civus
Hearing video

ZBA Hearing - December 9, 2020

Philadelphia Zoning Board of Adjustment (ZBA)Dec 9, 20206h 34m

Okay, good morning. Tanya, we'll wait for you to give us the green light to go forward.

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Yes.

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Thank you.

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okay chair we can try now thank you thank you very much tanya good morning everyone

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My name is Frank DiCicco. I'm the chair of the Zoning Board of Adjustment. I'll be participating

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in today's hearing along with our vice chair, Ms. Carol Tenere, board secretary, confessor

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plaza, and board members, Mr. Thomas Holloman and Mr. James Snell. Board administrator,

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Ms. Tanya Sunkit, and board attorney, Ms. Sharon Saleta, are also in attendance. For

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those of you who haven't yet participated in one of our virtual hearings, I'll go through

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some of the basics of what you can expect. First, we will be administering oaths to individual

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participants prior to their testimony. Second, we'd like to advise everyone that this proceeding

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is being recorded and that by participating, you acknowledge your agreement to be recorded.

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Third, for anyone participating by phone, if you wish to testify, you must raise your hand by

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hitting star nine and then star six to unmute yourself. I'll repeat, for anyone participating

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by phone, if you wish to testify, you must raise your hand by hitting star nine and then star six

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to unmute yourself. Finally, to enter an appearance statement, call Google 267-270-5548

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and leave your email address and the address of the property at issue.

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I'll repeat that.

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To enter an appearance statement, call Google 267-270-5548

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and leave your email address and the address of the property at issue.

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Before our Vice Chair, Ms. Tenere calls our first case,

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we'd like to ask if anyone is requesting a continuance

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or withdrawal of an appeal for this morning's list if so please raise your hand and while

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we're waiting for that I will read off a list of continuances that have already been requested

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MI 2020-001307 1127 North Lee Street that's number one on our list for our board members

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number seven on our list mi 2020 that's 001293 2154 north randolph street number eight on our list

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sharon uh we have no exhibits i understand for 1300 east columbia avenue

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that's true but if you could read the cases from the exhibit list first rather or the continuance

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list first rather than those with no exhibits please okay all right so next continued case is

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number page number 11 mi 2020-0007142544 west montgomery avenue

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number 17 on our list mi 2020 that's 001310 6931 van dyke street continuance as request

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attorney moving party and i believe those are all the continuance i have as of yet for this

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morning's list. And there are one, two, two listed, no exhibits so far, 1300 East Columbia

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I have two listed, no exhibits so far, 1300 East Columbia Avenue and 428 Monroe Street.

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Um, excuse me, this is Sharon.

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We actually do now have the exhibits for Monroe Street.

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What about Columbia?

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I don't have any record of receiving exhibits for that case.

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That case will be continued.

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and the case with no exhibits can we ask if anyone is here for it

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okay is there anyone here for 1300 east columbia avenue

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no new hands here okay um tanya has this case already been continued in the past

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I looked through my prior case summaries and didn't have any record of it having been

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listed in the past. What number is that? Number eight on our list. Okay, let me look at it.

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um no i don't think so okay mi 2020 dash zero zero one two nine five i'm sorry can i just stop

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you for one minute i do see sarah alderford with her hand up may i allow her to speak to this

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continue? Yes, please. Yep. Hi, Sarah, you've been unmuted. Are you the attorney for this case?

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Sarah Alderfer, you can unmute yourself.

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Good morning, Mr. Chair, members of the board. I was not raising my hand for this particular

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matter okay thank you all right so uh mi 2020 that's 001295 1300 east columbia avenue is continued

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any other requests for continuances or withdrawals please raise your hand

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we're going to open it back up to sarah who has her hand up for a continuous

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thank you uh good morning sarah please please identify yourself with the record spell your last

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name i'll swear you in sure sarah aldifer s-a-r-a-h-a-l-d-e-r-f-e-r 1500 jfk boulevard

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suite 800 philadelphia you swear and affirm to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the

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I do. I'm here today on 224751 North 53rd Street MI 2020-001308. I understand that there was some

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confusion with the hearing lists and we may or may not be on the list. However, we are withdrawing

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this appeal and i just wanted that to be noted what what what's the address again uh 2247

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to 51 north 53rd street all right has anybody found that yet no no i looked twice i don't see

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it on our list. Is it the 930 list? No, it's not on the list. Okay. Not on the 930 list, Sarah.

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Excuse me. This is Sharon. Sarah, is this something that was a resumption hearing? Was

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it previously? Was the hearing started on another date? No, the hearing was not started on another

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date this would have been the first hearing on this matter okay thank you i'm looking and it's

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not on the two o'clock list either if i'm not mistaken mr chair i believe that was yesterday's

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case if i'm not mistaken it was continued yes i believe that's true i confess her i thought it

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It sounded familiar, too.

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It sounds somewhat familiar, yeah.

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All right, Sarah.

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I guess Tanya will work it out with you.

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I think, as confessor said, we may have continued this yesterday.

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All right.

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Thank you so much.

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I'll reach out to Tanya.

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Thank you.

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Any other requests for continuances or withdrawals?

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We have a caller ending in 6894.

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Caller, you can now unmute yourself and speak to a continuance.

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Caller, you can now unmute yourself.

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and speak to a continuance.

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Good morning.

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Good morning.

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Please identify yourself for the record.

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This is Reverend Louis Nash, Sr.

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Miss you guys.

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Hi.

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Please, Reverend, spell your last name.

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Nash.

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N-A-S-H.

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Thank you.

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You're swearing to affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth.

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i do affirm thank you sir what uh what case are you here for 1407 and 09 north 15th street 1515

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north 16th street i believe it's mr mattione three and five and five are you the applicant

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no i'm the rco okay um and you're requesting a continuance

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no i was i was uh about to say raise your hands to affirm

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so we're asking if anyone is requesting a continuance or withdrawal i'm not i'm sorry

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i'm sorry no problem we'll get to that case shortly thank you

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no more hands at this time chair thank you

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okay before we get started

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we're going to have a vote on MI 2020-001458 7519 Ridge Avenue this case will be voted on

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at December the 16th at 9 30 a.m and we will vote on this case is MI 2020-000826

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6301 north broad street my vote is no my vote is no my vote is no

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tom jim

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well we got three votes okay we have three votes we may have technical problems with the other guys

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all right um okay let me get my paperwork straightened out here again

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so sharon uh 428 monroe we do have exhibits correct we do yes okay and one last time

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anyone requesting a continuance or withdrawal for the 930 list

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Excuse me, Chair, this is Pauline from IT.

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I was just wondering, Mr. Holloman just logged off, if he was going to, told him to log back

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in so that he could see if his sound returns.

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Okay, thank you.

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um can you hear us oh noise can you hear me yes we can yeah we're good now thank you

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all right um let's see before we go any further i just want to remind everybody do not attempt

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to testify in the chat.

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Any comments should be directed

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to our board administrator,

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Ms. Tanya Sunkit.

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Sorry, Chair, can I just do one housekeeping?

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Yes, ma'am.

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Court reporter, may I make sure that you're there?

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I'm here, Tanya.

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Thank you, Lori.

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You're welcome.

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All right, Chair, you can continue.

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That would have been something.

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All right.

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Sharon, do we go, or Tanya,

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do we go to the resumption hearings first or we just take them we take them in the order that

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they're listed correct um you should this is sharon you would generally do the resumption

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hearings the add-ons first okay we'll do that then so um i'll call it carol then you can do the rest

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That's MI2020-000970-6164 Walnut Street.

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We were waiting for feedback from the RCO and

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feedback from Councilwoman Gaultier's office.

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THE ATTORNEY'S VERN ANASTASIO.

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you may now speak good morning mr chairman members of the board can everyone hear me

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yes yes okay i'm sorry you can't see me i don't know what that's about but

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nevertheless i'm sorry was he promoted i mean i dressed up for this all right we're going to

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promote you i want to see it there you go there you go i mean i dressed up purposely so i figured

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you know mu thai okay we'll let you go fire away thanks um yeah we already put our case in chief

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on uh it was held for rco input we had not heard from anybody until recently uh apparently there

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was an rco issue where cobs creek was the coordinating rco identified to us when we

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filed this application in january my office emailed uh cops creek and the other rco uh

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that were identified asking for to be put on the agenda. That email goes back March 12th of this

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year. And after a few attempts, a secondary RCO did reply, but the primary RCO, coordinating RCO,

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did not reply to us. In fact, we hadn't heard from the coordinating RCO until 11th of November,

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which was after our achievability meeting. And of course, after the hearing and that email

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was not even directed to us. It was directed to the owner, the owner's daughter. It was forwarded

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to us subsequently. So nevertheless, it's a little convoluted, but at the end of the day,

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we did in fact meet with uh an rco we mailed to you know a couple hundred folks uh we had a meeting

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and uh that's where we are excuse me this is sharon saletta i believe that andrew goodman

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of councilwoman gauthier's office is um is signed on and has his hand raised he

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i believe wants to speak to this issue um and perhaps request a continuance but

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if you could thank you good morning mr goodman please identify yourself with the record

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andrew goodman g-o-o-d-m-a-n office of council member jamie r gaudier where or affirm to tell

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the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth yes absolutely thank you andrew please

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proceed? Yes, so our office would request that the board not proceed with a vote today on the

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grounds that the kind of outreach and notification requirements per the code were not satisfied,

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were not followed in this case. A meeting was indeed held, but it was with the wrong RCO.

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There is a process for officially getting a case reassigned should, you know, should a case

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actually require that, but that was not followed in this in this particular instance. And in fact,

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if we had known in advance, which is also a notification requirement outlined in the code

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of the applicant, we could have intercepted this and ensured that the meeting with the correct RCO

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actually happened, again, as per the code requirement. This sets what we believe to be

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a dangerous precedent that community engagement and notification outlined in the code be kind of,

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you know picked and chosen at will by the applicant and so we must object to that

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that is not typically the way it works as far as my experience and it's it's if i may mr chairman

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again we were notified of the coordinating rco we emailed as recently as early as march of 2020

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i've already sent that email to attorney saletta as evidence we did not receive any reply from the

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coordinating RCO. We did, however, get a gracious reply from a secondary RCO offering to hold a

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meeting since there was no reply from the, you know, it was a group email. No one ever heard

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from Cobbs Creek. So this secondary RCO stepped up and said that they would host the meeting,

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which then we took all the addresses and we did a certified mailing, which I've already put into

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the evidence of the record over the since the last meeting last hearing uh we held an rco meeting

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and it only after the fact did we find out that uh they needed another rco um and here's here's

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the kicker um we just found out that this coordinating rco they're not meeting again

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until next year uh and you know we put an application great i'm sorry

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uh and you know we put an application great i'm sorry i said that sounds great next year

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yeah well i mean we've we've you know we went through the process i understand with covid i

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certainly don't blame anybody for not reaching out back to us uh you know things happen especially

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during these difficult times but i don't think my client should be prejudiced further remember we

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You already had a hearing.

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Vern, you froze just there.

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Vern?

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I'm not sure.

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I mean, some point of clarification to respond.

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Hold on, Mr. Goodman, please.

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Vern?

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He's muted.

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You can continue.

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You, Vern, you froze up there for a minute.

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Okay, am I okay now?

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Yes.

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Okay, I just, I think I wrapped up by saying,

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I just think this would be very, you know,

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This penalizes my client for, and they didn't do anything that would warrant such a thing.

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We did exactly what we were supposed to do.

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Again, I don't blame the RCO for not replying, but be it one RCO or the other, the same number

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of addresses and the same individuals would have been mailed.

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Nothing would have changed.

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So we went through that process.

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We posted the property.

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We did a certified mailing, which is already a part of the record.

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There's not really much else we could have done.

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Yeah, I mean, from what I can see, you follow all the protocols that you needed to follow.

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Mr. Goodman?

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Yes, so we're certainly not contesting that mailers were not sent out, but the code also requires that district council office and overlapping RCOs be notified with advance notice of this meeting, which we weren't.

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And if we were notified, we would have been able to have this conversation at that time, but we weren't.

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So we're having it now, and I think, you know, the last date of the notification or the correspondence of the RCO being March 12th, I think is indicative, right?

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These are some dates that are all that are going to stick out in our mind as the days right before the city shut down due to COVID.

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and the Zoning Board's emergency regulations that they passed in the summer to start back up again

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state that the 45-day clock restarted to account for this and allow for applicants to re-engage

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with coordinating RCOs. And again, if we had known that this were a problem in July,

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we could have faced it in July, but we didn't, and so we're here today.

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We repeatedly emailed all the RCOs, all of them, throughout the COVID crisis. The only RCO to reply

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was achievability and we proceeded i understand some groups have more difficulties than others

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but the exact same 150 people would have been notified anyway so nothing and to and now after

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the fact to say oh we're by the way we're not in november we were notified by the way we're not

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meeting again in 2020 in november i think it's prejudice prejudice is my client yeah and that

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certainly not here to besmirch anybody the fact i mean cobs creek neighbors association has had

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quite a few zoning hearings since you know since the emergency regulations were passed so there

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would have been again an opportunity to intercept this and follow this according to the code um but

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it was missed and so we can't we asked the board not to proceed today

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mr goodman do you happen to know when the uh cops creek folks would be meeting

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um not off top of my head i mean usually they're standing meetings of the first monday of every

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month um so that's that's what i know brings us into january right and this board doesn't come

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back until i believe the 6th of january which is a month away at at the earliest um mr chairman

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might i remind everybody that this is we never had the hearing yep i know this is part two we've

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And we submitted written comment before that hearing as well.

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And no one reached out to us to coordinate a meeting in the last four weeks.

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The board's going to make a decision at the next week's executive session on the 16th.

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Thank you.

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Excuse me, but this is also a resumption hearing.

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Is that correct, Mr. Anastasios?

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Yes, this is part two.

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Yes.

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So, Sharon, we're taking more testimony?

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Yes, you are.

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Oh, I'm sorry.

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I'm sorry.

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I got ahead of myself.

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Well, the record's closed on our end.

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Yeah, on your end.

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Right.

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And Mr. Goodman, do you have any other comments on your side?

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No, nothing further.

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Thank you for the opportunity to speak this morning.

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Okay.

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Thank you.

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All right.

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Executive.

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So, Sharon, okay, we're going to close.

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The record's closed.

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The Board will make a decision next Wednesday, the 16th at 9.30 a.m.

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Okay, yes.

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The Board will make a decision next Wednesday.

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Thank you.

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Thank you.

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The other resumption hearing is MI2020-000774-3515 North 18th Street.

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Mr. Knockinson.

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can he be promoted he's being promoted now

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good morning mr chair members of the board good morning mr knockins

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identify yourself with the record please uh yes alan knockamson n-o-c-h-u-m-s-o-n

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of Knockamson, PC, 123 South Broad Street, Suite 1600, Philadelphia, PA, 19109.

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Just excuse me one second. I apologize.

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sorry about that i'm trying to socially distance in my office i'm the only one here and i had to

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answer the door sorry no problem do you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth nothing

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but the truth uh yes i do thank you please proceed uh yeah so i'm here to present 35 15 15

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north 8 18th street and um i'm going to share my screen

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uh so we were here previously regarding 35 enlarge that out yes

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uh can you see him mr chair a little bit bigger

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so let me uh just start out with the the notice of refusal so you can see

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what this is about. So we're here I believe a month or so ago regarding 3515 North 18th Street.

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We're here to legalize a four-unit dwelling in an RSA 5 property and the only reason why we're here

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is for the used variants. During the presentation,

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we showed that it's not uncommon to allow for multifamily structures within this proximity of

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within this proximity of the property and the only thing holding up the board's decision

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was community input we met with united uh toyoga and they unanimously are in support of this

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project and we also have they asked us to get signatures from nearby neighbors uh directly

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impacted by this project and here they are in support of it again it's we're not changing the

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unit count we're just legalizing the account there are meters uh for the uh this these amount of

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units and that's it thank you anyone have any questions on the board no no anyone would like

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to testify in this case please raise your hand no times at no hands at this time oh one second

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thank you planning commission one second chair um charles richardson has his hand up

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Oh, sorry about that. Charles, Mr. Richardson, please identify yourself with the record and I'll swear you in.

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Good morning, Mr. Chair and Board. Charles Richardson from the Office of Councilwoman Cindy Bass, room 312, City Hall.

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You swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth.

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I do. Councilwoman has no objections to granting the variance.

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Thank you very much. Thank you. Anyone else to testify?

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No hands, Chair.

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Thank you.

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Planning Commission?

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Good morning, Chair and members of the Board.

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My name is Greg Waldman, Planning Commission staff.

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Do you swear for them to tell the truth?

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The whole truth and nothing but the truth.

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I do.

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This property is indicated for single-family use in the comprehensive plan.

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We feel that the addition of a fourth unit represents an overuse of the property.

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Additionally, a decent development of multifamily in a single-family zone has created a collective overuse of the block.

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in a single-family zone has created a collective overuse of the block.

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Accordingly,

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Accordingly, we object to the granting of the variance.

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Thank you. MI 2020-000774 3515 North 18th Street. My vote is yes.

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My vote is yes. My vote is yes. My vote is yes. My vote is yes. Thank you. Thank you.

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uh tanya sharon we're ready to go forward with the irregular cases yes the regular list okay

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carol number three i believe uh not garrett is not garrett street 1163 garrett yes number two

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i'm sorry okay i moved my papers around yep it's okay thank you calendar number 1300 1163 garrett

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street good morning mr chair good morning can you put your name and address on the record

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please and spell your last name certainly it's jared klein k-l-e-i-n from blank rome 130 north

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18th Street in Philadelphia. Do you swear or affirm to tell the whole truth and nothing but

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the truth? Yes, I do. Do you also agree to waive the reading of the refusal and stipulate to its

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accuracy? I can waive the reading. Unfortunately, I can't stipulate to the accuracy, but I will

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explain that as I get into my brief presentation. Okay. And have you mailed the exhibit packet with

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proof of ownership, tax compliance, refusal referral, photos and plans of the property

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five days in advance of this hearing and have you met with the rco and do you have a letter

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yes to all those questions okay you may proceed thank you thank you very much i'm going to share

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my screen can you all see that yes yes good okay so we're here for 1163 garrett street

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which is in the pass young square neighborhood that i'm i'm sure the chair is very familiar

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with the location um this property is dual zone so it's a cmx1 with rsa5 um and that zoning

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designation we believe led to the missed refusal that i'm going to address in a second um but the

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application is to um consolidate lot lines uh this parcel has an odd uh configuration in that

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there's a rear there's an 1163 garret rear and an 1163 garret I'll call it the normal front parcel

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we're adjusting those lot lines and seeking to construct a single family house because the lot

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is of the typical South Philadelphia substandard lot size we got refusals for open area and rear

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yard depth the refusal that we think should be there but is not is the setback for the third

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floor from the street frontage. My read of section 14701-3 of the zoning code is that because we're

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CMX-1 but attached to an RSA-5, we were required to comply with the dimensional requirements of

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the RSA-5, but our plans did not show an eight-foot setback at the third floor. So we believe

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Al and I missed that refusal. However, as I'll explain as we move forward a little bit, we did

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address that issue with the RCO and the RCO was aware of that additional refusal and approved

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our proposal with that understanding. As I mentioned, we did meet with Pass Young Square

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Civic. Here is their letter of November 3rd where they were voted in non-opposition to the application

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and you'll see that they noted in here that the attorney for the property owner stated the

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application should have also received a refusal for the third story of the structure because it's

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not set back from the front. So we were fully transparent with the RCO about the issue we

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thought that L and I missed. Just to give you a sense of the application, this is the zoning map

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showing you the location of the parcel and an aerial map showing you that this property is

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located here. It is just off of Columbus Square and the city municipal building that's under a

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redevelopment proposal is located here so it's in that area this is the photograph of the subject

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property uh the idea is to demolish the existing structure as it is in as you can see a state of

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disrepair uh photos of posting uh and this is to give you some context on the block

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you can see that there are structures of a variety of sizes heights and shapes that are

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variety of sizes, heights, and shapes that are already on this block. This house here that I'm

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already on this block.

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showing on the screen is across the street from the subject property with its oddly configured

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bay windows in different heights. So we believe that what we're proposing is contextually appropriate

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for this block and as I noted the RCO agreed with it. Here are the plans. It's going to be a standard

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single-family house, much of the type that the board sees all the time. And again, the refusals

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that we received were for the rear yard depth, the open area, and that third floor setback.

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Floor plans and elevations. And the rest of my exhibit packet includes the standard documents

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that I don't need to walk the board through, certificate of tax clearance, deed showing my

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client's ownership, and the RCO mailing letter that was sent out to 107 different addresses.

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I would ask, in order to address the missing refusal issue, I provided Sharon with a separate

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set of the site plan. I would ask the board to stamp that as a proviso to clarify that the board

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is approving of the plans as presented. Excuse me, Mr. Klein, this is Sharon Saleta. I

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I did discuss this with Sarah Adamo at L&I and believe that it would be, just so it isn't confused, that these are not revised plans, these are your original plans.

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So adding a proviso stating approval includes variance for third floor setback. Would that be acceptable to you?

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If the board is inclined to grant this, yes, that would be a perfect proviso. Thank you.

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Thank you.

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And with that, I would just like my client to unmute herself, Elizabeth Garson, if you could virtually raise your hand.

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She's available. She can unmute herself and wait to be sworn in.

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Yes.

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Elizabeth, please state and spell your name and give us your address.

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Sure, it's Elizabeth Garson, E-L-I-S-A-B-E-T-H, G-A-R-S-O-N, and I live at 1159 Garrett Street, Philadelphia, PA, 19147.

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Mr. Chair or Madam Vice Chair, could you swear Ms. Garson in?

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I think the Chair does. Okay, do you swear for him to tell the whole truth and nothing but the truth?

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Yes, I do.

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Thank you.

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You may proceed.

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Elizabeth, did you hear my presentation this morning?

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I did.

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And do you adopt my statements as true, correct

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in your own testimony?

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Yes.

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Thank you very much.

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Members of the board, that's all I have.

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Okay, I'm back.

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Can you hear me?

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Yes, we can.

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Yes.

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Thank you, sorry about that.

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Questions from the board?

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No.

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Would anyone like else like to testify in this case? If so, please raise your hand.

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No hands at this time, Chair. Thank you. Planning Commission.

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Good afternoon. This is Greg Waldman, Planning Commission staff. This property

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is indicated for commercial residential mixed use on the comprehensive plan.

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both of the two lots consolidated are undersized from what is allowed under the zoning code,

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the requested lot consolidation would bring the consolidated lot closer to the minimum

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lot size required by the code. Accordingly, we have no objection to the granting of the

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requested variance. Thank you. MI 2020-001300, 1163 Gerrit Street, my vote is yes.

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my vote is yes excuse me this is sharon seleta could we add a proviso stating approval includes

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variance for third story setback so noted thank you thank you my vote is yes my vote is yes with

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proviso yes with proviso yes with proviso thank you very much everybody enjoy the rest of your

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day thank you you as well calendar number 1302 1407-09 north 15th street

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isaac slepner i think is the attorney

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oh i have a michael matt marionne okay you can promote him

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Mr. Sleipner is with Mr. Mattione's firm.

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I'm on.

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No, he's not promoted.

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Sorry, he's coming in now as a panelist.

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Sorry, he's coming in now as a panelist.

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All right.

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Thank you.

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Good morning.

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Sorry about that.

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Good morning, Mr. Mattione.

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Can you put your name and address on the record and spell your last name, please?

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Sure. It's Michael Matteoni, M-A-T-T-I-O-N-I, Federal Reserve Bank Building, 100 North Independence Mall, Suite 5A Northwest, Philadelphia, 19106.

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And do you swear or affirm to tell the whole truth and nothing but the truth?

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I do.

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Do you agree to waive the reading of the refusal and stipulate to its accuracy?

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I do.

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And have you emailed the exhibit packet with proof of ownership, tax compliance, refusal

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referral, photos, plans, five days in advance of this hearing, and have you met with the

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RCO, and do you have a letter?

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Yes, everything.

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Thank you.

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You may proceed.

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Thank you.

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Thank you.

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Okay.

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Thank you.

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And I have Joseph Byrne, the owner's representative, with me as well.

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This is, in many ways, a simple case.

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We're requesting to have 30 units in the building that presently exists.

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There will be no new construction, but it is legal for 24.

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And I'm just going by our tax certificate and the refusal.

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There's no new construction or anything in this building, but there are six units in the building that were built and were not legal.

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And we would like to legalize the units.

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We've met with the RCOs.

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We've met with four RCOs, four separate RCOs.

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Three of the RCOs, Map Holistic, Friends of the 47th Ward, and Community Land Trust, and they're the nearest in location to the property.

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They all support the granting of the variance.

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Beach Interplex sent in a letter saying that they oppose the variance, but they're also the farthest RCO from the property.

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The elder, Mr. Byrne, can speak to this a little bit as well.

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And I believe that Vivian Van Story from Community Land Trust and Reverend Nash, I know he's on, are both on and willing to talk about why they support this application.

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This application, again, the owner is very active in the community, and if they have the six extra units, it will give them additional funds that they will then use to benefit the community.

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They are very active in the community.

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They work very hard in the community.

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And this property was acquired by them, and it has, again, that's the opposition letter from Beach.

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It has six extra units.

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I just wanted to show some quick photos of it and then

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that's the building it's been there for a long time down the street at 1431

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north 15th street the exact same building that's legal for 28 units exact same building exact same

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footprint everything so when we met with the three nearest rcos map holistic friends of the 47th

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ward and community land trust they were all in strong support of this because they understand

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that the six additional units would give additional funds to allow this owner to give back to the community.

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They are very active in the community, and they fully support it for that reason.

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The alternative would be to have just larger units in the building, which the developer would do if this were denied.

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But again, the larger units are not as desirable.

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They have higher rents, and they leave the larger groups of students, which is mainly student housing, living together.

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and that has undesirable impacts of more likely for parties and things along those lines.

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The smaller units, just some additional photos of the building, the smaller units

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are much more desirable for that reason.

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So if I could bring on Mr. Byrne, if he could be unmuted.

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He just has to raise his hand first.

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Here it goes.

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you can unmute yourself and wait to be sworn in yes good morning sir please identify yourself

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for the record spell your name and that's where you win good morning chair uh joseph byrne b-y-r-n-e

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my address is 1516 north 5th street philadelphia pa 19122 swear or affirm to tell the truth the

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whole truth and nothing but the truth? I do. Thank you, Mr. Mattione. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

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Thank you. Mr. Mattione. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Joe, did you hear my statements?

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Joe, did you hear my statements?

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I did. And are they true and correct? They are. And do you adopt them as your testimony? I do.

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And do you have some any further comments for the board regarding you know why these six units

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legalizing and what benefits it gives to the community and how you work with the community

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regarding this property? Sure. So as Mr. Manionio mentioned, we were the original

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developer in 1431 North 15th Street, which is on the same block. This entire block on all four

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sides is 100% student housing. The sister building, 1431, is on the exact same footprint on the same

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block and we applied and received approval for the 28 units several years back. We were denied

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by the same board for this application and weren't really provided a reason why. It's the same size

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parcel on the same block with community support with the same architect and they basically just

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told us that they didn't feel like approving it at that time. So we amended the application,

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built the building and we had to do something obviously towards aware to change the application

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to move forward with the project, which we did. And I'd like to mention the fact that these units

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are not occupied, they're vacant. So what we're looking to do is, again, legalize the units that

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are there. We can offer these units at a lower rental rate and make them more affordable for

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for the residents in the area and basically that's it. Thank you. Thank you. Do you have any

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other witnesses Mr. Manione? Well I believe Reverend Lewis Nash and Vivian Van Story both

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want to testify they are from the two RCOs in the area that support the project. Okay if you can get

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them on and give us a brief presentation that would be helpful. Certainly. We do Reverend Nash

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first. Yeah, Reverend Nash is available. Good morning, Reverend. Please identify yourself again

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for the record. Good morning. My name is Reverend Lewis Nash, Sr. And Reverend, do you swear or

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for him to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth yes i do affirm thank you

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mr matty over reverend we met with you on this project correct uh 1407

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and you sent in a letter of support for this project yes i did and why are you in support

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of this project reverend i concur with the testimony that you gave and we would be pleased

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to support it because he is supportive to our community and we don't want someone to uh that

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made an investment in our community to lose out as well we appreciate the investment i have nothing

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further for robert nash mr chairman thank you any questions for this witness no no thank you

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Anyone else, Mr. Mattione?

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Vivian Van Story from Community Land Trust.

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She's available.

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She just needs to unmute herself and wait to be sworn in.

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Hello.

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Good morning, everyone.

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Good morning, ma'am.

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Please identify yourself with the records.

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Spell your name.

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Excuse me.

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My name is Vivian Van Story.

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I'm president of Community Land Trust, a housing development organization,

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a certified CHOTO for the city of Philadelphia.

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Would you please spell your last name?

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v-a-n-s-t-o-r-y it's one named van story thank you and you swear or affirm to tell the truth the

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whole truth and nothing but the truth yes thank you mr medione thank you mr chairman and uh

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miss van story um we met with you correct regarding this property in the application

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pending before the board yes and you uh were satisfied with the application yes at first

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I was with Beach also. And when it happened, we didn't understand the whole thing and who he was

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once I found out and then how he has contributed to the community in the past. And going forward,

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he is going to help us with some environmental education starting there to preserve the quality

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of life for the community. And on that end of where he has his buildings, we've always

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had multi-purpose buildings there. I mean, you know, not single family, but it was always

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structures and they were always, but six, we allow him to stay with the six and maybe he'll

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and maybe he'll help us with things going forward with the environment, the trash, quality of life.

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help us with things going forward with the environment to try.

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So when I, Mr. Nash had hosted the meeting, I went there too because I go back and forth

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and I met with him and I, you know, we worked, he said he would work with the community and plus

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it, he hasn't done a bad job in the past. So the Community Land Trust Corporation

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uh support his endeavors thank you thank you thank you do you have anyone else

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i have no further questions and i have no further um witnesses mr chairman thank you

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questions from the board no no i gotta have myself is there anyone else who would like to testify in

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this case don't use it this time chair thank you uh planning planning commission

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sorry about that um this is greg waldman planning commission staff this property is indicated for

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multi-family residential use on the comprehensive plan a total total of 14 units will you

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be permitted by right for this lot size and zoning district. We believe that existing 24 units is an

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overuse for the size of the lot and an additional six units would great in that non-conformity.

