Committee Hearing, February 24, 2003

Well, is it being cut into the future?

Yes. It is staying at the lower number, so the reduction is staying in place.

Could you get me the figures on that?

Yes.

That's for lawyers. How about for the personal services contracts and 83 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 the no-bid contracts?

We can give you a break-out of what's happening with all of our professional services contracts so you can see what's happening. There were across-the-board cuts of 2 and a half percent. So each department is supposed to reduce its Class 200, which is where the professional services contracts are, by 2 and a half percent, you know, for 2 and a half percent in '04, 2 and a half percent in '05 and 2 and a half percent in '06. And we can show you a table of how that breaks out in terms of the actual dollar reductions in the Class 200.

And I am still waiting for an answer from somebody in the Administration to a question I asked a few weeks ago on the more-from-less theory. That somehow the Administration is posing to us that except in the police and fire, the uniformed departments, they are going to arrive at more with less people. However, somehow or other, that does not seem to work in the uniformed departments, where 84 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 there are going to be no cuts because, apparently, they can't figure out how to apply the more from less theory. And it seems to me that that is a very fallacious theory. And more from less must have some element, if it has anything, concerning efficiency and productivity. And I understand you are eliminating the office, so maybe you are not interested in productivity anymore. I don't know about that. But I do know that it makes absolutely no sense to say there is one theory for the nonuniformed and another theory for the uniformed. I think they are all equal. I think all of the employees of Philadelphia overall do a splendid job, whether they are uniformed or not in uniform. If any complaint they have, it is that they don't get enough pay and don't get enough benefits. But they all do a great job. What I can't understand is the strange theory of, we have got to do more from less, and then say, but that does not apply in the uniformed department. 85 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 It seems to me if it does in the apply in the uniformed departments, it can't apply anywhere else. I think that's really the theory. I don't think you get more from less unless you are being inefficient. And if you are operating at top efficiency, more ought to equal more productivity, whether it is uniformed or not. But I would like to get some explanation. Because I don't like to see our city Administration, which, incidentally, I fully supporting circulating petitions to try to get them reelected, but I do want them to be considering seriously how to correct the number of things that I think I would have to give them C minuses for currently. And I would like to promote them to B's and maybe even B pluses or maybe even A's at some point. So I would like an answer to that theory. Tell me, ultimately, was that a misspoken theory, or do you believe that somehow or other, when you put on a uniform, you lose the ability to produce more with less? But as long as you are out of uniform, you can do so? 86 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 Thank you, Madam President. So I am awaiting the answer. And just to stop me from being boring and having to reraise the question again and again, I would appreciate an answer to it. Thank you, Madam President.

Councilman Nutter.

One question and one clarification. Madam chief of staff, I think when you were responding to Councilman Ortiz with regard to some of the skateboard activity, I know you made reference on a number of occasions to the Logan community. And I think, just for the record, I think you were actually probably talking about Logan Square.

Logan Square. I am sorry. You are right.

In response to a question raised by Councilman DiCicco, I was actually trying to look through the two big books. And I thought Mr. Dubow, who I know actually memorizes every page of the two big budget 87 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 books, I could not find, in response to Councilman DiCicco's question, I couldn't find under the Mayor's Office -- and we have discussed it a couple of times now -- the health czar or that department. I looked under the Mayor's Office. I looked under the Managing Director's Office. I couldn't find it on either organization chart or listing in the detail. Can you tell us where that office is?

It is in the Managing Director's Office. The health czar is a deputy managing director, so there is a line --

So there is no 16 title --

There is a line, it will say deputy managing director.

So the person is actually not funded out of the Mayor's Office, it is funded out of the Managing Director's Office?

That is correct.

And the assistant? There was a staff person that was listed.

Also assistant managing 88 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 director. So they are both in the Managing Director's Office.

Okay. All right. Thank you very much.

The Chair recognizes Councilman Goode.

