COUNCIL OF THE CITY OF PHILADELPHIA COMMITTEE ON THE DISABLED AND THE HANDICAPPED - - - Room 400, City Hall Philadelphia, Pennsylvania Monday, October 22, 2007 2:35 p.m. - - - PRESENT: COUNCILWOMAN CAROL ANN CAMPBELL, CHAIR COUNCILWOMAN DONNA REED MILLER COUNCILMAN JUAN RAMOS BILLS 070154, 070698 and 070699 RESOLUTIONS 070180, 070211 and 070412 - - - V A R A L L O Incorporated Litigation Support Services Eleven Penn Center 1835 Market Street, Suite 600 Philadelphia, Pennsylvania 19103 215.561.2220 215.567.2670 2
Good afternoon. I'm sorry that we're delayed. We were trying to wait for the other Councilmembers to come here, but we're going to open up and we're going to start. This is the Committee on the Disabled and Handicapped of City Council. We're going to start with the resolutions. Howard, would you read the numbers, please.
Resolution 070180, resolution authorizing City Council's Committee on the Disabled and the Handicapped to hold hearings to investigate and determine how many disabled and/or handicapped veterans, especially Iraq and Afghanistan War veterans, are living in the Delaware Valley, and Philadelphia in particular; to identify and determine how best to assist these veterans in the receipt of needed medical and/or rehabilitative 3 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. care; and to further determine ways that we can help the disabled war veteran get back into the mainstream of society; and Resolution 070211, resolution 6 authorizing City Council's Committee on the Disabled and the Handicapped to hold hearings to investigate and determine how many disabled and/or handicapped school-age children are transported to and from school under the supervision of the Philadelphia School Reform Commission; and to determine the means, methods and the criterion used by the Philadelphia School Reform Commission to ensure the safety of this group of children in transit; and Resolution 070412, resolution 19 authorizing City Council's Committee on the Disabled and the Handicapped to hold hearings to investigate and determine the needs of our disabled and/or handicapped children; to make a determination as to their ability to make full use of our recreational facilities. 4 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC.
Thank you. Any witnesses on either one of those resolutions? Good afternoon.
Good afternoon. This is my first time doing this, so I'm not really familiar with how everything works. My name is Cecilia Thompson. I'm an advocate with the Arc of Philadelphia. The Arc of Philadelphia advocates and provides supports and resources for people with disabilities, and I just wanted to make a comment on first Resolution 070211 regarding the transportation needs of people with disabilities. In addition to the Arc of Philadelphia, I'm also with a group called the Philadelphia Rights of Education Local Task Force and it's an organization that started in 1972 as a result of the park consent decree, which 5 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. the outcome of that was that people who are disabled are entitled to a free and appropriate public education, and we're federally mandated to kind of oversee systemic issues regarding special education in the City of Philadelphia. With this particular resolution, we get a lot of calls, horror stories whose parents and caregivers where the children are disrespected when they're receiving transportation, especially with people with developmental delays or severe mental retardation. The drivers and the matrons just don't understand the needs of that particular population, and when those caregivers try to explain it to them, I don't know if they're insensitive or just appear to be indifferent with regards to their needs. So we've had talks with Transportation. We've had talks with those people in the Office of Specialized Services on trying to come up with something where that particular 6 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. population can be treated with dignity and respect when they're being transported to and from school. So far, it's just still in the discussion stage. Nothing has moved forward. Everybody is sympathetic and has empathy, but I don't think they realize how hard it is on the parents who have these children. They just want them to get to school, and when the bus drivers and the bus matrons are not sensitive to the needs of this population, it just makes it very hard for everybody in general. If and when you do have a hearing, I could guarantee you I can get you more than just myself sitting here so you can actually hear the stories from the actual parents in regards to that whole transportation issue. And I guess my suggestion would be although the SRC is the governing body, the department that really oversees this is the Office of Specialized Services, so they would be 7 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. able to tell you in more specific detail their criterion, how they determine who gets public -- not public transportation; who gets transported to and from school. I do know that if you do have a severe developmental delay or a severe MR, you are automatically scheduled to be on the bus, as well as if you have any physical accommodations which prevents you from getting on public transportation, those children are transported to and from school. But as I stated earlier, the Office of Specialized Services, they would be able to tell you -- specifically Brenda Taylor. She's the head of Office of Specialized Services. They would be able to give you more detail rather than the SRC on what procedures and criterion and those particulars that are in place to determine who gets transported to and from school as it relates to their disability. And my second comment is on -- 8 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC.
Hold it on that point, please. Please be specific about the disrespect towards the students.
