COUNCIL OF THE CITY OF PHILADELPHIA PUBLIC HEARING COMMITTEE ON LICENSES AND INSPECTIONS - - - Room 401, City Hall Philadelphia, Pennsylvania Thursday, December 7, 2000 9:00 a.m. - - - BILL NO. 000137 - an ordinance amending the ordinance approved January 3, 1992, (Bill No. 1205-AA), which pursuant to subsection 9-204(8)(a) of the Philadelphia Code, designates the locations in Center City at which vending is permitted, by deleting all permitted vendor locations on both sides of 11th Street and 12th Street between Arch Street and Chestnut Street, all under certain terms and conditions. - - - PRESENT: COUNCILMAN RICHARD T. MARIANO, Chair COUNCILWOMAN JOAN L. KRAJEWSKI COUNCILMAN FRANK DI CICCO COUNCILMAN MICHAEL NUTTER COUNCILWOMAN BLONDELL REYNOLDS-BROWN - - - VINCENT VARALLO ASSOCIATES, INC. Registered Professional Reporters Eleven Penn Center 1835 Market Street, Suite 600 Philadelphia, Pennsylvania 19103 (215) 561-2220 I N D E X BILL NO. 000137 PAGE OTIS HAGLER, JR., L&I ...................... JOSEPH BELLER, ESQUIRE ..................... 16 MR. ALI .................................... 28 CHARLES MUHAMMAD ........................... 30 3 LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - BILL NO. 000137
Good morning. The Committee on License and Inspections is about to begin. Will the Clerk please read the bill.
Bill No. 000137, an ordinance amending the ordinance approved January 3, 1992, which pursuant to subsection 9-204(8)(a) of the Philadelphia Code, designates the locations in Center City at which vending is permitted, by deleting all permitted vendor locations on both sides of 11th Street and 12th Street between Arch Street and Chestnut Street, all under certain terms and conditions.
Thank you. Do we have anyone from the Administration to testify? (Witness comes forward.)
Good morning, Councilwoman Krajewski and members of the committee. I am Otis Hagler, Jr., Legislative Regulatory Affairs Manager.
Just a moment. I'm sorry, I couldn't hear you. Could you pull your mike back a little? Your name and address for the 4 LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - BILL NO. 000137 record.
Good morning, Councilwoman Krajewski. I'm Otis Hagler, Jr., Legislative Regulatory Affairs Manager for the Department of Licenses and Inspections. Today I'm here to testify on Bill 000137 which, if enacted, will prohibit vending on 11th and 12th Streets between Arch and Chestnut Streets. The Department of Licences and Inspections is charged with the responsibility for enforcement 9-204 Subsection (8)(a) of the Philadelphia Code related to licensing of vendors and inspecting for compliance with the provisions of the code. In accordance with our responsibilities, the Department of Licences and Inspections offers no 18 objections to the enactment of Bill 000137. It is prepared to enforce the provisions of this bill 20 should Council vote for its passage. Thank you. I'll be happy to answer any questions you may have at this time.
Thank you, Otis. Are there any questions for Mr. Hagler from the committee? 5 LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - BILL NO. 000137 Mr. DiCicco.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Hagler, your office -- I'm led to believe that your office has been receiving a number of complaints concerning the general condition of the vending operations along 11th Street and 12th Street in the area described in this proposed ordinance. Do you happen to have any information with you as to the number of complaints that your office may have received over the last six months or a year?
I'm not aware of the complaints or the actual number of the complaints that we've received. I heard from our Deputy Commissioner Verdi that he has received several calls in reference to that location.
