CITY OF PHILADELPHIA1 CITY COUNCIL COMMITTEE ON RULES HEARING ON BILL NO. 1101842 TRANSCRIPT OF HEARING, taken by and before JOSEPH P. DROMGOOLE, Professional Reporter and Notary Public, at City Hall, Room 13 494, 1450 John F. Kennedy Boulevard, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania 19107, on Wednesday, May 4, 2011, commencing at 10:11 a.m. 2 A P P E A R A N C E S:1 COMMITTEE ON RULES:2 COUNCILMAN JAMES F. KENNEY, Vice-Chair3 COUNCILMAN FRANK DICICCO COUNCILMAN FRANK RIZZO4 COUNCILWOMAN DONNA REED MILLER COUNCILMAN W. WILSON GOODE, JR.5 COUNCILMAN WILLIAM K. GREENLEE - - -6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 3 WITNESS: PAGE1 WILLIAM KRAMER 52 WITNESS:3 JOHN GATTUSO 74 WITNESS:5 KEVIN MAHONEY 126 WITNESS:7 CARL PRIMAVERA 158 WITNESS:9 RON BOWLAN 1910 WITNESS:11 G. ROSS WILSON 2212 WITNESS:13 DARWIN BEAUVAIS 2314 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 4
Good1 morning. Council Committee on Rules has2 a quorum with members Rizzo, DiCicco,3 Greenlee and Goode. I'm Councilman4 Kenney. I'm the vice chair of the5 committee chairing the committee today.6 The only bill that we have for7 consideration today is Bill Number8 110184, which is an oridance amending9 Title 14 of The Philadelphia Code,10 relating to "Zoning and Planning," by11 amending Chapter 14-300, entitled12 "Commercial Districts," by amending13 Section 14-305 (7)(e)(.2)(b) by exempting14 certain corner lots from the application15 thereof, under certain terms and16 conditions; and amending the Philadelphia17 Zoning Maps by changing the zoning18 designations of certain areas of land19 located within the area bounded by Walnut20 Street, 8th Street, Locust Street, and21 9th Street, all under certain terms and22 conditions.23 Mr. Kramer, please identify24 5 yourself for the record.1
Good morning,2 Councilman Kenney and Members of the3 Rules Committee. I am William Kramer,4 Division Director of the Development5 Division of the Philadelphia City6 Planning Commission. I am here today to7 testify on Bill Number 110184, which was8 introduced into City Council on March9 10th, 2011.10 Bill Number 110184 amends the11 Philadelphia Zoning Maps by rezoning a12 portion of the block bounded by Walnut13 Street, 8th Street, Locust Street and 9th14 Street from the existing zoning15 designation of "C4" Commercial to a16 proposed zoning designation of "C5"17 Commercial. Additionally the bill amends18 section 14-305(7)(e)(.2)(b) of the19 Philadelphia Zoning Code to provide for20 relief from setback restrictions above a21 certain height along Walnut Street.22 Currently on site is a parking23 structure with retail space on the ground24 6 floor which is intended to be the base1 for an additional twelve stories of a2 medical office building.3 The Philadelphia City Planning4 Commission at its meeting of April 19th,5 2011, considered Bill Number 110184 and6 recommended that it be improved.7 The City's Law Department had8 requested a technical amendment to the9 language of this Bill and I will10 respectfully submit it for your11 consideration.12 That's the conclusion of my13 testimony. I will be happy to answer any14 questions of the Committee at this time.15
Thank you,16 Mr. Kramer. Please let the record17 reflect that Councilwoman Donna Reed18 Miller is also in attendance.19 Any questions for Mr. Kramer?20 Seeing none, Mr. Gattuso, please, and21 Mr. Mahoney.22 Good morning. Please identify23 yourself for the record.24 7
Good morning. My1 name is John Gattuso. 4 Good morning. 21 Our proposed project consists of22 a 12-story, 153,000 square foot office23 building to be developed above the24 8 existing 7-story parking garage at 8th1 and Walnut Streets. It will be 1002 percent leased and occupied by the3 University of Pennsylvania Health System4 to be used as medical offices. Liberty5 and Parkway are proud to partner with an6 institution which has a storied history7 and tradition in Philadelphia and boasts8 the first medical school and first9 hospital in the nation. 19 In 1989, the existing 7-story20 parking garage was constructed21 encompassing this block. As part of the22 Urban Renewal Plan created for this23 block, two residential towers were24 9 proposed on the top of the garage and1 were envisioned to arise in excess of 2802 feet. The garage was designed and3 constructed to structurally accommodate4 these residential towers. In 2002, Wills5 Eye Hospital completed a 147,000 square6 foot building in place of the western7 residential tower at 9th and Walnut8 Streets. This development approach9 amended the Urban Renewal Plan to10 accommodate the change in use from11 residential to office. 16 Our proposed project at 8th and17 Walnut Street completes the original18 Urban Renewal Plan by substituting a19 smaller office building in place of the20 second residential tower. The original21 project had received all approvals for a22 323,000 square foot tower rising 280 feet23 in height. D. certification from the US Green11 Building Council, making it one of the12 most environmentally friendly and energy13 efficient buildings in Center City14 Philadelphia. We have worked with the15 Planning Commission to analyze the16 project relative to the proposed new17 zoning code and it complies with all18 material aspects of the new code,19 including the proposed "sky visibility"20 requirements. 10 In addition, a traffic study has11 been completed in connection with the12 proposed project. 11
