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Minutes

Committee Hearing, May 24, 2005

Philadelphia City Council Committee HearingsMay 24, 2005

People mentioned

Names our system found in this transcript. Automatically extracted, so it can include anyone named in the record, not only officials or parties.

- - - COUNCIL OF THE CITY OF PHILADELPHIA PUBLIC HEARING - COMMITTEE ON RULES - - - Room 400, City Hall Philadelphia, Pennsylvania Tuesday, May 24, 2005, 10:28 a.m. - - - BILL 050230 - An Ordinance amending Title of The Philadelphia Code, entitled 10 "Zoning and Planning," by amending Chapter 14-200 entitled "Residential 11 Districts," by amending requirements relating to courts in certain 12 Residential Districts, under certain terms and conditions. 13 BILL 050232 - An Ordinance amending Title 14 of 14 The Philadelphia Code, entitled "Zoning and Planning," by increasing the permissible height for fences located on the front lot line of certain properties in residential districts; and by permitting certain architectural embellishments on fences; all under certain terms and conditions. BILL 050233 - An Ordinance amending Title 14, Entitled "Zoning and Planning," to add definitions for certain architectural features that are commonly located on residential - - - V A R A L L O Incorporated Litigation Support Services 1835 Market Street, Suite 600 Philadelphia, Pennsylvania 19103 215.561.2220 215.567.2670 2 buildings, and to permit said architectural features on residential buildings located in residentially zoned districts, under certain terms and conditions. BILL 050339 - An Ordinance to amend the Philadelphia Zoning Maps by changing the zoning designations of certain areas of land located within an area bounded by Bridge Street, Tacony Street, a line 245 feet north of Sanger Street, the Delaware River and the Frankford Creek. BILL 050285 - An Ordinance to amend the Philadelphia Zoning Maps by changing the zoning designations of certain areas of land located within an area bounded by Essington Avenue, 67th Street, the Delaware River and the former Pennypacker Avenue. PRESENT: COUNCIL PRESIDENT ANNA C. VERNA COUNCILMAN DARRELL L. CLARKE COUNCILMAN DiCICCO COUNCILMAN JACK KELLY COUNCILMAN JAMES F. KENNEY COUNCILMAN RICHARD T. MARIANO COUNCILWOMAN DONNA REED MILLER COUNCILMAN MICHAEL NUTTER COUNCILWOMAN BLONDELL REYNOLDS-BROWN 3 Rules - 5/24/05 - - - P R O C E E D I N G S - - -

Council President Verna

Good morning, everyone. This is the public hearing of the Committee of the Whole. I'm sorry. Committee on Rules. I'm very anxious, believe me. I am so anxious for this budget to be behind us. Can we go to the Committee of the Whole and consider the budget? (Laughter.)

Council President Verna

Okay. I would ask Tommie Ericson to please read the title of Bill Number 050285. CLERK: An ordinance to amend the Philadelphia Zoning Maps by changing the zoning designations of certain areas of land located within an area bounded by Essington Avenue, 67th Street, the Delaware River and the former Pennypacker Avenue.

Council President Verna

Okay. Good morning. Excuse me, please. It has been called to my attention that someone 4 Rules - 5/24/05 would like me to indicate for the record who is present. To my immediate left is Councilman Clarke, to my immediate right Councilman Kenney, Councilman Mariano, Councilwoman Miller and Councilwoman Brown. So, we have a quorum. Okay. Please identify yourself --

Mr. Kelsen

Good morning --

Council President Verna

-- and proceed with your testimony.

Mr. Kelsen

-- Council President, members of the committee. Peter Kelsen, on behalf of the O'Neill property group.

Council President Verna

Excuse me. You're going to have to pull the microphone closer to you.

Mr. Kelsen

How's that, Council person.

Council President Verna

Much better.

Mr. Kelsen

Before I begin, let me introduce, Mr. Kevin Silver from O'Neill Property Group, who's with me today. 5 Rules - 5/24/05

Mr. Silver

Good morning.

Council President Verna

Good morning.

Mr. Kelsen

Mr. Lamont Shaw, as well.

Mr. Shaw

Good morning.

Mr. Kelsen

Council President, before I begin, I would like to hand up a proposed amendment to this bill that includes an additional parcel in the remapping. This has been discussed with technical staff, the Planning Commission, and if I may, I'd like to hand it up now, Council President.

Council President Verna

Okay.

Mr. Kelsen

Members of the committee, we are pleased to present to you a request for rezoning of the property which is bounded by 67th Street, Essington Avenue and the Schuylkill River. It is approximately a 50 acre parcel. We are requesting remapping to C-3 commercial, in order to allow the redevelopment of this blighted site for a 6 Rules - 5/24/05 viable community shopping center. The property, as we will indicate to you in a moment, consists of a vacant, deteriorated and blighted former industrial use. Members of the committee, it is environmentally impaired, having been used as junkyard and salvage yard. And our proposal is to reestablish it for a state of the art retail shopping center, containing approximately half a million square feet. We believe, and in meeting with the community and the Planning Commission and other constituent groups, that this development would not only create a viable shopping center at this location, but maybe more importantly, act as a catalyst to create development along Essington Avenue in areas that are extremely blighted. We would like to suggest to the committee that development of this center would create a minimum of 500 new, permanent jobs; create approximately 150 to 200 construction jobs; and generate fiscal -- 7 Rules - 5/24/05

Council President Verna

Sorry. How many construction jobs?

Mr. Kelsen

Approximately 150 to 200, Council President. The net impact to the City would be additional taxes in excess of $2 million a year, even during the tax abatement period. This is contrasted with about... And I know during budget time that's a very important number -- This is contrasted with about $50,000 a year in taxes generated by the existing blighted site. We've met extensively with the community. And I'm pleased to say that the Eastwick PAC and others readily support this application. They see it as we see it, as a gateway to the renaissance of Essington Avenue and the Eastwick area. In terms of our developer, O'Neill Property Group is a premier developer. They are responsible for the renaissance of Conshohocken Waterfront through the Millennium Project, a project that includes probably a half a billion dollars of private 8 Rules - 5/24/05 and government investment to stabilize that area. That was also a former industrial site that is now a mixed use site for residential, retail and commercial. I'm handing out a brochure that details our developer, as well as the proposed use. In addition, they were selected as the master redeveloper of Norristown, in order to reposition that critical hub for renovation and redevelopment. Finally, in Montgomery County, as well as in Bucks County, they have created over half a billion dollars, approximately, of new retail and commercial development in former brownfield sites, adding extensively to the tax base, employment base and overall quality of life of those areas. If the committee has any questions, we would be happy to answer them at this time.

Council President Verna

Thank you. I know that there have been numerous 9 Rules - 5/24/05 community meetings, and that the community has given me a letter in writing saying that they fully support this.

Mr. Kelsen

Thank you, Council person.

Council President Verna

Can you tell us if any tenants have been lined up for this project?

Mr. Kelsen

Council President --

Council President Verna

If so, who are they?

Mr. Kelsen

I can tell you that no 14 definitive tenants have been lined up at this time. The project is being marketed to a wide variety of tenants. And if I could give the committee an illustration of the types of tenants that we have been seeking and working with: For example, Target, Lowes. We have been working with Circuit City, Best Buy, a number of retail development opportunities such as Starbucks, local banks, et cetera. Council President, no formal tenant has been 10 Rules - 5/24/05 signed at this time. And one of the reasons for that is because until the property is zoned to permit the use, tenants are really reluctant to commit for a letter of intent purpose.

Council President Verna

Well, it is my hope that the developer will definitely keep the community involved, and that you have their input because I think they're very concerned as to what would be developed there.

Mr. Kelsen

Council President, I have given my word to the community and to staff that during the process we will continue to dialogue and involve the community in our thoughts, as well as our efforts to market the site, as well as to develop the site. So, there will in fact be ongoing community --

Council President Verna

I know it was mentioned that the developer was trying to get Bocsov's to locate there. Has there been any movement on that?

Mr. Kelsen

Mr. Silver, I'm going 11 Rules - 5/24/05 to ask you if you can answer that.

Mr. Silver

Council President, no, there hasn't been any further movement on that. We're continuing to pursue that through our retail brokerage company that we've retained. And we're hopeful that in the next six weeks or so we might be able to get some movement on that front.

Council President Verna

Do we have any indication as to when we will see something actually starting to get built and just when the completion date you anticipate will be?

Mr. Silver

Yes. As part of the remediation of the property, we're obligated, as per our consent order with Pennsylvania DEP, to have the site cleaned up within a year from the date of closing for the entirety of the assemblage which is going to be happening within the next week or so. So by a year from today the salvage operations will be completely cleaned off. The car carcasses, if you will, will be gone and the remediation will have been largely 12 Rules - 5/24/05 completed, if not fully completed, with the exception of continuing groundwater monitoring. During that time, simultaneously we're going to be preparing the site for the site development of the premises. And construction, we hope, will be able to commence within around the same time frame. And it should have about a to 11 month construction period, as soon as we get 12 into the ground. So we're hopeful that 13 within two years or so, give or take a couple 14 of months, we ought to have a thriving, 15 vibrant center. 16

Council President Verna

And there 17 was a traffic study conducted? 18

Mr. Kelsen

Yes, Council President. We retained the services of an independent traffic engineering firm who confirmed that the site would not have any negative traffic impact with this development. We will, of course, continue to meet with the Planning Commission and Streets Department as the site plan evolves, to 13 Rules - 5/24/05 ensure that they're satisfied with our engineering. A copy of the report that I've given you, Council President, as well as to the committee, has been provided to your staff and to the community.

Council President Verna

Thank you very much. Are there any questions from members of the committee? The Chair recognizes Councilman Kenney.

Councilman Kenney

Thank you, Madam President. First of all, I'd like to thank O'Neill Properties for their continued interest in the City. I know it's a very viable and well-known organization. They have done great work in the suburbs and the counties. So we're happy to have you continue to develop here.

Mr. Silver

Thank you.