Thank you, Madam President. Good morning, Ms. Wilkerson. I believe it is still morning. Related to the consulting contract for work force development strategies, on an annual basis what amount of work force development dollars flow through the city?

I don't know that number.

Could you give me that number and also the amount, what percentage of that is controlled by Philadelphia Work Force Development Corporation?

Yes.

Thank you. That's it.

Thank you. Councilman Rizzo, your light is on. 89 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 Would you like to be recognized?

Yes. Yes, Madam President. I am going to direct my question to Mr. Dubow. What frustrates me is that you come meet with us prior to this budget, you get good ideas from us, you get bad ideas. I just checked, and we discussed lots of issues that could maybe save the city some money, maybe looking at different ways to do things. Never hear back from you. I looked through the notes of last year's budget, the budget before that one, with ideas that were presented not just by me, by all the members of City Council. When we meet with you, what was your reaction to me with the questions that I asked, like maybe going after Harrisburg for 5 and a half million dollars annually that we spend for patrol on the roadways, and other issues that I am not going to discuss publicly? Wouldn't you think it would be nice to get back to us? 90 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03

Yes. There were a number of issues we discussed. There were some ideas that we thought were good. And in terms of ideas with Harrisburg, we have a whole range of issues that we present. And we are successful on some things, but not on others.

I am talking about communication back to the Council member. Me specifically; I am not speaking for my colleagues. It seems as though you are just waiting for these questions to be asked all over again publicly with the department heads. Like the fire department, police department. I asked about how we manage -- and Councilman Cohen just mentioned about the uniformed forces, which are very near and dear to my heart and to most people in this room. But, there is room for productivity improvements; different managements, different ways we manage the departments. But I don't think anyone has really looked into the fire department from outside, to look into the police department from outside to say, "Hey, you are wasting a lot of money here. You 91 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 could do this differently. Phone lines that you don't need, things that have accumulated." And a problem with government is that once you've got something, you never want to let go of it, even if you don't need it. So I would like to know what the fire department, what the police department, has done to really look at their operations to make sure they don't have 300 extra police cars they don't need. I will tell that story during the budget hearing that I have been talking to you about, and apparently falling on deaf ears, the number of cars the fleet management is required to make available every day for patrol, when they don't have enough cops to put in those cars, wasting taxpayers' money fixing cars on overtime. So I would like to really see how serious you are and start looking under the rocks in the fire department and the police department to see how they spend our money.

The police department actually has taken a number of steps. And they did this as part of in Operation Safe Streets, there was a look at their budget. 92 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 And there are three or four specific initiatives that are saving substantial amounts of overtime. I think the Police Commissioner talked about a couple of them when he was here. One was looking at the rule that everybody had to stay at police headquarters while he was there. And they have changed that rule. One was looking at the way the highways division did their overtime, and changing that. One was looking at narcotics overtime. So, I mean, we have been looking at the police department. We have been trying to figure out ways to reduce their costs.

Mr. Dubow, I am not talking about inspectors that don't get overtime just hanging around the police Administration Building. I am talking about the business of the police department. I am talking about the millions of dollars the communication center spends to make that operation work, from paper clips, to staplers, to pens and pencils, to the nuts and bolts of these operations. Not the stuff that everybody -- you 93 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 know, the sexy stuff that everybody sees. I am talking about how well these operations are managed, how well the money is spent in each of the police divisions, the police districts, to make sure that we are doing it efficiently. I made suggestions to you to have a retired top-ranking police inspector go in and look at these operations to see exactly, because they know firsthand. Because, you know, maybe some of you folks don't talk to the police department and the firefighters. But they talk to me and they shake their head on how we spend their money, the citizens' money. And if you don't know that, and if you have a department that no longer will exist soon, productivity and management, and you are going to allow the finance department, people that are number-crunchers, that can be easily manipulated by people in these operating departments, you need people that really understand how a big police department works. And this is not the first conversation. 94 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 And why I am so frustrated is that nobody listens. Everybody shakes their heads and says, "Yes, we are going to take care of that, Councilman. That's a great idea." And, guess what? Next year we will be talking about the same issue all over again, and the year after that, and we haven't saved a dime. Thank you.

