Thank you.
okay chair we have 137 attendees you can proceed as you wish thank you
good morning everyone my name is bill bergman and i will be chairing this morning's eba hearings
with me as our vice chair ismail shaheed president mr chairman our board member thomas
Solomon. Present, Mr. Chairman. Our board member, James Snell. Present, Mr. Chairman. Also here is
Hillary Emerson, our attorney, and our executive director, Tanya Sunkett. Be advised the proceedings
are being recorded. The video will be available by contacting TanyaSunkett at phil.gov. For the
benefit of our court stenographer, we ask attorneys and witnesses to identify themselves before
testifying. If you're participating by phone, you wish to testify, press star 9 to raise your hand
and star 6 to unmute. 200 appear on the statement call, 267-270-5548. Leave your email address and
the property in question. And finally, the question answer box on the screen is not for
comments or testimony. All comments should be directed to our executive director, Tanya Sumpit.
Let's look at our schedule this morning. Number seven, MI 2023-007-281-8014 Caster Avenue. That case has been continued.
And number three, MI 2022-007-453-301-23 Spring Garden Street.
Is there anyone in the audience for that case?
This is the third listing must be heard.
Good morning, Chair.
This is Yvette Benton.
I'll be your co-host for today.
I see no hands at this time.
Thank you.
So number three, MI 2022-007-453-301 to 23 Spring Garden Street.
I vote to dismiss.
Thomas Holloman, my vote is to dismiss.
James Snell, my vote is to dismiss.
Dismissed, my vote is to dismiss.
this. Number 10, MI 2023-006-162-1954 Patterson Avenue. This is a resumptive hearing, but
We'll take a request for continuance first.
The attorneys involved, Meredith Trego, Matthew McClure, and also Samuel Stretton,
who are representative of Samuel Stretton from his office.
Okay, Chair, the names you just called, I see none of those people with their hand up.
There's Meredith.
She's been promoted.
Matthew McClure, he's been promoted.
Morning, Mr. McClure.
The other hands that are raised, we will have to ask if any of them are here representing on behalf of Mr. Stratton.
Right. Okay.
Morning, Mr. McClure. Could you state your name, please, and spell for the court sonographer?
Sure. My name is Matthew McClure.
M-A-T-T-H-E-W-M-C-C-L-U-R-E.
I'm with the law firm of Ballard, B-A-L-L-A-R-D, SPAR, S-P-A-H-R-L-L-P, 1735 Market Street, Philadelphia.
And I'm here with my colleague, Meredith Trego, T-R-E-G-O.
We represent the Fama Park Conservancy, the applicant.
Do you swear, do you both swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
thank you it's mr stratton in the audience or anyone from his office
mr stratton or anyone from his office if you're in the audience please raise your hand
Chair, we had David, looks like, snap it.
chair we had david looks like
He's being promoted to panelists.
Good morning, Chair.
Hi, good morning.
i was having trouble hearing uh you said in opposition no no do you do you work for mr
stretton oh no i'm sorry okay thank you you'll have your chance later sir is there anyone from
mr stretton's office i see no hands chair thank you um excuse me uh there there's a note in the
chat that says someone named rich guerrilla is here for sam stratton um i'm not clear in what
capacity is mr guerrilla present thank you mr guerrilla you've been unmuted and allowed to speak
uh yes hello hi mr grill could you state your name is spelled please for the court
my name is rich guerrilla g-a-r-e-l-l-a right do you swear or affirm to tell the truth the
whole truth and nothing but the truth? Yes, I do. Are you associated with Mr. Stratton or are you
an attorney that works for him? I'm not an attorney that works for him. I am a client of his in this
matter. Okay. And I've discussed with him his position and would like to present it along with
our, with hopefully some objections to why this, there should be a continuance.
um hillary um i mean if he wants i mean well mr grill i think you were
disqualified as a party in the previous hearing am i correct i was summarily disqualified even
though i am an aggrieved party uh under under as the court has ruled so i would have there's
There's nothing about distance that that I can find in the law.
And so I don't see, you know, the disqualification itself is is one of the objections.
So it seems like I should be able to address that.
So the aggrieved party has to do, I believe, more with an appeal to the court of common pleas and not who can testify at a ZBA hearing.
That has not been that has not been defined.
So it's really the closest thing.
it's clearly not any taxpayer that's true yeah i understand mr grella so
mr chair um i do hear other representatives from other entities that were that were
represented by mr stratton presence um if i mean if i mean if they want to proceed
pros say they can but um in terms of the continuance request um but i yeah so our
our continuance was request came from mr stretton's office right on behalf of the front of
park civic friends of fdr park and then there were there were unnamed individuals so i don't know all
of whom he's representing and and and the fact of the matter is that we had told mr stretton
that if he could not make it that we want an attorney from his office or another attorney
to represent him? Yes, because, yes. All right, Mr. McClure, what is your position on this?
Mr. Chairman, we're opposed to the continuance. Obviously, this hearing was originally
started on February 21st. It was continued at the request of the civic associations back in January.
The original refusal, I mean, referral was back in October. We've done the case already. This is
just public comment. There are a lot of people here ready to testify and
give public comment. Mr. Garella, although he may not have standing to appeal or
participate as a party, sure as hell as an individual can testify
when it goes to public comment. So he's here. I see no
reason why we cannot go forward in this matter.
We're going to go forward with this matter today. The hearing
will go on. This case was filed five months ago.
we heard about an attorney last week
so we are going to hear this case
just for the point of information
the case will happen sometime around
lunchtime we should get to that point
this will be the
last one on the list and we'll
hold that so that we can go a couple hours
or an hour or two strictly on taking
public testimony okay
so we will hear this case today
it will be heard about lunchtime
does that sound right Hillary
yes Mr. Chairman
Okay. Thank you. Thank you all.
Thank you all.
Thank you all.
So we're going to go now to our regular list.
Silver.
Number two, MI 2023, 004-396-1807 East Boston Street.
Mark Feynman is the attorney.
The owner is Tantra's MLL Real Estate Partnership.
Chair Mark Fineman is coming back in as a panelist now.
There's a letter of support from East Kensington Neighbors Association and a letter of non-opposition from Council Member Lozada.
Good morning, Mr. Feynman.
Mr. Chairman, sorry to interrupt. It's Richard DeMarco. Wasn't one of my cases supposed to be continued attorney moving party?
It's Richard DeMarco. I'm sorry to interrupt.
I know, Mr. DeMarco. Hold on. What case was that?
Sorry about that. Yeah. 2940 East Ohio, the appeal against L&I, we have no opposition to the continuous attorney moving party from the city. I sent a letter a few weeks ago.
Mr. DeMarco, it's not it's not on the list today, so I think it was already removed and continued.
Oh, I appreciate it. Sorry about everybody.
Oh, not a problem. Have a good week. Have a good day.
All right. Bye.
Hi, Mr. Feynman. Could you state your name, please, and spell for the court sonographer?
Yes. Good morning. My name is Mark Feynman, F as in Frank, E-I-N as in Nicholas, M-A-N. Mark is with a K.
Do you swear or firm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Yes, I do.
Our vice chair has just a few questions for you, sir.
Good morning, counsel. Do you agree to weigh the reading of the refusal or stipulate towards accuracy?
Yes, I do.
have you emailed in all the required documents and exhibits that is needed to proceed with this case
five days in advance of this hearing yes i did thank you council please proceed and show your
screen yes bear with me one moment
are you able to see the screen we can sir okay excellent so uh i have my exhibit list here
number one is the application for the zoning and in this instance it was an application
for the first floor artist studio and artisan industry with retail sales, consumer goods,
with takeout window, dispensary window, second floor to be a single family dwelling.
The refusal, and this was clarified yesterday, my apology, this refusal that we have here is
exhibit two, which is a May 23rd exhibit. I learned late yesterday that there's actually
another refusal and that refusal is dated june the 30th i believe on that but i was not able to
get that loaded up in time for this hearing this morning but i believe that that is all part of
the packet there that refusal mirrors this except there is one additional item in there i can work
to get that over to the panel.
Exhibit three is the deed.
At one point in time,
this property was owned by co-owners
and this deed reflects a change.
Scroll down the next page there
reflecting that the Tantaros transferred
and now the ownership is with the applicant
who's before you today.
where i'm scrolling down here next i'll direct your attention
the diagram here is a rough diagram but i'll show you a sketch of it
our tax clearance these are photos of the posting of the of the notices my apologies for the change
in the angle this is the front of the property here with with the roll down door at this point
it used to be a garage in there and that was converted over this is how the interior looks
at this point with the you can see towards the front here where the window would be
With the you can see towards the front here where the window would be.
This is the February 28 letter from East Kensington Neighbors Association in support of the project.
And this was their meeting summary.
The application for the appeal.
And this is the sketch I was describing earlier to you, reflecting the nature.
The idea here is a working studio of glassblowing with the front area being a cafe selling or offering coffee to go.
The customers would come in, buy their coffee, or they would use the dispensary window to purchase the coffee
and to then stay on the premises that they chose to see the artwork
and also taking studio classes for the glassblowing.
The application is to use this area.
I want to go back to the letter from East Kensington, which describes quite well the circumstances that brings us before the board today.
There was a remapping in the East Kensington neighborhood area.
And as a result of that remapping, it restricted to single family zoning.
That's now been changed to allow for multi-use, which is what this property would be.
and that's why we need to come before the board we're asking for the approval to allow
the mixed use which would include the residential on the second floor and the commercial on the
first floor i believe present with with us today on online would would be rey lorenzo the owner
And I don't know if you can bring her on.
Could you please raise your hand?
Marie Lorenzo has been unmuted and allowed to speak, Chair.
Okay. Good morning. Could you please state your name and spell for the court stenographer?
Marie Lorenzo, M-A-R-I-E-L-O-R-E-N-Z-O.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth?
Um, please proceed counsel. Thank you very much. Ms. Lorenzo, you heard, uh, my presentation
initially to the board. Yes. And if you were to call it be testified, do you incorporate what
my testimony is as what your testimony would be? Yes. Would you like to add to it to describe and
explain to the board what it is that, that you have in mind to do? And, um, when you're done,
I'll be asking Mr. Purcell to testify, and I know he's also there, so if you could.
Yeah, I don't think I need to add anything.
If you want to call Nathan up, he is the tenant, and he's the one that's doing all this.
He's working hard, so you can call him up.
And you've been working closely with him?
But you would incorporate my testimony, though?
Yes, ma'am.
Thank you.
I would ask to call Nathan Purcell, P-U-R-C-E-L-L.
The 28th?
Mr. Purcell has been unmuted and allowed to speak.
Good morning.
Could you say your name, please, and spell for the court stenographer?
Yes, it's Nathan Purcell.
N-A-T-H-A-N-P-U-R-C-E-L-L.
Right.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Correct. Yes. Please proceed, counsel. Thank you, Chair. Mr. Purcell, you heard my testimony and you heard Ms. Lorenzo. Is that correct?
Correct. And if we do, do you incorporate our testimony as part of your testimony?
I do. Now, can you see on the screen the image that I'm showing?
Correct. Yes.
Can you explain what this image is and also if you could give the board an insight into what it is that you're planning to do there and why you're before the board?
Yes, I originally moved into this space in 2021 and I've been working there as an artist with my little studio in the back and a gallery up front.
and i've been waiting to uh since when i moved in in 2021 uh all the all the things that are
around me were pretty much under construction and were basically warehouses that were getting
torn down or or new buildings that like that have been getting built so i've been patiently
waiting to basically transform the actual space i'm going to push push the gallery
basically transform the the actual space i'm going to push push the gallery back and then put
the cafe uh in my front and i'm actually going to move out the the uh the little studio uh like
eventually uh but it's mainly going to be a gallery with a walk-up window now day-to-day
business is mainly going to be done through the actual window for uh safety purposes like
in like our like area it's it's still we're on a really nice block but around around around the
like corner there's there's still a lot of homeless encampments and stuff like that so
i want to i've designed it like this to keep the person working inside safe and then what we'll do
is we're going to be marketing the actual gallery exhibits through the, like, cafe.
And what the plan is, is we'll let people in basically once a month for, like, opening night.
And people will, like, be able to come through, check out the actual space, and have coffee as well.
And that's the basic plan.
And mainly on a day-to-day business, it's going to be a walk-up cafe with, like, takeout, basically.
If you could describe to the board, what type of gallery will this be?
Mainly illustration and sculpture.
Now, the street that you're on and the surrounding block, that's all undergoing major renovation and restoration.
Is that correct?
The block that I'm on is now finally finished.
Like it's like on the actual Boston between – well, it's between Kensington and whatever the first block is heading east.
So my block, all three of the huge buildings are like actually done.
And those are all new, correct?
Yeah, those are all brand new.
And so there's absolutely no commercial space on this block.
There's no food.
There's nothing else here.
The following block going down Boston Street, they have three other high rises going up that are going to be probably completed.
I think two of them are done.
And the last one looks like it'll probably be done by maybe springtime or something.
I'm not running the project, so I'm not really sure.
Part of your objective is to have the retail establishment to be able to service the resident that will be moving into all those units.
Correct.
I have no further questions.
All right.
Questions from the board?
No, Chair.
No, Chair.
Questions or comments from our attorney, Hillary Emerson?
um so a couple of things one uh mr fineman just wanted to verify that the
the later refusal the one in june is that mentions the artist studios and artisan industrial is the
one um that is before the board today that is correct yes thank you okay um that is the june
30 2023 refusal yes okay um and on the refusal it lists both um actually maybe it just has a
no i think the second one fixed it um it's just takeout restaurant the prior one had both
prepared food shop and takeout restaurant so this one fixed it okay that correct that adjusted that
and changed that yes okay okay great okay so then i think we're good we're good there um
Mr. Chair, if you grant in this case, we would need to include a proviso indicating that it's per a refusal dated 6-30-23.
Thank you.
Questions or comments from the virtual audience?
I see no hands at this time, Chair.
Planning Commission.
ron bednar city planning first name ron r-o-n last name bednar b-e-d-n-a-r
you swear a firm to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth
i do please proceed sir in 2016 the zoning at this location was changed from commercial mixed
use to residential multifamily in accordance with the recommendations in the comprehensive plan
This property has a documented history as a plumbing shop.
The appellant has shown that the proposed artist studio and artisan industrial sales of consumers
The proposed artist studio and artisan industrial sales of consumer goods and prepared food shop and a takeout restaurant will not injure the use of the adjacent properties.
Therefore, the City Planning Commission recommends the Zoning Board grant the four proposed use variances.
Thank you.
ML 2023 004 396 1807 East Boston I vote yes with proviso per refusal dated 6-30-23
Thomas Holloman my vote is yes with proviso James Snell my vote is yes with proviso
Ishmael Shahid my vote is yes with proviso thank you thank you counsel you have your votes
Thank you very much. Have a nice day, everyone.
Okay. Number five, MI 2023-003-956-1818. Franklin Mills Circle, Stephanie Boggs Magna, is the attorney. Letter of support from the Millbrook Civic Association.
good morning counsel could you state your name please and spell for the court sonographer
morning um stephanie magania lessons m-a-g-a-g-n-a right do you swear or firm to tell the truth the
whole truth nothing but the truth yes i do could you identify your client in relationship to the
property. My client is the owner of the property, Echo Ship PA. Okay, and our Vice Chair has just
a few questions for you. Good morning, Council. Do you read the reading of the reviews or stipulate
towards accuracy? Yes, I do. Have you emailed in all the required documents and exhibits that is
needed to proceed with this case five days in advance of this hearing? Yes, I have. Thank you,
COUNCIL. PLEASE PROCEED AND SHARE YOUR SCREEN. THANK YOU. SO AS WAS MENTIONED THIS PROJECT
IS FOR 1818 FRANKLIN MILLS CIRCLE. THIS IS AN EXISTING PARKING LOT AREA TO THE NORTH END OF THE
FRANKLIN MILLS COMPLEX. ABOUT 130,000 SQUARE FEET OF EXISTING IMPROVED PARKING LOT AREA HERE.
THIS IS A BETTER AREAL IMAGE OF THE SITE. WE ARE LOCATED DIRECTLY NEXT TO THE SAMS CLUB
that's here. There are in LA Fitness across the street, several auto uses, including a car wash
and a tire shop as well, and directly across Franklin Mill Circle from a large parking lot
area that's occupied by the Bethel Church as well. This site is currently being rented and used for
trailer parking. And more recently, we had another big use that we can show as well for truck trailer
driving school across the street here within the parking lot. So we have several auto uses
located here at the site. Here are some other pictures of this site along Franklin Mills. You
can see the existing trailers that are parked here. But the applicant and the owner of this
project are proposing to convert this property for use as personal vehicle sales. They are very
closely affiliated with A&W Auto Sales that has several car lots in New Jersey. They have their
successful business there and many years of experience and they are looking to open up a
new location at this shop. Here's a better picture of the subject property again and our relationship
to the church parking lot across the street and you can see here that the trailers that are
part of the ongoing operations as a trailer driving school from what we can tell.
Given the audio-oriented uses of this site, the current use of the property, would you feel that
the proposed car lot would be an improvement to this location, efficient within the location
within Franklin Mills at the northern end of the lot, consistent with the other auto uses in the
area. The personal vehicle sales and rentals, as it's defined in the zoning code, does require a
variance in the CA1 zoning district in which this property is located, so we are seeking relief for
that use in connection with the conversion. Again, this would just be for the area, this parking lot
area. Here, there are no physical improvements planned in connection with this use at that time
that would be sought separately later. We're simply seeking approval for the use. And given
the associated uses, that use will bring jobs to the neighborhood as well as utilize the local
businesses. So we do feel it is the least modification necessary to convert this to a
more viable and longstanding use here at this location.
So we did present this application
to the Millbrook Civic Association on January 30th.
We're happy to include their letter of support
within the package as well.
And we look forward to keeping communications open
keeping communications open with them as we begin operations on the site. Also, we did talk to
with them as we begin operations on the site.
Also note,
Councilman O'Neill's office. I'm aware that they are going to request that should the ZVA be
inclined to grant relief in this matter, that be limited to a temporary three-year approval. And we
have no objection to that at this time. So with that, Frank Mazzola is here on the applicant's
behalf on behalf of the owner. He has experience in the business as well. I'll ask him to identify
and raise his hand for the record.
Hi, sir.
Frank Mazzola has been unmuted and allowed to speak, Chair.
Good morning, sir.
Could you please state your name and spell for the court stenographer?
Yes, it is Frank Mazzola, F-R-A-N-K, last name M-A-Z-Z-O-L-A.
Right.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Please proceed, counsel.
Thanks, Frank.
Did you hear the statements I made to the board this morning?
I did, Stephanie.
Are they true and accurate to the best of your knowledge?
They are.
Would you adopt them as your own?
I would.
Thank you.
Very briefly, Frank, if you wouldn't mind, could you explain your role with AW and ECHOShip for the board, please?
