Yes, is that correct? I can include in this software the geolocation from the Google Earth.
Okay, and is that what you did?
Yes. Okay. Now, at my request, did you provide us with a comparison study to show the differences
between the shadows cast by a 38-foot-tall structure and a 50-foot-tall structure?
Yes. I use the same design on the right side, and our 38-feet-tall is on the third floor.
So, if I just remove the last floor, I can have the building with 38 feet tall.
Okay. Now, in fact, the house at 2002 Spring Garden Street is 50 feet tall. Is that correct?
Okay. Now, would you please explain the impact in the fall and explain the shadows
that that are created in the fall season at 8 a.m. Yes the the screen that I'm
sharing with you now it's showing on the right side the building with 38 feet
and on the left the building with our 50 feet almost 50 feet or the same size
of the the neighbor so I'm sorry we can see here that at 8 a.m. on the fall we
have the structure with most of shadow and the 38 feet we have part of the
last floor. And this changes by hour, of course, and at 10 a.m. we have at least the same.
Not exactly, of course, but we can see that only the last floor will be
covered by the sunlight. Okay, so are you saying that at 10 a.m.
there's almost the same shadow cast by a 38 foot building as a 50 foot building on the property next door.
Yeah, it's pretty similar. The changes are not significant.
Also, we can go further and then at noon, now here we have, sorry, it's PM here.
I can fix this later.
We have sun covering both buildings and at this time we start to see the shadow from
the garage, sorry, the garage building from Cityville.
Is it safe to say that as of 12 noon in the fall, there is no shadow from our property
to the property next door?
Now, do the impacts differ by season?
Mm-hmm.
I'm sorry, can you please go back to 8 a.m. in the fall?
Now, in your study, do you show the impact of shadows from across 20th Street?
from across 20th street yes i i did this because i i need to uh understand how everything works
Yes, I did this.
and the the buildings across the street are very important too at 8 a.m they are creating shadow on
the street and we can see that the 20th doesn't have sunlight and our proposal is being covered
part of that by the shadow from the buildings across the street.
So are you saying that we are in shadow, that our proposed structure is impacted by shadow
from across the street?
Yes, it is.
Does that shadow from across the street early in the morning extend beyond our property
to the property of 2002?
Okay, now can you show us the impact in the summertime? Sure, summer here, oops,
spring, summer. So here I create something a little bit different, I will
explain, and this is the shadow creates by our proposal over the neighbor's
And this yellow part, it's the shadow created by only the variance, the height.
So we are creating, like I'm trying to represent here, that most of the building will be covered
by the proposal with 38 feet. So this gray area is a 38 feet building.
and this yellow part is the height above that.
You jumped ahead of me, so I want to make sure that we understand what we're looking at.
You're in a new document now, is that correct?
No, no, no.
It's the same document, it's just a different slide.
Okay, but before we had the 38 foot to the right and we had the 50 foot to the left,
right?
Yes, before we had.
I did this comparison on fall only.
Right.
And so now what you did was you synthesized the information from both of those views and
you're now showing the area of difference with the, to me, it looks brown.
Is that brown?
study done by Mr. DeMarco's team?
Yes, I received that.
Okay. Would you show the panel that study?
Let me open here. We have this and this.
so their study is this on the left and I create something similar here on the right
okay so the study on the left is the one that was provided to us last week by Mr. DeMarco is that
right? Yes, that's right. Okay, now do you think that they have fairly and accurately shown the
conditions with their study? And somehow they they try to mislead this presentation. They use a 24
hours period. It's showing here on the graphic and more than 12 hours is night. So the building
it's covered by darkness most of the time of this GIF. So it's fair to say there are no shadows
cast at night, right? Of course not. Okay. And also the buildings across the street is not here.
okay so they don't show the impact of the shadows cast from the building across 20th street do they
no so they make it seem as if the only shadows that exist are those created by our building
is that right yes okay now at my request did you prepare a more fair analysis of
the impact of the light at this location. Yes, on the right side I created this
almost the same presentation, the GIF, divided by 30 and 30 minutes if I could
say that. We can see the hours under the presentation here and I use only the
times that we have Sun. So we are in the winter and it starts early morning, 7, 8
7 30 and we go through the day but it's fair to say that in every instance by 12 noon there is
no impact is that right yes okay and then the duration of the uh of the shadows cast changes
with the season right yes changes a lot in seasons right but but for sure we're only talking about
the longest period of time is from approximately 7 30 a.m to 11 30 a.m is that correct yes we can
use their graphic and it's showing here that around 7 15 i can say that is the time that
that our proposal is casting shadows onto the neighbor's property, 2002, until 1130.
And the rest of the day, it's from other structures.
Now here they are saying that it's Cityville Towers.
So we have this four hours, four hours something, and a day, and a winter day.
This changes a lot on summer.
Right.
And everyone on that block is impacted by shadow created by the existing parking garage.
Is that correct?
Not only the parking garage, but the towers also.
Now, finally, do your exhibits that we just discussed fairly and accurately depict the
conditions at this location?
yes okay thank you very much you're welcome i would like to say one more thing if i can
uh mrs miller mr miller please um i did some uh calculations uh just to to have some percentages
We have on the third floor 38 feet like we are saying until now and on this floor we have 45 feet set back on the rear.
setback on the rear. On the fourth floor, we have 53 feet setback on the rear. This means that we are
On the fourth floor we have
5% more or bigger than the neighbors. Per zoning, we can use 5% more than the neighbor because it's
an intermediate lot. We are in the corner, we can use 80%. So if I did a simple math, I can take
that we have 57 feet in the backyard, they have 64, and this means that we are 5% longer than
from the neighbors. I don't know if I was clear on this, but we are using only our 5%
that we can by zoning. It's fair to say that the only variance
sought here is for height. Yes, and this height, we consider that
that we are using only this 5% that we can use on the last floor.
