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Minutes

Committee Hearing, March 6, 2001

Philadelphia City Council Committee HearingsMar 6, 2001

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COUNCIL OF THE CITY OF PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET BEFORE THE COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - - - Room 400, City Hall Philadelphia, PA March 6, 2001 10:00 a.m. - - - Bill No. 010011 - "School Tax Authorization" Bill No. 010012 - "School Tax Authorization" Bill No. 010013 - "School Tax Authorization" (Full text of Bills attached.) PRESENT: COUNCIL PRESIDENT ANNA VERNA COUNCILWOMAN DONNA REED MILLER COUNCILWOMAN JANNIE BLACKWELL COUNCILMAN JAMES KENNEY COUNCILWOMAN BLONDELL REYNOLDS-BROWN COUNCILMAN DAVID COHEN COUNCILWOMAN MARIAN B. TASCO COUNCILMAN ANGEL L. ORTIZ COUNCILMAN FRANK DICICCO COUNCILMAN W. WILSON GOODE, JR. COUNCILMAN DARRELL CLARKE COUNCILMAN W. THACHER LONGSTRETH COUNCILMAN FRANK RIZZO COUNCILMAN W. THACHER LONGSTRETH VINCENT VARALLO ASSOCIATES, INC. Registered Professional Reporters 1835 Market Street, Suite 600 Philadelphia, PA 19103 (215) 561-2220 2 I N D E X Deborah Kahn, Secretary of Education...........5 Pedro Ramos, President, Board of Education.....14 Phil Goldsmith, Chief Executive Officer........21 Deidre Farmbry, Chief Academic Officer.........30 Rhonda Chatzkel, Chief Financial Officer.......43 John Lombardi, Transportation Services........139 Ron Daniels...................................156 Tom McGlinchey, CEO...........................283 3

Council President Verna

Good morning, everyone. We're here this morning to hear from officials of the School District of Philadelphia as to what they propose to spend on operations for their Fiscal Year beginning July 1, 2001. As we all know, the School District's operating budget is not subject to the approval of City Council, whose role in the fiscal affairs of the District is limited to the authorization of the levy of taxes by the Board of Education of the School District. These hearings are basically for informational purposes only and are used to support the Board of Education's request for an authorization to levy taxes in the amount that the Board of Education, all of whoms members are appointed by the Mayor, believes are necessary to balance the budget for the School District of Philadelphia. The amount and adequacy of the District's budget is determined exclusively by the Board of Education. This is the Committee of the Whole. I would ask Mr. McPherson to please read the titles of Bills Nos. 010011, 010012 and 010013. 4 3/6/01 - School District Budget

Mr. Mcpherson

Bill No. 010011 an ordinance amending Chapter 19-1800 of the Philadelphia Code entitled School Tax Authorization by amending Section 19-1801 to further authorize the Board of Education, the School District of Philadelphia to impose a tax on real estate within the City of Philadelphia. Bill No. 010012, an ordinance 10 amending Chapter 19-1800 of the Philadelphia Code entitled School Tax Authorization by amending Section 19-1804 to further authorize the Board of Education of the School District of Philadelphia to impose a tax on net income from real property, tangible and intangible personal property of residents of the School District of Philadelphia. Bill No. 010013, an ordinance 18 amending Chapter 19-1800 of the Philadelphia Code entitled School Tax Authorization by amending Section 19-1806 to further authorize the Board of Education of the School District of Philadelphia to impose a tax on the use or occupancy of real estate within the School District of Philadelphia.

Council President Verna

Thank you. 5 3/6/01 - School District Budget Before we begin, I'd like everyone to know that Councilman Nutter's child is sick. He will be unable to attend today's hearings, but has indicated he'll be here tomorrow. Please Identify yourself.