Thank you. Are there any other questions or comments from members of the committee? Thank you, Mr. Dubow. We will now hear from the Mayor's Office of Labor Relations.

Excuse me, Madam President. I would like the Administration to answer the question.

He lives in an that is located in the city on Wissahickon Avenue.

He lives in the city.

Good morning. Please identify yourself for the record and proceed with your testimony.

Good morning, 95 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 President Verna and members of City Council. My name is Bill Grab. I am the Director of Labor Relations.

Please proceed.

I am with my deputy, Delia Gorman and Joe Tolan. We are here to present the Office of Labor Relations request for Fiscal Year 2004 Operating Budget. The Labor Relations Office coordinates the programs affecting the city's 25,000 unionized employees. The Office of Labor Relations works with city managers and union representatives in collective bargaining, labor contract administration, dispute resolution, and labor management cooperation. The office is requesting $532,764 in Fiscal Year 2004, General Fund budget, which represents a decrease of $27,445 from our Fiscal 2003 estimated obligations. This was accomplished by eliminating two positions. The $532,000 breaks down to $474,000 to provide for the existing eight, $37,000 for the purchase of services, and $21,000 for materials. 96 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 Our fiscal '04 performance goals show that, with the anticipated increase in demands for support due to the contract negotiation cycle, it will be a challenge to maintain the level of labor relations training and grievance handling turnaround time that we have been providing. In Fiscal 2003, hearings were held before arbitration panels to produce interest arbitration awards covering police and fire department uniformed employees. An award covering the FOP-represented employees was issued in the summer of 2002. The IAFF arbitration hearings lasted into January 2003, and we anticipate issuance of a new award in the near future. Beginning in the fall of 2003, we will commence collective bargaining for successor agreements with the city employee's four unions, District Council 33, 47, FOP, and fire. The Office of Labor Relations is responsible for handling District Council 33 and District Council 37 grievances that operating departments have not resolved at lower levels with the grievance procedure. 97 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 Combined, the AFSCME District Council submitted to our office 118 grievances for Calendar Year 2002. Grievance issues ranged from one-day suspensions, to interpretation of contract language. In Calendar Year 2002, we disposed of 134 grievances. Another of our service level measures is training. Our training emphasis is to help managers and supervisors function effectively in a unionized environment by providing them with strategies for administering the labor contracts in their workplaces. In Fiscal Year '02, the Office of Labor Relations conducted training in these areas for 320 supervisors and managers. And we had set that goal, same goal, for the Fiscal Year 2003. However, as a consequence of the extended arbitration hearings, it will not be possible to meet that goal. In Fiscal Year '04 our focus will again be on contract negotiations, so we have reduced our goal to training 220 supervisors and managers, a number that we believe is attainable. We hope to increase this goal once more in 2005, Fiscal Year 98 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 2005. One of our main goals, one of our big programs is, we have Redesigning Government Initiative. In 1996 the city and AFSCME agreed to the Redesigning Government Initiative, RGI. It is a labor-management cooperation program designed to improve services to the citizens and reduce the cost of city government. Through RGI, the Recreation Department's summer meals program for low-income children has increased the number of meals served at recreation centers from 196,000 in Calendar Year '96, to more than 450,000 in Calendar Year 2001. The number of Recreation Department sites participating in the program has grown from 109 to 171. Another one of our RGI programs has been the police forensic sciences area, where we have improved the evidence handling and the analysis process to meet increased demands from the criminal justice system. For example, the number of DNA sample analyses performed by forensic staff rose dramatically from 250 in 1996 to 2,584 in 2001. 99 Bill Nos.