Councilman Kenney

And obviously you're professionals at this, so you look at 14 Rules - 5/24/05 that site and you see it; have a vision for what it could be. I just have to ask you as to what potential you think the surrounding activities have, not only on -- Obviously you think that your project will be successful regardless of what's there. But what do you think the future use of those, you know, waste disposal pits and sumps and old decaying industrial equipment, underground storage tanks and the operating junkyard... Do you see the potential for that use to change and improve? And how difficult will it be to get that done?

Mr. Silver

Well, generally speaking, when we come into a community and invest, particularly in a large-scale brownfields remediation like this one, we oftentimes are successful in creating a new aura for the community, where it chases away a lot of these nuisance uses. And even though we can't control anything outside of our site, we're confident that because we're going -- this is going to 15 Rules - 5/24/05 be a draw for the community where people are going to be coming from all different areas in Philadelphia and in the counties, that it will create a negative incentive for those uses to continue. We're directly attacking, you know, a lot of the salvage operations on the Essington Avenue side. So, we're solving that problem directly within this assemblage. And we're hopeful that our development will be able to have a positive impact on the balance of the block.

Councilman Kenney

Some of the stuff that I see in your handout deals with old industrial sites, so you have experience doing that. So I guess at some point you could possibly have the increased vision or extended vision of seeing those other areas perhaps developed either -- I don't know whether or not residential is doable or light industrial or retail. But I mean, is there a kind of a --

Mr. Silver

Yeah. We've had a 16 Rules - 5/24/05 history of when we invest in an area, that we usually look at very seriously add-on properties to create an additional critical mass. And we would certainly intend to do so in the future, particularly if any of the other property parcels become available.

Councilman Kenney

Because I know that Southwest Philly has suffered for many years under -- you know, having location -- many locations for these kind of activities. And looking at your proposal for the shopping center, and then knowing your track record, it seems like a really good day, moving forward, for Southwest Philly in that area. So I congratulate you and thank you for your involvement.

Mr. Kelsen

Thank you, Councilman. Councilman, just to add one brief word on that, I have found in the land use area that once a use like this goes into 50 acres -- it's a very sizable chunk of property -- the values of properties become impacted in a good way. 17 Rules - 5/24/05 And people come in and they realize that these negative blighted sites are not appropriate. And I think we're excited about the opportunity to sort of anchor that portion of it.

Councilman Kenney

So your development will increase the value of these questionable -- not questionable uses, but not exactly attractive uses for the neighborhood, increase the value to the point where the owners may decide it would be better maybe to sell it and go.

Mr. Kelsen

Well, that's what we're hopeful of, yes.

Councilman Kenney

Okay. Great.

Council President Verna

Certainly. And for the benefit of the members of the committee, I would just like to call to your attention that this 50 acre parcel is directly across the street from the Auto Mall. I think you would recognize the Auto Mall area, and that's where it's located. I would like the record to reflect that Councilman O'Neill has joined us. 18 Rules - 5/24/05 And the Chair recognizes Councilman Clarke.

Councilman Clarke

Thank you, Madam President. Good morning, gentlemen.

Mr. Kelsen

Good morning, Councilman.

Councilman Clarke

In terms of how far along you are in this project, have you selected the general contractor yet?

Mr. Silver

We have not. We are in the site engineering phase at the moment.

Councilman Clarke

Right. In your discussions with the local community and other members -- I don't know if you work with any people from the City. Have you talked about the opportunities for Philadelphians on the construction side?

Mr. Silver

It's a bit premature to get into specifics of that, but we have assured the Eastwick PAC, and any of the other personnel from the City, that we fully intend to employ local personnel as much as we can. That would be also true in our 19 Rules - 5/24/05 selection of the general contractor.

Councilman Clarke

Do you have a process that you've developed?

Mr. Silver

We don't have a formal process, but we made it known and when we put out our RFP for the construction general contractor selection process we have no 9 problem in inputting that because that's our intention anyway.

Councilman Clarke

That as a part of your RFP process you will, although it can't be obviously a requirement, but there will be some language to speak of goals, as it relates to local Philadelphia opportunity, particularly in the local community?

Mr. Silver

Yes, that's correct.

Councilman Clarke

All right. In terms of long-term employment, and traditionally in these types of operations people tend to hire people from the local community. Do you have a component as a part of your development strategy that will ensure that people are job ready? I know one of the 20 Rules - 5/24/05 things that, some instances, we have a development comes up and there are people not in the local community that have not been prepared adequately for the type of opportunities that will arise.

Mr. Kelsen

Let me answer that. Councilman Clarke, as part of our discussions with Eastwick PAC, we specifically indicated that we will create a job fair, so to speak.

Councilman Clarke

Okay.

Mr. Kelsen

To advise the community of job opportunities that the retailers will make available. These are post construction jobs. And to allow the community to be involved in a preferential hiring program. As long as the people are qualified, they will be given opportunity. So we, in fact, as part of our initial discussions with Eastwick PAC, discussed this, and we're committed to that process.

Councilman Clarke

Great. Okay. Thank you, Madam President.

Council President Verna

Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilman 21 Rules - 5/24/05 O'Neill.

Councilman O'Neill

Thank you, Madam President. I'd like to thank Mr. Kelsen, first of all, for giving me a courtesy call, where he pretty much went through all this. I just want to tell him that had he told me it was O'Neill Properties doing it -- and they're no relation -- but I have high regard for their work and their successes and their turnarounds. I would have even been in more of a hurry to get here for this hearing. Thank you.

Mr. Kelsen

Thank you, Councilman.

Council President Verna

Thank you. Are there any other questions or comments from members of the committee?

Mr. Kelsen

Madam President, I would just request, if I could, a suspension of the rules so that we could move forward on this project.

Council President Verna

Thank you. We will certainly consider that.

Mr. Kelsen

And we thank you so 22 Rules - 5/24/05 very much for your time and consideration, members of Council.

Council President Verna

And I want to thank you for all of your involvement with the community. I think that's extremely important. And I certainly want to wish you well. I think this is going to be a great shot in the arm for the entire City.

Mr. Kelsen

We thank you for your assistance.

Council President Verna

Thank you again.

Mr. Kelsen

Thank you.

Council President Verna

May we hear from -- Just a moment, please. The Chair recognizes Councilman Clarke.

Councilman Clarke

Thank you. One last question. Are you looking for any other opportunities? (Laughter.)

Mr. Kelsen

Absolutely, Councilman.

Council President Verna

Yes, All of the other property that's adjacent to this. 23 Rules - 5/24/05

Councilman Clarke

After you take care of Council President's project. We have some vacant land up in North Philadelphia.

Mr. Kelsen

We'll be back to you on that one.

Councilman Clarke

Okay. Fair enough.

Council President Verna

Thank you. Thank you very much. Thank you. May we hear from City Planning, please.

Mr. Chapman

Good morning, Madam President and members of the Rules Committee. My name is Thomas Chapman. I am the Director of the Development Planning Division for the City Planning Commission. I'm here today to testify on Bill 19 Number 050285. Rather than burden the record with repetitive testimony, Mr. Kelsen has already stated much of what my testimony was about. May I just say that the Planning Commission at its meeting of May 12, 2005, considered this bill and recommended that it 24 Rules - 5/24/05 be approved. One comment, partly in response to Councilman Kenney's question. I would expect that if this property does get developed, that you should see --

Council President Verna

Please don't say if. Say when.

Mr. Chapman

When. When this property becomes developed, that there will be an increase in value in adjacent sites, and that there would be renewed interest in various types of development along that stretch of Essington Avenue. I -- I don't -- I don't know that I would say that you'd see interest in residential development, but certainly -- certainly retail, additional retail; perhaps light industrial; possibly even hotel.

Council President Verna

Thank you.

Mr. Chapman

Thank you.

Council President Verna

Any questions of City Planning? (No response.)

Council President Verna

Thank you. 25 Rules - 5/24/05 At this time I would ask Mr. Ericson to please read the title of Bill Number 050230. CLERK: An ordinance amending Title of The Philadelphia Code, entitled "Zoning 7 and Planning," by amending Chapter 14-200 8 entitled "Residential Districts," by amending 9 requirements relating to courts in certain 10 Residential Districts, under certain terms 11 and conditions. 12

Council President Verna

Thank you. 13 Mr. Chapman. 14

Mr. Chapman

Good morning once again, Madam President, and members of the Rules Committee. My name is Thomas Chapman. I'm the Director of the Development Planning Division for the City Planning Commission. And I'm here today to testify on Bill Number 050230. Council members Mariano and DiCicco introduced this bill on March 31st of this year. This bill amends Section 14-200 of The Philadelphia Zoning Code, by eliminating Rules - 5/24/05 minimum size requirements for courts in the R-1 residential district through the R-10-B residential districts. While the Code does not require courts, when they are used they must be of a certain minimum width. Courts can be created by the simple addition of two bay windows or two dormers for residential property. In both instances, space between is considered a court and must meet minimum dimensional requirements which normally is 12 feet. The interpretation of what constitutes a court is one of the reasons why so many new homes are not able to meet some of the requirements of the zoning code. This slows down the development process, contributes to the backlog of cases at the Zoning Board of Adjustment and delays new development. This is one of the many antiquated provisions of the Zoning Code that serve little purpose today. The elimination of the minimum court 27 Rules - 5/24/05 width requirement was specifically recommended by the Building Industry's Association's report which was issued in 2004. The Planning Commission, at its meeting of April 14, 2005, recommended that Bill Number 050230 be approved. That concludes my testimony. I'd be happy to answer any questions of the committee.

Council President Verna

Does L & I agree with this? Do we have L & I here to testify?

Mr. Chapman

L & I is here.

Council President Verna

Good morning.

