No. This is the capital. It's Bill Number 050002. It has been moved and seconded that the amendments to Bill Number 050002 be adopted. All in favor will signify by saying aye. (Chorus of "ayes.")
Madam President, just like on the previous bill, I 363 Whole - 5/25/05 have an amendment to the amended capital budget, reflecting the additional $7 million in the recreation budget. It's being circulated.
Councilman Cohen, you have a question or comment? Your light is on.
Thank you. Madam President, I just wanted to ask Mr. McPherson the same question as I asked on the last capital bill. MR. McPHERSON: The answer is yes because this amendment then makes the capital budget consistent with the capital program, as we just amended it.
A motion was made. Was it seconded? UNIDENTIFIED COUNCIL PERSON: Second. 364 Whole - 5/25/05
It was moved and seconded that the amendment be adopted. Councilman Cohen.
Your light was still on. that's why I recognized you. Councilman DiCicco. COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: Clarification. Does this amendment increase the capital budget that has been submitted by the administration?
(Microphone not on, not reportable.) ...process so that the Planning Commission would have notice. COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: And what, if any, impact does this have on the five year plan? MR. McPHERSON: Nothing. It's capital. COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: So it doesn't have any impact on it.
Okay. All those in favor of the amendment will indicate by saying aye. (Chorus of "ayes.")
The ayes have it, and the amendment is adopted. The Chair again recognizes Councilwoman Blackwell, regarding Bill Number 050002.
Thank you, Madam President. I move that Bill Number 050002, as amended, be reported out of committee with a favorable recommendation, and a recommendation that the rules be suspended so as to permit first reading at our next session of Council.
It has been moved and seconded that Bill Number 050002 be reported out of committee with a 366 Whole - 5/25/05 favorable recommendation as amended; also, a recommendation the rules of Council be suspended so as to permit first reading at our next session of Council. All in favor will indicate by saying aye. (Chorus of "ayes.")
The ayes have it, and the motion carries. The Chair recognizes Councilwoman Blackwell regarding Bill Number 050003.
Thank you, Madam President. I move that the amendment to Bill 19 Number 050003 be adopted. UNIDENTIFIED COUNCIL PERSON: Second.
It has been moved and seconded that the amendments as provided earlier to the operating budget be adopted. 367 Whole - 5/25/05 All in favor will say aye. (Chorus of "ayes.")
The Chair recognizes Councilman Nutter. A vote's been cast. Councilman Nutter.
Yes, Madam Chair. These are -- This is the set of amendments that was put forward by Miss Reed that we walked through. Is that what we're talking about here? Madam Chair?
There were another set of amendments to the operating budget that had been discussed over some period of time, prior to the most recent set of proposed amendments, that had a variety of different schedules, proposed cuts and restorations. Now, it was indicated to me that there would at least be some opportunity for discussion of these proposed changes to the 368 Whole - 5/25/05 FY'06 operating budget prior to the time of taking up the other amendments that had been discussed at the witness table by Miss Reed. So I would at least... I mean, before we... These proposed amendments are very different in nature from each other.
The Chair recognizes Councilman Goode for a point of order. COUNCIMLAN GOODE: Thank you, Madam President. I believe there's a motion on the floor that was made and seconded.
There was. However... COUNCIMLAN GOODE: So we are reconsidering the matter.
I am told by our counselor that the issue is being debated. So, Councilman Nutter -- COUNCIMLAN GOODE: I don't mind the issue being debated, as long as we know what we're considering. We're considering the 369 Whole - 5/25/05 amendments as presented. There was a motion, and it was seconded. I don't mind a debate, but we're not considering a second set of amendments. We're debating the amendments that were just presented.
In the event that the Chair rules that there's only one set of amendments that are going to be voted on, will the Chair let us know that? It's my understanding -- It was my understanding that we'd be potentially voting on a second set of amendments. If the Chair rules that we are not, could you let us know? Because I would like to vote no on these amendments, if we're having no opportunity for a second set. I am being told by... In fact, Mr. Auerbach, why don't you explain it, please?
