was just wondering if you were still involved in trying to find out what billboards have permits and which ones don't, and if they don't, what type of activity are you going to do to 69 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. remove them. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: The eight sheets, the littler signs on the side of a building, at this point in time are about -- they're all down. They're all down. As to the billboards, this year under an agreement reached with the Law Department, we've received $770,850 in revenue from the licensing of billboards, which -- and basically --

Is that still voluntary? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: No. 15

In previous hearings we heard that companies were just voluntarily sending money for these permits. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Well, and previously there was a lot of litigation, whereas this agreement, this legal agreement that the Law Department really needs to speak to because it's beyond my capability to explain it properly, basically it enforces the 70 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. Council's will that they pay their license and get it, whereas before there was court opinions that they may not need a license. And now this is an agreement between all parties that, yes, they will have this license and will pay it to the City.

So, in other words, in your opinion, all of the billboards that exist in Philadelphia will have or should have permits? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Yes. And if they are proven to not be legal, then we can order them down. And there's criteria in the agreement that if it -- if they can prove that they had a permit at one point in time for that billboard, then it would remain, under the agreement. If they can't, they would be ordered to remove it.

Okay. Thank you, Madam President.

Is some of the billboard issues still under 71 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. litigation? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: I'm not sure at all, Council President. I thought that it was resolved with this agreement, but we'll have to get back to you on that. I'm not sure if there's still a litigation involved.

Councilman Greenlee.

The best of my memory, I think most of the companies have agreed, but I think there's like ten percent of the companies that are not in this agreement. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: That's accurate, but who they are, I'm not at all sure who -- the majority of the billboard owners or the sign faces, as we call them, are part of the agreement.

And then there was the counter lawsuit against the agreement. So I don't know where that stands now. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: But to 72 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. say that I'm aware of any more litigation, I'm really not at all sure. And the whole --

I think I recall what you said.

Yeah. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: The part that I'm happiest about is we got rid of the eight sheets, because they are eye graffiti all throughout our neighborhoods in Philadelphia and it was horrendous, and that's all gone now.

And what is the cost of the permit? I mean, I think we had set a certain fee. I think it was $600, but I think when they went to court -- COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Are you talking about the license for the billboard, the sign face?

Yes. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: One hundred fifty per sign face. In other words, some poles have three or two or 73 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. just one. It's 150 per sign face.

And you said we generated how much as a result of action taken? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Seven hundred and eighty thousand, eight hundred and fifty dollars this fiscal year in licenses for billboards.

Thank you. Are there any other questions from members of the Committee? (No response.)

Commissioner, a little bird whispered in my ear a little earlier that this will probably be your last budget hearing. I am told that you're on DROP and you'll be going out in August. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Yes.

I guess you have mixed emotions about that. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: I do. I really do. I get emotional. Right now 74 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. when you said that, I got all -- that's why I didn't mention it in my testimony, because I didn't want to like feel stern. But it would have been 36 years this September. I'll leave almost at 36 years. And as you know, your father and my father worked together. It's just so many fine memories of this place that is just unbelievable, coming here as a kid and now as an adult. It's a good feeling.

Great. We certainly want to wish you the best of luck. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Thank you.

Our next department? You might as well stay where you are, Commissioner. MR. McPHERSON: Board of L&I Review. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: This is the first time an L&I Commissioner is 75 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. reading this testimony. It's usually somebody else. Good morning, Council President Verna and members of Council. I am Robert D. Solvibile, Commissioner of the Department of License and Inspections. I appreciate the opportunity to present the Board of License and Inspection Review's Fiscal Year 2008 Operating Budget request. The Board of License and Inspection Review is requesting a total Fiscal Year '08 budget of $224,705 in the City's General Fund. For the General Fund breakout, we are requesting $198,108 in Class 100, $25,969 in Class 200 and $628 in Class 300. The General Fund budget represents an increase of $7,620 from Fiscal Year '07 estimated obligations. The Fiscal Year '08 request will fund three full-time General Fund positions, comparable to the Fiscal Year '07 authorized General Fund position level. 76 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. Thank you. I will be happy to answer any questions you may have.

