Yes. My name is Richard Passon. I'm the Vice President for Academic Affairs at St. Joseph's University. I and my colleague, Dr. Linda Lelii, Vice President for Student Life and Academic Development, who is here, and Rob Skomorucha, our Community Relations/Government Relations person, are here to represent St. Joseph's to articulate our university's position on this matter and to hear the views of our neighbors and our friends and, we understand, perhaps our students as they explain them today. 94 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 St. Joseph's position simply is that we do not oppose Bill No. 020482 -- I think I got those numbers correct -- which amends City Council Bill 010695 adopted in June, and especially these most recent amendments presented by Councilman Nutter today, because they seem to us to be clearly preferable to the existing legislation. I will explain this position shortly. But first, however, I would, with your permission, like to address two issues which have arisen out of recent media coverage of the original bill and the various reactions which have reported. Two implications have arisen from the media coverage, implications which I wish to correct for the record. One implication is that prior to the introduction of the original bill 19 concerning an Educational Housing District, St. Joseph's University was uninterested in the concerns of its neighbors and inactive in addressing their concerns. Our view is that nothing could be further from the truth. The fact is that St. Joseph's has worked very hard to be a good neighbor over many years. And that in 95 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 recent years, even before the introduction of the Educational Housing District legislation, it has increased its efforts in this area and, in fact, its investment. We have -- for example, our community relations staff will maintain constant communications with our neighbors. We have informed our students of the need to behave appropriately in the neighborhood through a variety of means; letters from the President, presentations at freshman orientations and others, articles in the student newspapers and in private conversations. We have responded, as far as I know, to every neighbor telephone call or letter. We've hired, after consultation with the Councilman and with community groups, off-duty Philadelphia Police Officers at our cost to patrol the surrounding area and respond to complaints. We have introduced the new policy applicable to the entering freshman class, which requires freshman and sophomore students to live on campus. And we have worked continually to obtain and build additional student housing and parking. We're proud of our efforts in this area 96 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 and we believe that our record shows a university engaged in active in many positive ways. We will continue to exert these efforts, whatever the outcome of today's discussions, because we think they are important. A second implication is that St. Joseph's has not, until the recent legislation, been interested in securing off-campus addresses of our students. And this suggestion also, I need to say for the record, is simply not true. We have for many years sought to obtain correct addresses for our students wherever they live. And in recent years we've extended these efforts to obtain and verify addresses for a variety of purposes which are important to the university and our students. We will continue in this task as well, independent of legislative mandates. Thank you very much for the opportunity to set the record straight on both of these issues. To return now to our position on the proposed amendments. St. Joseph's, as we understand them, thinks that these amendments are improvements to the present legislation. We believe that they are superior to the existing 97 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 bill.
And further, we wish to point out that we have been working for a long time with Councilman Nutter to suggest possibly changes in the existing bill and to react to various drafts that he has proposed. We believe that the current set of amendments is responsive to our suggestions and our expressions of concern. They demonstrate to us that the Councilman has been trying to listen to us and to our students, as he has been trying to listen, as he should, to his other constituents in our neighborhood. We are committed to such a cooperative process on this and other matters as a continuing part of our program of educating students to be responsible citizens. Now, we acknowledge that such processes are not simple and that they are open to a variety of interpretations by different people. We acknowledge that our students and their parents have been concerned about the present bill and we have encouraged open dialogue on this matter, as Councilman Nutter has told you. We acknowledge that our colleagues in higher education institutions in Philadelphia and 98 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania have their own concerns and are developing their own positions and we respect these concerns and will continue to try to be sensitive to them. One final point. We at St. Joseph's believe that the town and gown issues which we face with our neighbors are not one dimensional and that they will require multiple solutions. One very important solution, for example, to which we are committed, is the provision of additional campus housing for our students. We are now, in fact, as you've been told, in the process of planning for the addition of about 400 student beds. A start, not the total solution, to the issue in a residence complex at the corner of 54th and City Avenue, a project which has undergone, as you've heard, many renovations after consultation with our neighbors and with the assistance of Councilman Nutter. This body will -- that is, the Council, will in the near future be asked to support some zoning and land use changes to make that project possible. So that those additional student residents spaces will be available by the fall of 2004 and at the 99 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 appropriate time we will renew our request for support. Thank you for the opportunity to speak on behalf of St. Joseph's. This concludes my prepared remarks and I would be happy to respond to questions.
Thank you. Any questions? All the rest of the colleges and universities can call up together and you guys work it out. We'll do Penn, Temple, LaSalle. Is Drexel here? Anyone from Drexel here?
As incredible as it may sound, I'm trying to make sure I've got the proposed amendments correctly. The primary impact of the actual bill that was introduced I went, I guess, kind of right past that particular issue. And that was, that when the original bill 20 was passed, there was an ongoing concern about the one specific issue of vicarious liability with regard to colleges and universities, whether in the 4th District or not. And that discussion was ongoing. During the time of passage and 100 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 subsequent and during the course of the summer, there were various meetings and phone conversations about that particular issue between myself and the colleges and universities and Mayor Street, as well. And I had made a commitment that we would address that particular issue upon our return. And you may note that this particular Bill, 020482, was introduced on our first day of Council on September 12th. And in the beginning of the bill, under Definitions 10-1801, Item 2, responsible party, the last half of that sentence has been deleted, which reads, "and the college or university in which a student is enrolled." That automatically removes all of the colleges and universities from vicarious responsibility, because you only have vicarious responsibility related to a responsible party. Colleges and university have been taken out of that particular section. And there are a number of reasons. One, there are, in fact, significant legal implications to that issue which, I will state for the record, go way beyond the original intent of the legislation. 101 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 Two, it is at times, as a local legislator, sometimes impossible to know all of the other things that may be going on in the states, if not across the country. As I've said to my colleagues from time to time, I am just a guy from West Philadelphia and probably don't get out as much as I should. Recognizing both the significant legal implications beyond the intention of the bill, as well as even implementation complications, I think at this point in time having that particular provision, which did raise a whole host of eyebrows and caused a number of people to come to the table to have a discussion, it has in effect served its particular purpose. Nor do I wish to plunge the legislation into an area or into a realm in which it was not intended. The ongoing working relationship that has, to some extent, always been in place, but at times I think has become stagnant is no longer. The issues that we're trying to address, I believe, are not just Wynnefield, Overbrook, East Falls, Manayunk issues, but are actually city-wide issues having to do with, how do you, 102 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 on the one hand, promote the tremendous resource that a college or university could bring to your community, as well, in an effort to attract and retain students, we don't at the same time somehow push out long-time residents who are trying to figure out how to live in this new environment. And so for those reasons this particular provision is being removed because of the implications and also because I made a commitment that I would do that. And that's why I put the bill forward -- please. I'm sorry.
