COUNCIL OF THE CITY OF PHILADELPHIA PUBLIC HEARING BEFORE THE COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - - - Room 696, City Hall Philadelphia, Pennsylvania Monday, April 7, 2003 10:45 a.m. - - - FY '04 OPERATING BUDGET TESTIMONY - - - Bill No. 030009 Bill No. 030012 Bill No. 030013 Resolution No. 030030 Bill No. 030004 Bill No. 030008 Bill No. 030010 Bill No. 030002 Bill No. 030003 Bill No. 030005 Bill No. 030006 - - - PRESENT: COUNCIL PRESIDENT ANNA C. VERNA, Chair COUNCILWOMAN JANNIE BLACKWELL, Vice Chair COUNCILMAN DARRELL L. CLARKE COUNCILMAN DAVID COHEN COUNCILMAN W. WILSON GOODE, JR. COUNCILMAN JAMES F. KENNEY COUNCILMAN MICHAEL A. NUTTER COUNCILMAN ANGEL L. ORTIZ COUNCILMAN FRANK RIZZO, JR. COUNCILWOMAN MARIAN B. TASCO - - - V A R A L L O Incorporated Litigation Support Services Eleven Penn Center 1835 Market Street, Suite 600 Philadelphia, PA 19103 (215) 561-2220 (215) 567-2670 2 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
Good morning, everyone. This is the continued public hearing of the Committee of the Whole regarding Bill Nos. 030009, 030012, 030013, Resolution No. 030030, Bill 6 Nos. 030004, 030008, 030010, also Bill Nos. 030002, 030003, 030005, and 030006. Mr. Dubow, would you please come to the table? Good morning.
Good morning. I have two things. One is testimony on the carry-forward on Bill No. 030002 and Bill No. 030003. Before I start, I wanted to say that PICA has asked that we redo.
I'm sorry. I didn't hear you. Would you move the microphone closer to you, please?
Yes. I have testimony on amendment to Bill 20 No. 030002 and Bill No. 030003. Before I give that testimony though, I wanted to let you know that PICA has asked that we redo the five-year plan to show the impact of the state budget.
Sorry. I can't hear a single word. 3 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
PICA has asked that we redo the five-year plan to show the impact of the state budget cuts and the impact of the fire arbitration award. We hope to have that process done by the end of next week. We are going through the numbers now to see how that would affect our budget and plan.
The fire award is approximately $43 million over the life of the plan. It looks like the state budget cuts are about a hundred million dollars a year. Now I would like to go into the testimony on the carry-forward.
I appear before you today to offer testimony on Bill Nos. 030002 and 030003, 4 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole which propose to establish the City's FY 2004 capital budget and 2004-2009 capital programs. We are proposing modifications to add additional appropriations to carry forward all unobligated funding from prior years. In the proposed amendment all unobligated --
Mr. Dubow, do you have copies of the amendments, because we don't have them?
Yes. I'm told they were distributed to Council members this morning.
All right. It 5 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole was just handed to me. Please proceed.
In the proposed amendment all unobligated, general obligation, PICA and revenue bond capital appropriations have been carried forward from prior years with few exceptions. These exceptions fall mainly into three categories, unspent appropriations for which projects have been completed underbudget, aviation projects that were either funded with other sources or not approved by the airlines, and water payroll costs, which do not carry forward. There are a large number of projects that have been included in the carry-forward budget at the direct request of City Council members. All the remaining funding for these projects has been included in the carry-forward amendment proposed today. These recommendations do not include the lapsing of any unencumbered funding for projects of this nature, whether or not those projects have been completed. Other than the addition of the carry-forward appropriations, there are two proposed modifications to Bill Nos. 030002 and 030003. The first includes a proposed appropriation of $687,000 6 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole from prior year available balances for completed Council-designated projects. With the approval and authorization of the District Council Members, this funding can be used for other recreation projects within their district. The second request and modification is to delete the federal, state and other government off-budget funding amounts for transit projects erroneously included in Bill No. 030003. These projects are not technically funded with City appropriations, so they should not be included in the ordinance. I would be happy to answer any questions Council may have related to the recommended capital budget and program.
I'm sure Council members would like to review this for a moment. Are there any questions from members of the committee for Mr. Dubow? Councilwoman Tasco.
I'm just reading that. Would you explain to me what you are requesting again? 7 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
We are requesting to carry forward appropriations from earlier years so that money for projects that haven't been completed can be spent in '04.
So are any of the appropriations going from projects other than the ones they were appropriated for?
No, this is carrying them forward. The only changes, there is the 687,000 from earlier year projects in Council districts, but those changes are being done in consultation with the District Council Members so those changes won't happen without your approval.
Mr. Dubow, isn't this something that we do every year?
Thank you, Madam President. Mr. Dubow, during the capital budget I seem to recall raising the question regarding the Wynnefield Recreation Center and I believe the response at the time was that it would end up in the carry-forward budget which we have now received. So can you tell me where it is in the document we received, the page number?
Just one second. It's in the recreation department underlying 90F. It's part of the $270,000 shown there.
What page, Mr. Dubow? Are we in FY '04? Are we in the budget or the plan?
We have not figured out which book we are in yet. 9 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
In the budget. . It's in Line 86-K. It's part of the $270,000 and it is 70,000 of that 270.
You would not have. That's why -- you would know it when the book came out because it has a separate line in the glossy. You wouldn't know it from this without the explanation I just gave.
Okay. And how is it going to magically transfer into a line in the book?
The book will break out that 86-K and show the components of it into subprojects.
So what's the difference between, I guess, that and Line 86-I, which specifically gives a name to a new entity versus being a part of an innocuous line that no one can figure out what it was?
There is no magical reason. 10 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole We could split that out.
Thank you. Did we have a problem before? It seems like it was so long ago. Lancaster Avenue, was that already listed separately in the green book as a project of its own? Isn't that also a carry-forward?
I'm Gary Jastrzab from the City Planning Commission. In the recommended there was a separate line item for -- a subproject for Lancaster Avenue and it is included in both the budget -- or in the program budgeted -- programmed for 2005.
In the document that you have before you it is part of project --
Okay. And it will stay that way in the final? 11 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
Thanks. I'm just trying to keep track. Thank you, Madam Chair.
You're welcome. Are there any other questions of Mr. Dubow? The Chair recognizes Councilman Cohen.
In what amendment is the carry-forward proposal you have spoken to us about covered? What amendment covers that?
It's the amendment that was handed out this morning. There was a packet handed out.
There are two amendments, one for the budget year and one for the whole program.
There are two, the proposed amendment to Bill No. 030003 I think is what the top 12 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole of the packet shows, and there is another one that says "Proposed Amendment to 030002."
So there is no 5 reference made in the amendment to a carry-forward proposal; you merely incorporate the amendment by adding the dollar figure, changing the dollar figure.
So as in the previous question, one would not know that this amendment includes a carry-forward proposal.
You would know that it is amending the capital budget and see what the new numbers were.
Secondly, can you inform us generally of the role of the Planning Commission in developing the budget? I notice the gentleman coming from the Planning Commission, and my memory may be a built faulty, but that's kind of a new experience for me to have the budget director call on the Planning Commission. So would you tell us what is the role generally of the Planning Commission in formulating the budget?
By City charter the City 13 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole Planning Commission is responsible for preparing a recommended capital budget and program each year that is submitted to the Mayor and then transferred to City Council for their approval. This process today moves forward all of the projects in fiscal '03 into the fiscal '04 recommended budget, so it's an omnibus. What you have before you today is essentially an omnibus piece of legislation that moves forward all of the unexpended funds in projects in previous years. So the Planning Commission's role is to prepare the recommended capital budget and program and to --
So if Council Members wish to impact on the capital program or the capital 14 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole budget, it might be wise for us to be in communication with the Planning Commission as well as the budget director?
It is good to learn things even if it takes a long time to learn them. Thank you very much.
Thank you. Any other questions from members of the committee? Thank you, Mr. Dubow. I believe I saw Mr. Isdell here from the airport. I'm sure he has to get back to work. Would you please approach? Look at that snow. We want you out of here. Good morning.
I believe some of the Council members had asked that the airport be called back. Does anyone have any questions of Mr. Isdell? Councilman Cohen.
Thank you, Madam President. I read a couple of days ago in the 15 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole Inquirer about the opening of the new international lanes of traffic.
I forget what you call them at the air terminals. There are a large number of them?
That project is part of a terminal expansion project that included two new terminals, one that we opened in 2001 and the one that is scheduled to open later this month. That was financed by a combination of passenger facility charges and airline rates and charges, about 75, 16 percent, in that order. 17
Yes, passenger facility 20 charges. That's the $4.50 surcharge that is added 21 to the ticket price. It's a user fee, if you will. 22
Was that a user fee 23 on all flights or just international flights? 24
It's a user fee on all 25 flights, all tickets, domestic and international. 16 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
The terminal that we are opening this month is an international terminal, that is correct. It can be used, if necessary, for domestic traffic, but it was designed and it will be used primarily for international flights.
Who makes the decisions to levy the additional charge, the $4.75 you are referring to?
The airport and the City do that and the Federal Government authorizes the ability -- the enabling legislation for airports to add that fee to ticket prices comes from Congress and then each individual airport has to go through an approval process, which we have done successfully for about the last 12 years I believe.
With respect to the payments, this is all financed by bonds?
Yes. We did a series of bonds through the Philadelphia Authority for Industrial Development. 17 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
The airlines support the bonds through the rates and charges and the airport supports the bonds through the passenger facility charges.
But who makes the payment? Who has the legal responsibility to pay the bonds when due?
I'm going to ask my deputy director for finance administration to help me out with that. I think it's a complicated answer. This is Ed Anastasi, deputy director for finance and administration. Can you answer that?
Yes, I can. The debt service on the bonds issued by the Philadelphia Authority for Industrial Development is paid for by the Philadelphia Authority for Industrial Development. At the time those bonds were issued, the City issued -- the City's airport issued general airport revenue bonds over the PAID so that the PAID bond debt service payments are really securitized by the debt service on the airport general revenue bonds and that the 18 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole revenues that pay the debt service come from the landing fees that the airlines pay. It's incorporated in their landing fee rate. It comes also from terminal building rentals that the airlines pay. They pay a certain amount per square foot and that per square foot rental charge includes the debt service as well as the operating expenses associated with the new terminal.
How is the ability to make payments on those bonds impacted by the general decline in air traffic and, you know, caused possibly by the economic recession, possibly by the war, possibly by SARS? All of those items are mentioned in separate columns that very same day and caused me to be concerned. Also impacted by the bankruptcy of U.S. Airways, which is the main user of our airport. So it raised the question in my mind is there going to be any potential liability to the City of Philadelphia as a result of a possible problem with respect to meeting payments.
No. Clearly all of those factors had a negative impact on our revenues as they have on the general economy and particularly on the airline industry, but before we sold the bonds 19 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole we had to do very detailed feasibility studies that looked at worst case scenarios including U.S. Airways bankruptcy or potential liquidation, and we would not have been able to do the financing without being able to demonstrate, primarily because of the strong origination market that we have here in the Philadelphia area, that our airport would be secure and that a certain minimum level of activity and revenue associated with that activity would be ensured into the future despite some of these other economic factors such as the SARS and the bankruptcy process which U.S. Airways has recently successfully emerged from. I didn't know if you wanted to add anything to that.
That's correct. And I think the one thing is that we have been pretty fortunate here in Philadelphia. When you compare our traffic results for, for instance, calendar 2002, we were up about one-tenth of one percent. Now, if you looked at the nationwide average in passengers for calendar 2002 the nation as a whole was down about 4.7 percent. So I think that bodes well for the way we have been able to recover from, 20 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole for one thing, September 11 and the way U.S. Airways has been able to keep afloat during this process in which they have been doing everything that they could to emerge from bankruptcy by March 31, which they have been able to do.
We have done very well relative to the national average for airports and particularly relative to international passengers. We have continued to grow our international passenger base right through 2001, 2002. The numbers we just got indicate we set a new record for international passengers of 3.2 million. And that particular aspect of our passenger activity continues to grow even in the face of these negative economic indicators.
If it turned out that despite your careful analysis and preplanning, if it turned out that Philadelphia was impacted to the same extent as most of the rest of the nation and it was impossible to meet the payments, who would be the ultimate payer, PAID?
The ultimate payer of the bonds is paid, but the ultimate payer of the debt service are the airlines collectively that operate 21 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole out of Philadelphia, not only U.S. Airways, but the other signatories to the airline use and lease agreement.
Can you tell me again the difference between the two ultimate kinds of payers? What's the difference between the ultimate payment on the bonds and the ultimate payment on the debt service?
The ultimate payment on the bonds is PAID, as we said, the Philadelphia Authority for Industrial Development, but PAID is really not responsible for raising the revenues to pay the debt service. That responsibility falls to the airport, and we have the -- and the airlines, since they have approved this international terminal project, are responsible for meeting those debt service payments through their rates and charges.
So on the debt service there would never be an ultimate responsibility by the City of Philadelphia?
That is correct because the City is not responsible for general airport revenue bonds like they are responsible for paying debt service on the general obligation bonds. 22 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
With respect to the bonds themselves where PAID has the basic responsibility, doesn't the City back up the PAID bonds?
Yes, they do. The City's airport/aviation fund backs up the City revenue bonds but not the City's general fund, and the way we are able to do that is because the aviation fund -- the contract between the airlines and the City for a use and lease of the airport provides for the airlines through their rates and charges to make whole the aviation fund and the aviation fund is the fund responsible and obligated to make the debt service payment.
If I might add, Councilman, if you have read in recent days the situation that the Pittsburgh airport is confronted with where U.S. Airways has indicated a significant reduction in their activity, they have it at least very similar to ours, which would require the airport to recapture the necessary revenue from the other airline tenants. That's the way the leases are written. It is a residual type of agreement which requires the airlines as a group to cover that debt 23 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole service, and the only way you would have -- the worst worst case scenario would be if every airline in the United States went out of business, which I don't think is a reasonable prediction.
Not unless you pay full attention to the stories that the airlines are issuing. Don't they practically threaten that these days in their effort to get the amount of money they are seeking from Congress? Haven't they just gotten about $3 billion and isn't the President purportedly unhappy about the amount that the House and Senate are considering?
I think you are 100 percent correct on those statements, yes, sir.
Well, I don't want to take any more time than this, but you are saying it is very unlikely, or are you saying that under no 19 circumstances would the City of Philadelphia itself be responsible for payment of either debt service or the bonds?
Under no circumstances is the general fund responsible for making payment of any of the debt service on not only those bonds but for all other general airport revenue bonds that 24 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole have been issued.
If I understand what you are saying, it's a reassuring thought. Thanks very much.
Thank you. Any other questions from members of the committee? The Chair recognizes Councilwoman Tasco.
Can you describe the contracting process that was used for the Sky Sites initiative? What was your minority participation and goals and were they achieved?
That's a contract that we have. It is a concession contract for the sale of advertising inside the terminal buildings. That was done through a request for proposals. I think that was initiated back in 1999. The award was made in the year 2000 to -- the company Sky Sites has now been acquired by a larger global company called J.C. Decaux -- I think it is D-E-C-A-U-X -- and that contract required certain percentages of 25 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole participation. I believe that -- I don't have the detail in front of me. I know that I could get that for you very readily, but I believe that the initial DBE partner or one of the ones that was initially proposed was not able to reach a satisfactory agreement with the principal or the prime company and that a second company was substituted. That required approval by the Minority Business Enterprise Council, which they did achieve, and it is our understanding that they are meeting their commitments for the percentages of participation that were agreed to in that contract. That would be an easy thing for me to get up-to-the-minute details for you. I don't believe we have them with us today because we weren't prepared for that question.
What I would like to know is once these companies enter into a contract with minority companies, that the contract is satisfied rather than just have a paper participation. To what extent does the minority company participate in the contract? Do they actually get business? And so even though the first company may not have been successful in negotiating the contract with the major contractor, I would like 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole to know who the second subcontractor was and did that contract the subcontractor got have full participation? Did they make any money, or is it just that they were on paper a participant but not necessarily fulfilled, granted any actual work, did any actual work, and how much was the contract, how much money did they actually make?
I can say that one of the subs under Sky Sites was Terry Crockett, an architect, local architect, and I can tell you that he has been working -- I was with him on Friday going through the new international terminal on the planning, design and installation of the advertising that will be placed in that building. So I know that he is one minority sub who has been utilized, but to give you specific numbers and percentages, I think we need to get back to you on that. I would like to add, if I may, just that as a general practice at the airport over the last two years we have scheduled -- we do monthly contract review meetings. We review all of our professional services contracts and we also look at our concession contracts such as the one you are asking about. When we find a prime contractor that 27 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole is failing to live up to their commitments, we have a series of steps that we take. Initially we write a letter. If there is no remedial followup, we bring the principals of the company, of the prime, in for a personal meeting with myself. I sit in at those meetings. We remind them of their commitments. Many times there is enough time -- because we do this in a timely way, there is enough time for them to correct their deficiencies before the fiscal year is over. In the event they don't, we have the ability to terminate their contracts or, if it is a multiyear contract, to not renew, so we try to be aggressive. We work very closely with Mr. Roundtree and the Minority Business Enterprise Council and I think that there is always more work to be done in that area, but we would like to be a leader in the enforcement of the process, not just the initial commitment.
Thank you. And I would also like to know what happened to the first contract, subcontract, and why that didn't work out.
Okay. We would be happy to put that together. Should we send that to the 28 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole President's office?
I forgot to mention too that we are also monitored in the concession program in particular. The FAA requires us to submit an annual report that updates them on our participation, achievements relative to our initial goals, and we have done quite well in that area.
Thank you very much and I appreciate your effort in trying to stay on top of it and monitor it because that is important because what feedback we get from some of the minority contractors is that they get these contracts and then they don't actually do any work. It's just, you know, the company says, "I fulfill my commitment," but in the end they do not engage the subcontractor on the project and therefore the contractor does not make any money and does not do any of the work, and so I think the monitoring is extremely important and I hope that you will stay on it and strongly, strongly enforce that.
As you know, the 29 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole commitment of this Council is to make sure that things change. It is not business as usual.
Can you describe to me the post 9/11 hiring process for Civil Service employees at the airport? What were the difficulties that you have had and will any of these problems affect the new international terminal?
Yes. The biggest change is the requirement now for a ten-year criminal history records check for every employee. We had to do those checks on all 15,000 of the existing employees working at the airport. We have currently a staff of about 675 people that work for the City. They were all subjected to those background checks. The principal area right now relative to the new terminal where we have encountered problems is relative to our custodial staff. We currently have approximately 150 custodial vacancies. A large number of them, over a hundred, were budgeted and allocated specifically for the opening of the new building. We do have the largest inhouse custodial staff of any City agency and we felt that our 30 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole objective was to continue to use the inhouse capability by hiring additional staff for the new building. Remember, this building is 800,000 square feet. If you took the entire airport right now and cut it in half, this one new terminal is bigger than half of those other six terminals. So there is a large amount of terrazzo that has to be cleaned, the floors, many new bathrooms, and an enormous amount of glass that has to be cleaned in the building, interior and exterior. So we have been working with the central personnel department since about a year ago to address the shortfall. We were already short by about 50 positions in our custodial unit for the existing six terminals. We were successful in having a new specification written for the Custodial Worker 1 class. A test was given last summer. We got a Civil Service list late last year. We have been aggressively interviewing from that list, but we are still carrying large numbers of vacancies, and one of the big factors, if you look at the last hundred people that we got from the Civil Service list, we were only able to hire about one-third of that number, say about 30 to 33 people. A large 31 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole number of the candidates were eliminated by the criminal history records check. So that is not a good percentage obviously. We have currently scheduled very large certifications from the remaining people on the eligible list. Over the next several weeks we will be interviewing 100 people I think, two weeks from now, another 50 people a week after that and some large groups of candidates in May also. That will be after the terminal opens unfortunately. We are looking at the possibility, although we have not initiated any paperwork yet, of a temporary outsourcing for some custodial help and we have been working through the Mayor's Office of Labor Relations to ensure that we do that in a way that is in strict conformance with the contract and that hopefully, you know, we will be copasetic with District Council 33. I think the main concern is that that would simply be a temporary measure to get us through this period until we can fill all of our vacancies. So we are attacking the problem both from inhouse and outsourcing, and we have also been working closely with Mr. Dubow and the other City 32 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole agencies that have custodial workers who might potentially be available through downsizing in the general fund departments. We are very anxious, if they become available, to get them down to the airport for interviews and, if possible, to hire them as well.
I know we discussed this with you prior to today and my concern is that you are looking basically -- if a company comes in and you outsource this service, would the employees have to be City residents?
So what is the guaranty that you get a different pool of people if you outsource?
I think whoever we would ask to bring in from the outside, to bring in candidates, would be confronted with a lot of the same problems that the Civil Service system has and it is true they would not be confronted with the residency requirement, which does not really sit well with me personally, but for a temporary situation it may be something that we have to 33 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole consider.
So in the meantime you would still continue to search and test through the Civil Service process.
Absolutely. There are approximately 500 people on the current Civil Service list. We would like to get them in as quickly as possible for interviews and hopefully fill all of our vacancies and then we would avoid the outsourcing entirely.
What are some of the restrictions -- in the background check what is the criminal -- what criminal categories would prevent someone from being hired for the custodial position? Is it just any criminal, any arrests, or are there limitations, are there certain crimes, just what?
There is a list of disqualifying crimes that is published by the Transportation Security Administration, and they are essentially almost any felony disqualifies you and 34 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole that's because the nature of the custodial worker's job, at least at our airport, requires them to have access to areas beyond the secure checkpoints. So they are required to have badges that open some of the security doors to get to and from work and, as a result, they are required to go through these background checks. And we can get you that list of disqualifying crimes. I can assure you that we have also worked very proactively with the City's Law Department to review the security requirements particularly relevant to these background checks to make sure that even though it is a federal mandate, we want to assure that we are respecting people's constitutional rights, and the City's attorneys have been helpful in advising us in the administration of this process.
So do you have a firm in mind that you would deal with in terms of outsourcing?
Our initial outreach was to -- we have a company on board at the airport right now that has responsibility for our facility maintenance that includes about 25 different forms 35 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole of maintenance, everything from pigeon control to roofing to fence repair. One division of that joint venture is called Affiliated Building Services. They have actually done custodial services at some other airports in the United States including Chicago, so we have asked them for a cost quotation at this point, and we are evaluating whether it is really a cost-efficient way to go or not. We have not reached a final conclusion at this time.