I have a child with a developmental disability. If a child because of his disability is making sounds, because they are non-verbal and they're just trying to express themselves, the parents have told us that they say, Shut up, be quiet. Sometimes they put them in restraints, which are --
Wait a minute. Who is saying shut up and be quiet?
Usually it's the bus matron, because the bus driver is pretty much trying to drive the bus. I mean, the noise can be a little unsettling, but that's just the way they are. I mean, the interventions are in place, but until, I guess, they get to where the child doesn't make those sounds, this is how they communicate, you 9 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. know. They probably don't want to be on the bus or they might not -- some of them are required to be in a seat belt or some type of harness. They may not want to be in that harness, so they're wiggling around and it's uncomfortable, so they're going to make noises, they're going to make sounds. For those who are developmentally delayed or severe mental retardation, the way their brain works, they're communicating the best way they know how, and to be insensitive to that child is unfair to the child. The child can't help it. I mean, that's just the result of that particular disability. To say shut up and be quiet, it's not going to happen.
Most of the parents have gone to Transportation. They've gone to Office of Specialized Services. They've gone to the special 10 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. education case manager for that region. So parents are complaining. Unless you act inappropriately with the District, that's when you get some type of resolve. The policies that are in place are good policies up top. It's just that when it comes to implementation to the people that have to implement it, that's when it gets convoluted. So our fight is how can we get these people, these individuals who we're entrusting our children to, to implement these procedures and just be sensitive. Yes, they have trainings, but -- and it's not all the bus matrons and bus drivers, because my son has a very good bus driver and a very good bus attendant, but the calls we get, I mean, parents are almost in tears because it's upsetting to them. It might not be upsetting to the child, but it's upsetting to know that you as a parent -- you can't get on the bus because of state law, but it's just very 11 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. hurtful to know that somebody that you trust is saying things inappropriately about your child.
Have they ever thought about in a group coming, filing a formal complaint against the District regarding it?
Nobody has thought about that because that would require a lawyer, and most parents who have children with disabilities --
No. It wouldn't require a lawyer to file a complaint.
Well, most of the parents are under the impression that it would require a lawyer, and a lot of parents who have children with disabilities, because of the severe nature of the disability, one parent has 12 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. to stay home or in some cases the parent just because they have to go back and forth with different doctors' appointments and something going on at the school and you got to run to the school and try to figure out what's going on with that particular individual, you end up just -- if you don't get fired, you end up quitting and devoting -- your full-time job is your child's disability.
Just a minute. Councilwoman Miller wants to ask you something.
Good. I have two questions. Are all school buses equipped to take a handicapped -- or a wheelchair? Are all school buses equipped to take a wheelchair with a wheelchair lift? 13 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC.
No, because with the City of Philadelphia, some of the buses are contracted buses, and with those contracted buses -- and if a child does need a wheelchair, then what they do is, they will make sure that that child is on a bus that will accommodate that lift. If not, in those rare cases where that bus is not on the route to the school, then they have to put them in a cab.
Because let's say it's only one child on that route that requires a wheelchair. If that bus on that route does not have that particular accommodation, then they'll put them in a cab. And this is if it's ahead of time. Like if a child moves in the middle of the school year from one area to the next, more than likely they'll be put into some type of cab until the next school year, and then they will -- they usually try to accommodate 14 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. them by putting them on some type of vehicle that will accommodate the wheelchair. So they're very good at doing it. It's just every now and again it doesn't happen.
They take the child out of the wheelchair? You said they put them in a cab. They take the child out of the wheelchair?
That's what they have to do. And usually that cab is accompanied with a School District employee to help them, you know, be mobile until the District can find out -- can come up with a better solution. But, no, all the buses are not equipped, but they do try very hard to accommodate that child.
So the children are accommodated either way 15 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. whether there's a bus on their route or not?
Now, are most of the buses that are equipped with the wheelchair lift School District of Philadelphia buses or some of the buses that have contracts?
That I don't know. I would have to guess it's half and half.
Because one of the things that I was sitting here thinking about when you said how the bus matrons treat the children, it would seem to me it would be better -- and I don't even know whether it's feasible because I don't know how many buses the School District has, if they had --
They told us they have about, I want to say, 200 or more bus routes. They claim they have more than SEPTA, which is why they have the contracted buses to accommodate the 16 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. children.
Because I would think they would have specially trained matrons to ride on a bus with disabled children --
-- rather than just anybody, because you got to understand about disabilities and how to treat people.