Thank you12 very much for your testimony. Do you13 have anything to add? Please identify14 yourself for the record.15
Yes. My name is16 Kevin Mahoney. I'm senior vice president17 and chief administrative officer and vice18 dean of the School of Medicine at the19 University of Pennsylvania. I apologize20 for my tardiness. I didn't anticipate21 the weather and traffic a little bit.22 I just want to give a little23 sense as to Pennsylvania Hospital's plans24 13 for the future and why this project is1 important to us.2 Pennsylvania Hospital, different3 than the University in West Philadelphia,4 the nation's first hospital has been in5 this location for 251 years. And we6 continue to grow. And the hospital is7 doing well. It's serving the community.8 The growth is coming from a variety of9 reasons, one of which is we're one of the10 few hospitals left in Philadelphia that11 continues to deliver babies despite the12 malpractice crisis. And we continue to13 grow in that regard. And also the cancer14 and neurosurgical specialities are15 growing quite rapidly.16 We understand the impact on the17 community, so we studied where we could18 expand. We looked at building higher on19 top of the existing buildings. We looked20 at the building across the street. We21 looked at tearing down surrounding areas22 and we felt that the quickest way and the23 easiest way forward was to build on top24 14 of the garage at 8th Street and Walnut.1 We felt it would create jobs sooner in2 the construction industry. As John3 mentioned, it also uses Liberty's capital4 for the project versus the University.5 It allows us to invest in other medical6 technologies as opposed to the7 buildings. Using the existing parking8 garage also would hopefully get some of9 the traffic off of the 8th and Spruce10 intersection, which is quite congested.11 So this is for us a good new12 start and it's continued growth of13 Pennsylvania Hospital. And we appreciate14 your consideration.15
Thank you16 very much for your testimony, for your17 presence in Philadelphia. Both my18 children were born in Pennsylvania19 Hospital, so I thank you.20 Any questions for these21 witnesses? Seeing none, thank you very22 much. Mr. Primavera, Mr. Patterson and23 Mr. Beauvais.24 15
Good morning,1 Chairman, members of the committee. Carl2 Primavera. I'm here obviously with3 Darwin Beauvais, he'll speak for himself4 as he always does, and Ron Bowlan, vice5 president with Thomas Jefferson6 University. I'm representing the7 University and University Hospital8 today.9 We had sent a letter to10 Councilman DiCicco April 27th outlining a11 series of concerns on behalf of the12 city's stakeholders. And we're now13 unbundling those in a way that hopefully14 will assist in resolving the issues.15 Wills has their own counsel.16 And they're working directly with Liberty17 to address various issues. And Darwin,18 who just Monday started a new position19 with Zarwin and Baum, will speak on20 behalf of the St. James, which is the21 apartment building immediately across the22 street. They have concerns.23 Thomas Jefferson University24 16 Hospital have concerns primarily around1 the availability of parking. We're going2 to be dispossessed out of a garage as a3 result of this project. We met with4 Mr. Zuritsky and we're going to be5 meeting probably next week to talk about6 how we can efficiently, safely and7 affordably relocate both our customers8 and our staff so that our operations in9 the facilities aren't negatively impacted10 by the growth and the development.11 Also there's a series of issues12 surrounding traffic circulation. We may13 look to make some revisions on our campus14 so that we can offset some of the15 issues. And we may be talking to16 Councilman DiCicco about that, kind of a17 mitigation plan. And then also18 collectively and collaboratively19 hopefully we're going to be able to talk20 about eliminating confusion, because now21 we have three hospitals in the same22 neighborhood, and we want to make sure23 that people who are going to one know24 17 where to park, they don't end up being in1 the wrong place at the wrong time,2 because there are going to be a lot of3 people obviously coming for three4 different