Ms. Kahn

Good morning, President Verna, Councilmembers. My name is Deborah Kahn. I'm the Secretary of Education for the City of Philadelphia. It is a privilege for me to be here this morning on behalf of Mayor John F. Street to lead off the presentation of the School District of Philadelphia's Fiscal Year 2002 budget. Joining me at the table on my left is the President of the Board of Education, Mr. Pedro Ramos, and the Vice President, Mrs. Dorothy Sumners Rush. On my right, our interim Chief Executive Officer, Philip Goldsmith, and Chief Academic Officer, Dr. Deidre Farmbry. And Rhonda Chatzkel, Chief Financial Officer. After our prepared remarks, we all will be available to answer questions. It has been one year to the day since the School District appeared in this 6 3/6/01 - School District Budget Chamber to present its preliminary budget for the current school year. It has been a long year. A year of making change and progress on our twin goals of improving educational performance and restoring the School District to financial stability. " We took responsibility and worked hard to get rid of the excuses, both in fact and perception, that for too long have prevented the School District from getting where it needs to go. Enormous challenges remain, but we are moving in the right direction. As a result of the Home Rule Charter change, the Mayor appointed a dedicated new School Board that has tackled tough issues, like academic standards, school uniforms, budget cuts and charter schools with intelligence and integrity. We work as a team. This Board is "our" Board, an integral part of Mayor Street's administration. We changed the management structure of the School District so that the Board's policies can be carried out more effectively. Strong management is as necessary 7 3/6/01 - School District Budget to obtain educational results as it is to exercise good business practices. Our new leaders have set a tone that we can accomplish more with cooperation, candor, concentration and courage. These values will be put to the test as the District's budget process unfolds and still more changes are forthcoming. We negotiated a landmark contract with the Philadelphia Federation of Teachers. I'm pleased to recognize that Mr. Jerry Jordon, the Vice President and Chief of Staff for the PFT and the PFT chief negotiators is with us today. The contract provides many benefits, including professional growth opportunities for teachers, better learning conditions for students and greater flexibility for management. In fact, this new contract addresses nearly all of the constraints that have been expressed by principals and other managers over the years in operating schools and the criticisms leveled against the District from outside sources whom we need as our allies. Successful implementation of this contract, which we are doing in partnership with the PFT, is 8 3/6/01 - School District Budget fundamental to achieving our ultimate goals for the School District. Working with a team of community members, the School District this year also developed a comprehensive education Empowerment plan to significantly improve our student's academic performance as measured by the Commonwealth's PSSA exam. Districts that fail to carry out their plans and raise student achievement face a State takeover in three or four years. The Empowerment plan was approved by the State Department of Education in January and it will guide our educational and financial decision making in the years ahead. Our proposed operating budget already contains funding to retain some of the essential elements of the plan that have been underway in our District for a while now, such as full-day kindergarten, because we know these are the right. Things to do. Additional funding is needed on top of our proposed operating budget.