Thank you, Councilman. My name is Joe Mahoney, and I'm Senior Vice President of The Greater Philadelphia Chamber of Commerce. And we're joined today by a number of the colleges and universities that are a part of a group that we have at the Chamber called, The College and University Presidents Council. I had prepared testimony but, you know, frankly, a lot of the things that you addressed in your amendments today changed the tenure of the testimony. First, let me say that we congratulate you. We've engaged in a dialogue on 103 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 this issue for quite a while on the vicarious liability issue, and we do congratulate you for the action that you've taken on that issue to remove the universities, particularly the ones not in the 4th Councilmatic District, as responsible parties. The reason that we came together to testify today, even though many of the schools are not in the 4th District, are that we had a concern about the precedent that might be set by certain areas of the legislation. Items like the cars -- the decals and many of the things that you addressed in the amendments that you announced today. We do not want to see an undue burden, an administrative burden, put on the colleges and universities. And we thank you for your willingness to continue to engage in dialogue and to address some of the issues which may have had unintended consequences from what you were proposing. We will look at the amendments that you prepared today and come back to you, for the record, of our feelings on them. What we heard here today sounded like they went in -- you know, many cases address the concerns that our members have. I think that the 104 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 schools would probably like to express their own feelings on this. But we value the working relationship we have with you and with other members of the Council. And we applaud your willingness to continue to engage in a dialogue on this issue and we will look for an opportunity to have -- to increase the dialogue so that at a future date, perhaps in October, we can get you together with the Presidents Council meeting so that you can talk and express your feelings directly with them. We're sympathetic of the issues that are facing some of the neighborhoods and we thank you for your time.
Thank you both for your comments. And I will certainly be more than pleased to have an opportunity to sit down with the College and University Presidents Council. I would like to think that -- and that kind of responsibility does go both ways. But honestly, it wasn't until I introduced the legislation that I learned that such an entity existed. But I'm always pleased to sit down and have a conversation with people about anything that people are serious about talking about. 105 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 And I'm the first to acknowledge that, one, you don't always get it right the first time. But I also understand that sometimes when you are talking, people are not necessarily hearing you. And sometimes you do have to try get a person's attention. And not just for attention's sake. I mean, there are some very serious issues here. And I am more than pleased and prepared to engage in that kind of discussion and that kind of dialogue, not just about the 4th District, but because I represent the 4th District and I would not think on an issue like this to even propose legislation that might affect any other area. I don't know the other areas at that level of detail. I do at least get around. I may not get out of Philadelphia very much, but I do at least know this City. But these situations are often unique to particular neighborhoods. And we also recognize that there are always a lot of other things going on at the same time. Some you can see. Some you can't see. And we certainly have that situation going on right now. But thank you. I look forward to the -- scheduling that meeting. 106 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482
Good afternoon. My name is Carol Scheman and I am the University of Pennsylvania's Vice President for Government, Community and Public Affairs, and I'm pleased to be here today. I very much appreciate, deeply appreciate, Councilman Nutter's work on town gown issues. We are most especially appreciative that in response to our concerns, he has proposed the elimination of the concept of vicarious liability for universities. We are acutely aware of how hard Councilman Nutter has worked to find some reasonable balance and to address real problems. We're grateful of these changes. And in the spirit of this open and honest dialogue, I'd like to express some concerns that we have with even the new and sometimes, we believe, ambiguous amendments to the educational housing district legislation, and especially the precedent that such legislation could establish to the detriment of colleges and universities throughout the region and, quite frankly, beyond. It is not clear to us still which provisions apply only to the 4th Councilmatic District. We also continue to be very concerned 107 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 that other city districts will in the future decide to adopt these requirements. We believe that the bill creates unwise precedents of the roles of colleges and universities in relation to their students. We are concerned that these amendments taken together will create significant administrative burdens that are not necessarily balanced by benefits, and at the same time divert scarce resources from programs that we believe are, in fact, very effective. Penn has worked very closely with our Councilwoman, the City's police department, L & I, the Parking Authority and other city departments, as well as our communities, to improve coordination of services, public safety and quality of life. And Councilwoman Blackwell continues to work to encourage cooperation among academic institutions, businesses and residents to foster community dialogue and problem solving. We at Penn recognize that we are not simply educating the next generation of scientists, engineers, teachers, physicians and scholars, but also citizens. A Penn education involves scholarship research and service. And 108 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 our students choose Penn, and we know this for a fact because we've done surveys, not simply because we're one of the nation's finest research universities, but also because we are in Philadelphia and they want to go to school here. We take seriously our task of civic education. Thousands of our students participate not only in public service, but also in hundreds of academically-based community service learning programs. And I am enormously proud to tell you that Penn Center for Community Partnerships was just named the best program in the nation in the US News and World Report recent issue. We also understand that every year one-quarter of our undergraduates are new to our community. And we work closely with them, our elected community leaders, to introduce them to our communities and the expectations and responsibilities of living in our communities. Educating them on the basic issues of when to put the garbage out and understanding that most adults are not nocturnal. m. We have also joined with many other 109 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 West Philadelphia and University City institutions to create a voluntary Special Services District. The University City District has worked closely with all members of our community on improving the quality of our lives. We are concerned that the proposed legislation would redirect resources away from these productive efforts towards record keeping and administration. We have not yet had the opportunity to sit down with other colleges and universities to analyze this legislation in depth. And I have to thank you, Councilman Nutter, for the amendments you announced today.
I know that a number of them go directly to issues that I'm addressing here and I look forward to talking more about that. The first opportunity of the Presidents' meeting will be October 4th at the Chamber for the purposes of this hearing. However, we've identified a number of specific concerns. It does concern us that the concept of vicarious liability seems to live on in the bill, although it's not clear to me with the changes that you've made on the issue of 110 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 towing, that that will, in fact, get rid of that as well.