hospitals. Unless you're5 sophisticated and you know the6 neighborhood and you know where you have7 to go it's easy to just walk into a8 hospital building and be surprised. And9 then you have to move your car, you're10 not going to get compensated. A variety11 of operational issues.12 So with the Councilman's support13 we're going to be meeting next week with14 Liberty as well as Parkway. We're15 requesting that the rules not be16 suspended so that will give us time.17 There was a companion streets bill that18 was heard last week. So I'm reasonably19 confident that at our meeting next week20 we'll be able to work through our21 institutional issues and hopefully set a22 blueprint for success for all23 institutions moving forward.24 18
The issues1 you raised don't seem to be necessarily2 that unsurmountable.3
They're not4 insurmountable, they're complicated and5 they're worrisome. I mean Ron is in6 charge of all the facilities for7 Jefferson, the parking, the hospital8 employees, so he's kind of -- he's got9 some extra gray hair trying to figure all10 this out now. And it's just going to get11 more difficult. I guess the good news is12 it's good for Philadelphia because we are13 a health care --14
So he's17 confident to know that we're not going to18 be lacking for parking and for the type19 of safe and efficient campus that we need20 collectively.21 Ron, do you have anything to22 add?23
I'm Ron Bowlan,2 vice president for Thomas Jefferson3 University. One of our primary goals in4 trying to make parking in and around our5 campus is to make sure that there's6 capacity available for patients and7 visitors directly adjacent to the8 buildings they need to able to go to.9 And those -- those garages primarily on10 10th and Chestnut operate at or near11 capacity during peak times every week.12 And there are a lot of -- and we manage13 that by trying to push employees, staff14 to -- you know, to the outer reaches of15 the -- of the garage or off-site.16 There's parking subsidies and mass17 transit subsidies.18 So given that we are operating19 at capacity and then we will be losing20 somewhere, you know, between two and 30021 daily spaces as part of this project it's22 something we really have a lot of23 interest in and we really need to figure24 20 out.1
And TJ gets2 a lot of primo parking, I guess, at Penns3 Landing and places like that?4
Well, I7 would also think that some of the more8 remote lots, if that similar situation9 could be accomplished, would benefit also10 because they would be getting extra11 business and the City would be getting12 the extra parking tax that would be going13 to potentially private lots.14 Counselman DiCicco.15
Thank you,16 Mr. Chairman. Yesterday we had a17 discussion about the number of spaces18 available in a two or three-square block19 area. I'm going to say --20
We were talking23 earlier. And Mr. Wilson says that they24 21 can help us. They're in that business,1 so they have -- they believe they have2 control over an adequate supply as long3 as we can identify where it is, the cost4 structure. And they were saying earlier5 that they would maintain the same cost6 structure so that we wouldn't see a7 traumatic increase as a result of losing8 our position in this garage. So the9 compensations are very positive. And,10 you know, I think the reality is that11 moving forward the three institutions,12 the two Jefferson entities, Wills and13 Pennsylvania Hospital, I think they just14 need to get comfortable with15 collaborating on common issues, because16 it's going to continue, I think, to be a17 growth area for the city and for the18 hospitals.19
And that20 issue was discussed thoroughly yesterday21 in my office, the parking situation and22 the need to accommodate that shift, if23 you will, from the current lot to --24 22 garage to other facilities.1
I'm Ross Wilson,4 senior vice president of Parkway5 Corporation. Just to put it in6 perspective, there are over 70,000 public7 parking spaces in Center City. Within a8 five-minute walk of the Jefferson campus9 there are about 13,000 spaces. Within10 that 13,000 spaces Parkway controls 3,00011 spaces. The City Planning Commission has12 a report on Center City parking that13 suggests that their garages on average14 our 82 percent occupied. So out of that15 13,000 spaces there are probably 1,80016 that are vacant.17 We as a matter of routine move18 groups of monthlies, not our contractual19 cars between our various facilities. And20 we're 100 percent confident that we can21 move all of the cars that might be22 affected by this to other facilities that23 are within a five-minute walk of the24 23 Jefferson campus.1
Thank you2 very much. Sir, are you through with3 your testimony?4
Hold on. Do10 me a favor, would you please pull the11 microphone closer to you?12