Ms. Kahn

Without it, the District will not be able to achieve the team's full vision of smaller class sizes, intensive 9 3/6/01 - School District Budget instruction for struggling students, wide-spread use of technology and safe, orderly schools. Complementing this educational plan, the School District for the first time has prepared a multi-year financial plan, similar in concept to the City's five-year plan. The plan was an important undertaking that provides a history of School District revenues and expenses over the past several years and it explains why the District is in financial crisis. The plan does not seek to portray villains or to make excuses. But it is a presentation of the facts in a clear and straight-forward manner. The all-important budget gap-closing chapter remains to be written. Underscoring all of these developments of the past year have been our efforts to build stronger relationships with the School District's chief funders, the Governor and General Assembly of Pennsylvania and the City Council. Being at odds with our funders makes no sense and we continue to take steps to get it right. We're very aware and appreciative of how concerned and committed the members of this Council are to helping strengthen Philadelphia's 10 3/6/01 - School District Budget public schools. We have met with you as a group and with individual members on numerous occasions throughout the year to keep you informed of events and solicit your advice. We still make mistakes. I hope you believe that our efforts deserve better marks. On the State level, Mayor Street and Governor Ridge have forged a positive relationship that is working well for our City in general and our schools in particular. That good relationship extends to the members of the Governor's staff and secretaries of education and budget. A vital expression of this mutual support came in arranging the budget agreement last spring, which enabled our schools to be open for this full year. 9 millions in new funds. As welcome as these funds are, it will still not be enough to solve the District's financial problems. We also continue to work hard with the General Assembly, our own delegation and other key 11 3/6/01 - School District Budget members to increase their knowledge and improve their image of the Philadelphia School District. Many meetings in Harrisburg and at home with legislative leaders and staff are helping to bridge the communication barriers. In fact, about ten days ago the members of the House Education Committee spent about hours with us in here in Philadelphia eager 9 to see our schools despite the snow storm. There are 10 some big differences for sure between Philadelphia 11 and all of the Commonwealth's 500 other School 12 Districts. But the more we talk, the more we find 13 growing areas of common ground that give us reasons 14 to be hopeful. 15 With all of these efforts and our 16 determination to avoid excuses, I wish I could tell 17 you that we have found the solutions to the School 18 District's financial problems. You will hear today 19 the reasons why we currently project a deficit next 20 year of $191 million. You also will hear that the 21 District and City Administration will do everything 22 possible on our own to reduce this number. Our 23 actions will include a combination of organizational 24 changes, spending cut-backs, targeted use of federal and other grant funds, generation of local non-tax 12 3/6/01 - School District Budget revenues, coordination or consolidation of functions between the City and the School District and a willingness to think and act outside the box for financial and educational solutions that make sense. But the School District's financial problems have been years in the making and they will not be resolved in one budget cycle, nor will the District be able to solve the problem on its own.

Ms. Kahn

We simply must find a way, working together all of our partners, to generate sufficient recurring revenues to support a quality education for our 214,000 public school students. If we don't, let's not be surprised that the current conditions and results that we find so unsatisfactory will persist. For the next two days, we'll focus on the School District's budget. That means we'll be hearing about some of our big problems. But in truth, this is also an opportunity to share some of our successes. More than 70 percent of the School District's operating dollars are spent right in the classroom, and for that money our teachers, principals and counselors produce a lot of really successful students. They are the science and the chess and 13 3/6/01 - School District Budget the horticultural champions whose talents are awesome. They are the choral students whose concerts give us goose bumps. They are the learning disabled students who earn their places on the honor roll. They are the thousands of young men and women who become the first in their families to graduate from high school and go onto college. It helps me, and I hope it does you, to be reminded that in spite of our problems, we can take pride in our accomplishments and have confidence in our potential to do even better. My colleagues have important parts of the story to tell. Each will speak from his or her own perspective as we carry out our different roles in helping the School District do better. But from all of us you will hear a common commitment and conviction: this is a School District that needs and merits support for the sake of the children and this City, whose futures are one.

Mr. Ramos

Good morning. My name is Pedro Ramos. I'm president of the Board of Education, School District of Philadelphia. 14 3/6/01 - School District Budget Last March when it was my pleasure to last testify before this Committee, I had the honor of introducing new members of the Board of Education along with some valuable veterans. Since our last appearance in this Chamber, I'm proud to say the new Board has worked tirelessly on behalf of the children of Philadelphia. Our volunteer Board members have put in many long hours and wrestled with serious challenges. If I may, I would like to introduce the Board Members here today, starting with our able vice president, Dorothy Sumners Rush seated to my left. Also sitting immediately behind me are Board Members Martin Benarik; Reverend Ralph Blanks; Helen Cunningham; Sandra Dungy-Glenn; Christine James Brown; Michael Masch and Dr. Amelio Maticoli.

Council President Verna

Why don't you all stand so we can recognize you. (Applause.)

