civus
Hearing video

ZBA Hearing - January 19, 2022

Philadelphia Zoning Board of Adjustment (ZBA)Jan 19, 20226h 51m

I didn't say that.

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Okay.

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Um, so given that it's a commercial street, is it possible that visitors to the site may

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already be in the area at nearby shops or other locations, which does that take it into

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account into your, into your modeling?

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You mean people who are also going to the restaurant?

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Well, they could be, it's like a circuit.

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You stop in other places and you go, you know.

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Oh, sure.

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People can stop at other stores and be the residents from there.

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They could be walking around.

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That's exactly correct.

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Okay.

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Okay. Was that taken into account in your study?

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Absolutely. I specifically mentioned it earlier, yes.

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And you mentioned about three bus routes on Chestnut Street.

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Do you think it's better or worse for various uses on the street, including this one, to have three bus routes available as opposed to having none?

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I'm sorry. It only depends upon the demand.

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There's reasons why there are three bus routes on the street.

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there's reasons why they have a one lane specifically for the buses.

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If it wasn't that busy and people weren't dropped off that often, they wouldn't put a specific bus lane for the buses.

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If it wasn't that busy and people weren't dropped off that often,

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There's reasons why they do that.

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Earlier in your testimony, you mentioned the word fatalities on Chestnut Street.

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Are you aware of any fatalities on this block, 1900 block or 1800 block of Chestnut Street?

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No, what I read was from the PennDOT that they said that this particular street is one of the highest in fatalities.

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I don't remember the numbers, but I did receive it.

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If you need a copy of the reference, I could do that.

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No, I don't.

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But do you realize how long Chestnut Street is?

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From what street to what street did it go to?

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From what street to 63rd Street?

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Yes, they were talking about this specific location.

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What specific location?

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the surrounding area i'm sorry i'm sorry i couldn't hear you i'll say it again yeah which

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specific location that's what i'm trying to understand um i'd have i'd have to look up in

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pen dot to see what they were using i don't remember offhand to be honest okay so so you

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didn't look at this block for that no that's not true i did specifically mention chestnut

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i'm trying to determine if you did or not again you mentioned chestnut street it goes from front

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street to 63rd street so um but they were but i i'll move on um sure um you were you were

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discussing about west coast uh sports events ending at 2 a.m um

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have you seen you watch football or baseball or hockey

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for uh close to 70 years okay when's the last time a football game ended at 2 a.m on the west

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coast on the west well they because of tv now sometimes they do it earlier right they start

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earlier right they start eastern time prime right they well sometimes i've seen basketball games

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college games they start at 10 30 11 o'clock i've seen it all right check it all right mr

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started. I have no further questions. Thank you. So, Mr. Manione and Mr. Patterson both.

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I have one last witness, Mr. Chair. Pardon me? I have one final witness. Fine. Just to let both

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you know, we have a one o'clock stop, and I'm not going to rush you, but we have a one o'clock stop.

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So, who's your next witness? Joseph Anderson. I certainly hope we can finish by one o'clock.

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i think we'll finish quick okay quickly sir and i'm here this is tanya if i could just mention

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that one o'clock is a hard stop so closing should be before 1 pm thank you chair

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all right could you please state your name and spell for the court reporter

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mr collins oh the vanderslice vanderslice vanderslice hello mr chairman members of

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boards joe vanderslice can you hear me yes could you spell your name for the court reporter

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sure it's joseph vanderslice the fourth cpp last name is v-a-n-d-e-r-s-l-i-c-b all right do you

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swear for him to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth i do proceed again he's a

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a security risk management risk assessment expert.

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I have his CV and the CV of his partner, Russell Collins.

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They've both been up on the screen and they've been provided.

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I just want to ask him, are those two CVs reasonably accurate in terms of background experience?

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Yes, they are.

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And did you work with Mr. Collins on the project?

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Yes, I did.

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And what's your position with Collins Security Group?

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I am currently the president and chief security officer.

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And how long have you held that position?

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I've had this position since September of last year.

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And who was your employer in your position prior to this?

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Prior to KSG, I served over 17 years in security risk management, progressing through the ranks.

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for board gaming and served over five years as a security manager general at Bogada Hotel Casino

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Resort in Atlantic City for MGM Resorts International. I was an authority for the

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operation for the proprietary property security ordinance and possibly command over 250 person

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department, an additional 50 plus contract security team, and was directly involved in

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development operation and training for areas such as gaming, online gaming, hospitality,

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restaurants, nightlife bars, retails, conventions, and entertainment.