I represent the13 St. James. Just as Thomas Jefferson and14 Carl Primavera suggested, we're more than15 willing to sit down and have a16 discussion, but I want the Committee to17 realize that initially there are three18 main issues for the residents that are19 going to live next door. One is the20 issue with the mechanicals. There was a21 suggestion that the design would be22 tweaked, because I believe the windows23 would be at around three -- three24 24 by-three and looked too much like a jail1 cell. Four -- three is the fact that2 there's a five-foot encroachment coming3 closer to the St. James and the residents4 are up in arms.5 Now, parking because -- there6 hasn't been any discussions or a lengthy7 sit-down. And I understand that they8 were invited to meetings, public9 meetings, but nevertheless it -- it10 wasn't -- so I'm asking that the11 Committee not suspend the rules.12 I have comitted on behalf of13 St. James to sit down and meet with --14 with the developer. What I believe the15 point of contention will be is this fight16 for encroachment. And I would ask that17 the design team actually sit down with18 several of us to -- to give us their19 justification and maybe we could -- we20 could change everyone's perspective.21
I guess with22 all development, high-rise development or23 otherwise we have these ongoing24 25 conversations. I remember similar1 conversations going on with the2 development of the St. James. Everything3 seemed to work out okay and people are4 happy. We're happy with that particular5 project. And I would think that in the6 end everybody will be happy with this7 one.8
Thank you,13 Mr. Chairman. Do you have a date set for14 that meeting?15
I would18 urge you to do that because I had maybe19 an hour or so, maybe an hour-and-a-half20 meeting in my office yesterday and some21 of the -- the three issues that you spoke22 about were discussed quite thoroughly.23 There will be adjustments made to the24 26 size of the windows and there will be1 significant adjustments made to the2 mechanicals so as to minimize, if you3 will, the aesthetic issue that -- that4 the folks who live in the St. James might5 be concerned about, so -- and they're --6 they're working to make this project a7 good project.8 Everybody wants 100 percent. As9 you know, no one gets 100 percent. But I10 think all things considered this is going11 to be an improvement to that -- to that12 intersection. And I think that the13 St. James folks will -- in my opinion I14 believe will be satisfied with the15 efforts that are being made on the part16 of Liberty Trust to accommodate their17 concerns.18 I think that the biggest problem19 I've seen is there's been a communication20 issue depending on what side you're21 standing on. I believe what from I've22 seen in written documents and23 conversation that Liberty Trust has made24 27 every effort to reach out to the1 management, Stonehenge, I think it is,2 Dan Sablosky, but for whatever reason3 those meetings never took place. But I4 don't think it's because of any foot-5 dragging on behalf of Liberty Trust.6
In -- in fairness7 I did speak to Stonehenge. And they --8 they believe that overtures were -- that9 the time frame that they were being, you10 know --11
I know12 they're your clients and you need to13 represent them, but I have a totally14 different point of view on that -- that15 issue.16
Well, I'm -- I'm17 hoping we can -- we can start all over18 again.19
I will ask20 this committee not to suspend the rules,21 but I will ask that the bill be voted on22 favorably. But I don't want hold this,23 hold this forever. So you need to get24 28 your client to sit down and discuss those1 issues as soon as you can. Thanks.2
I will4 reiterate what I said earlier, with all5 the issues that we deal with in this6 council and in the city these are like7 really good problems to have as compared8 to some of the other issues we have9 facing other parts of the city. And10 we're talking about, you know, real --11 real construction and real jobs and real12 expansion of one of the most important13 industries in our region and that's14 health care. So I think despite the fact15 they have to be worked out they're not16 bad problems to have.17 Councilwoman Miller I believe18 has some questions. I think John Gattuso19 has to come back.20
Yes, I21 have a couple of questions. Darwin, a22 point you made, where does the St. James'23 residents park now?24 29
Okay.11 COUNCILMAN DICICCO:12 St. James -- excuse me, if I may,13 St. James has parking on their facility.14 They have their own parking garage.15
I believe21 that they have enough space in there to22 accommodate.23
But to2 answer the Councilwoman's question, it is3 a fairly new construction. It was built4 within the last ten years as an apartment5 building. And I don't know if they6 started to convert to condos or not.7 There is a garage.8
