of just a couple of words,
he does point out, and as is the fact
that elsewhere in the code,
our zoning code uses the phrase,
the much more specific phrase,
category two licensed gaming facility.
And that's in what used to be called the CED. It's now called S-P-E-N-T, Special Purpose Entertainment District. And the phrase used in that area, which is where city council wants gaming parlors to be, I would submit, that phrase is category two licensed gaming facility.
So the zoning code knows very well, as is exhibited in that phrase, that if it wants to pin down a type of gaming facility, it can make a very specific reference to a type.
And that's what it did in that section, in that S-P-E-N-T.
It refers to a specific type by using the phrase category two.
That is not the phrase used in the assembly and entertainment section.
And it's a fundamental rule of statutory construction that when there's a different phrasing used in different parts of the same statute or the same code, a different meaning is intended.
They could have said category two in the assembly and entertainment section, but they didn't.
They used a more general term, license gaming facility.
So I think on that matter alone, it's clear that the two different phrases mean different things.
And I would submit, I'm not going to go through all this in too much detail, but I would submit it that it's Parks Casino that is asking you to rewrite the code, not us.
We're fine with the code as it exists.
But I want to tell everybody, Mr. Chairman, that, you know, obviously this is something that the board is wrestling with.
Obviously, it's something that L&I has wrestled with.
Does it fit in this subcategory of use for assembly entertainment or does it not?
Well, the zoning code tells us very clearly how we're supposed to wrestle with something like that.
When you go to the beginning of the use chapter of the zoning code, there's a section that's called determination of use categories.
When you go to the beginning of the use,
And it says right here in the zoning code that when a use cannot be readily classified,
when you can't figure out, when you can't readily determine whether it should be in this category or that category,
or the main generic category or a subcategory, that LNI is authorized to determine the most
similar and the most appropriate. So you need to do the best that you can do if there's something
that cannot be readily just plugged in. And how do you do it? That you do it by looking at a number
of factors, including the types of activity that will occur, the types of equipment and the
processes, the existence and the number and the frequency of customers, and other parking and
other factors. So in other words, if you're trying to figure out what category does this animal fit
in, you need to look at the animal. You need to understand what is the nature of the use. What is
the activity that's going on here? What is happening inside this glass enclosure, as they
would have you, as they would have you look at it, this 2,600 square foot glass enclosure. And that
is something, Mr. Chairman and members of the board, that Parks and Chicky and Pete's have been
awfully silent about. They've hardly described what's actually going to be happening inside
inside this room. And I would argue that the materials that they've showed you have been
deceptive as to what's going on inside this room. Now, my point as I'm going to be showing you this
information, why am I going to be showing you this information? Because I think it's pretty clear.
I mean, Mr. Stewart says that this sentence in the assembly and this definition of casino
know, is a reference to a definition in state law. I'm not sure, I don't see that reference to the
definition in state law. They're not referring to a particular definition in state law. They're
referring to a licensed gaming facility that's authorized by the state pursuant to the law.
And so I think that what you need to, and what I think is behind here, and I do agree with Mr. Stewart, that the question is, what does the zoning code intend?
I think it's pretty clear, and I'm hoping that you'll agree with me after you hear my presentation, that the zoning code intends that gambling parlors, inbuilt these bricks and mortar gambling parlors.
that's regulated lock, stock, and barrel by the state is something that we should have in very
particular locations authorized by city council, the CED or the SPENT, that it's not to be just
considered a loosey-goosey assembly and entertainment use to be put into neighborhood
strip shopping centers right next to the bakery and the dry cleaner and the pizza place and where
there's thousands of row homes on all sides. I don't think that, and that's what I think that
the zoning code gets at, and I think that that's right. Back when this definition was inserted
into the zoning code, there was no such thing as sports gambling, but that's okay. You know,
that's okay. We look at laws all the time in terms of what is the drafters of the law intend,
and as society changes, the First Amendment also applies to the internet, even though back in 1776
there was no internet. That's okay. We have new facts. And the question is, what are those new
facts? And I'd like to show you what exactly is going to be going on here so that you can make
a determination whether these facts fit into this category or not. As you may remember from the first
day of the hearing, this was very much minimized by Mr. Shiraki and by Mr. Cullen and by Mr.
