Thank you.
Good morning, everyone.
My name is Bill Bergman, and I will be chairing today's meeting of the Philadelphia Zoning Board of Adjustment.
With me is our Vice Chair, Tenetta Graham.
Present, Mr. Chairman.
Our Secretary, Shara Elgaston.
Present, Mr. Chairman.
Our Board Member, Michael Johns.
Present, Mr. Chairman.
Board Member, Taya Nguyen.
She should be here any minute.
And our Board Member, Ryan McAdams.
Present, Mr. Chairman.
Also present is our Board Attorney, Hillary Emerson.
our zba director ian haggerty and our board administrator lakeisha dandy this hearing is
being recorded and will be posted on the zba website by participating you consent to be
recorded this is an in-person meeting with remote capable capabilities whether in person or on zoom
if you're called to speak please state and spell your name and wait to be sworn in after that
state your name each time before testifying to enter your appearance, indicate the property
address with your register on Zoom, speak with a staff member, call the ZBA office by
the close of business tomorrow at 215-689-2429 and provide your name email address and the case
address remote participants raise your virtual hand when directed so when we can call on you to
speak when you call when we call on you please you must click the join the as a panelist button
the q a is only for um procedural questions not comments if you are joining by phone press star
nine to raise your hand and source six to unmute and participate in person participants
and testifying get close to the mic so that all attendees and the court reporter can hear you
no eating no eating drinking or talking during the hearings aggressive behavior will be not
tolerated in an emergency file staff instructions the main exit is through the rear doors the
nearest stairwell is to the left if we evacuate go to love park across from our street and remain
there so that we can account for you let's look at our schedule for today
Get through our add-ons here.
number one MI 283-006-613-503-35
Duffin street um is the person present
joseph vaccaro is the attorney good morning chair this is jason handle will be your call
sorry good morning chair uh he's being promoted to panelists joseph thank you
good morning morning council could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer
joseph j-o-s-e-p-h the caro va c-c-a-r-o attorney for the applicant stephanie and francisco llc
do you swear or affirm to tell the truth told truth nothing but the truth yes i do so mr
for caro this is the fourth listing could you give us a quick update yes we've had a meeting
Yes. We've had a meeting with the RCO, which had issued a denial or refusal letter. So we'd like to re-engage with the RCO to hopefully try to change some minds.
with the rco which had issued a denial
So this is the fourth listing, and we still have no paperwork or anything of that nature from you. We're going to vote to dismiss this.
If the board is going to dismiss, could we at least avoid the two-year rule so that we could reapply?
We're not going to do that, Mr. Vaccaro. We're going to dismiss this case. So MI 2023-006-613-5030-5033-35, Duffield Street, I vote to dismiss.
Michael Johns, my vote is to dismiss.
Cheryl Gaston, my vote is to dismiss.
Tanetta Graham, my vote is to dismiss.
Ryan McAdams, my vote is to dismiss.
number seven mi 2025 004 587 45 13 to 15 tacawana street um
aletta astrander is the listed owner this is the second listing no exhibits
Joseph Vicarra. I'm sorry. Again, Joseph Vicarra on behalf of the applicant, Carlos Soto. He's the
tenant on the property. You're on this one too, Joe? Yes, sir. Oh, I don't want to have that. So
this is the second listing. We have no exhibits, Joe. Yes. We also have a letter of opposition
from the RCO. We'd like to re-engage with them. Okay. So what we'll do is we're going to continue
this one this one's only two listings so mi 20 25 004 587 45 13 to 15 tacawana street this case
is continued to 8 21 20 26 at 9 30 a.m i appreciate it thank you thank you that concludes my business
And number 11, MI 2025-006-997-9201 Potter Street. This case is continued until 825-2026 at 930 a.m.
oh okay so sorry Mr. Chair going back to to number seven it's continued to eight uh that's
45 13 to 15 Takawana Street that's continued to 8 25 26 and 9 30. okay yeah thank you
okay we're we're at now um number 13 mi 2025 007 011 34 45 melville street
no exhibits first listing port richmond warehouse incorporated as listed owner
No hands at this time, Chair.
So this is the first listing.
So MI 2025-007-011-3445 Melville Street.
This case is continued to 825-2026 at 930 a.m.
Chair, this is the entire executive director.
Can we please mark that must be heard since we haven't heard from the applicant in that matter?
Thank you.
That case is marked must be heard.
And number 14, MI 2025-007-014-133 Maritas Street, Oakley Stanbury, Oakley Stanbury is the listed owner. No exhibits, first listing.
No hands at this time, Chair.
okay so mi2025007014133 maria street this case is continued mark must be heard till 8 25 20 26
at 9 30 a.m are there any other requests for continuances
no hands at this time okay
we're going to go to our add-on list number one mi 2025 006
MI-2025-006-633-1246-57 North South 17th Street, I vote yes with proviso per amended refusal dated 5-5-26.
Michael Johns, my vote is yes with proviso.
Excuse me. Cheryl Gaston, my vote is yes with Proviso.
Tannetta Graham, my vote is yes with Proviso.
Ryan McAdams, my vote is yes with Proviso.
Number two, MI 2021-004-387-6809 Woodland Avenue.
and mr charl reed uh the planning recommendation yes into this one we had we had held it for video
review by a board member so this is the recommendation of the philadelphia city
planning commission the comprehensive plan recommends no change in zoning from the existing
rsa3 residential single-family zoning at this location the appellant has demonstrated that the
proposed use will not cause detrimental impacts beyond what would reasonably be expected the
planning commission recommends the board grant the requested special exception for personal care home
i vote yes with proviso per amended refusal dated september 10th 2025
temporary variance expires 5 7 31 and trash stored in rear outside
uh michael johns i confirm that i have reviewed the video of the hearing from 4
8-428 of the resumption hearing for 6809 Woodland Avenue and my vote is yes with proviso.
Tanetta Graham, my vote is yes with proviso.
Tywin, my vote is yes with proviso.
Is that it? We're good. Okay, thank you. Number three.
MI-2025-002-377-6517 Ray Street, I vote no.
Michael Johns, my vote is no.
Cheryl Gaston, my vote is no.
Tanetta Graham, my vote is no.
Ryan McAdams, my vote is no.
Ryan Wynn, my vote is no.
Number four, MI-2025-002-476-157-61 Bybury Road, I vote no.
Michael Johns, my vote is no.
Cheryl Gaston, my vote is no.
Tannetta Graham, my vote is no.
Ryan McAdams, my vote is no.
Tayaway, my vote is no.
number five mi 2022 001 391 5221 averford avenue i vote yes um
hold on do we have a proviso with this no i vote yes
JOHNS, MY VOTE IS YES.
MR. JOHNS, YOU'RE RECUSED FROM THIS MATTER.
OH, I'M SORRY, I'M RECUSED MYSELF, SORRY ABOUT THAT, SORRY ABOUT THAT.
I, CHERYL GASTON, CERTIFIED THAT I WATCHED THE APRIL 17, 2024 VIDEO RECORDING OF HEARING
IN THIS MATTER, AND MY VOTE IS YES.
I, Tanetta Graham, certify that I watched the April 17th, 2024 video recording of the hearing in this matter, and my vote is yes.
I, Ryan McAdams, certify that I watched the video of April 17th, 2024, I'm sorry, the video recording on the hearing on this matter, and my vote is yes.
I, Taya Nguyen, certify that I watched the April 17th, 2024 video recording of this matter, and my vote is yes.
Number six, MI 2025, 006-75-750-6151 Market Street.
The vote in this matter has been rescheduled to Wednesday, May 13th, 2026 at 9.30 a.m.
Start with our first case, number 12.
We're going to start with our first case, number 12, MI-2025-006-998-6354 Ray Street.
we're going to start with our
Craig Sobobley is the attorney.
Revere Street, yes.
Revere Street?
we also need a spanish interpreter
they're being promoted to panelists i'm already here
they're promoted to panelists share okay good morning board uh but could you wait till i'm
to have an interpreter come on i am right here your honor interpreter yes do we share oh i see
it okay could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer consuelo villa gomez spanish
interpreter c-o-n-s-u-e-l-o villa gomez via sin victor i-l-l-a-g-o-m-e-z right do you swear or
firm that you will interpret accurately completely and impartially from english to spanish and from
spanish to english to the best of your ability i do you please um turn on your video if you have it
please thank you very much you're welcome counsel could you please state your name and spell for the
stenographer uh craig sobel c-r-a-i-g-s-o-b-e-l attorney for the applicant uh miss diana
francois suero and she is to my right right do you swear or affirm to tell the truth the
truth nothing but the truth you counsel you oh i do okay i didn't know if yours yes wearing her in
we're gonna this is the one we're gonna just part-time or yeah so mr sobel just to clarify um
your the term i'm gonna you're gonna present i'm gonna present okay and does your presentation
need to be interpreted for your client
or have you already discussed it with her?
I've already discussed it.
Okay. All right.
So the interpreter will have you
in case we have questions for the client
and you can interpret the board's vote and such for her.
But we'll have the client in, right?
If she needs to testify, yes.
Okay. Is she going to testify, counsel?
I don't see any reason that she would,
But I may ask at the end, does she want to, you know, add anything or, you know, after she adopts and affirms what I present to the board?
So, counsel, just for a point of information, you have unanimous support from the RCO and a letter of non-opposition from Council Member Lozada.
Our vice chair has a few questions.
Good morning.
Have you submitted your documents and exhibits five days in advance of this hearing?
yes i have okay and do you waive the reading of the refusal and stipulate to its accuracy
yes i do i think you can share your screen and proceed with your case
uh right i'm gonna
look for my
Exhibits.
Bear with me, please.
This is our P1 exhibit, and it's our application for
and it's her application for the uh use of the but sir uh you you got to open up some of these
documents am i correct uh sorry to your documents sir we we see uh you've seen the whole document
no that's it just says pdfs okay hold on
that is not what
do me a favor stop sharing and then come back in again am i correct
stop sharing and then come back in reshare okay now come back in and reshare
you're just seeing these pdfs here we see we don't see anything right now
can you see this no we see you
If you have to share the screen all over again, they're saying.
Here you go.
This should work.
Did you see that?
Yeah, we see it now.
And so this is her application, along with she's a licensed nail tech with with the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania.
And she wishes to put on the first floor of her corner residence, which used to be a doctor's office, a small nail salon,
um which roughly would have three um chairs which she would service alone and it would be up by
appointment only um so so counsel we have all your paperwork why don't you start showing us
photos and copies of uh okay your plans
this is the refusal yeah we have all your paperwork
okay yeah so why don't you go to photos and plans
photos okay
so this is this is the architect plan
currently the property was a was a three-room sort of doctor's office that she wants to convert
to a kind of a general three-bay nail salon area it has an independent entrance
from the street which i'll show you in a minute
so this is the corner her corner property uh it's i think p11 here's the entrance it's an old
not used anymore kind of doctor's office it's it's got a side entrance that's what where she
would put the nail salon it's got a rear back entrance um as well this is a picture of her
property from the front she's the corner unit at revere and uh levick
and here's a google map view of
of this is her property with the pin on levick on the corner post this is the outside
let me show you some interior shots why do that so the the inside of the property is a is a three
room this one is from the back toward the front of the property
um toward the front of the property
that one is
now that's a
shot of the rear exit
this would be the general area i've got a better shot i think here's a better shot
So this would be the main area where you would come in and as you can see in the architect plan, she's going to remove these little rooms and just make a general space where she'll have the three bays for the nails, manicures, pedicures solely.
No, no other spa services. And in the back, she's going to have a storage room.
Let me see if I can share pictures, a better picture of the front.
Maybe if I stop sharing.
And. This is a better picture of the entrance to this. Lower level, and there's no no interior access from her house to the lower area.
and that at one time was a doctor's office right and at one time it was a doctor's office okay
and i think those are all the pictures i put your put your plans back up okay question questions
from the board uh the court we're going to accept his testimony am i correct hillary yes we can yep
do you want to see the uh exhibits again no just the plans the plans just put the plan that's it
that's it okay questions from the board how did the rco meeting go uh we had full support of the
I believe, 26 people in the neighborhood.
I believe 16 were remote by phone or.
And it's community community on the rise.
What about your directly adjacent neighbors?
They fully support as well.
From what I.
You have letters or anything from them?
I don't have any letters from them.
But there's only one neighbor because it's an end unit on Levek.
Other questions?
What is happening in that rear room behind the, I guess those are for the pedicure chairs?
So the rear room would be a storage room for supplies, this area.
Okay, and is the only sink the one in the powder room?
And there's the sinks across the way, and there's a little, like, kind of reception area right here.
But as far as the only sink, there will be one bathroom.
I was less worried about the bathroom.
I just have never been to an old salon that didn't have a utility.
oh they'll be they'll be you know in the uh to the actual three bays they'll need to have uh
water like i've never seen a i've never seen a nailed seat have water access so i mean i've
seen the chairs right but not but like typically they need a utility sink to be able to like clean
and wash hands and deal with a lot of the products that they bring in and i'm just wondering is there
in the stories
va a tener necesita interpretación señor si va a tener usted algún fregadero para materiales
además del lavabo del baño en esta área de almacenaje
lavadero como de ropa
lavadero como de ropa el lavabo para limpiar cosas the sink to clean your
I do need one.
Necesito, por favor, señora, que me diga su nombre completo y me lo deletre.
Diana Francois Suero.
Diana Francois Suero.
Could you spell it please?
N, N, C de casa, C, O, E, I, S, S, S, U, E, R, O.
do you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth
say yes okay could you we continue where we were her answers relative to the sinks
what's the answer me repite su respuesta señora
Could you repeat, please?
Yes, I have always been really careful with every tool and
utensil that i use all of the materials that i need to prevent any infection either bacteria
or whatever in my job i have been doing this for years and i know that cleaning it's essential for
the prevention of uh you know in the care of the health of every client i i also believe that the
rco i looked just in my file she commented that the utensils aren't necessarily um like washed
in a sink there's a uh desanitizer machine that she has where all the tools get put after each
client to be esteemed or cleaned I'm not I I have a note as that how she cleans
that the only like there's gonna be the like yes the sanitizer machine is in
most nail salons but there's usually other solutions that they're handling
right right she's only going to use the sink that's in the bathroom for the
operations el único lavabo que va usted a utilizar para la operación el único lavabo es el que esté
en el baño no no no aparte de del lavado del baño creo que necesito otro porque no puedo mezclar los
utensilios que uso para los clientes en el baño. So se necesita uno aparte. Aquí yo tengo videos
también de... So I know on top of the one that is in the bathroom, I think I need another one
because I cannot be mixing my tools with, you know, the things that are in the bathroom for
the clients. So I need one on top of that. And I have videos here. Yep, I think we're on the same
page. I hear what you're saying. It's just not on the plan. I don't see it on the plan.
I hear what she's saying. It's just not on the plan. It's I don't see on the plan either board member, but she intends to put, I guess, another sink for the mixing of the.
En el plan no se encuentra todavía puesto ese lavabo, entonces se necesita tener otro lavabo.
Other questions.
A ver, con otra pregunta.
But then when you do the manicuring, usually there's, you know, they ask you to wash your hands after they get done doing whatever they're doing to get your hands prepared for being painted.
So is she going to have a sink for that too?
si es lo mismo del lavabo porque yo sé que por ejemplo cuando uno va a hacerse las uñas de las
manos a uno se les pide después del manicure que no se lave las manos antes de que las pinten
exactamente entonces va a tener ese tipo de lavabo también porque yo sé que para los pedicures con
la silla que tiene su tina integrada eso es más que suficiente eso es una cosa pero para las manos
para lavar las manos antes de pintarlas va a tener un lavabo instalado para eso también
ese es el mismo que le estoy diciendo dar desde guanda
i was talking about all right questions questions from our attorney not at this time mr chair
questions or comments from the virtual audience or the current audience here yes sir we have a hand
up from slow folks they're being promoted the panel good morning mr folks yeah good morning
Could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer?
Mr. Folks?
I'm sorry.
Good morning.
Can you hear me?
Good morning.
Good morning.
I can't start.
Could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer?
I apologize.
I entered this check.
I entered everything by accident.
I should not be testifying at all.
I apologize.
You're not going to testify here?
no sir i apologize okay any other questions or comments from the virtual audience
no hands at this time chair planning commission morning chair members of the board michael gall
with the philadelphia city planning commission m-i-c-h-a-e-l-g-a-l-l you swear affirm to tell
the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth so affirm chair um please proceed with your
testimony thank you the comprehensive plan recommends no change to the rsa 5 residential
single-family attached zoning at this location. The property has a documented history of legal
office use as a doctor's office, dating to at least 1952. This end-of-row building is already
physically configured for similar uses, like many similar properties on this part of the city,
and along Levick Street, which operates as a de facto arterial for bridge access and has a number
of similar commercial activities fronting it. Therefore, the City Planning Commission recommends
the board grant the requested variance for personal services use mi2025-006-998-6354
revere street i vote yes johns my vote is yes cheryl gaston my vote is yes tenetta graham my
vote is yes i am mcadams my vote is yes hi i win my vote is yes thank you interpreter thank you
counselor thank you you all have a good day all right you too
number six mi 2025 002 853636 kerper street
joan conley is the current owner
this application is for use as a two-story family household living whereas
the proposed use two-story household living is prohibited in the rsa3 zoning district
good morning hi could you please your joan could you please state your name and spell for the
stenographer. And just pulled a little closer to you too, if you don't mind.
And just hold a little closer to you, too, if you don't mind. Yep. Joan Connelly, C-O-N-N-O-L-L-Y. Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth? I do, sir. Our vice chair has a few questions.
Good morning. How are you? Have you submitted your documents and exhibits five days in advance of this hearing? I have. And your refusal is
two-family household living
that's prohibited in an RSA 3
zoning district. Do you
attest to that refusal
and simply to its accuracy?
Alright. You are getting some
assistance, right? Yes. So we can begin
with your case.
Should I just address?
Okay. Yeah, why don't you start? Well, first
tell us what you're doing.
Well, the property is now zoned as single family, and I'd like to have it changed back to its original use as a duplex.
Okay. Is it currently set up as a duplex?
Yes, for electric, water, gas.
Sure. Why don't you start your test?
Okay. This property was built as a duplex with separate entrances and separate utilities, two electric meters, two gas meters, two breaker boxes,
and there are two hot water heaters and separate hookups in the basement for laundry.
My grandmother, Alvira Kramer, was the original owner.
She purchased it July 1959.
She always lived on the first floor and rented the second floor.
In 1998, my parents, Art and Peggy Kramer,
purchased the property from my grandmother and moved into the second floor
where they cared for my grandmother until she died in 2001.
Since 2001, the property has been occupied only by family.
In 2012, the property was changed from multifamily to single-family use, with a use permit issued on December 14, 2012.
Currently, I live on the first floor, and the second floor is used for family occasionally.
My father passed away August 26 last year.
i am now the owner of 636 purple street and made settlement on april 16th of 2026 i am asking to
change the property back to its original use as a duplex why don't you show us some photos
i believe the interior too yep they'll have it yeah they'll do it for you okay okay
okay that's going upstairs private access to the second floor right
first floor bathroom okay
uh the second floor kitchen okay
second floor bathroom okay
tell us about the rco
no it it's her property right right okay tell us about i did go to the rco meeting my sister did
okay could you thank you could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer
donna kramer d-o-n-n-a last name kramer k-r-a-m-b-r do you swear or affirm to tell the truth
told truth nothing but the truth i do please proceed uh so i went to the rco meeting um met
with them made my presentation and here's the letter um right that they approved they don't
have a problem with it all right all right okay questions from the board
questions or comments from our attorney not at this time mr chair actually sorry no one um
One thing I wanted to mention, so the property now is zoned RSA 3, which requires parking, and it looked like in the photos, there's parking to the side.
Yes, there's all street parking for 4 cars. Okay. It just wasn't mentioned on the refusal. I just wanted to note it for the record because it is a requirement. Thank you.
Questions or comments from the virtual audience to the current audience here?
No hands at this time, chair.
Planning Commission.
morning michael gall with the philadelphia city planning commission the comprehensive plan
recommends no change to the rsa3 residential single family attached zoning at this location
this property appears to have a history as a two dwelling unit building despite the issuance of
permit in 2012 for single family use therefore the philadelphia city planning commission recommends
the board grant the proposed use variance for two dwelling units thank you mi 2025 002 853 636
Kerper Street, I vote yes.
Michael Johns, my vote is yes.
Cheryl Gaston, my vote is yes.
tennetta graham my vote is yes ryan mcadams my vote is yes my vote is yes thank you thank you okay
Tynetta Graham, my vote is yes.
Ryan McAdams, my vote is yes.
Taya Wayne, my vote is yes.
number nine mi 2025 006 771 1121 walkin street this application is for the erection of a
a vertical addition to an existing attached building and includes roof deck and roof deck
access whereas the maximum occurred area for the RSA 5 zoning district is 75 percent
and 80 percent 84 percent is uh processed when when the maximum rear yard is nine feet and six
feet is proposed and where the where the stories above the second floor of the attached house
shall be set back
an additional eight feet
and this is zero.
Could the
Giselle
Yes, hi.
Sir, could you please state your name
and spell it for the stenographer?
Yeah, my name is Paul
Crager.
That's P-A-U-L
Last name is Crager
C-R-A-G-E-R
Do you swear or affirm
to tell the truth
told truth nothing about the truth i do east passion was unanimous support and there's a
letter of non-opposition from council member squilla uh our vice chair has just a few questions for
you sir good morning have you submitted your documents and exhibits five days in advance of
this hearing yes and and the chair just wait read your uh refusal um do you uh wait further
Read another refusal and stipulate to us accuracy. Yes. Okay. Well, we have amended slightly. Some of the things that were refused.
Okay, there. Yeah. All right. So you can show your screen and see what the keys.
Okay, just a moment.
Hey, okay. You should be able to see that. Correct.
not up yet not up yet oh i see here it comes again sorry yeah i see it's coming up oh got it
okay uh yeah good morning everyone uh as i said my name is paul crager my wife danielle who's the
co-owner of this property is also on the call uh we've lived here at 1121 watkins street since 2013
we're seeking a variance for a third story addition to our home uh thanks for your time
Let's move on here. So you can see the existing photos of the home. This is us on the top
left. Behind us, you can see this is the view directly from our backyard, 1120 Morris Street,
which is four stories at the rear, three in the front with a mansard roof.
This is the back of our property. Center is us. Left and right side, you can see
there's uh bump outs on the back of those homes uh which is what we're looking to do
we only see one picture that's the first picture
it's okay i'm sorry i missed what you said there would you repeat that
no we we we should it's it's it's it's a little issue on our part but we're okay okay okay good
Okay, sounds good. Okay. Here are our refusals. Just noting here that we previously requested a larger bump out than we're currently requesting. It's been reduced from three feet to two feet.
you can see that the difference highlighted here so the occupied back area would have been six
foot six now it's going to be seven foot six from 84 occupied to 82 occupied no changes to
the ground floor this is only on the upper floor all right here you can see highlighted the the
changes from the original submission and the plans, this clouded area down here highlights
where we've modified the plans.
Okay, the site plan here, you can see our house in the middle of Watkins Street, behind
on Morris Street there's two other houses that are four floors, three floors, these
on 12th Street are three floors, also three floors on Watkins Street here and here, and
and a few more around the neighborhood.
and a few more around the neighborhood.
The floor plan, you can see the two existing floors on the right-hand side.
On here, the third floor plan, you can see that it goes all the way to the front.
It's planning to add a primary bedroom and then another smaller bedroom in the back.
All the way to the left is the roof deck plan.
There's a five-foot setback from the front property line.
Pilot house is here. That's also setback.
Next diagram shows elevations.
This, again, is our house with the proposed changes.
We're proposing a standing seam metal on a mansion roof
with an open steel railing along the front wall of the roof deck.
In the rear, we'll use the same vinyl siding to match the existing two floors below.
You can also see an outline of 1120 Morris Street, 1114 Morris Street behind us, again
four floors and three floors.
This rendering shows what the project would look like completed.
This is the same thing just highlighting just our house here in the middle and existing
houses around the neighborhood that are already three floors, 19 of 20 row homes in the area
area that are three floors or above have a flush façade.
There's the rear yard again, showing the neighbor's overhangs.
We are planning to build out to the same point that the neighbors immediately to our left
and right have built out to.
this is a rendering of sight lines you can see that sight lines from the street level you can't
see the pilot house same thing from the second story because we're on the north side of the
street there's going to be no daylight changes to Watkins Street there would be daylight changes to
to the rear of the house that will basically just affect our backyard and our neighbor
at 1120.
These are more proposed photo renderings from the street level.
This is, we presented to the RCO in February.
We had unanimous support from both the RCO and community members.
We've also been in close contact with our neighbors on the block and everyone's in support.
And that is all we had prepared for the presentations.
Yeah, thank you for your time.
Let us know if you have any questions.
I noticed what you did with the RCO, but how about the neighbors on either side?
How are they?
Yeah, correct.
So, the neighbor to our right side are the owners we've spoken with and they're in support.
Right now, they're renting their house to a renter who, you know, has asked some questions,
has not opposed anything. The neighbors to the other side are in support.
Okay. Thank you. Questions from the Board?
Not a question, but a comment.
Yours would be the first third-story addition on your block, correct?
uh no there's another third story edition uh forgive me i can go back to uh you can see it
here it's actually being built um in this image this this one is third story also mid block
the end of the block is also third story here and here this is on your side of the street
is this the first third story on our side that's correct it will be the first yeah
Out of how many houses it looks like? I mean, there's nothing.
Uh, I'd have to count, but you know, somewhere around a dozen.
Okay. And then, uh, you said there was something on the other side being built.
Uh, yeah, so this is completed now at the time that this overhead photo was taken. Yes, this,
this is a completed, uh, third story on, on Watkins Street, just across the street.
okay thank you questions yeah i guess it's a question because the other house on watkin street
has a rear setback so it's actually there there's nothing above the second floor at the front of
your property i do appreciate that you all attempted to do a mansard roof for that third
floor and then you set back the fourth floor but you would still be the first third story that's
visit like that's at facade line on that street and um i guess i'm wondering a little bit more
I'm wondering a little bit more as like, what's the justification I need for the.
is like what's the the justification i need
Expansion yeah, yeah, I mean, the answer is basically the way the layout of our house works without a setback the front bedroom due to the location of our stairs and also this. Let's see if I can find it.
uh essentially cut out uh where the yeah here so you can see in the existing second story
um there this area right here does not fully cover the first floor of the house
um so basically uh adding a third story with a setback due to the stairs and that cut out
means the remaining area for a primary bedroom is pretty small so the variance
required to build all the way to the front of the property line makes the
third-floor primary bedroom viable okay and then is it planned that you all are
gonna live here continue to live here as yourself yeah absolutely yeah as I said
we've been here since since 2013 plan to continue uh for the foreseeable future okay so there so
there's no change to the second floor that's correct so so you'll have this sort of overhang
over the breezeway in the back with this third story you didn't show up i don't think i saw
rear elevation for the new rear elevation I know you showed the front but you didn't show what
happens I didn't see what happened yeah you can see that here a bit yeah okay so on the left here
that's the wait a minute let's get it here so on the left right is the bottom left is the rear
correct yes and so you've got this strange sort of overhang of that third floor which is
which is a little odd um and then on the front and go get back to the front rendering that you did
uh let's see were you looking for the rendering that you did oh the i just want to see it the
rendering in context with the rest of the block with the rest of the houses next to it
No, the front, not the rear, this is the front that I'm showing the front. Okay. Right. That's what I want to see.
Yeah, okay. So with the man start. Okay.
All right, that was it.
Thanks. Smart attorney. Not at this time, Mr. chair questions or comments from the virtual audience.
no hands at this time. Planning Commission. Michael Gall with the Philadelphia City Planning Commission. The comprehensive plan recommends no change to the existing RSA 5 residential single family attached zoning at this location. The building's existing condition is that of increased occupied area with a small rear yard and that condition dates to the neighborhood's construction. The block is consistently residential in nature exclusively two and three story attached homes with narrow right of way and neighboring residential properties close by in the rear and
across the street potentially impacting neighboring properties rights to light and air therefore the
city planning commission recommends that the board grant the requested variances for maximum
occupied area and rear yard depth but recommends that the board deny the requested variance for
upper floor setback okay mi2025 006 771 1121 watkin street i vote yes with proviso revised plan
and one page stamped by ZBA on May 6, 2026.
Michael Johns, my vote is yes with proviso.
Cheryl Gaston, my vote is no.
Tanetta Graham, my vote is yes with proviso.
My name McAdams, my vote is yes with proviso.
Diane Wynn, my vote is yes with proviso.
Thank you.
All right, here we go with M.
now we're going to do both together okay so MI 2020 MI 2025 002 821 22 26 West Tioga
and mi 2025 002 824 2224 west iowa street mr knockamson could you please state your name
Mr. Nockamson, could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer?
and spell for the stenographer alan knockamson
Alan Nockamson, A-L-A-N, last name Nockamson, N-O-C-H-U-M-S-O-N.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Mr. Nockamson, could you identify your client and relationship to the property?
Yeah, my client is, or client for both properties are Wise Holding Group LLC,
and in the virtual audience is Brian Wise, as well as Alex Lipkin, the members of the group.
I also have Matt Master Pasqua of Mass Architecture Studio who's going to go with me along with the drawings.
We have a letter of support from Allegheny West and also a letter from the Philadelphia Historical Commission.
Our vice chair has a few questions.
Thank you.
Good morning.
Have you submitted your documents and exhibits five days in advance of this hearing?
Yes, we have.
And do you waive the read and other refusals and stipulate to their accuracy?
I actually object to two of the refusals. The height refusal, I don't believe is correct. It's saying that we're proposing to have 42 feet and three and three quarters inches of height. That's the existing building structure. The new portion of the building structure is 36 feet, 11 inches, which would fall within the code requirements. And then the second refusal that we have an objection to is the amount of parking spots that are required.
This is an RSA 3 property, so it's a one-to-one ratio, except we're a historic property where within the building office.
Look at our accounts.
You're staring at Hillary the whole time.
Now, what are you trying to do?
I'm just telling you something.
So we have six units within the existing building structure, but it's a historic property, so we're exempt under 14-801-2F.
And then for the new portion of the building structure, there are six units, but because it's an extension of the historic use, it's a 50% ratio.
And so six units, 50% is three parking spaces. So we do meet for both properties that requirement as well. So, let me share my screen.
so this is one of these projects that you know i present a lot and but you know this is one of
these projects that you know you'll you'll remember over the course of your career i really do believe
so this is a historic property it's in really bad shape and my client has spent hundreds of
thousands of dollars to keep this property up the city has wanted to demolish this property time and
time again. And they've probably, I think they've spent $700,000 just to keep this property up.
To completely rehabilitate this property is going to take a couple million dollars. This property
has been profiled in multiple publications in the Inquirer and such, and it has a really cool
and interesting history, and we're trying to rehabilitate it and keep a part of that history
in in this neighborhood and i even we even got a letter from swan poodle in support of this project
like literally just came across my screen so um you know that was i was pleasantly surprised
about the you know our community meeting how you know how people really knew about this property
and its history and um and our attempt to keep it alive and it's you know you know you know to
Look at that. It's beautiful. We went through the Historic Commission. I have Matt, Master Pascoe. Why don't we just have him join as a panelist and swear him in? Because he'll tell the history of it.
Sure. Well, we'll get him on as soon as you're. Yeah. But, you know, we have 12 exhibits here. And like I said, Brian and Alex are on and Brian will tell you that he's from the Tioga area. This is an affordable housing project because that's all he does. And, and that, you know, he's really proud of this growing up in this area as well.
So the notice of refusals, there's two properties. Each are going to propose to have 12 dwelling units in there. There's a history, a long history of significant multifamily use. I think this is an 18 unit boarding house at one point that allowed for 50 people in one of the properties. There's significant multifamily use nearby, and we're leveraging the fact that we're street to street to provide the parking as necessary.