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Accordingly, we recommend that the requested variance not be granted.

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I get what you're saying, but if they made those units bigger, you're still going to have the same

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number of maybe an increase in the number of people occupying that building. All right,

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MI 2020-001302, 1407-09 North 15th Street. My vote is yes.

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My vote is yes. My vote is yes. My vote is yes. Thank you Mr. Chairman.

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Calendar number 0457, 1428 South 23rd Street.

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hi this is jared um i'm trying to share my screen yeah give me one second mister

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this is sharon saletta the property owner's name is jared beaujoli

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and i believe he's appearing pro se

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okay name and address for the record sir and can you spell your last name

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he's coming back in as a panelist thank you

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okay jared are you available open your mic and video

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Oh, okay. Perfect. Hi, Jared. Can you spell your last name and give us your entire name

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and address for the record? Yes. So it is Jared Borgeli. The last name is B-O-U-R-J-O-L-L-Y.

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And my address is 2213 Reed Street, Philadelphia, PA. And can you guys also see my screen that

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i'm sharing right now not yet but do you swear or affirm to tell the whole truth and nothing about

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the truth i do are you an attorney no i'm actually representing myself on this one okay um let me

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see something i'm trying to share the screen have you emailed the exhibit with the required

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documents which would be proof of ownership tax compliance refusal referral photos and plans of

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the property five five years five days in advance of this hearing and have you met with the rco

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and do you have a letter yes i have okay thank you you may proceed okay i'm just trying to get

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my screen you guys can't see it yet correct no jared do you have your documents open on your

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computer are you using the computer okay so now now that your documents open click on the share

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screen at the bottom of the zoom okay and then i'm clicking share and then click your documents

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and they will open up for all of us to view okay so i click share and then it says open system

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security okay i think i have to do some security stuff really quick hold on let's solve it all

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All right, here we go.

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Okay.

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Okay. And then let me try that again. Okay. And can you guys see it now?

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Yes, you're right.

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Okay. Sorry about that. Thank you for today. So the refusal for this project is I'm seeking

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to do a duplex in a RSA 5 district. This is a property which my father and I own in our personal

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names and I plan to reside in and my sister as well in the other unit. So I'm going to walk

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through my exhibit and I also wanted to state before I got started that I have full support

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from the Point Breeze Community Development Coalition and also the zoning committee and

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the community itself supports this project. So in my exhibit, I will go down the documents. You can

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see the refusal, and this is for the two-family dwelling in an RSA 5 district. And then the next

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document, I have some photos of nearby properties. This is the lot which the property would sit on.

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This is a new construction next to it, and then this is a property that's being rehabbed as well.

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the parcel that we are planning to build would be exactly the same height as this neighboring

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property so it wouldn't be any bigger and then I have some additional photos of nearby properties

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and then you can see that's across the street from the property this is also across the street

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from the property and this is the corner adjacent to the property this is the support from the

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community, the Point Breeze Community Coalition. They were all in support of the project. I didn't

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have anybody opposed of this. The community itself supported the project. Some of the

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provisors, which I spoke with the community and the board are to add a bike rack in front of the

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property just to kind of cut down on some of the congestion for cars, replacing the sidewalk

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in front of the property and then also removing the bay window that I had initially submitted

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to the plans with L and I and I agree with all those provisos. The next you will see a zoning

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map of the nearby. This is the property that's highlighted on the zoning map. As you can see,

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it's RSA 5 adjacent, you know, across from the property. And then this is my application of

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appeal and then additionally i have our tax good tax certificate standing i have my yeah that's

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the clearance you can see this is the deed of the property stating that we are the owners

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and then i have my zoning petitions which i got support from the neighbors nearby and next to the

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property there's a little bit more of those and then as you can see sorry this is zoomed in this

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is my certificate of bulk mailing. I had mailed it out to 214 nearby neighbors. Um, and then let

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me zoom this in. This is the project information form, which I also completed online. A copy of

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the provisos where I had, you know, I added, um, an egress and a stairs in the back. And I also

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removed the bay window, um, from the property, um, and those initial plans that I had submitted

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to L&I. And sorry, it's not letting me zoom in a little bit more or zoom out. And then this is

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the plans for the project. As I mentioned, it's going to be the same height as the neighboring

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property. And this next set of plans are the interior plans for the project. I will be living

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in the top unit and then my sister would be living in the bottom unit. And I've also highlighted the

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areas um that i've updated in the proviso and that would be the end of my presentation

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excuse me this is sharon seleta these revised plans are included in your packet is that correct

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yes they are and how many pages of the revised plans yes um just one page and then i have the

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reviso form that I completed as well.

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Okay.

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Thank you.

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And then I'm just going back up to the community support page.

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So did you guys have any questions for the project or?

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Frank, are you talking?

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Oh, we can't hear. Can you hear me?

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I think yes I think he might have to come back.

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I think, yes, I think he might have to come back.

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Can everyone hear me now? Yes we can. I just keep losing uh I keep losing my uh

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there you go okay uh i'm sorry have we concluded with the presentation

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yes yes does the board have any questions that's where we are okay has the board any questions no

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uh anyone else would like to testify in this case if so please raise your hand

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yes chair we have an albert little page good morning mr little page please identify yourself

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for the record. Good morning, Mr. Chair. My name is Albert Littlepage. I'm the president of Point

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Breeze Community Development Corporation. We're from to tell the truth, the whole truth and

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nothing but the truth? I do. Thank you. Please proceed. The Point Breeze Community Development

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Coalition is the coordinating RCO along with the community and the nearby neighbors supported this

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project along with the company Provisos. So we are in agreement with this project, sir.

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thank you and i i was not listening in because i was having technical difficulties there is a proviso

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yes um carol did you get that proviso no i did not they it was in a letter and now the letter's

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not up oh yeah the proviso excuse me this is sarin soled i would request that you hold the

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vote on this until the end of this 9 30 session um i have some questions about the proviso plans

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form i'd like to run by the applicant to make sure that we have it right before you vote on it

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okay so noted thank you and thank you thank you albert do i need to hold on a chair or can i hang

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up now uh i think you can hang up do we need mr little page sharon no okay thanks albert

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okay carol number five okay calendar number 1303 1515-17 north 16th street

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i'm here i'm mr mr mattione can you put your name and address on the record and spell your

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last name? Sure. Michael Mattioni, M-A-T-T-I-O-N-I. Federal Reserve Bank Building, 100 North Independence

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Mall, Suite 5A Northwest, Philadelphia, 19106. Do you swear or affirm to tell the whole truth

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and nothing but the truth? I do. And do you agree to waive the reading of the refusal and stipulate

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to its accuracy? I do. Another group of questions. Have you emailed your exhibit packet

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with the proof of ownership tax compliance refusal referral photos and plans of the property five

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days in advance of this hearing and have you met with the rco and do you have a letter yes

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everything okay thanks you may proceed thank you madam

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Okay, and again if Joseph Byrne could be unmuted because again this is a project he's involved

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with. And this is 1515 North 16th Street. It's similar but different to the case that we heard

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on 1407 when we have our tax compliance. It's different in that Mr. Byrne, his group, acquired

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this property on february 3rd 2020 but it was built six years ago the property has 20 units

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in it but it's legal for 19 units but the prior owner built it with 20 units um don't know why

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they did that but they were the prior owner and we had no control over what they did but we know

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what's in the building we are 204 square feet short of having the required square feet for 20

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units. So it's a very nominal variance that we're requesting. We did meet with, again,

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four different RCOs, and with respect to this, there was a support letter from three of the RCOs,

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the Community Land Trust, Matt Polistic, and Friends of the 47th Ward. And I know that we

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have Reverend Nash and Vivian Van Storey here to speak in support as well. There was an objection

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from beach interplex again beach interplex geographically is not very close to this the

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other three rcos are right next to this property and there are support letters from those rcos

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Those RCOs, I just want to get to the photograph for showing the property.

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i just want to get to

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This property is interesting.

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Even though it's new construction, it is on the Historic Register and was approved when constructed by the Historical Commission.

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and that's the property and it runs from 16th street to the little street behind it that I

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can't remember the name of I'm sorry anyway we're asking for one variance of 204 square feet to

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allow this this extra unit that's in the building to be legalized it is a vacant unit because it's

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not legal right now we've met with the RCOs like I said three of them strongly support it because

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Mr. Byrne has taken over the ownership of this property. He just took it over in February.

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And the alternative would be to have a larger unit or units in the building,

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but it is already laid out with this unit. So I would like to call on Mr. Byrne if he's unmuted.

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Mr. Byrne, you can unmute yourself. Yes, hi.

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he was sworn in the last case you have to swear him in again

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no uh mr byrne you're still on the road from earlier just identify yourself for the record

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please yes joseph byrne b-y-r-n-e and joe did you hear my statements i did are they true and correct

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they are and do you adopt them as your testimony i do and do you have any further

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comments regarding this application? Yeah, I just wanted to reiterate to the board,

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as Mr. Mattione mentioned, we acquired this building in its current state. It's been occupied

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for over five years. It runs to Sydenham Street from 16th. So the unit that was occupied

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at our own cost, we immediately, when we went to apply for our renter's license,

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were made aware that that unit was not legal.

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So we immediately moved to move the tenant out at our expense to break the lease,

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and that unit remains vacant.

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So we encountered this mistake that was made by the previous owner and developer.

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We immediately moved to make sure that we weren't in any violation

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and having that unit occupied,

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and we're just looking to legalize what someone else overlooked in the past.

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I have no further questions for Mr. Byrne, Mr. Chairman.

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Do you have anyone else, Mr. Maggioni?

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Again, Reverend Nash, if he's available.

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They would just have to raise their hand.

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You know, in the interest of time, Mr. Maggioni, as an officer of the court,

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We'll stipulate that Reverend Nash would adopt your testimony.

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And as well as Vivian Van Story.

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As well as Vivian Van Story.

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Thank you.

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Questions from the board?

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No.

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No.

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Anyone else like to testify in this case other than Ms. Van Story and Reverend Nash?

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No hands at this time, Chair.

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Thank you. Planning Commission.

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Good afternoon. Greg Weldon, Planning Commission staff.

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This property is indicated for multifamily residential use in the comprehensive plan.

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We do not believe that an addition of one unit would have an adverse impact to the block.

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Accordingly, we have no objection to the granting of the requested variance.

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Thank you. MI 2020-001303 1515-17 North 16th Street. My vote is yes.

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My vote is yes. My vote is yes. My vote is yes.

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Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you. Thank you. Calendar number 1292, 2018 East Tioga Street.

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Mr. Chair, it's a letter. We have a letter in non-opposition from Councilman Squilla on this.

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Thank you.

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Good morning, Mr. Clinton.

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Morning, Mr. Chairman.

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I'm Mr. Clinton. Name and address, please, and spell your last name.

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Henry Clinton, C-L-I-N-T-O-N, Queen Memorial Building, 1313 South 33rd Street, Philadelphia PA, 19146.

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Henry Clinton, C-L-I-N-T-O-N, Queen Memorial Building, 3rd.

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Do you swear on a firm to tell the whole truth and nothing but the truth?

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I do.

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Do you also agree to wave and stip?

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I do.

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And again, have you emailed the exhibit packet with proof of ownership, tax compliance,

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the refusal of the referral, photos and plans of the property five days within advance of this

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hearing? And have you met with the RCO and do you have a letter? Yes. Okay, you may proceed.

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Thanks. Good morning, Mr. Chairman, members of the board. Ms. Sunke, can I share my screen?

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Yes, you can, Mr. Clinton.

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is that large enough to see mr chairman

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yes yes yes this is good this is good okay uh this is concerning 2018 uh east tayoga street

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This is my presentation binder containing exhibits A-A through A-11.

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Appearance statement, the refusal.

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This is an RSA 5 zone, but as I will show you on this side of Tioga Street, it's generally multifamily.

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And the request is to add a three-family unit at this property.

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We met with Harrogate Civic Association.

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They are in support 12 to 1 at the meeting.

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They voted in our favor.

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They asked us to install cameras, provide some additional lighting, file a sidewalk tree application, and to have regular maintenance on the exterior sidewalk of the building.

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This is a pretty unique situation in that 2018 Tioga, my client purchased a property from the sheriff in September.

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The deed didn't get recorded until October.

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And then in November, for whatever reason, and you can see there's a sticker on the front door, the city demolished the building.

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And you'll see my photographs as I work through this presentation.

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This is the block right now.

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2012 is a duplex.

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2014 is a duplex.

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And I have documents at the end of my presentation to show you that.

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This was 2018, which the city demolished.

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This is a two-family, and this is a four-family.

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Here are photographs of the lot right now.

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You can see our posters notifying the community of our meeting today.

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Another shot of the vacant, now vacant lot.

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So the plans are to have three one-bedroom apartments on this site with one bedroom on

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the first floor, one bedroom on the second floor, and one bedroom on the third floor

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with a rooftop deck.

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These units are going to rent in the area of about $750 a month.

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We told the community group they were happy with that, and that's one of the reasons they

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issued their letter of support.

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The following documents are the deed, my mailings.

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I have to explain the tax certification.

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So I have attached real estate tax bills indicating that earlier this week, my client

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owed about $750, which he paid.

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This is a line from his credit card statement indicating that he paid.

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And then this morning, we just ran another printout from the UOPI indicating that he now has a credit of $336.

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That goes to the tax certification.

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These are your additional documents that are typically part of the presentation binder.

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The zoning map.

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I will have a witness who's on the call.

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Here's our zoning letter.

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certification that we mailed out 198 letters to the surrounding neighborhood but here's the

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records I wanted to show the board indicating that in fact my aerial photograph does represent

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what the remaining homes on this block on this side of the block are. 212 is a two family this

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since 1985. 214 is a two-family since 1976. 2020 is a two-family as of 2012 and 2024 has

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been a four-family since 1992. So I will entertain any questions that the board may have.

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So I will entertain any questions that the board may have.

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Do you have any witnesses?

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I have one witness to the owner, Wojtek Spadlow, who's on the call.

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And if he could be unmuted, I'll ask him to adopt my testimony.

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Wojtek, are you there?

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please unmute your mic oh yes do you hear me yes sir please identify yourself with the records by

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your first and last name his name vojcik w-o-j-c-i-e-c-h last name spadlo s-p-a-d-l-o

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i am the owner co-owner of the property thank you you swear or affirm to tell the truth the

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truth and nothing but the truth yes i do thank you did the court reporter get that spelling correct

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yes i did thank you chairman thank you uh mr uh clinton thank you mr chairman uh mr spadlow have

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you heard my testimony today yes i do if you had the opportunity to testify would you adopt my

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testimony as your own and as true and correct yes it is thank you mr spadlow thank you any questions

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from the board no no no no anyone else like to testify in this case if so please raise your hand

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no hands at this time chair thank you planning commission

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good morning this is greg walden planning commission staff this property was rezoned

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to residential single family in 2017 as recommended in the comprehensive plan

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However, we believe that three units is an overuse for the size of the lot.

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However, we would not object to two units.

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Thank you. MI 2020-001292-2018 East Tioga. My vote is yes.

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My vote is yes. My vote is yes. My vote is yes. My vote is yes.

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Carol, before you go, I'm going to be jumping off this call, this hearing for about 20 minutes or so.

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I know you're going to be here. I'm going to be here. Okay. Confessor, everybody,

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you'll have a quorum, I believe. James, you're still going to be on? Yes. Yes, sir. James,

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Professor and Tom? Yes. Okay. All right. I will see you all back in about 20 or 30 minutes. Thank

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you. Okay. Great. Calendar number 0263 1383 Sanger Street. I have a Sousa.

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Could you hear me?

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Yes, I can hear you, but I can't see you.

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Oh, yeah, I won't be able to show my appearance, but my name is Verna Souza.

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I'm the owner of 1383 East Sanger Street.

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Okay, can you spell your last name, please?

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Yes, no problem. S-O-Z-A.

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I'm sorry, could we just pause one second?

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Keisha, can you present her as a panelist?

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Yes, I just wanted to make sure she was the applicant first.

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Yes, I'm the...

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She's coming back in as a panelist now.

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Thank you.

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This is Sharon Saleta, if I could say that we do have a letter of support from the RCO.

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she's back ma'am you can unmute yourself okay could you hear me yes can you put your name and

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address on the record please and spell your last name okay so my first name is verna v-i-r-n-a

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last name Souza, S-O-Z-A, and the property I am applying for is 1383 East Sanger Street,

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Philadelphia, PA-19124. Okay, do you swear or affirm to tell the whole truth and nothing but

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the truth? Yes, I do. And have you emailed your exhibit packet with proof of ownership,

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tax compliance, refusal or referral, photos and plans of the property, five days in bail,

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refusal or referral photos and plans of the property five days in advance in advance of

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this hearing and have you met with the RCO and do you have a letter? Yes I have um and before we

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proceed is it possible if um the other applicant that's on the application which is under the name

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Feritza Cadillo you can see her on this call if she could share her screen to show that package

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as i present um sharon yes she can um okay if she raises her hand i believe she did yep

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yes she's coming in now as a panelist okay just so we're clear she will only show the slides and

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you would do the presentation thank you sounds great thank you tanya could i proceed yes you

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okay so good morning chair members and members of the board um my name is verna souza and sitting

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beside me during this meeting is my mother delma souza um we are both listed as owners of the 1383

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east sanger street property if you could okay so but he's sharing the package and a few so i'll

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just proceed um so the package being shared just consists of everything that's requested

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are you able to see the package no we can't see anything hold on let me do we do know it's an

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application for a permit for two for a two-family dwelling in an existing structure yes we still

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cannot see okay i'm going i'm sharing now okay now it's coming through i'm ready okay now you

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just have to put it up as you can see the application the refuel yes can you make it

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can you make it a little larger oh sure sure thank you so badita as mentioned earlier you're um the

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owner of the property can speak you can just move forward like vanna white with the slides

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okay thank you speaking she's just sharing okay so to begin the property was purchased during

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June of 2013 for me and my two children to reside. Unfortunately on August 18, 2018 our house caught

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on fire due to an electrical outage issue. Since then the property has been vacant due to not

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having insurance on the property at that time to assist with repairs. Gratefully my mother two years

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after, which is why she's the second owner now, she started to help us with fixing my home and

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transforming it to having the first floor into a bi-level with the basement as depicted on the

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plans that are shown in the package. And then the second floor would be a separate apartment.

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At the beginning of this process, we were not aware that to rent the second floor,

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I needed to complete a zoning because I had thought, you know, I'm living in the first unit

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until I was informed by license and inspection. After being informed, we immediately paused

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construction and began the process to make my home a legal duplex. There are many duplexes

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in the area. For instance, 1364 Sanger and 1392 Sanger C are just two of the many examples of my

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knowledge. I even have photos of it. You can see that they have two doors at the front entrance,

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just like how our property will have if passed to have become a duplex. So on October 7th to 2020,

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we met with the RCO after waiting several extra months due to the unexpected cancellations that

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the COVID pandemic has brought upon all of us. During that meeting with the RCO, we did receive

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a letter of support. Also, some details I forgot to mention is that we will make sure to have

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trash stored in container in front of the porch area. As soon as we get to the next steps of this

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process, I will also make sure I acquire all permits for building, electrical, and plumbing.

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Lastly, there will be exits located at basement rear, and there are windows on that level as well.

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You have no living in the basement, correct?

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So basically the plan is that me and my two children will be living on the first floor, and the basement is also part of our unit.

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And then the part that's run it to another person is going to be the second floor.

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Okay, Tom, do you need to see that plan?

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Do we have a picture? Oh, okay.

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Oh, yes, right here. Sorry.

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There it is, right there.

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And we had initially thought, since I was living in the first unit, that we didn't need, like, any permits.

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And we found out and we made sure to stop and make sure we begun the process as soon as possible.

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The bedroom that's in the basement, can you go back to this basement?

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Mm-hmm.

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Where is the exit?

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so it'll be at the rear of the basement um so currently we are like well not currently

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like well not currently because we have to pause it but we were doing we were working on that and

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because we have to pause it but we were doing we're working on that and making sure that

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making sure that that's safe and we have an exit there there are also windows located in the

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basement as well and then you go to the basement on the screen um you're present okay there you are

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um does that look yes okay to you yes good okay great um so yeah that's um everything i needed to

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clarify i just want to use this as a way to recover from the financial hardships that have

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been piling up ever since the incident in 2018 um i have a 10 year old and a daughter in college at

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moment so this will be a huge um help and i would greatly appreciate if the chair members

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and the members of the board could support thank you understood are there any witnesses

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does the board have any questions no

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i have a sloan folks

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sorry could you could you repeat that

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good morning good morning she's just saying we have some another person to speak to this

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okay okay hold on one second good morning and you can take your one second you can take your

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packet down.

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Okay.

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Thanks.

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Hi, Mr. Folks.

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Good morning, Madam Vice Chair

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and members of the ZBA. My name is Sloan Folks,

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S-L-O-A-N-E, F is in the fire,

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O-L-K-S, room 508

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City Hall, Office of Councilman

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Maria Quinonez Sanchez.

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The Councilwoman would like to have on the record

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that the applicant has met with

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the convening coordinating RCO,

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has received a letter of support

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and the Councilwoman

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has no opposition to this variance request.

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Thank you very much.

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Okay, and you were sworn in earlier, correct?

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No, ma'am, I was not.

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I apologize.

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I'm so used to hearing your name.

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Do you swear for him to tell the whole truth

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and nothing but the truth?

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Yes, ma'am.

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Thank you.

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Thank you.

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Does the board have any questions?

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No.

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No.

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No.

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Okay.

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I have one more hand, Mr. Allen.

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Mr. Allen, you can unmute yourself and wait to be sworn in.

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He's ready, Vice Chair.

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Okay, sir, can you put your name and address on the record and spell your last name?

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Hi, I'm not sure if I'm supposed to be on this Zoom. I'm supposed to be on the Zoom

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for 442 West Queen Lane.

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No, that's the wrong case.

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Right.

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You can continue.

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Is Mr. Al on this?

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No, he said he's not on the right Zoom. He don't think for this case.

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so okay so the board has no the board has no questions no thank you i'll count calendar number

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zero two six three i'm sorry chair i apologize for the interruption can we try to get planning

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commission on this we sure can as soon as i heard your voice i know back to my old thing

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planning commission please hi this is greg walden planning commission staff

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um this property is indicated for single family residential use in the comprehensive plan we do

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not believe that an additional unit at this location would create an adverse impact to the

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surrounding block accordingly we have no objection to the granting of the requested variance thank you

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calendar number 0263 1383 sangra street my vote is yes my vote is yes my vote is yes my vote is yes

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Okay, Ms. Sosa, your information will be emailed to you.

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Thank you so much, Guy.

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Happy holidays.

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Thanks, Petita.

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Calendar number 1299, 2511 East Firth Street.

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Leo has been promoted. He's coming in as a panelist.

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All right. Good morning, everyone. Sorry, it took me a second to get in.

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all right good morning everyone sorry took me a second to get in that's okay can you put your

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That's okay.

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name and address on the record please inspire your last name yes absolutely leo mulvihill

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that's m-u-l-v as in victor i-h-i-l-l address is 2424 east new york street suite 111 philadelphia

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19125 do you swear or affirm to tell the whole truth and nothing about the truth i do have you

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You also emailed your exhibit packet with proof of ownership, tax compliance, refusal, referral, photos, and plans of the property five days in advance of this hearing, and have you met with the RCO, and do you have a letter?

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Yes to all of those.

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Okay, you may proceed.

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All right, members of the board, good morning.

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Leo Mulvihill today on behalf of the applicant, 2511 East Firth, F-I-R-T-H Street Incorporated.

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We are here today because my client wishes to build three new single-family homes.

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The issue here is simple.

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We're in an industrial zone, and I'll show that in the zoning maps in a moment.

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For purposes of today's hearing, I'm showing now my exhibit table of contents.

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We have the refusal, appeal, and project information form at page one.

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Zoning maps at seven.

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Deed at eight.

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Commercial activity license at 17.

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Tax clearance at 18.

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My zoning letter is at 20.

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We have the letter of support from Old Richmond Civic Association at page 23.

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I have photos of the property at 24, plans at 36.

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So members of the board, I'm showing now a copy of the refusal.

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So the relocation of lot lines to take one lot divided into three, which are similar in width to existing homes on a residential block on Firth Street, which is located one block north of Greensgrove Farm in the Old Richmond Civic catchment right by Fishtown.

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The issue that we have here is that this lot is owned industrial commercial mixed use, meaning we can't build a house there if we wanted to.

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We tried to otherwise comply with all the RSA 5 guidelines.

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The lots are a little smaller because of how we had to do the subdivision, but they're similar, like I said, in width and depth to the existing homes that are adjacent.

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I'll move now to page seven of my packet, which I'm showing on the screen.

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you'll see indicated here on the top is the subject lot in dark purple that I've circled.

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Below, the second image is an overhead shot. This is right in between Allen and Gall Streets

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on Firth Street. This large purple parcel that I'm circling with my mouse, this is Greenscrow

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Farm. Directly next to us is a Greenscrow Farm storage area, which contains their apiary for

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you know, keeping bees, a number of other things. There's also a large metal structure that runs

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in the rear of the property. It may have used to house an industrial crane. We're not entirely sure.

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All right, yeah. Just perusing through my packet to get to the important stuff.

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Here's my notice letter, which went out on September 9. We had a community meeting

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on September 22nd. This is the reverse. It was a Zoom meeting. At page 22, I'm showing you my

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proof of mailing showing that 69 pieces of mail went out on September 11th. At page 23, which is

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on my screen, a letter dated October 9, from Rosemary Thomas, president of Old Richmond Civic,

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showing that 13 residents were present, 12 were in favor, one was opposed. So overall, this was

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approved by the RCL. Page 24, the site photos that I took, I apologize for my shadow, it was a little

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late in the day. This is looking westbound on Firth Street. You can see to the left the existing

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single-family homes are about 12, 13 feet wide. To the left you see Greensgrove's vehicles and the

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large open lot where the farm is located. The parcel that you see marked with an X in the street

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is where we're looking to build. I'm just going to do a 360 real quick for the photographs,

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paging through. Paging now for purpose of the record, 27. We see an open lot and then these

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plastic garage doors that have a no towing sign in front or no parking sign in front of them.

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This is the area in which we intend to build those three homes.

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And then you'll see in this photo, which is page 29 for the record, you can see that large

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crane structure in the rear. We're not touching that, that's staying. At this metal pole that

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indicating about one-third of the way down the picture. This is where the lot ends and we are

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not touching the rest of Greensgrove's lot which is off to the right of this photograph.

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This is looking now eastbound on Firth Street right towards Aramingo Avenue. You can see the

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rear of some of the industrial and commercial buildings are along Aramingo Avenue there.

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Southbound is the Sunsets. This is Greensgrove.

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all right those were the photographs now for purposes of the record referring to page 36

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in my packet these are the three homes that we intend to build brick front single family

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These are the three homes that we intend to build. Brick front, single family, three-story, nothing too crazy.

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three-story nothing

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Page 37, you can see how these three homes are going to fit into the existing site.

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This is the proposed lot consolidation. We're doing something a little weird with this, only because of the existing crane that I showed previously.

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um so 2509 East Firth which is the existing home directly to the west of where we're proposing to

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build they are keeping this part of this lot it looks kind of like a large L I'm indicating with

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my cursor right now or like an upside down L I guess I should say and then we are subdividing the

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lot so we don't touch any of that crane structure and we've been granted easements for each of these

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parcels to access a common fire alley. And the reason is the removal of this structure would be

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incredibly expensive and dangerous. Also, it continues through onto the adjacent parcel at

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Greensboro. So there's no way we could really do it or coordinate a way to get that out of there.

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So the existing owner of 2509 is happy to continue to maintain that and grant these easements to

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lots 1, 2, and 3 that we're proposing. These are the interior floor plans, nothing too crazy.

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Basement, we have a potential pet shower even, which is pretty cool, frankly. Bath, living area.

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I wish I had one. Ground floor, we have living, dining, stairs, and kitchen. The stairs are

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essentially switchback stairs in the middle of the house due to the lot width. We really can't

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do much else with it. Second floor, two bedrooms and a bath. Third floor, we have the owner's

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suite, so we have a large bath to the rear, large bedroom to the front with a nice-sized

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walk-in closet. Each of the homes also comes with a roof deck. The pilot houses are set

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back about halfway, so nobody's going to be hanging out in the street. This is the proposed

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building section. We're not going any taller than 38. This is our proposed subdivision plan,

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which has already been stamped by the city. Again, I'll zoom in on this for the board.

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These are our three lots. They end up about 571 square feet. If we had gone all the way back,

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which we initially tried to do when we were trying to figure out what to do with this giant

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steel crane frame, we would have been the same size as the adjacent lot of 2509, which is around

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1600 square feet. So technically we would have received the refusal of a lot size, but ultimately

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they're going to have use of space behind the homes here. And we do have the emergency access

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easements. Those agreements have already been prepared with the adjacent property owner who

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sold these slots to my client. And that was page 41, which is the last page of my packet.

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Going back to page 36, which are the proposed renderings, we're happy to answer any questions

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you may have at this time. But ultimately, the hardship here is this is a commercially zoned

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property on a residential block, pardon me, an industrially zoned property. It made sense probably

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in the past when there was some larger industrial structure here, considering the fact that this

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block, as you saw in the photographs that I showed, is entirely residential but for people form.

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That's why that's the hardship here, so that's why we're asking for our variances.

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And nothing else at this time.

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Does the board have any questions?

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No.

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No.

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And are there any witnesses?

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Not from me.

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Does anyone have their hands raised?

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Not at this time.

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Okay, planning commission?

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Good.

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Good morning. This is Greg Baldwin, City Planning. This property was rezoned from

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medium industrial to industrial commercial mixed use in 2017 as recommended in the comprehensive

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plan. Greens Grove Farm was using that property at the time of the rezoning. However, single-family

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residential use would be consistent with the rest of the block. Accordingly, we have no objection to

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with the granting of the requested variance.

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Thank you.

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Calendar number 1299, 2511 East Perth Street.

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My vote is yes.

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My vote is yes.

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My vote is yes.

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My vote is yes.

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Great, thank you Chair Tenere, members of the board.

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You have a good day.

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Okay, if everybody could hold on, you too, Leo.

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um number four uh calendar number oh four five seven one four two eight south 23rd street

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my vote is yes my vote is yes my vote is yes my vote is yes excuse me this is Sharon Saleta with

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my vote is yes excuse me this is sharon saletta with proviso one revised plans one page approved

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today please you got it my vote is yes with one page revised plans yes sir proviso yes for proviso

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yes with proviso thank you thank you sharon calendar number you're welcome

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1297-2951 South Broad Street.