I'm really concerned about the outsourcing in terms of what impact it has on Philadelphia. We have a high unemployment rate here and we want Philadelphians to work first and to begin outsourcing creates a problem and you make all the efforts to even try to get Philadelphians to the point of applying. I know that you don't personally engage in the recruitment, but do you know what recruitment efforts are made by the personnel department? Is it central personnel that does the recruitment?
Yes, and we met with them last April to discuss this need that we knew was coming. One of the things we felt was at the time that we had a high turnover rate in the custodial 36 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole unit and we felt it was partly because the requirement, the original requirement for that position, was tenth grade education with no 5 experience. We requested that they insert some experience requirement for people that had done some actual cleaning or custodial work and I believe they added a six-month requirement. They changed the spec with the Civil Service Commission and the administrative board's approval last summer and they did an aggressive advertising and recruitment effort which resulted in -- they gave a test I believe in September and we have one of the largest eligible lists that they have ever had in the history of that test. There were over 600 people on the list. The real problem we have confronted is this issue of the background checks eliminating in some cases 50 percent of those candidates. The other reason -- we did not rush to fill the positions as we might have and I think there were two reasons for that. One was that the building did not open as originally scheduled so that gave us the opportunity to postpone some of the hiring and we also knew there was a possibility for some general fund downsizing in other City 37 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole departments where they have custodial workers. That's been discussed all the way back I think for a year or so as well and our sense was we didn't want to fill these vacant positions with outside hires and not be able to accommodate people who have already worked for the City and might be in need of a transfer opportunity and we continue to look for some opportunities to bring those employees down to the airport. I don't think that will happen though until the new fiscal year. So we are really caught right now in this period where we are going to open the terminal May 1 and until July we probably don't have a realistic chance of filling a lot of those vacancies as we would like to, so that's why we thought a temporary solution might be helpful. We do want to retain a certain standard of cleanliness and it is difficult. The existing staff is overtaxed and particularly at the end of a snow season. They do a lot of the manual shoveling on the curbs. The custodial staff does all of that. They do get a lot of overtime, but even overtime becomes less of an incentive when you have had an awful lot of hours when you are stuck at the airport during the snow 38 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole season. So overtime is not always the answer, and we do need to fill some of these positions as quickly as possible so we can keep the place clean.
The companies that you are talking about outsourcing with possibly, are they local companies?
The joint venture of PAS has a local component. I think it has -- two of the three joint venture partners are local and the third one I'm not -- I think that is a Texas-based company, but I'm not a hundred percent sure.
General Asphalt was one. There is a company called Affiliated Building Services, ABS, and U.S. Facilities is also a member of the joint venture.
Yes, they would hire locally for our needs and they have had the maintenance contract at the airport now for about a year and a half and on all the other systems they maintain, as I mentioned, from elevators, 39 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole escalators, moving sidewalks, they have done a fine job, so that was our first resort because we already had them under contract. We would need to amend the contract to do this temporary custodial service. The other alternative would be to start from scratch with a bid through the Procurement Department, but that would take a significant amount of additional time.
Good morning. Mr. Isdell, let me go back to an issue that was raised by Councilman Cohen regarding the international terminal as well as the passenger facility charges. First, what was the total cost of the International Airport?
The new international terminal's total is approximately $550 million. 40 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
We broke ground in August of 1999 so it is about three and a half, three and three-quarters years to complete.
The original project which was approved by Council in 1998 had a projected completion date of January 1, 2002. We did -- you might recall we did additional financing in calendar year 2001 in the spring and summer. Council approved some additional financing at that time. The agreement --
The additional financing I believe was $187 million. At that time we also changed the projected completion date to July of 2002. The main reason that we have been unable to get the terminal open until this month has been the security requirements that were changed and imposed upon us following the 9/11 terrorist attacks under the Transportation Security Administration which was 41 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole created in November of 2001. As far as --
Let's go back for a moment though. The original projected completion date was when?
January 1, 2002, was changed to July 1, 2002. And we're anticipating opening for full operations May 1 of this year.
Your original projected completion was January 1, 2002, right?
How close were you to meeting that deadline on September 10, 2001?
September 10 of 2001 we had already changed the date to July 1 of 2002 and our sense on September 10 of 2001 was that we would in fact be open on July 1 of 2002 and we felt that we were on schedule and on budget to do that.
Okay. So let's make sure the record is clear. You had already anticipated missing the original completion date of January 1, 2002 prior to the events of September 11, correct?
You had changed your 42 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole date already from January 1, 2002 to July 1, 2002.
Then because of the events of September you were further impacted by 6 a whole host of requirements. And is that when you 7 moved the date back to May 1, 2003? 8
We moved the date back 9 several times primarily because we were unable to 10 get commitments from the TSA on the delivery of 11 security equipment required for the opening of the terminal. We were unable to get that commitment until December of last year when we finally received a letter that included a delivery schedule. We needed both the commitment for the equipment and a delivery schedule of when that equipment would actually be delivered. When we got that information in December, we were able then to come up with a concrete opening date and we have managed to live up to that.
And in terms of the budget, were you already over budget prior to the events of -- were you already over budget on September 10, 2001?
No, we were not and there 43 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole has been a requirement for some additional money because of the security requirements. We were able to get some federal airport improvement program money and to use some additional passenger facility charge money with the airlines' approval to cover that additional cost. So at the moment we are not looking for any additional money. We believe that we will finish the building on budget.
I appreciate that. I was not anticipating that you were going to announce today that you were asking for more money. That certainly wasn't the purpose of the question. Is it possible for you to forward to us through the Chair a copy of the application for this project in order to utilize the passenger facilities charges? We are at $4.50. That's the maximum, right?
And you had to file 21 an application with the FAA in order to fund the project with passenger facility charges?
And does that application list the project costs associated with 44 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole this project?
Yes, all the costs that would be paid for or financed with passenger facility charges would be listed on that.
And would those be the same as in the Code of Federal Regulations, Section 14, Subsection 151.41 under "Project Costs"? Those are listed as making field surveys, preparing plans and specifications, accomplishing or securing the accomplishing of the work, supervising and inspecting construction work, requiring land or an interest therein in any casement through or other interest in air space and administrative and other incidental costs incurred specifically in connection with accomplishing a project and that would not have otherwise been incurred? Are those the criteria for eligibility?
That sounds correct to me. I don't have the number of the regulation, but it sounds to me like you are quoting the correct regulation.
In your application for the use of the passenger facility charges for the international terminal, under what category was it listed that there would be any use of the bond proceeds or the passenger facilities charges, which are in essence the debt service for the payment of the bonds, where was the issue of either a grand opening or a party or celebration? Where would that be listed in the six eligible items?
We would not be using the passenger facility charge portion of the budget for the promotional event that we have planned for this Thursday.
That would come out of the airline rates and charges portion of the financing and there was a budgeted item for a grand opening and other promotional items in the original project budget. That would not have been submitted as a PFC application.
So when you responded to Councilman Cohen and you did give the 46 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole breakdown between the PFC portion and the airline rates and charges portion, you gave it as 75/25 I believe, but it was not clear -- is that correct?
It wasn't clear which was 75 and which was 25. Which is which?
Now, explain the 11 airline rates and charges component. How does that 12 work? 13
That's the portion of the 14 debt service that is funded out of the rentals, 15 terminal rentals, and landing fees that are paid by 16 the airlines for the use of the airport. 17
Those payments are made to 20 the airport, to the aviation fund, and essentially 21 that is how we self-sustain ourselves. 22
So the grand opening 23 event, money is being taken from that pool of 24 dollars or that reserve of dollars? 25
The dollars that we are talking about would have been used also for potentially debt service for our capital program.
And you are saying those dollars are being then diverted for the grand opening event?
No, the grand opening event is considered part of the capital budget of the overall terminal expansion project, so it is not a diversion. It's really a piece of the overall project which we think is quite legitimate. It comes out to about four one-hundredths of one percent of the total project expansion costs, a very low number for promotion of a $550 million building.
I understand that. We don't have to fight about the cost. It could be lower; it could be higher. I'm sure it will be a nice event. I guess the question is whether or not distribution --
And these are charges. The airlines generate these dollars from their tickets. At this time from their general revenues at the 48 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole airport the airlines pay us monthly charges for their use of the airfield and for their rentals for their space that they have in the terminal building. That budget also is partially made up of revenues that we have from concessions as well such as the shops, restaurants and parking, rent-a-cars, that type of thing.
And you are saying that this event was listed as a part of the overall application for the overall budget?
And is this fairly standard practice, or is this the kind of thing that you might, in order to keep the costs directly associated with construction and the like, is this the kind of thing that private fund-raising might be better utilized for?
I think that was one option that we looked at and, in fact, we have received some donated services. The vendors, for example, from our concession program have donated all of the giveaway items that are going to be used, the promotional items. We have gotten a couple of other things donated. It is a difficult time to be asking 49 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole the private sector for donations and contributions. They are hurting in many respects the same way the rest of the economy is, but as far as whether this is a normal practice or not, I would like to just say that every time we have opened a new facility at the airport in the years that I've been there, 8 there has been an event that dates back to the 9 opening of International Terminal A in 1991. There 10 was a two-day event that included a luncheon one 11 day, a reception and dinner the next night. I 12 believe they spent more on that activity in 1991 13 than we are going to spend this year in 2003. We had an airport day when we opened and completed a project to upgrade Terminals B, C, D and E in 1994. It was a day-long extravaganza. In 1998 we had a three-day event that cost approximately a million dollars for the opening of the B-C food court and retail mall, and in 1999 we had an event at the Marriott Hotel observing the opening of our new runway 8-26.
All of these events were paid for in the same fashion?
Yes, and in every case, as far as I know, there was some donated services or 50 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole materials from vendors who had participated in the project and we have tried to emulate that, but rather than a million-dollar event, which would have been I think reflective of the type of three-day event we had in 1998, we have reduced the event budget now below $200,000, so I think that we have done a pretty good job of being as frugal as we could be without having an event that would be less than appropriate. This is a milestone for the regional economy --
-- and we think it is appropriate to bring people's attention to it.
Who makes the decision about the size of the event, dollar expenditure and how the costs are covered?
In this particular case we worked with U.S. Airways because they are the developer and construction manager of the project and they of course wanted to have an event. They have invited over 600 people, many of whom include regional salespeople from around the country, travel agents, international press from both Europe and the Caribbean, so they wanted to have an event, but, 51 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole again, as a company emerging from bankruptcy, they wanted to have a tasteful and frugal event, and so we worked with them to conserve the cost as much as possible.
I understand the response, but my question was who actually made the decision on --
A joint decision between the airport and U.S. Airways in this particular case.
Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilman Cohen.
Thank you, Madam Chair. I just want you to know I appreciate very much the personal responses you have made to the questions I raised with you concerning my personal use or some problems I have had with respect to representation of people who have had some problems with tickets and I appreciate your personal involvement very much, but in that area there has always been one question that has troubled 52 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole me a great deal and that is that to so many Philadelphians our local airport is a luxury that they do not avail themselves of but use the Baltimore Airport or the Atlantic City Airport, probably a number of other airports I have not heard about, and I'm very concerned about Philadelphia becoming a business for others but not for Philadelphians like I'm concerned about the high price of Eagles tickets to the point where very few Philadelphians -- maybe no more than percent of 12 spectators are Philadelphian. The rest come from 13 other areas where the income is higher. 14 Is that why the airport is in better 15 shape because it charges more and gets customers mainly from the business or from the more affluent suburban areas than Philadelphians? Is that why the Philadelphia Airport is in better financial shape than apparently other airports are from what I gathered from your earlier statements and the gentleman with you?
I think that is a part of the overall picture. We do know that two-thirds of our passengers are business travelers as opposed to leisure travelers, so there has clearly been an 53 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole evolution over many years of our airport to become oriented towards serving those passengers which are essentially our clientele. We also have tried though, in recent years especially, to encourage and recruit some low-fare competition and to date our most successful efforts in that regard have been with Air Tran Airways to provide some low-fare opportunities for families and individuals to fly to some of the leisure destinations in Florida. Air Tran also recently announced that they are going to fly starting in May to Pittsburgh for $59 each way -- I'm sorry. Boston. I'm sorry. I apologize. Philadelphia to Boston starting in May at $59. In the past they have not been successful competing with U.S. Airways for business traffic such as their efforts to fly low-fare flights to Pittsburgh a couple years back, but we hope that they will be able to succeed and get a foothold in Philadelphia. I did want to respond to your concern about BWI by bringing some good news that we just got from our air service consultants. We completed an exhaustive study to identify leakage from our airport to our two nearest competitors, Newark and 54 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole Baltimore/Washington, and we were somewhat surprised to learn that the leakage to Baltimore is essentially offset 100 percent by leakage back to our airport from people in their metropolitan area. So concern that we have, which continues, about Baltimore taking low-fare traffic from our metropolitan area and encouraging those people to drive down to BWI to take Southwest Airlines has been somewhat relieved by the results of this study, which we would be happy to share with Council. We presented it about ten days ago to our airport advisory board. And our concern now more than anything is really with competition from the Newark and New York area for international passengers. So we will be focused on trying to continue to develop some low-fare service here as an alternative for leisure travelers and Philadelphians who want to go to Disney World and the Caribbean and places like that, but in addition we want to be aggressive in trying to offer more opportunities for international flights in conjunction with the opening of our new building and our sense that U.S. Airways, as they emerge from bankruptcy with a CEO who used to lead 55 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole the continental international development up at Newark airport, he's now on our side and he wants to develop an international hub in Philadelphia similar to what Newark became back in the '80s, and we think that would be a great development as well.
I think anything in that direction would be helpful. Incidentally, on the Baltimore, did the study indicate that the prices in fact were as low in Philadelphia as in Baltimore, or was the leakage back to Philadelphia from Baltimore related to other circumstances?
It was a combination. It was in many cases the destination served. You can't get to as many destinations through Baltimore as you can through Philadelphia so a certain number of people from their catchment area have to come up to Philadelphia to use our airport if they don't want to fly a one stop out of Baltimore, but in fact we have also noted in the last six months or so during the bankruptcy period U.S. Airways has become very aggressive in price competition with Southwest Airlines because they were aware that they were losing passengers, so they have recaptured some of those people by becoming more cost competitive. 56 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
I would certainly welcome, and I think Philadelphians would, any efforts that would make the Philadelphia Airport more amenable to Philadelphia travelers. And I assume that the report is going to go to the president for dissemination to other Members of Council?
I will look at that. Now let me go back to one item raised by Councilwoman Tasco and that is the question of minority employment among custodial workers and in your reply to her you refer to background checks being a cause for -- one of the causes at least for eliminating so many people from potential jobs at the airport. Do you get the details of the background check in the airport, or do you depend on the police department or some other department for their ultimate evaluation? I raise that question with you because in the days when I was freer to practice private criminal law, I learned, as most people do in that practice, that minorities get arrest records very easily in Philadelphia and elsewhere and that they 57 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole have to be looked at very carefully or you easily run into a situation where large numbers of people are eliminated for arrests that were relatively meaningless and might not have occurred except for the fact that the person was a member of a minority, but without dealing with that issue, I'm just wondering, like assault is a very common charge, often not substantiated when the matter goes to trial. The dismissal rate on assault charges is extremely high. The same applies -- so I would like to suggest, and I don't want to take the time now, but I think that is one area that has to be looked at hard and you have to find good reasons for finding somebody not eligible. In addition to the fact that minorities are often chargeable with crimes that others don't get, one has to take into account too the fact that many minorities have never had a chance to work and I wonder whether the turnover rate is due to the fact that you are often dealing with the population that is getting its first chance at a position. And it took me a long time to learn that you have to come to work on time, that what may be a good average to you of coming to work once or twice a 58 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole work on time is viewed as a capital offense generally. Generally if you are late once or twice during the year, it's considered too much, and it takes a while to learn that, and I was wondering whether the airport ever thought in terms of having some preliminary classes to acquaint people because most people that would be applying for custodial work, it might very well be their first trip into the world of work and something like coming to work on time, being appropriately dressed, being appropriately well-mannered in your relations with other people sometimes takes some experience. So I would like to suggest more work in those areas because I think it's just very important that we not write off people. Even if people do have a minor record, say, of guilt on an assault case or something like that, that we can't just afford to write Philadelphians off that easily, and I think that the airport would be doing a great deal for itself and for the City of Philadelphia if it could take the lead in establishing strong, positive records for employment of minorities, for learning that you have to maybe prepare a population that wasn't previously prepared for work habits that are 59 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole essential to the effective operation of the airport and to make a determined effort. I was impressed by the answers that you gave to Councilwoman Tasco in the way in which you personally involve yourself in the reporting with respect to vendors as to whether or not the prime people involved really did their job and you inserted yourself and I think that is very important to achieve success. So I'm just urging that in your thinking about minority participation it would be great if the airport could really lead the way by developing new approaches to make it possible for Philadelphians to be placed in custodial work and in contractual work and in every area of the vendors and the other facilities or workloads that exist at the airport. So I hope you will give thought to some new mechanisms.
You're an independent body largely and I think you have a high degree of employment. How many employees do you have at the airport?
About 675 City employees. All told about 21,000 people work at the airport for all the different entities down there.
Of course what I'm 60 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole saying applies I guess predominantly to the City employees, but should not be limited to them. We favor fair employment practices at every stage and every level and it would be great if the airport could be cited as the number one example of progress in Philadelphia. Thank you, Madam President.
I was going to say in response to the first part of your last question, the criminal history records are sent by the FBI to the Philadelphia Police Department as you suspected and then they are reviewed and we get the results after they are reviewed by the police, and I believe the City Solicitor participates in that review. You are right. They do not come directly to us, but we work with the Philadelphia Police Department in that process. And in response to the second part of your last question, we have just recently completed an RFP for training services for our custodial unit because that was identified. We have been doing what we call a re-engineering government initiative with the custodial unit over the last couple years, and the need for training, some of which is very 61 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole basic, as you indicated, was identified as a priority and we are just getting ready to enter into some agreements to bring some training services into that unit, which we hope will stabilize the unit and reduce the turnaround.
Thank you. They seem like positive steps. Thank you, Madam President.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Mr. Isdell, let me first congratulate you and your staff for the great job you do down at the airport especially right now. It must be a very trying situation with the levels of security and the changes, the many changes that have occurred down there, and I want the rest of my colleagues to be aware. I know people who work at the airport and you are one of the first directors of aviation that has a policy where anyone who worked, those 600-plus people that work at the airport, if they want to meet with you, that you will grant them time to come and sit down with you and discuss any issue that 62 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole affects the operation or their employment at the airport. That is incredible that you make that available to them.
The other issue is that since I have friends that work at the airport I know that recently we have had some criticisms of the various equipment that may be at the airport and I understand there is some pressure to take some equipment that you may need away. Could you assure me that that is not going to occur?
We have a meeting scheduled with the managing director to go over our fleet needs and requirements and I'm hopeful also with the help of our commerce director, Jim Corado, who is going to sit in on that meeting, that we will be able to keep the equipment that we need.
I would be interested to know because I know if you had something that you didn't need down there, you wouldn't have it. Thank you, Mr. Isdell. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Are there any other questions from Members of Council? 63 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole Thank you very much, Mr. Isdell. Thank you for the hard work you do at the airport. We appreciate it.
Mayor's Office of Information Services. This department was requested for a return. There are questions from the Members of Council. Good morning.
I guess I have a question similar to the one that I asked Mr. Isdell regarding the contracts that you give and the minority participation on those contracts. First, can you describe your minority participation goals and were they received and, second, can you describe the types of contracts that minority vendors received and the budgets fully expended? Do you contract with an individual and then not really use them? I guess that's the question.
We have approximately $5 million in purchase of services through my department. As the Council is aware, we do not have a centralized purchasing of all IT services, but from the central office we purchase approximately 5 million. Of that, many of them are maintenance for operating systems such as our mainframe equipment. We do bid many of our contracts. We are currently out with our desktop support, which has an, I believe, or 27 percent minority participation 13 requirement on that. We are also out for contract 14 on our software procurement. We have -- 15
If you have 25 to 16 27 percent goal, did you fulfill that goal? 17
That contract is currently 18 in negotiation and with either of the two finalists 19 they will meet their participation requirements. 20 Our contracts will vary. MBEC office we work 21 closely with in reviewing our contracts. They set 22 anywhere from a 10 percent to a 27 percent goal 23 normally. 24
Let's go back to 25 the contracts that you are not presently negotiating 65 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole but contracts you have negotiated in the past. They may have awarded a contract to a minority vendor. Were those contracts fulfilled? Did the individual vendors do the work, or do you just have on record that you have contracts with minority vendors?
I can speak for the last two years that I've been in office and the only area in which we have had those occurrences has been in training. MOIS does the training, all IT training, for across the City. We coordinate that. We work with the departments -- each department has a trainer coordinator -- to determine what the approximate training will be. With the tight budgets we have only seen about 50 percent of the training dollars expended particularly this year. Last year was about two-thirds. So in some cases where we thought we would have a half million dollars in training, we have only had -- I believe this year to date at about 200,000, 250,000. Last year we thought again it would be closer to 600,000 and it came in around 430,000. So there have been cases where based on initial budgets in the proposed budget that we have gone out and done contracting and IT training where 66 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole we have not issued those contracts. I am not aware of other contract areas in which we have submitted or gone out for contracts and then not used them. Occasionally if we get asked to reduce budgets, then we would have to eliminate some contracts and we have had that happen a couple of times.
-- in your budget. And then you would award the contract?
We would encumber the contracts based on estimated training amounts, but the departments then sign up their staff to take those classes and we bill as the departments use those resources. When we get to the last several months of a contract period, if we realize, I guess about a quarter before the end of the year, we will unencumber certain contracts if we have not used those services. Training is by far the one area where we have the least amount of control on.
So if I subcontract with you for -- if I receive a contract from you, does the contract say up to a certain amount or that 67 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole I will get $600,000?
I'm Jacqueline Henry. I'm the administrative services director. We usually allot a certain amount in the contract for each vendor. We do not guarantee that they will use any of it; however, we monitor it to make sure if there is training requirements across the City agencies, that we allot it appropriately across all of our vendors if they do the same type services. We don't guarantee the dollar amount, but from past experiences we generally base it upon their uses from the previous year, so most of them do use what we put in the contract.
