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Hearing video

ZBA Hearing - April 28, 2026

Philadelphia Zoning Board of Adjustment (ZBA)Apr 28, 20263h 28m

let's call it four bedrooms here four wings of the floor and there will be four bathrooms on the floor

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a dining area plenty of kitchen facilities so everyone can have space in the refrigerator cook

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at the same time if they want to whatever they want to do wash their clothes individually there's

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four washers and dryers on the floor so kia says well so you have three six nine twelve people

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living in this pod and they're all communal living on one floor so everybody together

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there, what about conflict resolution? How do you manage all that? And she's like, will there be house

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rules? And Sherman says, yeah, like any, just like, you know, we have building rules, like how to be a

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good neighbor. We'll have, you have to have house rules. She's like, have you done this before?

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What's the testing? What's, what's your focus group that's proven that this can be effective?

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And he said, well, we've had student housing and Joyce, I believe did a tour maybe 12 years ago

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about some of our student rentals.

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These student rentals were not group living.

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They were like apartments.

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You have students in apartments.

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Are you saying that or are you saying that?

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I'm saying that right now.

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German says it might, so then maybe with student housing

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might be whoever would be able to afford it

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and can afford the rent.

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So German says who he's going to pick to live here

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is whoever would be able to afford it and can afford the rent we wouldn't exclude any specific

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population so then um he says well uh we've had we've had a lot of occupants in other places we've

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you know five or six buildings next to each other six seven bedroom houses so it's effectively 42

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people that we've had together um so then one of the uh neighbors said one of the things she

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thinks that people are concerned about is the target audience you would have students are one

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thing but anyone who's recovering getting back into the population it sounds like they could also get

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a space in one of your pods and he said that's true that's possible i mean like again when we

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presented our two proposals this was not our favorite one to have the neighborhood uh but

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we're we have the property we have to develop it and so this is something that's effectively

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allowed by right and you know since the other application was denied and while we're under

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repeal we're going to seek to get this one approved ideally i'd like to have 16 apartments

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with probably one or two people maximum most of our tenants are single people and the same

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identical building in the prior proposal they would have just been 16 or 20 people instead of

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the 50. then nancy boyd says um it doesn't seem like there's any safety or any privacy where

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people can maybe put their money like like when you're living in a place and there's no doors so

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everybody has access to everybody else's personal belongings. It seems like folks who will want to

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live here who need to live in a room or space, they're not going to have a lot. So is it going

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to be like a conflict there where there's no bed, there's no dresser, there's no coming in?

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They're really looking at other folks, what they have, and maybe they could potentially be a real

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problem. And Jakubov says, well, there's closets. I'm going to share the screen again, and he shows

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that there's closets. Nancy says, well, is there any privacy with any closet or dresser? How does

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the units have privacy and um he says well for these kind let's call them walk-in closets people

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could bring their own security devices whether it's a safe luggage whether it's whatever it is

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that makes them seem fit you know this isn't designed to be permanent housing this is somebody

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that needs that could be permanent but in essence this is probably you know a transition for someone

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who has who needs a roof over the head doesn't care can't afford it so look we said when we got

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one o'clock we're going to make an evaluation okay this is what we're going to do and i would

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appreciate if you could figure out where you want to stop we're stopping at 1 15. okay the staff

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usually gets done at 12 30. ian haggerty and the keisha are coming in to help out a little bit

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but 1 15 okay it's a dead stop but it won't be the end of my case i'm oh oh no no no

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Oh, no, no, no. What I'm saying is, I'd like to stop. How much longer are you going to read?

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I'd like to stop.

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Sure.

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Okay.

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How much?

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I think we can get to the end of this transcript.

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If you get to the end of that, then I'm fine.

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Morris, do you hear what I said?

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You're dead.

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Okay, thank you. Go ahead, Steve.

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Okay. So he's saying, you know, people want a roof over their head, can't afford to have a single apartment.

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This is their way to have a house and be affordable.

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But then Nancy says, but people barely be in a shelter and people who need a room don't carry a bed.