It removes it. MS: SCHEMAN: Thank you. We are also concerned that the obligation to repair security plans for off campus transfers a fundamental municipal responsibility to colleges and universities. It's important to note that while Penn has a sworn and accredited police force that works closely with the City Police Department, we cannot assume the primary legal responsibility for off-campus areas. These and other provisions collectively beg the question of City enforcement of existing laws and regulations and appear to pass the burden on to other parties. The amendments -- you also addressed the issue of public disclosure, and we appreciate that because as you, in fact, did say, we have internal procedures that go beyond even the specific license, and we do appreciate your addressing that. We are worried that we can end up, as you noted earlier, in a slippery slope with having the state and federal government following City Council in these issues. We are 111 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 concerned, nevertheless, that the amendments seem to have -- and the bill -- has implied obligations for universities to regulate the behavior of adults, who may be only incidentally students. We think that this is not a good concept and we worry about it. The landlord provisions are also things that we're concerned about, that we need to spend more time talking. And I believe you have, in fact, made amendments to answer a lot of our questions. We are proud of the fact that Penn, along with many other colleges and universities in our region, bring enormous benefits, economic, cultural and social to our communities and our City. We are also mindful and concerned about the stresses that undergraduate living off campus bring to neighborhoods. Indeed, this is the main source of town gown problems across the nation. Penn and, we believe, most colleges and universities would like to be able to offer four-year, on-campus housing for all undergraduates. We urge this committee and City Council to consider creative financing that would 112 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 make such plans feasible. Philadelphia is our nation's premiere college and university town. We believe it is fitting for our City to take the lead in working with colleges and universities to build effective models for new dormitory development and other forms of undergraduate housing, as well as programs that encourage students to contribute to the health and vitality of the regional economy during and after their education. I know that members of City Council and the public know that other colleges and universities are watching this legislation in Philadelphia closely. I am confident, as evidenced by the dialogue we've had to date, and the dialogue we continue to have, and our close working relationship with Councilman Nutter and other members of this committee, that we can and will work together to develop a progressive model to deal with these issues that is based on cooperation and good will. Thank you.
Thank you. Are there other colleges or universities that wish to testify? 113 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482
Good morning, Chairman Mariano and Councilmembers Rizzo, Clarke, Nutter and Reynolds-Brown. It's a pleasure for me to be here today. My name is Tabb Bishop and I'm the Deputy Chief of Staff at Temple University. And I thank you for the opportunity to appear before you today to offer testimony regarding Bill No. 10 020482. At the outset, it should be noted that the sponsor of Bill No. 020482, Councilman Nutter, has met with the representatives of Temple University and has been sensitive to the many concerns regarding the establishment of Educational Housing Districts. Councilman Nutter's previous effort in this regard, Bill No. 18 010695, was amended before passage during the Spring 2002 session to address many of our issues. For example, Bill No. 010695 was amended before the passage to limit many of its provisions to only those colleges and universities that have a substantial portion of their facilities located in an Educational Housing District, which, under the bill, is 114 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 located in the 4th Councilmatic District. Temple University does not have a substantial portion of its facilities in that district. This new bill, Bill No. 020282, goes even further in addressing our concerns. It removes colleges and universities from the definition of responsible party, thereby eliminating the most troublesome aspect of the bill: The creation of vicarious liability for third parties. Although it is to others the debate the legality of imposing vicarious liability, I note the City's own Solicitor wrote on June 12, 2002, that the enforcement of Bill 15 0101695-A will present numerous practical and legal difficulties which should be addressed before implementation can proceed. I do not believe the vicarious liability provisions of Bill No. 010695-A can be enforced unless and until numerous policies, procedures and systems are developed, and unless administrative questions are answered. Temple joins those who applaud the removal of vicarious liability from Bill No. 0202482. Aside from the deletion of vicarious 115 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 liability, however, we are troubled by the new language in Bill No. 020482 that requires each student living or intending to live in an Educational Housing District to notify his or her landlord that he or she is a student. No other class of citizens is required to make such a declaration before attempting to secure housing. It is not difficult to imagine that such a requirement, if legal, could lead to situations where housing opportunities were precluded based on a person's status as a student. We respectfully ask the Committee to consider the wisdom of singling out this or any other class of people. Finally, although the bill does address many of Temple's serious concerns, we continue to be troubled about the impact that the bill will have on the colleges and universities throughout the City and region and, in particular, on the City's broader effort to attract and retain college students. The presidents of the local colleges and universities, the Greater Philadelphia Chamber of Commerce, The Pennsylvania Economy League, the 116 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 City through its Commerce Department, the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania, several prominent legislative leaders and prominent others have devoted substantial resources to make Philadelphia more attractive to students and their families as they make their college decisions, and college graduates as they make their career choices. The goal of these efforts is unassailable; to make Philadelphia and the region an attractive place to attend college or university and an attractive place to stay after graduation. Only by such measures will the City and region be able to reverse population and job losses, stop the "Brain Drain," and compete in an increasingly competitive world. We are concerned that the bill will have a deleterious impact on those important efforts.
