COUNCIL OF THE CITY OF PHILADELPHIA PUBLIC HEARING COMMITTEE ON PUBLIC HEALTH & HUMAN SERVICES - - - Room 400, City Hall Philadelphia, Pennsylvania Monday, November 15, 2004, 10:22 a.m. - - - Resolution 040954 - Resolution authorizing the Committee on Public Health and Human Services to hold public hearings to examine and investigate the practices and operations of the city-funded Philadelphia Animal Care and Control Association and to investigate alleged events wherein family pets have been euthanized despite attempts of said pet-owners to reclaim their lost pets. PRESENT: COUNCILWOMAN MARIAN B. TASCO, Chair COUNCILWOMAN BLONDELL REYNOLDS-BROWN COUNCILMAN JACK KELLY COUNCILMAN JAMES F. KENNEY COUNCILMAN RICHARD T. MARIANO COUNCILWOMAN DONNA REED-MILLER COUNCILMAN FRANK RIZZO - - - V A R A L L O Incorporated Litigation Support Services 1835 Market Street, Suite 600 Philadelphia, Pennsylvania 19103 215.561.2220 215.567.2670 2 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 - - - P R O C E E D I N G S - - -
Good morning. My name is Marion Tasco, and I'm Chair of the Committee on Public Health and Human Services. We're here today to have a public discussion on a resolution introduced by Councilman Jack Kelly, Resolution Number 040954, and we will ask the Clerk to please reads the resolution.
Resolution 040954, authorizing the Committee on Public Health and Human Services to hold public hearings to examine and investigate the practices and operations of the city-funded Philadelphia Animal Care and Control Association, and to investigate alleged events wherein family pets have been euthanized, despite attempts of said pet owners to reclaim their lost pets.
Thank you very much. 3 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 Before we begin with our panelists, the Councilman would like to have an opening statement. Councilman Kelly.
Yes. Thank you, Madam Chair. I just want to take this time right now to thank Councilwoman Tasco for having an immediate hearing. She acted very swiftly, and I think we all appreciate her efforts in getting this hearing started. I think that... I'm troubled by a lot of things that I've been reading about. And incidentally, I want to take this time now to commend and thank Stu Bykofsky a columnist for the Daily News... (Applause and cheers.)
...for bringing that to our attention. And I think it's something that has to be dealt with, and I think we have to make some swift changes to the policies that are currently being experienced by animal control in the City of Philadelphia. 4 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 You know, a lot of people think that, well, it's just animals. I don't think that way. I've been privileged to have pets most of my life. And I'll tell you one thing: Pets are a member of the family. They're a member of the family. And they're going to be treated -- And we sit in this Council, and we try to do everything we can to protect the citizens of our City. And we certainly have been overlooking the other members of the family, and that's the animals of Philadelphia. And that's what we want to do now. I want to have -- (Applause and cheers.)
I know there's going to be a lot of testimony, and I'm going to have the officials who have been providing this care to come and to give us their side of the story. I want to hear it. I have a lot of questions about their policies. And if it takes action by this Council, I think everyone here is 5 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 committed to do something to make sure that our animals are protected in the City of Philadelphia. And I want to thank everyone here for coming today. I know your time is very, very important. And by showing up today, you're telling me something. You're telling me that you want this action and you want this action to be taken not next week, next month or next year; immediately; today, if possible. (Applause.)
So with that, I will defer any further questions until the people responsible for handling animal control come up here and I will give this back to the Chair, Councilwoman Tasco.
Thank you. Certainly we appreciate the efforts of Councilman Kelly to bring this debate and discussion before the Council, and particularly this committee. During the course of the day, we will hear a lot of testimony. And what we'd 6 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 like to do is ask you for your respect for each other, and during the time the panelists are presenting their testimony. We will have our first panel, the Health Department. We've asked Commissioner John Domzalski and Deputy Commissioner Carmen Paris to come forth. Good morning, Commissioner. COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Good morning, Chairman Tasco. I appreciate the opportunity to be here. I am John Domzalski, Health Commissioner, for the department of Public Health. I have prepared testimony. And the way I have organized the presentation, Madam Chair, is that I would give a presentation; and then we would have the newly-appointed interim executive director of the Philadelphia Animal Care and Control Agency provide operational testimony as well.
All right. Thank you. Before you begin, let me just state 7 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 that we do have present Councilwoman Donna Miller as part of this panel. And other members of the Committee will join us soon. Thank you. COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Chairwoman Tasco, Councilman Kelly, Councilwoman Miller, I do have prepared testimony. I would like to preface that testimony with just a statement that reflects the way the Department of Public Health, the City of Philadelphia, regards this issue. First of all, and most important, there is no room anywhere in any of our facilities for uncaring treatment of animals; none. Certainly that applies to any association or agency associated with the City of Philadelphia. It applies in an over abundance, where any facility that's associated with the Department of Public Health. I have read the news accounts of the situations that have been reported at PACCA. I have looked at the cases that have been 8 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 reported on individual animals. And I will tell you that when you look at these, you have to identify -- and clearly we do -- that we have problems in these areas, without question. Those problems will be and are being addressed. I will tell you, of particular interest to me, were the e-mails that came in to Stu Bykofsky. I believe when I looked at them, there might have been just under a thousand of them. And when I looked at those e-mails, I teased out the e-mails that were from people who were doing more than expressing a sentiment about that agency. These were -- These were expressions from people who had direct contact with the agency. They weren't responding to other newspaper reports. They weren't responding to something that someone had told them. These were individuals who had direct contact with the animal care and control agency. 9 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 And I will tell you in the past several weeks, maybe two and a half weeks or more, I've spent time in that facility. I've been in the facility. I met with our board, the PACCA board. I've met with individual employees as I've gone through the facility, and I've met with the employees as a group. I will tell you that on the basis of that, and looking -- and looking at those e-mails, and looking at some of the incidents that have been reported, I believe that those -- a number of those incidents, those egregious incidents, did occur. I will go a step further and tell you that we take the care of animals seriously, so seriously that under the direction of the board, any individual who is identified as not caring for an animal in an appropriate manner, will be disciplined. In fact, I would like to see that individual fired. ) COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: More than 10 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 that, just as it is not acceptable to abuse any being in the care of the City, so it is equally not acceptable to abuse anyone who -- any animal that is in the care of the City. And indeed, should any future abuse occur or reports thereof, I will direct that those be investigated for possible prosecution under -- under the animal cruelty laws of this Commonwealth of Pennsylvania. ) COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: I will also tell you that as a result of meeting with those employees, that there's a lot of good things that have happened at PACCA. They don't make the front page of the newspapers because they -- And I'm not suggesting that they should. Good, competent humane, caring behavior must be the norm in any animal facility. It must be the norm in our facility as well.
And when we look forward to where we're going to be going with this issue, I am asking our new interpreter -- interim executive director and Deputy Commissioner 11 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 Carmen Paris, to work with the board to create an ethos in that agency, so that when people identify individuals who inappropriately treat animals, that there is an expectation that that will be reported up the line. I'm not suggesting that we excuse supervisors or management of their role to oversee that function, but to have an obligation on the part of every employee to report inappropriate behavior as they see it. I believe that is a good way to separate the people who do care for animals, who have done good things, from those individuals who need to be dealt with much more differently, much more severely, and to be fired and be out of there. I'd like to tell you a little now about the history and how we came to be in animal control in the City of Philadelphia. Prior to early 1980's, the management of animal control was the responsibility of the Philadelphia Police Department. 12 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 At that time the program was shifted to the Department of Public Health, where it remains today. The City traditionally provided animal control services through a contract with an outside agency. Initially, both the Women's Humane Society and the Pennsylvania SPCA were involved on some sort of an alternating basis with these contracts. The Pennsylvania SPCA later became the sole provider, and had been for approximately years. 14 On December 13, 2000, the Board of 15 the Pennsylvania SPCA gave notice to the city 16 that, starting in fiscal year 2003, it would 17 no longer provide these services for the 18 City. 19 The Pennsylvania SPCA agreed to 20 provide the services only through 2002, in 21 order to allow the department time to 22 transfer these services elsewhere. 23 The Pennsylvania SPCA decision to no 24 longer perform animal control services was 25 consistent with many animal welfare agencies 13 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 across the country, who saw the large-scale euthanization of unwanted, unadoptable animals as an inappropriate mission for an animal welfare agency. The Pennsylvania SPCA also believed that the city payment for animal control services was substantially below the actual cost of those services, forcing them to subsidize what they saw as a government responsibility. As we moved forward to develop an appropriate alternative, we learned how correct the SPCA was. They were delivering these services for approximately one-third of the city's current cost. Before arriving at the decision to establish the Philadelphia Animal Care and Control Association as a city-controlled, non-profit agency, the department looked for other qualified agencies to provide this service. No other agencies were interested, and the creation of another agency within the city government was not feasible, given the 14 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 limited time frame. The creation of a non-profit agency to provide animal control services was clearly the best way to hire qualified staff, control costs, and build a program in the limited time available. Limited time available, we're talking about months, which later slipped 10 to about 19 and three-quarter months by the 11 time of actual implementation. 12 Many of the original PACCA staff 13 members had, in fact, acquired much animal 14 handling skill and knowledge through years of 15 experience with the Pennsylvania SPCA. 16 In staffing the new agency, it was 17 understood that the Pennsylvania SPCA would 18 continue to accept adoptable animals from residents of the City of Philadelphia. And the role of the new agency would be to perform all of the traditional animal control functions with a limited adoption program.
We believe that adoptions clearly fell within the animal welfare mission of the 15 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 Pennsylvania SPCA. SPCA had the skill and a proven track record of successfully placing many of Philadelphia's unwanted animals. In fact, in the first ten months of fiscal year 2000, the SPCA successfully placed almost 6,500 animals in new homes. Unfortunately, we learned that the adoption function, as it applied to PACCA, would not apply. The Pennsylvania SPCA would only respond to situations of certain injured animals or animals in distress. All other animals would have to go to PACCA. And that required a substantial change in PACCA's mission that we are still working to resolve. It also increased significantly the number of animals that would need to go through the doors of this city-controlled shelter. This is a burden that I believe should not have been necessary. The staff of PACCA certainly proved to be up to the task of doing adoptions. And I will just digress a second 16 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 here, because when this agency took over and took form, the idea in the first year was, they would do some adoptions, but they would do a limited number of adoptions. I found that just absolutely unacceptable, that we would do a limited number of adoptions, regardless of what the situation was. So I directed -- and that was some of the mission -- the rescue agency people, and some of the board members to talk about the fact that we needed to drastically ratchet up adoptions. I believe, in retrospect, that that was the right thing to do. However, what it also created was a change in the operating plan of PACCA, so that they needed to divert an increased number of resources to do adoptions and get animals out into places to be adopted. And those animals, in fact, are better off having done that. But it did significantly change the staffing, the demand on the existing staff in that agency. 17 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 In the fiscal year that just ended, PACCA successfully arranged for the adoption of almost 4400 animals. They also placed an additional 1,055 animals with rescue organizations. And I can only imagine what these numbers would have been if we had had the active support and access to the adoption program of the Pennsylvania SPCA. I'm not sure why PACCA and the SPCA, the two largest shelters in Philadelphia, do not have this kind of a relationship. I know that the boards of both agencies are committed to the welfare of animals. And while there may be some differences in their mission, their concern for animals is paramount to each of those boards. I believe this is an area we can get back on what I believe is the right track, and I believe, when we talk to our boards to tell them that we expect them to work together for the combine and mutual purpose of improving the lot of Philadelphia's 18 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 animals, particularly those animals that are unwanted. You know, I mean, when you just look -- I believe -- I believe -- and this is, you know, again, and by no way intended to be a criticism. It has to do with the way we each look at our different mission. All right? I believe charity begins at home. All right? And I believe the helping hand that we reach out to animals ought to include Philadelphia and in Philadelphia. So, I get a little concerned and maybe sometimes upset when I see that, for example, in one of the most recent months I looked at, that only 14 animals from PACCA came to the SPCA were taken by the Pennsylvania SPCA, while in that same period 150 animals were brought from elsewhere across the state. The SPCA tells me, Commissioner, you've got to look. We've got a statewide mission. Understandably, they do. I would just like to work with them to see if we 19 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 can't get that mission effected a little closer to home here in Philadelphia.
There are some changes that will be occurring in the near future at PACCA that will have a significant impact on the way the Philadelphia community responds to the needs of animals. Clearly, the Alliance for Philadelphia's Animals is a very important process. We have in the government at this time being reviewed a memorandum of understanding with the Alliance for Philadelphia's Animals. We believe that will give us access to resources, some of which is certainly financial resources. But the other is an ability and an umbrella through which to bring a wide variety of animal agencies, PACCA, the Philadelphia -- Pennsylvania SPCA, the rescue missions and others, that can work toward improving the situation with Philadelphia's animals. What I have described above is certainly important. It does not mean that 20 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 we can ignore the problems at PACCA that exist. I recently met with many of the employees at that agency and heard first hand the many good stories concerning successful placements of unwanted animals, as well as a substantial number of animals that were returned to their owners. I have also read, as I said before, the e-mails that were sent to Stu Bykofsky at the Daily News, and to others, and have had -- that have had, an understatement, a less than desirable experience. As I said in my opening statement, that will change. The PACCA board recently hired an interim executive director, who has the responsibility to address these issues. And he's already begun to address them. I have assigned my deputy, Carmen Paris, to work directly with the new interim executive director, to ensure that PACCA meets the department's requirements to operate a clean, safe and humane shelter. 21 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 I asked both of them to tell me what additional resources they need to meet that requirement. They have already told me that they need additional staff. And I have agreed to support that. A volunteer and rescue coordinator has already been hired. And we expect to see a substantial difference in the relationship with rescue missions, and a more positive experience for those volunteers who have been willing to work and to improve the care given to animals of PACCA. Many of the physical changes necessary to improve the facility have been completed. Air conditioning was installed when the ventilation system proved inadequate. New drains have been installed to more adequately meet the needs of the shelter, and the telephone system has been improved. We will continue to work with PACCA to complete the physical needs of the shelter. 22 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 We'll closely monitor our contract with PACCA. We will insist that all animals be treated humanely, and we will insist that employees of PACCA who are unwilling to do that are replaced, fired, and potentially prosecuted. PACCA is a small agency, and any vacancies can create serious problems. PACCA lost a veterinarian and a veterinarian technician within a short period of time, and we are actively working to replace and fill those positions. We have already begun to change the makeup of the board, to include individuals active in the animal welfare community. More outside directors will be included within the next month. And we are on target, should the opportunity present itself, to spin this organization off as an independent nonprofit, capable of providing animal care and control services to our community, with the support of the city. I would also hope that, as a result of this conversation that we're having this 23 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 morning, that we'll be able to address the issue of more responsible pet ownership in Philadelphia.
Until we have large-scale spay and neutering programs, a licensing program that ensures that all lost animals can be identified and returned to their owners, and good education programs to ensure that our citizens understand their responsibilities as pet owners, shelters like PACCA will continue to run at capacity. If we can come together and work as a community to resolve these issues that I have described, the success of PACCA will be assured. And working with our partners, the SPCA and other animal welfare agencies across the city, the real winners in Philadelphia will be Philadelphia's animals. ) COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: I will tell you, just in terms of what the future looks like, in terms of what we really need in this city to deal with animals, almost 35,000 animals that came into the shelter last year 24 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 principally fall into two categories. They are injured; they are sick; they are strays. And that's about half. And the other half are unwanted, are unwanted. Make a decision, I'm going to have a pet. And then somewhere along the line, that decision turns out not to be convenient any more. So what we need, in terms of a program to meet the needs of this city, we want, one, responsible decision-making regarding having a pet in the first place. We need a good spay and neutering program available across the city. We need adherence to licensing. Licensing. Licensing is a good -- is a good thing to have because if your animal's licensed, we can identify who it is. And we returned over 800 licensed animals to the City of Philadelphia -- to residents of the Philadelphia last year. And aside from all of that, it's the law. People should not have a dog in this city that isn't licensed. If you have a dog 25 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 and it's not licensed, you're not complying with Philadelphia's laws. Now, I don't know how many people that are in this room have dogs and who live in the City of Philadelphia. And I won't ask for a show of hands how many do and how many have them licensed. But I'll tell you this: On either side of this room, I've got staff with applications for licenses for the City of Philadelphia license applications. People, we need to have responsible pet ownership. We have to have spay and neutering. We have to have licensing. We have to have immunization of our animal population in this city. The bigger picture is, I'm committed to work with all animal agencies through our new interim executive director, with my deputy, Carmen Paris; and personally, as the situation warrants to work with, to work with my good friend, Eric Hendrick, over at the SPCA, to work with the board of the SPCA, and to encourage our new board members to work 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 effectively, effectively across the board, including with the SPCA board, so that we can really bring about a new day for these -- for our animals and in Philadelphia. The most innocent in all of this are the animals, and they have been bearing the brunt across the board for decades. We need to change that. Madam Chair, I appreciate the opportunity; Councilwoman Reynolds-Brown, Councilwoman Donna Reed-Miller, Councilman Kelly, for the opportunity to present this testimony this morning. The next man we had was for our new interim executive director to talk about the operations at PACCA, if that's satisfactory.
Yes, but I'd like to ask some questions before we go to the operation.
Yes, ma'am. As the Commissioner for the Department of Health, who is in charge of PACCA? I mean, who has the ultimate responsibility for the operation of that agency? 27 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: The PACCA board has the responsibility.
What is the role of the Health Department? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: The Health Department... Well, first of all, the Health Department created the board. All right? As an option for providing these services. The role of the Health Department is to provide the funding that we do to the agency, and to continue doing that. And the responsibility of the department is to ensure that the services rendered in PACCA are appropriate, that they are done in a caring and humane way, that the agency operate a safe, efficient, humane shelter. And when those requirements are not being met, to insist that changes be made so that they can be met. And one of those changes has been the insistence of a new interim executive director.
But who from the Health Department monitors all of that 28 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 that you just talked about? Who visits PACCA to see that all of those requirements are being implemented? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Well, first I have to say that all of the functions in the Health Department, whether they're done right or not right, are my responsibility. All right? And that having been said, there are a number of people who assist me in discharging that responsibility. My deputy, Carmen Paris, who, by the way, assumed this function just a little over a year ago. All right? So, she wasn't there at the beginning, the creation or whatever. But thanks to the work of Carmen Paris and her -- the way that she has taken an interest in this facility, has gone a long way to our being able to not only verify the issues that have been reported about conditions at PACCA, but also allows us to have a little more hands-on up there, to be able to make those changes. So, Carmen Paris is a great assist to me in this process. 29 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04
So, does the Health Department set the standards of operation for the agency? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Yes. We did that in our contract with the agency, set out standards, as well as... And we created those in consultation with the former provider of the SPCA. But, you know, in terms of where we need to go, in terms of standards, I'm not at all sure that we've covered the kinds of bases in that standard setting that we need to do. And, you know, one of the things we've got is an interim executive director. What we need to do is to recruit an executive director that is skilled in this professional area. And in that regard, we've reached out to the National Animal Control Association which is a group of... It's the technical group, the professional group, that animal -- people who run animal shelters as -- in a professional way belong to. 30 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 We've invited them in. We've scheduled them, a time for them to come in, and survey every aspect of our operations, to give us a full report on everything from our receiving procedures, to our staffing, and our standards. And I do believe that we will be making revisions in those.