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Sorry for that.

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Xin Chen is now coming in as a panel.

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good morning mr jen can you put your name and address on the record please and spell your last

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name sure zen jen zhen j-i-n 1617 john f kennedy boulevard suite 1838 philadelphia pa 19103 here

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on behalf of the applicant do you swear or firm to tell the whole truth and nothing but the truth

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i do do you also agree to wave the reading of the refusal and stipulate to its accuracy

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I do.

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And again, have you emailed an exhibit packet with the proof of ownership, tax compliance,

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refusal referral, photos, plans of this property five days in advance of the hearing, and have

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you met with the RCO, and do you have a letter?

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Yes, to all questions.

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Okay, you may proceed.

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Thank you.

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I will go ahead and share with the Board the information relating to this case.

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this is an application for a legalization of existing conditions. We have submitted the

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refusal letter from the South Philadelphia Community Civic Association along with their

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petition, the photograph plans, LNI certification statement, property sale listing, appraisal,

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agreement of sale, D tax compliance, and other related documents. So this is an application

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for use as a two-family dwelling at this location. One of the key reasons that we're here before the

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board is because when this property was originally purchased, it was certified as a zoning

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classification of RM1. And this was done at the end of 2019, August of 2019, when my client

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purchased the property. It was certified as RM1. Not only that, at the time of appraisal,

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I'm going to scroll down a little bit here to the layout of the property in the appraisal report.

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The property had existing, right here, existing two units set up. One kitchen, living room,

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bedroom and heater bath and garage in what is essentially the basement level, but it's a kind

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of a walkout basement situation. And then the first floor and second floor again is with additional

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kitchen and bedroom. So when the property was purchased and even as when it was listed for

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purchase, everything in the record showed it was RM1 and that included the city cert, which came

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to my client. However, once it was purchased, the zoning for this district apparently was

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changed to RSA 5. So when my client went to apply for a rental license, he was given a refusal

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stating that you must now legalize this existing use of duplex because the zoning district has

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changed. The community is not in support of a duplex at the location, both at the meeting on

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Zoom from the community RCO leadership who ran the Zoom, as well as petitions provided. It seems

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that the surrounding neighbors are not supporting a legalization. But I want to point out that

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there is a hardship here for my client because this is not a situation that was created

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by my client this is a rm1 zone district that had a existing long-term existing apparently duplex

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that was sold as a duplex was appraised as a duplex and was existing as a duplex at the time

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that the property was acquired i'm going to show the board the photograph of the property as you

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can see these properties, this one's on the corner, the first floor is actually elevated

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off of the street level so that there is one entrance at the upper level.

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so that there is one entrance at the upper level, and then what is called the basement level that

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was the other unit actually has its own entrance on the street level. So this is not a sub-ground

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basement, this is actually more or less on a ground level as far as the basement level is

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concerned. The property itself has the two electric meters from some time back. It is

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set up as a duplex from the time of purchase. None of this stuff is really new. The kitchens

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were existing. My client wanted to do some renovations to update the interior, and I think

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that's what triggered between that and applying for the rental license both triggered the city's

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feedback that this has changed now to RSA 5. I am not sure that the property was actually vacant

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for very long because at the time of listing, if you look at the property, it was still being

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occupied by prior owner as far as we can tell. So it wasn't a situation where it was vacant for

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more than three years and the zoning reverted because of that. So I'm not sure what happened

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between the time it was certified in 2019 and the time my client went to apply for their rental

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license with the zoning classification or whether the city simply made a mistake but the end result

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is my client has purchased now what is an existing duplex but is now stuck facing having to re-renovate

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it back down to a single family dwelling which is a hardship in this case because that is not

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something he created or that he had contemplated would be the situation he would face. So we're

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asking the board in this case to look at the situation in the whole and understand that this

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is not again not an intent to illegally convert any property this was an existing duplex that

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simply was transferred as an rm1 district and then somehow the districting changed i'm gonna

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show the floor plans here this is basically the layout that is existing inside the property i'm

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zooming in to give the board a better view of what's here. So as you can see, again, the setup

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is that the property has a floor level basement that has its own kitchen and living room and

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bedroom. And then it has the entrance from the upper floor that goes into the second floor and

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third floor that is one unit. So once again, I totally understand the nature of the opposition

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from the community. But I do want the board to understand that there is, again, hardship here

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that was not created by my client through any action on their part. It was a change somehow in

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the zoning during dependency of a transaction in the end of 2019. This is not something that

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happened a long time ago where he should have been more aware of the oncoming change. So I want the

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South Philadelphia Civic Association was in favor or in opposition?

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No, they're in opposition because...

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And isn't there another RCO down there?

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They were the coordinating RCO.

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I don't know if the other RCO...

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We reached out to everyone that was listed on the RCO notification,

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but they are the ones that actually coordinated the meeting on Zoom.

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And they did receive a petition from a neighbor, I believe,

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that went around and got a petition against converting the property. So as you can see,

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the vote from their side is opposition. And we discussed the same facts that I'm presenting to

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the board at the meeting. They do not see it as a hardship because they don't feel that

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the change in zoning affected my client's rights in any way, which I disagree with, but

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that is the position they have taken in this case.

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So as you can see, we did have the virtual meeting.

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They had obtained their own petition in the area.

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We did not do a petition.

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I believe this is a legal issue more so than a issue that the neighbors may actually understand

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from the perspective of a pre-existing condition that was legal and then the zoning district

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being changed in the area. Does the board have any questions? No. The floor plans show like

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it is existing two units. Yes, it is existing two units, correct.

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This is the quote basement level as you can see from the elevation plan it is above ground

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And that is the first floor and that is the second floor, according to the building's elevation and also the floor plans you see before you.

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and that is the first floor and that is the second floor according to the buildings.

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Correct.

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And even the appraisal report indicated that was an existing kitchen, both in the basement as well as the existing kitchen that was on the first floor.

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So it was not a, when he purchased the property, it wasn't that there was no kitchen in the basement and we put it in.

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It was there even at the time of appraisal.

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We understand.

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Are there any witnesses on this case?

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I believe my client, he does not speak English.

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So if I may stipulate, but his daughter is present who can speak English and answer and confirm my testimony.

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Okay. Can you ask her to adopt your testimony?

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Sure. Sophia Lin, she should be available.

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Yes, she's coming in now.

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good morning all my name is sophia lynn s-o-p-h-i-a-l-i-n

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good morning do you swear or affirm to tell the whole truth and nothing about the truth

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yes i do thank you okay thank you uh miss lynn you heard my uh representation to the zoning board

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regarding the history and the current conditions of the property um can you verify that my

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representations are true and correct and adopt my testimony as your own yes thank you thank you

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if i can jump in can i before you go i apologize i got in a little bit late um

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the next door neighbor 2941 south broad is he the owner um let me let me um let me see i have

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the property sale agreement the seller was uh carmilla salvo i'm not sure if the next door

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neighbor i'm not aware if the next door neighbor is still related to this seller i see i'm trying

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to get a handle again i apologize i was i had to i had to get off and i was not here for the full

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presentation. No problem. There were two votes that were submitted by the RCO, opposing?

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Yes. Well, the RCO, so the RCO's board was present at the Zoom meeting, and they voted against it.

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There was one attendee who voted against it, and I believe the attendee or someone submitted

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a 35 signature petition in opposition from the neighbors.

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okay i see frank phaby that's why i asked 2949 he okay he was the one who um i assume circulated

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the petition is that correct it's possible yes frank the name frank does sound uh like the

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individual you just had it uh on one of your exhibits right there you just passed it oh

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i'm sorry all right he's the next door neighbor okay okay yes all right and and again i apologize

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guys for my lateness. Was there a letter from Councilman Swilla's office? I have not received

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a letter, but I'm not sure if someone from that office is present today. Yeah, so Carol, if you

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don't mind, I know you were going to ask the board. No, I don't mind at all. Not at all.

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Anyone else who would like to testify in this case, please raise your hand.

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no hands at this time chair yeah planning commission

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good morning this is greg waldman planning commission staff

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this property is indicated for single family residential use in the comprehensive plan

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it was part of a bill in 2019 that rezoned the block for multi-family residential to single

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family to reflect the existing land use of the block however because of the property's recent

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use as multifamily, we have no objection to the granting of the requested variance.

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Thank you. And with the Board's approval, I'd like to close the record on this and that

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we render a decision on next Wednesday's Executive Session 1216, I believe it is, at 9.30 a.m.

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I agree.

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Thank you.

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Thank you.

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Next case is a resumption hearing, calendar number 0037, 3114 Frankfort Avenue.

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this is Sharon Saleta do have a letter from the RCO and from Councilman Squilla in non-opposition

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And from Councilman Squilla in non-opposition.

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Ms. Hamill, are you out there?

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I have a...

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No, we're looking for Dorothy Hamill.

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She's coming in down as a panelist.

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Thank you.

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I am here.

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Can you put your name and address on the record, please, and spell your last name?

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Dorothy Hamill, H-A-M-I-L-L, 123 South Broad Street, Suite 2100, Philadelphia, PA, 19109.

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And do you swear or affirm to tell the whole truth and nothing but the truth?

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I do. You may proceed. Good morning, chairman, members of the board, Dorothy Hamill on behalf

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of the applicant, Avi Oslick, who is also on the call. We had previously presented at the

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last zoning hearing, but we had been waiting for a rehearing with the Powergate RCO because we had

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agreed to original application was for seven units and in our presentation had modified that

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and presented plans for six. We had the meeting with the Powergate RCO and presented they as you

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have in the letter they voted to a letter of non-opposition to the proposal provided we are

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we've agreed to put additional lighting and additional cameras on the building.

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We already have cameras on the building,

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but we've agreed to put additional cameras and lighting on the building

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as part of our proposal.

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And I think that's it.

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okay um questions from the board no no no no

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anyone else like to testify in this case if so please raise your hand

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no hands at this time chair

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Good morning. This is Greg Waldman from Planning Commission staff. This property is indicated

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for multifamily residential use in the comprehensive plan. The property has a long history of being

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used as multifamily. Accordingly, we have no objection to the granting of the variance.

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Thank you. Ms. Hamill, is that a revised plan?

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yes what i had attached in the previous hearing how many pages

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uh two pages two pages thank you this is sharon slutt ms himmel if you haven't done so could you

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please send me the revised plans and the proviso plans form as two separate pdfs sure so i can

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stamp them and return them to you thank you yes thank you mi 2020 that's zero zero zero zero three

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seven three one one four frankfurt avenue my vote is yes with the proviso revised plan two pages

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approved today my vote is yes with proviso yes with proviso yes with proviso yes with proviso

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MI 2020-001290, 428 Monroe Street.

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Thank you everyone.

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Have a nice holiday.

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Thank you.

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Stay safe.

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Thank you.

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Thank you.

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Thank you as well.

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I don't have no one hand raised for this one.

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Do you know the attorney?

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Excuse me.

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The attorney is Neil Sklaroff.

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yeah he's coming in as a panelist now

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This is Sharon's letter we received a letter in non-opposition from Councilman Squilla

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Mr. Neal, you can unmute yourself, say your name, and wait to be sworn in.

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Neal, can you put your name and address on the record and spell your last name?

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Certainly. I'm just trying to get this. There we go. My name is Neal Sklaroff. The last name is spelled S-K-L-A-R-O-F-F.

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my business address is 1500 market street suite 3500 e philadelphia 19102

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do you swear or affirm to tell the whole truth and nothing about the truth

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yes i do and you agree to waive the reading of the refusal and stipulate to its accuracy

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yes i do have you also emailed your exhibit packet with the following documents proof of

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ownership tax compliance refusal referral photos and or plans of the property five days in advance

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of this hearing and have you met with the RCO and do you have a letter? Yes I think we sent the

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exhibits in longer than five days ago but a slight revision was sent within the last few days

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and that's what I'll be showing on the screen. Okay I do have to tell you you look like a federal

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judge in your chambers. You may proceed. Well, I probably would have some good cases then.

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I'm pleased to represent the School District of Philadelphia today with regard to a modular

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Classroom Project at the William and Meredith School. Joining the hearing remotely today,

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I believe, is Nicole Ward and Gamil Hall, who are from the district's Office of Capital Programs,

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as well as Omar Rosa from Stantec, the civil engineer for the project, and William Colette

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from OZ Collaborative, the project architect. I'm going to invoke 14.303.14F, and if there's no

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objection, I will make statements that will be on behalf of the client and can be used by the board

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to make conclusions of law. The Meredith Elementary School, let me just go through some of these.

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initially a list of exhibits

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our tax clearance

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there are a number of deeds here

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the Emeritus Elementary School

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is an assemblage of eight parcels

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that were purchased and developed

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in 1929

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and we have a

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a consolidation plan that has been approved as part of this application and we'll show some of

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that in a moment. This is a copy of the zoning notice. The property has frontages and not only

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on Monroe Street but also Fitzwater and Fist Street and so we put up six posters as well as

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copies of the refusal as is required and these are photographs of the postings as well as

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the neighborhood directly across from the postings.

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This exhibit shows the area in which the modular classrooms are to be placed. Now let me explain

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why we need to have these modular classrooms. The catchment area, that is the geographical area

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from which students are supposed to come to Meredith, would produce 680 school children

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in classes from kindergarten to eighth grade. The current building is operating at 120 percent of

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capacity. But because there remains a lack of space, there are 130 students from the catchment

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area that must attend school outside of the catchment area. So in order to meet the need

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So in order to meet the need and to return the screen.

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and to return the students... Hi, I'm sorry.

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Hi, I'm sorry.

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If I could just ask a quick question.

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We had a question about whether there would be share of your exhibit package on the screen.

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Isn't it on the screen?

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No, Mrs. Sklaroff, we don't see it.

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I did get a question of the audience.

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Yeah, I'm sorry.

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No worries.

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What am I not, I did ask you there.

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you click the share screen button and then click on your documents to share

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i did do that seem to continue to have this so try to unshare and then do it again if you wish

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and i need to get to that um

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screen

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is that working it's coming mr square got it thank you so very kindly all right i'm sorry

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i'm sorry to take all of your time let me just get this so it's

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that should be better

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these were the the last of a long series of deeds again this are the posted zoning notices as well

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as the posted refusals there were six of those and we showed the property

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that were opposite in the neighborhood. What you're looking at here on the top

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is an area that was used for several rows of parking. You'll see there's an existing fence

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to the left and some really nicely redone homes along Monroe Street, which is also to the left

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there in the there's a mural at the I think that's the north end of the building that will

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not be affected by that that's part of the mural arts program the piece through imagination is the

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name of it to the right you see the long-standing Murrith elementary school building

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shot from the other end is view number two at the bottom as a mixed-use building at the end

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it's a restaurant on the fourth floor and the first floor and a multi-family I believe on the

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second and third floor these are some additional views of the school and the area again that was

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a parking lot that will now be partially parking and the modular classrooms. This is a rendering

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of the four modular classrooms that were proposed and the area between that set it back 30 feet back

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and the area between that and the fence will be used for 19 parking spaces.

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this is rendering a site plan of that elevation this is a top view showing the classrooms there

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are four classrooms each of which has a restroom toward the bottom where it says floor plan

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you're going to see in a moment that that's an elevated deck where the students will enter and

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leave and and they'll have a short walk till they get to the main building this is our application

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for approval this is the site plan the zoning site plan that went along with that

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and we have some better plans as we go along Mr. Sklaroff excuse the interruption I think we can

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get past some of those plans that you were ready to present and summarize. This is similar to what

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we've done in other cases when it comes to modular to provide additional space for students.

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I'll go over the refusal I think and we could wrap it up. Thank you. This is RM1 zoning district in

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which educational use is permitted by special exception. I think the record shows that we are

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in fact in educational use and I believe the plans and all the records will show that there's

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no adverse effect to the community. The next four items have to do with plantings and setbacks and

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and setbacks and the like. The first one has to do that the setback can't be any deeper than the

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the like, the first one has to do that.

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setbacks on adjacent properties. The adjacent properties have a zero setback. As a matter of

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practice, recently we do not put the modulars at the street front as a matter of safety,

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and here we want to keep it as close to the main building as possible, and therefore we have a

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larger than permitted front yard setback. The second issue is they wanted landscape buffering

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to the north and south and toward the rear of the lot. Well, the rear of the lot is really

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Fitzwater Street, so we have two frontages. But we're not going to put any plantings toward

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the mural, so not to obscure that, or toward the mixed-use building, which has some

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lower windows. We don't want to obscure those. The third item was that the fences are supposed

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to be either wood or metal, not a chain link fence. We do have a chain link fence. We need

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to have people be able to see through it. But we have agreed that is the community,

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that is the school community, as distinguished from the school district, will work with the

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local community to see what they can do to improve the image from the Monroe Street view.

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And the last that they're supposed to be landscaping before parking in the street,

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If we were to do that, we would reduce the number of available parking spaces, which is something that we don't think anybody wants.

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Let me just, we had a temporary zoning permit, and so here is the elevated steps and the modular building from the existing building, Meredith's school side, and the top photograph is from the, showing the fence along Monroe Street.

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And we did meet with some time ago with the Queen Village Neighbors Association, as well as an additional RCO, well attended with 83 folks.

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And for the most part, they're in favor of this with the one condition that we, that the local school district parents and whatever work in the future with regard to beautifying that fence.

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That completes my presentation.

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Again, we have some folks who could answer questions, but I think that it's for the most part our position.

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do you need anyone to adopt your testimony no i'm using 14 303 14 just wanted to double check

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thank you thank you questions from the board not a single one uh anyone else like to testify in

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this case if so please raise your hand no hands at this time chair thank you very much planning

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Commission. Good morning. This is Greg Waldman, Planning Commission staff. This property is

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indicated for multifamily residential use in the comprehensive plan. We have no objection to the

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granting of the requested variants. Thank you very much. MI 2020-001290, 428 Monroe Street.

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My vote is yes. My vote is yes. My vote is yes. My vote is yes. My vote is yes. Thank you,

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Mr. Squarrow. Thank you. That completes my business before

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the board. You all stay safe and well. You do likewise. Thank you.

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You too. Calendar number 1296 4425 Baltimore Avenue.

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i have a gregory

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yes you can present um gregory as a panelist he's the attorney good morning board

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good morning sir please identify yourself with the record spell your first and last name good

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morning my name is gregory heleniak h-e-l-e-n-i-a-k address of 2005 market street 16 4 philadelphia pa

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Address of 2005 Market Street, 164 Philadelphia PA, 19103.

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1910

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And do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?

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I do.

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Thank you. Please proceed.

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Ms. Denary, our either Secretary Plaza, can we have the questions asked of this here attorney?

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Yes. Name and address for the record, please. And can you spell your last, oh wait.

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I'm sorry, Tanari, if we could ask the questions regarding the exhibit package, so forth and so on.

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Have you emailed an exhibit packet with the required documents, including proof of ownership, tax compliance, a copy of the refusal or referral, and photos and or plans of the property five days in advance of this hearing?

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And have you met with the RCO, and do you have a letter?

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Yes, we have emailed the exhibit packet five days in advance.

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We met with the RCO, Spruce Hill Community Association, and have provided a letter in our packet.

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They are offering their full support.

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Thank you. You may proceed.

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Good morning to the board and all those assembled.

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My name is, as I said, my name is Gregory Heleniak.

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I represent Eric Grau and Carol Ann Muller-Grau, who I believe are on the call today as well and available for testimony.

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They are the owners of the property here, 4425 Baltimore Avenue.

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We're in the RTA 1 zoning district.

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I would ask that our submission packet be incorporated into the record.

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And we're here today because a refusal was issued by L&I when Mr. Grau applied for a

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zoning permit for the continued use of this property as a three-family dwelling. What happened,

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there was an issue with the rental license that Mr. Growl was going to resolve and was informed

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by L&I that he needed a zoning permit. When he applied for the zoning permit, a refusal was

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issued for the three dwelling units. This property was converted in 1955 to three units. At the time,

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it was a doctor's office and two dwelling units. In 1984, through variants from this board, it was

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converted to three dwelling units and has been in continuous use as three dwelling units

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since that time. I'm going to share my screen here.

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This is our exhibit list. The refusal I was mentioning

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and the Spruce Hill Community Association letter.

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We met with them outdoors.

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Mr. Helleniac?

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Yes.

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I'm sorry.

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I'm always pestering.

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Would it be okay for you to enlarge it a bit for the attendees?

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Absolutely.

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Thank you kindly.

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That's good.

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Thank you.

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We met with Spruce Hill on September 30th outside of the restaurant school.

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And I'd like to note that this sentence here, where Spruce Hill normally conveys a position of non-opposition if they're in agreement, but in this instance, they are more direct in asking that this board vote favorably on this application to restore the zoning for this property.

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As I said, this is a longstanding use of the property. My clients have owned the property since 2005 and have maintained the use of the property as three dwelling units since that time.

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Copies of the tenant list from the closing documents and the leases for the period of the last 15 years has been provided to the board as part of our exhibit packet.

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this no alterations have been made to this building nothing has been done like I said

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this came up as an issue with the rental license that we're trying to resolve and I need to resolve

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the underlying zoning records with L&I this entire block except for this is the property here

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As you'll see, this entire block is these brownstone twins.

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All but one of them has been converted to multiple dwelling units, several of them far denser than the three units that exist in this property.

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This property exists with one dwelling unit on the first floor, one dwelling unit on the second floor, and one dwelling unit on the third floor.

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As you'll see, here's the back of the property. These are the meters for the property. There are three meters, one for each unit, one for common features as in public lighting and common space lighting.

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And the fifth unit is for the basement, which is just used as storage by the owners of the property, not dwelling or living space. As you'll see, this is the feature.

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dwelling or living space as you'll see this is the these are pictures of the property here's

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evidence of the mailboxes and the units inside there's a kitchen on the first floor and bathroom

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here's evidence of the second floor unit with a kitchen third floor door and kitchen space

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And this is the examples of the block where the entire block, this is across the street,

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is multifamily in these old brownstone buildings, as you can see.

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So what we're asking for, as I said, is for this board to correct the error of L&Is in

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issuing a refusal for this use as it has been maintained continuously since the previous

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variance is granted in 1984 or in the alternative we would ask that a variance be granted. It would

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be a hardship for the Grouse to deconvert this building back to a less dense use involving

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moving of kitchens, conversion of access, etc., etc., especially when it's been in this three-unit

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configuration um for about 50 uh 60 years um if there's no questions for me i'd like to bring on

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mr growl uh to confirm my testimony please proceed thank you uh eric if you can please

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raise your hand so you can be recognized um okay eric can you uh put your name on the record

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Eric Grau, E-R-I-C-G-R-A-U.

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Chairman, would you...

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You swear, yeah, sir, you swear and affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?

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Yes.

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Please proceed, Mr. Hellen again.

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Eric, did you hear my testimony?

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Yes.

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Do you believe it to be true and accurate?

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Yes.

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Do you adopt it as your own?

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Yes.

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and you purchased just to confirm you purchased the property in 2005 that's correct at the time

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it was uh three dwelling units with existing leases yes and if you maintain the property

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is three dwelling units continuously for the 15 years you're in the building yes

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i i would now open it up for the board if you have any questions for me

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thank you any questions from the board no no anyone else would anyone else like to testify

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in this case if so please raise your hand we also have an additional witness who can confirm that

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it's been three units over those 15 years that the board would like to testify i don't think

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we'll need that person yet uh anyone else no hands at this time chair thank you planning commission

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um good morning cusp of the morning this is uh greg waldman um planning commission staff

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this property is zoned a two-family residential and is recommended to be rezoned to multi-family

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residential in the comprehensive plan accordingly we have no objection to the granting of the

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requested variance thank you mi2020-001296 4424 baltimore avenue my vote is yes

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my vote is yes my vote is yes my vote is yes my vote is yes thank you thank you mr

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just for clarification it is uh 4425 baltimore avenue i just want to make sure that was on the

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record did i did i miss did i misstate that i apologize it's 4425 baltimore avenue yes thank

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you we appreciate the board's time thank you calendar number one eight four five four forty

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two west queen lane good afternoon i mean good morning it is afternoon good morning it's still

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for the record and can you please spell your last name absolutely uh zenjin z-h-e-n-j-i-n 1617

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john f kennedy boulevard suite 1838 philadelphia pa 19103 here on behalf of the applicant

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you swear or affirm to tell the whole truth and nothing but the truth

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i do you also wave and stip i do and have you emailed the exhibit packet with proof of ownership

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tax compliance refusal referral photos and plans of the property five days in advance of this

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hearing and have you met with the rco and do you have a letter yes to all questions

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and have you met with the RCO and do you have a letter? Yes to all questions. Okay great you may

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proceed. Thank you. Good afternoon. I'm going to go ahead and share with the board the information

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on this matter. This is a application for a new construction on a vacant lot. What I want the

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board to understand is that 440 and 442 are essentially two lots that are being built together.

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these are twin buildings so the number of units actually reflect it's three of each

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property so total of six the refusal is attached along with the community letter from

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solar germantown petition of support on our side photos plans now we also submitted list of

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neighbors with three to four units photographs of the neighbors and property use records of

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the neighbors. What this property is, it is a RTA1 property, which means that under the zoning

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code by right, my client can build two units on each of the lot for a total of four. However,

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what my client would like to do is to build six total units, but with the condition, of course,

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that no unit would have more than two bedrooms. The reason why my client decided to approach the

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community with this proposal is because four units, while it's by right, based on the size of

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the lot and the buildings in the area, four units actually turn out to be harder to manage

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with more additional bedrooms than if we had six units where we're restricting it specifically to

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two bedrooms each. The density of the bedrooms actually wouldn't really change because each of

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the two units would have at least three bedrooms versus three units with two bedrooms would be

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essentially a wash when it comes to the total density according to bedrooms. Now the additional

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units will be smaller with less bedrooms so that it will be easier to manage from the management

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side. These are going to be rentals and we were very clear with the neighborhood association,

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the neighbors, that this is that is the intent and that is what we see also with the neighbors

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in the area. As part of RTA1, part of the refusal also indicated six parking spaces, and we're able

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to put four in the front based on our design. What I want to do is actually show the plans first to

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the board, and then we'll address the specifics on the community's letter. So as you can see,

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the property is two buildings side by side. This is one's 440, one's 442. You'll be three units in

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each. We're trying to put in the parking spaces in the front. What is actually unique about our

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proposal versus what is existing on the block is that there isn't really consistent off-street

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parking on the block. On our side of the block, for example, it's clear from the photo of the

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properties next door that while this lot is going to put parking in the existing buildings next to

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us which are also twin style with three families in each does not have any off-street parking and

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in fact the parkings are for the most part on this side street on street this is a different angle

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you can see that the other property has a side entrance similar to what we're proposing and

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this is the other size building from our property. What we also want to point out with the design is

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that the ultimate design is to propose two bedrooms, three units. And again, this property

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will have a pretty substantial side and rear yard available to it so that trash management,

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whether it's two units or three units will be much easier than a roll home situation because

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you can access the rear space here the entire rear space by the entire building so there is

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open space in the back there's actually a 20 foot deep rear yard and the width of the property also

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allows the yard the actual width of the yard to be pretty substantial as well i believe it is

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25 feet wide and 23 feet wide, so almost 50 foot wide in width, 20 foot deep for the rear yard area

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where the trash will be placed until pickup time. The parking will be in the front. We are proposing

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a curb cut in order to achieve that. So again, the layout inside will be three total units with

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two bedrooms each, keeping the total bedroom counts to six bedrooms per building. Again,

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it's two buildings, three units each, so the mirror image of this floor plan for the other

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half of the building. We are proposing some balconies, but again, the idea was to have

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proposing some balconies but again the idea was to have some additional open air for the individual

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units if they're not using the rear yard. If that is an issue of course the balconies are not

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something that my client must have as part of the design. This is a proposed design

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based on the idea of a six unit building. I do want to also point out that this is a heavily

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multi-family block, 432, 36, 38, 44. These are all addresses which my client has confirmed

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have at least three units, if not more, with the other addresses on the block also have many that

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are at least duplex, if not more. So on both sides of our property, we're actually surrounded by

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triplex multi-family uses as well. And these are also reflected in the city records, which is

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attached to our exhibit. So we have shown that these are documented three families,

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they're not just illegally converted three families. So to address the community opposition,

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we met with the solo Germantown Civic and they did write a pretty extensive statement

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with their opposition. The key items here is that they're asking for some,

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without conceding to even agreeing to any idea of anything over a duplex what they have brought up

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a lot of their opposition was aesthetics of the project while we understand aesthetics is

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important to the community and my client was willing to negotiate without being able to move

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forward beyond we just want aesthetics without even possibility of considering six units i think

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the discussion was not fruitful and therefore we did not actually get into details with what

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could be concessions in the aesthetic side the community basically took the position they would

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rather see a single family house here than anything else which i understand but um again this is at

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least a duplex by right for each and therefore four units by right on the lot even if we were

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to build completely uh by right based on the zoning code so again i want to be clear with the

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zoning board that my client is willing and asking for a restriction on the number of bedrooms as

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part of any decision from the board that would be in support of a six unit. And if not, the final

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project would be four units. But of course, by right, the number of bedrooms would be adjusted

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according to the needs of that design. My client did try to get a petition herself for the

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neighboring property. But the issue is that they're mostly rentals. And therefore, most of the tenants

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were not willing to actually get involved with a petition in this case and both properties on both

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sides are actually set up for a triplex use on each of the house as well so that is again the

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community is in opposition i want to be cleared out again with the board but once again my client

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understand that there's no legal hardship because it's a new construction but what we're asking for

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the board is kind of a more reasonable layout for the property in the sense that six units with

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limitation to two bedrooms, no more than two bedrooms each, just makes more sense here than

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larger two units. I'm certainly happy to answer any questions from the board at this time.

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And if you want me to direct to a particular exhibit, I will be happy to do so. Thank you.

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Do you need to get your client on? Yes, my client is here by phone. Let me pull up the information

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real quick to make sure that it might be shown as a phone number.

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My apologies.

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I'm just pulling up the information.

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I have the last four digits or you can just ask your client to raise his hand.

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Sure.

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I believe I have the last four digits here.

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That's why I'm actually trying to pull up my apologies because there was a lot of information

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going through so last four digits is one six five five um it should be uh pinkus

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caller ended in one six five five you can um unmute yourself and just say your name for the record

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they could press star six

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caller you will have to press star six so that you can speak

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mr jen in the interest of time as an officer of the court will stipulate that your client

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would adopt your testimony are there any other questions are there any questions from the

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Thank you.