Mr. Ramos

I'd like to note, as I was reading their names I was happy to see they were all still there. The past 12 months have brought 15 3/6/01 - School District Budget some highly significant and very positive changes to the School District. One could almost call it a new era. We have, as I said, a new Board, all of whom were appointed by one Mayor, and all of whom are accountable to that Mayor. I'm a five-year veteran of the Board and I can't begin to tell you how this has changed the way we do our business. We still are a diverse body with expertise in many fields, but now I see our Board as one team joined for the betterment of public education in this City. This Board has not been afraid to roll up its shirt sleeves and do the work it feels must be done, even if the decisions we made were not universally popular. The mandatory uniform policy is an excellent example. Through personal visits in last winter's education town meetings held in every 20 cluster, the Board heard citizens throughout the 21 City say they wanted children in uniform. So the 22 Board, under the leadership of Christine James Brown, looked at the issue from all sides, convened hearings, took testimony, and with the help of parents, students, teachers and 16 3/6/01 - School District Budget administrators crafted a policy. The Board also did something very bold. It did not try to "sell" uniforms as a panacea for many of the ills that are present in our schools. The Board took the realistic approach of saying uniforms are a good thing for improving school climate and making parents happier, but that policy is by no means a silver bullet. Another major change for the School District is our new management structure. This past October we named Philip Goldsmith as our interim Chief Executive Officer. We adopted this business model to focus and leverage the District resources, time, people and money towards its educational mission. Working with Phil on his leadership team is the respected educator, Dr. Deidre Farmbry, the Chief Academic Officer. Rhonda Chatzkel is our Chief Financial Officer. Phil, Deidre and Rhonda will be testifying in a few minutes. Rounding out the team is Tom McGlinchey, Chief Operating Officer, and Ron Daniels, Chief Information Officer. 17 3/6/01 - School District Budget We believe that this new structure increases the importance of education by allowing Deidra and the educators that she leads to focus on teaching and learning, the things they do best, while trained and seasoned managers do what they do best, manage. While there have been some growing pains as we implemented this new structure, I was pleased and surprised to see how quickly the new lines of authority were extended throughout the School District. Phil and his team have brought to the School District a new way of looking at all of the things that we do. As someone from the private sector who believes that too many School District employees spend too much time in meetings, I was pleased when one of Phil's first acts was to post standards for meetings in every conference room. A blue sign hangs in every conference room asking who called the meeting and why. Whether everyone in the room needs to be there, whether it is the best use of their time, whether someone who is not there should be, and whether the meeting will help the children and, if so, how and when. 18 3/6/01 - School District Budget Phil also took the issue of discipline by the horns and is dealing with it thoughtfully and aggressively. In addition, Phil is communicating that dollar savings don't need six zeros to be significant. The manager's perspective has also demanded greater focus on all sides of our house. The last year has also been a dramatic change in the relationship between the District and Harrisburg. Indeed, it is totally inaccurate for us to speak of us and them anymore.

Mr. Ramos

For the past year we have enjoyed a relationship that put aside many of the City and State differences that impeded our progress and we have worked together for Philadelphia's children. Perhaps the most significant example of this new cooperation was the new contract with the Philadelphia Federation of Teachers. It would have been impossible for the School District acting alone to offer our teachers all that they deserve. It would have been nearly impossible for the City and the School District to put together a decent package. 19 3/6/01 - School District Budget With the State, the City and School District working together, and here's an exciting word "cooperating," we were able to offer our teachers a contract they could accept and not one school day was missed. We are also enjoying improved relations with the PFT. It's no secret that the contract negotiations were long and difficult. After the pact was approved, the Union and School District came together promptly and professionally to work together for our children. I want to point out two examples. Shortly after Phil took the helm, PFT president, Ted Kirsch suggested Phil convene what is popularly known as a summit on the critical issue of school safety. I'm pleased to report to you that the first session of the safe school collaborative will be held later this month with at least two more sessions to follow. The second example is just as exciting. Procedures were developed to implement a revolutionary concept contained in the new contract, the selection of teachers by schools, rather than the selection of schools by teachers. 20 3/6/01 - School District Budget Teachers at 15 schools volunteered their schools to be pilot sites. As we learned from the pilot, this number will continue to expand. None of this is to in any way diminish the challenges we face on many fronts, not the least of which is financial. I want to leave you with the notion that this Board and Administration have been working hard to meet all the challenges through collaboration and cooperation with all of our stake holders. Certainly, this Council is one of our principal partners and we're here today to receive your help. At this point, I'd like to thank you and introduce Phil Goldsmith, the School District's interim Chief Executive Officer.

