Oh, the PIDC meeting was basically a presentation of our project before we even got started, where we met with all of the City agencies and the local utilities, and they had a chance to ask us questions about our project. And the only thing that was strongly urged, as I had mentioned, that we didn't continuously open up the street from past experience the City had with these kinds of facilities.
Did it have any relationship to the financing of the project?
Councilman Cohen, Carl Primavera. I mean, there were discussions separate and apart on financing, but the meeting that 57 4/11/01 STREETS & SERVICES - BILL 010182 Mr. Smyth was talking about was a part of the City's red-carpet coordination of City agencies for developers. And the concept was that rather than having the street opened numerous occasions, let's try to provide a common duct work so that once the infrastructure's in, then individual companies can take conduit through that, but you wouldn't have the streets opened up numerous times. And that was really the original thought that led to the ordinance here today.
Well, I was wondering if PIDC is involved in financing the various industrial enterprises or commercial enterprises. Is PIDC involved in the financing of this development?
This was a TIF project, and they may have acted as an agent.
I think Councilman Clarke may shed some light on that.
The answer is yes. PIDC was involved. This is a Tax Increment Financing project, and their involvement was early 58 4/11/01 STREETS & SERVICES - BILL 010182 on during that process of the TIF hearing. My understanding is that they continue to be involved in the project as it continues to be developed, not only upon completion, but it also monitors the job and the revenue associated with the project on an ongoing basis. So the answer is yes, Councilman.
Because of the timing and because of the work needed to light up the building, which I think is the term, we also ask the committee if we could have the rules suspended for acceleration of this project. Thank you.
Yeah. Did we ever do this before? This is for the Streets Department. Did we ever do this before, where we did amendment here, where it says, you know, if they can't get into one route, they can do another? Did we ever do that before? Is this something new?
No. Actually, there was some 59 4/11/01 STREETS & SERVICES - BILL 010182 concern expressed about, you know, the first and second phase. And the Streets Department offers this amendment as -- I mean sometimes, as we know, the City is getting congested, the right-of-way to build, and the intention is that -- I believe if there is a problem in construction and it becomes difficult to use the proposed route, for some unforeseeable reasons, there is a way that they can come back to the Streets Department and get approval for a changed route. And that's kind of the nature of this portion of the --
But then they don't have to come back here and get our approval. Is that --
No, no. That's really just a redesign issue around whatever construction problem may happen, you know, during the latter part of design or construction.
Now, does this set a precedent for everybody else coming after? You know, they get to do the same thing?
No. Actually, the Streets Department, after Council approves any kind of a 60 4/11/01 STREETS & SERVICES - BILL 010182 construction similar to this, there are street opening permits issued, and we record where the facilities are going into the street so that we have a record of it. And so normal procedure is for if there's any changes in construction, we get Asbell (ph.) drawings and, you know, we attach them and note any change in the permit as documented.
I don't know if you understood my question. If another firm comes in on another project, will you be doing the same thing? After this project, if we're doing something three years from, and they're going to come in and said, Well, you did this for them three years ago; are we going to do this for us? And then so on and so on. 'Cause the City wage tax was a one-time tax; we're still paying it. This the same deal?
Actually, I -- technically, I guess, because this project is connecting two buildings and they need a -- the industry needs a second route to make it a viable solution, no one would really want to probably go in a connection to the two buildings without having a backup 61 4/11/01 STREETS & SERVICES - BILL 010182 should anything happen and --
Councilman, let me see if I can answer the question. I mean, the typical ordinance is that Council approves, has a three-block radius or a three-block vicinity. So if your preferred route doesn't work out, it's built into it. This is actually a more restrictive ordinance than you typically see for this. So rather than setting a precedent that's liberal to some extent, we'd rather have the three blocks, but the City won't give us that. So I think it's more restrictive.
Based on this amendment, is there anything other than the route that is affected here that would get Council out of the loop? I think what I'm hearing is that Council's now out of the loop on anything that could develop. Is there anything that we aren't seeing here that this amendment or this change could 62 4/11/01 STREETS & SERVICES - BILL 010182 affect that we're not hearing?
This is not citywide; this is specific to this, am I correct? So, I mean, my point is that if any other -- if a similar type of request were made at another location, they'd still have to come back to Council for an ordinance.
The question is, is there anything that will be affected in this entire project other than the second route? Is there anything else that we're not hearing today that could be affected?
I don't believe so, because at this point, we have plans that have been reviewed by the Streets Department. And, you know, our testimony is based on that.
So there's no other -- there's no fine print or there's nothing that a month from now, six months from now, that this affects?