The bus matrons, they're part of a union, and technically what Transportation has told us, "us" meaning the Task Force and other concerned parent groups in regard to this issue, is that they are trained. Matter of fact, we had a meeting with the head of 1201 one day last week, and they're 17 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. down to two trainings. The training that they're having in November is for drug and alcohol in regards to their workers. The training that they're having in May is about special needs. So, of course, we all screamed and said, You mean to tell me that you're going to have a training in May? The school time is over now. Well, then he came up with some convoluted answer, so we kept being persistent and persistent saying that in your November meeting can you at least give us 45 minutes to -- not give us, but devote 45 minutes to those people, the special needs population, because there's no way that they could literally be doing it wrong up until May. And they told us that some of the people, they've been on the routes for years. I said, yes, that's true, but, again, I use my son as an example. He has a new bus driver, so he wasn't there last year when they had the training. So he would not be as informed as maybe a 18 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. seasoned driver or a seasoned matron on what to do when you have either physically or mentally disabled people on your bus. So we did try to fight for that. Now, I don't know if 1201 is going to do it, but we did -- those of us who were in the room, there was about ten of us representing different parents groups and different agencies, we were very adamant about not waiting until May to have the training on special needs.
So they have just a routine training, they do this every year? So a more experienced bus driver probably already had the training for special needs?
A new bus driver or a new bus matron -- bus attendant, I'm sorry, would not know.
Well, I 19 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. certainly agree that the training should happen sooner rather than later. In May school is out. And all of the drivers, whether they're from a contracted firm or a School District bus driver, have to attend these trainings.
Now, 1201 only represents the School District. From what we're told, the contracted drivers and attendants do receive training from the District, not necessarily 1201. I mean, the guy from 1201 could faithfully speak about the group he represents, but for those other contracted buses, they're supposed to get training, but we weren't given information on when their training would be.
My next statement would be about Resolution 20 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. 070412, about the recreational facilities. Again, this is a problem for all disabilities. For those children who are medically fragile that may need some assistance, may need some medication, most of the recreational and after-school facilities will just plain out say no, because they don't have the training to deal with those medical necessities. On the other end, for those who have developmental disabilities and severe mental retardation, unless they have what they call a therapeutic support person with them, they can't participate either. With the Department of Recreation, they won't flat out say no. 18 They'll just say they need a therapeutic support person, and if you're not approved by CBH to have a support person for after-school hours, then you pretty much can't participate in anything. We've been trying -- there was a group, the Office of Mental Retardation Networks, they said that they have a 21 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. contract with the federal government to provide trainings for these recreational facilities so that they can accept our children, but as to this date, those trainings have not happened. But, again, a lot of parents wanting their children to participate in different recreational and after-school activities are being told no, especially those who are either severely developmental delayed or severe mental retardation or those who are medically fragile and need some type of medical assistance so that they can participate. Currently, unless -- if you're a physically challenged child, the only place you can go to is maybe the Carousel House, Easter Seals, Variety Clubs, and a lot of parents just don't want to be regulated to those type of avenues. I mean, they're wonderful avenues and at least your child gets to go out and participate in something, but most parents, myself included, would like to 22 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. go to PAL or like their child to go to the Department of Recreation when they have the different things, the different things in the neighborhood to at least try and participate. He might not get it right, but at least it's exposing him to something and other children who don't have a disability.
Have you ever tried to talk to the Commissioner of Recreation?
No. I mean, I know they can't deny children. That much I do know, but when, again, parents call us and they try to put their children in these different facilities, this is what they're told, and nobody -- as a parent when you're told that your child can't do something because of the way they were born or a situation that occurred to them and the result is a disability, it's very disheartening. Sometimes you want to act inappropriately because your emotions get involved. You don't understand why -- my 23 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. child can do something. Why can't my child at least be here and try and participate? They might not be out on the basketball team when the game is actually happening, but they can still come to practice and participate or do something. So it gets very -- I can speak for myself, that even though I know the laws and know the ins and outs and I advocate for other parents very calmly and very methodically, when it comes to my son, my emotions do get in the way of my intellectual thought, because I just can't believe it. I mean, they just flat out tell you no and --
They tell you no, your child cannot come to this program because of their disability.
What type of program? Because there's a lot of things that a recreational facility -- 24 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. it's not a program, but there's things that children can do individually.
I tried to take my son around the corner to Sayre in West Philadelphia and I just wanted him to participate. I could care less if he actually played in the actual game. I just wanted him to get the exposure. And they said, Well, unless he has a therapeutic support person, he can't participate.
That's what I'm asking. You mean in basketball or in what? I'm trying to deal -- I don't want to deal in generalities. I want to deal in specifics, because I want to know what you're being told no to. Because we have an extraordinary Commissioner of Recreation and he goes beyond the call of duty really to try to help the entire community and especially disabled persons, and that's why I asked you had you ever reached out to him.