Thank you very much.
If we build a building with 38 feet and use our 80% by right with no variances,
just project and build, approve and build, this building will cover more than we are proposing now.
Thank you.
Okay, thank you.
I think Mr. DeMarco is trying to be heard.
Unmute yourself, Mr. DeMarco.
Okay, someone muted me. That's, sorry. Thank you. Let me say this, Mr. Chairman, I wanted Mr. Miller to get...
Let's get you on the record, please.
Good morning, everyone.
Richard DeMarco here on behalf of Mooring Properties, the property owner at 2002 Spring Garden.
You want to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Mr. Boland, are you going to be jumping in during this conversation?
I will try not to, but if you'd like to swear me in, Mr. Chairman.
Let's swear you in just in case, all right?
Full name?
Ryan Boland, 1801 Market Street, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, represent Spring Garden Civic Association.
We're ready for him to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth.
Thank you.
Okay, Mr. DeMarco.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Good morning, everyone.
So, Mr. Chairman, what I'm going to do is I'm just going to – I wanted Mr. Miller to get through the testimony from Ms. Stanky.
I do have an objection to the fact that that one comparison, those comparison drawings that showed the difference between the two, I did receive the shadow study prepared by Ms. Stanky, but not the comparison drawing.
So I would say this, I'm going to do my cross-examination, you know, as best I can.
I'd like to preserve the right to review those drawings, and I'd ask Mr. Miller to provide the comparison study to me.
I don't think I'll have to recall anybody, but I do want to preserve that right, place it on the record, and I'll try to do my cross, and hopefully I can get through it and it'll be fair and whatnot.
but i do want to mention on the record that i saw the the comparison drawings with the yellow
portion for the first time during miss stankey's testimony okay so i'm also going to ask that miss
stankey continue to share her screen because i don't have those um yellow uh comparison drawings
so i can refer to them during my cross that's all right thank you so let me ask this as a general
matter of miss stanky um i'm so i'm sure can you hear me okay miss stank yes yes i'm great i'm sure
you're not going to present testimony here and i don't i don't know that you did but i heard
something that confused me you're not going to testify to this board that a taller building
casts the same shadow as a smaller building right no that's not your testimony right
I didn't understand your question.
It's a very simple question, Ms. Stanky.
Does a taller building cast a greater shadow than a smaller building?
The difference is not relevant.
So you're refusing to answer the very simple question that a taller building,
or you're trying to argue to this board,
that a taller building does not cast a greater shadow than a smaller building?
It is casting shadow, but this difference between 38 feet
It is casting shadow, but this difference between 38 feet tall and the building that is being proposed is not relevant.
Ma'am, I'm going to ask the board to instruct the witness to answer my question, who's not answering it.
Does a taller building cast a greater shadow than a smaller building?
Which smaller building you are being referred?
A 38-foot building that we are proposing, this difference is not relevant.
Okay, you've again refused to answer my question.
I don't know if she's refusing.
I mean, I'm not an architect by no means, but if someone were to build a 30-story building on that site,
but the footprint was only say from the front of the building back 30 feet it certainly would have
a a greater shadow but not as wide all right i mean so i right i think i know where you're going
but it doesn't i don't think you're asking it the right way that's just my opinion well well look i
i certainly i don't feel i got an answer to the question so note my objection that the witness
refuses to answer a very simple and obvious question and i think that's how you have to
viewer testimony she can't answer the simple question of does a taller building cast a greater
shadow than a smaller building where it exists if that's are you saying that it's a buy a buy right
that miss stanky spoke to are you using that as the example that that buy right building
i heard her i heard her offer the testimony that the 50-foot building is is not casting uh as great
a shadow as a 38-foot building now what what you're saying mr chairman is that if the
area is is smaller than the greater area might be equal but that's not the question i asked the
question is does the taller building cast a greater shadow than a smaller building that's
the question she hasn't answered it and i object mr chairman she has answered it three times
i'm gonna ask that we all be civil today thank you
don't speak unless the other one has stopped speaking we have to get everything on a record
thank you kindly mr chairman i object the witness has answered three times she said it does but the
difference in this instance she used the word not relevant i would prefer to use the word not
material but the exhibit speaks for itself she shows the difference between the 38 foot and it's
on our screen now and the 50 foot and that difference is only uh on the roof of the building
next door at greatest impact so mr mr mr demarco is going to have to live with the testimony that
he has and he can spin it however he likes in closing argument but in the midst of the
examination it's inappropriate uh mr chairman may i continue uh yeah please leave up miss stankey
um so this yellow area is what you say is the difference between
an as of right project versus and please go to the 8 a.m uh portion okay thank you so so that's uh
The yellow is the difference between an as-of-write project and the current project, right?
All right.
So the yellow represents the additional shadow cast by the current proposal, correct?
Yes, correct.
And this time, the sun is not casting or, can I say, shining on the rear.
any you can see that any one of these buildings has sunlight on the rear facade at this time
so i'm not sure what you're what you're talking about but so the yellow is the we admit that the
yellow is the additional shadows cast by the current proposal right yes and that's due to