Yeah, I'm involved with the dealership. A&W has been in business in New Jersey for 40 plus years, operating out of the same location now since 1997.
And we believe the location there at the Franklin Mills Mall is a very good location for this type of business.
And we think that not only will it be an enhancement and improvement to what is currently being utilized there, but we'll also have a positive impact on the local businesses and the community.
We'll be utilizing a lot of the local businesses to support our business and as well as is hiring from the local community to support our business.
So we presented to the to the community board. We actually had an opportunity to present a few times and they seem very receptive and welcoming this, you know, this operation and the business that we would be bringing there.
Thank you, Frank. If there are any questions, we're happy to take those now.
Questions from the board?
No, Mr. Chairman.
no chair
questions or comments from our attorney Hillary Emerson
not at this time Mr. Chair
questions or comments from the virtual audience
Chair we have Mary Ann Benner
they have been unmuted and allowed to speak
good morning could you please state your name
and spell for the court stenographer
Good morning, Mary Ann Benner, M-A-R-Y, capital A-N-N-E, Benner, B-E-N-N-E-R. I'm one of the board members for the Millbrook Pacific Association.
All right. Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Please proceed.
Just wanted to say we welcome them as our neighbor, but I do understand also that, again, it's been a three-year variance.
just want to make sure that that's in the record i don't believe it's listed on the letter
all right thank you thank you very much we appreciate that is there anyone else in the
virtual audience chair we have alice udovich they have been unmuted and allowed to speak
good morning good morning good morning chairman members of the board state your name and spell
for the court sonography sure alice udovich a-l-i-c-e last name is u-d-o-v-i-c-h
on behalf of councilman brian o'neill you swear a firm to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing
about the truth i do please proceed thank you chairman um i just wanted to uh reiterate that
the councilman would if this uh board does in fact grant this variance that they do uh
do a temporary three-year variance um i believe the client um is not opposed to that as well
Thank you very much for calling, Alice.
We appreciate it.
Is there anyone else in the virtual audience?
I see the heads this time.
Planning Commission.
Yes, this is around Bednar City Planning.
Properties indicated for audio-oriented commercial mixed use on the city plan.
Given the documented use history and the physical circumstances of the site, we have no objection to the granting of variance.
Thank you.
So MI 2023-003-956, 1818 Franklin Mills Circle, I vote yes with proviso.
18-18 Franklin Mills Circle. I vote yes with proviso. Temporary variance expires 3-19-27.
Thomas Holloman. My vote is yes with proviso. James Snell. My vote is yes with proviso.
Ishmael Shahid. My vote is yes with proviso. Thank you, counsel. Thank you very much.
number eight mi2023006051 2547 north marston street henry langsom is the attorney we do not
have an rco letters at this point applicant has given us a position of 20 neighbors
in the 2,500 block of North Marston.
Mr. Langston.
Mr. Langston is coming back in as a panelist now, Chair.
Good morning, Mr. Langston.
Good morning, Mr. Langston.
good morning good morning sorry all right could you state your name please and spell for the
court stenographer henry langson h-e-n-r-y-l-a-n-g-s-a-n do you swear or firm to tell the
truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth i do could you identify your client in the
relationship to this property? Yes, the client is Circle of Life Personal Home Care LLC
by whose owner is Nidera Warren, and she should be present. Our vice chair has just a few questions
for you, sir. Good morning, counsel. Do you agree to weigh the reading of the refusal or stipulate
to its accuracy? I do. Have you emailed in all the required documents and exhibits that is needed to
proceed with this case five days in advance of this hearing? I did. Thank you. Please proceed.
I see you have already shared your screen. Thank you. Basically, I'm trying to get the
exhibit submission.
Um, panel members, um, uh, we have a zoning application, a referral, an appeal, um, site
control, uh, is maintained through a lease with the owner of the property who happens
to be Ms. Waring's sister. She may also be on at the meeting. There is a provision, if you go down
mid-screen, for the use of the premises in the lease as a personal home care business.
I'm highlighting it right now. That's the area in the lease.
A personal home care business is basically using a residential home to provide a living facility in a small, more intimate setting than, let's say, a nursing home without the medical coverage of a nursing home for basically older adults.
There are veterans, persons with Alzheimer's, other disabilities, and they live together, and it can be overnight stay or day stay there.
The patients often come from local hospitals, state agencies that are seeking care for older adults.
This group of population does not add or increase traffic or issues in the neighborhood.
They enhance it.
The operator, Ms. Waring, is trained in personal home care use.
She worked at Elwin Institute doing personal home care for about nine and a half years.
She currently works with families and children.
She currently works with families and children at CHOP in a technical capacity, but it's still in the care business.
And she has credentials, including over 100 hours of training in personal home care from the Pennsylvania State University and training in dementia care.
She has in the past operated in personal home care contacts to provide foods, medication, make sure the patients have medical treatment and get to their meetings, take their medication.
She does light housekeeping, cooking, and generalized care and assistance and loves doing it, has a calling in that area.
The neighborhood has a considerable amount of non-populated homes.
That is, some are lots, some are abandoned homes, and some are vacant homes.
she estimates estimated about 30 percent fall fell into that category in the immediate neighborhood
she went around to the neighbors to present the plan and got universal acceptance with the personal
home care use of the premises from the neighbors they signed the petition the petitions part of
this package. This is a layout of the home. There were no revised plans. There's photos
of the posting. Here are interior photos. This has been newly rehabbed.
There are RCO notices. This is her brochure, which explains the home in even more detail
than I have given. This is some credentials. She's training in dementia, personal home care
administration orientation, and she is a personal home care administrator from Penn State.
um here are her petitions that are signed by the neighbors or it's marked lot or vacant
um that is roughly the uh uh presentation that i wanted to share with mr langson mr langson
could you tell me what happened when they wanted to see the uh rco yes uh when they went to the
There was no opposition. One of the members attendees wanted to cancel the meeting because there was no attorney representation of Nadira Waring and the Circle of Light LLC.
see. I was not involved at that time. But the leader from the local RCO said to continue. There
was no opposition at any time. Okay. Thank you. Could you bring your client along, please, and
adopt your testimony? Yes. Can you come in, Ms. Waring? Raise your hand. Yeah. Ms. Waring has been
allowed to speak, please. Good morning. Good morning. Could you please state your name and
spell for the court stenographer?
Ms. Warren?
She's unmuted here.
Ms. Warren, could you state your name?
Okay. Mr. Langston, you're an officer of the court. We will accept your testament.
Thank you, sir.
Questions from the board?
No, Mr. Chairman.
No, Chair.
Questions or comments from our attorney, Hillary Emerson?
Not at this time, Mr. Chair.
Questions or comments from the virtual audience?
Chair, we have Odessa Tate.
Hello, can you hear me?
Hi, good morning.
Good morning.
Could you please state your name and spell for the court stenographer?
Good morning.
It's Odessa Tate, O-D-E-S-S-A-T-A-T-E.
O-D-E-S-S-A-T-A-T-E.
Right. Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth?
Are you a neighbor?
I am one of the RCUs.
Okay, please proceed.
So I can't quite contend with the lawyer's statement about there not being any opposition.
We did have the public hearing meeting in early December where there were no community members, but it was the RCOs.
A couple of the RCOs had objections, but we agreed and coming back to the table and having another discussion with Ms. Warren because we had additional questions to ask her in regards to the facility and bringing the facility into the community.
So, I had or the other RCOs, we had no additional information other than the location and that she wanted it to be a personal home care facility.
So, I guess it's a red flag, you know, not having an RCO letter or not having any information regarding the meeting and what happened because we were supposed to come back to the table.
and um today i wanted to explore continuance um in regards to this hearing and spoke to
colin who reached out to miss emerson in regards to a continuance okay but um we didn't have the
ability to have a proper evaluation you know for the personal care home and that is all right to
do so so i just wanted to make that comment and thank you thank you for uh calling in we do
appreciate your input um miss kate i just want to verify you're from um all in the family cdc
which is the coordinating rco in this case yes correct thank you thank you
um questions or comments from uh planning commission so ron bednar city planning the
property is indicated for residential use on the city plan we believe that proposed personal care
use will have no detrimental impact beyond what might be expected to have given its uh proposed
location therefore we recommend that the board grant this uh special exception mr langson uh
And we're going to hold this until there's an opportunity that you can talk with the RCO.
The case is closed other than hearing from the RCO and also giving you a chance to respond to what the RCO says.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Mr. Chair, would you like to have a resumption hearing scheduled in this matter
after a follow-up with the RCO occurs?
So I was thinking it's closed
other than what the RCO would have to say
and Mr. Langston's response to it.
Okay, so we're just taking written responses.
Okay, thank you.
Okay, good, great.
Number eight, number four.
We're going to hear number four and number six together.
MI 2024 000 635 101 Bethlehem Pike
and MI 2024 000 637 105 Bethlehem Pike
Henry Clinton is the attorney
also could Leonard Reuter please come on to
from the Planning Commission
uh good morning may it please the board leonard f reuter uh for the city of philadelphia
hi do you swear for him to tell the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth i do
thank you mr clinton morning mr chairman henry clinton h-e-n-r-y clinton c-l-i-n-t-o-n
and with me uh to my right your left is richard snowden he's the client who's having some
technical difficulties so he came into the office to participate in the zoom call thank you um do
you swear for him to tell the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth i do okay so what
we're going to do with this henry as i understand uh you'll go first um for your applicant and then
leonard will follow up and then i think leonard may call planning commission but please proceed
but if i could just just so it's clear this uh and boards council ms emerson uh mr clinton and i
have had a few discussions about this this is a remand to this board basically to get further
And remand to this board, basically, to get further information on, I guess, the availability of the MIHB.
information on
But so just just so that's in the record what we're doing.
All right. Thank you.
Please proceed, Henry.
So, Mr. Bergman, so there's two cases today, 101 Bethlehem Plague and 105.
The legal issues are the same with regard to both cases.
So I thought then for brevity purposes, I would do 101 and adopt everything for 105 rather than regurgitate information, if that's okay, Mr. Reuter and with the chairman.
Please.
So I'm just going to do a brief background and we'll get right into the heart of the issue.
So, and I don't know that it's necessary at this point, Mr. Chairman, to show my screen and go through the project again.
No, no, no, no, just follow up for the legal issues.
So we were before the board in June of 2023.
We had a number of projects where my client, Mr. Snowden, was basically downsizing commercial properties in Cessna Hill because of the inability to rent larger spaces and converting the back end of the commercial spaces into one bedroom apartments.
So there were two projects, 101 Bethlehem Pike and 105, where we did not get board approval.
Even though we had tremendous support, which I'll get to later, it didn't happen, and that's why we're back here in front of you to explain why we think it should have happened, not because the board made a mistake, but only because I think there was additional information the board didn't have, which hopefully we'll give you today, and that may be a deciding factor on where we go from here.
So we, after the board voted against the project, we filed an appeal.
The court, as Mr. Reuter just said, remanded it back to the court to basically, so that
we could contest the planning commission's issue with regard to the feasibility of the
client participating in the mixed income housing bonus.
And that's really what the case is all about today.
So we were trying to solve the vacancy issue on these two commercial properties, and there's apartments above, because, as I said at the outset, my client learned as a result of the pandemic, and this is a nationwide trend, that the first floor on commercial spaces, you don't need the back office that you used to have before.
And as a consequence, larger first floor commercial spaces on the avenue, Germantown Avenue, as well as Bethlehem Pike, remain vacant.
The two properties we're talking to you about today have been vacant for at least five years.
Even though my client is letting a local gallery use it rent-free just to have somebody in the space,
but it's not an income-driving mechanism that he's involved with right now.
So both projects, we were adding one unit, one apartment unit, and keeping the commercial space.
And that one apartment unit would be on the first floor.
individuals in the neighborhood who may be selling their home and want to stay in
Chestnut Hill would then be able to rent a one-bedroom apartment. So the refusals are
similar in that sense. And they're both zoned CMX1, but because they're adjacent to RS-A3,
the multifamily use was not permitted per the refusals. So the key thing about these properties
is that they are deemed significant on the National Register.
The other significant component, I think,
is at the time of our hearing in June of 23,
we had every significant group in Cessna Hill,
including neighbors as well as the councilwoman,
Cindy Bass, in support of what we were trying to do
because, again, no one likes vacant commercial space.
And our proposal wasn't going to change the facade
or the footprint or anything.
We're basically just going to add one apartment behind the commercial space.
So we had the Chestnut Hill Conservancy, Chestnut Hill Business Association, Chestnut Hill Business Improvement District, Chestnut Hill Parking Foundation, the Chestnut Hill Civic Association.
And as I said, Councilwoman Bass was also in support of the project.
So when it came time for the Planning Commission to give its comments, the Planning Commission,
and I'm going to read from the commentary, and Mr. Reuter, if I misquote anything, I'm
sure you'll stand to correct me.
So there was a lot of redundancy in terms of both 101 and 105.
The first sentence was, the comprehensive plan recommends no change in the commercial
mixed-use zoning of this property, which is CMX1.
So for 101, Planning Commission said this is a 5,560 square foot property, which could yield up to 13 dwelling units if the applicant chose to participate in the mixed income housing bonus.
That was for 101.
That was for 101.
105, Planning Commission said this is a 6,750-square-foot lot,
which could yield up to 17 dwelling units
if the applicant chose to participate in the next housing income bonus program.
So for 101, Planning Commission said you could do 13 dwelling units.
105, you could do 17 dwelling units.
Frankly, most developers would jump for joy with that.
My client is not that developer. He has developed historic properties in Chestnut Hill for over 40 years. He doesn't want to expand the footprint of the building. And frankly, if we attempted to expand the footprint of the building, even if the Planning Commission says it was by right, we would have a tremendous outpouring of opposition from everybody in the neighborhood, the Conservancy, the Chestnut Hill Business District, the Civic Association.
And I think they would probably move to make these buildings historically registered in Philadelphia so we wouldn't be able to do anything.
So we really were caught in a little bit of a crossfire here where we don't want to expand the buildings because it's not our game plan.
That's not the philosophy of the company.
And at the same time, we couldn't make a contribution, which we would love to do, for the trust fund because we're not permitted to.
So we were really in a situation where I didn't get a chance to really explain that to the board the first time around.
So Richard Snowden is here, and I just wanted to have him say a few things.
I'm not here to belabor the point, but that's really where we are.
If there was a mechanism for us to make a contribution, and if Mr. Reuter has any city fund or something where we could, we would certainly do that.
we're not looking to buy our way into approval, but I'm just trying to explain to the board
that we are willing participants in the program, but the program doesn't have a relief valve
to allow for an economic contribution to make this work. So we're still before the board with
our request to downsize the commercial space and put a one-bedroom apartment in the rear
of both of these buildings. So, Mr. Chairman, if you could swear in Mr. Snowden, I'm not going to
to be long. I'll ask him a few brief questions, and we'll move on. Snowden, please state your
name and spell for the court stenographer. Richard Wood Snowden. Spell, please, for the
court stenographer. Richard, R-I-C-H-A-R-D, last name Snowden, S-N-O-W, D as in David, E-N.
Do you swear for him to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
I do. Please proceed, Mr. Clinton. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. So, Mr. Snowden,
you're the principal of Bowman Properties Limited, correct? That's correct. And what's
the company's philosophy? We have restored and adaptively reused 100 buildings in the Germantown
Avenue, Chesson Hill Business District, beginning in 1981. Okay. And the two subject properties,
101 Bethlehem Pike and 105 Bethlehem Pike, 101, your company has owned since 2016, correct?
That's correct. And 105, your company has owned since 1999. Correct. And why has it been difficult
to rent the two commercial spaces at these properties? It's a low traffic area and the
spaces were too large. So we wanted to downsize them, put an apartment in the rear area and be
able to have a small gallery or something like that to maintain the commercial ambience of the
mixed-use district, but still make productive use of the square footage on the building.
And both of these properties, they're side-by-side, correct?
Yes, they are.
And they've been vacant for at least five years.
Correct.
And why can't you alter the building to put in, you know, the Planning Commission says
up to 13 or up to 17 units, and why don't you even want to expand the building to put
in one unit?
The only way to do that would be to substantially alter or demolish these two historic structures.
They are both completely serviceable, well-maintained stone Victorian buildings that are listed as significant on the National Register of Historic Places for Chestnut Hill.
And that is not what my company does.
Mr. Clinton was correct. If there was even a whiff of something like that, the Chesney Hill Conservancy would move to have these buildings put on the city register, and the whole thing would be moot. We wouldn't be able to do it anyway.
So we're stuck with the footprint we have, and we're trying to make the best of the situation that exists, which is to put a nice apartment in each of these buildings.
They're very expensive to adaptively reuse.
But we believe in the neighborhood and we're long term investors there.
And right now, you have a gallery.
And right now, do you have a gallery in one of the buildings?
Yes, it's in 105, and they are not paying any rent.
It's something we do.
We put artists into empty buildings so that they don't appear quite so to the Lord.
Is there anything else you want to say, Mr. Snowden?
No, I think that says it all.
And if you had the opportunity to testify, would you adopt my testimony as your own, and it's true and correct?
Yes, sir, I would. And Mr. Chairman, just a brief conclusion. So what we were trying to do is adhere to the next.
Excuse me, Mr. Clinton. This is Hillary. I just wanted to see if Mr. Reuter had any questions for your witness. Thank you.
No, I don't have any questions. Thank you.
Thank you, Ms. Emerson. So, Mr. Chairman, basically, I understand that the Planning
Commission looks at the comprehensive plan as they did with these two proposals. And if it
doesn't comport with the comprehensive plan, they have to make their determination. And I
understand Mr. Bednar will do the same thing today as Mr. Hegarty did before. And I respect that,
I really do. And so does Mr. Snowden. But I don't think it's good policy that if you do
that at the expense of continued vacancies when every major player in the game wants those stores
occupied, or you do it at the expense of alienating the community and the neighbors, i.e. that we
expand the building, which really wouldn't work. And if we expand the footprint, as I said, I think
there would be an outcry in the neighborhood and at the expense of our inability to make a
contribution. So maybe there needs to be a legislative change where we could, in a situation
like this, where you have historic properties, where you could make a contribution. But right
now, that relief is not there. So with that, I would close. And Mr. Werner, the floor is yours.
Sure. Thank you. I did want to say just for the record that Mr. Bednar is here just in the normal
routine position of being here as representative for city planning to give the recommendation
since this was a remand which on the face of the remand order itself it was for the applicant
to put something on the record to rebut planning commission's prior position regarding the
variance request i don't think it's necessary for mr bednar to repeat the planning commission's
recommendation but we can just incorporate it from the original case i did want to just if that
if the chair wants to hear from mr bednar we can we can incorporate it for the original case
that's great then so again just so we and just so it's clear in the record um and again mr clinton
will correct me if i'm wrong but uh i just wanted to clarify a couple things it's it's not that
we're not he's not his client is not allowed to put to get to do a payment in lieu it's because
he only wants to put one unit per building the payment in lieu wouldn't be an option because to
offer mixed income housing to get a bonus the mixed income housing bonus now you have to at
least have one unit and but it wouldn't we understand it doesn't make real economic sense
to if you're only going to put in a one additional unit that it wouldn't make economic sense uh in
In terms of, you know, well, in order to take advantage of the bonus or do a payment in lieu, you actually have to put in more units.