I guess the several are from me, but I know my office my office has received numerous calls from a lot of different folks, from people who use SEPTA, from people who work in the court building at 34 South 11th Street. A number of judges have called me concerning some of the problems that they recognize are out there by 6 LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - BILL NO. 000137 way some of the activity that goes on there. And I'm not suggesting that all of the vendors are causing all those problems. There are a few, obviously. I know we have problems with some of the amplified systems that are out on 11th Street where literally while judges are trying to conduct court hearings in 34 South 11th Street, they actually have a difficult time hearing testimony because of the noise that is emanating from the systems that are out on 11th Street. Some have to do with retail buildings or storefronts, and some may have to do especially in warmer whether when people bring out portable radios and put them on their vending carts. If I can just for a moment, I introduced this bill back in March of this year. And I want everyone to understand for the record, I dealt in the past two years with another location within my district and the problems related to vending, so it is not that I'm just concentrating in the area of 11th and Market. Mr. Hagler, you may be or may not be aware of there was a time in South Philadelphia in the area of around Broad and Snyder when there were anywhere from 10 to maybe 20 vendors on any given 7 LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - BILL NO. 000137 day that would set up their businesses along Broad Street on the east side between McKeen and Snyder. And for the better part of a year and a half my office, with me conducting meetings, the Department of L&I, Sanitation Department, Police Department tried to work out a compromise with those vendors to limit the number of vendors, to regulate the manner in which the vendors would set up their stands in the morning and afternoon, even allowing for a certain amount of time where vehicles could -- they could unload their product from the vehicle onto their stand and in the evening, vice versa, take the stuff off their stand and put it back in their trucks. And for a year and a half with monthly meetings, we thought we were able to reach an accommodation that would allow folks to run a business, earn a living and support their families. Because I'm not Mr. Scrooge. I know this is the time of the year where some people may think I'm Scrooge and trying to harm people in any way and basically limit their ability to make a living and support their family. That's really not what I am here for today and that's not what I'm about. I 8 LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - BILL NO. 000137 generally try to find a common ground for everyone. But the conditions that go on in Center City in this area described, I think, are unreasonable. I think the majority of the folks are out there are not paying attention to the code as it's been written. And I understand several years ago that this City Council enacted some legislation that carved out certain sections of Center City to be vending districts, and this area -- that may be the wrong terminology, but I understand it this section 13 or these two streets that we're talking about today are part of that vending district. And there were a number of licenses that would be issued within this area. And you can see from the photographs that were taken back in either March or April of this year, there are a number, and I think you would agree, there are a significant number of violations that are going on a daily basis. I want to go back a minute to South Philadelphia. After one and a half years of meetings, within one week after that bill had been enacted with everyone agreeing on it, the violations started to continue. It was like we never did 9 LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - BILL NO. 000137 anything for a year and a half.
That caused to me to react to the complaints of the people who live and work in that community as to the condition of sidewalks and the blatant violations that continued to go on after a year and a half's worth of work to try to find some resolution, which caused me to introduce a bill that basically eliminated vending. There's no more vending there. And it was very painful for me, although some people may not believe that because 2 of the vendors are relatives of mine. They're my 13 cousins. One of the guys was the oldest vendor in 14 terms of doing business along that area. He had been there for about a better part of or 16 years. He's no longer a vendor because they 17 continually ignored what the law was and what was required of them. So I don't know where we're going to wind up at the end of day here. And I suggested to you and I also suggested to Mr. Beller, I want the record to reflect what the problems are. I want everyone to understand that we take this serious, I do and I know this committee will take this serious. I'm not going to ask this committee today to vote on 10 LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - BILL NO. 000137 this bill, but I want to get the message out and I want the record to reflect what we want to happen. There will be a grace period between now and the time this Council comes back in January. And if what is going out there today is continuing after, at least for the next month until the time we come back, I have no problem coming back and asking for this committee to vote to this bill out favorable. Maybe it's the Christmas spirit in me; I don't know. But something needs to be done. You can't get off the Line at Broad 13 and Market without literally walking into a wall of 14 hats, bags, you name it. There's just violation 15 after violation. And I don't really enjoy calling 16 up the Department of L&I and having inspectors to go 17 out there policing this on a daily basis. L&I has a 18 lot of other things they can be doing. There are 19 houses falling around all over this City, but people 20 have to join with me in cooperation to make this 21 work. And I'm willing to offer that amount of time 22 to get, as they say, everyone to act in order here. 23 There are clearly some people who don't belong there. And obviously, they're making it more difficult for the folks who are legitimate, and I 11 LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - BILL NO. 000137 understand that. So we need to figure out a way of calling out the folks who don't belong there at all. Recognizing that there are people who have a license and they're paying their fees and all those other things. But there are s violations as it relates to the size of the stand, from what I can see and I think you can observe from these photographs, the products being left on the street. Before the CVS opened there was another store there, Foot Locker. People would set up their carts, their hand carts literally in front of the door of Foot Locker. And it became like their outside storage room. We can't allow it to go on. Because if we allow it to go on here, that means it's okay for every other district throughout this City. And I know at least the District Councilpeople would agree with me, we all have vending areas in our districts. But we can't let one group of folks do things that we're not allowing other people to do. That's what laws are created for. So I'm going to try to do this in the best spirit as possible in cooperation with the folks that are out here today and we need your 12 LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - BILL NO. 000137 cooperate. This is not about just eliminating people who are trying to make a living. But the guy who owns the vision center store at the southwest corner of 11th and Market, he has a right to earn a living. He pays taxes, heating bills, electric bills, employment compensation, hires people to work in there.