Sure. There's now a motion on the floor to amend the operating 370 Whole - 5/25/05 budget. It's been seconded. There's now a debate on that motion. The debate should continue. There should then be a vote on the motion to amend the operating budget. That way, if the amendment -- if that motion passes, then another motion would be in order to make different amendments to the operating budget. But there is a motion pending on the floor at the moment.
Well, I would only raise two issues in the course of this discussion. One is, will there be an opportunity in the course of this public meeting to consider any other amendments to Bill 050003?
One more point of information. Is it the Chair's ruling that the last set of amendments that are voted on, if passed, are the ones that finally amend the bill?
If the first set of amendments passes, the second motion really should be to undo the first set of amendments and substitute a second set of amendments.
So, if those amendments pass, they would be the germane.
So we have to consider the first set of amendments.
Okay. The second issue I raise is, I just want to make 372 Whole - 5/25/05 sure that I have clarity on this particular set of amendments, specifically related to restorations.
Thanks. What is the amount that is proposed to be restored to the Fire Department?
Councilman, I think we're all getting rather tired. Who are you asking the question of?
There's an amendment on the floor. I'd like to understand how much is being restored to the Fire Department.
Okay. So, I would suggest Miss Reed come to the witness table, since she submitted the Mayor's proposed amendments. (Councilman Goode speaking, away from the microphone, not reportable.) 373 Whole - 5/25/05
Moved from the public hearing to the public meeting. (Councilman Goode speaking, away from the microphone, not reportable.)
Point of information. Does the Chair rule that a Council member in a public meeting is not able to ask a question of a person who is sponsoring the amendment? I recognize Councilman Goode's position, relative to additional testimony from the administration. But is it appropriate or out of order for a Council member to ask the introducer of the amendment questions relative to the amendment?
I'm sorry. I didn't hear you. 374 Whole - 5/25/05 I think if the Councilman is asking a question -- and I know that Councilwoman Blackwell is the sponsor of the bill, but the sponsor of the amendments were the administration's, I would suggest that Miss Reed come up to the table and respond, please. COUNCIMLAN GOODE: I object, Madam President.
It's to the discretion of the Chair, I'm being told, and...
Where's that? I'm new on this Council. Can you show me where that discretion lies in our rules?
I don't have a copy of the rules with me, but there is a provision on regulation of committees, that the Chair of a committee controls the conduct of the hearing, sets rules and procedure for the conduct of the hearing. 375 Whole - 5/25/05
I have a motion, it's been seconded, we go back into a public meeting all over again? We can do that, then, every Thursday, if we...
We are in the public meeting. We are in the public meeting, and the Chair has ruled that a question has been asked, and that someone may approach the table to answer the question. That's in the discretion of the Chair.
If there's an amendment, it can only be presented at the public meeting.
At what point do you have a discussion on the amendments, if you have a question?
It can only be at the public meeting. 376 Whole - 5/25/05
-- about the amendment, in the public meeting. COUNCIMLAN GOODE: It's discussion. It's not testimony. It's not question and answer.
But if the person who presented the amendment has -- COUNCIMLAN GOODE: Councilman Nutter did not ask the sponsor to explain the amendment.
-- person answering the question -- asking the question.
Councilman Kenney asked was it appropriate for Councilman Nutter to direct his questions to the sponsor of the amendment. And it is appropriate. As the sponsor of the amendment --
-- thing to do. COUNCIMLAN GOODE: We moved to a vote. And I'm not against debate or discussion. I'm against further hearing on this issue.
You're against... COUNCIMLAN GOODE: Further hearing.
We can debate and discuss all night until tomorrow, but when 378 Whole - 5/25/05 we're considering one amendment I don't think we should take any more testimony on that amendment.
Madam Chair, I understand the distinction being raised. If I can then at least ask the sponsor of the amendment, our majority leader, the question on the amendment, there is some information that I'm trying to ascertain about the amendment.
Madam President, since it is an administration amendment, if my colleague has a series of questions, I would suggest that he direct them to the administration.
Okay. Which I'd be pleased to do. If it's esteemed by the Chair to be okay.