I mean, from my viewpoint, there isn't. We have actually submitted detailed plans and drawings showing the route that we intend to undertake. If for some 63 4/11/01 STREETS & SERVICES - BILL 010182 reason -- and we've done some pretty good homework so we don't expect a problem, but as lawyers, we all know that there's always something that can happen. If there's some condition or some obstruction and we need to move feet or feet 8 to get around that obstruction, because of the 9 timing of the project, we didn't want to come back 10 to City Council and go through a whole elaborate 11 process. 12 So what it says here is that subject to 13 approval by the Streets Department, if something 14 unintended happens in terms of this route, then it 15 builds into this system that the Streets 16 Department, if they think it's a prudent request, 17 will grant it, and we don't lose the time. 18 Because our tenants who are hopefully going to be 19 coming into this building can only come in if we 20 can guarantee delivery of the fiber. 21 So it's really a time sensitivity. If 22 we didn't have the pressure of time, we wouldn't 23 mind coming back. I certainly don't mind coming 24 back in front of this committee; I enjoy it. 25 (Laughter.) 64 4/11/01 STREETS & SERVICES - BILL 010182
Again, my question is, I understand the issue that we're discussing today. My -- the bigger question is, is anything else folded into this deal that could be affected other than the route of the -- the issue that we're discussing? Are there any other issues that could be affected that would take City Council out of the loop and put the decision process into the Streets Department only?
I don't believe so. I. . . You know, the next step, an agreement will be signed between the Amerimar organization and the City, and then all permits will be cut based on the description that's given in the ordinance.
Are you answering that as a matter of fact? You said you think so. Are you able to say absolutely not?
I am able to say that I will be a part of that process of getting information. As soon as we find that the bill is passed, and usually the organization comes back to get their agreement started, myself and the Law Department will be a part of that, and we will be making sure that the drawings presented then are just as they 65 4/11/01 STREETS & SERVICES - BILL 010182 are described in this legislation. That's one of the things that the Streets Department will be a part of that to assure that that's going to be what's built.
To the Streets Department representative: In the ordinary situation if there were a need, as Mr. Primavera indicated, of moving 10 feet or 25 feet, would the Streets Department have the authorization to approve that without coming back to City Council?
Yes. The procedure is to make sure that the proposal is actually okayed by the other utilities in the street. In other words, if you're going to move your location, we want to make sure, and we have inspectors and we have people that are -- that see how the job is progressing to make sure that any changes are done under coordination with other utilities, because we don't want people moving to locations that are already occupied by, say, for instance, a gas main 66 4/11/01 STREETS & SERVICES - BILL 010182 or something. So in that regard, we will oversee that portion of it.
And you wouldn't have to come back to City Council to get approval for that?
That will be done under a revision to the street opening permit issued by the Streets Department.
Well, I guess I'm wondering, why is there a need for this special, even more restrictive provision? Why is there a need for an amendment at all if you already have that authorization?
The typical ordinance 19 actually gives us a three-block flexibility, but the Streets Department, in their wisdom, didn't want to ask Council for that three-block flexibility. So we would be happy to operate under the traditional process, but this has been asked to be more restrictive. 67 4/11/01 STREETS & SERVICES - BILL 010182
Councilman Cohen, it's called "departmental bureaucracy." That's what this is.
I think I would like to just give a little clarity to this issue.
Make it more difficult to attract businesses to the City.
I got a little bit more involved than I planned to on this one, but this was the coaching of the City that took me here. I think I have to put things in perspective. As you drive your car or walk around the City, you've seen the City streets get ripped up for one or two conduits going there, okay? And you see the side of those plastic conduits that eventually get fiber. The undertaking we have here is 22 4-inchers going twice. That's why we said, can't 23 we have the three blocks? The 24 4-inchers is 24 basically an infrastructure that's 8-foot-by-8- foot. We have to find a way through the City 68 4/11/01 STREETS & SERVICES - BILL 010182 streets, and we've paid for the engineering to do this, to get ourselves basically from 401 North Broad Street to 1500 and then back around again. It's approximately 4,500 linear feet.
Any other questions for these witnesses? (No further questions.)
Anyone else who wishes to testify for or against the bill? (No response.)
This concludes the public hearing on the Committee on Streets and Services. Mr. Primavera, did you want to say something?
Likewise. Thank you for your time today. - - - 69 4/11/01 STREETS & SERVICES - PUBLIC MEETING
We will now move into the public meeting. We have just been notified by Councilman Brian O'Neill that at his request, we will hold Bill No. 010128 and 010130. They are being held at the request of the sponsor. The Chair recognizes Councilmember Cohen for a motion on Bill No. 010070.
Mr. Chairman, I move that Bill No. 010070 be reported out with a favorable recommendation and with a request for a suspension of the rules to permit first reading at our next session of Council. (Duly seconded.)
It's been properly moved and seconded that Bill No. 010070 be reported out of this committee with a favorable recommendation and that the rules of Council be suspended so as to permit first reading at our next session of Council. All those in favor of the bill will signify by saying aye. Those opposed? The bill is approved. 70 4/11/01 STREETS & SERVICES - PUBLIC MEETING The Chair recognizes Councilman Cohen for a motion on Bill No. 010091.
Mr. Chairman, I move that Bill No. 010091 be reported out with a favorable recommendation and with a request for a suspension of rules to permit first reading at the next session of Council. (Duly seconded.)