Then again, 25 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. we've never done that. We never knew that we had that opportunity. And he may have wonderful programs up at the top, but when it comes down to the actual implementation, I believe some staff people are scared. They don't know what to do because they don't have that training. They don't know what to expect from the various disabilities in regards to developmental delays and severe mental retardation. They don't know how to act. They may hear something from another parent, Why is that child in here with my child who doesn't have a disability. So it's not the Commissioner who is the head of the Department of Recreation. I'm sure he has wonderful programs, but when it gets down to the people who are implementing these programs and their responsibility is for all children --
I didn't say he had wonderful programs. What I said, he's an extraordinary 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. Commissioner, and I know he's concerned about this. Have you ever been to Carousel House?
He was able to participate in the programs there. But that's the Carousel House. That's not the Department of Recreation's facilities in my neighborhood, and that's where the problems happen. That's where the concerns happen.
But that is a recreation facility, because it's in my district. It is for disabled persons.
But what we're trying to advocate for is for other places to accept our children and not just the Carousel House. Everybody shouldn't have to go to the Carousel 27 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. House.
No, they shouldn't, but you -- and being disabled, I completely comprehend what you're saying, but sometimes from being disabled, I know a person tends to put theirself in harm's way if they don't have the right support system, because many times I've put myself in harm's way, and that's why I'm asking you. And certainly if I'm an adult, I'm an old lady and I place myself in harm's way, a child is a neophyte and I don't know that they would necessarily know what to do to protect themselves. But I'm going to speak to the Commissioner of Recreation about this, but I do know that he is approachable and he's amenable to change.
I mean, that's comforting to hear, because we were going at it from another direction, but I can make the suggestion to parents and as well as my organization that maybe we 28 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. need to write a letter and actually document when these instances occur so maybe he can intervene on behalf of those parents and caregivers who are just trying to provide a quality of life for their children in their own neighborhoods.
I understand that it's difficult. I know a few weeks ago I introduced legislation, and I realize that economically it wouldn't be feasible for every recreational center, but I asked that they take a Category A recreation facility and take at least ten percent of their programming and let it be geared towards children that were autistic, because I realize that every recreation facility would not have the manpower nor the specialized trained people to deal with autistic children, but I felt that autistic children should have a right to go to at least one recreational facility in the City and be able to enjoy 29 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. theirself like other children. So I don't know -- like I said, I'm going to speak to the Commissioner about this, and if you would like to take a group to meet with him, you let me know and I'll arrange for the meeting.
Can I just say one more thing? I had a member of my family whose leg was amputated due to cancer. She's a teenager. So we looked around the country to find out what activities people had. We looked at a national program to find out what activities were available for young people that were amputees. So we found a couple different models, and what we were going to do was actually go to the local rec center, go to the Y and talk to them about putting a program together for that particular 30 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. population. So what I wanted to say is that as parents, as Councilwoman Campbell said, every center is not going to be equipped with the special staff, et cetera, but as a parent, you can go and talk to the Commissioner, maybe even some people from the Carousel House that have that training and develop a program, talk to the Rec Department about developing a special program someplace out in the neighborhood, maybe one in the south, one in the southwest, maybe one in the northwest, you know, maybe four or five centers at different locations in the City, so that special activity could be held at various places in the City. But sometimes it takes a group of committed parents or community people to buy in and go and talk and see what you can do to create the activity. That's my point. Because certainly when we looked at Philadelphia, other than the Carousel House, there was nothing for an 31 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. amputee, but we went to talk to a couple instructors over at the Widener School. You're familiar with Widener, correct?
Because we saw them as the experts, and what did they do and how did they do wheelchair basketball and what other sports and things were around for amputees. But we did that as parents and family members of a young lady. So sometimes you can do that.
I mean, now that I know that offer is available, there are more than enough parents, especially those who have children on the autistic spectrum, that are hungry for something for that population. My son is included in that population as well. You want to be able to take your child to somewhere other than -- although I'm grateful for Special Olympics, Variety Club, Carousel House, Easter Seals, you want to be able to do something else with your child to 32 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. just improve their exposure and quality of life. So we'll get the parents.
And some of the centers are large enough that they could be equipped to do maybe one day a week or one evening a week or whatever or just maybe one Saturday, but I think that that's something that probably could be organized.
