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Hearing video

ZBA Hearing - July 23, 2025

Philadelphia Zoning Board of Adjustment (ZBA)Jul 23, 20254h 34m

Could you spell it, please?

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Architect, could you do that one more time for us?

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Yes.

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Sam Xu spells S-A-M and X-U is the last name.

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Okay.

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Okay. Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?

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Yes, sir.

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Counsel, will you have him start your presentation?

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Yes. Good afternoon, Mr. Zhu. Did you prepare these plans?

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Excuse me?

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Did you prepare these plans for 248 North?

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Yeah.

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All right.

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Okay, go ahead.

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And two of the plans.

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Okay, awesome.

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Could you explain to the board the plans that the owners have for the property?

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Yes. When Mr. Kenney and his wife purchased the property, it was terribly run down and everything was waiting to collapse.

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And Mr. Kenny hired contractors to rebuild it and secure it.

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Right now it's ready to be converted to a good use.

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So the two buildings, as I understand it, was...

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So the two buildings, as I understand it, was part of the recreation center.

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There was once before, and then after the other side was converted to daycare,

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and then there was more demand for this kind of services.

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and mr kenny uh invest more to uh try to convert the two buildings uh as part of the uh the larger

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daycare center so we have two buildings that are connected to the current daycare we label it north

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and south building on the right side is the north building and on the left side is the south building

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the south side has three entrances. One is from the main entrance to the current operating daycare

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and then one from Oak Ridge Street at the end and from the side and the north building has

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from the smaller street and then it's connected to the main daycare center by the basement

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so uh both uh buildings have five escapes so hold on a minute hillary we're only looking at one

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building am i correct okay yes the other building is already approved right the other building is

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already approved yes but we only want to have conversation about this building that we have

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now the new building right how many floor is the current building mister three floors each okay

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Okay. And are you going to make any renovation to the structure of the building at all?

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I'm sorry. I was a little...

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Are there going to be any renovation to the structure of the building?

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Yes. Yes. A lot of planning has been done and we are ready to go.

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and actually we submitted a building application.

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It was just being held up by the zoning.

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Right.

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And if you receive the permit,

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what are the renovations that are going to be made?

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Oh, it would be start right away.

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What are they?

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Oh, what are they?

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They, well, what the mix safe already done,

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It's interior alteration to make the inside, the design that shows the new part of the daycare center.

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Okay. Are there going to be renovations for the HVAC and electricity?

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Yes. All mechanical, electrical, plumbing, everything is going to be redone.

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Okay. Otherwise, the rooms are already done. You're not going to do any structural renovation, correct?

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No, not in terms of structure. It's already done by the make-safe phase earlier.

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I believe it was last year or before that, we had a structure engineer took care of the make-safe.

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Okay. All right. So just to clarify, the only renovations are the HVAC, electricity, sprinkler, and fire-rated wall. Are these the only renovations?

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Yes. It's to be compliant with the building code requirements.

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Okay. So let's look on the first floor. Let's see.

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um if i may just if you check them on in

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all right so if you can explain to the board there are three floors if you can explain to

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the board what is in each floor currently uh i'm sorry my my screen it's kind of dark i

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don't see anything oh you don't see anything right

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you don't see the plans on the screen no it's it's a completely oh yeah right now it is okay

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so on the uh we're looking at the south building right now yeah the first floor is that would be

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like a large gathering room. What is it? Yeah. What's the first floor? It's going to be a large

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gathering room. Okay. Yeah. And what kind of renovation are you going to make on the first

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floor uh interior of the tower is to uh uh frame the

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It's to frame the exterior walls, insulate, run the wires, install the ductwork, all that is required by the building code.

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Okay. And what about the second floor?

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Second floor, I remember it was divided into three classrooms with a toilet room. And each room, I remember, each room has a hand sink and a kitchenette, at least one kitchenette for the back.

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Okay. And the third floor?

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First of all, it's only one classroom, but also a bathroom and a kitchenette.

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Okay.

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So there is one classroom.

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Counsel, go back one minute.

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Okay.

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In the first one, I noticed the basement had a whole series of offices.

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Where is that at?

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The front one?

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Let's see.

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Do you hear the question, Mr?

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Oh, no, I'm sorry.

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I couldn't hear clearly.

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I'm trying to...

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In the basement.

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Are there offices in the basement?

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Yeah, the basement is not planned to be occupied.

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It's most likely for mechanical use.

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Not in this one.

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All right.

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All right.

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Board member, I would like to bring my client in to explain

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the classroom and how many students will be in the classroom.

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Okay, why don't you bring her on?

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I'm totally confused. Is this the building that we're looking at the right one?

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is this the one that's you're renovating yes there's three buildings there's one that is a

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one-story building that's not been shown in plan that is the existing daycare 248 Earlham Terrace

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has two buildings and a plaza that has a part of the the swimming pool in the middle they are not

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contiguous one of the buildings has a party wall that it shares with the adjacent house

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and one is the standalone building on the corner with the turret so it's the two buildings that

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we're looking at the plan are

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what they are in play

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right now. So everybody does need a

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review. So both these

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are part of the... Correct. And then there's

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a

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swimming pool in between the two.

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Yeah, it would have been helpful to have kind of a

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site plan.

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Site plan would have been lovely, yeah.

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Are we doing two buildings?

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Martine? Yes,

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I'm here. Okay.

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All right, Martine. I was going to

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say the refusal

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says a child care center in an existing semi-detached structure which means it's

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they're connected by a ground floor walkway which is why i think they've been considered a single

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structure there otherwise excuse me i'm sorry for the interruption uh was uh miss St. Ville sworn

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not not yet not yet hi could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer

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First name is Martine, M-A-R-T-I-N-E, last name Saintville, S-A-I-N-T hyphen V-I-L.