It's been properly moved and seconded that Bill No. 010091 be reported out of this committee with a favorable recommendation and that the rules of Council be suspended so as to permit first reading at our next session of Council. All those in favor of the bill will signify by saying aye. Those opposed? The bill is approved. The Chair recognizes Councilman Cohen.
Mr. Chairman, I move that Bill No. 010122 be reported out with a favorable recommendation and with a request for a suspension of the rules to permit first reading at the next session of City Council. 71 4/11/01 STREETS & SERVICES - PUBLIC MEETING (Duly seconded.)
It's been properly moved and seconded that Bill No. 010122 be reported out of this committee with a favorable recommendation and that the rules of Council be suspended so as to permit first reading at our next session of Council. All those in favor of the bill will signify by saying aye. Those opposed? The bill is approved. The Chair recognizes Councilman Cohen -- oh, I'm sorry, Bill No. 010128 is being held at the request of the sponsor, as is Bill No. 16 010130. They're both being held at the request of the sponsor. The Chair recognizes Councilman Cohen for a motion on Bill No. 010151.
Mr. Chairman, I move that Bill No. 010151 be reported out with a favorable recommendation and with a request for a suspension of the rules to permit first reading at the next City Council meeting. (Duly seconded.) 72 4/11/01 STREETS & SERVICES - PUBLIC MEETING
It's been properly moved and seconded that Bill No. 010151 be reported out of this committee with a favorable recommendation and that the rules of Council be suspended so as to permit first reading at our next session of Council. All those in favor of the bill will signify by saying aye. Those opposed? The bill is approved. The Chair recognizes Councilman Cohen.
Mr. Chairman, I move that Bill No. 010180 be reported out with a favorable recommendation and with a request for a suspension of the rules to permit first reading at the next session of City Council. (Duly seconded.)
It's been properly moved and seconded that Bill No. 010180 be reported out of this committee with a favorable recommendation and that the rules of Council be suspended so as to permit first reading at our next session of Council. All those in favor of the bill will 73 4/11/01 STREETS & SERVICES - PUBLIC MEETING signify by saying aye. Those opposed? The bill is approved.
Mr. Chairman, I move that Bill No. 010182 be amended as read to the Council Committee. (Duly seconded.)
It has been properly moved and seconded that the amendment to Bill No. 010182 be approved. All those if in favor signify by saying aye. Those opposed? The amendment is approved. The Chair recognizes Councilman Cohen for a motion on Bill No. 010182 as amended.
Mr. Chairman, I move that Bill No. 010182, as amended, be reported out with a favorable recommendation and with a request for the rules to be suspended to permit first reading at the next Council session. (Duly seconded.)
It's been properly moved and seconded that Bill No. 010182, as 74 4/11/01 STREETS & SERVICES - PUBLIC MEETING amended, be reported out of this committee with a favorable recommendation and that the rules of Council be suspended so as to permit first reading at our next session of Council. All those in favor of the bill will signify by saying aye. Those opposed? The bill is approved. The Chair recognizes Councilman Cohen.
Mr. Chairman, I move that Bill No. 010192 be reported out with a favorable recommendation and with a request for a suspension of the rules to permit first reading at the next Council session. (Duly seconded.)
It has been properly moved and seconded that Bill No. 010192 be reported out of committee with a favorable recommendation and that the rules of Council be suspended. All those in favor, signify by saying aye. Those opposed? The bill is approved. 75 4/11/01 STREETS & SERVICES - PUBLIC MEETING The Chair recognizes Councilman Cohen.
Mr. Chairman, I move that Bill No. 010195 be reported out with a favorable recommendation and with a request for a suspension of the rules to permit first reading at the next Council session. (Duly seconded.)
It's been properly moved and seconded that Bill No. 010195 be reported out of this committee with a favorable recommendation and that the rules of Council be suspended so as to permit first reading at our next session of Council. All those in favor of the bill will signify by saying aye. Those opposed? The bill is approved. The Chair recognizes Councilman Cohen for a motion on the next bill.
Mr. Chairman, I move that Bill No. 010196 be reported out with a favorable recommendation and with a request that the rules of Council be suspended so as to permit first reading at the next meeting of City Council. 76 4/11/01 STREETS & SERVICES - PUBLIC MEETING (Duly seconded.)
It's been properly moved and seconded that Bill No. 010196 be reported out of this committee with a favorable recommendation and that the rules of Council be suspended so as to permit first reading at our next session of Council. All those in favor of the bill will signify by saying aye. Those opposed? The bill is approved. This concludes the public meeting on the Committee of Streets and Services. Thank all members for attending, and a happy holiday to everyone.
Happy holiday, Mr. Chairman. (Adjourned 11:30 a.m.) 77 C E R T I F I C A T E I HEREBY CERTIFY that the foregoing proceedings of the Council of the City of Philadelphia of Wednesday, April 11, 2001, were reported fully and accurately by me, and that this is a correct transcript of same. RE: COUNCIL COMMITTEE ON STREETS AND SERVICES BILL NO.'S 010070, 010091, 010122, 010151 010180, 010192, 010195, 010196 __________________________________, JOSEPHINE CARDILLO, Registered Professional Reporter