Mr. Goldsmith

Thank you. Good morning, President Verna, Councilwoman Miller, Members of City Council. Aside from the people that have already been introduced, and others will be introduced later, I do want to acknowledge that there are a number of people here from the School District who really helped me and helped Dr. 21 3/6/01 - School District Budget Farmbry in providing us with the expertise and support to get the job done. I want to make sure that they're recognized for their support and hard work. Last November 1st I assumed the position as interim Chief Executive Officer of the School District as part of a new management structure the Board approved. I'm pleased to be working with my colleague Dr. Farmbry, who in August was named Chief Academic Officer. I accepted the position as interim CEO to give the Board time to evaluate the viability of this model and assess the characteristics and attributes needed in a permanent CEO. I also thought it would bring a fresh set of eyes to the School District. Not the eyes of an educator, yet someone who cares about education and who has also been in the private sector but familiar with the special dynamics of the public sector. But whether we are in the private sector representing shareholders or in the public sector representing tax payers and constituents, one thing should remain the same, we have an 22 3/6/01 - School District Budget obligation to manage our scarce resources in the most effective manner possible. We must always be asking whether there isn't a better way to be doing something. In fact, we should be asking whether we have to do it in the first place. Is it central to our core mission? Is there someone else who can do it better or more efficiently? We owe it to our school children to be asking these questions. These are the questions that I have been asking, some of the answers are complex and will take time; others, frankly, are Basic Management 01 practices. It's good, old fashion blocking and tackling. It's about having clear objectives, appropriate policies and procedures, a way to monitor results, a feedback, an accountability system. For example, we must better monitor and control overtime. We have begun that process. We must make sure that overnight travel and conferences are being utilized consistent with our educational focus. We have begun that process. 23 3/6/01 - School District Budget We must look in every nook and cranny for unnecessary costs, such as unneeded telephone lines. We have begun that process. We must make sure that we have a methodology in place to prioritize technology projects to ensure they are in line with our strategic needs. We have begun that process. We must look at ways that the City and School District can leverage their resources in expertise. Our chief Operating Officer, Tom McGlinchy, and City Managing Director, Joe Martz, have begun that process in the areas of fleet management and risk management. There are a host of other areas the City and School District can and must look at. In New York City, for example, the police department assumed responsibility for its School District's police officers. That has improved the recruiting, training and supervising of New York school safety officers. Our School District has the fourth largest security force in the Commonwealth. I can assure you Commissioner Timoney knows a lot more about policing than I do. 24 3/6/01 - School District Budget The retention of teachers is a critical issue for this District. It is our teachers who we rely on day in and day out. We have intensified our efforts to understand why teachers leave. For every experienced teacher we lose, it is one more inexperienced teacher we have to recruit. In the business world, it is common knowledge that there it is much better to retain a customer than to have to find a new one. Teachers are no different. We are trying to do a better job of analyzing our data. For example, are there some schools where the turnover is greater?