Is PACCA... Is this service contracted out or are these employees, city employees, Civil Service employees? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: They are not -- It's contracted out. They are not city employees.
So what we read in the paper about the service that was provided by the company, I guess, who ran it, having all of the family members on board, were you aware of that? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: You know, I -- I -- I -- I was. And let me tell you a little bit about that. We've been finished just about two years. Now, when we operated this -- 31 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 When we went into this -- First of all, we didn't want to go into this business. All right? This is not something we raised our hand and said, we are the best people --
We're in it, so -- COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: No; we weren't in it then. We weren't in it.
You're in it now, but -- COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: People who could, say we're not in it any more. After years of contracting this out, people 18 said, we're not doing it any more, for very 19 good reasons. 20 That left somebody needing to do it. 21 This is a huge public safety issue, with very 22 significant public health overtones. 23 So, what our decision was, to be 24 able to do something in 18 months in -- in -- 25 you know, in city government is pretty 32 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 daunting. That's finding a building, renovating it, staffing it. We decided that the best thing to do would be to hire as many people as we could from the existing employees of the Pennsylvania SPCA. So we hired nearly all of them. And I will tell you, when I met with the employees about a week and a half ago, I just asked how many previously had worked at the SPCA, I would say 60 to 70 percent are still on staff that came from over there. When these individuals came with everything, I was astounded to learn how much inner -- how much inner family stuff had existed, in terms of that -- in terms -- among those employees. All right. We had a husband and wife situation. We had a cousin. We had some other type of relationship. I was so concerned about this that I brought all the management in to my office. And I asked them -- I told them that -- just how inappropriate all of that was. 33 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 I was told also at the time that the board had no ability to fire people or make those kinds of changes, just on that fact because they were hired with those relationships intact. But here's what I asked them to take away from that meeting with me. First of all, I wanted to make sure that the supervisory patterns were not such where, if I'm being supervised -- where I'm being supervised by my wife, all right. It had to be a supervisory pattern so that... so that the supervision -- effective supervision -- could take place and also not in a way in which other employees would have to say that person's getting an unfair break. So those had to be done. And I told them my preference would be to remove every one of them that had those relationships, but I couldn't. But I just told them a word for the future was this: Any time anybody in that office in that agency had a notion that they were going to hire a family member or any 34 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 time they had a notion that they might develop a social relationship with an employee in that facility, that they should first come and talk to me, because I guarantee they would see a reason to change their mind on that. Those things exist. They are not appropriate. And everything needs to be done to make sure that, one, they don't ever happen again, and those that exist, that changes are made appropriately within the employment relationship.
So, what is going to happen now to change all of that? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Well, I think, you know, one -- and our interim executive director can talk about, you know, the supervisory patterns and the rest of it, but those things have to happen. You can't have people, you know, who are doing a job there, you know, and you say, well, I'm getting -- I'm getting a worse job; I'm getting rated unfairly because, you know, because me, I'm being supervised by my -- by 35 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 my wife. I mean, that -- that -- that -- that -- that -- that -- that has not good implications.
Yeah. Thank you, Commissioner, for your testimony today. COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: You're welcome.
I was very pleased to hear that you're going to be taking some disciplinary action against employees who mistreat the animals. All right? But I think that we should look at... How about the mistreatment of the people who use the facility, people who go down there? And maybe we should start changing the attitude and the arrogance that -- that some of the people that work in that facility have been giving to the people. (Applause.) 36 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04
We've been... We've been receiving a lot of information from a lot of people throughout the city about the type of people that are down there. Now, you mentioned that you are responsible for hiring of those people; is that true? You have the responsibility? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Yes.
Does anyone screen those people before they get in there? Regardless if they work for the SPCA or not, does anyone screen them? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Sure.
Do they have to have -- Is there a certain criteria that you're looking for? Is there something, a background that would really make them qualified to do that work? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Yes. And in terms of the current hiring, our interim executive director can talk in more detail about that.
Okay. I'll get to that. 37 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: But if I could talk about the staff issue, I think that's an important one, Councilman. I mean, you've really keyed on this. And part of those e-mails that came, you know, that I was referring to in Stu Bykofsky's... in response to his columns, the ones, the or so that were from people who 10 had actual first-hand experience with PACCA, 11 they were the ones that gave me... I mean, 12 it was -- it was a very dark night of the 13 soul looking at those. And it said to me a 14 couple -- 15
Well, could you 16 tell me -- Going back a little ways here, 17 Pennsylvania SPCA for years, for 25 years, 18 according to your testimony, were responsible 19 for the animal control in Philadelphia. Why 20 did they pull out? 21 COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: I think for a very good reason. And it was two-fold. One is that they didn't -- they didn't feel -- and they had been telling the city this for a number of years. We were -- City 38 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 was paying the SPCA $790,000 a year. All right. We're now -- We're now spending -- Our original budget was three times that much, and we've added to that.
$2.1 million? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Yes, sir. And we've added to that. And the other reason that they felt that they needed to pull out of that is for their corporate mission. And that's in line with other SPCA's around the country, that just have had it with having to euthanize that number of animals. It's just inconsistent with their welfare mission. And we understand that completely.
Well, what is the mission of PACCA right now? What is their admission? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: We do -- We do the animal control issues, such as, we will accept unwanted animals. PACCA will 39 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 respond to strays, confine strays, pick them up, essentially all of the animal control functions that -- And I think Mr. Hendricks can talk a little bit about that, that are different from -- different from the animal welfare mission of the SPCA, taking -- rescuing animals, and so forth.
Well, what is the percentage of the animals that are being adopted? What percentage would you say are being adopted? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Well, it depends. It depends if you take all of the animals. We have some animals that just cannot be adopted. They're too sick.
Right. COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: They're seriously injured.
Right. COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: If you look at overall the numbers, I think that's somewhere around 12 percent. Mr. Hendricks and I were talking about this when we met a couple weeks ago. 40 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 And he noted that probably if you took just the percentage of the animals that you could adopt, your percentage is probably higher. But I'm using the overall figure because it really highlights... just highlights the fact, when I talk about how many animals we adopt, 12.6 percent, what I'm also saying is the number of animals that are killed.
And that seems to me about 22,000 a year? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: I think -- Which I find is to be... That's astounding to me. COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Yeah. We'll make sure that we have that number. Yes, 22,320 in the last year.
Now, you mentioned something about your board. Do you to have a listing of the board members? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: I do.
Of PACCA? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: I do. 41 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04
Would you provide that to the Chair? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Absolutely we'll provide that.
Okay. COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: We have it here, and we can get that.
Could you tell me how many of the people are what you would consider qualified to sit on that board? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Oh, I think -- I think we have a very good board now. And it's going to get better. I believe that they are all... Let me give -- If I can give you a history, Councilman, and it's probably three --
Well, how many members presently are on the board? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Well, when we began PACCA, the original board, there were five members of the board. All of then were city employees. All right? Currently there are 11 board members. All right? Seven are city and four 42 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 are non city members. And as of next -- the board meeting which will be -- I understand it's on November 23rd -- that number will go to from -- go to seven city employee members and seven non city members. So, we've greatly expanded the number of non city members on that board, from zero to seven.
I certainly think that's a bad mix when you have seven city employees and then four other people that are on the board. I would like to see it reversed. I would like to see that we have some experienced people in animal control and animal care on that board -- COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: There are --
Because they're the ones that really have to take a hard look at the situation, so it doesn't get out of control. I think it's out of control right 43 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 now. I think -- And I appreciate your comments today that you're going -- you're going to start today and start implementing some of the changes that we have to have, because -- COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Right.
-- I just can't see any day that -- You know, each day means something, and maybe to the life and death of some animal right now. And I think that we should take immediate steps to cure some of these ills. COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Absolutely. When you see the list of non city members, Councilman Kelly, I think, you know, you'll be delighted to see just the caliber of individuals. And you know -- And, you know, what we have to say also is that I've been impressed through this process here. You know, the spotlight that Stu Bykofsky was able to shed on PACCA and on the whole issue of how we deal with animals, you know, as a society, has been extraordinarily 44 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 helpful. And when I see the outpouring of response to that, what we have in this community are a huge number of individuals that genuinely care about animals. And that's a wonderful resource. In addition to that, we have people in these rescue missions. And we're talking about people coming in, and the customer relationships, you know. We're abusing people that come through the door. Let me tell you, I mean, we can really beat up on the individual employees there. And there are some that need that. There are some that need that. But on the other hand, we've got to look at the whole management structure there, to see what have we invested in those employees, in terms of training, in terms of how to deal with a highly emotionally charged situation when individuals come in. And I was so just absolutely distraught seeing the comments from the people in the animal rescue mission as though 45 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 they weren't welcome in the facility. We're changing that. We're changing that. I mean, some of the stuff we said we're beginning today. Some of the stuff we've begun some time ago. And one of the things we've done, I believe we have -- Have we signed on the dotted line with the volunteer coordinator? DEPUTY COMMISSIONER PARIS: Yeah. COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: So to be able to have a welcoming front door for people who are there to help the animals.
Commissioner, I appreciate that. And I think that I also, of course, appreciate your input in making these changes. And I'm going to say right now I think you and the Deputy Commissioner are just as shocked as I was in reading those articles in the Daily News. I think that we all are in agreement that some changes have to be made. And I'd appreciate your comments and testimony today. I think we can work together as a Council. 46 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 You may need some... You may need some help, whether it be financial, whether it be anything else. I know the members of this committee, I think, are looking at the situation. And they're going to try to help you to do the better job of what you have been doing. And I know I appreciate Councilman Kenney is here, and all the other members of this committee, for taking an interest in this. COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Thank you, Councilman.
And I have further questions, but I think I'd rather direct them to the interim director. But I just want to make one comment, if I would. I have a copy of the petition that the Daily News had to petition to improve PACCA. It was signed by 12 -- almost 1200 people. So this is a very, very large problem. And I think that the people of 47 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 Philadelphia have really taken hold of this problem. And we have to do something immediately. Thank you. (Applause.)
We're not finished yet. We have other Council members that have some questions. I just want to go back to your board. Could you give me the category of city employees on that board? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Yes. The current board, we have an Assistant Health Commissioner is the president of the board. We have a program analyst from the A.I.D.S. Activity Coordinating Office on the board. We have the Finance Director of Finance and Administration for the Health Department on the board. And we have our Director of Vector Control Services on the board. Those are the city members. And then we have one, two, three, 48 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 four, five, six... We have seven. We will have seven... seven additional members.
So you have seven and seven. Who breaks the tie? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: I'm sorry?
Who breaks the tie? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Well, right now there's a seven -- there's a seven and four.
But you're going to make it seven and seven. COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: City and four non city, and...
Didn't you say you were going to seven non city and seven city? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Yeah. I think what I'd like to do is, I'm looking at these -- these numbers here. And there's one... I'm considering everybody below the line as a -- non city, but I don't think that that's so. There right now are four non city 49 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 members. And then the rest are from our city employees, but they're from outside the department.
What is the function of the board? What powers? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: The board -- The board hires and fires. The board hired the interim executive director. The board assesses, you know, the performance in the facility, and identifies areas that need to be -- that need to be added to, sets salaries.
Now, was the board operational during the time prior to this investigation, in the stories -- the stories that were presented by Stu Bykofsky, to bring the plight of the center to the public's attention? What were they doing? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Well, I think, you know... First of all, it was, you know, predominantly a city board. But having said that, they were also doing things like insisting that the improvements in the building be made. 50 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 The building -- The original assessment of the building was that the ventilation, as it was installed, was going to be appropriate. It didn't happen. It didn't even come close. And so, what we had to do, at the board's direction, to go back and get it air conditioned, a full ventilation system throughout the building, including the kennels.
So the board left the day-to-day operation to the agency -- the company that was subcontracted to oversee the facility? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: I'm sorry?
Did the board leave the day-to-day operation up to the director, who was on contract with the city? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Yes, but with -- with -- with oversight, and reports to the board. And that happens at their regular meetings.
So who reported to the board about what was going on at the 51 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 facility? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Oh, I think -- I think -- And I don't -- You know, we can look at -- I haven't, you know, seen, you know, all of those minutes. But I will tell you that I think issues did come up with problems. All right? There's no question about that. The... And -- And -- And what needed to be done. And I think the board had some expectations that some of the things that needed to be done were, in fact, being done. And they -- they -- they, quite frankly, were not. And the answer to that that they determined was not to continue trying to get it done that way, because what needed to happen is that the leadership in the agency needed to change. And they made that change.
I think Councilman Kelly has a follow-up question, and then Councilman Kenney asked to have a question, and Councilwoman Donna Reed-Miller, and then we'll hear from Mr. O'Donnell. 52 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04
Yes, Commissioner. I just want to follow up on what Councilwoman Tasco was alluding to, is the makeup of the board. Now, presently you -- Who is the one that's going to put on the additional people on that board? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: That's a board. The board votes to add people to the board. So it would be the president -- (Laughter.) COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: -- and the officers of the board.
So the board itself will be picking their fellow members, in other words. COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Well, there are -- there are some members that are appointed by the board. There are some members that are appointed by the Health Commissioner.
How many appointments do you have? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: I think I 53 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 have four.
You have four appointments? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: I believe so. And the others are board -- I --
And you plan on -- (Commissioner Domzalski conferred privately with someone in the audience, inaudible to the reporter.) COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Seven city members.
Seven city members. COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: I get to appoint the city members.
You're going to appoint three additional members, is that true, to bring it up to seven and seven? It's seven and four now. COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Yes.
So you will be appointing three additional members. Are you open for suggestions or 54 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 recommendations? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Absolutely.
And how do you replace any of these board members? Can they be replaced? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Yes, they can.
You have that? You have that power? You have that? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: I would have to look at the bylaws, but there is a procedure for replacement.
In other words, you could make a change if you wanted to remove two board members and appoint two new board members; is that true? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Yes, we can.
Okay. COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: And I will tell you, Councilman, if the bylaws don't read specifically that way now, we've got our 55 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 legal counsel here that -- you know, from the corporate section which will provide us with some options on how to make that occur.
Okay. So, you would be open, Commissioner -- COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Absolutely.
-- for any recommendations we may make? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Absolutely. And Councilman, you know, the board is scheduled to act on some appointments, I believe, on November 23rd. So if you could get us some information about that directly, why, everyone would be appreciative.
Thank you, Madam Chair. And I thank the board for allowing me to question prior to... Thank you for your consideration. Commissioner, how many animals were euthanized on average per year when the SPCA 56 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 had the contract, compared to PACCA? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: I think -- I think what -- what... It... About... Is it about 22,000?
Councilman, the report that I have here only covers a ten-month period.
I'm sorry. I'm Frank O'Donnell, the interim executive director of PACCA. The report that I have here covers a ten-month period, the year 2000. In that ten-month period, the SPCA reported receiving 34,382 animals. They reported euthanizing 24,711 animals in that ten-month period.
That is SPCA. That is fiscal year 2000. 57 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04
The last year for PACCA... The last year for PACCA, the number of animals euthanized was 22,320 animals.
How has that been on average going back? Is there information about -- I'm curious as to the numbers and what they say, from SPCA to PACCA, whether the numbers are similar, whether -- Obviously, the SPCA did more euthanizations in 2000.
I think, just looking at that period, the euthanizations in 2000 were fairly comparable to the number -- to -- in a 10-month period. I think if you look at them for a 12-month period, I don't have the rest of the numbers. You would see that they took in more animals than PACCA did. But if you look at that 10-month period where I do have the numbers, the numbers are fairly comparable to what PACCA had in a 12-month period and that the 58 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 euthanizations were about the same.
I -- I -- I think Mr. Hendricks would really be better able to answer --
Are there a written set of standards that apply to making a decision to euthanize an animal or not? Is there a certain checklist or certain period of time? How do -- I mean, it can't be purely a subjective decision. I'm sure there needs to be standards applied to when a decision -- a difficult decision like that is made.
We do have standards, Councilman. But the difficulty is, I mean, the very bottom line is that even under PACCA's stricter standards, which many people disagree with, we are still killing 10,000 adoptable animals a year. So if you change the standard, then 59 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 we'll be killing 12,000 adoptable animals a year.
Is there a set of standards? Is there a checklist? Is there a list offer criteria that must be met prior to the decision? I didn't say change the standards. I want to know if there are any. COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: I think -- I think it gets -- it gets determined -- that checklist gets determined by how long you have to keep certain categories of animals by law.
Okay. So, there is certain -- So there's statutory language... COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Yes, sir.
...that will make it -- allow -- help the -- an administrator or a person running a facility 60 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 like this to make a decision on whether to and when to euthanize an animal.
Were those standards adopted from the SPCA? Were they similar standards at PACCA than they are at the SPCA? And did any of these particular euthanizations that have gotten -- created this anger, was there a process followed in those? Because apparently what seems to be the issue, in addition to the euthanization of adoptable animals, which is sad and a shame and we should be upset about it, is the quickness with which -- the quickness with which these particular animals were euthanized before even trying to find them a home. COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Yeah. I mean -- COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: That's the one issue. The other issue is, do we coordinate 61 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 or does PACCA coordinate with the SPCA on trying to place adoptable animals in PACCA's control?
The answer to the first question, Councilman, is that if you look at the number of... If you look at PACCA, you have approximately 200, 210 cages in the regular part of the shelter. There are additional cages for specialized activities, such as when we first receive animals for post-op and for isolation. If you have 200 animals come in that day, the pure mathematics says that somehow or another 200 animals have to leave. We are faced with the situation of --
Does it happen in 62 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 the summer --
-- beat anybody up. I'm just trying to understand the process. On average, how many animals come into the shelter a day? And I recognize that in certain times of the years it's more than others. But do we have a general average?
If you look at the fact that the facility took in roughly 35,000 animals last year, that works out to about 90 animals a day on average. But the average -- But what really happens is, during the warmer months -- You start in the spring, you go through the summer, the numbers could go up as high as 200 animals. 63 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 And the cases that generally were in the Daily News were in that lower -- in that period of...
So the pressure, the capacity pressure was on at that particular time.
Is it possible that the facility just isn't big enough? It would seem to me to be logical that if taking our busiest months, busiest time of the year, we could possibly wind up with 200 animals being presented at the facility in a given day. Perhaps we need a larger facility. COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: That could be. And I think --
I mean, this is not a hospital facility. This can't be a very expensive type of facility, comparable to facilities that deal with, you know, people coming into a hospital or, you know, not having enough beds in a hospital, or an emergency room that's overworked or overburdened. 64 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 It seems to me it would be relatively easy to get -- either to expand a facility or to get another facility that would kind of keep us out from underneath the pressure of having to do something with these animals, as opposed to trying to find them a home. COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: I mean, I think you're -- you're -- you're right on point, Councilman; but, you know, I don't want to let us off the hook too easily on one. There are about six or eight animals that were reported, in terms that were dispatched in an extraordinarily, you know, fast way. I mean, I... being around government, I don't know of government ever doing anything in nine minutes, I mean, let alone that kind of an intervention. There was a problem with this. There's just absolutely no question. And that's where our standards, our procedures, and our training come in. When you look at... We have to 65 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 hire -- A licensed animal, we are required to keep for five days. We probably keep that animal a little longer than that. A stray animal we're required to keep for 48 hours; is that right.