Thank you very much. Commissioner, was the Board of L&I Review assessed the 2.5 percent general reduction? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: No. 10

Thank you. I have no further questions. Any questions from members of the Committee? (No response.)

Seeing none, I thank you. MR. McPHERSON: Board of Building Standards. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Good morning, Council President Verna and members of Council. I am Robert Solvibile, Commissioner of the Department of License and Inspections. I appreciate the opportunity to present the Board of Building Standards' Fiscal Year 2008 77 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. Operating Budget request. The Board of Building Standards is requesting a total Fiscal Year '08 budget of $112,792 in the City's General Fund. For the General Fund breakout, we are requesting $112,733 in Class 100 and $59 in Class 200. The General Fund budget represents an increase of $4,336 from our '07 estimated obligations. The Fiscal Year '08 request will fund two full-time General Fund positions, comparable to the '07 authorized General Fund position level. Thank you. I will be happy to answer any questions you may have.

Thank you very much. Commissioner, has the Board of Building Standards been assessed the 2.5 percent general reduction? COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: No, Council President.

Thank 78 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. you. I have no further questions. Are there any questions from members of the Committee? (No response.)

Seeing no one, I thank you very much. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Thank you. MR. McPHERSON: The Zoning Board of Adjustment. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Good morning, Council President Verna and members of Council. I am Robert Solvibile, Commissioner of the Department of License and Inspections. I appreciate the opportunity to present the Zoning Board of Adjustment's Fiscal Year 2008 Operating Budget request. The Zoning Board of Adjustment is requesting a total Fiscal Year '08 budget of $450,313 in the City's General Fund. For the General Fund breakout, we are requesting $402,272 in Class 100 and $48,041 in Class 200. 79 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. The General Fund budget represents an increase of $5,554 from Fiscal Year '07 estimated obligations. The Fiscal Year '08 will fund five full-time General Fund positions, comparable to the '07 authorized General Fund position level. Thank you. I will be happy to answer any questions you have.

Commissioner, the Zoning Board of Adjustment was assessed the 2.5 General Fund reduction. What is the value of this reduction and its operational impact? It would appear to me it's something like $10,000. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: We don't have a -- initially with the computerization, it won't have an impact on any processing that the Zoning Board of Adjustment does. Also, I'm told the reduction is $10,315, is the reduction you're asking for. We feel that we'll be able to make that up with the 80 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. productivity gained by the new system. As an example, when I go on my system now, I'll see that there's an appeal to whatever Board it's appealed to, whereas before I had to go over and ask some poor lady to find it. It's right there in front of me now, whereas before it never was. It's shared by anybody in the Department now, which creates a lot less productivity for the unit there.

Thank you. Are there any further questions from members of the Committee? (No response.)

Seeing none, thank you very much. COMMISSIONER SOLVIBILE: Thank you, and have a great day.

You do the same. MR. McPHERSON: The next department is the Water Department.