So if we wanted to talk about minority participation and the dollar value they receive from your office, could you give us a figure on the number of contracts you let and the dollar value that has been appropriated or that was used by the minority firms? Because you can have them on paper but they not receive any money. So you may have a percent contractual 23 participation, but you may have 5 percent dollar 24 participation, and that is what I'm interested in, 25 what is the dollar value and how much are minorities 68 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole and women in terms of your contractual relationships with them.
We would like to have that. Pass it on to the Chair. Are there any other questions from Members of Council? Thank you very much. Mayor's Office of Community Services. We call on our Council members, if they are listening on their intercoms, if you asked any of these departments to return, we would appreciate if you would come forward to City Council to address your issues to members of these departments. The Chair recognizes Councilman Nutter.
Thank you, Madam Chair. In response to one of the questions -- actually it wasn't even my question, but I looked in the responses. This is a letter dated March 31, 2003. The question was "Provide a list of the names for the companies that hired the 261 workers placed in the jobs through the welfare to work training 69 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole program and what has been the length of stay in these jobs?" It was actually asked by Councilman Ortiz. There is a listing, Madam Chair, of 5 companies that people received employment from. 6 The second part of the response was "The 7 average length of time a customer retains employment 8 is six months." My question is, based on that, what 9 does the, quote/unquote, customer do at that point 10 and why is the average length of employment six 11 months and is that an acceptable employment time 12 period based on the training and the cost of the 13 training? 14
Ralph Blakney, executive 18 director of the Mayor's Office of Community 19 Services. 20 The six-month period is an acceptable 21 period. The contract that the Mayor's Office of 22 Community Services has with the Department of 23 Community and Economic Development stipulates that 24 we are to find employment for one-half of the people 25 enrolled in the program. The amount of period that 70 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole the state gives as acceptable is actually one day, believe it or not. The goal is to find employment, not to necessarily keep the people employed. However, MOCS has gone beyond --
What I'm saying is according to the contract. It is a goal of --
I don't really care about the contract at that point. I'm glad we have a contract and I'm glad that we have a goal of trying to get people employed. What's our goal?
Our goal at this time is to keep the people employed for six months. We have been working to --
Well, what we have done recently is work to keep the people in employment for a minimum of one year. We have expanded our own internal goals and objectives in terms of maintaining employment for the people enrolled in the program.
How do you do that? 71 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
Well, there's a number of things that are done. We do hire retention specialists and their job is basically to maintain contact with the employers. The employers know that they can notify the agency when an employee is having issues on the job. The retention specialists actually, as a result of information that we receive, do contact the employees to try and work out whatever problems which may be causing them not to be as successful on the job as possible. Also, prior to employment we have a number of case managers who actually work with people enrolled in a program to help address issues that people come into the program with, issues such as child care issues, issues such as mentioned earlier in previous testimony, people not necessarily having good work habits in terms of reporting for work, for example. All of these kinds of issues are addressed to actually help ensure that the person, once they achieve employment, actually maintain employment, and right now we are looking at one year as being the goal that we are targeting. And I'm saying that in terms of tracking.
I understand that, 72 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole but your response was you have these companies. The average length of time a customer retains employment is six months. You are not able necessarily to influence how long those companies keep the person or the customer, are you?
So where does the 9 one year come into play and what does a person do 10 after they have gone through training, they are 11 employed for six months, now they are out of a job. 12 What do they do then? 13
For more information on 14 that question I would like to bring up Leon Simmons, 15 who is the director of the Mayor's Office of 16 Community Services supportive work program. 17
Customers that are 24 enrolled into the workwise program receive 25 employment retention. Basically that is supplied to 73 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole all customers upon them entering into employment. The goal, of course, for the retention services is to try to lock them in and work with the employer and the customer to sustain their employment for up to a year's time. Contractually with the state it is for a six-month period, but we view ourselves as a successful program with the City of Philadelphia and working with City residents, we extend that to a one-year period.
Last year's statistics we had over 55 percent -- I'm sorry. For a year, one year?
I'm sorry. We had a 35 percent one-year job retention rate for our customers enrolled in the workwise program.
The people who were able to stay one year, were they out of this pool of 74 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole people that were hired by the companies? 3
So tell me again 5 what happens to the six-month person or the average 6 length-of-stay customer. They come in. They get 7 training. How much does the training cost? What is 8 the cost of training each person? 9
So they come in. 11 They get the training. They work for six months. 12 Then are they fired or do they resign or how do they 13 end up only staying for six months? 14
Well, I think the scenario 15 that we are talking about would be someone who 16 received employment and for whatever their reason if 17 the employment did not last longer than six months, 18 they have the option of returning to the Mayor's 19 Office of Community Service workwise program. 20 One of the ways that we kind of view 21 ourselves in working under MOCS is if they are a 22 City resident and if they are seeking services, 23 there is no way in the world we would turn them 24 away. So even though they may not be enrolled in 25 the program by way of the state, they are eligible 75 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole to return to MOCS and obtain additional services to get themselves reemployed.
How many people have gone through training more than one time?
Would it be the balance of your nonretention for the year? You have 35 percent being retained for a year. Does that mean that the other 65 percent are coming back through the program?
No. Possibly they could either return back through CAO, which is what their initial referral source is, or they may opt to receive other services from other programs.
So the state contracts with us and their requirement is six months, but where is -- how do we seek to achieve the goal of a year or where does the year come in?
We are actually trying to influence the state right now to take a look at a year's retention. One of our internal analysis, we found that applying six months of retention services is not enough time to adequately move someone from 76 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole unemployment to employment successfully and also try to reach the agency's goals of self-sufficiency. And even, to be honest with you, some of the barriers that our customers actually face, even one year's retention is not enough. So at a minimum for what, of course, the state is allowed to give us for our efforts and for our contractual purposes, we applied the one-year internal stipulation of retention services. By the way, that has been met with a lot of enthusiasm by the state to the extent that the state recently allowed the Mayor's Office of Community Services to enter into Bucks County to employ the same type of services.
Mr. Blakney, as a part of your responses from the earlier hearing, there is an Attachment C which is a list of MOCS employees by name, title, department, funding source, zip code, date and position, date of hire and their salary. Is it possible to rearrange the order on this? It appears that this was grouped by work -- it appears that it was grouped by department. Is that the key to this document?
Job site more or less or 77 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole program.
Is it possible for you to reorder the listing such that it would be in a zip code cluster so, in other words, all the people -- take if there were 19103, all the 19103 people would be together, all the 05, all the 06 and then list all the same information, the name and the title of the department?
We could furnish that information. We can furnish that chart.
Within the zip code cluster for people that find themselves in the same zip code, if you could put the employee's name alphabetical by last name within their cluster, that would be helpful.
Thank you. Lastly, there was a fair amount of discussion last time about the Frankford Family Development Center and some truancy services up in the Frankford Cluster. I had also asked the question about who provides truancy prevention 78 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole services in West and Northwest Philadelphia. There is a very long answer here. It seems to be primarily DHS driven. I had two questions: One, what is the DSS staff? That is an acronym used in this response.
Got you. Okay. And I could not figure out from this response, is there a specific place similar to what you have at the Frankford Cluster where truancy prevention services are being provided? They appear to be being provided by a variety of organizations, but is there a central location for these services?
That question would be more appropriately handled by DHS if you are speaking about centralized location for truancy services.
I thought this was operating under MOCS similar to the Frankford Family Development Center.
Right. If your question is regarding Frankford, then that would be a question for MOCS. I thought I heard you say that 79 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole you were asking about truancy services provided in other areas of the City, and, as we had said in previous testimony, MOCS --
Okay. I understand the distinction. Mr. Fair, are you going to tell us something?
My name is David Fair, director of prevention services for the Department of Human Services. The truancy prevention effort that is supported by DHS at MOCS and other agencies is a citywide effort that is organized regionally by the areas that are served by the regional truancy courts. There are now ten regional truancy courts that are geographically located. The truancy courts occur mostly in public school buildings. There are a couple that are not in public schools. That's where we generally identify families that we will serve with our truancy prevention services, so it varies depending in the part of the City what schools the truancy courts are held in, but the agencies that provide the services are all identified as agencies that are active in the 80 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole particular community that they are serving. The Frankford situation is the only place, I think, where we have what we call a family center and the truancy program happening in the same facility. Often they are the same providers, but that's the only place I think where they have been in the same facility.
Is there any thought or discussion going on that would lead to similar types of models in other parts of the City?
Not really. I think because the truancy service is pretty much of a home-based service that's visiting the family at home and helping the family deal with its issue there is not as much a need to have a facility for people to come to. We do have family centers in all of these areas and the same services that are provided at the Frankford Family Development Center are provided to the families of truants in those other areas.
I think we had some discussion about the family center issue last time as well.
And I think we 81 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole determined that there was not one north of Market in West Philadelphia. What are we doing about that?
There is one in Mantua but not one further up in West Philadelphia.
Our request to the state for next year includes adding two new family centers and we sort of are dependent on whether or not that funding is awarded.
The original plan was actually to place one in the Frankford area of the City further east from where the Frankford Family Development Center is. There is a whole area of the City, Port Richmond and those areas, that we don't really have a program. The other places that we were thinking about having a family center was in the area around 25th and Allegheny, but none of those decisions are final, so we could still have conversations about that if the money comes in. We have initiated some conversations with Overbrook High School after the recent incidents there about developing some services that 82 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole are based in that particular high school for the community.
I appreciate the thought. What's driving the decision-making process here and why wouldn't there be one in the northwest section of the City?
The family centers are all based in neighborhoods where we have the highest number of reports of abuse and neglect and so that is generally where we have tried to target any new resources, in the areas where we don't have community-based resources for families that might help divert them from our system.
I understand that and I'm certainly not -- at a certain level I'm pleased if that's one of the criteria, that the numbers may be relatively low compared to other places. On the other hand, generally we want to be in the prevention business, and to the extent that we can provide services at a relatively early stage even in areas that are not showing signs of possibly a growing trend, and I don't know that to be the case, it would seem that we would geographically and strategically place them such that there is 83 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole well-rounded service throughout the City whether the numbers are high or not. We do have police districts and police officers patrolling in every section of the City regardless of whether crime is up or crime is down and certainly we shift the officers around as needed, but we don't leave anyone completely without service because they don't have that much problem.
I agree with you. The two challenges that we have is the money we are using and its restrictions, which is mostly TANF surplus funding from the state, which is specifically to be targeted to what is called placement prevention as opposed to the general primary prevention that you are talking about I think. And it is also supposed to be targeted to helping families reunify after they have been through our system. The other thing to keep in mind is the family centers are not the only kind of investment that we make. We do make a significant investment in after school and Beacon programs including in the Overbrook section of the city. In that area of the city we have a couple of intensive delinquency prevention programs that are targeted in that area 84 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole and we do this year have either a full or a part-time provider case manager who is assigned to all of the schools in that area. So there are other programs that we do that are more effectively distributed in that citywide than the family centers themselves.
You raised the Beacon issue and you are not here for DHS at the moment. You are trying to respond to a question that came up in MOCS, but I have a fair amount of questions to ask about one of the attachments that came with the response to some questions we asked DHS, so we can talk about that at that time. But I would be interested to see your statistical analysis plotted against a citywide map showing the location of these family centers and the rates in the different areas, which would possibly help better explain the site location decisions around the issue of abuse.
There is such a map. I don't have it with me, but we can make sure you get a copy of it.
I'd appreciate it. Thank you. 85 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you. Are there any other questions? Councilman Cohen, do you have questions?
Thank you, Madam Chair. The truancy work you described used to be done by the school; isn't that true? Is this the City performing the service for the School District?
This is David Fair again from the Department of Human Services. I think the service that we are providing is not what you are referring to. The School District used to and now this year has resumed having what they call truant officers who do identify kids who are truant and try to make sure that the parents are aware that their kids are truant and encourage them to come back to school. What we are offering really is a much more intensive family intervention that helps the family address whatever the issues are that may have supported the child's decision not to go to school. 86 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole So it's more of a social service or counseling service, case management, than it is what the School District previously provided.
About how many children does your service provide for in the course of a year?
For citywide we have about 2000 children that are served by the truancy services provided by DHS. There's an additional 2000 or so kids who are served by other parts of DHS, usually with services to children in their own homes, and then there are about 25,000 children who don't get referred by the School District for services that fit the same profile.
And about how many employees does all of that servicing involve?
I need a second here. Actually, it is in my other document. There are about 70 social workers. They don't work for the Department of Human Services though. They work for community-based provider agencies.
Community-based provider agencies that are funded through an RFP process. 87 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole They are not DHS employees specifically. They are working for an agency that exists in that community.
I'm just having difficulty in understanding why MOCS is involved.
MOCS predates my arrival at the Department of Human Services. There are two MOCS offices that sometime in the distant past had developed a relationship with DHS in this area and so they continued to provide their services. I think in Frankford the specific challenge was the lack of other organizations that were willing to provide this service when we originally started it there, but I was not here then. That was quite a few years ago.
I think I will leave the balance of that to Councilman Nutter. I just had difficulty in adjusting my thinking of MOCS and the services it renders. With respect to the other functions we talked about on MOCS, how many employees -- I heard your figure and percentages, but that means one thing if we are talking about a hundred employees and means something else if we are talking about a thousand or two thousand. How many employees do you 88 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole place under either the six-month program or the year program in the course of the year?
Last year there were approximately to 30 employers that we worked with 6 and the number continues to go up or down based on 7 the economic indicators right now, companies that 8 are actually -- 9
Does each employer 10 have a number assigned to him as to how many 11 employees he might involve? If you took those 25 12 employers that you had as of January this year, 13 how many employees would they be employing? 14
We could find that out for 15 you for sure. That would not be a problem. 16
Would you have any 17 idea in general as to the number? 18
The lowest it could 19 possibly be, of course, would be one and it could be 20 as high as maybe 10 to 12 employees per one employer 21 for sure. 22
Could you get that 23 information in the course of this hearing? 24
Yes. And that would be 25 effective January 1? 89 1 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
Yes, as of any given date. I would just like to know how big the program is and I would like to know the nature of the employers, the kind of work they do, are they labor organizations, are they employers, do they have anything to do with any construction industry, do they have anything to do with apprenticeship programs, or are they just separate standing corporate employers.
And I would like to know the numbers we are talking about and how many MOCS employees it takes to service them.
And an idea as to how 19 many more could be serviced that are not serviced 20 because of lack of ability on the part of the City 21 to come up with enough service time.
We actually canvass the 90 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole business community very aggressively both in Philadelphia and also outside the City of Philadelphia.
And then how do you pick the employees that get referred to them?
We do an internal screening based on our case management efforts within the program.
And do you get information with respect to the relative rates they pay?
Oh, most definitely. Of course there are bench marks that we have to meet with the state in order to qualify a natural program participant as being employed.
So in fact it is a state program carried out by the City but funded by the state?
Do the employees get checks reading "Commonwealth of Pennsylvania" or "City of Philadelphia"?
So you are City employees. So the funds come from the state, but apparently they go into the general fund?
No, there is no general fund money. It is just state money, grant fund money.
Into the City. I would like to have an idea of what you think you could effectively do and whether there is any followup of those who complete either the six-month or the year program.
And I would like to ask that they be recalled later this afternoon or tomorrow, whenever the next session is, Madam Chair, because my questions would be dependent upon the answers I guess.
Unless you get the information before we adjourn today.
Any other questions? I have a couple of questions. Let me ask you a couple of questions here. Do you have any advisory board for the Mayor's Office of Community Service?
How many members, who are they, and how are they selected?
There are state guidelines for how the boards should be composed, which is somewhat unique for community action agencies of 93 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole which MOCS is one in the State of Pennsylvania. Currently there are 36 advisory board members and the composition is that there are members that 5 are actually appointed by the Mayor. These people 6 have ties to City or government agencies. There are 7 also 12 people who can be appointed by the Mayor if 8 he decided to do so. Those 12 people actually 9 represent the corporate and business community 10 within the City of Philadelphia. And the last third 11 is actually composed of people who represent low 12 income communities throughout the City of Philadelphia.
There are actually elections held every two years in various communities. We actually break down the City into clusters of zip codes and elections are held in each of those clusters to produce the 12 low income community representatives.
How do people know 94 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole there is an election?
The elections are actually advertised through leaflets. We advertise through community newspapers and also through community-based organizations.
At this time we actually have ten different program sites and most of those sites also serve as area offices where people can access MOCS' various programs through those particular sites.
And they are determined by the income level? Is there an income requirement where you place your offices?
All of the sites were in place prior to my appointment as executive director, but I do know that the history of MOCS does suggest that each of the programs were placed based on the need of the community. All of the programs do not 95 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole necessarily provide the same services. For example, you have heard from Mr. Simmons, the director of supportive work program, and at that particular site that's the service that is primarily delivered there; however, people can through that site access other MOCS programs.
Have you ever presented to us -- we get so much paperwork -- the location of your various sites? Do we have that information?
Yes, we have provided that and we can do it again if necessary.
Could you do that? And, also, I would like to see the advisory board list of who are the members of the advisory board. What does the advisory board do?
The advisory board is really advisory in nature in that the board helps the staff and the administration primarily decide whether the agency is moving the way it should be, whether we're actually keeping in step with our mission, whether we are delivering services as effectively and efficiently as possible. The board has also been very 96 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole instrumental in helping to inform various communities within the City of what MOCS programs actually entail. The board also is very instrumental in making the agency's staff aware of what issues or concerns particular communities have regarding our programs. There have been a number of modifications and changes to MOCS programs as a result of recommendations of board members, so the board is an integral part of the actual planning and delivery of services.
Thank you very much. Are there any other questions? Thank you. You will provide that information tomorrow along with your other information?
Thank you. Recreation? Councilman Nutter, since you are the only Council Member left, do you have questions for the Recreation Department?
Yes. This is one of the first times I got to go first. There are a couple items regarding Recreation, Madam Chair. The 97 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole first is with regard to the transfer of sites between Recreation and Fairmount Park. There was a response that came to us recently regarding transfer dates and number of persons transferred. I needed to better understand where the facilities and the community groups that support these facilities and the larger community, where are they in terms of the process of a discussion about this transition and transfer regarding these facilities?
For the record, Vic Richard, recreation commissioner. The first meeting that is scheduled is on April 15. Well, that would be the second one. We have one this week that we will meet with the Gustine Lake community and that will just be one portion of it. On April 15 we also have another meeting scheduled with the Papa playground community organizations, and I don't have my schedule with me.
Commissioner, I'm sorry. Can you tell me when the Gustine meeting is.
And who would you be meeting with from Gustine Lake? 98 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
I don't have all of that information in front of me. I believe you are scheduled to attend that meeting as well. I think one of the Fairmount Park commissioners is going to be there, Mr. Bloom, yourself, myself as well.
I'm aware of that particular meeting, but that meeting is about the Arthur Ashe tennis facility supposed to be located at that location.
I do not believe it is specifically or even generally about transitioning of Gustine Lake from Fairmount Park to Recreation because the primary purpose of the meeting is actually to talk about some unresolved community issues around the use of the proposed outdoor courts at Gustine coming from the possible construction by the Arthur Ashe Tennis Center. Gustine Lake in terms of a recreation use is not only utilized by the local community but has historically had an even larger, almost citywide level of activity, so when we talk about talking to the community, at a traditional recreation center it is usually the people in the neighborhood. Gustine 99 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole is slightly unique in that particular regard, so I'm quite interested in who we are actually going to talk to about Gustine Lake, but the meeting that you are referring to, my recollection is, is specific to the tennis courts and unresolved issues of community use of those tennis courts, not about transfer of facility.
I had also planned to make contact and use some of that time to reach out to any community members as well. I also have a meeting scheduled with yourself I believe -- I just got confirmation -- next Monday, so you and I can talk in more detail and I can give you some of the recommendations that I would like to make to you and also get your input back as well as we continue to begin.
And you said you are going to be setting up meetings with the advisory groups or other community people for all six or seven, I guess, of these facilities?
That is correct. We are going back to Papa. I personally visited Gustine Lake. I believe the leader is about to retire, if he hasn't already, so I'm going to make sure that we 100 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole have a new leader in place as well. I have made two personal visits to Hunting Park already along with the PAL unit as well, Papa, Cobbs Creek and I am personally getting involved to make sure that I reach out and meet one on one and as a collective unit with every agency and Monday you and I will share even more when we do meet as well and I will take the recommendations that you bring.
When we were last together -- I did receive the materials that your office, you and the office, provided -- from your testimony back on March 3, we had a discussion about teen centers as well as after-school programs and six recreation centers. I could not determine from the response whether or not there will actually be a teen center or an after-school program located in the fourth district as a result of our discussions. And if it is in the response or any of the attachments, you can certainly direct me.
I know there is no teen center that is scheduled to be done in your 101 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole district.
Correct. The immediate -- the initial funding was relative to the criteria that was used based on the crime stats, an intentional target, and the funding was grant funding that was awarded. It is not that it can't be done. If it is funded, one of my first recommendations that I would see within your district would be for us to continue what we have started at Shepard. I have also had a recent meeting I want to say a week before last and maybe two weeks ago with the advisory group and the staff at Tustin as well.
Okay, but now, to be more specific, what steps need to take place in order to resolve both the teen center issue as well as the after-school program issue during the course of this budget season? What needs to happen?
The selection of a site and the funding for us to actually perform the work. 102 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
I think in at least one case the teen center -- I believe the proposed site would be Shepard, correct?
Yes, sir. I mean that facility is the one that's closest, ready to go, based on the work that has just been accomplished there.
So what's the funding barrier and how do we overcome that issue? How much money are we talking about?
You are looking at about a hundred to 125 to do Shepard and that is to purchase the rest of the equipment and also to put at least one but preferably two young teenagers in there to work with the staff and to attract the teens and to do the more specific programming.
No. That would cover the salaries for the two-part young people. We employ in the teen program two teenagers roughly between the ages of 18 to to interact and to do the 24 majority of the programming in the community and the rest of it would go to the supplies and equipment 103 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole that is needed, the setting up of the game room, concession, food, movie stuff and things like that, the actual programming and supplies.
Are those considered operating expenditures, or are they capital expenditures?
These would be operating. We have done the majority of the capital work to that particular facility already.
And how much operating expense for all the other items that you mentioned?
What are the possible sources of these funds, or how are the other -- how many teen centers are there?
Kingsessing opened in October. We're a couple weeks away from opening 104 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole Francis Myers.
And you're saying there is no money out of that block grant for a teen center at Shepard?