030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 With this burgeoning number of cases, an RGI committee was established to reduce the time it takes to store and retrieve samples for testing, and that has been reduced by 83 percent, allowing chemists to test more than 3,500 samples in Calendar Year 2002. The RGI committees have worked successfully with Revenue, L & I, Health, the police and recreation committees I have talked about, human services, and the airport. Potential new committees include are being looked at in the area of the Office of Emergency Shelter and Services and the library. The Office of Labor Relations is working with District Council 33 and 47 and the departments to increase additional RGI committees. This project will benefit the city by improving services, cutting costs, and enhancing revenue. We would like to thank the Council for this opportunity to present our budget request for Fiscal Year 2003 and are available to answer questions.

Thank you. 100 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 Can you tell us the status of the study concerning the savings to be achieved by replacing only 50 of the civilian DROP participation?

We are not involved in that, ma'am.

You are not? You are not involved in that?

It is the DROP report, according to Mr. Dubow, that's in the final stages of development.

Well, I think we are all very anxious to hear. Mr. Dubow, whether it is you or any other department, we are all anxious to hear about what that study reflects, please.

Yes. We promise that as soon as it is finalized, we will get you copies.

Thank you. The Administration has proposed to create administrative service centers. What role, if any, will your office have in the formulation of these centers?

I am meeting with the overall coordination group. Myself and my staff will be 101 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 involved beginning to find which departments will go where.

Will you require the approval of the city's unions?

In some issues yes and in some issues no. It is a very broad question. Where we are contractually and legally required to get approval, we will get that. Where we are required to meet and discuss, we will meet and discuss.

Do you intend to seek the cooperation of the unions? Have you started to talk to them? Have you started talking about making these changes? Have you spoken with any of the unions to date?

We -- I guess I have talked to District Council 33 concerning it, and we are --

I am sorry. You have spoken to who?

To District Council 33 about this. Most of the people, when we talk about these areas, are nonunion employees, except for the clerical staff. 102 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03

We also talk about consolidating the facilities, maintenance, and outsourcing custodial services. Again I ask you the same question. Will it require the approval of city unions? If so, have you already started talking?

The answer would be basically the same. I have informed and discussed with Mr. Matthews that the city intends to do this.

I am having a very difficult time hearing you for some reason.

I have discussed this with Mr. Matthews at an overall level. I have not discussed it with him in detail. I have not discussed it with the local unions as of yet.

You have spoken to?

Pete Matthews.

Is he the only union representative that you have spoken to?

Yes, at this time point.

Aren't there others that should be spoken to?

They would be in the locals 103 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 of District Council 33.

And when do you intend speaking to them?

Well, when Mr. Matthews and I agree that I should. He is the District Council President.

Can you tell us, what is the status of the firefighters' contract, and when do you anticipate the issuance of a new award?

The hearings, the open hearings are closed. Both sides have closed, briefs have been submitted by the parties. The arbitration panel is in executive session, and I believe one is scheduled for tomorrow. When they come up with an award is when they come up with an award.

I am not going to take much more time on my questioning. I see that there are a number of Council Members that want to be recognized. Therefore, we are going to give everyone three minutes, each of the Councilpeople three minutes, and we will have a second go-around. The first Councilperson to be recognized 104 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 is Councilman Ortiz.

Thank you, Madam Chair. You know, this is really very, I think, insulting and embarrassing. The firefighters' contract still hasn't been done, and it has been, like, two years.

No. It expired on June 30 of 2002, it expired.

But it has been in negotiation.

We began negotiations at the end of 2001.

You didn't begin negotiating when it expired.

No. December 2001, the end of December 2001.

The end of December 2001, and you still have not gone through that contract. And let me tell you something, I receive more calls from firefighters who are risking their lives here every day. And after 9/11, they are supposed to be the greatest heroes we have, and so 105 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 on. And, really, I think the treatment that has been going on is quite shabby, to say the least. But let me get on with, the two vacant positions that you are eliminating, have they been vacant very long, or are you just, you know -- how long have they been vacant?

