Thank you.
Good morning, everyone.
We will start shortly.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you.
good morning everyone my name is bill bergman and i will be chairing this morning zba hearing
With me is our Vice Chair, Tanetta Graham.
Present, Mr. Chairman.
Our Board Secretary, Cheryl L. Gaston.
Present, Mr. Chairman.
Our Board Member, Michael Johns.
Present, Mr. Chairman.
And our Board Member, Ryan McAdams.
Present, Mr. Chairman.
Also here is our Attorney, Hillary Emerson.
And also with our legal team today is Marina Campo, who is a third-year student at Villanova University's Law School.
and also is Ian Haggerty
and then our board administrator
Lakeisha Dandy
recording of this hearing will be posted
on the ZBA website
by participating you consent to be recorded
this is an in-person meeting
with remote capabilities
whether remote or in person
if you're called to speak
you must state and spell your name
and then wait to be sworn in
once you've been sworn in
please state your name each time
before beginning your testimony
any person may enter their appearance
to become an interested party to a case there are three ways to enter you can identify the case
property address on your zoom webinar you can see a staff member or you can call the zba appearance
line by the close of business tomorrow call 267-270-5548 leave a message that includes your
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and turn on your camera. The webinar Q&A is for questions about the hearing. Do not comment on
cases in the Q&A. And finally, if you're participating by phone, press star nine to
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the nearest stairwell is to the left outside the doors in case of an evacuation the rally point
is love park directly across arch street please remain there so we can account for you
so let's look at our uh our schedule for today
number seven mi 2025 003 91 34 49 8th street that case is continued till 5 6 26 at 9 30 a.m
And number 15, MI 2025-003-974-3319 West Allegheny Avenue.
That case is continued to 5626 at 9.30 a.m.
Are there any other requests for continuances?
Good morning, Chair.
I don't see any hands.
Thank you.
Number five, MI-2025-000305-2304-North Smedley Street.
This is the second listing.
We have no exhibits.
Aphasia Haynes is the listed owner applicant.
do we see anyone in the audience
so this is the second listing there are no hands at this raised at this time chair thank you this
is the second listing we still do not have any exhibits no one appeared the first time
So MI-2025-00305-2304 North Smedley Street, I vote to dismiss.
Michael Johns, my vote is to dismiss.
Cheryl Gaston, my vote is to dismiss.
Donetta Graham, my vote is to dismiss.
Donetta Graham, my vote is to dismiss.
Ryan McAdams, my vote is to dismiss.
Ryan McAdams, my vote is to dismiss.
Number 11, MI2025-002784, 18 West Oxford Street.
We have indication that this case may be withdrawn, but we do not at this point have any signed letter.
Megan Landert is the listed owner.
I don't see any hands or any names by the names here.
So MI 2025 002784 18 West Oxford Street.
This case is continued to 5626 must be heard.
And then number 14, MI-2025-003-216-5610-14 Germantown Avenue.
This case has been withdrawn.
We're going to go to our add-on list.
number number one mi 2025 004 120 1825 west butler street i vote yes michael johns my vote
is yes cheryl gaston my vote is yes tanetta graham my vote is yes ryan mcadams my vote is yes
Number two, MI-2025-004-506-5969 Oguns Avenue.
This matter, the vote in this matter has been rescheduled to Wednesday, November 19th at 9.30 a.m.
number number three mi2025 002 667 5045 jackson street
i vote yes good johns my vote is yes cheryl gaston my vote is yes
tennetta graham my vote is yes ryan mcadams my vote is yes number four mi2025
5-0-0-4-0-3-5-7-0-6-2-0-8-South Street.
I vote yes with proviso per amended
per amended refusal dated 10-6-25
and uses limited to first floor and basement.
Johns, my vote is yes with proviso.
Cheryl Gaston, my vote is yes with proviso.
Tanetta Graham, my vote is yes with proviso.
Ryan McAdams, my vote is yes with Provisos.
Number five, MI 2024-001-848-2055, Cheltenham Avenue.
The vote in this matter has been rescheduled to Wednesday, November 19th at 9.30 a.m.
Number six, MI 2024-004-415-5338, Walnut Street, I vote no.
Michael Jones, my vote is yes.
Cheryl Gaston, my vote is no.
Brian McAdams, my vote is no.
Thank you.
So number seven, 6930 King Sessing Avenue.
Steve Masters is the attorney.
Request to proceed, don't pro-tunc.
Mr. Masters.
They're being promoted to panelists.
Thank you.
Good morning, Mr. Chair, members of the board.
Good morning, counsel.
Could you please state your name as Bell for the Sonographer?
Steve Masters, S-T-E-V-E-M-A-S-T-E-R-S.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Mr. Masters, would you give us a short presentation on your request for 6930 King Sessing Avenue?
Yes, absolutely.
Mr. Chair, members of the board, we're requesting non-protunk relief to permit our client, Ayuba Fumba Kamara, to file an untimely appeal from a September 23, 2025 notice of referral, which denied his application for a zoning permit for the use of a personal vehicle sales and rental in an existing detention.
for the use of a personal vehicle sales and rental in an existing detached structure with
all other uses that are previously approved this is an icmx zoning district so there's no
variance required it's just a special exception an appeal from the notice of referral was due
on or before october 23rd 2025 earlier on october 28th we discovered that the appeal had not been
filed and immediately reached out to the board council and board executive director to seek the
non-protunk relief. As we understand what happened, there was a breakdown in operations at our firm.
A paralegal who was undergoing training to submit zoning applications via Eclipse
didn't realize that LNI uploads all the notices of refusals and referrals via Eclipse. She was
monitoring the her email and thinking that the uh notice of referral would be sent to her email
um that of course is not how it works um and when we discovered it five days after the deadline had
passed uh we were in a case management meeting when when we discovered that uh that uh very
significant news um we then uh immediately reached out to as i said the the board staff to to see what
we could do to address it. This case is similar to a Pennsylvania Supreme Court case called
Bass v. Commonwealth from 1979, in which a secretary's failure to timely deliver
appeal documents to an attorney was found to be grounds for granting non-protec relief.
And here, our trainee, her failure to timely discover the issuance of the notice of referral, just like in the case of Bass v. Commonwealth, was corrected within a very short time.
And so any prejudice that any other side would have was minimal.
The courts have said that when we look at determining non-protunk, we look at a couple factors that are significant here.
One, just laws acted within a day after discovering the missed deadline, and that was five days after the deadline had passed.
And two, that it's important to recognize that if we don't get non-protunk relief, that will greatly prejudice our client because he would have to wait a whole year before he could reapply.
So we respectfully request that the Zoning Board allow us to submit our appeal seeking a special exception within this short period of time after the deadline.
Thank you, Mr. Masters. Is there anyone on the board who has a question for Mr. Masters?
Counsel, are you okay with Mr. Masters?
Yes, no questions for me. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Pardon me?
No questions for me. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Okay, so the request to proceed non-protonk is granted. Application for appeal is accepted as timely. It must be – then we must be submitted – your appeal must be submitted by November 14th. Is that okay, Mr. Masters?
Yes, absolutely. We're going to be filing it today.
All right. Thank you very much, sir. Thank you.
Okay, sure. Thank you so much.
And the other members, can you vote as well?
Yes. Yeah. All right. I'm sorry. I vote yes. Yes. Request for non-proton granted. Yes. Yes.
I vote is yes. Non-proton is granted. Michael Johns. My vote is yes.
Cheryl Gaston. My vote is yes. Tanetta Graham. My vote is yes.
Ryan McAdams. My vote is yes. Thank you. Thank you.
Go to our regular list. Excuse me, chair. This is the court reporter.
This prior case, I didn't hear an MI number.
Was there one for it?
There's no.
Sorry, Mr. Kelly.
There's no MI number because this was a vote to accept the appeal.
So it has not been assigned yet.
Thank you.
Pardon the interruption.
No problem.
Thank you.
We're going to move on to number two.
MI 2024-003-935, 4422 Carverthin Road.
Geraldine and Nathaniel Lockwood
are the owner applicants.
There's a recommendation of support
from Council District 6,
which convened the RCO meeting.
The vote was 17 or 22 in support to oppose.
There's also a letter of support
from neighbor on the block
who verified issues that led
to the erection of offense.
Oh, yeah, sure.
which who's going to testify okay all right um could you um state your name
Could you state your name and spell it for the sonographer?
and spell it for the song
Could you please state your name and spell it for the sonographer?
My name is Geraldine Lockwood.
It's Geraldine, G-E-R-A-L-D-I-N-E.
Last name Lockwood, L-O-C-K-W-O-O-D.
Right.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Yes, I do.
The application of the erection of a six foot high front fence on Carthorne Road, whereas the allowable capacity of a fence located in the front setback is no more than 50 percent, whereas zero percent is proposed, whereas the allowable height for the fence in the front setback is less than four feet, is less than four feet in height and six foot is proposed.
Our vice chair has a few questions for you.
Good morning.
Have you submitted your documents five days in advance of the hearing?
Yes, I did.
And the chair just read your refusal.
Do you stipulate to its accuracy?
I'm sorry, repeat that.
He just read your refusal?
Do you stipulate to the accuracy of his refusal?
Yes, that's correct.
All right, thank you.
You can proceed with your case.
And I understand we're going to help you with your, Ian Haggerty is doing your presentation
for you on the screen here.
So why don't you start?
Tell us what you want to do.
Um, so I would like to keep up. My fence is actually not at six feet. It's at 68. Once they
placed the 68 feet. So once they, um, place the fence up, it took the fence down some in size.
Um, when Ellen and I came out, my fence was not even measured. Um, we were just sighted on it.
Um, another thing was when we went on the website, the fence wasn't put up to be malicious or
anything like that it was put up because um when we went on the website it said anything above six
feet we didn't read the fine print of it um but it is a privacy panel and it's in the front of our
home it's located alongside so it comes from the wall at a house to the top of the grass it doesn't
extend down to okay so mr haggarty could you start and could you i said thank you
so why don't you that's why don't you start explaining now what you have uh so that's the
fence um again like i say stated it's 68 feet and it's dividing my property and 44 24 and we
basically put that up okay and that's the fence again it's three panels and as you can see it's
not going down to the um to the curve and it's not blocking any views it's not a nuisance to
the neighborhood or anything like that tell me what happened when you went to the rco
when i went where sorry when you went to the community group oh um they call that the rco
i just explained to them you know why i wanted to keep it keep it up at the time we was having a
issue with an ongoing
neighbor, which they wind up moving
anyway, and
it was basically put up to
provide an area for
my grandchildren when they come
over to visit.
Is there anything else you want to add?
Well, could I swear you in?
I could move it
very close to you. You've got to pull it close to you.
Please state your name and
spell for the stenographer.
Nathaniel Lockwood.
First name's N-A-T-H-A-N-I-E-L.
Last name is Lockwood, L-O-C-K-O-O-D.
Right.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Mr. Lockwood, what could you add to this?
And when you stated we went to the RCA meeting, it did fall in our favor as far as the count-wise.
So we wasn't aware of how far the war was going to go as far as this year.
So, I mean, it did.
They sent a letter.
It's between 17 or 22 people in favor.
okay is there anything else you want to add
okay questions from the board
I have a question
are there any other fences
like this on your block
and is it like the exact same
type of fence or is it like
same exact fence and I think what the
issue is that we're on a
hill so all the other houses
when you go down they're like
I can't explain but my house
is on a hill
so our block comes up
So the house is going down like this.
So you're in the middle of the hill.
Absolutely.
So it makes it look larger than what it is, but it's actually not at six feet.
It's not.
I actually had the tape measure and we measured it.
And the other question is, you said the reason for putting the fence up was because of disputes with the neighbor that's no longer living there.
living there but also to you know enhance and increase our property value but what about the
No longer living there, but also to, you know, enhance and increase our property.
the neighbor that's living there now is there they have no issues at all okay did you get their
support they just moved in maybe october okay yeah thank you other questions questions from our
attorney hillary emerson not at this time mr chair questions or comments from this audience or the
virtual audience no questions at this time chair planning commission
thank you chair bergman and good morning david vecto f-e-c-t-e-a-u with the city planning
commission you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth yes sir i
do please proceed thank you sir uh chairman and board members the comprehensive plan recommends
no change to the rsa5 residential single family zoning at this location the city rezoned this
neighborhood in 1971 and a council-supported map change the appellant has shown that legalizing
this fence will not injure the use of adjacent property the city planning commission recommends
the board grant a proposed dimensional variance for fence height and opacity thank you very much
so mi2024-003-935-4422 car within road i vote yes michael johns my vote is yes
Cheryl Gaston, my vote is yes
Tanetta Graham, my vote is yes
Ryan McAdams, my vote is yes
You have your vote
Thank you
Thank you
You guys could leave
You look like you don't want to leave
Hi, Adrian
Thank you
Go ahead
All right
All right. We're going to do number six next. MI 2025 00311 6533 Keaton Sessing Avenue. Agner Kelly is the tenant applicant.
They're being promoted to panelists, Chair.
All right.
Thank you.
good morning good morning could you please state your name and spell for this stenographer
yes my name is anya kelly a-i-g-n-e-r kelly k-e-l-l-y right do you swear or affirm to
tell the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth yes um did you hillary are we still looking
for proof of meeting and mailing?
So, we did get, this morning,
we did get a letter of support with provisos
from the Southwest Philadelphia Consortium of RCOs.
Okay, thank you.
So, yes, so we can proceed with this matter.
So, this application is for use as a group child care
in an existing attached structure
with other existing uses in the structure
as previously approved,
whereas the proposed use,
group child care is not permitted
in an attached structure in the RSA 5 zoning district. Our vice chair has a few questions
for you, okay? Okay. Good morning. Have you emailed your documents five days in advance
of this hearing? Yes, I submitted them on the website. Okay. And do you waive the reading
of the refusal and stipulate to its accuracy? Yes. Okay. Thank you. You can share your screen
to proceed with your case. Your screen's coming up. Okay, you're up. You can start your presentation.
Okay. So the name of my daycare is Guardian Angels Family Daycare. We are located at 6533 King Cesson Avenue. Our hours of operation are currently 7.30 to 5.30 p.m. We are on site 7 a.m. to 6 p.m. just to prepare the classroom, clean up, and the closing duties.
uh weekend care is not available um the children are served hot and cold meals breakfast lunch and
two snacks um we do have the interconnected fire alarm system um and my current uh certificate
of compliance expires january 2025 i'm at 2026 sorry and um
Expires January, 2025. I'm at 2026, sorry. And my renewal window is between November 7th through December 7th.
I have pictures of, let me try to make this happen.
These are pictures of the outside of the property sitting right in front of it and directly across the street.
These are pictures facing the park, which is McCreech, and then the opposite way, which has the trolleys.
This is one photo of the backyard, which we do use to take the children outside.
This is the front view of the backyard leading back into the home and the stairwell.
This is the basement. This is what I'm trying to get approved.
So we do have an emergency exit, and that is the emergency exit walkthrough that leads out into the backyard.
This is my evacuation map that shows us in the classroom, the stairs leading back upstairs to the first floor,
as well as the door, which I previously showed on the other picture, the door and the exit leading out to the backyard.
um this is this is a view of the classroom downstairs that we are hoping to get approved
um these are the steps leading back upstairs to the first floor classroom
uh we do have a bathroom downstairs we have a toilet and then we have a um a portable sink
and these are pictures of the closet which we had built around the um hot water tank
so the children don't have any type of access to it.
These are pictures of the main floor classroom.
These are pictures leading to the upstairs bathroom,
steps leading to the upstairs bathroom.
This is the upstairs bathroom on the second level.
We do have the trash in the backyard.
It is currently blocked just by a fence pending approval.
We are hoping to get something better to just block the trash can a little bit better from the children.
Trash is picked up through the city on Fridays and recycling.
And then we do have available parking because their houses stop.
I forgot what's the address directly across the street.
But we do have a vacant lot across the street directly from us with the train behind it.
so the um the parents do have ample amount of parking if they need it to be able to stop
directly across the street from us and that was the last slide
Ms. Kelly, do you have anything else to present?
Questions from the board?
Yeah, I have a question, a couple of questions.
how often are the children in the basement um so we're hoping that this would be the three to
five year old room um so they would typically be down here um after morning drop off and then
um when it's time to be picked up uh i noticed there are no windows in the basement
um there's a small window in the bathroom and then um just a um
a window and the not the utility but like the front of the home there's a small window
right so there's there's really no natural light where the children aren't going to be all day
they're basically in a basement with no natural light okay um yeah so that's a concern for me
the exit out is a bill cold door which is i have one at a house that i have and it's kind of
difficult sometimes to open from underneath so that's a concern for me okay and the width of
your stairway to the basement is not three feet so that's a concern for me so it's just a general
concern of having children in a basement with no light and um other things that are kind of iffy
I have concerns.
Okay, so what age children are we talking about here?
I currently have the license for one through five, but in the basement area, it would be preschool, so three to five.
But in the basement area, it would be preschool, so three to five.
And I have the same, I have the concern about the staircase there for the children.
And the backyard, which you're using for play area, is that just concrete there?
On the ground?
And we also take them to the playground McCreech as well.
okay but the but the backyard itself you do use it as a play yes yes yes like that okay um all
right and then um i i'm concerned about that i mean it looks like you know you can you can put
down um what's that the rubberized little um play play mat oh yes we normally do have those it just
We just have to take it up just because of, like, the weather and everything, but we do have those.
Oh, all right.
And then I guess my concern is about, again, the no light in that basement, but also about fire safety.
usually you would need to have at least two means of ingress and egress and for certain age children
there are more requirements for fire protection and also about stairs because of you know the
age of the children and whether they are um capable as they say of self-preservation here
and usually there's um the idea of a panic bar like going up uh an exit door so that it's easier
to get out of the property in case there's a fire so i'm not seeing that so these are you know the
hardwired smoke detection system, which includes the strobe lights and the alarm, which is
very annoying, but it does the job, and the means of ingress and egress for children of
this age who are not always considered to be capable of self-preservation.
So, and I didn't ask, but is it just you here or do you have employees?
My mother, who currently lives in the hall.
So it's the two of you?
And it would be how many children?
Pendant approval will be 12.
All right.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Other questions from the board?
I have a question.
Can I see the picture of the backyard again, please?
i was just looking at it can you go down
a little bit i want the view for where the trash was at actually okay sorry thank you
that one yes hopefully i i hope that downspout isn't there anymore
the ones sticking out because coming from them steps if the child was the fall that is a main
that's a major problem right there for for safety wise right yes and there's no rail on that side
i hopefully it's not there it was just taken when the picture was there yeah no we sorry that goes
up to the first floor correct that does that uh yes leading into the kitchen first floor area yes
okay so the kids would have to come upstairs from the basement to go out to go to the to the backyard
yes okay i i just i just saw that and it just popped out i i would hope we could move that
and uh thank you miss kelly just for for the record could you show the stairs again so
all the board members have a good look at it the stairs to the basement that's a good basement yes
Okay. All right. Any other questions from the board?
Questions or comments from our attorney, Hillary Emerson?
Excuse me, Mr. Chair. I just wanted to note that, as I mentioned before, that the RCO did submit a letter this morning with provisos that the board should decide to grant this application.
the enforceable provisos are a three-year temporary variance hours of operation monday
through friday 7 a.m to 6 p.m and obtaining a certificate of occupancy so i just want to
um a certificate of occupancy so i just want to put that on the record for the board thank you
put that on the record for the board
thank you very much questions or comments from the audience this audience or the virtual audience
chair we have craig meladozian with their hand raised they're allowed
morning craig good morning chair bergman i could just for the record state your name
is spelled for the sonographer yes craig c-r-a-i-g melidocean m-e-l-i-d-o-s-i-a-n
you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth
i do chair bergman please proceed all right we shared some of the concerns of the rco meeting
on this was a little different we moved it to the morning on saturday hoping that we would be able
to get participation from near neighbors. Three of our RCOs actually had other programming at that
time, so they weighed in by use of, we recorded it on Zoom between that and our AI summary and
notes. We did share some of the concerns. One of them, Mr. Johns, was with the Bill Code door.
We're familiar with that, and that does possibly create, no, it doesn't, it creates potential
challenges for kids. We also looked at it from the ability of fire rescue to open it up from
the outside. We did not look at the issue of the windows. I guess I came with an internal bias as
a single parent. I had at any given time two or three girls being provided after school care
by people like Anye a couple blocks away on the 6,600 block of Belmar.
So maybe the lack of daylight could, and I say this jokingly,
could explain their aberrant behavior at times, but they actually did quite well.
In terms of workarounds, one, we did look at the issue of the screening.
uh we uh anya agreed to address that uh the issue of the downspouts i'll be honest we we did we did
miss and that doesn't need to be concerned also it potentially creates a a hazard during a cold
weather if anything freezes out there but we would anticipate the kids not going out there
but nonetheless that basement is a is an emergency exit to the communal alleyway
A couple of workarounds. One might be for when the kids are going out, that Anya and her mom take them up stairs through the internal stairway and then bring them out through the back at the first floor level, and that other use simply be emergency exit.
I do want to stress that she is a half a block away from a significant sized recreation center, the McCreish Recreation Center, with multiple fields, basketball, which the kids wouldn't be doing, skate park, et cetera.
So there is a large amount of programming there that would provide recreation for the kids during the summer.
We did weigh in on parking issues.
We don't believe there's going to be a stacking of cars out there because there is an absence of housing across the street.
So we did look at workarounds, nor did we indicate that they'd be limited to the first floor and the basement.
Because the thought in my mind certainly was, if this does take off and is successful after the third year, that there may be some consideration that if the mother were to leave the residence, they'd have the ability to move it to the second floor.
So it's the first and second floor.
We also put in the three-year proviso to make sure that there would be no problems, how it affected the near neighbors.
I do believe Anya has signed support from her attached neighbors.
So this was the rationale that we used, and the assumption was that between the state inspection and L&I coming in, that code issues would be caught by them, which we traditionally do not necessarily heavily focus on.
And I leave it at that unless you have a question for me.
Thank you very much.
Anyone else in the audience?
There are no hands at this time, Chair.
Planning Commission.
thank you chairman and good morning david fechto with the city planning commission
chairman and board members the comprehensive plan recommends no change to the rsa5 residential
single-family zoning at this location the city rezoned this neighborhood in 2019
in accord with recommendations in the comprehensive plan
This property has a documented history as a family child care for up to six children.
this property has a documented history as a family child care for up to six children
There is no unique physical condition or circumstance of this property.
It would prevent the continued use of the property as approved.
The City Planning Commission recommends that the Board deny the proposed use variance for group child care.
Thank you.
MI 2025-00311-6533 Kinsessing Avenue, I vote no.
Michael Johns, my vote is no.
Cheryl Gaston, my vote is no.
Tynetta Graham, my vote is no.
Ryan McAdams, my vote is no.
Thank you.
Thank you.
We're going to move on to number 12.
MI 2025 002 787 2230 West Ontario Avenue.
Joycelyn Clark is the owner applicant.
this application is for use as a multiple family household living three dwelling units
in an existing attached structure multiple family household living three dwelling units
is prohibited in the r2 zoning district there was unanimous support with provisos from
Allegheny West Civic Associate.
Five or ten votes.
Who's going to do the testifying?
Good morning.
Hi, could you please state your name
and spell it for this stenographer?
Tap it again.
Good morning.
No, it's good.
Nice and loud.
Now, could you please state your name and spell for the ethnographer?
My name is Jocelyn Clark, J-O-C-E-L-Y-N.
Clark is C-L-A-R-K.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Yes, I swear.
Our vice chair has a few questions for you.
Good morning.
Have you emailed your documents five days in advance of this hearing?
And do you waive the reading of the refusal or stability to its accuracy?
yes okay thank you and proceed with your case good morning um i am the owner of 2230
west ontario street and it's my my home my family home that i um received from my father
after a recent fire i had the request to change my home to a triplex because i'm getting older
and when I retire it will be a nice source of income my plan is to live on the first floor
and rent out the second floor and third floor unfortunately the neighborhood is zoned I think
it's light industrial even though we are a residential block so the variance the use
Transvariance was denied.
I'm not sure what else I can say.
I provide pictures.
I think what you need to do is, do you have pictures of what it looks like inside right now, or is it all damaged from the fire?
Oh, I have pictures of recent improvements.
Why don't we see what the place looks like.
Okay, all right.
So that was your posting of the hearing, right?
So there had been work.
Did L and I stop you?
No, my contractor did not complete my work in a timely fashion.
Right.
And did not complete all the paperwork that should be submitted to the city.
So it was a, I don't know what to call it, a contractor abandonment?
I don't know what else to call it.
So I'm proceeding on my own with putting in my request for a triplex,
and I will definitely find a new contractor once I get permission.
So you started to shape it up as a triplex.
Would that be the correct word?
Yes, that was the contractor.
And I thought all the paperwork was in place.
However, it was not.
All right.
Now, do you have drawings of what it's going to look like in the future?
They were submitted on the web.
Oh, I saw one.
Yeah, all right.
So why don't we look at what you have?
May I defer to my...
Architect?
Yes, my architect.
Thank you.
Your architect?
All right.
Is that on?
Yes, I am.
You are, okay.
Just to clarify, you can call your architect as a witness.
He cannot testify on your behalf, so you do need to ask him questions.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Okay, I'm unfamiliar with which questions I should ask,
I'm unfamiliar with which questions I should.
but Chris Hamill is my architect,
and I would like to call him as a witness.
Okay, sure.
Could you please state your name and spell for this tonight?
Yes, it's Chris Hamill, C-H-R-I-S, Hamill's H-A-M-N-E-L.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth,
the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Could you ask your architect to explain
what's going to go there?
Chris, can you explain what's going to go there?
So when I was approached by the contractor at the time, I didn't know Ms. Jocelyn at the time.
Is that better?
Sorry.
So I was hired by the contractor, not Ms. Jocelyn, at the time to do a three-family dwelling.
I gave him all the drawings.
Obviously, he never submitted them to get permits, and that's why we're here today, because we had to go for a variance.
So the way we had it set up was obviously the first floor and the basement was for Ms. Clark.
We have a bedroom in the back of the house and we have a bedroom in the basement.
We do have a egress window that we're putting in the side, which will have a grate over it that is a poppable grate that is an egress grate so that they can get in and out if there is, God forbid, a fire in the house.
um if you go in the other side we have on the second floor we have a two bedroom uh one bath
and on the third floor we have a one bedroom one bath everything's going to be fire separated um
two-hour fire separation for the stairwell and two-hour fire separation on the ceiling on the
first floor and the second floor which is explain what's in the basement again uh yeah in the
basement's just basically a if you could say a family room and a master bedroom
and on the first floor first floor there is a bedroom in the back of the house with a kitchen
and a living room okay um is there anything else you want to add um i've lived there my whole life
i inherited the house from my dad well he sold it to me for a dollar my neighbors are in support
I uploaded seven neighbors signing a letter in support of the plan.