Yes. COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: 48 hours. Required. On a stray. An owned animal, if I own an animal and I say, you flow, I just don't want you any more, and take you to the shelter, the way our laws are now, there is no requirement to keep that animal any particular --
But there's -- there's a human requirement to keep that animal. (Applause.)
All I would like to do is, at the end of this process, in addition to what the other Council people in this Committee will determine, if the function of dispatching, as you said or euthanizing an animal is a function of space and capacity and the pressure on that space, 66 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 doesn't it seem logical that we need more space? I'm not saying we don't need education on how people should deal with pets, how people should be responsible for pets, how people should license them. All those things, I guess, need to be addressed additionally. But the immediate issue right now for all of us is the issue of capacity. It's just you get to a point in certain months where you have 200 animals that come in at once, and you don't know what to do. And you have all the cages filled. And God, let's just start getting rid of them so we can make space. And if that's what ultimately winds up making that decision, let's just get another bigger building and more cages, until we figure out whether or not we can place those additional dogs. COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: There's no 24 question that space certainly would be able to make that better. Adopting more animals 67 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 would make it better.
Is there coordination between you and PACCA and the SPCA on placement? And should there be? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: There must be. There must be.
There is or there isn't or there should be? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Well, in the last month I looked at -- there may be updated figures that may prove me wrong on this -- SPCA took of our animals for 14 adoption. They took 150 animals from elsewhere in the state. I'd like to see that turned around. I'd like to see them taking our animals.
We're bearing the burden of animal placement for the rest of the state -- for a number of areas in the state, in addition to our own. The SPCA is. I'm sorry. The SPCA is. And is PACCA also? Is PACCA taking animals from people who come in from the suburbs that want to... COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: NO. 68 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04
No. So it's not. It's only an issue of SPCA's capacity vis-a-vis its responsibilities to the region? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Right.
PACCA is all we're dealing with with the city. COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Right.
Just -- And just again, I'll end on this. Just this one question. Are there some... And what's the role and the responsibility of the retail pet sales industry in this whole process? The Monster Pets, and the... You know, I mean, what can we do in an effort to regulate them, so that that poor animal who gets adopted as a cute puppy for Christmas doesn't wind up in Stu Bykofsky's column? (Applause.) COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: I think all of this goes together. I mean, the licensing regulation... Right now, I mean --
I mean, if I go to a retail pet store and buy a puppy, am I 69 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 required to license it there? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Not now.
Why not? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Well, that's changing. That's changing.
I understand. But we need to know what we need to do legislatively by ordinance, in order to enforce various components of this problem which one offer them is the retail industry, into having the license, perhaps requiring them, you know, to come back and provide a spay or neutering service or some type of -- I don't know -- voucher to get that done in a veterinary hospital, something that puts them -- brings them into the process, too. I mean, they're apparently part of the problem of unwanted animals, you know, roaming our streets or being presented at these facilities. So I would like, at the end of this process, to have some recommendations, either from L & I or Health, as to what we can do to impose some of those of those requirements on 70 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 retailers. COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Yeah. And I think one of the things that we've got to put back on our own department is the strict enforcement of the licensing regulations that are --
Seems the sensible place to do that is the time of sale. COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Sure.
I will entertain one question from Councilwoman Miller. Then what we'd like to do, Commissioner, and Mr. O'Donnell, is to ask you to step aside. We're going to have some of the public come forth and testify, so that you can hear their concerns. And then we'll come back to continue the discussion about what you plan to do, Mr. O'Donnell, to improve the situation at the agency. 71 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04
Thank you, Madam Chair. I have a couple questions, but I just will follow up on the one concerning licensing. What is the Health Department doing to educate the public? Because I don't know that people know that they should, if they get a dog, that that dog should be licensed. So, what type of public education are you doing and how do you plan to change that so the information can get out? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Right now what we do is, we have a license application. We do education at health fairs, at community meetings. That, without enforcement, unfortunately, just is not effective. We're changing that. And what we're going to do is the following: First of all, we're going to have educational sessions at all of the areas 72 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 that are heavily frequented by people who walk their dogs, to give them information, like on a Saturday, either on Forbidden Drive, Kelly Drive, Pennypack Park, about the fact that licensing is a requirement in the city; and to let people know, that by the way, we'll be back, probably in another couple of weeks or whatever, and it won't -- and at that point you're subject to a fine, a fine for not having the license. We don't want to fine people. What we want you to do is license your animal so that we can return the animal should it get lost. We've had 800 of those returned this year for that. So, we've got to do two things: We've got to, one, get out there, get the information out to where people are walking their pets. I have had people I've met, you know, just in normal conversation that say, oh, you have to have the dog licensed? I didn't know that.
Right. See, I 73 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 don't think they know. COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: That's what has got to get out.
Right. COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: We've got some PSA's done. We've worked with one of our board members. They've shot some footage. We're going to be able to do -- to get out there and talk about this so that people -- we can respond as a community. Councilman, you're absolutely right. Euthanizing one animal is one animal too many. And it's an abomination when you look across, you know -- you know, just the sheer numbers that we use. And anything we can do... And the licensing is a big step forward, and we're going to do that.
Do dogs still have to -- I'm not a pet owner. Do dogs still have the tags? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Yes.
I know when I was a little girl, when I was child, there was a dog catcher truck that used to come 74 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 around, and it would actually chase those animals that didn't have this little tag -- COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Yeah.
-- around the neck. COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: We still have a tag.
Is that actually the license? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: We have a tag, a license, and we also want to microchip the animal that will allow us then to... If the chip's gone or the tag's gone or whatever, we'll be able to find that animal.
Okay. Thank you, Madam Chair. I'll hold my other questions until later. COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Would you like to us step aside?
We should assume that the license comes from the Health Department? All of the paperwork transaction happens at the various health centers? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: For 75 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 licensing?
Yes. COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: No. We have a license number, where people can call in. We'll send out the forms. And shortly -- and I can't be more specific than that -- but it's going to be shortly you're going to be able to do that online.
Okay. Now, what we'd like to do is ask you to just stay with us, please. And we'll call... We would like to call Stu Bykofsky forward. And then we're going to have Edie Huggins. And then we'll go back to Councilman Rick Mariano. (Councilman Mariano entered the proceedings with his dog.) (Applause.)
Good morning, Chairlady. May I take a drink of water first?
Okay. Who's the 76 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 person with the dog? Council members... Dear Council members and interested parties, if you have not read the Daily News stories about the terrible things that were going on at PACCA, I have prepared a file for you.
Oh, I'm sorry. I'm Stu Bykofsky of the Philadelphia Daily News. Sorry. My reporting was the tip of the iceberg. For every horror story that I have reported, there are more. 16 Many of the sad experiences can be 17 read in online petition at Philly dot com, 18 and I'm delighted that the Health 19 Commissioner has done so. I have included a 20 small selection of some of those stories in 21 the packet. 22 The vast majority of complaints that 23 I received came not from disgruntled 24 employees, but from potential adopters, from 25 people seeking lost animals, from animal 77 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 rescue people who tell me they go to PACCA and are treated as a nuisance. Another category I did not include in my prepared remarks were volunteers. And I'm very much heartened to hear that the Health Department is looking for or will hire a director of volunteers. There are some exceptions, but rudeness and disinterest by PACCA employees seems to be the rule. Rescue volunteers go into the kennel holding their noses, to find sick, terrified animals often sitting on their own waste, sometimes not properly fed, lacking medical attention, having no toys to divert their attention from their miserable surroundings. It's bad enough for homeless strays, but imagine the terror and misery of a former house pet tossed into a cold cage, wondering what happened to his world, what crime he had committed to be so abandoned by his master. As I reported much of the misery and chaos at the PACCA house of horrors results from a lack of money and staff. 78 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 But lack of money does not explain PACCA's mismanagement which is rife with nepotism and a lack of accountability. The current management is abysmal. They are proven failures. They must all go and be replaced. (Applause and cheers.)
And be replaced with people who have top management and kennel experience. I call on you to ask Mayor Street to act sooner rather than later. Management is supposed to be overseen by the board of directors. Where were they while the mismanagement was going on? Were they asleep? Were they lied to? Did they turn a blind eye or shrug at helplessness? I am happy to hear that the number of board members that are non city employees will be going up. I'll actually address that a little bit later. The board now has majority of city employees on it. That's changing. That is a 79 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 bad arrangement. I'm glad the Health Department recognizes it now. It must be rectified because city employees have an inherent conflict of interest. People with animal care and kennel management experience must be able to join the board and form a majority. The Mayor can make that happen by simply requesting the resignation of four of the seven city employed board members. I would ask that you ask the Mayor to do that. Seven seven is a tie. The chairman would break the tie. That's not the way to go. We need a majority of non city employees.
And board members usually serve for a limited term. I have no 21 idea what that term is, but they're not board members for life. Even with the lack of funds and staff, PACCA can do a better job by using a core of volunteers. 80 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 Other cities that I've researched have hundreds of volunteers. And Philadelphia can, too, but they must be made to feel welcome. Too many have told me that they have been made to feel like dirt by current management and employees. I think you'll be hearing from some of them today. PACCA needs someone to recruit and organize volunteers. That person could himself or herself be a volunteer. I hear that a director of volunteers has been hired. I'd like to know more about that person. I wonder who he or she is related to. (Laughter.) (Applause.)
To paraphrase Field of Dreams, if you call them they will come. Let me give you an example. Bernadette Moreni of the Northeast read about the plight of animals at PACCA. She called up Pets Plus and got them to donate a pallet of food, plus toys and blankets. 81 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 She called me after she had done that to ask me to help arrange the donation. That has been done. That was one woman acting alone, working alone on her own. Nobody asked her to do it. The power of well-intentioned volunteers can be awesome. The city should direct PACCA to become a no-kill shelter as has been done in San Francisco and has been started in New York. PACCA must set two goals: One, finding homes for all adoptable animals; two, reducing the number of future homeless animals by aggressive spayed, neutered educational campaign. (Applause.)
Reducing the number of animal births plus adoptive programs can move Philadelphia forward. We currently rank 44th in the percentage of animals killed rather than adopted. That is shameful and inexcusable. Working with caring groups such as but not limited to the Alliance for 82 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 Philadelphia's Animals, and the People Pet Partnership, PACCA must organize an aggressive spay neuter program, perhaps in conjunction with local vets and the University of Pennsylvania's vet school. It need not cost a lot of money. Anything spent up front saves money at the end by having to deal with and dispose of fewer homeless animals. That does not resolve the problem of rude behavior on part of staff, and inhumane treatment such as rough treatment of animals and cleaning cages by hosing them down, with dogs inside. Cruelty should be a firing offense, pure and simple. I'm happy to hear the Commissioner say that he would contemplate prosecution against such people. A dog in its cage was hosed down just last week, according to a witness who spoke to me. Yes, even after I had written about that practice in the paper, just last week. Staffers must be trained to do their 83 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 jobs with professionalism and compassion, no 3 matter who they are related to or sleeping with. Those who can't or won't do the job must be fired. I have countless reports of staffers goofing off, reading, smoking, chewing gum, drinking coffee when management isn't around, sometimes when management is around. Some supervisors aren't much better. Yvonne Sutton, the Business Agent of District Council 33's Local 488 has promised cooperation. The union must be held to that promise. Since no one knows what's going on like the workers themselves, I would like every employee to write an anonymous note about what's going on in PACCA, and say how it can be fixed. Call it the suggestion box approach. These notes would go to the board which must provide much closer supervision of PACCA than in the past. But PACCA can not be fixed without 84 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 changing the current cast of characters. Mahatma Gandhi said, the greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated. Philadelphia desperately needs to pass that test. Thank you. (Applause.)
Thanks very much. Do you have any questions? Are there any questions of Mr. Bykofsky? Councilwoman Brown.
Good morning. I was particularly struck by your recommendation to look to area vets, University of Pennsylvania in particular, to their vet training, vet school over there. Do you know if that's the best practice that has been tried in other parts of the country?
I do not know if that's been tried in other parts of the country. 85 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04
No. I just wanted to thank again Stu Bykofsky for his really, I think, stirring newspaper account of the problem that we're facing in Philadelphia. And Stu, keep up the good work. Really appreciate it. (Applause.)
Thank you very much for your testimony. And thank you for the wonderful story that you wrote bringing this to light. Thank you.
Good morning, members of Council. I am Edie Huggins. I'm not here in an official capacity. If I don't get out of 86 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 here, I may not have an official capacity. (Laughter.)
But I'm here as a pet lover and as a volunteer at PACCA, a not well-received volunteer, I might add, but we will get into that. I'd like to start by reading a letter that I wrote to Mayor Street, August the 8th, 2003. Dear Mayor Street, I know you have a million things on your to-do list, but your help is really needed. Some of my co-workers here at NBC-10 and I volunteer each weekend at PACCA. The relatively new facility has the potential to do outstanding work when it comes to stray, unwanted and abused animals in our city. But the facility is plagued with huge problems, serious problems. The Director, George Stem, appears to be a good man but he has serious health issues which have caused him to be away from the facility. During his absence, the quality of 87 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 care at the facility dramatically dropped to the point where animals were and continue to suffer. George has since returned to the facility, but the problems are so severe it's impossible to think that one man can change it on his own. Some of the problems: The offices are air conditioned, but the kennels are not, leaving the very animals they are supposedly trying to care for in temperatures that are unbearable. Surely the heat has an effect on the health of the employees, too. When I discussed the overheating problem with management, was told a grant for air conditioning is waiting to be approved. That discussion took place months ago. Still no air conditioning. I've had many viewers call NBC-10, after I did a positive story on PACCA to get the good news out. Viewers said they had gone to PACCA to adopt, only to be appalled by the smell, the heat, and the unfriendly attitude of some of the workers. 88 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 I do know there are some employees that management is trying to discipline, but they're being hampered, I'm told, by the union. Being a union member myself, I know there is a place to protect the right of good workers, but not bad workers. More often than not, when we go there each weekend to work as volunteers, most of the cages are not cleaned. Water bowls are empty, if there's a bowl at all. And on some occasions there have been five to six puppies in one small cage, while there are other large empty cages in the same area. Also, new dogs are sometime put in cages that are not cleaned after the previous dog has moved out of the cage. We all know that puts the new dog at risk for parvo and other seriously sometime deadly diseases. I realize when you have many animals in cages, it's like having dozens of babies to be changed as soon as they defecate. 89 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 However, I can't tell you how many times I found feces that literally have been caked on the cages, indicating the waste has been there for days. I would not attempt to point out by name those who spend more time talking on their cell phones and smoking, rather than doing the job for which they're being paid, but I do feel obligated to point out there are some good workers who are excellent. Elizabeth. Elizabeth has since gone. , Eric, to name a few. I've tried to go through the proper channels in getting other PACCA to cut the grass around the facility so that the puppies can get some exercise and time out of their cages. Little has changed to give better day-to-day care to the animals, in terms of cleanliness, climate control, water and feeding. Other shelters advise me to immediately contact the Department of Agriculture and the Bureau of Dog Law 90 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 Enforcement to report the dire conditions, but I wanted to approach you first. You have the power to tell the appropriate city department to shape up. And I think, as an animal lover, you have a compassion to help those four-legged critters and others that are discarded and disposed. Now, since that time -- That was over a year ago -- I talked to the Health Commissioner.
I talked to Miss D'Allesandro, who is on the Mayor's staff or was on the Mayor's staff. And they were very, very distressed and said that changes would be made. Now, that was a year and a month ago later. The last time I was at PACCA there was a major change. They now have air conditioning. What has not changed is why I'm here today. I go there as a volunteer. I'm not paid. I don't go to be lauded or applauded, but I'll tell you the attitude of some of the workers there when we walk in, because we go there to work. It's almost as though they 91 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 resent the fact that we're here to clean cages, to walk dogs, to clean dishes, and to do some work. We're not trying to take over their jobs. We're trying to help. But that's not the way we're treated. The basics: Water, food and care. They bought some water plastic containers that were installed. They hung upside down. Well, the puppies couldn't learn how to get those, how to activate the bottles. Other containers leaked, leaving puppies lying in wet cages. They were finally removed and bowels replaced. So often volunteers, we would go and we'd find dry bowls or no water bowls at all. And the answer we'd get, well, they knock the bowls over. So we take them out. So our first task when we would go in, was to make sure all the puppies had water. Sometimes they'd literally drink one or two bull bowls of water. The point of it is, if you're not going to leave water there, at least take 92 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 water to them periodically and allow them to drink. They can't get out and go to the fountain. Food. Numerous times, if there were food bowls in the cages, often moist food had been mixed with dry food, and it was caked in the bowls. On the other hand, many cages would have numerous food bowls from previous feedings, reflecting that the cages had been open, that the bowl had been shoved in, creating... limiting the space that's already cramped. One volunteer from NBC-10 took on older dog home to foster. The dog was lethargic, covered... cowered in the back of its cage, trembling, emaciated. There were no special orders on the cages. And when she got the animal home a week later, she took it or she got the animal a week after we noticed it. She took it to the vet, only to find out that all but three of the little dog's teeth were rotted, and it had an infection so 93 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 severe that it caused a wound that had gone through its cheek. The dog couldn't chew the hard pellets that it was given. So it hadn't eaten for a week. Well, her vet removed the teeth and started it on antibiotics. The dog had to be hand fed. But Mandy is alive and well and living in Broomall, thanks to this woman. Now, workers say, we cannot hand feed every animal. And I understand that. But why, when this dog was brought in, did not the vet look at the dog's mouth and see the rotted teeth, the severe gum disease? And why was it not noted that this animal required special feeding? On three occasions dogs that have recently given birth or given birth at PACCA, the mother would not be taken out to allow her to relieve herself. And many dogs will not defecate if it means their litter is going to be covered. So, on a couple of occasions, the person who was in charge of the room, when I 94 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 say I'd like to take the dog outside, said, no. The dog is staying. She's trying to protect her puppies. So I'd get a supervisor, usually Junior, to come and help me. I'd take the dog out. The dog was fine. And when I got the dog outside, you wanted to ask yourself, how could she hold all of this urine and feces in? And these are things that to me are just... I just can't imagine, but I've seen them with my own ayes. Another time two new puppies were put with a surrogate mother. This is a practice that's not uncommon, except in this case the dog wasn't observed. And we went to clean her.