There has been fluxes, been change in our positions.

Could you be clear? Have they been vacant very long? You are eliminating two positions. Which are the two positions, and how long have they been vacant?

One is an RGI position that's been vacant about two years. The other position --

One RGI position has been vacant for two years, and that's in redesigning of government?

Yes.

And that's been vacant for two years. Go ahead.

And the other is on the grievance-handling staff. And that has been -- that 106 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 was last filled in 2002, I don't know when. I have had people come and go. And I was trying --

What do you mean, you have had people come and go? It is not a turnstile here.

I have turnover. Some people go, some replace them. At one time I had all three positions filled in 2002.

When was the last time the grievance position was filled? That you had an actual body, female or male, sitting at a table, at a chair.

I have three positions there. The last time I had a total of three was some time in 2002. I do not know when. I can find that out for you.

You had it, and you don't know when?

As I said, I had one employee transfer to another department. I have had two employees transfer to other departments. And I have hired two employees.

In '95, '96, and the 107 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 Redesigning Government Initiative was created -- and it was created, by the way, by the efforts of the unions and brought forth. I remember the Rendell Administration haling it as one of the things that were going to make government work. And now you are telling me that the one position that tries to make government work has been empty and vacant for two years, and now you are going to not fill it at all?

Go head.

Councilman Ortiz, this is Delia Gorman, Deputy Director. Actually, when the RGI project began in '96, as you said, negotiated in that contract, and in '97 we had two positions funded through a federal grant that were hired to deal with RGI. We still have one of those positions filled on a full-time basis. The other position has been vacant, as Mr. Grab indicated.

For a long time. So you are eliminating it. I mean, it has been vacant, but now you are go going to say, this is a cost-saving measure. 108 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 You have been saving costs for a long time, and it has not been filled. You are not really saving anything.

We have also been under the hiring freeze for a number of months. But I would say at least half of my position's responsibilities deal with the RGI. And I work closely with the person, full-time person, who is responsible for facilitating those RGI projects.

When it was going on and really being fully staffed -- and I remember in '98, '99 talking to L & I Commissioner -- it really seemed to be having an impact. And now you just are cutting it off, like the Office of Productivity, I guess, you know, I guess these ideas that keep coming up to try to make government more efficient.

I think, also, what we have developed, people, experts -- and maybe not experts, but people who are familiar with the process within the departments, who come in and do some of the things that the RGI people did in the beginning. We are not starting -- we started out 109 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 from scratch and we built a base.

It is no longer needed. You have got an efficient government. You are a very efficient running, well-oiled machine now. In deciding government and getting new ideas, you no longer need that.

We are building off a base that is higher than we were back in 1996.

Councilman Ortiz, I am sorry, your time is up. You will have to wait for the second go-around. Councilman Nutter.

Thank you, Madam President. Mr. Grab, I just have, I think, two questions for you. One is on of your testimony, where you talk about another Office of Labor Relations service level measure is training. And I think a different form of this question may have been asked with regard to the DROP program. My question has more to do with training the remaining employees as a result of personnel reductions through the DROP program. 110 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 Can you tell us what efforts are being made to train the remaining work force as we lose a fair amount of senior staff people who have a significant amount of institutional history?

I think that would come from the Personnel Department and other parts of the city. We train in labor management. We train new supervisors in labor management, new managers and labor management relations. Ours is very, very specific training.

Are we going to get new managers as a result of the more senior managers leaving?

Yes.

Is there a training program in place to deal with that issue?

We have a training program in place. We are training at all times. We train, at least we try to get in, twice a month into departments. We go generally and we will train supervisors and managers from different departments. We already went to a department, like 111 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 the Streets Department, and trained street department managers and supervisors.

And you may have mentioned this. And if you did, you will just tell me that. But on , your testimony is, "RGI committees have worked successfully in Revenue, L & I, Health, Police Departments, Forensic Sciences Division, Department of Human Services, and the airport." Can you tell me what those successful activities have been?