He has a right not to have somebody set up a card table literally in front of the entrance of his establishment and offer glasses for sale for $10 or $5 on a card table. I have to protect the person who is paying rent, paying business taxes, paying wage taxes and employing people, in addition to all the other expenses that she has in order to be able to stay and maintain a business. So if we can figure out a way in which we can both live together and operate together, I'm all for it. But I am not going to sit back and let this condition continue to exist any longer than beyond the time it takes for this Council to come back in January after our recess. And it committee make the decision whether or not they want to support the bill or not. But as the sponsor of the bill in whose district this condition exist, I'm certainly going to push for that. 13 LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - BILL NO. 000137 So, Councilman, you're the Chair of the committee here.
Thank you. I'd like to give my concurrence and support with what Councilman DiCicco just said being a member of this committee and being an at-large member of Council. I'd like Councilman DiCicco to hear my remarks. I'm hoping that all of the vendors, the ones that are appropriate to be there, and the ones that are appropriate know who they are, but I would ask L&I to please offer some guidance so they understand the parameters, that there's no confusion on exactly what they can do like what Councilman DiCicco described, the fact that you can't put a table up. And I assume that you can't. If you can, then we need to obviously deal with that if a person's allowed to be at that location. But I think that they need someone to turn to, to go out because I don't want them to come back here and say that they didn't know that they were violating any particular ordinance. So I would appreciate that L&I would convene a meeting, if necessary, a phone number for people to call to get some guidance on 14 LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - BILL NO. 000137 exactly what they should do and what they shouldn't do.
What we attempted to do in South Philadelphia, L&I actually went out -- and I'm not for graffiti, you know, but you got to figure a way of letting people know where they could be legitimately, and on the curb they sprayed a little maybe 5, 6-inch paint line and that says to everybody, This is your spot. And what we also did, we educated people to say if this is your spot, whereever that is, you don't come in today for whatever reason you decide not to set up, that doesn't give somebody else the right to come in your spot. That is your dedicated location. Because if not, you have that battle that always goes on out there, you know, who got there first in the morning and then another war starts. Now, I know in many of these instances that may not be the case. But I 15 LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - BILL NO. 000137 have to suspect that a few of them that probably goes on, where the war becomes who got here first. And then since I got there before Councilwoman Blondell Reynolds-Brown got there, she says, "Well, I've been here longer than you," and she'll set up next to me, and that leads to some of the problems that we have out there. So that's where I think the real enforcement will be helpful and then everyone understand that this is your location, it belongs to you and you can't just set up anywhere along that corridor just because you've been there for 10 years.
As far as I know, Councilman, the spaces are assigned to the vendors. They would have to get their assignments through our bench compliance unit. So as far as I know, the spaces are assigned to the vendors.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I think Mr. Beller who represents the vendors, he might want to say few words.