No college or university can make the claim that its students are always perfect neighbors. We can, however, do all within our power to forge good working relationships with our neighbors who, unlike our students, do not leave every four or so years. Like the institutions themselves, the neighbors are here 117 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 to stay. It is incumbent upon each institution to do all that it can to ensure that its neighbors' quality of life is not diminished by untoward or illegal behavior by students. At Temple we devote considerable time, effort and resources to ensure that the safety of our campus is intact and to foster positive relations with our neighbors, to ensure that our faculty, staff and students are respectful of our neighbors, and to promptly address any grievances that may arise. In closing, we believe that Bill No. 14 020482 is more palatable than its predecessor. We are concerned, however, that the new bill may still result in unintended consequences, negative publicity for our great City and its colleges and universities, greater administrative burdens, and even possible legal challenges. We know that this is not the bill's intent, nor is it the intent of this Council. Temple University stands ready to continue to work with City Government to fashion an appropriate solution to these issues. Again, I thank you for this opportunity. 118 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482
Good morning, Mr. Chairman, members of City Council. My name is Mary Kate McGinty and I am Assistant Vice President for Executive Affairs at University of Sciences in Philadelphia. I would like to first thank Councilman Nutter for addressing one of the major concerns of the educational community with the revision of Ordinance No. 010695-A to exclude the component of vicarious liability, and also acknowledge that we do support this change. Let me also say that USP fully appreciates Councilman Nutter's concern for its constituents. It is challenging, at best, for any college or university in an urban environment to determine the appropriate level of responsibility towards, and oversight of, their students, in addition to being sensitive, to have their students impact the local residents. At University of the Sciences, as I'm certain do all colleges and universities in Philadelphia, we work very hard to build and 119 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 maintain good relationships with our students, community groups, local residents, and City Council. If there are issues relating to student behavior off campus, we handle each case on an individual basis and then determine the most appropriate course of action for that particular situation. Our administration is always available to community members, and we try to work together to resolve any issues. But we also tread very carefully. What should be the distinction between a 21-year-old Philadelphia resident who, for example, is in violation of the nuisance ordinance, and a 21-year-old student? Should the enforcement policies differ? What is the legal role of a college or university in this circumstance? These are not simple issues and there are no easy answers. USP is proud to be part of the education Mecca that is Philadelphia. And we look forward to continuing to tribute to the growth and economic health of this great City. Students are the reason we exist. It is our relationship with them while they are attending our colleges and universities that will inspire 120 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 to them to stay after graduation and become contributors themselves. In closing, I'd like to thank you, Mr. Chairman, and members of the City Council for granting me the opportunity to share USP's views and concerns with regard to the ordinances being discussed today. I'd also like to express, once again, USP's sincere appreciation for the intent of these ordinances and the Councilman's concern for his constituents in the 4th District. It is our hope that City Council will fully consider the impact of the ordinances, not only on those residing in the Educational Housing District, but on the entire City as well. Thank you.
I just have a question. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Bishop, with respect to this particular bill, I had had some conversation with the bill sponsor and the president of Temple 121 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 University as it related to the implementation and its effects on Temple University. He had expressed his concerns. And I believe that the Councilman, as witnessed by your testimony, has addressed the major components, the vicarious liability issue. I just wanted some clarity. Is it your understanding that no student of Temple University, if they happen to live in the 4th Councilmatic District, will in any way require that Temple University be liable or responsible for their activities; is that your understanding of this bill?
Okay. That's the one issue that I was concerned about representing Temple University. Now, I may come back on another day to do a bill just for Temple University, but at this time I'm comfortable with the language that was provided by the sponsor. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
My name is Mary Young and I'm the Vice President of Public Relation at the 122 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 Association of Independent Colleges and Universities of Pennsylvania. Our association represents 81 independent colleges and universities throughout the Commonwealth. It's the second largest collection of private universities in the nation. As someone who represents private higher education before the General Assembly, I'm well aware of the continuous tension in town gown relationships. We do see that, as well, in Harrisburg. Neighbors rightfully become annoyed when students living in college neighborhoods cause disturbances. And the presidents of colleges and university work hard to minimize the source of friction. However, we must keep in mind the communities also benefit from the presence of higher education institutions. These colleges and universities provide economic stimulus, cultural, educational and athletic events, often free to the public, green space and perhaps most importantly, increase the value of local properties. I am here today to tell you that the Educational Housing District's legislation and its amendments is being closely 123 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 watched by the higher education community around the state and, I would venture to guess, around the nation due to its potential impact on our colleges and universities. I want to thank the author of the original legislation, Councilman Michael Nutter, for his amendment to remove the vicarious liability provision, and I applaud this intention. Certainly, the vicarious liability provisions are the most damaging and would set the worst precedent. However, our Association is concerned about the implications of other proposed amendments as well. I would like to briefly explain our concerns. First, current state law states that college students are adults and that colleges and universities must treat them as adults. This supports the educational mission of our colleges and universities in that our institutions strive to help these emerging adults, if you will, become responsible for their behavior. The Educational Housing District's bill and even the proposed amendments, I would submit, asks us to operate under a different assumption. The bill 124 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 and the amendment's premise is that students are not adults, and that the college should be responsible for their actions. Even the amendment requires the college to provide a plan of action to prevent students living anywhere in the Educational Housing District from violating certain City ordinances. Indeed, this bill may have unintended consequences of seeing worse behavior if you tell these students that they are not responsible for their actions. I urge the members of City Council to carefully consider the message this legislation is sending around the nation. Philadelphia currently is one of the top college towns in America. Pennsylvania attracts more out-of-state college students than all but one other state in the country. And Philadelphia's private colleges and universities are the largest component of this accomplishment. You want to continue to send a message to perspective students and parents that Philadelphia welcomes them. You want to treat these students as young adults. You want to continue to see students come into the Philadelphia area and not to see a 125 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 decline in the economic impact of your strong college and university sector. It appears that you may, at precisely this time when Philadelphia is trying to attract and retain more young people, you may be discouraging them. I encourage you to continue to work to resolve these problems, and I admire your amendments. You've done a lot towards that purpose. For the benefit of these students and for the communities, I would ask you to continue this effort.
I cannot speak to the impact of this legislation, but hope that statutory measures will not be necessary in order to work out these problems. Thank you for the opportunity to testify.
A real quick question on that adult statement. The college students under are adults? 21
The case is actually 126 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 Bradshaw vs. Rawlings. It's a case in 1979. It was just distinguished in a case in 1993.
So, therefore, when my 17-year-old becomes in March and he 9 applies to one of them schools, I'm not 10 responsible because he can get his own loans? 11 And then when the loans for college aid -- they 12 come back and say, well, you still live with your 13 father. Well, since he's 18 and he's an adult, 14 then he can get more college aid, right? 15 Therefore I'm not drained. 16
Nothing against 18 you, but it's all right -- it burdens us at this level. But they're adults when? They can't drink until they're 21.
But they can do a lot of other things before they're 21 in this state. And I agree with you that they can't do the drinking. But I see your point. You've made your point and I understand what you're saying. 127 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482
It's not on you. I mean, the Federal Government and the courts got to get it together and realize what message they're telling us. We can cheat and throw them out when they're and then they can go live at 7 their uncle's or something and get aid. You try 8 to do everything right, $80,000 becomes $20,000 9 take-home at the end of year. 10
It's a thorny problem and 11 we're dealing with it at the state level as well. 12 I mean, you know, there are major questions, 13 there are major mandates that are being placed on 14 colleges and universities at the state level and, 15 you know, it does raise costs for universities 16 and colleges. It does give a bad picture in 17 terms of how colleges and universities and 18 communities are working together. And to those who are present here, they can tell you how difficult the job of recruitment is.