I can give you a general idea. I will let Delia give you more little detail.

The revenue department project was one of the -- there is a second one we did at the recreation department. The revenue department, there was a dispute between the union and management over conducting travel audits, which would be having auditors travel out of town to conduct audits of companies that do business here.

What was the dispute, whether we should do it or not? 112 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03

No, that wasn't the dispute.

What was the dispute?

The dispute was over extra money to do it, extra pay. At that point the law department was looking at contracting out travel audits, since the auditors were reluctant to do them. So we sat down cooperatively and resolved that impasse. And they chose companies to audit, 13 and went out and generated a million dollars in 14 additional tax assessments by correcting the 15 company's auditing, or, I guess, their audit 16 submissions. 17

So our public 18 employees generated additional tax dollars. 19

Additional assessments, 20 which will ultimately be additional tax dollars.

Why would we contract something like that out?

Well, the dispute was between the union and management, where the auditors were refusing to do that work because they wanted 113 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 additional money to do it. The department's position was, an audit is an audit, whether you are doing it here or in San Francisco. So in order to get past that --

Well, I mean, I don't want to get in the middle of your labor-management issues. But if you were prepared to pay contract auditors, weren't you, in effect, going to pay more money for it? I mean, it is not like the public employees were going to go away. They are still on the payroll; right?

Yes. But the law department was proposing to do it on a contingency basis. So that if the tax dollars are not being collected, the contractor would then keep a percentage of whatever it is they got, they managed to collect.

Meaning the city received less; right?

Less than if our own people did it, yes. 114 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03

Right. Because when we do it --

We keep it all.

-- the employees don't participate in it; right? We get it all.

Yes, that's correct.

So let me understand. The three choices were: Have the public employees do it, receive a hundred percent of the funds; contract it out, pay additional money for whoever we were contracting to; or have a contingency agreement where if it was this million dollars or $20 million, whatever the case may be, we would not receive the full 100 percent of the outstanding amount because you had to pay a percentage to the contracting firm; right?

It was a choice between a contingency fee or having public employees do it.

Okay. So what did you end up doing?

Had the public employees do it.

You got a hundred percent of the money, too; right? 115 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03

I would assume so.

There was a modification in benefits.

Well, I mean, they didn't keep any of it; right?

No. The agreement we came to -- and it was a labor management committee -- was that, in return for making the additional travel and being on the road and staying in hotels and the disruption, they were getting an additional, a little additional overtime. But there was no higher class established, or anything like that.

I understand. That sounds like it was quite interesting and very successful. What did you do over at L & I?

L & I is still in progress, in terms of, they have a number of projects going that were looking at the license issuance process initially, in terms of eliminating licenses where possible; consolidating them where possible; also looking at streamlining the issuance process so that they happen more quickly. 116 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 And there are a number of improvements that they did make in terms of down time, where license applications would sit waiting for approval from somewhere. So they did manage to speed up the licensing procedure.

Is anyone working on an enforcement program?

In terms of inspections?

Yes.

We haven't gotten there yet.

When do you think you will?

I guess that's --

I would be real interested in that one.

I guess that's a question we need to probably ask L & I, also. I facilitate these and I try to do training on how to cooperate. But in terms of what the department wants to tackle and what the union wants to tackle, that's something the two of them kind of have to work out. 117 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03

Well, I appreciate and respect that. But, you know, I guess the flip side of all that is, last I checked, we all worked for the public. And, so, we might actually want to check on what the public's interested in.

I absolutely agree. I think one of the basic tenants of the RGI has been, and continues to be, it does not only have to be a win for the union and a win for management, but it has to be a win for the public; otherwise, it is not an RGI project.

Thank you very much.

The Chair recognizes Councilwoman Tasco.

Thank you very much. I want to continue with the airport. Could you tell me what you did out there at the airport.