No more questions for this witness. Mr. Beller. 16 LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - BILL NO. 000137
Thank you, Mr. Chairman, members of the committee, Councilman DiCicco. My name is Joseph Beller, B-E-L-L-E-R, I'm representing the vendors who would be affect by Bill 000137. 6 And a lot of what I would have said had been blunted 7 by what the sponsor, Councilman DiCicco, said. I do 8 want to say publicly, I've said it before and it's 9 been on this record, I've had the pleasure of 10 working with Councilman DiCicco. I find him to be 11 an honorable man and I hope nobody will interpret 12 what I do say as any personal knock on the 13 Councilman. He knows and this Council knows how I 14 feel. I've worked with many of you and I've been 15 yelled at by you sometimes, but generally we work 16 things out. 17 Let me say that the problem with this 18 bill is not what Councilman DiCicco is trying to 19 eradicate because no one of my clients has asked me 20 to in any way expand the rights that they have. And 21 in fact, they are probably more disturbed by the folks who just come in and set up without proper licenses. I have checked and I've checked with Mr. Hagler who's always very helpful, and all 21 of the people who would be affected by this bill have 17 LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - BILL NO. 000137 business privilege licenses, pay their taxes and have sidewalk vending licenses, whether for food or otherwise. And I inspected of them again this 5 morning myself to see if they were current, and they 6 are. 7 Now, the problem is twofold that I see. 8 One, there are people who just come and set up. 9 That adds the congestion, it blocks the highways, it 10 blocks the sidewalk, it's not good. The second 11 problem we have and freely admit is that some of the 12 folks maybe do not know, as Councilman Rizzo said, 13 don't know the parameters of what they can and can't 14 do. 15 I inspected the pictures that Councilman 16 DiCicco supplied to me was. It was very helpful. 17 Many of the vendors said that some of those pictures were taken during a time when they were setting up and there appeared to be extra boxes. However, I am told by the Councilman, I have no reason to doubt him, that some of them have not removed the boxes throughout hours of setting up. That's too long. The problem with this bill, ladies and gentlemen, is very simple. It cures the ill, but it is devastating. If I had a problem with my little 18 LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - BILL NO. 000137 finger, no doctor would say take my hand off. And what's happening here is that if this bill is passed in its present form, families will be thrown out 5 of business. Gateway and dot coms aren't coming to 6 hire these folks. You'll have 21 families, some of 7 these are families up to 4 and 5 people, and I know 8 Councilman DiCicco is sensitive to that and that's 9 why we've talked about it. The 21 legitimate 10 vendors were put there by this Council back in 1992 11 and 1993. They have assigned spots. I'm told that 12 there isn't any wrangling over spots. What happens 13 is the extras, the ones who come in and sneak in 14 during the day and set up a table, they're causing a 15 problem. They're not trying to take the designated 16 spots. And every one of these folks got a letter 17 back in 1992 and 1993 saying, You're at spot 93, 18 you're at spot 94, whatever it is, and that's been 19 honored among all of these gentlemen. We have a 20 very -- as you can see, a very American ethnically 21 diverse group of people who work together with no 22 problems among themselves. The interlopers cause a problem. The real problem, as I say, is the that cure may be worse than the illness here. You just 19 LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - BILL NO. 000137 can't take 21 families and throw them out. And I appreciate Councilman DiCicco's Christmas spirit in not asking that the bill be voted. It may be that it should be amended. Certainly, I cannot in all conscious ask L&I not to enforce the rules and regulations.
Based on the pictures Councilman DiCicco gave me, some of the vendors said they can address some of the problems. Some of them have stands that come up and maybe don't leave enough sidewalk. They say that they're adjustable and they will retract them and honor your request, Councilman. The other thing is that we have here in the room in addition to what I call the Embattled 21, we have people from 17th Street and 10th Street and other streets who are worried, frankly. And the reason they're worried, quickly, is this, Council designated the exact number of Center City vending spots and they designated them clearly and concisely. The problem is if you remove these 21, and the way the bill reads, you would remove them, you're down 21 spots. There's no place for them to go. And if Councilmen in another district have a problem and they adopt the same kind of legislation, 20 LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - BILL NO. 000137 you'll be down to under 200 vendors or 100. Now, that may or may not be for Council to speak to. But at the moment, other vendors who are here are afraid that piecemeal they will lose their spots. In the spirit in which Councilman DiCicco spoke, I would tell you that we can get either all together with L&I if will meet with 9 them. We can have a committee. They will help 10 police the area by talking to each other about 11 violations. Again, I was never asked to approach 12 this committee from the point of view of, let us 13 slide, let us do something we shouldn't do. The 14 real problem is, as I say, if you pass the bill in 15 the present form, 21 families are out on the 16 street -- or I'll change that, they're off the 17 street and they're out of work. That would be a 18 tragedy, not only at Christmastime, but anytime. 19 Some of these folks -- and I just want 20 to tell you I did a quick little survey. Some of 21 these folks have been in that area for 14 years. Some of them, 17 years. Some of these vendors have been vendors for 30 years. Many of them are new Americans and are in recent years. That's the old push cart that our grandfathers and we became 21 LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - BILL NO. 000137 lawyers and doctors and councilmen and congressmen. And it's great to see -- I'm delighted when I meet with this group, as I say, it's a very ethnically diverse group, but they are united. They want to be there. And although it may not look like it from the pictures, Councilman, they want to cooperate. They want to be left in peace. And if the way to be left in peace is not to boxes on the street, they're going to get the boxes off the street.