So we get that. We understand what the what the what the problem is.
But I just wanted to clarify that the properties are on the National Register.
But as Mr. Clinton pointed out, they're not on the local register.
The National Register, you know, makes the property amenable to certain tax credits and things like that that you can get from the federal government off your federal taxes.
But it doesn't have any local impact in terms of, you know, getting permits, building permits or something like that.
So it may be that at some point somebody would nominate these for the local register, but that hasn't happened yet.
So it's really just the city's position here.
And again, because it's a little bit unclear from the order what it is that the court was asking to happen here, how much of the records open, but to the extent that the board can understand the position of the city, it was the city planning commission's position before.
And it remains that because the mixed income housing bonus is available that and it would be a buy right option and that they're choosing not to take that option, understanding the rationale that Mr. Clinton put forward that at least on its face, the there is no hardship of the property because.
That, at least on its face, there is no hardship for the property because there is a less, this is not the minimum variance that would afford relief.
There is another option they can take.
They've chosen not to take it.
We understand the reasons why they're not taking it.
So on its face, we don't believe that it meets the requirements for granting a variance in this case.
And again, I'm talking for both 101 and 105 Bethlehem.
so that's that's you know again we're just restating the same position we took before i
think the remand was more for mr clinton to have that opportunity to put in the explanation of why
they're not pursuing the mixed income housing bonus but again like i just want to say we're
not preventing him from providing money to the city i mean anybody out there in tv land is more
than welcome to donate whatever you want to to the city but you don't get the benefit uh if you're
only doing one unit per building. So that's all. It's not a prohibition. It's just not available
for that type of project. All right. Thank you. Mr. Clint, do you have any response to that?
No, not really. I think basically cities sound like they're adopting what the Planning Commission
already said. All right. Thank you. So MI 2024, 000635, 101 Bethlehem Pike,
and MI 2024-00637-105 Bethlehem, Pike.
The votes in these matters are being held pending the preparation of supplemental findings of fact
and conclusions of law, which will be incorporated as provisos into the board's decisions.
Thank both of you.
Thank you very much.
Thank you, Chairman.
We'll go to number one.
Henry, I think you're involved in one too, maybe I'm wrong.
So Leonard is available and I'm sorry, MI 2023-005-139-626-30 North Delaware Avenue.
Michael Macchione is the attorney.
This is an appeal against L&I
Morning Mr. Mattione
Could you please state your name
Spelled for the court stenographer
Sure, Michael Mattione
M-A-T-T-I-O-N-I
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth
The whole truth and nothing but the truth
I see the Northern Liberties
Neighbors Association
is in support of the requested
extension.
Council Member Squilla is also
requesting an extension.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth,
tell the truth, nothing but the truth?
Okay, and our Vice Chair has a few
questions for you, sir.
Mr. Chair, this is an appeal against LNI, so they're not the normal required document.
All right. Well, let's proceed. Thank you. Sure. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And we did submit
some exhibits in advance, including a stipulation, and I believe that Mr. Reuter agreed to that
stipulation as it was revised is that correct leonard uh that's correct yes so i don't the
city uh doesn't need to present any witness here because all the facts that are relevant for us
on the legal questions um are just purely legal questions now there's no factual issues in
dispute uh i might have a couple questions for mr matty only or his client regarding um what i
understand is a vested rights argument they're making, but other than that, we agree to all the
relevant facts as it goes to the legal issues. Thank you. And again, Mr. Chairman, I believe
that Council Member Squilla is also present, and I would like to call him as a witness if he is here.
The issue before the board is whether the zoning permit that was the result of a hearing before
the zoning board on August 8th, 2018 is still a valid permit. This project is a 96-unit multifamily
structure with commercial uses at the ground floor. There was strong community support for
the project and variances to allow the project to move forward where granted we had the RCO support
and council member support when the original variances were granted in addition to the support
that we have from them today. The appellant obtained a zoning permit on August 5th, 2020.
appellant never received any notice of the expiration of the permit dated August 5, 2020
from L&I. Thereafter, appellant was forced to amend the plans for the project because of
significant changes in the floodplain rules. Appellant met with his architect and was forced
The appellant met with his architect and was forced to modify the plans and remove the basement from the structure.
to modify the plans and remove the basement from the structure.
This led appellant to file for an administrative review on June 16, 2022.
And this is after the city says that the permit expired.
The administrative review required notice to the council member, the RCO, and anyone who participated at the original zoning hearing.
The administrative review application was accepted as timely filed by L&I.
The administrative review was approved by L&I on July 19, 2022.
A copy of the administrative review permit dated July 19, 2022 is included in the memorandum of law that we presented as part of our exhibits.
After this happened, Appellant then filed for a one-year extension of the permit, believing that the permit ran until August 8, 2023.
The application to extend the permit for one year was denied by L&I because L&I stated that the permit expired on August 8, 2021,
which was three years from the date of the ZBA hearing, but not three years from the date of the
permit. No notice, again, no notice of the permit expiration was ever provided to appellant.
Appellant's administrative review was accepted by L&I, processed, and a new administrative permit
was issued despite the claim by L&I that the permit had expired prior to the administrative
review being filed. In reliance on this administrative permit, appellant spent more
than $300,000 on engineering, architectural, and legal fees, preparing the construction
permit application and related costs. When appellant sought to extend the permit for a year
as permitted in the code, appellant was informed the permit expired on August 8th, 2021 by L&I.
As a consequence of this action, appellant filed this appeal against L&I seeking to have the
permit declared valid and to extend the permit for an additional year. And we have three bases
for our position. First is the code language and ambiguity. When the original permit was issued
on August 5th, 2020, and that was delayed in part due to the pandemic, and stated the permit would
expire three years from the issuance or date of decision by the Zoning Board. Didn't say the
earlier of, it just said or. Once the administrative review was completed and the permit issued,
appellant applied for a one-year extension of the permit that had been granted by L&I on July 19th,
2022, as set forth in Code Section 1430310D. L&I, upon receipt of the application for the
permit, denied the permit extension, again, stating that the permit had expired on August
8th, 2021, even though they granted the administrative review in 2022 after the permit had supposedly
expired. So we believe that L&I's interpretation is incorrect. The permitting conditions and
limitations set forth on the permit are ambiguous at best as the timeframes. And whenever you have
an ambiguity in an ordinance or a permit, the code language is then construed in the most favorable
like to the landowner the code language here is ambiguous because it doesn't specify when
construction is required to commence it gives alternate dates once you have the ambiguity the
interpretation providing the most benefit to the landowner within three years of issuance must be
used lni also relied on a code bulletin for support of its position you know code bulletins
they're great they provide guidance on zoning issues and code interpretations but they can't
established policies or conditions inconsistent with the zoning code. So that's what they tried
to do here. They tried to say, well, the code bulletin says it's three years from the date of
the hearing, but that's not what the ordinance says. And when the ordinance disagrees, the code
bulletin can't be used to try and change the ordinance. In addition, the code bulletin that
they relied upon was issued on December 11th, 2019, which was after the August 2018 ZBA decision
granting the variances so that they can't retroactively impose conditions. So the code
is written. It allows the effective period for the permit to run from either the permit issuance
or the ZBA approval date. For these reasons, we believe that the first basis provides a reason
for sustaining the appeal. The second issue is the administrative review was a new permit.
and also the Eclipse specifically said when you went on Eclipse that we had three years from the
date of the issuance of the permit so if you went online to check to see when this permit would
expire Eclipse said it would expire in 2023 as well so so LNI with respect to the administrative
review they maintain that the administrative review was just a continuation of the existing
permit and not a new permit but this is at odds with the code language case law and prior LNI
conduct. Section 143031 of the code sets forth specific standards and procedures for administrative
review for projects with prior variance approvals. The process requires notice to the RCO, notice to
the council member, anyone else who appeared at the hearing, and then it will lead to review and
if granted a new permit. But if the permit's denied, you can also appeal that permit. So
So it clearly is a new permit when the administrative review was done.
It clearly is a new permit when the administrative review was done.
And the McEnany case cited in our memorandum said that there the Commonwealth Court said administrative review permits were independent approvals in which the applicant could have acquired vested rights.
And finally, we believe that there is a vested right here in this permit, the permit, the administrative review permit that was granted.
the McEnany court explained there were five things you have to show to get a vested right
one is due diligence and attempting to comply with the law two is good faith throughout the
proceedings three is the expenditure of substantial unrecoverable funds four is expiration without
appeal of the period during which an appeal could have been taken from the issuance of the permit
and five is the insufficiency of evidence to prove that individual property rights or the public
health, safety, or welfare would be adversely affected by the use of the permit. We believe
we meet all five of these requirements. Due diligence first, the appellant filed for the
administrative review in a timely manner. Nobody said it wasn't timely. They met all the code
requirements for notice and submission of required materials. They sent required notices. They acted
in good faith in dealing with L&I. And regarding the original permit, reasonably interpreted that
the acceptance, excuse me, for filing of the administrative review as well as the Eclipse
posting by L&I as verifying the expiration date of August 5th, 2023 as confirmation that they had
a valid permit. Good faith. The appellant acted in good faith in dealing with L&I. They submitted
the review application. They complied with all requirements of the application. They sent all
notices and just did everything you're supposed to do. The expenditure of unrecoverable funds
in reliance on the administrative review permit that they got in 2022, they went out and spent
more than $300,000 in engineering, architectural, and legal fees in preparing plans and taking other
actions necessary to obtain a construction permit. Those funds are unrecoverable. Even if
they started over again, they wouldn't be able to recover those funds. They would have to spend
additional funds. So those funds are unrecoverable. Expiration of the appeal period of the administrative
review permit. The appeal period for the administrative review permit expired and no
one took an appeal, not the RCO, not the council member, and none of the parties who appeared at
the zoning board. So no one filed an appeal. We actually have, again, support letters today from
the district council member and the RCO. Five is there is no adverse impact on public health,
safety, or welfare. Public health, safety, or welfare will not be adversely impacted if this
appeal is sustained. In fact, it will benefit because you will take a longstanding vacant
property and allow to be developed with a multifamily structure and a commercial use
in the ground floor. So it will help Delaware Avenue continue to grow. It will take care of
the long vacant site, and we get a good public benefit from that. So we believe that we have
three bases for sustaining this appeal, and especially with the vested rights argument.
What I would like to do, Mr. Chairman, is if Council Member Squilla is available,
just to call him briefly. I don't know if he's on.
Council member Squilla.
Do we see a hand?
I see no hands at this time, Chair.
He is in the participants.
He just doesn't have his hand raised, but he's out there.
I think.
We're looking for Mark Squilla?
His hand just went up.
He's been unmuted and allowed to speak.
Good morning, Councilman.
Good morning.
How are you?
Sorry, I was trying to...
That's okay.
Could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer?
Mark Squilla, M-A-R-K, S as in Sam, Q-U-I-L-L-A.
Right.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Proceed to...
Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Council member, did you support the project when it originally came before the board in 2018?
I did.
And did you object when the administrative review, you didn't file an objection when the administrative review was filed in 2022, did you?
I did not.
And do you support the project now?
And the community also supports the project.
And you support the granting of this request to extend the permit for an additional year to allow the building permits to be obtained?
And why do you support the project?
It was a project that really took a long time of dialogue and compromise with the community.
We worked hand in hand to come up with something that with not only Northern Liberties, but CDAG, Central Delaware Advocacy Group, to fit within the master plan.
And it would be, you know, a hardship, I think, to to go back and not allow this project to continue.
And it would be, you know, a hardship, I think, to.
I have nothing further for the council. Thank you.
Leonard, do you have any questions to the council person?
I do not. OK, thank you, councilman.
Thank you. Nothing further. OK, Leonard.
uh thank thank you chairman um i you know again as i said at the beginning uh mr mattione and i
and this letter had reached an agreement uh regarding certain stipulations i believe they're
attached to mr mattione's submission uh of documents i think that was made available
through i think a dropbox so i i assume that the board was able to access those yeah um so again
And it's the city's position that the problem here, we concede, as we did in the stipulations, that there was an error on the part of L&I when the administrative adjustment application came in.
And so, again, just to really quickly go through the dates, the original application came in May 3rd, 2018.
May 26th of 2018, a refusal was issued on the application.
And again, this was application 873511.
So that's a pre-Eclipse number that was in the Hanson system.
And that as a result of receiving that refusal, the applicant sought an approval of a variance from the zoning board.
So the zone, I'm not, I don't remember, I don't know exactly when the hearing was held, but the notice of decision from the zoning board was August 8, 2018.
So, again, with respect to the lapse of permits and approvals under the zoning code, that's section 14303 sub 10 sub A.
So it says, except as specifically stated in any other section of the zoning code, an approval or permit granted under the zoning code, including approvals by the Historical Commission pursuant to 14.1005, shall expire if construction or operation pursuant to the permit or approval has not begun within three years after the date the permit or approval was granted.
And then there's additional sections regarding the extension, but I think that's the three dates. And so I think we just want to address specifically the argument that this provision of the code is ambiguous. It's the city's position that this is not ambiguous.
There are a number of permit applications that go for zoning permits that have to have prerequisite approvals, whether that's historical commission, streets department, water department, planning, et cetera, et cetera.
All of those are approvals.
Those are always those always precede the actual permit issuance, because if it's required, then you can't get the permit until you've done those steps.
So approval and permit are not glosses of each other. They're not the same thing. An approval is an approval, a permit is a permit. The argument that the applicant wants to make here is that there's an ambiguity there and that it should be approval or permit, whichever is later.
And it doesn't say that. It says approval or permit. So I think taken to its logical extent, if they get three years from the approval and then three years from the permit and then another year extension, then a zoning board approval or historical commission approval or water department approval, et cetera, would effectively be good for seven years, which can't be the intent of city council.
um the the the point is that you have to have you you get an approval which is a conditional
thing that you know you get you seek from a an agency or department that approval is necessary
in order to go through the rest of the permitting process for a zoning permit
and then once you get that permit you have to get that permit within those three years now yes
there's going to be situations where you might need extra time we understand that there was
covid uh during the period um there actually was a uh short uh extension of affected of zoning
permits uh so if they if only if a zoning permit were going to expire within the effective period
so that would have been uh well basically in 2020 so the beginning of covid so permits that were
expiring around that time were given an additional 180 days but this permit wasn't expiring at that
time this permit was not going to expire until august of 2021 so i think initially there was the
So, I think initially there was the idea that, well, the administrative review permit could have acted as a de facto extension of the permit, but again, it still would have expired by the end of 2021.
idea that
And reference was made to the code bulletin and the code bulletin, which is code bulletin Z-1901.
We agree a code bulletin is not a regulation per se, but it's an expression of L&I's interpretation of the code.
And interpretations of the code, the board should give deference to the agency's own interpretation of the code.
We agree it's not a regulation, it's not a binding thing per se.
But we think that it's a reasonable expression of how L&I views the lapse, the language in the code on when permits lapse.
Because, again, we just don't think it was the intention of counsel that approvals would effectively continue forever, that you had to actually get the permit or a permit.
So in this case, it could have been a foundation permit.
It could have been a building permit.
But there was no permit that was obtained.
Again, we understand that there were reasons that were given as to why they couldn't proceed at the time, but we don't think that the board has any equitable authority to grant permits or grant extensions on an equitable basis.
basis that's separate and apart from the vested rights argument which i'll address in a second
but so basically uh the the code is clear we believe it's clear that administrative adjustments
and amendments by themselves do not extend zoning approvals but even if they did it would have only
been for another year which would have meant that the permit still would have except the permit
life plus a year still would have been the end of 2022 we do understand that it was uh the
administrative adjustment uh was granted an error um but uh an error by a plans examiner or
some glitch or whatever that happened in eclipse um it doesn't supersede what the code itself
already provides so that then brings me and i'll just address it briefly to the vested rights
argument. The city's not in a position to contradict or to counter the numbers and the
figures and the amount of work, which granted is mostly soft costs that went into the permit
applications and whether that money was spent in reliance upon the belief that the 2022
to administrative adjustment was a valid permit that could be extended again.
I certainly don't dispute that they had a reasonable basis to rely upon the administrative
adjustment.
So if they had obtained a permit to do work in 2022 or even 2023, none of those permits
have been revoked at that time, then yes, I think they would have been in reliance that
that and they could have actually proceeded at that point because they had not yet learned
of the city's position that the permits had expired because the city itself wasn't looking
at that at the time until they came in to ask for the additional extension.
Whether they can still reasonably rely upon that to get this board to grant an additional
exception, I will leave and defer to the board's position on that. I think the board is within
its authority to take that into consideration. But in terms of the numbers, the numbers were
submitted by Mr. Mattione. He's an officer of the court. I'm not here to dispute the numbers and
the money that was spent. I think it's up to the board to make a determination if those are
unrecoverable and if they were um if those unrecoverable sums mean that they have vested
a right in a permit that we believe is already actually expired so again there's no building
permit that's at issue in terms of like vested rights we're talking about whether they have
vested a right in the actual zoning permit that right being that they have they had a right to
have that extended till August of 2024. So if the board were to grant the extension, we think that
the permit would still have to expire by August of 2024. So again, we will leave it to the board's
discretion on how to respond to the vested rights argument, but we want to just make sure that in
the record, I specifically address the approval versus permit dispute, but also with respect to
the other legal arguments that Mr. Mattione raises, the city disagrees with those and
disagrees with those and we just want to preserve the argument that that uh those legal positions
we just want to preserve the argument that those
are incorrect that the city has the authority ellen i has the authority to interpret its own
code and the code bulletins are valid unless they're clearly erroneous which we don't think
they are uh so i think that's basically it unless you have any other questions for me
Mr. Mattione, do you have any response?
Sure, Mr. Chairman.
All I want to say is we believe that the city in 2022 acknowledged that the permit couldn't have expired in 2021 when they reviewed and granted the administrative review.
And when you went on Eclipse, it said that the permit would expire in 2023.
So we turned around, got the administrative review, spent $300,000 doing new plans and everything else, and then realized we're running out of time.
So we then asked for the one-year extension of the permit that was to expire in 2023 to extend it until 2024.
That's the first time we became aware that the city was saying that the permit actually expired in 2021, even though they went and reviewed the administrative review and granted a new permit.
So what we are requesting today is to say that we have a vested right in that permit and we spent all this money on it.
And that because of the delay in time of having this hearing that we get one year from today until March 19th, 2025, for the zoning permit to still be valid because, you know, we acted in good faith on the city's actions.
And we had no idea that the city was going to decide after we spent a lot of money that we no longer had a valid permit.
So that's all we're asking for, Mr. Chairman, is that you find that we have a vested right and that it goes until March 19th, 2025.
If I could just follow up with one.