Mr. Haigler

Good morning. Good day, Council President Verna and members of the committee. I am Otis Haigler, Jr., Director of Legislative Affairs for the Department of Licenses and Inspections. Today I'm here to provide testimony on Bill 050230, which, if enacted, will amend 28 Rules - 5/24/05 Chapter 14-200 of the Zoning Code, related to inner courts located on residential properties. The Department of Licenses and Inspections, in its efforts to streamline the regulatory process, to improve the service provided to our stakeholders, from time to time conducts internal reviews of its operations and codes that are enforced by the department, to determine if a certain code requirement or operational function no longer serves its intended purpose. Because of advances in building design, technology, and model code adoptions, certain zoning code requirements or operational functions may no longer be applicable to its intended purpose or it's initial purpose, and in fact, may have become impediments to develop in the City. With regard to the requirement of Section 14-204, subsection 2 of the Zoning Code, related to inner courts and residential occupancies, the initial intent of this provision was to address concerns during a 29 Rules - 5/24/05 period in the early 1900s when tenement housing, having no ventilation or natural lighting, was the norm, and the building codes of that time did not address this type of problem. This condition was highlighted in the October 2004 report of the Building Industry Association of Philadelphia. Through the evolution of building design and code updates, the provision that was first enacted to address concerns related to ventilation and lighting no longer applies to its intended purpose. The inner court requirement, as currently enforced by the department, provides for a distance of at least 12 feet between enclosed spaces on the same building lot. When zoning applications are filed with the department, showing an architectural feature, such as a recessed indentation in the wall, dormer windows for the second floor habitable rooms, as is common in many cape code type homes and some newer homes under 30 Rules - 5/24/05 consideration for development in the City or a recessed garage door that creates an exterior hallway, the applicant is issued a refusal for being in non-compliance with the inner court provision of the Zoning Code. After the refusal has been issued, the applicant's options are either to redesign the building, to eliminate the architectural feature or to seek a variance from the Zoning Board of Adjustment. Either option mentioned above adds delays and costs to the construction project and relates to an issue that is now adequately addressed in the adopted Model Building Code of the City for new construction, alterations and additions. Also due to periodic updates to model building codes, advances in technology and building design are incorporated in the update, to provide for public safety and health concerns of the local authority. The elimination of the inner court requirement for residential occupancies will further aid to streamline the permit 31 Rules - 5/24/05 application process of the department and assisted development community, wishing to commence construction projects in a timely manner in the City. The department thanks the Building Industry Association for highlighting this matter in their report, and will continue to work cooperatively actively with this association to address other shared concerns, in order to improve the service provided to our stakeholders. Thank you for allowing me to provide the department's testimony. I'd be happy to answer any questions at this time.

Council President Verna

Thank you. You may have said this, and I was distracted. Is it your testimony that the current city building code adequately addresses the issue of necessary ventilation of new construction, alterations and additions?

Mr. Haigler

Yes, ma'am, it does. The model codes take into account when there 32 Rules - 5/24/05 are areas in a building that doesn't have natural lighting or natural ventilation by openable windows. And in those instances, the model codes will require certain mechanical systems to be installed in the building to provide artificial ventilation and light. It's like any office building that does not have openable windows now, MSB, in particular. We have no openable windows there, but we have mechanical systems to address some of the ventilation issues that are necessary to sustain life in that type of environment.

Council President Verna

Let me ask: When was the current building code adopted?

Mr. Haigler

Our current building code, we adopted the International Construction Code, and it was recently adopted last year.

Council President Verna

Well, I am just thinking of... In my district there are condos being built. They're in the process 33 Rules - 5/24/05 of being built. And I think there's just an atrium that will be provided, without... Doesn't have windows. It will just have the atrium. So, how does this particular bill 6 now address that issue?

Mr. Haigler

Well, with an atrium you still would have --

Council President Verna

I beg your pardon?

Mr. Haigler

With atriums, you still would have to have some sort of lighting. You would have natural lighting from the -- from the -- from the skylight area, and as far as --

Council President Verna

There would be ventilation from that?

Mr. Haigler

As far as ventilation, you would have mechanical ventilation systems.

Council President Verna

I'm sorry. I can't hear you. There are conversations going on all over.

Mr. Haigler

With ventilation, you would still have mechanical ventilation 34 Rules - 5/24/05 systems, air conditioning -- heating/air conditioning ventilation systems that are mechanically installed to provide a certain, if I might get technical, certain cubic feet per minute. CFMs. Most mechanical systems provide a certain amount of ventilation, a certain amount of air that's required to sustain life. Generally you need somewhere in the neighborhood of about CFMs to have 11 proper ventilation, proper air. 12

Council President Verna

Thank you 13 for your explanation. I just wouldn't know 14 that. Thank you. 15

Mr. Haigler

Okay. 16

Council President Verna

Is there 17 any request for suspension of the rules on 18 this? 19

Mr. Haigler

Yes, ma'am. We do request a suspension of the rules to permit first reading at the next session of Council.

Council President Verna

Thank you. Are there any questions from members of the committee or any comments? (No response.) 35 Rules - 5/24/05

Council President Verna

Seeing none, I thank you. Do we have anyone else to testify on this bill? (No response.)

Council President Verna

I would like the record to reflect that Councilman Kelly has joined us. And I would ask Tom Ericson to please read the title of the next bill, 050232. CLERK: Bill Number 050232, an ordinance amending Title 14 of The Philadelphia Code, entitled "Zoning and Planning," by increasing the permissible height for fences located on the front lot line of certain properties in residential districts; and by permitting certain architectural embellishments on fences; all under certain terms and conditions.

Council President Verna

Mr. Ericson, excuse me. I am just being told that we do have witnesses on the last bill 25 that we just heard. 36 Rules - 5/24/05 If they're here, would they please approach the witness table? That's on Bill 4 Number 050230. Good morning. Please identify yourself for the record and proceed with your testimony.

Mr. Rust

Good morning, Council President. My name is Lawrence Rust. I'm the President of the Building and Industry Association of Philadelphia, the BIA.

Council President Verna

Do you want to proceed with your testimony, sir.

Mr. Rust

Thank you. I'm a resident of Philadelphia. I live in Councilman Clarke's district at 1119 Green Street. My company is also located in Philadelphia, at 4418 North American Street. I am the current President of the BIA. And in October, the BIA released a report called, If we fix it, they will come, which you all have a copy of. This report was the result of a request from the Managing Director's Office 37 Rules - 5/24/05 to identify key problems with the development process. The report was funded by the BIA and also by the William Penn Foundation. The findings of the report and the recommendations include changes in three bills which we're hearing today. May I testify on all three bills or just the one?

Council President Verna

No. One at a time, please.

Mr. Rust

Okay. The report has been endorsed by 10,000 Friends of Pennsylvania, the American Institute of Architects, Central Philadelphia Development Corporation, the Housing Alliance of Pennsylvania, LISK, Philadelphia Association of CDCs, Philadelphia Neighborhood Development Collaborative, the Reinvestment Fund, and the Urban Land Institute. In the production of this report, we interviewed over a hundred people. During the preparation, many of them cited three particular provisions, one being this inner court requirement. Bill Number 050230 regarding the 38 Rules - 5/24/05 inner court: A century ago in Philadelphia it was required that a ten-foot wide inner court be provided in tenements, to ensure adequate light and ventilation. Today L & I defines any area with two walls and no roof or a partial roof as a court and requires that that be feet wide. 9 The exhibits that are shown over 10 here... A good example of this is where it 11 says cape code. 12 The two -- The three dormer windows that are installed on the top of that house, this is a typical architectural detail that people use on modern homes. The Zoning Code calls the space between those two windows an inner court. Therefore, that very basic design must go before the Zoning Board of Adjustment. Your question previously, Council President, regarding the atrium, the ventilation issue is still covered by the Building Code. We're dealing strictly with the zoning issue. So, to further answer your 39 Rules - 5/24/05 question, the ventilation issue would still be dealt with by building, and it would not be disregarded by this change to the Zoning Code. Removal of the requirement would also allow architects to add interesting design elements to residential properties, and not have to square off each building. This home here, the cape code or the Philadelphia twin, both of these buildings, in order to meet Zoning Code and to go through the process without going to the Zoning Board, would be built without anything projecting from the front of the building, not a porch, not a bay window, not a dormer. And what we're asking is simply that the Zoning Code be amended and modernized so that architects and builders can design and build homes that are typically being built in other parts of the United States. Thank you.

Council President Verna

Thank you. Gentlemen, are you going to testify? Please identify yourself for the 40 Rules - 5/24/05 record and proceed with your testimony.

Mr. Claflin

Thank you, Council President. My name is George Claflin. I'm a resident of the Fifth District. And I've just built a building in the Far Northeast in Councilman O'Neill's district, the Core Services Building. I'm an architect. I was the President of the American Institute of Architects, Philadelphia Chapter, in 1997. And this morning I am representing that organization. I have very little to add. It was very well expressed by my colleague. Our organization has endorsed the report. As you can see, it applies to both suburban type dwellings that are built within the City limits, such as cape code houses. It also applies to twins, and particularly the type of twins that the Philadelphia Housing Authority is building as well. These conditions, that do not really impinge upon the safety and light and ventilation access for the residents, occur. 41 Rules - 5/24/05 And the result is often that the feature is completely eliminated and the building becomes a box, where in the beginning it was no one's intention to make the box. And I would just add to the comments made before, that this is often the case when the developer or owner is willing to spend this money. So there's an economic factor that's positive for the City, to allow these features to be built.

Council President Verna

Thank you very much. Good morning.

Mr. Johns

Good morning, Council President. Michael John's. I'm the General Manager of Program Development and Design for the Philadelphia Housing Authority. And I'm here representing the Housing Authority in support of this change to the Zoning Code. The plans that you see that are the renderings of buildings that we've recently completed, the top one on your right is the 42 Rules - 5/24/05 Lucien E. Blackwell Homes site. And those townhomes, the Philadelphia Housing Authority had to go to the Zoning Board of Adjustment to do the bays, exactly which was explained earlier, that cost us at least two months in our construction time frame. And as you know, with most of our developments, we develop our developments with a series of maybe bonds and tax credits. And they come with strict time limits, in terms of the time that we have to do the construction documents, go through the L & I process, and to complete the project and occupy the buildings. And each time we have to go to the Zoning Board for a hearing that takes a minimum of a month or two months to complete that process. So, we're here supporting the changes.