Thank you. And one more suggestion that I would want to make is that in regards to Resolution 070211, I really would suggest that you actually have somebody from the School District here where you can get the specifics. I know what I know because I'm a very involved parent. Because of my job as an advocate, I go to a lot of meetings and I'm availed to a lot of information, but if you really want the specifics and really grill the District on what they have and how their procedures are, I would suggest, before making any decisions, inviting somebody 33 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. from the Office of Specialized Services so they can give you detailed, accurate information. Thank you.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Thank you, Ms. Thompson, for coming this afternoon and testifying on these resolutions that are so important to the disabled and handicapped community and so important to us as members of City Council and to the Chair of this Committee. Have you gone and testified -- you speak from the heart. You speak from experience in having to care for a loved one with disability, and you're very articulate. Have you testified before the School Reform Commission?
Not on this particular issue. My testimony has 34 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. really been about the budget, not to cut anything, and the school psychologist and the school nurses, making sure nurses in every school that's not backed by a corporate sponsor, because currently there's only -- nurses are either in school two or three days a week. So the other two days, if somebody is hurt, the child is pretty much out of luck. Their only option, if it's a severe medical necessity, is 9-1-1. So we've been trying to advocate for that and the school psychologist, because currently, again, there's only one psychologist for every 1,700 students, which is unacceptable. They spend most of their time evaluating children who may require specially designed instruction, and the other part of their job is to help the counselors in group sessions with the children who are having some type of emotional problems or any other things that are coming from the home. Because the theory is if you have 35 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. more psychologists and have more of these group centers, maybe the children won't be as angry and you won't have these other things that are going on in society, such as the violence and the dropout. But they spend most of their time testing. So that's the things that we've been advocating for with the SRC thus far. Since they have a new person with Chairperson Dungee Glenn, she seems very open, very in tune with the needs of all the children in Philadelphia. So we think the next five years is going to be a positive one, but, I mean, for right now, that's been the biggest need. Don't cut anything else, and try to get our children some more psychologists and definitely be able to afford nurses who can stay in the schools five days a week.
I think that will be very important for you to consider going and getting yourself -- I know that the Chair can assist you and I 36 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. shall be willing to assist you through the Chair of this Committee in getting you before one of those meetings of the School Reform Commission and bringing people and parents and grandparents that are caring and caregivers that are caring for the disabled to come and make your statement heard in front of the School Reform Commission, who are the leaders and the overseers of making sure that those issues such as the budget is used to fully help that segment of our student population that are disabled. So if you care to do that, though. I've heard in your testimony that you have spoken before the School Reform Commission on budgetary issues. That, of course, I'm quite sure had you talk about the disabled. But I think it will be very good for you to specifically go when they have those meetings and speak before the School Reform Commission.
At this time, I'm going to switch to the ordinances, because one of our Committee members is going to have to leave soon. So I want to go while she's here. So right now I'm going to call up Bill 13 070154. It's an ordinance amending Chapter 9-1100 of The Philadelphia Code, entitled "Fair Practices," by providing that private entities providing taxi service shall not discriminate against individuals with disabilities by actions, including, but not limited to, refusing to provide service to individuals with disabilities who can use taxi vehicles, refusing to accommodate such individuals in the use of a guide or support animal due to blindness, deafness or refusing to assist with the stowing of mobility 38 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. devices, and any other assistive instrument and charging higher fares or fees for carrying individuals with disabilities and their equipment that are charged to other persons. Is there anyone here to testify on that? (No response.)
How are ya'll doing today? I'm from the 6th Ward, 5th 39 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. Division, Councilwoman. I just want to add on the amendment that you mentioned that they left out the word "service dogs." That's the only thing I need to say. Service dogs should be included in that, because a lot of people don't realize that people with epilepsy have to have a service dog and they come in handy and they keep the people out of the emergency room and they are very essential in this time and day that you have service dogs included in that amendment.
Well, we do have support animals for blindness there in this bill.
Councilwoman Campbell, I'd like to introduce Judith Lauren. She's an advocate for the epileptic people and she's very articulate about the people with 40 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. epilepsy, and she will explain what the service dog does.
Yes. Seeing how it said in there just for the blind and deaf, where it's not saying for otherwise and -- did it say service dog otherwise? Because in the portion that I had gotten written to me about today's hearing, they were just saying the blind and deaf, the dogs that help people that are blind and deaf. And there are many of us with epilepsy who have every right to service dogs, and it's still a challenge to get that because it's still very misunderstood having epilepsy in this country and state. But we have every right to service dogs. And when we have our applications in for them and have them in our lives, in which many of us already have happening, we want to know that we can get taxi cabs and go on trains and buses and such and whatnot with no discrimination, and be given equality of rights that people who are 41 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. blind and deaf, where many people who are even deaf can even drive cars.
Pardon me, Councilwoman. It says support animals due to blindness.