We found both puppies underneath her dead. Another time a lab mix had a new litter of puppies, and we thought some of them were dead or dying. We took them out of their cage. We wiped them down. We took them outside. It was summer then. And pretty soon they were running around like 95 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 little puppies should do. I have received dozens of calls from viewers with complaints running from, I want to volunteer, I want to foster... There's a woman who's husband is a veterinarian. He wants to give free services for neuter and spayed. But if they can get through to PACCA on the phone -- and usually they can't -- I would ask you sometimes just to get a person at PACCA. And if they finally go there, they're treated so rudely, that they don't want to go back. I could talk for hours about the lackadaisical attitude of many workers, about young dogs and puppies shivering, balled up in a metal cage with no 19 towel or soft cloth, getting inappropriate feedings, no attention given. So what needs to be addressed? Cleanliness. How do you explain metal cages that are so caked with feces that we have to use wire brushes to clean them? The other extreme, dogs that have 96 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 diarrhea. Yes, it's common. But why isn't the cage cleaned after each shift? Puppies covered with feces. These are animals that are on display for adoption. So imagine what's going on in the back kennels. The ones the public see. I spoke to James Coleman and Frank O'Donnell with several concerns, one being lack of supervision. At the end of each shift, why wouldn't the supervisor on duty inspect the kennels, the adoption area, and the entire facility, to see the conditions? And if they do, shame on them for signing off on work that's undone. Time after time workers from kennels to vet techs would come to us and confide in us, and they'd say they needed help but nobody would listen to them, because those in charge, as has been discussed before were related by birth, by marriage, godfathers, godmothers. Well, these workers who cared and 97 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 wanted to see things fixed asked for confidentiality. They were frustrated and fearful of retribution from the extended family. They told us money paid for adoption was taken on one instance. The contracts were missing and are destroyed. Now, signs were posted about thievery. When I spoke to George about it, he said security cameras had been redirected and he was, quote, investigating. A worker who is no longer there said several people have no doubt who stole the money, but feared retaliation if they spoke up. Other issues to be answered, overall cleanliness, monitoring laundry so that blood and fecal-covered material in which many animals are brought to PACCA don't remain unwashed for two or three days. When we went, we took our own detergent to clean cages and bowls. Disinfectant was locked up because we were told, it disappears if we leave it out. 98 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 On the outside, smokers must stop throwing their cigarette butts and empty packs into the area that's designed for puppies and dogs to exercise. Workers need to shovel and bag feces in the exercises yards. We as volunteers do it. Why don't they who are being paid for it do it? We need accountability and supervision by management. They're dealing with living things that need food, water, exercise, health, tender loving care. Most animals that are brought in, if they aren't manic in the beginning, trust me, in a week's time, providing they're not killed, chances are they'll be totally traumatized after days of being at PACCA. Skills in dealing with public and volunteers; it's not an easy task. We all have to deal with the public every day. But if you don't want to treat people and animals kindly, then, damn it, seek other employment. ) 99 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04
Councilwoman Tasco, don't tell our minister that I said dammit. Okay? Thank you very much. If you choose to stay, they must, must be sensitized to the needs that these creatures who can't do for themselves. Locked up, caged, fed and watered sporadically, unable to move freely and exercise their limbs and muscles. In closing, I know most of these dogs are throw-a-ways. They're mistreated. They're abused. They're unwanted. But for every bad dog, there's a scared, scarred puppy that would bring joy and happiness to a home that is prepared to take a commitment of love and take on the responsibility of care. PACCA must change, and those in Philadelphia animal care and control must learn care, not cruelty by neglect. Thank you so much. (Applause and cheers.)
Thank you, Miss Huggins, for that testimony. I just want to ask you: How long 100 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 were you a volunteer? Are you still a volunteer.
I kind of don't know. One of my volunteers says, she's afraid our car's going to be firebombed if we go back out. But yes, we are going to go back out.
Little over a year. Were there other volunteers with you at that time?
Yes. I got a group of about five. And I'd like to add -- and I'm not -- for to be patted on the back. I spent $2500 to build a grooming room. I don't think it's ever been used, except by the volunteers. And I just did that because I thought many of these little puppies that come in, they need to be cleaned. They need to be washed down. And then I'm told, well, we don't 101 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 have the personnel. Then get the personnel.
-- as far as you know, are they still volunteering today or...
We're on a hiatus. We're trying to see what's going to happen.
I don't mean to be dramatic, but it breaks our hearts to go there and work. And when we go there, we do work. We smell bad when we get through. But we're happy that we took two little dogs out and gave them some exercise or cleaned their cages, changed their paper in their cage.
Well, I think changes are in order. And I'm sure Mr. O'Donnell is going to agree with us that he has to take immediate action on a lot of this. Thank you very much.
Thank you very 102 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 much. (Applause.)
We thank Miss Huggins for her passionate testimony. You can tell that she cares. And I do believe Reverend Gray will forgive you for your comments because you feel so passionately about the issue. And thank you for all the hard work you've done with PACCA. And we hope you will continue to do that. Councilman Mariano. I see he brought a show and tell.
Thank you very much. I'll be testifying today not as a member of City Council, but I guess because Homer can't talk. This is my son Vincent's dog Homer. Homer is a little over a year old. We're not quite sure. Homer came from PACCA. Okay. Homer has been neutered. He has a 103 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 microchip in him. He's been groomed. He's been back to PACCA a number of times. And let me say that Homer's a very good dog. One time I was walking Homer around Juniata Park, and the police were there digging where they thought someone had buried a body. It was about six or eight months ago. And I saw Inspector Calarullo. Inspector Calarullo asked me to come over with Homer, and said, Rick, where did you get that dog? And I said, that's my son Vincent's. But he had to go away for the weekend and I'm walking him. And he says, well, I know that dog. I took that dog to PACCA. Homer came out of a triple homicide in West Philadelphia sometimes in July a year ago. So that's the type of animals and Mike's other animals, dogs, gets, that are getting there. If it wasn't for PACCA who PACCA is about ten blocks from my house. I get to 104 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 PACCA. I don't get there as much. I would love to volunteer. And I would tell you today, I wouldn't mind being on the board because it is in my Council District. But I guess I'm considered a city employee. I don't know if they want any more city employees, but I'd gladly be on the board. But the reason I wanted to testify for Homer and for PACCA is, there's going to be a million dogs like Homer. If you take a good look at Homer, Homer... I think he's a Republican, Councilman Kelly, but I'm actually not sure. But he was leaning towards that side during the election.
There's something good about him, as you would say. Homer is an American pit bull, but a mixed breed. Homer probably, if Inspector Calarullo didn't take him out of that house in West Philadelphia that day, who knows what 105 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 might have happened? He probably wouldn't be with us today, and wouldn't be the family member of my family that he is. The good thing about Homer is, he's a perfect dog. I mean, he would lay here all day, except for one or two trips to go outside for obvious reasons. He sees all these people around here. And probably if they're here, they're all animal lovers. He smells. He was smelling old ladies. People were giving him treats. He's just really happy to be here, which my point is, without PACCA, and without agencies like this, without Miss Huggins and Stu Bykofsky, and people that need to make sure that the right things are getting done -- I remember when PACCA first started up, Mr. Domzalski and Carmen Parish, too -- I spoke with both of them -- they called me and said, we're going to open this building on Hunting Park Avenue in your District. Do you have any interest in it? And I certainly did because it was not too far from my house. And I, frankly, 106 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 wasn't sure what kind of job the SPCA was doing, because over the years I think the SPCA changed the scope of their mission or their mission may have not been up to snuff with what Philadelphia needed them for. The neighborhood I live in, there's hundreds of dogs like Homer. If it wasn't for PACCA and places like that, I just don't know what would happen. So I appreciate Councilman Kelly, Councilwoman Brown, Councilwoman Tasco for having these hearings. Anything I can do, anything Homer can do, anything my family can do, we would be glad to do it because it's all about... You don't see the joy Homer brings with my son. You know, he lives with two of my sons and my stepson in the house. And he's the baby of the house. And at this point I'd much rather they had Homer than bringing some children into the world. So, thank you, and thank you for letting Homer and I testify. (Applause.).
Thank you, 107 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 Councilman. We're going to call Mary Aulg and Eric Hendricks. Do you have testimony?
You did. All right. Thank you. Would you identify yourselves for the record, please.
Good morning. My name is Mary Aulg, and I am here as a member of the Mayor's Animal Advisory Committee, but I am also Board President of the Pennsylvania SPCA. Thank you, Councilwoman, and other Councilmen, for the opportunity to talk to you. I testified at the Council hearings this past spring when there were hearings on the carriage horses, because I felt that when we gave back animal control to the city, 108 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 although the city has done some really good things, I really feel that after PACCA opened, the city dropped the ball. When we had the city contract, we being the SPCA, we were notoriously underfunded, but the SPCA has other resources. It was an incredible strain on us to use those other resources, but we had them. PACCA does not. For the almost years I've been 12 involved in animal control in this city in 13 any way, we have funded animal control at a 14 rate that is less than half or a third of 15 what any city of comparable size in the U.S. 16 funds it. That's a huge, huge problem. 17 And I really believe that a lot of 18 problems at PACCA are directly related to the 19 fact that they just don't have enough money. 20 I'm not discounting what people are saying. There's some very specific things that need to be straightened out. I know a lot of the board at PACCA, and I trust that they will get straightened out. I am thrilled to hear the Health 109 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 Commissioner say that we're going to start taking licensing seriously in this city, because for the years that I've been a 5 member of the Animal Advisory Committee, 6 we've been trying to make that happen. 7 I don't think -- and this is just my 8 opinion, but I do have some experience in 9 this field -- that PACCA should have been set 10 up as a non profit corporation. I think it 11 should be a city agency. 12 And I was also thrilled to hear that 13 PACCA is working with the National Animal 14 Control Association. 15 I would like to suggest that they 16 also work with the Humane Society of the United States and the American Humane Association, and visit other cities. Somebody has to visit the cities of comparable size, that have the same situation we do, where the SPCA and animal control are separate. That should be a city agency. That's my opinion. But I thought I would say it, since there was being talked about 110 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 earlier today. I don't think that when we even solve these problems, we're going to do away with euthanizing thousands and thousands of local -- of perfectly adoptable animals, unfortunately. There's only a couple of ways to solve that problem. One is mandatory spayed neuter. It needs to be the law. It needs to be enforced. And we need to educate the public. People don't know they're supposed to license their dogs, let alone why they should spay and neuter an animal. And I do know staff at these different agencies try really hard to do that. It's a very large task. But meanwhile, even if PACCA doubles in size, it will be filled to capacity, and all the animals will have to be euthanized any August day when 400 come in instead of 200. I was Director of the Morris Animal Refuge for five years. I'll never forget those August days. We were a much smaller 111 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 agency, but you would fill up. And what are you going to do with them? There is no place to put them. You can't turn them out on the street. I know that nobody likes euthanasia. I've seen enough to know how painful it is. It's horrible. But animals on the street are worse. Anyway, I just want to thank you for this opportunity and say that, you know, as President of the SPCA, if I can do anything to help, I will.
Thank you. My name its Eric Hendricks. I've been the Executive Director of the Pennsylvania SPCA for the past years. I 22 appreciate the opportunity to address City 23 Council on this very important subject. 24 I thought I would give a little 25 history of the SPCA since I've been around. 112 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 Actually, I'll go back even farther. For most of the 20th century, the city contracted out its animal control function to the Women's SPCA, but in 1978 the city came to us and asked us if we would be interested in performing that function. So, in the summer of 1978, we were made the animal control agency for the City of Philadelphia. In fact, the very first job we had for the city was to help in the MOVE confrontation in Powelton Village which resulted in the death of one policeman. We ended up taking 78 dogs from that house, and that's how we got involved in animal control. In the early 1980's, as Commissioner Domzalski already mentioned, the oversight of animal control was changed from the Police Department to the Health Department. And the Health Department people that I talked to were, in no uncertain terms, very unhappy to get that added responsibility. In December of 2000, after many years of performing as the city's animal 113 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 control contractor, the Pennsylvania SPCA advised the city that it would no longer perform as the contractor, at the end of June 2002. That was an 18-month notice. As it turns out, as you heard earlier, the actual turnover wasn't accomplished until September 1, 2002, at which time PACCA was born. Now, a little bit about my perception of the attitude of the City of Philadelphia towards its responsibility as an animal control agency itself. As far as I can determine, all city administrations have had one thing in common. They don't want to be bothered by animal complaints of any nature. Their solution to this: Pay a private contractor to handle the complaints, and pay as little as possible by requiring only a token, bare bones program of animal control. All complaints involving animals could then be passed along to the contractor. And when problems arose, it was the 114 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 contractor's fault, not the politicians'. I believe this attitude still exists and runs from the top down, from the Mayor's Office, to the Health Department, to the non profit organization created under the Health Department to actually perform animal control, and we know that is PACCA. The fact that the city even set PACCA up as a separate, non profit corporate entity seems to me to show that the city still doesn't want to touch animal control with a ten-foot pole. Another clue to the disregard that the city has for animal control is the fact that it allocates less than one one-thousandths of its budget on animal control, in spite of the fact that animal issues directly or indirectly affect nearly all Philadelphians. No other city in this country allocates a smaller per capita expenditure on animal control than does Philadelphia. Now, what to do about all this? Lessons learned from actually performing 115 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 animal control over the past two years should have by now convinced the city that this program must be given a higher priority, which means more money and more respect for the work that is performed. Animal control isn't sexy. It isn't now. If it were, perhaps it would be given the same attention by the Mayor as his plan to make the entire City of Philadelphia a wireless internet connection. First thing to be done, in my estimation, hire a professional animal control agency manager. I understand from Commissioner Domzalski that they have spoken with the people at NACA, the National Animal Control Association, who will no doubt help them in that regard. Second, clean house of those that don't care about working with animals. (Applause.)
And third, start planning a new facility that is actually designed from the ground up to house animals. 116 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 (Applause.)
The existing building will never work. As for the future, by officially recognizing the importance of animal control, in fact, by getting rid of the term animal control and replacing it with simply animal care, the city will be on the road to turning around the current embarrassing situation, to one where its animal care program, rather than being hidden, can be a source of pride, much like it is in San Diego, whose municipal animal care facility is almost a tourist attraction in itself. I was just out there a week ago. I can attest to that. A well-run animal care program could be one more reason for people to visit or move to Philadelphia, where the quality of life is reflected in the care that Philadelphians have for each other and their animals. This is not a far-fetched idea, nor an unattainable outcome, if proper weight is given to the program. 117 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 Thank you very much. (Applause.)
Thank you so much for your testimony. Chair recognizes Councilwoman Blondell Reynolds-Brown.
Thank you, Madam Chairwoman. First of all, I support your opinion regarding looking to other cities to find out what best practices are because that does become instructive for what Philadelphia can and should do better. You've raised it here. You've shared it with us here. Has that been discussed at board level yet?
Yes. Well, I'm not on the PACCA board. I'm on the SPCA board. But I think that... I know a lot of people on the PACCA board, and I know they'd be open to that. You know, it's going to cost money. Somebody has to travel there, but I think it's well worth doing. 118 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 You know, I have seen the San Francisco situation where the SPCA and the city work very closely together. They're located closely together. And to the city's credit, PACCA is located very close to the SPCA shelter. That was not an accident. That was done very intentionally. But, you know, there's a lot of reasons why, but back and forth between our two shelters has been a problem since PACCA opened. And, you know, I'm committed to us working that out. I believe Mr. Hendricks is. We... But that's only one small part of this, you flow. We have to... The city has to do more. Our laws for animals are lacking. I mean, you know, we don't enforce the pet license. And it is not unenforceable. They do it in cities like New York. New York is a lot bigger than Philadelphia. I always think, if New York can do it, we should be able to do it, you know. 119 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 I'm sure it's not easy, but maybe we could talk to them about how they do it. If it were up to me, pet stores would just not sell animals. I mean, that would be the law I would want to see. (Applause.).
Mr. Hendricks, would you say that the primary reason for pulling -- for SPCA for pulling out of the city and letting PACCA take over was financial more than --
No, it wasn't financial. It was mainly because of the euthanasia was getting worse rather than better. So, we'll admit to a failure in that area. Because as I said, we had it from 1978 onward, with the exception of one year. But over all those years, I thought the situation was deteriorating rather than 120 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 improving. Now, from the financial end, it was a drain on us. We basically subsidized the City of Philadelphia with our own money, to quite a degree, as you can tell. The highest amount we ever -- we were ever paid was $790,000. The city started off PACCA at $2.2 million.
So, we told the city that for years. At one point -- and this is about 14 or 18 years ago -- the city actually tried to 15 get us to do animal control for $50,000. And that's how little regard they had for the program. They just wanted to have someone they could say was the animal control agency. They didn't want to have to pay that person. But when people complained, when people called up City Hall to complain or even just ask about an animal to be picked up, it was, you know, said, well, call the SPCA. We pay them to do the job. 121 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 So, it was more a matter of the euthanasia rate being so depressingly high, but money was also consideration because it was draining our resources.
Well, would you say that if the city supported you the same as PACCA, for instance, $2.1 million, you could have probably done a much better job?
Oh, I would think so. And I think the city would, if we had been doing the same job at that rate, we would have been able to educate the City of Philadelphia residents to their responsibility of spaying, neutering better than we were able to do so.
That's all I have. That's all. I just want to mention that 12 years ago I got my dog Casey from the Morris Animal Shelter.
Well, I was already gone from there by then, but I'm sure you and Casey are very happy, because I had some wonderful animals. 122 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04
Thank you so much for your testimony. We have another board member here.
Oh, I'm sorry, Councilman. Forgive me, Councilman Rizzo. He did have his hand up.
Thank you. Thank you, Madam Chair. Mr. Hendricks, how are you today?
You know that you gave us ample warning that you were going to not continue the relationship with the city. Is there anything that could be done? And Councilman Kelly hit on a couple of points that I wanted to make, that is there anything that you think that could salvage the relationship between you and the city, if we could work the financials to be satisfactory and not insulting, would you consider taking the animal care program over 123 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 again? Is there anything that could be done to salvage that? Because as a Councilman-at-large, I would certainly work. And you know that I've had a real significant interest in this. I've seen this coming. I knew that when you left, that we were going to be in trouble here because this is not what we do. And...
I would really ask you if there's anything you could do to reconsider this, if we could work as a Council to bring this back to where it belongs.
That would have to be left to our board to decide. Personally I would advise the board against it. And one of the reasons I advise the board originally to get out of animal control was because the City of Philadelphia has great resources. We really don't. And remember, we are a statewide organization. We have seven shelters around the state that we have to be cognizant of. 124 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 We're not just a Philadelphia organization. I think the Philadelphia situation can be solved by Philadelphia. Every other big city in America has taken over its animal control. A number of them had long-term contracts with organizations like ours. But the fact is, you really shouldn't have a contract with a private agency. In fact, you shouldn't even have PACCA as a non profit entity. (Applause.)
PACCA should be an agency within Philadelphia, and possibly a separate agency, with a commissioner and not a little appendage off the Health Department. The Health Department really is not interested in running animal control. You're forcing it down their throats. And you shouldn't have to do that. And you shouldn't expect them to be thrilled about the idea. In a perfect world -- and I don't understand all there is in running a city of 125 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 the size of Philadelphia, obviously -- but I would elevate animal control, since it does touch so many citizens in Philadelphia, to a separate agency or I should say a department within the city, and have a commissioner in charge of animal control. And then you can do it right. But you've got to fund it. You've got to realize how important this is to the quality of life of all Philadelphians, and bite the bullet, give it some money, and get started on it. (Applause.)
Has your position -- I know there was another piece. And I don't mean to dig up some old issues, but I know that you had a concern with the pit bull, and that...