Now, we do have one refusal in terms of parking that we can't comply with. As you see on your screen, we're required to provide one handicapped parking space. If we did that, it would be too big for that lot where we would have less parking spaces and we couldn't comply with the three parking space requirement.
requirement um so we talked to the community about that they rather have more parking spaces
than have a handicapped parking space there uh and the only other refusal
the only other refusal um well i would also argue that the you know the refusal regarding surface
parking spaces are prohibited in the required front yards we don't have any parking there
if you consider tioga the the front of the property our parking is in the rear uh uh the
rear uh public uh street uh not the front parking street and then the really the one refusal we have
is the multi-family use which is again not out of character for the for the history of these
properties nearby and such and you know really the only and again this is a rather large lot
the lot size for each of them is 6750 square feet not that we are on one but if we were
that would allow 15 units as of right and the only way to make this project really work and and keep
historic structures in here is to have these amount of units also allows for the affordability
aspect of this project as well so we have a letter of support um not too descriptive other than you
know this is the the cockling armstrong house and matt um you know will definitely describe what
that is and the history behind it um but you know the nearby neighbor in the rear on the secondary
street like love this project they're like oh my god thank you so much because you'll see pictures
of the property it's in really bad shape obviously we fenced it in we've stabilized it um but they
they want you know it finished and so do we and then again we went through the historic commission
we have their you know their you know their review uh process and and their you know approval to move
forward if the board feels so inclined to grant these variances and then the property history
well when we then you know kind of bring matt on he can kind of go sure why don't you bring him on
what's his name matt master pasqua sure hello matthew master pasqua hi i mean okay you could
just spell it please yeah m-a-t-t-h-e-w master pasqua m-a-s-t-e-r-p-a-s-q-u-a you swear we're
referring to tell the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth i do counsel all right matthew uh
why don't you tell the board a little bit about the history of this property and its historic
significance yeah thank you alan um so yeah this is known as the conkling armstrong house it was
built in the late 19th century by conkling and armstrong who were manufacturers of terracotta
facade materials their main factory was on wissahickon it produced a lot of terracotta
pieces for the city as well as the whole eastern seaboard and into the midwest and they were a
large manufacturer of a truly american piece of architectural history they built these houses as
their own residences and then also sort of a showcase of some of their products and their
capabilities at their factory so all these ornate window details and banding and cornice lines and
all of that were manufactured by their company for their houses to sort of show their potential
clients what they were capable of. And yeah, I mean, they lived here for a while, and then it
went through a different, you know, round of ownership, like Alan said, multifamily use, etc.
Until finally, it was abandoned for a long time, and our clients picked it up and are trying to
restore it. For the rear addition, we decided that trying to match all of these ornate features of
the front building is not a tenable solution. So we tried to, you know, take context from the rear
street, Estelle Street, as well as some of the more modest neighboring buildings to, you know,
inspire our new design. So in this presentation, you'll see a handful of other projects we took
photos of um that are of the same period of the conkling armchair house but are not as ornate
so it's a little more feasible for us to construct yeah so matthew i actually have like uh let's
let's go through the uh site plan as well as the side elevations uh so first i want to point the
board's direction uh to the rear parking as you can see uh we use a pre-existing curb cut of 24
inches and we have three parking spaces on each property and to allow for proper traffic flow we
have an easement that's been created between the two properties we also have trash in the back
um but why don't you i i objected to the refusal as to the heights in the rear um just to confirm
uh this is the the actual height to to the roof line right matthew 36 feet 11 inches
that's correct all right is there anything else on this drawing that we can point the board's direction to
Is there anything else on this drawing that we can point the board's direction to?
So as you can see on the left side, that sort of diagonal hatch is our addition, and then the solid gray hatch is the existing building.
So you can see there is sort of a mezzanine or a short fourth floor attic space on the right side, and that is where that non-compliant height comes from.
and we are more or less matching the height of the third story on the rear portion of the existing
building for our new portion. And we have compliance with the side yard setbacks of
eight feet for both buildings. That's correct. Each of these houses are being developed as
independent homes or, you know, residences. So we kept an eight foot side yard in order to
provide tenant access to the building where we have the entrance to the building actually coming
in off of the side yard and this is for a few reasons one it works better for the stair layout
but then it also puts living space on the first floor along a stow street across the parking lot
so instead of having the main sort of non-inhabited residential entrance on the first floor front we
decided to put living rooms on the front instead yeah and then we have two entrances one on either
side for the rear portion for the addition and then we are maintaining the two front entrances
off of tioga for the entrance for the tenants that live on the existing building side yeah and
by continuing with the side yard everyone has access from front to back of the property including
the trash areas right correct yeah and then to go back to you know trash maintenance and storage
while we go into the actual floor plans there are ventilated trash areas within those units
themselves yes all right uh let's see is there anything different on this well this is the same
one uh anything on this drawing that would be of relevance to the board uh we are just showing uh
where the building would be visible from this is more for the historic commission but these three
photographs are from tioga 23rd street and astao street showing where these the the addition would
be visible from yeah and you did make the presentation uh by way of the historic
commission approval process what were their thoughts about the project correct yeah they
were in full support um they saw the significance of the existing structure and the dilapidated
nature of it and are supportive of any effort to try to maintain it restore it all right well let's
just go through the floor plans here so you were mentioning the front of these properties um i i
would almost equate it to almost like two buildings in one right yeah absolutely almost four buildings
and two if you think of it that way because we do have the property line down the center there is a
shared party wall running you know front or top to bottom of the page here so um just to orient
everybody. Tioga Street would be on the bottom of the page. Stow Street on the top of the page.
The first plan on the left is the basement plan. The only basement that we have is the existing
portion. There's no basement. There's only a crawl space on the addition. So the front entrances would
be the second plan in from the left. And they are sort of highlighted or not in white. So as Alan is
scrolling over them. You can see we have one on the left side, one on the right side,
and they both enter into a shared hallway and then to a staircase.
Yeah. There are. Go ahead. Sorry. I was going to say, so you have unit number 101 on both
in the front, unit 102 a little further in the existing building structure, right?
Correct. Yes. So those are the two on the first floor that are accessed from Tioga.
and then from the rear we have 103 and 104 and they are accessed off of a stow street
and you can see again those white hallways and staircases in the center of the building
those are all shared go all the way up to the third floor and the rear six units two four six
eight units sorry access up there so yeah we broke down the units by color so you can kind
orient yourselves and see you know where one unit starts and one unit stops and then the white also
shows you where those units are accessed from um the only again the only space we have in the
basement is in the existing building where there is a current basement and you know 101 and 102
on either side have access to that basement yeah and for each building uh structure there's 12 units
eight one bedrooms and four two bedrooms that's correct uh yes i believe so all right and then
you know the only other floor that has a bi-level or not bi-level but more of a loft
The only other floor that has a bi-level or not bi-level, but more of a loft is the third floor in the front.
Correct. Yes. So the third floor front, so 301 on either side, there is that fourth floor attic space.
We were trying to figure out how to best utilize that.
And according to some building code regulations, we were limited on how big of a space we could put up there without having to add additional staircases.
So we are using this as a mezzanine. So I'm imagining more of an office use on that space, but it would be come down to the tenant.
But that would be open to below. So there's sort of a double height or one and a half height space in those 301 units.
And then there's no roof deck access structures as part of this project, right?
Correct. Yeah, the stairs don't even go up to the roof deck. The maintenance access would be via ladder.
You can see we placed six condensing units on either side right above the staircase as to not disturb the people below.
And it'd make it easier for the board to see the drawings, too.
We kind of gave like four examples of different types of units out there in the buildings.
Right. So we're not exhaustive with our unit plans.
We just wanted to show sort of a snapshot of what we were offering in the market of rental apartments in the area.
So you can see we have a lot of one bedrooms, the like heavy gray walls.
Those are existing walls and kind of orient which ones are new, which ones are existing that way.
So the first two on the left here, those are within the existing building.
So we were kind of having to work with the existing window layouts and such like that in order to provide the amenities and what everybody expects out of an apartment these days on the right side.
these are two sorry god no i was gonna say i was gonna highlight the fact that you try to leverage
you know the the fact that you have side yards so you have a lot of light and air in the units
with a lot of windows in each of the rooms of course yeah yeah we did what we could to utilize
those windows as best as possible yeah you know um dealing with the fact in the older building you
have you know you have to deal with the historic commission of course right right so we do have um
You know, when we go for final approval with the Historic Commission right now, we just have the in-concept approval, but we will, you know, dimension out and have details for all of these windows to be replaced in the existing structure.
On the two on the right side, those are new units.
So these are mostly within the new portion of the building.
You can see the 1-3R, this actually covers part of the rear of the existing building and then the back portion of the new addition.
So it's a pretty sizable one bedroom unit, you know, dining room, living room, walk in closet, separate laundry room, all that.
And then next to that, we have the yellow unit. That is an example of our two bedroom unit.
It's two bed, two bath. Again, a laundry room, nice kitchen, an area for a dining room, as well as a pretty significant living room as well.
So this is, again, sort of just a snapshot of the units that we are offering in the building.
all right is there anything else you want to share before I go through the rest of my presentation
from an architect uh no now it's time like great all right well let's just go back to give you a
little bit more context in terms of just the neighborhood in general and the condition of
the property so let me just go backwards a little bit all right here are the photos
so this is the current condition of the property as you can see it's been fenced up the property's
been stabilized i'll have brian wise about my testimony as his own but i'll have him specify
how much how much money they have spent just to keep this property afloat because the city has
tried to demo it and they've spent a lot of money just to hopefully get this approval
this is the property in 2008 a little better before you know my clients bought it but still
not functional and then this is the rear of the property from s dog street again you can see here
i should have put another photo but if you go on google street view you'll see like in the past
there were garages back here um which leveraged the the um the curb cut
and then this is our uh proof of posting for both properties
a little rough there uh you know tayoga street to the right of the property
uh to the left of the properties and then from s dog right as well as left
alan what's on either side um i can you mean in terms of i mean are the existing properties
people yeah they're existing properties again the person on s dog to the left of us uh was at the
community meeting and they were very complimentary of of this project i see you know yeah there's not
much going on s dog that's the other thing they're like please activate that street for us because
that street for us because you know when you have like not much going on bad things sometimes
you know when you have like not much going on bad things sometimes
happen right let me uh go through the rest of this go through that
let's see oh this is and again i didn't go with this math but this is basically the house
and and the significant amount of work they're gonna have to do it's like shaded where they're
to have to restore it um and again that goes to you know the price of almost two
months probably over two million dollars to restore this property
and then this is just for a proof of mailing for the community meeting that took place
for both properties our applications for appeal for both properties
the the deeds to both properties owned by wise holding group LLC
and then our certificate of tax clearances uh I will ask that Mr. Wise uh virtually raise his hand
By Mr. Wise, please.
Yes. Good morning.
Mr. Wise, could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer?
Brian Wise, B-R-I-A-N-W-I-S-E.
All right. Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Yes, I do.
counsel uh yes brian you heard everything i had to state today about your zoning matter
yes i did is it true and correct yes it is do you adopt this your own testimony
yes i do specifically um i mentioned the figure i want to be accurate um i stated that you spend
around seven hundred thousand dollars just to stabilize this property through today's hearing
is that correct uh that's still correct you a little lower than that i'm looking here at
in our spreadsheet. So we bought the property. The 19th of this month will come up on our fifth
year owning the property. So since then, since purchasing the property, obviously interest
payments, then doing the make safe and then maintain the property with landscaping, snow
removal, fencing, scaffolding. I mean, we're at today 928,000 just to maintain the property.
And this is even before any approvals or any permitting to do the construction work and obviously the historic work that's going to be needed for the facade.
How much would that work entail, like going forward to restore the property to meet historic commission guidelines?
I mean, in my mind, I would like it to be 100 grand, but it's probably going to be more, like you said, a couple of million dollars to do it.
so it's a very ambitious project for us um as we usually do you know affordable housing new
construction regular rehabilitation but obviously this is um something different something special
um so we look forward to you know maintaining and keeping this property alive yeah and you grew up
in the tayoga area right yes all right and and your your your business is affordable housing
Yes. 90% of it, I'll say, is affordable housing. I'll be lying if I said 100%, but it's definitely 90%. That's what we do.
Can you tell the board some of the programs that you're a part of or that your property is a part of?
Yeah. So obviously, we work with PHA. We also work with a program called Babachi. And we just started back with a program for Youth Valley, which actually helps youth occupants when they're coming back.
a lot of them come from like foster care and that program helps them you know re-enter into society
by helping them go through school college and also helping them get a job and then living you
know on their own to help them re-acclimate and to be able to live in society and learn how to do
that from an early age so we just got back with doing that program all right well thank you for
your time all right questions are you welcome thank you yeah i have a question um just could
you pull up the site plan again alan i'm just trying to understand like the addition is now
going to be the entire extent of the to the property line on the style no no no there is
some rear yard oh yeah so i'm sorry this is a 20 uh foot rear yard setback that's where the parking
is okay that's where the parking is so is there any like outdoor space for these tenants no
probably not there is no landscaping in the in the rear but there is no outside parking
And Brian, you can speak to this, because I was at the community meeting, and you know your neighborhood better. It's a tough neighborhood, right?
and brian you can speak to this because i was at the community meeting and you know your neighborhood
There is outside space in the front. We do have a porch area, and there is space in the back for two benches that people can sit outside.
so the porch because originally i feel like in the presentation it was explained that only the
what is it the don't quote me but i want to say like the 9 to 15 units that are in the front half
of the building are going to access through that porch so for the the inhabitants that are going to
access the building through a stow street like it's going to be unlikely that they're going to
spend a ton of time on this porch so i'm just trying to get a sense of like this is a this
is dense like we're in the middle of a block 24 households could be up to 75 people and we've got
no outdoor space this is not the most transit accessible area there's only one bus line here
to get people to center city and we've only got three parking spaces well so not out of character
You know, 2230 West Tioga Street has 10 units, and it's 12 units in total that we're seeking.
Well, for each property, so it's 24 total.
Yeah, but, yeah, you mentioned something about 15.
I just wanted to make sure.
I said there's 15 properties, like, there's 15 units that would access the building through the front porch.
No, it's six and six.
Six and, okay.
Yeah, it's literally five and a half.
But, like, I was saying between nine and 15.
I was just, the numbers weren't in front of me.
No, no, no. I just want to make sure of that because that's when I heard six and nine, like I was thinking you were thinking was 15. It's six and six. There is outdoor space in the front.
Sentiment still stands. We've got 12 units. Half the units are accessing the building through the front porch. Half are going to be coming through that rear access point on Estelle Street. So you've really only got half of the building that's going to really be on that porch.
We also have a narrow there is space there if you pull up the other plane
There is space in the back and then as far as the transportation there's actually I think three bus lines
Which the the depot was right around the corner for 30 the 33 I think
Um for when I remember I used to catch the bus the 33 runs in Center City and also I think it's the
37 minutes to get from there to Center City.
So I think to assume that you're gonna have
almost 70 people that are only gonna use in service
that one bus line seems unlikely.
So I just wanna know like what is the plan,
especially if we're talking about a population
that is sort of reliant on public transportation
and if we're talking about low income individuals
who are in need of affordable housing,
what what is the i guess the plan for the for the like their livelihood in this building i can
understand the plan layout i'm thinking more so as like a long-term ecosystem for this property
that is fair as far as the transportation um it's it's i mean obviously for us it's hard to control
that and with the retrospect of agreeing with you um partially of what you're saying and then
also partially that everyone that's there may not need to go to center city every day you know
everybody you know they work in different areas they're going to different areas so again i can
agree with you um you know partially which what you're saying but it's nothing that we as individuals
can control as far as the transportation aspect outside of someone having their own vehicle
yeah and also brian i i think it was brought up at the community meaning
parking is not an issue i mean i know we're creating a lot of density here but
175 people are here that's a different story it's an eight it's it's it's 16
uh one bedrooms and eight two bedrooms um so it's you know we we feel that you're not going to have
as many people in in the one bedrooms they they're definitely more compact okay and and is the
management office on site or i think management office is brian right no no it's not me myself
but we do have a management um section of our business that manages all our properties directly
um as far as maintenance and also tenant issues so we do have uh management and we also have a
leasing um agent that we use to lease our properties like again for those various programs
and i also forgot to mention we do deal with the uh the va as well so that's off-site though correct
Yes. Okay. And you said, well, what percentage of these units would be affordable?
80% of those. We do 90% overall of our portfolio. We do 90% affordable.
We do 90% overall of our portfolio, we do 90% affordable in programming.
So in this particular project, it'll be about 80% if I have the math right, based on the conversion of our units.
I'm sorry?
Your plan is to do housing choice vouchers?
Yeah, we do.
Like I said, all of our programs are housing choice voucher, PHA, Babachi, and again, we do-
PHA has multiple programs, which is why I'm clarifying because housing choice vouchers is a
a very specific program where the tenant has to find you versus, say, like a project-based
voucher, which is more stable affordability.
So your plan is-
Yeah, so if you want to just broad stroke it, you can just basically, we'll say, a PHA
over all their programs that they have within their umbrella.
Because like you said, all the tenants have different income programs under the PHA program.
so the questions so yeah do have a couple questions so you have units in the basement
of the main building that's going to be rehab what's the depth of the basement below grade
is one it's six and a half feet below grade two and a half feet above grade so that's
fairly low and how many units are below grade just two the two front ones two units are
below green correct let me let me just make sure hold on i don't think you're correct when you
when you're talking about the height what is the height of the of this of the basement
the depth of the basement below the adjacent grade so you're at the grade what's the what's
not the grade at the pavement the grade because the the area is raised or what's yeah yeah right
yeah alan is correct at six and a half feet below grade and then two and a half feet above
So we're and then there are two basement units or two units with basement access on either side.
So a total of four. So a total of four basement units.
How many parking spaces total? Six.
Total three on each property. OK, and there are a total of 24 units, correct?
That's correct. Can you go to the site plan for a minute?
One of the things that I wanted to want to see is the pedestrian access from that backstreet.
What's the name of the backstreet? Stahl Street. Stahl Street.
The addition sits fairly far back from the street, and the block is pretty intact with pretty decent houses that have porches and the like, and there's no, from what I can see here, in order to get to the entrance to the back portion of this addition,
You have to go down the side way, go across the parking lot to the pavement, to the sort of the main pavement.
So there's no sort of direct line from the pavement straight up the side to access that entrance to that addition.
So that's. Feels like you're entering the back right of this building.
um so when you look at the units that are directly across the street and on that street
they all have these pretty sort of grand porches um and there's a sense of entry
we don't have that here it's it feels like a i understand the expense and the uh sort of the
restoration effort that's going to take place on the building on you know on the the front
which is amazing. That's an amazing building. I know that block and that area very well and glad
to see something being done. But I feel like you've neglected the street behind and with a
little more effort in the design of that back portion, whether it's addition or whether it's
a separate building altogether, because the only thing that really makes it an addition is you've
got some of these units that sort of are part of the original building because you've added a
bedroom or something that sort of connects to it. Other than that, it's a fairly distinct and
separate building and could be literally front on the street behind it if you wanted to.
But I think you've neglected the character of that front of that building, which is sad,
considering the amount of effort that you're going to take to do the restoration of the building
or the exterior of the building in the front so so that that is a big concern
for me i will say that the historic commission looked at that you know and obviously i'm sure
they addressed all those concerns as well and they did approve you know the design that we did put
They did approve, you know, the design that we did put out there in terms of the rear building structure or the addition.
out there.
Yeah, I understand that.
But I just want to. I'm sorry. Go ahead. I didn't mean to interrupt you. Go ahead.
No, I just say when you look at again, I'm just just made the comment.
If you go to the rendering that you did for the rear and I don't want to take up too much more time.
it literally looks it looks it looks it looks like you did a disservice to the to the property and the
streetscape of that of that backstreet it just does and the fact that if i have to get if i if
i live in this back portion of this building i have to go through a driveway right in a parking
lot to get to a walkway that's on the side there's no sort of direct you know straight route into
the building so I would like to make one response to that is if we were to bring
that building to the property line on Estelle Street we would not be able to
provide any parking and that was a driving factor of that design choice
for that yeah yes I that I clearly understand however when you look at the
elevation of that front it looks like a rear there's there's no sense of entry
you've got this grand entry on one side street and then the back you've got this sort of
it's the back of the house right it doesn't it doesn't give the same same respect to the to the
to the street behind so i can say yeah i appreciate the feedback um you know of all the feedback we
have gotten that is the first uh time we've heard that or the 50 of the unit that enters
through that back door mike still i would i would have said it but i felt like i don't
talked earlier but i will reinforce that sentiment so on the back uh mr johns you were saying that
if like i guess the back if it um let me let me let me say this we're going on yeah much further
than we are if you want to respond to this what you heard then we'll give a resumptive hearing
if you don't want to respond then we'll take it to so tell me where you stand with this i mean
honestly this is the first time we actually had pushback you know from well no i don't i don't
want to call it pushback i want to call it no good different way of looking at publish this
right so i mean the the thing is is that this is a very impactful project for this community i
understand it i understand it would be a shame if this wasn't approved because again i'm not
i'm saying do you want to respond to what you've heard i i don't know if we can change the okay
all right like any of you tell me and i just want to and i just want to say for the record i don't
personally look at it as pushback i just looked at it as you know just concerns that individuals
had um on the panel you know in reference to look and you know servicing so all right but i'm not
sure i'm not the architect i'm not sure if we can do anything as far as putting porches or anything
in the back to service that any other questions questions from our attorney not at this time mr
chair questions or comments from the virtual audience no hands at this time chair planning
commission chair i'm sorry a hand just went up from a telephone number sure
adrian yes adrian yes hello hi good morning could you please state your name is spelled
for the stenographer yes adrian fernandez f-e-r-n-a-n-d-e-z all right do you swear
a firm to tell the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth yes please proceed
is it are we um talking about both addressed at the same time and also
is it going to be a resumptive okay is it going to be a resumptive hearing no we're not
okay um so swamped or approves of this project at both addresses um with two provisos that were
sent in. And with consideration for what the board is saying, we also talked about increasing
landscaping at the public meeting. There were two neighbors from Estoff Street who lived
2221 and 2225, which are, I guess, within like 30 to 50 feet of the project. And as
As far as affordable housing or Section 8 residents, we would just want them to have
jobs because we have a lot of problems with Section 8 residents who are not occupied with
with jobs and families all day with destroying our neighborhoods okay thank you very much for
jobs and families all day with destroying our neighborhoods.
taking time to close we appreciate it planning commission michael gall with the philadelphia
city planning commission the planning commission recommends uh the contents of plan recommends no
change in zoning to this uh location from rsa 5 and rsa 3 residential single family attached to rta
1 residential 2 family. The subject property from Tioga to West Estaw Street. The proposal is to
renovate the historical structure. There are properties on this street that are 5 to 7 units,
but half the size of this property. The proposed unit count is slightly out of character with the
surrounding lots. The proposed parking off the rear Estaw Street and the proposed rear yard depth
is 28 feet less 18 feet for parking, where 20 is required for non-single-family use.
the deviation here is de minimis the proposed occupied area and height variances are also
de minimis therefore the city planning commission recommends the board grant the requested variances
for parking in the required rear yard parking access multi-family occupied area height and
parking space ratio but recommends a proviso of a maximum number of dwelling units at eight
yes and um mr gall i'm sorry is that recommendation for both for both for both for both yes we're
being we're entering that for 22 24 okay and so your recommendation is eight for each property
instead of the 12 that's requested okay yes yeah so yes we're going to take this on the
consideration next week we will vote next one yeah can I just respond to the Planning Commission
sure so I do believe that there's a recent case that the Commonwealth courts made a ruling that
when you're talking about hardship you look at historic designation and the effect it has
on the property and the cost of that property um we we couldn't do it at eight like this is
what we can do it as and it would be a shame that a historic property would have to come down
because of that um and again it's not out of character you know above eight even because
you know there was 2230 which has 10 units um i do believe that you know there's grounds for
undue hardship on their circumstances okay thank you question for hillary is it possible to allow
them to submit more information to outline that hardship before we like close the record um yes
we well we can close the record except for additional information okay i will say like
Throughout this presentation, it did not seem like the total budget was clear.
Like, to justify the 12 units, I don't know that I heard that as a clear argument from anyone.
And so, to allow you to give more information to justify how the historic costs,
other than knowing that just historic things cost money, is necessary.
Like, the 12 units for each is necessary.
I will supplement the record in terms of what...
But everything else is closed.
All right, thank you.
thank you thanks we're going to go to number two mi 20 25 000 391 34 49 8th street david
loza is the attorney they're being promoted to panel thank you
do we see council yeah you hear me
i can sure could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer
yeah my name is daniel louza d-a-n-i-e-l l-o-z and zebra a right do you swear or affirm to tell
the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth yes could you identify your client relationship
to the property uh my clients are um fa properties investment llc
and the principals of the LLC, Jose Fabricio Mejia and Alfa K. Polanco.
All right. Our Vice Chair has a few questions for you.
Good morning. Have you submitted your documents and exhibits five days in advance of this hearing?
Can you hear me? Raise the volume. Hold on.
Let me see if I can raise the volume. Hold on.
Have you submitted your documents and exhibits?
Yes, ma'am.
Okay. And do you waive the reading of the refusal and stipulate to its accuracy?
Yes, ma'am.
Okay. Thank you. You can share your screen and proceed with your case.
Okay. I need to invite Alberto Perez, which is the architect.
Can we add him into the screen?
um mr loza is he presenting i mean not presenting is he just showing the exhibits
because he can't present okay all right thank you
okay we have all your documents yes okay
and you got last night we sent you the updated certificate of task clearance correct
that was missing yes okay so this property 34
3449 A Street. We tried to make a case to get a two-family zoning.
Currently, it's a one-family dwelling, and we tried to get two apartments, one on the
first floor, one on the second floor.
So the owner is installing a security alarm system and security cameras in the area.
he's also adding exterior lighting to improve visibility and on the on the side for the trash
we are building a specific area in the front of the property next to the window between
the window and the entrance that's where the trash for the two apartments is gonna be
so this is the entrance going to the second floor this is the access to the second floor the hallway
and this is actually the unit inside
the second floor has to exit in the rear from the windows so the people in case of fire they have an
exit and the first floor unit has a door access to the rear in the back.
And this is the work being done on the property.
Here you have the blueprints
that are made by the architect showing the first the first floor on the one side and the second
floor on the other side then the first floor as you can see they have access exclusively
access to the basement and access to the rear yard and the and the second floor has access
from the front of the house to the second floor
i think this is the last
the last exhibit
let me ask you the rest of the block are there multiple family households living on the rest of
the block some are multi multi-family units and actually the 3314 h street was also a property
was converted into two family dwellings this is 34 49 i'm talking about 33 14. um the permit was
granted a cp 2025 003973 in the same layout than this one why why don't you bring your client on
and adopt your testimony then we'll open up for questions okay let me i don't know how to
well just your client's name right
you want to add jose fabricio and alfa i know they are online
You want to add Jose Fabricio and Alfa?
I know they are online, but I don't know how to add them.
Well, you don't have to do it.
Just mention his name and then we'll call for him, okay?
Okay, Jose, can you join us?
So they would need to raise their hands.
You said, what are the names, Jose?
Jose Fabricio Mejia and Alfa K. Polanco.
It's husband and wife.
save the second name because i don't see the first name mejia i'm sorry alpha polanco okay
alpha polanco is is in the virtual audience um she just needs to raise her hand okay let me see if i
can text her alpha polanco can you please raise your virtual hand so that you can be promoted
uh they're currently declining to be promoted
hello can you hand me oh yeah yeah could you please state your name and spell for the
stenographer um i'm out for polanco um a l f a p o l a c i mean n c o polanco
right do you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth
yes all right counsel yes would you could you ask her to adopt your testimony
i'm sorry can you say that again well she should adopt your testimony right
yes right could we do that yes can you adapt your testimony please
sir she needs to adopt the remarks that you made as her testimony so you need to ask her
if she can your testimony and then adopts it okay so the question is whether what i said is the
truth and you say that this the truth yes all right all right questions from the board uh yes
for the second floor unit what is the plan for the utilities and I speak more
Spanish Spanish he speaks better Spanish than English yeah okay can I
translate no no you can no you cannot did you speak with her about this question
i mean yes they went over the the blueprints many many times yes
okay well did you talk with her about the utilities um i'm assuming yes each each unit
has their own closet and their own toilet and their own and their own utility utility gonna be
separate from first floor and second floor it's gonna be two separate unit two separate utilities
understood that i think my my question is more about the utility connections typically in a row
house they are both in the basement but in this case only one of the units has access to the
basement so my question would be one how will the second floor unit access utilities if there's any
issue they need to address them okay let me can i ask them in spanish no we'd have to get an
interpreter okay can we get an interpreter all right hillary we want to do a result if you're
going to have to okay all right so we're going to do a resumptive hearing for this
and it's going to be on um 7 29 2026 at 9 30 a.m okay at that time could you come back and be
prepared to handle the questions okay and we'll have an interpreter we will have an interpreter
for the application. Thank you so much.
All right, thank you.
All right, number
number three.
000685
Waldemere Drive.
Vern Anastasio is the attorney.
he's being promoted to panelists here okay thank you he's he's right here um good morning again
we didn't talk yet today did we we have not good morning good morning could you please state your
name and spell for this is on the first yes good morning mr chair members of the board it's burn
Good morning, Mr. Chair, members of the board. It's Vern Anastasio, A-N-A-S-T-A-S-I-O, on behalf of Mr. Farouk El-Hadi.
Anastasio, A-N-A.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
We don't, let me see here. Did we get the letter yet from Mill Creek or Millbrook?
So, I'm sorry. So for this one, not since there was a meeting last week, correct?
Correct.
Okay, so yes, so we have not received anything since that meeting the RCO had previously sent a letter indicating they were opposed
But that was that was prior that was last summer that they sent a letter
So see the council persons and I'm gonna be asking that this the vote be held today
Because I there is a video that I'd like to be able to submit for the board to watch in in their own session
yeah but we'd have to open that up to other people right i mean yes any yeah exhibits would
have to be on the record um we could we couldn't just look at it in an executive session um i could
put we could put it on the record today okay what's the nature of the video it's just a
neighbor interaction with my client on the first the first time he went to his home and introduced
themselves to some of the families and you have that with you today electronically i would be
able to forward that to you all right well you could also share it via the via zoom if possible
i didn't believe we could do that you should be yeah if you have it on your computer we should be
able to do it that way if the if the board would like to see it well yes okay we may not be able
to do that right maybe at a resumption hearing then okay okay so why don't we get as much as
we can on the record okay of course here good morning have you submitted your documents and
exhibits five days in advance of this hearing i have and do you wait to read another refusal
or stipulate to his accuracy i do okay thank you show your screen and proceed with the case
i don't see a share option here
i think i need to be promoted electronically first
there it goes
Okay, 11920, Waldemere Drive.
We're here to legalize a three-family dwelling in an existing structure.
This was the appeal that went in.
my client purchased this property from a long time owner who took the garage
and put in a kitchen and put up some walls and put up a bathroom
my client i mean unlike many of my clients who come here and saying i thought i was buying a
triplex when in fact i did not i bought a duplex my client knew even though the
property presented itself as a triplex my client knew that it was only legally
zoned as a duplex he did purchase it anyway with the mission of getting it
approved getting it legalized he believed because the previous owner had
done so and that previous owner had good relations with the community that there
would be no con no issues whatsoever so i want to show you the the plan
interior layout
is this on a a whole group of duplexes there are there are many duplexes on the block yeah right
thank you as you can see here this is the ground level this is where the garage
and you have stairs that go up to the first floor from the front
it's the second unit and then the top unit my client lives in one of the units already
he lives on one of the i'm going to call second or third floor that's correct not the garage
that's correct not not the former garage that's correct
So he purchased it and this is the work that was done. He did, of course, do work on the property, nothing that would require any sort of permits.
so he purchased it and this is the work that was done he did of course
At the RCO meeting we heard about a list of violations on the property and there were some, some were unfounded, we appealed all of them and dealt with all of them.
So the only outstanding appeals, I'm sorry, violation is the use, of course.