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Are there any other questions?

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Are there any questions from the board?

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board. No.

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No.

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No.

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Anyone else who would like to testify in this case, please raise your hand.

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Yes, Chair, we have Mr. Charles Richardson.

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Good afternoon, Mr. Richardson.

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Please identify yourself with a record.

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You're still under oath from this morning.

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Good afternoon, Mr. Chair.

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Charles Richardson from the office of Councilwoman Cindy Bass, room 312 City Hall.

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The applicant met with the RCO, and the RCO had some very specific things that they were looking for in the case that they have come out against this.

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And in fact, the Councilwoman is supporting the RCO.

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The property that is being proposed to be built looks nothing like anything that's smack dab in the middle of a block.

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And then it looks nothing like anything that is in the neighborhood at all.

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The density that they're asking for is too high.

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And, you know, if they're going to build something, they should go with their buy right, if anything else.

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But again, they need to try to conform more with what actually exists in the neighborhood,

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as opposed to trying to put something that looks totally different and is out of character

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with the properties in the neighborhood. So the Councilwoman is in objection to granting this.

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Thank you. Anyone else?

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Yes, Chair, we have a, I'm sorry, never mind.

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To address that again, Chairman, just to be clear, when we met at the RCO, we were never

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really able to get into the aesthetics because the RCO is taking a hardline position against

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any variance whatsoever.

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In the case of a by right build, the aesthetics would be what my client would be building

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based on their by right design so that is why the aesthetics were not further discussed at that

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meeting because we were not able to get past the issue of the number of units yeah thank you

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i'm sorry you can go ahead keychain i'm sorry uh we have a um miss allison but if you want to speak

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first miss tye you can no i just wanted to make sure we got allison from solo miss weiss

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Ms. Weiss, good afternoon. Please identify yourself with the record, and I'll swear you in.

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Allison Weiss, A-double-L-I-S-O-N-W-E-I-S-S.

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Thank you.

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Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?

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Yes.

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Please proceed.

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Yes, we are the RCO, and we hosted the meeting, and we submitted our letter, as Mr. Jim has referred to it, but I wanted to make sure there are many community members that wanted to attend this meeting and voice their opposition, so I wanted to make sure they had an opportunity to speak.

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well they will but we're we're just not we're not going to entertain anything uh

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from everyone we want the same same message from everyone uh no disrespect if something new and

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different uh that would be helpful but if not we'll just recognize that there are other people

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who are in attendance who are be who oppose this project yes and we we do have an opportunity to

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to touch on aesthetics but the community is opposed so thank you i'm sorry i missed that

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first part about the aesthetics what was that we did have an opportunity to speak on the aesthetics

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and the neighbors were unhappy with the proposal the balconies that no other property in the

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near area so let me ask you this i mean the the mr jen said that the balconies

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were not that important they would have be willing to remove it is there is there any

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opportunity do you think there's an opportunity to have further conversation on this matter

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and aesthetics aside because that's not an issue for the board only if it is for a twin at most

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okay that's what I wanted to get at okay thank you thank you anyone else

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planning commission.

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Good afternoon. My name is Greg Walden, planning commission staff.

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This property is done to family residential and is recommended to remain as such in the

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comprehensive plan. We believe that six units is an overuse for the site. The applicant would

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The applicant would have been permitted to build four buy-write units if the lots were not consolidated.

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have been permitted to build four buy right units if the loss were not worth.

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We also believe that the proposed front-loaded parking with continuous curb cut would have an adverse impact to the block.

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Accordingly, we recommend that the requested variants not be granted.

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Thank you.

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MI 2020-001845442 West Queen Lane, my vote is no.

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my vote is no my vote is no my vote is no thank you thank you calendar number 1765

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879 marcella street

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this is sharon saletta the property owner's name is tanya solomon i believe she's representing

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herself. Thank you. Good afternoon, Ms. Solomon. She's coming in as a panelist now, Chair. Thank you.

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good afternoon

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you have two devices on

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if you can turn off the one you're not going to use okay it's off all right okay can you put your

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name and address on the record please oh yes tanya solomon address 879 marcella street

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philadelphia pennsylvania 19124 thank you can you spell your last name please yes solomon s-o-l-o-m-o-n

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and can you also swear or affirm to tell the whole truth and nothing but the truth

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Yes.

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Have you submitted an exhibit packet with proof of ownership, tax compliance, a copy of the refusal, photos, and or plans of the property five days in advance of this hearing?

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And have you met with the RCO?

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And do you have a letter?

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Yes.

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Everything was submitted with approval from the RCO.

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Okay, great.

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You may proceed.

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Well, we're just actually just asking for rezoning.

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to continue to run our group daycare from our homes.

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We've been doing-

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Yes.

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I'm sorry, do you have exhibits to present?

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They're not coming up for some reason.

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Okay.

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We've been trying to download them

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since we've been on this call.

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All right.

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I know you were having some technical difficulties.

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So Chair, if you need them,

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I can search for them and try to present.

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but they were sent over to everybody on 12-1. I don't think we're going to need those.

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Obviously, no matter what we do, the state's going to have to do the inspection. They'll

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figure that out. Sounds good. Thank you. You said this is a continuation. Was this

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a temporary before? Yes, we've had two temporaries before. How many years?

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One was for two.

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One was for five.

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Okay, thanks.

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Go ahead, Chair.

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I'm sorry for interrupting.

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No interruption.

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Are you asking for another temporary?

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Yes.

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The RCO agreed to another two years.

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They know that we were looking for a property.

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Okay.

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And when does your current lease run out?

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This is my home.

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I'm sorry.

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When your current temporary variance runs out,

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when was it it ran out in February 1st I believe oh okay all right understood

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any questions from the board no no anyone else like to testify in this case if so please

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raise your hand yes chair we have um miss hillary miss hillary you can unmute yourself

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say your name for the um record

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good morning or sorry good afternoon mr chair members of the board hillary emerson on behalf

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of councilwoman sherelle parker you swear and affirm to tell the truth the whole truth and

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nothing but the truth i do thank you you're welcome um councilman parker um is not opposed

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to an extension of a temporary variance at this property for a group child care facility.

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As you know, we typically have some concerns about commercial uses on residential properties,

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which is why we believe a temporary variance is appropriate in this case. And as Ms. Solomon

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indicated, she is looking for another property to house the daycare. We're happy to note that

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that she is operating a four-star facility at her property

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um facility at her property and also that the community and the neighbors were not opposed to

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and also that the community and the neighbors were not opposed.

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an extension of a temporary variance at this location thank you questions from the board

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no no anyone else testify

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planning commission

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good afternoon this is greg waldman planning commission staff this property is a single

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family residential and proposed to remain single family residential use in the comprehensive plan

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we do not believe that the continued use of the state family daycare would have an

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for adverse impact on the surrounding neighborhood accordingly we have no objection to the granting

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of the special exception thank you mi2020-001765879 marcella street my vote is yes with the proviso

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temporary variance to expire december 31st 2023

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23. My vote is yes with the proviso. Yes with proviso. Yes with proviso. Yes with proviso.

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I believe that concludes the 9 30 session. Do we have any unfinished business?

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Chair if I could I just wanted to put on record with Ms. Solomon.

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Yes. Last time she came this is Tanya Ms. Solomon there was an error on the zoning board's part

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and i appreciate that her understanding with this and um any other assistance she may need

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you can come to the zoning board but i just thank you tanya last time it was our fault

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but thank you very much very much okay um i have a case which was not called 1127 lee street

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uh i thought that was wasn't that one on the continuous yes mr jinn i'm sorry we thought i

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thought that was continued and it was read as continued at the beginning of the session

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wrong on that um if we're mistaken on that would be possible for the board to hear it now yeah we

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did submit all the uh evidence needed to present it today it's 11 27 north lee yes that's correct

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Yes, and we also had a letter from Councilman Scuola in opposition and support from the RCO.

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I apologize for including that on the continuance list.

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Oh, no problem.

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No worries.

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All right, let's go forward with MI 2020-001307, 1127 North Lee Street.

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mr jen you're still on their uh uh oath so just give us your full give us your name and

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proceed with your testimony thank you then jen z-h-e-n-j-i-n 1617 john f kennedy boulevard

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suite 1838 philadelphia pa 19103 here on behalf of the applicant

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carol

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it's carol you're muted

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has he put his name an address on the record yes okay so you have to be sworn in i was sworn in

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earlier okay so it's down to have you emailed an exhibit packet with the required documents

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including proof of ownership tax compliance a copy of the refusal or referral and photos

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including plans of the property five days in advance of this hearing and have you met with

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the RCO and do you have a letter? Yes, to all questions. Thank you. You may proceed. Thank

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you. I'm going to share with the board the information relating to this case.

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We have submitted the community letter, refusal, photos, plans, and related documents with this

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case this is an application for a dimensional variance uh for a an addition to the real of the

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property community is in support of this application as you can see from the community

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letter it is voted completely in support uh the plans of the property what this is this is

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essentially a trinity house it's an extremely tiny lot and it is actually surrounded by uh houses

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that are like it, which already had extensions done. And my client's property is about one

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property from the corner of a row of homes similar to it. As you can see, these are literally little

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rectangular houses that have very short depth and are very small in size. So the addition is

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primarily to give my client opportunity to have more space within the property. The neighboring

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Neighboring properties will not be really impacted except for this house, which is not an objection to our extension.

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properties will not be really impacted except for this house, which is not an objection.

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The other side properties have already been covered 100%, and this notch is where the addition would actually end up inside of.

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So this window here would not be impacted as well.

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In essence, our addition will have no real direct impact on the neighboring properties.

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there's also a legalization of an extension for a kitchen, which used to sit in this little square.

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My client had a addition done with the kitchen and now seeks to also do a second story addition

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to extend the bedrooms. That is all this application is for. Again, it is a, the issue

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is that this property is so small that there's a hardship to trying to get more space without

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triggering a variance. And we would ask the board's favorable ruling in this matter. Thank you.

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Thank you.

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Do you have your client to be sworn in?

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Yes, I should.

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My client should be here as well.

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Anne, are you on the line?

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Maybe you can...

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Please apologize again for the mistake that you and your client have.

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I'm sorry, Amy Hongfei is the client.

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My apologies.

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Yes, she's available.

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Does she just need to unmute herself and say her name for the record?

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Yeah, hello.

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My name is Hongfei.

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Please spell your, ma'am, please spell your first and last name.

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Okay.

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H-O-N-G, home, last name F-E-I, F-Frank, E, like Edward, I, Indian.

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I live in the...

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Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?

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I do.

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Thank you, Mr. Jin.

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Thank you.

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Amy, you have heard my testimony and representation to the zoning board regarding this property

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and this application.

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Can you verify that it is true and correct and adopted as your own testimony?

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Yes, it's true.

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Thank you.

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Thank you. Any questions from the Board?

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No.

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Anyone else would like to testify in this case? If so, please raise your hand.

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No hands at this time, Chair.

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Thank you. Planning Commission?

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Good afternoon. This is Greg Walbem, Planning Commission staff.

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this property is indicated for single family residential use in the comprehensive plan

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we have no objection to the granting of the requested variance thank you very much mi 2020

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dash zero zero one three zero seven one one two seven north lee street my vote is yes my vote is

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yes my vote thank you all mr jen i apologize to you and your client for the mix-up no problem

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all right thank you uh we any other any unfinished business 9 30 session

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no all good all good all right thank you everyone stay safe see you in about an hour and a half

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thank you thank you good afternoon everyone we're going to give miss sunken a few minutes

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to go through her files and then we'll proceed with the two o'clock session

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carol carol you there yes yes but while you're waiting number one on our list for two o'clock

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414 20 south 20th resumption oh yes that's an appeal against ellen i we're going to do that at

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the end of our session two o'clock session okay move that back and we'll explain you know number

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Number three is continued, number...

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I'll read those off.

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I just want to make sure of those, but that number one, we're going to do at the end of

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the session.

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So, Mr. Plaza, are you available?

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Secretary Plaza?

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Yes, I'm here.

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Can you reach out?

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Could you do me a favor and reach out to Tom?

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It looks like there might be some concerns with his devices.

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He's got like three...

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I'll get a hold of him right now.

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Thank you so kindly.

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can you hear me oh tom are you there yeah okay yeah you got like three devices yeah i had a

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problem once i correct it okay it's still showing one of them is still showing connecting to audio

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now if it works for you and the sound is fine for us right now leave it alone

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but chair we're ready to proceed okay thank you all right okay thank you tanya

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Good afternoon, everyone. My name is Frank DiCicco. I'm the Chair of the Zoning Board of Adjustment.

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I'll be participating in today's hearing along with our Vice Chair, Ms. Carol Tenere,

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Board Secretary, Confessor Plaza and Board Members, Mr. Thomas Holloman and Mr. James Snell.

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Board Administrator, Ms. Tanya Sunkett and Board Attorney, Ms. Sharon Saletta are also in attendance.

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For those of you who haven't yet participated in one of our virtual hearings, I'll go through some of the basics of what you can expect.

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For those of you who haven't yet participated in one of our virtual hearings,

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Thank you.

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First, we will be administering oaths to individual participants prior to their hearing.

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Second, we'd like to advise everyone that this proceeding is being recorded, that by participating, you acknowledge your agreement to be recorded.

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Third, for anyone participating by phone, if you wish to testify, you must raise your hand by hitting star 9 and then star 6 to unmute yourself.

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I'll repeat.

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For anyone participating by phone, if you wish to testify, you must raise your hand by hitting star 9 and then star 6 to unmute yourself.

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to enter an appearance statement call google 267-270-5548 and leave your email address

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and the address of the property at issue i'll repeat that also to enter an appearance statement

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call google 267-270-5548 and leave your email address and the address of the property at issue

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Before Vice Chair Tenere calls our first case, I'd like to announce the following cases that we've received a request for continuance.

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And I'd also like to ask at this time for anyone who's requesting a continuance or withdrawal for the two o'clock session this afternoon to please raise your hand.

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So the following are cases we've already been asked to continue.

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MI 2020-002267-533 West Montgomery Avenue.

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That's number two on our list.

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Number three on our list, MI 2020-002206-1370 South 46th Street.

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Number four on our list, MI 2020-002266, 2000-34 North 2nd Street, and MI 2020-002256, 1837 South 10th Street.

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Those are the requests we've gotten to date.

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if the applicant and or his or her attorney is available and if you agree or disagree with those

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cases being continued if you disagree with that please raise your hand at this time and again I'll

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repeat if you're requesting a continuance or withdrawal please raise your hand

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no hands at this time chair thank you and I would remind everybody please do not

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attempt to testify in the chat. Any comments should be directed to our board administrator,

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Ms. Tanya Sunker. I'm sorry. Chair, this is Sharon Saleta. Number six on your list I have

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marked as having no exhibits. I heard from the attorney Corin Weiss today and we received the

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exhibits today. We also have a letter of non-opposition from Councilman Squilla. If you

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I could call Mr. Weiss so he can explain why the exhibits weren't timely submitted.

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Thank you. Mr. Weiss, are you available?

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Good afternoon, Mr. Weiss. Please spell your first and last name and I'll swear you in.

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Warren Weiss. C-O-R-E-N-W-I-S-E.

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And do you swear and affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?

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I do.

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Please proceed.

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Thank you, Mr. Chair.

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the exhibits were provided previously I received a call that they were not

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formatted properly we're not reading well so I did reformat them and submit

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them today and I spoke to Ms. Saleta I do apologize to you and your panel as

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well as Ms. Sunket and Ms. Saleta as I know that this is really challenging

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stuff and everyone's taxed but it is some pretty simple in my opinion hopefully

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of yours to a pretty simple dimensional issue with support of the neighbors and the RCL.

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No worries.

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Thank you.

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Anyone, anyone, any hands are up?

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I think you're already answered, but I'll ask again, continuance or withdrawal requests.

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Are we going to hear this one, Chair?

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Yes.

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And I believe it's, that'll be the first case we're going to hear, number six.

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is that accurate

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that's right yes okay i guess we can proceed

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i'm going to promote him yep i'm sorry chair i'm going to promote him to panelists he's going

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to come back in i'm sorry i didn't hear i didn't hear you

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I'm sorry I didn't hear I didn't hear you he's being promoted yeah he'll be back now

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Mr. Wise you are promoted so you can share your screen as necessary

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calendar number 2203 1219 Latona Street Mr. Wise put your name and address on the record

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please and spell your last name orin wise c-o-r-e-n-w-i-s-e

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address address sorry 100 north 18th street suite 300 philadelphia pennsylvania 19103

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okay do you swear or affirm to tell the whole truth and nothing about the truth

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i do and you also agree to waive the reading of the refusal and stipulate to its accuracy i do

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Have you, do I read that?

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Have you emailed the exhibit packet

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or have we already gone through that?

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It was emailed.

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We've gone through it.

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We need to read that.

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Okay, have you emailed an exhibit packet

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with the required documents,

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proof of ownership, tax compliance,

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refusal referral, photos and or plans of the property

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five days in advance of the hearing?

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And have you met with the RCO

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and do you have a letter?

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I have emailed the exhibits

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that are required we have met with the RCO and in that packet there is a letter of non-opposition

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from Pass Young Square Civic Association. Thank you you may proceed. Okay and with me I believe

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on the call are the architect Rick Miller and the applicant at least one of the applicants

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Christopher Steven and Margaret Mecca. I believe I'm sharing my screen I hope you can see my exhibit

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packet yes yes we see it okay thank you um so starting with the refusal so this is 1219 latona

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street the refusal is if you're familiar with this provision 701 2b4 this is the this is the

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third floor addition uh statute where um you can in in attached row home or in an attached row home

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you can build a third story, but if you're abutting two row homes on either side that are only two

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story, an eight-foot setback is required. The refusal is because the plans submitted do not

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have an eight-foot setback for the proposed third story edition. And I'll just zoom. Well,

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here's the, we met with the RCO. Here's the letter that the zoning board should have received from

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passing square civic association uh that the the rco voted eight zero in non-opposition with the

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roof deck and pilot house uh trellises at the rear and the front um being used as single family

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household uh and they note the refusal as well here where abutting properties are two stories

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and the code requires an eight foot setback in that scenario um this is the petition we had

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signed. As I tell all my applicants, I'd rather five signatures from the adjacent nearly impacted

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neighbors than 40 signatures or 400 signatures. We're at 1219, here's 1217. Other neighbors all

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on the block of Latona, and let me show you that, that do not oppose the variance at 1219 Latona

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Street for a third story with no setback. I asked when my client sent me this petition, I said,

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where is 1221 they said oh they live in california here's the email uh margaret is my applicant she

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emails me here's the email down here from miss bucks debbie bucks who is 1221 uh that says here

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we agree for you to build your third floor without the setback we'd want to do the same

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so uh let me know and hopefully this pandemic business is over soon um i'm sorry just same

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email I printed twice by accident. Let me zoom through. So here's the plans. In fact, bear with

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me. I want to just drop into the photos first. And let me show you that. While you're doing that,

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full disclosure, if you noticed on the petition, there's a woman by the name of Amanda DiCicco.

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she does happen to be my cousin so full disclosure

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thank you sir and thank you to your cousin um i want to show you the subject property first

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if i can find a good one

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no i can't find a good one

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no it's in here somewhere there it is okay this is 1219 latona street you can see uh two story

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You can see a two-story abutting.

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We can't see her, no exhibits yet.

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We can't see your no exhibits yet.

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What's that?

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I'm not, I'm not.

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We can't see your exhibits.

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You are screen sharing.

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Let me try again.

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Anything?

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yes we see yes okay got it now there we go so this is 1219 latona um the applicants uh margaret

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and christopher have lived here uh margaret's on the house for about 10 years long-standing

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members of the community um before the pandemic they were actually you know looking for a little

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more space and actually were looking in the neighborhood they love this location as as many

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of us do uh it's it's a great area and they wanted to stay in the neighborhood but we're outgrowing

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their home looked around actually couldn't find anything then the pandemic hit and uh bad went

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to worse and now they're working from home and really need extra space so they started talking

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about building up and when we when they got into this process and dealt with the architect they

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realized that there's this issue with the abutting properties and requiring eight foot setback

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and I'm sure Mr. Chair and the members of the zoning board have heard this before this rule

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regarding the eight foot setback for abutting properties creates kind of the haves and the

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have not scenario because if you don't abut a two-story property you can build up three stories

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no problem and you don't have to maintain that cordis line no setback this is the this is if

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the picture showed their property they would be two doors over to the right so this property

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is three doors to the west of 1219 this is uh 1227 i think and what's also interesting about

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this property is this property is not set on the property line and there is already a setback

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and the setback we'll see on the plans i think it's uh four or five feet so the facade of this

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property is set back from the property line and we see that three and four doors down where

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this house the gray one on the left is is built on the property line and the next one is actually

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set back from the property line so this distance this difference between the facades of these

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properties is that setback that is carried down this block on Latona so we do see down and this

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is like I said this is to the west so to the west we have three-story properties then we have three

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story properties three doors down which is set back um and now looking to the east we again have

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the have-nots in the middle two stories and then when we get down to the corner

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three stories so this if if my clients were this one they could build up uh without any variance as

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by right. And then, I'm sorry. So there's their house, 1219, next door, next door. And there's

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these larger properties down to the east. And this is to the east looking south. This is to the east

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north, three large properties is to the east south, the south, southeast corner, larger tall

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properties and then this is it doesn't come out that good but i was trying to show the setback if

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you look further down here you can see the properties down here then reclaim the uh setback

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on latona street and looking to the west you can see this is that setback that these properties are

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all set back that that amount of space i saw that picture already so um well i'm here i'll just

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show you the tax clearance which if you're going i've been trying to get the tax experiences from

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the revenue department and when we use that website to request the tax clearance all we

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get now is technical difficulties so i wanted to print out this page it says 1219 latona street

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is zero past due and I hope that's and here's Margaret Mecca um so they are compliant but

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the actual cert we were not permitted here's the deed to uh Miss Mecca 1219 Latona Street

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dated 2000 2010 so if I pull it back up to the plans I think we got a pretty good understanding

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of that you can summarize okay um yeah let me i'll just they want to put up a third story they

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don't want to step back eight feet um and there is

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And I can surely have whoever's on the line, I think it's Christopher Steven or Margaret Mecca, I can ask them to adopt my testimony for the record if that's necessary.

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Here's what's proposed, just to give you the idea.

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so they're going to add this trellis it's just this does project out into into what's the

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sidewalk but it's actually within their property line like we said here's a third story addition

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that's proposed large windows uh you know uh facade materials um keeping in character with

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the neighborhood and there's a small cornice line to be preserved but you can see uh here it's it's

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minimal it's not eight feet but the deck itself is actually set back because they're they're uh

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and the neighborhood was thrilled about the fact they're adding so much green on the on the block

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because there's going to be some planters here and the deck itself is set back but it's this

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it's this living space that they're so uh so interested in gaining because um you know they're

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building the third story they want to make sure essentially the difference between the the eight

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foot setback and no setback is is it is a room um because the stairs have to stay where they are

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and if they have to set it back they lose all this front area but uh the layout is going to

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be an additional room uh two additional two rooms up in the third story and if my client's been

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recognized i would just ask them to put their name on the record and and uh confirm that my

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my statements have been accurate and they adopt them as their own

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oh anybody on

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do you know if they um on the telephone

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uh i believe they should be on the zoom uh raise your hand

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mr christopher and margaret

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no worries if they're not able to get on uh we'll stipulate

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oh there he is steven mr christopher can you hear us am i getting it backwards again

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steven christopher i'm sorry i do this i do this to that every time his name is steven christopher

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please identify yourself for the record spell your last name uh this is steven christopher with

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the ph and christopher last name ch-r-i-s-t-o-p-h-e-r and i have my wife here with me

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I'm Margaret Mecca. First name, M-A-R-G-A-R-E-T. Last name, M-E-C-C-A.

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Steven, did you hear my statement?

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Yes, we heard your statement and everything is accurate and we would like to adopt it as our own.

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Thank you. Questions from the board.

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i'm sorry chair well sorry the question um was for them was not answered they were answering

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corin's question okay swearing them in we could just make sure that's on the record gotcha miss

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miss mecca mr christopher do you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but

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the truth we do yes all right we're all legal now okay yeah questions from the board no

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no no no no one else would like to testify in this case if so please raise your hand

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no hands at this time chair thank you planning commission

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good afternoon my name is ariel de liberto that's a-r-i-e-l d as in dog i l-i b as in boy

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E-R-T-O

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And I'm here with the City Planning Commission

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Thank you, Swear or Affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth

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I do

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Please proceed

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This parcel zoning requires a third floor addition to be set back eight feet from the front facade

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Because the adjacent properties are two-story homes

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The applicant has not demonstrated hardship to justify granting the variance

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Therefore, we oppose the granting of the variance

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Thank you

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MI 2020-002203 1219 Latona Street. My vote is yes.

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My vote is yes.

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My vote is yes.

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My vote is yes.

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My vote is yes.

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So listen, when you get that deck built, if you look east, slightly to the left of the chimney stack on Jackson School, I'll be on my deck and just wave to me, all right?

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it's on the record it's on the record take care thank you very much may i be excused

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thank you very much may i be excused so are we going to seven and eight now

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i don't know we we didn't have it we did we get the exhibits uh sharon

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yes you're going to um the two oak lane okay because early oak lane ones we're okay to go

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yeah no we have very good okay count calendar number one eight three five eleven hundred oak lane

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and wait a second strike that eleven hundred dash eleven twelve oak lane calendar number one eight

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three five and there's another oak lane calendar number oh seven three seven eleven twenty two

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oak lane are they all to be heard together sharon they are these were actually continued so they

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could be considered together oh okay great um bill car is the attorney and paul bonnie

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is representing i believe the rco okay thanks

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bill should be available he can unmute himself and say his name for the record

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okay good afternoon mr chair members of the board can you put your name and address on the record

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please yes i can you'll be sworn in after okay william kerr k-e-r-r um high schwartz is my firm

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name 40 east airy street in norristown pa do you swear or affirm to tell the whole truth and nothing

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about the truth? I do. And do you agree to waive and stip? I do. Have you emailed the exhibit

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packets with the required documents, including proof of ownership, tax compliance, refusal,

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referral, photos, plans of this property five days in advance of the hearing? And have you met

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with the RCO? And do you have a letter? Yes, to all of that. Now, this is the third hearing in

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this in this matter the first was february 12th the second was november 4th of this year prior to

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the november 4th hearing we submitted all of our exhibits there were four packets so you should

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have all four packets from the november 4th hearing thank you mr bonnie do you want to put

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your name and address on the record yes uh good afternoon my name is paul bonnie uh my office

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address is 325 Chestnut Street, Suite 1109, 19106. I'm here representing the RCO and also the next

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door neighbor, Yvette Young. Okay, and do you swear or affirm to tell the whole truth and nothing but

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the truth? I do. So do you also agree to wave and stip? Yes. And have you also emailed the exhibit

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packet with proof of ownership, tax compliance, refusal, referral, photos, plans, five days in

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advance of this hearing and have you met with the rco and do you have a letter well you're well you

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are yeah just to clarify we're the we're the public and according to he's not the applicant

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right right so representing okay right okay we do have exhibits and witnesses but um pursuant to

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the board rules we're not legally required to understand understood thank you thank you

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you may proceed someone may proceed okay i think um where we were is we we have a pretty extensive

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record already um including um a statement of support from the count from councilwoman parker's

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office and also a statement of support from the planning commission uh at the last hearing i had

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almost gotten through my witnesses and we ran into a time crunch i have one additional witness

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that I like to put on. It's our engineer. So at this point, I'd like to call Sarah Poindexter,

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if you could raise your hand, Sarah. And Chair, if I could just point that the notice that went

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to the attorneys was that this would be limited to 45 minutes to an hour because we have another

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special listed. Thank you. Thank you. Yeah, this this will be very short. And then Mr. Boney can

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put his uh his uh opposition on here is available okay she just had to unmute herself uh it says

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sarah been activated are you able to hear me yes that you sir yes ma'am please identify yourself

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with the record uh spell your last first and last name this is sarah poindexter s-a-r-a-p-o-i-n-d-e-x-t-e-r

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Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?

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I do, yes.

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And your interest in this application?

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I'm the engineer of record and was the one who prepared the zoning site plan.

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I'm the engineer of record and was the one who prepared the zoning site.

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Thank you.

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Please proceed.

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Okay, I'm trying to, okay, this is, can everyone, I guess I'm not sure I've shared that yet.

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Can everyone see the screen?

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Nothing yet.

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every time you do this you think you have it figured out and then the next time you

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go to do it it doesn't quite work all right how about now no

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now yes got it now yes okay this is our this is our um the view of our project

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just to refresh your recollection.

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And then I want to get to the site plan.

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Does everyone see the site plan?

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Yes.

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And then this is our zoning plan.

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This is the one I really wanted to get to.

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Okay, so Sarah, have you, did you,

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did your office prepare this site plan?

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Sarah?

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We'll stipulate that.

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Sorry.

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I was muted.

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Excuse me, what was the question Bill? Did your office prepare this site plan?

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Yes. Okay, and who are you employed by?

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Employed by Rodriguez Consulting, Survey and Civil Engineer. Okay, could you just give the

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board a brief synopsis of your background as an engineer? I would stipulate she's an expert

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engineer thank you we'll stipulate thank you okay at the uh november 4th hearing um did you hear

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testimony by mr horner our traffic engineer i did and do you uh do you support or do you agree with

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his uh testimony on the uh the parking and the traffic issues i do um i i was also wanting just

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to point out in addition to david's testimony um you know there's kind of a counterintuitive

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engineering principle that i think applies um to this project where you know off street parking

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lots um sometimes people don't realize actually promote traffic um and and vehicles in neighborhoods

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so um i i think you know it's been said a few times throughout these testimonies but

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this senior housing development really is um meant to attract and you know how it's been explained

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and i think how it's represented in the design it's been um designed to attract seniors who

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who want to live in a community that doesn't require a private vehicle um that's you know

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why a shuttle has been is going to be provided by the management service so um it's it's my opinion

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that you know yes i agree with david's testimony but i also feel like that you know this development

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is meant to attract those who are looking to not have a private vehicle.

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So do you believe that the on-site parking that we're providing is adequate for this property?

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Yes, especially with the expanded parking, which is meant for the employees and visitors.