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restaurants, nightlife bars, retails, conventions, and entertainment. This also includes property

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safety, risk, and crisis management, which also includes threats and risks in and around the

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community, emergency action plan, security plan, life safety, investigations, physical security

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auditing, first responders surveillance, and executive protection. Regarding this matter,

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I have developed the security plan. I developed security plans for the restaurant headliner,

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such as Wolfgang Puck, Bobby Filet, Michael Shulson, Michael Simon, Jeffrey Zaccari, and Sherry Bowles.

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Are you familiar with the project called Bankroll, proposed at 1910 Chestnut Street?

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Yes.

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And try to briefly describe what you did to investigate the Bankroll project

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and its potential impacts on public safety in general and the residents of the William Penthouse in particular.

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Sure. We use a methodological approach to investigate and analyze the impact to William

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Penthouse and the community. This includes the examination of documents, open source information,

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police data, interviews, pictures, site inspections. We did two both day and night

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and research. Some of the documents we examined in our approach include bankrolls, WPH Q&A,

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bankroll security report, memorandum of agreement, post architectural layout, news articles,

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open sourced information uh zoning site plan zoning board hearing of 10 19 21.

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and based upon the information you reviewed how would you describe the proposed bankroll use

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um well i was on yesterday and i heard mr clark uh you know in there and no pun intended he was

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right on the money the actual use of the space uh working in regulating standards in the gaming

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environment you can you can see that the use and the understanding for risks associated

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Based on the facts presented, our analysis is the use, is development and operation of the sports bar restaurant entertainment and the curation and marketing of online sports engagement.

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The online sports engagement will require staff and that is proprietary contract or vendor to analyze sports games and pair patrons hurting or incentivizing them to an area of similar.

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Jackson, he doesn't know this.

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To effectively control viewing area for various sports contests or online betting opportunities.

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I believe given his background in gaming and security, he's perfectly capable.

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He's commenting on how this business operates specifically.

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And I'm not objecting to that.

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That's pure speculation.

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Anyway, you know.

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Move on.

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John, have you had the opportunity to review the Bankroll Security Report, which was included

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as Exhibit 10 in the materials presented by Bankroll at the hearing on October 19th?

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Yes.

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And as an expert in the field of security and risk management, do you believe that

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the Bankroll Security Report identifies and addresses the possible security and related

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issues proposed by the Bankroll Project?

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No.

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And why not?

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There's no document providing a settlement of understanding to detect, deter, delay,

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respond to emergencies and potential or actual threats. Risks in an environment that serves

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alcohol and promotes a competitive environment with an enhanced gaming experience are higher

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than in a typical restaurant. There is also no understanding presented as to the potential and

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actual risks to the neighbors or the community with the influx of people and use of this space.

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and excuse me what ways is the bankroll uh security report deficient

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there's no apparent methodological mythology applied to this document um there's considerable

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weight the document to the application of adding video surveillance system and cameras

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to as main deterrent to unwanted behavior um this fails to address what is known in the industry

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As a standard, the cameras will only affect the turn if there is a live and active response.

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Without that video surveillance system, it's basically a retroactive component, effectively making them an after-incident review component and a potential of providing a full sense of security.

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As demonstrated, there is no to limited natural surveillance from bankroll to the entrance of 1919.

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There was reference to installing three pan-tilt zoom cameras, where now I heard yesterday two pan-tilt zoom cameras with a 360 camera on the exterior, but there's no understanding on the programming.

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And what I mean by programming is whether or not these PTZs are going to be randomly moving around, or if they're going to stay static until somebody moves them, so they'll have a field of focus of where that field of focus is.

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uh making and there's no trained operator designated to operate the cameras effectively

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making them a static camera so you know ptcs are great but if there's nobody actually moving them

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So, you know, PTCs are great, but if there's nobody actually moving them, they're pretty much a standard camera looking at a certain area.

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they're

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The document pushes off monitoring onto the management of the space, whereas in restaurants, managers can be some of the busiest people.

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There is no mention of management being trained to identify and detect preemptive signs of unwanted behavior prior to escalations,

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which is one of the keys to an effective response.

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The document also suggests security will be in key areas, but these areas are not defined, so it's improbable to get the appropriate amount of personnel required.

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What also is required is operational understanding for each area of the space to assist in the development of the security plan.