Presently there is none, but for us to be able to reapply for more money --
Commissioner, I would like a teen center at Shepard Recreation Center, and I would like it in the course of this fiscal year, so I need somebody to tell me when and where we are going to get the hundred to $125,000 in order to make that happen. I mean this is a two-year-old discussion now. I think we had some of this discussion last year about a teen center in 105 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole West Philadelphia. We may not have been specific on the site. I think we had a geographic conversation.
Okay. When we meet Monday, I will talk to you in more detail and I'll bring you different funding sources that we may be able to use.
Who makes a decision on which funding sources are available or which is going to be utilized? Where does that decision rest?
It goes through at that time the director of social services, the managing director along with DHS direct department.
So we have you, we have Commissioner Martinez, and the managing director. Those are the three people involved in this.
Pretty much. I might have missed one or two. We use statistics from the Police Department as well, but, yes, that's the biggest one.
I'm not disagreeing with 106 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole you, Mr. Councilman. I will have something for you on Monday when we meet.
Are you going to have a list of potential funding sources or are you going to have a decision? Because that's what I'm really interested in. I don't need another list of potential funding sources. What I need in the course of this budget year is a decision with a definite date and when it's going to start. That's what I need.
Let's get Mr. Dubow. We have the commissioner. Is the managing director around? I mean I would really like to get to the end of this.
Rob Dubow, City's budget director. I've heard the discussion and we will get you a decision on the center during the course of this budget process.
So the commitment here is prior to a vote on the budget we are going to have a decision on this particular issue. 107 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
Are you going to be involved in seeking additional funding for this?
Well, it always falls to you. I think you are one of the highest ranking people in the room. Can you find out where he is?
Commissioner, while we are waiting on the search for the managing director, can you tell me about the after-school program?
I believe that's 108 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole funded through TANF. You have six of them, and I also asked the question back at budget time when you were here for your regular testimony about locating an after-school program in the 4th District because there is none presently, the state license.
Councilman Nutter, this is Bill Carapucci. We have about eight after-school programs within your Councilmatic district. We just opened up one with private funding at Shepard.
Is this the same as the one that's mentioned or the same type that is mentioned on of the testimony?
"Recreation will be offering state-licensed after-school programs in six recreation centers in FY '04. Simons, Christy and Tarken received licenses in FY '03." Is that what we are talking about?
No. The regular after-school programs, Councilman, we have eight of them in your district. The six that you are talking about, the ones that are potentially going to receive some money from the state, does not identify yet in your district. 109 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
Hopefully we will be able to within this fiscal year identify one. We are still working on these other six. It has been probably about a two- or three-year process to get to as far as we are now with this because this is a whole new venture for us. We made some progress at Simons, at Tarken and Christy because they have had a long history of working on this program. But we will definitely identify a site within your Councilmatic district and I will have that site to you by next Monday when you meet with the commissioner, a site that we can work on, not a site that I can say to you within six months it will be up, but we will work on making it up. We have to do some capital work at the sites. We have to meet with the local advisory council and we will have to deal with -- we want to put it in a site where there is a successful after-school program already and it could just be upgraded to meet state standards. So we will definitely come up with one within the next couple weeks, possibly Shepard.
You may not be able 110 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole to bring all sites on-line at one time and I can certainly understand how complicated that would be. Last year I would have said that I was concerned. This year I'm going to say I'm now offended at what appears to be a certain nonprioritizing of the needs of kids and young people and the not so young in certain areas of the City because even if all the centers couldn't come on-line at the same time, it seems to me that the identification process and the prep work process should be done simultaneously in order to legitimately and fairly serve people throughout the City. I do not understand this concept of until your neighborhood either falls apart or until all the kids are out trying to kill each other you don't get anything and there's not even something put on the drawing board to indicate when it might come. Again, I understand you can't do them all at the same time. Kids are kids and neighborhoods are neighborhoods and they all have their needs at a certain baseline level. And some will always need a little more than others and I understand that and that actually is fair, but to have some get something and the rest get nothing, not even a 111 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole thought, not even a pin on a drawing board or a map to say when funding is available, this is where we are going to go. We have identified the site. We know what the dollars are. We know what the needs are because we think that these kids deserve something as well, I'm now in the realm of being offended because we are not thinking beyond what we can do today. Now, it doesn't take that much more effort and it doesn't take that much more thought to figure out that kids in West Philadelphia north of Market Street or in East Falls or in North Philadelphia or Roxborough/Manayunk or Wynnefield or Overbrook might have some needs. They do, don't they?
The entire city has needs and I respect all of your comments. Maybe we may need to do a better job of communicating with you particularly, Councilman Nutter, but I believe that the efforts that have been made by this organization and the City as a whole have been valiant, and maybe we may not have served your particular area maybe to the level that you want or maybe we may have not communicated early on or as often as we should have. 112 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
Commissioner, I appreciate that. I'm not even asking for anything special. I just want what everybody else is getting. All of the people are citizens. They pay taxes. They have a certain level of expectation. We pick up everybody's trash. We put police all over the place. We do everything for everyone, but in certain situations we have a little thing going on over here, we have a little thing going on over there and other folks are trying to figure out, Well, what about us? So I'm not asking for anything special. I'm not asking for anything extra. I'm just asking for a baseline of service that everybody is getting the same thing in the city and then we go to another level based on need, based on statistics, or based on analysis or based on Johnny hit Susie or whoever did something to somebody else.
But I don't want to spend my time year in and year out having these debates and these fights about how something got analyzed or who has what, which is a function of --
I'm not here to debate and 113 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole argue either, Mr. Councilman. I'm just here to provide a good service, so I appreciate everything you are saying. There is nothing that is going on over here in this corner, over there in that corner, and if I may reiterate again, maybe we need to do a better job of communicating with you within your district a little better. Some of the work that has been done in certain parts of the city were done intentionally because of especially past neglect or deterioration or structural integrity or just whatever the case may be of a facility or a project, but everything that you said relative to services across this entire City, that's my goal and my responsibility in working hand in hand with you and the other 16 Council members, so I appreciate that.
Once we talk to the managing director and also with Rob Dubow, we will come back with a decision from them relative to the funding of your site as a teen center and then also we will come back and talk with you as well. I already planned to have the meeting with you to discuss the entire changeover of all of the rec 114 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole facilities and the pools with Fairmount Park and anything else.
I appreciate that and you recognize that on the list of the seven facilities to be transferred four of them are in the district that I represent, so having talked about this issue way back in the Commissioner DiBerardinis days and the Director Bill Mifflin days, I want to thank everybody for finally following up on it, but if we are going to do it, I would like to make sure we do it right, we do it not only with a sense of urgency, but respect and methodology that lays out to people this is what is going on, this is what is going to happen, and that they don't have to hear it as they are walking down the street one day.
Let's talk about the coordinated plan. Commissioner, I will give you a copy of the pertinent section of the charter. The response in the materials that I received that I'm going to say attempted to respond to this particular issue, it is Chapter 6, Section 5-600, Letter A. Your response was "The administration's infrastructure rightsizing initiative combined with 115 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole the Fairmount Park strategic planning process provides the best opportunity to create a meaningful, comprehensive and coordinated program of recreational activities in all City recreational facilities. My question is, and I think that the analysis of the department's facilities, Fairmount Park's facilities, and even this transfer of the 7 is quite important, but I am still trying to understand how that is covered or how that responds to the pertinent section of the charter that talks about from time to time you are required to formulate a comprehensive and coordinated program of cultural and physical recreational activities to be instituted and conducted in all City recreational facilities including those managed and operated by the Fairmount Park Commission. Your response in the letter seems to be directed more at infrastructure and number of facilities and who has jurisdiction over those facilities. The charter provision seems to go more toward the actual activities at our centers and our facilities, whether they are managed and operated by the Recreation Department or the Fairmount Park Commission regardless of how many we have or what 116 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole their size is. This is a programmatic issue, so I want to know how that will be conducted, when there will actually be a document that reflects this requirement under our Home Rule Charter.
My initial response, that was changed as it went through all the amendments. I had set up an initial time line where I wanted to have a new governing body in place and implement it and I want to say it may have been by the 1st of July or the end of August. Right now the administration is trying to accomplish to have both entities' new master plan or strategic action plan done together and I would need direction from Rob and also the managing director and from I guess maybe other levels in the administration as well if needed. But I'm more in the middle of are we going to implement a new board or are we stuck in the middle waiting to see if an entire new strategic plan not only with Fairmount Park but the whole City. So I'm sorry I have to answer your question that way.
I understand that, 117 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole but I think, Commissioner, what the real question is goes to the heart of developing a plan that ensures that certain recreational activities and physical activities and programmatic activities will be available at our various sites regardless of who is running them or who is in charge of them or how many we have. That at least to me is my reading of this particular section, that there are a certain set of standards for the kind of programmatic and physical activity uses that will be at these sites and so my question again is when will that kind of document be developed that talks about the physical activity programs at our various facilities and does such a document exist today?
We have our program directories that we publish throughout the four seasons of the year. I'm sure you know we are about to produce the new summer brochure program as well on all the camping and things of that nature. So we continue to update that, add, delete, and amend as the season dictates, whether it is basketball, ice hockey, skating or whatever the case may be, the same thing along with the senior programs as well throughout the calendar of the year. And we have 118 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole been doing it more in the seasonal brochure for us to put something in a full yearly package to produce that's the big directory that we are working on production now, sir.
We will have a few more things to talk about on Monday. Let's talk about the document that you just mentioned. That issue came up when you were here before us and I think we had some discussion about how that was going to be produced. You did send me information -- not just to myself. I'm sure to all members -- about the different facilities and some of the activities there. The brochure that you are talking about or the directory that you are talking about, is this the item that came up as a part of the discussion with regard to Keel Communications and what they are charging us for compiling the data in addition to some printing charges? Is that what we talked about last time?
Mary Platt-Coles, 119 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole deputy commissioner, Department of Recreation. The Keel Communications contract is $95,000 and that's for the directory, recreation fliers, recreation banners and consultancy fee. The bulk of the contract is for the printing of the directory at $73,000 and for the printing of 200,000 copies.
I know you highlighted in some of the materials that we received. Who worked on the new logo for the Recreation Department?
The entire executive management team, also executives in the maintenance 120 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole division along with management in the program division as well.
That was done through Keel. Presentation was made back and changes and deletions, additions or recommendations by the upper management group of the whole department was involved.
I believe that was last year's contract which was encumbered for $50,000, but not that much was expended. I believe it was closer to 31 or 32 that was expended for various services.
I'm responding to 121 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole the response.
Right. I understand. A new quality newsletter was done, the development of logo, advertisement and PR and marketing relative to the opening and a promotion of all of the new teen centers as well and that's what I can recall off the top of my head, sir.
So when you made reference to the $31,000, what was that for?
You forwarded a copy of the Dell contract on concessions. I believe it is Attachment 7. Can you tell me where in this contract there was a discussion with regard to the sale of water? And it is prohibitive apparently as an item to be brought in by patrons. Now, is that correct?
That's correct, sir. My name is Carlton Williams, deputy commissioner for 122 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole the Department of Recreation.
Can you tell me where in this contract there is a specific prohibition on bringing water into the facility or an exclusive right to sell water?
On No. 15 -- the pages aren't numbered, but let me give you the correct reference number, sir.
Is that No. 15 that starts with "This concession privilege is exclusively for the sale of" -
I have no idea. I have to look into that to see what that is. I don't know what that is, sir.
We are selling comestibles? Is that your testimony, that we are selling comestibles out at the Dell East?
Sir, that is something I will have to look into. 123 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
I have no idea what that is. I think we need to know how we are doing that out there.
The section -- and unfortunately this is a copy that we received from our Procurement Department.
Yes, sir. There is a section that, unfortunately, looks like it is overwritten here for the sale of soft drinks, soda bottles and that is part of -- bottled water should be in there also.
"The City will designate exclusive pouring rights to an entity and concessionaires permitted to dispense and sell only those soft drink products so designated by the City," and it is in that section that results in the 124 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole exclusive right to sell water?
In Section 8 it talks about ancillary sales and approved products list. Is there an approved products list?
Prior to the submission of the season, the concessionaire must provide the City with a list of items that are going to be sold at the Dell.
There were other T-shirts and other items that are sold at the Dell through other promotional activities, yes, sir.
Did the City receive 30 percent of the gross sales receipts?
Those items were worked out with some of the marketing people from promotional tours such as the Isley Brothers, for example, brought T-shirts. They would sell items at the facility and then we would receive partial dollars for that also.
When you say "partial," are you talking about the 30 percent in 125 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole the contract?
And what was the total dollar amount that the City received last year as a result of that?
That information I will have to get to you, Councilman. I don't have that with me.
The written response seems to indicate, at least at the time of the response, which was March 31, that you were still waiting on the total gross sales out at the Dell. Have you received that information yet?
Requests have been made. I have not received that information. I will look into it again. I will make those requests again.
Our fiscal division and 126 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole the Dell East management division is responsible for that and I will receive that, sir.
Do you have a ballpark figure on what the gross sales were last year or the year before? That goes back to 2001, right?
I don't want to speculate. I would rather give you the answer for the information that I receive. I don't have any ballpark figure at this point in time.
Because according to the contract the concessionaire is required to keep those records and that they be available for the City for inspection at all times; is that correct?
I made the request directly after that hearing when the question was asked.
What's today, April 127 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole 7?
And in a month you have not received that information?
I will put another request in and submit a deadline for that. I will make sure that I will try to get it within two weeks, sir.
And you will forward that as a part of the information and you will do it during the course of this budget process?
Last question. Commissioner, there was a listing of facilities in one of these attachments you may recall. Oh, very interesting we have solved the mystery of comestibles. In an intense Web site search by Councilman Rizzo the Merriam Webster's dictionary lists comestible. It is food. We're selling food out at the Dell now and comestibles. 128 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole It's food. Councilman, thank you very much. It is the magic of the Web.
Who says City Council doesn't know how to get along with each other? I think it's Attachment 4 that we received as a part of the package. District 8, this is a listing of facilities. Can you tell me why the John Anderson Cultural Center is not listed as a facility for the Recreation Department?
Councilman, for the last years John Anderson has had a unique relationship 17 with us. As you know, they basically operate the 18 place on their own with the help of the community 19 association and all we have done over the years is 20 provide seasonal staff people in the summertime and the maintenance division handles the maintenance work orders for the facility. Other than that, for the most part they have been very independent and it has never been the site where they really -- the community never really wanted one of our supervisors 129 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole in that facility. And I know when I worked out there years ago we used to just oversee it. We 4 probably should have listed it and we will list it 5 as a site, but it never was in the, I guess you 6 would call it, the norm of the other operating sites 7 where we have a leader, an assistant, that type of 8 thing. 9
What I would like to 10 ask, Deputy Commissioner, is that after 20 years a 11 lot of things change and given the fact that the 12 Wynnefield community is one of the few communities 13 in the City that does not have a large or even a 14 small outdoor recreational facility and I do greatly 15 appreciate the relationship the Recreation 16 Department has had. There has been an increase 17 growth in youth population and an increased need for 18 facilities and I'm sure you heard earlier that there 19 is an effort underway to provide an additional 20 recreational facility in the Wynnefield community. In the meantime I would like to explore -- and we can add this to the list for Monday -- not only additional seasonal employees but also a regular full-time person. The community view on this issue is shifting and we need to make sure that 130 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole there is regular service with a program out at the Wynnefield Recreation Center or the John C. Anderson Cultural Center that is full time in regularity. Okay?
I know over the years I always liked John Anderson to be part of our regular department, so if the community now is amenable to coming in in a regular operating fashion, we can work with that. In fact, maybe that could be one of our recommendations for possible down the road after school licensing.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Is recreation still in charge of the Veterans Stadium? 131 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
Do you have anything to do with collections of monies from the Eagles or the Phillies or payments to them, or is that done by a different department?
It is handled through finance and revenue. The stuff comes to us. Most of the payments come through our staff there and they make the deposits, but it's all monitored through finance, revenue.
When we approved the Veterans Department, there was an agreement that with respect to what were called super boxes that beginning with 2001 we were told the City would begin receiving revenue from the super boxes. From what I have been able to discover, no such revenue has come from either team, the Phillies or the Eagles. Do you know or does Mr. Dubow, who I see has approached the table too, whether that's so?
That is so. We have an ongoing dispute with the Eagles and the Phillies about their payments to the City and one of the issues is the sky box flip revenue. We sent them letters saying they owe us the money. We have not 132 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole received it yet.
Since you sent them the letters, has there been any occasion when the City has sent the money or paid any bills for the new stadiums?
I would have to check. I'm not sure that there has been, but I would have to check.
Even new lawyers know that if they are suing somebody for nonpayment to their client their client doesn't make payments to either side. That's one way you begin to enforce your rights. I would like if you could bring to us an up-to-date list of payments to and from Eagles, Phillies and the City of Philadelphia and/or any agency that may be representing the City of Philadelphia like PAID, any payments by PAID to the teams or any payments received by PAID as well as the City of Philadelphia and any other agencies that the City may use and that would receive or make payments to the teams. I'm concerned because that's one of the problems of being a long-term member is you might remember that the only reason the Vet Stadium was 133 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole ever approved by this City Council originally some 30-odd years ago was because of assurances made to the Council by the then Mayor, Mayor Goode, that we may have to wait a long time but sooner or later real money is going to come into the City from the super boxes, and that was the decisive vote that finally received the support of City Council in the financing of the original Vet Stadium. And I think if the promises of those who deal with the City and the promises of the City when they sweet talk us when they are seeking money or approval, I think the credibility of both the teams and the City is at stake, so I would appreciate, Mr. Dubow, if you could make that information available to us. They are all public records.
I understand what you want and we will get it to you and just for the record we share your concerns.
Right. Very good. That means we will get it, and I don't mean just a writing, at a time when we can question you about it.
I understand what you want. We'll get it to you in a timely fashion. 134 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
Now to Commissioner Richard. I'm interested in updating stories on two recreation centers. One is Belfield, which waited many, many years for rehab and finally got rehab, at least in part, and I would like to know the story on that, and the other one is on the Morris Estate, which I think has never had any rehab. I would like to know if there are any plans for that.
Belfield is still in great shape, Mr. Councilman, and I thank you for your leadership on the Belfield piece. To my knowledge right now there is no other plans to do any physical plant structure. I know we are about to make some management changes and Deputy Commissioner Carapucci can talk about that piece.
The president/supervisor there is on the DROP plan and he will be using up his time. He will be retiring sometime in early June, so we have identified someone that we are going to put there. His name is Denny Williams.
Could I ask, are you in touch with the community organization that is involved with their --
We would like to avoid a problem of somebody coming in that there has been a history with that is not satisfactory and we would like to avoid that.
We addressed that about two weeks ago and that is why the gentleman who is coming is who is coming. Thank you.
Good. And with respect to Morris Estate, a quiet, sleeping recreation center that has never demanded much. It once was the pride of West Oak Lane. It had an outdoor amphitheater which is in a state of disrepair and hasn't been used in many years and the insides have not seen any rehab work for many, many a year. Do you have any report on Morris Estate?
The capital improvements to Morris Estate was directly related to the play area, Councilman. We did make some improvements in 2001 to the play area. The building itself, I agree with you, does need some support in that area. It is a relatively old building and it needs to be addressed. We met with several members of the community about the conditions of that facility and the usage and some of the activities that were 136 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole occurring at night during off hours and we have tried to address them by working with the community, with the police department and also providing more support maintenancewise to that facility, but we have not done any capital improvements to the building itself or the structure.
The capital improvements that have been made since I have been here -- I know last year the basketball facility on top was reblacktopped and some other stuff. We did some minor floor repairs on the interior of the building. The biggest concern right now on the facility that I would like to see get done was issues relative to the gutters and the drainage system around the perimeter and also the windows so we can make the facility structure tight and then go from inside. Last year we also cleaned up the inside, threw a lot of stuff away and I want to say one or two rooms had new vinyl flooring put in, but my biggest concern right now would be the exterior piece, the gutters and the windows, so we can prevent more water damage and go from there, sir.
Thank you very much. Thank you, Madam Chair. 137 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
Commissioner, you said that you have four teen centers. Where are they other than Kingsessing and Myers? Where are the other two?
Rivera at 5th and Allegheny and McVeigh at D and Ontario and that was number one and two in that order.
So that I will go on the record, I have the same concerns that Councilman Nutter has in terms of the 9th Councilmatic District. I think we had this discussion in my office about that.
I won't go through with the same discussion you had with him, but I will say ditto on everything.
Thank you. I will go back to Mr. Dubow and the managing director. Thank you.
It seems that we represent districts that are taxpayers, voters, but we never get placed on the map. We have to just continue to fight for every little thing for these people in their community and I agree with the 138 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole councilman that we can't wait until it's broke to fix it. We have prevention and that's the message we have tried to send throughout this Council, not just in Recreation but in infrastructure throughout the City of Philadelphia. So I strongly echo his concerns. Are there any other questions by Members of Council to the commissioner?
And I have other questions of the managing director that don't necessarily relate to the Rec Department so I would like for you to stay and answer those questions.
Councilwoman Tasco, while I have the mike, if you don't mind, one of the facilities that we are talking over is Fisher Park in your Councilmatic district. I want to say tomorrow at 2:00 or 3:00, and I don't have my calendar with me, I will make the first visit as well. I will also be seeking to meet with you so I make sure that I make contact with the proper 139 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole community groups as well when we make that transfer as well.
Good afternoon. Would you identify yourself for the record?
Thank you, Madam Chair. Mr. Goldsmith, thank you for coming over on such short notice. Madam Chair, if I could also have Commissioner Martinez. As I understand, she is also one of the key decision-makers in this particular issue. If she could be at the table as well, I would appreciate it.
Mr. Managing Director, I'm sure you have gotten an update, but, for the record, there has been an ongoing discussion which started not just on budget day for recreation 140 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole but actually last year in a general way about an additional teen center. There are six of them; is that correct?