Good 81 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. morning, Commissioner. Please identify yourself for the record. And before you start your testimony, I would ask you to be kind enough to abbreviate what you have given us. The written testimony will be given to the stenographer and it will be transcribed in full. COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Thank you, Madam President. I will cut it down. Good afternoon, President Verna and members of City Council. I am Bernard Brunwasser, Water Commissioner, appearing before you today to testify on behalf of the Philadelphia Water Department's FY08 Operating Budget request. On my left is Deputy Commissioner for Finance and Administration, Joseph Clare, and on my right is Deputy Commissioner for Operations, Debra McCarty. 5 million 82 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. for other Water Fund activities, including the Water Revenue Bureau, debt service and central agency support, for a total of $704 million. 8 million higher than our FY07 appropriation, it is important to note that 131 million of this total is accounted for by a $125 million transfer of funds from the Water Department's Debt Service Reserve Fund to the Operating Budget and six million to pay for the cost of surety bonds and other costs related to the surety substitution. These bond proceeds will eventually be deposited in the Water Residual Fund's Special Infrastructure Account, as previously approved by City Council under Bill 060005, to acquire or construct water and sewer infrastructure projects that are consistent with the City's New River City economic development initiative. When this 83 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. 5 percent. As you know, the Philadelphia Water Department is a municipal utility serving the citizens of the Philadelphia region by providing integrated water, wastewater and storm water services. Our primary mission is to operate and maintain the infrastructure necessary to provide high-quality affordable drinking water; to protect the public health; to provide an adequate and reliable water supply for all residential, business and public needs; and to sustain and enhance the region's watersheds and quality of life by managing wastewater and storm water effectively. The Water Department operates three drinking water treatment plants, processing an average of 258 million gallons of treated drinking water each day; three wastewater treatment plants, 84 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. cleaning an average of 430 million gallons per day of sewage -- that went to over one billion yesterday or the day before, I should say -- a biosolids recycling facility; a sophisticated testing laboratory; and a range of customer service, technical and administrative support services. In addition, the Department maintains more than 3,100 miles of water mains, more than 3,500 miles of sewer, 79,000 storm water inlets, 26,000 fire hydrants and extensive related infrastructure. The Water Revenue Bureau of the Department of Revenue provides support for water and sewer billings and collections for the utility. Philadelphia's drinking water is safer than ever, substantially better than state and local regulations for purity require. Philadelphians have recognized the improvements in service provided by the Water Department, and our most recent citizen survey results show 85 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. an 81 percent satisfaction with overall PWD services and an 82 percent satisfaction with overall water quality. These are the highest levels of satisfaction ever received by the Water Department in this survey. We are also treating wastewater to award-winning levels, overseeing the cleanest water environment in 150 years and making progress in protecting our watersheds to keep our streams and rivers clean.

The three Water Pollution Control Plants have maintained high levels of treatment such that they have been recognized by the National Association of Clean Water Agencies with either Silver, Gold or Platinum awards over the past decade. This year, all three of our plants will receive Gold awards, reflecting perfect compliance with their National Pollution Discharge Elimination System permits in Calendar Year 2006. Last year, all three plants also achieved Gold awards for Calendar Year 2005. 86 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. The Water Department continues to have some of the lowest rates in the region for water, wastewater and storm water services. We have had great success in containing costs, increasing employee productivity and improving services. In past years, we have shared many of our successes in cost containment and revenue enhancement with you. Savings have resulted from a variety of sources, including maximizing grants, refinancing debt, reduced days lost to injury, energy savings, automatic meter reading and plant operating efficiencies. 5 million in future debt service expense. All three of the major bond rating agencies rated the Department's 87 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. bonds in the A minus/stable range. Moody's Investors Service assigned an A3/stable outlook rating to the Water Department and attributed this rating to the Department's strong management, improved financial operations, significant cash balances in the Rate Stabilization Fund and ongoing improvements in environmental compliance. I must thank City Council for unanimously approving the bond ordinance that led to this successful refunding. Philadelphia's drinking water meets or surpasses the requirements of state and federal standards 100 percent of the time. Nationally, the PWD is among an elite group of only 56 water utilities that have received a Directors Award from the EPA-sponsored Partnership for Safe Water for meeting the Partnership's goals for five consecutive years. Many Philadelphians are unaware of the connection between the work of the 88 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. Water Department and the quality of their local watershed - the creeks, streams, rivers and surrounding land that provide fresh water both for recreational enjoyment and for drinking water supply. The City now enjoys watersheds that are cleaner and healthier than they have been in well over a century. Once plagued by federal consent decrees for the failure to operate our wastewater treatment plant facilities in compliance with environmental regulations, these same plants are now winning national industry awards. S. EPA Region III -- that's the midatlantic states -- Source Water Protection Award, also received the American Water Works Association's Exemplary Source Water Protection Award and the American Council of Engineering Companies Diamond Award for the Schuylkill River Source Water Assessment. These awards recognize the Water 89 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. Department as the model for the region and country in the area of source water protection. PWD's management of the storm water system is an important service for both flood control and environmental protection. In January 2006, PWD also initiated new storm water regulations. The new regulations are an important tool in the City's efforts to reduce flooding and to protect our rivers and streams. Accordingly, all development projects that disturb more than 15,000 square feet of earth must comply with water quality and non-structural site design requirements that are consistent with state and federal storm water best management practices. In FY08, the PWD has budgeted an additional $900,000 to expedite the review of storm water plans. Also in Fiscal '08, the PWD has budgeted $3 million to fund backwater valve installations in flood-prone properties. These backwater valves will help to 90 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. protect properties that are prone to flooding due to sewer backups.