I see that.
Tell me the rest of the block.
What's the rest of the block look like?
I don't have pictures of it.
You don't have pictures.
I guess I'm curious as to how many multiple families live on that block.
I can do that.
So when we went to the RCO, I prepared little pictures.
So her house currently is single family.
um next to her which would be uh 20 2028 is a single family but next to that is a building
which would be considered 20 22 14 west ontario which was approved in the beginning of 2024 for
63 dwellings with 40 parking spaces um and everything else on it is single family except
for on her right hand side the last house is considered it's not even considered a house
for automotive sales and then next to that is a like probably i would say about a 10 000
square foot automotive building so it's a variation of buildings on that a lot all right thank you
questions from the board uh the same issues i generally bring up on other um plans like this
um depth of basement uh slab to the uh grade outdoor grade there's no section so
So what's that? There's only one sort of small window out of the master bedroom.
There's another little window out of the, I'm talking about the basement now,
and there's no window in the sort of open space, which is a concern.
And then there's, then for the first floor, you've got to walk through a bedroom to get to the backyard,
which is always a big concern for me.
do you want to respond to that before we move on um i mean the only response i could say is
in the basement as per code we do have it's per code we need a 5.2 square foot opening
when we do clear opening we have an 8.28 i believe square opening to be able to get in
and out for egress purposes god forbid there is a fire and in the back the bedroom it's
basically just the way the house is set up because there's a breezeway so the only way
to not create the doorway with a hallway you're going to create such a small bedroom you're not
going to be able to use it other questions that create a walkway out of the breezeway
out of the main living area yes the plan before um what was your plan for trash for the three units
oh there will be one of those trash closets for the um actually for each of the living units and
i'll also put cans in the backyard as i need to can you point that out on the plan yeah we
put cans in the backyard as i need to can you point that out on the plan yeah we this plan
didn't have a change we are going to put trash reviews in each apartment so they have a door
they can put the trash in it's going to be a louver's pantry um excuse me where's that trash
pilot no it's not on the set of drawings we we did change them but obviously i sent a old i brought
an old set so where do you think it would be um in the back in the kitchen area probably in the
kitchen area on the first well first floor she has the back to back backyard so she can put it
in the backyard for the second and third floor um i was assuming close close to the kitchen area
um probably on the third floor to the back of the steps and just shift the stuff around
second floor probably same scenario to the back of the steps so at least they have an area for trash
oh i've noticed that there's two entryway door door entryways so i guess one of them is for the
first floor unit and the
one is for the second and third floor unit?
Yes, ma'am.
Other questions?
What made you pick three units instead
of two?
Oh, my house is a three, it was a
three-story family house. We were a
family of nine growing up.
I thank God it's just me.
Yeah, but what I'm saying, you decided
to make it three apartments instead of
two for financial reasons or yes yeah you don't think you could have done this with two units
yes but it's a three-story okay house so i felt three separate apartments one for each floor
questions from our attorney hillary emerson not at this time mr chair questions or comments
from the audience or the virtual audience no hands raised at this time chair planning commission
thank you chairman and good morning David Fecto with the city planning commission
chairman and board members the comprehensive plan recommends no change to the i2 medium
industrial zoning at this location the city rezoned this neighborhood in 2006 and a council
requested map change this property has a documented history as two dwelling units however there is no
unique physical condition or circumstance we'll prevent it from being continuing to be used as
two units city planning commission recommends the board grant the proposed use variance for
multi-family dwellings but limit it to two dwelling units um we're going to vote on this two weeks
i want to take this back to the board and in the executive session so two weeks that wednesday
will be here at 9 30 a.m and we'll vote chair i'm sorry to interrupt we do have a hand that uh
One up for caller, call-in customer.
You're allowed to talk?
You're allowed to speak.
Phone number 267-271-3552.
You're allowed to speak.
Hi, could you please say your name is spelled for the stenographer?
Yes, Adrian Fernandez.
My last name is spelled S-E-R-N-A-N-D-E-Z.
Adrian, do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth,
nothing but the truth?
Please proceed.
I just want to ask if this can have a provisor of a limit of two units, no basement living, and that the trash be kept indoors.
Thank you very much.
So we're going to vote on this in two weeks, on Wednesday, and we'll take it to executive session.
You'll hear the results on 930 a.m., two weeks.
Question.
Do I need to be present?
You don't have to be present.
you can listen on the phone okay okay thank you both thank you thank you
Number one on our normal list, MI 2024-003731-2617-25, Grace Ferry Avenue, Zen Gin is the attorney.
they're being promoted to panelists a letter of support from residents organized for
advocacy and direction six in support one abstained good morning good morning counsel
could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer yes my name is then jen z-h-e-n
J-I-N, here on behalf of the applicant.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Could you identify your client, the relationship to the property?
Yes, my client is a property owner, Fortune Property LLC.
Ms. Chelsea Huang will be available to verify my testimony.
And our vice chair has a few questions for you.
And our vice chair has a few questions for you.
Good morning.
Good morning.
Have you submitted your document?
Have you submitted your documents five days in advance of this hearing?
And you have a couple of refusals.
So do you waive the reading of the refusals and stipulate to their accuracy?
We have an amended refusal and we do stipulate to its accuracy.
Thank you.
You may share your screen and proceed with your case.
Thank you.
I'm going to share with the board what was previously submitted.
Can the board see my screen on theirs?
It's coming up right now.
Yep, we're good.
Great, thank you.
So this is an application for a project that is at the address 2617 to 25 Grace Ferry Avenue.
This is an interesting project in the sense that this property is a semi-triangular shaped property that is zoned in an I-2 industrial district.
However, even the existing building that is there now is used as a kind of a restaurant.
and it has not been developed in addition to that in the past.
And what we're proposing is a kind of a development
that would be similar to what has been happening a lot
on Washington Avenue near Grace Ferry.
This particular property being rather unique
in that it's kind of at the intersection of Grace Ferry and Washington Avenue.
So the proposal originally was to build on top of an existing structure, but after meeting with the community and trying to meet their desire for parking spaces for the residential units, we've decided to go back and make this a complete new structure by demolishing the existing structure, putting in underground parking, and building above.
There are multiple refusals, mainly due to the I2 zoning.
The eating and drinking establishments are prohibited.
That actually exists now at this space, and this would be a continued use.
Multifamily household living is obviously prohibited in I2.
However, there are very similar projects nearby that are already built.
In fact, one apartment-type structure not far from us across the street on Washington Avenue
Minimum yard requirement is an eight-foot or five-foot proposed.
The household living requires parking.
Wait, I'm sorry.
This might be the old refusal.
My apologies.
I think this is the amended refusal here.
So we are providing the parking, but there's also parking required for the eating and drinking
establishments, and there's no parking provided on site for that.
and there's a aisle width issue with the 90 degree parking space where it's 18
foot required and we have 17 foot 6 inches. The best way to better understand
this project is to actually look at the plans, the revised plans that we have
that is the current project. As you can see here's a photo which is a little
hard to see on the screen, but I will show the photos as well in a second. This is a rather
uniquely shaped parcel that is sandwiched between different streets, Grace Ferry, Washington Avenue,
and it is an existing structure that is kind of leading into both the South Philadelphia,
Sosna area as well as the Point Breeze area of Washington Avenue. So this is kind of a unique
corner where it's located. Our proposal is a multi-floor design using the existing footprint
which leads to the backyard refusal that was listed on the refusal itself. Because of the
shape of the property, the design for the first floor commercial is divided into a restaurant
and a cafe area. I'm going to zoom in a little bit. I think it's a little difficult to see.
So you see that there's a restaurant and there's a proposed cafe area, which would be the commercial
pieces of the property with a street front that will be shown on the rendering in a second
that gives a lot of glass surfaces to make it so it's more visible and more appealing on the street
level. It also includes the entryway to the residential area, which would be here, with an
elevator, bicycle storage room, meter room, entry residential vestibules, and stairway. There are two
stairways to this overall structure. There's another stairway also on the other side of the
the building for code requirements.
It is also suggested that we make sure there's a mailing area within the
There's a mailing area within the meter room that's not marked on the plan, but that is something that is being designed in.
meter room. That's not marked on the plan, but that is.
The commercial unit has its own separate vestibule entry for the commercial space and would not be sharing the entry space with the residential units.
So that is the basic idea of the first floor.
This is the layout of the units.
they're basically replicated in the upper floors. So what you have is you have the stairway, the
elevator, a common corridor, and then the secondary stairway on the other end, and the unit count
would be the same on every floor, which is how we reach the total unit count in this particular
project. So you can see here that this is a two-bedroom design here, two-bedroom design,
two-bedroom design. Here we have a one-bedroom unit. On this side, again, we have two-bedroom
and two-bedroom units. So primarily, there are five one-bedroom units and the rest will be two-bedroom
units for the remaining four floors above. In addition, as part of the underground proposal,
So this is the parking that the community requested that we make available in this project.
This was originally not in the project design.
The original idea was to keep the slab design and build upwards.
However, the community asked for us to do an underground parking.
And that is, I'm sorry, I didn't expect it to zoom that much.
Here we go.
the uh so so the underground parking would be accessed through the uh what's essentially a
little side street coming off of grace ferry uh they would come in and the parking would be
underground there's there are a total of 13 spaces and the elevator also reaches all the
way to the underground parking this essentially uh provides residential parking uh for the
residents. This will not be generally used for the commercial parking. Now, there are on-street
parking on Washington Avenue. There used to be on-street parking on Grace Ferry, but we were
advised by the community that may change in the near future because it's been changed to
where no parking may be allowed. However, the on-street parking on Washington Avenue
has existed already and was used by the existing restaurant business, and we do not believe that
there will be an issue for the business to continue with that parking being available.
But the garage would be an addition that is something that wasn't part of the original design.
So a profile view and some material that was discussed for the purpose of the facade of the
building, this being a building that would be kind of the first building to be seen heading into
that part of Philadelphia off of Grace Ferry. The community asked us to consider having larger
window designs on the property and using some of the materials that are very similar to existing
buildings down the street. And the architect did take all those considerations. And also,
So we were advised to try to wash an avenue side for the commercial space, make the first floor as much done with glass and windows and floor to ceiling level glass surfaces as possible so that it is more visible and lit up.
And that consideration was also adopted in our design.
So this is an older rendering without the enlarged windows, just to give an idea of how this structure would look from its 3D perspective.
And that is essentially how we were able to work with the community to come up with the finalized design.
The community supports this project with the changes that we have made.
Um, let me, so the, uh, we have had, again, multiple meetings with the community, um, and with the changes, uh, and also with us agreeing to also provide a few low income housing units, uh, as part of the overall project, uh, the community supported our project.
Some of the things that were raised as concerns, there is a railroad bridge that would abut the one side of the building.
We're going to put sound resistance, soundproofing style windows, shadow resistance.
Sound resistant, soundproofing style windows, shadow resistant type windows on that side of the building for sure.
And overall, the building would have additional soundproofing to ensure that the railroad and the trains passing would not be impacting the residents.
But as a general overall project, we've received very positive feedback from the community.
There are similar projects up and down Washington Avenue, and our facade, again, is designed to fit and match those type of new projects as well.
So with that, we have received, again, support from the community, and we would ask the board's favorable review of our application.
My client is available to answer any questions, and also the architect is available to answer any of the board's questions.
Why don't we have your testimony adopted, and we'll have the architectural call should we need to ask them any questions, okay?
Sure. Thank you.
Chelsea, can you raise your hand virtually to be identified?
Can you hear me?
Yes, we can.
Hi, could you please state your name as spelled for the stenographer?
Yeah, my name is Chiaozhen Kwan, spelled as Q-I-A-O-Z-H-E-N, last name H-U-A-N-G.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Please proceed, counsel.
Thank you.
Chelsea, did you see my presentation and hear my representations before the zoning board?
Can you verify what I have presented to the zoning board is true and correct and adopted as your own testimony?
Thank you.
Questions from the board.
Yeah, did you have a streets review of the curb cuts for the driveway into the underground parking lot?
I'm going to defer that question to the architect.
I believe he would be better situated to answer that.
KJ Architecture should be here.
I'm not sure how his name is.
Let me give me one second.
i believe it's mr johnson mr johnson for um mr newen so it i don't know if it's mr johnson
that's with us today kenneth johnson they're being promoted to panel this year thank you thank you
uh you need to unmute mr johnson all right can you hear me good morning mr johnson could you
please state your name and spell for the stenographer kenneth johnson k-e-n-n-e-t-h
johnson j-o-h-n-s-o-n you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth
yes counsel thank you uh mr johnson did you hear the question relating to the streets
department approval for the curb cuts was that uh ever obtained for the uh for the underground
parking yes we um applied for the streets and the curb cut was already is already there so
the curb cut is done they they said that curb crap is okay but the problem is when we're back
the curb cut was there but it wasn't when we first went to get the streets approval
the underground wasn't on the plan
so when we
revised it we resubmitted it
to the streets department because
we had to get the underground approval
and that's still in reveal
but it would be the same curb cut
there's no change to the size
no we're not changing the curb cut
the curb cut is in the exact location we need it
and it's wide enough
other questions for the board
is there interior trash storage
in each unit, or is there a trash room in the building somewhere? How is the trash
being managed? There's bins.
I don't know if you could go back to the site plan.
But there's bins outside for trash collection.
It's right next to where...
Which job page of the plan would that be on? The site plan.
As mentioned before, that building was used for restaurants
in the past, and we're using the same area
where they store the trash bins in the refuge
for the tenants and for the businesses.
So the commercial tenant and the residences will use the same trash
area? Yes, of course, you probably have to have more additional
bins there, but yes. Because we're using
because we're using the same footprint as the existing building
the same footprint as the existing building.
other questions where would
where would the uh is this the that it says
dumpster here i think so this will be the area i see it says
dumpsters yeah yeah they have been relocated to the other side
yes and that's that's fenced in right yes
thank you other questions
questions or comments from our attorney
Hillary Emerson.
Yes, just a couple things for clarification.
One, the amended refusal, that reflects the revised plans, right?
There are not any additional revised plans.
Correct.
And second, the refusal just says eating and drinking establishments.
Do you have or has your client determined what type of eating and drinking establishments
um they would have at the property a prepared food shop takeout restaurant sit down restaurant
um um i saw chelsea just walked away i was about to ask her that question uh chelsea can you
can you kindly answer that uh was there a is there a tenant that's already um
being uh considered for that eating and drinking establishment it's most likely going to be a
restaurant isn't it yeah that's uh we were hoping that's a restaurant uh for the commercial tenant
but we don't talk about uh restaurant tenant it's coming and it'd be a um like just a takeout
restaurant it could be just a uh it could be a eating restaurant but it would most likely be a
restaurant of some sort yes so would you be okay with a proviso if the board grants limiting the
used to either a sit down or take out restaurant yes okay thank you thank you
question questions or comments from the audience virtual audience or the the virtual audience
no hands at this time chair planning commission thank you chairman and good morning david fecto
with the city planning commission chairman and board members the comprehensive plan recommends
a change in zoning at this location from i2 medium industrial to icmx industrial commercial mixed use
the city rezoned this neighborhood in 1971 in a council supported map change eating and drinking
establishments would be allowed in the proposed zoning districts uh well household living would
not the proposed zoning is due primarily to the presence of an active freight rail line next door
which poses a hazard to residential development the city planning commission recommends that the
board grant proposed use variants for eating and drinking establishments but deny all other
proposed variances we also note for the board that absent participation in a city state or
federal program or a city zoning incentive affordability mentioned in the appellant's
testimony cannot be enforced by any city agency thank you hillary um what's our proviso here is
an amended refusal what's the date um i thought i had that on there
the amended refusal was dated yes 6 10 25
And it will also be mentioned this is for a sit-down or take-out restaurant?
Right.
So we'd want to say something to the effect of eating and drinking establishments
use limited to sit-down or take-out restaurants.
All right. So, MI 2024-003-731-2617-25 Grace Ferry Avenue, I vote yes with proviso.
Amendor refusal dated 6-10-25 proviso.
Eating or drinking establishment, sit down or take out.
Michael Johns, my vote is yes with proviso.
yes with provisos tenetta graham my vote is yes with provisos ryan mcadams my vote is yes with
provisos thank you um counsel could you please stay on sure so mi2024 and by the way thank you
for the last case um number four mi 2024 007 311 64
Number four, MI 2024-007-311-6049, Caster Avenue.
Counselor, could you, just for the record, state your name?
Zen Jin, Z-H-E-N-J-I-N, here on behalf of the applicant.
Right.
You've already been sworn.
There is a letter of support from Community on the Rise.
Our vice chair has a few questions for you.
Good morning again.
And have you submitted these documents five days in advance of this hearing?
And do you waive the reading of the refusal and stipulate to its accuracy?
Thank you.
Share your screen and proceed, please.
Thank you.
I'm going to share with the board what was previously submitted for 6049 Pastor Avenue.
Can the board see my screen on theirs?
Thank you.
So I am here on behalf of Bright Sun Rise LLC, Mr. Jiang Li Ming.
is the property owner. And this is an application for the use of the space for the purpose of a hot
food breakfast and bakery, which is essentially categorized as a takeout restaurant on the first
floor of that particular property. This location on Castor Avenue 6049 is in the middle of a
commercial mixed use block. There are very similar uses, but different types of foods on the block
including pizzeria and other types of food that does not conflict with my client's proposed
breakfast service. The breakfast service that my client is proposing is supported by the community
after our meeting, both with the community group's board as well as a separate open community
meeting. The one issue that they raised was the community actually would prefer this to be a full
takeout service set up rather than having any kind of table and seating. We on the plans show,
and I'm going to go to the plans this way the board can reference as we discuss this. We on
the plan show two tables with four seats. The community was concerned that they would rather
see that the breakfast food is just simply taken over the counter, purchased and taken rather than
have people sit there so for the waiting area they suggested that we use bench seating instead
of table and seats we have no objections to that request and certainly would be happy to make that
the final design the general purpose of this is my client who is from the area who is in the food
business has noticed that there's a lack of any kind of breakfast service businesses in that area
and particularly for the residents near Castor Avenue.
So his proposal is to do breakfast service
primarily focused on the breakfast sandwiches,
omelets, pancakes.
So it's a mix of American-style breakfast
with a little bit of Asian pastries as well,
which will be pre-packaged
And simply, there's no baking on the premises.
The bakery will be prepackaged, brought in, and sold alongside with the prepared breakfast items,
such as omelets, sandwiches, pancakes.
The proposal is to have, I believe I have a business plan, which you'll be better able to...
I'm sorry.
Right. So the proposal is to simply have breakfast service until about afternoon time.
So the hours of operation would start around 7 a.m. and the service would end around 4 p.m., with most services ending after 3, but there will be cleanup afterwards.
He anticipates generally at the start to have four employees working in the space, mostly in the kitchen area and one at the counter.
and there will be no again no seating so there'll be limited service of any other than preparing
the food and serving it to the customers so with the type of space size that he has this is the
best uses of space a full sit-down restaurant would actually be a lot more difficult to accomplish
the location on Castor Avenue the neighboring properties are pretty much all commercial uses
There's a shared driveway in the back, which makes trash management and even some deliveries much easier
because the trash trucks actually would access the back where the dumpsters for all the businesses generally are located.
So there is no negative impact from the trash generated from the business because there would be.
negative impact from the trash generated from the business because there would be space in the back
for the trash and pickup would be away from the main street during hours when people would be
heading to work. There are on-street parking. The community even suggested maybe he should apply for
a delivery spot in the front for some deliveries. Again, with the size of the operation, he's not
anticipating any really large trucks for delivery purposes. So we do not anticipate that would be
an issue once the business is going. So with all that, again, and with the community support,
we're asking for the board's favorable review of this application and permit the use of a
takeout restaurant at this location. My client should be here and would be able to verify my
testimony sure mr john can you raise your hand to be identified
there are no hands raised at the sign um counsel you uh or an officer of the court
we will accept your testimony questions from the board
yeah so you said there will be cooking on on premises right yes okay so how is the
Where is the exhaust vented?
It would be vented out to the roof.
So there is, I'm going to put the plans back up.
Thank you.
Chair, we have a hand raised from Sloan folks.
Sloan, let's get testimony, please.
I'm sorry. I'm sorry, Chairman.
You're not 6049 Caster, are you?
Yes, I am. But I was waiting for questions or concerns from the community.
So I'll let the applicant complete their testimony.
All right. Yes. So so we do have proposed cooking limited.
It's limited to this side of the kitchen. You can see here there would be a hood system and the hood system.
would be venting out to the roof.
It's going to vent through the building?
It's going to vent through the building, yes.
Because the upstairs is vacant right now,
so they can make all the changes needed
to make this work.
Other questions?
So this breakfast
would be
7 in the morning
until 4 in the afternoon?
3 in the afternoon
is when my client anticipates
he would be basically closing but you know he wants the hours to four because there's cleaning
and closing down that usually takes about an hour to clean the kitchen and make sure everything's
put away um well okay so the concept is sort of like a set place that i go to all the time and i
can't think of the name of it right now uh first watch where it's just breakfast kind of breakfast
some lunch service yes but they have like sit-down service now you know correct maybe it's
maybe it's me but i i'm not sure if i would like breakfast food taken out because it
gets cold so quickly like that's just me um so you're you're not going to have any seating this
is all going to be takeout.
As you saw in the plan,
we originally had two tables
planned with four seats.
It's not anticipated
a lot of people would sit down.
The community actually
did not prefer that.
They wanted to simply keep it
a completely takeout setting
and just ask us to put benches in.
Other questions?
How many and how many?
Well, no, you just told me.
All right.
Thank you.
questions from our attorney
not at this time
questions or comments from the virtual audience
I'm sorry
Chairman Brickman
I had a hard time unmuting myself
could you just for the record
state your name and spell for the sonographer
yes my name is Sloan
S-L-O-A-N-E, F-S-L-O-L-K-S, representing the Office of the Council member of Ketze Lazano.
Right. Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Yes, sir, I do. Thank you very much.
Yes, we after reviewing the testimony of the RCO and then separately going out and meeting with local.
of the RCO and then separately going out and meeting with local residents and near residents
regarding this application and finding that, you know, the, the, the, the community was in
support of the, uh, opening of the restaurant. Uh, the council member has no opposition to,
uh, the appellant's application. Thank you. Thank you, Sloan. Thanks for calling in. Is
there anyone else in the virtual audience? Great, Chair. This is Jason Handel. I'll be
stepping in temporarily i do not see any further hands okay planning commission thank you chair
bergman and good morning david vecto with the city planning commission chairman and board members
the comprehensive plan recommends no change to the cmx1 commercial mixed use zoning at this location
the city rezoned this neighborhood in 1974 and a council supported map change the proposed use
is consistent with the character of the surrounding area which hosts several other takeout restaurants
the city planning commission recommends that the board grant the requested use variants for a
takeout restaurant thank you mi 2024 007 311 60 49 castor avenue i vote yes proviso hours of
operation 7a to 3p michael johns my sorry mr chair is that seven days a week it is seven days a week
thank you my vote is yes with proviso cheryl gaston my vote is yes with proviso tenetta
Graham, my vote is yes with Proviso.
Ryan McAdams, my vote is yes with Proviso.
Sen, could you please stay on?
All right, so we're going to move to number 13, MI-2025-002-813-6426, Castorapta.
There is a request for continuance from Community on the Rise.
Currently, they are in unanimous opposition of this.
what we want to do is we want to hear the case and if we can vote if not we're going to hold for
the community okay sure so um could you identify your client yes so my client is uh jimmy uh man
tom a tenant to the property all right um and our vice chair has a few questions
good uh morning again um have you uh emailed your documents five days in advance of this hearing
yes we did okay and do you waive the reading of this refusal and simply to its accuracy
i do okay thank you you may proceed with your case thank you uh so good morning again uh members
of the board i'm gonna go ahead and put up the documents we submitted to the zoning board on the
screen. Can the board see my screen on there? We can, sir. Thank you. So this is an application
for use of the space as a personal service. There is some history with this property,
which is worth noting because this exact application, this exact business actually
was approved by Variance back in 2020.
At the time, it was approved for three years,
temporary, to expire.
The owner of the business, at some point in 2024,
I believe, changed hands to the current operator
without changing the business.
The business has stayed the same throughout the time.
They, however, did not realize
that their zoning permit had expired until more recently,
And that is why we're before the board with this particular application again.
And this is, again, the same application for the same business that was operating since the original approval in 2021, because 2020, due to the pandemic, they actually didn't open for some time.
The reason this use is refused is because this zoning, this property is kind of unique in that it is partially CMX2 and partially RSA5.
And I would note that the proposed use is prohibited in the residential part of the property districting because it's kind of a divided zoning and the most restrictive zoning would apply.
So we met with the community and presented this matter.
They actually stopped by the business.
The community came by and did a walkthrough of the business.
And then we had the open meeting.
The hours of operation, admittedly, is longer than what was originally agreed to in the original temporary variants.
Again, the current operators have been working their business a little bit longer hours due to the demand.
working their business a little bit longer hours due to the demand.
There are some L&I violations relating to a certificate for fire alarm system.
And the license and inspections officer also indicated that there's a shower in the building
and they raised the question about why is there a shower in the building.
Those violations, actually, there was signage for fire, fire alarm certification, the zoning itself, and a extension cord that they asked to be removed.
So those were the primary violations.
And there was concern that with the shower and the way that business is structured, that people may be sleeping overnight instead of going home after work.
So that was something that was raised by the license and inspections inspector.
Now, before we went to the community meeting, we were asked to actually go and obtain a petition in support of the neighbors that was requested by the community and was performed by my office.
And we actually reached out to the neighbors on the block, including some of the businesses that are right next to the existing business who signed off.
I believe this particular one is a restaurant.
This is also likely a restaurant that's one is across the street, one is next door.
So these businesses, the owners are well aware of the operation.
They have no problem with the business being there for the past five, six years.
And there are residents in the area that also signed that had no issues with the business operations.
I'm not sure why the community decided to ask for continuance.
At the meeting, we weren't asked or told.
I was not told about any concerns that would lead to a continuance.
But obviously, their letter raises that particular concern.
this is photograph of the space and this is the plan layout so there's foot massage
chairs in the front I'm going to go ahead and zoom in a little bit because it's a little hard to
so this is the waiting area foot massage area and then the rest of the space has massage rooms
with the there's an exit to the back so actually there's a parking lot a large parking lot behind
this property which runs the property again runs all the way through and I believe it's the parking
lot area that is zoned RSA 5 in the zoning which led to the refusal based on the residential zoning
The portion that the actual business is located in is zone CMX2, to my knowledge.