This isn't on you and this is not germane in this conversation. It's only because you're probably the only person that can pass this along the line. Shortly, the only people who are going to be able to afford go 128 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 to college will be the very rich or the very poor that gets aid if you can't play basketball or football. So that eliminates the whole working middle class. I didn't go to college until I paid went myself at night. I said I had one at Drexel and one's a senior in high school. It doesn't look very rosy for the senior in high school.
And that is something that we're trying to address with the General Assembly and we're also trying to address that through the Higher Education Assistance Agency aid. But you're right. I would say that that is what is happening.
This is the last thing I'm going to say and I'm going let Councilman dot it. We need to do what Israel does, and when you get out of high school you go in the military for 3 years and then if you do good, you stay if they want to you stay. And then if you want to go to college they pay for you to go to college in something you have an aptibility for; women, years; men, years. Everybody. If you can't be an infantry captain, 129 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 you can wash the trucks. If you can't do that, you ay be a jet mechanic. That's what we need. Ed's smiling, but I'm frustrated and I'm looking at paying for one and another one coming and it's, like, this is a joke. And we're sitting here fighting about cost. This isn't going to raise costs. This is going to get that poor guy that took off today that came here and sat here and it's only for him. I'm sorry, Michael. It's just not a good time to talk about colleges for me.
Ms. Young, let me mention a couple other things. One, I deeply appreciate your testimony and I am sensitive, very sensitive to your concerns. What really brings us here today, and unfortunately, it took nine pages in this bill and probably another seven or eight in the other one. What we're fundamentally trying to deliver is a three-pronged message. One, we do in fact want young people to come here to Philadelphia, get a good education, have a good time, enjoy yourselves. We think we have a special City here. Never lived anywhere else, no disrespect 130 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 to other towns around the country. I've been to a few places, they all seem very nice. I'm a Philadelphian. I'm going to be a Philadelphian. But as I mentioned earlier, in our ongoing efforts to attract and retain young people, students, to come to Philadelphia and get an education and live here, we cannot leave the residents unprotected. They are our current tax base. They are our working people. They provide a certain element to the neighborhood that is also very important. Now, I've tried to be very clear, not only with the universities in the district, but others. More often times than not universities and colleges don't move. They expand, they grow, but they don't just pick up their buildings and leave. And the residents aren't moving either, many of them. Although they have options. And my constituents, quite honestly, many of them are in a position they have options. They live literally a block, a half a block, two blocks away from another political jurisdiction called Montgomery County, Lower Merion, Bala Cynwyd. And they can very easily move. It cannot be in the City's interest 131 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 in an effort to attract one group of constituents who we want to have here to then lose another group of constituents at the same time. And so the simpler message as opposed to the nine pages is, respect the residents and if you want to be treated as an adult, act like an adult. The colleges and universities have a much more unique relationship with the students than neighbors ever will. They pay money and you have a contractual relationship with them because when you pay you, you give them grades and ultimately you give them a diploma. It is the primary reason that probably 99 percent of the young people are in the neighborhood. It's not just because it's a good neighborhood. They've come to get something. You have a certain amount of authority and control over their actions because you can deny something to them that either they, their parents, the financial aid people, or some bank has decided to make an investment in. We need you to step up to the plate. We've also asked our property owner and manager community to step up because they 132 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 have a contractual relationship with these young people. They pay rent, you provide me with shelter, hopefully air-conditioning and heat in a decent place to live. What we've had over time is a backing away by these various parties that have some level of control or some ability to impose restrictions on a group of young people, many of whom are away from home for the first time, many of whom are in a totally different environment. That's fine. I understand that. If you want to be treated as an adult, start acting as an adult. And all we're left to do -- I mean, this is not one of the prouder moments of my time. I'm in my 11th year. I know good legislation. I know required legislation. I know defensive legislation. This is the last straw. Build more housing -- you've heard about a proposed development project -- change behavior. We have some students here who are going, I think, be at the university for a little while. Now, they can talk to an old guy like me and they'll say, "Well, old man go somewhere. " Peer to peer, though, they have 5 acknowledged that there are some problems 6 themselves.
And I've put the challenge to the 7 student constituency to say, Look, if you're not 8 doing some of the things that you're doing, then 9 us old adults aren't doing some of the things 10 that we're doing. So there's got to be a coming 11 together and a meeting the minds that says, you 12 have the right to be here, to get a good education, enjoy yourselves, be a viable part of this community. And one of the things, unfortunately, that has not come out in this hearing, but there have been other discussions about it, is the lack of recognition of what it really means from an economic development standpoint, from an employment standpoint, from a property value standpoint, and even more importantly, from a student standpoint of what these young people bring to a community. They do make it rather lively; some days a little too lively, but it is lively. They provide community service. They 134 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 work with young people. They do a whole host of things that most of us don't know anything about because we don't promote enough of it. And so the concern, and I understand it, that somehow this may be perceived as negative. If we decide to perceive it as negative, then it will be perceived as negative. If we decide to perceive it as positive, that we're working with our young people, that we're working with the colleges and universities, that they're implementing systems that are going to help these young people understand that all of their education is not going to be learned in a classroom, but some of it's going to be learned in your living environment. It's going to be learned by living down the street from Ms. Jones or Mr. Smith or someone else. That's also a part of your education. And we're trying to do our share at the community level. But we also have to have certain levels of protection. This is a very fluid environment. Last I checked, the only thing that is set in stone is the 10 Commandments. Everything else is negotiable. And we've been in a negotiation over time. This 135 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 didn't start this way. It may not end this way. But somewhere in between as a legislator, I'm compelled to take action for what I can do in response to my constituents and to protect and respect the rights of these young people. There has to be a balance. And that line has shifted from time to time.
Sir, I respectfully say I don't question your motives at all. I just would ask that in this discussion you consider how others are viewing this piece of legislation. They are not aware perhaps of the kinds of concerns you have, but they have concerns of their own and they are trying to deal with the same kinds of problems in other places across the state. So I don't disrespect your motives, and I appreciate what you're trying to accomplish. I thank you for letting me have my opportunity to discuss it. Thanks.
Good afternoon, Chairman Mariano, Councilwoman Brown, Councilman Nutter, other members of the committee. My name is Edward Tureanski, I'm the Assistant Vice 136 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 President of Government and Community Relations at LaSalle University.