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What I also think is a great addition of this expanded parking is that it allows for ADA

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compliant loading and trash pickup. And do you have an opinion as to whether

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this proposed development including the parking in the driveway

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configuration would have a negative impact on the neighborhood from an engineering perspective?

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I do not believe it will have a negative impact. That's all I have for Ms. Poindexter.

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I have some questions. Thank you Mr. Kerr. Could you keep just leave this drawing up on the screen?

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I'll leave it there.

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But could you zoom in a little bit on the drawing?

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This is where I get challenged.

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Well, it's...

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Because I'm not seeing the zoom, the zooming it, the zooming...

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Maybe the plus at the middle top, but I don't know.

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Yeah, I'm not seeing... maybe I'll try that.

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No, that's not working.

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Okay, if you can just then push it down so we can see the top of the page.

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Yeah, I'm not seeing any function that would allow me to zoom in.

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That's it.

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Is that okay?

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A little more, a little more.

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How's that?

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Thank you.

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Thank you very much.

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Good afternoon, Ms. Poindexter.

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Your drawing has at the top towards the left has a label about Oak Lane Avenue and it says that on this.

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label about Oak Lane Avenue and it says that on this block Oak Lane Avenue has a width of 60 feet

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but then it says quote on city plan so I'm guessing that that means that on paper in the

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city offices it says 60 feet but you would you agree with me that in real life it's not 60 feet

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wide it is 60 feet wide um the difference between the um you know the city plan and the actual um

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is that there's not a 13 foot sidewalk 34 foot pavement 13 foot sidewalk um designation it was

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not built to city plan but the actual right-of-way width is 60 feet

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Well, I don't want to embarrass you, but I mean, it's clear that you have not measured

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it. Is that correct? That you didn't go out there with a tape measure? I mean, I'm just

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going to, let me cut to the chase because this is just a factual matter. My client and

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I went up to the-

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We actually, we are as a surveyor. Yeah. So we did measure. And on the north side of

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oak lane the right-of-way from a visual standpoint it looks like it's private property but the right

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of way actually goes through the front yards of the the properties on the north side of oak lane

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right so on okay i don't know why we're having this problem so on the city plan the right-of-way

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goes through somebody's front lawn but in real life a car has only a much much narrower width

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from concrete curb to concrete curb.

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So it sounds like you're asking for the width of the pavement, not the right-of-way.

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Thank you.

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Is that correct?

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Yeah, the right-of-way is the legal city limit property.

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Okay, well, I didn't understand your terminology in your profession, and I apologize for that.

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So the width of the street that the car can drive on before it hits a curb is much less than 60.

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Is that correct?

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Correct.

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It was supposed to be 34 feet, and it is less than 34 feet.

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Okay.

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Would it surprise you if it was 22 feet 6 inches?

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No, it would not surprise me if it was 22 feet 6 inches.

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OK, because as you'll hear in a few minutes, my client and I went out with a tape measure this weekend and it was 22 feet, six inches.

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I want to direct your attention to the parking that you have indicated in the middle of the drawing.

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And so cars would enter first on 11th Street.

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Isn't that correct?

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this this driveway here on 11th street right where the pointer is

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do you do you know how wide do you know how wide that driveway is

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i'm going to open up the drawing on my side since i can't see it on the screen um just give me a

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moment if you have the answer you can let me know but give me a second to open up the drawing okay

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Well, I estimated it with my yardstick to be nine feet, 10 inches.

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Okay.

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Okay.

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So that doesn't sound crazy to you.

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I'm not saying that that doesn't sound incorrect.

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You have no reason to argue with that at this point.

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I don't.

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Okay.

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And then so cars would, I mean, we can get into that later if we will.

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I understand you're taking my word for it.

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But so cars go in there at 11th Street, and then they turn, and then there's some spaces on the left and some spaces on the right.

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And then they exit up at Oak Lane, this 22-foot, 6-inch street that we talked about.

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Is that correct?

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That's correct.

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Okay.

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And Oak Lane goes two ways, right?

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it's a it's a two-way street is that correct that's correct okay and you have what's called here a

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passenger turning study vehicle on the right and actually it's tough to see but

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right there in the middle of the driveway that's exiting on oak lane you have a

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turning, some turning lines. And as you can see, isn't it correct that for a car exiting

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on Oak Lane and turning right, that the two lines that are drawn on this page actually

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cross over into opposing traffic in order to make that right-hand turn?

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Would you agree with me that that's what this drawing indicates?

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would you agree with me that that's what this drawing indicates

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So it does show that from this auto turn that you do to, let's see, it does show some lines

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kind of going out into the opposing traffic, yes.

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Thank you very much.

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And you would agree with me that the predominant driver in this scenario are elderly people.

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Is that correct?

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No, actually, these are for employees and visitors.

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Okay.

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Would you agree with me that there are some ambulances and emergency vehicles that are larger than 19 feet in length?

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yeah i think i would add though that this is a conceptual plan let me just add that this is a

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conceptual has not gone through it this is not a technical um you know plan to be constructed from

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we can certainly widen the proposed curb cut or flares in order to have you know an easier

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turning movement that's that's not a problem at all let me interrupt if I may or is that to

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suggest that we've not you've not yet gone through the streets uh department uh review

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as it relates this has been approved by streets department yes this has been approved so um if

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but I'm just saying that there's you know uh concerns and also this is done by you know a

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computerized program. It just basically shows that the movement can happen. It's not a perfect

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program, but we use it. Go ahead. When you said conceptual, that kind of threw me off. That's why

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I asked. Okay. Well, the zoning plan is conceptual. We will have to go through a subsequent streets

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department review, their checklist number two review, that shows a lot more detail than this.

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Would you also agree with me, Ms. Poindexter, that large ambulances and emergency vehicles have a wider turning radius than your typical passenger car?

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I would. And again, you know, those types of details will be reviewed in detail with the building permit review.

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if any adjustments are needed in order to make those turning movements work we certainly will

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be working with all those departments right now this is a concept to get us through a zoning

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approval well we'll see about that I have no further questions thank you great

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just some a few redirect questions I'll redirect Ms. Poindexter again is it your testimony that

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THIS CONFIGURATION, AGAIN, THE DRIVEWAY OFF OF 11th STREET INTO THE SHARED PARKING FOR 1100 AND

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1122 IS APPROPRIATE FROM AN ENGINEERING STANDPOINT? YES, I DO. AND IT HAS BEEN APPROVED BY THE STREETS

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DEPARTMENT IN THEIR INITIAL REVIEW, CORRECT? THAT'S CORRECT. AND THEN AS FAR AS THE RIGHT-OF-WAY,

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Can you see the cursor that I'm moving on?

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Yes, I can.

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Is this heavy line here along, I guess, the south side of Oak Lane, is that the right-of-way, the legal right-of-way?

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The red line, the property line, that's the southern right-of-way line.

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and then the dark black line right underneath the oak lane avenue that's the northern right-of-way line

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okay so here we have the southern right-of-way line correct that's correct and then we have

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the sidewalk line which is out here i believe that's where your curb line is correct okay

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that's the curb line and then across the street on the north um the curb line is much closer

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correct correct correct and that was what was um identified that the paving width is less than 34

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feet it's right and then the ultimate right of way line is this other uh dark line up here to

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the north correct that's correct so the city at some point theoretically could decide that they

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were going to expand this right of way and go to the ultimate right of way line correct

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if that was needed correct that's correct that's correct okay uh that's all that i have

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okay uh i thank you very much um i'm ready to put on my case

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um and i'm also going to so i have five witnesses they're all i think very well rehearsed

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um and we really want to move through them quickly i am going to email my exhibits

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right now they're on their way over to um ms sunkett

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Right now, they're on their way over to Ms. Sunkett and Mr. Kerr and Ms. Suleta.

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These are my main exhibits.

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And I'm going to share my screen.

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Well, in a moment, I will share my screen.

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First, I want to say that we're going to focus our attention on a few things.

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I just want to tell you what they are so you have a little bit of a roadmap.

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First, this is a case about a use variance and also several dimensional variances.

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And we're going to point out that no hardship has been demonstrated and that we can actually prove that this can be used.

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in compliance with the zoning code we're also going to focus on the character of the neighborhood

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we have a lot of photos to show you we're going to focus on the lack of parking in the neighborhood

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and we're also going to focus on traffic safety issues we don't have any experts

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we just have residents and their observations and photographs and experiences

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witnesses, but we think that that will show pretty much.

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So I am going to share my screen here.

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Let's see.

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Okay.

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Well, this is from last time, and this is from today, and you will see that we have

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five witnesses we may have a sixth depending upon if we need the sixth but we have five witnesses

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and the first witness i'd like all of my if possible ms sunkett i'd like all my witnesses

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to raise their hands and be recognized and then we can just move through them one after another

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or would you rather they raise their hand only when we get to them um yes once we get to them

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Okay, then my first witness is Freda Williams, and I'd like Ms. Williams to raise her hand and be recognized, please.

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Afternoon, Ms. Williams. Please identify yourself with a record, name and address.

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She hasn't raised her hand yet, Chair.

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Can we go to the next person, Mr. Bonney?

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We'll come back to Ms. Williams if we have to.

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She's available now. Ms. Freda, you can unmute yourself. I'm waiting to be sworn in.

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OK.

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Good afternoon, Miss Williams.

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Please identify yourself, name and address.

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Good afternoon.

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My name is Freda Williams.

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It's F-R-E-I-D-A, Williams.

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W-I-L-L-I-S.

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It may be looking like John Williams.

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It does.

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We got her.

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She's on.

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Paul.

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Paul.

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can everyone else hear me i can yes chair we can hear you fine paul could you hear me

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you're muted paul sorry there was a blip hear me i can hear you okay miss williams was just

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giving us her name we'll get her address and i'll swear her in thank you okay you have my name

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yep and the spelling got that okay thank you and i live at 815 asbury terrace

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do you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth

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yes sir i do thank you ma'am mr bonnie okay ms williams i'm going to turn the floor over to you

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and i'll just uh scroll through the exhibits as you speak okay well again my name is freedom

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Williams. I am the co-chair, well actually I'm the chair of the Housing and Zoning Committee of the

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Oak Lane Community Action Association, commonly known as OLCA, and we are the RCO for this

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particular matter. And today I would like to describe to you who we are, talk a bit about

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the immediate neighborhood, and report to you the votes of the community at the two RCO meetings

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that were held on this matter. And then I also want to bring to your attention the strength of

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our opposition to this project. I guess everyone thinks where they live is the best place, but

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you know, we take a great deal of pride in East Oak Lane. It's a very old neighborhood. It was

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established in 1683. We have a long history of community engagement. Aside from OCA as an RCO,

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We're a community organization. We have our tree tenders. We have the Friends of the Oak Lane Library.

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We have multiple organized blocks. We have many block captains.

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And many in this neighborhood have a book where East Oak Lane is actually featured.

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It's called The Images of America, Oak Lane.

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It's called The Images of America, Oak Lane, Olney, and Logan.

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And in the introduction, the book states,

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in East Oak Lane, the home builders erected mostly large, elaborate, detached houses.

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Mr. Chairman, I'd like to object to this.

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This book is not in evidence.

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I haven't seen it.

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Yeah, I'll sustain it.

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Okay.

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With all due respect, Ms. Williams, I appreciate.

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That's fine.

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we can appreciate the pride you have in your community i'm well familiar with your community

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we can get just to the heart of the matter as to what the opposition is about

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thank you we can we can omit this exhibit i'm gonna let's keep please keep going ms

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williams we want to cover a lot of ground okay sorry i'm not seeing any of you mr bonnie we

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have no exhibits up. Oh, okay. Well, that's a problem. I apologize for that. Do you see it now?

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Yes, we do. Thank you. Okay. Well, so this is what you missed. And then this is their website.

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And then this is the book she was quoting from. And it's just the introduction to a book. But

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Why don't you continue? We can ignore this exhibit, and Ms. Williams, please proceed.

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Okay. Well, basically, again, what I want to bring to your attention is that

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there are, you know, if you look at the subject property, you can see up and down Oak Lane that

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there are, yes, a few institutional uses. There's a school. There's a firehouse. But basically,

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this project is surrounded by homes, detached residential homes. And we're the people who live

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in the homes. We, you know, we didn't come here by random. We chose to be here. And we are a

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diverse community. We've been an active community, but actually this project has galvanized us in a

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way in terms of opposition, which is a bit stronger than has

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been that has happened in the past. We, if you look at the

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property, not a drawing, not a rendering, but if you actually

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look at a photo of the property, it's vacant, it's a flat

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corner lot. And you can see the property from Oak Lane. You can

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also see all of the other homes, detached single homes that

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around this area. I believe that there were some photos, I'm not sure if you can see them or not.

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But nonetheless, since you asked, and it came up before that was about the width of Oak Lane.

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And I did go out, I went out with Mr. Boney, and we measured from curb to curb,

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and it was considerably narrow at 12th Street, and it was 22 feet six inches wide.

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There's also, we pointed to out the narrowness of the driveway on 11th Street.

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And I understand that the engineer talked about it being a concept and they would make changes as necessary.

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But currently, as it stands, this is a very narrow driveway and there's a set of stairs that jut out.

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And then there are stacked, you know, there are cones that are stacked and the church uses that.

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And sometimes they put the cones out and then that eliminates parking.

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So, again, you know, just just to let you know, and I wish you could see the photographs and you could actually see more of what the actual neighborhood looks like.

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As to the RCO meetings, I have submitted reports from the RCO meeting from February 12th, I believe.

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it was sorry only yes um chair did we lose paul bonnie i was just thinking the same thing i don't

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see him yeah miss williams could you please pause sure mr bonnie are you out there yeah i don't see

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him here. I just looked. I don't see him either. I'm not seeing him either.

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Ms. Saletta, do you have contact for Mr. Bonney?

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Yes, I will give him a call on his seat now.

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Thank you kindly.

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Thank you.

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Mr. Bonnie signed on

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on his ipad he is on can you um identify and keisha can you promote him yeah thank you

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there we go got you back

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okay miss williams continue please and if you can summarize it would be helpful

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oh let me try and get the exhibits up on this um okay i was just pointing out to to the board

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that, again, this particular area, the particular site, is basically surrounded by residential

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detached single-family homes. But I was bringing to your attention that we had submitted as the RCO

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two reports regarding both addresses, 1100 and 1122 Oak Lane. The first RCO meeting that we held

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was held on February 5th. At that particular meeting, over 100 people came out. 82 people

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voted in opposition. 15 were in support of the request for variance. There were a number of

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objections that were raised with regard to why they felt that this was not the appropriate site.

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But the primary one is that this is zoned as single-family housing, and that is what we believe

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it should be used for. In the second RCO meeting, which was held October 22nd, and we also sent a

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report for that, we objected to the unity of use application by the applicant. Again, because this

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supports the original application, we are not in support of anything that supports this project.

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As we've indicated previously, we have concerns about parking. We know they had a parking engineer

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or they had you know someone who did parking however we live here and we are the ones who

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experience our need for parking and having to walk from this place to that place and uh parking is

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one of the concerns that we have and actually from what we can see just based on the refusal

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it indicated that the church only had five spaces and now they want to share those five

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when on the on the refusal it actually states that the church was to have 32 spaces. Now how that was

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how they got a variance for that previously we don't know. I'm only going by what is on the

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actual refusal or the application that they made at this time. So we are not in support at all of

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any shared parking. The next thing I'd like to bring to your attention is that you may have

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received multiple letters because our neighbors, as I've said, were very much engaged in a series

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of actions that were in opposition. And one of the things that we did were yard signs. I think

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we've lost Mr. Boney again. And he had our exhibits, which were to show you that we had over

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100 signs that stated no, no to this apartment building. When you strip away the title of senior

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affordable, whatever you want to call it, the bottom line is that this is an apartment building

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with 40 units and the potential for 40, 60, it's a stretch to go to 80, but certainly there are

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some people who would be couples and therefore we're not only talking about 40 additional

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persons being added at this one site. In addition to the yard signs, which we didn't have to beg

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people to obtain, they called us. They were willing to pay. That's the level of opposition.

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We held not one, not two, but three rallies. I'm sorry you don't have the photographs to show you

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how many people actually came out. At two of the rallies, 75 people came out in opposition.

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In the last rally that we had in September, we actually had signs where, you know, we knew we

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couldn't come to the ZBA. And so we came out and we stood and we asked you to vote no. That was

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the purpose of that particular rally. So once again, what we would say is that we consider

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ourselves. As citizens, taxpayers, property owners, we are held to a certain standard.

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We're expected to participate in, you know, the process. We're asked to participate in RCO,

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and we're seen as being competent to assess and measure and to make determinations about our

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to assess and measure and to make determinations about our neighborhood. And that is what we have

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neighborhood.

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done. So in the second RCL for the unity of use, I don't know if I reported the actual vote,

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but it was 64 opposed and two in support. So again, the only thing that I can say to you,

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Mr. Chairman, I'm sorry to interrupt. This is Sharon's letter. Mr. Bonnie is asking that he

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again be promoted he has signed on his main computer i apologize for interrupting and if you

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can just um allow me miss williams yes sir yeah you can conclude that would be helpful thank you

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okay so my conclusion is that we are asking that our judgment as experts in our neighborhood

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be respected and acknowledged because we are indeed the experts as to what belongs

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in our particular neighborhood. We have no objection to senior housing in general. We are

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simply saying this is not zoned. It's inappropriate, the height and the use. And we would say that

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they should that what should go there is what it's zoned for single family detached housing

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thank you very much thank you for your testimony very helpful thank you mr bonnie

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can you see my screen mr chairman all we have is the uh introduction into the uh yes history of

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oak lane i'm just going to rapid fire scroll through these exhibits this is the um photograph

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that ms williams was referring to that shows the neighborhood this is from google all the houses

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in the back around and i'll just continue this is the subject property that she was describing

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as flat and vacant that's one side of it that's the other side of it this is the property looking

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from Oak Lane, as she mentioned, straight through to Ms. Young's house. Ms. Young's going to speak

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next. She lives in the house to the right. This is the narrowing of Oak Lane, Mr. Chairman. We

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spent some time on this last hearing and also a few minutes ago. As you can see, looking straight

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up Oak Lane, it radically narrows on the block of the subject property. The subject property is to

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the right, on the far right corner. And as you can see, Oak Lane really narrows considerably.

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I hope you can all see that. And that's a two-lane street. This is the rear driveway

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on 11th Street that I measured as 9 feet 10 inches. This would be the entrance to the

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parking spots. This is a little closer. This is me sort of holding the camera above the gate.

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And this is the looking at that entrance from 11th Street. You can see the two neighbors right

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next to that driveway have lawn signs protesting this project. These are the various lawn signs

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that are around the neighborhood. The purpose of these photographs are not just to show you the

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lawn signs, but also to show you the single-family homes that are in this neighborhood. I'm just

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going to scroll right through it. Gorgeous house, beautiful houses, beautiful neighborhood,

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beautiful neighborhood. Now these are the rallies, and I'm almost at the end here.

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This is one of the rallies that was held specifically to oppose this project,

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which would be right across the street. You can see the vacant lot on the right-hand side.

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Here is another different rally.

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And now this is the difference.

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So these are two rallies altogether.

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And then the third rally is in the next page.

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This is at the zoning board hearing that was ultimately canceled for procedural reasons.

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And instead of coming, we can't come to 1515 ARCH.

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so all of the neighbors uh associated with the rco gathered at the site and held signs

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to try and mimic as if they were in your boardroom i'm going to object to all these photos of these

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rallies i don't i don't have any way of knowing who these folks are where they live how close

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they live to the property i have no way no way of vetting that out so i would just object to

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these and ask that they be stricken from the record i hear what you're saying but i just don't

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see people coming from other parts of the city. I'm familiar with Oak Lane and how they operate,

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so I'll overrule your objection. Okay, thank you. So now I'd like to call Ms. Yvette Young if she

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can raise her hand. Yvette Young, you can now unmute your mic, say your name, and wait to be sworn in.

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And Paul, I would ask that you instruct your witnesses if we can come up, have...

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And Paul, I would ask you to instruct your witnesses, if we can come up, have a discussion

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or comments, something new and different, not to be disrespectful, but in the interest of time

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that would be helpful. Yvette, are you there?

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Yvette, I hear a lot of static. Yvette, we hear a lot of static. Ms. Young?

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So I muted her, Ms. Young, if you could reconnect, maybe with a telephone.

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So could we move to the next witness, Tanya, while that's happening, or let's move?

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Yes, Chair.

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We can move to Mr. Matthews.

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And then we'll come back to Ms. Young.

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Yeah, thank you.

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i'm here if you can hear me yes sir please identify yourself first and last name and your

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address my name is david matthews m-a-t-t-h-e-w-s i'm from 6701 north 11th street

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in philadelphia oklahoma and do you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth and

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nothing but the truth i do and what you live in what proximity to the application

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um i live about half a block away because um it's it takes up that that lot takes up like half of

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the block okay i just want your close proximity by any chance uh i don't know if you saw the

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exhibit with the protesters were you in that group were you in that i was in a couple of them

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okay thank you that's all i need to know thank you mr bonnie mr chairman uh uh this what's on

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on my screen is an overhead aerial photograph.

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The subject proper-

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Paul, you're froze.

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Uh-oh.

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We gotta get you a new computer.

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I think it might be the technology, internet.

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I am still here if anybody, if-

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Yeah, just hang in there, sir.

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Okay.

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We lost your attorney,

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or at least lost contact with your attorney, I should say.

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The zoning attorney's worst nightmare.

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We're not too happy about it either.

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I can imagine. I can imagine.

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Property is down in the middle, the middle center, right where the word Google.

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Paul, we lost you three minutes ago.

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We lost you. There you go again.

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Paul, can you hear me?

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Unmute yourself, Paul, Bonnie.

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Take yourself off of mute.

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Sorry.

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Paul?

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Yeah, you're on.

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Paul?

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Yes, I hear you.

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Okay, we lost you shortly after I asked Mr. Matthews if he was in that group of protesters.

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and then you started to speak and we lost you why don't i just turn it over to him

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yeah okay let's do that all right well um i don't know if anybody else i don't have a

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i have a screen does anybody else see the exhibit yes it's up i'm gonna leave and come back then

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all right well there i am i got it got it back thank you oh okay uh my name is dave

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have david henry matthews i'm the son of alice and henry matthews uh who bought the our property

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at 11th and oak lane uh i think it was 1971 and if you're looking at a picture like i am right now

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it's the brown roof house all the way over to the right and above oak lane so that's our house

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um i'm in strong opposition to this to this uh proposed building uh oak lane is definitely a

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community of single family homes and it's best like that the road is very narrow across that's

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right next to the proposed property um basically uh i'd also like to point out that uh there are

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are there three other single-family homes right across the street from the church

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and where they're proposing the new building?

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It would be just a heartless money grab.

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I mean, it's just a terrible thing.

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I see so many people trying to make us live with it.

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I do appreciate the chance to, after all this time,

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after all this time to get a chance to speak to the people who need to hear from us um please

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to get a chance to speak to the people who need to hear from us.

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understand we treasure our neighborhood we don't want to see it exploited um we've lived in that

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house since 1971 and it's been passed down from my parents to me to my to my my brothers and

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sisters and it's good i'm sure it will be passed down to our next family to our next generation

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too where it's it's our family homestead where we've all stayed when we needed to from time to

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time and for long periods and short periods of time uh in east oak lane we're just regular people

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where i'm i mean i'm an audio engineer i mean meaning like a audio visual technician and i get

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up and work every day you know i prefer to be a guitar player and audio recording engineer but

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you know in another life maybe uh but just to say that all these people that live in east oak lane

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We're not rich. We're just working folks that have chosen a really great place to live, and we all feel very lucky to live there.

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People who want to live in the city and have a place in the city.

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Mr. Matthews, if you can conclude, no disrespect.

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I'm very close. I will conclude by saying that that's a perfect spot.

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That location, 1122, is a perfect spot for a house.

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If you look at the image, you can see that our house, which is about half an acre, is exactly the same shape and almost the same size as that property.

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And if they build a single family home, maybe even two, they would sell instantly and for a good price.

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Mr. Matthews, can you tell us, just I'll ask you one question.

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Are there any parking problems with the congregants of the Refuge Church?

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there are many problems tell us one of them well they park on the sidewalk they park in no parking

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zones all along all of oak lane that you can see on the sidewalk so that cars can pass by when they

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park there they park on my and how do you know it's from that church and not the other church

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well because my my mother was a member when she was alive she was a member of east of oak lane

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Presbyterian Church, and we're tight with that church. That's where I went as a kid. And if

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anything was going on with Oak Lane Presbyterian Church, my mother, when she was alive, or any of

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us would have been able to ask for that to be handled, because we're very good friends with

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the minister. Let me ask it this way. Is the Presbyterian Church a better neighbor than the

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refuge church much better thank you very much mr i know for the questions i appreciate it thank you

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and appreciate it on a lighter on a lighter note maybe you can get your audio visual skills and

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help mr bonnie out thank you mr chair could i just ask a few uh cross-examination questions

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mr matthews yes i'm here you've been there since 1971 correct off and on yes okay um when you

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moved into the into the part your parents moved into the property was the uh the saint mary's

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ukrainian church um occupying the property 1122 oak lane if you're talking about the spot where the

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evangelical refuge baptist churches is that what you mean i'm talking about the vacant lot oh that

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place oh um yes there was that was a president uh what do you call it um ukrainian church so there

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was a Ukrainian church there in 1971, correct? As far as I know, yeah. Were you aware that there

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was a fire at that church in 2013? Yes. And so between 1971 and 2013, this vacant lot was

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occupied by the church, correct? Yes. Okay, that's all I have. My next woman is Yvette Young. Yvette,

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um she she uh signed back on on the phone

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she can do star six so that she can raise her hand we'll know who she is

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and how many other witnesses do you have mr bonnie after miss young

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i have five all together so i have young and then two more

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i have a caller um number ended in 7816 yes that's her hello this is yvette young hi yvette

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thank you um what uh can you please state your name and address for the record

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yes yvette young y v e t t e and my address is 6625 north 12th street which is next door

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And my address is 6625 North 12th Street, which is next door to the subject property.

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Mr. Chair, do you want to give her the yes?

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Ms. Young, do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?

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Yes, I do.

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Thank you. Please proceed.

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Are you a member of the Oak Lane Community Action Association?

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Yes, I am.

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I show you Exhibit 12, which is your deed, showing you purchased your property in 2014. Is that correct?

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Yes, that is my deed.

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Your house is a single-family house?

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Yes.

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As you heard last time, the pastor said that they used the vacant lot as a parking lot. Is that correct, as far as you know?

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Yes, that is correct.

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I'd like to refer you to the current proposal. Tell us if you're opposed, and if so, why?

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I am opposed to the project. A 40-unit apartment building at this location is improper. Our neighborhood is predominantly single-family homes. Apartment houses are not allowed at this location. It's too dense. There would be too much traffic and too many cars looking for parking.

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I also think that the proposal is too high.

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With the height, there would be many, many windows at a very high height facing the side of my house.

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The project would have an emergency side exit facing my property with a footpath that would run against my property.

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um there's insufficient open space insufficient rear yard insufficient parking keep going

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most of the houses in my neighborhood are three-story homes they have plenty of open space

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they have rear yards they have um the properties have driveways and garages

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Ms. Young and Mr. Bonny, excuse the interruption, and please don't misunderstand.

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I think we've got the picture figuratively and literally.

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I'll jump to you.

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Yeah, because, I mean, it's repetitive, and I don't mean that disrespectful.

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These people have been waiting a long time.

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I think the board understands the very nature of this community as being single-family residential.

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Okay, so I'm going to show you the pictures of the houses on her block.

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very quickly. Thank you. Very quick. The subject property is on the left. Her house is the first

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house there. You can see half of it. I'm going to just take you down the block on her side.

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She would testify that all of these houses are not only single family detached, but that they

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are owner occupied. Is that correct, Ms. Young? Yes or no? Yes, that is correct. Okay, then this

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is the zoning map of her property is in the blue rectangle on the left hand side and as you can see

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the zoning map has this entire area of as rsd3 which is what the subject property is zoned for

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the rsa is also single family that's just attached not detached so those are mostly duplexes um now

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there are the random anomalies, but this is what the zoning map provides. Now I'd like to

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go through the parking situation because the consultant for the developer said that Oak Lane

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was one of the blocks that he was relying upon to handle the parking load from this facility.

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and as you can see on oak lane the subject property has the red dot in it and on oak lane

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on that block the signs from the parking authority for many years have said no parking anytime on

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either side of the 1100 block on the on the block to the right between 11th and lawton there's no

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parking at all on the south side and then in front of mr matthew's house there's no parking

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right on that little stretch on the corner going to the left hand side you have the 1200 block

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on the bottom of the 1200 on the south side of the 1200 block you have the firehouse

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and also some parking lots for some businesses so there's no parking at all in the middle of that

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block and there's only two hour parking on the corner near the library on the north side you

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Can I jump in here? Is this relevant to Mr. Matthews' testimony?

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Because I have some follow-up questions for Mr. Matthews.

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I thought you've... No, this is Ms. Young.

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I'm sorry, Ms. Young. I'm sorry. Ms. Young?

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Yeah, this is still Ms. Young.

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Ms. Young would be testifying that this is, in fact, what the parking signs...

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Ms. Young would be testifying that this is, in fact, what the parking signs say on these blocks,

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so we're still on Ms. Young. Okay, gotcha. And so on the 1200 block of Oak Lane,

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on the north side, in the middle, it's no stopping at all because there's a firehouse across the

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street. And on either ends of that block, it's no parking during school time, which is basically the

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entire daytime, 7 a.m. to 4.30, as is this little stretch on North 12th Street above Oak Lane. So

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really, you know, this is one-third of the area that the consultant said would supply parking

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capacity for this facility. He said, in particular, the 1,200 block of Oak Lane would provide parking

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capacity for this facility. That's really not correct because you can't park there during

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school times or it's only two-hour parking and you know unless you want to have these senior

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citizens uh you know running outside all at all times of the day and weekend to move their cars

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every two hours and when school opens or closes it's just not going to happen um i'll just ask

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you ms young is that do you agree with everything i said absolutely okay furthermore ms young

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would testify that another part of what the consultant was relying upon was the entirety

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of this block of 12th street that she lives on and that they would have senior citizens parking

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all the way at the bottom of 12th street um in the night and inclement weather or whenever

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and i would object to that that's not what that's not what the testimony was it's not what the

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testimony was uh that's all i have on this exhibit but let me um well through while it's up there

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Could I cross-examine Ms. Young on a couple of points?