Council President Verna

Thank you very much. Are there any questions from members of the committee? 43 Rules - 5/24/05 (No response.)

Council President Verna

Gentlemen, thank you. Do we have anyone else to testify on this bill? (No response.)

Council President Verna

Again, I would ask Mr. Ericson to please read the title of Bill Number 050232. CLERK: An ordinance amending Title of The Philadelphia Code, entitled "Zoning 13 and Planning," by increasing the permissible 14 height for fences located on the front lot line of certain properties in residential districts; and by permitting certain architectural embellishments on fences; all under certain terms and conditions.

Council President Verna

Gentlemen. Mr. Chapman.

Mr. Chapman

Madam President, for the City Planning Commission, my name is Thomas Chapman. Bill Number 050232 amends Section 25 14-231 of the Philadelphia Zoning Code, by 44 Rules - 5/24/05 increasing the permissible height of fences located in the front yard of a property from three feet six inches to four feet. Additionally, this bill would permit certain architectural features on fences to be up to eight feet in height. The architectural features that would be permitted to be up to eight feet in height include fence posts, gate posts and trellises. The increase of fence height to four feet was a recommendation of the Building Industry Association report. This change would make the allowable height of a fence to be consistent with the standard fences offered at many retail home stores. The Planning Commission is supportive of the increase in the allowable fence height, but there were some concerns regarding the permitted architectural features that would be allowed up to eight feet. Having a four feet trellis on top of an already four foot high fence would in 45 Rules - 5/24/05 effect create an eight foot high fence. Additionally, there was a concern that gate posts and fence posts being permitted to double the height of the allowable fence was excessive. The Planning Commission at its meeting of April 14, 2005, recommended that Bill Number 050232 be approved, with the recommendation that the word trellises be removed from the bill, and that the height of fence posts and gate posts be limited to six feet. I have prepared a proposed amendment to this bill and at this time would submit that to the committee. That concludes my testimony. I'd be happy to answer any questions.

Council President Verna

Mr. Chapman, would it be necessary to remove the word "trellis" if the overall height of the fence or the architectural features were limited to six feet?

Mr. Chapman

Madam President, it was the recommendation of the commission that 46 Rules - 5/24/05 the height of the fence be limited to four feet. We didn't -- The commission didn't address that particular question. But I suppose that if the combined height of the fence and trellis were limited to four feet, that that would be consistent with the Planning Commission's recommendation.

Council President Verna

Does L & I agree with this amendment?

Mr. Haigler

We are in concurrence with the amendment, Madam President.

Council President Verna

All right. Is there any testimony that you would like to present us?

Mr. Haigler

Yes, ma'am. Good day, Council President Verna and members of the committee. I am Otis Haigler, Jr., Director of Legislative Affairs for the Department of Licenses and Inspections. Today I'm here to provide testimony on Bill 050232 which, if enacted, will amend Chapter 14-200 of the Zoning Code, relating 47 Rules - 5/24/05 to fence height on the front property line of residential properties. The Department of Licenses and Inspections, in its efforts to streamline the regulatory process to improve service provided to our stakeholders from time to time conducts internal reviews of its operations and codes that are enforced by the department, to look for ways to streamline its process and is eliminate requirements which cause undue burden on the citizens we serve. With regard to the requirements of Section 14-231, subsection four of the Zoning Code, related to fence heights on the front property line of residential properties, we have found through experience and review that an amendment of this section is warranted to provide relief for homeowners who find themselves in technical violation of the code when purchasing a fence in the standard four foot heights. The current fence requirements of Section 14-231 prohibits the installation of 48 Rules - 5/24/05 a fence on the front property line in excess of three and a half feet in height. Based on contact with local fence retail outlets, we have been informed that the standard height for fencing is either four feet or six feet. Sizes other than the standard height or stock sizes are considered special orders that generally cost more for the consumer to purchase than the standard stock item. Further, we have found through our experience that the general public is not aware of the three and a half foot fence height requirement and make routine purchases of fencing in the standard heights for installation on their properties. Enforcement of the current three and a half foot fence provision often requires a variance from the Zoning Board of Adjustment for homeowners wishing to install a four foot fence on their front property line. This entails the payment of the $100 fee for the hearing to be scheduled, and could take many weeks before the hearing is 49 Rules - 5/24/05 held. If the homeowner wanted an accelerated hearing before the board, to reduce the time of delay, an additional $500 is needed for this service. Since there has been little to no 8 opposition from the public regarding this matter in the past, the board routinely has granted the variance request. After the variance request is granted, the homeowner can now secure their permit for an additional $25 and install the fence. If a homeowner followed all the outlined steps to comply with the current requirements, it would cost at a minimum $125, excluding the time spent with the department to apply for the permit and the Zoning Board of Adjustment hearing which in many cases, depending on the covered area and type of fence purchased, is more than the cost of the fence. A minor amendment to the fence requirements for installations on the front 50 Rules - 5/24/05 property line will aid to streamline the permit application process and assist homeowners with their efforts to improve the esthetical appearance of their homes. The department thanks the Building Industry Association of Philadelphia for highlighting this matter in their 2004 report on building development in the City, and will continue to work cooperatively with this association to address other shared concerns, in order to improve the service provided to our stakeholders. Thank you for the opportunity to provide the department's testimony on this issue, and I'd be happy to answer any questions.

Council President Verna

Thank you. Mr. Chapman, I think we have to clarify the record. I believe when I asked you about removing the trellis, if the overall height of the fence with the architectural features were limited to six feet. You said four feet. 51 Rules - 5/24/05 And yet, in your testimony I believe you say that the commission is recommending that the word "trellis" be removed from the bill, and that the height of the fence posts and gate posts be limited to six feet. Is it four feet or six feet?

Mr. Chapman

Let me clarify that, if I can, Madam President.

Council President Verna

Please.

Mr. Chapman

The commission's -- The commission's recommendation was that the height of the fence be four feet. They also recommended that the word "trellises" just be removed from the bill 16 completely, and also that gate posts and fence posts be limited to a height of six feet. In response to your question, I said that the commission didn't address the issue of a fence with a two foot high trellis on it that would make the fence and trellis a combined six feet. And I said that but if the combined fence and trellis were limited to four feet, 52 Rules - 5/24/05 I suppose that would be consistent with the Planning Commission's recommendation. So, in other words, the Planning Commission is recommending that a fence be limited to four feet and that gate posts and fence posts be limited to six feet.

Council President Verna

I'll tell you, it's about as clear as blue mud to me, but I'll check it. I will recognize Councilman O'Neill at this time.

Councilman O'Neill

Yes. Thank you. Gentlemen, this is primarily directed to the Planning Commission, but either of you can respond. I don't know if I have 40,000 single family homes in my district or 50, but there's somewhere in that range. Every one of them, I believe, is impacted by this bill. And I'm not necessarily against the idea of changing from three and a half to four to make it easier for people to get their fences from Home 53 Rules - 5/24/05 Depot. But there's an issue here that's not being addressed. I want to know if it was addressed. I can't have this apply to those 40 or 50,000 homes, unless it is addressed. And that is, the front of homes with solid wall fences, I don't care if they're cheap apache fences or the fancy white vinyl fences... are offensive to a community. They actually create a form of blight, visual blight. And many homes, row homes, twin homes, single homes have raised front lawns. They're not the same -- They're not the same height as the sidewalk or the street. So, there's -- there's an incline. And people often put the fence on that incline. Now, were the fence to be slatted, were it to be a picket type fence, rather than a solid fence in the front of the home, air, light, view, it really doesn't have an impact whether it's three and a half or four, even if it is a raised front lawn. But the solid wall, I won't find one 54 Rules - 5/24/05 person in my district, unless they already have this, that thinks it is acceptable. So, I would ask you how you feel, whether there's been any discussions about changing, as we move from three and a half to four, changing the regulation for front of the house fences, to be able to see through them. Some of these are large corner properties that go -- You know, they wrap around. And so, the wall that gets created by this solid fence is enormous. So, I just ask you to... I've talked to the sponsors about this, and we've been in some discussions. Thank you.

Mr. Chapman

Madam President, if I could respond, personally that did not come up in our discussion, but I have to say that I would agree with the sentiments that Councilman O'Neill just expressed. We could -- We could probably amend this bill with some language that would require a certain percentage of the fence to allow the penetration of light and air. I'm 55 Rules - 5/24/05 not exactly sure off the top of my head what those words would be, but --

Councilman O'Neill

There are other jurisdictions that have that language, I understand.

Mr. Chapman

Absolutely.

Mr. Haigler

We would not be opposed to an amendment to allow certain openable area within the fence on the front property line.

Councilman O'Neill

Right.

Mr. Haigler

Just make sure it's on the front property line.

Councilman O'Neill

Right, front of the house. Wherever the front of the house is.

Mr. Chapman

That's an excellent suggestion, if I may say so.

Councilman O'Neill

Thank you.

Council President Verna

The Chair recognizes Councilman DiCicco. COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: Thank you, Madam President, and I concur with Councilman O'Neill. Myself and Councilman Mariano are 56 Rules - 5/24/05 the other sponsors of the bill. I just placed a call, actually, to Ventnor City, New Jersey, but the surveyor is not available. I know from personal experience, doing the back of my house, that there's a requirement that the fencing from the property line must be a slatted picket type fence at least the minimum of feet back 11 from the property line before you can then 12 erect a solid fence between the party -- 13 which becomes the party wall the property 14 line between the two adjacent properties. 15 So, we're going to ask... I know Councilman Mariano is engaged in a discussion with Mr. McDonald. And that we'll probably vote this bill out as is, but we will have amendments at the next -- for the next Rules Committee meeting that will reflect some of the opinions and recommendations that have been made here. But again, he's right, Councilman, there are other jurisdictions. And I happen to be engaged in doing it. Literally as we 57 Rules - 5/24/05 speak, there's fencing being placed up, and there is a requirement. I'm not sure what the requirement is on the front side of the property, but I have to believe -- would have to believe that it's going to require -- that it would be prohibited from doing a solid fence. If they're saying in the back you have to keep it open from feet from the 11 property line, it just makes sense that it's 12 a slotted picket type fence in front, with a 13 height restriction as well. 14

Council President Verna

The Chair 15 recognizes Councilman Kelly.