Thank you, Joe, thank you for your testimony. But I think that goes to the heart of what led me to do this. It may be some of the 21, it may be all of the in addition 15 to the folks who don't belong there that cause me to 16 react and other folks to react with the complaints. 17 I will not ask you to identify anyone, but I suspect 18 without putting words in your mouth from the 19 pictures you observed that probably some of the 21 20 that you're representing are in clear violation of a 21 number of the regulations or codes that they're supposed to comply with. So I didn't wake up one day and say, "You know, I want to get rid of 21 vendors, or whatever the number is, I don't want to have any more vending here." What I want to do -- 22 LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - BILL NO. 000137 and as you know because you and I have been working for about three years with the newsstand industry or association. You know, I've been a friend. I'm not trying to get rid of newsstand folks in the City. I'm trying to figure out a way in which their stands and their business could blend into the fabric and the streetscape of Philadelphia. There has to be some order on the sidewalks so that all Philadelphians can enjoy it.
Councilman, I assured this group on a mass meeting on Monday night that you had no evil personal intentions, that you were trying to attack it. I just felt, as I said before, in all fairness the attack would work but it would be an injustice to many of them. If someone is in violation and he's told once and twice and he gets fined, there are remedies. I don't want to mention them out loud. But Mr. Hagler may still be in the room and there are certainly remedies for removing a vendor and removing his license. And I can't in all good conscience fight you if he violates the law.
But, Joe, let me just step back for a minute. You heard my statement about it. Over a year and a half I worked with the 23 LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - BILL NO. 000137 vendors in South Philadelphia. This bill was introduced in March of this year. Eight months have passed. Everyone knew there was a bill out there.
Everyone understood that there would be hearing at sometime. And these conditions still exist. So I think this is the last -- I don't want warning; that may be too strong. This is the last opportunity, in my opinion, the committee will decide what they want to do, in my opinion, that these folks have to straighten up their act. Eight months have passed and if you go out there, Joe, not even talking about the people who come in who shouldn't be there, these conditions exist today. So for eight months, people ignored it. I'm not going to sit back and allow that to be ignored anymore. Again, I'm trying not to be real tough about this, but I think the message has to be clear.
It is time to realize that this is serious. I take it serious and I have to believe that this committee he take it serious. 24 LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - BILL NO. 000137
Well, it's their livelihood, and I assure you they take it seriously. I think your suggestion that somebody from L&I work with these folks, it may require a one-day visit and I'll be happy to go along and we'll go from cart to cart, we'll tag those who have no licenses and those that do will be told, you're an inch, you're five inches over, move other here, fix this, and we'll get it done.
Joe, if they can figure out a way, and I'll end my statement now, if you can figure out a way to work with L&I and your clients to come up with something a little bit more uniform so there's no question as to is this the kind of stand, without really imposing any financial hardship on these folks to go out and buy new stands, but with the exception of the hotdog stands, the rest of them aren't that expensive to construct, I don't think. Come up with something that is aesthetically maybe acceptable and pleasing because, you're right, vending is part of the fabric of the Philadelphia streetscape. But if it's done in a haphazard way that it's being done here, I think it takes away from that. And all I'm saying is we want 25 LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - BILL NO. 000137 order. You know where I am with corrals for honor boxes and all, I think we need order on the sidewalks. And if they want to be part of the sidewalk streetscape, they have to cooperate.
What I will do, though, Joe, is -- and you can explain to your clients so they don't get all upset. I would ask that this committee vote the bill out favorably and we'll hold it. We won't call it for second and final reading. We won't do anything today or next week. We recess next week. We'll come back in January and between now and that time and I'll even say maybe into February, the beginning of that February, we'll have that much more time and your clients will have that much more time to do what it is that they need to do to eliminate the problems that are out there.
