civus
Hearing video

ZBA Hearing - November 9, 2023

Philadelphia Zoning Board of Adjustment (ZBA)Nov 9, 20235h 14m

but there's a change in the development character of the property that we'll talk about in a bit, which brings us here today.

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I've included my typical exhibit package that I'll walk through as we speak today.

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are the refusal, which we have waived the reading of.

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But this is the only thing that we're really here to talk about

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is a dimensional standards for lowering the density of the third floor.

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What we're proposing is to do a three-floor flush facade rather than the setback.

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That is the only item that has triggered the refusal.

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And the only reason why we have to do that is because this property is between two, two-story.

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why we have to do that is because this property is between two two-story properties so the code

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requires that if you're going to develop a property between two two stories your third floor

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has to be set back we don't want we are seeking a variance because we believe that's a hardship

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for our particular situation and because of the the way the block is developing right now and

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we'll see that in a few minutes i'll just just move by the the easy stuff here's the deed my

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clients owning the property their llc and the tax clearance for their llc and as we get down

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to the application for appeal we'll talk about the the uh hardship a little bit more when we

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get to the pictures will be better said then project information sheet exhibit five exhibit

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six as you can see what we're talking about is a property that is one property off the corner

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on the corner of South 24th and Jarrett. And there it is in that circle. All the properties here,

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we're not looking for anything different. It's going to be single family, new construction.

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And as you saw, this particular property here in the red box is going up three floors. Now,

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the board, just so the board is clear, the third floor that it looks like it is already there

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is a hardship created by my client. That's not why we're here. On the pleasure of the board,

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if we must remove it, we will. But if you can look just two properties over, you can see

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by right, there's a three-story property that's built, and we were looking to basically match

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that. Across the street from that, there's three others. Right across the street, one, two, three,

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on the same street, just a few blocks up, all three stories straight up, and right across the

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street is a three-story property. And so this is what we're going to get to as far as what the

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development character of the block. This block is beginning to develop as a three-story flush

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facade type of block. There are a couple that have the setback, but because of that, those blocks,

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it is a compromise of the sale price. My client's taking the position that if you don't do the

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three-floor flush with the full roof deck, you're going to be stuck in a market where your third

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floor is much smaller and people don't want to look out of a balcony looking at the house next

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door. They want to be on the roof deck. They want the larger square foot interior with the fuller

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roof deck. That's more marketable and that will prevent the economic hardship that he foresees

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in this particular development. So as we move through the exhibits, again, you see the property

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and just looking at what we have here on the just and this is going to play into what we will be

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talking about when planning comes in we are here because we need the variance to do the three four

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but this property of the corner does not because of the way the code is drafted so this property

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will be able to go up three floors flush this property on the next the two-story property here

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we believe that that is a that owner should be on the call today in support of our project

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he would be the most, I guess, affected neighbor being right next door. And this owner is in

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agreement with it, with our zoning request. So again, this property is a matter of right,

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can go three stories flushed if it's ever redeveloped. As you can see further down the

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block, this is the property that is identical to what we're doing. This is the one that's set back.

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so you have one setback and you have one that's three stories straight up the one that's here on

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the corner next to it that can go three stories straight up because it won't have a two-story on

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either side of it so that one so you count two now that can be three stories without this planning

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commission um relief and then if you go down the block you see the other three here so that means

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this this building can go three stories if it's ever developed with flush without the zoning

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board being involved. And if it does, then so will this one, and then so will this one.

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So the way this block has been developed, three-story flush facades are going to be the

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direction that you'll see most of the houses developed. And that's what we're arguing as a

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hardship. Across the street, looking towards South 24th, that block, there are no three-stories.