That's where it sits.
This is the letter that went out to everyone.
and the proof of mailing. So it's a little unusual in that lots of times we have folks
saying that they purchase what appears to be a triplex or almost, you know, a full triplex,
but they, you know, and they believe that that's what they were buying. My client knew
that it was legally zoned a duplex. He saw that the garage was outfitted with a bathroom. It
still needed to be you know sort of worked on a little bit but was all framed out and decided to
purchase it so that he could legalize it again he he did believe because the previous owner who had
lived for generations on in this property no one else had a problem with him building out as much
as he did on that basement that that would pretty much be you know okay uh what my client will
testify and you know the evidence will show is that my client's name is Farouk El Hadi
and the very first day he moved into his property he went and visited and introduced himself to his
neighbors and after they asked him what his name was it was very clear that she said verbatim and
you'll hear testimony today from my client I never thought I'd see the day of Farouk would live in
this neighborhood let alone this block so from that moment on Mr. Farouk Elhadi had a feeling
that things weren't going to be as smooth with this triplex as he had hoped
and I have nothing further for now I'd like to call Mr. Elhadi to the stand if he could raise his
virtual hand. They're promoted chair. Okay. Sir. Here he is. Hi. Can you guys hear me? Could you
Yeah, could you turn on your video, please?
Hi, sir.
Could you please state your name as spelled for the stenographer?
My name is Farouk El-Hadidi, F-A-R-O-U-K.
All right.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Counsel?
Thank you.
Farouk, did you hear my presentation to the board this morning?
Is it true and accurate to the best of your knowledge?
do you adopt it as adopted as your own testimony yes okay and can you explain to the board uh your
uh experience thus far uh upon moving into this property um moving in um and um after introducing
myself to a lot of the neighbors and a lot of people that represent themselves as part of the
community. Um, you know, many times I introduced myself with, you know, I told them my name is
Farouk and verbatim, um, I've been told twice, you know, um, and most recently one of them was,
one of them was saying, um, you know, she never expected to see somebody with that name
in this kind of neighborhood. Um, and further on, uh, across the street from me when I introduced
myself and you know we're talking and and i get asked i get asked that question a lot what's my
relationship to the to the building and um two different occasions where the cops were called
after me you know picking up some mails or being in the lot um that someone is trying to break in
as of last week cops were called on my wife mom and five-year-old that were they were trying even
though they were just checking on the on the building uh someone was breaking into the into
the into the building which is not very true um another time when um you know i was in uniform
going to to see something um somebody was walking the dog and they asked the same question what are
Somebody was walking the dog and they asked the same question. What are you doing here? What is this appeal for? And I explained what's going on. And same kind of answer. And, you know, when I told them that I'm a pilot, I work for this company, here's what I do.
doing here
And it's very disrespectful and very, you know, names were called and comments were made.
And that was it, you know, multiple times on many different occasions.
You know, everybody wanted to make sure that I'm not welcomed in that block, in that street, in that neighborhood.
at least four different times where I can call verbatim what they said and how they said it.
And for the record, the Human Relations Commission is being notified of this as well.
Still looking at it?
They're going to be notified of this, yes.
Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Farouk.
And you do have possession of the video that you'll be able to forward so that we can then have a resumptive hearing.
Is that correct?
Thank you.
Um, hold on. Um, I guess, I guess the question would be, sir, your council said, but when you bought it, you knew that it was an improper building.
What do you mean?
Yeah, as I said in my presentation and you adopted as your own testimony that.
although the property presented itself to you as a physical three-family dwelling you did
understand that it was only approved for two is that correct yes and you took on that
responsibility to legalize it is that correct yes sir and you purchased it from a very long-standing
member of the community who did that build out on the on the bottom floor is that correct
yes sir and all the people who have come up to you and uh told you you know either they are not
supporting your appeal or they're not quite sure what someone like you is doing on the block they
were all good relations with the prior owner is that correct yeah they knew him on a first name
basis they they were really friendly with them as many of them are long term um um you know neighbors
thank you yes all right questions from the board yes i well what i do want to say i'm sorry that
you feel that uh i'm sorry that this happened to you but i do want to focus on the nature of the
actual zoning request um so i think my first question is how many other multi-family properties
are on the immediate block there's at least four four and are there any that are triplexes
or are all the others only duplexes?
I have not seen other triplexes.
And then for the other,
is this the first unit that will have access
for one of the units through that,
what was the former garage?
There are other properties on that block
whose garages have been converted to something.
To something, okay.
And then my second question is around
just understanding,
I know you said that there was a bathroom
in the garage at purchase, but what led you to believe that this had been converted into a third
unit? It was a kitchen as well. Kitchen as well. Okay. I have a question about the RCO meeting.
Could you just explain what happened at the RCO meeting? It was very much in line of the
conversations my client has had in the past. So they were opposition, a lot of opposition.
Without question.
Defending the person who actually built it out
and saying that, well, he knew, so that's on him.
And that was my next question, like the hardship,
because it seemed like if he knew that it was a duplex,
do you think it was a self-created hardship,
or does he have a different hardship in terms of just...
He assumed the risk, but the hardship exists physically
with the property that he'll have to either gut that himself.
But obviously he's assuming the risk.
And my...
honest about it. Unlike sometimes, you know, some folks on it. Thank you. And my last question is
your immediate next next door neighbor. Um, were they in support or opposition? The immediate
next door. There's only one person on the other side. Yeah. Mr. Farouk, have you had any
communication with the immediate next door neighbor? Yes, I had, um, her name is Melissa
and, um, and Tom and her mom. They it's a big, it's a, it's another duplex and the family lives
in there they're not opposing this okay thank you actually i do have one more question was the
garage already completely separated or was there just a kitchen or a kitchenette and a bathroom
in the garage similar to like a rec room or a basement what bar area could have
can you pull up the plan again just so we see what he's what you're talking about
was there a separate entrance right and had the utilities been separated like had it been
already subdivided from the home itself with there were only two utility boxes okay yeah
so to what work is left uh that your client would need to do to come turn this into a holy third
I THINK HE'S ALREADY, PARUK, COULD YOU EXPLAIN WHAT WORK IS EITHER LEFT OR WHAT WORK YOU COMPLETED UPON PURCHASE?
CAN YOU SHOW THE BASEMENT PLAN SO WE CAN SEE?
PARUK, DID YOU HEAR THE QUESTION?
HE WENT OFF, I THINK.
i believe there was he did do work in that basement but none that would require uh any
more additional it looks like everything that was done required permits that's sort of why i was
asking and would he be opposed to a co no he's not opposed to okay because anything that touches
any plumbing and anything that touches any electrical and any partition walls requires a
permit so um i don't know what work could have been done to convert it that wouldn't have required
well flooring permits other than flooring and painting right that's i believe that's what
pretty much they did but um so then it was already wholly separated right except for the electric it
was not separated yeah except for the utilities but you're saying like this was already subdivided
where it had no connection to the rest of the home it was already closed off yeah okay yeah
I thought your question was about separation of utilities.
Yeah, it was about closing off of the structure.
So who has access to the parking in the back? Is it just the unit on the basement, or do other units have access to the parking?
There's two-car parking in the rear, and right now it's two of the units would have access to that.
And under this scenario, will they still have access?
yes this is a shared driveway in the back here
right questions from our attorney um not so much a question i just wanted to
note um the so let me just okay this is rsa four so parking is not required
the so the parking spaces it seemed like would have previously been interior parking and so
there's no reference to moving these two service parking spaces so that may need to be done through
a separate permit application um and which could also generate a refusal for having parking if it's
in the required rear yard or because it's access from a shared driveway so that should not be a
problem right um but i just want to make a note of that for the record because i saw the spaces
but did not see any note on the um refusal about that so thank you questions or comments from the
virtual audience. Chair, we had a hand up from Matthew Burns. Okay, we're going to do the
council person's offices here. How else could you please state your name and spell for the
stenographer? Morning, Chairman, members of the board, Alice Udovich, A-L-I-C-E-U-D-O-V-I-C-H,
on behalf of Councilman Brian. You swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth,
nothing but the truth? I do. Please proceed. I first want to say that I apologize if your
client felt in any way that this had anything to do with anything other than zoning i also want to
maintain that the property is listed as being owned by real estate empire llc i'm sure that
that's a somewhat sophisticated operation and they knew exactly what they were buying
this is a complete overuse of this property these this is a small row of five or six duplexes there
is no hardship existing here as to why this property can't be used as a duplex instead
of trying to take a utility and garage floor level and and make it into a tiny apartment
do you have any questions no thank you anyone else please the other person in the audience
yes we have a hand up from matthew burns and another hand from the virtual audience
persons with the initial GC.
Okay. First one, please.
Hello?
Hello?
Hi, GC.
Could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer?
My name is Giovanni Carpino, G-I-O-V-A-N-N-I.
last names Carpino C-A-R-P-I-N-O do you swear or affirm to tell the truth the
whole truth nothing but the truth yes sir could you turn your video on and are
yes sir could you turn your video on and are you a neighbor i am
you a neighbor
all right please i don't know if it's going to let me let me uh start your testimony we're fine
let me yeah i have to pull over but um so i've owned since 2006 um there's probably more like
nine units there's a separation for a breezeway that are on that block um we welcome all owners
uh to that block actually there's a couple owners that are on this call as well
that owner occupy as well as myself um i have no objection to him continuing usage as a duplex
But when it comes to a triplex, that just messes with the infrastructure of our neighborhood, allowing more cars, trash, people, and it becomes very overcluttered.
I would love to know because everybody has been so welcoming.
We all help each other shovel during the wintertime.
We all are friends with each other on that block.
So I find it very hard to believe I'm not calling him a liar, but I find it hard to believe that somebody would object to him the way he's saying it's being objected.
So, Mr. Carpino, you're not in favor of this project, am I correct?
I'm not in favor of this project because of what he's trying to do.
He's been doing work in that building unpermitted for a while now.
he's taken down trees that he threw the trees down into the into the crick
I'm not great on the property okay the property alone I'm the I'm objective in
it of a triplex yes it's not any questions all right next hand please
and how many hands do we have up sure we have Matthew Burns and I hit our
lopez okay mr burns hi hi mr burns could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer
uh matthew burns m-a-t-t-h-e-w-e-e-r-n-s all right do you swear or affirm to tell the truth
told truth nothing but the truth i do are you a neighbor yes are you in favor of this project
or against against do you have any reasons you can present other than what's already been
explained yeah i mean i attended that meeting last week and the one prior to that uh that they
didn't even show up to um so i've i've never met um the client i've never seen him before
that's just me i don't know but i know giovanni i know you hire uh they're my next door neighbors
i live in this house we have all similar units there's i don't see how this could be a triplex
it would be fairly unlivable at the meeting itself when they passed around pictures
of the units all i saw was an unfinished basement with a slop sink in it okay
the units in the house that i have in the same house so i don't know where these pictures are
coming from or what they're showing us but it seems very disingenuous what they're doing
um i am also sorry uh like we rent to our upstairs neighbors we don't care about their background or
where they came from right i mean thank you very much we appreciate your comments
counselor do you have any questions i don't next hand please
hi good afternoon everyone hi could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer
yes it's yahira lopez y-a-h-i-r-a l-o-p-e-z right do you swear or affirm to tell the truth
told truth nothing but the truth i do are you a neighbor yes i am are you in favor of this
practice or against i am against this project and then please if there's anything that's different
than what's already been testified but other than that we will note that you're in favor okay
Again, I'm sure.
Pretty much, you know, we're all very neighborly here.
We're very welcoming.
We highly encourage owner occupancy, which is great because we tend to get along.
We all care for our properties.
Pretty much for the same reasons Giovanni and Matthew had stated there is a shortage in parking.
We all share the same common area in the back.
There is only one way in and one way out.
so there is uh it will increase uh daily traffic back there uh there will be an
so there will also be an overload of utilities by uh uh turning a duplex into a triplex with
more strain on the sewage water and electrical infrastructure unfortunately today the main
storm drain sits right behind my property so that also can impact my infrastructure as well
so that also can impact my infrastructure as well thank you thank you thank you very much i think
many things you've said we've all heard we appreciate it council do you have any questions
i have no questions just comment that uh the unit would be you know small enough that i don't think
any kind of impact on the water or sewage would be the material is there anyone else in the audience
no hands at this time chair any commission planning commission um michael gall with the
philadelphia city planning commission the comprehensive plan recommends no change to
the rsa4 residential single family attached zoning at this location the city last rezoned
this neighborhood in 1981 at that time the property had been zoned r7 at residential
which is today's rsa4 and had been zoned residential single family since the inception
of the zoning code in 1933. a previous owner did receive approval to legalize a second dwelling
unit however there is no unique physical condition or circumstance of this property
that would prevent it from being used in strict conformity with the zoning code there are other
two unit buildings on this block face but no legal three unit buildings city planning commission
therefore recommends the board grant the proposed use variance for residential use but with a
recommended proviso maximum of two units okay so um thank you very much we're going to have a
resumptive hearing on this on 7 29 2026 at 9 30 a.m uh we will close other than additional
information that we'll hear from council am i correct hillary and the rco and the rco actually
mr sure since we're doing a resumption hearing i would i would leave the record open because the
rco hasn't submitted a letter okay i know council had addition um had a video they wanted to submit
and they're also going to show proof of posting and that sort of thing okay so let's leave the
record open all right thank you very much thank you all right okay yeah okay
Number eight, MI-2025-005-738-2408, Nicholas Street.
Vern Anastasio is the attorney.
Mr. Anastasio, just for the record, state your name.
You've already been sworn.
Good afternoon, Mr. Chair.
Members of the board, Vern Anastasio, A-N-A-S-T-A-S-I-O.
On behalf of my client, Killian Gersing.
Okay. Let's see here what we have here. Slash Community Corporation. We have a letter from them. Non-opposition from Council Member Young. Our Vice Chair has a few additional questions.
Good afternoon. Have you submitted your documents and exhibits five days in advance of this hearing?
I did.
And do you waive the read and the refusal to assimilate to us accuracy?
All right. Thank you. Show your screen and proceed with your case.
2408 nicholas street our application is for visitor accommodation in an existing structure
that just went blank
MY COMPUTER JUST FROZE.
SECOND.
SORRY ABOUT THAT, MR. CHAIR.
IT SHOULD BE BETTER NOW.
IT'S A VISITOR ACCOMMODATION IN AN
existing structure and i have to stop sharing and reshare my apologies
i'm getting blank pages here right now so
I have to
I may have to reboot
Visitor accommodation in an existing structure and we have a refusal here.
This is a beautifully renovated apart home.
this is a beautifully renovated apart uh home
it's a duplex
i'm sorry there it is no it's not there it is
there's this for both units yes sir
it's a duplex as you can see here there's the layout
your first floor unit in red top unit in green
property has been completely redeveloped on the interior and exterior
we spoke to the immediate neighbor on this side here where my cursor is they are in complete support
This property had been used for limited lodging previously, zero incident.
They are using Deluxe Hospitality, Mr. Anthony Lolio, who has testified before this board several times about the management style, the vetting, the rules and regulations, no one under 25, no parties, very strict as Deluxe has always done.
Beautifully appointed. We met with the neighbors, the RCO, and as a result of those meetings, we move into evidence their letter of non-opposition, as well as Councilman Young's letter of support.
The block is still a challenging block. There is an immediate adjacent property that has been cleaned and sealed. There's no development going on as planned because my client has invested a lot into into this property and wants to make sure that it yields enough to maintain it. We do respectfully request the granting of this variance for the visitor accommodation. Thank you.
you want to bring your client on mr killian gersing if he's still here with us please raise
your virtual hand thank you i'm on hi could you please state your name sir and spell for the
stenographer uh this is killing gersing k-i-l-i-a-n last name gersing g-e-r-s-i-n-g
you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth
i do could you turn your video on please yeah thank you
Council thank you Killian did you hear my presentation to the board today I did it's
true and accurate to the best of your knowledge it is and you adopt it as your own testimony
yes I do thank you I have nothing further questions from the board
what's going to be the trash plan is this going to be something that's completely
managed by the um I guess the company yep uh yep it'll be interior and that after every stay
the deluxe hospitality comes in and takes all that trash out and then do you know what when
you were doing this before what was your sort of average tenure of a visitor gillian what's the
average tenure right now it is about um one to two months but we're not doing any short-term
right now it's medium-term essentially and so the plan this would shift it so like this would
obviously allow you to have less than 30 day rental so okay other questions
um does your client have experience with oh yes yes so he's done these kind of things yes he
certainly has and again uh he's going to be using uh the platform platform management folks that do
this stuff um one of them being a deluxe listing which mr lolio has been here in the past and
had testified to his strict vetting and strict maintenance of the properties okay and um does
he have like a rating gillian do you have a rating yet anywhere it's a rating on the on the on the
airbnb platform you mean yes yeah it's it's it's i believe it's around like 4.8 4.9 but i've
it's it's very hard yeah out of five stars that's right oh okay that's high yeah
questions from our attorney not at this time questions or comments from the virtual audience
i think cheryl's shopping no hands at this time chair any commission michael gall with the
philadelphia city planning commission the comprehensive plan recommends a change in
zoning at this location from the existing RM1 residential multifamily to RSA5 residential
single-family attached. The appellant has not demonstrated that there are any unique
the appellant has not demonstrated that there are any unique physical conditions or circumstances of
physical conditions or circumstances of the property that would
the property that would prevent it from being used in strict conformance with the zoning code
therefore the city planning commission recommends the board deny the requested variance for visitor
accommodation use in my 2025-005-438-2408 nicholas street i vote yes temporary variance expires 5729
Thank you, Michael Johns. My vote is yes with proviso.
Cheryl Gaster, my vote is yes with proviso.
Tanetta Graham, my vote is yes with proviso.
Taya Wayne, my vote is yes with proviso.
Thank you, counsel.
Thank you.
MI-2025-006-773-2233 North 7th Street. Eric Carroll is the attorney.
they're being promoted to panelists share
unanimous support from 37 ward RCO and non-opposition from council member Young
good morning chairman panel Eric Carroll here for the applicant appellant
hi Mr Kers could you please spell your name for the stenographer
certainly eric c-a-r-r-o-l-l right do you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth nothing
but the truth i do and could you identify your client a relationship to this property yes so my
client is um unique consulting and investments and the principal of that firm moniquetta coats
uh is here in the virtual audience she is the contractor and consultant for the tenant in this
the commercial tenant in this space son Sarah Hammond or voice shares a few
questions good afternoon have you submitted your documents and exhibits
five days in advance of this hearing yes and do you waive the reading of the
referral and stipulate to its accuracy I do okay thank you can show your screen
and proceed with your case okay the the property here at issue actually goes by
two addresses 22 33 north 7th street as well as 22 24 to 22 50 germantown avenue uh the proper
the property as a whole is this white building here that was erected in 2021 dolphins dolphin
street is immediately to the north uh germantown avenue is to the east and 7th street is to the
west and it's it's a triangular property at the end of the block so you can see it's a four story
building. Those are residential apartments on floors two, three, and four. And the first
floor is, it's a commercial space and some offices for the leasing company.
Property zone CMX2. My, as I said, my client is unique consulting investments. They're a
contractor and development consultant they were retained by Sun Sarah Hammond an individual who
signed a commercial lease for part of the first floor space what Ms Hammond wants to do is install
a event space it would be known as S and S Lux suite this would be an event space that you know
where people could rent out it's not a bar or a restaurant it's for private events
i've submitted all the documents this is the refusal as you see the application is for event
space with occasional live entertainment and that proposed use is not permitted here this
is a referral for special exception not not a not a refusal the appeal was submitted
project information form was submitted
these are the plans as I mentioned it's a it's a triangular property the event space would be at
the point of the triangle which is on the left of these plants here but actually to the north
pointing towards Dolphin Street you can see the layout you would walk in at the at the entrance
at the building and then there's the event space here uh where the tables and chairs or whatever
people renting the space would want to put in would be kitchen and bathrooms in the back the
whole area is only 2662 square feet the other portion of the first floor there there ultimately
may be other tenants in there but we are only leasing this Porsche this front portion here
this these are pictures of what the interior looks like as you can see
These are pictures of what the interior looks like.
As you can see, the fit out has been completed.
Another one here.
My client actually met with the RCO back on April 15th.
And as part of that meeting, she prepared this overview.
So what it is, professionally managed indoor event space for private celebrations,
small gatherings, business meeting, community events. This is not a very big space, so there's
not going to be a lot of people there. There's no liquor license. There's going to be no alcohol
sales. This is not going to be a late night club or anything like that. There's ample parking along
Germantown Avenue. For this part of the city, it's an oddly low density area, and there's ample
street parking the 37th ward rco voted unanimously in support 13-0 on april 15th
i have the pictures of the posted notices along the building
certificates of mailing for the rco meeting
uh and this is also the tax clearance certificate
for son sarah hammond and her lease with with the with the actual building owner germantown owner llc
um i have miss coates in the audience in the virtual audience i would ask that she be
elevated unless there's any questions at this point um is it possible that the tenant could
be asked to adopt your testimony as opposed to the contractor who she hired because i do
looks like she is in the audience uh if ms hammond is in the audience yes she could be elevated and
i've absolutely thank you
what's your name again
since sarah hammond can you raise your hand please currently miss hammond and miss coates
are both declining to become panelists at this time um let me see i have hold on let me see if
i can get in touch with them okay she's trying i just got a text from my client apparently she's
trying to join right now okay all right miss hammond can you please accept the request to be
promoted to a panelist do we share
Ms. Hammond, can you please unmute yourself and turn on your camera, you've been promoted.
Thank you.
so how are we making out with seeing her um it looks like she went off of the zoo so so council
you know officer the court could can you answer most of the questions you think yes okay questions
from the board what's your hours of operation um it would mostly be in the afternoons uh on the
weekends or evenings but i think the latest thing will be scheduled for like the limit at the end of
night would be 9 or 10 o'clock maybe even earlier would you say to end at 9 yes yes this would not
be a late night establishment i have a question about deliveries um i understand that you guys
have that primary entrance that's at the corner of germantown and 7th street um but it is you know
there's a column in front of it so i'm wondering is it your plan to have like all if you're going
If you're going to have a rental furniture, if you're going to have catering coming in and out of that same entrance, or do you have access to like a loading dock?
to have a rental furniture if you're going to have catering coming in and out of that same entrance
There's a, yeah, there's actually a, there's a, on 7th street, there's a side door entrance and that's, which once you go into that, that's, you know, where the trash trucks come in and out there.
There's a large space in inside the building coming off 7th street.
and your client will have use of that space yes that's an agreement with building management yes
and then my second question and what is the plan on site for amplified sound or music or even live
music um to the extent there would be live music there would not be it would not be a situation
where there wouldn't be a concert situation it would be like a small band or a dj or something
like that um but it would decibels would be contractually limited
understood but there's still so there's plan to have that on site
what's going to be the plan for sound attenuation between the floors for the residences above
The landlord does not have an issue with this. As I said, it's a new building.
I understand that. That wasn't my question.
I'm sorry. Could you rephrase your question, please?
My question was, what is your client's plan for sound attenuation between the units, given that
this is a first commercial condo and there are a rental unit and there are residences above
i don't we don't think that that will be an issue given the construction but if it is i mean we're
just going to have to further limit the the decibel um cap on the on the contracts okay
and then on the plan i just because i'm looking in google maps hi good afternoon this is sansari
hammond i apologize for the delay sure could you please state your name and spell it for the
stenographer. Sure. Sanceri Hammond, S-O-N-C-E-R-A-H-A-M-M-O-N-D. Do you swear or affirm the
tell the truth, told truth, nothing about the truth? Yes. And you're the owner. Yes. You're
going to be the tenant. Yes. Of those speeds. Yes. Questions? Ms. Hammond, could you speak to
the volume issues with the live music? So there shouldn't be any live music here. If you heard
live music it can be from my other cell phone which is vibrating but there should be live music
at the no no at the in the event space you're going to have djs oh i'm so sorry i was i was
out of the meeting for a moment so i didn't hear that information so we will allow djs but to a
certain extent and we do have speakers also that we do provide yeah so my question was actually
what is the plan for sound attenuation between your unit and the residences above
so the ducting work that was built into the space does allow the information to be sound
proof for the tenants above so there shouldn't be any sound issues with the tenants being able
to hear anything that goes on within the commercial space okay and then uh the other
question was about loading in like for furniture or for catering and deliveries so we don't allow
any catering um if people can bring food but not a physical caterer because we do not have
a kitchenette inside the space low and then we do load it we can load in from the main entrance
into the side the suite so your plan is to do drop off catering only yes okay and then what
so what type of events are you planning on having in this space typically small intimate events such
as baby showers um office events cater um not caterers office events baby showers parties very
intimate set set in no more than about 60 to 70 people and then what's the max uh what's the max
people that can be in the space 75 okay all the questions questions from our attorney
not at this time mr chair questions or comments from the virtual audience
no hands at this time i did want to clarify um because this is a large building and there are
i believe multiple commercial spaces is this considered unit b this is considered commercial
2. Yes. Tenant B. Yes. Tenant B. Commercial 2. Okay. Yes. Thank you. No problem.
Anyone in the virtual audience? No hands at the time, Chair. Planning Commission.
Michael Gall with the Philadelphia City Planning Commission. The comprehensive plan recommends no
change to the existing CMX2 commercial mixed-use zoning at this location. This property has a long
documented history as a hotel location dating to well before the adoption of
the city's first zoning code and the property subsequently operated as an
auto repair business. In the new building, the proposed use of this
In the new building, the proposed use of this property as an assembly facility is consistent with the corridor nature of Germantown Avenue and should cause no undue detriment to neighboring properties beyond what might otherwise be expected.
property as an assembly facility is consistent with the corridor nature
Therefore, the Philadelphia City Planning Commission recommends that the Board grant the requested special exception for event assembly facility use.
MI 2025-006-773-2233 North 7th Street.
I vote yes with proviso. Events to end by 9 p.m. and commercial, unit commercial B only.
Michael Johns, my vote is yes with proviso.
Cheryl Gaston, my vote is yes with proviso.
Tanetta Graham, my vote is yes with proviso.
Taya Wynn, my vote is yes with proviso.
Thank you, Council.
And just to clarify, I'll put on the notice of decision, it's commercial 2 slash tenant B.
That's kind of a double name.
i'll put both on there so it's clear thank you um number 15.
MI-2025-007-015-203-09, Diamond Street. Myra the Ferliger is the attorney.
Non-opposition from Council Member Lozada. Letter of support from Norris Square.
Council, could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer?
Meredith Ferliger, F-E-R-L-E-G-E-R.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Yes, I do.
Could you identify your client in relationship to the property?
My client is SAV Investments, LLC, and that LLC is represented today on the Zoom by Dan Hirschel.
Okay. Our Vice Chair has a few questions. Hi. Good afternoon. Have you submitted your documents and exhibits five days in advance of this hearing? Yes, I did. And do you waive the reading of the refusal and stipulate to its accuracy? Yes, I do. Okay. Thank you. You can show your screen and proceed with the case.
all right we do also on the zoom today have our architect logan dry from kca in case there are
any questions before the board today is a proposal that will eliminate a long vacant lot at the
corner of diamond street and north phillip street in the city's nara square section of north
philadelphia this identical proposal was approved by the board back in 2020 though with different
refusals at the time than are before the board today due to a change in zoning that has occurred
since then the property involved as you know is 203 209 diamond street and is currently zoned rsa5
it was last zoned cmx2 during the initial approval the board has an exhibit packet in front of you
with 16 exhibits, including tax clearance at Exhibit 2 and the deed to the property at Exhibit 3.
As Mr. Chairman mentioned, we are also pleased to include at Exhibit 16 letters of support from
both the Councilwoman and the official RCO for this property.
Turning to the zoning map here on the screen at Exhibit 5, you'll see that this lot here
is at the corner of diamond street and north phillip street just by way of context north
american street is just to the west of the property what is notable here is that this is the
only rsa5 zoned lot facing diamond street for many many blocks to both the west as well as to
the east and if i just sort of scroll over i on the view that i have here i can't even get an rsa5
lot to the west, and the next one to the east is all the way over here at Hancock Street.
Other than this anomaly in zoning classification, all of the other lots facing Diamond Street are
zoned RM1, CMX2, or ICMX on the American Street corridor. As you can see on the next couple of
pages, this area was rezoned shortly after the board's last approval for this lot, rezoning the
lot from cmx2 to its current condition rsa5 the aerials to the property are shown at exhibit 7
the aerials to the property are shown at exhibit seven just to give you a little bit more context
just to give you
in the first view here looking north you'll see the vacant lot that is the subject of this
application at the corner now if the board takes note of the surrounding area you'll see a dominant
industrial commercial stretch along american street and then more more uh proximate to this
property you'll see an auto repair garage directly next door to the east of the property
now from this view you'll also see the newer multi-family
developments that have been constructed closer to diamond street along some of the side streets
the next image here is just a closer view and again just showing you a little bit
better context of north second street just to the east of the property
And again, this is looking at the property from the east direction, looking towards North 2nd Street.
And then this large vacant swath of land here that you can see in the image is currently under construction for a new commercial office building.
looking at the uh street view images here this first image of the property is from north phillip
street uh and again this also shows the timely posted zoning posters the second image here is
looking a little bit further uh down on north phillip street the property is basically to the
right of the photo and you can see here basically half of the block on north phillips street a
little bit further way down is uh residential and then the other half facing american street
is dominantly industrial commercial this is a view of the property from diamond street where
again you'll see that auto repair and window tint business that is directly next to this property
and i believe was recently renovated looking in the opposite direction of the property there are
a few mixed residential commercial structures as well as a new multi-family just off of north
second street just off of diamond and then again this next image is looking east on diamond street
where again you can see the fairly clear lack of dominant single-family character in this particular
area. And then looking west on Diamond Street, this is directly next to the property, where again
you can see the large commercial child care center next door, and then across the street is where
that office building is, I believe, under construction. And then this is the zoning
posters that were posted on Diamond Street. So the zoning plans are shown at Exhibit 9, which again
is identical to that which was approved and permitted in 2020. The proposal itself calls
for the erection of a four-story structure to be used as a multifamily dwelling with eight dwelling
units. The structure itself meets all of the dimensional requirements of the code.
And if I zoom in on the zoning plans, although a nine-foot rear yard is required, you can see here
that the structure itself will actually be set back 12 feet from the next adjacent
lot on north phillips street which happens to be a vacant city-owned lot
the floor plans are included at exhibit 10. overall there are eight units each over a thousand
square feet the cellar level includes bike storage trash storage mechanical and tenant storage
The two first floor units also have a small flexible living space on that lower level as well.
All of the units themselves have ample living space in unit laundry and in unit trash closets in addition to that trash storage area in the cellar level as well.
Commercial trash pickup will be required for this building.
as i mentioned logan dry is here and he can explain the floor plans in any additional detail
that the board requires but the units themselves you can see are all fairly uniform in size and
layout we did also include a rendering of the building at exhibit 11. now as i mentioned in
In 2020, the project itself was reviewed and granted relief based on two refusals at the
This time, under current restrictions, the application only received one refusal for
the proposed multifamily use.
You can see in 2020, the refusals were for density and lack of commercial, and now the
and lack of commercial and now the refusal is just for the proposed multi-family
refusal is just for the proposed
we submit that the board can consider several hardships granting authorizing grant of relief
of this request first just basically starting with the history of the property any remaining
structures on this particular lot were seemingly demolished sometime back in the 60s and it has
remained entirely vacant since then furthermore as i've shown at exhibit 12 and i'll bring up the
zoning plan here this exact project was reviewed and approved by the board and granted variances
based on the refusal that i showed a few minutes ago that request was pursued by a prior owner of
the property my client now is the new owner of the property who is just looking to re-entitle
this identical project unfortunately not only did the zoning of the property itself change
but it became even more restrictive and entirely out of character with the context of this
particular section of diamond street the property itself suffered unique hardships in terms of
density back in 2020 and although the commercial use itself is no longer required the hardships
preventing development of single-family dwellings remain.
As you can see on Exhibit 6, let me zoom back out on this.