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like you're not going to have a bed with you most times jermis says i mean that might be

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something we might look at and maybe something we would charge extra for to give them a bed

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uh then um then we have um oh this was my uh my comment about transitional living

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uh you call transitional housing multiple times so the question is i don't see any communal dining

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facilities that are defined you said there's areas that people can cook but can people go to any

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floor and any part of the building to cook are they supposed to only go to the area that's closest to

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where their room is and he says well there's multiple areas for them to cook that's communal

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it's shared transitional i would argue that anything that you don't own is transitional

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somebody runs an apartment for a year it's transitioning for the year so we went back and

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forth about transitional and uh german meredith says german was very clear when he means

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transitional somebody who's looking for a roof over their head um so then uh

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okay tell more about um how are the rents paid are they paid daily weekly bi-weekly how can

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somebody this issue in that question yes it appears to be yeah how do they know how much

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how much time they're buying when they're when they give you money at certain intervals

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and German says well there'll be a regular lease just like anything else they'll pay ahead

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just like a regular tenant would the lease would be anything from 30 days to a year

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and then we have Neva if you have like seven ten people with personal care needs personal care

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needs being defined not only as you know they need assistance with their medicine they need

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assistance maybe getting the doctor they need assistance paying bills any kind of cognitive

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issues how are these are all things that go with personal care how are you going to safeguard 50

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people living here and then the third part of my question is what about children will children be

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permitted to live here german says i don't see why they wouldn't be permitted to live there

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talking about children but as far as the mental i would i'm going to treat anybody that wants to

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live here as i would anybody else who wants to rent for me i'm not going to ask them what their

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mental state is what their drug addiction is or isn't i'm going to check their ability to pay

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i'm going to check their background and as long as they qualify both on an economic level

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then they can and they can afford the place they can stay there neva says but that's not what

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legally i'm saying a group facility has with individuals who need personal care and he said

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i'm not he said i'm not providing personal care um and then he says um that's not what that says at

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that's not what that says if I'm the only one providing it you know it's a

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space for them to live that's all that's all I'm providing so then so okay so

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that's all a Germans doing is providing the housing so then we get to joy so

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you're reading into the record he's reading into the record transcript and

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he's misreading what's from the paper stop mr chair i'm i know but just control your client

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let him finish him we're going to get out of this all right but i i do want to object because he's

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now selectively reading things without reading the clarifying points i noticed that he's not

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reading everything i noticed that okay well it's it's in it we've we've submitted i'm saying i said

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meredith's had a long statement there you jump past that so i'm saying you know oh not even

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that the words that that he's saying out loud aren't what's on the client to please be quiet

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all right meredith meredith is perfectly free to read other statements if she wants and yeah

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let's go so okay so uh the zoning code prohibits you know apartment you occupy more than three

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people blah blah blah um i have a couple questions so you're not outsourcing any of these services

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and the first question so you're not okay outsourcing services when i looked at the

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building it doesn't even look like it belongs on the block um there'll be congestion traffic living

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with total interruption the quality of life on the residential block um neva says you're having

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approximately 12 people in a pod that could potentially be unrelated how will you keep

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children safe um and um and it appears to say this just says um how will you my job to keep them safe

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uh so maris says no if sherman was renting apartments to people it's the same as if he's

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he's doing now potentially 12 people with unrelated peoples can you repeat what you said

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can you repeat what you said um my job to keep them safe it's not my job um german says my job

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um my job to keep them safe it's not

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is to provide them to anybody that wants to have housing that's what i'm offering that's a very hard

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statement mr german i mean it's a hard statement it's not like my job to keep them safe and gene

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allen says in this in the light of the fact that we have three schools in the immediate area with

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one within one block how do you plan to vet other than finances who can have access to your rental

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units germans the same way i've had any of my other tenants we do background checks make sure

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they have they're good residents we manage hundreds of units a lot of them are in parkside

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i don't know does anybody hear of any complaints about the neighbors and and our residents and

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even says this is a totally different project and german says well we're asking for the same

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income requirements we do for anybody else it's just these income requirements are much more

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attainable for a lot of people but you know uh we don't want to be in a position where we put

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our staff at risk we don't want to do that either putting the entire block at risk by having all

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these individuals coming here we know nothing of them let me ask you something mr german would you

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like to live next to this facility and he said i would rather live next to a 16 unit building and

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neva said that's not what i asked you i asked you would you like to live next to this what

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you're proposing unknown speaker it doesn't say please please would you and um uh and then you