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Let us just finish.

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I'm almost done with this witness, and then you can have her.

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Well, I was going to do it on this exhibit.

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I can go back to this one.

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I can go back to this one.

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Ms. Young, is this what your street, did you take this picture,

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and is this what your street looks like on any given night?

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Yes.

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And I'm going to show additional pictures.

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That's the subject property.

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This is still your block.

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Yes.

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And again, I'll object to these because we don't have information as to when these pictures

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were taken.

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That's fair.

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Day, day of the week, my engine provided very specific information as to when he was

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out there.

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You can ask her that.

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Can you hear me now?

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Yes.

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What we need is for you gentlemen to stop, try to prevent yourself from talking over

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each other.

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and we are running close to an hour, if not past the hour.

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We're not in it.

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Ms. Young, I'm trying to get through it, Mr. Chairman.

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I'm trying my best to plow through it.

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Ms. Young, you got this email from the police department that said

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at the top and bottom of your blocks on this year alone,

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there was five auto accidents.

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Is that correct?

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That is correct.

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Do you think that this is a safe driving area

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or is it a tricky driving area? It is a very tricky one because coming off of that narrow

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street at Oak Lane, there have been actually other numerous accidents, including a hit and run. My

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niece's car was hit in front of the library. She only reported that to her insurance company,

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not to the police. So that actually is one of the accidents that went unreported, but there are

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numerous is it so a lot is it so tricky that the city put four speed bumps on your block

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that is correct okay i don't have any other i don't have any other questions uh bill you can

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mr carter cross-examine yeah sure could you go back to that aerial photo paul

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all right um just a few questions on this uh miss young uh paul could you just hover over

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Ms. Young's property? Right here. Which is right below the St. Mary's Protectorist Church? Well I

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think that's an old thing from Google but that's where it is on this drawing. So Ms. Young when

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you purchased the church had already burned down it was no longer there correct? Correct. Okay now

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across 12th street on the corner we have the Oak Lane Library correct? Yes. Okay and that's not

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single family residential correct correct and are you familiar with the premier apartments

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yes and where are they in relation to your property right here okay are you familiar with

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the premier apartments yes okay are you aware that there's 46 apartment units in there

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yeah i am yes and that there's no part there's no on-site parking with that property correct

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and that there's no part there's no on-site parking with that property correct

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You

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yes that's part of the problem okay and then there's also the firehouse that's on

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oakland behind the library correct yes okay then across uh north of oakland then you have

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the elwood school correct the car with respect i think it was noted in uh miss williams's testimony

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that we stipulate that there are some municipal buildings

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within the general vicinity.

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Okay, just one thought, just one last question.

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You're not a traffic engineer or any kind of a civil engineer, correct, Ms. Young?

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Yes, I am.

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I have my master's degree in civil engineering, yes.

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Okay, so you are a civil engineer, okay.

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Yes, I am.

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Okay, did you do any engineering studies that you've presented to the board here today

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for this project?

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I did do some measuring of the street yes I did you've not presented that to the board

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no I did not okay that's all I have my next witness is uh penny null if she could be recognized

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I'm chair um if I could mention that we have over 100 people in this zoning I'm hearing and

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that we have another special, and the allotted time has surpassed, and just to note.

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I thank you, and I just said that a few minutes ago, so.

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Well, Mr. Chair, I'd like to ask you what you'd like to do.

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Well, if there's any substantive issues that have not yet been covered,

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not, again, not to be disrespectful to the folks who are waiting online to testify,

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I don't imagine we're going to get anything much different than has already been testified to by

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the near neighbors uh well there there is Mr. Chairman there I could put on Ms. Kroll and ask

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her like you know 45 seconds of stuff and then I can rest and then I can do 45 seconds and rest

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and then I can do my closing argument now he can ask cross but you know I just want her to talk

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about her property okay proceed we can finish it today then that's what we'll do if we can't

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finish it today then then you're right okay but well i don't want us to close and we'd like you

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know hopefully that we'd like the record to be closed so thank you ms crawl can you uh

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unmute yourself she's available she just has to unmute herself i'm sorry

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miss kroll penny can you unmute yourself can anyone hear me i can hear you i can yes chair

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we hear you fine all right because i leave i lose i lose and have to keep getting out so i get lost

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occasionally miss kroll miss kroll good afternoon please identify yourself for the record spell

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your first and last name and provide us with your and provide us with your address my name is penny

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Kroll, P-E-N-N-Y-K-R-O-L-L. I live at 6610 Lawton Avenue. Do you swear or affirm to tell the

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truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? I do. Ms. Proceed, Mr. Bonnie. Ms. Kroll, I'd like

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you to jump to the last part of your testimony, which is about your house. Yes. I'm going to put

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your house on here, so go for it. I live at 6610 Lawton. It's over half an acre in size, actually

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0.66 acres in size. It's about one and a half blocks away from the subject property. I have a

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huge, large front yard and backyard that the kids can play. The white fence you see there

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is just the front side of the house versus the back side of the house. Well, we bought the house

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because we were looking for a nice neighborhood to raise the children in and a nice large space

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Ms. Kroll, so you're, now I'm showing the data sheet from your property and it's correct that

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you said your parcel is 0.66 acres and you have a single family home on it. Is that correct?

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Yes, I do. I'm showing now the zoning map that shows your house in relation to the subject

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property, your house being on a property that's 0.66 acres and the subject property being 0.48

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acres according to the engineer of the applicant, is that correct? Yes. I have no further questions

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of this witness. All right, just a couple quick questions. Ms. Law, did you receive a letter from

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my office with regard to the RCO meeting on this project? Yes. Okay, because I don't see you on the

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list. Oh, that's because there are three of us who live in the house, we're a multi-generational home,

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and my daughter and son-in-law, the Light Hearts, were the ones who went.

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Yeah, I don't see 6610 Lawton as an address that we were required to notice by the...

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yeah i don't see 6610 lawton as a as an address that we were required to notice by the uh

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well oh oh let me tell you we did not get a notice from miss crawl miss crawl miss crawl

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thank you for your testimony thank you and i would just state an objection that she's not

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uh a near neighbor so we would ask that her testimony be stricken look at it 20 look at

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exhibit 23 mr kurt so i i'll rest and i'm i'm ready for closing arguments i think the applicant

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should go first since it's their burden but then I'm ready to chime in. Mr. Kroll, Mr. Kerr I'm sorry

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are you ready? I'd like to actually just share my screen just in rebuttal to some of this testimony

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Mr. Pony if you can get out now I'm going to find I just have one visual I'd like to share.

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I think I'm finished I think I'm out tell me if I need to do something.

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NEW SPEAKERS. I'M TRYING TO SHARE. IS ANYONE SEEING?

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NEW SPEAKERS, NOT YET.

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NEW SPEAKERS, ARE WE SEEING THAT NOW?

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NEW SPEAKERS, YES, WE ARE.

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Okay, this is exhibit six from my – and this is actually an aerial photo and two other photos of the prior church building that was located on this property on 1122 until 2013.

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It's a very substantial church building, not single-family residential, very limited parking and or driveway.

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way and this is what the neighborhood was used to from the 20s to 2013 that's what the record

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indicates so I'll state that in rebuttal to Mr. Boney's case and as far as the closing we believe

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that the record here support well actually are there any are there any other neighbors that are

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going to make statements here I would hope not no I think we close that down for them we close that

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Okay. So I believe that the record supports the grant of the requested variance. First of all,

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this photo establishes that this property is really nonconforming since the 1920s. But for

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the prior, this church would still be there. We're proposing a much less intensive use,

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40 units of senior housings, which is one of the most innocuous and unobtrusive uses that you can

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imagine. We have testimony in the record of the significant efforts made by both Pastor Richardson

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and Mr. Bruce Morgan, the developer, to be respectful of the neighborhood and also to

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respond to their concerns. We've been at this for a year and a half now. There are a significant

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number of support letters which have also been submitted in the record in our binder number two.

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So the board should have that and you can refer to those support letters. So there is significant

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excuse me, significant support from the neighborhood.

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We also have testimony from our expert architect

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that the use in the proposal is reasonable

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for the property, that there'll be no negative impacts

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and that the requested variances are the minimum

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that are needed for this reasonable use.

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There's testimony from Mr. David Horner, the traffic expert,

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that the proposal will not create traffic impacts

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and that there's more than sufficient parking

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for the proposed use.

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We have supportive testimony from Sarah Rodriguez,

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our civil engineer.

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all of that all all three of those are experts and there is no expert rebuttal testimony to any

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of that evidence final couple points the planning commission letter which was read into the record

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at the last hearing recognizes the need for affordable housing and indicates unequivocal

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support for the grant of these variances and finally at the first hearing back in february

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council and parker's office made a very significant statement in support of the project so we think

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We've done our homework.

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We've done everything we could.

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We've tried to accommodate the neighborhood.

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We recognize that there's still some opposition,

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but we believe that given the history of this property,

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it's a reasonable proposal

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and that the requested variances are warranted.

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Thank you.

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Mr. Chairman, I'll be as quick as I can.

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Go ahead, I'm sorry.

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Go ahead, Mr. Boni.

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Okay.

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The applicant has not provided any evidence

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demonstrating a hardship for the use variants

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or for any of the dimensional variances. The subject property is zoned RSD3, which is for

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single-family residential detached only. It's a rectangular property with one corner that's

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extended a little bit. It's 0.48 acres. It's flat. It's vacant. And we, in fact, have demonstrated

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what we don't have to demonstrate, that the compliance with the zoning code can

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What we don't have to demonstrate, that the compliance with the zoning code can in fact be done.

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That a single-family house can easily be put here as it does exist on three sides of this property.

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On the south side, there's Yvette Young's house and the rest of the block.

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Behind it, there's a house on 11th Street behind this property that's a single-family house.

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That's next to that rear driveway.

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And across the street on Oak Lane, there is three single family homes. So it is really beyond any dispute that a single family home can be built on this property easily. In fact, Ms. Kroll's property, which is a block and a half away, is on a property that's larger than this property. So certainly a single family home can be on this property.

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We have demonstrated parking problems that the applicant has not mentioned.

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We have demonstrated safety problems that the applicant has not mentioned.

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And I'm really just hitting the high points here.

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But also, Mr. Chairman, take a look at the parking situation.

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The church in the 90s obtained a variance to have seven spots, even though 74 was required.

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Seven spots.

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Now they come to you with a unity of use application to share those spots. There is absolutely zero evidence presented to warrant a reduction in the variance that you granted them.

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Similarly, this subject parcel needs 27 spots.

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So with the church now under the current code requiring, I believe, 35 spots, I'm sorry, 32 spots.

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So the church under the current code, as indicated by the refusal, requires 32 spots.

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The subject project would require 27 spots.

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that's total required 59 spots, and they're providing you with 12. That is, that's not even

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a variance, so not, I don't think a variance can be granted for such a radical departure from the

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code. Finally, I will just add, as I'll be a bit of a lawyer and mention that this board granted

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a variance for the subject parcel four years ago for a parking lot. It's undisputed,

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Can you still hear me? It's undisputed that it's been used as a parking lot.

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And so, of course, there's no hardship if you deny this application, because they can use it

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with the variance that you granted them, or your predecessor, granted them four years ago.

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So in conclusion, Mr. Chairman, we ask you to do the right thing. We think this neighborhood

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has worked hard to show you the strength of their resolve. They've sold yard signs. They've had

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three rallies. They've had standing room only meetings. They've consistently been overwhelmingly

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voting against this project. We think and we humbly request with all the respect and strength

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that they can muster. And I think that they have earned and that we ask you to vote no on this

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project it does not give us any pleasure to ask that um we're we're it's a shame that we think the

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applicant has um you know misunderstood the requirements of a hardship um in in philadelphia

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and um you know we're happy to see senior housing someplace else at a different product property

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there are there are areas of this region of this district of the city where the city said in its

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2035 plan that we should have more senior housing there's plenty of areas in the upper north district

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that are properly zoned for that and we would be happy to you know to to see the developer go to

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one of those places properly zoned but this is unfortunately the wrong location and we thank

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you so much for your time um and we really you know put our fate in your if i could respond just

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briefly, Mr. Chairman? I can't hear you're muted, Mr. Chairman. 30 seconds, please. Okay, just very

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quickly. Mr. Bonnie's testimony was all neighbors who opposed the property project. There was no

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expert testimony from anyone who testified that it was in fact possible to build single family

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homes on this property. And the other thing to just keep in mind is for 70 some years, this was

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a church. And the neighborhood had the good fortune that the church burned down. And now

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they want the property to be down-zoned, down-used to single-family homes. This property has

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this property has been used institutionally since the 1920s. What we're proposing is a

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been used institutionally for since 19—1920.

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significant reduction in intensity and we believe that the expert testimony is unrebutted and

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warrants the grant of the variances. Thank you. Thank you. I said earlier, a few minutes ago,

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that I was shutting down the testimony. I failed to ask, is there anyone from

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the councilwoman's office available? Is Hillary still here? Is Hillary on?

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hillary you can unmute hillary i apologize i i got i got ahead of myself on that one

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oh that's okay please identify yourself you're still on the earth from earlier today

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yes this is hillary emerson on behalf of councilwoman sherelle parker

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please proceed um well i had i spoke at the last two hearings uh mr chair so i i did not have any

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additional comments to add from the councilwoman okay thank you i just wanted to make sure that

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thank you very much no problem uh questions from the board no uh i think we got the planning

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commission last time but i'll ask the planning commission again good evening or good afternoon

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Ariel DiLiberto from the City Planning Commission. Our previous testimony stands. We are in support

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of this project in variance. Thank you. I'd like a little more time to talk to our board.

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So the record on this case is closed. We'll render a decision next Wednesday, December the 16th

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at 9 30 a.m. Thank you all for your participation. Okay, thanks for your patience and your attention.

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Thank you, everybody.

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and we're doing 20th street now yes calendar number one four three three four one four sorry

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um chair you um can i please just respectfully ask um that if it's okay with you all we can

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just do the continuances for 330 so that everyone here doesn't have to wait in case it's continued

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absolutely just give me a second to get my paperwork okay all right on the 3 30 list

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the following cases have requested a continuance uh page number one 20 mi 2020-001830

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2041 north reese r-e-e-se street

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Number six on our list, MI 2020-001-861-2442 North 54th Street.

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And what I have next, Sharon, from earlier today, you had mentioned that page number seven,

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3639 North 19th did not have an exhibit. Is that still the case?

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I'm sorry, I was muted. I asked you, could you just call that out to see if anyone is here for it?

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Sure. MI 2020-000197, 3639 North 19th Street. Is anyone here for this case? Please raise your hand.

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No hands at this time, Chair.

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Okay, this will be continued. Tanya, has this been continued in the past?

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Yes, it should be a must be heard. Thank you.

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This will be a must be heard. Thank you.

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next one was number eight on our list mi 2020 that's zero zero one nine four five five six

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zero zero ogons avenue that is um meredith furlinger she is prepared to go forward when

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we get to the 330 list. Okay, next one, number nine on our list, MI 2020, that's 001-936-5901

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North 10th Street. Could we ask if anyone is here for this? Is there anyone here? Hillary's hand is

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Hillary's hand is up for this.

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up for this Hillary

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Hillary, we have not yet received, and correct me if I'm wrong, Tanya, any exhibits on this case?

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we have not yet received

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and

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Good afternoon again, Mr. Chair.

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Hillary Emerson on behalf of Counsel Mitchell-Parker.

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I reached out to the RCO yesterday to see if a meeting had occurred because I hadn't heard either from the applicant or the RCO since the original email went out.

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And I still have not heard from either party.

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So we would request a continuance at this time.

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thank you tanya have we has this been uh continued in the past yes a couple times

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okay chair if i could note that both number seven and number nine the attorney is michael lambert

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i don't have exhibits for either okay we will reach out to them mi 2020-001936

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5901 north 10th street is continued must be heard and we also number 10 on our 330 list

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mi2020-001944 7135 rising sun avenue is there anyone here for this case

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um we have alicia jackson and she cannot speak because it's uh i'll promote her

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cannell lc um alicia you've been promoted to panelists you don't have to open your video

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could you speak to the continuance miss miss jackson please spell your first and last name

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and provide us with your address

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Alicia do you have audio

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I only see a camera

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Ms. Jackson, I would ask that you chat with me through the Q&A regarding this case.

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And do you have an attorney to represent you to go forward today?

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And if you can chat with the Q&A, we can resolve that with the attorney for the board.

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okay chair

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yes excuse me this is hillary emerson in councilman parker's office the rising sun avenue

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case um was just called is also in our district um as uh the art i checked with the coordinating

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rco and a meeting hasn't been held yet in this matter so we believe a continuance would be

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appropriate at this time okay and again i'll ask tanya has this already been continued um it has

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one time chair but it's okay for it to just go forward and not at this time it must be heard

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thank you mi 2020-001944 7135 rising sun avenue is continued

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um chair is number nine continued as well because i know there's no exhibits

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uh north 10th street yeah i thought we continued that correct yes we did yes thanks all right

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so we go back to the uh the resumption hearing resumption hearing which is on page number one

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calendar number 1433 414 south 20th street

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is the attorney um mr demarco michael phillips yes i already promoted michael

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name and address for the record please and spell your last name please

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michael phillips p-h-i-l-l-i-p-s oh good we'll make another pass and bring some more

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Thank you.

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Shake your vegetables.

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What's your party?

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Hello.

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I'm sorry.

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No idea who that is.

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Looks like that's right.

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I'm sorry.

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I muted everyone.

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So you guys might have to unmute yourself.

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Good afternoon again.

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Michael Phillips, P-H-I-L-L-I-P-S.

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1500 Market Street, Suite 3400, Philadelphia PA 19102.

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I'm here on behalf of the property owner, RLDL 20th Street, LLC.

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i'm here on behalf of the property owner rldl 20th street llc this is an appeal against lni we

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are the property owner um mr demarco who i see just uh joined as well uh represents before you

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go any further do you swear our firm to tell the whole truth and nothing but the truth i do

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and have you emailed an exhibit packet with all the required documents proof of ownership tax

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compliance refusal referral photos and plans of the property in advance of the hearing five days

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in advance of the hearing have you met with the rco you know there's no rco here yeah this uh since

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it's an appeal against lni and again this is our third hearing um but i did email our exhibit packet

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um on behalf of the property owner um to miss salato prior to the november 4th scheduled hearing

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um just to refresh the board's recollection uh mr demarco put on testimony at the two

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prior hearings which were in august of 2019 and october of 2019 and request uh rested his case

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at the conclusion of the october 15 2019 hearing um at this point uh the city of philadelphia and

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I actually do not see Mr. Reuter on.

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However, the city and the property owner like to make argument and put on our case in defense of this permit.

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I will begin by stating that the law is clear here.

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and we've spent about four to five hours of hearing discussing matters of quiet title

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and discussing many extraneous matters, none of which have to do with the validity

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of my client's by-right zoning permit.

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Shelly DeHall, the plans examiner, testified at the prior hearing that the plans and permit

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were all issued in conformity with the zoning code.

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And that's the starting base point,

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is a presumption that the municipal officers

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perform their duties properly.

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And in order to rebut that presumption,

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the appellants need to show

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and have the burden of showing affirmative evidence

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that there was some irregularity,

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that there was something wrong with the permit.

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They have altogether failed to do so.

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The law matters and the code matters.

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This is not an instance where just how many neighbors come to a hearing and say that they

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oppose a project, because here the project was in full conformity with the zoning code.

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Not liking the law or not liking a buy-right project is not justification to appeal a buy-right

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permit, and you can't just disregard the code because you don't like the result.

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Here, our client relied on the code in its development plans and utilized the fresh food bonus for the additional 15 feet of height and utilized the affordable housing bonus so that the CMX1 property would be treated as CMX2.

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They have paid $62,640 into the city's affordable housing trust in connection with this project and for the issuance of the building permit.

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So think of the uncertainty that would be created here if this permit were invalidated, because what the appellants have argued are, one, that the fresh food bonus is unconstitutional.

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And I would state that, aside from the fact that they lack standing to make that argument, that is an argument for the courts.

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Two, they have argued, oh, so that would, as a result, invalidate any permit that relied on the fresh food bonus prior to 2019.

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Now, the code was subsequently changed, as was noted, through the legislative process.

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the neighbors lobbied councilman johnson uh and were able to effectuate a change in the fresh food

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uh bonus that's the proper way to change an ordinance and that's the way the law works if

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you don't like a law the reaction isn't to attack everybody who relied on that valid law

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it's to lobby and have the law changed and that's what they did but to invalidate every

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permit that relied on this bonus justifiably prior to 2019 would be an absurd result

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developers need to know that they can rely on the code and that is exactly what was done here

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And that is exactly what was done here.

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the other arguments that have been

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The other arguments that have been presented by the appellants, one relates to the parking.

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Now, I'm going to share my screen now so we can go through.

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this is the permit that was issued valid zoning permit complete demolition of existing structure

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direction of an attack structure 60 feet high with the fresh food market bonus

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and the mixed income moderate housing bonus.

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The parking, we proposed four units and four parking spaces.

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You'll note here is the zoning application that was filed,

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which specifically references that the four,

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I'm just putting my cursor over where it says four accessory parking spaces

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and two accessory bicycle parking spaces in basement

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to be accessed by shared driveway accessory to ground floor commercial use.

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The appellants have argued that the parking is not permitted because it's not clear what the use was for.

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Here it is clear. It was always intended for the ground floor commercial use.

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Furthermore, the plan also calls out parking at basement accessory to commercial use.

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here was the code which provided that in the rsa 5 rm1 and cmx2 districts and here we're cmx1

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from a use standpoint we're treated as cmx2 because of the utilization of the moderate

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income housing bonus but from a density uh i mean from a development standpoint uh we're bound by

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rsa5 and here accessory parking for any single family two family or multi-family use shall be

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prohibited unless it can be accessed from a shared driveway alley or rear street and that was not

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what our parking was accessory to our commercial use as was made clear in the plans. I also think

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it's worth pointing out that the code that rear street has since been defined and as I'll get

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into in a little bit when we tried to reach a compromise with the neighbors to avoid this

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protracted now 18 months worth of litigation and promises that they will appeal us in the future

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and tried to reach a compromise through a variance plan. The parking for the residential

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use at the time was permitted by Wright because Waverly is a rare street. At the time that we

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pulled the permit, there was no definition of rare street and there was that period of uncertainty.

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so what's left we have arguments about quiet title those are an absolute red herring

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and totally irrelevant and notwithstanding the fact that my clients are the legal owner of 418

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and 414 to 416 and have deeds to the property, right?

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And also a corrective deed was entered into because if you may recall, it's been a while,

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but in August when Mr. DeMarco brought forward an attorney claiming to act on behalf of one

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of the heirs of an owner of the property from the 70s who claimed that we did not have title

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to 2006 Waverly, which was not even an actual address, and retained an attorney who was

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the appellant Ms. Gilboy's husband's business partner to represent these heirs who lived

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in California.

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We dealt with that for two hours.

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Well, that's all resolved in moot.

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A corrective deed was filed.

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A settlement agreement was reached with those neighbors, I mean, with those heirs, which totally and completely resolves any quiet title issues that could have been pertinent.

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But again, they're not.

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So the one other piece of evidence that Mr. DeMarco tried to bring forward was that the parking garage was not feasible.

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We have David Plant from Rogerio Plant Land Design who will be able to testify that first off, the driveway ramp and the slope is not a zoning code issue.

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There were no regulations pertaining to that in the code.

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Second, the curb cut was approved by the streets department.

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the curb cut was approved by the streets department and third the driveway ramp is

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feasible and i'll note that you know permits were issued for this so are we going to hear from

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witnesses or is this are we doing different witnesses this is an this is an introduction

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uh but but my witnesses will be brief because quite frankly the uh the plans are clear in

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And the appellants have the burden of pointing out that there is some error and they have altogether failed to do so.

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Before I bring, call my first witness, I do want to make one other statement in my opening as to why it's now, you know, December 2020 and our last hearing was October of 2019.

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um despite the by right nature of the plan um faced with now two protracted hearings

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and the promise uh which i have emails in my exhibit packets from miss gilboy that

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they will continue just appealing and appealing and appealing we tried to reach a compromise uh

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and uh and we presented a variance plan uh with the understanding that the neighborhood would

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then support this if we reduce the height, but we had to expand the footprint of the building.

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We went to a meeting before Center City Residents Association on that plan. We received a refusal.

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Went through the time to have a meeting with CCRA, who issued a letter of non-opposition,

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um but there was one problem with that plan near neighbor who lived directly behind uh who lives

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essentially directly behind the uh the property and i'll show where right now um so our property

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here is outlined in uh green it's this in the rear uh this one right here outlined in blue

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opposed our request for a variance.

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They did not oppose the buy-right plan,

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but they opposed the variance

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as it would impinge upon their light and air.

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They hired an attorney, Matt McClure,

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over at Ballard Spar,

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and were prepared to come to the hearing

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to testify that we did not show a hardship.

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And quite frankly,

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we couldn't show a hardship here

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because we have a buy right permit so with that in mind uh we did not proceed with that variance

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plan and entered into an agreement with uh miss her name is angela luton i have the agreement in

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the record as part of our exhibits where she confirmed she does not oppose the buy right plan

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it's taller she's you know has said it was emails that say she might not love the height she might

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not love the fresh food market but it's by right and she respects the by right process so i cannot

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in good faith come before the board and claim to have a hardship when a near neighbor complains

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even if it's one near neighbor against 100 neighbors who want to oppose a by right development

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because the law matters here this is not a variance case this is a by right permit i'll

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again also point out that we have no opposition here from uh the neighbor to directly to the rear

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nor to number five right here, 2001.

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The appellants and the people fighting this right here,

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Ms. Simillo is opposing it

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and other neighbors throughout the neighborhood.

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Again, not on the basis that what we did is not by right,

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but on the basis that they just don't like

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what we're proposing.

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With that, I will briefly call my witnesses

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mr chairman do i get an opportunity to respond to that opening i didn't know we were doing

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opening statements i mean i would like an opportunity to respond i know you're pressed

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for time but i i thought we were getting right to testimony today well we got a lot of argument

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that you know needs a response so i don't want to belabor two days worth of hearing on mr demarco's

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arguments excuse me this is the reporter if everyone could please speak one at a time thank

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you i'm trying to do that mr chairman i'd like the uh the opportunity to respond i didn't know

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we were doing argument at the beginning of this hearing. I thought we were going to go right into

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witnesses. I've never had the opportunity to address the board on legal argument. You just

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heard a bunch of legal argument. He referred to exhibits, some of which are objectable to me. I

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can try to be brief, but, you know, I know you're pressed for time, Mr. Chairman, so I'll defer to

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the board on this, but I'd like to respond. Mr. Phillips, you were about to respond to that

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comment. Yes, I would like, I have transcripts, two days worth of hearings. Mr. DeMarco has

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arrested his case. This is the opportunity now for the property owner to put on their case. I opened.

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this is the opportunity now for the property owner to put on their case i opened i would like to call

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my witnesses briefly mr demarco will have the opportunity to cross uh examine them and then

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we just get to closings all right let's proceed that way thank you i would first like to call um

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Nancy Templeton.

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Ms. Templeton is now available.

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She can unmute herself.

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I have unmuted myself.

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Good afternoon, ma'am. Please identify yourself for the record, first and last name.

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Nancy Templeton, T-E-M-P-L-E-T-O-N, with CH Planning.

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Ms. Templeton, do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?

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I do.

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Thank you. Please proceed, Mr. Phillips.

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And Mr. DeMarco, I would just ask if you would agree to stipulate to Ms. Templeton as an expert land planner.

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Yes, I will.

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Mr. Stampleton, note, Exhibit 6 of the property owner's packet is a report dated October 14th,

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2019 concerning 414 to 18 South 20th Street. Did you prepare this report?

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I did.

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Okay. And did you review the zoning plan that is at issue in this hearing?

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I did.

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Okay. And you reviewed also the zoning application?

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Yes.

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Okay. Is it your professional expert opinion that the zoning plan met all dimensional and use

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requirements? It is. Okay. And is it your professional opinion that the parking that

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was proposed was permitted for the commercial use? Yes. Okay. And with respect to the

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uh the drive uh the driveway and the pitch of the uh of the ramp into the basement

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is your professional opinion that that is a zoning code issue it is it is not a zoning code issue

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did you find any valid uh objections uh to the zoning plan no

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i have no further questions may i mr chairman demarco uh before uh mr demarco does that i

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just want to introduce myself sorry i was a little bit late i had a conflicting meeting that went

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longer um no worries mr sure please identify yourself sure this is leonard reuter r-e-u-t-e-r

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for the city of philadelphia do you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth nothing

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about the truth uh yes i do um and i would just say that i i have no no questions um from ms

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templeton thank you mr demarco good afternoon everyone uh ms templeton thank you mike uh phillips

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if you don't mind leaving your screen up at least for the moment uh because uh since it's ms

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templeton's report probably easier to go through that um i have it as well but uh you have it up

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I'll ask you to leave it up if that's okay. Sure. Ms. Templeton. So good afternoon, Ms. Templeton.

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I've stipulated to your qualifications. I have some questions. So in your report, actually,

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what's on the screen right now where you have background, you mentioned that the plan involved

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a lot consolidation of two lots, right? You see that? Yes. All right. So you are aware that this

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was a lot consolidation of three lots into one, right? Let me ask you this. Did you see the lot

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consolidation plan itself? I don't recall. Okay. Are you aware that it was a consolidation of

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three lots into one? I will just subject to the point that the lot consolidation permit

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and the lot consolidation plan are not being appealed. I'm sorry. There's a statement right

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on her plan. I'm asking her if she knows that the sentence in her report is inaccurate. I'm

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allowed to do that. Are you aware? Ms. Templeton, please, if you could. I don't recall. You don't

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recall. All right. And you have said that clarification of ownership is not a zoning

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issue, right? You've made that opinion here today, right? I have. All right. You're aware that

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right? You've made that opinion here today, right? I have. All right. You're aware that the zoning

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code at section 14-303 subsection 1 includes a voluminous list of requirements to demonstrate

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ownership in order to submit a zoning application to LNI? You aware of that? That is true. Yes.