The uses of surrounding properties here would foreclose the development of unsubsidized single-family homes on this particular lot,
which was actually consolidated under former ownership.
most of the surrounding uses of properties facing diamond street are either industrial
automotive or are substantially sized commercial developments on parcels like the one across the
street that are significantly larger furthermore there are multitude of existing and multi-family
developments just even in this view alone development supporting 13 units 18 units
And if I happen to zoom out more, there would be even more orange dots up and down North Phillip Street and North 2nd Street, indicating the presence of multifamily dwellings.
I did include a full list of nearby multifamily and their densities in the memo of law at Exhibit 13.
we do submit this as the least minimum variance as no dimensional variances are necessary and
is completely identical to the development that was previously approved on this lot
just by way of comparison if this lot was zoned rm1 the eight proposed units would actually be
permitted by right here so it is perfectly comparable to the rm1 densities that surround
the property the layout itself also supports the finding with eight well appointed units that are
that are quite large we also submit this will not increase congestion given the character of this
area and the transit oriented nature of this particular development it will not impair light
and air or negatively impact surrounding properties nor will it place any undue burden on facilities
utilities or cause any environmental damage pollution or erosion we submit that the
the variance complies in full with section 14303 of the code and again is further detailed in the
memo of law just one final note when the board heard this case in 2020 it received a letter of
opposition from the community this time around the developer was able to work with the community to
execute a cba of mutually acceptable terms and we're very happy to say that the community was
supportive of the project this time around uh so i'm happy to bring my client on adopt my testimony
and answer any questions who's your client dan hirsch out okay
Good morning, Mr. Chair. This is Jason Hand. I'm stepping in temporarily. Dan Herschel has
been promoted. They'll be coming back in shortly. Dan, could you please state your
name and spell for the stenographer? Let's be back in shortly. Sure.
hey hello everyone thank you meredith please please state your name and spell it for the
stenographer surely yeah dan hershout d-a-n last name h-i-r-s-h-o-u-t
Sure, Leah. Dan Hirschhout, D-A-N, last name H-I-R-S-H-O-U-T.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, told the truth, nothing but the truth?
Counsel?
Dan, can you confirm you have authority to speak on behalf of SAV Investments, LLC?
And you've been present and heard all the testimony and evidence that I offered in front of the board today?
Do you agree that testimony was true and accurate, and would you adopt it as if you had provided it to the board yourself?
yes happy to answer questions from the board yeah question how's how are you dealing with mail and
deliveries dan are you able to address that question well there's going to be a um obviously
there'll be an interior uh mailbox but maybe i would defer to our architect to give you a more
exact uh location of the mailboxes in the process and and how yeah so and of course folks are getting
a lot of uh amazon deliveries so box areas for boxes and how does it work and if you can show
that on the plan how do you do are we dealing with that where's the architect yeah logan dry please
i don't i don't see on anything on this first floor that shows
a mail room or we're somewhere to place boxes or
or anything there is a long corridor yeah while we're waiting for logan i mean i think
i think just even logan in the audience do you do you see him if logan drives in the audience
to come back in as a panelist now ah there he is logan could you please state your name is
spelled for the stenographer sure logan dry l-o-g-a-n-d-r-y you swear affirm to tell the
truth the whole truth nothing but the truth i do counsel okay logan you heard uh board members
question concerning uh mail on the first floor can you confirm that just given the size uh of
these units and the first floor layout that there would be ample space to add a uh a designated mail
area yeah i mean you know right now that staircase off of um phillips street has a has a corridor
that's separated from the staircase but um if we needed to uh do like a separate designated
area we could always bump a small space either off of that corridor to enlarge it where they
could possibly fit you know something more suited for packages or in unit two we could bump into
that space as well to make a dedicated package space there's plenty of room on the first floor
to add that if that was yeah because right now right now your hallway appears to be probably
four feet maybe four and a half feet so you know yeah we could we could we could get another two
feet or so and then easily get you know a more dedicated like package or mailbox counter um the
back corridor that goes into the yard is a little bit tighter but i would probably do it off of
phillips street just because um it's probably the most realistic place that we're going to meet the
usps standards for packages and mailboxes that sort of thing when it's inside but
and the trash you have commercial trash pickup and everybody has access to the trash room and
the basement right yep other questions is the thought that the tenants are going to walk down
the four flights of stairs for those that are living on the fourth floor to dispose of their
trash in the basement or is the management company planning to manage trash at each
for for the building logan or dan are you able to address that question
well yeah i was going to say physically yes they go down the stairs unless you know dan has
a management company that comes around and collects it from each unit um i'm not sure on
that arrangement but yeah physically you'd have to go down the stairs whether it's the tenants or
um you know management but maybe dan can speak a little bit more to how he manages the properties
and trash and stuff like that when it's commercial pickup yeah absolutely i mean we're going to plan
to be through there basically and even on a daily basis to keep the premises clean so we can arrange
something you know that's uh that'll be you know win-win for everybody involved most importantly
not to put someone out of uh you know the physicality of going up and down before eight
eight flights of steps so that certainly can be worked into the property management agreements
and we already do this at a number of other properties where we even have like a valet service
how many of your other properties are fourth floor walk-ups uh there's two others two others okay so
you do have experience with this yeah and are they a similar number of units in the building
in the building basically you know nice roomy uh you know layouts okay other questions questions
Basically, you know, nice roomy, you know, layouts.
from our attorney not at this time mr chair questions or comments from the virtual audience
i do not see any hands mr chair planning commission give me that michael gall with
the philadelphia city planning commission the comprehensive plan recommends no change
to the previous cmx2 commercial mixed-use zoning at this location in 2021 in a council
support its community remapping this property was remapped to rsa 5 residential single family
attached under the previous cmx2 base zoning six residential units would be allowed here by right
therefore the city planning commission recommends the board grant the proposed variants for
multi-family use but at a recommended proviso with a maximum of six residential units
and by 2025 0 0 7 0 1 0 1 5 203 to 09 diamond street i vote yes michael johns my vote is yes
sarah gaston my vote is yes it's another graham my vote is yes i went my vote is yes
thank you thanks guys thank you all right thank you okay yeah so next one is mi 2025
95-007-019-432, East Gerrard Avenue.
Michael Agnell is the attorney.
There's a letter of support from Fishtown Neighbors,
unanimous support from Fishtown Kensington Business,
and no opposition from Council Member Squillin.
Sir, could you please, by the way, we're sorry you're the last one.
Oh, I'm glad you fit.
You know, I mean, you know, could you please state your name and spell for this stenographer?
Yeah. Hi, my name is Michael Eggnall, M-I-C-H-A-E-L, last name E-G-N-A-L.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
And could you identify your client in relationship to the property?
Right. My clients are the owners of the LLC that owns the property. I'm going to make sure that they're here.
But Nestor and Edison should be okay in there, and also Michelle Kashuk from parallel architecture is also planning to join us.
Okay, so why don't we, why don't the or vice chair has a few questions for you.
Good afternoon. Have you submitted your documents and exhibits five days in advance of this hearing?
We have, and do you waive the reading of the refusal and stipulate to its accuracy?
We do. Okay, thank you. You can see your screen and proceed.
Thank you.
so 432 and 434 east gerard avenue are two adjacent masonry structures at the corner of
east gerard avenue and earl street that you see there they're currently two separate tax parcels
and part of this application is combining the two into a single property and that that generated the
refusals in addition to i'm coming to the side here filling in the second and third stories with
additions within the existing footprint also generated the refusals we received a referral
for a special exception because the restaurant use requires a special exception within the nca overlay
I didn't want to switch so that's the existing condition to give you a sense of the streetscape we're directly adjacent to another restaurant, which is our only neighbor.
I want to show you that there.
here. So the full screen. Can you see this? Okay. So the, I'm showing you, you saw the existing
condition the rendering is the we're maintaining the existing structure and we're planning to
let's see
there we go the plan is to fill in an addition within the existing footprint at the second and
third stories, and that would be residential use. The two buildings will be combined across the
first floor, and that will be a restaurant. The owners of the building already own and operate
a restaurant in Philadelphia, and they're similarly going to bring the same use here
that they already are successful with elsewhere. The community and the business improvement district
were supportive of this because these are seasoned operators. They're restoring an existing building.
seasoned operators, they're restoring an existing building, they're bringing back retail activity at
They're bringing back retail activity.
the ground level, and they've given consideration for handicap access, trash management, and they're
planning to operate a family-friendly business that won't have late business hours, and yeah,
that resonated with the community. So at that point, I'd like to invite Michelle Keshek, if she's
here to um speak to the the design itself okay why don't we why don't we um yep
they are coming back in as a panelist right now
hello hi could you please state your name as bellford's photographer
Yes, Michelle Kleshek, M-I-C-H-E-L-L-E, Kleshek, K-L-E-S-C-H-I-C-K.
Thank you.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Counsel?
Michelle, why don't you take us through the layout and, you know, speak to the life safety things and, you know, just to the layout of the restaurant in general?
Okay. Yeah, so you did a pretty good job of explaining the, you know, the overall concept of the building.
We do have the openings in the first floor allow flow between the two sides.
We've raised the floor in a portion of the building because the two buildings are a different level on the first floor.
So we wanted to make sure that we had seating that was accessible since we were going to take the time to put the ramp in there.
um so we raised the floor and a portion of the fourth floor so you can come in and then
you know navigate throughout the public space of the building on the first floor
um in the back of the house we have the trash area and the storage area and then um access
to the basement that would include you know probably uh like one of those ramps so that
they can bring food and stuff in from that side entrance so they don't have to come through the
restaurant with it and also then to remove trash from that area um and then further back is the
staircase that accesses the residential units on the upper floors it's not a super big building
did you speak to the trash room yet and where it's accessible from and who uses it um yeah so
there's actually a trash room the on the far lower right hand corner of each floor on the first floor
there you can see it um there's a uh the staircase for the upper floor units with a trash room tucked
underneath of them um it should be big enough for four to six you know standard size trash cans for
the residential area and then for the commercial area there'd be room for three or four trash cans
um i believe when we were with meeting with the neighbors uh we said there we would probably have
trash pickup twice a week um and then um you know see how it goes regarding if it needs to be more
frequently or less frequently to uh you know keep from too many trash trucks on the street but then
also to not have stuff pile up on the property uh that's right thank you okay do you want to
bring your client on to the doctor i got them a text i didn't get a reply can we see is there
anybody named Nestor or Edison in the audience? I'd like to bring them in.
Well, you're an officer of the court. We have you. You've got me.
Well, and we have the architect, right? That's right.
So questions from the board? Yes. So it looks like there's currently a bill code door
on the street and that the new proposed handicap ramp is going to eliminate that.
what will be the access to the basement that's right uh michelle do you want to speak to this
yeah i was going to say if you can show back the the floor plan if you can zoom in on the first
floor okay uh shoot what is it there you go i'm in up a little bit so um you can see the trash room
in the trash area and commercial area there um the third door from the right there's actually
a old window or door opening in that wall that would then provide access to the basement so the
idea would be to come into that door and then have like one of those roller caster things so they can
load boxes into the basement and then you'd only be bringing it up you know a little bit at a time
to use it in the kitchen so carrying it back up wouldn't be difficult like the old uh like
the old pulley pulley elevators well no not not necessarily like a dumb waiter um
like the old roller skates yeah the old yeah yeah
like the old roller skates. Yeah, the old roller. Yeah, yeah. And like you see a lot of people with the Bilco doors that they put those in there too, so they can just set the box down and slide it into the basement. So it'd be the same idea. It would just be inside.
Okay. Yes. And where the trash room is being stored is where is that rear fire escape? That is the current garage.
That's right.
Right. Okay.
The garage will disappear.
It'll disappear.
And again, the owners are restaurateurs.
collaboration with the architect for this scheme so they understand the logistics of moving the
food in and i mean they do this every day and they're comfortable with the logistics of and
that they'd be able to handle it all right okay other questions are you assuming the deliveries
for the bar are going to be off of the door that's right at the back bar is that what's going to
happen bar deliveries are that's just the escape route for the bartender when something happens
i think it would probably just depend on like yeah how big of a delivery it is if it's something
that could go immediately to the bar then yeah it would come in that way if not it would go
in the same way as everything else and then redistribute from the staircases and this is
all eight and this is all eight and no take out yes
It is definitely an Eden restaurant. I, I thought every place probably was Eden and take out, but it's certainly an Eden restaurant.
What are we doing about venting?
Michelle.
so um i think the vent is going to come up in the back corner where that yard is and it would go all
the way up the back in our yard area and then turn back over the roof so that it was you know
well be up with you know proper distances beyond the property line in the back and and we did
discuss this with the community uh if we toggle back to the current street view there was that
there was an exhaust from this was a restaurant 20 or 30 years ago there's an exhaust at the main
level just shooting right out of the wall and the community wanted that to disappear and we agreed
so we're running it all the way up so that it doesn't bother the community and it's not an
eyesore okay thank you questions from our attorney um so we have a when i was looking through this
last night a little bit of an issue with the refusal um because the refusal just talks about
the restaurant it doesn't mention any residential uses and i went and looked at what was filed with
lni to see if it was something that was just missed by lni and the plans that lni has show
what the description that was given to lni was a restaurant on the first and second floor
with residential above what was in the plans today showed restaurant on the first floor
with residential on the second and third floor so i just wanted clarification on what's happening
and we're going to have to get a new refusal before we vote on this because the refusal
does not reflect what's being requested i think that there was a process uh a back and forth with
the community that yielded the change where we wanted to shrink the restaurant and have more
residential so that as part of this process of working with the community that's kind of where
we landed so we um will certainly get you the yes so so what you need to do so then so because
there is a change in the number of dwelling units um and the way this property is zoned you have to
a certain amount of lot area per dwelling unit so l and i have to look at that and determine
if that can occur by right or if that needs a variance as well so we will need you to submit
a letter requesting to amend the refusal to reflect that and have l and i review the the
new proposal so and then once we receive that we can vote on it we don't need to have a resumption
hearings we presented every everything's been presented today but we will need an amended
refusal um otherwise your client will not if this is a um if you're if this is granted your client
will not get what they're asking for based on the current we don't anticipate a problem for the
you what for square footage but uh i understand that but yeah ellen i'll have to review that yeah
questions from the virtual audience chair we have a hand up from bob everett he's being promoted to
panelists i'm mr everett yeah i'm here i knew you are you always there could you please state your
name and spell for the stenographer sure first name robert last name everett e-v-e-r-e-t-t
do you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth
i do please proceed obviously our letter we were in support of this project yep and if i recall
the original refusal only mentioned the rear yard and the maximum area and we noticed since it was
And we noticed since it was in the overlay, Elvin and I, as they seem to be doing in this area a lot, didn't include the special exception for eat-in dining.
in the overlay elvin i as they seem to be doing
So they had to go back and get it updated.
And that's what we're looking at now.
All right.
And you're totally in favor.
We appreciate you staying on the phone and getting on the line.
Thank you, sir.
Can I just add that Ms. Emerson or someone mentioned about takeout.
it's the same refusal as the eat and dining but on other refusals or referrals we've gotten they've
listed them both back to back online that if they're going to be looking and updating they
might want to add that in if it's if it's primarily sit down with like accessory takeout essentially
it doesn't need to have that on there but if the use if it really has two distinct uses then l and
i will sometimes put both sit down and take out on the refusal um but if this has if this has a
bunch of seating in it which i believe it from what i recall looking at this last night there's
a bunch of seating then the l and i probably would classify it as a sit down restaurant and there can
be accessory takeout it's not a problem all right thanks that helps you some other pieces planning
commission michael gall with the philadelphia city planning commission the comprehensive plan
recommends no change to the existing CMX2 commercial mixed-use zoning at this location.
The proposed use of this property as a sit-down restaurant is consistent with adjacent uses on
the same block face and would cause no undue detriment beyond what might otherwise be expected.
However, there is no unique circumstance or physical condition of the property that would
prevent it from being used in compliance with the zoning code's dimensional standards.
The proposal here would leave no rear yard space and would cover nearly the entire lot.
Therefore, the City Planning Commission recommends the board grant the special exception for sit-down
restaurant use in the nca overlay but recommends that the board deny the requested dimensional
variances for maximum occupied lot area and minimum rear yard depth go ahead chair if i may
we're not changing the footprint the the the lot coverage and the distance from the rear lot line
is the same today tomorrow 20 years ago we're simply adding an addition above the party exists
okay so we're going to hold the vote on this and hillary we're not going to set a date we'll wait
do we hear is that correct as soon as we get the amended refusal then we can vote we'll get a hold
of you and we'll vote on that okay um thank you very much for you put a lot long time in here
today we appreciate it um is there anyone in the audience whose case has not been called
no hands at this time chair and and i want to thank the staff for staying late we don't usually
stay this late but i didn't have the heart to tell you we're going to schedule you to 2 o'clock
I appreciate it.
Thanks.
Thank you.
good afternoon everyone my name is bill bergman and i will be chairing today's meeting of the
philadelphia zoning board of adjustment with me is our vice chair tenetta graham present mr
chairman our secretary shellel gaston president mr chairman board member michael johns president
mr chairman board member taiwan president mr chairman also here is our attorney hillary emerson
our zb zba director in haggerty and our board administrator lakeisha dandy this hearing has
been recorded and will be posted on the zba website by participating you agree to be recorded
This is an in-person meeting with remote participation. Whether in person or in Zoom, if you are called to speak, please stand, state, and spell your name so that all can hear you, including our court reporter.
To enter an appearance, indicate the property address where you registered for Zoom, speak with a staff member, call the ZBA office by the end of business tomorrow,
call 215-680-2429 and provide your name email and the address of the appealed case
remote participation raise your virtual hand when directed so we can call on you to speak when you
so we can call on you to speak. When you, when we are, when you are called upon,
just click the join the panelists, join as a panelist button. Use the Q&A only for
procedural questions, do not comment on cases.
If you are joining by phone, press star 9 to raise your hand and star 6 to unmute.
In-person participation. If testifying, get close to the microphone so that all attendees
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Aggressive behavior will not be tolerated. In an emergency, follow the staff instructions
the main exit is through the doors at the rear the nearest stairwell is to the left
if we evacuate go to love park across art street please remain here so that we can
count forever so let's look at our schedule for this afternoon
number one mi 2025 006 261 1135 to 43 south broad street that case has been withdrawn
number three
MI-2025-007-792-6048 Baltimore Avenue.
That case is being continued until 7-29-26 at 2 p.m.
number seven
mi2026 0001986 242 2401 north dover street that case has continued until 7 29 26 at 2 p.m
And number eight, MI 2026-000200-2416 North Dover Street.
That case is continued until 7-29-26 at 2 p.m.
Are there any other requests for continuances?
we're going to go to our add-on list
oh thank you mi 2025 006 848 226 35 north 24 street
i vote yes with proviso maximum two dwelling units no household living in the basement
interior trash storage michael johns my vote is yes with proviso
cheryl gaston my vote is yes with provisos tenetta graham my vote is yes with provisos
thia winn my vote is yes we provide
we're going to go to our list here
number two mi 2025 006 372 434 dickison street isaac slepner is the attorney
good afternoon mr chairman take a seat thank you could you please state your name and spell for
the stenographer yes my name is isaac i is in india s is in sam double a is in alpha c is in
charlie my last name is slepner s is in sam l is in larry e is in elvis p is in peter n is in norman
e is in elvis r is in robert you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but
the truth yes i do could you identify your client a relationship to the property my clients are
joshua and emily punnings they are the property owners i am counsel of the property owners and
they are here to adopt my testimony eventually. Dickinson Square, RCO 10-8 in opposition,
and Councilman Squilla has written a letter of opposition. Vice Chair has a few questions for
you. Sure. Good afternoon. Have you submitted your documents and exhibits five days in advance of
this hearing? I have, other than a few that were just provided to me yesterday, but largely yes.
Largely, yes.
Okay. Thank you. And do you waive the reading of the refusal and stipulate to its accuracy?
Thank you.
And do you waive the read another refusal and stipulate to us accuracy?
Yes, I do.
Thank you.
You can share your screen and proceed with your case.
All right.
Here we go.
So, I'm going to share my screen.
Am I a panelist yet?
I think that's the first part.
Oh, there it is.
Thanks for your patience.
okay um thank you chair members of the board uh right now i'm presenting the table of contents of
um our exhibit and witness list uh that had been sent to the board prior to today um just kind of
underscoring that there's a bit more to this than would immediately meet the eye yeah we have all
your paperwork everything okay um exhibit two is our notice of refusal which we just stipulated
to exhibit three is the application of appeal that was prepared and filed by my client's original
counsel who is not me uh this actually is part of the hardship that they face in um leading up to
getting this uh zoning variance their initial counsel however did um very astutely point out
that the hardship at the property, they are seeking to a variance for a parking space at
the front of their property. They live at 434 Dickinson Street, which is a mid-block row.
And in RSA 5, parking is only allowed where it's accessed by a side or rear drive.
They purchased the house. The house does not have access from the side or rear. The very design of
the house is the hardship. However, when they purchased the house, they also purchased it
under assurance from a realtor that this would be a simple process. And in fact, you'll see in
my materials, there's a history of cars parking there prior to my clients. My clients do not park
there, but I will show you examples of cars parked there. In any event, this is the initial
application for appeal um that's our our item two uh item three is the deed in favor of my
clients um showing it was recorded in november of 2024 i can make that a little larger for everybody
Okay. Item five shows that they have a zero tax balance. I was not able to generate the document from this site, but I did print out their tax history.
um so the next item is the original letter from their initial counsel to the neighbors uh dated
10 30 25 inviting them to an rco meeting on 11 18 25 and followed by the certificate of mailing
um with regard to that letter in october then there was a letter uh to the board of november
19th of 25 and a vote tally. And at that vote, back in November of last year, there was a
bit more of opposition. It looks like the total vote was 9 to 3. After that point, their
council did not appear with them at the RCO meeting in November, and we're not entirely
sure what happened there but they eventually hired me and I entered my appearance that's item
I think it's item nine I entered my appearance initially by email on January 30th of this year
and I also sent a letter by email to Mr. Hegarty and Ms. Emerson on 410 of this year I sent out a
new letter to the neighbors. The RCO was gracious enough to sympathize with my clients and understand
that they had had issues with their counsel in the past and hosted a new RCO meeting. So I
wrote a letter dated April 10th of this year inviting everyone to an RCO meeting to be held
on April 21st. This is the certificate of mailing. It's many pages long because Dickinson Square is a
pretty dense neighborhood so as
So as part of my client's attempt to get this curb cut and parking spot zoned, they went ahead and got pre-approval from the streets department, which they obtained in May of 2025.
That is our item number 13.
they also have a contract with PICO to eventually build a new telephone pole about five feet
eastward on Dickinson Street sidewalk that will eventually move all of the utilities and I
actually have our structural engineer here to explain our plan this is a copy of the zoning
plan, and as you'll see, I'll kind of call out a few different pieces of it here.
So over here, this is where the telephone pole currently stands, and that would not
allow access once a curb cut would be built.
The telephone pole would be moved about five feet over here, which is a breezeway door
between 432 their neighbor their immediate neighbor 432 and 434 and down here is an inset of
the grading and slope and integration into the sidewalk of what the curb cut would be and i will
call our civil engineer jake sheridan of aqua economics to testify a little bit more to that
now photos this is a close-up taken uh on 415 of this year of the zoning poster it's not orange
in this case it was white posted by their front door this is a bit more of a wide shot as you can
see this paved area was here they purchased the house with this paved area here and that is posted
at their front door this brick wall next to them you'll see in a minute this brick wall next to
them is the sidewall of this single story front loading garage which is uh 436 dickinson um and
this is a side-by-side view of the properties this is a view from across the street where you can see
our property 434 436 and the telephone pole that is sort of obstructing where a curb cut otherwise
would go um following that that's a view dickinson street looking towards fourth street
and this is a view looking towards fifth street um 436 is the garage here this is a coffee shop
and the corner of fifth street now as i mentioned my clients purchased the house
under the assurance of a realtor that they were going to be able to park a car there
This Zillow ad shows a car park there.
That is not my client's car.
The Zillow ad was what they had found when they were originally shopping for their house,
and that car probably belonged to the prior owner of the property.
Here's another view, another Zillow shot of that.
this is the letter um that the board received more recently in the past weeks uh from dickinson
square west civic uh i would state that the letter uses the word overwhelmingly and i don't think
that a two vote margin really would consist of a an overwhelming opposition there there was
opposition um the total vote was uh eight to seven in opposition of the general um population of the
rco and two to one of the board so that's um a lot slimmer of a margin than then probably should be
considered overwhelming in addition uh my clients had originally um with with the assistance of
their prior council uh they took it upon themselves to have a number of their neighbors sign letters
in support including their neighbor at 432 dickinson which is the house that immediately
adjoins their house and the property in front of which the uh utility pole the new utility
pole would be placed uh this is a letter from the resident at 432 dickinson from their neighbor at
430 dickinson uh a letter from their neighbor you we have remember i told you we have all your
paperwork understood so you don't have to go over everything understood um with that i would like to
uh call my clients to adopt my testimony josh emily um please
no i don't
Hi, take a seat, sir.
hi could you please okay all right
Hi, could you please?
Okay, all right.
all right why don't you pull the microphone close to you sir over here why don't you you
Come over here.
All right.
can sit there by yourself that's it hi could you please state your name and spell it for the
not refer joshua cunnings do you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth nothing but the
truth yes counsel um good morning uh josh did you hear all the testimony and see all the documentary
evidence that i introduced to the board just now yes and is all of that testimony and all of those
documents are they true and correct to the best of your knowledge yes and would you adopt that
testimony as though you had given it yourself yes thank you is that your case or do you have other
witnesses i do have some further witnesses okay why don't you go back and sit down and if we have
any questions for you we'll bring you back so your other witnesses are going to be um my uh i have
one witness um jake sheridan he is our structural engineer i wanted him to give a bit more of
explanation of exactly the size and shape uh and that this would take up no more than one
uh parking space why don't you bring him up is he here or he is he's on the zoom okay
what's his name again jake sheridan mr sheridan
Good afternoon, Chair. This is Jason Hand. I'll be your calls for this session.
Jake Sheridan should be welcome, sir. Jake Sheridan should be coming back in shortly.
And my...
Well, we'll get him next. Let's take him to Sheridan.
I believe that there are some other of my client's neighbors out there,
and at this point I would invite them to raise their hands,
either whether they're in the room or out on the Zoom, to testify.
Well, here's the thing. This is your clients. I will call when people can put their hands up. Okay. In other words, the process would be your witness, right? Understood. We'll go to the board, our lawyer, and then we'll go to the audience. Understood. Okay. All right.
mr sheridan yes can you guys hear me i can sir could you please state your name
it's spelled for the stenographer my name is jacob sheridan j-a-c-o-b-s-h-e-r-i-d-a-n
do you swear or firm to tell the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth
that's correct counsel uh jake good morning um good afternoon rather did you draw up the plans
that i am about to pull up right here that's correct i don't uh here we go and jake you can
see my screen correct yes so why don't you um take the board through describe uh the dimensions of
where the curb cut would be and can you give them a little bit of background about moving this
telephone pole? So pretty much the curb cut is designed to be completely within the property
owner's frontage as well as meeting all of the streets department minimum standards as far as
the apron depth and side flares as well as well as trying to minimally you know impact the relocation
of the pico telephone pole by trying to adhere to the minimum distance of the offset from the
proposed apron that you can see on the plan okay okay and this was um these plans were given
pre-approval by streets department yeah yeah the streets department signed off on the the zoning
level aspect of the plan and you know building permit level submission and and approval would
be subsequent to a potential um granting of the variance okay and would how many parking spaces
uh length um does this space uh does this curb cut take up uh basically less than one a typical
parallel parking parking space is anywhere between 20 to 22 feet per city standards and this curb cut
is how long again uh the curb cut itself is 12 and a half feet plus a two foot and one and a half
foot flares so so in in total in total yes yes 15 feet
okay um and you've personally visited the site uh you took your photos and and evaluated it
personally visited the site uh you took your photos and and evaluated it prior to drawing
up these plans that's correct okay and these are photos that you took um looking east and
west on dickinson and showing that telephone pole that are on the bottom of your plan set
that's correct okay um i have nothing further for mr sheridan right now if we need him we'll call
him back so please keep him available who's your next witness um i believe that there are
some supporters out on the zoom i don't have the supporters they're going to have an opportunity
when i call okay so that's your case uh that that's our case in chief yes questions from the
board yeah i have a question you mentioned that the the uh residents of the property at 432
didn't have a problem, but do you have anything from the actual owner of 432?
I have a letter from one of the residents of 432. I am not sure whether that is a tenant or
an owner. However, I would like to know whether or not the owner of that property, I understand
tenants may not have an issue, but quite frankly, if I was the owner of the property next door,
would not want to have a telephone pole moved from the house in front next door to me in front of mine
so so that's my question did the is this does do you have something from the owner of that property
not a res not a tenant i an owner my clients may be better uh equipped to answer that question
um i can recall my client they do not they're shaking their head no okay thank you i guess
they do not okay all right all the questions yes um i have a question about the overall site plan
for the property sure um it looks like this does not have a backyard or rear yard is that correct
it does not to my knowledge have a backyard that's accessible from the street so typically
when houses with this design are designed this way it's because the front yard is supposed to replace
the fact that the rear yard doesn't exist and so i just want to be clear that like what's being
proposed is to take the only open space on this lot and to replace it with a non-standard parking
space um okay should i i again i can have my clients uh come to testify about the kind of
dimensions and uh features of their house i i do want to say the parking space is a standard
size parking space it isn't the they have 18 18 by eight and a half feet of
like availability within that front yard to the property line so that's not including any
like i mean typically they're not going to park their car exactly on the property line and also
that's a standard car i think my concern is that like by making this a parking space like
your clients might not live here forever this they're the only tenants that i'm assuming have
ever lived in this house in this format based on just property data and if anybody that comes
behind them has a bigger car which happens right there there are large format cars it would not
fit in that spot it would overhang onto the sidewalk which is what the current drawing is
actually showing the the current drawing is showing the the stamp that what we have to model
for the streets department is a 19 foot long vehicle which is equivalent to like an like a
ford f-250 pickup truck with an extended cab the regular size suv but yes and it's regular size
suvs are typically between 15 to 17 feet sure but we're at this point we're mincing words because
we're talking about a foot i'm not like gonna belabor it but i think my issue is that like
we're talking about taking up the space all the way up to the actual facade and even in typically
there's some sort of barrier that keeps
the car from hitting the wall. Okay.
Understood. Let me ask you the question. How many
people in the audience are here
relative to this case?
Put your hand up. Okay.
So I think what I want to do is
look, when we get
to this point, each person can get two
minutes, but what I wish you would do is come
up, mention
council do you have any comments when not okay so what i'm what i'm going to do is we're going to
bring the people up who want to testify and we'll give them you know if you would um you're either
for the project or against okay because i think i know where most of the people here as i've just
been watching you shake your heads the whole time so um first person why don't we come up
and if you would just state your name is spelled for the stenographer
and if you would
just state your name
and spell for this
to not
good afternoon sir sir please sit down sure you can um could you please state your name
is spelled for the doctor donald mccrone m-c-c-r-o-n-e can you get a little closer to the can you get a
little closer to the mic, please. Donald McCrone. M-C-C-R-O-N-E. Right. Do you swear or affirm to
tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth? Yes. Sir, are you a neighbor? I am. Are you
in favor of this project or against? I am not. You're against. I'm not. I'm against. Okay. All
right. You know, it's already been sort of brought up, but that, you know, it is a walkable
neighborhood a uh another curb cut um reduces safety um you know uh okay as is the morning
counselor do you have any questions to this witness um sir so
have you personally seen anyone hit by a car uh coming out of a curb cut on a
mid-block property, say, out of 436? Dickinson?
Personally, no. Okay. Thank you. And yet,
you know, one does see... We're going to bring
the next person up. We know where you... We understand where you stand. Okay? Thank you very much.
Thank you. Good afternoon.
Hi. Could you please state your name and spell it for the sonographer?