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you don't you don't know and then wow this is the second most profound thing you've said tonight so

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that implies that that's mr yakubov speaking uh that's a reference to him um and and then

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he's implying things by with providing no evidence and again this is why we objected to this

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transcript because it is it is complete hearsay for him to be reading things into the record

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without being able to validate who's making these statements listen we're close to being finished

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you will be given ample opportunity to respond to it okay but ample opportunity

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mr jacobo says i'd rather live next to a regular apartment building but then uh put nine apartments

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their regular apartment building uh and then they went back and forth about can you lower the 16 to

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nine uh then um neva says when someone says it's not their job to keep children safe it's profoundly

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hard to move past that statement profoundly hard uh then we have

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this is Meredith addressing some of the um some of the questions that were in the chat

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um one of the questions German will you do research background uh background research

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for potential tenants for Megan's law is that something you typically do he says we'd run

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general background checks I think Megan's law is part of that um then Andrew Goodman said there

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There's a rent question, how much will the rent be?

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I believe we're underwriting it,

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about $500 a month per bed.

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So then we have,

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will you have a staff person somewhere in the building

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that will overlook regardless to who's paying the rent

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or what they will be somewhere,

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somebody to overlook what's going on into that home?

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And German says, well, we manage all of our properties.

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There's somebody nearby our offices at 51st and Lancaster.

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he just testified to that earlier that there's other buildings where he has staff but there's no

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staff there will be no staff in this building he says nobody on this one building nobody in the

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room and german says nobody on this building yet but we will have a caretaker or something like

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that then german says we will we're about to start building the 48 unit property which is

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in the backyard there'll be somebody on staff there during business hours and then we have

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so just we're clear anyone can move into this building as long as they can pay the rent so

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can we go on record as saying that this is what you're telling us anyone can move into this

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building if they're able to pay the rent they can afford 500 a month they can live here

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german says that's correct then neva says is that um baron you said some kind of background check

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what would be the stipulation that would prevent you uh what would prevent an individual from being

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able to rent a property i think this is the last um portion that we're going to look at

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um the question is um you told us anybody who can afford it you can is going to live here

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reading no no no i'm just i'm just you're you're testifying right now i'm testifying right now i'm

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saying that uh what we're going to see now is back and forth trying to get him to clarify is there

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anyone that you would not be okay with is there anyone that you would say no to to live in this

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building. Okay, this is where we're at. So unknown speaker, I think this is German, but it says it's

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a case-by-case basis. So then Neva says, well, give me an example of at least two cases where

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you would not rent based on background check. And German says, it depends on violent crimes that

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may be and how recent those crimes may have been committed and the circumstances behind those

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crimes that may be committed. You know, nobody's perfect. Neva says, and what's the next violent

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crime i mean they've been convicted and served their time so they can they can um they can

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they can um they they can they've committed a violent crime you would not rent to them

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they've committed a violent crime you would not rent to them and germans

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and german says no it's not what that's not what i said and then um german says so in this instance

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everybody's case is different if somebody got out of jail yesterday right and for killing someone

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i'd want to know what happened right and if if i'm okay with that then they could live in my building

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right it varies so it's case um by case and neva says can you at least give us two examples of two

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individuals that you would not rent to based on their background check that's the question i'm

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asking and german says i'm not sure would have to be a case-by-case basis i don't know i can't

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think of every single so neva says give me one example of an individual you would not rent to

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that's what you're saying here today on the record that you can't give us an example of one person

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you would not rent to based on their background uh that background check and uh and uh meredith

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then comes in and says, well, if you respect, there's very specific requirements for the code.

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And Neva says, I just want an example of one person that you would not rent to.

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And then German says, I think if somebody walks in and then somebody might deny them,

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I might approve it, maybe because I like them. So it varies. So it's somebody that I have to end up

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managing and I have to make sure they'll be able to pay the rent and that, you know,

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they wouldn't damage the property or anything case by case.

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Is that the end?

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Almost.

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To reduce recidivism is to give people who are coming out of jail a place to live

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because they need to have a place.

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If they come out with an ankle bracelet, they have to have a room and a place to live.

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This helps people from recommitting crimes.

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German says, I mean, if it's somebody that can afford the rent

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and they are more than welcome to stay at my place,

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but that's not who we're targeting, not targeting them.

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