I have been mistaken on many occasions for Councilman Mariano. I believe he may have engaged at a point in time in some identity theft which I'll be taking to the District Attorney about. (Laughter.)
No, I waved to him in the back there. Ladies and gentlemen, I won't extend these proceedings any longer, in that many of the comments that I had prepared have been dealt with in part by subsequent amendments that Councilman Nutter has introduced. And policymaking is above my pay grade, so I will not invent new testimony at this time. The only thing I would like to do is to stress that in terms of any legislative approach that would be taken to deal with the substantive problems, which incidentally are of prime concern, I think, to all of us in higher education. I think we, along with neighbors and elected officials such as yourself, Councilman, 137 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 do share concerns about quality of life for all the residents of our City. And our president, Brother Michael McGinnis have made very clear that if the communities surrounding our colleges and universities are not ones in which people can live, work, and study to the kind of satisfaction that all of us would want for our closest loved-ones, then we've failed, then we have a problem that we have to deal with. And in that respect, the concerns we had in any legislative approach had to do with precedents that are set with replicability of legislation from one district or another, from one municipality to another. Administrative burdens that could detract from practical efforts that are meant to build better relations and to provide better education for students and unintended consequences. And in concluding, the only thing I would like to do is to echo what Joe Mahoney of the Chamber said at the outset of this segment of the testimony in that we understand and appreciate the concerns that drove us to this point in time and that we hold out great hope 138 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 that in your direct dealings with the subset of the Chamber of the college and university presidents that we'll be able to address mutual concerns and come to a point where we have best practices in place so that residents can see the benefits of having an institution of higher learning close to their homes so that students can be brought to a greater point of maternity so that they appreciate the need to respect and take care of what is their home, although for a temporary period of time. I thank you very much for your attention.
Thank you. Thank you very much. We've at times almost kind of talked about some of them in the third person, but we do actually have some live, active, registered students here with us who have been following this process for sometime. I've had an opportunity to meet with a few of them and they have some testimony that they'd like to share. So, Kyle, why don't you come up and Matt, introduce yourselves. And after you, we will 139 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 hear from the Department of License and Inspections and the Commerce Department together.
My name is Kyle Bruno. I'm a sophomore at St. Joseph's University. This is my friend Matt Drake. He is also a college sophomore at St. Joseph's University. First off, I would just like to thank the representatives of the other schools for actually supporting us and making us feel like the students' interests aren't being marginalized.
Oh, I'm sorry. I would thank you guys for making our interests paramount and not marginilizing our interests. I'd also like to thank Councilman Nutter who met with us within two working days when we met and expressed on record some discontent with my own university because the president, we made contact with him two weeks ago has yet to return to my phone call. But moving on. This bill, Councilman Nutter has been working on and we understand this bill. We 140 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 understand the community. And we understand the concerns. But the unintended consequences are still consequences nevertheless. What we're trying to look for is kind of a dialectic synthesis, a kind of unity where we can work together. I want to be able -- and I would like to say this and I've said this to my own neighbors, that in the community usually if you have a problem with your neighbor, you go over to your neighbor's house if they're making too much noise and tell them. We don't see that happening much with students. Instead, there's a knee jerk reaction to immediately call the cops. If a neighbor came to my door, I would tell you straight up that I would turn down my music and I would try to regulate because nobody's goal is to get in trouble. Also, with the different parking issues that concern many people, parking is a concern. We live in these places just as you. And I know personally and I know about seven friends, we all got tickets one day because we parked on the wrong side of the street in the wrong direction. And since then, we have, every 141 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 single one of us has made it a point to park in the right direction. So the idea that students are just animal house kids is blasphemy. And that's why I want to continue to work together because this is the only way, I view that we're going to get anything accomplished is working together and not just blindly accepting whatever Councilman Nutter says. As our school said that they supported in the original bill which has seen a lot of opposition. And the reason why we're both sitting here is to try to get the amendments. And Councilman Nutter has been fantastic at that. We view that we have these rights. And we don't want our rights to be infringed upon, manipulated or coerced by force in any way. And I view that for any part of the community. I don't want to feel that students are alienated simply because we are students. And I don't want to have a negative connotation simply because we are students. And I do realize the community's problems, but the only way we're going to do this is working together. The community, they are just as you 142 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 are here, so we're going to have work together because the community loves the disposable income that college students pour into the community pour in the local businesses and pour into like kids that rent from different people. I found it personally ironic that the man earlier was up here talking about how he so offended by the way students act, yet he was making a capitalistic profit off us in that respect. Working together is the only way, and I'm trying to encourage that we all work together. And, you know, kids aren't going to stop partying. And this isn't a huge -- my school in particular isn't a huge party school, but we do live in a very residential neighborhood and we understand that. And concerns are going to have to be taken. And working together is, I view, the best way. I thank and applaud the other colleges for standing up for us and giving me personally, because I was kind of feeling dejected, a glimmer of hope that my own university did not give.
Gentlemen, I 143 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 must commend you for your willingness to take a leadership role and represent the student body that you represent. And it's encouraging to know that you're paying attention and you're thinking about what we're doing on this side of the table and how it will impact the constituency that you are a part of. So having, again, worked in higher education and worked with college students around issues somewhat like this -- and for the record, Penn State is the number-one party school. I'm just compelled to share that with you and to ask you to consider being on a neighbor in a community who has to respectfully endure and respect your rights while they try to enjoy a quality of life right there in Wynnefield. So you're to be commended for your willingness to work with us and help us sort of get it right on this end of the table, period.
Thank you for just giving us a chance. Thank you for working just so dogmatically to try to solve this issue. I really appreciate it. It restored my faith in the representative democracy.
Just don't 144 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 start a web page. We got one already. Count how many words I say. Michael wins all the time because it takes a lot words to say a couple things.
If I'm within 50 words of him, it's great. Do you want to say something?
Basically, Kyle summed up all the relevant viewpoints that we have as a student body. We just understand that there has a homeostasis between the community and the student body. We need to work together, of course. And we fully concede that there are transgressions committed against the community that show us in poor light, but I don't think blanket problem. I think on the most part most students are respectful of the concerns of the community. And I think with the dialog being open as it is, I think we can proceed and really get to a juncture where it will be fair and equitable for all relevant parties.