All right. Councilman Nutter, please ask your question.
Point of order. Was this question asked in the public hearing? I believe this question was already asked and answered during the public 379 Whole - 5/25/05 hearing. $3.4 billion or... Is that it?
I don't believe I heard the question being asked or the answer. I know I didn't ask.
Councilman Ramos, I think there were two figures being bandered about. There were two figures being bandered about, so I think Councilman Nutter does have the right to ask the question and get an answer.
Mr. Managing Director, what is the amount to be restored to the Fire Department?
Councilman Nutter, Pedro 380 Whole - 5/25/05 Ramos, Managing Director. At line 2.16, under personal services, as pointed out by my colleague, Diane Reed, reflects a difference of $3.4 million.
And what was the amount that was originally proposed or how much was originally proposed to be cut?
Didn't the good Councilman have the opportunity to ask this in public hearings? We just heard the same answer that was given earlier, an hour ago. Is the intention of the Councilman to proceed with the same line of questioning and make us go into a public hearing all over again? If it's at your discretion, Madam President, I suggest that you use your discretion to limit the time and the repetition of the same questions that we heard the good Councilman from West Philadelphia ask.
The Chair recognizes Councilman Kenny. 381 Whole - 5/25/05
I am getting in line. I want to get in line. I have a question for Mr. Ramos.
Madam President, the Council can always do what it wishes to, and all that's needed is a motion to suspend the rules, to permit the questioning of this witness during this hearing. If there's an aye vote, Councilman Nutter can do it. If the membership votes no, that's the end of Councilman Nutter's questioning. So I'd like to suggest to Councilman Nutter he make that motion and we can settle this.
Councilman Cohen, I think a ruling was made. I think a ruling was made. I said that Councilman Nutter could ask his questions, and I am 382 Whole - 5/25/05 asking that he proceed. Thank you. Try to be as brief as possible.
Thank you. Councilman Ramos, let me assure you we will not, at least on my part, be going into a full-blown hearing. I only have two questions. Mr. Managing Director, the $3.4 million, that amount does not represent a full restoration of proposed cuts to the Fire Department, does it?
Okay. And can you tell us, for the amount that's being restored, which sounds like it's about half, can you tell us at this point, as we are at budget time, can you tell us which services will be restored as a result of this proposed restoration of about 50 percent of the proposed cut?
So it is unknown at this time as to which services will be restored.
Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilman Kenney.
Thank you, Madam President. Based on that response to that question, I'll be voting no on this amendment. I think it's appropriate that we be given the information as to which services would be restored. I think it's important for all of us to know fully, before we vote on any restoration, what's going back. So that's my comment. I'm not asking any question, but unless we have an opportunity to know where 384 Whole - 5/25/05 these service put-backs will go, I can not vote in favor of it. Thank you.
Madam majority leader, would you make your motion to adopt the amendments, please, for the second time?
All right. I move that the amendments to Bill Number 050003 be adopted. UNIDENTIFIED COUNCIL PERSON: Second.
It has been moved and seconded that the amendments as proposed by the administration on Bill 21 Number 050003 be adopted. All in favor will say aye. (Chorus of "ayes.")
Those opposed? 385 Whole - 5/25/05 (Chorus of "nos.")
Roll call, please. MR. McPHERSON: Councilwoman Blackwell.
No. 12 MR. McPHERSON: Councilman DiCicco. COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: Aye. MR. McPHERSON: Councilman Goode.
Aye. MR. McPHERSON: Councilwoman Miller. 386 Whole - 5/25/05
The amendment is adopted. Again, the Chair recognizes Councilwoman Blackwell.
Thank you, Madam President. 387 Whole - 5/25/05 I move that Bill Number 050003, as amended, be reported out of committee with a favorable recommendation, and also that the rules of Council --
I'm sorry. Excuse me. I'm just being told that Councilman Kelly wants to be recognized.
Yes. Madam Chair, I'd like to offer one amendment to Bill Number 050003.