You can. Sure.
Sure. Very briefly. I do recall now that this matter was originally scheduled for January. Is that right?
December.
December. All right. And I had to request a continuance because I was going to be out of the country. So that's on me. I don't object to adding that additional period of time if you were going to grant the extension. So whatever that would lead to.
Okay, thank you. So MI 2023-005-139-626-30 North Delaware Avenue. We're going to hold this for executive session. We'll vote on this next Wednesday at 930. Does that sound right, Hillary?
Excuse me. Yes, that should be fine, Mr. Chair.
Yeah, so we'll vote on this next Wednesday at 930 and thank both of you.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you, Larry.
Number nine.
one minute number nine mi 2022 007 347 224 to 30 west top of hawkins street michael phillips
is the attorney for
Tulpahawken Mansion
and also Steve Masters
represents the Protestants.
Good morning.
Could you state your name please and spell for the court
sonographer? Michael Phillips
M-I-C-H-A-E-L
P-H-I-L-L-I-P-S
You're on behalf of the applicant Topohokin-Mansion, LLC.
Right. Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Mr. Masters?
Good morning, Mr. Chair, members of the board.
Steve Masters, S-T-E-V-E-M-A-S-T-E-R-S, from the law firm of JustLaws.
Right. Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Okay. Today, we're going to take public testimony.
And as stated at the February 21st hearing in this matter, the purpose of this resumptive hearing is for the board to hear public testimony and the recommendation of the City Planning Commission in order to ensure that everyone who wishes to express their position on this matter is given an opportunity to be heard.
The board will only be accepting public testimony from individuals or organizations who have not already submitted correspondence to the board stating their position.
The lone exception will be the registered community organization whose boundaries include the subject property.
They will be permitted to testify to the RCO process for the project if they wish.
The board will now read into the record the names of the individuals from whom they have received correspondence regarding their positions in this matter.
If your name is not read on this record and you wish to testify, please raise your hand.
If your name is not read on this record and you wish to testify, please raise your hand.
The board will ask that all testifiers keep the remarks brief, concise, and focus on the requested special exception.
Wait a minute. Hold on.
I'm sorry, I got that one at the end wrong there.
Keep the remarks brief, concise, and focus on the proposed parking spaces at the subject
property.
In addition, please avoid repeated comments offered by the previous testifiers.
Thank you.
And here's our list right there.
here's the support
for Tulpa Hawkins Street
Alexander Russell
Carlene Neal
Councilmember
Vaughn
Dr. Annette
Exiles
Slifrin
Ebenezer Maxwell-Mansion
Elizabeth Shepard
Erin Davison
Evan Michaels
Greg and Sean Kennedy
Hannah Church
Joe Malone
Janice Buschetti
James and Sarah Norbert
Jennifer Miller
John Fitzpatrick
John and Marsha Crawford
Kareem Rosser
Catherine Boltz
Catherine Pennypacker, Kelly Ha, Lionel Guerrera, Lori Spadaro, Luke Smith, Melissa and Clayton Martin, Michelle Kending, Oliver Haber, Olivia Weber, Paige Chapman, Rouse and Julia Gord Morphrey, Ramah Asav Smith,
Real Properties
which is Amanda Ranville
Roberta Moore
and William Marsh
Sherlam Cotton
and here's people in opposition
Mr. Chair
there are a few additional names
at the bottom I can just read them
Simone Grisemore
Sophia Swago
Stacey Rollins
State Representative Stephen Kinsey
Wallingford Apartments
letter from Eli Scherr and Wesley Connors. Here's opposition.
Carla Willard, Connie Winters, Elma Glassgold, Eve Gorin, G. Carter, June Gorin, Jenny Ann
Holtz-Martz, Jill Skull, Jacqueline and Thomas Sharpless, Jonathan Barnes, Julia Mann, Lisa
Waddell, M. Aaron Rickwacker, Mary South and Karen Oliver, Michael Ramos, Nathan Long,
P. Scott Donover, Pamela Hipp, Peggy Zwarta and Tom Baker, Robin Tevis, Susan Tobiah, Susan Wright, Suzanne Kalback, Susan Willard, and Laura Ressinger, the Waldorf School, Betsy Sweeney, Vincent Jones, and William DePetris.
Is that it, Elri, for that one?
Yes, that is, Mr. Chair.
Two quick notes.
One, we received word from Councilman Bass's office that she has now taken a position of support in this project.
Secondly, there was a question about rebuttal evidence in this case.
So if we could just address that before going to public testimony.
Thank you.
We will not take the rebuttal here. That'll be part of what you respond to, right?
Well, Mr. Chair, if I just may, this question came up in prior hearings of what the extent would be of any proposed rebuttal testimony from Mr. Beelby.
We have been through, I believe there were two hearings of Mr. Masters and his witnesses and experts presenting evidence.
We have very, very brief rebuttal on two points which I included additional photographs in my packet specifically to address those two very
um photographs in my packet uh specifically to address those two very narrow points i do not
expect that any uh questions of mr bb on rebuttal uh would quite frankly last more than five minutes
so so i think what would prefer that rebuttal make that part of when you submit your documents
at the end that we're going to call for okay so hold on one minute here um
The briefs are going to be due.
What we're looking for is April 19th, and I want you to make that part of your brief instead of doing it today.
Okay, well, then I would just ask it to the extent that the record would be closed at the end that just that tab 34, which are photos of Pastoria Street, Street, Street Bump.
and I believe there are also photos of school-aged children who use Topohokin that those be allowed to be accepted
and that Mr. BLB can either submit an affidavit or submit something to attest to the accuracy of them.
Mr. Chair, likewise, we would ask that our additional exhibits that we submitted in advance of this hearing be approved.
And I don't believe that we require any verification or authentication of them.
Mr. Phillips, do you have a...
No, I do. That's fine.
All right. So, questions or comments from the virtual audience?
Chair, the first hand we have is Lillian Hightower. They have been unmuted and allowed to speak.
Hi, could you please state your name as spelled for the court sonographer?
Hello, good morning, everyone. My name is Lillian, L-I-L-L-I-A-N. Last name is Hightower, H-I-G-H-T-O-W-E-R.
You swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth.
Please proceed.
Good morning, everyone. I am just here to say that I am in support of the zoning that is requested for the property that Darren currently is the owner of.
I have been a resident of West Helper-Hawkins Street for, it will be 30 years come this November.
I am also a former employee of the previous owner of that property, the Unitarian Universalist House.
I worked there as the marketing and admissions director for just a little over 10 years.
During my time at the Unitarian Universalist House, we prided ourselves as being good neighbors to this community.
And the property was kept, the maintenance on the property was kept up.
And we also did a lot of community activities with the neighbors.
And we did have opposition at time for zoning issues, but never during my time while I worked there did a inquiry or question come up about traffic coming and going from Pastoria Street.
I also say this because I think it's interesting that it is now a concern.
During my time at UU House, I worked at getting residents moved in and out of the nursing wing, as well as the main area that supported, I guess, care for adults who could manage their own care.
But the nursing wing had a lot of traffic that would come and go regularly because we provided long-term care support for people who could not care for themselves.
We often moved residents in from the Pastoria Street side because that's where the wing was.
There was also traffic that would come in to drop equipment off and so forth.
And so to say that that was it wasn't a concern for the neighbors, although there was traffic that proceeded in and out of that that area.
Also on, I will say there was traffic also on Topahawken Street.
A lot of times our larger deliveries came off of Topahawken Street.
Also as a resident on this block, my home, in addition to the three properties to the left of me, do not have driveways.
We are the only three properties on West Topahawken Street that are directly, directly across from Darren's property.
And we do not have driveways.
Between these three properties, there are at least six vehicles.
Between these three properties, there are at least six vehicles.
I know that as I'm getting older, I'll be celebrating a birthday this year.
I'll be 63.
It's very difficult for me to have to unload and bring my whatever it is I'm carrying in.
If I have to park all the way down the street, oftentimes that could be the case.
So having the convenience of being able to park in front of my home is very important to me.
I do know that there are currently cars that are parking right near my property, close to Green Street, where Topahawken and Green is, because a lot of residents who live on Walnut Lane park at that location on Topahawken Street.
in addition to those people who live at Darren's property who hopefully will be able to park in
front of their own property if this is ruled in his favor, would alleviate those 15, at least
15 parking spots to be used for residents who do not have driveways. I also feel it's really
important to bring it to the attention that we know that other construction work is being
done in this community that will also take up, I believe, parking on our street because
the, I know the property that's expected to be built near the train station, I think will
be underway soon.
And I believe it's going to be 62 units with a limited amount of parking that's going to
be provided for those units and likely that some of that parking will flow onto Topahawken Street
because we know Wayne Avenue hardly ever has any parking. I also feel it's important that we
recognize that the train that travels from Topahawken to Center City may no longer exist.
We are currently looking at how that will result in traffic in terms of people maybe needing
vehicles if they can no longer take the train. So I can't say for sure if that will be an issue,
but it's a possibility. For me, like I said, one of the things UU House prided itself in was being
a good neighbor and maintaining the grounds. And I was concerned maybe when the property went into
other hands, if that would be an issue. But I can honestly say that Darren has kept the property
immaculate and to the um i guess uh level that you house has kept it and above and he has been
a good neighbor um i am i am in support of of the parking for the residents who live at that
property all right thank you any questions
you're muted steve sorry about that i have one or two questions
Ms. Hightower, your testimony is basically concerned with too many cars being parked on
West Papahawken and interfering with your being able to park close to your home. Would that be correct?
Ms. Hightower, please raise your hand.
I believe Ms. Hightower signed off and I just would like to say if we're doing
cross-examination of witnesses no we're not just just the i'm trying to lay out the first couple
people yes yes that that is a concern in addition to other things yes okay and um
have you been inside uh darren bilby's property um do you know how large it is objection
I agree with that, Mr. Ministers.
Now, I will agree that that's.
Move on from that question, please.
So do you have an objection if there are additional parking places put into the property for for the tenants and not onto Pastoria Street?
Or do you only want the additional parking on Pastoria Street?
you? Well, my thing is that during the whole time UU House operated the property, one of the
biggest concerns that the neighbors had is that we didn't intrude onto the grounds because they
felt it would take something away aesthetically from the property. So UU House did everything
that we could to maintain the property and the look of the property because that always seemed
to be their concern so now i don't understand why their concern is not the same because if there
were additional cars parked in that area would it not take away from the aesthetics i mean the
grounds are beautiful now um so i'm not quite sure what their concerns seem to be if that answers
your question not really i'm just trying to understand why why do you insist that the parking
Not really. I'm just trying to understand why. Why do you insist that the parking has to be on Pastorius when it clearly can be in many different places on the property?
it has
Well, in fact, just a few minutes ago, I took my dog for a walk and I walked down Pastore Street and I noticed that the way that the cars are situated to be parked, there's still plenty of ample space for walking.
I actually walked along the sidewalk that was recently built there.
The cars do not, you know, go outside of that area.
And I think it would alleviate the number of parking, like I said, on top of Hawking Street and also in that general area that you're referring to, because aesthetically, that has always been the concern for the residents, that it stayed open.
Finally, last question.
do you know that there are already 22 parking spaces on the property, which is more than one
per unit? So you're basically asking the zoning board to support a variance for people to have
two parking spaces at their homes instead of just one? Well, I have two parking spaces. I mean,
I have two cars, so I would like to park both of my cars. I don't see, and I noticed that all of
the people who reside on Pastore Street have large enough driveways where they can park one or two
vehicles so i'm still not finding their cause for not supporting it no further questions
phillips do you have any questions no mr chair okay next hand please
chair we have mark grissomore they have been unmuted and allowed to speak
hello can you hear me yes please state your name and spell for the court stenographer
Yes, of course.
My name is Mark Rismore, M-A-R-K-G-R-I-S-A-M-O-R-E.
I'll keep my comments brief.
Hold on.
Do you swear for him to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Are you in favor or against?
I'm in favor.
Is there any reason other than what we've heard already that you're in favor for?
I would say, yeah, one extra comment.
So, my wife and I are having our first baby soon.
Congratulations.
So, thank you.
And so, allowing the extra parking would result in having less cars going through the existing parking lot as a roadway.
It would just generally make us feel safer as tenants on the property.
um additionally uh darren's been a phenomenal landlord who has uh put in garden plots on the
property and has maintained a beautiful green space for us um and uh that's all i have to say
so thank you for your time thank you um i'm going to move on to the next one i said okay
anybody have any questions for that i have no questions right next hand
chair we have christopher hines they have been unmuted and allowed to speak
good morning could you please state your name and spell for the court stenographer
christopher hines please unmute yourself
my apologies uh my name is christopher heinz right t-o-p-h-e-r right last name heinz h-i-n-e-s
do you swear or firm to tell the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth
i do are you for or against this for uh is there anything that's been said that you can add to
just one quick point I come home late at night most of the time and sometimes I don't have
spots and I have to try and park on Tulpahawken and there are never any spots at night in fact
there's generally not spots for another two or three blocks and that fact makes it difficult
to invite anybody over to my house because they can't find a parking spot that's that's one thing
at night, there's no parking around here. Opening up the Pestoria Street would definitely add a lot
of parking and ease some issues on other streets. Thank you, Mr. Hines. We're going to move on.
Next hand. Chair, we have Devin Hill. They have been unmuted and allowed to speak.
Good morning. Could you please state your name and spell for the court sonographer?
My name is Devin Hill, spelled D-E-V-I-N-H-I-L-L.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Are you for or against this project?
I am for this project.
Is there anything that you can add to what's already been said?
Yes, absolutely. I'm just going to keep it extremely brief. It's a safety issue for my family and I. Me and my daughter together, sometimes we have to park on Tomahawk Street. There's been times where we had to park on Wayne Avenue. There's also been times when we have to park on Green Street.
Yes, absolutely.
I'm just going to keep it extremely brief.
So it depends on, you know, where the spots are really pretty much available.
And, you know, it's just a safety issue for, you know, for her being being able to walk those long distances.
There's been times where, you know, we we come home at night, you know, extremely late.
And I would if we had the choice to park somewhere, you know, it would be in front of our home.
But our second best option will be Tomahawken Street. And if Tomahawken Street isn't available to us, then the only other streets that we have are pretty much Wayne Avenue, Green Street and Walnut Lane.
And it's I don't know if you're familiar with those blocks, but these are extremely long blocks for us to have to walk up and down.
So for for my family and I, I think that is pretty much just a safety issue. And that's all I have.
Right. Mr. Chair, can we have the witnesses identify what their addresses are? Because I'm curious which ones live inside the subject property and which ones do not.
Okay. So the next ones will do that. Okay. Thank you. Next hand, please.
Chair, we have Summer Humphrey. They have been unmuted and allowed to speak.
Good morning. Could you please state your name and spell for the court stenographer?
Good morning. I am Summer Humphrey, Summer spelled S-U-M-M-E-R-H-U-M-P-H-R-E-Y.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
What block do you live on?
225 West Pastoria Street, Unit 18.
Thank you. Are you for or against this project?
Okay. Is there anything you could add?
um nothing really to be honest that was my husband who just oh well thank you very much
we appreciate your input thank you next hand chair we have fred cap they have been unmuted
and allowed to speak good morning could you please state your name and spell for the court
sonographer yes can you hear me i can uh my name is fred cap f-r-e-d-c-a-p-p
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Are you a neighbor?
Yes, I live directly across the street.
What block is that, sir?
I'm at 240 West Pastoria Street.
Thank you.
Are you for this or against this?
I'm against it.
Okay, could you tell us why?
So I live directly across the street at 240 West Pastoria's with my girlfriend.
and we are expecting our first child at the moment.
Congratulations.
Thank you.
I've lived in the neighborhood my entire life.
I care about the residents and about the neighborhood.
And last year I approached Darren and asked if he wanted to have coffee
to talk about the project.
I met with him.
We discussed everything for over an hour.
And I had asked him if he would ever be willing to accept a negotiation
where we gave him three parking spaces on the Pastorius parking lot
for his handicapped tenants because I heard over and over again
that this is an issue for people who can't walk so far to their front doors.
Darren didn't really say yes or no, never got back to me on that.
So it seems that he's convinced he really wants the 15 parking spaces
on on pastorius um as it stands if he gets approval for those 15 parking spaces um i'm a
little bit worried that my child is eventually going to be put at risk with this big parking
lot directly across the street from our front yard um i want him to be able to ride his bike
walk on the street safely um it is obviously has become a thoroughfare for pedestrians in
the neighborhood, there are a ton of people walking up and down the street all times of day
because it's a nice, quiet street. And I see kids walking to Waldorf School every single day,
riding their bikes, running. It's become a real amenity, I think, for the neighborhood.
And if we allow the 15 parking spots to start using pastories, it's going to be a much busier
Road. You've heard many times that the 200 block of West Pastorius is an alley more than a street
in a historic residential neighborhood, and I'm most concerned with the precedent that this
in a historic residential neighborhood, and I'm most concerned with the precedent
that this variance application would set if approved.
Darren has 20 units and 29 parking spaces already within the property.
If we are calling these 15 additional off-street parking spaces a hardship,
what's to stop other developers in the area from arguing the same?
That they need to build more parking lots and need more than one parking space per unit.
doesn't city planning want to concentrate development that minimizes car traffic and
encourages residents to walk and use public transportation most people in our neighborhood
park on the street because we have few curb cuts interrupting sidewalks i wonder how many of my
neighbors on topahawken or mccallum or walnut lane would feel about having multiple driveways
and a linear parking lot taking up 183 feet of their sidewalks.
I hope we can protect the quality of life for the rest of the people on my block
and those in the larger neighborhood who have to walk in the pastorious partway.
I especially hope that the board denies the variance.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Is there any follow-up questions?
Yes, I do have a few questions.
Mr. Kapp, Michael Phillips here, attorney for the applicant. So, your property front,
Pastorius, is that correct? Correct.
And it's a new construction, it was a new construction home?
Correct. Okay. When was it built?
2022, 2023. Okay. And it was, correct, this was subdivided off of a parcel that fronted
um walnut lane right that you subdivided off the i'm objecting this is going beyond the the scope
of his testimony mr mr phillips could could you try to get to the point sure um you uh have a curb
cut correct yes i built my home by right i needed no variances everything was by right i'm allowed
a curb cut i parked one vehicle there it is nothing at all similar we have discussed this
at previous meetings you've brought this point up at least at two other times i got a buy right
project done i have one curb cut for one vehicle and that is all it is not anything comparable to
thank you thank you mr phillips you have anything else just the only other question are you related
to one of the uh opponents of the project uh miss connie winters yes and how are you related
to Ms. Winters. She's my mother. Okay. Thank you. No other questions. Okay. Next hand.
Chair, we have Yvonne Haskins. They have been unmuted and allowed to speak.