We are working on a Redesigning Government Initiative there involving their custodial work force. One of the reasons we went in with the custodial work force, there had been some proposals in the past, prior to the RGI being negotiated, 118 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 where there was some consideration being given to contracting out. That's not the case at this point. They are looking at training issues for supervisors and for custodial workers. And I believe they put -- they had some input into our requests for proposals for doing training airport-wide.

Not too long ago I, and I think all of our Council Members, got a copy of a letter from a representative from District Council 33. And I also met with the representatives from 33 and 47 to talk about some issues at the airport. Were you aware of those grievance issues raised by those two unions?

I have been involved to some extent on a grievance that I think was filed by District Council 47, but I am not handling the grievances directly. I had been -- I think I did got cc'd on the letter you are referring to. I am somewhat aware of it, but I am not actually the person handling the grievance, if it has come that level. I'm not sure it has.

Well, as in your 119 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 statement, you talk about working with grievances with the various departments. And, as I understand it, some of these issues that were raised were very serious. Did you all initiate any contact, whether it was you or the executive director, with the airport to discuss the issues outlined in that letter?

I did talk to the human resources manager for the airport. And I think what had happened was, I have been in contact with the airport, in giving them advice on how to handle issues and, in some cases, how to address some things that were, I think, as a result of miscommunication. But without knowing more of the details, I don't think I can answer your question. I can find out the status of that grievance and get back to you.

When I spoke to Mr. Isdale, the executive director of the airport, he had called in another labor-management organization to come in to help them resolve some of their issues. 120 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03

We have been down talking to the airport several months ago regarding a number of other issues, and they were talking about bringing in PALM, Philadelphia Area Labor Management Cooperation. And we talked to them, and we were behind them in bringing in PALM.

You were what?

We were behind the department. We were saying we were for it.

Did they have to pay for that service?

I think they have them on contract to deal with the meetings with the airlines and other issues like that, so it was part of that contract.

But these weren't airline issues; these were issues relative to employees, supervisors, human resource area. And if that is your area, why would we contract with an outside agency to handle those issues?

Sometimes departments need an intensity in those types of areas that we cannot give, and they contract out with other -- with 121 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 contractors for that, people who are in the business of doing that.

Well, aren't you in the business of taking care of the grievance, the labor relations between supervisors and employees and the unions? That's what you say here in your discussion.

We do that. But, I mean, there are other departments who do bring in outside consultants for different areas. For example, PALM is active in the Streets Department, in the Highways and Traffic Engineering Division. They are involved throughout the city on different issues.

At our meeting with top management at the airport, we did offer to give them specialized training, seven to eight sessions of training, for their supervisors and managers on what the contract -- how the contract may limit their actions and what they can and can't do. So over the next couple of months, we are going to be conducting training at the airport in the labor relations and the contract, so that all 122 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 of the supervisors and managers are informed about that.

And the human resources department, does that person understand the relationship between the unions and the employees and the supervisors? I understand there is some question about the capability of -- not capability, but that person's ability to understand the role of the relationship between the labor and the supervisors.

I have provided advice from time to time on how to handle certain situations. Beyond that, I'm not sure.

Is there any effort to provide an understanding to the supervisors and human resources director what the contract needs and how their responsibility for enforcing the contract and what rules and regulations around employees' rights and responsibilities?

That's exactly the content of our day-long training session, which we are going to be giving to the airport supervisors and managers over the next several months. Including human resources, yes. 123 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03

I would like to have a report, status report, on that. I also would like to know -- we will talk to the airport about the other issues -- what you plan to do to resolve the issues at the airport and to develop ongoing, long-term resolutions to these issues. I would also like to have your assessment of the problems and what you think should take place to resolve them.

Okay.

Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilwoman Brown.

Thank you, Madam President. Good morning. Last paragraph on of your testimony, you state, "RGI committees have worked successfully with a number of city departments." Elaborate what you have done with the Department of Human Services.