Well, respectfully, I would request that you not ask it to be voted and I would request that the committee not vote it because, as I LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - BILL NO. 000137 say, in its present form it is so catastrophic for those folks, for the good ones --
Mr. Beller, it can always be amended before the final vote, but since eight months have passed and there really has been no change in the manner in which they conduct business, I think the only thing that people may understand is that the fact that this legislation is really looming over them and they're going to have to correct it.
Again, I would go back to what you said earlier, if you can hold the request for that until after the recess, then maybe by then we could have demonstrated --
Mr. Beller, I know you're doing your best to represent your clients and I think you know me well enough. I won't pull anything. I won't do anything without your knowledge. I'm giving warning now. Again, maybe "warning" is too strong of a word, but I don't know any other word use at this time because eight months have passed -- and I don't want to belabor the record with being redundant here. Eight months have passed, conditions haven't changed. There's another 27 LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - BILL NO. 000137 minimum of 30-something days until we come back, probably 40 days before we come back. It won't happen that week. We have 40-something days to talk to each other, talk to L&I, talk to your clients. February brings us maybe 50 days out before any action on the bill would takes place if it requires it. It may not. And if they cooperate and things are where we want them to be, the bill will die. Simple as that. There's no surprises from me. You know that.
Thank you, Councilman. Thank you, Mr. Beller. Councilwoman Reynolds, you have a question for Mr. Beller?
The sponsor of the bill has actually spoken to my question because you did state in your testimony that you find the bill as it is currently written quite punitive. 28 LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - BILL NO. 000137
Given that, I would suggest that you begin to think about potential amendments. The opportunity exist for you offer up what you believe the content or language of the bill could be or should be.
Thank you, Councilwoman. Any other questions for this witness? (No questions.)
Ali, A-L-I. Everything that I was going to say has been covered. But only a few things I have to say that we know for a fact that License and Inspections have been doing a great job. 29 LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - BILL NO. 000137 Maybe they don't have enough to do what they should do being in other places. But I don't see a need for anyone to come out and do License and Inspections job. Let them do their own job. Respect them and let them do their own job. And they can correct things. If things is not correct, they can do it. I believe that they can do it. They have been in the future when they had enough people there, but as it stands now, it doesn't have enough people there to do the job that it should be done. I don't see no need for City Council to have to go out and take pictures and do all this kind of stuff. That's taking other people's jobs.
Thank you, Mr. Ali, and that's why we're going to have somewhere between 40 and 50 days for the vendors like yourself to work with L&I to figure out what it is that is wrong out there and make the corrections. You'll have that time. And it's L&I that's going to meet with you to discuss whatever those issues are.
Thank you Councilman. Any other questions from the committee 30 LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - BILL NO. 000137 to Mr. Ali? (No questions.)
I just want to -- you know, I got a few words to say. I'm the person that you have that picture on the top of the corner, you know, got the box with the boxes on a push cart.
Yeah, 11th and Market. 31 LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - BILL NO. 000137
First of all, I've been a vendor downtown years. There were times I had a 5 truck and I used to load my merchandise off and on 6 the truck. But right now as time went along, you 7 know, longevity has it rewards sometimes. So where 8 I'm at today, I leave my merchandise in a shoe store 9 on 11th Street and the shoe store open 10 o'clock 10 every morning. So it takes approximately at least 11 two hours to set my stand up and then -- 12
Yes, sir. Sometimes two, 15 sometimes an hour. It all depends because the store 16 might open 10:30 sometimes, you know, the owner of 17 the store. So I leave my stuff in the store. But I 18 will correct that at once. You won't never see no 19 boxes laying around, none of that crazy stuff. I can handle that. But I want to ask another question. For people downtown vending that's illegal, that matter going to be handled as soon as possible?
That's my 32 LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - BILL NO. 000137 understanding that L&I will be out again and enforce whatever it is they need to do to cull out and clean out the area of the folks who shouldn't be there in the first place.
Okay, that's all I had to do. I just wanted to let you know why my box was over there from the beginning and why we was just getting everything done, you know, to keep the record straight.
Thank you, Mr. Muhammad. Any other witnesses on this bill? Come up, sir. (Witness comes forward.)
Thank you, sir. State your name for the record and spell it.