So that is why we're before the board today.
It's essentially that this business has been started back in 2020 through a variance with the community.
They asked for temporary to make sure there won't be any issues with the business that would cause them to change their mind.
The current community group that we met with is a different, it's a different set of members
and different group than the original group who are no longer active.
So again, we did a petition based on their request.
We met with them and we allowed them also to do a site visit, all for the purpose of
showing that this is the same business that really has been there for the past five, six
years.
So what we're essentially asking the board to do is to extend that prior approval. I can show that this was the approval that was granted back in 2020, and at the time it was granted again temporary three-year to expire.
And that's essentially the cause of the reapplication that is before the board today.
So at the time, it was Oxford Circle Civic that was involved.
And they are the ones that supported us at that time for the temporary variance.
And this is the current owner is the same business doing the same name.
same type of business. The landowner is still Tommy Castor, LLC. So there is a lease
with my client ongoing. The other thing that is rather confusing to me on the letter itself was
uh, was the, uh, the vote, uh, the, it seems to me that the vote was support for the attendees.
the vote.
Um, and then it was later said that it was opposed by the attendees. So it's little,
um, little confusing, but that that's really where I'm at with this case is that we had,
um, we're basically asking the board to extend an existing business
to permit them to continue to operate in that location.
That concludes my testimony, and I'm happy to try to answer any questions.
I do believe...
Where's your client?
Has your client here?
I don't believe my client is here today.
He actually was traveling, and I was advised that he would not be available today.
Questions from the board.
As a point of clarification, I believe the owner has changed as well.
Yeah, I see the owners has one in California, the same thing.
No, the business owner, yes.
The business owner, Jimmy, has another operation before in California.
And that's his prior operation.
Questions from the board?
Yep, I have a question.
So I don't know if we can get the answer without the owner being here,
but could you go back to the drawings?
you said there was a shower that was there
has the shower been removed or if not do we know what the
purpose of the shower is since it was suspected that
overnight guests were there. So the let me get to the
plan. So that was put in with the
original build out of the space and I believe
i believe it's right here is what it's it's in the bathroom there's a shower and there's cow space
um it looks like it says shower room it's called out a shower room yeah let me um
so so the so it's still there right and do we know what is what the use is
I don't know if it's a shower room, but how was it used in terms of the business?
Yeah, so it was used because there's a lot of oils being used as part of the massage process,
and some people prefer to clean themselves before they leave
and actually use the shower for that purpose.
Other questions from the board?
so so so so was there a letter do we have a letter of support from the rco no i mean i i think the
only letter we have right now is their request for continuance along with they want a continuance
and at this point they're uh unanimously imposed okay gotcha thank you right so one last question
so will you um i know the hours of operation uh initially was agreed to uh as a different closure
but they've been staying open an hour later.
Had they discussed that with the RCO that you know of?
When we presented it, we had said that the extra hour mostly also is for cleaning up
and trying to get the business property shut down.
I didn't get feedback at that time.
They had an issue with it.
Apparently, they took issue with it on their letter.
But at the meeting, that was just a discussion that, you know, we're operating a little bit longer than what was originally agreed to.
But that was also, again, the prior operator followed the same hour.
So we didn't, my current client didn't realize that there was an agreement to close at 9.
Other questions?
It says here that there was some fire hazards or some fire conditions.
So the fire alarm needs to be certified again.
There's actually someone working on that with the owner of the business.
Since we got that notification, there was a fire exit sign that needs to, I guess, to be updated or replaced because it's not lighting up.
And there was some extension cords used for some of the rooms where they had extension cords running from the wall.
we were told that that is not permitted.
It's a fire hazard.
So you're talking the hardwired smoke detection system.
Certification.
Annual certification.
Emergency lighting.
All right.
And I guess...
They're actually in the process of remediating all those items that were listed.
Right.
But the shutdown was because of the...
the shutdown was because of the fact that the temporary permit had expired like two years ago?
Yes, yes. The temporary permit did expire two years ago. The current operator wasn't,
because it was an ongoing business when they came in. The prior business owner apparently became
pregnant and decided that she no longer can take care of the business and transferred it to the
current operator and because it was already operating and existing he didn't rethink anything
of it and just continued the same operation okay about how many clients do we have here
so they generally um that question was asked i think they generally have i believe
it's by appointment for the most part um and then they said that generally speaking
they can get it's three workers generally there and each can see probably four four clients to
five clients a day, minimum. So about 10 to 15 customers per day.
And the services you're offering, you said it's massage, so it's...
Right. So facial, foot, body massage.
Okay. Thank you.
Thank you.
Any other questions from the board?
um hillary we're going to wind up holding this um questions from our attorney
not at this time mr chair are there any questions from the virtual audience
no hands at this time chair planning do you want to wait uh we'll weigh in okay so what i'm going
to do is um maybe a resumptive hearing resumptive hearing will give a chance for the the community
to come in, have some say, and Jen, I think some of the questions that were asked would
be worthwhile if your client could be here, too, to answer particular questions, right?
So I'm going to schedule this for a resumptive hearing, 1-13-26 at 9.30 a.m.
Thank you.
Thank you.
I have one more matter, I believe, before the board today.
I don't know if that's ready to be heard or I can wait.
Why don't we do this?
Why don't, why don't you, yeah, okay.
Yeah, we'll be good.
All right, why don't we do it?
We'll, I see one of the councils in the audience here who, yeah, but we'll do your, not one
more, but I'm going to call it your fourth.
How's that sound?
Of course.
Of course.
So MI 2025-004-926-5017 Woodland Avenue.
This is a reconsideration hearing.
I believe that where we are with this is there will be a presentation by you.
There will be questions from the board.
There will be public testimony and the planning commission.
So just for the record, state your name.
Yes, Zen Jin, Z-H-E-N-J-I-N for the application.
Right. At the testimony and evidence presented at the original hearing on this matter are incorporated into the record for this hearing.
The scope of the reconsideration hearing is limited to the revised plans proposed by the applicant.
But as you start your presentation, you could just give us two minutes on what this case was about and then where you stand now.
OK, absolutely. Thank you, Chair. Good morning.
I'm going to share with the board the documentations we submitted for this reconsideration.
This is a reconsideration based on an application originally for a triplex at this location, which is zoned RSA 5.
We have, as part of our reconsideration request, reduced that to a duplex.
One of the main concerns, we believe, at the first hearing is the design of the building of the area is rather unique.
As the board can see from the photographs, there are porches, there are slanted roofs, and various unique design aspects to the facade, and our building is kind of a filler in the middle.
The community supported our original proposal, but the board had concerns with the original design being overly square and did not reflect the layout of the buildings in the area.
We have gone back with the architect to revise the building substantially, particularly in the setback facade area of the front to make sure that.
of sit back facade area of the front to make sure that the the roof design is one that while you
cannot exactly match next door has more of the character of the next door building brick facade
and the sit back porch which wasn't part of the original design all this would help make these
make this building fit much better into the neighborhood's design which I'm going to go
back to the photographs again that would much better fit the style of building that you see
already on the block which is a mix of brick and other materials but they have more character with
the porches and then this building which would share our the one side of our building has kind
of a unique slant to the roof. My client's architect tried to redesign with also a stylistic
slant, which would hopefully give it a much more coherent look to the two buildings once the new
building is constructed in. So it'll be brick facade, windows styled and sized appropriately
to match the neighboring properties and a front porch as well to match the neighboring properties.
We also will reduce the overall use from three units to two units by essentially taking away
the proposed third floor unit and enlarging the second and third floor combined unit to have
a much larger living, kitchen, family area, and the bedrooms would be part of a single unit rather
than having two separate units. The first floor unit would stay and continue to be structured
as originally proposed. And there is, again, a small setback roof deck for the upper floor unit.
so both units will have access to outdoor space as well.
So that is essentially the primary changes that were made
as part of our request for the board to reconsider this application.
We do want to point out again,
the community was in support from the beginning of this filler project
because they do want to see that this lot get developed.
And they originally actually had no issue with even the three-family design, mainly because it is not inconsistent with sizes and types of uses that they see in that area.
But we understand that a triplex might be too dense, and my client, again, has revised it to a duplex design at this point.
So that is our revised proposal we're presenting to the board today.
Do you want to bring your client on and adopt your testimony?
Yes, sure.
Let me see if...
Azik or Sam, can you raise your hand virtually to be identified?
There are no hands at this time being raised.
I counsel you.
You're an officer of the court.
We'll take your testimony.
Questions from the board?
Yes, I have a question. So the RCO was okay with the two units too, right?
Yes. Well, they were okay even with the three units. So they are still in support of RCO.
But they've seen the revised plans and everything. Okay. And thank you.
What's happening with the basement? I didn't see anything labeled.
Oh, my apologies. Let me put that back up.
yeah so one one of the uh the basement will be let me put up that again
so that'll be a utility and storage and washer dryer they
they're not going to there's no living in the basement um one second my apologies
yeah so there's washer dryer um utilities it's it's basically a water closet uh there's
it's just going to be a essentially a storage space at this point um no proposed living in
the basement but the it's it's so the is it going to be finished um it well it's going to be because
it's a new construction so it will be there will be i don't want to call it finished but it's
you know concrete concrete and everything else would be in the basement it's not a
like a like when we look at older houses they tend to have a pretty rundown looking basement
this is still be a fully fully set up basement the plan the point your plan um is showing
the plan the point your plan um is showing a furred out wall in the basement all the way around
yes so it would be in a sense finished finished yeah yes so you so so if you're if you're not
utilizing the basement why is it finished i think the original the original plan also had it as a
finished space for whatever the uh person who's going to occupy want to use it for whether it's
workout room or anything else uh but again we understand that the board generally do not wish
to have uh living in the basement and we we have no issue with that all right other questions
is there outdoor space for the first the first floor unit uh yes there's a rear yard um for the
first floor um i believe there is a site plan um i see it 10 foot rear yard by 16. thank you
thank you other questions questions from our attorney
not at this time mr chair questions or comments from the virtual audience
no hands raised at this time chair play any commission uh chairman we'll stand on our
previous recommendation okay um
so mi 2025 004926 5017 woodland avenue i vote yes with proviso maximum two dwelling units
Revised plans, two pages, stamped by ZBA on November 5th, 2025.
And no living in the basement?
No household living in the basement.
Michael Johnson, my vote is yes with provisos.
Cheryl Gaston, my vote is yes with provisos.
Tanetta Graham, my vote is yes with provisos.
Ryan McAdams, my vote is yes with provisos.
Thank you.
number three mi 2024 006 815 2000 west venango street um sherman tompin is the attorney
no rco letter do we have an rco letter hillary
or is a letter of opposition from tayoga united
Okay, so this one, so there were earlier letters submitted earlier this year, one in support and one in opposition.
But from your packet, it looked like there was another community meeting, I believe, in September.
And we have not seen any updated communications from the RCO from the time of that meeting.
Okay, just for the record, counsel, could you please state your name and spell for the sonographer?
Yes, my name is Sherman Toppin, last name T-O-P-P-I-N.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Could you identify your client, a relationship to the property?
Yes, my client is Mr. William Cook.
He should be in the audience.
He can be, I believe he's reflected there.
And our vice chair has a few questions for you, okay?
Good morning.
Have you submitted your documents five days in advance of this hearing?
I have.
And do you waive the reading of the refusal and stipulate to its accuracy?
All right.
Thank you.
you share your screen and proceed with the case okay so we are here um it should be right there
in front of you there it is so we're we're here to talk about 2000 west venango street and this
my client is william cook he is the individual owner of this property this property as you can
see by the picture is a industrial property but it is a series of just carriages that roll up in
the front uh we'll go we'll be talking to we'll be looking at the plans lower down let me just
go ahead and begin to scroll down to my typical all right so our the exhibits that we have here
include the this typical things that i generally present refusal deed application for appeal to
the cba the project information sheet the cba map um photos of the property as well as the plans
a notice of the hearing, the addresses we mail to, certificate of mailing, the notice of this
hearing, as well as photos of the posted hearing, as well, tax certificate. And the last thing we
don't have is the support from the RCO council person. Now, we know that Cindy Bass's,
her office contacted the RCO yesterday, because I was called yesterday at the same time.
We had a positive vote. We had 12 people voted in favor of our petition at the RCO meeting.
in favor of our petition at the RCO meeting. So it was a overwhelmingly positive vote in our
So it was an overwhelmingly positive vote.
favor. The issue that we had before to between the two RCO hearings was that we had a positive
vote in the first RCO hearing. But afterwards, a petition came in from members of the church
across the street that turned the tide, if you will. That was a surprise to us. We requested
a continuance so they could have another RCO meeting to flush out those issues of what these
folks had. In the second RCO meeting, none of those folks showed up. So we didn't understand
exactly what was fueling it. We know from the first hearing that because there's a school
across the street, that one of the issues that was mentioned by a member of the community was
that the kids come into school, they enter through the rear immediately across the street from our
use, and they were concerned about the drop-off and pickups and cars coming in down the street.
Now, we noted that there is a sidewalk in front of this.
So there is really not kids walking in the street.
There's no – our cars aren't driving in the street.
It's just a typical street.
So we weren't sure that that was a valid reason.
In the second RCO meeting, we talked about creating more of a security piece where that if cars are coming in the morning, there will be cones so that cars don't go anywhere near the other side of the street when they're coming in to be dropped off in the front of the day or at the end of the day.
with that explanation and with other explanations we had around the uses and times, we had the
support. And so we expected in this to get a positive letter of support from this RCO, which
has not been drafted. So that's why we don't have that exhibit present. But let's talk a little bit
about what our exhibit package does to show. What our client would like to do in this particular
space is automotive repair and there's an area for a paint shop you'd like to do those two uses
this particular property is owned or say five but it has historical industrial use it's not
a residential property it's under literally half under a bridge so this area has historically been
industrial it's it's basically an old school storage facility that is now was later rezoned
So that is what we are seeking here, to use it more along the lines of its historical use rather than as a residential site.
Further in our pack, we have the normal things that we would see, the deed showing the property is owned by Mr. William Cook.
We have our application for appeals setting forth exactly what we want to do here today.
And the project information sheet, which is number four.
As we move down, let's get down to some visuals.
Here we are.
So the property, as you can see in the red box, is a triangular-shaped property of sorts, and that big building right next to it is this church.
In that church is where they have a small school, and there's some residential houses on one side.
It's the northern side of the church building, but aside from that, you have the only neighbors being the highway and another industrial-use catacorner.
So this is not a block where folks are, as you can see, how the block is situated, and I'll make this a little bit bigger.
We were not convinced that there was an issue with – this is not a small street.
Let me just widen my screen just a bit.
Is it currently vacant or is it currently being used?
It's currently being used.
It's currently being used when my client purchased the property.
They were renting out each one of the storage space.
I got it.
So at one end of the storage, I guess the top of the triangle, there was a tenant there that had a use that the community did not like.
They were doing a, to be quite frank, overnight speakeasy on Fridays and Saturdays.
Speakeasy, yeah, okay.
So how about that?
Out of a storage unit, they'd roll it up and they'd have a speak.
So the first RCO meeting, they had a lot of talk about.
Do you do that just to give us a little humor?
Just to give you, we just want to let you know what was.
All right, okay.
It still exists in this city.
This is a roll-up garage speakeasy.
But that tenant was vacated, gone, and now all bays are used for simply automotive.
So that was the difference between RCU meeting one.
Now you're trying to have it zoned in the proper way.
Now we're trying to have it zoned legally so he can use it the proper way.
All right.
Thank you.
And so I'll go down.
So, again, you see the ZBA map showing the mix of uses in this particular area.
So this is not an area – this is an area that is residential surrounding that I2, CMX2, and my client's right on the edge of that, CMX2 on both corners, catacorner, and I2 right across the street.
So this is the character of the property that – so let's go right to what it looks like in the inside.
In our pictures – so – oh, let me go a little too fast there.
And in our pictures, you can see this is looking, this is on the tip of the triangle, the front tip, where you can see walking up to the, you can see the highway right there.
In our pictures, you can see this is looking – this is on the tip of the triangle.
And this is, these are the bays that run alongside the street.
There's a broad sidewalk there and cars sometimes, as you can see in this picture, park in front of the bay that they're leasing.
But there's, and so that's, that was, that's on that side.
Let me go on.
Let's show the reverse view further up.
But on the road further up is this big garage space.
So what we talked about in the community is that any car that is coming for service would go in there.
They would go in this gated garage area and not be on the street where people have to walk off if they were coming down that sidewalk.
That was an understanding and noticed by the client.
He said that there won't be cars parked on the sidewalk or in front of the building on this side.
They go into this space, and in that space where those two roll-up bays you see inside of the gated parking lot is where the paint is.
And that's the only part we're talking about are the whole all six?
It's the whole site.
It's the whole site.
So we're going to go down and see what's being.
When you roll up those bays, this is what you're seeing on the inside.
You're seeing just automotive repair stuff in each one of these bays.
one two three four five six so cars come in they fix them up and they roll out that's basically
one bay is a painting bay one no not that painting bay right now they have a temporary
painting bay but they're i'll show you the space this area in this picture that's in front of you
is where the painting bay will be the the they will it will come back and they'll be an exhaust
system in there all of that will be it'll be built out to code it'll be built out to code
environment and you can and here the where the painting bay is and i'll see you'll you'll see
on the plans later on exactly how it's situated let me make this a little smaller uh i'll make
this a little smaller all right so all right here we go so here is the bullseye view of i guess the
top the bird's eye view and you see from the you see the bays some are square in the front and
there's a couple irregular shaped ones the painting area will be back here in the back
so you'll come into the parking garage or the parking lot and the painting bay is back here
facing far from no no no people are there on the other side of that is the bridge okay um so that
is the ultimate um scenario as far as where it will be so um and going further down let me
open this up bigger back to normal size um is there an office there too yes yes so i'll show
you so the office is inside it's third third way in so you come in through one of the painting bay
one of those two bays from the outside lead into the painting bay area that's not yet built out
the second leads into this hallway this common hallway that runs along back here there is a
storage area in in this office there's actually a little bathroom it's not reflected here but
There's a little bathroom in that office space there.
But ultimately, only one bay is accessible there.
So the guys just sort of walk out and work in the bays and come out because it was built that way, not to have a rare access.
They just come to the front, and that's why you see a solid wall to all the bays and only the door on the one side.
Only one bay has access.
Bay two has access to the storage.
All the other bays, the workers just come walk around the building.
Um, and, and, and this area here is where the parking lot is and as you, and, uh, moving
So there is, so the existing conditions show that there's a sidewalk that runs along the
industrial, the use that my client had, and there's a sidewalk on the other side of the
street.
The kids aren't required to walk on that side of the street.
There's a whole street in between and they have their own way.
which is which was what the issue was they we didn't find that there was a safety issue so
much they were most concerned quite frankly on that that use i mentioned and when that use
disappeared i find that the community more supported the gentleman mr cook and he'll
testify to this has been an automotive repair guy his whole life that he's came up as a young kid
doing that's how he feeds his family he has he has plans on doing training for other young men
trying to come up into the automotive trade in that space.
He already mentors a couple that work for him.
So he's that guy.
He's a small businessman, tradesman, and is seeking to use this as his.
And this is his only site.
This is his bread and butter site.
He put all of his chips into this use,
and he's hoping to broaden it into painting and having it there.
Let me increase the size of this a little bit more,
and we'll get to the rest of what I've got to present.
So we had a meeting, again, we had two RCO meetings.
So we had a meeting.
Again, we have two RCO meetings.
I already talked about those two.
I already talked about those two.
The second one was definitely more positive.
It was completely positive.
It was like night and day out of the two.
And then we have in our package all the addresses that we mailed,
and our number 10 exhibit is our certificate of mailing of all of those addresses.
We just sort of lay it out here.
And then our proof of mailing is at the end of that.
And here's our notice of this hearing, which was posted on the property here, on the fence.
It shows the property immediately behind this gate.
And then Mr. Cook's tax cert is the last, Exhibit 13, which is good until the end of this month, end of November, issue date, and it expires at the end of November.
So he has a valid tax.
um he has everything in order at this point he simply just wanted the community to be in support
of his use and with that i'd like to bring mr cook on to adopt my test okay mr cook
mr cook has been promoted and they're allowed to thank you hi mr cook could you please state
your name and spell for the stenographer william w-i-l-l-a-m hook c-o-o-k
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Could you turn your video on if possible?
We're trying to.
Well, why don't we start?
Counsel?
Mr. Cook, have you heard all of the testimony that I've made on your behalf up to this point?
And do you agree to this testimony?
Would you adopt it as your own if you could testify?
Is there anything that you would like to add to let the board hear what I did not mention relating to the property or the use that's proposed?
Yes, I was talking to Miss Duffalo's at Gratz High School as far as starting an auto program there.
And it was all contingent on this hearing here, as well as Lotus Outreach is called Laura.
It's a nonprofit as far as teaching the kids auto repair work.
OK, and you've proceeded with that in lieu of this hearing or just in general?
How did those conversations come about?
My brother is the high school coach at Grats High School, and he mentioned to his colleagues that, you know, I was in the auto repair business.
this and they said that they were trying to start a program and we just started talking up from there
and um that's how that's how everything all of this transpired because of the teaching of the
kids uh i just wanted to have everything um on point as far as uh legally with the city and
everything okay i understand and um and you would you adopt my i don't know if i asked you that
would you doubt my testimony as your own? Yes.
Okay. Any questions of the board? Questions from the
board. The smaller bays,
what are the dimensions of the smaller bays?
And is the intent that the cars will be
parked in those bays, the smaller ones? I didn't see any
dimensions on the plan. Yes, there's some dimensions.
i'll go to it so that you can see that yeah i'm in 600 yeah i guess those are dimensions
so here here are the dimensions i mean we'll make it a little smaller so i well i mean it doesn't
say you know like bay number five it's what by what five oh i see the dimension link the length
and width right the architect did here is the architect just indicated the the gross square
footage but not the length and width so are the so okay so are the bays that are like number five
four other than the one that's notated as storage is the intent that cars will be in those bays
when they're when they're worked on oh so you're referring to um bay five
the small ones that front on north 20th street i'm it's up to my i'm trying to get to
i'm making sure that a car can fit in the bay you know all the way because you made a statement
that no cars will be parked on the pavement when they're being worked on so if but the
bays have got to be able to fit a car right i understand imagine on the plan okay mr mr cook
can you answer the question as far as can a bay accommodate each car reversing in or driving in
Can a bay accommodate each car reversing in or driving in forward?
forward.
Yes, a bay can accommodate actually about three cars.
And what's the depth, do you know, off the top of your head?
No, I don't know off the top of my head.
But you can definitely get three cars in each bay.
And with the doors closed?
I have a question.
So this is all one business?
Yes, yes.
And are the bays, do he rent the bays out for storage, vehicle storage for some folks?
My understanding, previously, all of these bays had different tents that were rented.
When Mr. Cook purchased it, he began to use them.
Some of them were rented, and he used the balance of them for his business.
So the ones that he rents out, does he have any kind of policy for them not to park on the pavement?
Mr. Cook?
Or signage or something like that for them?
Yes, Mr. Cook, there's two parts to the question. I guess one, is your business occupying all bays? And if you're leasing some of them, do you have some instructions for people who you rent to relating to parking on the street?
Mr. Cook?
Yes, can you hear me now?
You can now, sir.
Oh, I'm sorry. Yes, yes, there would be no parking on the street because I know I'm already getting pushed back from the neighbors.
So I don't I definitely don't want anything else to interfere.
That would include the sidewalk, too. It's the sidewalk.
And yeah, no, no, definitely no parking on the sidewalk.
OK. And the other question was, are you is your business occupying all of the bays at this time or will you know?
OK, you will. You have some of these that are rented to others.
yes you mean like now is it i don't understand the question well and again the question was
they want to know if there's a single business operating the property and you've said no to that
so there's some bays you still rent to others is that's is that correct for storage for storage
only and for those bays have you or have you produced any instructions to those tenants how
to not park in front of their
bay or on the sidewalk in front of their
bay? Yes.
Okay, so they have
that from you? Yes.
And how will that be enforced
by you?
Verbally.
I'll go and check
to make sure that they're not
following the rules.
Okay, and if they
are, would that be an infraction
of the lease that you have with them?
Yes, it's definitely cause for termination
of the lease.
Other questions?
Yes, okay.
asking questions
about the spray
painting, is it?
So we have
you have a
ventilation system for this?
I'll be getting
one installed.
Okay, so
So you're doing, it says personal vehicle repair, but you're also doing body, fender, and spray painting as part of this?
Light body, no painting.
Light body.
Yeah, yeah.
I thought you're asking for paint.
Do you mean now?
don't like no i'm talking about your plan here you're oh yes the plan yes the plan is to have
painting yes okay so do you have like uh you're planning to have paint booths how are you planning
to to do this is that what that is in this space here that you're pointing out on the plan is for
painting yes a paint booth yeah a paint booth okay so that means you have to have um exhaust system
uh yes and then there's the question about um hazardous waste um
removal how are you handling that uh it's a company called safety clean
that that handles the waste removal right and usually for um these paint booths you have to
have a certain fire reading um have you looked into that is that part of what you're planning
to do here yes okay all right you're saying yes but you're my my question is more um have you looked
um have you looked into all the parts of this painting yes it's companies that come out and
into all the parts of this
when they when they build the paint booth they build the fire uh system with it like it comes
installed with it so it's not like you can just get a paint booth without the uh the fire uh system
it's already installed in it so i definitely done my due diligence on that all right and then i guess
I'm trying to figure out okay so um from this plan from what I'm understanding was discussed
before there's this parking lot that's over to the right hand side is that
and then people would come in they they would park the car and then come into an office say
to I guess check the car in and say what kind of services that they're going to have
And then there's no entrances here into these different parts of this, other than from this area, or where are the other entrances to these garages or whatever you want to call them, or this part of the building, the bays?
Well, the two entrances, can you make this screen bigger?
The two entrances here, I believe, the top side of the triangle or the bottom of the garage?
The bottom part.
So why don't you show where the office is and how you would get to the office, I think.