Well, I wasn't going to bring it up, especially after seeing a part pit bull wandering around so friendly here, but that's another --
Could you elaborate on that for a minute for the record? 126 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04
All right. Councilman Rizzo is bringing up an issue that I testified to before in this chamber. I was here at one point testifying that the City of Philadelphia should address the pit bull issue by setting up its own ban on pit bulls, that would be like a 15-year phase-out of pit bulls. I know there is in Harrisburg a law that says municipalities and counties cannot have breed specific bans. I think the City of Philadelphia is powerful enough. I also know that the head of the Bureau of Dog Law in Harrisburg wants to change that particular provision that denies cities and counties from passing such legislation. But the city right now should start working on the pit bull problem. It is part of animal control or animal care, but it is a specific area. And I'll guarantee you that there will be a very -- there will be very quick action in this area if some little girl or some older person is mauled to death by a 127 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 pit bull in the City of Philadelphia. City Council will pass a law banning pit bulls in hours, but we shouldn't have 5 to wait for a martyr to the cause for that 6 action to start. But that's what's going to 7 happen at some point in the next few years. 8 We've had some close calls already 9 in this area. And it's going to happen. I 10 can guarantee you. 11
Councilman, see, this is 14 one place where I somewhat disagree with 15 Eric. I think he already has legislation 16 that takes care of that. 17 We have legislation that says you 18 can not have a dangerous dog in this city. 19 We don't enforce it until a nun's dog is 20 killed and it gets on T.V. That's part of 21 the problem. 22 And we don't enforce it because we 23 don't put enough money into animal control. 24 You can't have two or three animal control officers in a city this size. You just 128 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 can't. And the police can't possibly do animal control. They can barely take care of the crime.
My name is William Hawkins. I'm Vice President and new board member of the SPCA. I must agree with Ms. Aulg on this particular issue, as far as pit bulls, because the definition of pit bull is very, very loose. A Staffordshire terrier is what we call a pit bull over here. And there are some delightful pit bulls, as we've just seen today. So I don't think we should be painting with a broad brush a breed of dog or an extended breed of dog because I think we're then condemning an awful lot of dogs to death because what happens then -- (Applause.) 129 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04
Even with a phase-out you're going to have a negative impact. Thank you.
All right. Were you going to testify also, Mr. Hawkins?
All right. Would you identify yourself again for the record.
William Hawkins. I'm the Vice President of the Pennsylvania SPCA. I'm also been a consultant to the Mayor's Advisory Committee. But I'm here --
Well, I'd hate to have to rush through because I've got some important things to say. And I'd like to thank you, Madam Chair, and also Councilman Kelly for these hearings. They come at a time when the City of Philadelphia has to make a decision as to whether it wants to become a more humane and compassionate city in the way we treat our 130 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 animals or if we want to continue down the road of what appears to be our collective failure to protect them. The hearings are an opportunity to address problems, identify positive changes, and take the next steps to improving the plight of Philadelphia's animals. Unfortunately, something is very wrong here. You only had to be in the Northeast on Saturday to see one example of how inhumane Philadelphia has become. How the Pennsylvania Game Commission and the Philadelphia Police Department slaughtered the young deer was a disgrace. (Applause.)
And there are countless other actions that put us in a bad light. For a city that has seen a decrease in its human population in recent years, we have seen an increase in the numbers of animals that have been euthanized. From what I can tell, the numbers are still increasing at PACCA. But when you 131 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 add in those killed at the Morris Animal Refuge in recent years, the numbers are horrifying. S. cities. Currently both PACCA and Morris have what I consider to be unacceptable kill rates at their shelter. The internal operations of a shelter will reveal why its kill rates are so high. In most instances, it's due to the individual shelter's odd interpretation of what constitutes humane and true compassion. PACCA's problems are not simply a case of the inappropriate actions of a few staff. Shelter staff problems often run deep. They can include a bad staff selection process, weak or non-existent training, poor or non-existent performance, management programs, and poor oversight by senior management. Also, shelter staff are subject to a partial or total loss of morale, by virtue of 132 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 killing so many animals, even as the public continues to bring in wave after wave of abandoned animals. Unfortunately, shelter workers begin to see the public as an enemy, rather than an ally in the lifesaving cause. It is a trend I've noticed within many of the city's administrative departments. Realistically, experts have found that lasting change can come about only by changing operational imperatives and putting in place programs and services that focus on saving lives. Shelter managers and staff must acknowledge problems. Most people, including reporters, have sympathy for those who face up to difficulties and try to work through them. Those who practice denial, on the other hand, are generally suspected of deliberate wrongdoing. Unfortunately, PACCA problems have been ongoing, especially since the one health department management staff person associated with the development and information and the 133 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 start of PACCA retired shortly after its opening. And I sincerely believe that George Stem came into the position determined to make a positive difference. My exposure to PACCA and many of its staff and management since its inception has covered a wide range of issues, not just shelter, but also enforcement of the horse carriage regulation City Council passed three years ago. My initial contacts with them were positive, but it was apparent that they were soon overwhelmed by the prospect of not only responding to calls for help throughout the city, but also taking in and trying to care for so many animals. I received calls from city residents related to instances where an animal had been euthanized, when in fact they were adopters ready to take in the animal. To me this indicated early on internal problems at the facility. I frequently mentioned PACCA's 134 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 problems and related issues to some of the board members and to the Health Department. Each time the board members indicated that PACCA was overwhelmed by their duties. At the time there was no response from the Health Department. On one occasion at the Mayor's own Advisory Committee meeting at PACCA, a senior member of the Health Department attended. He wanted to revisit the recently approved Horse Carriage regulations because he said the Health Department felt they might be too strict. They had only just been implemented. My comment to him was, if you renege on the very humane regulations that your department fought for and that others helped to pass, and took three years to finalize, then you might just as well take the care out of PACCA. I could tell that then new PACCA staff were alarmed by the health officials desire to possibly weaken the new law.
That is also when I realized that 135 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 there was a void at the top of the Health Department when it came to caring for the animals. This was further confirmed by the lack of interest and enforcing the horse carriage regulations. Under the two previous Health Commissioners there was at least a ray of hope for humane and compassionate care of animals. I mention this because I believe it is central to the problems at PACCA. Deputy Commissioner Paris may want a kindler, gentler environment. However, I'm not convinced that she has the department's mandate. And that is why the hierarchy of accountability covers many levels: Shelter workers, supervisors, management, the PACCA board, Health Department middle and senior management. You can't pick one or two and ignore the others. As a board member of a number of other boards, I believe that accountability of the board is key to this issue. It is the 136 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 central piece of this whole problem. It's true of any organization, including non profit companies. So often non profit boards think they have to be less involved in their organization's operations simply because they are non profit. PACCA has an immediate need, as well as long-term needs. I spoke with Deputy Commissioner Paris regarding some of the short-term issues. To meet the current need, actions that can be implemented immediately in order to deal with the most necessary issues can include current and recommended protocols with staff and management. Are they in place? If not, develop them. Then develop a solid training program which will provide positive longer-term results, not a Band-Aid. We can't just train current staff who aren't doing their job. That's not going -- That just won't be good for the longer term. If there are staff that have 137 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 displayed inhumane practices, they should be terminated immediately. )
Now, we've talked about the board also. Concurrently I suggest that the entire board dissolve itself and reply to be members. There should be few Health Department -- (Applause.)
Otherwise we have board members approving who they want. And I think part of the problem, then, is just going to continue, and we won't have the best selection. And there should be someone on the board who is not afraid to speak out. Too often there is, I don't want to rock the boat. I don't want to say anything that might create a problem for my organization. That's how we got into this mess. Hoping things will get better won't help anyone, especially the animals. Unfortunately, there is little 138 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 funding currently available. And due to the changes being implemented at the shelter facility, we must act very, very quickly. And I've heard that from Council members today. And that's very satisfying. We also need targeted funding, funding that will be used for specific purposes. If you just put a bunch of money into a failing organization, without all the right protocols in place, and without specific uses for those funds, then it's not going to achieve those results that you want. Those funds could be used for specific purposes, such as formal ongoing training programs, a shelter focus on adoption and spay neuter, and not just euthanasia, and outreach and educational programs, and personnel needs such as veterinary staff and humane officers. But we must act today. Today's hearings should not be an opportunity to vent, but instead we must use them as a way to identify best practices for PACCA, and the 139 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 city's entire attitude -- the city's entire attitude to animals. If we truly focus on the animals we are supposed to be caring for, then we have a good chance of success. I hope in some way I can contribute to that success. Thank you for your time today. (Applause.)
Thank you very much. I read your testimony. I thought you offered some very good recommendations. And we hope that the interim director, as well as the new board members, will kind of explore some of the recommendations that all of you have made, relative to the operation of PACCA. Any questions from members of the panel? (No response.)
We'd like to 140 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 call Steve and Ed Troy. And next we'll have Nancy James, Martin Thomas and Carol White. If they're here, be prepared to come forward.
Good afternoon. Would you state your name for the record, please.
My name is Steven Troy. I'm a former pet owner, thanks to PACCA. I just want to talk this afternoon about my experience with PACCA employees there, and my conversation with Deputy Commissioner Carmen Paris. I'm just going to read the events that took place the week of August 8th. On the morning of August 8, 2004, our dog Shia escaped from our back yard without its collar on. My dog is a black and white Shetland sheep dog, approximately two years old. The following morning, August 9th, I made a lost dog report over the phone to 141 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 PACCA. The same day my brother walked through PACCA to see if our dog was returned. Also, on the morning of August 11th, my brother Mike again went to PACCA and filed a report in person, and also walked around the shelter at 10:30 a.m. All throughout the week my family and I posted flyers of our dog, and put them on telephone poles and store windows. On Saturday, August 14th, we received a phone call from a Carol Kimback. Carol had found our dog the same day that we lost it. And she took the dog to her house from Sunday, August 8th, to Wednesday, August 11th, hoping -- When she returned the dog she hoped that it would be reunited with its owners. On Sunday we -- my family and I, we went to PACCA to pick up our dog, only to be greeted rudely by the staff. And one of the staff members also told my mom, who's sitting back here, to get the hell out of her face. 142 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 The Director, George Stem, would not provide us with any documentation or reason why they killed our dog. They said they were going to investigate the mistakes that their staff had made. Impatiently Monday morning I returned to PACCA to demand an explanation as to why they killed our dog. After we refused to leave and demanded that they show us paperwork, they showed us their record that the dog was brought into PACCA on Wednesday, August 8th, at 2:17 p.m. and killed August 11th, at 2:26 p.m., nine minutes later. Even with two lost dog reports on file and a poster of our dog in PACCA's lobby, they wasted no time in killing our dog in nine minutes. And also, with that, I didn't know where to turn to. I called Deputy Commissioner Carmen Paris to explain my situation, and that I wanted something done about it. 143 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 She basically said, oh, well, what's done is done, and offered not an explanation, not an apology. And after our conversation with Miss Paris, I felt hopeless and helpless in not knowing where to go. Eventually I did contact the media which has brought us here today.
Let me just say one thing, that if that was my dog, I wouldn't be sitting here today. I would be over in the criminal justice center facing assault and battery charges for the first -- (Applause and cheers.)
I don't know... I don't know who did that. I don't know who did it, what personnel was responsible for it. But I'll say one thing, that person should not be working for PACCA or any city agency right now. 144 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 (Applause.)
Okay. That's what I mean. I suspected that. Because I can't... And I don't know -- and this is a question I have later. You know, how many days. I mean, the average length of stay. I can't understand your dog being put to sleep just for three -- three days, was it? VOICE IN THE AUDIENCE: Nine minutes.
The lady who found 145 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 our dog kept it for three days, but she didn't see our flyers till after she returned it to PACCA.
So the dog arrived at PACCA 2:17 p.m., Wednesday, August 11th. Killed the same day, 2:26 p.m.
Council, my name is Ed Troy. I would like to also say that we also had a flyer at PACCA's office the day of, when our dog was brought there on Wednesday. We hung a flyer and showed the staff our flyer hours before our dog was brought there. And still within nine minutes or dog was put to death. We talked about procedures earlier, a checklist. We still have not received anything. What checklist did they go through within nine minutes? Who decided to put our dog to death? We talked about the employees. There's only one resolution to this, with 146 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 those employees. They got to go. Thank you. That's all you can do. (Applause.)
Thank you. Do you have anything else you'd like to say? (No response.)
We thank you for your testimony. We're sorry about your dog. We hope that out of this hearing, and the articles that have appeared, and the outcry from the public, that we do believe that there will be a commitment from the city, the Health Department, to change what is happening with PACCA. Certainly bringing these issues to light sheds light on what has happened, and causes us to demand that changes be made. And I don't think that your testimony will go on deaf ears. Thank you.
Nancy James, 147 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 Martin Thomas and Carol White. And Lisa Carpino. Good afternoon. Would you please identify yourself for the record.
Yes. I'm Nancy James, and I... I -- This started for me back in March -- actually February of this year. Someone I know went to PACCA and saw seven dogs there. And she said, you know, these dogs are going to be destroyed if we don't get them out. And I have a large network of friends, e friends. And I e-mailed them. And we were able to get all the dogs out except for one which PACCA had labeled a Lhasa Apso, a 20-pound dog, as a buyer. And I knew as a private citizen I would not be able to get that dog out. So what I did was, I contacted a rescue, a person that rescued malts and Lhasa Apsos, as 148 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 well as bred them. And she said she would do her best to get that dog out of PACCA, so we could rescue that dog. She tried over several days to get in touch with PACCA, and was -- you know, kept getting turned around to different -- you know, kept getting the phone calls not being returned. Finally she was able to talk to Karen McGinley Miller -- who's Karen McGinley Miller now. And Karen's attitude, as she reported it to me, was awful. Karen was hostile, angry, said to her, you're not going to get that dog. She said, well, can I come down and see the dog? Don't even bother coming down to see the dog. You are not going to get that dog. She called me that night, Thursday night. This was Thursday. Thursday night we talked. And I said to her, we've got to do more. What else can we do? And we put our heads together and 149 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 said, we can get a certified animal behaviorist to come in and actually evaluate the dog because there's no one obviously on PACCA out really -- outside of animal behaviorist really able to evaluate this dog, and is this dog truly salvageable. She put me in contact with a certified animal behaviorist. I spoke to the animal behaviorist because I knew a little bit about the dog's history. I had heard some things about the dog's history. And what the animal behaviorist said to me, between the family dynamics and being thrown in a crate, a cage at PACCA, it's bringing out the worst traits of this dog. What she also said to me, and the reason Kathy had put this person in touch -- put me in touch with a certified animal behaviorist, as a certified animal behaviorist student, her first case as a student was a Lhasa Apso that was on death row. And basically her instructor said, if you don't salvage this dog, if you can't 150 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 turn this dog around, this dog is going to be killed. That dog is now a lap dog for a senior citizen. (Applause.)
She said to me, I can't come tomorrow, which is Friday, she said, but I'll be willing to come on my own time at no 9 charge to PACCA to evaluate this dog. The rescue person said that she would come down to also evaluate the dog. I said, but I would come down to evaluate the dog, to be with them to see the dog as well. As well as I had two foster homes lined up for the dog, and that we -- And I also contacted an attorney because I understand that PACCA would be concerned about letting go a dog that they considered an aggressive biter. Friday morning I called, excited because I had a solution to a problem. Here's one dog that would not have to be euthanized. I called. And I finally got ahold 151 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 of Karen McGinley through someone's cell phone because she did not return my calls. And she was hostile, angry and rude. She was upset with me for trying to rescue the dog. She said, someone called last night trying to get that dog. I'm not going to let that dog go. And as a matter of fact, then she told me the dog had been killed. I was stunned because of her vitriol. It was as though I was the enemy. Here's a dog that could have been saved. We had a solution. What I saw was there was no willingness to have any creativity, originality or vision. It was about letting this dog die, not letting -- She wanted to have -- There was a power struggle. She wasn't going to let that dog go. She wasn't going to let us evaluate that dog, and she made sure of it by killing the dog. After that, what I did was, I said, I'm not going to let this dog die. I don't 152 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 know what this dog's name is but I'm calling it Monty, and this is Monty's mission. I'm making my mission to make sure that dog does not die in vain. And I started talking to people, animal welfare experts, vets, rescue groups. And the overwhelming response that I got about PACCA was 99 percent negative, incredibly negative. My experience was not isolated, unfortunately. And so, when I found -- When Stu Bykofsky's column came out, I knew that was my opportunity to talk to him. And I sent him a lot of information that I had been gathering along, talking to people, taking statements, writing to people, corresponding with people, because I knew that something had to be done about PACCA. And I knew there would come a time when I would be able to use that information to ensure that PACCA gets changed. And I agree with everyone who says that management has to be changed, the board has to be changed. There is no room -- That 153 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 the people there... to have no animal welfare expert on that board is just unconscionable. So that people there who are related and have not had that addressed is just abominable. When I talked to George Stem, which I did. And he was shocked that this woman was able to turn this dog around. They have no clue about what things can be done with quote unquote aggressive dogs. This is a 20-pound Lhasa Apso thrown into a crate. And it's an aggressive biter. It's going to be destroyed.
Good morning, City Council. Thank you for having this hearing so maybe what happened with us today won't happen to anybody else's pet. 154 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 This is a sad situation I'm about to present. I am saying this in reference that the tragedy that happened to my dog happened two years ago.
My dog's name was Sebastian. About two years ago my daughter Laura had brought Sebastian to PACCA to find him a good home. We, under circumstances, could not keep Sebastian. She had brought him to Sebastian [sic] that day in hoping to find him a good hope home. After she had brought Sebastian into PACCA, within five minutes my daughter called me, Laura Heffner. She says, mom, I brought him in. I said, Laura, go back and get him. I felt so guilt stricken about taking him there. I was trying to find another solution 155 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 to the problem with Sebastian. She went back in within five minutes. She went to the desk and asked for our dog back. They said it was too late, that the dog snapped. They were trying to put him into a cage, and he snapped at someone. So they decided they were going to put him down. I cried terribly on the phone. Laura, I said, put one of the workers on the phone. She said, mom -- I heard her say, somebody get on the phone and talk to my mother. They said, we don't have to talk to anybody. They would not get on the phone and talk to me. I tried calling them. They would not pick up the phone there, because my daughter Laura was calling me from her cell phone. She said, mom, the reason they put him down was because she said he snapped while someone was putting him into a cage. 156 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 How they had time in those five minutes to try to even walk the dog back there and put him in a cage is beyond me. I don't know how they even had time to do that and to put him down. Apparently they must have took him right back and put him down right away. Sebastian never snapped at anyone. He was a very friendly dog. He never hurt anybody. I miss my dog very much. And if there's something that I can do today to try to put a stop to this I will. A couple days ago I tried to call PACCA. m. I tried to call PACCA, the number 685-9702, only to hear a recording to call 686-1776, where the calls were being taken by. I got ahold of an operator at City Hall. I asked her why the calls were being referred from PACCA to City Hall. She said, you're calling for PACCA? I said, yes. She says, why? 157 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 She went on to just have a conversation with me. I said because I'm going to testify in a couple days against PACCA about what happened with my dog. She said, do you know the reason why the SPCA turned the city's contract down at PACCA? I said, no. Why? She said because the SPCA started out years ago as a no-kill shelter, she said, and they didn't want to kill any more animals. And that's one of the reasons why the SPCA turned down a contract with the city. And her name was Donna. She was a City Hall operator. And that's all I know about her. And she said to me, just go to that hearing, and speak out and try to help those animals. And I said, well why -- Also again I asked her why the calls were being referred. She said because they're short of 158 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 staff and everybody decides to leave early there. She said also that two years ago when PACCA started, and the city gave them all this money to open it up, that nobody bothered ever thinking about the circumstances, what was going to happen with those animals, because there's not enough room there and they're very much understaffed. Why a City Hall operator would go on to tell me this, I don't know. But I'm glad she did because I brought some light as to why the SPCA no longer has the contract with the city. To me she said that they didn't want to kill the animals, that they didn't want any part of that. So I'm begging today hopefully maybe the SPCA will take the contract back from PACCA, and they'll continue their good work that they've been doing. I don't know what else to say, except that I miss my dog very much. I don't 159 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 know what else to do.