Meanwhile, the Water Department is nearing completion of its two-year comprehensive hydraulic engineering study of those neighborhoods in the City that have experienced basement flooding due to surcharge sewers. We are close to beginning to design significant capital projects to permanently cure this problem. We have greatly increased our capital program in order to fund these infrastructure improvements in the coming years. My hope is that over the next decade the City of Philadelphia will virtually eliminate this type of problem. None of the above financial service improvements would have been possible without the hard work and professional achievements of the people of the Philadelphia Water Department. I want to thank all of the employees. We're members of all the important agencies throughout the nation, and we 91 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. look forward to our continued partnership with City Council toward further improvement during FY08 and the years ahead. At this time, I'd be happy to answer any questions you may have.

Thank you very much, Commissioner. The Chair recognizes Councilman Greenlee.

Thank you, Madam President. Commissioner -- and I know part of this is Water Revenue related, but this just came to my attention yesterday and you're here. Shut-offs for non-payment, have you been doing those on Saturday for a while? I didn't realize that. Because the person got shut off on Saturday and obviously she could -- without giving you the full story, she messed up, she was late on her agreement, but she had issues and a death in the family and that kind 92 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. of thing and obviously couldn't get back on until about o'clock -- she was down 4 there early Monday, but by the time she 5 got back on, it was Monday evening. Sounds a little unfair to me. COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: I think the advantage of Saturday shut-offs is the fact that that's when most people are home rather than during the week and they often have an opportunity to forestall the shut-off at that time. Now, she would have been notified. She certainly had gotten notice and due process up till that point. But, yes, we do shut off on Saturdays, and I think it helps us and it helps some of these customers to be there when our folks arrive.

But if they're not there, you still turn off, right? COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Yes, we do.

Because 93 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. that's what happened to her. She just didn't happen to be home. And unlike -- and I guess we're not going to agree on this, but unlike at least Monday through Thursday and Friday at least to a certain point, the person can go down and get the bill paid. They can't do that on Saturday. So they're off for two days. It just doesn't -- I mean, I understand about being home and trying to collect the money if they're there. That makes sense, because they're more likely to be home, but if you do shut them off and they're not there, they're without water for a couple days with no ability to do anything about it, correct? I mean, they can't do anything on the weekends. COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: As I said, they did receive due process.

I understand that. COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: And we will accept checks. Some people will not come to the door and they owe us 94 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. money --

Well, they might not be home, in all fairness, right? COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: That's also possible, but what I'm saying is, if the word goes out that you have to be home for a shut-off, we're never going to be able to do a shut-off.

Well, I don't think the word should be that they have to be home. I guess what I'm saying is, there is a difference during the week when you get shut off than on Saturday, correct? COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Correct.

And in this case, the woman had kids. I mean, it was -- and I'm not saying she's without fault. She should have paid the bill. I'm not saying that. But it just doesn't seem -- has this been going on for a while, Saturday shut-offs? 95 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Yes. And we do have an emergency number on the notice and if she comes back, if somebody comes back on a Saturday later in the day and sees that their service has been shut off, they can call us and, if we can, we will restore them that same day, but they have to have 50 percent of their bill 10 ready at the door.

You mean you'll send somebody back -- COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Yes.

-- if you have the personnel to do that? COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Yes. If we're still out there, yes.

Is that decision to shut off on Saturday, is that Water Commissioner, Water Revenue, combination of both? COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Well, we get notices from the Water Revenue Bureau. We are told who is in line for shut-off, and we then take that work and 96 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. parcel it out as best we can.