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Even in the MOA, staffing is described as sufficient, but I see no assessment to determine the acquired level security personnel and presence.

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More importantly, their training.

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There is only one only mention of security, and there is no emphasis on identifiable uniform security, which identifiable, identifiable uniform security is an example of a deterrent.

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This is another standard overlooked in the document.

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Without doing an assessment, how would they determine the need for outside resources like law enforcement understanding where they would be most effective as a visual presence?

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There is no understanding if they will use proprietary or contract security force for both the space and outside on the sideboard.

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If both are used, or in the industry we like to call hybridization approach, this also presents challenges for training and supervision.

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For outside of the space, documented mention of the cameras and security safety, but their authority will be limited to the space and the sideboard.

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Problems that are pushed from the main entrance, also the emergency entrance, will go to Chestnut Street.

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There's no mention of mitigating the crowd efforts for the space that will certainly draw a crowd due to Wisconsin.

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The document fails to address crowd dynamic and overflow and simply dismisses it.

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It is unclear if the lobby has its own capacity or part of the 490 patron capacity, which does not include employees, contractors, or vendors required to work the space.

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The document dismisses the possibility of line control outside its lobby or other mitigation methods to control capacity, which will be higher than just a table count of 400.

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The document also calls for resources from local law enforcement, but there is no understanding

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of what their duties or actions will be other than presence.

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Due to the design of the resources in the immediate area, there will be sufficient impairment

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to traffic form and thus restricting backup to potential violent incidents, potentially

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triggering the overuse or underuse of the application forced by police or the security

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assigned.

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This document was produced in the understanding of risk of operating a restaurant, but it

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not just the restaurant there are considerable other factors to situate to the situational

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and security awareness such as alcohol awareness gaming awareness suspicious activity emergency

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situations such as fire evacuations fight cpr these important due diligence processes are

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typically associated with a security plan or emergency action plan at this point in the

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operation to benefit not only benefit the business and understanding and identifying risk to the

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operation for loss of revenue personnel and reputation when evaluating risk security does

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not start at the door but must be layered to address detection deterrence and adequate response

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this document does not demonstrate any understanding for these standards

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to analyze risk you must demonstrate the basic understanding of these threat vulnerabilities

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to people property in the process this document fails to demonstrate the basic concept and it is

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clear that there was no threat vulnerability risk assessment conducted by a certified security

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professional to safeguard the community let alone the space did ksg prepare an impact report

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regarding the proposed bankroll use yes we did there's a copy of that report on the screen now

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uh the front page is yes yes and uh just summarize to the board the conclusions reached in the impact

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report. Sure. We concluded that there'll be a detrimental long-term and consequential impact

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to the community in William Penthouse. As stated, there has been no security or life safety

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understanding presented for analysis. There is no security plan or emergency action plan for the

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space itself, let alone the community and the risk factors associated with alcohol awareness,

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gaming awareness, or an effective response component demonstrated. The overflow of patrons

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in the areas will increase congestion and also potentially increase crime and noise in the area.

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this is represented in our report with the philadelphia police department calls for services

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of two other center city locations with similar use

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There is no plan to address the traffic flow around the area, which is crucial to life safety since the front of 1919 serves as a known, let me repeat, known emergency response location for occupants of William Penthouse, who are of an older demographic and residents with physical disabilities.

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there is no plan to address the traffic flow around the air which is crucial to life safety

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The traffic flow will also impact the community in the area, especially with responding emergency services.

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William Penthouse will have to spend time, money, and resources to protect the people and the property, which residents will have to navigate.

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Would installation of a gate at the front of the William Penthouse alleviate the problems you described?

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I'm sorry, can you repeat the question?

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Would installation of a gate at the front of the William Penthouse alleviate the problems you described?

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You dropped down, Mike. I can hardly hear you.

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Would installation of a gate at the front of the William Penthouse alleviate the problems you described?

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No, it will not.

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I mean, and that's an example of just throwing just something at an issue.

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You have to actually analyze what the threats and risks are to that community in that area.

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So a gate, in and of self-offense even, can be scaled in seven seconds.

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So it is part of a strategy, but it is not a whole strategy, and it will not alleviate some of the conditions that might arise from overflow from bankroll.

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What are the present conditions on Chestnut Street on a typical weekend evening?

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Can you hear me, Joe?

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Hello?

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I think you lost him.

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Joe?

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Joe?

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Oh, I'm sorry, I'm back.

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