I have another dog since Sebastian died, and I just recently adopted a cat from a shelter to prevent that cat from being killed. So, again, I'm begging the SPCA to please take the contract back. You started out as a no-kill shelter. Please continue the good work that you've been doing, and take the contract back from PACCA, so they can no longer kill anybody else's animals.
Thank you very much for your testimony, Miss White. (Applause.)
You know, we're really sorry about these dogs. And I don't know whether the SPCA will do that or not. But our responsibility is to set up a system where the animals are protected, and that the policy of no kill is enforced or becomes a part of the policy. So if we don't get SPCA, we have a responsibility to care for the animals also.
There's just one more 160 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 thing I'd like to say. I understood when the Commissioner was speaking for PACCA, how he was going to do this and how he was going to do that. Shouldn't he have done this and done that, and not after the fact? (Applause.)
Isn't that what his job was about? Not to -- It's a sin, because the city has always been known after the fact, after the fact something happens, after the fact of this incident. Your job, Commissioner, from PACCA was to protect these animals. Now you're getting up here like a scared person saying, you're going to do this and you're going to do that. You should have done that before. Maybe they would have saved my dog and other dogs. (Applause.)
Accountability 161 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 is important. That's why I asked him where does the ban come from? Who's in charge?
Good afternoon. Would you state your name for the record, please.
Yes. Good afternoon. My name is Lisa Carpino. And first I want to start by saying that this is very emotional for me. And I'm not one of those people that took my dog and decided after six years of having it that I just didn't want a dog any more. I was in an abusive marriage, and I needed to get out with my child and get them out of that environment. And I had a dog that I wasn't going to leave with him either. I had no family here. And I called PACCA, and I told them I had a pure-bred dog. He was a white -- little white West Highland terrier, weighed 16 pounds. And his name was Winston. 162 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 And when I called on the phone, they told me that although there were no 4 guarantees of placement for my dog, that they thought there was a good shot that he would be adopted because of the fact that he grew up with children and he was a pure-bred dog. And so I brought the dog down there. It was very emotional for my daughter and myself. We both brought him down there. And when we brought him in, there was a woman in the lobby who was interested in adopting my dog. And she had stated that she was interested. And of course, they told her that she needed to go through the adoption process, which was understandable. I had called three days later to see if the woman had adopted my dog, and was told that my dog was put down because he was aggressive. My dog grew up with three children. He was never aggressive. So, I'm here today that hopefully something will be done to prevent this. 163 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 My dog didn't have a chance. He had three days, and that was it. And I'm very angry with PACCA. I demanded an explanation. I said, who makes this decision? Who determines whether my dog is put down or not? I was told that the veterinarian makes that decision. I don't know if that's true or not, but how can -- can a veterinarian in that small amount of time determine that my dog, who was clearly not aggressive with anybody, should be put down, and not given a chance for adoption? He was only there three days. That was it. So I want to thank Stu for bringing this to a head, and hopefully something will be done about this. (Applause.)
Thank you. Thank you very much. 164 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 We want to thank you, and all of the witnesses who have come down today to share their stories with us. It's very painful to lose a dog. And I had to put my dog down because he was sick. I cried the whole time. And so, it's very sad. But to have it done, you know, when you think it's not going to happen, it's very painful to lose an animal like that. Could we have Jennifer Mack, Lisa Scarduzzio, Christian Tolan, Marisa Palicio and Linda Jean Patton. (No response.)
Okay. On with the next panel. Kathy Sylvester, Audrey Stansbury, Jane Stansbury, and Louis Paluccio. All of them can come forward. We'll take one at a time. So, you can sit there. Would you begin, please. Identify yourself, please, for the record
My name is Linda Jean Patton. The recent articles about PACCA in 165 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 the Daily News are especially sad, after all the optimism expressed at the Alliance for Philadelphia's Animals late in September. I was concerned when the Mayor's name was dropped from the name of the Alliance. Isn't our Mayor interested in this problem? The Mayor of New York City and the Governor of New Jersey were both concerned enough to create and/or work with groups concerned about the welfare of companion animals. Why is our Mayor not supporting this volunteer effort, at least with his name? The animal rescue community, of which I am a part, is aware of the problems at PACCA. And the inhumane treatment of animals is inexcusable and must not be tolerated. PACCA needs reform, but I hope that these hearings will be more than just horror stores about people's experiences with PACCA. PACCA is not ultimately responsible for the deaths of the thousands of innocent 166 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 creatures who end up at their facility. The part of Mr. Bykofsky's story that I wish that people would focus on is the 90 to 200 animals per day that end up at PACCA. The responsibility for their deaths lies with the humans of this city who fail to spay or neuter their pets, surrender their pets for trivial reasons, abandon their pets to the street, and allow their pets to roam the streets unprotected. (Applause.)
I was born in Philadelphia, and I have lived here all my life. I live now in South Philadelphia. I volunteer with the rescue. One of the things we do is take stray animals and their kittens off the street, take them to the vet, spay and neuter them, vaccinate them, and put them up for adoption. I was shocked at the number of stray animals, stray cats specifically, in my neighborhood. And. I was truly horrified by the fact that almost every one of them is 167 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 adoptable, a stray animal, not feral. Most of them are clearly discarded house cats, tamed trusting creatures that crave human companionship that have been away with no more thought than discarded trash. Because why else would they end up rubbing against my window crying to be let in? I've had contact with a group that organizes low-cost spay and neuter clinics held at PACCA. The clinics are staffed with volunteer vets and technicians and other people in the animal rescue community who help with the administrative and grunt work. I've been at PACCA on days when they brought animals in when there was no space to house them, and while we were helping volunteer vets and technicians to spay and neuter and vaccinate animals that we had culled from the city streets to be put up for adoption, 20 feet away animals were being put to death in the euthanasia room. It's very wrenching when you're a volunteer for a rescue, and your heart wants to rescue animals, and you know that you 168 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 can't rescue all of them. There's a solution for the problem. We need low-cost spay and neuter clinics for pets, for strays, for rescues, and for feral cats. This is a desperate need, and one that can be solved with the cooperation of the veterinary community and volunteers. The group that I work with is putting on these clinics at a cost to the city of nothing. They're staffed by volunteer vets and technicians, and the cost to PACCA is the use of the clinic, and the cost to the people who have their animals spade and neutered is the cost of the supplies to PACCA. We also need to adequately fund and properly staff PACCA. And this can hopefully be accomplished with the cooperation of the city government and private donors, and hopefully by way of the Alliance for Philadelphia's Animals and ultimately Mattie's Fund. But last and the most difficult is 169 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 that people must be made to understand that having an animal companion means assuming a lifelong commitment with that animal. (Applause.)
And that requires spaying and neutering, proper care, and that their responsibility does not end when the animal grows up, loses his novelty or becomes inconvenient. I don't know how to begin to solve that problem. Although one local organization has a heart-rending tape, encouraging spaying and neutering by showing animals being euthanized, what I would like to do is to sentence irresponsible animal guardians to public service hours at the shelter, and force them to watch as healthy, lovable cats and dogs are put to death for the crime of being unwanted. I've read stories about American soldiers stationed in the war zone in Iraq, facing death every day, who have cared for and rescued stray dogs and cats. And then there are the others. I 170 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 recall someone who called our rescue to ask us if we could find a home for her pair of nine-year-old cats. She was getting rid of them because she was getting new furniture. Or another rescuer telling me that someone she knew was going to call the shelter to come and get his 14-year-old cat. Translation: The cat is to be put to death because the cat could no longer climb the stairs to get to her litter box. And this person would not be troubled to put a litter box where the cat could reach it. This last item is the most difficult because it requires a radical change of attitude in so many people. Unfortunately, most of the negative energy and criticism resulting from the articles will be directed against PACCA. A similar thing happened during the Philadelphia weekly story about the Morris Animal Refuge. Unbelievably, I heard that some people responded to the Morris story by deciding not to adopt animals from Morris. If they had given it any thought, 171 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 they would see that they need to adopt as many animals as possible from these institutions, to lower the appallingly high death rates. The serious personnel policy and procedure problems at PACCA desperately need to be addressed. But what the public must be made to understand is that the blood of these innocents is first and foremost on the hands of all those who devalue the lives of their companion animals who fail -- (Applause.)
-- who fail to make the necessary lifetime commitment to their pets' welfare, who do not spay or neuter, and who recklessly and cruelly abandon their animal companions to the streets and to the shelters. Until that happens, no more homeless pets will remain a dream, and the lives of Philadelphia's homeless animals will remain a nightmare. Thank you. (Applause.) 172 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04
My name is Lou Palucco. I will not attempt to color coat my anger, frustration and lack of trust with all those connected with PACCA, which includes this City Council and city administration. After all, it was City Council, with the blessings of this Mayor, that gave Philadelphia the dubious distinction of having the largest cat and dog slaughterhouse in the tri-state region. This City Council could not find the funds to help a beleaguered Pennsylvania SPCA, at a time when that facility was extremely overburdened and was looking for ways to lessen the killings taking place there. Yet, Council found tens of millions of tax dollars to operate PACCA, a cesspool filled with the blood of tens of thousands of unfortunate cats, dogs and wildlife. How many Council members took an unannounced visit to this killing facility 173 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 before Mr. Stu Bykofsky's story broke in the Daily News? I'd bet a paycheck not one of you had. Are those who truly care about animals in this city supposed to believe this Council when City Council allowed an outdated and problem-laden heating system kill all of the zoo's primates that fiery Christmas Eve? Are we to believe this Council cares about animals, when you allowed bullets to fly in our city parks to kill bear as they ate over bait, when nonlethal methods exist? Are we to believe this Council has compassion towards animals, when you allowed this excuse of a Health Department the right to poison all animals in Rittenhouse and Washington Squares, to rid those center city parks of rats, when there are nonlethal methods available? To sit before you here today, as I did in 1986 before Councilman Ed Schwartz, in 1994 before Councilwoman Marion Tasco, in 1999 before Councilman Frank Rizzo, and twice before Councilman DiCicco in 2002 and 2004, 174 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 and now before you, Councilman Kelly, makes me believe these hearings on the welfare of animals in this city are nothing more than face saving of a heartless City Council and Mayor, that the animal advisory board is nothing more than puppets who mislead the public on behalf of a city administration that cares little, if at all, for the animals within the city limits, and for those residents who truly care for animals, both companion and wildlife. The problem with the city administration is, you keep believing the experts who have vested interests in keeping the status quo. It's time you start listening to true animal advocates who have always been ahead of the headlines, on the issues of compassion and humane treatment of our animal neighbors. With regards to the City Health Department, under whose auspices PACCA falls, this department is a disaster when it comes to the welfare of animals. 175 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 Why does the Health Department continually fail in its duties of caring for the animals under its watch? Evidence of the Health Department's incompetence in animal welfare are the never-ending abuses inherent in the carriage horse trade, which led to the death of Bishop, a horse that was literally worked to death. Today we witness how the City Health Department again failed the animals during years of neglect and abuse at PACCA. Who was not doing their job on the tax dole at the Health Department? Why is the neglect and abuse of defenseless animals on the taxpayers' money allowed to continue? This Health Department has shown time and again they care nothing of the cruelty perpetrated upon animals under their watch. It's time to remove those in the health Department who permit such abuses to continue, and those changes should begin at the top. 176 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 The public is tired of hearing empty promises. And when the heat settles, you all go back to your status quo attitude of, they're just animals.
Tell that to seven-year-old Kala Troy, who lost her best friend Shia in nine minutes, when the butchers of PACCA were doing what this city hired them to do. This Council and this city administration needs some serious attitude adjustment, when it comes to the treatment of animals. You need to look beyond your prejudices and your ignorance when it concerns a sentient being. The New York City Animal Care and Control Division is the first shelter nationwide to introduce Pet Ark, a virtual pet ATM that helps in matching adopters by linking all of the homeless pets from New York's five regional boroughs to help prospective adopters and help to lessen the number of animals killed. The San Francisco SPCA began a 177 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 massive education and adoption and free spay neuter program which has brought that city's kill rate to almost nil. What innovative and educational programs are existing at PACCA? Why is PACCA an unknown to the majority of pet owners in this city? Because those who are in charge of running PACCA are clueless, and satisfied with the status quo of killing tens of thousands of dogs and cats and dogs annually. )
These people at PACCA need to be seeking other employment. They've proven they cannot be trusted in their current occupation. Butchers should not be doing the jobs of humane workers. (Applause.)
What are the requirements -- What are the requirements of getting employment in PACCA's slaughterhouse? That you be a family member of George Stem or a friend of his? I mean his wife, his son, his 178 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 brother-in-law, and his girlfriend, George's sister-in-law, and friends David and Darlene, and on and on. It's obvious that these people are simply there to collect the paycheck. Because if it weren't their motive, we would not be sitting here today listening to the horror stories these butchers have committed at taxpayers' expense. (Applause.)
It's time to take these con artists off the tax payroll. There are people across this city on fixed incomes who are doing TNVR: Trap, neuter, vaccinate, release. Then PACCA arrives and traps and kills the very animals these people have trapped, neutered and vaccinated. I know. I'm one of those who do TNVR, and it costs me thousands of my dollars every year, only to see the white PACCA truck in the neighborhood and the cats go missing, never to be seen again. The people who do TNVR are the 179 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 people who should be running PACCA, not the butchers currently employed there. (Applause.)
These are people who the people who do TNVR in this city. These are people who know how to stretch a dollar and be humane at the same time. At $2.26 million tax dollars, one would think the experts of PACCA would have the same money and heart sense, but the experts at PACCA seem senseless in money and senseless in brains. (Applause.)
The Chinese have a saying, beware the wrath of the patient man. Animal advocates and activists have been very patient with this city's callous disregard for the welfare of the animals who reside here. We are demanding that you change those in charge of PACCA, and replace them with true animal advocates who will place the welfare of the animals before any other considerations. 180 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 It's time that you understand that the people of this city are tired of being lied to, and that we demand changes that place the animals' welfare first. For this City Council to retain Carmen Paris of the Health Department and Karen Miller of PACCA will expose this Council as I've described. If this Council truly cares, then the firing should start with the person known as the executioner, Karen Miller. (Applause.)
This woman does not understand animals, and certainly doesn't care whether they live or die, as is proven by her heartless eagerness to kill healthy cats and dogs at a whim. The people of this city want and deserve a full-scale investigation into all aspects of PACCA, its hiring practices, financial records, how and where the money is 181 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 spent, humane policies, educational outreach services, adoption records, screening of adopters, euthanasia records, employee backgrounds. Do any have records of animal abuse? The entire operation needs investigation. The people of this city want and deserve to have the findings made public, and also made public what City Council intends to do to correct the problems. The people want and expect follow-up, unannounced visits to this facility, and the findings made public. Thank you for allowing me to speak for those innocent death row victims waiting their turn to die at the hands of the butchers at PACCA. Thank you. (Applause.)
Thank you very much. And what we would invite you to do is, during the course of our budget hearings in the spring, that you come in and be a voice for the animals. Because we need to 182 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 have the testimony. When people have an issue they care about, they bring it to the Council. This Council has been vigilant and has taken action to correct those problems, when it is brought to our attention. We do have a lot on our plate. Sometimes things do pass us. But once it's brought to our attention, we do take action. And if we have an advocate for the animals, for the PACCA, and the care, then we need to know that at budget time, when the budget is before the City Council. That's when we can act about that.
Hello. My name is Lisa Scarduzzio. And I volunteer with the Doberman rescue, and I also formed a little bit of alliance with a lot of the local rescue -- breed rescue groups. On August 10th, around that time, we started going into PACCA two, three times a week, getting lists of dogs that needed to 183 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 get rescued. And we got out to dogs per week, and got them into rescue groups. What I'm going to speak about is just a few of the things that I've seen while I was there. On one occasion I went to see what dogs were available. And one of the vet techs came up to me. And she handed me this little dog. And his name was chicken bones. They called him chicken bones because he looked like a chicken. He was all bones. And she said, please get him out of here. We don't want to get him euthanized. He's a very sweet dog. I said, sure, I'd be glad to take him and I'm sure I'll have no problem getting him to a foster home tonight. I'll hold him until I need to. We went up to the computer. She went to do the paperwork. And he was in their computer system as a green iguana.
A green iguana. 184 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04
He was in their computer system as a green iguana. UNIDENTIFIED VOICE: A large lizard.
A large lizard. They have a cage, a card number for their dogs that are in their holding facilities. And throughout the history of PACCA, the descriptions of the dogs are not always accurate. In this case this little white dog was labeled a green iguana. There was a mixup between the tag number, the cage card, whatever it may have been. But obviously, it was not a green iguana. It's in a happy home now. It had a little bit of a health thing; you know, just needed to get fattened up a little bit. But he's living happily now. On one of my other visits to PACCA, I went in to get another list of dogs that needed to get into rescue. And I walked through the back, and I noticed a large mixed dog, but it appeared to be mostly Great Dane. I questioned the counselor, adoption 185 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 counselor, that was walking with me. And I said, could you tell me why this dog is going to be euthanized? She looked at the tag and knew he was going to be euthanized. And she said, the dog is suffering from post-partum depression. It has a heart murmur. And therefore, we're going to euthanize it. I looked at it more closely, and I said, could you please explain to me how a male dog could have post-partum depression? I just didn't see that as being possible. That was on a Thursday. She went up front. She said, let me see if I can get the more accurate information. She went into the computer again. She said, the dog in this cage number is euthanized to be -- is scheduled to be euthanized today, she said, but obviously there's some type of mixup. We spent about three hours going through records, and this, that, and the other. Finally she said, I realize that 186 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 this dog was not seen by the vet yet. I said, okay. Well, I will get this dog into a foster home with Great Dane Rescue as soon as you give me the okay to pull it. That was on a Thursday. We called back over the weekend. Monday morning comes. The dog still did not see the vet yet. She calls me back. She said, I'm taking him in right now. She took him in the back. She scanned him. The dog was microchipped. It was a dog PACCA had adopted out themselves two or three months prior to that. And the owner had been calling for that dog all week, from I was told. They turned around and told the owner that the battery in the microchip was dead, and that's why they didn't know whose dog it was. But I'm just very grateful that I was there that day to point out the fact that a male dog does not have post-partum depression. There's other things that we've done 187 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 to try to fix some of the problems that we as volunteers at University Community had seen as problems. A lot of times when we're setting up a dog that we want to rescue, we have to get it into a foster home. A lot of times we need information, background information. This dog was owner turning. Did it live with children? Just basic things did it ever bite? If it was owner turned, then surely that information should be available. Sadly, with PACCA it rarely is. So that can just be a problem. But we did -- Some of the things PACCA says we can't hold a dog. Then we got them to agree to be able to hold the dog for us for 72 hours. We volunteered to bring in our own holding equipment. We said, give us an area. If we're working on getting a dog into a rescue group, we know it's not something we could do in hours. We need at least three 24 or four days. Give us an area to put our dogs. We'll bring in food, we'll bring in 188 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 crates, whatever is needed. Just please don't euthanize innocent animals because you do not have anywhere to put them. I was told that they had nobody to clean the crates; so, therefore, they could not let us bring in our own crates. None of the workers at PACCA during the day would volunteer to feed them if we could not get in.