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All right. So you're aware that 14-303 contains the requirement that the applicant have

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authorization from the owners to submit a zoning application do you agree authorization from the

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owners right we can put that up on the screen if you want i mean i believe you've admitted it but

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let me let me make it make sure it's clear for the record you do agree that zoning section 14-303

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requires the applicant to provide authorization from all of the owners of the property to submit

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a zoning application? I'll just object to the point that I think it's beyond the scope of

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her report, and we've ad nauseum. We've established ownership, haven't we? We've established ownership.

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We've established that there was equitable ownership at the time. This goes to Mr. DeMarco's

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argument that 2006 Waverly Street, which was not a taxable parcel, was owned by, was never properly

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conveyed to the prior owners and interest, and therefore that invalidates its entire

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permit. We've gone through this ad nauseum. Ms. Templeton is not here to testify regarding

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the ownership. She's here to testify regarding whether or not the plan and the permit were

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validly issued uh mr chairman uh the the objection is is is is clearly because they do not want you

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to hear the evidence and the cross-examination because the issue is is extremely clear that they

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did not have authorization to file the zoning application at the time it was filed the witness

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has given an opinion that ownership is not an issue and it's just not correct ownership is an

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issue because you have to demonstrate that you have authority to file an application

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from the owners when you file at that time we did not i did not get into it with this witness yet

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she's made an opinion about it the problem is that and and as far as ownership mr chairman

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that's the problem they have not demonstrated ownership that is why this board has to decide

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that issue because L&I did not elect to revoke the permit and punted the issue to you. And

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unfortunately for the applicant, the code is crystal clear that you are required to have

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ownership or authorization from the owner to file the application, and they did not.

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At the time of the original application, that's what you're saying, correct? At the time of the

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original application the argument goes back to what we talked about a while ago that they did

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not have ownership right since that time and according to and correct me because i'm not a

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lawyer mr phillips that matter has now been resolved is that correct that we do show proof

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of ownership now correct and at the time of the application we were the equitable owner of the

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parcel at 414-416 south 20th street which was the legal parcel recognized by the city

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of Philadelphia. We were under contract to purchase it at the time of the application.

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If we accept Mr. DeMarco's argument, are you suggesting, Mr. DeMarco, I'm not putting words

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in your mouth, that the applicant go back and start all over again? I'm suggesting that the

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applicant misrepresented to the department that it had full site control when it did not and knew it

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did not move forward with an application even though they were getting ready to file a quiet

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title litigation immediately after they obtained a permit they failed to notify the department

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that they had a piece of the property where the owner did not consent to the filing of the

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application and let you know that when we had the hearings last year the applicant rushed to get

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that in did not have that authorization and got his permit and then filed a quiet title action

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which has been settled since then so i'm happy to stipulate that the quiet title litigation i'm

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happy to stipulate that it's been settled the issue though is that you're required not to lie

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to the department and say you have site control when you do not have was accusing me

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gentlemen gentlemen

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Mr. Phillips

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if I might

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my point Mr. DeMarco is

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My point, Mr. DeMarco, is if you're agreeing that they've gone through the process,

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yeah

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they've got quiet title now, why are you suggesting we shouldn't move forward with this?

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No, we should move forward with the hearing.

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Because it's been corrected, hasn't it?

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We should move forward with the hearing.

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First of all, there are other issues.

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There's a number of blatant inconsistencies in the plan and conflicts,

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and there's plenty of legal reasons why the permit shouldn't have been issued also.

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But one of the critical reasons is that the code says what it says, Mr. Chairman.

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The code says you have to have site control.

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We asked the department to, we demanded that department withdraw, revoke the permit because at the time they did not have site control at the time this all happened.

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Department said, no, the zoning board's got to decide that.

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So the fact that they've now settled, by the way, they settled, everybody had settled.

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And we thought we had an agreement where the applicant wasn't going to move forward with this project, has now elected to move forward.

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So the case was settled in that time frame, during that time.

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But the problem is at the time, because he couldn't get the permit now.

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You see, if he were to go forward with this now, if Ellen and I would have done the right thing and revoked the permit like they should have, he would have to go back.

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He wouldn't be able to build this now because the code has been changed because of this project.

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because this project was so unsightly and so not what was intended by city council in the code.

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They changed the code immediately after they got the permit.

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So the problem is at the time the applicant was made, they had no site control,

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and they told Ellen Nye that they had it, and that was a misrepresentation,

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and this board is empowered to decide that issue.

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And, yes, we would say that they would have to move forward again.

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hi this is a um leonard reuter just to respond to that uh the argument um is it i'm not quite

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understanding the argument here because under the code actual code section that was cited by

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mr demarco that's 14 pardon me 14 303 sub 1 uh sub c and then going even further 0.3

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so that sub c.3 each application filed pursuant to this 14303 sub 1 sub c is hereby deemed an

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application filed on behalf of the legal owner of the property and on behalf of any equitable

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owner of the property with an interest in the application all filings or statements submitted

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in support of such application are hereby attributed to the legal owner and to any

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equitable owner with an interest in the application. So when people present an

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application as an equitable owner, we look at basically we see what the

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documents are that they present to show equitable ownership, which was done in

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this case. Mr. DeMarco is saying there was another property owner who should

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have been part of that and that's what led to the quiet title action. The

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department, or I should say really, I was asked at the time to look into

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this and we had everybody at the city um we all decided that this you know if we were not actually

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even approached by the so-called you know property owner we are approached again by the objectors to

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the permit and uh again the failure to name everybody that should be named or even if there

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were a failure or some kind of defect in the deed or something that by itself um i'm not hearing where

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there's any authority in the code that that by itself would invalidate the permit the city always

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looks at these sorts of disputes whether it's a property a boundary dispute you know somebody says

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oh he doesn't have an authority to put a fence there because we actually have an easement i mean

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that's a kind of dispute that could come up anytime the city of philadelphia we don't make

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those determinations we don't send out we don't have we don't do the title search we don't send

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out surveyors that's up to the people who are making the dispute uh to deal with so there was

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there were no there was nothing at the time that would have led the city to have

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revoked this permit on the basis of somebody else coming in and one third party saying that

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another third party really owned or had an interest in this so and again now that it does

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appear to be cured and I think I heard that there's really no dispute that any dispute that

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any question of ownership of the other parcel has been resolved i again don't see how it make would

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make any sense uh for that to again require the revocation of this permit i mean if if you open

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the door to that then the lni could be revoking zoning permits all over the place because we would

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have no idea if somebody after the fact had filed some kind of quiet title action in another case

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in another property. So it seems like that's just not a workable solution. I think that

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I think that we just have to move on here because it would be putting the department in an untenable situation where now we have to validate who owns what.

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we just have to move on here because it would be putting the department in an untenable

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And that's just not something that the code requires and it's not even something that is even possible.

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So I can move on, Mr. Chair, and try to expedite this.

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I'll move on to other aspects of my cross and Ms. Templeton, but I do want to respond to Mr. Reuter.

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The code says what it says.

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Someone has authority to enforce these code provisions.

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The code says very clearly, no person other than legal owner, equitable owner, conservator, or tenant shall file a zoning application under this zoning code, okay?

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Someone's got to enforce this.

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If L&I doesn't want to do it, you as the zoning board sit above L&I and operate with those powers.

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Someone's got to do it.

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If L&I doesn't feel like doing it, and I agree that someone else has to bring that forward because the applicant did not present the right information.

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So it's up to us to do it.

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I mean, someone's got to do it.

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We did not know.

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We're not the applicant.

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So we found out after the fact that they lied to the department.

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I won't use the word lie.

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They misrepresented to the department that they had site control.

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Someone needs to enforce this.

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And it's got to be you, unfortunately, because L&I has abdicated that responsibility.

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The problem with Mr. Reuter's point is, if no one enforces this, any applicants can lie to the department and say, I own this property.

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I want to file zoning application.

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L&I is not going to check.

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What I'm saying is that it's moot.

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It's clearly it is.

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I'm sorry.

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I'm sorry, gentlemen.

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One at a time.

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Gentlemen, you're talking.

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I'll move on.

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Well, I've remained quiet.

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I just need to say one more thing.

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Mr. Phillips, just one second, please.

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Leonard, finish your statement, please.

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Look, I'm saying, you know, again, obviously I don't agree with Mr. DeMarco's characterization of what the code says or what the department's required to do.

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But regardless of that, the issue is clearly moot now.

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There simply isn't any, I see no public policy purpose that would be furthered by requiring this to go back to the starting board, to the starting blocks or, you know what I meant.

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you know it's it it doesn't make any sense to me that would be a tremendous waste of uh everybody's

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resources it's moot it's done that's what i was getting it is resolved if i can just state one

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one thing just to piggyback on the mootness at the time the application was filed there was

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a legal address of 414-16 south 20th street this is from the opa's um property records

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the owners listed with the city of philadelphia were the kims su wan kim and young he kim

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the land area referenced in the city's records was 2278 square feet which includes the entire

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parcel including this 2006 waverly that mr demarco is complaining about so from the city's

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standpoint the legal owner of the entire parcel were the kims and that is who my client was under

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equitable ownership with so not only is it move it's just it's inaccurate to say that any falsehood

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or lie was perpetrated upon the city the city goes based on the tax records we go based on the tax

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records and clearing up a minor title discrepancy which has been cleared up is not a justification

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to invalidate the permit I'll let Mr. DeMarco continue asking Ms. Templeton questions you may

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thank you um all right so miss templeton uh let's talk about this this garage elevator which uh

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i note that on your report on page six of your report where you have written section eight by

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the way do you have that report in front of you i'm pulling it up oh okay i thank you mike

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so miss templeton number eight at the end of your report section eight uh which is on page six

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you see oh thank you mike you see where it says do you see that on your screen uh miss templeton

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i do all right you say the proposed garage will have an elevator

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to provide access between the parking garage and the street level

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you see that yes all right that's inaccurate right

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my understanding was there would be an elevator all right but you know that the plans don't show

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an elevator they show a ramp right i believe you're mistaken uh to what that says it's an

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elevator for pedestrians for pedestrians yes street level not not for vehicle not for vehicles

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Okay, but you know that the plans actually do show.

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Okay. But you know that the plans actually do show a garage elevator on the elevation drawing.

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You're aware of that?

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I thought there was an indication on the plan that the applicant corrected.

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all right so you do agree though that there was a discrepancy on the zoning plan itself between

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whether there was a garage elevator or where there was a ramp right because the elevation showed the

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elevator but the plan showed the ramp would you agree with that i don't recall exactly but i do

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know there was a discrepancy that i i believe the applicant acknowledged and

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either intended to correct or did correct sorry i think that's fair the applicant acknowledged

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that that was a that was an inconsistency agreed yes all right so let's let me ask you something

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if the elevation was right and that there is a garage elevator proposed you couldn't that would

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be a structure that would not count as open space do you agree with that yes okay fair enough thank

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you uh did you do you recall the testimony of the architect at the earlier hearings that

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a garage elevator was considered for this project do you recall that i believe so all right fair

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enough did you also see on the zoning application itself that it proposes a garage elevator did you

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see that on the application mr phillips went through it when he gave his opening oh god they

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pull it up okay thank you very much um can i just uh interrupt for a second mr demarco could you

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just clarify um the phrase you're using excuse me who's speaking i'm sorry this is this is leonard

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reuter um could you just clarify what you mean by garage elevator are you referring to an elevator

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that lifts automobiles or an elevator for uh humans that just happens to be in the garage

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just so um it's really more for the board to understand what you're talking about

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Yes, I'm speaking about a garage elevator for cars. That is shown on the elevation on the zoning drawing.

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Objection is not shown. The word elevator is on the zoning plan. However, the zoning plan clearly references a shared driveway.

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The zoning application says access by a shared driveway, and the zoning permit says shared driveway.

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There is no car elevator proposed, no mechanical lift proposed.

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And again, this is another red herring because it's something that was not proposed and is not part of the permit.

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Mr. Chairman, that statement is directly contradicted by the language that where his courser is right now.

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Yeah, mechanical elevator.

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There's a mechanical elevator in the building.

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That's not a car elevator.

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That's an elevator that in the reason that's lifted is because any elevator overrun is part of the structure.

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So, therefore, I reference it on the application.

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I'm going to object.

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I'm trying to cross-examine this witness, and I'm getting testimony from Mr. Phillips.

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I know it's embarrassing that there's been all sorts of mistakes on their application,

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but I'm allowed to conduct a reasonable cross-examination without being interrupted with testimony.

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We agree that you guys shouldn't be interrupting each other, but I think we did need clarity.

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Mr. Reuter asked the question if it was an elevator for vehicles or was an elevator for

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pedestrians and I think that's that's a fair question to ask. So let's proceed as quickly as

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we can please. I'll try to do that. Ms. Templeton getting back to the zoning application in front of

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you you see where it says accessed by a by shared driveway and mechanical elevator right? Yes.

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and and the phrase preceding that is talking about parking spaces and bicycle spaces right

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yes all right do you think it's clear that what mr phillips is saying that mechanical elevator

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refers to a pedestrian elevator do you think that's clear from that application

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it is not clear okay and that would certainly dovetail with the confusion on the plane itself

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where the garage elevator is shown on the elevation, but the ramp is shown on the drawing.

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Don't you agree?

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Where is the elevator on the drawing?

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Thank you.

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You see where it says to the right, it says garage door for car elevator to basement on the elevation.

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Garage door for car elevator to basement.

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and there's a structure shown there right yes I see all right so so it's certainly I think it's

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Yes, I see that.

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All right. So it's certainly, I think it's fair to say, isn't it, that there is confusion within the application language and the elevation drawing as to whether a garage elevator was intended or a ramp. Do you agree with that?

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Yes, I guess so.

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All right. Fair enough. Thank you.

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And would you agree as a land planner that a garage elevator is a structure which would not be counted as open space, right?

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Yes.

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All right. And so if, in fact, the elevation was correct, the garage elevator structure could not be counted as open space. Agreed?

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Yes.

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Thank you.

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All right. Do you also agree that garage, excuse me, parking spaces that are accessory to any use

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must be accessible to street level, right? That's in the code itself, is it not?

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Yes, that makes sense.

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Okay. And it's, for the record, Mr. Chairman, that's section 14-801.3, which requires that

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any accessory parking be accessible to the street all right um you also state in your report miss

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templeton that and that's on page two of your report i don't know that you need to change this

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mike but i'll i'll ask the question you agree that the regulations in the zoning code at 14-800

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for parking and loading those regulations are applicable you say it in the third paragraph you

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say the development is also subject to the regulations of section 14-800 for parking and

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loading you agree with that statement right yes okay have you seen the um

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the garage

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layout drawings provided

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and Ms. Sunkit, if you can

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provide me

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share screen ability

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I think you already did

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but I think Mike, I guess you have to click out

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Do you want me to pull it up on mine?

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I know where you got your material plants

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Yes, sir

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I could do it too

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but I'm happy to have you

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I appreciate that very much

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Thank you very much

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indulge you but let me ask make sure that uh nancy has uh miss templeton has seen it have you seen

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the uh the plant david plant's response uh and drawings before today no you have not okay

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well let's do this um i'd like to refer you to it and ask you the question if if if you can answer

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so you can answer. If not, I understand. Mike, I'm going to ask her about the ramp drawing.

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If you could pan down, I appreciate you helping with this. Right there.

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Ms. Templeton, do you see there's a 24-foot width? I'm sorry, I'll up a little bit, Mike. I'm sorry.

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right there do you see there's a 24 foot width in the middle there there's a measurement of 24

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feet across i can't really read it very well mike is good enough to zoom in i appreciate it mike

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okay 24 in uh 24 feet right that's not an accident right that's a driveway aisle width do you agree

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do i agree that driveways are 24 feet no let me rephrase okay so i'll make it clear

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do you agree that the code requires driveway aisles within parking garages to be 24 feet

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i don't recall the exact language but

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um okay that's what it is that's what it is all right uh but you know that you agree that

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there are requirements for driveway aisle width and yes all right and do you see how the driveway

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ramp depicted in this photo intrudes on the 24 foot wide width there

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you see the edge of the driveway ramp right excuse me the the car ramp going down you see

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that there right you point to it are you are you saying here yes sir yep

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do you see that miss templeton yes all right do you see how the ramp comes into and past and within

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the 24 feet wide dimension i guess so all right it's a zone violation isn't it

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It's a zoning violation, isn't it?

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it has to have to have clearance i don't think i don't know

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It has to have clearance.

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I don't think, I don't know.

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I don't know if I agree with that.

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All right.

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Well, this is cool.

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I'll reserve this questioning for Mr. Planck, Mr. Chairman.

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Thank you, Ms. Templeton.

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So you have made the opinion, and Mike, thank you for putting that drawing up.

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You've made the opinion that because the accessory parking is for the commercial parking,

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that it's not the curb cut is not prohibited because it's accessory to the commercial use

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correct that's one of the the access is yes right well it doesn't have to follow the rsa-5

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right but then but that's because that is because you you have stated very clearly in your report

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that because the parking is accessory to the commercial it is permitted right yes all right

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so but do you recall that the project table on the zoning drawing

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states that the parking is accessory to the residential units

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i believe that issue coming having been presented and i think it was

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again um a clarification of an error that needed to be corrected i believe so all right i recall

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all right fair enough so so in other words that was a mistake on the plan as well correct

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i believe that's what it was all right so the and to be clear the the and i think i should

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mike if you want me to do i'm happy to do i don't want to keep making your work but um i would like

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the board to put on the screen i'd like to put the plan up which i can thank you and we can look at

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the zoning table this is where the discrepancy resides the zoning table is at the top we went

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yeah we went over this before already i know but she's testifying yeah um all right you have

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any sense rich how much longer it's going to be uh well i can be done with cross of miss templeton

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relatively uh we got a leash and we have an entire 330 i mean if this is going to be for

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every witness i mean i think we're well beyond the scope but i mean i thought most of this we

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may have heard but we went we went over this ad nauseum at the last hearing finish up with

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Ms. Templeton, and then we'll make a decision. Thank you.

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Right. She made the conclusion, Mr. Chairman, so I have to ask her about it.

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I'll try to be as brief as I can.

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So, Ms. Templeton, you see the four proposed parking units on the table,

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our accessory to the residential use there?

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Can you point to it again?

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Of course, it's right here, Ms. Templeton.

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It's four for residential right there.

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Okay.

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Yeah. All right. So wouldn't you agree that it is certainly unclear from the plan as to whether the accessory parking was accessory to the commercial or the residential in the best light to the developer? Would you agree?

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again i was

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i was understood that this to be an error that was going to be corrected fine so isn't it true

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then that the zoning examiner could have asked for a clarification here or at least an amendment

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to the plan to make it clear that the parking was accessory to the commercial don't you agree

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i guess you'd have to ask the examiner well i'm asking you as a zoning expert

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you're here as a zoning expert well yes they could ask for clarification all right thank you

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and certainly the examiner could have asked for some sort of floor plan to show that the parking

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was only accessible to the commercial unit she could have asked for that correct

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I guess you could ask for anything.

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Right. Doesn't L&I have written authority in the code to request whatever clarification it needs?

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Yes.

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Do you agree? Okay.

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And you mentioned in your report that as far as the curb cut on Waverly Street,

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um you're aware that the code provision that that we have cited uh which is 14-803

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1c.1 which is is to prohibit front-loaded garages on residential row home blocks

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you you know that's part of the current code right yes okay so

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you know that's part of the current code right yes okay so the the section that i just mentioned

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the intent of that section is to prohibit front-loaded garages on residential row home

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blocks correct i don't know if that's clearly stated but i understand what you're saying

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all right and waverly is a single family row home block is it not yes okay fair enough i'm objecting

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to the fact because we received a permit for this for the residential use when we went for

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the variance. So clearly this is not a refusal issue. This is what we're going through here

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again. Mr. Chairman, this is why I reserved my objection to Mr. Phillips' intro. That's not

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really relevant and that's not necessarily correct. There could have been an error on that

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too. But anyway, I'll move on. I'll move on. Are you also familiar, Ms. Templeton, with

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the provision of the code that says that on a corner property both street frontages are

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considered frontages for the purposes of measurement and setbacks? Yes. And to be

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clear, so I'll put that on the record, that's 14-701-1D, which states that both Waverly and

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20th street are can or should be considered frontages uh are you aware of that yes but i

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believe the planning commission can designate a primary frontage street i agree i agree with you

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is there any evidence on this plan whatsoever that the planning commission did that

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i did not see any okay and you would you would state that if you knew that right

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that's something you would certainly be interested in right

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could you restate that um of course uh if the planning commission had designated

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one of the frontage frontages as primary you would certainly state that in your report right

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um yes i suppose so right because that would relate to whether this was a whether the curb

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cut was adjacent to a rear street right right right so waverly can it should be considered a

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frontage so it really can't be right objection you're making legal argument that you're leading

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I'll move on.

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So as far as the, I'm almost done.

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And thank you for your time, Mr. Chairman and Ms. Templeton.

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As far as the fresh food market is concerned,

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you've made an opinion that the fresh food market

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let me make sure I read it correctly. I'm sorry. I'm almost done here.

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You stated that

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let me ask you this. You know that there are certain definitions that are applicable to a

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fresh fruit market, right? In the code? Yes. Right. And one of those definitions in the code at the

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time it existed at the time of this application stated that, thank you, Michael, a fresh fruit

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establishment to be considered that has to either be 5,000 square feet or has to have 50% of its

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display area be for fresh fruits and vegetables, right? You aware of that? Yes. Simple question,

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Ms. Templeton do you agree that the zoning plan itself not the application but the zoning plan

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does not show any floor plan of the fresh food market do you agree with that I agree all right

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and do you agree that the examiner is only taking the statement of the applicant in the application

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that the plan meets those requirements for the display area that's in the code do you agree with

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that? I can't know what the examiner thought. Okay, I'll try to rephrase. Do you agree that

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the plan has no floor plan, which would show that 50% of the display area was for fresh fruits and

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vegetables? There's no floor plan. Of the food market, right? Of the food market. And you also

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agree, you stated this earlier, that the L&I has full jurisdiction to ask for that if they so chose.

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Do great. I agree. All right. I have nothing further, Mr. Chairman. Thank you. Unfortunately,

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Mr. Chairman, I do have two brief redirects that I need to clear up for my record.

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Very brief. Yes. Ms. Templeton, we'll go back to this plan.

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Ms. Templeton, we'll go back to this plan and Mr. DeMarco drew your attention to the

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elevations where it says garage door for car elevator to basement.

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In your opinion as a land planner, what is the purpose of building elevations in a zoning

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plan?

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The purpose of elevations?

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Yes, of an elevation.

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uh to show um characteristics that you can't see on a

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on a plan view height and

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primarily the height primarily okay and looking back at the actual zoning plan and much was made

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about whether this was an elevator or a ramp on the zoning plan does it clearly say exterior

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ramp down to basement yes does it also say ramp up from basement yes are there references

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to a shared driveway in the zoning plan I'll show you here and there's references to shared

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driveway in the uh application yes okay uh based on this zoning site plan right here

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would any reasonable person look at this site plan and think that there

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is an elevator being proposed and not a ramp

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no um also much was made ado about the fact that uh and i believe as mr uh Montalbano testified at

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hearing it said four for residential and zero for commercial. However within the projects group does

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it say accessory to commercial use? Yes. Within the zoning application did it say accessory to

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commercial use? Yes. Right here within the application does it say proposed parking at

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basement accessory to commercial use? Yes. Is there any question in your mind as you look at this

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based upon the application in the plan that the proposed parking was to be accessory to the

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commercial use? No question. And lastly, I will ask about this issue about frontages and rear

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street. Is it fair to say that the determination of whether or not Waverly is a rear street or not

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only matters if the accessory parking is proposed for a single family, two family, or multi-family

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use? Correct. It does not matter if it is proposed for a commercial use, correct? Correct. I have no

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further questions. Just one question based on that last question. One question. Ms. Templeton,

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it's prohibited. The curb cut would be prohibited if this were solely a multifamily use, right?

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Or any residential use. All right. And there are four residential units in the building, right?

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yes okay that's all let me just make one clarification when you say it's prohibited

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would you mean it's prohibited unless waverly is designated as a rear street

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because if waverly is designated as a rear street then wouldn't the code

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permit parking for the residential use it would not

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so um and i'll leave it at that all right further gentlemen here's where we are um

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we're going to close the record the board will make a decision next wednesday at 9 30 a.m which

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is december the 16th on this matter thank you all mr chairman i have to put an objection on the

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record i i was promised that i would have an opportunity to talk to the engineer and cross

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examine the engineer uh it's it's relevant to the interior of the garage and the feasibility of it

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it's one of our major issues uh we're gonna have to continue at the earlier hearings you had said

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that we would hear from the engineer it's in the testimony uh i need to cross-examine the

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engineer that's why i didn't call him as a witness this was in the record at the earlier hearings

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i have to have to have a right to talk to mr plant uh it's it's a critical part of our presentation

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mr chairman and i will just say this in response mr chairman if the board feels that it uh that

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it has heard enough evidence or has heard enough argument over the past six hours and that they

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have not heard any affirmative evidence whatsoever showing that this zoning permit should be

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revoked, then the appellant has failed to satisfy their burden and we can move on. If there are any

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the appellant has failed to satisfy their burden and we can move on if there are any questions

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that the board has about any aspects of this permit um you know i would welcome those and

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we'd be happy to answer them but i think what we've shown is that this is a by right project

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here's the problem mr chairman during the architect's testimony i forgot for i forgot

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I did not continue with questioning because I was told the engineer would be available.

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And the board was a group, from what I remember from the transcript, and I can get it to you, you allowed me to do that.

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You said we would hear from the engineer.

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And I'm now being prevented from having that right.

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It's going to be a problem that's going to potentially require a remand.

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And I don't have a complete record.

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I forgave testimony that I wanted to do on cross because I was promised to have the engineer.

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Can I ask for an offer of proof of what Mr. DeMarco wants to ask the engineer?

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I was just getting to that.

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I mean, what else are we going to talk about that we haven't already covered?

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With all due respect, Mr. DeMarco.

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The discrepancy, the lack of accessibility of the interior parking and the Rosario plant drawing is critical evidence of the ownership issue.

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And I understand that you might be uncomfortable with ruling on that.

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I hear what you're saying in your voice, but I've got to make the record because I believe that it's a critical issue that if this board is not going to deal with it, the courts are going to want to deal with it.

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So this is my last shot, Mr. Chairman, to make a record.

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I don't want to belabor the point, but I've got to make that record.

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And Mr. Plant and Rogerio are the people who produced the plan,

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which show that there's another owner out there that did not get said at the time.

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I understand Mike doesn't want you to hear it, but I've got to make a record.

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I don't want you to have to keep continuing this, but I've got to cross-examine Mr. Plant.

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I was promised that.

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We've already heard it for like three hours.

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So the cross-examination of Ms. Templeton doesn't satisfy any of those

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issues you're saying or other issues that the end that Mr. Plant would be able to address

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Mr. Plant if you remember and I know it's stale in your mind but when we had these hearings back

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last year I agreed not to continue a certain cross-examination of the architect because they

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deferred to the engineer on these critical issues whether you are going to rule in favor of us or

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not I've got to be able to make my record or else we're going to be back here so I agreed not to

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continue with certain questioning of Mr. Montalbano because I was told I would have an opportunity to

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speak to the engineer and Mr. Phillips and Mr. Phillips will agree he did tell me that it's one

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of his witnesses so I okay all right all right so what we didn't do finish up last year we'll have

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to finish up next year so uh we'll continue this case yeah uh mi 2020-001433 414 south 20th street

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do we have a date tanya no chair not at this time okay miss sunkett will notify you of the

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continued case date i appreciate your time mr chairman thank you and all i'm asking again

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new and different please understood thank you mr chairman thank you time board have a good

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holiday if i don't see you all right everybody stay safe thank you bye all right that concludes

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the two o'clock list am i correct that's correct yes it is now 10 of 12 we'll get back here at uh

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five o'clock or five after? Sounds good. Five after five.

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Ready? Yeah. Okay, thank you. Before we begin, Ms. Sunkett, we'll give you an opportunity to

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open up and see how many hands come up or whatever, and we'll wait to hear from you.

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Nope, we're good, Chair. Oh, we're ready to roll. Okay. Yes, sir. All right. Good evening, everyone.

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my name is Frank DiCicco. I'm the Chair of the Zoning Board of Adjustment. I'll be participating

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in this evening's hearing along with our Vice Chair Ms. Carol Tenere, Board Secretary Confessor

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Plaza and Board Members Mr. Thomas Holloman and Mr. James Snell. Board Administrator Tanya Sunkit

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and Board Attorney Ms. Sharon Saleta are also in attendance. For those of you who haven't yet

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participated in one of our virtual hearings, I'll go through some of the basics of what you can

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expect. First, we will be administering oaths to individual participants prior to their testimony.

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Second, we'd like to advise everyone that this proceeding is being recorded and that

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Second, we'd like to advise everyone that this proceeding is being recorded and that by

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by participating, you acknowledge your agreement to be recorded.

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Third, for anyone participating by phone, if you wish to testify, you must raise your

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hand by hitting star 9 and then star 6 to unmute yourself.

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I'll repeat.

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For anyone participating by phone, if you wish to testify, you must raise your hand

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by hitting star 9 and then star 6 to unmute yourself.

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To enter an appearance statement, call Google 267-270-5548 and leave your email address

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and the address of the property at issue. I'll repeat. To enter an appearance statement,

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call Google 267-270-5548 and leave your email address and the address of the property at issue.

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Before Ms. Denary calls our first case, we'd like to ask if anyone is requesting a continuance or withdrawal for this evening's 3.30 list, please raise your hand.

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In the meantime, I will read into the record.

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Do I have to do it again?

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We read these earlier.

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You know what?

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Let me read them just in case somebody can.

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Yeah, it would be helpful.

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Yeah.

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Okay.

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The following requests for continuance have been made.

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I'll read them off.

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If anyone disagrees with them, please raise your hand.

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MI 2020-001-830-2041 North Rees Street.

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Excuse me, Chair.

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This is Sharon Saleta.

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We actually interrupted the 2 o'clock session to go through these.

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I know.

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I just figured maybe somebody didn't hear it.

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Oh, okay.

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That's a good idea.

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I'm sorry.

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Thank you.

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Yes, absolutely.

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No worries.

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Number six on our list, MI2020-001861, 2442 North 54th Street.

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And those are the two that I have that were requested, continuance were requested.

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If anyone objects, the attorney or the applicant, please raise your hand.