Mattione. They kept referring to this quote-unquote small area. Mr. Shiraki said, and I'm reading from
my notes, that quote, there's no way to know the sports book is even inside there. That's what he
said. Mr. Cullen from Parks referred to it as a miniature. It's a miniature operation. And I think
that that that really minimizes what is actually going on here. I'd like to share my screen.
uh what is actually going on here i'd like to um share my screen let me see how i can do this
and i again want to thank you that um for the time um that you're giving me and i
this is a very important matter and so um let me see what i can do here i think when you mentioned
about they referred to it as mini i think that was part of an answer to the current location at
seventh packer versus the proposed location at 1526 packer okay which is considerably smaller
thank you i think you would agree with that i would agree the square footage is smaller as i
said i think a hearing or two ago just i'm going to try and go through this really quickly
so if someone wants me to stop and spend more time but i'm going to try and go
all you're breaking up all we got an echo yes you said if anyone wants to stop me and then you
started your voice started vibrating okay can you hear me okay yes okay i hope i'm paying comcast a
lot more money these days so hopefully um things will be in good shape um i'm getting a little
animated, so I'll try and keep my voice moderate. As I stated before, there's going to be
at least $3 million gambled here on a monthly basis. These are the numbers pre-pandemic,
$3 million gambled on a monthly basis. That's not the amount lost. The amount lost is the
number below that. So let's say in December of 2019, $328,000 was lost at 700 Packer in the
retail sports book. I'm going to flip through the state law because we already, I think,
talked about that ad nauseum. And then I'm going to go to, these are all materials pretty much
from Parks Casino itself. This is where Parks went to the Gaming Control Board to apply for
their sports wagering certificate to get authority to do sports wagering anywhere in the Commonwealth.
And they started off by saying that their executives are from all over the world.
They're from the United Kingdom originally.
And they also talk about this something called iGaming, which I think we're going to see
in this Commonwealth very quickly, which is Parks Casino and other casinos putting slot
machines and blackjack on your cell phones.
it's always considered the same. It's always, it's usually talked about in conjunction with
sports wagering. Indeed, Mr. Cullen, one of the main witnesses from Parks is the vice president
in charge of sports wagering and iGaming. So it's, you know, they're related. And of course,
again, Parks is mentioning how much their senior executive team comes from all over the world.
but what are they saying when they go to the gaming control board they talk about
parks casino and south philadelphia turf club in the same breath and they talk about retail and
mobile app sports betting let's let's see what that parts us to say about that
in their retail launch at the end of 2018 they were proposing again both for parks casino and
the south philadelphia turf club the same exact thing and that's what this slide says it's the
same exact thing at both locations. They would have tellers, self-service kiosks, and mobile
devices. Now, self-service kiosks, we're going to talk about in a little bit because Parks
explains exactly what that is. And they also talk about mobile apps, intranet-based only.
What's the intranet? Well, the next bullet says what that is. It's limited to the building.
and so it's not the internet but it's more like an in-house internet that is only you can only
plug into if you're actually on the premises and of course at the bottom of this page something
that is key to this business is what's called in-game wagering and as you can see by this
bullet towards the bottom they're looking at the Europe evidence from Europe and New Jersey about
in-game wagering. And that's discussed here at the bottom of the slide, in-game bets and in-game
wagering. They talk about that being better for the Commonwealth. What's in-game bets? In-game
bets is if you want to bet on a tennis match that's happening tomorrow, you can bet who's going to win
that tennis match. That's not in-game betting because you're not betting in the game. But when
the tennis match is occurring, this would allow you to bet on every single point if you want to.
This would allow you to bet on every single point if you want to.
Which player, which tennis player is going to win the next point?
And of course, when you go to baseball, you know, is the next pitch going to be a ball or a strike?
Is the next hit going to be a double or a grand slam?
And these are the, you know, rapidity of the gambling that's going to be happening here.
Now, um, doesn't some of that, what you just described already exist?
Some, some, some, some of that, you can bet on a field goal.
You can bet on who's going to score the first point that already currently exists.
Correct.
It exists.
Like I can go on to fan duels or draft Kings and I can, and I can do that.
But just like, and I'll tread on this lightly, but just like many people in this Commonwealth can go on their phones and look at pornography, that doesn't mean that the zoning code doesn't dictate where gentlemen's clubs are supposed to be.
So this is a specific use that they're going to market and promote at a certain location for this activity to happen, you know, as a business.
And the zoning code regulates that.
So just because people can do things on their cell phone does not eliminate the land use laws that we have in this Commonwealth.
And so, you know, I understand people are doing some of this stuff. That doesn't mean that a bricks and mortar location needs to be in a neighborhood.
And, you know, I said I brought this up at the last hearing or one before that. You can go in any bar, but we're talking about chicken and pizza. It's called a sports bar. They could call whatever they want. It's called a sports bar.
They have numerous TVs in there with games all over the country, maybe all over the world going on at any given time.
People are on their cell phone placing bets.
I don't understand. I guess I'm having a hard time understanding.
Where does this change the nature of what is already permitted to happen now?
Well, if this gaming sports betting parlor, this 2,600 square foot portion of Chickie and Pete's, allow people to go in that room, sit down, watch the game and make a bet.
I don't understand the difference.
Well, the difference is I think I think what harm is being done to the community, I guess.
I think the next half of this argument, I just don't understand it.
Excuse me, this is Sharon Saleta. Can I suggest that arguments regarding the impact on the community be considered in the second part?
I actually said that at the end. I apologize. I'm just mind blown about these arguments.
To answer your question, I think, and I won't talk about the harm to the community, Ms. Saleta, but to answer your question, what's the difference?