No, I'm talking about just getting into the base themselves because I'm not seeing how you.
yeah the bays only have roll up roll up uh garage door in front of each bay that's the
but there's to your point um there's no there's no pathway from the other side the back side of
the bays to the main area they walking around they have to walk around ah okay all right at
least at this point the way because it's a solid wall there gotcha okay all right thank you other
the questions questions for our attorney hillary emerson not at this time mr chair questions or
comments from the virtual audience chair we have charles richardson with his hands raised
he's allowed to speak good morning mr richardson good morning mr chair and board
hi could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer charles richardson r-i-c-h-a-r-d
S.O.N. Office of Councilwoman Cindy Bass Room 508 City Hall. You swear or affirm to tell the
truth the whole truth nothing but the truth. I do. Please proceed. I am aware that the second
meeting did take place with regard to this property. The first one there was some contention
because of the fact that there was the as Sherman had alluded to there was a illegal use going on
inside the property at the
time. There was a second meeting that took
place this year on
September the 16th and
this is according to and I'm reading
from Regina
RCO chair that the second
meeting took place and
she said that she sent
out a letter. I don't
know why it never reached you guys but
she sent a letter of approval and that
But the people that attended the meeting did approve of the granting the variance for this property.
So we'll stand in non-opposition.
You're standing in?
Non-opposition.
Oh, thank you very much.
Thank you much.
Is there anyone else in the audience?
Hi, Chair.
We have Adrian Fernandez with their hand raised.
They're allowed to speak.
adrian
chair the hand just went down okay thank you um anyone else
planning commission thank you chairman and good afternoon david vecto with the city planning
commission the comprehensive plan recommends no change to the rsa5 residential single family
zoning at this location the city rezoned this neighborhood in 2006 and a community requested
map change at that time this property was zoned c2 today's commercial cmx2 commercial mixed use
even if the property zoning had not changed cmx2 would still not allow the proposed use
cmx2 would still not allow the proposed use this property has received several violations for an
This property has received several violations.
unlicensed auto repair and for exterior sanitation the city planning commission recommends the board
grant a proposed use variance for personal vehicle repair maintenance but deny the use
variance for a paint finishing shop due to its proximity to the row homes across the street
um i'm going to hold this two weeks and we'll come back on a wednesday and vote on this at
9 30 a.m okay thank you chair i'm sorry to interrupt we had that hand go back up from
the call-in listener if the case is over she'll you know we we're not going to take a call now
I mean, the case is done.
Reschedule for two weeks, and we'll come back and we'll vote.
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you.
Hillary, we break at what, 1230?
We break at 1230 or what?
We cannot go past 1 o'clock.
So I think we have three more matters.
Right.
All right, let me go with number eight.
MI-2025-000-393-5339 Wayne Avenue.
Vern Anastasio is the attorney.
Let's see here.
There's unanimous support from the 12th Board Democratic Committee, 15 total votes, and a letter of opposition from Solo Germantown, but the letter of opposition contains provisos.
They're being promoted to panelists, Chair.
afternoon mr chair council could you please state your name and spell for the sonographer
yep it's verne anastasio a-n-a-s-t-a-s-i-o on behalf of mr wilkins hatton all right do you
swear or firm to tell the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth i do our vice chair has a
few questions. Good afternoon. Have you submitted your documents five days
in advance of this hearing? Good afternoon. Yes, I did. And do
you waive the reading of the vizuzo and stipulate to its accuracy? I do.
Okay, thank you. You can proceed. Thank you.
To chair and members of the board, this is
5339 Wayne Avenue, and
And it, let me do this here.
Application is for six units.
It's legalizing pre-existing use.
Submitted in my 66-page exhibit packet that I'm moving into evidence is a very long history of zoning for this property.
That shows this as multifamily, which is why the coordinating RCO gave unanimous support, as everybody knows this, to be a six-family dwelling.
There was a six-unit rental license.
It's been outfitted, according to the International Building Code, for a six-family dwelling.
and anyway so let's get to
the interior so you can see
what we're talking about. Apartment
number one is this efficiency
apartment right here.
There's a
main hall
and it takes you to the back which is
apartment
two which is a one bedroom.
Going up
the stairs to the second floor
you're going to be in a
main hallway here.
You've got one unit here.
Second floor.
And you've got another efficiency in the front
where my cursor is.
And you have the identical layout at the top floor.
Another efficiency up front.
And a one-bedroom apartment.
I'm going to pull out and show you some photos.
And I can zoom in at any time, so please ask away.
But page 10 through 38 are all photos of the different units.
also included in this exhibit packet is a legal affidavit of continuous use
by my client swearing under oath of the continuity of the six unit
It's wearing under oath of the continuity of the six-unit dwelling.
There's a front view.
You've got your trash storage on the side for all the units.
All six mailboxes, which you can see there's nothing recent about those.
You've got your fire mitigation system.
your electrical plus the seventh house account your dry basement
additional photos of different units
there's the letter that went out to all the individual 78 individual households
We did two mailings. There is the, at the time, active six-unit rental license.
Page 46 of the exhibit being moved into evidence. We also have our deed of
aerial shots showing a considerable amount of vacant space. So this is not a matter
of overbuilding or over-legalizing or a density problem, as you can see.
Here's the zoning map.
Here's the trash plan that's under contract.
And here's the overwhelming 15 folks in support, mostly immediate neighbors, who know this
property and know that it has always been a six-family dwelling. I did not get a chance to
review the provisos of the secondary RCO, but I'm certainly willing, so is my client, to do anything
within reason. We understand that we will still need to go through the process again to get an
administrative CO as well. And with that, because of the long history of the property in question
of a multifamily dwelling because of its current unique condition that makes compliance impossible,
if not impracticable. I respectfully request the granting of the variance,
and I would like to have Mr. Wilkins Hatton raise his virtual hand if he's still in the audience.
Vern, before we go to him, so I see Solow writes a letter that there's numerous L&I violations,
and they've had numerous complaints about the building over the years.
Yeah. Well, over the years, I can't speak to it. There are a few current violations that I'm working personally with the board of L&I Review Board to get them.
None of them are health and safety issues. I think the only thing still left is the use.
But yeah. And you, in fact, there was rental licenses for all six.
There were. Yeah. And I've moved that into evidence already.
All right. You want to bring your client on? Yes, sir. Thank you.
Wilkins Hatton, if you could please raise your virtual hand.
Do we see his hand?
There's no one with their hand raised at this time.
All right, Vern, you're an officer of the court. We'll take your testimony.
Thank you.
Questions from the board.
Yeah, I'm looking at the atlas and there are five open violations, electrical hazard, waste accumulation, prohibited plumbing system issues, inspection, testing and maintenance.
Yeah, they haven't been. They just haven't been closed out yet.
Again, I'm personally working on these. The electrical work has been done.
So has the plumbing. The trash was a minor issue that we've dealt with.
that action
is pending. There's a
stay until we get through this.
the past
you weren't aware of the past ones. Okay.
All right.
And this is currently occupied?
The whole building is occupied?
I don't think the entire building is occupied
but it is, I believe
three of the units are occupied.
Other questions?
chair we have charles richardson with their hand raised okay it's just i'll get to him in one
minute council or hillary emerson questions or comments not at this time questions or
comments from the virtual audience mr richardson good afternoon again mr chair just for the record
good afternoon again mr chair just for the record mr richard just state your name
certainly charles richardson r-i-c-h-a-r-d-s-o-n office of councilwoman cindy bathroom 508 city
hall please proceed sir you've already been sworn thank you uh looking at the um summary from the
second meeting that took place
which was
May the 22nd of 2025
there were
15 attendees
and all were
in support
of this project
number of
attendees is 21
three RCOs
16 near neighbors
and the applicant of course
and Vern were
there at that meeting
uh the rco is uh in favor and we will stand in non-opposition for this project thank you
anyone else in the virtual audience
no hands at this time chair plenty commission thank you chairman and good afternoon david
effecto with the city planning commission chairman and board members the comprehensive
plan recommends a change in zoning at this location from rsa 3 residential single family
to rta 1 residential 2 family attached the city's re rezone this neighborhood in 1974 and a council
supported map change this property has a documented use as three dwelling units dating to the 1940s
this appears to be a legalization of a previously approved use the city planning commission
recommends the board grant a proposed
legalization of six dwelling units.
And my
Oh, you ready to go.
And my 2025
000393
5339 Wayne Avenue.
I vote yes. Michael Johns.
My vote is yes.
Cheryl Gaston. My vote is yes.
Tannetta Graham. My vote is yes.
Ryan McAdams. My vote is yes.
Thank you all. Thank you, counsel.
Hillary, we're shooting for one.
All right.
One more.
And my 2025, 003, 773, 1230 to 36 Wall Street.
Henry Clinton.
They're being promoted to panelists.
There's a letter of support from the 14th Community Organization, RCO.
Seven in support, four in opposition, and a letter of non-opposition from Councilmember
Young.
There is a recommendation for a proviso.
Good afternoon, Mr. Chairman.
Henry Clinton, H-T-N-R-Y, C-L-I-N-T-O-N.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Could you identify your client, the relationship to this property?
My client is St. Joseph Holdings, LLC, and the principal of which is URI, Y-U-R-Y, Steingart, S-T-E-I-N-G-A-R-T.
He's on the call.
And our vice chair has a few questions for you, Mr. Clinton.
Good afternoon.
Have you submitted your documents five days in advance of this hearing?
Yes, I have, Ms. Graham.
All right.
And do you waive the reading of the refusal and stipulate to its accuracy?
Okay, thank you.
You can share your screen and proceed with your case.
Thank you.
Is that visible, Mr. Chairman?
All right.
Good afternoon, Mr. Chairman, members of the board.
I'm here on behalf of St. Joseph Property Holdings, LLC.
Principal Yuri Steingart is on the call, as is the architect, Ryan Salomeo, who will walk through the floor plans.
This is a relocation of lot lines to create two lots.
One is a single family home that's existing.
It'll remain.
The issue before the board is the other lot upon which we propose a two family dwelling.
There are other multifamily properties on the block on the same side of the street as well as across the street.
And we have a letter of support from the community group and a pre-detailed community benefits agreement, which I believe was already forwarded to the board.
Table of contents, A1 through A10.
Notice of refusal.
This is an RSA 5 zoning district, single family, relocation of lot lines.
Lot E is the one that we're talking about today.
There's no change in the existing structure for lot F, which is going to be continued use as a single-family home.
We have two refusals, one for use, one for dimensional.
We have two refusals, one for use, one for dimensional.
The dimensional variances are de minimis.
The average lot size, required lot size, is 960.
We're 18 feet short of that on one lot and 29 feet short of that on the other lot.
And there are 2% and 3% variations, which would be considered de minimis.
the rco letter i have is a separate attachment but i think you already referred to it mr
chairman i'll bring it up toward the end uh this is wallace street 1200 block the single family
home is here that remains uh we're proposing a two-family dwelling adjacent to the existing
single family posting of the posters on the lot adjacent to the single family and this is the
single-family property right here these are plans that have been prepared by
Harman Deutsch the subject property where the vacant lot is is parcel E
existing family is F and here's a infill of that those two properties we have a
chart prepared showing the board the other multi-family as well as single
family that are on the block and in the neighborhood. The purple are the two-family
dwellings and the blue are the single-family dwelling. So on this side of the street, we do
have one two-family dwelling already. Across the street are numerous duplexes as well as around
the corner on 13th Street on both sides of the street. So Ryan, I'm going to ask you to unmute
yourself and you can walk through the floor plans for the board. Ryan is an architect with Harmon
in Deutsch-Olo architecture?
If you could unmute yourself.
They're allowed to speak.
Hi, Ryan.
Good morning.
Hi, Ryan.
Could you please state your name
as Bell for the stenographer?
Yes, my name is Ryan Salomeo,
R-Y-A-N-S-O-L-I-M-E-O.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Council.
Ryan, can you walk through the floor plans for this two-family dwelling for the board, and I'll use the cursor as you go from basement to the roof?
Sure. Starting in the top left corner, that is our basement plan.
There is three bedrooms and two bathrooms.
as you'll see the entire rear yard area will be dug out and will be open to the back so
it will appear as a um you know it won't it won't be it won't have just like small egress wells that
entire space is dug out and then there are stairs that lead from the rear yard out to the alley
which is to the west of our building um the next plan in the middle there is the first floor plan
the area in tan is where they enter into from the street um so there'll be two doors one into the
first floor and basement unit and then one which will enter into the second third second and third
floor which also has rooftop access um and both units are four bed three bath units the first
floor and basement unit has the outdoor sunken patio garden space and the upper unit has access
to a roof deck which is accessed through an open staircase so you would step can you just address
a little bit about what this area here is in the rear of the building yeah so there so instead of
having a rear yard at the back of the first floor we've dug that entire section out um so that the
basement has full walkout capacity into that garden space and then those stairs that we've
That leads up to the four-foot alley to the side of our building.
And we have a cutaway of that later on in the presentation.
Yes, there's a section through that that shows that.
Second floor?
Yes, second floor has one bedroom, one bath, and then the kitchen and living for that unit.
And then the third floor has three additional bedrooms and two additional bathrooms.
Each unit has trash storage in the mechanical space with washer-dryer, HVAC, and trash storage.
And then here's the elevations. We have a brick front with the mansard little detailing at the
top and the back as you can see the the cutaway that shows the full openness of
that shows the full openness of the basement and the stairs leading back up to the
the basement and the stairs leading back up
the egress alley to our right side on this photo on this drawing
and here's a section through that just shows that rear yard space being
dug out so that their their outdoor space is at the basement level
uh this is that was the survey plan for the line relocation yeah i want to go to the the cutaway
okay we already did that all right we'll go to the survey this is the uh
lot line relocation plan yes and that's our zoning
and that's the streets approval for the
All right. The remaining documents, I'll go from here, Ryan. Thank you. Remaining documents are the typical documents you would see in a presentation. I have two tax clearances because the original LLC was inadvertently formed with the number two at the end for some reason.
The real property owner is St. Joseph Property Holdings, LLC, but I got certificates for both just in case we're on any issues.
Zoning map, again, reflecting this is an RSA 5 zoning district, but the usage is compatible with some of the other multifamily on the block as well as on 13th Street.
This is a deed indicating ownership.
This is the corrected deed, indicating that the proper owner is St. Joseph Property Holdings, LLC.
Notice of mailing to the community, we mailed out 82 pieces of mail to everyone within 200 feet of the property.
Also, I can bring up the letter of support from the community.
So this is a letter from 14th Community Organization indicating that they do support the project.
There was some concern about bedrooms in the basement, not necessarily because of access issues, but because they were concerned that someone might try to convert that into another unit or perhaps use it for short-term rentals.
and we did negotiate with the fourth community organization
that there will be no short-term rentals
or any type of reconstruction or subdivision of that basement unit.
We also entered into a community benefits agreement.
We're limited to two dwellings.
The original proposal was three dwellings.
Foundation excavation will not go lower than the adjacent neighbors
and we'll have underpinning, one vented closet in each dwelling, no visitor accommodation,
red brick on the front, utility meters painted red, install a street tree. And we're also going
to participate in the housing voucher with PHA with at least one dwelling unit for a period of
time devoted to that program. This is a summary of the vote, as the chairman mentioned at the
outset you want to show your client on pardon me your client yes uh yuri can you unmute yourself
please
yuri steingart
you're on the call
mr steingart can you raise your hand
I have a hand raised from Joe Barone.
Joe Barone is the other principal with the LLC.
Okay, thank you.
Hello there.
Hi, sir.
Mr. Barone.
Hi, Mr. Barone.
Could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer?
Yes, Joseph J. Barone, Jr.
And Mr. Brown, could you please, hold on, do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Yes, I do.
Two things. One, could you turn your video on, and the other thing is you're going to have to speak up because you're coming across very low.
Let me try my video here.
Let's see.
We're going to bring you back in as a panelist.
okay can you hear me at least a little bit better yeah
okay can you hear me at least a little bit better
joe can you speak a little bit louder when i ask you the questions
yes uh were you on were you on the call when i presented the project that you're a member of the
llc yes and if you had the opportunity to testify would you adopt my testimony as your own and as
children correct yes all right questions from the board
Henry just could you show the basement again please sure
and I just a comment that uh you know the bedrooms in the basement a living space in
the basement this is clearly a better way to do it because you completely walk outside so
So that definitely is appreciated in terms of that layout.
So the only concern that I would have just their four bedroom units, and there's just not a whole lot of like real sort of living space and closet space, but that's not a zoning issue.
Other questions from the board?
Questions or comments from our attorney, Hillary Emerson?
not at this time mr questions or comments from the virtual audience no hands raised at this time
chair thank you chairman and good afternoon david vector with the city planning commission
chairman and board members the comprehensive plan recommends no change to the rsa5 residential
single family zoning at this location the city changed the zoning maps in this neighborhood
in 2017 and a council requested map change the both the proposed lot sizes and the proposed
two-family use are consistent with the character of the other homes and lots on this block face
the city planning commission recommends of the board grant the proposed use variance for two
dwelling units and the proposed dimensional variance for a lot area thank you MI 2025
5-0-0-3-7-7-3-1-2-30-36
Wallace Street. I vote yes with proviso.
No limited lodging. Michael Johns, my vote is
yes with proviso. Cheryl Gaston, my vote is yes with proviso.
Tanetta Graham, my vote is yes with proviso. Brian McAdams, my vote
is yes with proviso. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
We have one case left. We'll do that at 2 p.m. today.
sorry that we have to wait so long
but we have to take a break
the staff needs a little bit of a break
is there anyone else whose case
has not been called other than the
2244 Margaret Street
Margaret Street
I'm sorry
see everyone at 2pm
So we still have one case from this morning, and we're going to do that first.
Number 10, MI 2025, 002-775-2244-Margaret Street,
Marisol Acosta is the attorney for the case.
Good afternoon, Mr. Chair.
This is Jason Hammond.
They will be coming back in as a panel shortly.
Thank you.
You're welcome.
Hi, good afternoon.
Good morning, counsel.
Could you please state your name and spell it for the stenographer?
Maricel Acosta, M-A-R-I-S-E-L, last name A-C-O-S-T-A.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
We're very sorry we didn't get to you this morning.
It's okay.
Could you identify your client in a relationship to the property?
Yes, my client is Alexander Schlachterman.
Dr. Schlachterman is the sole member and owner of Baha's One LLC.
Baja Swan LLC is the owner of 2244 Margaret Street.
I see you have support from the Bridesburg Community Action.
There's also a letter of support from Council Member Driscoll and two form letters of support.
Our vice chair has a few questions for you.
Good afternoon.
Have you emailed your documents five days in advance of this hearing?
Yes, the original submissions were indeed. I know that the board asked on Monday for
Yes, the original submissions were indeed.
I know that the board asked.
indoor pictures. So those were submitted on Monday as a supplement.
Great. Thank you. And do you waive the reading of the refusal and stipulate to its accuracy?
I do accept the parcel owner shown on the refusal notice is the prior owner. I think it may have
just been a delay maybe with the city having updated who the owner was. So it shows parcel
owner as the prior owner when indeed you'll see from the deed the owner at that time was
Baha's one LLC. Okay, thank you. You may share your screen and proceed with your case.
should be the green button on the bottom yeah i'm hearing share screen but it's not giving me
a green light on the share button it says cancel you will open your cancel uh documents already
I think you open your documents.
It's open.
The document is open already, but let me see if, oh, there we go.
Can you see?
Yep, it's coming up.
Okay, great.
We're good.
Thank you.
So thank you, Mr. Chairman and board members.
I'm here again on behalf of Baja's Juan LLC regarding a request for a use variance from
a single family to a two-family dwelling at 2244 Margaret Street.
This is the picture.
It's a corner lot right on Taconi and Margaret.
Basically, the story on here is that the owner, Dr. Schlachterman, through his LLC,
He's been a member of Philadelphia and working in Philadelphia basically all of his life, except for some of his training and basically as a renter most of that time as well.
And he now owns his first home.
And now he wanted to also be invested in the city where he works.
So he has friends in this neighborhood in Breitsburg where he heard of this particular property that was in need of love.
and he wanted to be able to help increase the housing stock in the city and to be able to
invest back in the city where he works and was raised. So he bought this property in October of
2024. The owner who was there had been, I understand, for generations within the same
family, just different generations. But in the last many years, they didn't have the means to
really maintained. So there had been a lot of disrepair inside of the home and it'd become
really dilapidated. And I believe the owner hadn't really been able to find somebody to
buy the property as is to just live in it because of the conditions that it were in.
And so through these friends that live in the neighborhood, my husband, I'm sorry,
my client decided to try to connect with the property owners. And once you start,
you know, he bought the property. And once you started working in and trying to make repairs and
see what kind of damage internally had to be repaired, it was evident that it's, you know,
it's a lot of investment that has to be made to fix it up. He wants to fix this up and have it,
you know, be a benefit to the community. And the only way really to make it a viable economic use
for the community is to have the variance that he's requested. So that instead of having it,
you know, be this two-floor single family, he can have one unit in the first floor and one unit in
the second floor. So it could be a smaller, you know, two-unit housing that would allow for more
affordable pricing. The variance that he's requesting will not harm the adjacent property.
In fact, he has the support written letters from both of the adjacent property owners.
He's not looking to, you know, build up additional floors or do anything that would create some sort of disruption for light or for air for any of the neighbors or create any public concerns.
So we don't believe there'll be any adverse impact.
To the contrary, we think if he's able to do this, it will be a benefit to the community.
And the last thing is we believe the variance that is being requested, which is just from the one family to the two family dwelling, is the minimum necessary for the relief that's requested and to make this something viable.
Okay, could you show us some photos?
I'm going to go through just so you have what the packet includes.
We have basically, let me just start really quick.
I'll show you what I meant about the error in the notice of refusal.
the notice of refusal. So this is the notice of refusal from April 15th. The reason was that
So this is the notice of refusal from April 15th.
it's an RSA 5 zone and we're seeking to use it for two families. Down here, if you could see,
is where it says parcel owner. That was the prior owner that this property was purchased from.
I'll show you in the deed. Whoops, went too far.
So this is the deed that was recorded with the city back in October 2024, that was the
prior owner and Baja Swan LLC is the right owner.
So any event, once we received the denial, a timely application for appeal was filed
that included the project information form. We went ahead and submitted letters to the
neighbors. 135 letters were sent. This is a template of that. Announcing for the public
meeting that took place with the RCO on October 2nd. And I can, my client was present at that
meeting, so he could also attest to that. And the occurrence during the meeting, this
is confirming the mailing to the two adjacent property owners, and this is the proof of the
135 letters that were mailed. So the RCO meeting went well. We have the support, as you mentioned
earlier. This is the final position taken of support with the letter. What we don't have here,
but i understand you did receive it was that letter of non-opposition from district six
councilman um michael driscoll i understand it's a letter of support it's a letter okay great well
great um yeah i understand that i haven't seen the letter i understand that it was uploaded okay
thank you and this is the letters from the two owners sorry
okay this is claudia guzman um on margaret street side and on the other side on um
to Coney is I think what we should do now you should show us what you're going to do
like do you have plans so I understand that the original sorry these are the tax clearances I'll
just finish that um and the poster for the hearing today that was 20 days ahead um and there's some
pictures on the back which were the indoor that I can let um if you have questions on that I can let
my client talk about that but in short it shows a lot of the damage and some of the stuff he's
been able to start he got a permit for indoor demolition so he was able to start clearing
through he replaced windows this is kind of some of the before etc etc this is some of the layout
um my understanding is that the initial permit that was submitted to l and i didn't include any
any plans he hadn't invested yet on an architect to have plans and my understanding was that l
and i didn't ask that and didn't ask for them but that it was you know the denied and i know that
when we uh that initial april 25th appeal um there i don't know that there were plans there
there were plans that were um drafted and presented at the rco meeting but i i see that
they weren't included in this packet i can if you want to see share with you um and then submit it
if you'd allow that a pdf i have a pdf of the plan sorry so so i think what we need to do is we need
to see what you're going to do like that like a drawing with you right now like drawings what
it's going to look like we you know for both floors right so yes that with you i do um let me
see if can you share this can you see this tab we see it maybe you can blow it up just a little bit
okay okay so you can see the basement there's no living space in the basement it's just storage
um and here's the first that's the first floor that you're looking at and then the second floor
is to the right um so these plans which were the ones presented at the rco have it set up as like
A TWO-BEDROOM ON EACH LEVEL.
SO THAT FIRST FLOOR, THERE'S A KITCHEN IN WHAT YOU'RE CALLING COMMON
space there's like not a living room or what is what is that yes it's a common space together so
a kitchen with um you know a common space all all in one okay
um you know a common space all all in one okay and then a washer dryer with two bedrooms all
which have their own windows and then a bathroom okay um questions from the board
uh trash storage what's the plan what's the plan for trash
so in the back there's a storage um area in the back of the building and that's where the trash
cans will be and so there's it sorry go ahead no go ahead and there's which i don't think that you
can it just says storage unit i don't have a picture of but it's oh well i guess from the
very front of the building you could it's basically the back on taconi street so there's storage
They'll store these in that what says storage unit is that's a garage that's attached to it.
Currently, it's a garage. Yeah. And my understanding is there's a separate permit that was submitted to L&I that's still pending to bring into compliance that area, because apparently that's not really a garage.
It's so there's some changes that will need to be made to bring that into compliance.
Again, more of the investments that have to be made.
But the plan, again, is back in what you saw on that first page that had kind of like a garage towards the end would look like a garage.
That's the storage area. And it will be just a smaller storage area back there to fit all the trash cans.
And there's a deck off of the second floor.
so this will this is part of the of that other permit that is still pending but the idea is just
to be able to have stairs from outside so instead of that other area that you could see in that
initial picture on the back which kind of had like a full deck area on top of that storage
area beneath this will just be the smaller storage underneath some stairs this is if we get the
approval that's pending, which I think is contingent on us getting the variance. But
then they would build the stairs to be able to go up independently into the second floor. So
there'll be a small area so that it's, you know, it's not like a big deck, but just an area so
that you have a landing, so to speak, up there, which is back there.
other questions so when you say storage unit you mean we have a picture of do you have a photo of
it yeah just let me see if from the street it looks like a garage right and that's the that's
part of what is subject to that separate pending permit application which is to bring it into
comply here let me see if we can see let me blow this up
so from this picture i think you can you can see what looks like like a deck on the top and what
looks like a garage which again these need to be addressed but that's part of that separate
application. And I will, if once I can bring in my client in to testify, he can also explain more
of the details of what's pending there, but there's not going to be that top full
sort of deck that appears to be there. And this isn't going to be, you know, sticking out here
in that way, but it'll be storage that will be compliant storage back there underneath the
planned stairs is there a curb cut there too i cannot answer that curb cut shows up on the atlas
i mean on the google on google earth it shows there's a curb cut right in front of the garage
door i'd have to yeah i'd have to defer that maybe to my client if he can why don't you bring
your client on. Yes. So he's Dr. Alexander Schlachterman. He should be here if he could
raise his hand to join in. Thanks for being rejoined as a panel shortly, Counselor.