Councilman Kelly

Yes. Councilman, I just want to ask if those other jurisdictions, are they still -- Those jurisdictions, are they limiting their fences to four feet standard or are they -- COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: No. The only jurisdiction I can speak of with some knowledge is in Ventnor City, New Jersey, there's a six foot height limitation, maximum of six foot. 58 Rules - 5/24/05 So it's a ranch type house, big -- similar to properties in Northeast Philadelphia. So you can put a maximum of six feet. And that could be a solid fence. But from the property line back to wherever the house starts, because you usually have a lawn, there's a minimum requirement of feet that the fence has to 10 be open fence, slatted picket type fence. 11

Councilman Kelly

Oh, slatted? 12 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: Could be six 13 feet, but it's got to be at least open. 14 As to the front -- And what I just 15 said, I have to assume that it's going to be the same requirement in the front. You can't do a solid fence in the front or around the perimeter of the property. What the height limit there is I don't know.

Councilman Kelly

What is the height -- COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: They have different zones in that township or that City of Ventnor. 59 Rules - 5/24/05 Some zones would require... you can actually put an eight foot fence. I guess it's where it's more commercial, as opposed to residential. I don't have the facts. I'm waiting. I'll get those over the next couple weeks, and we can look at that as a template to figure out what we might need to do here.

Councilman Kelly

What is the height restriction in the front? COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: I'm not sure of that. I would assume... I'm only assuming. It's probably four feet.

Councilman Kelly

Four feet? COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: Because that would match up with the 15 foot setback as you come around to the back of the property, but I could be wrong on that.

Councilman O'Neill

My guess is that these fences are being cut at four and six because they're the standards that are out there.

Councilman Kelly

They're the standards. 60 Rules - 5/24/05

Councilman O'Neill

But I think there's another issue here; that's all. COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: And not only is it a question of esthetics; I think it's a question of safety as well. I mean, people can get behind that fence, and... You know, it's a wall. I mean, you're putting up a wall. I don't care if it's vinyl or masonry; it's a wall. And it does esthetically really lend to the openness of the neighborhood. I mean, we don't have this problem in South Philadelphia, but...

Councilman Kelly

Setting or at least putting this at four feet is going to make a lot of sense because it's going to cut down on the amount of variances that are required in the L & I. COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: But you're going to want to allow people at least to do six foot in the back where the yards butt up if they want a little bit more privacy.

Councilman Kelly

I would think that most of the fences that are in the City 61 Rules - 5/24/05 are probably four feet anyway.

Mr. Haigler

That's correct.

Councilman Kelly

And you're just making them all legal. COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: In the row house neighborhoods they are primarily six foot. In the rowhouse neighborhoods.

Councilman Kelly

In the row houses? They're behind them, right.

Councilman O'Neill

The old rowhouse neighborhoods. COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: Right. There's still a lot of --

Councilman O'Neill

The new ones have front lawns. COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: We still have concrete.

Council President Verna

Thank you. I believe we have several other people that would like to testify. If you could make your testimony rather brief, we would appreciate it. Again, I would ask you to testify -- give your name, and then proceed with your 62 Rules - 5/24/05 testimony.

Mr. Sauer

Good morning, Madam President, and members of Council. My name is Rick Sauer.

Council President Verna

I'm sorry, sir. You're going to have to pull the microphone closer to you.

Mr. Sauer

Sure. Is that better? Good morning, Madam President, and members of Council. My name is Rick Sauer, and I'm the Executive Director of the Philadelphia Association of Community Development Corporations. And I want to thank you for the opportunity to testify today, in particular, on Bill 050232. I'm here to actually support the whole package of bills to update the Zoning Code before you today and implement the recommendations that were identified in the BIA report released last year that we endorsed, which makes many constructive recommendations to improve Philadelphia's development process. 63 Rules - 5/24/05 I think what we've seen is that the cumbersome aspects of the development in Philadelphia are barriers for both market rate developers, affordable housing developers and homeowners looking to improve their existing homes, and ultimately increase the cost and the time frame for doing development improvement to homes. And the Zoning Code, in particular, has been long recognized as overly complicated and technical. So, we're glad to see that the City is reviewing the current code, to figure out how we can streamline that. We're certainly supportive of that process because we think it has great potential to facilitate further development and improvement in our neighborhoods. We don't think, though, that we should wait for a comprehensive overview to address some specific short-term issues that we think Council could take action on now. So, in particular, this Bill 050232, as we know, would raise the maximum height of 64 Rules - 5/24/05 front yard fence from three and a half to four feet and permit homeowners to buy retail fences that are commonly available. We want to encourage homeowners to improve the appearance of their properties. And right now I think we're putting some obstacles in their way to doing that. There's an exhibit I think may have been put up over there (Indicating) that lays out some of the cost and time implications for someone who wants to go out. Oh, I'm sorry. Over on this side (Indicating). Didn't see where he put it. So, if you want to put up -- If you don't want to get a custom built fence to meet the three and a half foot requirement, you have to go for the appeal to the Zoning Board. You -- Typically they request that you have representation from a lawyer. There's a series of weeks that it takes to go through this process. And it could end up costing the homeowner more to actually file 25 the paperwork and hire the attorney to 65 Rules - 5/24/05 represent them than to buy the fence itself..

Councilman O'Neill

You don't need an attorney unless you're a corporation.

Mr. Sauer

I understand you're not required to have an attorney. My understanding is you're often requested, though, to be represented. In any case, I think what this bill 10 would do would help facilitate more homeowners to be able to go out and buy the standard fence that are available. And we want to provide choice to homeowners to be able to do that. So, we encourage Council to take action and advance this bill, to enable homeowners, as well as others involved in neighborhood revitalization, to improve the appearance of our neighborhoods.

Council President Verna

Thank you very much.

Ms. Gray

Good morning, Madam Chair.

Council President Verna

Good morning. 66 Rules - 5/24/05

Ms. Gray

Excuse me?

Council President Verna

I said good morning.

Ms. Gray

Oh. Good morning. And members of Council. My name is Rose Gray, and I'm Director of Development for Asociacion de Puertorriquenos en Marcha, and I'm here today in support of this bill. Prior to my tenure with -- present tenure with APM I served three mayors as the administrative for the Zoning Board, the Board of Building Standards, and the L & I Review Board. years later this bill is on the 16 table where it was back when I was the 17 administrator. And the thought process at 18 that time why we didn't increase the fence 19 was that they were considered -- four foot 20 was considered a spite fence. 21 I don't think six inches of fencing 22 makes a neighbor in disharmony with his 23 fellow neighbors. It is the neighbors that 24 make the disharmony. 25 So I think this is also a 67 Rules - 5/24/05 constituency issue, as well as a developer issue, and affordable housing in particular because the costs that were reflected by what Mr. Sauer had said previously is evident. The cost of getting a variance is almost the cost of doing a fence. So, I don't think we helped our constituency by continuing to make them get manufactured fencing, especially manufactured to meet the Zoning Code. So today we are in support of a four foot limit. And my... What is it called here? My brief addresses all the three issues before you today. So, I sincerely hope that you consider this. And this is the beginning of a dialog to look at other issues that the Zoning Code misses presently, and to continue with revisions. I think the time is now. Thank you.

Council President Verna

Thank you very much. The Chair recognizes Councilman O'Neill. 68 Rules - 5/24/05

Councilman O'Neill

I just want to bring Mr. Chapman back for a quick question; that's all; clarification.

Council President Verna

Is Mr. Chapman here?

Councilman O'Neill

Tom, you're familiar with the situation I mentioned with the raised lawn, front lawns.

Councilman O'Neill

Oftentimes there's a retaining wall that has been built, usually by the homeowner over the years, to make the front lawn level in front of their house.

Councilman O'Neill

So you might have two, three, four sometimes five feet of wall, brick or stone wall in front of the house, and then a fence. This has nothing to do with three and a half to four. I'm just pointing out that it's my understanding -- and you can correct me. This is the clarification I'm looking for. 69 Rules - 5/24/05 I come in for a fence on top of that front wall. And this is a wall that's right at the sidewalk. Looks very nice when you drive by. I then put a three and a half or a four foot fence up. I'm not really concerned about that issue. That is legal, right? Under the three -- If it's three and a half on top of that -- on top of that wall? The wall doesn't enter into the height.

Mr. Haigler

It does.

Mr. Chapman

Councilman, I think my reading of the code is the opposite. And I think Mr. Haigler would agree with me.

Councilman O'Neill

Well, L & I has some work to do, because I can tell you there are...

Mr. Chapman

I believe that once you erect --

Councilman O'Neill

There are a lot of them out there.

Mr. Haigler

I think the retaining wall issue is a separate issue. The retaining wall issue is required as a 70 Rules - 5/24/05 building permit or building issue. A fence is a zoning issue.

Councilman O'Neill

Let's make sure the record is clear. Is it the retaining wall? Today. I know we haven't changed this yet. So, I don't want to enter into a four foot discussion. But today over-the-counter permit, not zoning variance. I've got a retaining wall at my sidewalk in front of my front lawn. Let's just say for argument it is three feet tall. Can I put more than a half a foot above that as a fence, with a three and a half foot limit or does the point of measurement start with the top of the wall?

Mr. Chapman

Councilman, I can read directly from the Zoning Code on that. And I believe that you count the height of the retaining wall, and then count the height of the fence.

Councilman O'Neill

Okay.

Mr. Chapman

So if the retaining is three, and you want to put a three and a half 71 Rules - 5/24/05 foot fence on top of that, you have six and a half feet of fencing.