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That's going to stay pretty much the same. Immediately across the street, these are the

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stories that are again the older housing stock that are a part of the legacy of the property

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but right at the corner again this is the type of construction that is marketable that people

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are buying on the block um and and as we go through again these are the three that are already

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on this block they didn't have dakota zoning because of the configuration of not being between

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two two stories but they're right there um and we we see that this is exactly what my client

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believed that he could do when he started his construction stopped it before you know and to

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come to the board to get the uh the approval to proceed uh and again this is just another view

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the approval to proceed and again this is just another view of the same argument that we're

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of the same argument

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making that this type of construction three floors uh flush facades is the marketing direction of the

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development of this particular corner and street as we go down further again that's just another

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picture here looking into the inside all we've got is the property is basically you know studded out

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first floor is second floor going up third floor it's just started out there's nothing else

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happening in the property but this they've stopped all construction pending the direction of this

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basement is here the mechanicals are basically roughed in and that's where the property is at

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this point in time awaiting the outcome of these proceedings this is the rear of the property as

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can see again just started out and waiting awaiting the outcome of this and this is the

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little patio space this it should be mentioned that this particular property is 14 feet wide

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and 48 feet deep it's small that means every bit of square foot is needed for marketable square foot

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for sale and we feel that if we start to chop away at that on the third floor it will really

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compromise the ability of this particular owner to sell it and recoup or he'll face what we believe

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a financial hardship so just looking at let me bring this down a little bit smaller so we can

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look at the layout of the floors and nothing nothing unusual to see here that we would not

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expect basement is just going to be undeveloped with mechanicals in this crawl space there'll be

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a window for egress on either side the front and the rear to get out of that basement as you walk

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up the stairs to the first floor there's a living room dining room kitchen basic setup walking out

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to the small patio in the back the very small patio there as you go up to the second floor

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there's a bedroom on the front and the back with a common bath in between those two and as you get

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into the third floor and this is where we feel is the most marketable value of the property is that

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there's a primary large bedroom there with the clause walking closet and either this can either

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be developed into with a walk-in bath with a full closet here or there's different options but i

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think this is what this is what we feel is the marketing the owner's area of the house and why

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we think it's important to have that full uh that full layout there as you get into the top you have

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a fuller roof deck as well and again we're just talking about a property that's 14 feet wide by

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48 in depth all done it will only have 14 and 1440 square feet which is still relatively small

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to carry the price um that they're seeking or that the market will bear at this point in time

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so let's go down let's go further down through the the through the package here we have just more

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visuals of the property how it will look on the front you've kind of seen it as it's roughed in

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door first floor window second and third with the roof deck up top and uh and the uh basically the

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you know straightforward layout nothing nothing unusual or different so we did send to the rcos

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a notice as we can see here this we also with this notice sent the refusal as well as several

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pictures of the property that meeting was not attended so well but we did mark we didn't send

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it to 175 different near neighbors. And this is the list of those folks and their certificate of

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mailing. We do the old school. We don't do VISTA. So we actually have to do it six to a page. So

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there's all of our postings of certificate of mailing. The zoning board, the zoning ZVA notice

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poster, as you can see here, was posted on the property at the appropriate time before the

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hearing. And we did walk, and I personally walked a petition out to the neighbors so they could see

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what we're trying to do and to understand it even easier. And so the kind of petition we put was

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very clear. The code requires this middle look, but we're looking for this corner look. And we

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asked members of the community that were there on that day when we did the door knock, what was

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their preference? And we got from that three members of the community that those were just

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the three that were there. Everyone that basically we met and encountered that would talk to us

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said that they were fine with an approved and signed this petition didn't have very many people

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so I guess it's a very narrow block and we went there around 10 o'clock during the day so there

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may have been people at work but during the actual ZBA hearing meeting there were 10 members there

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but not in the affected area and so that's why we do have well we did get last night um a um a sub

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letter of non-opposition from Point Priest Community Development Corporation so we have that

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And I added it to this presentation here today, but it should be coming from Point Breeze.

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And as you can see, they mention here that they don't, that the reason why they're taking non-opposition because although there were 10 persons.

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they don't that the reason why they're taking non-opposition because although there were 10

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persons that attended the meeting there were none within the two within the you know the the radius

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that's required and as a result they um they took a neutral position on the project uh knowing that

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we did a petition and did other things there so with that i would like to advance um mr narian

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with if he can raise his virtual hand

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Reuben Narayan, please raise your virtual hand.

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He's been unmuted and allowed to speak, Chair.

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Sir, could you please state your name and spell for the court's sonographer?

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Reuben Narayan?

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Spell your name, please.

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Hold on a second.

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And maybe I can do something here.

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Microphone, speakers.

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We hear you.

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Just one of you.