Thank you. I understood. Yeah, I apologize. I know he's currently working at the hospital and
he's trying to remain as available as he can. Hi, everyone. Can you see me?
We can. Yeah, sure. Oh, very good. Good. Could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer?
Yes. Hi, my name is Dr. Alexander Schlockterman, A-L-E-X-A-N-D-E-R, last name Schlockterman, S-C-H-L-A-C-H-T-E-R-M-A-N-E-R.
Last name Schlockterman, S-C-H-L-A-C-H-T-E-R-M-A-N.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Yes, I do.
Counsel?
Counsel, could you?
Hi, Dr. Schlockterman.
Have you heard the testimony that I have provided up to now?
I have, and I attest that it is true, and I agree to it.
I was going to ask if you could attest that it's correct and accurate, and do you adopt it as your own?
Thank you.
Are you going to ask them about their background?
Can you share with the board more information about the curb cut and about what looks like a garage currently?
Yes, I can.
Thank you.
So in that area, it had previously been used as a garage space with a garage door and the curb cut for cars to enter and exit that area.
We found upon investigation of the property that this was not legally obtained.
And so we are not planning to use it as a garage space, but rather maintain it as a storage space.
we've removed the first three feet which were again not in compliance that's that overhang roof
that came with the demo permit and the and the facade corrections that we did as well and so at
this time there is access to the back of the building through those doorways and as I said
it's not being used or planned to be used as a garage okay questions from the board
okay i'm still on the storage unit thing um so there's is there a walkway uh something there
there was talk of putting stairs there to make an entrance for the second floor is that what
you're planning to do there or yes ma'am so the egress from the second floor um currently the
space that we're calling storage will be maintained with the walls. The roof was in
disrepair, and so that's been removed. And we currently have access to the second floor.
And again, that will be future permit provided that we're able to move forward with the duplex
so that we'll be able to have an egress from the second floor down to the street and then
turning along the side of the building and right at the back door, which is, as you can see that
overhang in the previous garage space, that's the access to the back door. So that area will be
accessed so that there's an addition of steps. It's not a building, but it does warrant a permit
for an addition to be built for those steps, which will be covered stairs coming from the second
floor down to the street giving entrance and exit for the second floor. All right so you're going to
have then two means of ingress and egress to the second floor is that what I'm hearing? Currently
it will be one means from to the second floor through the through the back staircase there
will be windows in each bedroom the only entrant the only other exit or entrance to the building
will be from the front of the building to the first floor so each apartment will have an egress
with windows. All right. And then this overhang, is that an awning? It used to be. It has been
removed when we found that it was not within regulation or it wasn't allowed, basically. I
don't know that the previous owners had installed these things. That was all removed once we found
that it was not allowed. And are you still going to have that garage door there or are you going
to put something else there? I would put doors, but not garage door. And yeah, it'll be much
easier to access doors, opening, closing to move the trash cans in and out. Okay. And then my only
other question, and, you know, again, why two bedrooms? Yeah. So as I, I'm sorry, I go ahead.
I mean, the living, the actual living space is a little small, and it looks like the bedrooms are
take up most of the um the area for the unit so um and and so in thinking of the plan the for
the floor plan as to whether this be you know a one bedroom on each floor versus two bedroom uh
it is within code to have larger um these these rooms are uh i believe the the measurements on that
plan that Ms. Acosta brought up, but they are within code and they were at least 10 by 12,
I believe, bedrooms with enough floor space to have, oh, there we go.
So the measurements may be on there, may not. But these are the, they're actually pretty good sized bedrooms. I agree that they could be bigger and you could have huge rooms.
The measurements may be on there, may not, but these are the,
I think you're referring to the actual living space, which you're calling a common space where the common space kitchen and the living room is like.
yeah so pretty small compared to uh the space that you have for the um for these yeah so so i i grew
up in a house where the common space was really the space where family hung out and uh and enjoyed
company uh and really it with the with the modern view of the kitchen connected to the living space
it cuts out those unnecessary rooms that aren't used like a dining room.
And these, so in my understanding and the way that I feel that this would be a nice setup
was that you could actually have a big open area like we have here for the living space
and easy access to stay connected to mom or dad, whoever's doing dinner.
And so that was my thought process in this open forum.
all right and it's also easier for keeping an eye on kids which I have too and I think that
it's tough if you want to be with them I don't have I don't have an issue with
you having an open I think they call it open concept there I think that the open concept
is in a very small space as compared to the space that you have for the two bedrooms and
if you had just one bedroom you'd have more space for this common area if you will just my
just my two cents here any other questions i agree questions or comments from our attorney
ryan mcsherry uh good afternoon uh i just wanted to note that i guess the the requested variance if
granted by the board today would only apply to i guess the property as it currently stands it
would not apply uh the use variance would not apply to any future additions to the property
the applicant would need to get a refusal and then come back to the board to essentially
extend the variance to those uh to any additions to the property
okay questions or comments from the audience or the first audience
yeah i do not see any hands raised hi planning commission amy boy with the planning commission
amyboid do you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth i do please
proceed the comprehensive plan recommends no change to the rsa 5 residential single family
zoning at this location the city rezoned this neighborhood in 1971 and the council supported
map change there are no unique physical conditions or circumstances of this property that would
prevent it from being used in strict conformity with the zoning code this is a primary single
family block face. The planning commission recommends that the board deny the proposed
use variance for two dwelling units. So counsel, I'm going to hold this case and we're going to
vote on it on in two weeks on Wednesday at 2 p.m. We're going to go to executive session and just
trying to iron out some of the things that we've heard today and figure out where we stand with
this. Okay. Okay. Can I add one? I know that wasn't included, but I was looking at Atlas.
If I may add that it is an RSA five area, but there are right across the street directly in front and catty corner on both of them and behind multiple CMX twos that are half, you know, multiple units allowed.
So it would be disruptive to the neighborhood.
Well, that's part of the record.
Your comments will be part of the record.
OK, so two weeks on Wednesday at 2 p.m.
We will vote.
OK, thank you very much.
Thank you.
Is there anyone left from this morning whose case has not been called?
I do not see any hands, Mr. Chair.
Okay, so here we go with the afternoon session.
Good afternoon, everyone.
My name is Bill Bergman, and I will be chairing this meeting of the Zoning Board of Adjustment.
With me is our Vice Chair, Tanetta Graham.
Present, Mr. Chairman.
Our Board Secretary, Charlotte L. Gaston.
Present, Mr. Chairman.
Our Board Member, Michael Johns.
Present, Mr. Chairman.
And our Board Member, Ryan McAdams.
Present, Mr. Chairman.
Also here is our attorney, Ryan McSherry, and today we also have with us, let me get her name here, Maria Como, who was a third-year Villanova student who's been helping out with our attorney's house today, right?
And also here is Ian Haggerty and our border administrator, Lakeisha Dandy.
Recording of this hearing will be posted on the ZBA website.
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Please remain there so we can account for you.
Let's look at our schedule for this afternoon.
Number one, MI-2025-001-870-1518 West Tioga Street.
This case is continued to 3-18-26 at 2 p.m.
And number six, MI-2025-004-033-1608-14 Walnut Street,
This case is continued to 3-18-26 at 2 p.m.
Are there any other requests for continuances?
Good afternoon, Mr. Chair.
This is Jason Handel, who will be your co-host for the session.
I have a hand up from Mr. Sherman Toppin.
Mr. Toppin.
Good afternoon, members of the board.
I wanted to discuss or seek a continuance for 4860 Lancaster Avenue.
I believe it's scheduled for 330, so I'm not sure if you're handling all of the continuance.
No, we're going to come back to that, Charlie.
Okay, thank you.
Thank you, sir.
Any other requests for continuance?
Yes, Chair, I have a hand up from a Ms. Michelle Payne.
I will allow them to speak.
Thank you.
hello can you can you see me hi hi could you please state your name and spell for the
sonographer uh my name is michelle pain m-i-c-h-e-l-l-e-p-a-y-n-e you swear or firm to tell
the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth i do what case are you interested in and
It's 5-1-1-2 Willows Avenue.
Number two.
Ms. Payne, let me ask you this.
Do you have an attorney?
I do not.
So our understanding is you're going to need an attorney to move forward.
OK, you because you can't you can't represent yourself.
It's an LLC.
So I'm not the LLC.
I'm a I'm a neighbor.
OK, well, but you're not.
So what are you what are you trying to say?
I have just, I'm a neighbor objector, and I was just asking for a continuance.
Okay, so I'm going to call that case very shortly, okay?
Just give us a chance.
We'll let you have some of your say, okay?
All right, any other requests for continuance?
No further hats, Mr. Chair.
okay so we're going to go to the add-ons mi 2025 001 886 627 north 64 street i vote yes
i vote yes michael johnson's vote is yes excuse me uh this is our board council ryan mcsherey
michael johnson's vote is yes excuse me
i believe we just need a certification that the video has been the video recording has
been watched before we take a vote right okay um i i have i certify that i've watched
the video and and have read all notes relative to the case i believe uh mr mcadams also needs to
certify
Michael John
go ahead Michael
Michael John my vote is yes
Cheryl Gaston my vote is yes
Tanetta Graham
my vote is no
Ryan McAdams certify that I
watched the video
the October I'm sorry October
8th video recording of the hearing
in this matter and my vote is yes
okay and number two
Tanetta Graham will handle this
Thank you, Chair. MI-2025-003642, 5334 West Gerrard Avenue. My vote is yes.
Michael Johns, my vote is yes.
Cheryl Gaston, my vote is yes.
Ryan McAdams, my vote is yes.
in the basement here yeah yeah that's right you got it yep you were good okay okay good all good
all right and number three mi2024-007-233-2719 east allegheny avenue the vote in this matter
has been rescheduled to wednesday november 19th at 2 p.m we're going to go to case number two
MI-2025-003-967-5112 Willows Avenue.
The owner is Philadelphia Renovation Group, LLC.
Chair, Joseph Consul has their hand raised.
Do I promote them?
Chair?
Hi, Mr. Consul.
Yes, please promote them, Jay.
Yeah, they'll be coming back in shortly.
Good afternoon, board.
Joe Consul.
Are you handling this case?
Yes, sir.
All right.
State your name and spell it for the sonographer.
Joseph Consul.
That's J-O-S-E-P-H.
Last name is Consul.
That's C-O-N-S-O-L-E.
You swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Mr. Consul, there was a neighbor just on requesting a continuum to bring that person back on?
Ms. Payne?
Do we see her hand?
They'll be rejoining as a panelist now, Mr. Chair.
Ms. Payne, are you available?
Chair, I think we can move on.
Okay, we'll move on.
Mr. Counsel, you already was sworn.
and could you identify your client
in relationship to the property?
Yes, my client is Philadelphia Renovation Group, LLC.
Both principals, which are Mark Pagano
and Jamal Hassben are on the call,
as well as Shang Chen, the architect for the project.
There's a letter of support from Cedar Park Neighbors
based on revised plans.
And there was opposition from neighbors
and they talk about it here, okay?
Our vice chair has a few questions for you, sir.
Good afternoon.
Have you submitted your documents
five days in advance of this hearing?
And do you waive the reading of the refusal
and stipulate to its accuracy?
Okay, thank you.
You can share your screen and proceed with your case.
All right, my screen should be up.
The lot we are looking at
is the empty lot on the screen,
between the two properties directly in the middle. It's 5-1-1-2 Willows Avenue. Mark Pagano and Jamal
Hasbin are the owners of Philadelphia Renovation Group LLC, the group that purchased the property
in 2024. We are here for one-dimensional variance.
One-dimensional variance to permit the erection of a new attached single-family home.
Before I talk about what we're building, I will mention briefly the procedural history of this case, which is a little bit unique.
So, on my screen on October 17th, 2024, Ellen and I reviewed my team's application for an attached home and issued a buy-write zoning permit.
My clients, in good faith, relied on that permit and moved forward with their development plans.
Eight months later, they got this letter, which was June of 2025.
L&I realized its mistake and issued this intent to revoke. The revocation did not create the need
for the variance. The fact that the lots 20 foot wide in an RSA 3 zone always required it because
they were unable to comply with the side yard requirements. However, this created sort of a
confusing, delayed process that brings us to today's hearing. As mentioned, we were always
going to need a variance today, as Atlas confirms, and as you saw on the screen a second ago,
it's a vacant 20-foot wide lot. Total square footage is 2,028 square feet. This lot has sat
undeveloped for decades. It at one point was owned by the city's redevelopment authority.
RSA 3 code requires an 8-foot side yard to be semi-detached on a 20-foot wide lot.
This setback would consume 40% of the property's worth, approximately leaving my clients with a 12-foot wide buildable footprint,
which if I just zip back to these, you can see is not in conformance with the other lots on the block.
nor is it economically viable nor is it reasonable or functional to design a single family dwelling
with um that's 12 feet wide because of these unique physical conditions the property cannot
be developed in strict conformity with the code to allow for a reasonable single family use or
to promote the development of a home on a long standing dilapidated lot this is not a self-inflicted
hardship. It's inherent to the narrow dimensions of the lot. Furthermore, as you can see,
5110 and 5114 willows, as mentioned, both in the RCO letter and in the screen you can see now,
those properties have solid windowless party walls facing the vacant lot. The block itself,
we can say anticipates an attached infill home in this location.
Just zipping over to the plans.
Let's see, we ran a little bit here.
Proposal is to build a high-quality single-family home that makes reasonable use of this lot.
We have experienced developers that are proposing a full basement with a family room,
one bedroom, and a full bathroom.
First floor feature the main living room, including a dining room, a kitchen, and a powder room.
Second floor has got two bedrooms with their own bathrooms and a laundry room.
Third floor will serve as the primary suite, contains a master bedroom, master bathroom, and a walk-in closet and a study.
The architect can speak about any questions regarding the plans as well as they're on the call.
And finally, we'll have an eight-foot setback on that third floor.
Originally, we did not have that, but the plans have since been redesigned.
Regarding the basement level, this is not – let's see if I can find the right photos for that.
This is not a dark, unsafe sort of space.
that it will contain two separate dedicated emergency egress routes from this level.
From the rear bedroom, you have what amounts to a full-height door that provides a direct walkout exit into the rear egress wall.
And from the front family room, there's a separate dedicated egress wall for the front window.
Regarding the RCO process, we believe this is an example of the RCO process working as intended.
The evolution of the project's exterior directly addresses variance criteria.
We first presented, or my clients did, presented to Cedar Park.
Originally, they were in opposition, as there was concern about the original three-story facade not being in compliance.
as there was concern about the original three-story facade not being in compliance with the rest of
the block my clients returned with uh updated plans which redesigned the project's exterior
in response to every concern that they had the revised plans uh let's see if i can find the
revised plans form. There it is. Set back the third story by eight feet, added a full-width
front porch across the entire front of the house, aligned the new home's front facade with the
direct neighbors at 5114 Willows, and matched the porch roof floor lines and window lines to
the neighboring homes. As a direct result of presenting all those changes, we have the support
of the RCOs. There is neighbor opposition that does not appear to be related at all to the side
yard variance request, though I'm sure someone on the call will speak about that. We believe it
just has to do with issues outside of our control regarding the ownership of the property.
So in conclusion, we have a clear and necessary hardship based on the width of the property.
It's not self-created, nor will it alter the essential character of the neighborhood.
In fact, it will improve it by filling in a longstanding vacant lot.
With that, I'll call my client unless the board would like to speak to the architect about their plans at all.
We will talk.
Why don't you call your client first?
And if we need your architect, we'll get back.
You got it.
All right.
Mark or Jamal.
Pagano will be coming back in as a panel shortly.
Hey, this is Mark Pagano.
I'm here.
Mark, please state your name and spell for the sonographer.
Mark Pagano, M-A-R-K-P-A-G-A-N-O.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Counsel, please proceed.
Good afternoon, Mark.
Did you hear my testimony just now?
Was it accurate, and do you adopt it as your own?
I have nothing further pending.
Any questions?
Questions from the board.
uh yeah you mentioned that there there's a direct walk out from the basement to the rear yard but
the plan doesn't show that is that a revive another revision to the plans or am i missing
um i mark can can you comment on that and or should i call the architect in
yeah you can ask shang to hop on for that
i heard him raise his hand
i'll be coming back in as a panel shortly okay thank you what's his name
it's uh hs shang is pronounced shang pronounced shang okay but it's h-s-i-n-g
hi can you hear me i can could you please state your name and spelled for the stenographer
Yes, my name is Xin Yuan Chen, H-S-I-N-G-Y-U-A-N, last name C-H-E-N.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Please proceed, counsel.
Could you please address the board member's question, Mr. Johns?
Yes, respond to the front egress original that was on the original design and when we submit to
the previous building permit. We do have the egress well in the front for the family room.
However, to respond RCO's comment and we redesign the front facade and then we remove the front
egress well and we put the entire uh wall with the property west of the porch and then to align
with the jason neighbor and that's why we changed the egress well to the windows you can see the
the front facade the small window below the uh the porch deck so so does the big stuff so the
in the new plan does the basement extend under the porch uh not not basement under under the
porch but we just leave the window there if you see the section yeah the section here you can see
uh the the couch for the family room but but we just put the the window below the deck
But we just put the window below the deck, not extend the basement fully out.
I see.
So they're just windows.
So they're not an egress window.
They're just windows.
They're going to be a dark room with the porch over top of it.
But what I thought I heard the attorney say was that there was a direct walkout from the bedroom to the rear yard.
That's what I understood him.
uh the rear yes the rear yard there's a bedroom yes no no is it is there an exit uh out of the
rear yard well we do have egress well right so that's what that's what i did so the egress well
there's not a direct access out like a stairway that goes up to the yard uh correct okay
yeah i have a question so um i know that um there's some opposition with some of the neighbors
um do you have support from the two houses that are um immediately adjacent to the parcel
mark are you aware uh i would say no the the woman that at uh first requested uh to be on
the call uh she's 51 14 and then 51 10 uh didn't show up to the first rco but they came to the
second one um but uh their um comments were um i don't know how to say this not not kind of not
related to the build just different things they were saying i got a little out of control but
no i would say um no and are there any other three-story uh houses on your side of the block
Yes, I need to go to the Google's preview.
I'm not sure if I can share my screen.
Well, your testimony, tell us what you see.
Is it 5122, Mr. Chen?
Is that what you're looking at?
Yeah, so this was a duplex approved by the board.
I don't see when, but I'll bring it up.
That's the corner, right?
Yeah, not on the corner, though.
No, it is not the corner.
All the other two-story houses are to the left of this
house, correct? Yes. Thank you.
Other questions from the board?
Questions from our attorney? No,
Chair. Questions or comments from the audience or the virtual audience?
Yes, Chair. I have a Todd Shalvey.
Todd Shalvey. They'll be coming back in as a panel shortly.
All right.
And it should be Todd Chevelli, excuse me.
hello everybody i am not involved in this case um i am involved i believe in the next case
well thank you very much
is there anyone in the audience
relative to this case
I have a handle from Velvet
I have a Michelle Payne's hand up
I'll start with them first
excuse me
any hand
who is it
Michelle Powell
hi hi michelle yes that's me right i've already swore you in i understand you're a neighbor
if you can could you please turn your video on oh sure
thank you michelle could you give us your comments on this case sure um i i have a lot
um i'll try to get through them quickly um i'm the adjacent neighbor at 51 14 willow's
I'm the adjacent neighbor at 5114 Willows Avenue. Obviously, like you said, it's a freestanding detached two-story home, and I'm objecting to this variance in this development.
Avenue.
From the outset, I'm concerned and confused. I'm not sure how we arrived at this point procedurally.
I understand that mistakes were made on the front end with L&I, but the very first line of the Philadelphia Zoning Codes table of building types that are allowed in this district, it lists attached structures as expressly prohibited in RSA 1, 2, and 3.
and this is an RSA 3. And that's under the use provisions of the code, not the dimensional
provisions of the code. So I'm just not, I'm really confused at why this is not an expressly
prohibited structure. My understanding is that they're just not permitted at all in this zoning
district. And the code is very specific side yard requirements described throughout it with
explicit charts and figures that show all of the combinations of circumstances, but there are none
at all that exist for lots in the RSA 1, 2, and 3 that are detached homes, or that are, excuse me,
that are bounded on both sides by a neighboring structure. So this application is looking to put,
take two detached homes and attach them, and then construct a three-story structure that doesn't
just change the dimension of the side yard but it takes it out all together um and like i said
honestly i've been confused about the nature of the refusal of the variance because it seems like
it is offering relief from a prohibition that is just completely fundamental to the district
definitions here um and that's that's the legal part of my argument um but i have others um
Why don't you give us what you're what you're why you're against it. Please tell us that.
So aside from the fact that I think it violates the code and it makes the code mean mean nothing.
Well, you've said that about the code, but give me the other issues.
So, OK, so this is a short, wide block. It gets a lot of foot in car traffic. It gets fire truck traffic.
It's a connector from 52nd Street and Baltimore Avenue. All of the buildings on it are built at about the same time, 100 years ago.
there are two different districts um on this block this side is rsm or rsa3 the other side
is rm1 um the block was zoned this way for as far back as i've been able to to check the code
um even on the on the north side there are like modified side yards in the back there's sort of
those u-shaped dog ear space um i don't know how to say it a side court that um is not part of this
building um and except for the the two three-story buildings on the block there's the one that you
saw that's not quite on the corner but it's just beside the fire station and there's one on the
other north corner um there are let's get concentrating on why is it you're against it
Don't describe. Tell me why you're. I'm describing because it's it's really relevant to why it doesn't fit the character of.
All right. So you're saying this building doesn't fit the character, right?
It doesn't fit the character. It's not within the general welfare and the public health.
We've been working for years on putting together on clearing out portions of the lot and planning perennials.
If you could see, I submitted some pictures. There's a blooming perennial garden there. The neighbors want that. I think they all wrote letters. This has never been used this way historically. In the history of Philadelphia, it's never had a structure on it.
And the zoning code has updated that and updated that and never changed it.
I don't think they've made a case for the minimum variance requirement.
I don't think they've made a case for a hardship because they bought the land this way, knowing that it was narrow and that it would have to attach two detached structures, which it's not zoned for.
I mean, I have other reasons.
i submitted comments online um i tried to list all of them i submitted pictures okay um and i
know that velvet who is here is the other um adjoining adjacent lot and she would like to
be able to comment as well we appreciate your viewpoint we thank you for taking the time let
me move on to the other neighbor okay yeah and i we understand where you are okay
i need more hands up yes velvet how will be promoted shortly mr chair
Yes, Velvet Howell will be promoted shortly, Mr. Chair.
Hello.
Hi, could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer?
My name is Velvet Howell.
Could you spell your last name, please?
H as in Henry, O-W-E-L-L.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Yes, I do.
I understand you are a neighbor next to this parcel here.
Are you in favor of this project or against?
I am against.
Could you give us any reason that hasn't already been said?
As what Michelle, my neighbor, has stated, based on the codes, there's no breezeway for the sides.
That house has been always a detached home.
It's now at no choice of my own.
If that build becomes now, that it will now be in an attached home.
I am worried about them building a home on that lot where there's never been a build before.
and the foundation of the other homes based on the ages to crumble down.
That lot has been, it's not a sore eye.
It has been utilized for, as what Michelle said, a beautiful garden, and it's been well taken care of.
And I feel as though some of the coding has been dismissed in regards to, I think the last meeting I was on, Mr. Consul mentioned it.
I missed the first one, but I did attend to the second one.
And they were stating about how are they going to take trash out?
There is everyone has that side breezeway where you can leave your garbage and take it in the morning.
But if you're going to leave it on the porch, you know, or are they going to take it through the home?
There's so many different variables that are there that we have concerns about.
Right. Thank you very much for taking the time to call so we understand your position.
Is there anyone else in the audience?
Yes, Sean Markovich.
I will promote on the panelist right now.
How many more hands do you have, Jason?
Just this one.
Hello.
Hello.
My name is Sean Markovich, S-H-A-W-N, last name M-A-R-K-O-V-I-C-H.
I'm actually here.
Hold on.
Hold on.
Oh, sorry.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Are you a neighbor?
Could you tell us your position in this case?
Right.
I'm here representing Cedar Park Neighbors.
The RCO assigned this case.
Are you in favor of this project or against?
Cedar Park Neighbors does support this.
I want to make one important notation because I felt it was misleading in the beginning of the presentation.
the um initial plans that were presented to you did show the original front facade with the full
three-story and that is not at all that was agreed upon i did see the provisos but i just
want to make sure that that is not submitted that front facade with the full three-story is not
submitted um because i felt it was really confusing to see those presented here today
that was that was my mistake sean i i apologize for that i brought up the provide the revised
plans after that but that was originally my mistake right i did see the revised plans thank
you because it does i just want to make sure that's absolutely clear um and then i take full
credit for that okay thank you um and then i did also want to note that um the third floor is allowed
by right and it would i understand neighbors concerns about having a three-story allowed by
right on a block that is predominantly two-story with the exception of the one but that is what
the code has given us and we can only make the best of what we have with this code so the code
allows a full three-story right up against the front of this streetscape by right and as much
as i wish it didn't that's what it does allow so um i just wanted to make sure that that was
absolutely clear thank you thank you is there anyone else jace
no further hands mr chair planning commission
oh oh come on come on up wait we have someone here come on up yes i believe my client had
wanted to respond to some other comments so there's a there's another oh okay wants to testify
come on take a seat
I apologize.
Take a seat.
All right, and if you would, pull the mic close to you and turn it on.
See the green button?
All right.
Could you state your name and spell it for the stenographer?
Yvette Young, Y-V-E-T-T-E-Y-O-U-N-G.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Are you a neighbor?
All right, please proceed then.
I just seeing the situation my concern for the residents there is when you build a three-story
structure between two two-story structures you're now blocking the sunlight that those
residents would typically be receiving so not only does it look strange which I've seen
in a lot of cases around the city we're changing uh neighborhoods in a manner that is not
historically the way that those neighborhoods were built and it does look odd all right thank
thank you very much for taking the time we appreciate it um joe do you want to make a
statement uh i believe my client wanted to just address a couple of the things that were were
said he had his hand he had his hand up he can speak briefly and then i'll rest yeah just quick
I know there was a comment made by Michelle that this was a garden or perennials, and it was never a garden.
I have pictures before when we took down a 600-foot tree, and it was fully overgrown.
I have pictures that were submitted as an exhibit.
You should have them there, but this was never a garden at all.
So, Mark, is your testimony that the garden issue was something that was sort of manufactured after the fact?