And I was12 wondering how many spaces will be13 available in this -- how many spaces are14 available in the current garage and --15 and how many office spaces are going to16 be built, how many office -- offices will17 be built in -- in this new addition?18
Councilwoman, the19 new building investment proposed is a20 153,000 square feet in a 12-story21 building. It is leased in its entirety22 to the Penn Health System. And what23 we've been informed by Penn as to their24 31 intent would be to take certain doctors1 offices that are currently in their2 campus and relocate them to this new3 building. I don't know off of the top of4 my head how many individual doctors that5 involves. And perhaps Mr. Mahoney might6 be able to have that information as an --7 as an estimate.8
So9 actually I guess the space is there and10 it will be based on the need of the11 doctor how much will be determined?12
The existing13 garage has 685 spaces. 650. And the14 majority of it is used as a transient15 garage so that people come in and park16 for a couple of hours and then leave. So17 the garage was initially sized,18 Councilwoman, to take two apartment19 towers above it and to provide parking20 for all those residential towers. It's21 being developed at a much lower density22 than what it was originally planned to,23 to accommodate those two residential24 32 towers.1
But we're2 talking about Pennsylvania Hospital or3 University of Pennsylvania?4
All7 right. Because I got a little bit8 confused. You know, in the testimony you9 said University of Penn and now you refer10 to Penn.11
And I did13 not know that was an affiliate. I did14 not know that.15
And I have one17 other question about your construction.18 Do you happen to have an equal19 opportunity plan to go along with this20 $70,000,000 construction?21
Yes,22 Councilwoman. As you appropriately point23 out, this $70,000,000 project -- actually24 33 Liberty's total construction cost is1 about $35,000,000, our construction2 cost. And we have developed and3 submitted to the Redevelopment Authority4 and it has been approved by the5 Redevelopment Authority an economic6 opportunity plan, which addresses not7 only minority and disabled firms, but8 also employment. That plan I'm glad to9 submit to the Committee. But it provides10 for up to 15 to 20 percent and equals11 between five and ten percent. And that's12 just with regards to disabled enterprises13 for this project. And we'll make that14 available for the public record.15
I assume16 that Councilman DiCicco has a copy of17 that?18
Actually,19 Councilwoman, I'll leave one here to go20 along with my testimony, too.21
I'll just ask2 the sponsor of the bill if we can have3 the EOP attached as an exhibit to the4 bill. Thank you.5
Thank you6 very much. Any other questions for these7 witnesses?8 Mr. Beauvais, do you have9 anything else?10
Thank you.12 Anyone else to testify on this bill?13 Seeing none we'll -- also I would like to14 announce that Bill Number 110185 is being15 held at the request of the sponsor. And16 that will conclude our public hearing.17 We'll now convene a public18 meeting. The Chair recognizes Councilman19 DiCicco for the approval of the amendment20 to Bill Number 110184.21
Thank you,22 Mr. Chairman. I move that the amendment23 to Bill Number 110184 be approved.24 35
Moved and2 seconded. All in favor?3 COMMITTEE MEMBERS: Aye.4
There are5 none opposed. The bill is so amended.6 The Chair recognizes Councilman DiCicco.7
Thank you,8 Mr. Chairman. I move that Bill Number9 110184 as amended be reported out of this10 Committee with a favorable recommendation11 and a further recommendation made for12 rules suspension.13
Moved and15 seconded. All in favor.16 COMMITTEE MEMBERS: Aye.17
Hearing none18 opposed, Bill Number 110184 as amended be19 reported out of this Committee favorably20 and a request made for rules suspension21 to allow first reading at our next22 Council session. That concludes the23 business of the Rules Committee. Thank24 36 you very much for your time.1 (At this time, the Committee on2 Rules session concluded at 10:40 a.m.)3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 37 C E R T I F I C A T I O N1 I, Joseph P. Dromgoole,2 Professional Reporter and Notary Public for3 the State of Pennsylvania, do hereby certify4 the forgoing to be a true and accurate5 transcript of my original stenographic notes6 taken at the time and place hereinbefore set7 forth.8 9 ____________________10 Joseph P. Dromgoole11 Professional Court Reporter12 Notary Public13 (My commission expires June14 of 2011)15 Date: __________________16 17 (The foregoing certification of18 this transcript does not apply to any19 reproduction of the same by any means, unless20 under the direct control and/or supervision21 of the certifying reporter.)22 23 24