Councilman O'Neill

Thank you. That's actually encouraging.

Mr. Chapman

Read right from the Zoning Code under retaining walls, it says, retaining walls shall be considered as fences and controlled under this paragraph.

Councilman O'Neill

Okay. Great. There's an area -- It's not in my district -- that's actually not too far from an area that we both know down in Mayfair that I have -- that I drive by every so often. And it's pretty -- Right on Cottman Avenue. It's pretty ugly. Okay. I just assumed, since they're so visible, they were legal. Thank you.

Council President Verna

Thank you. Are there any other questions or comments from members of the committee? Again, I would ask you to identify yourself.

Mr. Rust

Lawrence Rust, representing the BIA. I wanted to address 72 Rules - 5/24/05 Councilman O'Neill's question about solid fencing.

Council President Verna

Councilman O'Neill.

Mr. Rust

I think this is a very reasonable question and a reasonable concern. However, right now, as the Zoning Code is written, you can go in and apply for and receive counter over the counter a permit for a three and a half foot fence that is solid. So what we're talking about doing with this bill is to increase it to four feet tall.

Councilman O'Neill

I'm disagreeing with you.

Councilman O'Neill

I honestly disagree with you. And I have about 40,000 homeowners who would welcome the compromise between lifting the limit and going to four, and opening up the front fence and not having it be a wall. 73 Rules - 5/24/05 Now, anyone who's interested in design and neighborhood -- the look of a neighborhood should think that's a friendly amendment.

Mr. Rust

No, no. I understand.

Councilman O'Neill

And I don't want to debate it; please. I agree that somebody's making these at four feet because the rest of the world is doing it. But it's an opportunity to also do what the rest of the world is doing and they're not allowing solid fences in front of houses.

Mr. Rust

I'm not disagreeing.

Councilman O'Neill

So, it was something that was left out. I think we have a nice conversation going with the Planning Commission. We all agree we want to amend it. We have, I think, another hearing in a week. And we'll have a good amendment, and we'll pass it. We're not talking about holding off on this. There's no hidden agenda here. I 74 Rules - 5/24/05 actually think you guys have done us a service by bringing these bills to us, but that doesn't mean that there aren't some issues out there that could be even more helpful. Once in a while we know something, from talking to constituents, visiting different neighborhoods. And I'm just trying to add that to the mix.

Mr. Rust

To complete my thought, I'm not disagreeing with you at all, but what I'm saying is that we're dealing with the zoning issue, and your concerns are the place to deal with them is really the Building Code, because right now as it sits, the three and a half foot fence can be solid. And I happen to agree with you.

Councilman O'Neill

This is going to become a zoning issue, because if someone wants to do a solid fence, and they want to do it at four feet, they're going to have to go to the Zoning Board. And I just say you come here at your own risk if you come back to us and say, 75 Rules - 5/24/05 that's a hardship for those people. They want to have a wall in front of their house instead of a fence. So, it is a zoning issue. It becomes a zoning issue if we create a requirement that it be an open fence. But I think it's a good requirement, just as going to four feet is a good requirement.

Mr. Rust

Thank you.

Council President Verna

Thank you. Are there any other questions or comments from members of the committee? (No response.)

Council President Verna

Would anyone else like to testify on this bill? (No response.)

Council President Verna

Seeing no 19 one, I would ask Mr. Ericson to please read the title of Bill Number 050233. CLERK: An ordinance, amending Title 14, entitled "Zoning and Planning," to add definitions for certain architectural features that are commonly located on residential buildings, and to permit said 76 Rules - 5/24/05 architectural features on residential buildings located in residentially zoned districts, under certain terms and conditions.

Mr. Chapman

Good morning once again, Madam President, and members of the Rules Committee. Thomas Chapman for the City Planning Commission. Bill Number 050233 amends Section 11 14-102 and 14-231 of the Zoning Code by adding a number of definitions of architectural features; and then further, by permitting them in all residential districts. This bill defines balustrades, bay windows, chimneys, cornices, entranceway covers, molding and belt courses, pents, pilasters and rustications, and then permits them in all residential districts so that they are not considered as occupied area or encroachments into the front, side or rear yards, court or required setback. An illustration of these terms are shown to your left on the photo board. Under the current provisions of the 77 Rules - 5/24/05 Zoning Code, all the aforementioned architectural features would be considered part of the occupied area calculations and considered encroachments. Because some interpretations of the features have proven a detriment to new construction and have helped to cause a backlog at the Zoning Board of Adjustment, the BIA's report specifically recommended that these improvements be permitted without any zoning implications. The Planning Commission at its meeting April 14, 2005, considered this bill 15 and recommended that Bill Number 050233 be approved. Thank you.

Council President Verna

Thank you.

Mr. Haigler

Good day, Council President Verna and members of the committee. I'm Otis Haigler, Jr., Director of Legislative Affairs for the Department of Licenses and Inspections. Today I'm here to provide testimony on Bill 050233 which, if enacted, will add 78 Rules - 5/24/05 definitions to the Zoning Code and permit certain common architectural features on residential properties. This amendment was proposed as a result of the report issued by the Building Industry Association of Philadelphia, concerning ways in which to streamline the regulatory process in order to remove impediments to development in the City. Many of the recommendations in this report have already been adopted by the department, and we will continue to work cooperatively with the association to address other shared concerns, in order to improve the service provided to our stakeholders. The amendments highlighted in Bill 18 050233 are minor, esthetical enhancements which will approve the appearance of residential properties and assist homeowners with this effort. It is for this reason that the department fully supports passage and enactment of Bill 050233. We will be offering a technical 79 Rules - 5/24/05 amendment to the bill, in order to clarify the requirements governing when balustrades are permitted. The department thanks the Building Industry Association of Philadelphia for highlighting this matter in their 2004 report. Thank you for the opportunity to provide the department's testimony. And I will be happy to answer any questions at this time.

Council President Verna

Thank you. Do we have a copy of the amendment?

Mr. Haigler

Yes, we do, Madam President.

Council President Verna

May we have it, please? Gentlemen, you both testified that these changes to the Zoning Code are as a result of recommendations contained in a 2003 report of the Building Industry Association of Philadelphia. Are there other recommendations of the association, other than those that are 80 Rules - 5/24/05 being proposed to us today, that you anticipate being implemented?

Mr. Haigler

Well, we have already implemented or started to implement areas in the way of automation, automating our processes, as you know, to streamline the process of application approvals and applications that are made to the department. We hope to in the near future be able to allow a lot of our application to be applied for over the internet. This should help the building industry tremendously so they utilize this service a lot in their process. Something that's industry wide already that I know I have my own little favorite where I can get my registration for my vehicle. I love doing it over the internet. Always procrastinate. I wait till the last minute to register my vehicle, but it's easy when I can go right on line and do that. And it's a service that is provided and that we would hope to provide in the near future. 81 Rules - 5/24/05

Council President Verna

Thank you. And is there a need for suspension of the rules, and are you requesting that?

Mr. Haigler

Well, we would like to request a suspension of the rules, to permit first reading at the next session of Council. Thank you.

Council President Verna

Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilman Clarke.

Councilman Clarke

Thank you, Madam President. Good morning. With respects to the projecting architectural features, there's one that I do have a question, the balustrade or some people would probably call it a balcony, not a balcony.

Mr. Haigler

That's why we're offering this friendly amendment, to reduce the projection. Currently, under the current provision of the ordinance, I think the projection says it has to be at least three feet, no more than three feet. 82 Rules - 5/24/05 We're scaling that back to inches because we don't want that to be confused with a balcony. You won't be able to stand on it. It will be too small. It's an architectural feature.

Councilman Clarke

Okay. All 8 right. That was my question, the limitations 9 as it relates to protrusion. 10

Mr. Haigler

That's correct. And 11 we're scaling that back to 24 inches. 12

Councilman Clarke

What's the 13 limit, in terms of height? Would it be 14 second floor up or would it be on the first 15 floor? 16

Mr. Haigler

It doesn't really say. 17 We have no language currently in the 18 definition as to where this would be located, 19 either first or second floor. But if it's 20 only 24 inches that it can protrude, it 21 probably really wouldn't make too much of a 22 difference either way. 23

Councilman Clarke

If it were on 24 a... Just... If it were on a Center City street... 83 Rules - 5/24/05

Mr. Haigler

Well, yeah.

Councilman Clarke

...two feet out from the building line on the first floor, you don't think that could be problematic?

Mr. Haigler

It wouldn't extend out more than what the steps currently in the front of the property would extend out from the property.

Councilman Clarke

But if the steps were not on that particular side. As an example, there's a corner property, say, Pine Street. And then you have 18th Street where the steps entering the property on 18th Street, and then the side is Pine Street, right? Where there are no steps, no entry. And you have windows, and you have these balustrades that could protrude two feet out from the side of that building on the first floor, do you see the potential for a problem?

Mr. Haigler

That will take some thought. I understand where you're coming from, Councilman. And you don't want to encroach onto the public right of way and 84 Rules - 5/24/05 cause any concerns related to what the already openable area. If you have -- If you have a certain amount of sidewalk clearance, unobstructed area on the sidewalk, you don't want to encroach onto that area.

Councilman Clarke

Right.

Mr. Chapman

Councilman, if I may, typically in the situation that you described, the windows are going to be elevated somewhat up off the sidewalk maybe six or seven or eight feet. So that at... Where the building meets the ground, you know, it would be possibly...

Councilman Clarke

I only say that because I have a friend who has a property, and the windows are five feet, five and a half feet. I'm six three. Potential for me to get knocked in the head is quite evident. I think, Councilman O'Neill, you're around six three or six four. Councilman O'Neill and I might have a problem walking down that street. And I'm just concerned that if we allow these 85 Rules - 5/24/05 protrusions on --

Mr. Haigler

I'm not exactly sure if I've seen them typically at the first floor level. I mostly have seen this type of feature at the second floor or upper floor levels of the building. I mean, I don't think I've... Maybe somebody might have seen this in some area of the City, but I don't think I've typically seen this at the first floor level.