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Oh, okay.

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You don't need to see me.

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Okay.

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I'm sorry.

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State your name and spell for the court stenographer.

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My first name, Reuven.

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Last name, Narayan.

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First name spelled R-E-U-V-E-N.

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Last name spelled N-A-R-Y-A-N.

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You swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth.

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I do.

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please proceed counsel uh yes mr narian have you been listening to the testimony that i've

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been making on your behalf for the project of at 2355 garrett street yes sir and would you

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adopt this testimony as your own testimony yes sir and is there anything that i've omitted or

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didn't say that you'd like to add to what i've already testified to on behalf of the project

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and yourself uh no everything seems to be in order um um just the third floor it's going to

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be like the master and the bed in the back like uh like you said and it's going to be a walk-in

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closet and the and the the area that is closer to the to the street is going to be like the master

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shower so i heard that you weren't so sure about that but it's uh this is the layout if it makes

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any difference it's in the plans as well oh yes yes see that that thank you for clarifying everything

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besides that sounds correct yes sir okay well i appreciate that so at this time if there's

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any further questions for the board i'd like to answer them questions from the board no chair

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no mr chairman questions or comments from our attorney hillary ramson

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just a brief comment mr chair um we didn't receive the letter from the rco so mr top and

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And if you could please forward that as soon as we're done, that would be great.

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Thank you.

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Yes, I will do that.

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I will do that.

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Questions or comments from the virtual audience?

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Chair, we have a call-in user four.

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Call-in user, please unmute yourself and wait for the chair.

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Hi, could you please state your name and spell for the course stenographer?

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Hello? Is your hand still up? Yes, their hand is still up, Chair. Call and user, can you

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please unmute yourself? Yes, hi, Tiffany Green, concerned citizen of Point 3, RCO. Hold on,

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Do me a favor. Could you spell your name, please, for the court stenographer?

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C-I-F-F-A-N-Y-G-R-E-E-N.

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Right. Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?

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Yes.

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Please proceed.

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Okay. First of all, I have not received anything from this particular developer at all.

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I didn't even receive a notification that he sent out.

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We have not received anything from him regarding this project.

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But yet, so when we went to the meeting, we were at the meeting, there was considerable, you know, opposition from us.

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And I think .3 CDC, I believe because the person that was heading up the meeting then, she talked about it.

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And we talked to him about doing the setback.

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What happened, and I'm trying to – my notes are really sketchy, but that he had built straight up,

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and then he did not follow the rules in terms of doing a setback, okay?

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And so the thing about it is that now he wants to legitimize this because he didn't follow the rules.

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And we don't think that this is correct because of the fact that what's bothering me here with this is this, okay?

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And I'm going to say this and put it on the record.

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Okay, Point Breast was one of the first communities, and when we met with Deputy Mayor Greenberg back in 2013, it was stated to us that this was their way up because we did not want the three-story houses in the middle of the blocks regarding privacy, skyline, whatever you want to say, that they were going to do the setback.

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Now, it was supposed to be the setback period on two both sides.

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Now, it was supposed to be the setback period on to both sides.

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Now, what this came in with about the lots, this was something that city council snuck in.

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We don't know anything about that, but I know that the setback was supposed to be so you wouldn't be up on the neighbors.

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And I feel that, you know, at this point that a lot of this is being changing, and I feel that this should be upheld.

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Okay, because it's not right that a lot of the community at this particular point are not, you know,

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A lot of times people are busy, they can't come, they can't sit.

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Like, it's very hard to sit through this for the whole day up until 3.30,

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and then you expect people to sit on here and wait just for one project.

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So the thing is that there's no real variance.

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There's no hardship here with him.

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There's no hardship why he needs to have this variance done.

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Where is it?

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This is Sussan Pol's hardship, and I don't see or we don't see where he actually had a hardship here

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with somebody that didn't follow the rules and tried to get over and he got caught.

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That's what it feels at this point.

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And we're saying that we're asking the zoning committee to uphold this.

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This is not right.

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This was supposed to be about part of character and maintain the character of two-story communities.

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And constantly coming into our neighborhood where you have mainly newcomers or sometimes voting

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because they're living in three-story, that's not right to the two-stories, you know.

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