And I don't want to belabor the point, but I know there were some utilities -- I'm not sure if Water was one of them -- that wouldn't even shut off on Friday at one point for the reason I just said, that the customer could not make good on the bill until Monday. COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: There are occasions, Councilman, when we have -- we make a conscious decision not to have shut-offs on certain holidays, certain major holidays and things of that nature, but, generally speaking, the folks that we eventually come out to shut off have had many opportunities to come in and sign a payment agreement with the Water Revenue Bureau or pay their bill in full.

Well, in this case, like I said, the person was late. She had an agreement. She fell behind. So I'm not defending that. It 97 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. just seems that she had no alternative, and I didn't know about that she could have called and somebody else could come out. I don't even know when she got home on Saturday. COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Right.

I don't know. I guess we're going to disagree on that. I don't think there should be Saturday shut-offs, but I'll leave it at that. Thank you, Madam President.

You're welcome. The Chair recognizes Councilman Goode.

Thank you, Madam President. Good morning, Commissioner. Commissioner, what is the Water Department's collection rate? COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Well, it's actually the Revenue Department's 98 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. collection rate, but I think I can speak to it. It's best that I describe it, if you don't mind. Our revenues are between $400, $500 million annually, but let's use $100 million as an example. If the Water Revenue Bureau bills $100 million, let's say, within Fiscal '06, because that's the last complete year, if they billed $100 million throughout the year, at the end of the year they will have collected within that year approximately $96 to $97 million. Now, that $96 or $97 million is made up typically of about 85 to 86 million from '06 itself and about $8 million from the immediate prior year, which is '05. They also collect another $2 or $3 million from years prior to Fiscal '05. So at the end of the day, they have collected maybe $96 to $97 million within Fiscal '06, though billed $100 million. The current collection factor of '06 billings and collections within 99 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. '06 is approximately 85 to 86 percent. That's called the current collection factor.

How has that changed over the last five years? COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Very little.

And how much money is owed to the City in terms of Water Revenue collection? COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: I don't have -- I haven't seen any recent figures, but it's probably along the lines of $200 million.

And how has that changed over the last five years? COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Also probably has not changed a great deal.

And what new efforts are underway to go after that $200 million? COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: What have we done? One of the things that we've done is, beginning in 1997, we 100 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. implemented the largest automatic meter program in the water industry in the U.S. and now virtually every home has an automatic water meter, which eliminates disputes over estimated bills.

Commissioner, you said not much has changed over the last five years. What new have you tried over the last five years to go after that $200 million? COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Again, I'm talking about the Water Revenue Bureau, but we're going to a new billing system, which will give the customer service reps more tools to use and a better history of each account. During the moratorium, the shut-off moratorium for residential customers, which lasts from December 1st through April 1st each year, we go after existing vacant properties and do dig-ups and we check all these non-billed status properties. The new AMR -- the AMR that we 101 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. have, the automatic meter system, spews out records to us where we investigate suspicious accounts. Over the past six or seven years, the Water Department has investigated and collected over $18 million in accounts that would have otherwise gone unknown. And that's 9 million in existing money. It doesn't 10 count the money once you put an account 11 on the books again that you collect 12 subsequently. 13

Let me try 14 the question from one other approach. 15 How much of that $200 million do you 16 expect to recover over the next five 17 years? 18 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Of that 200 million? Some of that 200 million is not yet due. That's kind of an all-inclusive number, but much of -- some of that is up to 15 years old. Because we have the ability to lien a property, we have to keep our receivables on the books for up to 15 years. 102 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC.

The question was, over the next five years, how much do you expect to recover? COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: I really don't know. A lot depends on some other advancements that we may have with the new billing system.

Okay. Thank you. Thank you, Madam President.

Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilman Kelly.

Thank you, Madam Chair. Good morning, Commissioner. COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Good morning.

Just following up on Councilman Goode's line of questioning, what is the rate of collections right now? Is it any better than PGW, for instance? 103 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: I'm not sure what PGW's collection factors are at the moment, but I know in past years there was some confusion over the collection rates and factors, and it always comes up. On a cumulative basis, again, the Revenue Department gets about up to 97 percent.