Mr. Goldsmith

Is there a specific point in time when teachers leave? When they leave, where are they going and why? This information will not only help us project what our needs may be in the future, but more importantly help us design targeted strategies to increase our retention rate. A school-safe environment is one such strategy. It is essential if we are to retain and recruit teachers. It is also essential in fostering a learning environment in our schools for our children. It is essential in 25 3/6/01 - School District Budget order to retain the public's trust and confidence and public education. The fact of the matter is that we are in a fight for market share, and a safe school environment is a must. It is a priority. We are undertaking a number of steps: First and foremost, to solve a problem you have to first acknowledge that it exists. A safe school environment is not simply a Philadelphia issue; it exists in our suburbs and across the country, as today's headlines remind us. My concern, indeed my responsibility, is here in Philadelphia. Secondly, you have to let people know what you expect. Dr. Farmbry and I have communicated with our school administrators that we expect them to report serious incidents promptly, as required by School District policy and State law. Not reporting and under-reporting will not be tolerated. Thirdly, at Central Administration, we need to make sure our processes are as streamlined as possible. We are reviewing our procedures and will continue to do 3/6/01 - School District Budget so. In some cases, we've already streamlined the paperwork. CEP, Community Educational Partners, an innovative alternative school is now filled to capacity. We look forward to its larger new facility in the fall. Fourth, we must recognize that a safe school environment is not the responsibility of the Administration alone. It will require cooperation and team work among the entire School District family and beyond, with other agencies and organizations. Consequently, I have established a safe school collaborative. It consists of representatives of teachers, principals, cluster leaders, administrators, parents, the Board and students. I thank Ted Kirsch and the PFT for suggesting this concept to me. The first meeting of the safe school collaborative will be held later this month. Two others meetings will follow; one in April and one in May. We can hear from others as to their recommendations and suggestions on what we can be doing together. Our work in this and other areas will continue. 27 3/6/01 - School District Budget Today we present you with a proposed operating budget for Fiscal Year 2001, contains $191 million deficit. This is a staff-generated budget. It is the first step in our process. Much work remains to be done. We must be true to Mayor Street's commitment to cut $100,000,000 of expenses from the budget over four years. Last year was the first down payment. It is now time for the next one. It is essential that in the months and years ahead we re-evaluate the way we conduct our business, not only in our business services like transportation or facilities or food service, but also in the way we provide and support educational services. Like any successful enterprise, we must focus on our core mission. We are inundated with many good ideas and programs, but the fact is that we can only do so much. To use the language of technology, our bandwith is measured by dollars, time and capacity is limited. So we must make choices. When we say no, as we must, it's 28 3/6/01 - School District Budget not that we don't care; it's because we do care. We must focus on what is essential and build on what we know works. Let us not forget that the most important organizational unit in the School District is a classroom. It is our center stage. Our students are the stars. Our administrative function should exist for one purpose, to support the learning and teaching that takes place in our schools.

Mr. Goldsmith

We are, in essence, the stage hands. We need to develop a customer service orientation toward our schools that would rival any business. Our students are no less important. Dr. Farmbry and I have been and will continue to evaluate the District's organizational structure to determine what makes the most sense at this point in time. We must preserve what is best with the current system and shed what is not. I'm not advocating change for change sake, but instead to reinvest the savings and resources into hands-on teaching and learning. After all, that is our mission. Although there are things we can do more efficiently and effectively, I must strongly 29 3/6/01 - School District Budget caution we cannot cut our way out of this financial problem. Many of the changes we aspire to will not occur overnight. Under the leadership of Board Member Mike Masch and Chief Financial Officer Rhonda Chatzkel, we have developed a three-year financial outlook for the District. It explains why we are where we are. As a result, we have a more accurate picture of the magnitude of the situation facing us. As our Chief Financial Officer, Ms. Chatzkel, will demonstrate, the current financial situation did not occur overnight. One-time financial fixes over the years have allowed us to forestall a deficit which otherwise would have occurred in 1997. These one-time actions allowed us to get through the school years, but they masked the District's underlying structural deficit. Consequently, the deficit for 2001 and beyond is more pronounced and stark than ever. I know that you have heard that before, but the multi-year plan tells a story as accurately and as cogently as possible. Without 30 3/6/01 - School District Budget a full and open understanding, we will not be able to arrive at a comprehensive solution to our financial issues. Without a long-term comprehensive solution involving the City, the State and the District, we will be unable to provide the type of education the school children of this Commonwealth's largest City need, deserve and require to ensure they become productive citizens. Thank you.

Council President Verna

Thank you.

Mr. Ramos

I'd like to now introduce our Chief Academic Officer, Dr. Deidre Farmbry.