Department of Human Services, that's an ongoing RGI right now that was started around a specialization pilot project that management wanted to do. 124 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 And what we did was, form two project committees, two RGI project committees, one of which was looking at measurement. In other words, coming up with measurements to determine whether or not they are providing better service through specializing. And the other one was a committee around communication, and internal and external communication, and how the project got communicated, how well the employees felt that they were informed about what was going on, and how well they felt they were informed about what resources were available to them. So those committees are still ongoing. We haven't had a final report from them yet.

Anticipated date of the final report?

I would need to get back to you. I have to check with my RGI person.

How long have you been working with DHS on the matters you just mentioned?

It's been about a year.

You close that 125 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 paragraph by saying new committees will include OES and Free Library. What goals or anticipated outcomes do you expect from whatever issues they brought to you where they want your intervention?

With OESS, we have been talking with Joe Mitchell about streamlining the intake process. And, basically, they have kind of a mish-mosh of different ways people get brought into the system, and then placed. The other thing that is of concern is how long the placement process takes and how efficient that is. And, so, I think we are in the early talking stages about this. This is just the last month or so. That I think that there are issues that RGI could be very valuable in addressing. And I just had a meeting last week with Kathy Scott and Joe Mitchell. And we are all, I think, pretty much on the same page about what this project would look like. We have a pretty tight time frame, I think six months from now.

I am sorry. Kathy Scott is 126 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 the president Of District Council 47, Local 2187.

And Free Library, what's online?

Well, Free Library has meeting in labor-management context with Kevin Vaughan, the Executive Director -- the Deputy Director. And we have had some good labor-management meetings. I think there was some discussion about getting some training for them before we pick a project, because they need to be trained on how to do the cooperative process. So we don't have any project identified at the Library yet, but I think they have got some possibilities, and we just need to get some training done.

So is this voluntary for city department heads to come to you, or do you, given your mission, approach city departments? How does it work?

Well, these days, actually, it has been the departments approaching us. When we first started, we were approaching departments. I think it was important, when RGI first 127 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 began, that we get some early successes so that we could, in effect, market the process. And now we have some successes under our belt, and we can talk about them. And departments have come to us and expressed an interest in trying.

And what is your protocol at the end of the process? Are those reports public, public information beyond the department heads?

Generally it hasn't been. The only exception would be the police department. When we did do -- redid the DNA process, they had a press conference about it. But that was their -- they offered to do that. So, that was helpful for us. But, generally, it is an internal report to the department heads.

So could a member of this legislative body ask to see a report at the end of the process?

Yes. Absolutely.

I would be specifically interested in OESS. Because, given the two items you have mentioned, if they can be 128 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 addressed at least for tighter efficiencies, there would hopefully be fewer people being homeless.

Hopefully that will be the outcome.

Thank you, Madam President.

You are welcome. The Chair recognizes Councilman Goode.

Thank you, Madam President. On of your testimony, you talk about the training numbers going down in Fiscal Year '04 because of contract negotiations. Is that because of personnel involved in training will be involved in contract negotiations, or is that because it is in the last year of a contract?

Both.

Can you...

Part of it is, the people will be involved in negotiations who do the training. The other part of it is that we will be getting ready, once we have new contracts, to do 129 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 training in the new contracts in the next fiscal year.

Next question is, in light of you present this as a quantitative measurement, as opposed to a qualitative measurement, do your training programs change at all from year to year, or are they purely based upon contracts?

They change. I think one of the things, if you look at the number of grievances that we have received over the years, they are going down. And I think one of the things is the training of supervisors has helped that. I think RGI has helped that. And I don't know what else. But, anyway, there has been --

How would the training programs specifically change during contract negotiation? Are you training managers and supervisors related to issues that are part of that contract negotiation?

During negotiations, it will basically remain the same. It is after 130 Bill Nos. 030004, 030008, and 030010 - 2/24/03 negotiations, when matters change in the contract.