Correct.
correct the fence was always that white fence but the part of it had like a swing gate so you
could go in there um we replaced that in the last month because michelle did start planning
starting the plant when the rto notifications went out so we did put the fence up to secure it but
no this i have pictures there was a monster tree there that was a a nuisance and and uh could have
fell on somebody's house that we took down it was fully fully overgrown and i submitted them to the
zba uh calendar as exhibits too and i can send them to joe to share on a screen if you need them
okay i just have one quick question and can i ask one quick question to the uh to the attorney
this is a privately held lot correct correct though it's not a publicly it's not public land
right correct and it goes from property to property correct structure to structure if you
were to do a side yard on each side how much width would you have to build something you would
I mean, if you were to do the minimum, you'd be down to 12 feet total.
It's 20 feet now.
So bottom line, you could barely build something if you did any kind of setback.
But the fact that...
You would not be able to build a house as wide as any of the other homes on the street.
And 12 feet is extremely small and not livable.
so basically this is it would be a hardship to try to do anything other than kind of what you're
doing absolutely and here's the here's the old tree photo as well is that right mark or is that
is that a different tree yes that's a three i have i have actual pictures from my tree guy before he
removed it of the lot and it was uh you know very very overgrown there there was not one flower in
that in that yard behind that fence thank you mark planning commission amy boyd with the planning
commission the comprehensive plan recommends no change in zoning at this location to the rsa3
residential single family there are properties on this block that contain side yards where others
do not the appellant has demonstrated that the narrowness of the lot presents unique side
constraints for fully complying with the zoning code for side yard setback however the proposed
deviation from the code is not the least minimum the planning commission recommends that the board
grant their requested variance for no side yard with proviso minimum five foot set back
okay um mr council we're going to hold this vote for two weeks we're going to vote on it wednesday
two weeks from now at 2 p.m understood thank you thank you for your presentation
have a good day everyone thank you bye thank you
MI-2025-003-971-1920-4036.
Excuse me, Chair.
There was a request to hear matter number seven on the earlier side.
Pounds?
Yes, I believe Mr. Goldberg, I think, had a conflict this evening.
So I think that request.
And now you'll hear the rest of them together, right?
All right.
okay all right
All right.
thank you so number seven mi2025 004043 1128 mount vernon street
alms goldberg is the attorney um mr goldberg could you state your name as
spelled for the stenographer a-l-e-x-g-o-l-d-b-e-r-g right do you
swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth
i do could you identify your client the relationship to the property
Sure. My client is Lee Tereshuk. She's in the virtual audience. She's the owner of the property.
Okay. Our vice chair has a few questions.
Good afternoon. Have you emailed your documents five days in advance of this hearing?
I have.
And do you waive the refusal and stipulate to its accuracy?
I think there's one inaccuracy, very minor.
um there's no reference to the existing single family living that shares the building with the
visitor accommodations i think the refusals are correct but in the description i think that should
be referenced thank you at the 14th community organization rco uh 16 in support um one
opposition and a letter of non-opposition from council member young and applicant also has 26
signatures from neighbors 19 from the block that's right thank you okay um so my client
lee tarishuk was before the board in 2022 where she got approval for this same variance
nothing has changed here that variance is set to expire in on december 1st of this year
of course we respect the the process and we understand the reasons why a you need a variance
for this type of use and b why they're given on a temporary basis i think in this specific case
this is a textbook uh you know good operator who has had no complaints from her near neighbors
she got letters of support both times through this process uh but you know the variance is
set to expire after the third year and we're here again um so i know the board has changed over but
much of the information is the same here's our notice of refusal um again that that variance in
2022 is set to expire december 1st 2025 for visitor accommodations and lee lives in the first
floor uh and this visitor accommodations unit is on the second and third floor same building so she
owns and manages the property it's one unit yeah so it's a two-unit building right like she lives
on the ground floor she has a two-unit rental license even though technically she's one of her
own tenants um and has you know great relationships with the neighbors here's the most recent letter
of support that references 16 to 1 uh that there were near neighbors uh on mount vernon who voted
in support at the meeting and that while they typically don't support these types of things
they this owner has operated for three years without complaints and no one has reported any
issues. Here's the meeting summary letter. This is the letter from 2022, actually a different RCO
that said similar things and that they're in support and they trusted her at the time. And
I think she's really made good on that olive branch that the RCO made to her. This is that
notice of decision. And here's a two-unit rental license that she has.
Petition, as you referenced, Mr. Chairman, 26 signatures, many of which from Mount Vernon Street.
She has a good relationship with the neighbors.
She told me she also has a good relationship with the sanitation workers on her block.
Very kind lady.
You'll hear her adopt my testimony if you have any questions for her.
There are other Airbnbs nearby in this part of Philadelphia.
She's not the only one in close proximity.
Here's a zoning map.
This is an RSA-5 property that legally has two units.
Here's the photos. This is street to street. You'll see parking in the rear, not accessible
by the guests. Here's the posting on both facades to the right of the property on Mount Vernon and
to the left. And then Clay Street is the rear street behind her. Interior photos. So again,
second and third floor, there's sort of a sunroom up there. There's a roof deck. There's actually a
sauna in there. There's nice amenities. She really takes personal enjoyment out of the people
that she meets that stay with her. Designed for four to six guests at a time. She does have some
longer term bookings like two to three months that signed an additional rental agreement. She's got
284 reviews, 4.96 stars. Here are some of those. There you go. 4.96 guest favorite. She has quiet
hours no parties no smoking no pets and you know generally has been an asset to the community here
and, you know, generally has been an asset to the community.
Here's very basic plans.
The owner's apartment is here on the first floor,
accessed through a common vestibule.
You go up the stairs, you have a bedroom and a bathroom
with kitchen and dining on the second floor,
and then upstairs you have more living spaces
and like a large balcony, but considered a roof deck
and another bedroom there as well.
Here's the meeting notice.
We met with the RCO in October.
Mailing certificates, application for appeal, and tax deed and tax clearance.
And the one thing I'd ask the board to consider before I call my client on to adopt my testimony
is possibly four to five years, but we deferred to the board.
Why don't you bring your client on?
Lee, if you could raise your virtual hand.
Can you hear me?
We can.
Hi, could you please state your name and spell for this letter?
My name is Lee Terechchuk, L-E-E-T-E-R-E-S-C-H-U-K.
Do you swear or affirm the tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Could you turn your video on?
Could you turn your video on?
Turn the video on.
What do I do?
Okay, why don't we start the testimony, Counselor?
hi lee did you hear my testimony today yes i do and was it true and correct yes do you adopt it
as your own yes is there anything else that you'd like to share with the board today about your um
your short-term uh your visitor accommodation oh i really appreciate my neighborhood um
If my neighborhood is not safe, actually, even the zoning, my guests will not appear.
My guests come from Six Continental, even come from Israel, North Europe.
So it's not only exposed for Philadelphia, it's also for USA.
Most of my guests worry about safety.
so I really want to show appreciation
my neighborhood has been
even better than before
and my guests they feel safe
so I just
want the board to know
besides you approve I also want you
to show appreciation how
Philadelphia has improved
and then my neighborhood
be safe for all my
guests because their safety
is my first priority
okay thank you very much
Questions from the board?
Questions from our attorney?
No, Chair.
Questions or comments from this audience or the virtual audience?
Planning Commission?
Amy Boyd with the Planning Commission.
The comprehensive plan recommends no change to the RSA 5 residential single-family zoning at this location.
the appellant has not demonstrated that there are unique physical conditions or circumstances
of the property that would prevent it from being used in conformance at the zoning code
the planning commission recommends that the board deny their requested variance for visitor
accommodation mi-2025-004-043-1128 mount vernon street i vote yes with proviso temporary variance
which expires 12-1-2029.
Michael Johns, my vote is yes with proviso.
What is it with existing?
I mean, maybe just proviso that it's limited to the...
Proviso limited to the second and third floor.
Michael Johns, my vote.
So is it this three years,
or it's just that as they both may honor?
I gave it four years, second and third floor.
Okay, yep.
Michael Johns, my vote is yes with provisos.
Cheryl Gaston, my vote is yes with provisos.
Tanetta Graham, my vote is yes with provisos.
Ryan McAdams, my vote is yes with provisos.
Thank you.
Thank you, counsel.
Number three, MI 2025-003-971, 1924-36, Washington Avenue.
Andrea Solomon is the attorney.
Counsel, could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer?
Good afternoon, Andrea Solomon, A-N-D-R-E-A-S-A-L-O-M-O-N.
Good afternoon, Andrea Solomon, A-N-D-R-E-A-S-A-L-O-M.
You swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Could you identify your client and their relationship to the property?
My client is Keystone NFP, Philadelphia, Washington, LLC, the tenant of the subject property.
There's a letter of support from Point Breeze Community Development.
The vote was eight in support, two in opposition.
There was a near neighbor who voted.
and our
vice chair has a few questions.
Good afternoon. Have you
submitted your documents five
days in advance of this hearing? We did.
Okay. And did you waive the
refusal and simulate to its accuracy?
I do. Thank you. You can proceed with
your screen. Thank you. I am not
seeing the share my screen button.
There we go.
Join us, panelists. Thank you.
okay here we go we're here today with an application for two signs that are accessory
to the existing gym at the second floor of this property one internally illuminated flat wall sign
on South 20th Street and one internally illuminated projecting sign along Washington Avenue with me
today are Todd Shively from Planet Fitness and Sharon Brandt from Foreman Sign Company
the uh the the sign company um as Chairman Bergman stated we did receive support from a community
group point breeze community development coalition back in july uh the reason we're here is this
property is uh zoned i2 um medium industrial and uh the uh signs because the tenant is located on
the second floor it's a rare second floor commercial space are above the second floor
windowsill so each of the signs has received a refusal for their location um the property
as i said is along washington avenue bounded by south 20th street and altar street
this board granted the variance for the use for personal services last november
uh this is a view of the subject property um as along this is washington street south 20th street
again the tenant space is located on the second floor somewhere along this light post is where
the entrance to the planet fitness will be located um it shares the the property with
uh two other tenants that are located on the first floor uh really the sign is my as to to
both identify this commercial space on the second floor and help with this highly trafficked area to
way find uh show where the ingress and egress is of the location along washington
and demarcate where the tenant space on the second floor is
here's a key plan of the first floor as you can see this red space is the first floor really
entrance the solely the entrance of the planet fitness the majority of the space will be on the
second floor and the first floor is primarily occupied by the other tenants
I'll try to zoom in here.
This is the location of the two signs, the projecting sign along Washington Avenue on
the second floor and on South 20th Street.
There is also an already permitted wall sign just above where the entrance to the lobby
will be.
Since the property is zoned I-2, really the allowable signage for this property is over 10 times what we're proposing.
It's a very muted sign package and really comes out of Planet Fitness' experience with other properties and the recommendation of the sign company to show where the tenant's base is.
this is a rendering of what the uh wall sign along south 20th street will look like
the sign details the already permitted sign above the entrance and the projecting sign
that it's we're requesting the variance for again to show where the second floor space is
spaces sign details attachment details the refusal which indicates that it's just for the location
fine details.
of the signs these are other planet fitness locations they've used this typology before
where their space their tenant space is on their gym space is on the second floor they
demarcate the location they're very active in their community um it'll it'll really be an asset
to the neighbors uh as indicated from the the support received um and todd is here to talk
more about the kinds of programs that they offer this is a layout of the equipment uh on the second
floor space and uh the gym is slated to open in december december 29th of this year
these are some of the latest construction drawings this is the second floor space
and the the stairwell is really the only thing that will be occupying the first floor
and um with that as i mentioned todd is here uh i can bring him on um we're requesting the
limited relief for the location of the signs and any other relief necessary sure why don't you
bring how many signs will in total total for the plant planet fitness there will be three signs
total. All right. Two are part of this package.
What's his name? Todd Shively. I think
he has his hand raised. Okay. Yes, Chair. He'll be
coming back in after Panama shortly. Thank you very much. Understood.
Good afternoon, everybody. Hi. Todd, could you
please state your name and spell for the stenographer? Yes. Todd
Ed Shively, T-O-D-D, and then my last name is S-C-H-I-V-E-L-Y.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Counsel, proceed.
Hi, Todd.
Did you see the entirety of my presentation?
Yes, I did.
And is it true and accurate to the best of your knowledge?
Yes, it is.
And do you adopt it as your own testimony?
Questions from the board.
all right
thing where's the projecting sign here it's along washington avenue i'll show it first
uh this is the the existing property uh it's it's really at the edge of this window
uh okay yeah you have a photo of it too yes i'll show the rendering
it was hard to see in the picture so that's why i was just asking
here we go ah okay all right
okay thank you thanks all the questions questions or comments from our attorney uh no chair questions
or comments from the audience or the virtual audience?
No hands raised, Mr. Chair.
Planning Commission.
Amy Boyd with the Planning Commission.
The comprehensive plan recommends a change in zoning at this location
from the current I-2 medium industrial to IRMX industrial residential mixed use.
The appellant has not demonstrated that there are unique physical conditions
or circumstances of the property that would prevent it
from being used in conformance with the zoning code.
The Planning Commission recommends that the Board deny their requested variance for sign height.
We'll just state that the space is up the second floor, so this is really to designate where that tenant space is.
So MI 2025-003-971, 1924-36 Washington Avenue, I vote yes.
Michael Johns, my vote is yes.
Cheryl Gaston, my vote is yes.
Tynetta Graham, my vote is yes.
Ryan McAdams, my vote is yes.
Thank you, Councilman.
thank you very much so number four mi 2025 004019 323 western rod avenue david orphanetes is the
attorney there is unanimous support from the south kensington community partners
10 total votes and a letter non-opposition from council member young
good afternoon mr chairman i count uh council could you please state your name and spell for
Counsel, could you please state your name and spell for the sonographer?
the sonographer certainly my name is david or
Certainly. My name is David Orphanides. My last name is spelled O-R-P-H-A-N-I-D-E-S.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Counsel, I understand this is a request from you for a hearing hold.
That's correct.
Okay. Our vice chair has a few questions for you.
Good afternoon. Have you submitted your documents five days in advance of this hearing?
Yes, I did.
Do you waive the reading of the refusal and stipulate to its accuracy?
I stipulate to the accuracy of the original refusal, but the reason that we've requested
to hear and hold is that we made revisions to the design of the project, which increased
one cited refusal and probably going to create an additional refusal.
And as such, we need an amended refusal for the zoning board to vote its case.
So the notice of refusal isn't 100% applicable to the current, the latest design, which, again, is at the request of the community and resulted in unanimous support by the community group, the South Kensington Community Partners.
David, we're going to have a resumptive hearing for this.
That's fine. Yes.
So if I can share my screen.
Okay. Again, my name is David Orfanides, and I'm here representing 323 Girard, LLC, the owner of the property. The properties, the two properties we are dealing with today are 323 and 325 West Girard. You have a picture up here on your screen right now that show the two properties. They are presently vacant lots.
323 at the corner has been vacant for quite some time you can see here some street view photographs
if i go back to 2007 you can see here which is the earliest street view photograph both
properties their existing structures on those built on those lots but they are both vacant
so for over 20 years these properties and actually the building next door as well which is currently
still standing in its current vacant condition and bladed condition. But these two properties
in question have been vacant for almost 20 years at this point. And then sometime before 2014,
between 2014 and 2012, you can see that 323, the demolition of the existing building was commenced
in 2012 and then by 2014 it was vacant and that continued vacant through the years you can see
again here's 325 which is next to the vacant 323 lot with the blighted property next to it
and then as we go you can see through the years oops i'm going the wrong way
and you can you can see so why don't we start your presentation i mean we see this so long
Longstanding vacant lot, again. So the properties are both 65 feet deep, and then they go, they run, you can see here in the deed, and you'll see on the zoning plans in a minute, they run to a 14-foot wide alley, which runs across the property to the north of us.
That 14-foot wide alley is also referenced in a deed for the property, not only behind us, but then to the west of those properties on North 4th Street, which utilizes that access for rear egress.
That's interesting to note because when you look at our original zoning drawings and our survey plan, you will see that alley located to the north of us.
And that alley cannot be utilized, cannot be built on per the deeds, the references in the deeds.
And what that serves to do is create a buffer between our property and any building on the property to the north of us.
There's a four-story, six-unit building that was built to the north of us, and they run right up against this alley.
They actually utilize the alley to access their property.
And again, I bring that up because this was our original design, our original zoning drawings.
Four-story building with, and you can see here, went back to a point with open parking underneath the rear portion.
There was a superstructure.
This is not solid from front to back.
It's a series of beams, covered beams that then breached this and covered this or extended past this open area here to the rear property line.
Through the, and that allowed for the three accessory off-street parking spaces, including one, the ADA space.
This property is on CMX2, so we did provide the required commercial space at the front of the property with the original design.
Our original refusal was that we had...
Our original refusal was that we had more dwelling units than were permitted on the lot for given the lot size.
Our building height, 38 feet, is permitted.
Our roof height is 41 feet, but we dropped the parapet down to six inches so that the actual parapet height is the height of what's permitted with a by right 38-foot building because you're allowed three feet, six inches.
So from the outside, the building we've proposed looks the same as a by right building.
And also, you'll see in a minute, given what's around us, the height of this building and what's proposed around us, the height of the building works more in conjunction than the lower building.
And then originally, the original refusal did not have a rear yard depth refusal, but I eventually communicated with the examiner.
We talked about that superstructure that I mentioned on the zoning plans that extended to the rear.
And we indicated that because that superstructure extends over these beams with an open area beneath of it, open to the sky, extended to the rear property line, we had a zero rear yard depth.
But again, if you take a look at the original zoning drawings that I showed to you, the upper portion of the building, the solid portion of the building, was set back and provided the required open area and rear yard depth from that point.
We presented this to the community group, and this is the building that we presented originally.
This was the view from the front on the left.
The view on the right was the view from the rear.
You can see the open carport underneath.
These were the renderings of the original building.
And again, you could see the carport with the open kind of, you know, we had the support to handle the kind of cantilevered upper floors.
that went at the front and at the rear again with the wall that came down here
and then and then the original floor plans as mentioned we had a smaller commercial space it
was the required 30 feet deep we had the three parking spaces to the rear and then we had the
six units two per floor that went on each of the floors above from the low 800s to the mid 800s
when we went and met we met with south kensington community partners twice once in july and once in
September, the 14303 notices and the certificates of mailings for both of those are at the end of
my exhibit book. And interestingly enough, this doesn't happen very often, but what they preferred
to see was larger commercial space, get rid of the parking spaces, and we actually added an
additional unit, an AD unit at the ADA unit at the rear of the ground floor. So now our revised
plans look like this. And so you see for up to the west, abutting that building that's in
disrepair and has been for over two decades, the building extends almost to the rear property line.
There's a small open area to the rear, which is an open area for the ADA unit at the upper,
but then it extends all the way to the rear property line on the eastern portion of that
ground floor we did notch out and create open space for the upper floors at the second third
and fourth floor back in this corner and there is a roof deck with a pilot house that all the units
including the front units which have the city views can utilize and you can see that here
the to help you get an idea so the front with the revision looks essentially the same
except that the commercial space extends further to the rear.
And then what we have is we have an ADA unit here at the rear,
and you can see her in the floor plans.
So before we had a commercial space, and you could see it was 657 square feet.
We now have a commercial space that's almost 1,000 square feet.
We have a one-bedroom, 600-square-foot ADA unit in the rear,
which is now accessed off of North Oriana Street.
And then the units above all became slightly larger.
The front units went from low 800s to mid 800s.
The rear units went from mid 800s almost to 900 square feet.
The roof deck split front to rear is once again remaining.
Our stairs, it's an interesting system.
It's kind of a stacked scissor where almost like an auto garage,
which allows us to have a more condensed area utilized for that going up and down,
which then reduced the impact that it had on the livable space for the dwelling units.
The commercial unit at the ground floor has the use of the front portion of the cellar,
and then there's residential storage to the rear.
We do show at the back of the commercial space, admittedly, a smaller trash room.
This will actually be made larger, but it has direct access out to the street.
that can be accessed from the inside interior hallways by the residential units and it could be
That can be accessed from the inside interior hallways by the residential units, and it can be accessed from the commercial unit directly itself.
And again, the revised renderings you can see here, we've now taken the eastern portion, and here you can see that extending near the rear property line.
But again, there is a little bit of open area dedicated to the ADA unit.
And then you see here each of the rear second, third, and fourth floor units have very large open outdoor areas above the ADA unit here.
Here is the one access to the hallway.
Here is the trash room door.
And then here's an access to the commercial unit, which also has access off of West Gerard, you can see here.
They have their main entrance here.
and then there's a second egress there's an egress here on westward and egress off north
ariana which you can see here from the floor plans provide two means of egress um for the
upper floor units one out to north ariana and one out to westward um this this lot is approximately
the same size as the lot behind us again that is a six unit building um we do have the commercial
space, our units, our floor plate, because of what we were asked to do by the community and build
towards the rear lot line is actually greater than the property to the north of us. And I only
say that to say, again, that's what the community asked of us. It wasn't what we originally came in
with. We were willing to provide it when they asked for it. And it does provide for a greater
area within the building for the units. So although we now have seven units, the units
have all gotten larger than what they originally were, again, at the direction of the community
group. We do, as mentioned, this property is a longstanding blighted property, and we contend
that given that condition of the property, given what's been requested of us by the community group,
particularly not only that they saw the refusal for the square footage of the lot to be acceptable,
but actually asked us to actually put in another unit, which that is the refusal that I mentioned
that will actually be increased with the change in the design.
So this refusal, the minimum lot area refusal, will become greater.
We will still have a zero rear yard depth refusal, again, because of that superstructure extending to the rear.
We considered that to have no rear yard depth. Now we will have no rear yard depth for more of the building. And then we will also have almost 100% lot coverage. There is that a bit of open area here, back here. But other than that, and that's for the ADA unit, other than that, we will have close to 100% lot coverage, which will create the additional refusal that we're working on.
The three accessory parking spaces, including the one ADA band space, goes away, but this property is located on West Gerard Avenue. We know that there is an abundance of public transportation on West Gerard Avenue.
I think the fact that they're trying to revitalize West Gerard Avenue, there are development projects going on at 310 West Gerard. There is, which looks to be built, I think it's 166 units, 74 feet tall.
That property is located, if I can go up here, that property is located here, across this right here.
And I indicated 60 feet because that's ICMX.
It did have variances for that.
And then you have CMX2 property.
You have this almost 70-foot tall building, which has the same zoning classification as we have,
that had a number of variances, 40-some units that was built here at 342 to 354 West Reward.
This is a city health center that's located at CMX3.
We know that CMX3 has no maximum height limit, but a 500-far limit.
So we are barely over the height restriction for CMX2.
um this this this there's an overlay that applies to this property that does not allow us to utilize
the mixed income housing bonus in cmx2 for additional height however given what's going
on around us in terms of the zoning classifications and existing and proposed development we believe
the um three foot variance uh for the height and then keeping the parapet down to what a
bi-right parapet would be, is the least variance required in this particular situation that allows
us to have a little better floor-to-ceiling heights for the four floors as well. So I think
I've addressed the lot area for the number of units, I've addressed the height, and again,
the open area and rear yard depth refusals that will be increased and created.
The open area and rear yard death refusals that will be increased and created as a result of the of the changes that the community requested are, again, at the request of the community.
David, do you want to bring your client on?
Sure. And again, just real quickly, tax compliance is included.
We have that. We have all that, David.
Yep. So if I can have Andy Hong Lin promoted to panelist, he's my client.
He's the managing member of the LLC.
I'm back in right now, Captain.
Thank you.
Hello?
Hi, Andy.
How are you, sir?
Could you please state your name and spell it for the stenographer?
Good evening.
My name is Hong Lin, also known as Andy.
My name spells H-O-N-G-L-I-N.
I'm here representing 323 Gerard LLC tonight.
All right.
All right.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Please proceed, counsel.
Andy, again, you are the managing member of the owner of the property 323 Gerard LLC?
And did you hear the statements that I made to the board today?
And are they true and correct to the best of your knowledge?
And would you adopt him as your own?
Okay, thank you, Andy.
I don't have any further questions.
I also have the architect, Samuel Turner, with us.
If you'd like to have him adopt.
If we have to have questions for the architect, please have him stand by.
Questions from the board, and we will be also holding us for a resumptive hearing.
Questions from the board.
Well, I think you said a lot.
I tried to get it in.
I know that the chairman likes to keep me moving.
i feel like i'm always under pressure to get a lot in but you do a pretty good job of it david
i feel like that guy at the end of the commercial with the conditions that you know that's
let's get focused there sorry but you but you did you explained it out and it was clear i thought
so i really don't have any um any uh real issues with the um with with the project other than the
handicap accessible unit does doesn't look like it complies um but other than that it seems like
you addressed the concerns of the community and um the units are kind of tight but you've got a
lot of glass so i think that'll probably not feel so tight right um and these are green roofs that
you so we're planning on doing that yes we're andy can speak to that and that is the plan to put them
both around the roof deck at the top but then also around the perimeter of the roof decks in the
corner but we're not we're not large enough to qualify um for the green roof bonus so you know
we didn't get into that in a lot of detail as we normally would if we had included it
yep thank you all right any other questions comments questions or comments from our attorney
uh no chair questions or comments from the virtual audience
planning are you do you want to wait for the resumptive hearing i can go now if you want okay
sure amy boy with the planning commission the comprehensive plan recommends no change in
zoning at this location from the current cmx2 commercial mixed use the appellant has not
demonstrated that there are unique physical conditions or circumstances of the property
that would prevent it from being used in conformance with the zoning code the planning commission
recommends that the board deny their requested variances for a lot area per dwelling unit
building height and minimum rear yard depth and thank you just in response the property has been
blighted and vacant i can't hear what you're saying i think you speak to that david what you
say no i just said the property's been inflated for over 20 years and then based upon herzburg
i think that that addresses those comments by so we're going to schedule this for a resumptive
hearing mr chair mr chair yes sorry to interrupt but um there's a handle from sam turner he's the
architect if there were any questions we're fine okay all right okay i understand resumptive
hearing 1 13 26 at 9 30 a.m okay thank you very much thank you number five mi 2025 004 020 236
to 40 north 60th street rachel pritzker is the attorney there's a letter of support from
achievability vote was 18 in support for an opposition and a letter of non-opposition from
Councilmember Jones.
We'll be coming back in as a panel shortly.
Good afternoon.
Hi, Council, how are you?
Could you please state your name and spell it for the stenographer?
Yes, it's Rachel, R-A-C-H-A-E-L, Pritzker, P-R-I-T-Z-K-E-R.