Lisa Miller, M-I-L-L-E-R. Right. Do you swear
referring to tell the truth told truth nothing but the truth i do are you a neighbor i am are
you in favor of this project you're against i'm against thank you for is there anything you could
offer real quick well i i have been nearly hit by cars coming out of driveways that are in the
middle of block in this neighborhood i walk everywhere and there's a reason we have zoning
uh ordinances and um as bad as i feel for my neighbors i don't think this is uh enough to
to justify a variance thank you counsel do you have what do you wait you have a question i don't
have any questions next person please
there you go
get that mic real close to you if you could good afternoon good afternoon could you please state
your name and spell it for the stenographer geraldine johnson spell the whole name yeah
g-r-a-l-d-i-n-e johnson j-o-h-n-s-o-n if you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth
nothing but the truth yes are you a neighbor oh 40 years for only 40 years okay 40 and some plus
hold on um are you for this project or against against is there anything you can offer that you
haven't heard uh besides the gentleman that was before me about safety and also all the people on
block have a problem with parking okay and i am not a driver but i sympathize with those that do
drive and they want a parking spot too okay all right do you have any questions council
i i don't have any questions thank you very much for coming down next person please
we're not we're not in a hurry
pull that chair up come right up
we'll put that break down for you i know i could you please state your name and spell but by the
way good afternoon good afternoon could you uh state your name and spell for the stenographer
judy mays j-u-d-y-m-a-y-s right do you swear or firm to tell the truth told truth nothing but
truth yes are you for or against this project yes all right is there anything you can offer
that you haven't heard nothing but thank you very much council nothing thank you next person
good afternoon there you go nice all right pull that mic closely if you can my name is
katherine deangelis that's k-a-t-h-e-r-i-n-e that's d-e capital a-n-g-e-l-i-s do you swear
a firm to tell the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth i do are you in favor of this
project or against i'm against it is there anything you can add that you haven't heard
uh yes go ahead um i own a property uh one there's a property next to them and then i own the next
uh yes go ahead um i own a property uh
property after that and it's a six unit apartment building which generates a lot of traffic um
their property or where they want to place the curb cut um it actually used to be a garden
um it was a full frontal garden in this house but where they want to place their car
um is about 50 feet from the corner which is a double stop sign and it's a highly trafficked
corner at fifth and dickinson um so there's no way they either have to pull into this spot or
back into it they're going to cause um confusion with drivers coming there is a lot of traffic
at that intersection right and it's very close to it all right thank you do you have any questions
counsel ma'am do you drive yes okay yes and have have you experienced any of this confusion that
you describe and are talking about yes okay um so you have
how can you be aware or sure that everyone else is as confused as you are
i can't be i can't speak for someone else obviously it's a personal matter it's when
you pull up to a stop sign and you're making a left or you're coming straight through you either
have clear passage or you don't you have to wait for a car that's backing out which is dangerous
we also have kirkbride school in the neighborhood and these kids walk
on the pavement every single day thank you very much you're welcome next person
afternoon afternoon okay why don't we get that microphone nice and close here so
so we've heard a lot so first of all state your name and spell for the sonographer
my name is
why don't you spell your last name
all right do you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth
now we've heard a lot from all the other people what i want to know are you for this or against
and your neighbor
all right council do you have any questions no thank you very much for coming
go ahead go ahead good thanks um the first is when that property
It was built. There was a gate in front of it.
Secured both sides.
No, I'm putting this back.
All right. Go ahead.
My understanding is, and I'd like the owners to testify under oath
Okay. Right. Thank you very much for coming down and sitting here. Next person, please.
Why don't we pick that up?
Name is Wanda Scott.
wanda could you spell your name for the court's note thanks well s-c-o-t-t right do you swear
or affirm to tell the truth told truth nothing but truth i do and you were a neighbor yes okay
are you for or against yes thank you the oldest continuous living person on that block so i've
seen that block change how many how many years i want to hear how many years but you were probably
like 20 years 20 years old when you moved there right okay no i was 15. oh that's right still
there so i'm 50 something years oh okay that's great so i've seen that and one of the pictures
that the lawyer showed where he showed the cars like in the driveway that was the builder that
was not a previous owner that was the builder so i don't think he you know like said that the builder
They were improperly parked in that lot because they were doing work on that, the house.
because they were doing work on that the house thank you counsel you have any questions
Thank you. Councilor, you have any questions?
ma'am do you have any any person please any other evidence to that it's the builder other than
your claim no okay i got it i got it sorry hi could you please state your name good afternoon
first could you please state your name and spell it for us yes laura mullen l-a-u-r-a-m-u-l-l-i-n
do you swear or affirm to tell the truth told truth to nothing but the truth i do are you for
or against against okay is there anything else i mean we've had a lot so we're trying to yeah
really well explained but the neighborhood is great the street is great and uh i appreciate
your ability to have a speaker oh thank you is there anyone else is there anyone in the virtual
audience yes chair i have a hand up from a jack zhao i will allow them to speak okay
yes hi jack do you uh could you please name and state your name and spell freak stenographer
my name is jack last name z-h-a-o i'm the uh you know i'm the part you know uh partner of the
investment that falls hold on hold on hold on do you swear or affirm to tell the truth told truth
nothing but the truth um yes are you a are you a neighbor yes all right could you turn your
video on oh yes let me promote let me promote them for us this is
it should be coming back in shortly okay what did i say stay as the attending okay all right sir
can you hear can you see me
waiting for your video all right you have to accept that promotion
excuse me mr chair oh okay hi jack are you a neighbor
i'm sorry mr chair is coming back in now okay
yes uh i'm the neighbor and i uh against it you're against the two thank you thank you very
much council you have any questions for that uh are you a neighbor within 250 feet no i'm
the neighbor and uh part of the neighbor next door at 432 432 dickinson 432 dickinson i never
sign any paper okay all right thank you anyone else in the virtual audience yes chair i have
a hand up from chat on price i will go ahead no time how many more hands do you have up just four
hi could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer they're coming back in short
hi i'm jaclyn price hi could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer
Jacqueline, J-A-C-L-Y-N, last name Price, P-R-I-C-E.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, told truth, nothing but the truth?
Jacqueline, are you a neighbor?
Are you for or against this project?
For this project.
Counsel, do you have any questions?
Jacqueline, what way would this benefit the block in the neighborhood in your estimation?
so i mean i i think it would benefit it in terms of getting cars off the street a lot of times
sometimes there's cars that parked on the curb and i feel like that's also a hazard too in terms of
walking down the street okay thank you thank you very much next hand please
yes and a hand up from sunbeat padanik i'll promote them they should be coming back in shortly
yes uh yes hello can you hear me sir could you please state your name and spell for the
stenographer uh yes uh sam that is spelled s-a-m as in mary b as in boy i t as in tom
last name is pat naik p as in paul a t as in tom t as in tom a n as in nancy a-i-k
do you swear or affirm to tell the truth whole truth nothing but the truth
yes are you a neighbor yes are you in favor or against uh i'm in favor okay uh is there anything
you get off that you haven't heard uh no i think uh all right the last person mentioned what i was
No, I think the last person mentioned what I was going to say.
Councilor, do you have any questions?
Counselor, do you have any questions for this person?
Not at this time.
All right.
Next hand, please.
Yes, a hand up from Alicia.
I will promote them and it should be coming back in shortly.
What do you have?
One more hand after that, Nate?
Yes, sir.
All right.
Thank you.
hi can you hear me i can could you please state your name and spell your stenographer
sure my name is haley shah first name is h-e-l-y last name shot s-h-a-h i am a neighbor and i am
in favor okay well don't let me swear you in first do you swear or affirm tell truth told
truth nothing but the truth yes you're in favor can you offer anything that hasn't been said
no thank you thank you next hand yes last hand is a jill gallagher i will promote them they
be coming back in shortly mr chair okay
Jill yes hi could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer
sure hi jill j-i-l-l gallagher g-a
you're breaking up jill
jill we lost you
okay um
jill okay we're gonna have to be is there any more hands up
yeah one more by uh kate mcdonald that's the last hand
that should be coming back in shortly
kate could you please state your hand name and spell it for the stenographer
sure jill gallagher g-a-l-l-a-g-a-g-a-g-r all right do you swear or firm to tell the truth
told truth nothing but the truth miss gallagher
i do um are you in favor of this project or against
i'm against it okay is there anything you did offer that hasn't already been said
no counselor you have any questions jill i know do you have any more hands
yeah i had one more mcdonald kate please kate mcdonald
good afternoon could you please hi good afternoon could you please state your name and spell for
the stenographer my name is kate mcdonald spelled k-a-t-e-m-a-c-d-o-n-a-l-d do you swear or affirm
tell the truth told truth nothing but the truth yes are you a neighbor yes are you in favor or
against i'm in favor all right thank you very much is there anything you could offer that hasn't
already been said uh not at this time thank you all right thank you very much planning commission
amy boyd with the planning commission amyboid do you swear or affirm to tell the truth the
whole truth nothing but the truth i do please proceed the comprehensive plan recommends no
change in zoning at this location from the existing rsa 5 residential single family
the appellant has not shown that there are unique physical conditions or circumstances
that would prevent the property from being used in conformity with the zoning code
the planning commission recommends that the board deny their requested variance for parking
thank you mi2025-006-372-434 dickinson street i vote no michael johns my vote is no
cheryl gaston my vote is no tenetta graham my vote is no iowen my vote is no um thank you for
everyone who participated um um on both sides of this we appreciate everybody coming down thank
you counsel thank you board all right number four mi 2025 007 803 934 tasker street gabriel fellis
is the attorney
good afternoon sure hi one minute council we're trying to clear a room here no problem
hi one morning council we're trying to clear a room here no problem
hi council could you please state your name and spell it for the stenographer
my name is gabriel fellis g-a-b-r-i-e-l last name is fellas it's f as in frank e-l-l-u-s as in sam
right do you swear we're referring to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth
yes council i see there's a letter of support from east pashonka avenue um vote was 10 to 3.
yeah so you provided a petition signed by eight people 12 of which from the block
our vice chair has a few questions for you good afternoon have you submitted your documents and
exhibits five days in advance of this hearing yes and do you waive the reading of the refusal
and stipulate to its accuracy i do all right thank you you can share your screen and proceed
okay do i see the title page here yes great thank you so we're here today seeking approval
for use of the property for a two-family household living.
The property in its current condition is a three-story single-family home
in the RSA 5 zoning district, which expressly prohibits two families.
This application is not proposing any exterior alterations or construction.
As we'll see, the planned interior renovations generally just propose
splitting up the current single-family layout into two separate units
by creating two separate entrances for each unit.
So this is the refusal issued by L&I for the use of two-family household living.
Again, two families are expressly prohibited in the RSA 5 Zoning District.
These are our proposed type plans.
The proposed change will have a one-bedroom unit that will take up the basement and first floor,
and then a two-bedroom unit that will take up the second and third floors.
So the basement will be used exclusively for storage,
for laundry and a mechanical room, no proposed basement living.
The bathroom in the basement is already in its existing proposed condition.
So this is the first floor.
Here's where you'll see the main change in the layout.
The proposed plans will add a hallway here that will separate the entrances
that lead to the stairs to the second and third floor two-bedroom unit,
while the first floor tenant can enter through this hallway here.
some more site plans here that you already have so here we have a link to a vimeo walk through
the property and its current condition so the board can get a sense of the current configuration
of the property but we also have some interior photos included next so here is the front of the
property and this is the entrance way that will eventually be the common entrance way for the
two tenants again the proposed change will extend the entrance way to allow for two entrances
one will go to the first floor unit and the other will lead to the stairs to the unit that will take
up the second and third force so this here are the stairs that will lead to the upstairs unit
there's some more interior photos of the property here
so this is the basement area again the basement will continue to be used exclusively for storage
laundry and mechanicals with no proposed living space
this is the back patio that the downstairs unit will have access to
here we have some aerial views of 934 tasker in relation to the other properties
now here we have our zoning map so as i mentioned previously even though the block is primarily
zoned RSA 5. Uses in multifamily is actually quite common on the block. There's no way out
of character with the surrounding area. We included lists here nearby properties that have
been previously been granted use variances and rental licenses for multifamily household use
with the same RSA 5 zoning designation. As you can see here, many properties on the immediate
block and surrounding blocks have been granted variances for multifamilies in the past. In some
cases property have been granted use for for more than two residential living units with the same
total square footage or in some cases less square footage per unit i'm now turning to our community
outreach efforts uh this is the notification letter that our office sent out on february 17th
in anticipation of our meeting with the east passion crossing civic association
We know that the community on March 9th received their unanimous letter of support, three actually abstained from the vote.
We know that the community on March 9th, where we see
Ms. McCarthy also spoke with neighbors before that meeting. She gathered 18 signatures of support from them.
Here we have the deed to the property, showing Ms. McCarthy taking title to 934 Tasker in November of 2015.
here we have our application for appeal and our project information form
here we have pictures of the zba notification posters notifying neighbors of our here and here
today this is our statement of real estate tax compliance and here we have our certificates of
mailing uh for the rco meeting um that we sent out to neighbors on february 17th
so uh with that i'd like to bring my client uh miss kellyan mccarthy she's in the virtual
audience uh i'll enter my testimony and answer any questions that the board sure
Thank you.
are you on she should be on that email
oh okay
Kelly Ann
here she is
yeah she is right here
hi Kelly could you unmute please
kelly mccoffee please unmute
here you go kelly
you're unmuted you should be able to speak
Kelly?
Hello?
Hi, yes.
Kelly, could you please state your name and spell it for the stenographer?
Kelly Ann McCarthy.
K-E-L-L-I-A-N-N-E.
McCarthy, M-C-C-A-R-T-H-Y.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
If possible, could you turn your video on?
okay wow all right council one why don't we start her i mean the video doesn't seem to be working
but see uh kelly have you had my testimony today i have and uh was it true and correct to the best
of your knowledge it was and would you adopt it as if it were your own i would great uh any questions
for the questions from the board go back to the plans i'm sorry no i just want to see the plans
we we kind of went through the plans up again and i was asking for trash for both units
kellyanne do you want to speak to the trash situation
um we plan on keeping the trash and enclosed receptacle out front
i plan to stay in the house so i will handle trash uh night um putting it out for collection
is there a space in the rear where you can store the trash instead of out front until trash day
for the first level yes but not for upstairs okay so is there a place in this uh the second
level where you can have interior trash storage until uh yes would you be amenable to that
i would okay thank you and the preference would be not having the first floor trash in the front
and you can throw it in the rear
until trash day. That would be great.
That's what we do.
Michael?
Yeah, I just wanted this. He kind of went through the
plans so quickly. I didn't get a
chance to kind of see them.
Yeah, sorry about that. Which page did you want to see?
No, I see the first floor plan.
Good doesn't
have access to our bedroom
access to our bedroom because the backyard was the second floor so you go upstairs and then what happens
because the backyard
was the second floor.
how come the stairs on the other side of the house now am i missing something
oh it should be flipped okay yeah
okay okay so the second and third floor is one unit correct correct okay
And board member Graham already mentioned about the interior storage for trash and a vented closet and no storage or trash out front, but in the rear for the first floor unit.
Okay. All right. Thank you.
Is there access to the roof?
so that's not a spiral staircase
on that third floor plane
in the corner
it's a slight spiral staircase
from the second to the third floor
and then with the staircase
going down because there's two staircases
shown side by side
where does the other staircase go
one from the first floor to the second
and then there's second to third
Got it. So the spirals from the second and third. Understood. Yes. And the second floor unit, there's no washer or dryer? Not currently. Okay. And is there, do you think that you might put one in the future? Definitely. Okay. And then my second question is about the second and third floor units access to utilities. Are you planning to live on the first floor? Yes.
and then is it all electric uh electric and gas electric and gas okay so what is the plan for uh
the second floor and third floor unit if they need to access the pico and the pgw meters in the future
well i i will be in the first floor unit i plan to stay in the house so
I can I can assist with that at any time okay and then I think my last question is really about
like what's your what's driving your decision to want to do this well I would I would love to stay
in my neighborhood so doing this will allow me to offset the cost of maintaining my house and
give me some flexibility to stay here as I get older okay thank you I have no further questions
all right other questions questions from our attorney no questions at this time
questions or comments from the virtual audience chair i do not see any hands raised planning
commission you mean what oh well come on up
there you go hi my name is mary stump and they are down and relax sit down and relax
well we'll we'll watch you i'm gonna watch your purse when you talk i promise could you please
state your name and spell for the stop my name is mary stump m-a-r-y-s-t-u-m-p-f do you swear
or a firm that tell the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth i do are you a neighbor
i am not a neighbor but i had a question well i live on i live on um the 1200 block of balesworth
street yeah sure that's fantastic i mean it's it's not immediately in that name it's a little
farther away yeah i just had a question about the um the uh petition that was um circulated
i didn't really get a chance to see a lot of the the addresses but i'm wondering are they
residents they do they are those from owners are they just from tenants or people that just happened
I think the owner gets it from the area right around so it could be you could have like I
thought it went pretty fast but I wasn't sure if there were like maybe uh three signatures from
one address I mean maybe not there's a lot of them but yeah but I don't know if those are just
tenants or are they I don't know people that are residents and you live at 12th and Ellsworth I do
that's a good distance away it is but yeah I just was curious because we had we had a doctor's
office that was switched from RSA five to a commercial on the corner and you know they
they did this petition and there were people that were just renters they didn't really own
the property okay well thank you very much everybody has it okay so questions or comments
will be the virtual planning commission that we do play the commission not yet
any commission planning commission amy boy for the planning commission the
comprehensive plan recommends no change in zoning to the current RSA 5
To the current RSA 5 residential single-family, the appellant has not shown that there are unique physical conditions or circumstances of the property that would prevent it from being used in conformity with the zoning code.
residential single-family the appellant has not shown that there are
The Planning Commission recommends that the board deny the requested variance for two-family.
So, MI 2025-007-803-934 Tashkar Street, I vote yes with proviso.
first floor trash started stored in rear yard second floor start stored in unit
michael johnson my vote is yes with provisos
cheryl gaston my booty chest with provisos tenetta graham my vote is yes with provisos
i went my vote is yes with provisos thank you thank you my 2025 007 849 1801 east huntington
street and the two lawyers names we have is not they're not here so council just um
could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer yes uh mr chair members of the
board brett feldman 1835 market street philadelphia pennsylvania 19103 i represent the applicant um
1801 Huntington, LLC, and it's Principal Jacob Roller, as well as the Legacy Culinary Group,
and its Chief Strategy Officer, Natasha Stoffer.
Hold on. Do you swear or affirm the tell-the-truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
And I see there's support from Kensington Neighbors Association and also non-opposition
from Council Member Squilla. Our Vice Chair has a few questions for you.
Good afternoon. Have you submitted your documents and exhibits five days in advance
of this hearing? Yes, we did. Okay. And do you waive the reading out of refusal and stipulate
to its accuracy? I do. All right. Thank you. You can share your screen and proceed with the case.
I'll share one second.
Again, Mr. Chair, Brett Feldman, I represent the applicant, property owner and the principal, Jacob Roller, as well as the tenant, Legacy Culinary Group and Strother Enterprises, passed up exhibits 1 through 13, which I'd ask to be incorporated into the record.
they are great um what this is an application uh to convert uh this and i think we've got some
boards uh that we use to the community group and i thought we would just bring them anyway today
uh this is an amazing historic building uh this is uh from the uh kensington textile bank from 1909
um it's it's been in the paper i think for the last couple years and articles about
um what mr roller wants to do and what miss strother wants to do here and her family business
but the idea is the two-story building the lower level is a we've already have approvals for a
commissary kitchen which would support Strother Enterprises which is a leading Philadelphia
food culinary group they as as Mr. Strother will will testify provide a lot of catering at the
convention center and the airport and now at the Cobbs Creek Golf Facility they'll be using
they'll finally have a permanent location for their cooking and culinary needs in a lower level.
And then the first floor is this magnificent yet deteriorating event space that that's what we want
to convert this into. You know, if you've been in Del Frisco's or Union Trust or any of those
amazing old bank spaces, that's really what we're envisioning here. We went through the historical
approval process. We did obtain historical approval for this, and now we're here for the
first floor event facility. You see the exhibits here, and I'll just start going through these here.
We have a great letter of support from the Preservation Alliance, Paul Stenke, Executive
Director, who talks all about the history of the building and how this is really just a perfect
adaptive reuse for such a building we went to the east kensington neighbors association
We have a letter of unanimous support with provisos from the EKNA.
we have a letter of unanimous support with provisos from the
We had a lot of neighbors who came right from those immediate blocks.
We discussed hours of operation and the valet parking arrangements and trash disposal.
And you'll see that in our proviso letter, which we've agreed to.
And that's the proviso letter there.
But just getting to the property itself, here we are on Kensington Avenue, East Huntington
and Harold, East Harold Street is on the other side.
That's the building right there.
The view from, I think it's from Huntington right there, this magnificent two-story building
with the mezzanine and then another view of the building and then really the magnificence
is really the interior of this building.
Again, it's to marvel that it's still there.
I think it's been empty, Jacob, how long?
Since the 90s now?
Since the 90s, this building has been empty and vacant.
We plan to clean it up
and really just let the magnificence of the interior
and the windows speak for itself here.
again just taking you through some of the interior pictures here's some of the exterior
pictures historical and and then more more current we are we are that that's the posting pictures
and we have been working to keep this as clean as possible you'll see this is some more recent
pictures that we went out there working with the community to fence this area in to clean it to
CLEAN IT UP. AND WE'VE BEEN, AGAIN, WORKING WITH ALL DIFFERENT CITY AGENCIES, AS YOU
KNOW, ON THAT AREA. IT'S BEEN A CHALLENGE. BUT REALLY WHAT IS EXCITED TO THE COMMUNITY
IS THE IDEA OF BRINGING LIFE AND VITALITY TO THIS BUILDING, WHICH WE THINK WILL BE CRITICAL
TO MAKING THIS IMMEDIATE LOCATION AS SAFE AND AS CLEAN AS POSSIBLE. JUST SOME REAL QUICK
pictures here of how we supported it here is here is the floor plan and let me let me just I guess
with the floor plan and Mr. I'm just gonna ask you now to just speak for a minute um sure could
you please state your name and spell for the stenographer yes can you hear me yeah hello
Mr. Chairman and Board. Hello, Mr. Chairman and Board. How are you? I'm good. My name is Natasha, N-A-T-A-S-H-A, Strother, S-T-R-O-T-H-E-R. Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, told the truth, nothing but the truth? Yes. Counsel? I think I mentioned already, but you are the Chief Strategy Officer for Strother Enterprises. I know you're always hesitant to talk about the family business and the history of the business,
But if you could just give the board a quick overview of what, over the last, I guess it's 30 years now, 40 years now, your family business has done, and what types of lines of business.
I know we've got the boards that have some of the logos and operations of what your family has done, but if you could just briefly.
Thank you. Thank you, Brett.
So Strather Enterprises, as it's pointed out on the board, we are a local business.
We've been around for close to 40 years.
We're a veteran-owned business, and we provide contract food services.
We started as a catering company in the mid-80s, and I'm part of that third generation of this
business.
So we started as a catering company, and we transitioned into contract food services.
And like Brett mentioned, we partner with some notable clients, whether it's the Pennsylvania
Convention Center Authority.
We've worked with most recently the Fittler Club at Cobb's Creek, the new Cobb's Creek
Golf Course.
We also own and operate several airport concessions here in the Philadelphia International Airport.
So we operate two subway locations and a Southeast Asian brand called Wind Kitchen.
We've partnered with Live Casino.
So we've been doing contract food services and catering, like you've mentioned, for close
to 40 years.
we're all wherever we go we we make sure that we're committed to the community and part of our
values and mission is to make sure we're empowering the community offering jobs and supporting
development so they can move on in helping to create the next generation of food entrepreneurs
so we would love to do that here in this community as well thank you and as i mentioned you're taking
both the lower level and the first floor correct of the building correct yes and just briefly the
lower level, which I've got the floor plan up here, this would be your commissary kitchen,
correct? Correct. And you would be providing, this is where you'd be making the food that
this is where you'd be making the food that would then continue to serve serve um serve the rest of
would then continue to serve the rest.
the business operations correct that's correct and then the first floor would be um uh in synergy
with the commissary kitchen below would be an event assembly location correct that's correct
and the idea would be to do life life cycle events there uh host host um non-profit events
weddings, other events, correct? That's correct. Okay, great. So that's the lower level. There's
trash storage down there, and that's where the kitchen is, and then there's a small mezzanine,
and then the main floor here is where you saw those pictures with the interior. That's where
the event space. Yes, yes. As far as occupancy, it's with tables. We understand it's around 130,
130, 140, with standing. With some tables, it's more like 170, 180, roughly. That's what
we've been told from the architects. We have building permits already for the commissary
kitchen and some of the preparations on this floor here. And then we are in discussions
with Temple, the hospital facility that's up there, regarding using one of their lots
for our valet operations.
We know...
Is that Einstein Hospital?
Episcopal, the old Episcopal?
Episcopal up there, yeah,
which is, I think, two blocks, Jacob, three blocks?
Yeah, one block.
We know we're going to need valet for special events
on that first floor.
Our customers are going to demand it.
We talked to the community about that,
so the valet would be on there in the front
as well as delivery area.
And that's really, you know, kind of the...
The basement will handle all your operations.
The food will go from there to all your operations.
That's correct.
Yeah, and then just, these are the boards
I know that we have in the room here,
but just, again...
Is the second floor just a mezzanine looking down?
Yeah, there's a small, what, 200 square feet,
something like that?
Yeah, it was an office.
Yeah, it was an office right there.
But that's really, you know,
KIND OF THE OUTLINE OF WHAT WE'RE LOOKING TO DO. AGAIN, THIS HAS BEEN VETTED HEAVILY BY
HISTORIC COMMISSION, THE COMMUNITY. THERE'S BEEN ARTICLES IN THE PAPER. I'M JUST BRINGING UP
ONE OF THE ARTICLES. I THINK ONE OF THE ZONE BOI MEMBERS MIGHT EVEN BE QUOTED IN THAT ARTICLE.
WE'RE FINALLY REALLY PLEASED TO NOW BE HERE IN FRONT OF THE BOARD TO BRING THIS,
hopefully to to reality and to to get this going as soon as possible a question is from the board
okay um deliveries and then uh you're going to be sending this food out how is that gonna work
deliveries in terms of the raw materials to make the food and then um you know once you've made
the food uh you're going to have a distribution system or what are you going to use for that
so okay so for for uh to to actually service the second floor so we'll use the food i mean
we'll use the commissary kitchen um that's in the basement to serve the food upstairs um
if you and one of the drawings you'll see that there uh lifts that will allow you to you know
bring the food from in from downstairs upstairs but also to receive the raw materials you'll see
there's a delivery zone right there along uh kensington avenue there'll be a loading zone
if i'm correct and then we'll load in right there on harold street there's a ramp there right
yeah yes all right and for the uh cooking part of this the venting how is that going to be handled
will you repeat your question i'm sorry venting oh for the food preparation area it's through the
roof we we had we included that on the historic plans okay yeah and in terms of the designation
of this property is it locally designated i think it's individually i believe it's individually
designated historic yeah yes it is locally designated oh yes yes philadelphia historic yes
okay and then um we already we already had to go to we already appeared before the historic commission
to get the approvals um for this so is any of the interior designated at all just or is it just the
exterior just the exterior right yeah yeah okay yeah all right okay thank you all the questions
yes yep go ahead uh my question is about main
yes my question is about main entrance because i know you have two entrances to the facility
is the uh herald street or not herald street sorry is the kensington avenue entrance
going to be the main entrance for any guests that come for an event
it's the the huntington avenue side of the building the huntington avenue so the with the
stairwell right with it you can see there's a there's an ada ramp along that side okay excuse
me chairman i don't know what the gentleman just wanted oh i'm sorry could you please state your
name and spell it for the stenographer jacob roller get a little closer mr roller jacob roller
do you swear or affirm to tell the truth whole truth nothing but the truth i do please proceed
continue did did you have more questions specifically no i was just because i see this
but your drawing currently is cut off so i was trying to understand like there are patrons coming
in you've got i see the deliveries are on the herald streets are like at the corner on the
street side yeah you can see we have sort of a a stair and a ramp there okay i see that to be all
highlighted the different the different areas and then what's the plan for your employees because i
understand that when you have guests you're going to have valet but what is your plan for and how
many people do you anticipate are going to be at the facility like on a typical day so on a typical
day um we on a typical day like full-time employees will be anywhere from like 10 to 12 employees
and then because this is event driven you know we'll have a plan we we have a plan throughout
Strother Enterprises would rehire and recruit initially it would be for the community and
that would be the goal again they would be per diem employees like catering staff yeah and it
is the idea that you're only going to be catering for events that are held at this facility are you
going to be using this facility as a basis to do catering for other events outside of the facility
um it could be for both it could be for on-site and off-site catering so that's the way we would
look at it okay it's the idea really is to have this operating five or probably more than five
days a week yeah so that's what i was wondering so like if we like if it's fully staffed you've
got 12 people i think my question is given that there's no parking on site what's the plan for
the parking for the people that are here every day for the um community or for your employees
for the employees well they would either have to find uh parking i can't say that fully thought
through that yeah but either they would find parking most of our employees currently um they
commute to work um the disc or septa there are different ways to do it but we i can't i can't say
that i'm going that far with it um but it is so very close to public transportation that's what
we would encourage okay and where are the dumpsters or or what is the trash um removal plan
so right there to the left of the building you'll see that gated area there will be
uh trash receptacles and areas storage area um on the harold street side of the building
there's a there's a trash storage room in the basement and then the trash comes up there and
then it goes out oh yeah yeah it's going to be yeah there is if you look on the basement plan
there's a whole trash storage uh room that's been um approved out for for that right questions or
comments from our attorney no questions at this time questions or comments from the virtual audience
planning commission just afterwards just um adopt my testimony well sorry go ahead okay but
mitasha you you heard my testimony and was it true and accurate and do you adopt it as your own great
and then jacob
I also adopt your testimony, Brad, and I just wanted to point out, you know, since we are here for hardship, that, you know, this is a very unique building, very difficult to reuse, not easily adaptable into, you know, residential uses or other more conventional uses.
You know, this is a very special space, and, you know, to use it for events is something that has proven successful in past adaptive reuse situations here in Philadelphia.
And, you know, we would greatly appreciate the relief here.
And as you said, it's been empty now for decades.
35 years?
Plus, at least, yeah.
It was used as a bank from 1909 until sometime in the 80s or 90s, and it's been vacant ever since.
It has not shown to be possible to reuse it in other manners.
you know possible to reuse it in in other manners planning commission here i'm sorry
to interrupt this is ian haggarty we do appear to have two remote participants who have their hands
raised i'm going to promote elige crawley to panelists now all right
i could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer
Hello. Hello. Can I be here? Okay. I most certainly could you please state your name and spell for my name is Laji Crowley. First name is L. A. G. E. last name is Crowley C. R. A. W. L. E. Y.
You swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth. Nothing but the truth.