Just go register all them people to vote and then go visit your 145 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 democratic ward leader with a whole little wagon full on registrations, and he'll talk to you a little more.
Mr. Chairman, I would also put on the record that there have been ongoing discussions, although they were not able to be here today because of their own schedules, St. Joe's University has a University Student Senate. And I've also had an opportunity to meet with the president, Jordan Hitchens (ph); the vice president Ann Kennedy; and a number of other students, Regan, Allison, Amanda, Gail, and Mark. We've had ongoing discussions about these particular issues as well.
Good afternoon, Chairman Mariano and members of the Committee on Licenses and Inspections. My name is Dominic Verdi. I'm here today to provide testimony on Bill No. 23 020482 and Bill No. 020484 that propose to amend the Philadelphia Code by adding requirements applicable to property owners who rent to 146 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 students in Educational Housing Districts and to colleges and universities attended by such students. The Department of Licenses and Inspections does not support this Bill 020482 and 020484 for the following reasons: The bills place administrative burden on the Department. The Department currently regulates the inspection of residential rental property and has sufficient enforcement power under the Philadelphia Code to provide for the safety and welfare of citizens. The bill does not mandate under penalty, consequence or incentive that a college or university comply with the recording requirements contained within the bill, thus the Department may not be in a position to provide sufficient reports to the Mayor and Council come November 1st of each year. Also, the reporting requirements placed on colleges and universities will not impact student behaviors achieve a decrease in public nuisances or affect landlord compliance with the zoning code. 147 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 The bill places a heavy administrative burden on the department by requiring the Department to provide notification of a violation not only to the student but also to the college or university and landlord. Notification to three separate parties increases the paperwork of the Department and will increase the Department's postage cost. Extra time will need to be spent on checking a separate database for the landlord's home mailing address. While a great administrative burden on the Department, notifying colleges, universities and landlords of student violations will not induce students to change their habits. Bill No. 020482 requires that L & I provide the Mayor and Council a listing of the numbers and types of traffic code violations served to students in the Educational Housing District in a 12-month period segregated by the school attended by each student. In order to abide by the provisions, L & I would have to ask the police Department and Philadelphia Parking Authority respectively to run a report on the license number of every 148 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 single student in the designated Educational Housing District over a 12-month period. The time and administrative task will be overwhelming to the Police Department and parking Authority and Police Department will be forced to direct efforts from police to performing this administrative function. Bill No. 020482 also requires L & I to provide a listing of all buildings for which application has been made in a 12-month period in order to obtain or renew a multi-family dwelling license. Such listing shall identify the building inspected by the Department and the buildings for which certificates have been provided. For those buildings that have been inspected but for which certification has not been issued, the Department must provide a description of the violations of building and occupancy code requirements to prevent certification and description of the actions that must be taken by the owner of the structure to obtain certification. L & I does not have the capability of running a report for multi-family dwelling 149 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 activity in a certain year. L & I would need a complete listing of every address in the Educational Housing District. The department would have to do a search by property address to determine if a multi-family license was issued or renewed and to provide a description of the building construction and occupancy code required for each address. This type of search would take months and L & I would have to reassign staff from other activities to this project alone.
In addition, one would have to go through the expansive report and pick out student addresses registered by colleges or universities, a task in itself, very time consuming. And all of this reporting will not affect the behaviors of students or bring property owners into compliance with the law. Students and property owners will be compelled to be lawful by L & I enforcement of the existing code by issuance of violations, deterrence of possible court prosecution. L & I is confident the Philadelphia Code enables the Department to provide for the safety and welfare of its citizens. This bill 150 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 does not carry a consequence, incentive, or mandate to colleges and universities fail to adhere to reporting requirements. Thus, L & I will be dependent on outside sources of information without having authority to coerce colleges or universities to provide such information. The Department will not be able to meet November 1st deadlines if information is not received. The language in the bill is not forceful enough in directing colleges and universities or landlords to take a punitive action against students if students receive three violations in one year. All the reporting requirements add an immeasurable amount of time, work, cost and burden to the department. The Philadelphia Code also provides the Department with the ability to address nuisance properties and ensure that multi-family dwellings are in compliance with zoning regulations. The Department of Inspections will make itself available to this committee and all Councilmembers to discuss effective ways 151 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 facilitating harmony in residential communities with student housing. This concludes my testimony. And I'm happy to answer any questions.
Just a couple. Mr. Verdi, does the Department anticipate any increase disease in the City also as a result of this legislation?
Now, how many notices did the Department send out for violations last year?
If I'm not mistaken, just IN our housing unit alone, there were close to a hundred thousand. I can get you that number.
And you presently inspect buildings; is that correct? Is that a part of the function of L & I these days? 152 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482
Now, do you have computers in the Department or are you still using by cards?
Have you upgraded from cobalt or -- I mean, do you have any of the higher level --
You don't have the computers we have that only work every five days?
We have the newer ones that only work every three days. The computer system we're currently using now has given quite a bit of problems with information.
We are currently working on a system now that by Friday there should be 20 153 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 inspectors on-line and within two months our whole entire inspectional staff should have a full new computer system.
That was some of the more interesting testimony that I've heard.
Just to let everyone here understand, we have been working closely with the Police Department and the Councilman's office, and the different universities in relationships to different public nuisance issues. We have did some stepping up of enforcement in certain areas and we are now looking into with our nuisance task force some issues relating to buildings that don't quite fall under the current nuisance laws. We just recently had a meeting with my nuisance task force that they have some wording that we'll be giving over to Council and looking into more or less an umbrella-type public nuisance ordinance which will help alleviate, not only the university issues, with also just general public nuisance issues.
Mr. Verdi, I 154 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 think the last thing I'll say is I'm looking at my good friend over to the side who is former ranking officer in the marines, and I think that it is quite clear that you have earned your stripes today. You have charged up a hill for God only knows what reason and attempted to capture it. And I'm sure when you get back, you'll find out what the mission was. But thank you for coming in today. We appreciate it.
Good afternoon, Chairman Mariano and Members of City Council. My name is Duane Bumb. I'm the Deputy Commerce Director for the City. I appreciate the opportunity to speak with you about Bills 020482 and 020485. Before I read through my brief remarks, I wanted to personally thank Councilman Nutter for the amendments he's already introduced, specifically on --
Look, he can't take the adulations. Somebody here has to dislike him, not you personally, Duane. But somebody's got to get up and call him something. 155 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 Because I'm doing it if somebody don't.