Good morning. Good morning, Ms. Haskins. Could you please state your name and spell for the
court stenographer? Yvonne Haskins. Y as in yesterday, V as in Victor, O-N-N-E. Haskins,
H-A-S-N-S. All right. Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but
the truth? I do. Are you a neighbor? Yes, I am. In what block do you live in? In the 200 block
directly across the street from 224 all right are you for this or against i have to be against it
all right thank you you've heard a great deal of testimony that we just heard is there anything
else that you could add i would like to add two things that i have not heard anyone speak to
I understood from prior discussion that all of the traffic from Mr. Beelvich's property would pour into Pastoria Street.
And that is because of a traffic study or an engineering study that says his driveway is only 12 feet.
and I was struck by hearing that, that it's incorrect. The curb cut for his driveway
is the same as the curb cut for my driveway. I live directly across the street in a four-unit
building. I live on the first floor. I have a driveway beside my building,
and my driveway is 18 to 19 feet wide my curb cut is the same and I have to come over a public
sidewalk to get into Tulpa Harkin Street anyone coming out of a driveway along Tulpa Harkin Street
has to take extra care because you're coming into a busy street it's like coming into any
busy street and therefore i don't understand why all
busy street. And therefore, I don't understand why all of the traffic from 22, 24, 30 has to
pour onto Pastoria Street. I've walked on Pastoria Street many times. It's a very lovely place to
walk. It's like an alleyway. And I really have felt very uncomfortable when cars come rushing
through and i can't imagine 35 cars going out into into past stories the other other concern i have
with the property is that the front of the property seems to be getting set up uh continuing
to be set up as an airbnb i've i've been concerned because we live across so i think i think miss
haskins we want to concentrate on the on the parking that's requested in the back there so
Why don't we just concentrate on that?
I think the parking, it's more than just the parking in the rear that that is at issue.
If if the motive for the for all the parking going on, all the cars going out of the rear is for the Airbnb in the front, I think an illegal Airbnb.
Again, objection to anyone.
So we're not going to take your testimony about that.
Well, Mr. Chair, there is evidence that we've submitted in our exhibit binder today that Mr. Bilby reserved six parking spaces at the front of his property off of Tupperhawken for Airbnb customers.
So I think it's directly relevant because he's asking for a variance for 15 parking spaces.
He has six that he has held captive inside his property that he doesn't allow his tenants to use.
If he did, that would be that would be nine. That would be not, you know, that he would that he could knock it down to nine at most.
So I think it's very relevant. Mr. Masters, I I I hear what you're saying, but we're going to move on from that.
Miss Haskins, do you have anything else you want to offer?
No, sir. That is my. And Miss Haskins, we do we do appreciate your comments and your testimony.
OK, next hand, please.
Chair, we have Jeffrey Jones. They have been unmuted and allowed to speak.
Hi, could you state your name, please, and spell for the court stenographer?
Yes, Jeffrey Jones. J-E-F-F-R-E-Y, J-O-N-E-S.
Right. Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Are you a neighbor?
what's your relationship to the property? Well, the relationship to the property is I live in the
area and I have friends who live on that block of Pastoria Street who I regularly visit and it has
become concerning for me because I understand that they've been calming measures and cushions
put in place, which are great, but they do not solve the problem for the pedestrians and other
residents in the area and school kids who use that as a normal way of walking and just going
about their business. The reason that these cushions are not going to be helpful is because
cars are still speeding by. The 20 mile an hour speed limit is not adhered to. Just this past
Saturday as I was visiting a friend, I was almost hit by a car traveling approximately 35 or 30
miles an hour i had to jump onto the curb just to you know get out of the way of the vehicle
now i'm an able-bodied individual but i we have to consider those who are not as able-bodied in
the youth in the area when they're walking around they may not be able to hop out of the way and be
able to avoid cars that are going to be speeding if traffic pattern changes if there are additional
cars coming through who are not abiding by the speed limit there's no way of monitoring the speed
limit then who's to say what other catastrophes will come by diane menunez and our good neighbor
mr russell were two individuals whose lives were changed because of accidents in and around that
area of increasing traffic mr jones mr jones we understand your point about traffic is there
anything else that you would want to raise yeah i want to raise the fact that you know there is
no pedestrian curb way on pastoria increasing traffic in that area will do nothing more than
to cause more accidents.
Mr. Jones, can I just ask
what Mr. Jones' address is?
Mr. Jones, where do you live?
Looks like you signed off.
Mr. Jones, please unmute yourself.
He said he wasn't a neighbor
when he started.
I have an address for him
of 6002 Wayne Avenue.
Okay, thank you very much.
But just to be clear, Mr. Chair,
he was testifying to...
I'm still here.
yeah we'll stick at 200 way mr phillips anything else that was my question for him and mr
okay mr phillips anything else that was my question for him yeah mr mr jones when you
were testifying to the car that almost hit you can you can you um identify the exact location
of where you were when that was happening yeah uh 265 pasturius i was visiting a friend at that
address location thank you all right okay next hand please chair we have suzanne ponson
How many more hands do you see?
After Ms. Ponson, there are only two more hands, Chair.
All right, thank you.
Hi, could you please state your name and spell for the court stenographer?
Ms. Ponson, please unmute yourself.
Suzanne Ponson please unmute yourself
she may be having some technical issues Cher all right move on to the next hand
Cher we have Dure Montague they have been unmuted and allowed to speak
how could you please state your name and spell for the court stenographer
sir. My name is DeRay Montague. First name D-U-R-A-Y-M-O-N-T-A-G-U-E. Do you swear or affirm
to tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth? I do. Are you a neighbor? Yes.
And where do you, what, what block do you live on, sir? I live two doors from the property in
question on 250 West Top of Hawkins Street. Okay. Are you in favor or against this project?
I am in favor of the project. And you've heard a great deal of testimony. Is there anything else
you could add? Yes. I agree with the fact that we need parking. Another factor is there are always
cars parked at the fire hydrants across from my house every night. My visitors have nowhere to
park. My house borders, I have a parking lot where I park my family's three cars, and we enter and
exit primarily on Pastoria Street, and I don't have any problem with the amount of traffic.
The new safety cushions have probably cut down some of the pass-through traffic,
if nothing else. And I understand what the opponent's points are, and I really appreciate
their passion, but they're wrong on this. We have neighbors that have parking right in front of
their house that they can't use. They're spilling into and impacting negatively the rest of the
neighborhood. And I live, I'm impacted as much as anyone by all of Darren's developments. I brought
my home 10 years ago next door to two abandoned, unused, decaying properties. And 10 years later,
Darren has rehabbed those to the improvement of the community and as much as anyone's impacted
Germantown in years and years. So in closing, I just think that all of us, all the people on this
call, the people who are against it, they have generally two things in common. They don't live
on Pastoria Street, or if they do, they have that privilege. We all have that privilege. My house is
on Tupperhawken Street, but I exit onto Pastoria Street, past the carriage houses that used to be
for horses and buggies, and now they all have parking lots. I don't understand the almost
hypocrisy, and it disappoints me. I think people really care about this neighborhood, and it's
very impressive, but with all that Darren has contributed to the neighborhood, the fact that
he's rented to a diverse and brought a new diverse and talented community to our area.
It's a shame that they have the hardship of not having parking in front of their house. I don't
think it would have much of any impact on pedestrians or us who use it for entry and exit.
All right. Thank you. Does anyone have any questions? Okay. Next hand, please.
Chair, we have Che Villanueva.
They've been unmuted and allowed to speak.
Good morning.
Could you please state your name and spell for the court stenographer?
Mr. or Ms. Villanueva, please unmute yourself.
Mr. or Ms. Villanueva.
Mr. or Ms. Villanueva, please unmute yourself.
Chair, they're not unmuting.
Is there any other hands?
We have one more, George Boudreaux.
George Boudreaux, please unmute yourself and wait for this.
Good morning.
Good morning.
Could you please state your name and spell for the court stenographer?
My name is Dr. George Boudreaux, George traditional spelling.
My last name is B-O-U-D-R-E-A-U.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Objection, Mr. Chair.
We believe that Mr. Boudreaux has already put a written statement in.
And so he's barred from making public testimony today.
I'm barred from making a public statement, sir.
So, sir, if you've already given us a written comments, that's already part of the record.
And we're trying to we're trying to move this along today.
And that's the reason we did it.
But your your comments have already been taken into consideration.
And thank you for taking time to calls.
We appreciate it.
Excuse me.
This is Hillary.
I just want to clarify, Mr. Boudreaux, are you from the Ebenezer Mansion?
Ebenezer Maxwell Mansion, the Historic House Museum, yes.
Yes, we have received that letter.
Thank you.
Is there anyone else in the virtual audience?
I see no hands, Chair.
Mr. Chair, I have a request.
We had a witness for public testimony who was not able to remain.
Her name is Shea Villanueva.
and we would like to be able to supplement the record
with her written statement in lieu of her public statement today.
That's fine.
And Mr. Chair, it looks like Suzanne Ponson is trying to testify.
We can give her one more opportunity to see if her technical issues are resolved.
Hi, could you, Susan?
Yes, Suzanne.
Sir, I'm very sorry.
No, no, no.
I'm using the telephone.
I mean, I'm using the telephone.
Could you please state your name and spell for the court stenographer?
My name is Suzanne, S-U-Z-A-N-N-E.
And the last name is Ponson, P as in Paul, O-N-S-E-N.
Right.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Are you a neighbor?
I'm not a near neighbor, but I am a neighbor.
But I am.
Tell me the block that you live in.
You'll have to give me your address.
I live in the 5900 block of McCallum.
But I am president of West Central Germantown Neighbors.
OK. Are you for or against this project?
I'm not calling. I would like to clarify some questions that I know have been asked in the past.
And we have not as none of the board members have spoken up about it.
But I'd like to explain. I was president a year ago when when the last RCO meeting occurred and and when the vote was taken and so forth.
The only thing that I'd like to say is that at the time, the subject was debated about near neighbors versus not near neighbors.
And the point I'm raising has to do with the fact that perhaps 25 of the near neighbors that voted or are tenants of 224 to 30 West Alpahawkins Street.
We use the list of near neighbors as the city required.
But we did not make any notation to the fact that, as I said, 24, 25 of the voters, and I don't know how they voted because it was an anonymous vote.
I don't know how they voted, but 25 of the voters, their vote was made and credited to the near-neighbor position.
And I can say that the board, we had a debate about it within the board.
We had a debate about how we should go with this.
And in the end, we decided to go with the list that was provided for us by the city.
was provided for us by the city right and that's all that i'd like to say okay um thank you very
Right.
And that's all that I.
much do you understand what i yeah okay i do understand i think what you said and we we
appreciate taking the time to call us okay thank you is there anyone else in the virtual audience
chair we have a kyle church with their hand up they have been unmuted and allowed to speak
so this will be the last one we're taking okay yes chair
hi could you please state your name and spell for the court stenographer
yes this is kyle church k-y-l-e church is c-h-u-r-c-h um i'm here with my wife
hold on hold on hold on one minute do you swear or firm to tell the truth the whole truth nothing
but the truth yes i do are you a neighbor uh uh i am a resident on on uh pastoria street
what 100 block uh say i'm at 225 okay all right mr chair we we object to this testimony because
hannah church who is with um mr church um has submitted a written statement um already and so
we believe that they're barred from testimony i have not i can confirm we received a statement
already from hannah church in writing sir we already have a comments for your wife it's part
of the record and uh we appreciate the letter and it is can i give my comments as well um i i think
we're going to stay with what your wife sent us and we appreciate the time you've spent to try
to cause thank you is there anyone else i see no further hands chair planning commission
this is uh ron bednar city planning
yeah i already swore you right right yes yeah the comprehensive plan recommends no change to
residential single family zoning at this location city planning commission recommend on the original
case that there is to be no curb cuts on Pastoria Street. This new application to create additional
spaces with direct access to Pastoria Street would create five new curb cuts, with the majority
being over 25 feet in width at the street. The City Planning Commission maintains that the
parking is excessive and sees no unique conditions of the property that would cause us to
change our original recommendation. Thank you. The due dates for the brief will be Friday the 19th
at the close of business. Thank both of you. Just for clarification, Mr. Chair and board
counsel, are we submitting just briefs or are we submitting suggested facts and conclusions?
of what how would you like us to to proceed just just submit your your closing arguments and any
rebuttal evidence that we already discussed today or supplemental evidence that we've already
discussed today that the board is permitting um to go into the record otherwise the record is closed
okay and just for clarification i know mr masters meant did mention uh i believe it was
miss Villanueva that he'd be submitting um a written uh you'll get a copy okay yeah and and
we did have one uh similarly uh glenn miss glenn near carter who i believe had her hand raised and
then it was down i don't believe she was able to uh um connect for uh um technical issues so i would
just request the same that you know we'd be permitted to submit a supplemental letter on her
behalf we have no objection thank you all right thank you uh to the board for your uh time and
thank you so much okay um hillary so we talked about breaking at 12 30 right
um yes mr chair so why don't we do this why don't we take a five minute break and then we'll come
back, and we can read into the record all the names and things of that nature, and then start
fresh at 1.30. Is that okay? It might be better to read the name, because I think people will be
coming back later, and we will want them to hear their names. Okay, so then we'll take a break now,
you're saying? Yes, I think we should take a break now, Mr. Chair. Okay, good. Okay, so why don't we
come back at 1.10? Well, I think we can come back at 1.30. I think that would be fine.
Okay. All right. 1.30 is fine. All right. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Good afternoon, everyone.
My name is Bill Bergman.
I will be chairing this afternoon's hearing.
We're going to go to number 10, MI 2023-006-162, 1954 Patterson Avenue.
On this case will be two attorneys, Meredith Trego and Matthew McClure, and also Leonard Reuter is an attorney for this city.
He should be here, too.
chair matthew mcclure is coming back in as a panelist now i'm waiting for i'm waiting for
mr voider and meredith trago to put their hands up okay
chairman matt mcclure yeah i matt you've already been sworn leonard you've already been sworn
and and just to clarify the city is not the applicant we are the property owner
by agreement with fairmont park conservancy they are the applicant and taking the lead
on this but i'm i'll be here in case there's any questions from the board thank you
All Republican parties have been promoted to panelists, Chair.
Thank you.
As stated at the February 21st hearing of this matter, the purpose of the resumptive hearing is for the board to hear public testimony and the recommendation of the City Planning Commission in order to ensure that everyone who wishes to express their position on this matter is given an opportunity to be heard.
The board will only be accepting public testimony from individuals or organizations that have not already submitted correspondence to the board stating their position.
The lone exception will be the registered community organizations whose boundaries include subject property.
They were permitted to testify regarding the RCO process for this project if they wish.
The board will now read into the record the names of the individuals and organizations from whom it has received correspondence regarding their positions in this matter.
If your name is not read into the record and you wish to testify, please raise your hand.
The board asks that all testifiers keep their remarks brief, concise, and focus on the requested special exception to remove the heritage trees from subject property.
In addition, please avoid repeating comments offered by previous testifiers.
Here are people who have sent letters that are in support.
Anderson Marks Youth Sports Organization, Council President Kenyatta Johnson, Hunting Park United, NOMO Foundation, Philadelphia Dragons Sport Association, Philadelphia Parks and Recreation, South Philadelphia Sigma Sharks, State Representative Regina Young, Unity in the Community, and Warren Abbott.
Here's letters of opposition.
Bradford Whitman, Brian Jeans, Brianna Gialdo, Brina Belford, Brielle Brilani, Britt Doberg,
Brooke Wesley, Taryn Cervani, Carly Russ, Katherine Darin, Katherine Roberts, Kathy
Van Der Root, Charles Blinnick, Charles Murphy, Chris Pico, Chris Wack, Christina Gardner,
Christopher Bruhn, Dara Silverman, Doran Helmel, David Schepanskic, Delaware Valley
Ornithical Club, Dr. John Chico Baker, Dr. Julia Mitchell, Dr. Wendy Gibson,
Dr. Julia Mitchell, Dr. Wendy Gibson, Eugene Clarion, Elaine Hughes-Jensen,
Ilu Serpell, Ilan Grunberg, Emily Serena, Emmett Wilson, Flo Carmody, Friends of FDR Park,
G. Pluck, Gabriel Gubb, Bonji, Garrett Sager, Goyer Pilello, Haley Brantford, Heather Severson, Huckle Young, James Stanton, June Pluck, Jane Fishman, Jay Sheffman, Jeffrey Turner, Jennifer Miller.
Jennifer Prince, Jess Mercurio,
Gemico Call, John Amadio,
Julia Kropik, Karen and Felix Penzula,
Karen Leibowitz, Kat Ken Don,
Kat Weary, Kate Laspina,
Caitlin Navarro, Caitlin Rebisch,
Catherine McGuire, Catherine Rice, Tim Alsbrooks, Tim Barbetta, Kristen Kiki Becker, Kristen
Jennewitz, Christy Glazer, Lori Crandall, Lori Bernneister, Lauren McClutchin,
Clutchin, Lauren Schiffman, Lily Safran, LJ Brubaker, Lucine Miller, Lynn Gallagher,
Mucklin Koch, Malcolm O'Malley, Mark Kaplan, Max Friedman, Megan Anger, Michael Horsey, Miriam Harlan, Nadia Cummings, Neil Petillo, Nicole Hoffman, Nicole Kemmel, Norma Gottlieb,
Ali Jem, Ali Zagovic, Packer Park Civic Association, Patricia Yannitz, Richard Goella, Robert Kaponskik,
Rita Gitter-Munz, Sally Coyne, Sirene Carr, Sharon Tayman, Silver Licello, Sefin Kroll, PhD.
Stephanie Barber, Wendy Leapheart,
Wincote Audubon Society.
We will now go to the virtual audience,
and I believe we're going to start with the RCO.
Is Barbara Capozzi in the audience?
Barbara Capozzi, if you're in the virtual audience,
there she is.
Okay, now her name disappears here.
i had this back up she's been unmuted and allowed to speak
good afternoon could you please state your name is spelled for the court stenographer
um my name is barbara capozzi c-a-p-o-z-z-i do you swear or affirm to tell the truth the
whole truth and nothing but the truth of course yes and you're you're one of the rcos am i correct
Yes, actually both.
Esteem chair and board, I'll be as brief as possible.
Go ahead.
Happy first day of spring.
We should all be down at FDR Park now doing a field view because I'm sure that if you saw the gorgeous trees that are to be killed because of this application, you would vote against it as we have.
My name is Barbara Capozzi.
I'm the president of the Packer Park Civic Association for 30 years.
No one wants the job.
um packer park is the lovely community immediately adjacent to fdr park i'm also the co-president of
the friends of fdr park along with lindsey stanapikio who will be next we are firm supporters
of the parks and rec system for decades and i am probably the leading advocate for the fdr parks
revival over the last 25 plus years i have volunteered thousands of hours spent thousands
of dollars and this case is ripping my heart out and stomping on it. I can summarize this plan in
two words and save you all this reading. Bad karma. I can summarize it in three words. Very bad
karma. Of all the places in 360 acres to dump toxic turf fields and
Of all the places and 360 acres to dump toxic turf fields, and that's another subject for another day, the experts picked in the midst of 64 huge, gorgeous heritage trees.