This is my granddaughter. My name Richard Lindsey. I just want to say one thing. Vending, as you call it, we call ourselves merchants, has been a tradition in Center City and 11th Street has been a tradition in Center City just 33 LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - BILL NO. 000137 like the Italian Market or other places in this City. Those of you who have been working on the vending issue, as you call it, know that anytime anything happens, you always come at 11th Street. And the numbers on 11th Street since the'70s have been thinning out. You come every couple years with this ordinance, that ordinance. 11th Street is a tradition, has been a tradition for us for a long time. And I may be one of the oldest merchants downtown right now that you're looking at. I'm there from a long time, and it's a tradition. So you really have to understand that. As far as working with you, the ordinances and get everything clear, a lot of the issues, aside from the pictures that you mentioned, are people who come with the card tables. We don't even know them, that set up against Vision Center and different places. We don't condone that and other loud noise and stuff that happens, that's not us. But it happens on 11th Street because you know we have several businesses off 11th Street. We have several businesses that have audio and video stuff so there's noise. We'll do our part to clean up this mess. But I just want it clear that just like 34 LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - BILL NO. 000137 other historical places in Philadelphia, 11th and Market has been a tradition for us. Thank you.
Any questions from this witness? Otis, can you come back up. Councilwoman Reynolds-Brown has a question for you. Thank you, sir.
Good morning. Given the former witness testimony, procedurally what happens with merchants who want to become legal and registered with the Department of L&I?
They would have to apply for their licenses. The business compliance unit, as I understand it, assigns the spaces to the vendors to vend at a particular location. There are 300 vending locations throughout Center City, and the vendors would have to visit our offices, our business compliance unit to get an assigned space to one of those locations. If the vendor is not licensed to that location, then our inspectors would have the power to remove that vendor from that location and confiscate their merchandise. 35 LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - BILL NO. 000137
So then you would have a running record already, a history, if you will, of merchants that have the long history like the former witness, correct.
Yes, yes. As a matter of fact, we do have a list. I have a list here of the vendors who are assigned to locations on 11th and 12th Street. That list we made available to Councilman DiCicco, and I can give a copy of that that list to the Chair.
Will you participating and a part of the negotiations with the legal counsel for the vendors as well as with Councilman Frank DiCicco? Will you be a part of deliberations?
I can make myself if that's at the pleasure of the Commissioner, the Deputy Commission. Deputy Commissioner Verdi is the deputy commissioner over business regulatory enforcement and Gerald Richards, he would be the chief the business compliance unit. But I can certainly make myself available if the so desired my presence to be there.
In the 36 LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - BILL NO. 000137 spirit of cooperation and knowing Councilman DiCicco's always willingness to find a middle ground where there's some win/win on all sides, I would encourage that so that some consideration is given to protecting those who already have a long historical legal presence in those locations.
Thank you, Mr. Hagler. No more questions for Mr. Hagler. This ends the public hearing. - - - 37 COUNCIL OF THE CITY OF PHILADELPHIA PUBLIC MEETING COMMITTEE ON LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS - - - Thursday, December 7, 2000 - - - Public Meeting conducted by the Committee on License and Inspections, held in Room 9 401, City Hall, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, on the above date, to consider action on the following: BILL NO. 000137 - - - PRESENT: COUNCILMAN RICHARD T. MARIANO, Chair COUNCILWOMAN JOAN L. KRAJEWSKI COUNCILMAN FRANK DI CICCO COUNCILMAN MICHAEL NUTTER COUNCILWOMAN BLONDELL REYNOLDS-BROWN - - - 38 PUBLIC MEETING
We're going to go right into the public meeting. This opens the public meeting of L&I. I want to recognize Councilman DiCicco for a motion.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I move that Bill No. 00037 be reported out of this committee with a favorable recommendation. (Duly seconded.)
It's motioned and seconded. All on this motion, the ayes? (Aye.)
No nays. The ayes have it. The bill passes out of committee. And this ends the public meeting of L&I. Thank you. (Committee adjourned at 9:45 a.m.) - - - 39 C E R T I F I C A T I O N I HEREBY CERTIFY that the foregoing proceedings of the Council of the City of Philadelphia of December 7, 2000, were reported fully and accurately by me, and that this is a correct transcript of the same. RE: COMMITTEE ON LICENSE AND INSPECTIONS ___________________________ Lisa C. Bradley, RPR and Notary Public