Yes, it's Rachel, R-A-C-H-A-E-L, Pritzker, P-R-I-T-Z-K-U.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Do you identify your client, the relationship to the property?
Yes, my client is Stacy and Brian Phillips, and they are the owners of the property.
And our vice chair has a few questions for you.
Thank you.
Good afternoon.
Have you submitted your documents five days in advance of this hearing?
And do you waive the reading of the refusal and stipulate to its accuracy?
Okay. Thank you. You can proceed with your case.
Thank you.
Okay. Can you see my screen?
We can.
Great. This is 236 to 40 North 60th Street.
Here is a copy of the refusal. The property is zoned RSA 5.
and we are proposing use of a child care center within an existing structure. The only refusal
we have is for the child care center is not permitted in the RSA 5 residential zoning district.
I'm just going to go down to some photos of the property while I talk about
the hardship. We obviously have a tax clearance certificate and the deed.
zoning map showing the RSA 5 parcel here is an aerial photo of the property it's the area
bounded in the red here and it's an existing church you can see from my screen just to give
you some idea what the property is this is a long-standing church since 1962 it was converted
partially the second floor was converted in 1989 for a daycare center we are just proposing to use
the entire structure as a daycare center and because of the base zoning being rsa5 even though
it's an existing long-standing church and not a single family home that is what generated
the one refusal here's another view of it further down the street as you can see so it's a one and
two-story structure all connected again a church that we're using going to be using as a daycare
center and this is the second floor I was referring to where in back in 1989 there was a permit pulled
which I'll show you in a second for a daycare center just on the second floor we're looking to
use the entire property as a daycare center again another front photo it also shows the zoning
posters on the property. Here are some interior photos for the board as well. Just empty the
moment bathroom official closet space this was the permits i was referring to before
back in the early 90s church and then as you see right here second floor daycare center
the first floor being a church at that time it was um 60 children and to include preparing and
serving food here's where in the code we don't comply again it's rsa5 so while it does permit
i think family child care which is a limited number of children in order to accommodate
the full structure and to have more than I think it's either between, I have to look
four and six students, we would need to have a child care center and that is not permitted
in RSA 5.
We met with the community group Achievability on August 6th.
We sent the notice letters and here's the letter from Achievability.
There were, I think, 22 out of the 28 people at the meeting in support, as evidenced by this letter, 18 here and four there.
And then we have a letter from a non-opposition from Councilman Curtis Jones's office.
We also, the owners, Stacey and Brian Phillips, who are on this call as well, did walk around.
they're actually grew up in this neighborhood so they walked around and made sure to share
with the community and get some signatures related to support for the project so here's
that petition as well just can quickly go through some of the floor plans
so this is the existing basement layout it's a little angular on the left first
Layout, it's a little angular on the left.
First floor layout.
Mezzanine and the second floor.
Brian, who is one of the owners, is also an expert in construction, so we want to promote him.
If you have any questions about the interior, the floor plans, any construction, he would be able to answer those as well.
additional features and then second floor in operation now i don't believe so at the moment
um so the second floor was the daycare now they want to use the first floor too
yeah i think back in 1989 is when that um permit was pulled i don't think it's still in functioning
since uh their ownership i just think given the state of the interior i would i don't think
anybody is in there at the moment.
So if we could call Stacey and Brian Phillips
so that they could be sworn in
and provide any additional information,
that would be great.
They should be coming back in as a panel shortly.
Stacy and Brian. Yes. Good afternoon. Hi. Hello. Hi. Why don't I do this in case both of you want to testify. I'll start with Ms. Phillips. Why don't you go first? State your name and spell for the sonographer.
Stacy Phillips. S-T-A-C-Y-P-H-I-L-L-I-P-S. You swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth? Yes.
Mr. Phillips?
Brian Phillips, B-R-I-A-N, P-H-I-L-L-I-P-S.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Counsel, please proceed.
Brian and Stacey, have you heard my testimony today?
Do you believe it to be true and accurate, and can you adopt it as your own?
Yes, we believe it to be true and accurate, and yes, we adopt it as our own.
Thank you.
I just want to before any additional things you want to address, the chairman had asked the second floor is not has not been in use and it is not in use for the child care center currently.
Is that correct? That's correct. Okay. Do you know the last time since your ownership was, has it been any use for a child care center in there on the second floor?
Not since our ownership now. Okay.
If you want to share any comments briefly, you're welcome to do so at this time.
We are, as our attorney said, we are members of the community.
We were born and raised in the area.
We came back in 1990 and started a preschool on 56th Street.
So we've been in the community as a preschool for 35 years, since 1990, 1991.
and we then expanded to another center on 63rd street just a few years ago and it has just been
the the request of our community members and also our current clients to expand the the daycare
center to provide more services in the area and we just want to make sure that we're continuing
to beautify our neighborhood and also providing a much needed service and safety for the students
and children in our community can you just share just lastly about some of the um is it free
programming as a paid programming how many students will it be what are the ages just give a little
back detail to the board as well sure uh so we've we've received support from the reinvestment fund
so we will be able to provide um hopefully currently we provide free programming through
the City of Philadelphia's PHL Pre-K program. So a lot of the programming that we hope to provide
in this facility will mirror the others where there's no cost to the families for the daytime
programming. The city has provided a program for that. Also, there's going to be two and above,
ages two and above, and there will also be an after-school component so that the students
up to age 12 will be able to come and utilize the facility, and we also will accept families
And we also will accept families of all kinds, obviously, no matter what their affordability is.
of all kinds, obviously.
But for the most part, we do plan to have the PHL Pre-K program, which will provide free programming.
It will also increase at least 7 to 10 jobs, increase it by 10.
And also the number of students would be 60, roughly 60 preschoolers and around 15 after school students, before and after school students.
And then just quickly, Brian, if you could just address construction timeline, I just think that would be helpful for the board as well.
um the existing construction timeline would be about between uh three and four months give or
take how long it takes to get permits uh we only have to put up a new four classrooms so it's about
four or five partitions we're going to be provided that'll be new um all the other space would be
existing and then we would be putting down just existing um like finished floors in the existing
space. But like on the second floor, where they used to have a very, I'd say about 2,000 square
feet, we're breaking that up into two smaller classrooms. One may be about 600 square feet,
the other one give or take 500 square feet, just to make it more intimate and teachable with smaller
preschool sizes. But for most of the building, we're utilizing a lot of the space that's
there. And we have two nice medium-sized spaces for after-school programs. We're looking for,
as Dr. Phillips said, for ages up to like 12 years old. Thank you.
Mr. Phillips, maybe you could explain to us just real quickly, are you going to have
the cooking food on site for people? Will there be a commercial kitchen?
How many bathrooms are you going to put in? That kind of issue.
um well the kitchen is a commercial based kitchen most of our sites um we have a service where the
food comes prepared we just do warming we don't have it's not like a full service kitchen where
we're cooking yeah all of the classrooms has a separate bathroom for each classroom but there's
also on the first floor there's an extra like four classrooms that can be utilized but at all our
newer centers, each classroom has its own bathroom for the kids.
And then there's a separate set of gang bathrooms just as a backup
for staff to have their own privacy.
Questions from the board?
Is there any outdoor space?
On this particular site?
A yard or anything like that? No.
So what's the plan for outdoor activities for the young people?
So for the requirements for the outdoor play space, if there's no outdoor play space, then we need to provide indoor play space.
And so we will be taking one of the classrooms and it will be converted into an indoor play space.
And then there's also outdoor play space in our facility that's just a few blocks down.
There's also the public rec center right there at 57th and Vine, where we can take the students to the playground, the park, so we can utilize the public facilities for outdoor play space.
But we do provide indoor play space.
Thank you.
I think the outdoor option is really good.
Also, there was some opposition.
Do you know what the opposition was for?
you had like folks that opposed to what it was for well one one concern was about um they asked
about parking um and we kind of explained to them in traffic of course um that in the morning you
know it gets a little heavy for drop off at none of our centers we have any traffic concerns because
most of the parents are trying to get to work so they come and drop their kids off um we have a
real good intake process, and then they're gone. So we just told them, you know, for five to ten
minutes, you have a few cars coming in, but none of them are hanging around, double parked. So that
was one concern. And then the other concern was just about the neighborhood itself. It really had
nothing to do with the building or in the business. It was just, she was just kind of adamant about
the safety of the area. But also we told them we bring our own security. We have people that come
and just check on the centers just to make sure that we're okay. And we have a relationship with
the police and the fire department to do things with our kids. So we try to keep a presence
as well. And all of our centers have security with cameras all the way around. So we try to do the
We try to do the best we can with that. So that concern we really couldn't address, but we could address what we could do structurally to our facility.
the best we can with that.
So that concerned.
There was also one more concern about our vehicles. Would, you know, school buses or anything like that be parked at the vehicle at the facility?
and we did explain that there's a parking spot at our original facility on 56 and Vine
for where we park our van and our bus.
So no vehicles would be parked at that facility.
Will, handicap accessibility, how are you?
We have a proposed ramp at the entrance as soon as you come in.
We have a set of double doors and a single personnel door,
But the set of double doors ramp, we have an interior ramp that comes in and gets us to the first floor there.
So you're going to have an exterior ramp also because it looks like it's a.
No, the ramp is interior.
As soon as you open up the double doors, you walk about, give or take, six, seven feet.
And there will be a ramp to get you up into the open space, which used to be the sanctuary of the church.
OK, so there's so OK, so there's zero step entrance into them.
OK, gotcha.
Yeah. You got it. Other questions? So how many children all together in the different
facilities that you have are you servicing or providing your services to?
In addition, there was 60. You're projecting there'll be 60 here. Is that what I heard?
Yes. Yes. And then you said you had two other facilities.
Yes. So you want to know what the yeah, what the student count is at our other facilities?
OK, so on 56 and Vine, we have 84 students in that building and it's a building with a trailer and a large play yard.
And then one block down, there's a we occupy the basement of a church and there are 90 students in that building.
And then on 63rd Street, we currently have around 68 to 70 students in that building.
And then this is going to be an additional, how many did you say?
I thought I heard 60, but then I heard something about maybe 15 after school.
yeah so full-time 60 full-time students and then roughly um 12 to 15 before and after school
students okay all right the questions how many how many how many staff members did you say you had
at this facility you were planning this facility will add from eight to ten staff members
okay all right thank you you're welcome questions from our attorney
uh no chair questions or comments from the virtual audience
i do not see any hands mr chair planning commission amy boyd with the planning commission
the comprehensive plan recommends no change in zoning to the current rsa 5 residential single
family. The proposed child care center is an expansion of a line standing permitted use.
The proposed use will have minimal impacts on the surrounding properties and the appellant
has shown that there are unique physical conditions or circumstances that would prevent
the property from being used in conformance with the zoning code. The Planning Commission
recommends that the Board grant their proposed variance for child care center.
MI 2025-004020, 236 to 40 North 60th Street, I vote yes.
Michael Johns, my vote is yes.
Cheryl Gaston, my vote is yes, and I commend you for the work that you're doing and the number of children that you're serving and providing some needed, I would think, boost to their young educational lives.
Absolutely.
thank you tenetta graham my vote is yes ryan mcadams my vote is yes thank you number 11 thank
you thank you oh thank you number 11 mi 2025 004 825 1 convention avenue ronald
patterson is the attorney and then um alan will be with you and you'll do three in a row
Mr. Patterson, could you please state your name and spell for this sonographer?
Good afternoon.
Ronald Patterson, P-A-T-T-E-R-S-O-N, Claire Harrison Law Firm, 1834.
Patterson, P-A-T-T-E-R-S-O-N, Claire Harrison Law Firm, 1835 Market Street.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Yes, I do.
Could you identify your client and relationship to the property?
With me is Derek Tash, T-A-S-C-H, and he's an architect with the University of Pennsylvania Penn Medicine.
Okay. And there is a unanimous support from Southwest Philadelphia District Services and a letter of non-opposition from Councilmember Gauthier. Our vice chair has a few questions.
Good afternoon. Have you submitted your documents five days in advance of this hearing?
Yes, I have.
And do you waive the reading of the refusal and stipulate to its accuracy?
Yes, I do.
Okay, thank you. You can begin your presentation.
so this application regards one convention avenue it's the university of pennsylvania
penn medicine pavilion hospital located next to the penn museum its services include cardiology
neuroscience and oncology it's an innovative facility that supports research and clinicians
and faculty. It has approximately 500 private rooms, 47 operating rooms, and 1.5 million square
feet of floor space. I would say it's the icon of the campus. It has existing building identification
sign, as you see at the top here on both sides of the building. It has the pen shield and pen,
and it also has a monument sign, which I'll show you in a minute.
It has another sign package throughout the campus that includes wayfinding signs
and right-of-way signs on the sidewalk.
It's located in an SPINS district, which allows flat wall and freestanding signs,
but no greater than 64 square feet each.
The hospital opened in 2021, and in 2021, the board approved these two roofs, we'll call flat wall signs on the upper floor, not a roof sign, and a monument sign.
Today, we are seeking changes to the signs.
Let's see if I can show you this.
This is the location of the two building identification signs.
Here's an existing monument sign, which I'll show you, and we're asking for an additional monument sign at this location.
So we're looking to, I'll say, rebrand the hospital for a few important reasons, for rebranding, for identification, for waif signing, and increasing traffic safety.
We have three refusals, one for each sign, because we'd exceed 64 square feet.
I'll have Derek now testify with me.
Derek, if you want to tell the board your name and address.
Derek, why don't you state your name and spell for the sonographer?
My name is Derek Tash, D-E-R-E-K-T-A-S-C-H.
All right.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Yes, I do.
Counsel, please proceed.
Thank you.
Derek, what's your position with Penn?
I am the health system architect for Penn Medicine.
You've heard my presentation so far.
Would you agree it's true and accurate?
And you would adopt it as if it were your own?
I would.
So why does Penn Medicine want to change these signs?
You might say it was initially triggered with the renaming of the building itself.
Earlier this year, we did receive a generous gift in exchange for renaming the building from the Clifton family.
very long-standing supporters of the of the health system and the university as a whole board members
and just just proponents of the health system in general really great um supporters all around
um but but really what it comes down to is that um this is our flagship hospital and so as such
uh there are types of specialty care and really complicated procedures that are really only
provided at this building uh and what that becomes is that we we do receive a large number
of visitors from outside of town. And so even if you are from this area, that part of the
neighborhood, I think everybody's aware is pretty dense and it can be complicated. If you're coming
to visit the hospital, you generally have a whole lot of other things on your mind. It can be
confusing. We do receive a number of visitors that accidentally become confused, arrive at the wrong
building. So any chance we can take to really highlight building identity and really
improve the wayfinding we see really tends to alleviate that so the building top signage you
know is for folks that are approaching maybe from the highway or at a distance they can you know feel
comfortable that they're going the right place they're finding the building and then the second
And then the second monument sign that we're requesting is really just in the four years we've been open.
monument sign that we're requesting is really just in the
We see that that is a weak point in kind of decision-making as people are driving down the street.
And so we think that that will go a long way to help alleviate that and bring people comfort that they're driving to the right.
And what I'm showing you is the existing sign, correct?
Correct.
Okay. And so this is what the rendering would be on the other side of the building, correct?
Correct.
Correct. And the two high building identification signs are visible from I-76, is that fair to say?
Correct. And the signs were included in an overall sign package that was seen by the Art Commission in connection with its approval of the chains of copy for the way signing signs?
Correct. And would you agree or opine that a hardship would exist here to adequately identify the building correctly?
Especially at that height and those distances that you have to view the sign?
Yes. Okay. And this building and the other building comport with the character and context of that campus. And there are similar buildings with similar size and location of signage. Is that fair to say? Yes. And what would you call this campus? A collection of pan and chop? Yes. So a very dense area. And as you mentioned, it would be important for ways of finding and traffic safety. Correct. Okay. Thank you.
we did meet with the southwest district services on august 20 and you there's a letter of support
for the signage so again three signs one is two are expanding existing sign and one is a new
monument sign i'll show you the picture again there we go
do you have to have your testimony adopted or i did you did i i went yes i did that okay good
yeah thank you questions from the board i'm recusing um from from this uh i was chair when
came to CDR. Okay. Questions from our attorney? I don't have a question. I just have a comment.
Well, my son was in the pavilion twice, and it's an amazing building, and
you know
anything to
promote Penn and the work that they do
there is
I would say too
that Penn name up top means nothing
if you're looking for a building
it didn't say pavilion
at the time
it did not
we've learned a lot in the last four years
since it's been open
so this is really trying to rectify that
Thank you. Questions from our attorney? No, Chair.
Questions or comments from the virtual audience?
I do not see any answer, Mr. Chair.
The Planning Commission.
Amy Boyd with the Planning Commission. The comprehensive
plan recommends no change in zoning to the existing
SPINS, Special Purpose Institution. The appellant has
demonstrated that the proposed signs of this size are necessary for
wayfinding the planning commission recommends the board grant their requested variances for
building identification sign area thank you um mi 2025 004 825 1 convention center i vote yes
cheryl gaston my vote is yes tenetta graham my vote is yes ryan mcadams my vote is yes
thank you thank you all right thank you very much um we're gonna let
So Alan, come up and set up.
We're going to take a five-minute.
Alan will be ready by then.
We're going to do the three-minute, the three cases he has,
and then we're going to go right into the 330 list, okay?
So everybody take five minutes.
I'll try to keep it short.
No, no, no, that's okay.
All right, number eight, MI 2025-004-044-2304 North 21st Street.
Alan Nockamson is the attorney.
There's a letter of non-opposition from Council Member Young
and a letter of support from all the family CDC with two provisors.
So if you would, please state your name and spell for the stenographer.
Alan Nockamson.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Could you identify your client, the relationship to the property?
Yes, my client is 2304 N21st Street, LLC.
the owner of the property, and its representative should be in the virtual audience.
Boom, hire son, Nicholas.
uh nicholas our vice chair has a few questions for you good afternoon have you submitted your
Our vice chair has a few questions.
documents five days in advance of this hearing yes and do you waive the reading of the refusal
and stipulate to its accuracy i do okay thank you you can proceed with your case thank you
i do not believe i'm a panelist yet
you will be soon yes
Thank you.
I'm trying to just get full screen mode.
all right so i'm here to present 2304 north 21st street uh it had you know it has 12 exhibits in
my exhibit packet and we notify 201 addresses of the community meeting so this is an rsa5 property
that we're looking to put a duplex here as the chairman stated we have a letter of support
from the community, all in the family, CDC.
There are two provisos, no basement living.
We have no objection to that proviso.
And then the trash management is unit number one
has trash stored in the rear
and unit number two has a ventilated trash room.
We have no objection to that proviso as well.
Again, here's a letter, just a vote count.
And then this property has a long history
of multifamily use when it was active
It went from four units to three units in 1954.
And then the aerial views of the property, this is really interesting.
If you look at it, we're the only property building structure on 21st Street on this block.
So it's very interesting.
I do believe that there was a variance request and approval from the board for a duplex next door to us at 2306 some time ago.
The maps of the area, again, we are RSA 5 property, but, you know, again, long history of multifamily use.
There's not one other building structure currently on our block.
This is our property right now.
My clients have done updates with permits, but, you know, obviously we're trying to get the use approved.
This is our orange notice posting for today's hearing.
this is what the property looked in 2019 before my client put work on the property again with
permits this is north 21st street to the right to the left interior photos this is the basement
so this is the current condition of the basement we are not intending to have basement living down
there probably just utilities i do believe there is this is a bi-level unit and maybe there will
be a washer and dryer down there but nothing else and then this is just pictures various pictures
my client's just waiting for the approval you know to get you know to use this property
um i do actually no let me say this his brother lives in the upper unit so he does have a rental
license for for one unit his brother lives in the upper unit just keeping a watchful eye on the
property plans and drawings as you can see here you walk through a common vestibule you'll make
a left you have a living room kitchen you know bathroom bedroom you go down the flight of steps
and it's an open floor plan down here again proviso no living in the basement instead of
going to left for unit number one which which is a two bedroom one bath you go to unit number two
which is a bi-level three-bedroom, two-bath, you see here that, oh, by the way, in this unit,
also you can go up a flight of steps, and this is the second bedroom on the second floor.
Instead of unit number one, you go up to this flight of steps for unit number two,
kitchen, bathroom, bedroom, go up a flight of steps, there's two more bedrooms and a bathroom.
again we met with the community 201 addresses were notified of the community meeting on
september 9th 2025 at 6 30 p.m this is the addresses we mailed it to proof of mailing
to those addresses our applications for appeal that we filed on behalf of 2304 and 21st street
LLC. And then finally, our, you know, proof of ownership with the deed, as well as proof of tax compliance. I'm going to unshare.
as well as proof of tax compliance.
I'm going to unshare my screen.
I would ask that Nick virtually raise his hand and be sworn in.
In the virtual audience, please raise your hand.
Oh, Mr. Nicholas.
He goes by Nick, but Mr. Nicholas?
Okay, they're coming back in as a panel now, though.
Thank you.
Mr. Chair, I do see him in the virtual audience, just his camera.
There's some issue, I guess, with his camera.
Mr. Nicholas?
Hi. Sir, could you please state your name and spell it for the stenographer?
First name is Boomerson, B-O-O-M-H-Y-R-S-O-N.
Last name is Nicholas, N-I-C-O-L-A-S.
You swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Yes, I do.
Nicholas, could you turn your video on? Is that possible?
i'm trying to do that right now okay so alan start your testimony yeah mr nicholas you heard
everything i had to state today yes is it true and correct yes and do you adopt it as your own
testimony yes i do thank you questions from the board look like you made it work say that one
more time. It looks like you made it work. Oh thank you. Thank you.
Questions or comments from our attorney? No chair. Questions or comments from the virtual audience?
No hands Mr. Chair. Planning Commission. Amy Boyd with the Planning Commission. The comprehensive
plan recommends no change in zoning at this location from the current RSA 5 residential
single-family. While this property has evidence of multifamily use in the 1950s, there is a 1970
zoning permit stating that the current use is single-family. The plan has not demonstrated
that there are unique physical conditions or circumstances of the property that would prevent
it from being used in conformance with the zoning code. The Planning Commission recommends that the
board deny the requested variance for multifamily. Yeah, Mr. Chair, as I stated, I believe that 2306
north 21st street was granted for a duplex does have a history of a long history of multifamily
use and we're trying to activate that block as the only standing building structure on the block
so we would ask for a duplex thank you so mi 2025 004044 2304 north 21st street i vote yes
with proviso provisos no household living in the basement trash stored in the rear yard for unit
one, interior trash storage for unit two.
Johns, my vote is yes with provisals.
Cheryl Gaston, my vote is yes with provisals.
Tanetta Graham, my vote is yes with provisals.
Ryan McAdams, my vote is yes with provisals.
Number nine, MI 2025-004045-2307 North 11th Street.
Mr. Nockleson, just for the record, state your name.
Alan Nockleson.
Could you identify your client and the relationship to the property?
Yes, my client is SJ Developers, LLC, and to the left of me is Josh Kravitz, its representative.
There's a support from the 37th Ward RCO.
The vote was 13 in support, one in opposition, two abstain, and there's a letter of non-opposition from Council Member Young,
and also there's an applicant who provided one form letter of support from a near neighbor.
Our vice chair has a few questions.
Good afternoon.
have you submitted your documents five days in advance of this hearing yes and
do you waive the reading of the refusal and stipulate to its accuracy I do okay
thank you make sure your screen and proceed thank you so if this board is
inclined to grant this variance appeal I would ask that I would grant it with
proviso we have revised plans that we previously said I so for 2307 North 11
Street, we have 11 exhibits. We notified 130 addresses of the community meeting. So our refusal
is this. We're asking for five-family household living at a CMX2 property. We have two refusals,
the first of which is the fact that we're not offering any commercial use on the ground floor,
not out of character for that block, as you'll see. And then secondly,
Not out of character for that block, as you'll see.
And then secondly, the amount of units.
We're allowed three units as of right for CMX2.
We're asking for five.
We're swapping out the commercial unit with the residential unit.
And we believe that based on the floor plans, it should fit the needs for a good five units.
As I indicated, we have submitted revised plans.
We made two changes.
We reduced the building height to 31 feet, four inches, and we also removed basement living.
So we would ask that the board grant the variance request with the revised plans.
So we have a letter of support from the community.
It was overwhelming support here.
And then we got the support of the only other property really that's developed,
or at least the only other owner on that block
that is in support of our project.
And then maps of the area, yes, we're CMX2,
but you'll see that it's out of character
to have commercial use where we are located.
And then you can see from the aerial view,
really there's really not much development here on this block.
There is 2315-17,
but the other properties that face North 11th Street are all vacant.
and then photographs of the property this is the front of our property right now
this is our orange notice poster that we posted within the time frame required under the philadelphia
zoning code this is north 11th street to the right of property again you're not really seeing any
commercial use here north 11th street to left their property again not seeing any commercial
use here and then these are our plans and drawings you can see here that you'll see
from the floor plans is better, but there is no use, no even lower level use for the two units,
unit one and unit two. There's some slight use you'll see in the floor plans here.
We also made these into type B units by lowering the height of the building. So there's two studios
of type B here. There's a common hallway and you can see here. So there's a type B here,
left unit number one type b here unit number two so that we're very mindful of the community that
you know there are people who are aging out who need to maybe downsize and to provide them these
type b would be very helpful for them and then we have units three and units four these are all
one bedrooms again you come up with five steps there's a living room a kitchen and a bedroom
and then the same to the right and then unit number five it's on its own floor
again we met with the community we notified 130 addresses of the community
meeting these are this is our proof of mailing to those addresses our
application for appeal that we filed on behalf of SJ developers LLC the notice
of refusal as well as the project information form the deed to the
property showing sj developers llc's the owner and the certificate of tax clearance i'm going to
stop sharing my screen for a second i would ask that mr kravitz be sworn in and i'll have a few
questions for him sir could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer yes josh
kravitz thank you josh kravitz j-o-s-h-k-r-a-v-e-t-s do you swear or affirm to tell the
truth the whole truth nothing but the truth yes i do she comes yeah josh you heard everything i
had to state today about your zoning matter yes is it true and correct yes and do you adopt this
your own testimony yes thank you can you go back sure i lost track where's the fifth unit it's
it's the whole third floor mr chair oh the whole third yeah so you had the first and second uh
it's on the third is yeah it's on there maybe i just went through it too quickly mr chair i
apologize but let me just go show right here so this is the second floor right so you have the
two one bedrooms here right and then the third floor is on its own right here right and it's
it's the whole floor and that's a two-bedroom unit um questions can you walk us through the
plans you went kind of quick on this one oh that's fine um i do apologize so most importantly is this
i will focus the board's attention we eliminated as part of our revised plans the lower level use
for units number one and units number two there is a limited area for a utility room and storage
down here but it we're building this essentially on grade so if you go up you know uh what's it
called you have unit number one which is right here it's just a studio right so you have a
It's just a studio, right?