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and if there's anyone else who would like to have their cases continued please raise your hand

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or withdrawn please raise your hand um so chair i'm not sure if you recall but

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there were a couple of other cases that were continued number seven was it hold on a second

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please as that was there were no exhibits you called to see if anyone was here and it was

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continued must be heard um also the same with number nine continued must be heard and number

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10 continued but not must be heard all right okay there were no exhibits okay i didn't get those

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okay i got them now just so number seven

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I think we already did that one right

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that's right you did already know that you you um called it out and asked if anyone was here

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representing the applicant okay so it was number seven and then number number nine number nine

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both of those were must be heard and then i did those earlier correct all right and then number

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10 was continued but not must be heard okay so we're we're straight on that yes thank you okay

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um tanya we go we are okay yes chair ready to proceed okay calendar number

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calendar number 1831-2209

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north 7th street

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mr chair this is jason hand

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mr jason had his hand up he has now been made a

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thank you i believe

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Hi, Mr. Jin. Can you put your name and address on the record and spell your last name, please?

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Yes. Zen Jin, Z-H-E-N-J-I-N, 1617 John F. Kennedy Boulevard, Suite 1838, Philadelphia PA 19103, here on behalf of the applicant.

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Thank you. Do you swear or affirm to tell the whole truth and nothing but the truth?

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I do.

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Do you agree to waive the reading of the refusal and stipulate to its accuracy?

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I do.

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And have you emailed all the exhibits, proof of ownership, tax compliance, refusal referral, photos, plans, five days in advance of this hearing?

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And have you met with the RCO and do you have a letter?

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and have you met with the RCO, and do you have a letter?

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Yes, to all those questions.

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Yes, to all those questions.

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You may proceed.

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Excuse me, Mr. Chen, you have three cases on the 330 list.

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If any of those should be considered together, could you let us know?

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Sure.

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The other two actually can be considered together.

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They're related matters.

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But not with this case, correct?

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Not with this case.

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Okay.

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Thank you.

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Thank you.

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I'm going to go ahead and share some information with the board

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so that we can look at the case itself.

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So I have up before the board the letter,

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I'm sorry, the cover letter,

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which shows that we submitted refusal,

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community letter, photos, plans, and related documents.

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This application is straightforward.

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And in fact, this area has a lot of such applications,

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which is that this zone this area is zoned cmx2 however majority of the block particularly 7th

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street 8th street is actually either vacant or currently residential if you look at the photographs

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our lot is sitting next to what is an existing multifamily and on the other side of the this is

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the lot in question and then on the other side of the whoops i'm sorry i expected more photos

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my apologies. On the other side of this property actually is another new construction, which is

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also multifamily. When we met with the RCO, which is APM, a meeting was held and all attendees at

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the meeting were in support of the idea of waiving the requirement for a commercial space for this

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particular property because it is kind of sandwiched between two multifamily residential

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and the rest of the block has no active commercial at this time 7th street at this location actually

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is pretty close to germantown avenue which does have commercial um it is a commercial quarter and

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does have commercial activity it just hasn't quite reached this area of 7th street uh majority of

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this area in fact is um less developed and even the street on the other side of the street it is

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actually, I believe, back to more residential properties, not commercial, with a lot of vacant

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lots also mixed in in the area. As such, the community actually supported waiving the commercial

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use. We basically are asking what would be normally a two residential unit and a commercial

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to be changed to a total of three residential units in this case. The plans are shown here.

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this property it does have a easement alleyway which will be something that is shared theoretically

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with the neighboring property however it is going to be pretty tight because the other property is

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built already you can see in this photo again we're actually sandwiched between two multi-family

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residential development at this time the floor plans basically lay out one unit on each floor

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with the basement being for utilities

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and basically open storage space.

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The bedrooms are with two bedrooms each,

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three units in total

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with a large living room kitchen area in each unit.

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The trash storage is available behind the property.

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There is space and there's again,

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a easement access way,

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although it's probably gonna be difficult to use that.

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what my client also did is have a small roof deck placed for the upper unit so that they could

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always put the trash here and then the first floor unit obviously has direct access to the rear yard

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through the side and even the second unit could access because there is a alleyway theoretically

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there is an alleyway I'm not sure how wide it's going to end up being as I'm not sure the other

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property left enough of the easement, but there would be an access way to the rear as well. So

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even as a CMX use, if there was a commercial unit on the first floor, I don't believe the trash and

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other situations would necessarily change, and it would actually increase potentially the amount of

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traffic and parking that would be on the block. As such, the community did support our request for

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as variants, and we would ask the board's favorable consideration in this matter.

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Thank you.

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Do you have a witness?

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I believe my client should be on the line.

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Let me, if you can give me one second.

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My apologies.

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Joseph, are you there?

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Joseph, are you there?

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Thank you.

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It should be Mr. Gitterman, Joseph Gitterman.

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If not in the interest of time, Mr. Jinn, as an officer of the court,

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would stipulate that your client would be adopting your testimony?

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Yes, I would stipulate as such.

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Thank you.

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Any questions from the board?

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No.

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No.

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No.

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Anyone else would like to testify in this case?

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If so, please raise your hand.

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Joseph Gitterman has his hand raised, sir.

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I will allow him to speak right now.

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Sir, please identify yourself.

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Spell your first and last name.

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Yes, how are you, everybody?

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My name is Joseph Gitterman, J-O-S-E-P-H,

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And the last name is Gitterman, G-I-T-E-R-M-A-N.

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And do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?

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Yes, I do.

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Thank you.

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Mr. Jin?

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Thank you.

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Mr. Gitterman, you heard my representation and testimony before the zoning board relating to this case.

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Can you verify that it's true and correct and adopted as your own testimony?

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Yes, I do.

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Thank you.

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Thank you.

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Anyone else?

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No. Mr. Mason, Planning Commission.

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Yes, this is Mason Austin, representing the Planning Commission.

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Do we have a firm to tell the truth, if nothing but the truth?

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I do.

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Thank you. Please proceed.

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Great. Thank you.

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Mr. Chairman and members of the Board, while the lot is designated for multifamily residential in the comprehensive plan, it is zoned for commercial mixed use.

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However, subsequent to the publication of the district plan that designated this lot for multifamily residential,

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the council office has embarked on a strategy to strengthen this segment of the commercial district.

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In support of those efforts, the staff of the Planning Commission recommends against the granting of the requested variance.

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I'm sorry to catch that last part.

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Recommends against the granting of the requested variance.

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There's both sides of it. All right.

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i uh mr chairman i did speak with uh miss jones at the councilman's office and i think you will

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see that in this situation this particular property is difficult to put a viable commercial

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but yeah i agree i i agree that's what i was getting at yeah no disrespect the planning i just

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i agree uh okay mi2020-001831 2209 north 7th street my vote is yes

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my vote is yes my vote is yes my vote is yes

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is the next case is the next case thank you is the next case the add-on case with uh mr patterson

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or do we go to market street mark i don't know i have a market street is next

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if you could call the add-on for mr patterson that would be great thank you

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Okay, great. Calendar number 0916, 2616 South 8th Street.

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The attorney is Ron Patterson, and I think he's reporting on the status of an agreement with the neighbors.

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South 8th Street or 18th Street?

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18th Street.

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Is it South 18th?

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Yeah.

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Okay.

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I believe it's South 8th Street.

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the original hearing was on

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December 2nd

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yeah I thought it was South 18th Street

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18th and Oregon

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okay Mr. Patterson

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can correct that then thank you

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this is the one they had to work out

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some arrangements with Dr. Nocella

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or somebody next to her I believe

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yes

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is mr patterson available mr patterson is available i'm promoting him to panelists right

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now thank you very much jason

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hey thank you mr patterson name and address for the record please

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good evening ron patterson 1835 market street philadelphia ppa 19103

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do you swear or affirm to tell the whole truth and nothing but the truth

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i do do you agree to wave and stiff yes i do and you're here for the

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status of the agreement yes yes thank you so yes last wednesday on the second at 2 p.m we had a

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hearing a full hearing and we concluded the hearing um they're uh at the hearing the

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a full hearing, and we concluded the hearing. At the hearing, the immediate neighbor

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you

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attorney interjected and wanted to ask if we could reach an understanding and an agreement,

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because we share a lot, line, and easement. And so the board graciously let us have a week

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to talk about it and negotiate, and we did come to an understanding and an into agreement. And I have

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I sent a letter confirming to that effect, as well as the neighbors from attorneys from

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Verne Anastasio's office, Harry Cook.

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He has a letter from him confirming that, as well as a letter of support from Ms. Nestico,

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the adjacent neighbor.

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So we're all good.

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So that's an agreement between both parties, not a proviso, correct?

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That is correct.

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Yes, it's a private agreement.

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We can vote this now, correct?

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That's correct.

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Okay.

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MI 2020-0916, 2616 South 18th Street.

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My vote is yes.

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My vote is yes.

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My vote is yes.

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My vote is yes.

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Thank you.

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Great.

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Thank you for your consideration there.

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Thank you.

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Thank you.

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Thank you.

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Calendar number 1767-2222 Market Street.

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Mr. Bob Kerlis has his hand up. I will allow him to speak right now. And Mr. Alex Clore as well.

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You can promote Mr. Kerlis, too. He's the attorney.

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Okay.

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Promote him to a panelist.

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He's now a panelist, ma'am.

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Thank you so much.

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You're welcome.

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hi mr careless can you put your name and address on the record please and spell your last name

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uh good evening robert careless c-a-r-e-l-e-s-s cozen o'connor 1650 market street

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philadelphia pa 19103 do you swear or affirm to tell the truth and nothing but the truth

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i do do you agree to wait the reading of the refusal and stipulate to its accuracy

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i do have you submitted all the exhibits proof of ownership proof of tax compliance refusal

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referral photos and plans of the property five days in advance of this hearing and have you met

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with the rco and do you have a letter i do on all accounts you may proceed thank you yes your screen

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is up that's great uh good evening everyone i'm here before you today with respect to the new

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professional office building for Morgan Lewis under construction at 2222 Market Street.

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The application that we've submitted requests a special exception for the accessory use of two

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outdoor areas as roof decks on the 13th floor and 19th floor that I'm indicating on the drawing

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and are highlighted. As confirmed by L&I, our drawings satisfy the criteria that's set forth

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section 146045 with respect to the dimension of the decks. I'm showing you the drawing for

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the 13th floor deck. Market Street is here, 23rd and Ludlow. The occupiable area of the 13th floor

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deck is 85 feet long, 25 feet wide. For the 19th floor deck, which is where I'm indicating,

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The occupiable area is 136 feet long, 27 feet square feet wide, excuse me.

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Showing you pictures of the surrounding area from perspectives looking east and west.

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The top picture is a perspective from 23rd and Market looking east.

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You can see the large parking lot to our north. On the other side of Market, the 23A

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condominium building is to our south here. This is the proposed area in the

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Google image where the parking lot is. The 238 condominium building, again to

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our south, is approximately 118 feet in height. Our proposed deck on the 13th

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floor is at an elevation of 198 feet or 80 feet above the 238 building. Further,

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our neighbors at 23A have sent a letter of support to CCRA, our RCO, in support of our

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application for this grant of a special exception. This letter references a community benefits

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agreement. That agreement contemplates the decks and provides if the use would be limited to

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accessory uses to the office building and no nuisances would be permitted. That same covenant

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That same covenant is found in our lease with Morgan Lewis.

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is found in our lease with Morgan Lewis.

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We did meet with CCRA on October 27th to discuss our application.

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Following the public meeting portion of CCRA's zoning meeting, the zoning committee voted to not oppose the application,

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provided with a proviso that there would be no amplified music on these decks after 7 p.m. on weekdays.

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We respectfully requested that CCRA reconsider that proviso and amend it if it felt that

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a proviso had to be suggested, such that the language be in line with our CVA, at least

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with Morgan Lewis.

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CCRA was not able to consider that request at the November meeting, and we did notify

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them that we would be requesting that the 7 p.m. proviso not be imposed on the grant

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of our special exception.

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uh i'll note briefly that pennsylvania law is clear that the at the imposition of conditions

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on the grant of a special exception must find support in the record in order to warrant their

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imposition um our again our application is proposing to use two outdoor areas as roof decks

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on a 19-story office building in the cmx 5 district this is not a bar this is not a restaurant

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This isn't a law firm, it's an international law firm that would have lawyers there working

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well after 7 p.m. In terms of the grant of a special exception, we meet the test

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for the grant of a special exception as set forth in section 14.303.78

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without the imposition of any proviso and we would respectfully urge the board to grant our special

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exception without proviso, but if the board is inclined to grant the special exception,

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only if it is subject to a proviso we would request that the board adopt the proviso that's

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consistent with the cva and with our lease with morgan and we had sent that language into the

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board but i'll read it that the use of the bow keys and roof decks be limited to use as accessory

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to business and professional office purposes and not for any purpose which constitutes

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a nuisance under applicable philadelphia law or code um again we think that whatever concern may

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be generated by the 7 p.m. proviso would be covered in that covenant and I remind the board that we

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also have the an unconditional letter of support from CCR from the 238 condominium building to our

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south. That does conclude my testimony. I do thank the board for its time. I do have two witnesses

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that I'd like to ask to come off mute and affirm my testimony.

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Could I please ask Mr. Wale Mambukunj of Parkway Corporation to raise his hand?

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You can unmute.

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Good evening, everyone.

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Good evening, sir.

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Please identify yourself with a record first and last name.

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Certainly.

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My name is Wale Mapuganji.

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First name W.

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A is in Albert.

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L is in Larry.

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E is in Edward.

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Last name M is in Mary.

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A is in Albert.

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B is in Boy.

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O is in Orange.

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G is in Gun.

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U is in Umbrella.

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N is in Nancy.

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J is in Juice.

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E is in Egg.

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Thank you. Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?

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I do.

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Thank you, Mr. Karolish.

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Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

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Wale, could you just take for the record your title at Parkway Corporation and your professional address?

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Certainly. My title is Vice President and Project Executive for Real Estate and Development at Parkway Corporation.

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Address is 150 North Broad Street, Philadelphia.

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you and and while did you hear my presentation to the board just just a few minutes ago yes i did

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and would you adopt and affirm that testimony as if it were your own testimony yes could i

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mr chairman could i please ask um mr alexander clore of gensler to raise his hand so he can come

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off mute yes good evening good evening please identify yourself first and last name please

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Alex Klohr, K-L-O-H-R.

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So you swear or firm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?

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I do.

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Please proceed, Mr. Kirlis.

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Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

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Alex, are you familiar with the criteria for the grant of a special exception on the Philadelphia Zoning Code?

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Yes.

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And in your professional opinion, do we meet the criteria for the grant of a special exception?

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Yes.

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Yes.

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And did you hear my presentation of the board?

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I did.

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And would you adopt and affirm that testimony

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as if they're your own testimony?

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Yes.

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Thank you.

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Mr. Chairman, I have nothing further for the board tonight.

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Any questions from the board?

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No.

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Anyone else would like to testify in this case?

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If so, please raise your hand.

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No further hands at this time, Mr. Chair.

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No further hands at this time, Mr. Chair.

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Thank you, Jason.

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Jason, Planning Commission?

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Plenty.

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This is Mason Austin representing the Planning Commission.

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Mr. Chair and members of the Board, the lot is designated for commercial,

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core commercial mixed use in the comprehensive plan and is zoned for that use.

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Because the lot is located in a major commercial district,

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staff of the Planning Commission have no opposition to the granting of the special exception.

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Thank you very much.

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mi2020-0017672222 market street my vote is yes my vote is yes my vote is yes my vote is yes

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no proviso

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okay thank you very much with proviso no proviso that was not i just wanted to clarify

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I'm sorry, nobifies.

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Right, thank you.

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All right, MI2020-001833, and I believe that's 2225 North 8th Street.

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And Mr. Jinn, is this connected to the 7th Street project as well?

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Yes, it is in a way, the same owners, so we can proceed with both.

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because we had a workout in agreement with the council office.

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All right. MI 2020-001832, 2215 North 7th Street.

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You've already been sworn in.

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Just please identify yourself with the record.

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Thank you.

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Zen Jin, Z-H-E-N-J-I-N, 1617 John F. Kennedy Boulevard,

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Suite 1838, Philadelphia PA 19103.

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Here on behalf of the applicant.

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Thank you, Mr. Jin.

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Please proceed with your testimony.

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Thank you.

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We have some questions. I forgot. So used to Carol. I apologize.

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No problem. Do you agree to wave and step? I do.

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Have you emailed an exhibit packet and the required documents, including proof of ownership,

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proof of tax compliance, a copy of the refusal or referral, and photos and or plans of the

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property five days in advance of the hearing? I did. Also, have you met with the RCO and do you

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have a letter? We do. Yes. Thank you. Thank you. Please proceed. Thank you. I'm going to go ahead

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and share with the board the information relating to this case. My apologies. I'm trying to

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let me make sure I'm providing the 8th street, yes okay. So this is the application on 8th street

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which is the first of the matter. They're related in overall request but they're a little different

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in size and location. The 8th street property is one that is in a CMX2 zone district much like the

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7th Street property we did earlier. What it is is that these properties are kind of sandwiched

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among residential properties, and it is zoned CMX2, but there's no real commercial activity on these

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blocks. And even though the lot itself right now looks like it could be used for some commercial

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purpose, the reality is most of this block is residential. When we met with the community group,

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it is at the same meeting that we had two other properties with, the neighborhood overwhelmingly

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supported the idea of keeping it just a residential property. As such, our request essentially is to

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place a residential building as a multifamily unit, converting what would have been required

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first floor commercial to an additional residential unit. As you can see, the building

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would be three-story. It would be built to a similar height as to what is existing in the

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neighborhood. The property itself would be divided into each floor being one unit. I'm going to zoom

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in a little bit to make it easier for the board to see. Again, leaving an open family exercise

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area in the basement for the first floor unit. Dining and bedroom. We have on the upper floors

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two bedrooms or a study room and a bedroom depending on how the ultimately the individuals

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who's using the property would like to use it. There is a roof deck also on the third floor.

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This property does have a rear yard. It is not a corner property but right as of right now the

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property has vacant lots next to it. The management of the trash would be the roof deck would be up

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to replace some of the trash.

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First floor would have the rear yard access.

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And in the case of the second floor unit, I believe we put in a specific trash room for that unit within the unit until trash is ready to be taken out.

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And in the case of the second floor unit,

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I believe we put in a...

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So given that situation, we did receive support from the community on this request.

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Now, I want to go ahead and share the other property and explain to the board what we had done with that one, because it relates back to the council office's non-opposition to our proposal for a complete residential property on this particular address.

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So what I'm doing now is I'm sharing the information from the other case, 2215 to 19 North 7th Street.

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I'm going to show the refusal which is based on the number of units based on the lot size as well

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as the commercial now this what this is it's a subdivision in a sense a consolidation of three

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lots each CMX2 each would have by right been at least three units plus the commercial what my

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client is doing he's combining these into one because he is doing this even though we received

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support from the community for full residential use of a total of 12 units the council office

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asked that we work with them and place at least a commercial unit into the space because it is

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closer towards the germantown avenue side and the hope is that with all these additional multi

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families coming into place that this commercial unit would be viable in the future because the

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negotiations kind of lasted until late this morning. What we have agreed to do is to maintain

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a request for 12 residential units, but with the understanding that this unit here, which

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was originally on the plan as a residential unit, would be converted to a first floor

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commercial space. It's approximately 684.8 square foot on the ground level, and then

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it has its own associated lower level. By doing this what we would like to do is either have

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a one-page supplemental plan submitted to the board to be stamped or if this can be done in

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some way as a proviso based on the location and size of the unit either one would be acceptable

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to my client and myself depending on which way the board wish to proceed with this matter. But

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By doing this, what we're doing is we're giving the,

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because the council office request

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is some kind of commercial space

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that is not necessarily a huge space,

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but enough to be used in this building to be provided.

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We are providing that as a way to meet their requirements

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while still keeping with the overall design of the project.

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This particular project have more units.

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However, everyone has access to the rear yard

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and the stairwells inside also all leads to the top level.

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There are actually trash rooms,

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also small trash rooms placed within each unit.

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And these are basically all two bedroom units

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that are designed within this space.

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So with the commercial unit coming in,

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we may have to slightly relay out the floor plan

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on some of the upper floors,

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maybe reducing them to one bedroom unit

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and moving one unit up there

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while providing a commercial space on the first floor.

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So I wanted to explain that to the board

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as part of this application.

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It's part of the reason the council office

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also does not object to the 8th Street

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being a completely residential property.

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I'm sorry, I'm not hearing.

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The commercial, can you hear me?

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Yes, I can now.

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The commercial component that you're showing here in yellow.

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Yes.

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What address is that attributed to?

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22 what?

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So here's the issue.

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This is a consolidation request.

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Yeah.

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So in order for us to really clarify this with L&I later,

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after if we go for building permit,

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we probably would want some kind of marking on the plan

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to say that's the commercial space.

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This is currently unit four on the residential plan

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that we agreed to convert to a commercial use.

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So, Sharon, maybe you can help me, what is your special language that we would need to make certain that if we approve this plan, that the commercial component, I mean, it's going to probably require a revised plan, no?

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I think, Mr. Jin, you even said that you may change some of the apartments to one bedroom as opposed to two.

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So I think the main floor, the only floor that's being affected by this change would be the first floor.

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So if we were to do a plan, we would probably just mark, make sure this is marked completely

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If we were to do a plan, we would probably just make sure this is marked.

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as a commercial.

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And then if the board would leave the other floors without stamp plans, we can always

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readjust those freely with the building department moving forward.

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With the council office had no objection to the total of the 12 units that we're requesting.

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Yeah, I get that.

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I just want to make sure that we...

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I don't know if Sharon would be able to advise on this.

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an alternative would be that first floor must contain a 684.8 square foot commercial space.

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I can do that, but is it address specific?

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It wouldn't be. This will be a... Oh, sorry, Sharon.

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I'm sorry. This is Sharon Saleta. I was disconnected for a few minutes, so I'm not sure what the issue is.

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So if I may, Chairman.

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So what we're doing is we have agreed with the council office to change what you see on the screen here, Unit 4, essentially to be provided as a commercial space.

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While maintaining a total of 12 residential units besides adding this commercial space here.

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So the question is, what's the best way to put that into the decision from the board?

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so that's complicated would it be possible for us just to hold the vote for one week in order to

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work out what the exact language should be and whether it's better to do it by

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a proviso or revised plans i i don't have an objection to that absolutely yeah i think we

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just you know we want to you know help you out and get this done i just want to make sure that

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everyone is comfortable with what the language is right and i don't want my client to have

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problems at lni in the future yeah all right so so we'll hold that one up let's go back to

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do you have your client do you have anybody yes um it'll be uh mr david uh badouj badouj

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sir please identify yourself with the record and spell your last name please

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uh david badush d-a-v-i-d b-o-b-a-d-o-u-c-h and you swear or affirm to tell the truth the

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whole truth and nothing but the truth i do mr jinn thank you mr badush you were you were here

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during my presentation um you've heard what i represented to the board regarding the two

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properties uh can you verify that my presentation is true and accurate and adopted as your own

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Yes. Thank you.

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I just have one comment, just one question.

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If we were just writing proviso for 685 square feet of commercial, isn't that just a simple solution or no?

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Well, but it's going to change the dimensions, I believe, and I'm not, I don't know, correct me if I'm wrong, Sharon.

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um i i would rather run it by ellen i so that i can confirm that you will not have any issues

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when you go to get a permit yeah sir it'll work to your advantage we're only going to hold it

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one week okay all right it'll work to your advantage so there's no no no confusion no

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mix-up all right thank you okay thank you um this is sharon soletti again can i just say mr jinn

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thank you so much for your office being so accommodating i think i emailed you after seven

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than last night and you got back to me immediately and provided all the information that we needed

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so thank you it's our pleasure you're welcome all right so what we'll do is we're going to vote the

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eighth street one first uh mi 2020 i believe uh the planning commission did not get an opportunity

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oh sorry about that i'm sorry mason i'm sorry no no problem uh mr uh this is mason austin representing

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of the Planning Commission, Mr. Chairman and members of the board, with regard to 2225 North

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8th Street, the lot is designated for multi-family residential in the comprehensive plan, but

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is zoned for commercial mixed use. Because the proposal would be by right in the recommended

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zoning district, Planning Commission supports the granting of the requested variance.

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Thank you, and I got ahead of myself again. Is there anyone else who would like to testify

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in this case? Please raise your hand.

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Okay. Thank you. Thank you. MI 2020-001833. 2225 North 8th Street. My vote is yes with

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the proviso second floor unit to provide a ventilated trash room. Yes with proviso. Yes

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And for MI 2020-001832, 2215-2219 North 8th Street, this case, this hearing will be resumed on Tanya, we can do.

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this hearing will be resumed on tanya we can do this next week because it's just a

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a matter of clearing up the language yes as you wish chair okay so we'll do it

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tuesday or wednesday what works best how about tuesday for this we got multiple ones on wednesday

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that's the 15th correct correct all right this hearing will be resumed on december the 15th

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at 9 30 a.m at which time we'll consider any feedback related to the proposed plan and any

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adjustments that need to be made to the uh uh to the i don't know the architectural plans of this

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project thank you okay all right um last case mi 2020 does zero zero one nine four five five six

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This is Sharon Saleta. Mr. Richardson couldn't say but he did email us a letter in support.

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I figured he was yeah okay thank you. I figured that's why I called back up. I figured he was

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around somewhere. Oguns Avenue. Good evening Mr. Chairman. Good evening madam.

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so we have no little people today well we do actually have little people there's one sitting

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next to me very quietly eating his dinner and the other is um bad mom alert watching okay

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okay also she texted me a picture that made my day so thank you okay miss belliger let's proceed

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thank you all right good evening um i guess you need to start first right yes i do yep do you uh

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do you agree to wave and stip i sure do and uh have you emailed an exhibit packet with the required

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documents including proof of ownership proof of tax clearance a copy of the refusal or referral

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and photos of the property or plans of the property five days in advance of the hearing

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i sure did and have you met with the rco and if you have do you have a letter we do okay thank

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you please proceed all right uh good evening mr chairman i'm sorry could you swear her in oh i'm

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sorry right you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth i sure

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do thank you thank you tanya mr chairman members of the board my name is meredith ferliger f-e-r-l-e-g-e-r

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of Dilworth Paxson, 1500 Market Street, Suite 3500E. My client is DFH Regency LLC, which is

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the owner of the property and is represented here today by Josh Greenberger. This is a very simple

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request, so I will be brief. We did receive a letter of support from a concerned community

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association, which is in your packet at tab 11 and is up on the screen. And as Sharon indicated,

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we did also receive a letter of support from the councilwoman's office. The property before you

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today is 5600 Ogance Avenue. As you can see in the aerial photos that I have up on the screen at

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tab six, this is a very large property that extends along Ogance Avenue from West Olney Avenue

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to North 18th Street. The property is over two acres and contains a three-building apartment

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complex that was built in the early 1940s. So the board understands the scale of the buildings,

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I'll briefly scroll through some of the photos at tab 12. Now historically the number of units

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in the buildings based on the public records that we have has varied at most reaching 203 units

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sometime in the 90s, but the property was most recently documented as having 202 units.

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And I will bring up the most recent permit that reflects the 202 units.

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The rental license that the current property owner has is also for 202 units.

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Now, the building has studio, one-bedroom, and two-bedroom units,

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which are shown in sample floor plans at tab four. My client just purchased this property

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just over a year ago in October of 2019. Since then, they've been undertaking a comprehensive

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assessment of the property in preparation for beginning some significant renovations to these

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rather old buildings. Renovations will include unit-by-unit overhauls,

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including adding individual HVAC and washer and dryers, an amenity building, updated common areas

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and facade modifications. Now as the new owner has become more familiar with the building and

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its tenants, they discovered that the building in fact has 206 residential units, not 202.

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not 202. That's why we're here, Board, for the missing four units. Now, with respect to the

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That's why we're here board for the

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and this

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application, we received one refusal. The property is zoned RM1, which of course permits multifamily.

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However, based on the lot size, technically only 194 units are permitted. This is, of course,

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based on the modern zoning code and does not take into account the long-term history of this

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property, which has 200, which is documented as having 202 units. It's not clear where or when

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the additional four units came to be. In fact, we're not even sure which of the units are those

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missing four. There are no units that are clearly different than the others that would help explain

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where this discrepancy came from. My client was not able to gather any useful information from

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the prior owner. We accordingly, of course, submit to a hardship because this board previously

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approved the structure for 202 units back in 2011. The instant request is just to correct the

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zoning records, which exclude those four units that have been in existence presumably for a long

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time and certainly as long as my client has owned it the last year. 206 versus 202 units is a

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comparatively small deviation for a property of this size. This is the least minimum variance

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given the long-term existence of these units. This won't increase congestion. The complex does

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have a large underground parking facility, and the four units have existed for presumably some time.

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The proposal will not impair light and air or negatively impact surrounding properties.

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the complex has been in existence for near 80 years, and the new owner is about to undertake a

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sweeping modernization project that is long overdue. Documenting the four missing units

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will ensure that this new owner is not stymied by incorrect zoning records.

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We submit the variance complies in full with the provisions of section 14-303-8E of the code,

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as is further detailed in my memorandum of law, submitted at tab 7. As I mentioned,

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we did meet with the community, a concerned community organization, association. Their

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letter of support is attached at tab 11. Now, Josh, if you could hit the raise hand button now,

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josh greenberger

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josh greenberger you have to raise your hand sir okay

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josh greenberger yes josh greenberger mr greenberg's been allowed to speak

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Thank you. Good evening, sir. Please identify yourself with a record name and a name, first and last name.

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Josh, we don't hear you.

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in the interest of time uh marith we will uh you being officer court will stipulate that your

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client would adopt your testimony thank you mr chairman thank you any questions from the board

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no no no thank you would anyone else like to testify in this case if so please raise your hand

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I'll answer, Mr. Chair.

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Thank you.

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Planning Commission?

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Mr. Chairman and members of the board, this is Mason Austin representing the Planning

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Commission.

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The lot is designated for multifamily residential in the comprehensive plan and is zoned for

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that use.

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Given the history of the property, the relatively minimal variance requested, and in deference

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to the neighborhood group, staff of the Planning Commission has no opposition to the granting

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of the variance.

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Thank you very much.

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MI 2020-001945

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5600 Ogons Avenue

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My vote is yes

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My vote is yes

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My vote is yes

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My vote is yes

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No revised plan, correct?

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No

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Okay, Meredith, thank you

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Thank you, everyone

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This concludes the 3.30 hearing

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Is there any unfinished business?

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That's it, Chair

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We're all good

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Thank you again, everyone

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Thank you

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