They couldn't guarantee that the crates would be, you know, clean. Therefore, they were unwilling to give us an area to house our dogs until we got them into rescue. That was, you flow, another problem. We also made other recommendations, as far as getting volunteers into PACCA that were trained to answer the telephone, to go into the computer and answer questions that people might have if somebody is calling up saying, hey, do you have my dog? Or a rescue is calling up and saying, we hear that you have a Rotweiler. Could you tell me if it's male or female? A lot of times that information... It was like pulling teeth just to get that information. 189 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 And with certain breeds, you can't just pull a dog from a shelter, not knowing if it's even a male or a female, stick it into a home with other dogs and other small children, without getting a little bit of basic information. And a lot of times that was just a large problem with PACCA. And it's still a continuing problem, for the most part. We've also in October, October 22, 2003, I asked a lot of the rescues to send letters to the board, the board that overseas PACCA. And we did that. That was a year ago. We've called Fox. We asked for undercover investigations. I mean, we've sent -- I sent letters to the Mayor. Other people have sent letters to the Mayor. If it wasn't for the Daily News, this information would still be behind closed doors. And that's sad. I think that we need a new board, and I think we need total revamping of the system. ) 190 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04
Because, you know... Start with people that know what they're doing and care. That's the problem. A lot of these people... I think that the workers are overwhelmed, whatever it may be. We asked -- We asked the board to increase the budget. We did that before the budget was finalized in October. And nothing was done. Our e-mails were not returned. And more animals died. Another thing, litters of puppies being put to sleep for flees. We volunteered to bring in volunteers to wash puppies. If flees are such a problem, give the dog a bath, not the needle. They don't deserve it. That's it. I hope something can be done.
I'm a little nervous. My 191 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 name is Jennifer Mack. A few months ago my baby, full bred pit bull, and my full bred shepherd had a litter of five puppies. Trying to make a long story short. Let me just show you a picture of Vibe. This is Vibe right here (Indicating). I made her survive when she was seven days old. She got a small cut on the back of her neck. Her mom was licking at it, licking at it. It became a two-inch by two-inch hole in the back of her neck at ten days old. I nursed this dog for five weeks, fed it by hand, took it to work with me, fed it on my breaks. When they were seven weeks old, I only had two puppies left. I gave away three. I was walking in the door. Within minutes, somebody took the two puppies from right outside my door within five feet because, you know... I later found out who it was. They took them to PACCA on a 192 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 Thursday night. I found out they were there. Somebody seen my -- my picture hanging up on my -- on my door. And I went there Friday night. Of course, they couldn't give me my dogs. Actually, the people that were there Friday night were pretty nice. I knew that they weren't going to give me my dogs that night. They brought the dogs out. The guy that was working in the back... You know, they were jumping up on me and everything. And he said, you want to carry them back? I said, okay. They went back there. The cages were clean. I don't know who he was, but I guess he was, you know, pretty sure in what he was doing, because he let me go back there. The guy at the counter told me it would be about $30 a dog. The next morning I went back with a hundred dollars. I had $103. 193 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 First the woman behind the counter told me, you got to wait four more minutes until o'clock. 5 Okay. I'm going to wait. Stay 6 calm. 7 She... You know, I don't know. 8 Bills are here. $16 for registration. $10 9 for rabies shot that they couldn't even get 10 yet because they were too young. Came out to $112. I said, all right. I have to leave, and come back with the remainder of the money. It was only a few dollars. I said, I want to see my dogs. She just looks at me. And I said, I want to see my dogs. Well, didn't you see them last night? I said, yeah, I saw them last night, but I want to see them again. Looked at the guy that was pushing the needles because I seen -- you know, I seen how he acted towards, you know, somebody else's dog that they were getting put down. 194 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 Said, oh, no, we don't do that here. You don't... Are you going to show me them? No. You saw them last night. Well, guess what? I have $103 on me. If one of the dogs is dead, I'm taking the one other home. Still wouldn't let me see the dogs. Came back. Got the dogs. I had the dogs for three days. I'm sorry. They got... They got really sick, really, really sick. They wouldn't eat. I mean, I put a piece of steak in front of them. They wouldn't eat it. I thought, you know, first day I thought maybe, you know, they were just -- you know, I don't know, just weren't eating right or whatever. After three days I took them to the vet. Both of them had parvo. That night, went home. And I wrote on here... This was a week before. Please help us. We still need our mommy. A week later they're mommy's gone. 195 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 She -- She got parvo, and she died after about three days. $2,000 in vet bills, you know. I don't know. When I seen how sick these dogs were, and I knew there was something really seriously wrong, you know, I don't know if they check these dogs... I don't know. They told me the virus can be spread on the bottom of your shoe. Well, then probably almost every dog in there has it, and every -- I mean, how many people are taking dogs home and giving the virus to their dogs, like happened to mine? Now my baby is gone.
We thank you for much for your testimony. Thank you all very much for your testimony. (Applause.)
Did we call your name, Miss? UNIDENTIFIED VOICE: Oh, no. That's all right.
Are you Ann 196 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 Shrinkle? Come forward. Buddy Hyman, Rose Blouser.
I'm also from the last group. Marisa Palicio. I was called before.
Okay. We'll get you on. We're going to finish this panel, and then we're going to go back to the administration. So, you can pull a chair up, sir. Thank you.
Councilman Kelly has a statement he'd like to make before you begin your testimony.
Yes. I just want to speak to all the people that are speaking today on all of these panels. I just want to give you some assurance that this is not a topic that we're just going to discuss today and just drop, and then everything goes back to normal tomorrow. 197 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 I can assure you that this Council... I know that the Chair of this committee, Councilwoman Tasco, and there is Councilwoman Brown, there is Councilwoman Miller, Councilman Kenney was here, Councilman Rizzo was here... There's a lot of Council people that were just as shocked as you were or, actually, as anyone, as even the Health Commissioner was shocked when he read those stories in the newspapers. And I want to tell you right now that this is something that we're going to be working on. We're going to try to work with the administration, and we are. We're part of the administration. I for one am probably negligent in a way because I didn't have a clue that this was going on. Now that we do know what was going on, what's been going on for the last two years, I think that you can rest assured that we're going to try to do everything we can to change it and change it immediately. Okay? So, I want to just make that known before 198 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 your testimony today. Thank you. (Applause.)
Hi. My name is Audrey Stansbury. And I just want to say that the last story we heard just exemplifies that people need to really have an understanding that they need to have their animals inoculated. (Applause.)
And we really need a good education system out there, you know, teaching people, you know, if they do have an animal, what to do. Because it is heartbreaking. And a lot of it is ignorance. So... But I'm here to tell you my story today of my experience with PACCA. My daughter and I, everywhere we go, we pick up animals that are stray. Sometimes 50 a year, 60 or whatever. We don't keep them all. Many times we call all the different SPCAs and ask them if they're crowded, and we take it to the least crowded 199 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 one. That's the best we can do for most of them. On this particular occasion, we spotted a mother cat and her four kittens. We were walking our dog. We took our dog back home. We got an appropriate container. We spent the whole night catching this mother cat and her four kittens. When we had them all safely in a cage -- And we were very careful with them. The kittens were feral kittens, wild kittens. The mother was sort of half and half. We called the SPCA. And they said that they weren't taking any animals at that time. And we had, you know, had a relationship with the SPCA people, and always had, you know, a good experience with them. So we took the animals, the four kittens and their mother to PACCA. This was in the early evening. The workers... There were four workers that we saw that were outside of the building. They were smoking or eating pizza, I think, or something like that. 200 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 We had to wait for them to come and unlock the door because they had actually locked the door. They let us in. There were two men there. The one was behind the counter, and one was, you flow, approaching the kennel that we brought in with the animals. And we said -- You know, we started to explain the mother's kind of friendly. Before we finished even saying the sentence, the guy picked the mother cat up, not by the scruff of her neck and gently under her rear, just grabbed her by her head and flung her behind him into a box and slammed the lid down. And I was like, wait, wait, wait. My daughter, who's 17 years old, started crying at this point. And she turned to the other guy and said, does he always do this? And I was like, wait, wait. I'll take the four kittens put them myself into the crate. He said, I don't have time for this 201 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 shit, lady. He grabbed those kittens by their legs, their tails, their skin, not the scruff of their neck, I mean, and just... And flung them into a separate box, and slammed the lid down before he even looked to see. I mean, it was like he was trying to demonstrate his slam dunk. So we the next day separately... I called the Mayor's office. My daughter called, wrote a letter to the Health Department. Both of us got a response. My daughter got a response in writing, and I got a call from the Health Department, who referred me to George Stem, who I spoke with personally. He said, you know, you can come to our facility, yadda, yadda, yadda. I said, we weren't really interested in doing that. But I told him I would be happy to come in and identify the person that treated the animals so roughly. And he said that he knew exactly -- 202 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 by my description, he knew exactly who the person was, and that he would deal with that person, that they should lose their job. As far as I know, no one's lost their job there. Secondly, we went to the animal alliance meeting specifically to talk to Carmen and other members of the Health Department because we wanted to make sure that they knew that there were problems at PACCA. And when they finished giving their speeches after the alliance meeting, my daughter and I, like, rushed up to the front and talked to Carmen and one other man who isn't here -- they were supposed to be heads of the Health Department -- and told them, expressed to them our deep concerns about what was going on there.
And we were told it wasn't the time or the place to talk about it. So, that's all I have to say. And we were so grateful because we tried to get City Paper involved. We had a letter-writing 203 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 campaign. We tried to get people aware of what was going on there. So, we were so grateful that the article was in the paper and that other people came forward. So, that's all I have to tell you. Thank you for being here.
I'm Ann Shrinkle. I'm the President and Founder of Animal Alliance. And since PACCA opened its doors two years ago, we have been the largest rescuer to that facility, removing each week between 10 and 15 dogs. So, in the classic case of, there's two sides to every story, I'm here to speak on behalf of PACCA, and tell you that I -- I -- after six years of being in the rescue business full-time as a volunteer, I've had just a fine experience, no problems at all, dealing with PACCA. And I have dealt with a lot of 204 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 shelters in the tri-state area, and PACCA, the conditions there are right on par with the conditions in most animal shelters, which is -- You know, it is what it is. So, I didn't have any prepared comments for today, but I would like to read a letter that I wrote to Stu that he chose not to publish. And it says, as the President and founder of Animal Alliance, a New Jersey animal rescue group that's been working with PACCA since they opened two years ago, I wish to share with you my thoughts regarding your article. In the interest of fair and balanced reporting, I hope you'll consider my input, as my organization is the largest rescuer to PACCA, each week removing between 10 and 15 animals. All our care and foster care network provided with necessary medical care and spayed and neutered prior to adoption to carefully screen to adoptive homes. Karen Miller, who I have had the 205 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 pleasure of working with for the past two years, has worked tirelessly against seemingly insurmountable odds to see to it that as many animals as possible are removed from PACCA and transferred to rescue organizations, such as Animal Alliance, rescue organizations who wish to proactively work with her. She routinely calls me to advise me of dogs who need help, and has gone the distance for innumerable animals to, ensure their safe placement into rescue groups, not just mine, but many others, or adoptive homes. She has virtually no budget and chronic staffing problems, and she still does her best. Clearly stated, the faults for the city's pet overpopulation problems lies with the owners who grow weary of their pets and surrender them to PACCA by the droves each day. These are the folks who fail to spay and neuter their pets, allow them to wantonly 206 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 breed, and dump more animals into a city already terribly overpopulated with animals. 150 to 200 animals are received in a typical day at PACCA, and I see it all the time. It is unjust and unfair to blame the overworked, understaffed PACCA team for the sins of an entire city. A lack of community responsibility for your pets, coupled with inadequate funding from the city creates a revolving door at PACCA, in which community residents routinely dump their pets on PACCA's doorsteps, and PACCA to deal with the problem. There's simply not enough homes for these pets, and despite efforts to make changes and increase community collaboration, the only present solution, sadly, is euthanasia for the surplus. And I see it all the time. People pull up. Their mom dog had puppies. They just dump 12 dogs at a time right there in the lobby, all day long. The Alliance for Philadelphia's 207 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 Animals, a recently formed coalition of local rescue groups and shelters, hopes to improve conditions at PACCA, while striving to make Philadelphia a no-kill city in the next decade. These noteworthy goals have been accomplished or is being pursued by various communities across the country, such as San Francisco; Ithaca, New York. And in New York City a similar effort has been underway since 2002. And their highly successful model is the basis for the Philadelphia Alliance.
So I encouraged Stu to write an article spotlighting the positive efforts of these groups, as it's positioned to increase adoptions, increase low-cost spay neuter services, and increase rescue group involvement and volunteers at PACCA. Of particular interest is that PACCA itself is a member of the Alliance, clearly demonstrating that even though there may be problems, they are partnering proactively in an effort to bring about community change. 208 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 I also urged Stu to visit our web site. The 50 dogs we have in our foster care at present always come from PACCA, as did most of the dogs in our recently adopted pet file. There are 1,000 animals that we have removed from PACCA since they opened their doors two years ago. And each one of them are alive, well, altered, and being cared for in adoptive homes, thanks to the direct efforts of Karen Miller, the woman referred to as the executioner in Stu's articles. It was Karen who personally saw to it that these animals were directed to our rescue, often holding them longer, sometimes in her office, in makeshift cages, longer than she had to, until we could get to Philadelphia to pick them up. Someone has to authorize the euthanasia of animals when the shelter is busting at the seams and there is simply no 23 more room for the unending stream of animals. I have stood at PACCA and seen every single cage filled with animals, and people 209 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 lined up out the door holding more to dump in on the top. Where, where, where are these animals supposed to go? So until Philadelphia implements adoption and spay neuter programs as proposed by the Alliance for Philadelphia's Animals, there will continue to be a hideous pet overpopulation problem in this city. And as people's lost pets run away from yards, with no license no, no tag on, and they wonder, gee, how did my pet die? People don't spay neuter their pets, their pets have puppies, and they can't understand, you flow, how the puppies end up at the shelter when they were in their yard. Until all these problems change, Karen Miller is going to have to keep doing the hardest job in this world, the job no one else wants to do. And that is, to decide what dogs and what cats must pay with their lives, for the sins of the humans who bred them, fought them, abused them, neglected them, allowed 210 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 them to procreate, and then set them loose on the streets, abandoned them, or dumped them at PACCA themselves. Thank you. )
My name is Marie Savalasios. And I'm speaking as a volunteer and as animal activist. This is a letter that I wrote to Councilman Kenney. I'm going to summarize it. This is quite long. My first volunteer assignment at PACCA began on May 18th. And it consisted of cleaning cages in the puppy and cat room for a period of one week, four days. Okay. Being inside the kennels and having access to the areas off limit to the public, I was able to see how the shelter operated and how employees performed their job. On subsequent volunteer assignments, I continued to see irregularities, which I 211 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 pointed out to shelter management in writing. Some of those irregularities include filthy cages, thirsty and hungry animals, clogged drains, and a horrible smell of urine and feces. There were also missing cage carts, sick and untreated cats put in same cages with healthy cats, kennels turning the lights on at 4:00 p.m. and keeping animals in the dark for long periods of time. There were dogs with wounds, injuries that were left untreated. The dogs are confined to metal cages arranged in rows. They are not walked or socialized, and many of them are destroyed after just a few days at the shelter. Many of the larger dogs have to be destroyed recently due to a highly contagious virus that propagated, caused by lack of sanitation. Seeing how badly the animals needed help, I became involved in adoption counseling at several events throughout the city, as well as at the Pet Smart store 212 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 located in Horrocks Avenue, whose adoption center showcases PACCA animals. This center has been closed repeatedly because PACCA doesn't have available stuff to handle adoptions on weekends. I offered to help, since I live nearby, and was willing to train volunteers so the adoption center would remain open. I had a team of volunteers ready to start in this project, and was very excited about getting animals out of the shelter and into permanent homes. The manager of this store had complaints repeatedly to me about PACCA's disorganization and continued absence of the adoption center, especially since Pet Smart has always been very successful with their adoption initiative, and has recently reported the nationwide number of adoptions of two million. I'm going to skip for the next part. There is no full-time vet at the shelter. As a matter of fact, they don't 213 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 seem to be... PACCA cannot find one that is willing to work there. Animals that have not been spayed or neutered aren't allowed to leave the shelter after being adopted because of the this. No full-time vet means that animals that arrive at PACCA spend several days waiting to be processed before they can be placed in the adoption area. Most cages in the puppy room 12 adoption process areas are the same size as cat cages. In my opinion, they are too small for the dogs. They have to be spend -- They have to spend days, sometimes weeks, confined in them, without a chance for a walk. It is clear that I'm being punished by PACCA for speaking out in public about what's happening at the shelter. I have personally been told that I can no longer volunteer there. Last Saturday Carmen Paris told me that in person. Apparently, I'm not welcome any more. My work there is not welcome any more, even though I'm just a volunteer. I'm 214 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 not getting paid. I'm doing it out of my own time. And this is what has prompted me to come here and speak in public about this. And I hope they will reconsider that -- what they're doing, and will allow me and other volunteers to go back and work and help the animals because that's what I'm here for. Thank you. (Applause.)
Good afternoon. My name is Rose Blouser. I work with Jersey Shitzu Rescue. I live in Philadelphia, where there's cooperation of people in the tri-state area, Delaware, Philadelphia and New Jersey. I'm glad PACCA does work with Alliance because they certainly have not worked with us in the past. They've had our contact information basically the first month they opened. And I've stopped by periodically and told, oh, 215 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 yes, we have it. But since they have opened, they have not called us once for a Shitzu or any small dog. That little Westie we could have -- we would have taken. We'll do other breeds than just Shitzu's. I do, however, have a contact who had a little Shitzu at PACCA. And this little story will exemplify my point, in that she couldn't come to pick up the dog. So, she asked me if I would pick her up from PACCA and bring to it her home, her rescue. And when I went over to PACCA, I went in. I told them who I was, what I was there for. And they said, please wait. I think I waited a good hour. And I went to the window several times. They said, somebody will be with you. Somebody will be with you. Went back into the small dog area. Was escorted by PACCA to get the animal. The cages are stacked like two or three on top of each other. The volume of noise in the back is sometimes unbelievable 216 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 from barking. Okay. We went to get the little guy out from underneath. And he shied away, and then he snapped. Well, if you were alone, afraid, in a place filled with noise, wouldn't you be wanting to protect yourself if you see strange hands coming to grab you? And one of the workers said, are you sure you want to take him? He's awful vicious. Maybe we should just put him down. And I said, no, no. I'm taking him to another rescue. They've dealt with aggressive, assertive dogs. That's part of what we do in rescue. We evaluate -- As soon as we got the dog out of that area into a quiet area, he was still shaking, but he calmed down. When I got him home, he was the sweetest little thing. Took him to my friend in rescue. And she was able to bathe him, groom him, clean him up. She kept him for two weeks, evaluated his needs. And he's a happy, healthy little dog in a loving family 217 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 right now. (Applause.)