I'm sorry. I was confusing them with the after-school programs, of which there are six. There are four of these teen centers throughout the City. The issue has arisen with regard to the placement of a center in the northwestern section of the city. It is my understanding that a variety of criteria are considered including crime statistics, I'm assuming number of youth, access to other facilities, quality of facilities and the like. This discussion has been ongoing for some time. West Philadelphia north of Market, which is covered by the 19th police district, I'm sure if you talk to Police Commissioner Johnson, he will tell you of some of the issues out in that district, and I mean I fully support the placement of these facilities where they are presently. I'm sure they are serving an at-risk and greatly in-need population, but part of the discussion earlier was also on the prevention side, notwithstanding 141 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole troubled areas of the city, but that all of our young people need a certain variety of services to the extent that we can spread them out geographically to try to serve as many people as possible, and what I'm left with in today's discussion is apparently but for a hundred to 125,000 dollars we could have one of these centers in West Philadelphia. We have identified, we believe, a location, a very large Class A size recreation center, and what I have asked the commissioner, the two commissioners and the budget director, and we wanted you here because you are listed as naturally a decision-maker in this process, is we find the necessary funds through a variety of funding sources which we have heard about in the course of this budget season that provide after-school programs and grants, juvenile justice grants and this grant and that grant and the other grant. I need a decision on this particular issue in the course of this budget season. I need a commitment from the four of you at the table that a decision, hopefully positive, will be made in the course of this budget season, a date certain by which the necessary work, 142 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole if any work was left to be done, would start and when the citizens out in West Philadelphia would start to receive the benefit of this kind of facility that other people are receiving in other neighborhoods but would come soon to this community with the full complement of resources that are available at these centers in other parts of the City. This is a very serious issue to me. I would like to have it resolved in the course of this budget season. I will not give you the same extended, somewhat agitated speech that I made earlier, but the same level of passion and commitment is here for your appearance as was about a half hour ago.
I appreciate that, Mr. Managing Director. It is a very serious issue --
And I think the fact 143 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole that we have started those teen centers shows that we believe in them and we would like to have as many as possible and we will look at where we can get the money and look at the other priorities and have a decision for you as soon as we can and we will explain to you why we made that decision, whether it be positive or contrary.
I appreciate that, Mr. Managing Director. Lastly, and I'm sure you will get this update as well, all I can ask -- and you're relatively new in the current position and fresh eyes can bring a different perspective. I need to ask that as we plan out these proposals, as good as they are, that consideration and some amount of discussion take place, even if we are only going to do a couple, that someone ask the question what about the rest of the City and when will we have on-line the similar facilities in other places, recognizing that either logistically or financially we cannot always start eight, nine or ten things at the same time. I understand that. But I think we owe our citizens and certainly this Council is owed some amount of scheduling and thought that goes into 144 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole these programs or proposals that says we can only do three. We have plans to do whatever and over the next few years we have identified the sites and the funding for these activities so that you at least have a notion that something is going to happen in a relatively short period of time as opposed to at times these either frantic or explosive situations under these circumstances, which are not necessarily the best way to set public policy, but that come out of the frustration of watching things happen and knowing what you have or what you don't have.
I'm not used to anybody saying that any of my requests are reasonable and by the time you reappear, you may have changed your mind, but for the moment --
You just said I had a fresh set of eyes and I truly believe and I think one thing we all know that serving public life that our problems far outstrip the resources --
-- and we can't do everything at once so I think it is important that 145 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole we set criteria, that we understand why we are doing things where and try to give some sense of time so that it not look like our decisions are capricious or arbitrary and that's the way I prefer to manage, so I agree with what you are asking for. I think it is reasonable.
Thank you, Mr. Managing Director. Madam Chair, I know you said you had questions for the managing director. I have some as well, but my request was for him to be here for the recreation part and I will defer.
Mine are not related to recreation. Do you have questions of Miss Martinez relative to the Recreation Department?
Only to ask, since I didn't get a chance to ask her directly, for her involvement in this process and her at least potential advocacy to have such a center and that the resources available to the department of human services may be looked upon as one source of funding.
Good afternoon. Alva Martinez from the Department of Human Services. 146 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole Councilman, we were not involved in the decisions about the location of the previously established teen centers, but I will participate in this decision-making process as required by the managing director.
Any other questions for the Recreation Department? There being none, Mr. Williams, you will certainly get the information that was requested by the councilman on the financial situation or in terms of the contract?
Thank you. I would note that information has to be presented to this committee before decisions are made on this budget. Just for clarification, Mr. Goldsmith, we got an amendment this morning and I guess this information was available to us in our capital budget book, but it sort of stands out for me here on of the amended budget for the capital, 2030 -- 30003. I notice that in the managing director's office you have funding for citywide 147 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole facilities and in addition to that green light upgrading. I mean how does all of that fall into your -- the green light lighting upgrades? Let me ask that question.
The green lighting upgrades, it is a more efficient way to do lighting and the municipal energy office reports to the managing director so it falls into the managing director's office budget.
No, I went too quickly. It's a project of the municipal energy office. It is an energy efficiency project and the municipal energy office reports to the managing 148 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole director, so it falls into the managing director's office budget in the capital program.
No, it is not that type of green lighting. The green lighting I think in this case means that they are energy efficient, so it is not streetlights.
We will get you a description of it. It is not traffic lights.
Thank you because I'm having such a hard time getting a turning light at Adams Avenue and Rising Sun. I don't understand when you have a corner with a traffic jam, the state has improved the -- has widened the street, that we cannot get a green turn light there. For those people who are traveling that intersection, it would certainly be very good. That's why I was looking at that.
It's a different issue, 149 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole but I would be delighted to talk to you about the issue that you are concerned about and see what the reasons are and what we may be able to do.
Madam Chair, I can only recommend to you that you may want to pursue legislative response to that. There has been a plethora of legislation around the issue of stop signs and traffic signals and the like and you may want to pursue the left turn arrow from a legislative standpoint.
Thank you very much. Any other questions of the managing director? Thank you for coming over.
Madam Chair, are you finished with the managing director?
Mr. Managing Director, we had talked back in late February about a plan for citywide deployment of the CLIP program. At the time the response was you anticipated having 150 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole a plan in 30 days and that conversation took place back on February 26. Do you have a sense of where this is right now?
I have reviewed an initial proposal and we need at least another meeting to kick it around, but we are looking at it and seeing how we can take that districtwide in particular parts of each district depending on what the criteria are, so we are working on that right now.
We also talked back at that time about the issue of homeowners receiving violation notices regarding failed retaining walls and the complications that some homeowners face with regard to having received the notice of violation, although the actual violation may not be at their home, but it attaches to the entire wall and the negative impact that that might have on their ability to either sell their home or get a mortgage or refinance, those kinds of issues. Any update on that?
The sinking hole 151 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole issue in the 400 block of North Daggett Street I have been concerned about for some time. Do we have a game plan on how we deal with the homes that were vacated as a result of City intervention as well as the remaining 75 percent of the homeowners who are still on the block?
Lastly, you have been involved or your office has been involved in discussion about zero tolerance policy regarding nuisance activities, specifically Haverford Avenue, Lansdowne Avenue and Main Street. Do you have any information on how we are going to implement zero tolerance policy on behavioral issues in those primarily commercial corridors that are surrounded by residential neighborhoods?
No, I do not. I have not been privy to those conversations, but I will followup on those. I have been involved in some conversations in Manayunk I think on slightly different issues.
Right. I think Fran from your office, she and I were in a meeting together. 152 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole Lastly, I think it is still called the First Union, but maybe now it is just generally referred to as the bike race and the need for extra coordination with the neighborhoods that the bike race traverses through. The race itself is fine. It is the after race activities that are leading to a deterioration in the neighborhood appreciation for the bike race, similar to your office's efforts -- and I'm sure you have been involved more recently in how we calmed things down, for instance, on South Street in a post Mardis Gras situation. We need some of that same kind of attention to a major event that does come through the neighborhoods. As I said, the daytime activities are fine. It is the post bike race activities that are destroying the reputation and the good will built up by the bike race in those areas that it is traveling through.
Are there any other questions from Members of the Council for the 153 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole managing director? Thank you very much. Are there any questions for the Department of Human Services?
Good afternoon. Alva Martinez, the commissioner of the Department of Human Services, and joining me are Cheryl Ransom, deputy commissioner, David Fair, director of community-based prevention.
Excuse me for a moment. Could we get about a five-minute break? The stenographer needs a break.
The Committee is back in session. Thank you. At this time the Chair recognizes Councilman Nutter.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Commissioner Martinez, from your responses in a letter dated March 25, 2003 there 154 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole were a number of attachments based on information requests. One of them was a request to provide a list of after-school programs funded by DHS and their locations of operation. Also, please note if there is any overlap on the after-school programs administered through the Recreation Department, Philadelphia Safe and Sound or DHS. That was a request I made at the time. Your response I believe is captured by Attachment D in the materials; is that correct?
Commissioner, I looked at this document and spent some time with it last night. First, I think there is one error. If you would go to -- the pages are not numbered, but if you would go to the Fourth District.
Councilman, they are attachments C and D. So you are looking at Attachment D?
In the letter the response indicated that Attachment D was responsive to that question. C seemed to be -- C was provide a 155 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole map of DHS providers for prevention services and also provide the number of people serviced by each provider and their location. That was Attachment C.
This is David Fair, director of prevention services. Attachment D refers to the after-school and Beacon programs that are funded through the Children's Investment Strategy project. There are a number of other providers that we had to do after school on these development programs that are listed on the regular contract list. That is Attachment C.
We will get to that. Thank you. Commissioner, if I could direct your attention to -- as I said, the pages are not numbered, but if you go to the Fourth District.
That West Kensington Boys and Girls Club, I'm going to assume that that was an error and that probably goes potentially with 156 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole the Seventh District, potentially.
We will check on that. I believe you might actually be correct on that.
Even with our most recent protracted and slightly convoluted round of redistricting I think I did not capture West Kensington.
What I'm wondering is whether there is another program that replaces this one, so we will clarify that.
I appreciate that. For our purposes at least in terms of the statistical analysis, I did move West Kensington over into the Seventh District. You'll rework it and we will figure it out.
When I looked at the sites and I characterized them as you did and split them out into three categories, you have the after-school existing, you have the after-school new, and then you have the Beacon and the family center, some of which are new and some of which are expansions, but I kept those three categories basically together. And for the three categories 157 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole you have number of slots, you have total dollars associated with those slots, and then I did some total totals and some percentage analyses based on all of this information. It is literally just on a notepad here, but I would be glad to share the information with you. The first question I guess is for all of the new or expanded, for instance, why don't we just take the first page and looking at the first district, you have a new Beacon and what appear to be two new family centers. In the slots category you have NA, which I guess is not applicable at the moment. Does that mean that these programs will not have, quote/unquote, slots? Is that why that category -- is that why it is listed that way or you haven't figured out the number of slots?
For the Beacon program at the time this list was developed awards had just been made, so they hadn't been determined yet. For the family centers, the reason it is listed that way, I think, is they don't just do after school, but they also do parenting and case management and I think when Safe and Sound did this list, they just didn't have that information available to them. But they 158 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole are not new family centers. What they are is -- Caring People's Alliance is a new provider of a family center.
I understand. I don't need to get into the particulars in the different districts because you have repeated that same methodology throughout the documents, so I am just taking that as an example. All of them have NA in that particular area. The after-school existing and the after-school new do list the number of slots, and so I want to talk about the number of slots. You have broken out the document by Councilmatic district, so I would like to stay in that format. One, is there any particular average cost associated with these slots, or is it more a function of who is providing the service and the location involved?
In almost every case the school year programs are funded at the level of $1,500 per slot. If there is a summer program involved, it goes up to about $2,000. 159 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
And you are here for the earlier discussion with regard to recreation, and some of the -- I guess in the concept of how we provide a certain level of balanced service throughout the City and making sure that to the greatest extent possible more and more of our children can avail themselves and their parents naturally of these services. So I would like to get a better understanding and I'm just going to run through these numbers as they are laid out in your charts, and so this is number of slots by Councilmatic district and these are totals by district. In the first it is 672, in the second 680, in the third 777, in the fourth 243, in the fifth 1197, in the sixth it's 62, in the seventh it is 1033, in the eighth it is 860, in the ninth it is 374 and in the tenth it's zero. Most districts seem to be up in the 6, 700 range and then we have a couple that are over a thousand and then we have some that are significantly less. Can you tell me what the thinking was here or how we ended up with some of these numbers?
As I mentioned earlier, 160 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole Councilman, the goal of the Children's Investment Strategy is to target those neighborhoods where there are the highest rates of abuse and neglect. It is the same conversation we have had several times. The funding is targeted to the areas of the City where according to existing data there are either the highest numbers of underserved kids or the lowest number of quality programs available for those kids, but the resources that are available --
Now, what's going on at these locations? What are the services that are being provided?
The basic after-school program includes an academic assistance component, a physical recreational component, some kind of community service or community activity and some cultural activities and that's basically the big outline of what they do. The Beacons have a little bit more intense services. They also will be eventually offering parenting programs and various community education programming.
Wouldn't most children benefit from these children programs 161 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole regardless of whether they are abused or not?
Absolutely, but the data indicates that there are a hundred thousand children in Philadelphia who after school have literally no 6 place to go where there is an adult. So the target for the Children's Investment Strategy has been to fill that particular gap. In some areas of the City the gap is greater than in others. In terms of the funding source, the money that is used primarily for this, at least as far as DHS is concerned, our requirement under the state and federal guidelines is to target the constituency that we are responsible for, which is the constituency of kids and families whose risk of involvement in the abuse and neglect in the child protection and juvenile justice system is highest.
So you're telling me either one of two things, that either children in the fourth, six, ninth and tenth districts either, one, have an incredible number of after-school programs and activities available to them such that they don't need any of these services or, two, that the statistical data seems to indicate that there is no need for these services? 162 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
Neither of those statements is accurate. The gap is greater in those neighborhoods. No neighborhood in the City has sufficient resources for all kids to be safe after school. Some neighborhoods in the City have fewer resources available than others and that has been the priority for this investment.
I guess then my only response to that is given what you said, is there any minimum level that all of the areas or in this instance you have broken out the data by Councilmatic district which again naturally, one, thank you, makes it a lot easier for all of us to be oriented to the data. I mean, should we have a system that says we will serve a minimum number of children in each area and then either as need or statistics indicate or as abuse or unfortunate circumstances arise we will serve even more? This is all new to me so I'm trying to understand the strategy here.
The Children's Investment Strategy itself is actually based on that kind of understanding. There is a basic level of service 163 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole available in the neighborhood and the idea was to make sure that all neighborhoods in the City have a level of service that was at least roughly equivalent to what the community needs. We are not even close to that. We have only gotten about a third of the way toward the capacity that we are trying to build in terms of after-school and youth development programs, but in certain areas of the City there are not publicly funded perhaps, but there are programs for children or the likelihood that there will be a parent at home after school so that the child can go home, that they are not latch-key children. All of those factors were taken into account. And so in some neighborhoods of the City you have much greater challenges for children, but you also have resources available for those children. In many areas of the city you have very great challenges to the children and no resources. In some sections of the city the challenges are not that great and there seem to be, based on that analysis which was conducted with the Robert Wood Johnson grant a few years ago, based on that analysis there is adequate opportunity, out-of-school-time opportunity for those kids. 164 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole In addition to those programs that are listed here as part of the Children's Investment Strategy, we do have other programs that are targeting kids with special needs. We have an intensive delinquency prevention -- two intensive delinquency prevention programs in the Fourth Councilmatic District and we have a variety of parenting programs, again, not at the level that we have in some other areas of the city where the need is greater, but it sort of depends on what the service is that we are trying to provide and how intense and how broadly shaped it is.
I wanted to add that the Department of Human Services receives funding from the state to prioritize the most vulnerable kids and families in the City. It does not mean that those resources cannot be applied to meet the basic needs of children all across the city and, in fact, as you will see, we are making new investments in every district, and I certainly understand your concern -- I have heard it repeatedly today -- about investing in a higher level in the Fourth District. That being said, from my standpoint it is still early in our re-engineering of the 165 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole Department of Human Services and we have drawn down a significant amount of TANF money through DHS into the City and the state, at the time they granted that to us, made it pretty clear that they wanted us to use that money to target the most vulnerable communities. Now we have done that. We have made that commitment and we have continued to follow the data that tells us where the abuse, neglect and delinquency is in the City and at the same time we are creating systems of social services, Councilman, that will meet the needs of kids anywhere where they may live. It's a challenge when you have such a large city to take what I consider a little bit of money given our needs and make it work for everyone in the same way, but I guess what I want to say is we have been data driven. We have been data driven and really looking at where the gaps were in relation to where the highest level of abuse, neglect and delinquency comes from, but we are not ignoring the needs of the City as a whole. In fact, as David Fair says, the Children's Investment Strategy has as a goal raising money that will help us provide services to 100,000 166 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole kids throughout the City and we are on our way to that goal, but we have not met it yet.
Where does the money come from? I mean what I added up on this document was a little over $27 million. Where does that money come from?
I don't know where all of it comes from. Most of it comes from TANF funding that's awarded by the Office of Children, Youth and Families in Harrisburg to DHS for this purpose. There is other money that the Children's Investment Strategy gets for its investments including human services development fund money, some Work Force Investment Act funding. I don't know how that money gets allocated.
Let me make one comment based on the response from the commissioner, and in any of my passion about this let me try to assure you that it is not singly directed at just the district that I represent, although I am a very passionate advocate for the district, but, as I mentioned, there are four districts that stand out rather significantly in this analysis, not just the Fourth, but also the Sixth, the Ninth and the Tenth. 167 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole Now, as Councilwoman Tasco mentioned when she was in the Chair a little while ago, and we have seen this in a couple other situations, I think by anyone's estimation some of these areas, and there are many others, but some of these districts seem to at a certain level suffer from decency of either reputation or census tract analysis that would indicate either above average incomes or house values and the like and often in some instances -- well, I will just leave it at maybe inadvertently are often looked upon as neighborhoods that don't necessarily need some of these services or a higher level of attention. This is not directed at DHS. This is at times throughout the government and it can be found in a variety of government services by departments. I don't want to be in a situation where -- again, you heard this in the earlier discussion -- we spend a tremendous amount of resource, which is appropriate, in certain parts of the city and basically tell the other parts, well, you are doing fairly well and you guys just have to fend for yourselves and when you start having problems though, give us a call and we will be glad to get a 168 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole good program going for you as well. I think we have to change -- I mean I just basically reject that mind set. I'm not going to allow myself to get caught in the debate between the haves and the have nots as opposed to a discussion that says everyone gets a certain baseline level of support and then we look at our statistical analyses and risk factors and the like and build on that base. But when you look at this, I have to believe that there are more than 243 -- I'm assuming a slot represents a child?
I have to believe there are more than 243 kids in the entire district that have a need or that only 62 kids in the Sixth District, no children in the Tenth and little more than what is happening over in the Fourth at 374 in the Ninth. Do we have a variety of recreational centers and other activities that may not be reflected on here? Sure. I'm not debating that or discounting that either, but Gompers Grade School in the Wynnefield community can serve a whole host of kids, but you have Mann right down the street as well or Beeber. There are a number of schools in 169 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole West Philadelphia, Overbrook High being one and a variety of others. There are things going on in those neighborhoods that are not at times the most positive, so sure I'm going to be a passionate advocate for the district and I would like to see the numbers up in certain ways, but some of this is just public policy.
Let me just say that your approach to doing an analysis that has kind of a baseline service level for every district is one that I actually favor. I think it's a really good idea and I'm going to encourage us to go back and work with our partners to come up with a model that would be satisfactory. I just want to emphasize that we are still aggressively in the process of raising -- making more resources available toward the Children's Investment Strategy goal, number one; number two, that other services in all of these districts are not reflected in this document and perhaps had we had more time and we would have thought about this, we would have mapped that because it is important to recognize that there are other sources of investments, many, many, services 170 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole in the district that have an impact on children.
Right, and at the same time I don't want to ignore any of them, so if I'm only working from the one document that doesn't reflect everything else that is out there, then --
-- the document doesn't lie. It says what it says and it certainly shows that these resources are invested more heavily in districts where we mapped out and see some higher levels of abuse and neglect. That being said, it would be narrow-minded for the department to wait for kids to get hurt in order to start investing. Let me just be very clear that that's why I created a prevention division, so I take your recommendations to heart and, as I said, three years is a long time; however, we have been doing some major restructuring and I will take that as a challenge and opportunity to not back away from our commitment to invest in the high-risk areas where kids are getting hurt but to do it in a way, to 171 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole enhance our analysis in a way, that is more satisfactory to all Council people even if you are blessed with a district with lower negative outcomes, which I think is something that we should all be happy for.
True. Two last questions: One, I am aware that Daroff I believe was identified a couple years ago or at least a year or so ago as a Beacon location, although I don't see it on the chart here and maybe it's in a different category or a different program. Secondly, I would like to better understand I guess the connection or the relationship here between Philadelphia Commercial Development Corporation/LIFE, which I'm sure is some wonderful acronym, and the two schools involved, Bluford and Gompers, which also have stars next to them or an asterisk, but I could not figure out from the document what the asterisk meant.
I don't know what the asterisk means. I think I can find that out for you. I think that PCDC is the conduit for the organization which is LIFE, where they -- how they get their cash because they must not have their own 172 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole 501-C-3, but I will have to check that out. I don't have the details on that.
Thank you, and if you would find out what LIFE stands for as well, I would appreciate that.
I'll do that as well. I know that the Daroff Beacon was moved to another school because of some issue around the school building itself, but I would have to go back and find out why that happened.
This was the first round of Beacon funding. I remember there was some discussion about the fact that we had to find another site, but I don't remember what it is, so I will have to get back to you on that one as well.
If you could let me know about that, I would appreciate it. I will put this analysis in a more readable fashion so you don't have to drive yourself crazy trying to figure out my notes, but let's talk about Attachment E, which is in response to a question regarding your communication strategy. 173 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole This was actually a question raised both by Councilwoman Tasco and myself. I took a look at Attachment E by the fiscal years that you have laid out. On the letter itself it makes reference to the printers and who the media person is and the like. Do you see that page? The question was "Provide the names of subcontractors used by Keel Communications in its work for the department. Indicate if they are a Philadelphia based, minority owned, and/or women owned. That was Councilwoman Tasco's question. And then I asked about the issue of double payment for vendors regarding Keel Communications and the placement of radio ads and for management concession. Your response is in terms of printers the two printers are Americor Press located in Bensalem, PA, and Consolidated Drake which you have listed as a woman co-owned business. Do you know who the principals are of Americor Press?
I do not have that information at this moment, but I will get it to you.
And who decided to use that particular vendor? 174 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
I am not sure if our communications director participated in that decision or whether it was Frank who made the decision. I'm not sure. I can find that out.
With regard to Consolidated Drake, which is over on Parkside Avenue and is actually in the Fourth District, you should also know that there is a minority male who has a printing operation located within the premises of Consolidated Drake and so if work is going over there, you may have an opportunity to help a minority vendor as well as a female at that location.