Councilman Clarke

Okay. All right.

Mr. Haigler

Maybe one of the architects --

Councilman Clarke

For the record, we're authorizing that, just for the record, first floor.

Mr. Haigler

This bill doesn't prevent it at the first floor level.

Councilman Clarke

Okay.

Mr. Haigler

As it's currently written, it doesn't prevent it at the first floor level. 86 Rules - 5/24/05

Councilman Clarke

All right. Thank you.

Council President Verna

Okay. Any other questiones or comments from members of the committee? (No response.)

Council President Verna

Do we have anyone else to testify on this bill? Please approach the witness table. Again, I would ask you to identify yourself for the record and proceed with your testimony. Again, Michael Johns, General Manager for Program Development and Design for the Philadelphia Housing Authority. I just want to address what just came up, in terms of the encroachment onto the street, the actual building. And George Claflin is going to explain a little bit more about that. It actually... This actually represents an encroachment onto the front yard, not into the right of way. So the requirement of the two 87 Rules - 5/24/05 feet -- For example, if the Zoning Code requires a front yard of ten feet, and you have to have the ten feet from the right of way or the pavement. And then if you want to encroach two feet to put this balustrade on, then you're encroaching two feet onto the front yard, never onto the pavement. Like, for example, in a typical North Philadelphia row home where your property line is essentially the pavement, that you couldn't do this balustrade two feet out. You would still have to go for some type of a variance or something like that or you'd have to go to the Streets Department because they control the encroachment onto the pavement. But George is going to explain a little bit more about that.

Mr. Claflin

I'm George Claflin. I was introduced before. Practicing architect and representing the American Institute of Architects. 88 Rules - 5/24/05 May I have permission to approach the graphic up there?

Councilman Clarke

(Nods head up and down.)

Mr. Claflin

This speaker (Indicating) working?

Councilman Clarke

Yes.

Mr. Claflin

Thank you. We prepared a graphic of a typical Philadelphia house. And this would -- The issues here apply to all neighborhoods and all house types, but we didn't really have the time to do it for every type. And it reviews this. I think the key point, though, on the balcony question is that all of this relates to zoning required front rear and side yards, not street relationships or encroachment on the street space which is, as I understand, regulated by the Streets Department, and no change in that is proposed here. Just going from the bottom to the top, rustication. That's an exaggeration of 89 Rules - 5/24/05 the masonry effect of the base. And again, we're showing you examples that you will recognize as traditional architecture in Philadelphia.

Councilman Clarke

I'm only asking about the balustrade.

Mr. Claflin

(Indicating.)

Councilman Clarke

Yes.

Mr. Claflin

Yes. That's the example --

Councilman Clarke

Would that be a permissible use on a first floor? That's the only question I have.

Mr. Claflin

If there were no front yard, it would in my opinion not be permissible. If there were a front yard, yes.

Councilman Clarke

We're talking about Center City, no yard -- no front yards.

Mr. Claflin

If there were no front yard, no, not on the first floor.

Councilman Clarke

It would not be permissible on the front or on the side of a property that faced the street frontage. If 90 Rules - 5/24/05 you have a corner property -- Do you understand what I'm saying? You have a corner property --

Mr. Claflin

Yes, no encroachment in the street space.

Councilman Clarke

Okay. No 8 encroachment in the street. Okay.

Mr. Claflin

No encroachment in the required street clearance.

Councilman Clarke

Okay. All right.

Mr. Claflin

So we have examples here of rustication. That's the exaggeration.

Councilman Clarke

I'm okay with that. I just had that one question about the balustrade. All right. Thank you.

Mr. Claflin

Rustication exaggeration of the masonry effect at the base, pilaster which is a non-structural column often associated with an entrance where you might see it on the surface of a dwelling in another position, the entranceway 91 Rules - 5/24/05 cover, the pent which we see a lot of in Society Hill. This is a small roof of -- intermediate to the height of the building, that covers the entrance and is a tradition. Certainly the bay window. The bay window is not a full bay in this definition. This is a bay window that starts above the floor line. The molding and belt course which is a decorative element that you see in many Philadelphia buildings. The cornice which you see at the top of many Philadelphia buildings, and the chimney. And the other point I want to make is that these are shown as traditional. It could be modern. There's no stylistic suggestion here. It is the opinion of many architects, and certainly the AIA of Philadelphia would agree with this, that the buildings that face the street make the space of the street. They define what is really the public space. And we are in general in favor of making that public space as rich in 92 Rules - 5/24/05 architectural detail as is possible. So, where owners and developers are willing to provide these features, we think that it is an appropriate flexibility in the yard space, as required under the zoning, to allow these features. Thank you.

Council President Verna

Thank you very much. Please identify yourself for the record and proceed with your testimony. MR. McPHEDRIN: Good morning, Council President. My name is Sue McPhedrin. And I work for the Reinvestment Fund. I'm also a Philadelphia resident. Committee members may be most familiar with TRF's recent role with NTI, but for years TRF has provided financing for 20 residential and other developments in Philadelphia throughout the region. We've helped to create more than 10,000 housing units, most of these in Philadelphia, and most of them affordable. For years we financed only 93 Rules - 5/24/05 affordable housing development. This was just about the only game in town. Now increasingly we receive financing requests from market rate developers in Philadelphia. This is a great trend, and all of us who believe in strong Philadelphia neighborhoods, would do well to support it, along with continued, affordable housing development which is also critical. Developers consider many factors when they decide where to build: Reasonable costs, steady stream of buyers and renters, available financing, public support and a predictable development process are all important. Also critical are building and zoning codes that reflect current best practices and support the development of homes that meet the needs of today's buyers. This bill before you today, as well as the two others, represent three opportunities to bring Philadelphia's Zoning Code in line with 21st century standards. Removing three of the reasons why 94 Rules - 5/24/05 developers may need to seek a zoning variance will translate into faster development timetables, lower costs and better designs. Many large cities have entirely rewritten their codes to support modern urban design trends. While these three changes may seem minor, they represent important first steps towards modernizing our process and creating an environment where builders and home buyers can thrive. Please support these amendments and take this opportunity to promote the redevelopment of Philadelphia neighborhoods. I also have testimony here from Mr. Shaheed Dewan, Chief Financial Officer of Universal Community Homes which I'm happy to read or hand in.

Council President Verna

If you have copies, I would suggest that you submit to it each of the members, and we will give a copy to the stenographer, and it will be made part of the record.

Mr. Rust

Thank you very much. 95 Rules - 5/24/05

Council President Verna

Thank you. Do we have anyone else to testify on this bill? Mr. Chapman.

Mr. Chapman

Thank you, Madam President. I want to get back a bit to Councilman Clarke's question. I'm not sure why this didn't occur to me when you asked the question, but in the situation that you described, that extension over the sidewalk, that would become a Streets Department issue.

Councilman Clarke

Yes.

Mr. Chapman

And you would need to get -- You would need to -- You would need to establish a certain amount of clearance, and the depth of that balustrade or -- or... Yeah, that's what we're talking about, balustrade. Once it got -- And I'm not sure about this. But once it got to be either 18 or inches, once it gets to that depth, 24 then it requires an ordinance of Council.

Councilman Clarke

Okay. 96 Rules - 5/24/05

Mr. Chapman

So, you do have that protection there.

Councilman Clarke

Okay. Thank you.

Council President Verna

Thank you very much. Are there -- Do we have any other witnesses to testify on this bill? (No response.)

Council President Verna

Seeing none, I would ask Mr. Ericson to please read the title of Bill Number 050339. CLERK: An Ordinance to amend the Philadelphia Zoning Maps by changing the zoning designations of certain areas of land located within an area bounded by Bridge Street, Tacony Street, a line 245 feet north of Sanger Street, the Delaware River and the Frankford Creek.

Mr. Chapman

Good morning once again, Council President Verna and members of the Rules Committee. Again, for the City Planning Commission, my name is Thomas Chapman. 97 Rules - 5/24/05 Bill Number 050339 would rezone 1.4 acres of land located within the Frankford Arsenal Business Center from the current designation of G-2 general industrial to a designation of C-3 commercial. The purpose of this rezoning is to allow for the commercial development of this property. The Frankford Arsenal property was the subject of Bill Number 030068 which rezoned approximately 46 acres of the 83 acre Frankford Arsenal to a zoning designation of C-3 commercial. The subject bill will provide additional area in the commercial development in order to provide loading and better circulation within the proposed development of that site. The Planning Commission at its meeting of May 12, 2005, considered this bill 22 and recommended that it be approved. Thank you.

Council President Verna

Thank you. I'm assuming that when you state 98 Rules - 5/24/05 that the amendment would provide, quote, loading, end of quote, I'm assuming that it is for general use within the business center or is it for one particular business?

Mr. Chapman

No. No, Madam President. This zoning would... There's a proposal for the northern end of the Frankford Arsenal.

Council President Verna

Sorry. Can't hear you.

Mr. Chapman

There's a proposal for the northern end of the Frankford Arsenal property to be developed with a shopping center. And the developer, after discussions with several tenants, decided that they needed to provide additional area within the Frankford Business Center for this development. And that's why we're here before you today. Most of the property needed for the commercial development had been rezoned back in 2003. And this is a relatively small 99 Rules - 5/24/05 rezoning.

Council President Verna

Very well. Are there any questions from members of the committee? The Chair recognizes Councilman O'Neill.

Councilman O'Neill

Mr. Chapman, I'm not familiar with C-3. Could you just... I know C-1. I know C-2. I know C-7. I don't know a whole lot of other C's. What is C-3 in relation to those or to area shopping center, anything like that?

Mr. Chapman

Generally --

Councilman O'Neill

What are the distinguishing characteristics?

Mr. Chapman

Councilman, I guess the most distinguishing characteristic between, say, C-3, and area shopping center is that C-3 would allow wholesale sales. I don't think that the developer plans to have any wholesale businesses here, but that's really one of the main --

Councilman O'Neill

What's the difference between C-3 and C-7? 100 Rules - 5/24/05

Mr. Chapman

C-7 is more restrictive, in terms of permitted uses.