Yes, I do. Are you a neighbor? Do you have an interest in this project? I am a neighbor and have interest in this project. Please proceed.
um so first off hello to everybody we've spoken at the neighbors meeting and got some information
on what was going on and as a homeowner and a property owner on harold street i'm excited for
the new life that this brings in and ideally it removes a lot of the drugs and prostitution in
the area i know that's bigger than just this location and more of a partnership with the city
but excited for that um i can't say i'm excited for this event space but as a resident i am
terrified of what the event space can do for the parking in the area um harold street is already a
one-way street supporting homes also we have maybe two or three new developing apartments in the area
uh i am aware that maybe permit parking may be permitted um that's not exactly something i'm
excited about uh i am aware that this location will be open as late as 12 p.m uh which i'm not
exactly excited about especially as a father of a three and a five year old that that can get
really dicey on a given day um so i am kind of apprehensive about my yes um again excited for
what is to come but i also still have a lot of worries that are unaddressed uh we have gone over
things like putting up the gate which has helped but has also shifted uh some of the people that
hang out there we have some pictures here in your slideshow that kind of demonstrates the activity
there. So I think that there is still more work to come before getting to this point that this is a
thriving wedding venue when you have drug activity and prostitution going on in the corner. So again,
the gates that have been put up have been helpful, but I feel like the property overall is going to
need a property manager, someone that can be consistently keeping up with this. And so that's
my number one concern also someone spoke on it earlier um and i think i'm forgetting my place
we spoke on parking and yeah i'll have to leave it at that because it's slipping me but just on
my concerns there as a resident on this location all right thank you much thank you for taking
time to call next hand please hi chair we have a hand up from britney sanchez they're being promoted
with the panel. Hi, can you hear me okay? Could you please state your name and spell for the
stenographer? Yes, my name is Brittany Sanchez. B-R-I-T-T-A-N-Y-S-A-N-C-H-E-Z. You swear
referring to tell the truth told truth nothing but the truth i do um are you a neighbor yes i lived
on harold street directly across from this building please proceed um i went to the community meeting
on in april and spoke with these lovely people here i think that natasha's idea is something
that can really change the community and would be great however i do have concerns um jacob roller
and Brett Feldman were specifically spoken to that the community support came with demonstration
from that last month of showing how much they cared about our community and the fact that
their building has been abandoned for so long and there's no one there taking care of it which has
led to this drug activity, prostitution, dealers, feces and urine all outside. They have shown none
of that. The pictures that they uploaded here of the fence being put up is only on the front
part of that building but i could go outside right now and show you what it currently looks like
um so what was posted here isn't accurate to what's actually happening outside why i think
a wedding venue would obviously make some type of change because this is something that you would
have to maintain 24 7 in order to have people who want to actually have their wedding here
i don't think that they held up their end of the bargain of showing that they were committed to
improving the environment to show the potential of this space and to continue to have community
um the potential of this space and to and to continue to have community support behind them
support.
thank you um mr film do you want to respond absolutely um we i think you saw the pictures of
we've spent and take all you can answer this more we've spent thousands of dollars on that fencing
and the maintenance of that fencing over the last month month and a half um you know to to do
everything we can do to try to secure that that building. I mean, and we were repeatedly in touch
with East Kensington Neighbors Association about what we were doing each step of the way over the
last month and a half. So it's been our intention to to resolve any concerns. Anything further on
that? I was just going to add, you know, parking. I think people have mentioned that is a concern
is why we've been, we have sort of a, you know, early confirmation from Temple University Episcopal
campus that they have excess capacity at their facility, which is, you know, as you guys can see
on the map is right there a block away. And so we do intend to utilize valet service between, you know,
I think most people coming to events there, if they're driving, they would take, they would take
use of that valet uh were also of course you know directly adjacent to the huntingdon station on on
the l uh as far as the fences we we heard that feedback from the community we went out and and
as brett said spent thousands of dollars to purchase and install fencing on on either side
of the building and uh you know the the greater conditions of of kensington avenue is is a much
greater problem uh than than you know just that that but we hope to be part of the solution
also i own this building for decades yeah all right thank you um planning commission
amy boyd with the planning commission the comprehensive plan recommends a changing
zoning at this location from the current cmx 2.5 commercial mix use to cmx3 the proposed used to
be allowed by special exception under the proposed zoning the appellant has demonstrated that the
proposed use will not cause detrimental impact beyond what would reasonably be expected the
planning commission recommends that the board grant their requested variance for event assembly
facility thank you um lynn um first floor in basement only there's a small portion on the
second floor that they're not using right okay thank you mi2025-007-849-1801 east huntington
street i vote yes with proviso first and basement floor only michael johns my vote is yes with
proviso great adaptive reuse for this building cheryl guest then my vote is yes with proviso
Tanetta Graham, my vote is yes with Proviso.
Tywin, my vote is yes with Proviso.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you very much for having me.
Thank you so much.
We haven't seen you in a while.
Try to get on here more often.
Here you go.
Number six.
MI 2026-00179-1202-Altra Street.
Alex Goldberg is the attorney.
non-opposition from passion
civic association
mr goldberg would you please state your name is spelled for the stenographer
alex goldberg a-l-e-x-g-o-l-d-b-e-r-g you swear or affirm to tell the truth the
whole truth and nothing but the truth i do mr goldberg could you identify your client a
relationship to this property sure my client is 118 12 street llc and its representatives francis
wang and jack zhao are in the virtual audience vice chair has just a few questions for you sir
good afternoon have you submitted your documents and exhibits five days in advance of this hearing
i have and you wave the reason of the refusal and stipulate to its accuracy i wave the reading but
we have a amended plans in the packet that would change yes yep all right thank you can show your
screen to proceed with your case okay um so i'm here presenting um a proposed direction of a new
structure with six dwelling units this is a cmx3 property and as you'll see in a moment we are
asking for one dimensional refusal for occupied area um this entire block is owned cmx3 and
cmx3 specifically does not regulate the amount of units that you can have it
cmx 3 specifically does not regulate the amount of units that you can have it it has regulations
on occupied area parking and floor area ratio we are availing ourselves of this process because
we believe that the version of this project that you're about to see with six units is
better than the by right six unit project at this location and we have a letter of non-opposition
from the rco as well as a letter of support from the directly adjacent neighbor the notice of
refusal is for occupied area at the time of the original application we were asking for 89.75
percent occupied area we met with the coordinating rco in march and they asked for a couple things
and you'll see their letter but you know their position being non-opposition really hinged on
us making a modification to the building and compromising some of the building size to make
it smaller and agreeing to some other things but that's our one one refusal item the other thing
i have not mentioned is that there are two accessory parking interior accessory parking spaces
included as a part of this development project here's the letter of non-opposition from passing
square civic association um they mention in here that they would like a proviso
prohibiting visitor accommodations and short-term rentals it's not a part of this application
i don't know if that's an enforceable proviso but we are agreeable to it what so uh you know
that i'll just leave that uh as is the other things that we agreed to were interior trash
storage you'll see a trash room in the building common trash room and also commercial trash pickup
we're agreeable to to private trash pickup multiple times per week
here's that proviso form zoom out and over the most notable change is that we shrunk the building
by two and a half feet at the rear we now have a seven nearly eight foot rear yard and our occupied
area is now 84.6%. We reduced the occupied area by about 5%. I will note that there are other
properties and you'll see an exhibit shortly, possibly even the next. I'll wait until I get
to that exhibit to explain. We have letters of support from nearby neighbors. So my client owns
the two properties on 12th Street, which are perpendicular to us, but neighbor this building.
And we also have a letter of support from 1206 Alter Street, which is the neighbor to the right of this building structure. So both adjacent neighbors are in support. There's also a letter on here from 1212 Alter Street.
So the occupied area refusal that we're dealing with is commonplace in CMX3 properties that are
in close proximity. You can see on the screen the 1200 block of Alter Street specifically,
and I would point out that in 2017, a greater variance, one of 89% was granted to 1230 Alter
street and in 2018 a greater variance of 91 occupied area was granted to 1224 altar street
here's the 1300 block of altar street as well these are all full lot coverage and then south
11th street the the street to our right here's an aerial view so this is a double wide lot that
was consolidated prior to the engagement of our firm or or the initiation of this zoning matter
that happened in September of 2025. So the lot is 28 feet wide and measures 1,367 square feet.
Here's a zoning map. Again, you can see we're just off of Washington Ave. There is a large
number of CMX3 properties here, many of them multifamily structures, but a mix of singles,
multis, and commercial properties. My client owns a 10-unit building on the corner right next to us,
And next to that property is a commercial building that he owns, which is the management office for his property management company, which has over 150 units under management.
So that's a positive meaning that the management, the property management company is in very close proximity.
You can see how close we are to Washington Ave.
There are multiple bus lines.
I mean, it's a major road, obviously, Washington Ave.
Here's the front of the property.
Here's the notice posting.
here it is in 09 so it's been vacant for some time to the right you can see these large buildings
taller than ours um i believe this is somewhere around 48 units and i think this is a 10 this is
a 10 unit building right there here's the left so you have a mix of ones and twos and also an
here's the left. So you have a mix of ones and twos and also an industrial slash commercial
industrial
rules.
property on this side of the street. There's no parking available, no street parking available on
altar, no legal street parking, I should say. So the curb cut that we're proposing won't take any
publicly accessible parking spots off of the street. Here's the plans and drawings. So the
project architect CP Wang is in the virtual audience. If there are any specific questions
about materials or or architectural components um i think it has an interesting sort of four-toned
uh you know design to it uh there's two doors here you'll see on the plans one goes directly
into the garage area and one goes directly into the residential entry point and they also connect
on the inside there's a three-foot wide alley that also runs down the left side of the property
and and sorry before i move off of this page um we have a letter of support from 1206 altar which
is the building the single family home approved by way of variance to the right of us um going
back to what i said at the beginning of my presentation technically under cmx3 zoning we
we would be permitted to add an additional floor onto this building structure to achieve our six
dwelling units we felt at the outside of this application process and the rco agreed with us
that rather than building a taller building structure which my client is entitled to do
we would match the roof line of the building structure to the right of us
and ask for an occupied area
occupied area variance which is what we have done so you can see here that you
know we're matching the height of that building next to us
and shorter than the building to the left of us and I'll note that this
structure right here is a part of the lot this is not a standalone
lot here so this is sort of the back of the lot where that building structure
is okay here's an additional site plan and sort of massing map front elevations
the building structure is 39 feet high here the floor plan so we have parking
on the first floor there's no living in the basement at the back of the the
first floor there's a large storage area and below that there is a partial
basement with additional storage so we have a ton of storage here for unit owners there is a trash
room in the rear of the property with direct direct access to the rear and also direct access
through the front of the property the second stairwell here which we were required to provide
because of the four-story nature in the unit count of the building does take up valuable square
footage of the you know the floors above it it does also give us a second means of egress for
all four units all six units and it empties out directly into that three foot wide alley that's to
the left of us you can see there's a vestibule here and that that enters directly into
parking area the three floors above it are very similar they're all one bed one bath units
we did shrink the building structure which shrunk those three back facing units
um they were all previously 420 square feet one bed one bath units now those rear facing ones are
smaller um 355 square feet it wasn't you know that was a topic of conversation at the rco meeting
um there were comp there were there was commentary in in that meeting that that is what some people
are looking for it's less expensive and maybe they live alone um which we agreed with um you
can see here the upper floors again are much the same there is a shared roof deck on the top floor
as being the primary outdoor space with all necessary setbacks all of the units have washers
and dryers the building will be sprinklered you know obviously modern state-of-the-art there's
nice natural light in every unit because of the large windows that we have at the front
and the back of the building structure there's a cross-section
We mailed notice. We had that meeting with the RCO on March 10th.
Mailing certificates, application for appeal, deed to the property, and then there's two tax
clearance certs here, one for 1202 and one for 1204 because the city's records have not updated
that this is one tax account, but they're both clear. With that, I'd like to call my client to
adopt my testimony jack or francis i'm not sure which one of them will be on
mr chair i have a hand up from uh fang wong do you think that's possible yeah yes i'll go ahead
and promote them right now please accept the promotion to panelists when you receive it okay
I'm with that control.
Hello.
Hi, could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer?
Yes, my name is Fang Wang, F-A-N-G, W-A-N-G.
do you swear or affirm to tell the truth told you nothing but the truth
yes should you turn your video on please oh
yes thank you counsel hi fang um did you hear my testimony today yes and was it true and correct
yes and do you adopt it as your own yes thank you questions from the board can you go back to
this section i want to see how who has all the residents have access to the um roof deck or just
the upper all the residents have access to the roof deck and i think in anticipation of more
questions maybe having my architect uh promoted and sworn in my sure why not okay well i want to
see who's your architect uh his name is cp wang it might he might be showing up as pink oh there
is right there all right sir could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer
it's becoming back in shortly mr chair yeah i know okay
and so the the uh so all the residents have access to the to the to the uh roof deck okay all right
any other questions is there ventilated trash storage on each floor or in each unit there we
just have the trash room on the first floor um we can sort of look into finding some space in in a
in the common hallway um i don't want to carve any more space out of the units themselves but it's
something that we can look into i think just generally you know at the top unit that's a
five-story long walk down it's a long walk down um and then which uh which residents are going
have access to the parking good question so i asked the same my understanding is in is that
when the the units are leased up the it'll be essentially first come first serve to be able to
you know privatize your parking space the building is the entire lot limit at this point right no
we're at 84 84.9 well the residents have access to their i guess whatever the rear yards they will
yeah and i'll go back to that first floor floor plan i mean it's not huge but there's this storage
area back here that opens directly into the rear and also the trash opens directly and is there
any more detail like for the storage area all residents will have access to it or is it going
to be restricted to the building itself you mean like a sizable space building owner yeah i think
my my and francis you correct me if i'm wrong i believe that the building storage will be in the
basement and the tenant storage will be sectioned off on the first floor in some capacity just
because it's easier for them to get to their stuff yeah just could you tell me real quick what the
buy right option is for the unit 500 far is is the is the maximum floor area ratio we're at 339
so we could put a whole additional floor on the building structure the floors are nine feet nine
and a half feet somewhere between there so you know 48 foot building the unit count um you'd
have to get an elevator, wouldn't you? That's right. The unit count is limited by the
building code within that far. And then
for the building at the corner, I know you said you're shorter than it.
How tall is that building? It's a great
question. I believe it's... Or do you know just like generally? I think it's at least
45 feet tall. It's a four-story structure, but it... Because it's not
built yet, right? No, it is built. It is built. Yeah, and you can see it in the photos. I wasn't
sure if that was the rendering there's two there's two big buildings on the corner okay yeah i was
like i was sorry and then the building next the next door which is at 1206 altar street it's
permitted zoning but not building permits it's uh i guess it's by our by right well it was approved
by way of variance because single family living is not allowed by right in cmx3 okay and they also
So they also got a variance for the parking because it's weird.
I guess in multifamily CMX3, you're allowed, but in single family, you're not.
Frances, if you're still there.
I just, because your building went up first and I know you matched the Cornice line.
It looks like you matched the height to the building, but it's not there yet.
So I was just trying to make sure that there's no chance that they'll come behind you and change that.
I don't think so.
You know, my client doesn't own that property.
sure i don't know if it's under construction yet if francis can opine as to that that would
I don't know if it's under construction yet.
If Francis can opine as to that, that would be great.
be great but it was matched based off of the approved drawings right right this one's like
um questions or comments for our attorney
no questions at this time questions or comments from the audience or the virtual audience come on
good afternoon by the way you've been here a long time thank you all right why don't you get closer
and bring that mic right over here my name is jacqueline dorsey j-a-c-q-u-e-l-i-n-e capital g-o-r-s-u-i
you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth i do and are you a
neighbor yes i am i live at 1208 altar first of all there's an alleyway next to 1206 that gives me
entrance to my back and they have the building built directly next door to 1206 eliminating
that alleyway and i they can't do that second of all the building on the corner they have a trap
a dumpster on the outside of the walkway so they're not putting the dumps they have six
apartments there that they use as airbnbs and they have a dumpster out there i have pictures
of this is not this unit pardon this is something another location that's another it's on the same
point yeah i but it's not it's not 1202. no it's not 1202. it's the owner of 12. okay okay he has
all the properties you're saying yes he does okay so i'm i'm just concerned about that alleyway
because I need access. I'm a senior. Plus, there is parking on that street. You park on the side
where the buildings are. You can park in that street. I think the cars that are parked there
are parked on the sidewalk. No, no. My friends that come to 1208 Altar park in front of my door.
Okay. Okay. And the police never stops them. If you park on the sidewalk, they give you a ticket.
okay they parked in front of my door 1208 um anything else ma'am
no other than uh i'm i'm just i'm i'm just opposing it because i think we have enough
they had he has the corner there um he doesn't you know i don't think he wants to use it
for people to rent apartments that's just okay you're concerned with the airbnb that
that's right all right all right thank you ma'am we we do appreciate you coming in and give us your
voice anyone else in the virtual audience sure come on up could i wait to respond
respond everybody yeah okay but real quick al do you have a uh rendering in your render
does it show the alleyway there is no alleyway
She lives at 1208 and her building structure is not built to the lot line, right?
so there's there's it's not an alleyway it's her her lot there's open space between her lot
and 1206. okay we're two lots over there's no alley there's no public alley or easement
servicing her parcel from ours it is in the back not a public record that we're aware of yes it
is a public record because he tried to build that there and i called license and inspection
and they stopped him. It's two alleyways there. It's one next to 1206 and it's one that he's
already blocked off. I have a picture of it. We don't believe that to be the case.
To Peter Street. The one that he blocks off goes out to Peter Street and the one that's there
that's next to 1206, whoever built on Peter Street, they took the alleyway to go all the way through
to the street. But I can come from my backyard. There's an alleyway there that leads all the way
to the one you blocked off. All right. Thank you. Why don't we let your associate come up?
the the the atlas doesn't show an alley the the city on atlas it doesn't show an alley
I've had that help.
All right, let me hear.
All right.
I just want to say my my grandmother bought that house in 1947 oh and I've had it since 1965
congratulations that's beautiful could you uh please state your name oh we we just state your
name because we've already sworn you in for that other case yes my name is Mary Stumpf M-A-R-Y-S-T-U-M-P-F
now mary you still live at 12th and ellsworth and how close i do well i live at the i my property
goes from uh 12th and ellsworth through to peter street 1240 peter street which is the next little
street south of altar so what's your testimony okay well um when during the um the zoning meeting
with the civic it was brought out that the entire south side of altar street was erroneously changed
to cmx three it should be rsa five and supposedly the planning commission knows that that's true but
because it was changed and it's allowing people to to build what they're building now like the
giant yeah and the person that owns that's that's here um to present this building um this it's the
same owner as the one right on uh 12th street the 10 units that he's using six of them as an airbnb
be and then there's a he's got a and you know this was brought up at the civic that um the dumpster
really should be he's creating this precedent of having the dumpster but that's not relative
to this case in other words you're saying he's doing it somewhere else you're concerned about
what he's right next door to this well okay yeah 12 alter and yeah sure as well so um yeah
and i agree with you that he should get rid of the dumpster we we don't disagree about that and
that came up with the community meeting and i i believe to my memory he said that he would and
he's on the call now so i think we're in agreement about that this is different property but i agree
and um the other thing was uh the size of some of these units uh they're sort of like a hotel room
they're very small some of them like 300 some square feet definitely thank you very much by
rate he's allowed to do it yes thank you very much can i ask alex a quick question sure was
Was the owner of 1206 at your community meeting as well?
Because I know it looks like they own a considerable amount of the rest of the block as well.
You may have more information than me, but I don't think they were there.
They just signed a letter.
I don't think they were there.
Honestly, they may know who that person is.
I can just note on the Airbnb thing.
That was clearly a reason why that came up in the letter.
and and you know what my client testified to at the community meeting was that he has tenants in
that building on the corner that are subleasing their their units through airbnb it's a cmx3
property which you're allowed to obviously you need the permits and the licenses to do that
um but that is not his intention and we were agreeable to a proviso like eliminating that
possibility all right what what one more one more time you can come up but come on up but
but concentrate on this property that he's talking about go ahead thank you
uh 1208 1206 the people that live in at the people that own 1206 live in new jersey
so they never come to the meetings and i always remind them of it but they own the property but
they live in jersey but that the point is i said it has nothing to do with 1202 am i right yeah
that's the neighbor yeah thank you that's my question thank you very much
um all right anyone else in the virtual audience
no hands at this time chair it is built
it is or at least as of july it looked almost done i'm looking on cycle media
planning commission amy boy with the planning commission the comprehensive plan recommends
no change in zoning from these existing cmx3 commercial mixed use the appellant has not shown
that there are unique physical conditions or circumstances that would prevent the property
from being used in conformity with the zoning code the planning commission recommends that
the board deny the requested variance for occupied area can i just briefly respond so i think there
is a unique circumstance here in that the six units are allowed and the option that would not
put us in front of this board was was a worse option and the community agreed with that and
and that's why we're asking for the variance that we are today so so council
and that's why we're asking for the variance that we are today so so council the uh limited lodging
and um the um uh visitor accommodations they'd have to come back in for that anyway am i correct
right so right right we don't we don't need a variance for it that's why yeah i'm i'm yeah cmx
3 allows it so that was why it was an issue for the community because they didn't want us to pull
a by-right permit we don't want to make that a we're agreeable to it
mi 2026 000 179 1202 altar street i vote yes with with proviso revised plan one page
stamp by cba on may 6 20 26 and uh hold on here no another proviso no live-in lodging or visitor
accommodations i would say michael john agreed to by the um the applicant agreed to by the applicant
michael johns my vote is yes with provisos
Cheryl Gaston my vote is no
uh it's another ground my vote is yes supervisors thank you council thank you for coming in ladies
number nine MI 2026 00000214 1946 grad street
henry clinton is the attorney good afternoon mr chairman members of the board mr clinton
could you please state your name is spelled for the stenographer sure my name is henry clinton
h-e-n-r-y clinton c-l-i-n-t-o-n right do you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth
nothing but the truth i do could you identify your client their relationship to the property
The client is capital P, capital A, capital B, capital K, S, Properties, LLC, and one of the principals is on the call with me. His name is Saad, S-A-A-D, Chaudhry, C-H-A-U-R-I.
I see there was a letter of support with proviso from the RCO, and there's also a CBA. Am I correct?
Correct.
Okay. Our vice chair has a few questions.
good afternoon have you submitted your documents and exhibits five days in advance of this hearing
i have miss graham except for the cva agreement which we submitted yesterday okay thank you and
do you waive the reading of the refusals and stipulate to the accuracy i do all right thank
you you can show your screen and proceed with your key thank you mr graham
is that visible mr chairman it is all right good afternoon everyone again i'm
I'm here for, it's actually a legalization of an eight-unit apartment building.
Table of contents, A1 through A10.
This is a rather very unique circumstance.
My client purchased the property in March of 2024 as an eight-unit apartment building.
He has rental licenses, and I have them here in the packet that go through the whole history.
But basically, this property was a two-family zoning-approved dwelling in 2010.
Sometime between 2012, if you look at the rental licenses here, and 2021, the property was converted to eight separate individual studio apartments.
And I'll go through the permits and really explain what happened.
But bottom line is, my client buys it in 2024, inherits eight tenants, all of them happen to be students, except one who was a senior citizen.
And then in November of 2024, he got a sticker slapped on the front of the building by L&I saying, cease and desist and vacate the property.
And I have a picture of that.
So he had to get everyone out of the property at the same time.
And ironically, the client purchased this property right near Temple and another property on 18th Street at the same time frame.
And both of them are eight units and both of them receive violations from L&I that is not zoned properly.
And I have filed an appeal, an application, try to legalize both.
Today's hearing is on Gratt Street.
I have another hearing.
I just wanted to tell the board that I have another application like this next week on May 13th.
And it's the same issue where it's been used as eight units for over a decade, but never, ever legalized.
So I'll walk through this.
So I'll walk through this.
So we are an RM1 zoning district, so multifamily.
So we are in RM1 zoning district, so multifamily is permitted.
By right, and when I show you the photographs on the street, by right, you can typically get a triplex on this block.
Now, I wasn't able to find out, you know, those triplexes, are they three, two bedrooms, you know, four bedrooms, I don't really know.
But when you see the photographs, you'll see it's a multifamily block, duplexes and triplexes.
Our refusals are, you can't have eight units when you're only allowed three, and you need parking spaces, and we have none.
We do have a letter of support from Beach Community Services, and we went through the same discussion with them.
They just couldn't understand how you could have a property operating with eight units for over 10 years, and now all of a sudden it's discovered.
We don't know why it was discovered.
My client really didn't dwell on that.
He was really focused on trying to fix the problem and come up with a solution.
So one of the things that we said to the community is, look, we know this block is full of students.
You don't want students. So we will agree only to rent to senior citizens.
And my client will testify how he went about the process of trying to find a company that would be able to put ambulatory seniors, and by seniors that's being defined as anyone over 60, ambulatory, who has a history of doing this.
And he was able to find somebody and have a lease with that particular senior provider at the end of this document.
So the community was concerned about only renting the seniors and also trash management.
And you'll see that we have a master lease with a company that's going to be in charge of trash as well as preparing meals, et cetera.
And I'll go through that at the end.
Henry, just for a point of information, I'm going to recuse myself from this.
I try to avoid voting on these Temple cases because I was there so long.
So Tenet is going to take this case over, OK?
I was hoping I could call you as a witness, Mr. Chairman.
So this is 1946 North Gratz.
We're on the even side of the street, which is always the west side.
And here's the property.
Beautiful elevation.
You can see next door is a triplex.
On the other side is a triplex.
There's a duplex here.
Again, we're looking south to Center City.
Here's another triplex here.
We're looking in the opposite direction.
We're looking north.
Again, mostly multifamily on the block.
There are some single family, but mainly multi.
Again, more photographs just per perspective.
Here's the front of the building.
Here's the placard that was put on the front door.
So each, basically what we have is each floor, starting with the basement, and it's a three-story structure.
Each floor has two apartments or two studios.
And when I show you the floor plan, you'll see how it's laid out.
I have interior photographs.
We're actually taken by my client who's going to testify today.
So we have, you know, nice decks on or balconies on each floor.
We have a entrance to the basement units.
There's a set of walk down steps in both the front and the rear of the property.
I'm just showing you other triplexes on the block.
All right.
This is the cease operation, November 3rd, you know, 2025.
Just happened about four months ago.
So, Saad, who's on the call, went through and took photographs.
So, this is A1.
This is in the basement, first unit in the front of the building.
So, everyone has a kitchen.
Everyone has a bathroom.
And it's a studio ranging in square feet from 278 square feet up to 408 square feet.
It's still the front.
What was the upper limit?
Again, please.
Pardon me. Attorney Clinton. What was the upper limit, again, in terms of the square footage?
You said 278. 278. That's the smallest. There's two units, 278. And then there's three units over 400 square feet.
And it's my understanding from the. Is that good?
is my understanding from yes i'm sorry i just didn't hear what you said okay i was just asking
you to you know repeat all right so this is a1 this is the front unit in the basement this is a2
rear unit in the basement which has a means of egress from the rear just like the front i'll
show you that on the floor plan again a2 closet every unit has a split unit so they have their
own individually controlled heating and air. Now we're on the second floor front, V1.
Now we're on the second floor front, V1.
Looking out through the front window there.
Now we're on the second floor.
All the bathrooms are relatively the same.
I mean, there's a lot of photographs, but I thought it was, you know,
We're asking for eight units.
I just thought it would be best to show you photographs of every unit
rather than just say this is what one looks like and apply that to all of them.
So now we're on the third floor, front, D1.
Just to switch back steps leading from the basement all the way up to the third floor.
closet that's going to be a trash closet by the way but when you see the master lease the agency
that's going to be involved with this building they're going to do all that they're going to
collect the trash uh they're going to service the clients that are in here
and this is the rear yard and there's a set of steps underneath these steps leading to the basement
my front door again there's our placards posting all right so here are the plans um
let's start go to the left side
so here's the lower level here's the front of the building where you can go down the steps
and into the studio in the front.
And again, you know, we drew the bed in.
There's no beds depicted in the photographs,
but the kitchens and the baths and the standalone closets are.
So then if you want to get into the rear unit,
you would come into the rear steps and down into the basement,
or you can come in the front door and then switch back into the bottom.
But there's a means of egress for both studios in the basement.
So then you'd walk up, again, switch back steps.
You'd go to the front studio, and then there's an entrance to the rear studio.
And then you have an exit to the rear yard on the first floor.
Continue going up the steps.
Then you're on the second floor front, second floor rear.
And I can blow this up and show you the square footage.
The smallest ones are going to be in the basement.
So this is 278 and 357.
Oh, here's, excuse me, the smallest are the basement and first floor front.
The other studio here is 278, and then rear is 408.
Second floor, 332, 401.
and then third floor, 330 and 401.
There's no rooftop deck in this facility.
The other documents are what you would typically see in a presentation such as this,
the application, the PIP form, the tax information indicating that taxes are due,
zoning map it is a large lot it's 82 feet deep the house itself is about 62.
the deed indicating ownership in april of 2024
this is a notice letter to the community for the community meeting
uh so i just want to get into these zoning records so again i said in the beginning that
This zone is a two-family.
So it's a 2010 property, as of right, two-family dwelling.
And I couldn't find, you know, anything other than a site plan for this property and the front elevation.
So the front elevation is basically what's there.
I think they took some liberty maybe with the front porch, but it's basically laid out that way.
Now, I found the rental license from 2012.
Well, it's inactive.
It says two units, which would have been legal.
This is now we jump up to 2021.
All of a sudden, it's eight units.
Again, this is inactive because it went inactive as of 2023.
And, you know, Odin Properties is a well-known company, and they operate many, many apartments in the city.
so again my client looks at it does a little research on odin figured all right if they
have eight units it's eight units uh then 2023 again there's a new owner eight units
Then 2023, again, there's a new owner, eight units.
My client purchased it, was able to get a rental license for eight units, and it's active.
So then I went and started to look at the building permits.
So I see in 2011, there's suppression system.
There are sprinklers in the building, plumbing permits, mechanical and electrical.
So when I looked at them, these elite fire protection, again, they do annual inspections, which is now expired because there's nobody in there.
But I'll show you that at the end. So here's a plumbing permit from 2011.
Somehow this contractor got a plumbing permit for eight water closets, you know, eight toilets, eight bathtubs, two washing machines and 14 laboratories.
Then the mechanical was able to install eight wall-mounted heat pumps in each of the rooms, one in each of the eight rooms.
This is 2011.
Electrical, eight 20-amp, 200-volt outlets, and they have it listed as a duplex apartment,
which we know that it either was then or became eight in 2012 or shortly thereafter.
are so these are just some other records i pulled to show you that there's a sprinkler certification
so there are sprinklers there which has since expired
expiration date 9 25 of last year and this is the administrative notice of the violation
indicating that you need a uu new use because they the city classified this as a rooming house
Even though technically a rooming house would be just rooms with maybe a common bathroom, here I'm arguing that these are basically studio apartments, which they are.
That's why I showed you all the photographs.
Again, a sprinkler certification.
And we also have central alarm monitoring by Frank Gentile of Elite.
All right.
So, again, my client had a problem.
It's empty. He doesn't know what he's going to do with it. The community doesn't want students.
So Mr. Chaudhary went and found a company called One Year Health Matters, LLC.
We have a signed lease agreement for a three year term, master leasing these eight apartments to this company.
And they have ready, willing and able seniors, 60 years and old, older ambulatory, where they this company coordinates the tenant services.
and it's a triple net lease.
So I'll go through the lease.
I don't want to be overbearing,
but I think some of the clauses in there
are significant to what we're trying to do here.
And then I'll talk about the tenant background
and the tenant experience
and show you where they're doing this now
in Southwest Philadelphia.
They basically sublease 31 bedroom apartments for seniors.
The apartments are owned by somebody else,
just like this situation,
and they provide in-home care as needed.
okay wait a minute um so um our council this proviso for seniors only we can't really enforce
that that is correct we cannot do that yeah so but i i made a note because the rco um did that
and i there was a i don't know if the cba has been finalized but i know there was conversations
towards an agreement related to the provisos okay yeah i was trying to see in case i don't want
them to go all through it and we can't really like you know proviso it so i think i think it's okay
we're gonna you know trust that you just submit it with your packet in the lease
agreement we can't enforce that okay only seniors only proviso but we do
understand that you have a CBA with the RCO so right and you and mr. Graham to be
perfectly candid the RCO is not signing yet but they understand they wanted us
to do that so we signed it as an indication of good faith okay so all right
if i don't want to bring your client on to adopt your testimony sure mr tyree can you come on please
uh can you hear me yes yep okay hi can you state your name and spell it for the record
uh my name is sad s-a-a-d last name is chowdhri c-h-a-u-d-h-r-i okay do you swear or affirm to
tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth i do okay go ahead counsel all right
Mr. Chowdhury, were you on the call when I presented the project?
And did you take all the photographs that I showed here to the board today?
And are you an active participant in this project?