Who made the decision to utilize Harmaline, which is located in Bala Cynwyd?
Again, I would need to confirm whether our communications director was part of making that decision or whether that came 175 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole recommended and chosen by Keel Communications and I will find that specific answer out for you and let you know.
And the funding for these items -- I'm not moving to Attachment E. You have given us three fiscal years, Commissioner, and if I could ask for fiscal year 2000 data with the same printout. I know you were distracted. You have given us 2001, 2002 and 2003. If you could also provide us with 2000, fiscal year 2000, with the same data here, I would appreciate it.
The funding for these items, is that from your general fund expenditures, or is this also primarily the funding that you get from either the state or federal government?
It is funding that comes from the state, federal and City, and it falls under the category of administrative expenses that the department incurs. And they are reimbursable by those funding streams.
In one of your 176 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole responses -- I don't know whether it is in the letter or somewhere -- you indicated that you have 75 different vendors that you utilize in the DHS communications strategy. It is in the letter.
Is that a tad overwhelming at some level, to have to deal with 75 different vendors on communications?
Well, we have used them over the years for specific needs that we have and, as you will see, we have been very busy on the communications front --
-- and doing a wide range of outreach and education activities and so different vendors meet different needs. It is quite a bit. I agree with that. And certainly it is -- it has been a priority for us to get out in the public and as I mentioned earlier our reports of abuse and neglect are up by 12 percent and I firmly believe that while my agenda is to reduce the number of abuse and neglect cases in the City, we can't reduce it unless we know about it and so part of -- that's just one example of why this investment is 177 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole important because clearly people were underreporting in the City because we were not doing outreach. So, yes, it is a lot to manage.
I want to talk about one last item. The data comes from Attachment E. For 2001 Fund for Philadelphia the administrative fees were $30,108.39. Now, please explain this to me. You pay the Fund for Philadelphia an administrative fee for what?
4 percent of the funding that they administer for administrative and fiscal support services and just the management of the funding and the maintenance of records and the production of records for the department.
In that same fiscal year Harmaline Media, the cost was $106,290.75. This was for a radio ad campaign to recruit staff?
Well, the ads were informing the public that there were job 178 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole opportunities available at the Department of Human Services for social workers and for youth detention counselors because at the point I became commissioner we were really in a crisis with understaffing and we're understaffed now, but we are much better than we were before. We have hired over 300 social workers since I became commissioner with a net gain of 70 over the level that we had when I became commissioner. High turnover is a problem of crisis proportion nationally in child welfare systems and it was really a very targeted ad campaign that was put through a lot of minority media, community newspaper, radio, et cetera, to get people to apply for the jobs. And we have been so successful that central personnel closed the test last month because they had 400 applications they were not able to process, but right now we have no 19 list because we basically hired everybody off of the list. It's a really tough situation and the reason why, Councilman, I made the decision to make this investment, even though I think it's a lot of money and I think it is too much money, that's what it costs, is because central personnel does not have 179 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole the capacity or the financial resources in their budget to do it the way that DHS needs it done so had I not invested from our federal, state and local resources, it would not have happened. And we had no choice really. At this point, as you will see, we have shifted -- or I don't know if it is reflected here. This year we shifted our targeted campaign to youth detention counselors because that's where we had an even bigger crisis, so we are reducing overtime by bringing in the right staff in addition to other strategies. There's a very high turnover rate in the Department of Human Services because of the nature of the work.
I understand. It's very tough work. Why is that? Why do you have such a high turnover rate?
Well, because staff make life-and-death decisions, because the workloads are intense and the caseloads are high, even though we have been bringing them down, because there is a huge amount of pressure constantly from the clients, from the public, from the courts, and because they can find work that pays equal or maybe even a little 180 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole less but still is less stressful out in the community. However, however, I believe it's also because the department had not done the kinds of things that needed to be done to make staff feel supported and noted. For example, we got phones for all of our social workers. When I became commissioner, social workers shared phone lines even in our new building. That's not acceptable. So it is also about investing in our staff and we are doing that and our retention is going up because we are lowering caseloads investing in our staff and bringing in more bodies to carry the load.
It's always tough with these averages, but what's the average salary of a caseworker?
From the top of my head I think -- well, the starting salaries are 27 and 28 for Social Worker I and II and I believe $34,000 -- no, for Trainee and I 27 and 28,0000; for Social Worker II the starting salary is $34,000. And the other thing we have done is reopen the test for Social Worker IIs which allows us to bring in people with experience and master's degrees. That was not 181 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole open when I became commissioner. I believe many of our social workers are making around 45, $50,000. That's what I remember off the top of my head because we have a fair amount of people that have stayed there a long time. I might also add we have close to 600 social workers at any point in time working in the department so it's natural that there is going to be movement. It is a big organization.
I understand. In the same fiscal year, 2001, the department, according to Attachment E, paid Keel Communications $401,006.23 for a variety of services. Is that about ten social workers?
Maybe a little less with benefits. You know, councilman, I believe that it might be something, that amount of money might be a number of social workers, and I'm not sure if it was ten or it might be less. It might be less.
I totally understand the point, but I also -- I understand the point and I accept the point, but I also want to be very clear that we don't do communications investments for 182 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole social purposes or for publicity purposes. We did it because we believe that an investment in outreach and an investment in recruitment of staff and an investment in changing the image of the Department of Human Services so that people trust us and come to us and accept us as the primary entity in the City that is responsible for this work was a good investment and I truly believe that over time we will be able to minimize our communications investment because we won't have as great a need to build trust like we did initially. In fact, for next year we are projecting a budget that is significantly lower than the budget we had this year because we believe we can now begin to shift that money into other expenses and also because the economy is bad and that's where we are going to -- that is a priority area to cut.
Are you anticipating bringing any of these services inhouse?
Well, we are definitely committed to using our internal resources as much as possible and based on the questions that I have received, quite frankly, I am going to personally get more involved in finding out what kind of 183 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole infrastructure we can access internally in the City because sometimes, Councilman, the issue for me is speed. It doesn't mean that I can't get the work done. It is that there would be tremendous delays for me to get it done inhouse because there is a backlog and so perhaps there are ways that I can work with procurement and printing and maybe invest some resources in building their capacity so that they can serve the department better. And so, yes, we will make a commitment to reduce costs as much as possible with that strategy as part of our plan.
Let's talk about 2002 and 2003 quickly. The Fund for Philadelphia, $51,000 in administrative fees; Harmaline Media, $10,000 for radio ads for the juvenile justice conference; Keel Communications, $391,788.72. For 2003, Fund for Philadelphia, $36,801; Harmaline Media, 114,525 and Keel Communications $273,236.78. The total for the three fiscal years is the Fund for Philadelphia you have paid in administrative fees $117,964.90; Harmaline Media, $231,498.50 and Keel Communications is $1,660,031.73 for various services. 184 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole First, why does the administrative fee seem to fluctuate at least over that three-year period with the Fund for Philadelphia?
My understanding would be that it's dependent on the amount of money that was administered through the Fund for Philadelphia. It is 4 percent of whatever money is administered.
Commissioner, you were here earlier and actually you were at the table. We had a somewhat painful, slightly agitated, at least on my side, discussion about a teen center in West Philadelphia which I don't have because we need 100 to $125,000 to open a teen center in West Philadelphia, but over the last three years we have spent over a million dollars to a communications person. I'm not commenting on the quality of work. I have actually never seen any of the work. It could be wonderful for all I know, although I have been around for the last three years and I'm not sure that any of it has kind of penetrated my mind. I don't understand why I don't have a teen center versus a million dollars in communications. I would like to communicate with the teens out in West Philadelphia and I can do it a 185 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole lot cheaper, for about $125,000.
I did hear your comments about that, Councilman, and, as I said before, I will be part of any kind of planning that the managing director pulls together to look at how we can give you a response as quickly as possible. I will say that under my administration of the Department of Human Services we have invested a significant amount of money, many millions of dollars, in new and re-engineered programs and that I believe that a million dollars in communications, while it is a significant amount of money, relates to the fact that our department had absolutely no 15 infrastructure to communicate with the public, to recruit staff, to give people information about our hotline, to build a customer service line, which we did not have, and I accept your comment and I can just tell you that from where I was sitting at the time as commissioner, that had I not invested in building a communications infrastructure, I could not have done my job. I accept the questions. I think that they are important questions and I will answer to the best of my ability, but we are aware of where 186 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole every single one of those dollars went and what we got for it. And I am accountable for that expenditure, but I am very committed to investing money in programs and that has been my priority, in programs, services, and not only programs and services, but quality programs and services. So I'm not going to -- I can't use -- I accept your comments and I just am simply saying that our communications strategy has to do with improving the quality of services that DHS does and many questions have been raised which will allow me to help me think about this more carefully in the future.
Where do you anticipate these same three categories or cost centers to be in FY '04?
We are planning for a significant reduction in communications because we are planning for a potential reduction in funding overall in the Department of Human Services, so we are expecting to reduce it to at least $700,000, if not more if we have to, again over a department that has $600 million in funding overall and that has a responsibility to do the kind of things we have to do. 187 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
Look, I believe in as much communication as the next person, but I also believe even stronger in providing service and you just have to have a greater sense of appreciation from the earlier discussion to now this discussion about some of these dollars. The pot is not unlimited and while we are out communicating in a certain way with people, we also need to be providing services. So I'm not saying that your department or agency should be fully responsible for the funding of the teen center, although I understand the agency is involved in that particular program, but these are some pretty hefty figures. As a regular citizen who -- I mean I watch a little TV, I listen to the radio every now and then, and I'm sure people are paying attention to this and they are responding and they are hearing and they are seeing and they are doing, but, quite frankly, that's not doing anything for us getting closer to providing direct services in an environment where dollars are shrinking and you are telling me you are reducing that particular budget.
Councilman, let me just say this: The communications budget will be reduced 188 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole next year and some of the figures that you quoted have been going down, as you yourself noted, but let me just say this: If the department spends 350 -- I mean the situation I came into is that the Department of Human Services was spending at that time I guess around $300 million in programs and services that the community often did not know about. My own staff did not know the kinds of things that DHS had available for our families. It was a crisis situation, and I think that clearly the priority for us in expenditures has to be direct service. It has to be. There is no question about it. And I'm as uncomfortable as you are with the notion that we spend any money on any administrative costs. However, if we have services and people don't know how to access those services when they need them, then the services are not effective and it is as good as if they were not there. One of the issues we confront in the City is that we fund things and then they get underutilized. My position is that our communications investment has to be conservative, it has to be cost efficient and it has to be strategically used and I will account for that to 189 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole Council on a continuing basis and any time I can cut, I will cut.
I appreciate that. Last question. Do you know what the size of either of the two firms may be, Harmaline Media or Keel Communications? Do you know how many people work there?
I would not know the exact number. I don't believe they are particularly large firms. I believe they are small firms, but I don't know an exact number and we will find that out for you.
Yes. One comment you made earlier was that the personnel department did not have the capability to recruit as you might have wanted them to and that you found it necessary to do your own recruitment and you found dollars in your budget to do that. The use of those dollars, were you supposed to use those dollars for recruitment processes, or were they dollars supposed to be used for services? 190 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
Were they categorized -- yes. How were they categorized, the funds that you used?
If you used federal dollars, what federal dollars did you use? If you used state dollars, what dollars did you use? If you used local dollars, what dollars did you use?
I'm asking our finance director, John Senier, to join me in explaining the funding streams that were used for this purpose.
Good afternoon, Councilwoman. The funding for this is 34 percent is federal Title 40 dollars, around 40 percent is Act 148 dollars -- I'm sorry. It is more than that. It is around 45 percent, and around 12 cents of a dollar for City dollars.
Where did those dollars come from? They came from the state but what did you apply for those dollars for?
They were part of the mix 191 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole of the department's needs-based budget request. The department makes a needs-based budget request to the state and it has the expenditure items listed of what we intend to spend and it also provides the funding sources and under that allocation we were able to do these communications.
When you applied for the money, did you cite in your application that you were going to use the money for communications or recruitment?
Specifically, no, at that time, but we can reallocate funds with the approval from the state and we subsequently reallocated our categorical funding to the state to include that and which they approved.
Councilwoman, I would also like to add that we meet with the state on a very regular basis, more than once per month. They know what we are doing, and if they have a problem with anything we are doing, they let us know. Recruitment of staff is something that they will cite us on and we can lose our license for having too high caseloads, so it is like they don't exactly tell us how to do our job, but they will tell us if 192 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole your caseloads hit above 30 to 1 cases per social worker, then they put our license at risk, and so that's why they give us the flexibility to just solve our problems in the ways we want it and we would use our administrative dollars for this kind of expense, not direct service dollars. No direct services were cut to do this and I also want to say that DHS, before I became commissioner, always returned money to the state. There was always a significant amount of underspending at DHS that was returned to the state, so I really did not have to take away from anything. In fact, I brought money into the City with a lot of help and so this money was not ever taken away from any direct service.
Thank you very much. Are there any other questions from Members of Council? Thank you very much.
Good afternoon. Thank you for your patience. Please identify yourself for the record. 193 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
I'm Fay Moore, SEPTA's general manager, and joining me is Frances Jones, AGM of government affairs.
Thank you, Madam President. Good afternoon, Miss Moore. Would you please update me on my request for detailed information about what public transportation infrastructure is owned by the City and not SEPTA?
I don't remember receiving it and I think I would have taken particular note to it. Can you check with the Council President's office and/or re-send a copy to my office?
We sent 20 copies to the Council President's office as a part of our response.
I have been waiting 194 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole for it.
The original response with that information on the lease leaseback was sent over in a timely manner and that was the first package that was sent over, the full package, and then there was another attachment that was sent over also.
Did you also send copies of the actual lease leaseback agreement?
In previous testimony, I believe you testified on March 11, did you reference a need for service cuts and fare increases on that date?
No, I just said, like everybody else, we would have to do some tightening of the budget and just give a heads-up that we were looking at some deficit situations.
Why did you not reference it if the fiscal situation is that severe? My understanding is that what happened with relation to the state is a difference of $15 million, but it obviously was already a $40 million problem, so why 195 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole would you not reference the need for fare increases and/or drastic service cuts at that point?
Because at that point in time we did not know what mechanism we were going to take. We alluded to the fact that, like other agencies, we had a deficit and a budget situation, but we did not know exactly which direction we were going to take.
Miss Moore, in the package you just recently sent to I believe all Members of Council -- I don't believe I was the only one to receive it -- there is actually a schedule in here for how you release your budget. It says "release budget outlook to public week of March 31, 2003," so if it was going to be released on the week of March 31, at what point was it developed? Was it not being developed by March 11?
It was underway, but, again, it had not been finalized. We were trying desperately to avoid fare increases. We were looking at other mechanisms that we could do to try to handle it internally, but the size of it was just so big we could not manage it internally.
You don't think it 196 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole would have been appropriate to give this Council any indication that there would be drastic service cuts or fare increases?
We didn't know there were going to be drastic fare increases. We realized --
At that point you said we will try to live within our means like everyone else. From that point it went from being a $40 million deficit to a $55 million deficit. I won't say that million additional dollars is not 12 drastic, but I would say if you already were dealing 13 with a $40 million deficit, why would you not inform 14 the Council that you were looking at drastic service 15 cuts and/or fare increases, particularly fare increases?
Because at that point in time, sir, we were not. The dollar amounts had not been finalized to come up with our deficit. By the time we finished Council hearings, we were then hovering around the $40 million mark. You add it with the $15 million that we didn't receive from the state, it became 55 million and it was just way too big for us to handle internally, but we did not know the dollar amounts were 40 million when we were 197 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole sitting here on March 11.
Miss Moore, in preparation for coming to Council to receive what is about a $60 million subsidy -- I believe it is $57, $58 million -- were you aware of Council's timetable in terms of this budget process?
No, sir. I knew my schedule, but I didn't know your schedule. I'm not sure I'm answering your question. I knew we were going to make a presentation to you mid-March. I also knew that my normal process --
Because I can tell you that the last time there was a fare increase by SEPTA two years ago, SEPTA did exactly the same thing. Regardless of who was specifically responsible for it, they came in to Council, said nothing about a fare increase, dealt with their own budget process and timetable, did not inform this Council of what was a drastic fare increase at that time and then turned around a week or so after we 198 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole finished our budget process and told the City of Philadelphia that they were raising fares, and of course at which time members of the community, taxpayers, want to know why would Council pass a budget and have no knowledge that there were going to be fare increases and, in this case, drastic service cuts and fare increases.
Again, Councilman, I didn't know -- we had not finalized the magnitude of our own internal problem when I was before you previously. We finalized that afterwards and it was compounded with the additional $15 million reduction from the state.
Let's talk about it now then. What do you hope to generate in terms of additional revenues by raising tokens by ten cents?
I didn't have it broken down in that type of category. We had one big dollar amount. We can give you some idea, but I looked at total dollar amounts and the total dollar amounts we needed from the fare increase was 15 --
So you don't know how much money you are supposed to get from raising tokens by 10 percent? 199 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
The numbers, no, I don't have it with me, but we can get it for you.
But now I'm the general manager, so I don't have the detail per each of the line items. We have that information and we can provide it.
Do you view the ten cents that you are trying to raise on the tokens as being a cost to the School District or a cost to the school children?
As general manager, who do you view it as being a cost to, the School District or the school children?
It depends on how the School District handles it. Currently if they continue their pattern -- I don't know how they handle it. There will be increase cost to tokens.
And they are subsidized by the same people you are subsidized by and so you are passing it on --
Overall it is subsidized by the state. Is that what you are saying?
That is exactly what I'm saying. So you get a cut from the state and you decide to pass on some of the cost to the School District, which is also subsidized by the state.
The riding public. We still have individuals who buy a great deal of tokens. The School District might be the biggest concentrated user of tokens, but there is the general public that still uses tokens. We did not target the School District specifically in raising the token price. 201 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
Can you forward through the Chair the amount of money you hope to generate from adding a cost to the tokens on school children and how much impact that will have on the actual School District? Because we might want to take that out of your subsidy.
Thank you. Lastly, just dealing with the issue of utilization of disadvantaged contractors, a question I didn't get a chance to ask several weeks ago. Are those decisions actually made at the staff level or the board level and to what extent are they made at the staff level versus board level? Could you explain that process? It is not really an either/or type of question. I would like to understand where the decisions in terms of contract and utilization of disadvantaged contractors is actually made.
Let me start with a piece of additional information. All of our contracts are formally advertised. Primes then respond via a request for bid or a request for proposal, whichever way we send it out. The prime response to us -- as part of that package, he or she would list the subs 202 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole that would be involved in that particular contract. The award is made, voted on by the board, but it is made to the prime. So at that point in time the subs are listed.
In terms of the utilization of -- I understand the contracts are approved for the prime, but in terms of the utilization, when you are talking about a figure, a percentage in terms of within that contract, who ultimately makes that decision, or not just ultimately makes that decision. In terms of process how is that decision made? Is that a staff level decision or a board level decision in terms of the awarding of contracts that denote how much minority participation is going to be?
The internal calculation is done initially by staff in establishing a goal. It is done for every contract. It is based on the scope of services and the DVEs or firms associated in our database that can do the work.
So if the board wanted to raise it, the board could raise it?
No. It has to be based on the availability of DVEs for that particular scope 203 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole of services.
We went through that question before in terms of you said from year to year that availability does not change.
No, the availability changes per contract. The availability on an overall basis --
I know it should be based upon availability, but could you tell me it actually is based upon availability?
So your numbers in terms of minority participation vary greatly from year to year?
The last three preceding years it was about 18 percent overall goal DVE. 204 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole This year is 15 percent. So you have in two years or in four years a variance of 3 percent. I don't know whether you consider that great or not, but there has been a variance.
What is the highest level of participation since you've been there not just as general manager, as affiliation period?
I know we have had 10 percent. I think one year was 21 percent. The 11 highest we reached was about 21 percent. 12
But your response is 16 that is actually a staff decision that is based upon 17 availability of disadvantaged contractors? 18
Contract by contract. From a global DVE, we do it, we submit it to the federal transportation authority. They review it, review the processes and then approve a goal, so the goal is developed by staff.
I'm just trying to clarify whether you believe it is a staff decision in the end or a board decision. 205 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
Who actually makes the decision in terms of coming up with the goals?
You're welcome. The Chair recognizes Councilwoman Tasco.
I wanted to refer back to Councilman Goode's question about the lack of knowledge and information this Council received on the budget on the fare increase. Two years ago who prepared the numbers to determine whether or not there should be a fare increase?
The finance department is responsible for finalizing the budgets. That would also include looking at the projected revenues and expenses for the next year.
Are the same people 206 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole there this year that were there two years ago?
So the question becomes are they politically savvy to understand and to send you over here without giving you some information that there might be a fare increase and we did not know two years ago and you come over here and you get chewed out because you don't tell us that there may be a fare increase?
They are competent individuals. They were compiling information and doing the forecast during the time frame we were here. We also had to have information prepared and ready for a board discussion which met March or 17 27, so they were formalizing information. The only 18 thing I mention here is that our financial outlook 19 looked as bad as the state's, but at that point I 20 did not have specific details. We were formalizing 21 the degree of the deficit. 22
Did you call the 23 President and tell her there might be the 24 possibility of a fare increase? 25
Do you think you all have learned your lesson for this next year?
I think there would be a process that we would handle it differently. I'm not so sure how much information I will have specifically for you at that junction, but I think we would handle the process just a bit differently.
So hopefully you all got the message. I just heard a rumor and I don't see it in any of your documentation that there might be a discontinuation of Line C up Broad Street. Is that a rumor?
It is not a rumor. It is in the information that we sent over, yes.
The primary justification is it runs parallel with Broad Street.
So it is duplicating 208 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole services. If we are looking at services to eliminate, part of what we looked at would be services that were duplicated in another form.
I have not been on a subway in a long time, but is it handicapped accessible?
If I'm at Broad Street and I'm handicapped and I need to get on a bus. I can't access the subway. What do I do?
I'm sorry. Repeat that. I think I understood you, but I just want to make sure.
I'm in a location and I am handicapped. I need a bus. I need assistance in accessing transportation. The nearest location of the subway is not handicapped accessible. Do I have to spend my time to find a subway site that is handicapped accessible to accommodate me?