Ninety-seven? COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Of what they bill. But on a current collection factor basis -- and this is a number that became controversial a couple years ago -- it's about 85 to 86 percent. But that is a number that would never approach 100 percent for many reasons, mostly because when you're talking about a given fiscal year, many bills go out in June, one-twelfth of the bills go out in June, and some of them don't have due dates until the following fiscal year, so they're not credited to --

Until the 104 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. following year. COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Yeah. So, as I said, about 85 to 86 percent of the revenue comes in from the year, the current year, and about eight to nine percent of the revenue comes in from the immediate prior year, and then another two to three percent comes in from older billings. So for every hundred million dollars that's billed by the Water Revenue Bureau, they will collect in a given year approximately $97 million.

Do you have any plans to have payments automatically transferred from checking accounts from banks? COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: We are looking into much of this, and I think our new billing system should be able to make that a reality for us. I think there's a lot of -- we've actually done some payments by credit card, but there's an additional fee to the customer. So it's kind of a -- we're 105 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. weighing all of these options.

Well, I think it's something you have to look at. COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: You can pay online today.

You can? COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Yeah.

Okay. I just want to have an idea that projects for lettings, for instance, it goes from the Water Department to the Capital Program to Procurement. Could you tell me really what you're working at as far as a timeline from when you get a project to when it's going to be awarded to a contractor? COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Yeah. I have the experts in the room, I think. About five months, we're hearing. And some things are -- some projects are highly complex and they may take a little bit longer. Sometimes the vendors have to come in, take a look at it and then ask a lot of questions and -- 106 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC.

Well, it seems like to me there seems to be a hitch in one of these departments, whether it be the Capital Program or whether it be the Procurement, but somewhere along the line when you release it, it doesn't get to the contractor until months, if not years, later, and I just want to know if any improvement has been made over the last year or so, if anyone can give me an idea. COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: We'll get back to you on that. I'm not positive about what's been done in Procurement over the past couple of years on this topic.

Well, I just want to know where the hold-up is. Is it in the Capital Program or is it in Procurement? It's somewhere in there, and I don't know who -- I know these projects are fully budgeted. It's nothing to do with the lack of funding for it. It's just more or less it's an 107 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. internal problem that we have, and it seems like it's always delayed. And some of them it's very important, because this is an infrastructure problem, and I think that we should start looking at ways to improve the administration or at least processing projects. COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Sure, Councilman Kelly. Actually, I have my Chief Engineer and General Manager for Planning and Engineering, Mr. Steve Furtek, and I think he can help on some of this.

How you doing, Councilman? For the most part, we don't see that there's huge delays in projects once they leave the Water Department. Occasionally there's a project that's very difficult and will require a back and forth --

When you say it leaves the Water Department, where does it go? 108 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC.

It goes to Procurement for advertising and bidding. Procurement actually accepts the bids, and then the award and notice to proceed occurs after that.

Could you give me --

Now, when the project is bid, depending on the complexity of the job, there may be a two-month window where the contractor has an opportunity to look at the plans and specs and propose his bid. The entire time is about five months. It's pretty routine. Occasionally we have a very complex job where there's a lot of questions from the contractor, and those particular jobs take a little bit longer.

And after Procurement receives this information, then they can award the contract to the --

Right. Once the 109 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. bids are tabulated, then there's a review process that occurs to make sure all the paperwork is in by each bidder, and then the award is issued.

Where does the Capital Program come in?

My understanding of the Capital Program component is, they provide oversight in general terms and make sure that the financing is in place, that we have the capital money, and it's basically a checks and balances kind of an arrangement.

So when you have a project, it goes to the Capital Program first, then Procurement?

Correct.

So there seems to be some play in there.

I think --

How long does the Capital Program --

If you look at it as a pipeline of projects, there's a 110 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. constant flow through that pipeline, and every month we're awarding so many jobs. The delays are few and far between. They typically are related to a specific project that has some issue, but, generally speaking, there's a progression of projects every month.