But it will be service dogs, because you see people that appear to be normal or appear to be okay, but they have epilepsy. And the dog should have an orange or either yellow blanket on, or what you call it, and that's a service dog. And some people have tried not to service people with service dogs because they have no idea that this person needs that dog.
What does it do? 42 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. For people with epilepsy?
Well, they wouldn't be existing if they didn't have them. They can help us very much to sense our seizures before they can happen and help to resist a seizure, keep a seizure from happening. They can also help us very much.
Wait a minute. You're going a little fast. I can't understand what you're saying.
They can help to keep a seizure from happening, because they can sense it sooner and quicker before any human can. So they can help keep the seizure from happening. Just like the way humans who don't want to learn about epilepsy, that in itself could help. When I say "humans," I don't mean humans who have epilepsy. I mean those who don't have epilepsy and still don't want to understand it. That would help very 43 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. much. Like the woman who was speaking before me and talking about mental retardation and developmental disorders and neurological, epilepsy is the oldest and largest neurological disorder in this country and world and still the most disrespected and discriminated against, where the man who wrote the American Disability Act, Tony Coelho, has epilepsy. When he wrote that, he wasn't just thinking of people with epilepsy. He was thinking of everybody with disabilities. Just like all of us with epilepsy aren't discriminating or hurting or harming anybody, but it's everybody else who cares to be unfair and unkind and discriminating and not admitting how wrong and incorrect they have been toward mistreating those of us with epilepsy.
Well, I don't think they just discriminate against people with epilepsy. I think they discriminate against people that are disabled, period. 44 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC.
Well, they do that very much with people. But I have seen the changes, believe me, because I have tried very hard to get my way and my rights and my equality in this country, in the state, but when you mention epilepsy, still people want to run, but yet you can go in places plenty now and see many people who are getting jobs who have very visible disabilities and it's very seeable and visible, and it's very beautiful that you can see people that are visibly disabled getting their careers happening, but with those of us with the non-visible, people are still trying to tell us to be quiet and not tell anybody, to try and keep it to yourself. But to hide what you're living, to hide what's a part of your life heals nothing, helps nothing. And hiding who you are -- just like the gays and lesbians don't have to hide who they are, which is something they chose to be, where epilepsy is nothing we chose. 45 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC.
So you would like us to add to the bill "service dogs"?
Okay. Is there anyone else for that? (No response.)
With that, I'm going to move on to the last one, 070698.
An ordinance 14 amending Title 12 of The Philadelphia Code, entitled "Traffic Code," by amending Section 12-102, entitled "Definitions," and amending Section 18 12-1201 of The Philadelphia Code, entitled "Authority to Install Traffic-Control Devices," to provide for the installation of variable speed limit signs and pedestrian traffic control signals designed to meet the needs of the disabled and senior citizens; all under certain terms and conditions. 46 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC.
Ms. Chairman, members of the Committee, thank you for the opportunity to testify before you today. My name is Charles Denny and I am the Acting Chief Traffic Engineer for the Department of Streets. I am here to testify on Bill No. 070698. According to the State Vehicle Code, the City of Philadelphia must follow Pennsylvania Department of Transportation's regulations on the use of traffic control devices. PennDOT has adopted the Uniform Manual on Traffic Control Devices, MUTCD, propagated by the Federal Highway Administration. The MUTCD ensures that traffic control devices are the same across states and nation. The City complies with the MUTCD. The MUTCD is designed to meet the needs of the disabled and senior 47 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. citizens, as well as others. The MUTCD is a changing document that accommodates the changes in the law like the Americans with Disability Act and changes in technology. The last edition came out in 2003 and we are waiting for the next edition, which will come out in 2008 or 2009. The City is currently incorporating some of those changes that are expected in the next version, like longer crossing times for all pedestrians. The current edition allows for longer crossing times for locations with children, senior citizens and disabled pedestrians in the timing of the traffic signals. PennDOT regulations currently do not allow for fixed variable speed limit signs. They do allow for portable signs. They are considering the use in the Commonwealth, but we must await for the approval of these devices before we can use them. In closing, we must follow 48 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. PennDOT regulations and the MUTCD in the use of traffic control devices. We cannot follow local regulations that contradict the state and federal regulations. The Law Department will also propose some amendments to this bill. Thank you for the opportunity to appear before you today, and I'll answer any questions.
We just have to comply with the state regulations, and if the bill contradicts the state regulations, then we can't follow it.
Not supporting the bill, but I'm not necessarily against the concept of the bill.
But you're going to propose through -- you have requested the Law Department to appear? 49 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC.
The Law Department had looked at it and forwarded some amendment proposals.
I don't know that they're coming to testify. They had sent a memo to legislative consultant here, Joyce Eubanks.