If you wanted to do it the fastest way, you could call our travel information center. 209 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
I'm on Broad Street and I don't have a phone nearby and I need to get on the subway. I need transportation up Broad Street. Where do I go to get on a bus, or how do I access the subway? Are you going to spend money to make all of the stops along Broad Street handicapped accessible, and if you don't, you all need to rethink the thought about changing and discontinuing the line because you have senior citizens who don't want to go -- and a large portion of your ridership are senior citizens. So there has to be a little more than numbers. It seems to me from the testimony we get from you guys it is just all numbers. There is no sensitivity to anything whether it is about people, riders or minority contractors. Well, you know, maybe it is just a cavalier attitude. So I think you need to rethink that Line C because it goes from South Philadelphia and certainly goes to my district, which is at the end of Broad Street, actually over to Cheltenham Avenue. There is no subway stop beyond Fernrock. Once you get there, you need a bus. So you are going to have a bus on that line to get people north and we have a large ridership. 210 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
Thank you. I think that's my question, Council President.
Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilman Clarke.
Thank you, Madam President. I actually want to follow up on the Route C question issue. I was actually going to ask that question about Route C. Isn't that one of the most utilized routes particularly during peak hour and did you take that into account or did you just look at duplicative service as it relates to a corridor?
I will tell you the four or five factors that we considered and it was definitely not done just by numbers. Duplicate service was one aspect. The service standards that were adopted would have been another aspect. Availability of other services, ease of connections, et cetera, would have been another factor and there were a couple of other factors, so it wasn't just by the numbers. 211 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
You rolled it out together and you sort of looked at it, so it was not one factor, but multiple factors that we looked at in coming up with the list.
So when we talked about Route 121, my favorite route that's no longer in operation during a particular time, when we talked about the fact that it was all about the ridership and that word was used over and over again when the decision was made to opt to go to 30th Street, all of those other factors weren't taken into account? Did the rules change?
No, the rules have not changed. The ridership is a key component when we are looking at some of the service standards. It is also some information we have gathered from community that would have requested X versus Y in terms of changing a route.
Any type of community. We get tons of requests, say, for more transportation 212 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole to 30th Street.
I'm asking about 121. The only community that came in to speak about 121 at the public meeting were the senior citizens from the Presbyterian Homes and they were all in favor of maintaining the 121, so I'm trying to get a sense of what exactly you were looking at, since you are now saying that ridership is not necessarily the end all.
Not by itself. It is a critical component because we adopted service standards and the service standards tell us if it is not giving us certain ridership, we should really consider eliminating it. Ridership is one component and a critical component because, again, the service standard is there in such a way that we can spread the maximum amount of services to the most people. The community I was referring to, the 121, the community at large, not one specific community. We had gotten a lot of requests to provide more service towards 30th Street.
Since you bring that up, did you provide the committee with the information that we requested at the last hearing? 213 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
Yes, I did, and I guess I'm a little perplexed because we sent or copies 4 over and it sounds like you didn't get copies. 5
I didn't get that. 6 I got the information on the locations, the Broad 7 Street intersections, but I didn't get that. Did 8 you send it to -- 9
Yes, we sent it to the 10 President's office in a box and we have a signoff on 11 the person who received it. 12
That's not it. We sent a 15 package over to the budget office first and they 16 made some changes and then we sent 20 copies over to 17 the President's office in a box. 18
That would 19 have been distributed if we received it. We are 20 calling down to see if we received it.
We just called the office. We are told that there were three sets that came up. They are rather large.
No. Those were the initial sets. There was a box with copies in it and in 7 that box was the one set of the specs. 8
We have 9 someone coming up from the fourth floor because I 10 don't know. 11
In the meantime you can have 12 mine. I'm reading from what I'm going to now hand 13 to you. We are actually talking Routes 44 and the 14 121 and subsequent to establishing service to 30th 15 Street 25 of the passengers continued to use the 16 Route 121. It dropped to under ten when we 17 eliminated midday and weekend service. Some of the 18 passengers went to Route 48 and the changes gave us 19 approximately 500 additional passengers serviced 20 through 30th Street.
It would be more helpful if I had a copy of that. Thank you. I will read it after I ask the question. Going back to the C, you indicated there were a number of factors associated with the 215 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole elimination of that and I'm assuming that there was an analysis done in writing on the C route. Could you provide us with that analysis indicating all of the various categories and compare that with the analysis that we are doing on the 121 by category? Because I'm assuming you used the same methodology associated with the elimination of the 121 and the recommendation for the elimination of the C?
Route 27, what is the recommendation on the closure? What is that based on?
I don't have the details in front of me so we will have to send you that one, the 27 as well.
And a similar analysis in terms of the recommendation per category?
I would like to thank you for providing a response with respect to 216 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole the transit stops on Broad Street. I just wanted to ask you a particular question about the North Philadelphia station, which is pretty much the Germantown/Lehigh/Glenwood station. Early on in the planning process when you were doing your outreach there was a community organization involved in that program, I believe the Neighborhood Action Bureau, and they held a number of or hosted a number of meetings for SEPTA and the relationship was discontinued, but now it appears that there is some movement, some additional movement, as relates to the restoration at that particular location and I'm asking will there continue to be community outreach to ensure that the information is disseminated among the community in a timely way using, if not that community organization, a similar community organization?
And also as we proceed on the various capital projects down at the north corridor, if there, in fact, can be some relationship with the various community organizations up and down that corridor, because I see you have them out until year 2012. I'm assuming 217 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole that those community organizations will be in place. I asked for that commitment because I'm not sure I will still be a councilperson, so if I can get that commitment at a minimum to work with those organizations.
I can't guarantee that I will be there in 2012, but it is generally a process to do outreach.
Your commitment is on behalf of SEPTA and they will still be there in some way, shape or form. I had one question with respect to Miss Jones. I needed to ask that question of her, and it was a particular rail line bridge along the 9th Street corridor, the new rail line that was constructed a few years ago and it runs adjacent to a playground at 8th and Poplar and one of the questions was lighting under that bridge that ran the span of the playground like a block long and it actually divides the Richard Allen, the new Richard Allen development, from the playground and it is extremely dark under there in the evening hours and there was a request both verbally and in writing from the communities to get some lighting under that 218 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole bridge because we have a lot of children going to and from that playground and families and it is extremely dark and relatively dangerous and we will hopefully get that lighting under that bridge.
It think it's Amtrak. According to our investigation, it's Amtrak, but it is not owned by SEPTA.
Yes. There are lots of rail lines where we use the line and we have trackage rights, but we do not own the bridge.
I'm not sure if they still have service there, but we checked and we don't own the bridge.
Let me understand this. During the major reconstruction of that line 219 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole -- there was actually an additional line built. This was actually around the building of the Convention Center when they eliminated a portion of the rail line that actually went into the old Reading Terminal train shed. You are telling me that that line is owned by Amtrak?
A significant piece of all the lines that we operate on are owned by Amtrak.
Although Amtrak never owned that line? Wasn't that owned by the Reading Rail Line?
Well, the Reading line is owned -- part of the tracks we operate were owned by the Reading lines and others owned by Amtrak and actually one or two CSX, but we will double-check. This is part of our rail works.
I have never known Amtrak to use that line during the Reading train shed and I don't know if you go back because I didn't think Amtrak was in existence back then and then during the time of the elimination of the rail line into the train shed when there was a new line built, I'm trying to understand why Amtrak would build a viaduct along that corridor if they never 220 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole had trains or currently don't have trains on it and that was a relatively expensive development, I'm assuming, by virtue of the length of it. You are telling me that Amtrak owned the line prior to -- when it was used by Reading trains and the elimination of the Reading trains, subsequently the line as it relates to the Convention Center construction, that Amtrak decided to rebuild a brand new viaduct? And I'd say it is probably a couple miles long. Having never used it for trains, you are saying that Amtrak took that expense on its own for purposes of SEPTA?
We will check the ownership. This was part of rail works, which was a little before my time, so we have to double-check the ownership.
Well, why would you come here today and say that Amtrak owns it?
What Miss Jones has indicated is in doing the research she thinks Amtrak owns the property. We will double-check and confirm. I can tell you there is very little track that we own immediately within this corridor, within the Center City piece. But we can double-check who 221 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole owns that one.
I understand. I'm only asking for some lights under there.
If Amtrak owns it, I have to go to Amtrak to get the lights, although SEPTA utilizes the lines?
Correct. We pay trackage fees for all the lines, but if we determine that it is Amtrak, we will also give you a name to get in touch with.
If it is determined this it is owned by SEPTA, you will take the responsibility for putting the lights under the bridge?
Then we'll talk. I would have to know the magnitude of what is happening. We will look into it.
We have been talking for a while. I don't want to keep talking about it.
We will find out who owns it. Let us first find out who owns it, so we know what degree of responsibility we can even --
We have already gone 222 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole over that. I'm asking if SEPTA owns it -- and you are not sure, I agree. We will concede the fact that we are not sure, but if SEPTA does own it, my question is will you put the lights under the bridge if it is then your ownership and your responsibility is creating an unsafe condition; i.e., the residents of that particular community in the playground, will you put lights under the bridge?
So what I'm saying is I cannot commit to that. I have to double-check and see what is involved and get back in touch with you. This is the first I'm really hearing about the project, so I need to get somewhat up to speed.
Thank you. The Chair now recognizes Councilwoman Tasco.
Thank you. When I asked you about the C Line, I don't have -- I guess we will get it in the material that you sent -- the lines that you are contemplating discontinuing. You said you sent that over to us? 223 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
That was another package that just came last week. That looks like it. That had nothing to do with the operating budget. That was information that we sent last year regarding the service, the budget.
Is this the thing that we were looking for that we couldn't find before?
This notice of your annual service plan public hearings, is that just for those areas that you are going to reorganize, 63 and 64? You have a hearing in Chester, 1234, Tenley Temple and Turner Middle School. Is that only because those areas are impacted by this plan?
By the service plan. Before 224 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole we realized how big the deficit was, the service plan would have represented those changes that we anticipated making to our services, so that is for that plan. There are subsequent hearings being developed for the fare increase, service standards -- I mean service reductions as well as the budget overall, and that will be two hearings in each one of the five counties. So the hearing you just referred to is just for the initial service plan.
So now those people in my district who ride the C bus, they have to come downtown or go to Tenley Temple or 59th Street or Chester for public hearings? Are there public hearings in the northwest?
No. We are going to have two public hearings in Philadelphia. They are both going to be at the Convention Center, since we anticipate a lot of participants.
And this is for the entire reduction under rail service?
And the fare 225 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole increase?
Correct, and that is two hearings in each one of the five counties.
Will the system still be funded by the time they have the hearings so people will be able to get to the Convention Center?
When is this action going to take place, the discontinuation of these lines?
I will give you a general answer because we also have some union contracts and things that have to take place. We anticipate for the most part we are talking when we do the fall schedules they will be in effect.
So this notice for SEPTA's fiscal year 2003 annual service plan public hearings, that was just for the targeted area where you had planned to reorganize?
So this is no 25 longer effective? 226 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
Oh, no, you are still having the service plan because, again, it is a separate document, so you are going to have to have service plan hearings. So that is still in place, but we have added for the budget and during that time frame you can do budget, fare hearings, the service reductions, et cetera, and those will take place about mid-May. There is another schedule coming out.
Okay. Well, I guess I am wondering where was the hearing for the northwest section of the City for the service plan?
We are trying to concentrate all of it in Center City so that the greatest number of people have access to it.
I will again caution you about Route C. Unless you are prepared to spend millions of dollars to make the subway line handicapped accessible, you might rethink discontinuing that route. Thank you. Thank you, colleagues.
Microphone for 227 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole Councilman Rizzo.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Good afternoon, Fay Moore and Frances Jones.
I'm not going to refer to the letter I sent you because I don't believe you have read it yet or had an opportunity to review the letter in reference to the service cuts so I will hold back on that, but I can tell you that it amazed me that we sat here a few weeks ago and there wasn't one little blurb about these service cuts and I have talked to some people at Philadelphia International Airport, that this has really become a disservice to the people. We are opening up a multimillion dollar, many millions of dollar terminal, international terminal, and, as you know, international travels like access to light rail and I think honestly in my opinion you were ill-advised in trying to turn this into a political mission to try to get Harrisburg's attention.
That was not the case at 228 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole all, sir. I know that has been published, but that is not the case at all, sir.
I don't think too many people believe that. We are being candid here. I believe it was a political decision and I believe it was ill-advised and I think that it will be proven because, again, I don't see where you honestly have made any effort to try to reduce service. I mean you got right to the bottom line. You didn't suggest efficiencies. You didn't suggest running service in the peak versus the nonpeak. In my opinion and everyone that I have spoken to, especially since you didn't even mention when you were here for all of that time, how drastic -- and this probably is my opinion, you talk about the budget. I heard you say it to Councilman Goode. I believe you knew this because I have talked to some other people at SEPTA that told me that this is not new, that this plan has been on the table for a while now.
Sir, then I will tell you that whoever you talked to lied to you because it is not. We have every year a deficit situation that we have to address. That part is not new, but this 229 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole plan was not on the table. It was being formed. Projections were being looked at when I was here.
I don't want to debate that with you. You have your opinion. You have an informed decision. I've been around politics a long time and around this city a long time and this seems like a very, very drastic step to take in my personal opinion especially the R-1 airport line and the Route C and some of the other services, just to say you are going to cut them and, just to remind you, this is only 6 percent of your budget you are talking about here. To go to that extreme that you as good managers can't figure out how to make this system work without all this -- again, because I refer to it as politics, but I'll move on from there.
Councilman, excuse me. Before you move on, I was going to ask about the airport line. How much did it cost us for the construction of that line?
We would have to talk to 230 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole those involved in that to get the information.
I will tell you that one of the criteria we looked at -- well, some years back we all adopted what we call service standards. About two, three, four years ago they were adopted for the regional rail lines. As part of that we also did a ranking for each one of the routes. The R-6 Kenwood is the lowest producing route that we have and the airport is the next to it. So it transports about 2000 people daily, but it is still one that is not as efficient as some of the other routes that we have.
I didn't mean to interrupt you, but I have questions on that and I appreciate your letting me ask them.
Not a problem, Madam President. I spoke with representatives of the airport and they indicate to me that employees that work there, vendors that work there, depend on that line to go to work. Now we are opening up this new terminal. What kind of message does it send to the 231 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole traveling public that here we are trying to get this airport back on track, this incredible project, and we're talking about disconnecting the line between the airport and 30th Street? It just doesn't make sense unless it is politics. Unless it is sending a message to Harrisburg, I can't imagine a good manager wanting -- and I'm not being disrespectful to you. I'm talking about the people that help you make these decisions, trying to eliminate an airport line, and I have comments about many of the other lines that you are suggesting, but again it just doesn't make any sense.
The guests of the airport party will be going on the last train.
Many of those guests aren't going to be taking the train. They are going to fly in, Councilman Ortiz. So that's my feeling about this entire situation, and when you have an opportunity to read my letter, I assume some of the questions we asked about your police department, et cetera, have been responded to because I haven't gotten those answers. They are probably in that box.
The issue that I would appreciate you getting back to me on who you would assign this is a question that I've asked for years and years to your predecessor. I would like to know could you get with the School District and work together in an effort to transport our school children. I see too many yellow school buses on our city streets where I was told that legally you can't help the School District in transporting our school children and using SEPTA buses like we do with school buses. You're in the business of transportation. Maybe the School District shouldn't be in it. Maybe they should have not as significant a role as they have in transporting our school kids. I would appreciate it if you and Paul Valas could get together and tell me what you can do legally to help the School District, using the expertise of SEPTA, in trying to reduce the dollars that the School District has to spend in the transportation of school students. I use this analogy. I go to a particular intersection in the morning and, without exaggeration, there is half a dozen school buses, two waiting to go this direction, two the other, and 233 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole I look up and there's eight, ten kids on each of the buses, some days less than that. So I would appreciate it if you would assign someone at the top of your organization to work with the School District to see and identify what you can do, what you can't do, what the obstacles are, and if there is some legislation that is required, maybe our friends in Harrisburg, if there are obstacles, can help at least with that. I doubt it's a local issue if there are obstacles, but sometimes people, just to get away from the question, say, "We can't do that." I like people who can figure out how we can do it and do more utilizing SEPTA.
You're welcome. We are having trouble with our sound equipment today for some reason. Let me just ask a question. How and when will the users of the C bus be notified of this 234 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole hearing?
I will tell you the efforts that we have undertaken for community information. We first have to formally publish the budget book. My finance people are busy back there because they have to deliver copies to the public libraries today just by our own statute. In addition, we will be taking out full information in -- making legal announcements in the paper, et cetera. We do outreach. In some instances we do seat drops, et cetera, so there will be a lot of information circulated about all the service changes. And I was just reminded it is placed in every vehicle. There are formal notices placed in every vehicle, bus, trolley.
I don't have a copy of whatever it was that was circulated regarding -- in fact, Joan DePaul is here and before you leave I would like you to get together with her so we know exactly what we should have to distribute.
In the box with the three large copies there should have been other copies also. 235 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
You are going to have to see her because there were only three copies and we need and I think a call was made to 5 provide 20 copies. 6 Let's go back to the C bus. Are we 7 anticipating that the people who would normally be 8 using the C bus will now use the subway? 9
Some of them. There are 10 other mechanisms. There are other services. I 11 don't know the specific for each one of the routes, 12 but we can give you -- 13
What other 14 route would they use if they didn't use the subway? 15 What street would they have to go to? 16
Aren't there other buses 17 running along that way? Just the Broad Street? 18 But, again, in our response back we will indicate 19 the thought process we undertook with regard to the 20 C bus.
Would you tell us when you do that what improvements you are making to make the subways safer and cleaner so that we wouldn't hesitate to use it?
And, you know, this past weekend I believe there were three events down at the stadium area and I am sure -- and I don't know how closely you work with the people at the stadium area, but when there are three such events, don't you think SEPTA would advertise for people who are going to either the game or to an event to use public transportation?
We actually did that. We put it in the Metro. We did some seat drops.
Not everybody gets the Metro that goes to the game. Not everybody gets the Metro unless you are in town and you are using public transportation.
I guess not too many people heard, nor would they take advantage of it. Was there much of an increase with passengers this weekend?
Yes, we took a significant increase in passengers. I don't have the count numbers, since I have been over here today, but they tell me we had an increased volume over the weekend. 237 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
With the airport line, I suggest that you look at that again. You said that you only have 2000 users a day, 2000 people who are going to be greatly inconvenienced. I think that you may not have to use as many runs, but that service certainly should be available, particularly now with the expansion. As I said, the lights are not working, so anyone that wants to be recognized, if you would just raise your hand, please, because there is something wrong with the monitor. Councilman Ortiz.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Route C, I wasn't going to ask any, but Route C --
Again, I don't have the ridership in front of me, but I would say, yes, just from personal observations I would say yes.
It has a high 238 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole ridership.
It does. I can tell you because I -- and I think the Council President said you expect all of those individuals that use that bus because the rationale was not low ridership. The rationale was not that it was losing money on that line. I guess the airport line you might be using that rationale. The rationale is that it was a duplicate of another route and that duplicate is the train. I don't think that is quite a good comparison. I don't think if you are leaving -- all of those individuals, has anybody thought what is the percentage of people that will not go down to the subway if the C route is stopped? Does anybody have a thought about that?
Our planners have. Again, when we send you the information on the C, we will include all the thought processes that went behind it.
And that lady that Councilwoman Tasco talked about, she can get a taxi to the next subway station --
And we will also address the 239 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole handicapped assessment.
But if it is not losing money and it is a high ridership, why take off one of the most popular lines you have? It doesn't seem to go with public relations. We have a popular line here. Let's inconvenience people. Let's take it out. We'll make a lot of people happy that way. We will increase the ridership of SEPTA. We will make a lot of friends that way. It doesn't make sense to take a highly utilized line just in public relations, in terms of anything, and eliminating it. I don't know what thought process took place that illuminated that this was a great idea, but if it is being used and it is popular and it is high ridership, why eliminate it? That is almost a slap in the face of the public transport rider. You utilize us, so we are going to eliminate what you use. Don't you think so?
Of course, nothing is as simple. It is as simple as that. You're sitting in your apartment. You know that you take that line and it isn't because it is losing money. It isn't because it is being underutilized. The train to the 240 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole airport you might say is being underutilized, although people can question whether that is lack also of letting people know that the service is really available. Very few people do know about that. And I think it is probably lack of communications and public relations, but when you have something that is utilized -- I have here -- these are petitions and it may not seem to be a huge number, but these are all students from one high school. They are from the High School of the Performing Arts. I was there last Friday and they have a petition about the cuts in services and about what Councilman Goode spoke about, the 10 percent increase. We have been debating the money that is charged students here for a very long time. We have been asking SEPTA to find ways in which students can ride for free or get a bigger subsidy or get a bigger discount. To his question you just said, "Well, they cut a check." Well, they cut a check and then they sell the tokens to the students.
They cut a check, but you increase the token and the student has to carry 241 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole your increase.
But we need students to go to schools. There is a special responsibility that we have. It isn't as simple as you cut a check. The School Board is not also a deep-pocketed corporate structure. It is coming from the same individuals that give you your subsidy and I think we need to be able to look at those things. I really don't think that there has been a lot of thought given to these policies that you are putting forward.
Yes, sir, there has been. Like I said, I will give you the information on the Route C. I will give you any information that you need on your service changes, but these things were not done in a vacuum.
Councilman Goode, do you have a point of information?
-- I don't have your answers in front of me as to the contracts that we asked for last time in terms of SEPTA, in terms of public service contracts, in terms of lawyers, all 242 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole of those. I don't have those answers. But you are going to come back.
You are going to have to come back here. You are going to have to come back. I'm sorry. Before I approve a cent, I vote a cent for any subsidy, you are going to have to come back. Thank you, Madam Chair.
You're welcome. The Chair recognizes Councilwoman Blackwell.