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Right, all right.

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Hi, do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, told truth, nothing but the truth?

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Yes, I do.

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Counsel?

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So, Martine, why don't you start off by exactly saying what you're doing, what the buildings are?

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Yes, thank you.

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My name is Martine Saintville, as stated.

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So the building where I'm sitting now is the current preschool Bambino Academy Center.

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And it has nothing to do with this project?

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No, it used to be the All Boys and Girls Club.

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Okay.

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Prior to requesting the zoning, when I had to do the center here, the city had us have a surveyor come out to break the line.

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So that's why it is separated into two separate sides.

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So it used to be one unit, one building as the Old Boys and Girls Club.

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So we cut the line.

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We have 259 and 248 West Earlham.

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We are requesting zoning for 248 West Earlham, which are two properties that are adjacent to this one where I'm sitting at.

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The request for the amount of kids, it wouldn't be 72 as stated earlier.

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I cannot actually say how many kids will be, but tentatively, it may be.

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actually say how many kids will be, but tentatively, it may be approximately 65 kids,

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not 72. The city will give the occupancy, and when DPW comes, that's when they will decide

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how many kids can be at the center. So we are requesting the variance because once we

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decided that we needed to do the center expand the center we find out that it was not zoned

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as commercial we thought it was part of the old boys and girls club and it would be still

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part of it so that's um the purpose of the variant right so you have two buildings with

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a swimming pool in the middle that you're going to do away with the swimming pool and make it a

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playground yes and the one building has an office in the basement the other one's just no right yes

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okay um all right questions from the board

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yes i have a question about the drop-off and entrance plan um i see where the modes of

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egress are going to be but are parents going to be doing drop-off through that central

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plaza and playground area like is that going to be come the new public entrance to the campus

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So the entrance to drop off would still remain, it would be on Pulaski, because that's where we have the most parking. Because we occupied the whole corner, which is Calter, Pulaski, and Earlham, that gives us a lot of parking space because we do not have the neighbors park around because they park in front of their places.

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and drop-off is at different time it's not everyone comes like a school and drop off at 8 30 so we

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open at seven we will have some parents drop off at seven and we offer phl pre-k so the phl pre-k

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usually time frame is 8 30 drop off up until nine so nine nine p nine a.m is the cutoff time so

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drop-off is staggered it's not all at once okay and but what is the process like right now like

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what do you think your volume is because at this point we're doubling the number of people who

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would be coming at any given time to this corner yes most of our parents are neighborhood parents

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So we do not have a lot of parents who actually drive.

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They do come in by foot and drop off the kids.

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The parents who actually have to drive to drop off some of their kids, like I said,

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there's always plenty of parking for them to pull and drop off their kids.

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And at the same time, our teachers as well.

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I only have two teachers who drive apart from myself.

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okay and then my other two questions are really about facilities so are three questions about

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facilities yes one what's the plan for the filling in because i know he said covering the um swimming

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pool are you filling in the hole and then coming back with a parking with a sorry with a playground

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because that was not shown in the plan like there's no site plan that shows the connectivity

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between these buildings and the entrance?

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So if, I'm not sure if I can have access

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to show the plan, but if Ms. Gabrielle can pull in

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a 1.3, so it will actually have that on.

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keep if i made my second third question so you can see the site plan that while she pulls it up

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you might be able to answer what's the plan for like lunch and food and snacks i didn't see a

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a kitchen facility on the plans so we do not propose a kitchen plan that's the reason why i

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requested the kitchenette so we do have a kitchen on site here because it's closely related so and

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we do offer on cacfb food we prepare our own food at the center so the food would be um

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um serve at the other um center around each classroom will have their kitchen net so which

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Around each classroom will have their kitchen net, which would be a small refrigerator, so that way they can store milk, juice, and then cereal would be stored there as well in the classroom.

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would be a small

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And if we need any food that we have to cook, it's usually food that we warm up.

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Is there going to be an industrial warming station in either of the new proposed buildings? It just seems like it's a lot of kids to have to sort of walk food from around the corner.

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Um, we actually, when we used to have food delivered, it will be delivered, you know,

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covered and just take it over. So I think that's a possibility that we can always

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wheel the food out to the two sections. And then my third question is around bathrooms.

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So I see there is bathroom facilities on every floor. Just in my experience with daycares,

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there's usually like, and especially kids that are potty training, there's usually kids scaled

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bathrooms that have multiple bathrooms that allow them to, you know, learn that are also at like

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little people sized or scaled. And I'm wondering, like, is that going to be accommodated since

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most of the age range, age ranges in the new facility seem to be under the age of five?

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so um based on experience when we built this center it didn't have two things it didn't have

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sank inside the classroom after covid i added sank so now i do understand the um utility of

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having the bathroom inside the classroom and that's one of the things i did request for the

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architect to um make sure that the bathroom are connected where they can be used in the classroom

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which i think there's a bathroom in every classroom but it's a single stall

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and they all seem to be adult scaled instead of you know for they're not going to be adult

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scales um i don't know when he built when he um drew the plan he have them as adult but they

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cannot be adult because of the size they need to be able to reach um the sink the soap and the

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toilet and then my second question would be then where are your staff and the teenagers that are

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on the top floor going to the bathroom because they would need adult scale like you need both

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scale bathrooms yes right now the plan is not showing that and then my last question

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is about separation you've got the teenagers and you've got the five-year-olds what's the security

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