Ms. Farmbry

Good morning, Council President Verna, Councilwoman Miller and Council Members. My name is Deidre Farmbry. I'm the Chief Academic Officer for the School District of Philadelphia. I thank you for the opportunity to update you on the educational progress being made in our District. As you are all aware, we are in the midst of a major transformation of the management structure of the District. My role as 31 3/6/01 - School District Budget Chief Academic Officer is to evaluate and promote sound educational policies and programs that support what is the key, the prime, the absolutely vital element of this School District, the classroom. It is in the 9000 classrooms of our 264 schools where the real work gets done. It's in the classrooms that are 212,000 students guided by our 13,500 teachers learning to connect today's successful learning with tomorrow's success in the workplace, in the Boardroom and in the this Chamber. As a proud product of the School District of Philadelphia myself and as a former teacher, department head, principal and cluster leader, I am keenly aware that making the connection has never been more challenging for Philadelphia and, indeed, for most urban School Districts. Schools reflect society. Nowhere in Philadelphia is the impact of the City's evolving demographics and economics felt more keenly than in our schools. Let me site just two examples. 32 3/6/01 - School District Budget Seventy-five languages and dialects are spoken by children in our District. Among them, Cambodian, Mandarin Chinese, Hmong Vietnamese, Russian and Albanian. Even within the more traditional world languages, such as French, there are dialects which vary by region. Seventy-eight percent of our students are from low-income households. Grand parents who live on fixed incomes are raising a significant percentage of our students. That means we must provide basic services, such as health screenings even as we teach reading, math, technology and science. While such facts of these have changed over the past decade, the overall story line of the triumphs and trials of the School District have remained pretty much the same; big City, poor kids, a staff trying and parents aspiring. My first experience telling that story came 13 years ago when I wrote and revised materials for former superintendent. Yes, I'm here 13 years later and the story line is the same; big City, poor kids, a staff that is trying and parents still aspiring. A major difference 33 3/6/01 - School District Budget this time is a degree to which finances are tightening. Consequently, the road to the happy ending that we all want for the story this year will be accompanied by tough decisions within the District over what is worthy of preserving and what gets eliminated. Everyone who is spellbound by the story, either because of their direct involvement in it or their desire to alter the ending, is aware that this year more than ever a satisfactory ending will take herculean and creative maneuvering given the fiscal realities and constant pressure for our students to do better. As we engage in this yearly process of balancing fiscal prudence with educational responsibilities, we must always keep our eyes on the most important characters in this School District story, without whom there would be no tale to tell. They are our students, whose personal stories add to the complexity of each chapter. Whether it is the chapter on pre-school, grade school, middle school or high 34 3/6/01 - School District Budget school, their story of struggle and success anchor our efforts and lend focus to the overall District plot line and educational story that leads to self-sufficiency and solid citizenship. Keeping that end in mind, please indulge me while I write the current chapter by focusing on individual highlights.

Ms. Farmbry

Just this winter, the District began a partnership with the prestigious United States Naval Academy to help students at Benjamin Franklin High School prepare to attend that academy. Arlene Fields, the coordinator for the Naval Academy Center of Influence at Benjamin Franklin High School, the woman who initiated the partnership, is here today. We are impartial when it comes to the service academies. In the audience are four students, Aneesa Romans, Joshua Young, Thristan Senior and Khristina Allen from Carver High School who have been accepted to West Point. They are here with their exemplary principal Roselyn Chivis, and Herb Young, corporate partner from Turner Construction who helped to initiate that connection. ) 35 3/6/01 - School District Budget

Ms. Farmbry

Despite our fiscal constraints, the District provides instruction in vocal and instrumental music in neighborhood schools, not simply in music-magnet schools. About 270 music teachers provide not only appreciation, but also opportunities to perform and compose. In the audience are fifth grader Jasmine Hernandez, her teacher Lillian Adorno and her Principal, Sonja Perez from Potter-Thomas School. Jasmine's composition was orchestrated by professional composer Robert Sierra and performed by the Philadelphia Orchestra. (Applause.)