Today I thought we should rise to say we know that we have a meeting in fact on the 24th in West Philadelphia with regard to closing Angora Terrace and that is absolutely going to be a big issue for people who live right there. It is one block from a new senior residence, 243 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole Bernice Arms, for example, named after my mother and it is a block from Turner School. It is the same block as a shopping mall, 58th Street Mall, and it is a real big issue. People are threatened with the rate increase and then to take away a route that has been around forever is very, very difficult. So I would hope that you would consider that. I know we have a meeting next week or the 24th, whenever that is, to discuss the issue, but we already know that the community is really, really upset about that. And the other thing -- and, as you know, that is the last stop on the edge -- at the end of 59th Street on Baltimore Pike when you leave the city. It is our last stop. So we don't have anything. And we have a lot of seniors around there and without that it is going to be a real severe hardship. The other thing I'm concerned about obviously are the SEPTA reconstruction projects. We haven't spoken to the President's office yet, but we are trying to still deal with the issues that -- we still are considering having a public hearing before the end of next month so that those community businesses who are so concerned have an opportunity 244 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole to come in. We appreciate you working with us on lots at 60th and 54th Street to -- 56th Street to deal with temporary parking and hopefully they will be transferred to the city afterwards for permanent parking for people who shop on the strip, but we are also concerned about those neighborhood businesses who are really, really suffering. We have worked with the Commerce Department to help to be involved in a facade treatment, but obviously a facade treatment doesn't start until the work stops which is some five years away, six years away, and also the curbs and sidewalks and all the problems that therein exist, obviously that won't be finished until the end of the project. Our businesses are really, really suffering. We have approached everyone from our Congressman on down for help because these are neighborhood businesses, so we don't have people coming in from the suburbs or Center City or some other place to shop, just poor neighborhood people who see their area so disorganized that they don't appreciate that it is technically opened if they can't get to them and finally I say in that regard -- so we ask you to 245 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole work with us, but I will say in that regard I went to a demonstration at the Stop N Go at 55th and Larchwood where they were demonstrating 155 days on Sunday. I don't know. All the days run together when you are always working. On Saturday the block captain says that there is no dumpster so the workers at the end of the night stack their boards and they just won't clean up. They always have -- SEPTA won't clean up. He managed to get somebody from the water department to get him some kind of wrench. They won't put a dumpster and won't clean up and they don't move their stuff. They just stack it. They just use the block because it is a dead end as if they have a right to do that but they are people who live there, so we are again appealing -- I know we have in the past -- to you to appeal to those workers to give to the community -- it is hard enough. We want the project, but we want them to clean up at the end of the day. I'm still getting those complaints that they will not clean up at the end of the day. They won't put their materials away. They won't sweep up, that they just totally disrespect the community, and that is the part that exacerbates it when they won't sweep or clean up or 246 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole move their stuff.
They just stop and leave and then we have the community saying nobody cares about them in addition to the businesses. I can make available the block captain's name and number who has a property there and who himself has taken to sweeping up the whole block because he has been there since the '80s but feels that we really need some help there and some respect.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Miss Moore, I would like to better understand the time line that we are working with and some of the responses to the earlier questions. Tell me again or refresh my memory, when were you last here?
I think March 11, or was it the 18th? The 11th. 247 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
And when was it known -- it seems that the governor's budget is a bit of the impetus for at least this one document that we have and I know there has been a search for another document, but when you came to us, did you -- again refresh my recollection. You are saying that you already had a $40 million deficit?
At that point in time I didn't know the dollar amount. I knew we had a deficit. We routinely have a deficit. I didn't know the magnitude of that deficit when I was before Council.
So your testimony gave no indication back at that time as to what the actual deficit was?
Because we did not know the actual deficit. I indicated in there we had a budget situation like the state, like the City, et cetera, but I did not know the dollar amount.
It was between the meeting and the board meeting that I had on the 26th. Right. We were finalizing it between the time we 248 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole left here and the time we had to present some information to the board, which would have been March 26.
Not to delve too much into your process and procedure over there, but you have a chief financial officer, right?
And I will make the big assumption that you meet from time to time and that SEPTA, like most other agencies, keeps a general ledger of what its finances are at any particular point in time?
When was the last time you were aware of what the deficit might be?
Let's just make sure that we are talking about the right frame of reference.
Forget about the additional 6 percent cut from the state. Are you aware on a monthly or biweekly basis, depending on how often people in the shop meet, just what your current cash situation is, what your projected 249 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole deficit is at any point in time?
What we get monthly would be our current situation, how much our revenue is, how much our expenses. When we see that general trend, we start compiling all of our information around this time of year so we can start looking at our projection for fiscal year 2004, so next year.
But you are not tracking during the course of the current fiscal year --
Not a projected -- well, projected deficit for this fiscal year, but we are not expecting a deficit for this fiscal year. This is for fiscal year 2004 that we are expecting a deficit.
What do you expect your finances to be at the end of this fiscal year?
How are you going from balanced to a $40 million deficit?
In that same information you should see a major increase of about $42 million and 250 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole it is outlined in there. We are talking prescription drug increases. We are talking about wage increases. We are talking about propulsion power increases, and those dollar amounts should be outlined in that information that you have.
Are you talking about for the moment the press release?
I have a section 11 here called "Additional Expense Projections," total budget $888 million, $42 million increase, 5 percent increase compared to FY '03; is that what we are talking about?
Wage increase, $16 million, medical 10.4, prescription drugs 3, pension contribution 5, propulsion power and fuel, 1, materials and services, 7.
And you are saying that none of this information was available when you were with us March 11?
We start doing the 251 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole projections for the next year during the same time frame of coming to Council, so sometimes late February, but no later than about mid-March we start looking at our actual numbers and then project forward.
800 million or 888 for 2004 so 840 or 50 million for this year.
We received rather detailed information, for instance, from the School District, I think technically who was in after you, shortly after you, which lays out anticipated end of the fiscal year as well as budgets for future years and anticipated deficits and the like. I think actually our budget director is over there for the City and we get the same information from the City. How is it that when SEPTA comes it is under a circumstance where you don't know what the state of your finances are?
I didn't say we didn't know 252 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole the state of our financials. I said I didn't know the magnitude of the deficit. When we issue our budget book, we put in there a five-year projection. That tells us that we have growing at significant deficits. So each year we face a deficit. In the last six or seven years what we have been managing to do is reduce internal expenses to have balanced that. In addition to that, we had a fare increase in 2001. What we didn't know was the size of the deficit. If memory serves me right, we had one general manager that proclaimed a $75 million deficit to this group and it was nowhere close to that after we started finalizing and doing the information. So I didn't want to give a false number. I wanted to have a good number, and I had a better number March 26.
That's when I met with my board to give them a briefing about the financial condition.
And then we were informed I guess basically as a result of either 253 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole that presentation or the press release that went out on either March 31 or April 1?
Thank you, Madam President. Did the board take any action on March -- 12
-- relative to 14 approving any cuts, approving any fare increase, any 15 statements regarding fare increase, any consensus 16 that this should be a combination of fare increases 17 and cuts? What was the board's response to what I 18 assume was information shared with them that day? 19
It was just that, 20 information shared. The board knows that we have to 21 go through public processes and they will get the 22 first draft of the budget book along with everybody 23 else. 24
So the board had no 25 direct feedback before you would come out and talk 254 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole about discontinuing those types of services and fare increases?
Their response was pretty much what it was here, it is going to be ugly, there's going to be some tough decisions, but we have a need for $55 million, and to fix that need, it is going to be very painful for all of us.
So the board won't take any formal action until June 26?
At the latest, and we sort of say at the latest because with all the input we are going to receive, we anticipate not giving it to them in May but to give it to them in June to vote on.
Thank you, Madam President. Thank you, Councilman Nutter.
Let me make one suggestion based on this chain of events. I would like to recommend that whenever SEPTA comes at budget time -- and I understand you have an $888 million budget. We contribute 58 million, so 255 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole somewhat small in the general scheme of things, but I think we are the largest county contributor. Is that correct?
And then a significant amount of the farebox revenues come from Philadelphia residents; is that correct?
That's not bad, five counties and one of them is putting 49 percent in the pot.
Would Philadelphia be the largest proportion of the farebox?
If I could recommend then for next year's hearing and in the future if SEPTA would come at a time when it is in a position to present a full financial picture including what you anticipate the deficit to be.
That would work for me. We 256 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole will coordinate it. I don't know who we coordinate it with, but that would work for me.
Now, Councilman Goode asked a number of important questions, but the most recent one, so here we have a situation where the general manager and the staff make a presentation with a host of recommendations to the board as to what your financial situation is and how you would propose to respond to it. Is that what happened on the 26th?
The board's response is some combination of that is pretty interesting and it sounds pretty ugly, end of response?
It was a deeper response, but I mean it was no formal action, et cetera. They too have to have the opportunity to study each one of the routes that we are looking at. They have to get input from other people and we have to do detailed presentations to them in terms of formal briefing. We outlined it in general terms and 257 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole overall terms for them. We first had to make the determination that there was a $55 million problem and that is where we spent most of our time with the board, just making sure that they understood the magnitude of the problem.
And the additional $15 million on top of the 40 you already expected comes as a result of Part 1 of Governor Rendell's budget?
Well, I don't know about Part 1, but as far as I was concerned, it was the budget that we had and it did have a 6 percent reduction, yes.
Does Part 2 of the Governor's budget indicate any either restoration of those funds or any additional funding for SEPTA, or is it at all reasonable to hope or anticipate or conclude that as a result of Part 2 of the Governor's budget that the 6 percent cut would be restored or if any additional funding would be available?
I have no direct knowledge about a Part 2 that would benefit us. There have been some discussions going back and forth, but to 258 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole date no one has presented anything that would say we are going to be restored.
Has SEPTA had any contact with either the Governor's office or any of the legislative caucus leaders in the general assembly?
We are having ongoing conversations with budget and the secretary of transportation. We have individuals that are in Harrisburg I guess having discussions on our behalf, so that is ongoing.
Has the agency itself spent any time either on the phone or any other electronic communication or in person talking to the Governor, the Governor's representatives, or any other leaders of the four caucuses?
When you say "representatives," does that include like the chief of staff out of the Governor's office?
I think he would consider himself a fairly large level official.
We are having ongoing conversations with that office, the budget office, and the secretary of transportation. 259 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
For the record, why don't I register my strongest possible opposition to the discontinuance of service, notwithstanding my little recent personal encounter with the R-6. If we can keep the repair activity to a reasonable time on the weekends, I probably won't have many problems with the R-6. You know there is a long history here between the ridership and the agency and that for about a ten-year period of time the R-6 was on the hit list every other year until we finally convinced SEPTA, one, that that was not particularly wise and, two, that we could actually increase ridership through a partnership, which I believe has happened. Now, the R-6 will always be, to use appropriate terminology, will always be representative of the little engine that could. It can only serve so many people, but it does serve a particular constituency and does go through a variety of neighborhoods. It is not and will probably never be the Chestnut Hill local, although under this circumstance it seems that that may not 260 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole make much difference because the R-8 is on the list as well. So naturally my constituents are going to oppose strenuously any proposed discontinuance of service on the R-6. Now, I need to understand. For City transit you have on your chart here discontinuance of the 35 and a route segment discontinuance of the 27. The options left to my constituents in the Roxborough/Manayunk community are what under that circumstance?
I would have to get it to you. I don't know that right offhand.
Do we know what the route segment discontinuance for the 27 is?
There are a number of inquiring minds that want to know about that. Let's talk about these hearings. Did I understand from the earlier testimony that there were going to be two hearings about all of these service issues in Philadelphia?
And they will be where? 261 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
Yes, one a.m., one p.m. I would have to give you the dates. I don't remember the dates. The 19th.
Now, is there something that prevents you from having more hearings and at locations that are actually more conducive to people participating in them?
Other than we wouldn't know how many hearings that would ultimately be needed. There is a limitation to just the staff as we spread it out because every jurisdiction, every municipality, et cetera, would want to hear it. So we thought if we centralize it at least in 262 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole Philadelphia that we would get the biggest number of participants and we also had the same dilemma when we went out to the counties trying to figure out where to have it that was more central to each one of the counties.
Look, I have an appreciation for a centralized hearing, but what is the real prospect that someone from many of these neighborhoods, especially for the nighttime -- I mean the daytime hearing is impacted by the fact that most people have to work. They don't really have time to run around and go to hearings. The evening hearing at the Convention Center, I mean how many people do we think from neighborhoods are going to either stay in town or, because of other obligations, go home, get either the kids, the family, the spouse, grandmom, somebody, all together for whatever the nighttime activity is and then venture back into town for a hearing that Lord knows when it is going to be over? What makes anybody think that any significant number of people are going to participate in that?
Our past history would suggest that a significant number of people 263 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole participate in our hearings.
I think for the fare hearings we might have had 5 or 600. Does that sound right? My treasurer pointed out that just for the Kenwood hearing we had there were about 300 that came to public hearings. So our public hearings --
Well, that was a line discontinuance and we did -- you are talking about the ones at the SEPTA headquarters?
I remember those hearings and we did kind of pump up the volume a little bit, but I think that kind of makes the point. They were at the Adam's Mark Hotel. The people that ride the R-6 live out in that neighborhood whether they live in Wynnefield, Overbrook or Lower Merion. I'm not so sure that you have an exact replica of that particular crowd even for that line at the Convention Center. When are you going to do it, 6 or 7 o'clock at night?
I think they start early, 264 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole 5:00, 5:30. Again, we would have to double-check the time frame, but there is also one in the a.m.
I would really like to strongly encourage additional thought on some regional hearings for city transit or city and suburban rail passengers. It is at least more likely that you would have a representative group of people from West Philadelphia at a West Philadelphia hearing. I would think the same might possibly be true for South Philadelphia. You already have basically a Center City location. I think Councilwoman Tasco raised the issue again. Whether you work or not, trying to venture back into town if you live in Mt. Airy to come to a SEPTA hearing, especially given -- I mean let me ask you this question: Has this level of proposed either cutback or elimination of service ever been proposed in SEPTA's history?
I would have to double-check the history. I'm not really sure.
Not in the eight years I've been here, no. 265 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
It would seem to me that we want to try to have a few more than the regular average normal round of hearings. Regionalize them to four or five -- you know, cut the city up into four quadrants or five sectors and make sure that you can hear from as many people as possible. The flip side of that is, although you won't particularly enjoy it at the hearing, you know, the more people to express a concern and an interest about all of these issues I think at a certain level become potential supporters or can be more focused in their concern about what is going on here because I don't necessarily know that anybody is going to be looking to us to fill your $55 million gap, so if you are going to get people all wound up about this document and the timing and how it goes down and all of that and if you are going to have all of these hearings, I think you need to maximize participation in order to at least demonstrate a fuller understanding and concern that people have about what is going on with the system.
We actually thought we were doing that by expanding it to ten hearings, but I 266 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole will take it back and we'll kick it around. We are doing ten hearings throughout the five-county area.
I understand. Let's talk about some local issues. You know that I was out on Friday on the Market-Frankford El doing a tour. The streets department has -- there was a concern about the light level, the amount of light under the El at night. There are lights attached to the superstructure. There was a concern that the lights were not functioning. The report from the Streets Department in a nighttime observation is that all of the lights are working. I believe one of the concerns here -- and I now think I better understand it -- there are a couple of areas where the roadway is blocked. When the road was completely opened and if the lights are working, the additional light you get under the El more than likely comes from vehicular headlights. If the area is cordoned off and cars are traveling less frequently on Market Street because it is a zigzag mishmash of barriers and obstacles, there is probably an immediate decrease in the amount of light under the El because there are no cars there, which creates an unsafe condition 267 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole for residents and neighbors because they can't see what is going on. There has been an uptake in criminal activity including, as I read in the morning newspaper, apparently somebody was shot and killed at 62nd and Market last night. The police department from the 19th was out at the tour on Friday. It seems to me that there probably is now an additional need for an upgrade in the lighting directly under the El such that whenever these areas get closed off -- and we will have a separate discussion about what is closed off -- there is still light under there. So I think the neighbors' observation that it is darker under the El is correct, but the reason they think it is darker is not necessarily correct because they think the lights aren't working. The lights are working. There is less light under the El because there are no cars under there. So I need you to take a look at how we increase the light directly in the area under the El between the columns right down the center of Market Street. Second, I believe we are supposed to get together shortly to talk about this issue of the one 268 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole lane open to vehicular traffic. Councilwoman Blackwell raised the issue today. The issue has been raised on a number of other days. We'll potentially have one of the best looking superstructures out there. Unfortunately, there won't be any businesses left to take advantage of the great superstructure and the new train stations because we are facing the potential that most of them are going to die before this project is over. I'm sure that is not SEPTA's goal, but it is a potential reality and we have to figure out how to keep a certain amount of traffic flowing and moving on that street. I understand that there are challenges. Having done the tour, I'm much better versed in what is going on. On the other hand, especially for some of this underground infrastructure work as compared to the center lane support structure work, there are some situations -- and we certainly see it out on regular city streets that don't have posts down the middle, but we see it on wide city streets where they are able to keep a lane of traffic open in residential areas just so that people can go back and forth. It may slow things down a little bit and 269 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole Lord knows this is not a project that we want to slow down --
-- but there has to be a balance between safety, getting the job done as quickly as possible, and the preservation of businesses and the viability of Market Street. It is a complete mess out there and we won't have anything to be particularly proud of other than a superstructure, but there are not going to be any businesses out there by the time this project is done based on how it's going. The last issue is it was my observation on Friday that there were actually a couple African-American males who were working on the job site. I restrict that to a couple. I would strongly encourage -- at least for the time that I was out there. I would strongly encourage that either as a part of any increased security that we are going to try to provide out there or if there are efforts to keep some lane of traffic open or if there are any efforts to -- the Councilman raised an issue about the cleanup. The job site is a mess and I understand on the interior you are going to have 270 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole some problems, but much of that interior debris and dirt and other mess ends up getting outside those gates and flowing out into the neighborhood. There are all kinds of different work opportunities, but certainly one of them which may provide some immediate employment for neighborhood people literally is just working to keep the neighborhood in a fairly decent shape, which may present some job opportunities. Obviously there are other people out there who have skills who may also -- as I'm told, who are also part of -- who are members of unions who are not being called to work, and so I and others will continue to reemphasize the need to seek people out who are in fact union members, who do in fact live in that neighborhood, and that the agency as the owner of the project, who has a contractual relationship with its contractors, should insist. And if we can provide, I will certainly get to you the name, address and phone numbers of local people who are members of unions who are not being called to work on that particular project. It is a disgrace if there are people in the neighborhood who could work but are not being called for whatever 271 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole reason and are sitting by the phone for a call that is never going to come.
I'm not sure whether you are asking a question or if you just want me to acknowledge that I hear you. The area --
I assume that the sound system is working. What I want you to say is I heard you and I'm going to do something about it.
Well, I heard you and I'll look at what I can do about it. The contractors have a contractual obligation to clean up the site. So that one especially I will look at that immediately because they are obligated to keep the site areas mopped up, cleaned up, et cetera. So I will look at that one.
It is not happening and it was not a pretty site out there the other day. I understand it is a construction site, but, you know, there's already a significant amount of disruption. We shouldn't add insult to injury by leaving the neighborhood in worse shape than the way we found it.
Thank you. 272 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole Thank you, Madam Chair. I'm sorry. And what is going to happen on this issue of additional regionalized neighborhood hearings on this plan?
I will have to go back and look at resources. The problem we face is that everybody would want a regional meeting and we just can't do but so many meetings. We will have to look at it. I will have to kick it around with the staff in the office.
When you say everybody would want one, what does that mean?
If I do one additional hearing someplace else, another location would want a hearing and another and another and another and another and at some point in time we just don't have that many resources to have as many meetings as everybody would like and going in specific jurisdictions. So we thought we were actually doing the better thing by doing it centralized so that everyone could hear what the other person's concerns might have been, not just a regional, something specific for that group. So the Chestnut Hill people could hear 273 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole from the Kenwood people, et cetera, and so everybody could hear everybody else's concerns.
I understand the theory, but I think the practical application is that you are only going to get so much participation from so many people at a centralized location like the Convention Center either o'clock in the 9 morning or 6 o'clock at night versus some ability to 10 accommodate the life-styles that people have. You know, look, we are all on the government payroll. We can be at a meeting at any time of the day or night. It is what we do. Other people, as I often say, they have like real lives and they have things that they have to do with themselves and most of it is not focused on us or what we do, but the prospect of going to a neighborhood meeting or something that is near your neighborhood is much more likely as opposed to venturing in town in the evening for something like this.
I will look at how many additional hearings we can have. I'm not going to promise at this point we are going to do all regional because it would consume a lot of effort 274 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole and, again, I'm not really sure --
You are talking about a massive change in how the system functions and operates. And are we providing free parking for all these people that are coming to the center?
For a point of order the Chair recognizes Councilman Goode.
Thank you, Madam President. Miss Moore, there are going to be ten meetings in five counties?
But the majority of the fare revenue and the highest county subsidy comes from Philadelphia?
Well, I have five counties 275 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole that I have to deal with on an equal basis.
But the majority of fare revenue and the highest county subsidy comes from Philadelphia?
The highest local -- yes, the highest local subsidy comes from Philadelphia.
You are more concerned about the client ridership in Philadelphia and the subsidy from Philadelphia I'm assuming of the five counties?
But you are more concerned with Philadelphia I'm assuming?
You may want to talk to your chief financial officer about how much fare revenue and how much subsidy comes from Philadelphia.
When you talked to your board on March about this doom and gloom 25 plan about drastic service cuts and fare increases, 276 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole I'm assuming at the time you told them you were only anticipating a 1.5 percent decline in ridership as a result of that?
Of the fare increase. The 1.5 percent decline is just as a result of the fare increase.
So you are assuming only a 1.5 percent decline as a result of the fare increase?
Two years ago what were you anticipating in terms of decline in ridership because of the fare increase?
I'm sorry. One more, Madam President. 277 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
That 1.5 percent then was not based upon obviously this level of discontinuation of service?
And it also was not based on discontinuation of service on these lines. So what is supposed to happen with regard to discontinuation of service on these lines? You are assuming some dropoff because of fare increase, but you are not assuming additional dropoff because of additional discontinuation of --
So the ridership is expected to climb by more than 1.5 percent. Just 1.5 percent is based upon the fare increase?
Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilman Kenney.
Madam Chair, I'll pass. 278 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole
Are there any other questions for our witnesses? Seeing none, this committee will stand in recess until tomorrow at 1 o'clock. Thank you all very much. (The hearing adjourned at 5:40 p.m.) 279 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole I N D E X QUESTIONING OF: ROB DUBOW 2 CHARLES ISDELL 14 DIANA NEFF 63 RALPH BLAKNEY 69 ALVA MARTINEZ 153 FAY MOORE 192 280 4/7/03 - Committee of the Whole CERTIFICATE I HEREBY CERTIFY that the foregoing proceedings of the Committee of the Whole of the Council of the City of Philadelphia of April 7, 2003 were reported fully and accurately by me and that this is a correct transcript of same. ______________________________ Cynthia A. Whyte, RPR (The foregoing certification of this transcript does not apply to any reproduction of the same by any means, unless under the direct control and/or supervision of the certifying reporter.)