It's being circulated now, Madam Chair. Madam Chair, I would just like to offer this amendment. And what this amendment does is, it restores the revenue or the appropriations to two facilities which provide City services to the communities of North Philadelphia and Northeast Philadelphia. And they are known as mini City Halls. I think that it totals about $418,000 for the complete operation. And I 388 Whole - 5/25/05 think that we're speaking of a budget of $3.4 billion. It's not too much to ask for. While I think we have been discussing the restoration to the Art Museum, the Atwater Kent Museum, the free libraries, the Recreation Departments, and Is most of the funding for the Fire Department, I think this has been an omission. And I want to correct this omission by amending the bill to include the appropriations which will enable both of these facilities. Now, it's my understanding that the lease has expired in North Philadelphia location, but this will enable -- this will enable and give the proper funding to whenever they decide to reopen that office at a new location, they will be able to do so. And it will also continue the operation at the Northeast facility in their present location. So, therefore, I am asking an additional $418,000 which will increase the public properties space rentals and come out 389 Whole - 5/25/05 of the Director of Finance fringe benefits.
Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilwoman Krajewski.
Thank you, Madam President. Since the mini City Hall that Councilman Kelly's referring to happens to be --
-- happens to be in the 6th district, it's been there for the last, oh, I would say at least 16 years, since Mayor Goode was in office. And 17 I worked with him in order to get the mini 18 City Hall exactly where it is. 19 I feel that the show is not over. I 20 have been in contact with the administration for some time. And I think I advised Councilman Kelly the same issue that, please, I am working on it. I have represented the people in the 6th District for the last 25 years. 390 Whole - 5/25/05 I don't know a time since I've been here that I allowed the people that I represent down. And there would be no way that I would let this pass. But I tried to tell the Councilman that I am on it, but he didn't... he won't listen. And I'm still telling you, Councilman, I have been on this, and so is Councilman Mariano. We've been here. We've been here, Councilman. I know what the 6th District wants. And there is no way that I'm going to allow them to not do that.
Madam President, if I may, the Councilman is correct. She does a great job in her District, but I'd like to remind her that this not only includes her district --
-- but it includes many, many communities throughout the Northeast, as well as the communities in 391 Whole - 5/25/05 North Philadelphia.
It's the boundary. I found it where it is, and I made sure that it was located in the 6th District.
Madam President, this amendment just gives the appropriations --
My motion is to table the amendment. UNIDENTIFIED COUNCIL PERSON: Second.
It has been moved and seconded that the amendment be tabled. 392 Whole - 5/25/05 And the Chair recognizes Councilman Mariano. I think your light's been on, too, for some time.
Thank you, Madam President. And to follow what Councilwoman Krajewski said, Councilman Kelly is a great at-large Councilman from Northeast Philadelphia. And he's doing in his mind what he thinks is right. But Councilwoman Krajewski is absolutely right. The Democratic caucus of the District Council people of Northeast Philadelphia... She represents it. My district's across the street. We have been working with the Mayor quietly behind the scenes, out of the glare of the newspapers and news media, to keep this thing open. Councilman Kelly's intentions are well meaning, but this is a time when you have to go with the District Council people on this one. We are going to restore this, and we're going to do it behind the scenes, 393 Whole - 5/25/05 out of the glare of the media. And if it closes, it will be opened up. And I think the same thing is going to go for the one in Germantown. I can't speak for that, but we have been assured -- And whatever it's become a political football, it's not our political football. We are just grabbing the ball and making sure our constituents get what they need. And same as Councilman Kelly. It's just the approach of it.
The motion was made to table. It was seconded. It is not debatable. It is not debatable. All in favor will signify by saying aye. (Chorus of "ayes.")
Yes. 394 Whole - 5/25/05 MR. McPHERSON: Councilwoman Blackwell.
Aye. MR. McPHERSON: Councilman DiCicco. COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: Aye. MR. McPHERSON: Councilman Goode.
Only because of Councilwoman Krajewski, no -- I'm saying yes. (Laughter.)
You see what this administration does to me? (Laughter.)
Strokes over nothing, over a contrived crisis. MR. McPHERSON: Councilwoman Krajewski. 395 Whole - 5/25/05