That demonstrates the attitude. The minute a dog showed the slightest bit of aggression, oh, we'll put him down; he's unadoptable. And also, I want to say, everybody's been talking about the education. I agree. In fact, there was an e-mail that came by, setting up a volunteer program at PACCA, asking if I'd be interested. I wrote back and said, yes, I would. Could you give me more details? Can I find out what's going on? I got that e-mail three weeks ago; have gotten no response. Got an e-mail the first week of August of this year, saying, we would like volunteers to help transport dogs to rescue groups or foster homes from the PACCA building. And I e-mailed them and said, I work with the rescue. I've transported dogs. I have a van. I have plenty of dog cages. I'd 218 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 be glad to help move dogs, if they just need the transport because I work basically weekends. That was over three months ago. They have not called me nor contacted me for one transport. Is this an agency that is actually active, trying to help with adoptions? I don't know, but I don't think so. At least, they've not called on me. And I've been willing to volunteer. That's all. Thank you for your attention to this matter.
My name's Buddy Hines, and I'm here as a lover of animals. I have six animals in my home at this time, all of whom were adopted from one place or another. This has been my practice throughout my adult life. To elaborate, my feelings of the horror stories that I've read about and heard about here today will be just a few more 219 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 words on the same subject. So, I'm going to try to address you as a professional. I am a retired project manager and adjunct professor at Temple University. I am accustomed to dealing with the public. I am more so accustomed to running operations, dealing with people, assigning and accepting responsibility. PACCA is a failure. And in the real world, where there are no umbrellas, enterprises which fail cease to exist. In the real world, individuals who fail to perform the functions that they are assigned and paid for, disappear from the field. In the real world, those who oversee and are ultimately responsible, and who remain ignorant of the deficiencies of their enterprises, they disappear, too, from the field. I happen to believe that, as the Bible says, man is given dominion over the animals. 220 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 With dominion comes responsibility. Anyone who deals with animals and does not feel responsible, who does not feel affinity, is, in my opinion, something less than a complete human being. These are personal feelings. What I would like to see Council do is get rid of this failure, to look to cities like San Francisco, whose efforts I'm personally acquainted with, learn how to do the job right, and apply the necessary resources, financial, physical, and personnel. That's basic management 101. Council has the power. The Mayor has power. These hearings, I hope, are merely a beginning. There is action to be taken, appropriate action. I've heard a lot of pretty words and broad generalities today about what will be done. I'd like to see a project outline, tasks broken down, schedules created, and funding assigned. We seem to have a lot of money for enterprises in this city that have little or 221 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 nothing to do with living things. Most of the animals I've heard talked about today were someone's family members. Let's take care of our families, I charge you. (Applause.)
Thank you all for your testimony. We'd like to now have Mr. O'Donnell come back, if Karen Miller is here, and Yvonne Sutton from District Council 33, to come forward. What we'd like to hear is what is going to be done to improve the conditions, what changes are going to be done, and also I'd just like to say to the Commissioner, you don't have to come back, but if you want to... But we want to... I'm very concerned about the board. Come on, Mr. O'Donnell. You all come up. About the board. I do believe that you need to... I don't know who the non city members will be, but certainly you need to put people on there who may come from the advocate community, so 222 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 that they can feel free to speak out when there are things that are wrong. And also, I do believe that it shouldn't be so weighted to the city. There should be an effort to... Because city employees have to protect themselves. And we want people on the board who can speak out about what's going on, and who can bring to your attention what's going on, and feel free to do that. I think you need to look at the structure of that board. And we, certainly as the Chair of this committee, along with Councilman Kelly, would like to see the board members before they are appointed. First Miss Sutton, because your testimony may be less than Mr. O'Donnell's, in terms of some of the questions we have. I thought PACCA was contracted out to another agency. Do you still have city employees that work there?
They're not city employees. They're private employees, but I organized them. 223 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04
And they work there as part of your union structure..
54. Okay. You've heard the testimony of some of the people today. Do you have a comment you'd like to give?
Yes, I do. First of all, thank you, Councilwoman Tasco, and Councilman Kelly, for allowing me to speak to you today on behalf of PACCA and the employees that work there. Let me first say that --
I'm sorry. Yvonne Sutton, Business Agent for Local 40-B. 224 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 Let me first begin by saying that upon PACCA's inception there was never enough money allocated, from the very beginning, to do all the things that needed to be done, in terms of animal care. About a year ago I met with the Health Commissioner. And my concern was there were going to be all kinds of problems because there was not enough staff. And through no fault of the Commissioner, there was just not enough money allocated. I had been saying that over and over and over again. We have staff members -- Sometimes in that kennel there may be only two people working. Staff members come in when they're on vacation. They get a call; asked to come in because they have nobody to cover a schedule; and they come.
It's not enough for the number of animals that come in there. 225 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 You're talking about a 24-hour-a-day operation, with 54 people. There are people that work in the office, the kennel staff; people that work in the adoptions. And the worst part about it is that they've continued to add on more programs without the correct number of staff people. So they've continued to stretch the staff thin and thin and thin. It is impossible for three people to take care of all the animals in the kennel on a shift. Sometime there's only one staff member there. People call out. People get sick. People go on vacation. And they don't have enough staff members in the very beginning. You know, I feel very badly for the owners who have lost their animals because they were put to sleep and they should not have been. But please keep in mind that the people that I represent don't make those decisions. 226 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 And number two, I heard some of the animal -- the owners testified that their animals aren't aggressive. And maybe those animals aren't aggressive when they're in their home. But we have had union members that has been attacked and bitten by animals that were brought in to PACCA, and have had to be out of work because they were bitten so severely. So, maybe those animals weren't aggressive in their homes. But when they come in a strange place, they have become aggressive. And we have animals that have been bitten very, very badly. So, I'm here to say, I think that the people that testify... I don't believe people came here today and took their time to make up stories about PACCA. I believe that there are some issues at PACCA that need to be addressed. But I believe the most important issue that has not been addressed is the fact that there has never been enough money put in the budget to 227 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 adequately care for the animals. I heard somebody testify that they couldn't discipline employees because of the union. Nothing could be further from the truth. We have a contract. We have... There's a process in which management has the right to discipline employees. The other side of it is, employees have never been trained. There has been no 11 training at PACCA. That needs to happen. There needs to be money allocated in the budget for that to happen. I have been advocating for two years that they need to address the issues at PACCA, because if they didn't, what's happening now would happen. And I just want to say that every employee at PACCA has adopted animals from PACCA. So I want to just clear up the fact that they're not butchers. They're not people that don't care about animals. Because every employee in PACCA has more than one animal that they have taken home. So, they do what they're told to do. 228 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 We have employees that work five weeks before they get a weekend off, seven and eight days straight. But when they ask them to stay to work another shift, they do it. They do it because they do care about the animals. (Applause.)
Miss Sutton, you mentioned you have 54 employees. Who hires them?
What's his criteria? Does he look for anything? Do they have to have a certain background to be hired? Do they... You know, do they have some kind of experience in animal control, animal care?
It's my understanding 229 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 that a lot of the workers came from SPCA.
and I would like to say at this time, the SPCA, of course, as any organization, you're going to have some dedicated people. You're going to have some good people in your organization. There's no 12 doubt there's probably some in PACCA. There's also some people that should not be there by any stretch of the imagination, in my opinion. (Applause.)
According to the testimony that I've listened to today, there are some people that should not be in that facility. And that's what we have to do. We have to do -- We have to work together on this. I know that you and the Health Commissioner and everyone else has to be on board with this, because we have to do some 230 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 screening, seriously screening. And this is not -- This is something that has to change, has to change today or tomorrow. But let me tell you, let me assure you that I am going to take it upon myself that I am going to follow up. And I know other Council people are going to follow up. And we're going to make unannounced visits to that facility. And if we see anything in there -- (Applause.)
And I'm not saying -- I'm not saying only myself. I'm going to send people in there because they would know me right off the bat. (Applause.)
They're going to be polite to me, and they're going to be -- I'm not going to say that. But what I want to do is, I want to assure the people here giving testimony that we're listening, and we're going to do something about it, and we're going to do it 231 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 immediately. I know I was -- I was speaking to the Chairwoman of this -- this committee, and she's serious about it, and so were other Council members. I don't want to play to the crowd. I don't want to play to anything. I want to do a good job, and I want to do a thorough job. And what we have to start with, we have to start with personnel because that seems to be the biggest problem right now. (Applause.)
We really have to deal with that. The training, as you mentioned -- and I agree with you a hundred percent -- there's got to be a training program for anybody that takes a position in there. I don't care what it is. I don't care if it's information. I don't care if it's on the telephone. Whatever it is. They have to treat people with respect, with dignity. We have to treat people right, 232 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 humanely. And this is one of the things that we can start that immediately. I don't see any drawbacks to that. I would also like to ask the Health Commissioner and everyone else, and the Director... I would like to have a meeting with the people involved in here. And I would like to have some health or animal activists also with me to make their recommendations. We've heard a lot of them today. And some of them are well thought out, and I think there's something that we definitely have to do. There's a lot of questions that I have for Mr. O'Donnell. But I want to thank you for, of course, coming in. And I think that you're representing the employees, but I think that you're trying to do the best for them. You mentioned something about not having the proper amount of financial backing from the city. I would like to mention something that Councilwoman Tasco alluded to earlier 233 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 today, is asking people at budget time to come in and to start -- and coming in here with the Health Department or whatever, and mention that this is one of the segments that have been lost. I know -- You know, I know the Health Commissioner has a lot of problems. We have the same thing in City Council. Our primary goal is to make this city as safe as we possibly can.
All right? But somehow we overlooked the other members of our city, and that's the animal; and that right now the animals of Philadelphia have been mistreated over the last two years, as far as I know. (Applause.)
Councilman, I'd just like to add that I am willing to do whatever I can do, from the union standpoint, to make PACCA the best place that it can be, and to 234 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 make sure that the people that are there are trained, and do what they need to do, to give the animals the best care that they can give.
Well, I just want to ask one thing here. You must have been working with George Stem, is that correct --
-- over the years? His hiring practices, do you know who he's been hiring?
I would say, I guess, maybe six -- between six and eight. I'm not sure of the exact number. 235 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04
George and I have had a lot of conversations about things that were going on in PACCA. And we talked about family members being over other family members there, and the problems that it could cause. And up until... George has been sick for a while.
And it's unfortunate that he didn't have the opportunity to straighten some of those things out.
Well, let me ask Mr. O'Donnell: You were, of course, overseeing this facility and this department. Were you ever informed that he was hiring his relatives? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Excuse me, Councilman. Mr. O'Donnell is in the chair for three weeks.
Oh, just three weeks? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Three 236 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 weeks. He's part of the chain.
Well, isn't it true that you were a part-time consultant?
Yes, I was. And my organization went in and worked with the executive director. We advised the executive director that those hiring practices were inappropriate, and there has not been a single hire of that nature since January or prior to that.
Yes. That's when I started. 237 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04
Okay. In other words, you called an immediate halt to something like that?
Well, we advised the Commissioner. And the Commissioner made it very clear that that would not occur.
Any new hires, for instance. Any new hires. Is anyone looking at who they're hiring?
What we did is, we went in and looked at the job descriptions, reworked all of the job descriptions at PACCA, met with the executive director, went over those job descriptions. The union had the opportunity to see some of those job descriptions. And those descriptions lay out the criteria under which we hire an employee. And as a practical matter, the way most employees would be hired is to first start as temporaries, so you have the opportunity to assess their work. And then as a permanent position becomes available, then you look to your good temporaries and 238 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 you promote them.
Okay. Now, I would just like to get on to the volunteer. You have... You're in the process of hiring a director of volunteers; is that correct?
And that's a director. And that would be... Their responsibility would be what? Getting volunteers?
Responsibility is getting volunteers, coordinating volunteer activities, working with the various units within PACCA to determine what the needs are for volunteers. 239 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 It makes absolutely no sense to bring volunteers into a facility until you have made a determination as to how you're going to best use them. All you wind up doing is giving them a bad experience. We don't want that to occur any more, and it's not going to occur any more.
Well, I think that this is one of the first things that we're going to have to do, because I think we're going to have to sit down with that person, your new director. And she or he has to do something. With all of these groups that were coming today, there was a lot of volunteers. We have a lot of volunteers throughout this city, it looks like. And I don't think there's going to be a problem of running that facility, with 240 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 as much help as you're going to get from the public. Somehow or other, things are moving too slow or not moving at all. And I think that we have to sit down, and I want to sit down with a lot of people involved today, and try to get this thing worked out. I would like to have a meeting as soon as I can with these people. I want to see if we can get these... volunteers on board, and put them on board, and put them in positions that they're going to -- that they're going to -- their input is going to be heard. And that's important, because I don't want to see volunteers just being used for the lousiest jobs of all, and then pay people, just walk away, and do whatever they're doing. I want to see them being used and have an input. I want to see them running that -- I mean, helping to run that facility, and not just being there doing the lower jobs there. 241 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04
I absolutely agree with you. And it is my belief that one of the areas where we can use volunteers the best is in the adoption program, to increase our adoptions.
Absolutely. And I think this is one of the things that we want to do, is to see if we can get into this adoption, rather than execution. Incidentally, speaking of, how are the animals being put away, if I can use that expression or euthanized? How are they being euthanized? VOICE IN THE AUDIENCE: Say killed.
As they said, say killed. And that's what's happening. The animals are being killed.
You have never used gas? 242 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04
Okay. Is Mr. Stem, is he going to be returning; do you know or is he... What is his status as of today? COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: His status as of today, as I understand it, Mr. Stem is gravely ill, in hospital. And the board voted at its last session to employ an interim executive director while a search goes on for a permanent position.
I'm just a little confused over the way an animal goes through the process, if it is found -- someone finds an animal, a lost animal, and they bring it to the facility. What is the -- What is the process that... your normal process that you would put that animal through or put it up for shelter or adoption? Could you explain that to me?
Councilman, the issue is, what category does the animal fall into? In my formal testimony, I would 243 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 attempt to address some of that.
But if an animal comes into the shelter, the animal is assessed for suitability for adoption. There are a number of criteria that we use to make that assessment. One, obviously, is the space we have in the shelter. Another criteria is the medical condition of the animal.
Is there a veterinarian? Is there a vet on the premises to make this judgment?
We have a vet and we have veterinary technicians. And again, in my testimony I address what we're doing to try --
Right now we have a part-time vet. What we have done is, we have raised the salary of that position because we 244 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 realize that we're not going to get a vet at what we're paying. So we are now actively recruiting for a full-time vet. We are also actively recruiting for two vet technician positions that have a license and have the shelter experience, to go in and make some of those assessments that we need made. That's ongoing, as we speak.
Okay. And while there are vets, from what the testimony I've heard today, that some of them would even volunteer their services, if need be.
What we'd like to do -- And since you've only been on the job three weeks, what we'd like to do, we do have another hearing here this afternoon. And the Chair of the SEPTA board is on time constraints. 245 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 What we'd like to do is, we'll meet -- schedule the meeting. The Councilman will schedule the meeting with you, because what we'd like to see is the detailed plan for your operation, and we can't do all of that here today. So, we could sit and go over that with you, in terms of what you plan to do, what the time line is for doing it, and so that we will have -- we have some assurances that things are being done. COMMISSIONER DOMZALSKI: Madam Chair and Councilman Kelly, you have my assurance that you will have open access, you know, to us, to our facilities, to people who work with us, and to get meetings scheduled, and to have meetings with a variety of people. And I want to thank you again for the way you've, one, you've scheduled this hearing; two, the way it's been conducted, in terms of having input from a wide spectrum of points of view, on an issue that is of critical importance to everyone in the City of Philadelphia. 246 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 So, we thank you, and you will have our cooperation.
Thank you. Miss Miller -- Miss McGinley, would you like to say something? I know your name has been called a lot today. And would you like to say something on your behalf? MS. McGINLEY: I know the people at PACCA, the people that work for PACCA, are dedicated people. And we saved so many animals, and we have so many good stories that, unfortunately, you don't have the opportunity to hear today. I have pictures, if you would like to see them, for some animals that we have placed into rescue. So far today, since we've opened PACCA's doors, we transferred 3,341 animals to rescue. And each and every one of us work very hard. And it's a very hard job to put an animal, you know, to sleep, to schedule an animal for euthanasia, but the job does have to be done. 247 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 Unfortunately, there's so many animals coming in. And if we could decrease the intake of the animals coming through the building, then we would have a better chance of finding each and every animal, an adoptable animal, a home. There's just not enough homes for them. And public education, neutering and spaying, is one of the things that we need to, you know, definitely work on. But if any time you want to see any pictures, I do have them available for you.
Well, we also understand that this is not a very simple issue. It's complex. And that there is a responsibility on all sides. MS. McGINLEY: Ownership.
Ownership, as well as our commitment, the city's commitment to taking care of the animals, and doing something about the neutering and the education.
Just all of the 248 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 issues that have been raised today. So, while, you know, we have to have the discussion and the debate. And then now we move to take some action. MS. McGINLEY: That's right.
To make the corrections, and that... Give some assurances to the public that action will be taken. You heard a lot of people here today. We want to ask them to volunteer. And I'm sure they'll be willing to volunteer to come in and work at PACCA. You have a volunteer coordinator. That has to be certainly dealt with. And so, we will -- we would -- we would hope that takes place. We will recess this hearing to the call of the Chair. But in the meantime, we'll have ongoing discussions with the department. And with those of you who testified, the Councilman will be in touch with you. 249 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 MS. McGINLEY: Thank you. (Unidentified person speaking away from the microphone, not reportable.)
We believe that those people who have made the commitment, to include everybody in the process, and that, you know, in the heat of passion and emotion, sometimes things are said or done that aren't meant to be hurtful or mean. And so, I hope that we can move forward in a positive way, that those people who are so passionate about this issue, who have had animals who have died and who have had problems can all overcome that, and that we work together to make PACCA work for the city. (Unidentified woman speaking away from the microphone, not reportable.)
Well, those are discussions that will have to take place. You heard today the SPCA is not willing to do that. It doesn't mean that we can't find other ways of doing it. We do have to recess this. We will 250 040954 - Health/Human Services - 11/15/04 have a follow-up hearing to discuss what has happened with PACCA, what progress they've made, what changes have been made, and what experiences people have had with PACCA. The meeting is recessed to the call of the Chair. Thank you. (Hearing recessed to the call of the Chair, at 2:15 p.m.) 251 CERTIFICATE I HEREBY CERTIFY that the proceedings and evidence are contained fully and accurately in the stenographic notes taken by me upon the public hearing of The Philadelphia City Council, taken on November 15, 2004, and that this is a true and correct transcript of same. _____________________________ DAVID A. DEIK, RPR and Commissioner of Deeds (The foregoing certification of this transcript does not apply to any reproduction of the same by any means, unless under the direct control and/or supervision of the certifying reporter.)