The difference is, I think, in the intensity and the magnitude of the marketing and the promotion.
And indeed, if this was just going on anyway, then they wouldn't want to open this. They wouldn't want to open this. They would just put out little signs on the bar that says, go to parkscasino.com rather than FanDuel's.
but they want to have a bricks and this is a very expensive location with a lot of heavy duty
equipment and as I and this this slide gets us into the type of equipment that's that's going
to be that's going to be installed that would be installed at this location this equipment
is not at any bar that has any sports bar these are over-the-counter terminals where you can use
cash. That's what this seven teller is. Now, this is at Parks Casino. I'm showing you what's at
Parks Casino because the next page shows you the same thing happening at the South Philly sports
book. And then 12 self-service kiosks. Well, what are these kiosks? So, Mr. Chairman, there are no
sports bars in Philadelphia that are allowed to have these kiosks. And that's what they're asking
you to authorize today is these are these kiosks and these over the terminal, over the counter
terminals. And this is at the South Philadelphia Turf Club, where they put in a million dollars
in renovations. And they also have these terminals, and they have these self-service
wagering kiosks. And they have security. Why do they need security? Well, that's a good question.
I'll leave that hanging. They need security, and they need surveillance. That's enhanced security
measures is the surveillance. You'll see that on another slide. And that all needs to be installed
in coordination and with the approval of the Pennsylvania Game and Control Board Bureau of Casino Compliance.
I'm going to say that again. That needs to be approved by the Pennsylvania Game and Control Board Bureau of Casino Compliance.
That needs to be approved by the Pennsylvania Game and Control Board Bureau of Casino Compliance.
And of course, no one can go into that 2,600 square foot area unless you're 21 years or older.
What are they going to have in these machines?
They're going to have, I'll just sort of, they have player account management where each player can have an account with Parks Casino.
that's called their core iGaming platform and then the second paragraph here is this
can be company what can be does the platform or the software and that's integrated with your
player account management and now what are the options so here's to let me ask you a question
about about the um the kiosk you mentioned the kiosk i'm going to answer the question right now
Look at the bottom of this page. What can a patron, what can a gambler do at Chicky and Pete's if this opens? What are their options? They have four options to place a bet. They can go to the live teller for an over-the-counter. They go to cash up to the counter and there's a man or a woman behind. They'll take your cash and you can place your bet. That's sort of like old school.
like as if you're at the track we could you know two to show one to place that sort of thing that
that's if it was a horse and if you want to do it uh i appear i want to bet for the eagles to win
then you can go to the self-service kiosks so you could do it all yourself you can put cash
or your credit card into a self-service kiosk and do your betting there and we're going to
see that on the next slide. Or you can do it. I can bet the lottery at CVS. They have kiosks
and CVS and other establishments. You can go in and bet on the state lottery.
And if someone wanted to put. I just want to go back up about the account management.
Yeah. That already exists. People have accounts. I have a friend of mine who bets horses every
saturday he's on the phone giving his code name and places his bets again i'm just trying to figure
out what differentiates this from what is already existing okay well let's keep going the second
i'm pardon me uh mr bonnie this is tanya sunkett if i could just make a request that you allow the
chair to get his questions totally out before you respond so we have a clear record thank you
thank you and i apologize no worries no worries okay i get a little animated when we start talking
about i do too some lottery machine in awawa which is not i don't think it's betting it's
gambling people stand in line to go up to those machines they don't go in there to buy medicine
sometimes they go in there to go bet the lottery just like they do with the newsstand outside of
Chicky and Pete's. I'm not, we're not trying to outlaw gambling. We're trying to decide whether
this is a particular use that should be in a neighborhood shopping center. So the second to
the bottom bullet, it talks about mobile apps on tablets and devices. So that's your phone and your
iPad or your Samsung tablet. And then this last one is not yet legal in this Commonwealth, but this
is strict online and mobile, which is once iGaming is launched. And of course, iGaming is
about to be launched, but it's not yet. Here's the self-service kiosk. This kiosk at Parks,
when it went to the Gaming Control Board in making this presentation, is emphasizing that
this is a Pennsylvania Gaming Control Board licensed manufacturer. So this is this kiosk.
what does it do? How does it work? What is the activity that would be happening inside this
Chicky and Beats? What's going on with that touchscreen? And this is a question, you know,
I think the chairman is asking some very good questions, like what is the difference with what
they want to do here with what you can do in any sports bar today? And I think a large part of that
answer are these kiosks with these touch screens um that they would want to install here now you
know chicken pizza has not told you about this mr shiraki didn't talk about this mr mr bonnie
this is sharon slitta i'm sorry to interrupt again but again this seems to be going more to
the impact on the community no no i'm not i'm talking i'm talking about the degree
of pennsylvania game and control board regulation over everything that happens here and i'm also
talking about the activity because i understand that i am just saying that if the distinction
is between sports wagering and whether a