Heritage trees means they're old, they're 25 inches in diameter or more, multiple branches, and usually at least 30 feet high.
And this is the difference between BookSmart and StreetSmart.
Pay attention.
BookSmart, StreetSmart.
Street Smart should win.
Whoever goes along with this bad decision will forever ruin the nature and flow of this beautiful, peaceful park.
My neighbors say they moved here to be next to the park, not a noisy, bright lights and ball field activity center.
Just because of the time, energy, good faith, and volunteer efforts that the two RCOs have made, we did not get a lawyer.
We did not want to be adversarial to the Parks and Rec and Fairmount Park systems.
We naively believed that they would respect us, all of our hard work, our nights, our weekends, meetings, meetings, meetings, cleaning the park on Sundays, and respect our position in the community, on the street, and literally boots on the ground in this community with park users and neighbors.
After all, we are the people who get the complaints.
We're the first line of defense.
We object to Mr. McCuller's continued characterization that the RCOs delayed this matter.
Once we received the exact plans, which was mid-November, we immediately asked Fairmount Park and Parks and Rec for a meeting to discuss the many questions that we had.
We know from our constituents what questions people will ask.
So in order to get those answers first, we had to meet with them.
Very important issue. Traffic, security plan, why only 170 parking spaces, et cetera.
We got no response. We wrote again. We are always polite and courteous. Always. We requested a meeting. Finally, the date for that meeting was set, not by us, but by the Fairmont Park and Parks and Rec, and it was January 26th. So we did not delay. We asked then, we asked now for a modification of the current plan so the delay was not on our part.
packer park civic has already voted to appeal this decision if it goes against us
friends of fdr park has not taken that vote yet there are many environmental groups also opposed
to this and its plans in the current state that it's in i hope that you please read those heartfelt
letters as well especially from the bird people on behalf of packer park civic only our neighbors
vehemently do not want more traffic noise and lights it's not like we don't have a lot going
on down here already. We do. Fairmont Park is giving us fields, yet cutting down the very trees
that protect us from the noise, the lights, the music that these fields on the northern portion
of FDR will generate. So we're getting the fields and they're killing our buffer. Makes no sense.
The neighbors were adamant about that and I put forward their opposition. In my role as co-president
of the Friends Group, I have tried to compromise with Parks and Rec. This plan for the sake of the
neighbors now my neighbors are not happy about that compromise but i am trying to work with
everybody the friends have been trying since november to modify this plan very simply and
save a huge number of these large gorgeous trees that serve as buffers it's a lose-lose for packer
park and it's also a lose-lose for the park um we have we have tried to get a meeting with the
new head of parks and rec the new commissioner we had a meeting scheduled for four o'clock yesterday
it was canceled right before with no explanation and no request to reschedule if there's an
emergency you usually say well let me reschedule this that did not happen so i believe the hard
working volunteers who have kept this park clean and beautiful deserve better than the disrespect
and demissive attitude from both parks and rec and fairmont park conservancy for us volunteers
This whole process has been one of marginalizing the RCOs, and that's very sad, because these are the people who care so much.
To summarize, the applicant did not show that there's no reasonable alternative to this plan.
We tried and got nowhere.
We do have a reasonable alternative.
All we ask is a slight shift, same footprint.
I know it's already been surveyed.
Just shift it over to the West.
Lose one field, lose two courts, save the beautiful championship tree,
save the clubhouse where the friends operate their volunteer activities out of children's
library etc the applicant also did not show that there's no harm to the park and to the neighbors
a traffic study was never done um it was offered to us january 26 i'm sure that it has not commenced
there's also been no security plan and we've had an endless vandalism routed scenes and issues
ungodly uh in the last in this last week it was heartbreaking the beautiful new anna c verna
playground was taken over by bullies last weekend and my phone rang off the hook from parents very
last weekend and my phone rang off the hook from parents very very upsetting yes they call me not
very upsetting
Fairmount Park or Parks and Rec they have no idea how to reach those boats in the ivory tower
please know that the park already has to be closed six to seven times a year on Sundays
closed for further people coming in because it's too packed and that's not Eagle Sundays that's
other spring Sundays. And it's also many other Sundays are too close for comfort, but it's not
closed. The ZBI, this process, not personally to you, but this process is stifled advocacy
and we did not get a lawyer, which was our mistake. The witnesses went in untouched and
that's unfortunate. It's almost impossible to advocate over Zoom. So please bear with me,
I'm almost done. The master plan was a framework. We had no idea the specific placement of the first
fields until November 2023. We asked many questions, the parking spaces, the traffic,
the security. We had no idea these large gorgeous trees would be cut for ball fields. No one at the
multiple planning meetings in 2018 ever advocated for tournament play or killing trees, just the
opposite. However, after COVID, and I'm sure you all know this, times are far different now.
There's a decline in civility, a decline in respect, and what looked benign in 2018
is now toxic, controversial, flammable, combustible. No one behaves anymore. There is no respect. So
the thought of having all these fields here and no trees to buffer it are pretty upsetting.
One of the trees alone is a state champion, 122 inches in diameter and 40 feet high, many, many branches.
It's slated to come down.
Believe me, if you saw it in person, you would weep.
We have shown an alternate plan, and we advocate for its acceptance.
And there is harm to the community, and we advocate for the plans and the traffic study to show that.
Finally, I have to say this, that we are very, very disappointed at Fairmount Park and the parks and rec and the disrespectful and dismissive attitude they have had toward their biggest advocates, the volunteers.
Thank you so much for listening.
Any questions?
Thank you.
Could the representative for FDR, RCO, please come on?
That would be Lindsay, last name beginning with S. I don't want to butcher. Yes, I see her at the bottom. There you go. Thank you.
Lindsay Scannapico has been unmuted and allowed to speak.
Good afternoon. Could you please state your name and spell for the court stenographer?
Good afternoon, Chairman. Good morning. Good afternoon, everyone. My name is Lindsay Scannapico. That's L-I-N-D-S-E-Y. Last name is Scannapico, S-C-A-N-N-A-P-I-E-C-O.
You swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Thank you. Please proceed.
Thank you very much, Chairman.
Honorable members of the Zoning Board and everybody else who has gathered here today, thank you so much.
I stand here today as the co-president of the Friends of FDR Park alongside Barb Capozzi.
I am not a paid staff member or paid consultant.
This is just a park that I love dearly and decided to get more involved in about eight years ago when I joined the Friends of FDR Park.
It was clear at the last hearing that we were unable to ask questions of the experts, clarify statements that were made, or participate without legal counsel.
Therefore, we found legal counsel today. Unfortunately, they were unable to join the meeting today, which is why we requested continuance.
It is not to further delay this process. It is really to allow us to have representation at the table.
let me be clear we are not opposed to the master plan in fact we are exceedingly enthusiastic about
the opportunity for investment and support within fdr park however our concerns lie with the lack
of community input in this specific zoning application and the removal of heritage trees
when we believe that there is an alternative plan that would be better for all while we recognize
the thoroughness of the public engagement process in 2018, five years ago, prior to the pandemic,
we have found ourselves unable to share concerns in the process today now that details and designs
have been developed. When we saw the master plan in 2018, one of the big questions the Friends of
the FDR Park Board had, and was well documented, was regarding the traffic and security plans in
was regarding the traffic and security plans in the park the investment sounded great but the
the park.
The investment
salary
operational impacts were critical master plans are a framework and we understood this but we
were told continually that our concerns and questions would be answered in the design phase
this has not occurred fdr park has experienced a significant uptick in visitors with the number
soaring from 2.75 million visitors recorded prior to the pandemic to over 4.5 million visitors last
year. The population of the city of Philadelphia, as we all know, is only around 1.5 million people.
So this is a really significant regional park. Regular closures already happen in the park due
to unsafe conditions caused by excessive traffic. We've had fatalities in the park due to this.
We are currently closing the park six to eight times a year in the spring and autumn due to too much traffic.
In this zoning application, no traffic or security plan has been presented,
and we believe there is a specific detrimental impact by the traffic and congestion this skilled facility will bring to the park and surrounding roads.
We support the master plan, but we do have concerns about this application.
We implore the zoning board to consider a requirement for an alternative that would mitigate these concerns.
We have a plan that we believe would save 30% of the heritage trees, 14 to 15 of the trees specifically.
It would give four high-quality multi-use courts, three basketball courts, and this parking provision as detailed.
I also wish to just address some misconceptions and statements that were made on the record that
I believe were inaccurate. Contrary to the accusations that were made, we have only
actively sought information and engaged in dialogue since receiving the plans. We only
received the plans on November 14th. We asked questions on November 20th and again on December
18th. We received an email from Fairmount Park Conservancy on January 3rd saying that it would
require them until mid-January to get us a response. On January 11th, they asked for a meeting on
January 27th. We had that meeting and accommodated their schedules and we hosted our public RCO
meeting two weeks later. We are committed to transparency as a community group.
I would also like to clarify for the Zoning Board our process at the public meeting.
We have been accused that our process was exclusionary as we only permitted paying
members to vote and allow members to be from the city of, and we allow members, I'm sorry,
we allow members to be from beyond the city of Philadelphia. As a park that attracts 4.5 million
visitors per annum, it's probably actually higher than that because it's just based on cell phone
data, it is clear that we are a regionally significant park and we have many supporters
from all over the region. We also follow the guidance as outlined in the Park Friends document
issued by the Fairmont Park Conservancy, which recommends that you charge people a membership fee
in order to be part of a friends group. This is exactly in line with their guidance and
recommendations. Otherwise, things would just become a popularity contest depending on specific
issues that were raised. Lastly, I urge the board to recognize the true value of the area under
discussion. It was stated in the previous hearing that it was, quote, an informal dog park,
I'm sorry, an informal dog run or soil stockpile. That is frankly just not true. This area is used
by thousands of people for various recreational activities, birding, picnicking, playing,
walking. There's organized walking groups that use this area each and every single week. I was
THIS AREA ON SUNDAY AND RAN INTO HUNDREDS OF PEOPLE IN THIS PART OF THE PARK. THIS IS NOT JUST
A DOG RUN OR STOIL STOCKPILE. WE BELIEVE THAT THERE IS AN ALTERNATIVE PLAN THAT HONORS THE
SPIRIT OF THE MASTER PLAN, A DESIRE FOR HIGH QUALITY SPORTS FIELDS AND ALSO THE CONCERNS OF OUR
COMMUNITY. AND WE URGE THE ZONING BOARD TO TAKE THAT INTO CONSIDERATION IN TODAY'S CONVERSATION.
So thank you very much for the time for us to share our concerns.
Thank you for your comments.
Go to the virtual audience, please.
Chair, we have Cynthia O'Keefe.
They have been unmuted and allowed to speak.
Hi, good afternoon.
Good afternoon.
Could you state your name and spell, please, for the court sonographer?
Yes, it's Cynthia, C-Y-N-T-H-I-A.
o'keefe is o apostrophe k e e f e do you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth nothing
but the truth i do are you a neighbor uh i'm not a neighbor i live in bergen county new jersey and
Uh, I'm not a neighbor. I live in Bergen County, New Jersey in Ridgewood, and I'm an interested party.
And, um,
All right. So, so, so let, so let me ask you this. Are you for this or against the project?
I'm against it.
Okay. And give us, if you can, give us something different than what we've heard from the last two people, if that's possible.
Sure. I certainly will.
Thank you.
As a resident of Ridgewood, New Jersey, I'm increasingly concerned about the many parallels that are projects within not only New Jersey.
Obviously, it's the very same situation that is happening with this park.
And as one of the earlier callers spoke before, it's bad karma.
The Fairmont Park Conservancy website says you believe in the power of open spaces and the importance of nature to urban communities.
But from the what I understand about this project is that you're taking nature away.
And so leveling trees that provide clean air and then installing plastic playing fields, which we all know have been, you know, understood to be toxic.
And every day information comes out about the toxic nature and forever chemicals.
Hold on. Hold on. Hold on a minute, please.
We've had testimony about that.
So could you concentrate on what you think is different that you know about this project?
Well, what I know about this project is that, well, I don't know if there's a stormwater runoff plan related to the toxic turf fields.
I also, you know, I'm against the leveling of the heritage trees.
And so I wanted to state my objection for the record.
and um obviously you seem like you want to cut me off so if that's the case no i don't want to cut
you off but what i'm trying to do is concentrate on other points that have already been made
so no i don't want to cut you off okay well to sum it up i don't agree with leveling that amount
of trees we obviously need them for our environment it's part of what should be considered
important in an open space plan. And again, I believe turf is toxic, and you should reevaluate
those plans. That's all I have to say. Thank you. Thank you for taking the time to calls.
Next hand, please. Chair, we have Candace, last name beginning with an L. They have been unmuted
and allowed to speak. Hi, could you please state your name and spell it for the court's stenographer?
Good afternoon, everyone.
It's Candice, C-A-N-D-I-C-E.
My last name is DeTore, D-E, capital T-O-R-E.
You swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Are you a neighbor?
Please proceed.
Are you for or against this project?
I am 100% against this project.
Well, thank you.
If that's the case, could you try to concentrate on something different than what we've already
heard?
Because we have heard from the first two presentations were kind of inclusive.
So if you can think of something different.
Well, with all due respect for, I think my opinion as a local resident is just as valid, but I promise you I will keep it quick.
I just want to say I've sat by for years and years and watched more and more areas of my beloved park get taken over for private sports fields that then become inaccessible to the public.
The last thing we need in our neighborhood is more sports fields.
And to think that someone thinks that sports fields would better accompany one of the oldest houses, yes, the oldest, in South Philadelphia would be better than that trees is an absolute disgrace.
We don't need more people coming into our neighborhood.
We don't need more sports fields.
And none of us here in this meeting will be alive to see any of the newly planted trees become the size of the trees that you want to cut down.
Not you specifically.
And so, yes, I'm against it, and I'm here to protect my beloved park.
Thank you for your time.
Thank you for calling in.
We appreciate it.
Next hand, please.
Next hand is Danielle Nelson.
They have been unmuted and allowed to speak.
Hello.
Good afternoon.
Could you state your name, please, and spell for the court stenographer?
It's Danielle Nelson.
That's D-A-N-I-E-L-L-E.
and nelson is n-e-l-s-o-n all right do you swear or firm to tell the truth the whole truth nothing
but the truth yes are you a neighbor yes uh are you for or against this project i am for the project
okay could you please let us know your comments um as being a neighbor i've been in the area for
years my children go to this park um we have family functions at the park we have like sports
Um, we have family functions at the park. We have like sports themes. We just like to go to the park
themes we just like
to have fun. My children go to a daycare near the park and we have family fun day every year. It's
just supportive of the family to show their appreciation, you know, for the kids coming to
the daycare. So I think that more, um, you know, things for the children to do at the park would
suit the park because it is a park and it's a family park. Okay. Uh, thank you very much for
taking time to close. We appreciate it. Next hand, please. We have David Gibson. They have been
allowed to speak. Hi, could you state your name, please, and spell it for the court stenographer?
Can you hear me? I can. David Gibson, David, D-A-V-I-D, Gibson, G-I-B-S-O-N. Right. You
swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? I certainly do.
Are you a neighbor? I am. Are you for this project or against? I'm opposed to the special
exception. Okay, and could you let us know if there's something different than what you've
already heard? Well, first of all, I'm in agreement with the Conservancy and with the experts that
acknowledge the park is experiencing groundwater flooding, but I'm in disagreement about how to
address this issue. It's practical and irresponsible to spend millions of dollars trying to engineer a
high and dry athletic zone inside a 100-year flood zone in the age of rising tides. A more
practical approach would be to decrease the hardscaping install boardwalks facilitate more
passive recreation there are better places for fields in our city places where grass fields
would solve the field crisis and add additional green space to our city rather than destroying
it um also i i bike down there all the time and you know i would just it's just a beautiful space
pretty wild i like it the way it is i don't want to see it change please tell the conservancy to
design a better alternative. I'm sure there are many other alternatives. Pretty much what I have
to say. Thank you very much for your comments. Next hand, please. Here we have Elowen Corbyn.
They have been unmuted and allowed to speak. Hello. Hi, good afternoon. Could you state your
name, please, and spell it for the court stenographer? Sure. It's an unusual one.
That's okay.
Elowen Corby, E-L-O-W-Y-N.
Last name Corby, C-O-R-B as in boy, Y.
You swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth.
Are you a neighbor?
I live in Point Breeze.
Are you in favor of this project or against it?
In opposition, against it.
And there's been a lot of testimony.
is there anything additional you can offer yes there is i will do this all right so almost 19
000 people have already collectively signed petitions in opposition to this plan both rcos
have voted overwhelmingly against it and they've submitted hundreds of letters of opposition
none of the fdr plan has ever been discussed before city council there have been no hearings
called. The Parks Commission hasn't had any public meetings since 2019. It is wrong that a privately
funded non-government entity like the Conservancy can clear-cut this much public space without an
explicit mandate from the public. Too many people have been disqualified and silenced from even
making a comment here. It is shameful and it is undemocratic. I would like to see the board
ask the Conservancy for a range of alternative plans that would save some of these trees.
Thank you very much for calling us and taking the time.
Next hand, please.
Here we have Adam Woods.
They have been unmuted and allowed to speak.
Hi, good afternoon.
Could you state your name and spell, please, for the court sonographer?
My name is Adam Woods, A-D-A-M-W-O-O-D-S.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Are you a neighbor?
I am. I live in South Philly.
Are you in favor of this project or against?
I am opposed to this project.
Okay. And you've heard a lot of testimony before you. Is there anything different in your opposition that we haven't heard?
Yeah, I would just like to state that this plan undermines the Philly tree plan, which states that the preservation of our existing canopy is a primary goal for the city.
It undermines the Philadelphia Tree Canopy Assessment, which found that between 2008 and 2018, Philadelphia lost 6% of its canopy.
It undermines the Philadelphia Climate Action Playbook, which states that we need to use nature as a solution and that trees help remove carbon pollution while managing heat, clearing pollutants from the air, and managing stormwater runoff.
clearing pollutants from the air, and managing stormwater runoff.
It's as if one hand of the city doesn't know or consider important what the other is doing
it's as if
or the goals it has set.
The field crisis is real, but we should not be forced to choose between our fields and
our natural resources.
These fields need to be put in neighborhoods where kids can actually access them and where
they do not require the demolition of our green spaces.
Thanks for listening.
Thank you for your comments.
Next hand, please.
Chair, we have Whitney Peeling. They have been unmuted and allowed to speak.
Hi, could you state your name and spell it, please, for the court stenographer?
For Whitney Peeling. That's W-H-I-T-N-E-Y-P, like Peter, E-E-L-I-N-G.
Right. Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Are you a neighbor?
I am. I live in South Philly.
Are you in favor of this project or against?
I am against.
And you've heard a lot of people testify prior to you.
Is there anything different that you could offer to us?
Yeah, a bit different.