Well, somewhere in my testimony there is some criticism. I do appreciate the amendment on vicarious liability as well as, I think, some of the other amendments proposed today, in fact, do improve this legislation and we are very anxious to work with you. I was before you this past spring when you had the public hearing on 010695 which created the Educational Housing Districts and I raised concern at that time that the bill was in conflict with the City retention efforts. I believe the same is true of the two bills before you today. One of the major factors driving the City's economy is the ability of highly skilled work force. Recognizing that meeting of the needs of this emerging knowledge industry will be critical to the City's ongoing economic viability, the Department of Commerce has been active in the area of student retention. We have refined this broader initiative into three distinct areas of activity: Number 1, attracting 156 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 students to attend the nearly 80 institutions of higher learning in this region. Number 2, engaging these students attending school here in all aspects of City life. And Number 3 retaining a high percentage of the graduating students in our local work force. This past Saturday, we successfully kicked off third annual Philadelphia College Festival on the Parkway. Approximately 20,000 college students attended that event. This year for the first time we've expanded the format of the Philadelphia College Festival to include a full week of activities targeting college students. From concerts at the Kimmel Center to baseball games at the Vet, we want to introduce area college students to all the amenities and attractions that the City has to offer. This region has nearly a quarter of a million college students. Over a third of those students attend colleges in the City. These students represent one of our greatest resources as we try to meet the challenges of the emerging new economy. In the face of these challenges, we cannot afford to alienate those very students who 157 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 hold the key to our economic future. While I fully recognize that the intent of the two bills before you today is to ensure the safety of the students and other City residents living in neighborhoods impacted by nearby colleges, I believe these bills also send out an unintended message that college student pose threat to our neighborhoods and should be closely monitored. By adding a level bureaucracy to local government when dealing with the issues of college students, whether that be registering every student-own car operated within the Educational Housing District or requiring landlords to hire additional staff to monitor attend college. The bills do not recognize that students are individuals who must be held accountable for their actions regardless of their students status. In that regard we have more than enough laws, if properly enforced, to protect all of our residents in the quiet enjoyment of the respective neighborhoods. Because of the potential problems associated with Bills 020482 and 020484, I believe it would not be in the City's best 158 9/24/02 - LICENCES - BILL 020482 interest to allow these bills to become law. I would be pleased to respond to any questions you might have. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Bumb. Seeing no questions for these two witnesses, we're going to close the public hearing and go right into the meeting. - - - 159 COUNCIL OF THE CITY OF PHILADELPHIA PUBLIC MEETING COMMITTEE ON LICENCES AND INSPECTIONS - - - September 24, 2002 - - - Public Meeting conducted by the Committee on Licences and Inspections, held in Room 696, City Hall, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, on the above date, to consider action on the following: BILLS 020411, 020482, 020484 - - - PRESENT: COUNCILMAN RICHARD T. MARIANO, Chair COUNCILWOMAN JANNIE BLACKWELL COUNCILMAN DARRELL CLARKE COUNCILMAN FRANK DICICCO COUNCILWOMAN JOAN L. KRAJEWSKI COUNCILMAN MICHAEL A. NUTTER COUNCILWOMAN BLONDELL REYNOLDS BROWN COUNCILMAN FRANK RIZZO - - - 160 9/24/02 - LICENCES - PUBLIC MEETING
The Chair recognizes Councilman Clark for a motion on Bill 4 020411.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I'd like to make a motion on the proposed amendments to Bill No. 020411 as read into the record in the public hearing and as distributed to members of the committee. (Duly seconded.)
A motion's been made and duly seconded. All those in favor say aye. (Aye.)
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I would like to make a motion that Bill No. 020411, as amended, be reported out of committee with favorable recommendation, and request for a suspension of the rules as to allow first reading at next Session of Council. (Duly seconded.) 161 9/24/02 - LICENCES - PUBLIC MEETING
There's been a second. Bill 020411, as amended, there's a motion on the floor as amended. All those in favor? (Aye.)
Seeing none, the bill passes as amended out of this committee. The Chair recognizes Councilman Nutter for motion on Bill 020482.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I move that the proposed amendments as read into the record and circulated during the public hearing be adopted. (Duly seconded.)
The motion has been made and seconded. All those in favor the amendments? (Aye.)
Seeing none, the amendments pass. 162 9/24/02 - LICENCES - PUBLIC MEETING Councilman.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I move that Bill 020482, as amended be reported out of the committee with a favorable recommendation, further recommendation that the Rules of Council be suspended so as to permit first reading at our next Session. (Duly seconded.)
The motion has been mad and seconded. Bill 020482, as amended, will be voted out of committee with a suspension of the rules. All those in favor? (Aye.)
Seeing none, the bill passes. Councilman Nutter again.
Mr. Chairman, I move that the proposed amendments during the public hearing to Bill 020484 be adopted. (Duly seconded.)
A motion has 163 9/24/02 - LICENCES - PUBLIC MEETING been made and seconded for these amendments. All those in favor? (Aye.)
Seeing none, Bill 020484 has been amended. Councilman Nutter.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I move that Bill 020484, as amended, be reported out of this committee with a favorable recommendation, and a further recommendation that the Rules of Council be suspended so as to permit first reading at our next session. (Duly seconded.)
There has been a motion and second Bill 020484 has been amended and the bill go out of committee, as amended, with a suspension of the Rules. All those in favor? (Aye.)
Opposed? (No response.) 164 9/24/02 - LICENCES - PUBLIC MEETING
None. Councilman Clarke, back to 020411, do you want to suspend the rules? Did you say suspend the rules?
Mr. Chairman. I'm sorry, I should have taken care of this earlier. There was a letter submitted by Philadelphia University which I'd like to have incorporated into the record as if it had been read into the record.
That will be done. That letter will be put into the record. This concludes the public meeting of licenses and inspections. Thank you, everyone, for coming. (Council adjourned at 1:45 p.m.) - - - 165 C E R T I F I C A T I O N I HEREBY CERTIFY that the foregoing proceedings of the Council of the City of Philadelphia of September 24, 2002, were reported fully and accurately by me, and that this is a correct transcript of the same. RE: COMMITTEE ON LICENSES AND INSPECTIONS ___________________________ Lisa C. Bradley, RPR and Notary Public