And generally you could say that it takes about five months or so before a project is awarded --

That's correct.

-- to a contractor? Okay. That's what I wanted. Thank you, Madam President.

You're welcome. The Chair recognizes Councilman Greenlee.

Thank you, Madam President. Commissioner, just at the risk of belaboring a point, just one more question on the Saturday shut-off issue. 111 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. You had mentioned earlier about the ability of the customer if they have the money to call and somebody would come out and pay. Do you have any idea, or could you get it, how many people do or can take advantage of that; in other words, how much you collect by that process of somebody calling back on a Saturday? Is there a way to find that out? COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: We do have that -- well, I don't know if we've isolated Saturday, but we do know that the folks that go and do the shut-offs do bring in a lot of revenue.

But that might be just the first time when they catch the people home, whether it's a Saturday or a Tuesday, right? COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Right. I think what we've found out is as our culture has changed over the last generation or two, it's much more likely to catch someone home on a Saturday than 112 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. on a weekday.

All right. I hear that, but that person that's not home on a weekday still has the ability to pay right away down here and get on the next day. The Saturday person doesn't have that. I know I'm repeating myself here. COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: No. 11 I understand, but I honestly don't have that great of sympathy. If someone has not contacted us, the Revenue Bureau, and has not done what they need to do to protect their water, their water source, then if it happens on a Saturday and they're out of water for a day or two, as bad as that is, I find I'm not that -- I'm not that concerned. It's a shame, but they should not have put themselves in that position.

Well, we agree on that. They should not have put themselves in the position, but I think there is a difference. I don't know how 113 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. else to say it. The person has the ability to do something more quickly any other day than a Saturday. So we're going to -- COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: I think one of the things that we might be able to do is to make sure that the notice that we leave on a Saturday once we've shut them off or we leave them a message to call perhaps our emergency desk when they get home and, if they have their 50 percent, to give us a call and we'll make every effort to restore them as soon as possible.

Okay. How -- never mind. Maybe you don't know. The other utilities, do they have Saturday shut-offs now? COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: I believe so.

They do? COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Yeah.

I know there was a time they didn't, but I'm not 114 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. sure. Because, again, this is the first time it got raised. I was surprised when I -- I know you do emergency shut-offs, there's leaks and all like that. That's different. COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Now, Councilman, I know you also know that we have a shut-off moratorium for residential customers from December 1st through April 1st.

I understand. COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Unfortunately, sometimes that moratorium is more of a disservice to some of the customers, because they ride that too long. They get behind the eight ball, and it's unfortunate.

I understand that, and people take advantage of sometimes the good-meaning programs. I understand that. In this case, it wasn't that much money. I forget the exact -- I mean, it wasn't 115 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. like she was like months and months behind. She had an agreement. There was a death in the family. She messed up, and she admits that she messed up, but -- all right. I'm belaboring the point again. Okay. Thank you, Madam President.

You're welcome. Are there any other questions from members of the Committee of the Water Commissioner? (No response.)

Seeing none, Commissioner, thank you very much. COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Thank you. I just wanted to mention that you probably won't be seeing me at the next budget either. I'm also in DROP and --

Oh, really? This is the first I'm hearing it. COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Well, 116 4/17/07 - WHOLE - BILL 070114, ETC. yeah. December is -- if I last that long, it will be December.

Thank you very much for all of your service. COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Thank you.

This Committee will stand in recess until tomorrow, Wednesday, April the 18th at 10:00 a.m. Thank you very much. (Committee of the Whole adjourned at 12:00 p.m.) - - - 117 CERTIFICATE I HEREBY CERTIFY that the proceedings, evidence and objections are contained fully and accurately in the stenographic notes taken by me upon the foregoing matter on April 17, 2007, and that this is a true and correct transcript of same. ______________________________ MICHELE L. MURPHY RPR-Notary Public (The foregoing certification of this transcript does not apply to any reproduction of the same by any means, unless under the direct control and/or supervision of the certifying reporter.)