I would tend to think that if they had a problem with it, they should have come and let us hear what they had to say. It's very easy for people to sit on the sidelines and say what you shouldn't be until you walked in the shoes of the people that need these things. It's not an easy life. And I believe the most important facet of this bill is where a person would have additional time to be able to cross the street so they don't get hit by a car. So I think if they had a problem with this and if it contradicted 50 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. the state law, then they should have come here and presented it, and I will call the City Solicitor and tell him that. But I want to thank you for coming out.
I don't think they made major changes. They just added some words and changed some text.
Well, I would think since they're really not disabled over there from the ones that I know, that they could have at least picked up the phone and if not told me, told my legislative aide or my chief of staff. It's no joke being out in these streets being disabled. We had a man killed at 16th and John F. Kennedy because he didn't have enough time to get across the street in a wheelchair.
What was the 51 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. location again?
16th and John F. Kennedy. That was about six or seven months ago. So, like I said, this is a serious situation and it has to be dealt with, and you can't just keep closing your eyes to what exists. Now, I have found that since I've become disabled that I see things that I never saw before, and I was looking, but I really never saw them, and I guess that's because I've become more sensitive to the needs and the problems of people that are disabled. But I do appreciate you coming out.
All right. And we'll take a look at 16th and JFK and see if there's anything we can do.
I have a question. 52 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. Hi, Mr. Denny. In terms of the traffic control device -- and there are standards, you said here, set by the state and the Federal Highway Administration -- does the time on the device vary according to the width of the street or the amount of traffic? For example, in Center City there's lots and lots and lots of traffic. So do those signals change? Do you have more time to cross the street versus maybe some small street out in the neighborhood?
Time does vary. Sometimes it varies based on the volume of traffic, but in all cases, there's a minimum time for pedestrians to cross the street that we incorporate into each traffic signal. In the past they were two times. One was four feet per second for general population and three feet per second in areas where there were schools, senior citizens or disabled. The change that occurred is, we've gone from four feet per second to three and a half feet 53 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. per second in determining how much time to provide. So we look at the time to cross from the curb to the edge of the furthest travel lane, and we divide that by the time, which now is either three or three and a half feet per second. And we determine what that time is and we incorporate that into the traffic signal timing. So that the green or the man and the flashing light are long enough.
So what does three feet per second equate to from one curb to the other? On the count-down timers it's 20, correct?
Well, the count-down timers start counting at the time that -- the start of the flashing hand and last until the flashing hand stops flashing. That's a requirement of Pennsylvania Department of Transportation. The flashing hand is an indication that tells people they should not start crossing. Before that, there 54 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. is a person indication which says you can start to cross. But if the flashing hand comes up, it tells you not to start, but if you started, you should finish, and then the count-down counts down how long that lasts. There is a period after the end of the flashing hand stops flashing of about five seconds where the hand is steady but the cross street green does not start, and that occurs during the yellow and the all red phase for the motor vehicle indications. The hand is then steady for about five seconds. So people who, for instance, out here at JFK and 15th Street where we have a flashing hand, it flashes, I think, for about ten seconds, but there's still an additional five seconds after it stops flashing for you to finish crossing the street before the cross street, either 15th Street or JFK, gets a green light.
So you have about ten seconds to get across the 55 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. street?
At that particular location. Actually, it's because it's 5 ten plus five. At smaller locations, 6 like at 15th and Chestnut, which is only 7 20 feet or 26 feet wide, you don't need 8 that much additional time. But there, 9 each case both streets are getting 24 10 seconds. At 15th and JFK the amount of 11 time given for both streets is about even 12 also. 13 So there is a certain amount of 14 time in front of the flashing hand where 15 the "walk" indication is on, and that eats up the rest of the time that's available for pedestrians to cross.
But if there is a school or senior center or a disability facility, you do add time, you said?
We use the slower speed. So we take the distance to cross, instead of dividing it by three and a half feet per second, we divide it by 56 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. three feet per second. And prior to about a year ago we were using four feet per second for general population. We are now using three and a half feet per second. And we're in the process of going through the City. We'll be retiming signals to use the slower three and a half feet per second, where appropriate.
And you still do put up signs. I've noticed in neighborhoods that you might have a sign up if there's a disabled person on a particular block. You put some type of sign up that warns drivers.
I believe we put up blind children signs, deaf child signs and some handicapped signs for the children. There's a form that's filled in by the parents, an application that they call, ask for it, we send it to them. They fill it in. I believe the doctor also fills it in, and it's sent back to us and then we post the sign. 57 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC.