So you have a livery room, you have a kitchen, and you have like a bathroom area, right?
delivery room, you have a kitchen, and
They're not huge units by themselves.
But again, I think the community appreciates, you know, some, you know, that there's opportunities
for especially these type B units, and people don't want to take care of things, you know,
as much as they grow older.
The second unit here, again, you have the living room and the kitchen area, and then
you have a bathroom and a closet and then you have like i guess it's actually not even considered a
studio it does have its own bedroom so that is actually a one bedroom so i misstated this is a
one bedroom this is a studio and then the square footage of unit number one is 456 square feet
and then unit number two is
465 square feet
so in order to get to
any of the units you have to
go through this sort of like
narrow
breezeway alleyway sort of
space and what's the width of that space
looks like it's
I can't read the dimensions of 3 feet or
what is it
it's 3 feet
8 inches
So you've got not even a four foot walkway that you have to go down 30 feet to get to the main entrance of the apartment building.
It's it seems it seems rather unsafe.
Well, I would believe in I would ask Mr. Kravis to confirm, like, you know, we're going to have a nice walkway there that's going to be well defined, but also well lit.
Is that correct? Yes, that's correct.
Well, the issue, the issue, though, is if somebody builds a property, which they probably will right next to you and they don't they don't do a setback, you've still got this long, narrow alleyway to get to your unit, which is which is which is not a good thing.
Right. It's only four foot wide. Somebody's coming down the walkway. You've got to pass them. It's not even five feet. Right.
You've got your five-foot turning radius at the doorway for the handicap accessible unit.
So it's just sort of a bad layout, in my opinion.
Yeah, all I can say is that it's a very interesting block where there's not much going on at all there.
and we did you did meet with the neighbor next door who is supportive of this project who is
well who knows what's going on here yeah that's on the other side on this side there won't be an
adjacent property if you're facing our property there won't be an adjacent oh that's right to
the right because it's the backyard of the other that's right actually that's a good point actually
That's a good point. Let me show you that.
So no one's going to build here. There's light in there because it's people's backyards.
Which to me makes it almost even worse because some of the things people keep in their backyards between dogs and everything else, it may not be the most pleasant way to get to your front door, right, to your unit.
So I think it's a better way to sort of lay it out.
I don't know that the density of units is great either, but those are my issues.
Well, I would say this.
This is a CMX2 property, which allows multifamily use.
One of our refusals is to eliminate the commercial, which I think there are grounds to do that.
In terms of the amount of units, you know, again, we were very mindful of having
no like you know lower level living so we you know when we presented in front of the community
we originally had lower level living and we received support from them and and i indicated
mr kravitz you know knowing the board very well i was like i don't think this is appropriate to
have lower level living here lower level you had five units oh five units still so my own opinion
and i think part of this design is because you're trying to jam five units in whereas before you
had the basement too you know i'm saying you're i think it's the amount of units that's helping
drive when you're going in here well that's me yeah and and so if the board feels so inclined
you know to you know put a another proviso lowering the amount of units to four units
you know you know that's for the board right yeah sure um it's also to get because it's such
a long building it's to get light um into the side as well for the for the front level i understand
the side as well for the for the front level i understand the setback that makes i mean all
philadelphia you know sort of key shape row houses have that you know key shape for a reason to get
light into those back bedrooms right or so getting the light and the the units is one thing my
concern even with alleys not alleys but rear yards and that's the entrance is the middle of this
building it's it's it's not it doesn't feel like it's a safe thing to do or or inviting thing to
do if there's a way to reconfigure it so that the front door is the front door on the street
and other than that what if we provided some type of gate access to that breezeway
maybe and maybe the reduction of units would allow you to do something better
in terms of the layout well how about this i think it makes sense for us to talk to the architect
and and and and see what we can do and and come back here um i mean i think by well not by right
but this could fit three you're asking for five what would four look like that's right and and
basically we'd be swapping out the commercial but let's see what we can do with five but if we can
And I think four is appropriate because there's four units allowed by Wright, just three residential, one commercial.
We're trying to swap out the commercial.
But let me see what we can do with the architect.
I just don't want to have a situation where we have a continuous continuance, and it's like March 18th.
I would do a resumptive hearing.
That would be in the beginning of January.
I think that's something that we'll talk to our client.
Council, is it all right if we just go resumptive hearing?
Yes, that should be fine.
And when, you know, I don't, planning shouldn't take a position where they're going to be.
All right, so MI 2025-004-045-2307 North 11th Street, we'll have a resumptive hearing
1-13-26 at 9.30 a.m.
Thank you.
Thank you.
And we have one more for you, Al.
All right.
MI-2025-004-128-5200-208 Wayne Avenue.
Alan Ockamson is the attorney.
There's unanimous support from the 12th Ward Democratic Committee,
six total votes, two are near neighbors,
and letter of non-opposition from Solo Germantown.
Applicant also has a petition of support from 18 signatures
from two neighbors on the block and 17 form letters of support.
And there's also letters of a whole list of people.
So, Mr. Knockamson, could you identify your client and their relationship to the property?
Yes, my client is the owner of the property, Wayne Hall Holding Company, as well as his occupant, Life Turning Point.
Okay, and our vice chair has a few questions for you.
Thank you.
Good evening. Have you submitted your documents five days in advance of this hearing?
And do you waive the reading letter refusal and stipulate to its accuracy?
see i i do with the understanding that we have an amended notice of refusal the board should have
okay all right thank you you can proceed with your case all right thank you until left of me
is rita whitaker uh your your executive director right yes yes so um this you know this is one of
these projects you're like it's you know first of all from a design aspect we're we're reinvigorating
uh a carriage house uh in you know that's you'll you'll see the difference it's night and day
um more so it's it's it's meant for good um so a little information about life turning point and
rita if i missed anything please let me know at the end um but it's it's it's an organization that
helps support uh single mothers who are homeless and you know to put that you know put them in a
place that they can get back literally on their feet and you know rita's been part of this
organization for 26 of the 30 27 27 there you go 27 of the of the 30 years of and it's had
different names in some ways but 27 out of 30 years at this location and uh so they have a huge
house in the front on wayne avenue uh that has 10 rooms and you know those women stay 18 months
up to 18 months to get themselves back on their feet. The requirement is to have a job and for
the people to save 50% of their earnings, which they keep their organization until those women
leave after 18 months. And then that money's returned to them. So now they have savings and
they're able to get back on their feet and there's all these great programs. I'm going to let Rita
and I'm going to let Rita talk about what they do.
talk about what they do. Well, there's some women, it's a little tougher, right?
Well, there are some women, it's a little tougher, right?
Like some of them can't get literally back on their feet
within that 18-month period,
and they need a little bit of extra help.
So Life Turning Point decided to reinvigorate
this little carriage house to create two units here
for some of those other women to help them out
for a little bit longer period of time,
and that's basically what we're doing here.
um so this is you know an rta uh one property uh so we have a couple refusals here let me just get
on there it's directly behind the big house oh yeah and it's a huge parking lot and and the person
who's who's closest to this this this carriage house is in support of the of the project as well
the person who's most affected uh so yeah i mean this is the refusal we're we're not allowed more
than one principal residence, and, you know, and, you know, that's why we're here today.
And then we got a letter of non-opposition from the group unanimous from the RCO, and
they gave a huge explanation, kind of like what I said, and, you know, you know, or this
organization doesn't treat, you know, this is a shelter, right, and we can, you know,
um it's it's really a good organization to have responsible individuals who are living there
and oversight as well and then even solo germantown civic association i have to say
that's a first that i've gotten a letter of non-opposition so um and i appreciate the fact
that they recognized that you know that this is the case so and then we got a petition so
and then we have other letters of support with some of the the organizations that life uh turning
point collaborate men who care of germantown inc whose ever gospel mission germany united
community development corporation um and again just shows the history of the property
and then a little bit of background that's a historic structure there and our architect who
i think had to leave because of the late hour um has already talked to the historic commission
it's it's it's past you know staff staff level review what it's not late i i know i know
exactly exactly well you're you're in you're in you're in second shift
but we're at the end of second shift
but you know it has a great history
but that's what it looks like now
and then just a little bit about life
turning point
and about their mission
and I have
stated that verbally
and then maps of the area
and we're at the corner of Hansberry
and Dwayne
and the photographs of the property
this is all us right so we're huge and we have a huge parking lot and this is the carriage house
in the rear right here wow it's a beautiful home uh this is from hansbury to the side
uh these are the hearing notice posters obviously we needed two postings because we faced two public
streets wayne avenue to the right of the property to the left of the property hansbury uh to to the
right to the left and then interior photos this is the main home obviously we haven't done any work
on the new carriage house just give you an idea of what it looks like inside and then i do believe
this is the carriage house yeah so we haven't completed the work it's going to be two units
in the car two units yeah and then just our plans and drawings you can see just from a site plan
this is the larger you know currently used home and this is the carriage house right there
And then these are simple floor plans.
You have a common living room, kitchen, bathroom.
Both of the units are the same.
You go up a flight of steps, two bedrooms.
And this is the renderings of what we hope it's going to look like.
And this all was reviewed and approved at a staff level at the historic.
And then we met with the community on September 16th.
proof of mailing application for appeal
and then most importantly deed to the property and then finally the certificate of tax clearance
uh with that being said i would ask that miss whitaker be sworn in
could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer rita whitaker r-i-t-a-w-h-i-t-a-k-e-r
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Please proceed, counsel.
uh first of all have you um you heard everything i had to state today is that correct yes about
First of all, have you heard everything I had to state today?
Is that correct?
jorizoni matter and is it true and correct yes and do you adopt as your own testimony yes did
i miss anything is there anything you want to add no okay good all right just want to make sure
all right you can tell us if he missed that's okay exactly but i think i missed something
during the community meeting that's why i asked questions from the board well alan you started
off by saying you were going to let her describe the program and then you described the whole
program. I know. I can't help myself. Well, no, I think I only did a fraction of it. I'm sure I
did not give it justice. The amount of work that you do it day in and day out, how many employees
you have there? Yes. So it's 10 paid staff and 20 volunteer staff on a monthly basis. And what's
24 hour staff coverage? And then what type of programming do you do? Give an example of
something. So it is an 18-month residential Christian discipleship program for moms and
kids that are homeless. And it's not a shelter, it's a home. We call it a home. And the moms
live with us for 18 months. And while they're with us, they have to attend classes. We require
them to attend classes in parenting, life skills, finance. They also have a couple general Bible
studies. We have mentors for our moms. We have mentors for our boys. We have a wellness component
to our program where on a quarterly basis we have a massage therapist that comes in an esthetician
a woman that comes in and does facials we take our families on trips we've gone places like the
beach the opera snow tubing all of our moms have to work to live in our program so when they come
in for the first 30 days they're on a probationary period and then they have to find work within 90
days after they pass probation they have to save 50 of their monthly income to live with us but
they get all that back when they move out and the most that we've ever had a mom save with us was
over twelve thousand dollars so to come in some place homeless with your kids and leave out with
over twelve thousand dollars in your pocket is a pretty good accomplishment and once they complete
the program they matriculate into our alumni ministry where we continue to track them you know
continue to work with them but we help them to get permanent housing once they complete the program
And so the purpose of the cottage renovation is to provide two apartments for two families to transition into, because sometimes once they've been with us for the 18 months, they may not be ready yet to go out into the big belt world on their own.
So this will kind of give them another step to transition into where we could continue to be there for them and continue to support them as well.
But I mean, the program, we do a lot.
I can't really tell it.
Just out of curiosity, how long have you been in the big house?
I'll call it the big house. Yeah, I've been there for 27 years. And you were in there? Yes. And I
walked in those doors in 1998 as a missionary and I never left. And now I went in under another
organization. They closed it down and some former board members approached me and asked me if I
wanted to keep it going. And I said, yes. And they actually bought the property back for me
and gave it to me to serve these moms and kids for a dollar a month. They said, all I have to do is
raised my own monthly operating expenses so it's become my property and my ministry under life
turning point since 2020 that's and we're expanding that's amazing i do have a question
if you can go back to the rendering of the cottage sure um uh lovely cottage clearly um lovely
property um my only uh i guess uh wish is that if you could eliminate a parking space in front of
our couple parking space that's a good shot a couple parking spaces in front of this this
cottage because there's no sort of front to this right and if there was a way to just create some
green space or something so that you don't walk out the door into this do this huge parking lot
um but there's i can i can speak to that alan doesn't have the renderings of it but actually
the whole front of that property is going to be all green space that's what it's going to be
yeah that rendering was old before we started to work with the landscaper but that's going to be
all green space the actual owner of the property mr adcock said he wants us his words were take it
back to eden and so because he owns the property yes sir that's what we're going to do we're going
and take it back to Eden. You can't see it in that picture, but right to the
left of it is a commercial playground that we just got
built for our current families, and so the families that live in the cottage will also have
access to the commercial playground set, and it's going to go back to Eden
because that is the wishes of Mr. Adcock.
That's great. Thank you.
Questions from our attorney? No, Chair.
Just then they're going to use more pervious kind of surface there.
more pervious kind of surface there.
Absolutely, yes.
Absolutely, yes.
That's a good idea.
And how will the cottage trash be collected?
So we have a dumpster on site.
So yeah, the moms that live in the cottage
will also use the dumpster that our moms use.
And we're going to have to get a larger dumpster
to accommodate the families that will be living in the cottage.
Questions from the virtual audience?
Planning Commission.
Excuse me.
I'm sorry to interrupt, but we have Charles Richardson with the hand raised.
Oh, you're okay.
Mr. Richardson.
Mr. Richardson.
Yes, please excuse the interruption.
Good afternoon, everyone.
You know, I knew you'd be there because I noticed your name on one of the things here.
So why don't you state your name, and you've already been sworn, as usual.
Certainly.
Charles Richardson, R-I-C-H-A-R-D-S-O-N, Office of Councilwoman Cindy Bass Room, 508 City Hall.
Councilwoman has no opposition to granting the variance.
Thank you very much for, as usual, staying around and always being there.
Thank you.
Planning Commission.
Amy Boyd with the Planning Commission.
The Comprehensive Plan recommends a change in zoning at this location from RTA 1 Residential 2 Family to RM1 Residential Multifamily.
The proposal for multiple principal buildings and multiple principal uses would be allowed under the proposed zoning.
The Planning Commission recommends that the Board grant their experience for multiple principal uses in buildings.
MI 2025-004-128-5200-208 Wayne Avenue.
the only thing what's the amended repeat he says he has an amended refusal what would the date be
oh i haven't
september 25th
so mi 2025 004 128 5200 208 wayne avenue i vote yes with proviso amended refusal dated
September 25th, 2025.
Michael Johns, my vote is yes with proviso.
Cheryl Gaston, my vote is yes with proviso.
Tanetta Graham, my vote is yes with proviso.
Ryan McAdams, my vote is yes with proviso.
Thank you, and congratulations.
You're just doing a great job.
Thank you so much.
God bless you.
Excuse me, Mr. Chair.
Oh, here you go.
I believe Hillary Emerson will be joining you.
Hillary's coming back?
She's coming back for the remainder.
Oh, my goodness.
She knows this is the best part of the day.
I know she does.
Good afternoon, Mr. Chair.
Can you hear me?
Of course we can hear you, Hillary.
All right, we're starting the afternoon schedule.
Good afternoon, everyone.
My name is Bill Bergman, and I will be chairing this meeting of the Philadelphia Zoning Board.
With me is our vice chair, Tanetta Graham.
Present, Mr. Chairman.
Board Secretary Cheryl L. Gaston.
Present, Mr. Chairman.
Board Member Michael Johns.
Present.
Michael Zares.
Present, Mr. Chairman.
And Board Member Ryan McAdams.
Present, Mr. Chairman.
Also, here is Hillary Emerson, our attorney, our Zoning Board Director, Ian Haggerty, and our Board Administrator, Lakeisha Dandy.
recording this hearing will be posted on the zba website by participating you consent to be
recorded whether remote or in person if you're called to speak you must state and spell your
name and then wait to be sworn in once you've been sworn in please state your name each time
before beginning your testimony any person may enter their appearance to become an interested
party there are three ways you can identify the case property address on your zoom webinar
You can see a staff member, or you can call the ZBA appearance line by the close of business tomorrow.
Call 267-270-5548.
Leave a message that includes your email address and the address of the property of the appeal.
The following guidance is for our remote attendees.
First, when directed by the chair, you should raise your virtual hand in order to be recognized to speak.
Second, if you're called to testify, you'll be prompted to join as a panelist.
Please accept the request and turn on your camera.
Third, the webinar Q&A is for questions about the hearing.
Do not comment on cases in the Q&A.
And fourth, if you're participating by phone, press star 9 to raise your hand and star 6 to unmute.
So let's take a look at our schedule for this afternoon.
Number two, MI 2024-003-951-5518 Morton Street Continuance has been received from the owner.
Number two.
The case will be continued to 5-6-26 at 3-30.
And number three, MI-2025-002819, 2922R-24 South Felton Street.
No exhibitors at the first listing.
Council Member Gauthier has requested a continuance.
is there
Nicholas or Larissa Foschino
listed and also
Philly Permit
oh no so it's Nicholas and
Larissa Foschino
Foschino
are the listed owners
good evening
Mr. Chair this is Jason Handel
will be your calls for the session
I have a hand up from
an Eric Hodge
I will allow them to speak
Eric Hodge please unmute
yes I was
calling on behalf of Leisure's group
for the Morton Street
I just wanted to verify that
the date of our continuance
Morton Street
Morton Street
has been continued sir
yes I just wanted to verify the date
the date yeah the date is 5 6 26 at 3 30. at 3 30. thanks a lot that was it thank you
let's go back do we see the fascinos
all right so mi 2025 002 819. excuse me mr chair mr melodosian has his hand raised
he's been allowed to speak
This is Craig Melodosian, Chair.
Yeah, Craig, are you involved in this case on Felton Street?
Yes, sir.
I'm the coordinating RCO.
We never heard from the applicant or the expediter.
We wrote them and asked them what they were going to do.
Of course, we copied Trey at a councilwoman OTA's office.
We have no problem with the continuance, but we thought it was odd that we had heard from no one on this project.
We had work with Mr. Faschino some years ago when he tried to convert it to a commercial.
So, again, we have no problem with the continuance, but we thought their silence was unusual.
So here's what I'm going to do.
I'm going to continue it and mark it must be heard.
OK, thank you.
Great.
I am I twenty twenty five zero zero to eight one nine twenty nine twenty two are the twenty four south Felton Street.
Cases continue to five six twenty six at three thirty.
I'm going to go back to number one.
Number one, MI 2024-003-924-917 West Somerset Street.
Alga Rosada is the listed owner.
No exhibits, third listing.
Case was continued on 4-23-25.
Mark must be heard.
917 West Somerset
Street, Auger Rosada.
Do we see anybody?
Yeah, I do not see anyone
with that name in the audience. No one is raising
their hand. All right, so
MI 2024-003-924-917
West Somerset Street. I vote to dismiss.
Michael Johnson, my vote is to dismiss.
Cheryl Gaston, my vote is to dismiss.
Tanetta Graham, my vote is to dismiss.
Ryan McAdams, my vote is to dismiss.
And number four, MI 2025-003-221, 1268 North Newkirk Street.
Kareem Darrell is the listed owner.
No exhibits, first listing.
yeah i do not see anyone answering to that name in the virtual audience and no one has raised
their hand for the matter thank you so mi2025 003 221 1268 north new kirk street that case is
that case is continued 5626 at 330 mark must be heard and number five mi2025 003 384 4860
continued 5-6-26 at 3-30.
lancaster avenue sherman toppen mr toppen was on earlier today to talk about this project
mr toppen you still want sir thank you uh yes good uh good afternoon mr chair and members of
board i'm here to speak on on 4860 lancaster avenue we are we're seeking a continuance but
the circumstances are a bit interesting and that's why we had a one rco meeting in this particular
case in that rco meeting the rco chair conducted the meeting if those zoom he had all the folks
that he contacted in his house he didn't put a screen on we had no idea who was there
we asked changes of it it didn't go in the right direction he he criticized the look of the
building personally and we feel that there was some bias in the way he conducted the meeting
afterwards we could be circulated a petition with quite a bit of support in the same area so that
for that reason we requested a second rco meeting and we had time to do it he then refused to
schedule that second rco meeting and as a result we feel we feel it is important that we bring our
project to the community in a proper meeting even proctored by the by the council person would be
appropriate or a different rco so we'd like a continuance for that reason to work that out
and to present our project our project to the community we feel in an unbiased manner
So MI 2025-003-384-4860, Lancaster Avenue. Cases continued to 5626 at 330.
Mr. Chair, can I just add just a quick question for Mr. Toppin.
Mr. Toppin, when I was reviewing the exhibits for this case, it looked like there was a smoking lounge proposed on one of the floors.
I don't have the exact answer for this, but I was a little concerned that that was another primary use that should be on the refusal.
I don't know if that would necessarily be considered accessory to a restaurant.
And so maybe we can talk more about that offline, but I just wanted to raise that issue that if that's being proposed, it may be considered like a separate use.
There is, there was, I saw in the plans the same, there was some conversation of a possibility that it could enable that use as well.
so correct you will be correct um miss emerson i will discuss it with you offline and and if we
have to make any amendments to the refusal and we have now time to do so um and to preserve and to
proceed with that but that was not mentioned in the rco meetings but it clearly was on the plans
yes okay all right thank you thank you thank you number number six thank you uh council okay number
6-MI-2025-006-317, 3110 Araminga Avenue. Henry Clinton is the attorney. This is a reconsideration
hearing. Good evening, Mr. Chairman. Good evening, Mr. Clinton. You've already been sworn. Could
you just state your name for the record? Sure. Henry Clinton, C-L-I-N-T-O-N.
So, Mr. Clinton, this is a reconsideration hearing. The testimony and evidence presented
at the original hearing on this matter are incorporated into the record for this hearing.
The scope of the reconsideration hearing is limited to the revised plans proposed by the applicant.
So you'll make a presentation for the applicant.
We'll take questions from the board, public testimony, then planning will take a position.
If you want, why don't you start off with a short background of how we got to here?
Sure. Good evening, Mr. Chairman, members of the board.
So this is a request to convert a first-floor doctor's office, Dr. Herbert Frank, long-time family doctor in the area, to a one-bedroom apartment.
And at the outset, I'd like to thank the board for reconsidering this.
It's not always done, so I really do appreciate how it does my client.
So anyway, when we presented it the first time, my client had hand-drawn floor plans, which were inadequate.
I knew that going in and it was raised by the board.
So we came back for another hearing, resumption hearing, and the client, despite my prodding, still did not have full professional plans.
So now we have full professional plans that I can show the board.
We're basically asking to maintain the one-bedroom apartment on the second floor and have a one-bedroom apartment on the first floor.
and have a one-bedroom apartment on the first floor.
And the issue was the floor plans.
And the issue was the floor plans were not professional,
and they were not adequately outlined.
If I can share that, I can show it to the board.
Why don't you start your presentation?
Did I lose you?
So we see your full screen in every area. You're up now, sir.
Great. Actually, this is not the one I want to show you.
So this is the request for consideration. And what I'll do, I'll run through the plans to give you a little bit of back.
This was the first set of plans, obviously inadequate.
And they were calling for two bedrooms on the second floor apartment.
And we only want one bedroom. We then submitted these plans by an architect, but these were not deemed adequate.
So these are the final plans. Proposed basement, no living, will be storage.
First floor, kitchen in the front.
Before it was, I think, in the middle or the rear.
Bathroom, bedroom, exit to the rear yard.
Yes, through the bedroom, but there's not a lot of space, and the client wanted the bedroom in the rear.
Second floor, originally presented as two bedrooms in the front.
That's been eliminated.
There's going to be a bedroom in the front, a living, bath, and a kitchen.
There's also a trash closet here in the kitchen for storage of trash.
That's basically the presentation.
Two one-bedroom apartments.
This is existing on the right-hand side, the second floor.
This first floor is proposed.
And that is the presentation, Mr. Chairman.
You want to bring your client on to adopt your testimony?
Yeah, I don't know that he's still on or around, but I'll ask him.
if he doesn't answer you're an officer of the court all right claudia bilis b-y-l-i-s claudio
are you on the call do we see him the chair counsel i do not see anyone answering to the
name of the audience mr clinton uh you're an officer of the court you're obviously we take
your testimony i appreciate questions from the board thank you for the updated plans they're
very helpful um i think the uh layout um other than the going through the bedroom to go to the
backyard if you could do that doorway out of the that breezeway would probably be much better
layout um on the second floor i i don't know why the um the kitchen isn't where you know where the
living room is and it's all one big space and make that kitchen a bedroom i think i think um
My fellow member would probably like that better.
So you don't have to walk through the living room to go to bathroom.
But other than that, much.
He's got Cheryl left him, by the way.
See, I'm working with you.
Thank you, Mr. Johns, for the comments.
Yeah, that second floor is existing.
So I don't want to make a promise on that one.
All right.
Other questions?
Questions from our attorney?
Not at this time, Mr. Chair.
Planning Commission.
Amy Boyd with the Planning Commission.
The Planning Commission won't be changing our testimony from the previous hearing.
Would you like me to redate again?
the comprehensive plan recommends no change to the rsa 5 residential single family zoning at
this location the city rezoned this neighborhood in 2017 in accord with recommendation from the
comprehensive plan the city issued a rental license in 2013 for one dwelling unit the
planning commission recommends that the board deny their quest variance for two dwelling units
Thank you.
MI 2025-006-317-3110 Aramingo Avenue.
I vote yes.
Michael Johns, my vote is yes.
Cheryl Gaston, my vote is yes.
Tanetta Graham, my vote is yes.
Henry, thank you, Henry, for producing, obviously, a much better product.
Well, and likewise, thank you for reconsidering this. Have a great night, everybody.
Right. Is there anyone in the audience whose case has not been called from the 330 list?
I do not see any hands, Mr. Chair.
Thanks, everybody. I think we're at a decent time, too, here, right?
we're a decent time too here right yes wow yeah we're 5 25 20 something thank you everybody for
Wow. Yeah, we're...
the nice hard work and we we got it done i was a little concerned earlier in the day where we
were running but thank you all thank you and michael thanks for making sure i'll laugh next
it's a little serious next to me mike you know what i mean all right right right right i see
everyone have a good night