And have you coordinated and leased to a home health care company, a master lease?
And if you had the opportunity to testify, would you adopt my testimony as your own and as true, correct?
And if you had the opportunity to testify, would you adopt my testimony as your own?
Yes. Correct. Yes.
I have no further questions. Okay. All right. I have a question.
Can you go back to your rendering and tell me how does a person get to the second, I mean, the basement rear apartment?
it should be on it might be on your plan yeah i think you're right i don't know if i passed
them or not i think you did but it's kind of i did you're right miss ma'am you're right
i know the answer but i want to show it to you
All right, so here is the lower level. This is the front where my cursor is to get into the front studio. You would enter through the front, go down the steps and into the unit.
The same thing with the, with the, the rear.
You would enter in through.
The rear and go, so you're going to the other alley. I mean, there's no, you can't do that on all sides. Like, so I think what I think what happens.
my mistake I think what happens here because I was I was in these apartments you come in through
the front and you go down the switch back steps to get into the lower level and then you can go
all right that makes okay all right questions from the board
okay um I just I not question comment this is entirely too dense um and I don't understand
And you say you're going to do this with seniors. These are a bunch of steps where you say these people are ambulatory. I guess I could call myself a senior at this point. I'm ambulatory, but a bunch of steps like that is a little hard for, I think, most of the seniors to deal with.
Plus, you say now you said you were going to contract with some service that's going to come in and help these seniors.
Is that what I heard?
Yes. Yes.
So the company, the company that we have the lease with is called One Your Health Matters.
And what they do is they have skilled and unskilled services, nursing and LPNs, and they will, I mean, it's just like seniors who are living alone at home.
You know, you can have a foot doctor come in one day.
You could have somebody from Penn Health come in one day.
The next day, you might have someone come in and bathe you, even though the family's taking care of the senior.
This is the move now where there's all services being provided in the home.
And this company has already 30 apartments in a structure in southwest Philly where they do this for 30 different individuals.
And they don't take if you're in fact in a lease, if you're on a walker, they won't take you.
If you're using a wheelchair, they won't take you.
They just it just doesn't fit their model.
Their model is ambulatory individuals over 60 years old, and they say they have a need.
So they're going to sign a master lease for three years.
And if the board is feeling uncomfortable and want to put in a sunset provision or something like that, because the lease is only three years, I'll be candid.
It's not a 20-year lease.
It's three years.
So I'm trying to give you as much flavor as what this client is trying to do.
yeah i have a question about the the operator so i understand that they have this other building in
southwest philly is that building also a stair access only building yes in fact i have a picture
this is the bill so okay so i will say the big difference here is this is a two-story building
versus what we're looking at which is going to be four stories once we include
The basement and like that's a very different setup. So I don't is the.
Operator able to speak to how they plan to manage.
2 more flights of stairs with elderly.
You know, homeowners are renters.
Well, I'm just going to talk about the economics that they're, they are signing a master lease.
where they are going to be responsible for insurance, taxes, utilities, and rent.
And then it is up to them to fill the units.
the units if they have understand that i think what we're i think the reason we're giving these
I think while we understand that, I think the reason we're...
questions is because their model in southwest philly does not directly apply to the setup of
this current building and while they yes they take the risk when they sign the lease it is a very
different setup if they have to start renting it out to other people and it becomes something
that's like very different than what we've discussed very different than what's been
discussed with the rcos and the residents it becomes a completely different project all
together and we're talking about anybody could rent here yeah i i can see yeah i can see that
miss when i guess the only thing i would say is what's different about our building is one floor
right because if if a senior walks in and is in the basement that's one floor down
if he's on the first he or she is on the first floor it's even and so it's it has to do with
the two apartments on the third floor then I I can see that the other thing and I'm sorry
the other thing is I mean the my concern is um for eight dwelling unit you need to have
3,400 square feet. And currently you have 1,365 square feet. So you're talking about
almost 2,000 square feet less than you would ordinarily need to have this number of units.
And it appears that somebody did this conversion. It doesn't appear that they had any permits to do it. And if they had tried to get permits to do this, they wouldn't have been allowed to do it.
And I just, I'm having a real problem with the density. I'm having a real problem with the idea that you're going to put seniors, which, you know, right now they may not be needing a walker or wheelchair, but there's no guarantee that, you know, they won't fall.
they won't have some other condition that comes up where they're gonna have uh the ambulatory
problems that makes this um all these steps a problem and even to get into the first floor
unit you have to go uh first floor unit you have to go up steps i mean this isn't this isn't like a
a property where you know you're you there's any floor where you don't have to deal with steps
I hear what you're saying. I mean, we're just trying to go on the track record of this company side, interviewed a number of different companies, and this was one that said they would take senior adults 60 years or older, ambulatory, non-vehicle owning, and they participate in the tenant's coordinated transportation program.
So I hear what everybody's saying. I don't know how you can limit your population of renters to just seniors. I mean, I don't know how you can do that either.
I have a question about the trash done at RCO, wanted to have dedicated trash areas and trash compactors. Where would, where are they? Like, where's the space on the plan for trash?
Interior trash storage or?
All right, let me, I'm going to go into that.
Management plan is.
All right, so.
on the the there's the basement front trash storage a mop closet same thing here
okay same thing here and there and and the the there's one on each in each studio apartment
and the company is going to be responsible for collecting this trash from each senior's room
that's that's in the lease also all right um questions from our attorney
not at this time questions from the virtual audience
madam chair i do not see any hands raised okay on planning commission amy boyd with
the planning commission the comprehensive plan recommends no change in zoning to the existing
RM1 residential multifamily. Based on the lot area, the property would be allowed three units
buy rate or four units with the mixed income housing bonus. Eight units is not the least
minimum and there is no evidence that the conversion was done with the benefit of the
proper zoning permits. The Planning Commission recommends that the Board deny the requested
The Planning Commission recommends that the board deny the requested variance for eight dwelling units.
variance for eight dwelling units.
Can I address that?
Yes, you may, counsel.
All right, thank you.
So, I know there's eight units.
I can't prove it that there's apartments on this block with six bedrooms and potentially seven bedrooms.
So I think we have to look at not necessarily the number of units, but the number of bedrooms.
And this is not a rooming house.
Each senior would have their own living space, bathroom, kitchen, and going to be well managed by a professional company.
So I appreciate your consideration.
And again, if the board wants to consider even a sunset provision, that would be a wonderful thing.
And we can see whether this, you know, I don't want to call it experiment, but see whether this type of living in an apartment building where many, many seniors are living by themselves in a home of their own home or institutionalized.
This seems like a potential way to go.
Alright, thank you so much Council. So we had a lot of discussion on this, so we want to take it back to executive session. I have some folks that have a couple other questions they want to peel out a little bit further.
so thank you we're going to hold the vote on this and we can vote on this uh next week
i appreciate it and i'll see you next week with the 18th street thank you very much
this grant number 10 mi 2026 000 226 3240 to 64 hancock street peter kelson is the attorney
Jared, that should be coming back in shortly.
Good afternoon, members of the board.
Peter Kelsen on behalf of the Hispanic Association of Contractors and Enterprises, commonly known
as ASE.
If I may, I'd like to promote-
Hold just one minute.
it. I'm sorry. No, you don't have to be sorry. I mean, although everyone knows you, could you
please spell your name for the court stenographer? Of course. I apologize. Let me swear you in,
okay? Absolutely. I apologize. It's Peter K-E-L-S-E-N, blank Rome, LLP. Do you swear or affirm
to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? I certainly do. And then if you
would, please one more time, identify your client or relationship to the property. Sure. The owner
the property and my client is the hispanic association of contractors and enterprises
commonly referred to as assay um and at this time mr bergman if i could i would like to just one
more little one more time could our vice chair ask you a few questions absolutely there you go
and then we'll start good afternoon have you submitted your documents and exhibits
five days in advance of this hearing? Yes, I did. And do you waive the reading of the refusal
and stipulate to its accuracy? Absolutely, I will. Okay, thank you. You can share your screen
and proceed with your case. Okay. Again, I would ask if I could have Eric Bodson promoted. Yep.
And also Maria Gonzalez, the director of ASEI. Sure. As well. Thank you. First one, please come on.
yeah and then maria gonzalez that's becoming bacon as a panel of short mr chair
thank you so much yeah here you go sir how are you
you have the whole family today yeah i mean you're gonna get a whole team here i mean like eric's
here now i mean listen if i had time i would have brought labor in and we would have had everybody
all right can i just say that uh maria yeah i just want to wait for any commission together for many
years maria
eric let me swear you in could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer
yes eric you got two devices on yes we do
well eric is not going to testify he's going to run oh okay well then we'll just let him stand
yeah that's right okay if that's okay maria yes hi maria could you please state your name
is spelled for the stenographer yes maria gonzalez m-a-r-i-a-g-o-n
Yes, Maria Gonzalez, M-A-R-I-A-G-O-N-Z-A-L-E-Z.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Please proceed, Mr. Kelson.
Thank you again, members of the board.
You'll see on your screen our exhibit package, including the referral, RCO letter of support, photographs, renderings, plans, deed.
The property is owned by ASEE, as I indicated.
It's a 501c3 entity, and it is shown as real estate tax exempt.
And lastly, our notices and certificates of mailing.
If I may, members of the board, the subject property consists of a one-story structure.
It has been owned by ASEE through a transaction with the Redevelopment Authority of the City of Philadelphia.
It contains about 17,150 square feet, originally constructed in 2009.
You can see it illustrated in this aerial before you on Exhibit 3.
And I want to show you street-level views, if I could, at exhibits.
There we go.
The Hancock Street frontage.
this property fronts on hancock street westmoreland and what was formerly known as paleo thorpe
so three frontages westmoreland frontage
former paleo thorpe street frontage you will also see the entrance from this angle
to parking area gated and one more and now we're looking north on hancock street
It is adjacent to Karib Towers and the Casa Karib developments that were done by ASE a number of years ago that support senior housing.
At the time this property was developed, it was used by Mercy Life as a life center in support of the seniors and the community surrounding it.
Mercy has since ceased its operation at this location, and it is currently vacant.
The property is zoned, as you will see at Exhibit 3, the zoning map, I-2 Industrial.
However, the City Council currently has before it, and I believe you have a copy of this, thank you,
I'm showing you on the screen bill number 260211.
This was introduced by Council Member Lozada on March 12th of this year.
And this bill seeks and proposes to remap a large section of the immediate area.
But most specifically, members of the board, it would remap the subject property to CMX3 commercial.
Why is that relevant? Well, if this bill had been enacted, it's now sitting before the Rules
Committee, but it has not had a hearing yet or scheduled. This would be a buy-write use,
completely buy-write use. But because it's currently shown as I-2, we need a zoning board
variance because the use that I'm going to describe to you in a moment does not fit within the I-2
district. So what are we going to use the property for? The property will be used as an educational
and therapeutic treatment facility for students with special needs, specifically autism,
grades K through 12. We anticipate approximately 55 to 70 students as it ramps up. Let me show
you a floor plan you can find that floor plan at exhibit five this is a conceptual floor plan
pretty much baked but it'll give you an idea of the level of detail the level of sophistication
that will be brought to the to the uh to the use and operation and we will be utilizing the entire
first the first floor of the property there is no second floor and all of the
renovations members of the board will be done internally there's no external
expansion or modification of the footprint I'll say we'll enter into a
lease with an entity by the name of Mary Kay Mary Kay is is a renowned
specialist in it's a not-for-profit as well in the area of special needs
education services counseling social services etc
services, counseling, social services, etc. And again, as I indicated, this will be basically
an educational and therapeutic facility for those individuals in that need category.
What's especially important to ASSEI, as well as to America, and especially to the community,
it will serve this catchment basin of North Philadelphia, which needs much more
programming for these individuals. There's a real deficit here. And now they're going to have
state-of-the-art programming right here. We have met with a community, and the community
has indicated its support for this use. You can see a copy of the meeting summary
on your screen. It was unanimous support. The council member is supportive as indicated by
the fact that she's introduced the remapping legislation and will be moving that legislation
through rules committee and achieve final passage. The proposed use members of the board I would
submit to you is in fact consistent with Mercy's Life Center use. Now, while this is educational
programming, the Life Center use component also did include counseling, special services, as well
as therapies and clinical care in many cases. So they're very similar. But again, because of the
i2 designation a zoning board variance for this use right now is required i would submit to you
members of the board that the proposed use will enable critical state-of-the-art educational and
therapeutic programming to be made available for the special needs population and it fulfills
not only that mission but it is complementary and compatible with assay's mission
of community development and support.
If the board has any questions,
either I or Maria will be happy to answer them.
Are you going to have Maria adopt your testimony?
I will.
Are we ready for that?
Maria, would you unmute for a second?
Thank you.
Ms. Gonzalez, what is your position at ASE?
I'm the president of the organization.
And are you familiar with the proposal that's before the zoning board this afternoon?
And did you hear my presentation from the beginning?
Yes, I did.
And you heard all of it?
Do you find the statements that I made to be true and correct to the best of your knowledge?
And finally, would you adopt those statements as your own?
thank you very much questions from the board your question um how are students um coming to the
facility are they bussed um are they how are they dropped off are they maria why don't once you take
that one it will be a combination of both there will be some children that may be bussed in um
and there may be some that will be dropped off um in on the building on the lower um side facing
on the southern part of the building there is a driveway and there is if you see to your left
there's an opening there where um cars can pull in off the street drop drop off the children and
they can proceed going down um and making that left down uh peltor street um that was a similar
operation that we had with mercy life when they actually there was more activity because at
But the highest point where they had full enrollment of seniors, they were serving 170 seniors at one time, and they were dropping off in front of the building because there's kind of like a drive-in, you know, pull-off area in front of the building and then through the side of the building.
And here with Merrikey's operations, they're only going to be serving 50 to 70 students at the maximum.
Great. And another question. I see there's an outdoor court, but I don't see any outdoor
sort of space for the students. Will that be sort of gated off and you'll provide some outdoor
space for them, or how's that space going to work? So, if you go to the floor plan right there,
So if you go to the floor plan right there, so you see that gray area on the center, that is a gated courtyard for their use, and they're proposing to install, you know, swings and things like that, and that's gated from the street, so the children can, would not be able to leave that space.
So you see that gray area on
Great, thank you.
Okay, questions.
Yes, question, and this is just a query.
So, the application is under, what does it say here, group medical, dental, and health practitioner and personal services.
And not under some sort of, well, I don't know whether there's one for this, but for educational use.
Right.
So, I'm sorry, Ms. Guzman, I didn't mean to cut you off.
i mean they're they're school children correct yeah so that's right yeah so if it was an actual
school then they do educational facility if it was child care they do child care center
but i think if they're providing like specific like uh any sort of like therapies or anything
that then falls under the group medical and i think also the personal services if there's like
trained like it's some sort of like training and things that they're doing that's typically
how L&I breaks it out. Interesting. That's correct, Ms. Gaston. Hillary's correct. When we've made the
application to L&I, we're very careful to include the group medical and health practitioner because
of the therapeutic component, valuation components, etc. But because it is not a public school, L&I
puts it down as personal services. That's why I wanted to go through the record and show the
plans as clearly as I hope I did to confirm that this is, in fact, a school for special needs
children. Okay. And then how do you find these children, or how are they directed to this
facility. Maria, would you want one? Yes. So, they are, Merrikey has agreement with the local
charter schools and public schools. So, charter schools, they have to accept all children,
regardless of abilities and capacity. And when they have a child that needs special needs,
usually they have a an agreement with a provider and they take that child outside of the community
in this situation the child can stay inside the community and be able to get the services that
they need in order for them to be successful successful in their academic life and also
receive the proper treatment that they need in order to address their um you know their disability
So they're really children from the community.
Ms. Gonzalez, if I could just ask you one quick question, building on Ms. Gaston's.
Meraki is an approved provider to the school district as well as to the certain charters you referred to?
Okay. Thank you.
Okay. All right. Any other questions?
Thank you.
Thank you.
Questions from our attorney, Hillary Emerson?
Not at this time, Mr. Chair.
Questions or comments from the virtual audience?
Do not see any hands, Mr. Chair.
Planning Commission.
Amy Boyd with the Planning Commission.
The comprehensive plan recommends a change in zoning at this location from the existing
I-2 medium industrial to RM1 residential multifamily.
The proposed use is in harmony with the previously permitted use on the site and with the surrounding
residential uses.
The Planning Commission recommends that the Board grant the requested variance for personal
services.
Thank you.
i saw a couple notes we're ready to vote right
uh yes we're we're fine okay sure yeah there's a couple notes but we're all good
for sure m i 20 26 000 226 32 40 to 64 north hancock street i vote yes
michael johns my vote is yes cheryl gaston my vote is yes sonetta graham my vote is yes
my vote is yes thank you thank you thank you uh thank you is there anyone in the uh audience
whose uh two o'clock case has not been called i do not see any hands okay so
miss gaston has directed that we take a five minute break
good afternoon everyone my name is bill bergman
and I will be chairing this Zoning Board of Adjustment hearing.
Zoning Board of Adjustment hearing. With me is our Vice Chair, Teneda Graham.
With me is our Vice Chair, Teneda Graham.
Teneda Graham, President, Mr. Chairman,
our Secretary, Cheryl L. Gaston, President, Mr. Chairman, Board Member, Michael Johns, President,
Mr. Chairman, and Board Member, Taya Nguyen, President, Mr. Chairman.
Also present is our Attorney, Hillary Emerson, our ZBA Director, Ian Haggerty, and our Board
Administrator, Lakeisha Dandy. This hearing is being recorded and will be posted on the ZBA
website. By participating, you consent to be recorded. This is an in-person meeting with
remote participation. Whether in person or Zoom, if you're called to speak, please state
and spell your name. Wait to be sworn in. After that, state your name each time before
testifying. To ensure to enter an appearance, indicate the property address on your Zoom
webinar speak with a staff member or call the zba office by close the business tomorrow call
215-686-2429 and provide your name email and the case and the address of the case
remote participation raise your virtual hand when directed when we call on you just click
on the join the panelists button use the q a only for questions relative to procedure
there will be no case comments if you are joining by phone please press star nine to raise your
hand and star six to unmute so let's look at our schedule for this afternoon
number one mi 2024 003 951 5518
Morton Street.
is the attorney.
Devin?
This is the fourth listing of this
MI-2022
Sorry to interrupt. This is Jason.
now be your calls for the session mr hukta does not seem to be part of the virtual audience this
afternoon thank you mi 2024-003-951-5518 morton street i voted dismiss michael johns my vote is
to dismiss cheryl gaston my vote is to dismiss tennetta graham i voted to dismiss number two
MI 2025-001-576, 2016 North Bancroft Street.
Devin Upta is the attorney.
This is the third listing.
Mr. Chair, we did receive a continuance request earlier today from Mr. Upta for this matter.
He had been previously advised that he needed to appear for any continuing request since this was the third listing.
He's not in the audience, Mike, correct?
I do not see him in there.
MI 2025-001-576-2617 North Bankrupt.
I vote to dismiss.
Michael Johns, my vote is to dismiss.
Cheryl Gaston, my vote is to dismiss.
Tanetta Graham, my vote is to dismiss.
I win. My vote is to dismiss. Also, my vote was to dismiss for the last one.
I didn't get on record.
What'd she say?
Well, that's okay.
Number three, MI2025002819, 2922, rear to 24 South Felton Street.
um this case is continued until 8 25 2026 at 3 30 p.m number four mi 2025 003 221
1968 new kirk street this is the second listing we have no uh exhibits
It's Coronel Farrell, Farrell is the listed person, applicant.
Mr. Chair, I do not see them in the virtual audience either.
All right.
So when no one appeared the last time, so MI 2025-003-221-1268 North Newkirk Street, I vote to dismiss.
michael johns my vote is to dismiss cheryl gaster my vote is to dismiss
Michael Johns, my vote is to dismiss.
Cheryl Gaston, my vote is to dismiss.
Sonata Graham, my vote is to dismiss.
Tywin, my vote is to dismiss.
Number 6, MI-2025-007-171-219 West Roosevelt Boulevard.
Lubna Alarbi is the listed applicant. This is the first listing.
There is support from the 42nd Ward.
Lubna Arati, please raise your virtual hand and wait to be sworn in.
Lubna Arati, once again, please raise your virtual hand.
all right so all right they raised their hand i don't love them to speak okay
okay you're next good good afternoon how are you could you please state your name and spell
for the stenographer you have to say your name hello my name is
and could you spell it please for the court stenographer uh l-u-d-n-a last name aloradi
a-l-a-r-a-d-i all right do you swear or affirm that tell the truth the whole truth nothing but
the truth yes we we do not have any of your exhibits we did not receive anything for you
for today's hearing yeah it says successive successfully submitted
i even got an email that says successfully so um we need uh lubna to be the one speaking please
um the person who was who was sworn in um unfortunately we do not have a record of
receiving your documents so um unfortunately we're going to need to continue this matter today
um but please reach out to the zoning office to make sure that um we that everything goes through
next time um so that we can proceed okay well we got the email says accepted for today yeah but
but we don't have it we don't have it it's the first listing we don't have it all right so here's
what we're going to do we're going to continue it and then what we'll do is you can call the
office and people here will help you in getting your documents in okay for the next hearing so
So MI 2025-007-171-219 West Roosevelt Board.
This case is continued to 825-2026 at 3.30 p.m.
And just to update, I was just advised we did receive a submission from you,
but it was after close of business yesterday.
The exhibits need to be submitted five days in advance so they can be reviewed for completeness.
So that's why we have it marked as no exhibits because one, as of the end of the day yesterday, we did not have anything.
Okay, sorry about that. So number eight, MI 2025-007-187, 6930 King Sesson Avenue.
This case is continued until 825-2026 at 3.30 p.m.
Now we're going to go to our list and we're going to start with number nine.
Number nine, MI-2025-007-250-340 North 18th Street.
You're a counsel, right?
I'm the owner of the property, Mr. Chairman.
Okay, and you represent yourself?
Yes, I'm an attorney by tree.
Okay, could you state your name and spell for the sonographer?
Yes, my first name is Adesola, A-D-E-S-O-L-A.
My last name is Adebason, A-D-E-G-B-E-S-A-N.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Yes, I do.
Right.
I usually say, like, you know, could you identify a client in a relationship to the property?
I don't have to say it this time.
So our vice chair has a few questions.
Good evening.
Have you submitted your documents and exhibits five days in advance of this hearing?
Yes, ma'am.
And do you waive the refusal and stipulate to its accuracy?
Yes, ma'am.
All right.
Thank you.
You can share your screen and proceed with this.
Can you tell us what happened to the RCO meeting?
yes so at the rco meeting i was prepared to present my presentation the rco
the rco chair i believe it was charles karn advised that i needed to have specific architectural
chair i believe it was charles karn advised that i needed to have
drawings i advised that because i was not intending to build any construction that i did not have
those but i did offer that if i needed to get those i would but i did check at the training
that same evening i believe and then followed up in writing with lakeisha dandy just to make sure
if that was required for the specific variance use that i'm requesting she advised that it was
not so I decided to proceed with today's hearing so as mentioned I'm the owner my husband and I
own this property at 3804 north 18th street in Philadelphia PA19140 I'm here today to request
the use variants for permission to use the property as a two-family home unfortunately
when we bought the property there was a tenant on the top floor and we were under the impression
that it was legally operating as a two-family unit but only to find out that it wasn't which
is why we began this process and there are a few reasons to support my request but specifically
the why is I'll focus on first just the unique physical structure of the property which a lot
of the homes on this block are this way but it is currently a three-story property that is sort
of already set up as a two unit it was built in 1940 there's a four to five bedrooms within the
whole home two and a half bedrooms it's 2 390 square feet and the third floor layout rests at
the top of a separate set of stairs which my understanding is that there previously was at
some point in time a separate electric meter even though this property was not legally zoned but
But the property is at least about 300 square feet larger than most of the homes on this
residential block, with the exception of 3800 North 18th Street, which seems to have undergone
some renovations.
This use variance would not alter the neighborhood scheme for a couple of reasons.
One, there was already two families living in that home, so it's not going to additionally
congest the property with any additional parking because it was already in use that
but as you can see here on the screen from this first picture to the far left is at 3800 north
18 so that is a four unit multi-family property which each unit has two bedrooms and a bath and
that property is only 1365 square feet directly to the left here as well that's 3802 that is a
multi-unit property as well as well which according to the documents online there's five bedrooms and
but it is legally zoned as a duplex or two-family unit and then directly to the right of the
property here you may not see it in the pictures I can zoom in a little bit but 3806 actually has
two entrances so whether or not it is legally or legally operating as a multi-unit it is currently
being occupied by two families and then it's not a multi-unit but on 1735 West Butler Street at
corner directly across the street it also was granted use variance for the first floor as a
grocery store and two additional apartments on the second floor so i just say all that to say that
it would not alter the neighborhood scheme in any way and then because there is no construction
um it's not going to impair any light or air um for any of the adjacent properties because
yes um so i'll walk through sure these now um so let me just i'll do it this way all right
so this is the front of the property here and this is another front street this is also just
a picture of the back door and the backyard so this is the first landing of the steps so these
pictures here are the way it's set up now and we were temporary living in the property but we're
doing a little bit of um renovations because it it was built in 1940 but it's also very old interior
so this is the first floor kitchen as you can see uh the pictures are 3d which is why they look a
little zoomed out so that you can sort of see everything. This is the kitchen on the third
floor, which is already there. It's not anything additionally built. And then this is the half
bathroom in the basement, which just has a toilet and a sink that's not pictured. This is the second
floor bathroom. It's your standard bathroom, full bath, kitchen, and a vanity. And then this is the
bathroom on the third floor, which you can't see the tub pictured, but there is a small tub to the
left of the toilet and a sink as well and then on the second floor this is the
bedroom one there's a bedroom two this is a bedroom three and this is the
bedroom on the third floor but then back down to the first floor there's a living
room there's a dining room and then on the top floor there is a third floor
which could alternatively be used as a bedroom as well so I did submit some
I did submit some artwork that is not very great and I'll admit that on the record but the purpose
artwork that is not very great and I'll admit that on the record.
of that was in use of it with conjunction of the photos just to really show that when you walk in
it's living room dining room kitchen you take the steps up to the second floor there's three bedrooms
and one bathroom and then the same steps that go out to that same front main entrance lead to a
third floor that has a separate door and you immediately walk into the kitchen the bathroom
right there and then there's two rooms which one could be used as a living room or it could be used
as two bedrooms and then there's also um a roof a door that accesses the roof from the third floor
as well so the first and second floor is an apartment in the third floor yes um i will
quickly show i know we waived this so you all know uh the the notice of refusal but the purpose of
this use variance is because it is an RSA 5 residential area and um that does not permissively
allow for use of two family and then I did walk through the photos but I will
um I did also provide just pictures of the zoning posters um with the exception of the last one so
you'll see that it's properly time stamped just to show you that we had it there was some wind
um sometime last week so that's why the last photo you'll see um the zoning poster was sort
of removed and posted on the the light pole and then that's why that last one has a time
stamp of april 28th just to show you that we were complying with keeping that up
um up until this hearing and then i know we haven't gotten into it but i know one of the
concern to sort of the storage for the moti unit so my husband and i did sort of look into this
looking to keep that if you're on that bottom property meaning the first and second floor
you'll keep your trash in the backyard until it's time to bring it out for trash days which
are tuesdays and friday on that block but then for the top unit um we'll have these sort of
installed so that there's not there's not really much room in the kitchen for a utility closet
but there is room to sort of install these types of cabinets so that they can have trash internally
which because it is only meant to be for one or two people likely one person we don't anticipate
it being that much trash but just wanted to proactively um propose that option as well
just in case the board was concerned about that questions from the board yeah but i understand
the explanation of the building but it's kind of hard without kind of some kind of level of plans
um to see how the um that second unit is accessed i know you described it um sort of being accessed
from this main stairway um but is there a separate i know you said there's a separate doorway into the
third floor but how is that how is that stairway separated from the rest of the
second floor right and from the first floor yes so I will I'll show you the
pictures of the steps and then try my best to explain it so here what we're
looking at that is the main entrance directly to the right and I'm sorry okay
you can't see what I see I see a tab blocking the pictures but so this right
here this front door is the main entrance directly next to this is a door
that allows you to go into the front living room if you walk up to these
steps here what you can't see but you'll see the ladder right there there is a
separate door that also goes to the second floor which will be closed
because this you can see in this picture the you can see the door frame where the
door closes there is a door right there as well so it's a separate entrance that
goes up to the top steps and then i'll show you the what that picture looks like so this is exactly
what it looks like so what you see here to the left is where that main entrance that goes into
the living room if you walk directly up these steps where you see that ladder to the left there
is actually a door and right in front of that ladder the door is open so you can't tell but
that door closes so that entrance and then going up those top landings is where you ultimately get
to that second unit right in that area. The walkway that you see up there that looks like
a door is open, that is the open kitchen. There's no door in the kitchen. So I know
it's difficult. So how does, so how does the, so the first,
the lower level unit is bi-level, right? This first floor, second floor, and has access
to the basement. How does one that lives in that lower level unit, does the lower level
going to have to come into this stairway to go to the second floor of their unit no because the
No, because the door is going to be closed. So there's an internal steps for them to get to the second. When you say the second unit, you mean the second story?
door is going to be closed so there's an internal steps for them to get to the second floor
No, the second floor of the main, of the ground floor unit, of the first floor unit.
Is there a separate set of stairs internal to that apartment that takes them to the second floor of their apartment?
And where is that?
So I believe it's in...
okay so that's a problem because it's cut off okay so this this right here is the living room
and as you can see there's a piano and um i'm apologies because i just realized it's cut off
in this picture so directly to the right of this chair these are the set of internal stairs that
goes up to the second floor and as soon as you get to the top of that second floor landing
you're in between one of the bedrooms and the bathroom and you don't have access to the third
to the to the third story from that landing so it's like it's the old back stair yes correct
it's the old back stair right that's typically pretty narrow and pretty steep so uh it's kind
difficult to get furniture up those stairs so they are somewhat steep but not narrow
and speaking from experience because um unfortunately the previous owner did not
clean out the property so that was my lovely responsibility we got many beds and dressers
and a lot of things down the stairs so it's not um it's not narrow at all it's actually quite wide
um but sort of steep in the sense of i believe there are 16 15 steps and i only know that because
they had a wheelchair um sort of accessibility um chair attached to the stairs that we removed
the questions how do you get to the basement from the same unit then it's the it's directly
there's a door in the kitchen let me see if I can actually so especially if
stairwells on both sides of your unit yes there's a stairwell that goes
directly to the basement from the first floor kitchen okay I do know why but
yeah there's a there right by the backyard door right here to the left of
it which unfortunately you can't see in the pictures either there is a door that
leads directly to the basement you said there was a tenant in this when you
purchase the property yes and um are the utilities already separated between unit one and unit two
no so the tenant um when i'm sorry let me just clarify when we purchased the property
before closing there was a tenant there obviously the tenant had to become vacant so that we could
purchase the property but um necessarily but yeah yeah well yeah that was that was a part of the
the um closing agreement that they needed to deliver the property um vacant but um at the time
there were not separate utilities when it was it's rather complicated but i'll make a long story
short when i called pgo to transfer everything over into my name they were confused because they
did have an address there as unit as apartment one or floor ones and two and then another one
as four three so i said okay can we put all of them in my name they ended up calling me back
saying that actually there's only one there used to be two meters but now it
seems like everything merged into one so it was they were also very confused but
my understanding was that the previous owner was paying the utilities and the
tenant was just paying her minimal rent so when you subdivide this should you
get approval what's gonna be your plan for the utilities and managing the
tenant so my plan will only be to have an additional electric meter set insert
it to separate that and then to personally maintain the water bill and the gas bill okay
do you have the support of the neighbors on either side of the home i don't have that in writing but
verbally i've talked to them extensively they've seen us coming in and out moving things out of
the property and renovating they're okay with it and then i do also want to add that at the rco
meeting, the leader did basically verbalize and say, we're not looking to prevent you from doing
this. We know what's going on in the neighborhood. We know that most of these properties are already
operating this way. So we don't anticipate it being an issue. So did you get a letter from the
RCO? No. And I anticipate that's because they were under the assumption that if I continued
this hearing, that I would come back for a second hearing, which in reaching out, I explained I
opted not to do that because I paid a lot of money to make sure to notify the company
and I didn't want to sort of reincur those costs.