Okay. I think we probably need to get some up. I'm going to double-check, but we just had an apartment built by Inglis House up around Stenton and Washington Lane, which gives us more people there in that area with wheelchairs, and I don't know whether people know. I mean, they have to have noticed that we have more people around in a wheelchair, but I don't know that they know that that facility is there. I'm going to check that area to see if there's some signs up alerting drivers that they should slow down or look out for -- because there's a Rite Aid store. So I see many -- and a Dunkin' Donuts. I see many people from those apartments traveling in their wheelchair up Washington Lane to the various stores.
We do have a sign at the Inglis House up at Belmont and Conshohocken. I don't know if we even know there's a facility at Washington 58 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. Lane and Stenton.
There's one at Washington Lane -- on Stenton near Washington Lane, and they just opened one on Walnut Lane near Morton that probably also needs signs.
If you give us the exact locations, we can post signs at those.
No. 070699, an ordinance enacting a new Chapter 12-300 of The Philadelphia Code, entitled "Special Restrictions Upon Use of Vehicles Around Wheelchair Lift Equipped Vehicles," to require a driver of a vehicle meeting or overtaking any wheelchair lift equipped vehicle stopped on a highway or trafficway to stop at least ten feet before reaching the 59 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. wheelchair lift equipped vehicle when the red hazard signal lights on the wheelchair lift equipped vehicle are flashing and the wheelchair lift is deployed to load or unload a disabled passenger, and providing for the reporting of and setting penalties for violations; all under certain terms and conditions.
Good afternoon again. Again, my names is Charles Denny and I'm here also to testify on Bill 14 070699. This particular bill has to comply with the State Vehicle Code, which regulates various types of motor vehicles. I mean, there are specific regulations in the State Vehicle Code for school buses which have this flashing operation. I don't believe there's any other vehicles that are authorized by the Vehicle Code to have flashing operations which require traffic to stop other than the school buses, and the City really 60 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. can't pass legislation that would contradict the State Vehicle Code. If this legislation goes through, it has to go through the state and into the State Vehicle Code.
That part of this bill was crafted by the technical staff, so I'll have to speak to them about it, because there was a discussion about this and they said that that's the way it should be formulated based upon the way they did this. So we'll have to check that.
Because that did come up, because my question was most vans that I know of that have wheelchair lifts don't have flashing lights.
I didn't understand that, because I know mine doesn't. 61 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC.
I haven't seen it, but I'll speak to the technical staff about it.
Mr. Denny, on this bill, 070699, the position of the Administration is that you're not in support of this bill because of the reasons that you stated, that it was not within our jurisdiction?
Okay. In the previous bill, 070698, you said that the Law Department was going to propose some amendments. Is there any amendments that you have, or this one you don't have?
So on this bill as well, you're waiting on the Law 62 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. Department to propose some amendments?
I understand we just got the amendments, but they stipulated their position, but they did not say that it could not be done. That's what my legal assistant just told me. That was the decision from the Law Department.
Well, they had sent a proposal with, I guess, changes in the language of the bill.
Thank you very much. That concludes the public hearing on the aforementioned bills that we discussed. Now we're going to go into a public meeting.
Thank you, Madam Chair. You've requested that I 63 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC. call up these bills before the Committee. I move that Bill No. 070154 be reported out of Committee with a favorable recommendation and further move that the rules of Council be suspended to permit first reading of this bill at our next Council meeting. (Duly seconded.)
It's been properly moved and seconded. All in favor? (Aye.)
Thank you, Madam Chair. I move that Bill No. 070698 be reported out of Committee with a favorable recommendation and further move that the rules of Council be suspended to permit first reading of this bill at our next Council meeting. (Duly seconded.)
It's been properly moved and seconded. All in favor? (Aye.) 64 10/22/07 - DISABLED - BILL 070154, ETC.
I move that Bill No. 070699 be reported out of Committee with a favorable recommendation and further move that the rules of Council be suspended to permit first reading of this bill at our next Council meeting. (Duly seconded.)
It's been properly moved and seconded. All in favor? (Aye.)
Thank you. On Resolution No. 070180, No. 17 070211 and 070412, that will be referred to the call of the Chair. This concludes all business. Thank you. (Committee on the Disabled and the Handicapped adjourned at 3:35 p.m.) - - - 65 CERTIFICATE I HEREBY CERTIFY that the proceedings, evidence and objections are contained fully and accurately in the stenographic notes taken by me upon the foregoing matter on October 22, 2007, and that this is a true and correct transcript of same. ______________________________ MICHELE L. MURPHY RPR-Notary Public (The foregoing certification of this transcript does not apply to any reproduction of the same by any means, unless under the direct control and/or supervision of the certifying reporter.)