At the moment, these trees are the only thing standing in the way of the rollout of more toxic artificial turf.
And the dangers of that turf have been repeatedly documented locally in the Enquirer and in publications worldwide, including peer-reviewed journals.
The introduction of that turf would introduce toxic PFAS chemicals and microplastics into the surrounding ecosystem and have a negative effect on our children's health, including my own child.
um it's going to poison our kids and we can't talk about supporting our young people while
installing toxic turf at the same time and these turf companies they're profiting off of our
children while robbing them of good help good health sorry and a habitable planet and i'd like
the board to require the conservancy to go back to the drawing board thank you very much for your
comments and taking the time is there well who's the next hand please chair the next hand is dito
van rigersburg they have been unmuted and allowed to speak
hi could you state your name please and spell for the court sonographer
hello it's mary long it's dito d-i-t-o another word van v-a-n another word rigersburg r-e-i
G-E-R-S
B-E-R-G
You swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth
and nothing but the truth
Are you a neighbor?
I am, I live in South Korea
Are you in favor of this project or against?
I'm against
Okay, and we've had quite a bit of reasons why
Is there anything different in your
comments?
I want to talk about water
So, raising the level of the park and displacing immersion and existing wetland with parking
lots and plastic turf will displace water into other areas, and water will always go
somewhere. So, in addition, the former refinery site is being raised to the west by Hillco.
The Army Corps of Engineers is proposing to build levees to raise the Schuylkill banks.
the navy yard is bringing in fill and raising every building they construct to the southeast
so collectively these developments will intensify flooding throughout south philly
where we have used where we used to have a permeable buffer at the golf course that
absorbed the water we will now have a giant concrete and plastic built environment that
endangers neighborhoods where people live so i'm asking that you please consider how many reasons
there are to mandate a viable alternative to the current iteration of this plan thank you for your
comments next hand please here we have someone by the name of shandell they have been unmuted and
allowed to speak sure hello how are you could you state your name please and spell for the court
stenographer. My name is Shandell Jackson. First name S-H-A-N-D-E-L-L. Last name Jackson. J-A-C-K-S-O-N.
You swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
I affirm. Are you a neighbor? Yes. Are you for this project or against? I am for this project.
Could you, we've had one other person testify today. Could you offer us anything different
than what you've already heard? I just want to say to y'all, this is a project. So this
for us this is our home family of many generations has come here this place is where our family gets
Family of many generations has come here. This place is where our family gets together and have family outings and have family day for us.
together and have out
The FDR Park could be better, have a better place for the youth, a place where we can say that our superstars started from their basketball or football career as children.
It's a shame that we have to travel to a place like the Chamonix Park when we actually have the great space here.
There are places like Lake Point in Georgia that serves 30 sports sports year round places like Grand Park that started on the cornfield and now has 26 baseball, softball, diamond, 31 multipurpose field of soccer, football and lacrosse and just added basketball and volleyball, not to mention having food and beverage service on their site and on site restaurant.
Why can't our youth have the same and share better things in life, especially when we have the area to do so?
There are plenty of athletics people from Philly, but one named Rasul Butler is currently from South Philadelphia.
Let's create more stars. The children deserve it, and we must start by making things better.
Thank you for taking the time to call us. We appreciate that.
Next hand, please.
Tara, the next person is Beatrice Zovich. They have been unmuted and allowed to speak.
I thank you. Could you state your name, please, and spell for the stenographer?
Yes, Beatrice Zovich. Beatrice is B-E-A-T-R-I-C-E, Zovich, Z-O-V-I-C-H.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Are you a neighbor?
Are you for this project or against?
Against.
Is there anything additional that you haven't heard to tell us?
Go ahead.
So I would like to draw your attention to the sports complex on city-owned land proposed to undergo a $2.5 billion renovation, which finds room for hotels, restaurants, and entertainment venues, but not a single field for our children, which is literally across the street from FDR Park.
I would also like to mention a vacant lot at 3100 South Christopher Columbus Boulevard, as well as a vacant lot just across Patterson Avenue at 3400 South Broad Street, both of which are over a million square feet.
When we zoom out and look at these vacant lots, it's clear that the city has space for recreational fields.
So why are we being forced to choose between our children and our natural resources?
Why is the city forcing more development in South Philly's most precious green space?
The city needs to do better. Please tell the Conservancy to go back to the drawing board.
This plan is not a good one. Thank you very much. Thank you for taking the time. Next hand, please.
Chair, the next person is Sherelle Robinson. They have been unmuted and allowed to speak.
Could you state your name, please, and spell for the stenographer?
Hi, my name is Sherelle Robinson. His first name is spelled S as in Sam, H-E-R-E-L-L, last name R-O-B-I-N-S-O-N.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
I affirm.
Are you a neighbor?
Yes, the same zip code.
Could you, are you for or against this project?
For the project.
You've heard a couple of people prior to you.
Is there anything additional you'd want to offer?
I'll try my best.
Generally, I feel that adding the improvements to FDR Park would actually contribute to making Philadelphia more resilient
against what it is facing and what it could face. And that's regarding quality of life,
the climate issues health-wise. I think it could be a sort of park-based intervention
on health in Philadelphia, because one of the top two causes in Philly is in relation to
cardiovascular issues and the disparities in the communities that are nearby that use the parks
will be positively affected. I think it's effective land management, climate-wise,
addressing the groundwater flooding, creating recreation access will improve the chronic
illnesses or even mental health outcomes of locals who come, like myself and my two children,
one who's neurodiverse. And actually improving health outcomes could probably improve quality
of life issues and community discourse from increased stress. And economically, I think
that it would be viewed as an extra amenity. It could invite other visitors, which obviously
would make money for local businesses and also improve the outside view of the area,
which we kind of have a bad rep right now, especially South Philly. Respectfully, I think
that it's a bit irresponsible to see the issues that FDR Park has seen progressively over time
and not be proactive. I think that plans for public spaces have to be in favor
of improving and maintaining all life, not just animal and plant life, human life as well.
human life as well. And we can do that with increased recreation space. Like there has to
And we can do that with increased recreation space. There has to be
be a balance, a balanced consideration of all inhabitants of the space, not just plant and
animal life in the space. And I think that the plan does that by keeping two thirds of the space
green. And but the but nature has to share. We have to inhabit the park as well. So one third
of the recreational space will help at least the 100 over 100,000 locals in the south part of
Philadelphia. And I think that lastly, just as we have to, sometimes we have to shed a historic tie
in order to make way for a better serving future. So just as we have to shed baby teeth to make room
for better serving teeth, so it'll help us take in more nourishment, I think FDR Park has to do
that and share. And I think disallowing the new bill could actually continue the confinement of
us into spaces that are hazardous, not functional, or spaces
that just don't support recreation. And that's not fair to us
who've been here our whole lives. Thank you very much for taking
the time to call us. We appreciate it. Next hand, please.
Next hand, Chair, is Fred Stein. They have been
unmuted. How many more hands do you see?
After Mr. Stein, we have 1, 2, 3, 4,
5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11.
Looks like 11 more heads after Mr. Stein's here.
Sir, could you please state your name and spell for the court's
phonographer?
It's Fred Stein, F-R-E-D-S-T-I-N-E.
I'm with the Delaware.
Go ahead.
Go ahead.
You go first.
Go ahead.
I was just launching right in, but I should swear in.
All right.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Are you a neighbor?
Are you a neighbor?
I am not.
No, I am not.
I work with an environmental organization, the Delaware Riverkeeper Network.
I do serve on a board in the community, the East with the neighbors.
Are you in favor of this project or against?
I'm against.
And you've heard a lot of testimony prior.
Is there anything additional you can offer?
Yes, I think I do.
So we've heard a lot of information about the environmental impact about building floodplains,
cutting down trees, and how that will impact flooding and stormwater runoff.
Much of my presentation was going to echo that, but to respect everyone's time,
I would only recommend that or add to that that many government agencies, universities, and entities throughout the region and the world agree with that.
In order to prepare for climate change and to create a sustainable green city, you have to maintain the natural environment.
And that comes from a Philadelphia city report called Growing Stronger Toward a Climate-Ready Philadelphia. They talk strongly about protecting open space and the natural environment.
And that's echoed by the Delaware Valley Regional Planning Commission in their cost effects of climate change in southeast Pennsylvania.
They reiterate that, and I could submit this written comment so these quotes from these entities are on the record.
Drexel University has put together a large consortium, including the city, and have come up with the same conclusion.
So it's not just coming from an environmental community perspective, but agencies and universities that are committed to protecting the public safety and health of the city are all in favor of protecting these trees and the hundreds and hundreds of more smaller ones that don't get the classification as heritage trees.
and all the hundreds of acres that will be lost by putting artificial turf down.
Cutting down the trees is not a sustainable practice.
Filling wetlands and natural meadows is not a sustainable practice.
Covering open space with artificial turf is not a sustainable practice.
FDR Park is already essentially a bathtub with elevated perimeters around Patterson Avenue, Broad Street, the enclaves and 95.
The Conservancy's plan will be filling, bringing in acre or many, many tons of earth to build these sports fields to take up space within that bathtub that's going to displace the water.
to take up space within that bathtub that's going to displace the water.
I would only want to, my final point would be is the youth of Philadelphia definitely need outdoor
recreational open space. The natural open space on the west side of the park can and does provide
that. There's no arguing that organized sports can benefit thousands of youth, but city residents
should not be forced to choose between natural open space that enhances their quality of life
and recreating on plastic surfaces that science has shown can cause its own health problems.
Thank you very much. Thank you for taking the time. Next hand, please.
Here we have Cameron Powell. They have been unmuted and allowed to speak.
Hi, could you please state your name and spell for the court stenographer?
Hi, this is Cameron Powell, C-A-M-E-R-O-N-P-O-W-E-L-L.
Right. Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Are you a neighbor?
Are you in favor of this project or against?
I'm against.
Okay. We've had a lot of testimony. Is there anything different that you could add?
First of all, just to say that it's dumb, right?
I mean, I would hope you could just give us more than it's dumb.
Well, I would if you'd allow me to keep speaking.
So it's dumb to say, hmm, we already have an entire portion of our lovely city
dedicated to sports arenas, Wells Fargo Center, the link, et cetera.
But we choose to demolish.
Now, I don't know anybody on the zoning board personally, but it seems that you folks must not be from Philadelphia because you would know that FDR Park is a local treasure.
Nothing like it in all the city.
And you choose to demolish and destroy this green space.
The zoning board doesn't do that.
The zoning board doesn't do that.
We're listening for testimony as to why you don't think it should.
the tree well it's a surprise to me because you guys aren't advocating against it once again
we're here on both sides that's what we're here for to hear both sides sir okay well no not okay
that's where we are we're here about one thing about the trees and that's okay it's about the
trees it it should be self-evident that there are better alternatives for this thing to happen
it's like
when you folks that get put
in these positions of power
you're against the project
thank you very much
next hand
Chair we have Judy Stepanowski
she's been unmuted
and allowed to speak
Hi could you state your name please
and spell for the court stenographer
do we see her hand yes miss stepanowski could you please unmute yourself
okay hi hi could you please state your name and spell for the court stenographer
judith stepanowski s-t-e-p as in paul e-n-a-s-k-i-e you swear or firm to tell the truth
the whole truth and nothing but the truth yes i do um are you a neighbor no i'm not
okay uh are you for this project or against the project opposed okay is there anything
additional than what we've already heard yes yes okay i'm i am a city resident and i've used
the park many times okay i'm a birder and one of the things fairmount park i mean fdr park is
one of the top three philadelphia birding areas based on the number of recorded species
228 species have been recorded in the park, many of them migratory with limited options for places to rest and feed in the area.
There's also a great number of breeding birds in the park.
Mature trees are extremely important to breeding and migratory birds.
And the biggest reason for the loss in bird life, we've had over 3 million birds lost in the U.S. since 1970.
The biggest reason is loss of habitat.
And these trees in FDR Park provide valuable bird habitat.
at the city of Philadelphia in.
The city of Philadelphia in 2002 signed on to the Urban Conservation Treaty for Migratory Birds.
This is a treaty with the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service, and the city of Philadelphia was the third city in the country to sign on to this treaty.
and by doing this there they said they would make a strong commitment to migratory bird conservation
um the treaty is dedicated to conserving birds in or passing through our cities through a variety
of means meaning habitat conservation primarily but also education um conservation and working
to conserve, protect, and restore and enhance the tree habitat. Philadelphia is positioned
along the Atlantic Flyway at the intersection of numerous migration routes, making it a
particularly important city in terms of the vast number of migrants passing through and
the need to ensure the availability of habitat where birds can quickly restore depleted energy
resources.
In 2009, the city made a renewal commitment to the Urban Bird Conservation Treaty, and
the city received a $70,000 grant funding as part of their commitment to restore, conserve,
and protect valuable bird habitat within Philadelphia.
um let's see um the taking of the mature trees is is totally contrary to philadelphia's role
and and as a signer of this treaty um mature trees are critical for supporting birds they
cannot simply be replaced by planting younger trees mature trees are also important in
fighting climate change. A tree takes about 30 years until it reaches maturity, at which point
it absorbs the most carbon dioxide from the atmosphere. Trees absorb about 40 percent of
the human-produced carbon dioxide from our atmosphere. By replacing mature trees with
smaller trees, they cannot compare in any way to the amount of carbon dioxide absorbed by the
mature trees. Mature trees also provide shade and cooling of the local environment.
South Philadelphia with the sports complex, which actually used to be, I've just recently learned,
the sports complex was part of FDR Park initially, and that was taken to develop
the sports stadiums.
South Philadelphia is
totally, almost
totally built
space, blacktop,
particularly with the sports stadiums
and the many parking lots nearby.
These contribute to
warming of the environment.
By taking
the trees, they are
going to be
reducing the cooling of the environment.
In particular with turf fields, it makes it even worse.
Turf fields are 30 to 55 degrees warmer than natural gas fields.
Thank you.
So obviously you gave us a lot of information.
We appreciate your call and appreciate the interest you have in this.
Could I have the next hand, please?
Chair, the next hand is Michael Schreiber. They have been unmuted and allowed to speak.
Sir, could you please state your name and spell for the court stenographer?
Mr. Schreiber.
Michael Schreiber.
Move to the next hand.
chair the next hand is dina willow they have been unmuted and allowed to speak
hello everyone how are you today hi could you please state your name and spell for the court
sonographer yes my name is dina willow d fidelto d-e-f-e-d-e-l-t-o i am a caretaker at the meadows
which was originally actually called the woodlands okay you swear well hold on one minute hold on
one minute. Do you swear or affirm? No, no, that's okay. Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth,
the whole truth and nothing but the truth? I do. So I'm going to try to, um, try to keep it
try to keep it short. I know. Are you a neighbor? Oh, I am. Yes. So not only am I a neighbor,
short. Are you a neighbor? Oh, I am. Yeah. So not only am I a neighbor,
but I'm a neighbor actually on both ends of the park. So growing up in Southwest Philadelphia
and Eastwick and then residing as an adult in South Philly and back and forth taking care of
my parents. Are you in favor of the project? I am a hundred percent against it. Okay. Could you tell
us something different than what we've already done? I can. I can. So I'm going to start by saying
that the pollution in the neighborhoods surrounding the parameter of FDR really is off the charts.
My father's dead, so are countless of my neighbors. One person in every household on my street has
died of cancer, and the rest are suffering with like debilitating issues, health issues.
The community surrounding the park are South and Southwest Philly, and we've actually been deemed
a cancer cluster. And all because we're in close proximity to the Sunoco Hilco refinery.
I mean, it's right across from FDR, literally. The Philadelphia Water Department, the sewage,
their chemical methane that burns constantly, the landfill that it was even built on,
our whole area, we're poisoned by the airport fuel and the radiation constantly.
And now that all those canopies of trees were cut down in front of I-95 at FDR, my God, it's like you can't even walk around that.
It's terrible.
I know we're living on DuPont illegal dumping grounds.
I mean, it's crazy, the area.
And FDR Park is literally just, it was this beautiful green space in a sea of concrete, right?
And I believe that our neighborhoods are under attack.
and the underprivileged children, they deserve nature and clean air too, okay? My father is dead.
I've had 26 surgeries because of this pollution. The only thing that is going to save us are those
heritage trees. We all know there's a lot of corruption. There's a lot of gaslighting. I mean,
it's just common sense. It doesn't take a genius, okay? But like, at what point do we say like,
guys, enough is enough. I'm telling you, we can't breathe. We can't open our windows.
You walk to your car, you have to cover your face in the morning. These trees are all that
saves us. And all the nonsense that is going on in our society today and everything that's
happening and all the chaos, this place truly was a sanctuary for the neighbors and for our
community and the wildlife there um that has that that calls that place home i mean there's that's
really all that's left the deer um the fox the eagle's nests i mean these are all part it's an
ecosystem and if you if you cut down these heritage trees if you continue destroying this
natural wetland and that and and that untouched developed woodlands if they continue to destroy
this like that's going to make our our community and our brothers and our sisters sicker and sicker
and then that turns into a genocide like this is my like this is my family i can't even get my mom
to move because she's too old and she doesn't want to leave her doctors and why are there why are
there real estate developers on the board of the fairmount park conservancy why are there real
estate developers i think i want to concentrate on on the trees in the park and okay well i just
appreciate everything you've said. Thank you. Thank you for hearing me. And another thing I
want to understand that we signed, I believe that the FPC signed a treaty with the Lenape
and a treaty of renewed friendship and that they're supposed to protect this land. They're
supposed to protect these trees. So how is this happening? You know, it's happening because the
same people who are on these boards are making a percentage of privatizing this land. They're
getting the percentage of it and that's insane you cannot you cannot defend our land if you're
getting a percentage to develop it miss willow i understand where you are on this and and and
thank you very much next hand please chair next hand is sarah anton they have been unmuted and
allowed to speak sure hi could you please state your name
Sarah, Anton, please unmute yourself.
Chair, I hear nothing.
Move on to the next hand, please.
Next, we have Kimberly Richards.
They have been unmuted and allowed to speak.
Hi, could you state your name, please, and spell for the court stenographer?
Kimberly Richards, please unmute yourself.
Hi, hello.
Hi, could you state your name, please, and spell for the court stenographer?
Hi, could you state your name, please, and spell for the court stenographer?
Hi, Kimberly Richards.
Hi, Kimberly Hitcher, K-I-M-B-E-R-L-Y-R-I-C-H-A-R-D-S.
Right, do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Are you a neighbor?
Are you in favor of this project or against?
I am in favor of this project.