I don't know what that meant. Honestly, I don't know what that meant.
I don't know what that meant.
Honestly, I don't know what that meant.
Oh, so, so sorry.
Oh, so sorry. So just paying to print out the notice of refusal and the notice itself to mail it out to, I believe it was 157 people, and then to pay for each of the certificates of compliance to make sure that I had that.
So they didn't give you a letter because they wanted you to come back to them? I'm trying to, they didn't provide a, you had a meeting with the community, right?
Yes, sir. Okay. And they, so we don't let, we don't have a letter on record from them.
We do not. Okay. And, okay. So we don't, so we don't know the outcome of the meeting or from them. Okay.
Yeah, no, I didn't receive a summary notice. Um, and I sort of explained that in the email as well. I'm not sure why, but again, I anticipate it's because they wanted me to present these architectural drawings and try to reschedule.
like to to postpone this hearing to set up a second rco meeting and so i assume that that
is likely why there was no summary i mean i will say architectural drawings would have been helpful
and you're going to need them to proceed with construction so i do think that like
it's it's kind of hard to understand how these two are working currently
and you okay so sorry just for to clarify i would need them even if i'm not doing
because you don't you think it's well you're gonna i don't you don't i don't see how you're
gonna get through this project to subdivide it without any construction
because even fixture replacement requires you to pull permits and usually they're
require some sort of documentation for that there's like shop there's ways around it but
it's complicated and you need lots of like sub consultants which you could do but um yeah
um so you never presented to the rco i did but not it was it it wasn't a full meeting in my opinion
if they asked questions we talked about things and they didn't necessarily vote but they went
around and asked sort of like do you recommend if she has a second meeting or request the continuance
um hillary do we take a shot at the rco see where they stand with it um we could i mean we could
hold this right thing for you know two weeks a month see if there's further
discussion see if we get a response from the RCO yeah I mean it's up to the
board the meeting requirement was met and yeah so the meeting requirement was
met but I think we deserve take one more shot at them to see if they're willing
sentence on and then when we come back we'll make a decision okay yeah i would just uh put a deadline
on that yep yep uh two weeks that would be fine all right um questions or comments from from our
attorney um not at this time mr chair questions or comments from the virtual audience i do not see
any hands with the chair planning commission take a position planning commission yes um amy boy with
the planning commission the comprehensive plan recommends no change to the current rsa five
residential single family zoning at this location the property was remapped from rm1 residential
multi-family in 2021 there are multiple multi-family properties on this block so the proposed two units
is in harmony and is the least minimum the planning commission recommends that the board grant the
progressive variance for two family thank you um so we're gonna we close this except for what we
yeah it closes except for a letter from the rco um and a response from the applicant if they wish
and we'll vote um in two weeks which i believe is the 22nd 22nd i think yeah
do i return for that hearing or how does that work
you know so it's not it's just oh 20th i'm sorry not the 22nd it's the 20th um
so you you could be here if you want but we're not taking any additional testimony
we're just voting on the matter um well it's you responded writing yeah yeah okay thank you
Number 5, MI 2025-003-384-4860, Lancaster, Abbott.
4860 Lancaster Avenue Sherman Toppin is the attorney
Sherman Toppin is...
let me come on back in as a panel with provisos from the RCO good morning members of the board
good morning council afternoon um could you please state your name and spell for the sonographer
yes um my name is Sherman Toppin I'm here represent oh last name spelled t-o-p-p-i-n
I'm here representing the applicant for the Lancaster LLC do you swear or affirm to tell
the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth I do our voice chair has just a few questions
good evening have you submitted your documents and exhibits five days in advance of this hearing
i have and do you waive the reading of the refusals and stipulate to their accuracy
yes all right thank you you can share your screen and proceed okay
once i'm not seeing
i am i'm not seeing the button to share green you don't see the green button on the bottom
yeah of course i've done this one looks like there's something going on the green you don't
see the green button on the bottom i do but when i hit it it's not looking at my second
my window i think you have to open them first right then you go to the green button yeah
it's open it's open chair let's see here what's going
yeah okay so sherman why don't i do this why don't i go to my uh last case and then we'll
come back and see how you make out okay i can figure that out one second all right
so let's go to number seven mi 2023 007 178 1710 north buvier street zen jinn is the attorney
in a man unanimous support from beach community services and a letter of non-opposition from
council member young
good afternoon can't uh board here there you go i know we don't i don't
I usually see you by this time of the day.
So could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer?
Yes, Zen Jin, Z-H-E-N, last name J-I-N, here on behalf of the applicant.
All right.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
But you identify who your client is and the relationship they have to the property?
Yes, my client's Mr. Alex Coppa, the owner of the property.
And our vice chair has a few questions.
Good evening.
have you submitted your documents and exhibits five days in advance of this hearing
oh okay you but wait we can't hear you zen said we can't hear you zen zen we can't hear
oh yeah headphone uh okay yes all right something there okay and do you waive the reading of the
refusal and stipulate to its accuracy i do all right thank you you can share your screen and
proceed thank you i will share with the board what was previously submitted in this case
it should be coming up in one second can the board see my exhibit yeah thank you
this is an application for a new construction in an rm1 district my client proposes a duplex
at this location the variances are dimensional in nature this block on north bovier street
A lot of the properties that are currently built have six-foot rear yards.
My client is simply looking to have the same depth rear yard in his proposal.
It is smaller than what is permitted in the district.
As you can see, they all relate to each other in that a six-foot yard is a smaller square foot,
and therefore more coverage of the occupied area.
All three refusals relate to each other.
we met with beach uh regarding this matter uh they are
in support this uh part of bovier street again with the existing
in support this part of bovier street again with the existing buildings generally being relatively
deep having small rear yards it is not inconsistent with what is already built in the area in fact
we would be lined up with this building you see in this photograph here as far as depth is concerned
and even the existing building itself which is a two-story existing structure that is going to be
demolished it is also not a hundred percent conforming with the nine nine foot rear yard
requirements so the existing building is very old it this is the existing conditions inside
it'll be demolished and a new structure built in its place the new building will be a three
story structure which actually essentially is what are on the block now for the most part
everything on the block is now three stories so we'll be matching uh what is currently on the
block as far as height is concerned uh the main thing about the property that's a little different
than some of the other ones on the block is that we do have a side alleyway between us and the
property next door that allows rear access by both units occupants so trash will be stored in the
back uh in the enclosed yard and the occupants have a wide enough alley which actually you can
see in the photograph here uh this once the building's complete it'll be gated uh to make
sure that it's safe there will be lighting to make sure that it's lit so that occupants can safely
access it to the back but trash will be stored in the back and brought out front uh at the uh
on the days that trash will be picked up the my client actually is very active in the area in
managing trash cleaning the street he does own other properties in the area so he makes a trip
around to make sure that he cleans all his properties regularly it's part of the reason
beach supported him strongly and also the councilman's office supported him because he is
he has been working closely with the community to make sure trash is not an issue at any of his
properties uh with the layout of the building it is a standard uh three-story structure uh the
first floor and cellar would be or basement would be one unit and then the second floor and third
floor would be the second unit uh the bedrooms are located on the first floor there's one in
the front one in the back with the kitchen dining essentially the basement which all those marked
The storage can be used as additional living space, rec room, with additional storage in the back.
Mechanicals are in the basement, along with washer and dryer.
The upper floor unit has three bedrooms and a den in the back of the second floor.
It also has access to the roof deck via Pilot House.
The roof deck is only accessible by the second unit.
it is not accessible by the lower unit on the first and basement levels that is essentially
the layout we are here primarily for the dimensional variances to the rear of the property
and again we're seeking a three-foot variance from the required nine foot setback
for the rear yard and it is again consistent to quite a few of the properties already on the block
and i believe my client is here to verify my testimony uh and i'm certainly happy to answer
any questions relating to this project what's your client's name uh alex copa alex copa yep copa yes
we're coming back in as a panel for the council with the chair
hello hi could you please sorry could you please state your name and spell it for the stenographer
my legal name is alexander copa o-l-e-k-s-a-n-d-r last name is copa k-o-p-a you swear or affirm to
tell the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth yes i do sir could you please turn on your
video i'm trying to right now i don't know what's going on oh there you go you're on okay counsel
thank you um mr copa did you see uh what i presented on the screen to the zoning board
and hear my testimony yes i did can you verify what i have represented to the board is true
and correct and adopt it as your own testimony yes thank you questions from the board can you
zoom zoom out so we can see all the floor plans yes is this better yeah that's better so now
so you said they have access the first floor has access to there's an alleyway is that an alleyway
so you said they have access the first floor has access
that's shared by the neighbor next door or is that or is the or is the property line three feet
who should answer the question myself for the attorney you can answer it alex if you know for
sure okay so that is a fire alley uh it's uh accessible to uh all the buildings from 1710
all the way to 1724 north bovier i believe and plus 1708 north bovier that is a three
feet uh white alley that goes alongside the building and there is a three feet fire alley
in the back that goes along parallel to the north bovier street okay so when you say you're going
to have a gate on that alley how are you going it's it's a it's a it's a special gate with a quick uh
quick set release basically in case the people have to evacuate in emergency there is no lock
there or padlock all they have to do is just press on the push bar and the gate opens up okay and
this is you so all the other buildings still have access to this alley uh yes okay now the gate that
is there it was not installed by me uh i don't know who installed it but it's been there forever
as far as i remember is that that three foot looks like a three foot gate yeah it's almost
like a fence yes yeah but yeah that's that's no real security other questions
questions from our attorney hillary emerson not at this time mr chair questions from the virtual
audience do not see any hands mr chair planning commission amy board with the planning commission
the comprehensive plan recommends no change the current r1 residential multi-family zoning
the appellant has not shown that there are unique physical conditions or circumstances
of the property that would prevent it from being used in conformance with the zoning code
the planning commission recommends that the board deny the requested variance for rear yard depth
three yard area and occupied area mi 2025 007 178 17 10 north bouvier street i vote yes
michael johns my vote is yes cheryl gaston my vote is yes tenetta graham my vote is yes
my vote is yes thank you council thank you thank you very much um thank you um sherman toppin please
I'll be coming back in shortly Mr. Chair thank you I appreciate it
good afternoon member of the board how are we making out okay I I think we are but we have
a backup plan my client who is Thomas Pender he is a cat he is uh he is okay so I think if I
remember correctly you stated your name and I already swore you in did you talk to our
vice chair too right i i did i did i didn't talk about share i was at the share screen point but
i would ask that thomas pender be advanced co-panelists to share his okay sure why don't
you send him on and i'll talk through the exhibits as he scrolls yep
using my dad's computer so there's something not quite right about it
mr top and who did you want promoted uh mr thomas pender thank you
mr pender is now promoted to panelists and can share
hey good afternoon members of the board once again sorry for the technical difficulties and
inconvenience there but i'm pleased to be representing mr thomas pender who is a member
of 4860 lancaster llc which is the owner of the structure that's in front of you that you see
pictorially here and if you can scroll down on one page mr pender will begin our presentation
so our typical exhibit package contains quite a few things although you see there where it says
applicant white horse white horse tavern at the time of the the architect filed it they put that
there but we have a deed showing that the property has been transferred to 3860 lc as exhibit number
two we waived the reading of the refusal but we want to mention that in our agreement with the
rco there's two if you can scroll down once mr pendle to the refusal this particular case had
This particular case had involved two refusals, one further down, just to see the refusal language.
involved two refusals.
Yes, the property was refused for two reasons.
One, section 14-6045, which is concerning roof decks, and the second was table 14-7013, which was dimensional.
In our agreement with the community, we have agreed to drop and redesign the building as we have in the plans to remove the roof deck request, making this a dimensional only application for height.
So as a matter of right, the building can be 38 feet in height as permitted by the zoning code.
And we are proposing a fourth floor, which would raise the building to 45 feet in height.
and that is the only so if you can scroll down mr pender to really exhibit five exhibit two is the
deed which i mentioned that you still you'll see the deed there um our client is the owner of the
record we have the project information sheet number five just kind of gives you a sense from
the at this elevation you can see the block is zoned uh cmx2 and our our in the pink in the red
square there you see the subject property opposite our property is um icmx um imcmx there and it's a
like a dollar store and every on all the properties fronting on lancaster in this very in this
commercial area are one to three story structures that are all commercial on the first floor or
commercial in generally so the property what we're using the property if you can scroll down once
more uh we want to there's an image there just how the property and the block is being utilized
there at lancaster avenue you can see on the top there all the residential uses are behind
the property there's uh several vacant lots for them thompson street and style street
and uh west yard you see that that's where the residential homes are but fronting on lancaster
avenue on both sides of the subject property are all commercial uses and uh and and every structure
is different. And if you can scroll down further, Mr. Fender, you can kind of see this. This is
again a Google shot giving you a sense of subject property in relationship to its surrounding
rooftops. There's just a few properties to the left and two to the right. On either side of the
subject property, the red box there, are churches. And we have support. One, the church that's the
larger rooftop is closed and it doesn't have they're not meeting but on the other side we have
full support of that ministry and the numbers and further down the block is all commercial
uses that have no objections or particular use as a restaurant and scroll down further
so this is the view of the property looking to the left and the right see the subject property there
uh white house the white horse bar is present there with the big white horse can't miss it
coming down lancaster so we're going to be updating significantly the appearance of this
struck of this front facade and the side facade as you can see it's got windows on the third on
the third floor and it has it just has a dated and really a appearance that's going to be transformed
by my client's proposed restaurant um and as you can scroll further down you can see what i was
telling you earlier that every almost every house or every structure alone has a different appearance
so there's not a single consistent appearance to match to even as you move further down the block
you see that there's a gas station and there's no there's almost no two structures alike on this
side of the street um and so scroll down further mr fender so let's look at so so some of these
pictures and mr fender you can scroll through these as i talk these are images of as you enter
the structure and as you move in these are exterior front pictures there's about 30 of these you can
scroll down quickly so that this is the first floor when you open the front door you see this
is the initial image of the existing bar that was there um serving clients and you can go through
the reverse image of the same shot as this is the uh this is a prep area also on the first floor on
the other side that bar wall and as you go down there'll be more pictures of the bar you can scroll
down through so this again this is a wider shot of that the bathroom on the first floor all of
this will be updated and renewed as you will see in the plans uh lower down this is again the first
back of the first floor is this here and that back door goes through the street in the rear
climbing the steps you get to the second floor and this is that stairway going up and this is what
you see on the second floor from the landing um from this as you can see this image will be
transform two um into a very elegant restaurant space continue on and you can kind of ease it
restaurant space continue on and these are just more pictures of the existing
interior as it currently is building the bar has been out of use for some time
and as you go to the fourth third floor you have this the third third floor is
relatively is completely really not finished they may have started to do
some things years and years back and they're finished as you look out third
floor through the window you see a space between the adjacent church and and the
further grassy area are the homes in the rear and it's just more pictures looking down from the
third floor going downstairs now this is again that prep area behind the first floor bar you get
to the mechanical and the rear from the basement and it's just unfinished mechanical space all of
this will be bathrooms and finished space in the new plan further on you can kind of go down so
yeah that's what you've got one redeeming thing is back to electrical updating and this is the
rare visual of the building this will also be transported this is two stories it will go four
stories up and be completely renewed looking from the back and with security lights and now going
into our exhibits let's uh let's begin there now mr fender you may have to make your you can scroll
down mr fender on number seven i think we're going into the plans uh we'd like to make those smaller
so we look forward to see what we're looking at so as you scroll down from this page
you will see that this is the existing conditions of the building except for the picture that's
that's the new elevation i will i will make one notation here um from a standpoint of what we
planned um this elevation this 3d view that you see to the left is going to be it almost seems
that there's a second a second floor was an open two-story with an open two-story on ceiling root
clear this will this will possibly be to a maximum but supposed to be two solid floors so there'll be
a floor of the floor will run to the rear of the building so each floor will be the extent of the
footprint of the building I'm not as pictorial as not as shown here I think this was an old pitch
they didn't swap out but so the existing pitch of this otherwise shows the existing conditions of it
let's move down to what would be and what is proposed as you scroll down from here mr bender
all right um so this gives you as let's just start from the basement up so from the basement up um
you can see that there's just a rare unfinished closed space but you'll have bathrooms down
where we go this is an area where there'll be bathrooms and just storage in the elevator
there'll be an elevator added to this building so there's mostly mechanical storage and just
bathrooms in the basement as you go into the first floor it will have a similar presence as
the current first floor when you walk in there's the going to be you know the barn and a bar with
tables for seating um as you move back there's going to be a bathroom then elevator then of
course, and then there's the commercial kitchen, which will serve as the food preparation for the
building here in the rear of the first floor. So scrolling down a little further to the second and
third, scroll down a bit, Mr. Fender. Okay, yes, just to give a third and fourth view. So as you
walk up the stairs and take the elevator, you'd be able to see that there's going to be bathrooms
closed, a lounge area, table seating, more table seating style on the third floor. And the fourth
floor is more being it's conceived as the event space area where there's more there's i guess the
way it's going to be configured there'll be group settings where people will have private group
settings and served in that and these these are square clusters here and the additional seating
proposed in the rear of the building in fourth floor the roof is going to be pretty fascinating
in this particular building because it's going to be an entire glass ceiling um just locked i think
there'll be a lot of a picture maybe two feet going from front to back but it'll be it'll
ultimately look up out at the so it's a complete glass ceiling proposed here and from the second
and third floor there will be uh if you go to you scroll down further mr fender you can see that the
entire second and third floor there's perceived to be glass windows in which you can see a direct
view unstructured straight to the philadelphia skyline from this map which is why they conceived
it this way and these are the existing second floor windows will remain and um to move down
the elevations are all they'll are all pretty much in keeping with what we just said from the
front there's going to be a bump out um that it's from and that it's sort of a triangular bump out
and that goes out to four feet and down to one and that would kind of give that would give a
view looking towards the center city direction that would bump out and this will be the presence
that people will sleep in the front and from the rear again complete glass a glass
and from the rare again complete glass glass or almost a glass walls for the second third floor
giving unobstructed views over those two-story structures that are behind the house to the
photograph skyline moving down to number eight you can make it bigger and dependable so we did
have a meeting with the we've had two actually meetings with the rco and we've come to an
agreement with them regarding this particular plan um there they were they had a hiccup was
the roof deck and the noise that could potentially be there uh towards the back rear homes which we
went in an agreement with the community removed and instead made those solid
sorry solid floors that don't have any roof or exposure to the outside and because of that we
were able to seek the agreement of pretty much the uniform agreement on the of the 51 folks there
the 24 affected there's only one opposition and 24 in support why we have a letter of support
and just to finish our presentation here if you scroll down this defender we've got we have um
you can scroll down further and send it to the next exhibit yes we these are you can scroll
really quickly through these this has just been the addresses that we served um you can keep
scrolling down this pendant um that and then these are the certificates of mailing for each
of these addresses about 150 125 i think it was all together keep scrolling you keep just scrolling
down through all of these and i think we have if you and here are posting the zba notice of
close images and also twice over two existing front entrances we also posted on the rare
as well you can see that there's postings on the rare and then finally we have our um we
have our tax search for the owner of the property which is 4860 lancaster avenue and and we have
our letter we also get a petition between rco meetings relating to it we have additional
signatures of support from members of the community around this property and this will
go on for several pages I think we have about 20 or 20 signatures from different
members of the community and that community immediately right behind the
property and those who go to the church next to it and this was the this last
exhibit here is the meeting somewhere through ZVA so with that and since Mr.
Pender is scrolling for us the exhibits I'd like to ask Mr. Pender a few
questions relating to my testimony on behalf of his llc um and mr fender have you been listening
to all that i said on your behalf uh during this last few minutes hold on hold on is she one again
the owner you're bringing the owner on right uh yes and mr mr pender's the owner he's
sure i just want to swear him in when he gets on oh i'm sorry i'm sorry
yes i heard everything hi sir could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer
thomas pender t-h-o-m-a-s pender p-e-n-d-e-r do you swear or affirm to tell the truth the
whole truth nothing but the truth yes counsel oh yes mr pender have you been um on the call here
and listening to my testimony on your behalf these last several minutes yes and from what i've said
do you agree that the testimony i've said has been accurate and complete yes and is there anything
you'd like to add to something that i have not mentioned no okay and would you accept this
testimony as your own yes any questions we'd love to questions from the board
okay what are we doing about uh the venting for uh this space
um i believe you said that um venting venting venting as as uh hvac venting
no you've got a commercial kitchen for the cooking for the kitchen oh i i see i see yes
if you can go to miss miss bender if you can scroll up to that i think we can perhaps we
can figure this part out to when we get the commercial kitchen area but i just saw it
Okay, so here's the commercial, if you could make that just bigger, Mr. Fender, so we can focus in on the kitchen portion of it.
okay here so this again this is a pictorial layout of what is proposed here but what i'm
and i can only say what i i'm assuming will will be taking place here is that
they will be these will be dented to the outside through their rear exact exterior brick wall
these will be dented to the outside through their rare exterior brick wall.
Not through the roof?
I would not imagine that they would take, well, whatever the code permits,
like again, that gets it out of a little bit of where I'm,
but if it has to go through the roof, there's ways it can get there
because it was already a commercial kitchen in this exact same space.
um so and i don't think they're so where it's the venting now is that on here okay so if you
go to the original pictures the original pictures mr pender further up doors i want to see where
you want to go through this okay further up right further down further down okay yeah you you should
know you should know better than me yeah just the first floor here first floor okay this is the space
where the the larger commercial kitchen will ultimately will be and i strike what i said
earlier anything here where the commercial kitchen will be but the existing kitchen the existing
kitchen is what i was talking about asking for i think yeah right here is this not well this is
just uh this is just well this is the existing prep here was there a there was right next to
that that um sink i'm trying to see you so it's back here but there's not like a picture of it
oh i i see so do you remember how the venting is i see i see the grill back there where the arrow
Do you recall, Mr. Fender, how that tape on the grill is vented?
So that I'm unsure of, and there's a hood there, so I'm not sure where it runs to.
But from what I understand, the plan was to vent everything out the back wall.
But what Ms. Gaskin is stating is that if you're building codes, it is required to vent out through the ceiling, and your ceiling is proposed to be glass.
Would it be the plan?
I'm not.
I'm not.
Was that you?
making a representation about where i'm making a representation i'm just asking where are you
planning to do the venting once you do this addition of this property like currently it's
you you you're saying it's going through the back but i'm not sure where um but you know usually the
venting goes through the roof is the is the roof going to be glass like the I see the windows is
the roof going to be glass too or how is this going yes if you if you scroll down to the plans
with Lucas what is proposed from an aesthetic standpoint that the roof would be these glass
window panes these glass panes there there is but there is still space alongside and there's
the elevator so there will be the pilot house of the elevator here but there is space alongside
where venting would still occur on the on the side but this is again posed in scale perhaps
i would imagine if there was any issue concerning the code the scale of these windows would be
It's a tale to enable any venting that will have to happen through the main booth.
And I guess, okay.
So, okay.
Capacity.
How many people do you have in there at this time?
And how many more people are you planning to have in this space once you do this addition?
Currently, the restaurant is closed and only occupied the first two floors.
Whatever the building code limits it to, the fire code limits it to, is where the building is limited.
I don't think, I'm not sure if Mr. Fender has a better estimation of the capacity.
uh do you mr timber um what about tables how many table spaces do you think you might serve
uh maybe 10 15 per floor depending on the size
okay okay thank you all the questions
questions or comments from our attorney um mr poppin i just wanted a little clarifications
on the the plans because the rco asked for no roof deck and you took the roof deck out right
yes okay what so instead of the was the roof deck above the fourth floor
or was it behind the fourth floor above the third floor uh if you um
behind the fourth floor above the third floor uh if you um if you can scroll mr tender to the
existing the existing uh that will give us a better look at that oh no further down further
sorry further down to the plans yes uh the existing conditions of the plans it was the second gauge
basically the roof deck was going to be over the second floor and the original the
your plans have a page further up in the surface just slightly up further yeah further up further
yeah here here so here this this is a work this area if you look at the existing third floor
it says open to below so the roof deck would have been in this lounge area on top the second floor
and the third was building up stop behind the third floor okay yes it would be it would be
behind this will be it would be at the second floor and the third floor would stop short um
and it would be open to below for the top two floors got you okay so so the the reason i was
asking is just so if you're not having the roof deck were there any are there any changes
dimensionally to the envelope of the structure because you remove the roof deck and put it in
put in the lounge area instead to just i'm trying to determine if if the board approves this if we
need to um if there should be revised plans that we stamped or if we just proviso you know no no
roof deck and then you submit revised plans to lni that don't show a roof deck just trying to figure
out what the board would need to do i understand um the way the way we we are we're not in we're
not looking to increase the building envelope any dimensionally not even mention this it'll simply
stack um two floors on top the second floor there's already a half floor of a third floor existing
and there'll be almost i guess a floor and a half placed on top of the existing structure
is what is proposed okay is there no is there i'm sorry is there another sheet that sorry go ahead
no no you you you go ahead you asked your question is there another sheet that shows
the fourth floor oh yes if you could scroll down mr fender i think you might hold it slow slow the
first and second third there it is okay so it says stacked it's stacked on the fourth third
all four floors will be of equal size what's the plan for the third and the fourth floor
Or is it only going to be rentable by people who are hosting an event?
Or will there be sort of general bar service there on typical night?
And why don't you give us some of your vision for the top two for those?
So it would be also used for like a restaurant, depending on how packed we are, and an event space.
And it would be like a lounge area for everyone.
so okay but looking at the third floor and the fourth floor plan it's all lounge furniture
so is the idea that if i came in for dinner on a tuesday night i might eat dinner on the
couches on the third floor or would that only be yes sorry the engineer just placed things there
just for the look of it we didn't quite we didn't tell him to sit the chairs and things of that
nature he just put that into the picture when he did it as a design i understood that so then what
for like what is your current plan as the operator so i would be putting like actual places so you
can actually sit and eat some some would be couches like we have like when you sit your
back and there be chairs on the other side so you can sit and eat but as well as you can have
regular table service yes okay and so when it's not an event like what's the plan for the lounge
side that part i haven't quite figured out like between like the rco meeting at the ars yes so
i when you're saying that you mean like moving the furniture out of the way or
no i mean like typically neighbors have comments about lounge uses so i was just wondering showing
that this is a four floor plan for a restaurant lounge and event space and nothing that has come
up so far in your testimony has addressed typical things that neighbors care about i'm wondering
has it been discussed uh it was i i could yeah yes um um this way it was discussed as to how
the whole structure would be used because although they have the top floors are mostly on glass and
are going to be event-ish in nature the the upper floors were a question because the existing bar
was mainly the first floor only
was mainly the first floor only and the second floor was in as you can see in this plan was the
and the second floor was
as you
typical restaurant as you move up as it gets busier these upper floors i guess the way mr
pender put it if there was no events that day nothing happens on the fourth floor at all
it's just it's a reservation only booked um area up top but the third floor is more is kind of a
hybrid the way it was talked about the visit there is a big bar in the middle the tables and an
additional seating might fill in this back area either in the configuration of six tables or just
an open standing um lounge situation just depending on the demand so there was conversation
along that line about how the restaurant might fill up if it wasn't busy and I think you mentioned
like on tuesday when it's not busy these top floors may not be utilized that that was that
was at least okay so then what were their comments because you were i mean you're adding a a floor to
what was already there yes so the comments i can summarize that's where we get into the negotiation
of no roof deck on the second floor because the comments were there might be noise if that if
that restaurant pours open to on top the third second floor and there's there's noise in that
on that uh if you do an event that's sort of an outdoor patio event then that noise would
overflow into the community and that's where we negotiate the community to enclose the second the
rare third and fourth floor so there would be no food deck at all so that was the nature of
conversations relating to the rare of the property okay but so currently as proposed this would still
They'll be all four floors would be fully utilized as typical operations.
Yes, if that can be asked.
Any other questions?
And you did say this was right next door to a church, right?
There's a church on either side.
One closed and one open.
Oh, okay.
And then those churches are okay with this expansion?
the the one that's operating the the open one they were pretty excited because they they do a lot of
events at their church involved in catering so they envisioned utilizing the space for events
that the church can't um accommodate of a social nature so that was that was why we got so much
much of that many of the signatures on our petition of the members of the church next door
okay thank you and um was there any discussion at the rco meeting about parking
or the lack thereof yes there was there was there was talk about parking and because the existing
bar was a walk-up bar from the community and this bar this takes it to a bar plus restaurant
configuration there was conversation about you know there's no parking space here how would that
the accommodated and then the conversation was this our client has right across the street is
a dollar store that closes at nine i think i don't know there i think it closed in the nine
o'clock time frame so anything that would that is an empty parking lot clients going to pursue
getting an arrangement to park there there'll be valet parking also that he's working out for
different folks and all of the rest there's another restaurant one block down that is also a walk up
bar restaurant and they have also dealt with the same situation of people who bring in
walking from the community behind and that has not been that was not referring to the crab shack
that is mostly takeout no well there was no there's a bar in the next block not
okay all right i don't think i don't think it's that but um but no that they discussed that you
You know, the bulk of churches on either side operate on Sunday only, and they make it together.
I hear you.
I think my one comment is that that's a very congested corridor.
Like, from Lancaster, Belmont, like, if they're, Gerard, if there is any kind of traffic, it is, like, right at that intersection.
And so, and I don't know how long it's been since that bar opened, but as a person that drives past it, almost every day of my life,
i don't remember ever seeing anybody going into that establishment in the 17 years that i've been
here um not to say that they weren't i just didn't notice it so i am like wondering like how this is
going to uh you know fit in with the flow of traffic and people that are already over there
um and and sort of what's your plan but it sounds like it's you're moving towards having agreement
with the dollar store and potentially the laundromat and the churches to try to have a formal
dollar store and potentially the laundromat and the churches to try to have a formal agreement
to utilize their parking spaces yes that's correct and the community was pretty excited
about having a restaurant of what is hopefully of the caliber discussed at this spot most of
the restaurants along that corridor in that in those three blocks or walk up you know take out
You can't dodge and take it to a family event at those other places.
So they like the idea.
And then having that viewpoint to the skyline was a selling point.
And again, I guess this would be the last thing.
But that was really my question about capacity.
It's like you're talking about putting a lot of money into this expansion of this business and there doesn't appear to be a real idea of how many people are really going to utilize this place.
whether the you know in the end the the cost uh is going to be covered by um the clientele
that frequents the place so people may be excited about the idea that doesn't necessarily mean that
they're going to frequent the place and and this is going to need two you know four floors here
i mean again i'm not sure about how many people you're talking about having because
when i asked the question i didn't get it well i think it doesn't l and i set the number of people
yes yes you gotta you gotta get the l and i first to see what they'll let you have right
all right any other questions questions from our attorney not anymore mr chair questions from the
the virtual audience you're not seeing the hands with the chair planning commission
Amy Boyd with the Planning Commission. The comprehensive plan recommends no change to the CMX2 commercial mixed-use zoning at this location. The appellant has not demonstrated that there are unique physical circumstances or conditions of the property that would prevent it from being used in conformance with the zoning code. The Planning Commission recommends that the Board deny their requested variance for height.
mi2025-003-384-4860
Lancaster Avenue
I vote yes
Michael John
my vote is yes
Cheryl Gaston
my vote is yes
Tanetta Graham
my vote is yes
Iowa and my vote is yes
thank you Sherman
thank you to your client
is there anyone in the audience
whose case has not been called
where's Ian at by the way
there are no hands Mr. Chair
thank you
What happened to our 345 dismissal today?
I mean, where are we being in Hagerty?
Our short agenda, what happened?
Well, let me shut this off.
It started, it went bad when we had one part of the thing
and we had like 16 people to testify at one part.
Right.
Great job.