Councilman O'Neill

Okay.

Mr. Chapman

C-3 allows... As I said, it allows wholesale uses and C-7 doesn't. C-3 doesn't have a specific parking requirement, and that's one aspect that distinguishes it from area shopping center and neighborhood shopping center and C-7. But the developer's not going to build a shopping center without plenty of parking.

Councilman O'Neill

Okay. But he's not required to or required to put any number of spaces.

Mr. Chapman

That's correct.

Councilman O'Neill

Okay. Thank you.

Council President Verna

Thank you. Are there any other questions from members of the committee on this bill? (No response.)

Council President Verna

Do we have anyone else to testify on the bill? 101 Rules - 5/24/05 (No response.)

Council President Verna

Mr. Chapman, I note June the 16th can not come soon enough for some of us. So, is there a particular request that you would like to make on this bill?

Mr. Chapman

Yes, Madam President. Thank you. We would request that the rules be suspended on this bill.

Council President Verna

We will certainly consider that. Thank you.

Mr. Chapman

Thank you very much.

Council President Verna

This will conclude the public hearing of the Committee on Rules. (Public hearing concluded at 11:56 a.m.) 102 Rules - 5/24/05 - - - COUNCIL OF THE CITY OF PHILADELPHIA PUBLIC MEETING - COMMITTEE ON RULES - - - Room 400, City Hall Philadelphia, Pennsylvania Tuesday, May 24, 2005, 11:56 a.m. - - - BILL 050230 - An Ordinance amending Title of The Philadelphia Code, entitled 10 "Zoning and Planning," by amending Chapter 14-200 entitled "Residential 11 Districts," by amending requirements relating to courts in certain 12 Residential Districts, under certain terms and conditions. 13 BILL 050232 - An Ordinance amending Title 14 of 14 The Philadelphia Code, entitled "Zoning and Planning," by increasing the permissible height for fences located on the front lot line of certain properties in residential districts; and by permitting certain architectural embellishments on fences; all under certain terms and conditions. BILL 050233 - An Ordinance amending Title 14, Entitled "Zoning and Planning," to add definitions for certain architectural features that are commonly located on residential - - - V A R A L L O Incorporated Litigation Support Services 1835 Market Street, Suite 600 Philadelphia, Pennsylvania 19103 215.561.2220 215.567.2670 103 Rules - 5/24/05 buildings, and to permit said architectural features on residential buildings located in residentially zoned districts, under certain terms and conditions. BILL 050339 - An Ordinance to amend the Philadelphia Zoning Maps by changing the zoning designations of certain areas of land located within an area bounded by Bridge Street, Tacony Street, a line 245 feet north of Sanger Street, the Delaware River and the Frankford Creek. BILL 050285 - An Ordinance to amend the Philadelphia Zoning Maps by changing the zoning designations of certain areas of land located within an area bounded by Essington Avenue, 67th Street, the Delaware River and the former Pennypacker Avenue. PRESENT: COUNCIL PRESIDENT ANNA C. VERNA COUNCILMAN DARRELL L. CLARKE COUNCILMAN DiCICCO COUNCILMAN JACK KELLY COUNCILMAN JAMES F. KENNEY COUNCILMAN RICHARD T. MARIANO COUNCILWOMAN DONNA REED MILLER COUNCILMAN MICHAEL NUTTER COUNCILWOMAN BLONDELL REYNOLDS-BROWN 104 Rules - 5/24/05 - - - P R O C E E D I N G S - - -

Council President Verna

We will now go into our public meeting. The Chair recognizes Councilman Clarke regarding Bill Number 050285.

Councilman Clarke

Thank you, Madam President. Madam President, I move that the amendment to Bill Number 050285 be adopted.

Council President Verna

Do I hear a second?

Councilman O'Neill

Second.

Council President Verna

It has been moved and second that the amendment as proposed earlier be adopted. All in favor will say aye. (Chorus of "ayes.")

Council President Verna

Those opposed? (No response.)

Council President Verna

The ayes have it, and the motion carries. 105 Rules - 5/24/05 Again the Chair recognizes Councilman Clarke.

Councilman Clarke

I move that Bill 5 Number 050285 as amended be adopted.

Councilman Kelly

Second.

Councilman Clarke

And request for suspension of the rules as to allow reading at the next session of Council.

Councilman Kelly

Second.

Council President Verna

It has been moved and seconded that Bill Number 050285 be reported out of committee with a favorable recommendation, as amended; also that the rules of Council be suspended so as to permit first reading at our next session of Council. All in favor will indicate by saying aye. (Chorus of "ayes.")

Council President Verna

Those opposed? (No response.)

Council President Verna

The ayes have it, and the motion carries. 106 Rules - 5/24/05 Again the Chair recognizes Councilman Clarke, regarding Bill Number 050230.

Councilman Clarke

I move that Bill 6 Number 050230 be reported out of committee with a favorable recommendation and request for rules suspension.

Councilman Kelly

Second.

Council President Verna

It has been moved and seconded that Bill Number 050230 be reported out of committee with a favorable recommendation; also, a recommendation that the rules of Council be suspended so as to permit first reading at our next session of Council. All in favor will indicate by saying aye. (Chorus of "ayes.")

Council President Verna

Those opposed? (No response.)

Council President Verna

The ayes have it, and the motion carries. The Chair recognizes Councilman 107 Rules - 5/24/05 Clarke regarding Bill Number 050232. I'm sorry. Did we vote on that? (Discussion held off the record.)

Council President Verna

Okay. There was an amendment introduced. I think it was technical; was it not?

Councilman Mariano

There was a technical amendment, but there was other amendments that we want to work out.

Council President Verna

I know, but there was a technical amendment. What is your desire, then, as sponsor?

Councilman Mariano

This one? 32?

Council President Verna

I want to introduce the technical amendments.

Council President Verna

Okay. Without suspension.

Councilman Mariano

I want to introduce this amendment. (Discussion held off the record.)

Council President Verna

The Chair recognizes Councilman Clarke.

Councilman Clarke

Thank you, Madam 108 Rules - 5/24/05 President. Madam President, I propose an amendment to Bill Number 050232. Move for the adoption of that amendment.

Councilman Mariano

Second.

Council President Verna

It has been moved and seconded.

Councilman O'Neill

Copy of the amendment. I haven't seen it. I may have it in my pile.

Council President Verna

I believe Mr. Chapman indicated it was a technical amendment; did you not, Mr. Chapman? Did you indicate that the amendment proposed on 050232 was a technical amendment?

Councilman O'Neill

As I understand it. Is that for the front -- The six feet is allowed for in the front of the house for a...

Mr. Chapman

Just for the posts. Just for the gate post. The height of the fence is four feet.

Councilman O'Neill

Okay.

Mr. Chapman

That's all. 109 Rules - 5/24/05

Council President Verna

Motion was made and seconded. All in favor of the adoption of the amendment will say aye. (Chorus of "ayes.")

Council President Verna

Those opposed? (No response.)

Council President Verna

The ayes have it, and the amendment is adopted. The Chair again recognizes Councilman Clarke.

Councilman Clarke

Move that Bill 15 Number 050232 be reported out of committee with favorable recommendation. UNIDENTIFIED COUNCIL PERSON: Second.

Council President Verna

It has been moved and seconded that Bill Number 050232 be reported out of committee with a favorable recommendation as amended. All in favor will say aye. (Chorus of "ayes.")

Council President Verna

Those 110 Rules - 5/24/05 opposed? (No response.)

Council President Verna

The ayes have it, and the motion carries. The Chair again recognizes Councilman Clarke regarding Bill Number 050233.

Councilman Clarke

Move to adopt an amendment to Bill Number 050233. UNIDENTIFIED COUNCIL PERSON: Second.

Council President Verna

It has been moved and seconded that the amendment as presented be adopted. All in favor will signify by saying aye. (Chorus of "ayes.")

Council President Verna

Those opposed? (No response.)

Council President Verna

The ayes have it, and the motion carries. Again the Chair recognizes Councilman Clarke. 111 Rules - 5/24/05

Councilman Clarke

Move that Bill 3 Number 050233 as amended be reported out of committee with a favorable recommendation and request for rules suspension, as to allow first reading at our next session.

Councilman Ramos

Second.

Council President Verna

It has been moved and seconded that Bill Number 050233 be reported out of committee with a favorable recommendation, as amended; also, a recommendation that the rules of Council be suspended so as to permit first reading at our next session of Council. All in favor will indicate by saying aye. (Chorus of "ayes.")

Council President Verna

Those opposed? (No response.)

Council President Verna

The ayes have it, and the motion carries. Again the Chair recognizes Councilman Clarke regarding Bill Number 050339. 112 Rules - 5/24/05

Councilman Clarke

I move that Bill 3 Number 050339 be reported out of committee with a favorable recommendation and a request for rules suspension as to allow reading at our next session of Council. UNIDENTIFIED COUNCIL PERSON: Second.

Council President Verna

It has been moved and seconded that Bill Number 050339 be reported out of committee with a favorable recommendation; also, a recommendation that the rules of Council be suspended so as to permit first reading at our next Council session. All in favor will please indicate by saying aye. (Chorus of "ayes.")

Council President Verna

Those opposed? (No response.)

Council President Verna

The ayes have it, and the motion carries. I think this concludes our public meeting of the rules committee. Thank you 113 Rules - 5/24/05 very much. (Public meeting concluded at 12:06 p.m.) 114 CERTIFICATE I HEREBY CERTIFY that the proceedings and evidence are contained fully and accurately in the stenographic notes taken by me upon the public hearing and public meeting of The Philadelphia City Council, taken on May 24, 2005, and that this is a true and correct transcript of same. _____________________________ DAVID A. DEIK, RPR and Commissioner of Deeds (The foregoing certification of this transcript does not apply to any reproduction of the same by any means, unless under the direct control and/or supervision of the certifying reporter.)