We've had quite a bit of testimony. Is there anything different that you could offer?
um i believe so um i'm in favor of this project because like there was said before
uh this park is like a staple in the community for our family
pardon me um we bring our family there for fun games and just to get together just to get away
from some of the stuff and the trauma in our neighborhoods it's just a peaceful place for us
to be. I feel as though the project would be beneficial so we don't have to travel out of
our own community to have, you know, like a beautiful space or beautiful scenery that
we would have to go to other places. I feel as though the center, the space would be beneficial
to other parts of the community, especially for the youth, to bring us like a better morale
in the city with the youth. They have a lot of issues with gun violence and things like that,
and they always talk about how the youth don't have anywhere to go. I feel like this place
would be a central spot where youth can meet up. We could do youth activities. We could come together
as a community. We could do events. I know people are worried about like the trees. We can do events
where we could plant new trees, clean up the community, you know, have youth days, things like
that. I just feel like it'll make the community a better place. All right. Thank you for taking
the time to call us. We appreciate it. Next hand, please. Jared, the next hand is Carol
Petratus. They have been muted and allowed to speak. Hello. Hi, could you state your name,
please, and spell for the court stenographer? It's Carol Petratus, C-A-R-O-L, and then Petratus
is p-e-t-r-a-i-t-i-s right you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth nothing but the
truth i do are you a neighbor i am uh are you for this project or against it i'm against but i have
two sentences to say that are different from what other people have said you can say those two
sentences. Thank you. I'm a senior citizen that lives in the neighborhood. And this natural part
of the FDR park is the only accessible place that myself and my husband can go to, to be in
something approximating some wild nature. And that's the reason that we oppose the destruction
of these trees that support the whole environment
and area of FDR Park.
Thank you so much for taking the time to close.
Who's next?
Chair, we have Harrison Mace.
They have been allowed to speak.
Could you state your name, please,
and spell for the court stenographer?
Yep. Can you hear me?
Yeah, my name is Harrison Mace.
I don't know why it says maybe.
It's spelled H-A-R-R-I-S-O-N-M-A-C-E, Mace.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Are you a neighbor?
Are you for this or against?
Against.
Is there anything you're going to offer that we haven't heard?
Yep, definitely.
Go ahead.
Thank you.
Good afternoon, board.
My name is Harrison Mace.
I live near Broad and Ellsworth.
I'm an environmental justice professional, and this is the part that I take walks in for my mental health.
I want to thank you all for taking the time to listen to the public.
There haven't been a ton of meaningful ways for the public to express their concerns over time,
especially as more and more have surfaced, whether this version of the plan is the right one.
Sally McCabe of the Pennsylvania Horticultural Society,
recently honored for a sustainability award at Philly's only annual sustainability award ceremony,
talks about the difference between need-based design and asset-based design.
Needs-based community design focuses on deficits and looks to outside agencies for resources.
In contrast, asset-based community development focuses on honing and leveraging existing strengths within the community.
Looking at the world as a blank piece of paper for whatever you want to impose upon the people you are...
Looking at the world as a blank piece of paper for whatever you want to impose upon the people
you are charged with serving is an outdated approach to development. The current approach
is what got us into the climate crisis in the first place, and the Legislative and Oversight
Committee as part of city government just meant this month to learn how far off the city is
from meeting its 2050 carbon neutrality goal. I'd be happy to share more about this if it's
views to the board's decision. As mentioned by Adam earlier, the tree canopy declined a massive
6% between 2006 and 2018. Declined. And when the clear cutting of Cobbs Creek created countless
issues among neighbors, that number is not looking good from 2018. In fact, it was one of the reasons
council member and now majority leader Catherine Gilmore Richardson introduced the tree bill,
which passed unanimously. This legislation was created to act as the muscle behind the City
Council, the Office of Sustainability, and the organization Tree Philly to enforce the city's
stated goals around tree canopy. What should this law stand for? It represents something,
and your decision represents something too. It's 2024 today, and the time to consider what natural
and existing resources we have is more than overdue. I mean, even the fact that we are
discussing this very bill, which was passed in the time since this initial plan was conceived,
is testament to the fact that things change. No one on the Zoom will be alive by the time any
new saplings reach the level of climate sequestration that these 64-some-odd trees carry
today. And finally, because today the board is only considering the trees with this case,
I'd like you to require the Conservancy to revisit the drawing board around various alternatives that keep the trees in FDR around an asset-based design process.
Thank you for your consideration.
Thank you for your call.
Next hand, please.
Chair, we have Dan DiLoreto.
They have been unmuted.
How many more hands do you have?
We have five more, Chair.
Thank you very much.
Hi, could you state your name, please, and spell for the court stenographer?
the name has disappeared chair okay go the next hand the next person is praise
itica they have been unmuted and allowed to speak i could you state your name please and spell for
the court stenographer yes my name is praise itica first name p-r-a-i-s-e praises and praise the
lord last name spelled i d is in dog i k a i are firm to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing
but the truth i do are you a neighbor i'm not a neighbor but i'm nearby and i use the park often
and i have a favorite project are you in favor or against i'm 100 against it and i have new
information to share i am a youth i am a youth and i've heard a lot of discussion on community
but it is very clear and evident the community does not include the indigenous people who are
native to this land nor the non-humans and there is a general tone of human superiority which is
distressing and quite frankly disrespectful to see. The only reason why we're in a climate
crisis is because people put humans above everything else and I've heard a lot of statistics
given on climate change and what different conservancies are doing for or against it.
But what I will say is we will not survive climate change if we are unwilling to change.
We have forced the earth to change over and over again. And this is yet another
project that is asking the earth to do unreasonable things for the gain and the greed of very few.
And it's disappointing, but not surprising to see that this is happening again. People have
been cut off, people not being allowed to share their comments. And I think that says a lot more
about what the goal of the project is rather than it being for a community. It's for a couple of
people to have a little bit more money in their pockets. And that's unfortunate because if people
will not center the earth in our projects going forward, none of us will be able to have a
comfortable life. So people need to be willing to be uncomfortable and become more creative with
thinking about what community spaces can look like if we all want to live long lives, not just
me as a youth, not just you as seniors or older people. We all need a place to live, and at the
end of the day, we cannot and we will never be able to create another earth. Thank you, and that's
all I have to say. Thank you for taking the time to call. Next hand, please. Chair, we have Anastasia
they have been unmuted and allowed to speak
Hello.
hello hi could you state your name please
Hi, could you state your name, please, and spell for the court stenographer?
Sure. My name is Anastasia Vrtsjanova. My last, my first name is spelled A-N-A-T-A-S-S-I-A, last name V-E-R-T-J-A-N-O-V-A.
Right. Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Are you a neighbor?
Are you in favor of this project or against?
I am against.
Is there anything different that you have to offer at this point than what we've heard?
Please.
I hear a lot of the support for this project being in favor of the youth and for them to have recreational space.
I strongly agree with that.
I think it's very important.
I also spend time at this park and I see the children engaging with the play space.
I see that development, and I believe it's very important for children to have that green space.
We have a lot of other places in the city that have that.
Additionally, I was at the Lenape Prey ceremony for these trees and specifically was watching these children play, climb, interact,
which is something that I don't think can be done with recreational sports in this space.
Finally, I want to request that the board pay attention not only to the things that have been said by the citizens here who are for or against, but also to please pay attention to both the number of residents who are in opposition to this, as well as who is in opposition.
it's it's the neighbors it's those of us that live here um while uh many who are in support
are people who are affiliated with some of these uh sport leagues and people who can profit from
this so i really again urge the zoning board to pay attention uh to specifically um the the number
of people who are concerned and who care about the space thank you so much thank you for taking
the time to call us next hand chair we have lady danny morinich they have been unmuted and allowed
to speak how could you state your name please and spell for the course ethnographer
lady danny morinich please unmute yourself
danny morenick d-a-n-n-i last name m-o-r-i-n-i-c-h right do you swear or affirm to tell
the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth i do are you a neighbor i am not but i am
a local forager that has led over three dozen foraging walks in the park okay all right um
are you in favor of this project or against i'm against right we've had tremendous amount of
test money. I only need one minute, 30 seconds of your time, sir. You can have one minute,
30 seconds of my time, please. Thank you very much. There's a group in South Philly that
recycles human waste into universally usable product. It's eco-friendly, free, and the kind
of group that Mayor Parker would want to use as part of her clean and green initiative. But instead
of embracing it, it's being destroyed. And the group, they're called trees. Trees absorb the
carbon dioxide we exhale via photosynthesis and create oxygen. And as an added benefit,
they sequester carbon, keeping the area cooler, fix the soil, and filter water to keep it from
flooding into our sewer system. The leaves remove dangerous pollution, especially in neighborhoods
close to the highways, and can reduce ailments like asthma and heart disease, which are responsible
for about 5% of deaths worldwide. And older trees do this more effectively than the newly planted.
South Philadelphia is one of the hottest areas of the city, and the heat island effects can raise temperatures up to 22 degrees hotter than leafy suburban areas.
Removal of trees will increase that heat.
The International Journal of Environmental Research and Public Health published an impact study of green space on violent crime in urban environments in 2019.
It synthesized findings of 45 papers deducing that the presence of parks and other green spaces reduces urban crime, specifically gun crime.
And that was echoed by a 2022 UPEM study that found a direct correlation between more trees and fewer shootings.
Based on this evidence, I would suggest that it's not a warehouse of artificial fields that we need in South Philly, but to plant and more importantly, preserve our large heritage trees.
Thank you.
Thank you for taking the time to call us.
Next hand.
Chair, we have Randy Holman.
They have been unmuted and allowed to speak.
Hi, could you please state your name?
Hello, my name is Randolph Holman, that's R-A-N-D-O-L-P-H, Holman, H-O-L-M-A-N.
Do you swear or affirm the tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Yes, I do.
Yes, I do.
Are you a neighbor, sir?
Correct, I am.
Are you for this project or against?
I am for this project.
Is there anything that you haven't heard yet that you could offer differently?
So I've been a lifelong resident of South Philadelphia.
I grew up in the area and I am one of the original members of the Anderson
Monarchs baseball team.
And on that same field, right, where I had the opportunity to play baseball,
gain lifelong friendships and learn sports and in the teachings of Jackie
Robinson, right, which I still use today.
On that field also was discovered a young lady named Monet Davis, right?
She went on to become famous around the country for playing baseball, one of the first female pitchers in Little League baseball and gained recognition for the whole city in this area for being an athlete.
And she's going on to do great things. Right. So that opportunity would not have been there if we didn't have those great parks and recreation fields that were maintained for us to play and become better athletes.
and in return become better people and better citizens, right?
So I'm advocating for the places for young people to grow,
not just in athletics, but in life, right?
This opportunity to have these fields, right,
that are not going to be affected by maybe like a rainstorm
where, okay, we can't enjoy the field today because it's flooded, right?
We want to give those kids opportunities to grow.
Right. And I think with this project, we can do that. Right.
And I think that long term solutions will be great for the community, not just the surrounding community, but but the city and further.
Because I noticed that. So those fields that's there, the baseball fields, Richie Ashburn and now called Dick Allen field.
I was one of the first teams to play on those fields. Right.
When the Phillies advocated and they gave you money, we played on those fields, right?
Much different than playing in Mary Anderson Recreation Center.
It was well-maintained, just like Mary Anderson was, thanks to Steve Bandura.
Those fields were well-maintained, and they've created a lot of great people,
not just athletes, but people, right?
And I think we can continue to do that, right, with more great spaces for athletics to grow.
Right. And I think it's a return on the city investment, not just not just for the local area, but for everyone.
When the city, when South Philly does well, I think, you know, everyone surrounding what does well.
Right. I've lived there my whole life. Like we know about Sunoco.
Right. We know about the congestion at the ballparks bring.
But don't forget, we love that. We love our force teams. Right.
We love the Phillies. We love the Flyers, Sixers and definitely love the Eagles.
and no complaints when that stadium sold out on a Sunday.
We all love it.
We can't wait for a Sunday.
So we shouldn't have a problem to see those fields flooded with people,
not water with people, over there having a good time playing sports.
That's how I feel.
I'm Randolph Holman, and I am for the athletic fields.
Mr. Holman, thank you for your call.
We appreciate you calling in.
Thank you.
Yvette?
Chair, we have Susan Patron.
they have been muted and allowed to speak
hi could you please state your name and spell for the court stenographer
my name is susan patrone s-u-s-a-n p-a-t-r-o-n-e right do you swear or affirm to tell the truth
the whole truth nothing but the truth i do are you a neighbor yes i am uh are you in favor of
this prosecutor against? I am opposed. Okay. And I know that you oppose it. Is there anything
different that you haven't heard yet today? Well, I, first of all, I, everyone has covered
most of the points. So I would just like to make one. Sure. I am a past president of Pashunk
Square Civic Association and also past president of Columbus Square Advisory Council. So I,
I know I'm familiar with a lot of what is process and what isn't.
I would just like to say that Barbara Capozzi and Lindsay Scantopico had covered very well what needs still to be covered in this process related to the RCOs.
I want to urge ZBA to deny this special exception and to bring it back to the civics, to the RCOs, and continue and make it.
to the civics, to the RCOs, and continue and make it even a more transparent process.
Thank you.
Thank you for taking the time to call us.
We appreciate it.
Yvette?
Chair, we have Noah Sturridge.
They've been unmuted and allowed to speak.
Could you please state your name and spell for the court stenographer?
Noah Sturridge?
go to the next hand please chair the next hand is sarah anton they've been unmuted and allowed to speak
I see it, but she's not a muting chair, Sarah Anton.
Oh, right after Patron. Do you love it?
Hi, could you state your name, please, and spell for the course stenographer?
sarah and time
chair i'm not getting any reply
go to the next hand
we have scott stallone they have been unmuted
hi could you state your name please and spell for the court stenographer
my name is scott stallone s-c-o-t-t-s-t-a-l-l-o-n-e
right do you swear a firm to tell the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth
Are you a neighbor?
Are you in favor or against this project?
Dead set opposed, 100%.
Okay. Is there anything different you can offer than what we've heard?
A little bit. I'd like to rebut one of the prior comments, and that is specifically in reference to what happens on game day during Eagles season with regards to the FDR park.
It is left in a shambles. It is overrun by SUVs. People drive up on the grass. They destroy the place.
That is the mentality of the people who come to the park on Sundays from out of the area, from wherever they're coming, is I own a home in South Philadelphia.
I have maintained a separate office in South Philadelphia in a building owned by P. Agnes.
He is one of the largest developers in South Philadelphia for the last 21 years.
This is not good news for the residents of South Philadelphia.
This will bring all kinds of problems, environmentally, traffic.
We know about the PFAS.
This is a mess.
There are other places.
Nobody here is opposed to group sports.
I am an avid Philadelphia sports fan.
I love our teams.
I watch as many.
I consume as much as I can.
But when it comes down to having the space to do what it is that we need to do,
there's got to be a better way than this proposed project thank you thank you for taking on the
calls for that how many hands you have of that chair we have no more hands okay thank you um
planning commission well sorry one moment uh i think nicole um not nicole chair the hands that
are up are on the list right no no no there was one other one um noah noah yes he was trying to
get back on.
Noah Sturgis, please unmute yourself and wait for the chair.
Hi, Noah.
Noah Sturgis, please unmute yourself and wait for the chair.
I'm still not getting any replies here.
All right.
Thank you.
No other hand, no other hands that were on our list, right?
Not on the list.
Planning commission.
Thank you, Chair Bergman.
And good afternoon, David Fecto, F-E-C-T-E-A-U.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth?
Yes, sir.
Please proceed.
Thank you, sir.
Chairman and members of the board, the comprehensive plan recommends no change to the special purpose open space at this location.
This proposal enables the development of a major component of the Franklin Delano Roosevelt Park Master Plan after initial phases have already been completed or are underway.
The appellant has shown that the proposed project cannot be practically redesigned to protect the heritage trees that are currently on site.
the city planning commission recommends that the board grant the proposed special exception
for removal of 48 heritage trees the uh the board will take this under consideration
The the board will take this on the consideration and vote on this.
Excuse me, Mr. Chair, we should allow council of the applicant to respond to the testimony briefly and the planning recommendation if they wish, and then we can we can close the record.
Thank you. Please proceed. Which one? Matt?
Yeah, Mr. Chairman, thank you. I'm going to be very brief. A couple of things, just to correct the record. Plans were actually received by the RCOs back in October. Later at the request, we spent several hundred dollars, I think close to a thousand to set large printed color plans in multiple copies in November because I guess the electronic copies weren't good enough.
but we did that at Ardine. Again, we're proceeding here at Bowers Bar as Pro Voto Council because of
our support of this project. There were also 300 neighbors that signed petitions in support of the
project. We didn't have their names, but I just would like to confirm that they're part of the
record themselves, and they were a part of Kenyatta Johnson's support, those petitions that
one in um on the um issue of no reasonable alternative we totally agree with the planning
commission's uh opinion and we think that the the testimony that we got from our all our ecological
witnesses and landscape architects and like i think support that very well there's a lot of
competing concerns here on this site and we believe that we're approaching this in a very responsible
Pacific way. As for operational concerns about safety and traffic, they really do not relate
to the removal of heritage trees, obviously the removing of a tree. Here we're removing 48
heritage trees and replacing them with 1,000. That doesn't cause traffic. It's about removal
of trees. So again, there's over 1,000 additional trees that are being planted. I would note there
There was no refuting of the issues with the RCO meeting.
There was no refuting the fact that there were actually probably well over 100, if not more than 100, people that weren't able to vote at the meeting itself, even though they were clearly from the neighborhood.
Or that there were people who may not even be from the neighborhood, let alone the city, that got to vote because they were able to pay 25 hours.
Obviously, that's not how we're supposed to be running civic meetings, or at least we disagree with that approach.
um comments like we don't need people more people coming into the neighborhood we we find are very
sad obviously it's important these these fields are close by to public transportation which this
field is uh as a kid i used to go to fdr park and i didn't live in south philadelphia so i think it's
wonderful that we're having this opportunity um toxic issues regarding poisoning kids and pfas
Again, that has nothing to do with the issue at hand. And obviously, we refute the characterization, whether the fields are grass or whether they're artificial turf does not affect the issue of having to remove the trees in order to have the fields in order to deal with the plain need.
And the Parks and Rec Deputy Commissioner testified at the last time.
And then just to kind of remind folks here, because there's been a lot of stats that have been thrown out,
and maybe it's misinformation or, you know, a lot of things go out on the Internet that just aren't true.
The park's about 348 acres.
42 of those 340 acres are going to be used for fields in court.
105 acres are going to be used for wetlands and meadows.
64 acres actual water and again over a thousand trees are going to be planted so we rely upon
the testimony and evidence we prevent presented obviously we support the planning commission's
decision and thank councilman council president johnson for his support as well as the administration
thank you thank you um we're going to take this to next wednesday in our executive session
and uh in the next day or so all the letters that we received all the emails our council's
going to have them sent all the board members so that we can all review before next week's
meeting and we will vote on this next wednesday at 9 30 a.m and thank you to everybody who
all the time you spent waiting and um and council we thank you too thank you everyone
thank you mr chairman members of the board thank you
Thank you.
Thank you to the staff today for all the time you spent here.
We appreciate it.
Our pleasure, Chair.
Have a good night.
Good night, all.
Good night, team.
Good night.
Good night, everybody.