Ms. Farmbry

Last month on February 17th, 40 students performed with the Philadelphia Orchestra at the Academy of Music in the side-by-side program many of you may have attended. Also joining us today are students from the West Philadelphia High School Automotive Academy whose electric car will be entered into the National Tour de Soul in May. (Applause.)

Ms. Farmbry

It is clear that many hurdles remain as the District moves into the 21st Century, but the District is moving forward where it 36 3/6/01 - School District Budget counts the most, teaching and learning. I will name a few items to prove that point. This is the School District that has seen both student attendance and achievement rise to levels honored by the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania. Fifty-eight schools received 1.3 million of the State's awards for improved performance on State standardized tests, and 10 schools received $525,800 of the awards for 11 improved attendance. Five of our schools 12 received awards in both categories. 13 In the audience is Creighton 14 principal Katherine McKellar-Carter and Home and 15 School President Liberta Veara. 16 Creighton's 8th grade students 17 showed the most impressive improvement, not only 18 on the State's test but also on the District's 19 own SAT-9 test. 20 (Applause.) 21

Ms. Farmbry

This is a School 22 District which has pioneered in partnership with 23 communities of faith starting years ago, long before President Bush endorsed that concept. Over 150 churches, synagogues and mosques are working with 37 3/6/01 - School District Budget schools to improve educational opportunities. Reverend Albert Campbell of Mt. Carmel Baptist Church in West Philadelphia and Reverend Robert Shine of Barachah Baptist Church in West Oak Lane have engaged their congregations in school partnerships resulting in exemplary after-school programs and mentoring relationships. The Reverend Joel Barnaby of Port Richmond's Greater Church of Philadelphia and Bill and Nancy Wolf of St. Philip United Methodist Church of Harrowgate run after-school programs with the Sheridan School. This is the School District that is working with the Philadelphia Federation of Teachers and the Commonwealth Association of School Administrators, the administrators and principal union, to develop the most effective plans for use of the most precious resource we have, time in the classroom with children and teachers working to raise their skills. Next school year, this team's work will help our teachers and children get the most out of the extra half hour a day we will be 38 3/6/01 - School District Budget implementing as a result of the new PFT contract. This is the School District that is holding the line on requiring students to take more courses in math, science and world languages, and trying innovative efforts to relieve the shortage of teachers in those subject areas, a shortage that is affecting Districts nationwide. This is a School District that has gained national recognition for the reduced class size early bound literacy initiative, which has brought 494 literacy intern teachers to 176 schools, where these college graduates partner with a classroom teacher to give kindergarten and first grade children a double-dose of attention focused on reading. The results after one year shows more kindergarten and first graders reading on grade level, and more teachers choosing to stay in the District. This is the School District which has created twilight schools, alternative educational programs associated with our comprehensive high schools for students with severe and persistent behavioral and attendance problems. 39 3/6/01 - School District Budget At one high school, more than percent of the twilight school 9th graders were attempting to pass 9th grade courses for a third time. At the same school during 1999-2000, 57 percent of twilight school 9th graders earned at least one credit and 34 percent had earned the maximum two. As you can see from just these examples, good, solid instruction and learning goes on each day in this District, the nation's seventh largest. I haven't the time to list more successes of our children, the Baldi Middle School's "Math Counts" team victory in regional competition or AMY Northwest's partnership with the Prince Theater to help students write and perform their own plays, or the Lincoln and Saul High Schools' team, which along with several colleges, created a combined major exhibit at this year's Philadelphia Flower Show at the Pennsylvania Convention Center. I can't begin to list the achievements of our great graduates, which include several members of this body, as well as University presidents, heart surgeons and others you will be hearing about soon on radio. 40 3/6/01 - School District Budget Back to the most important feature of the District's progress, student achievement. In addition to report card grades, progress is documented each year by results on the SAT-9, Stanford Achievement Test, and the State's 7 PSSA. The SAT-9 measures student progress in 8 reading, math and science with graduated scores 9 from below basic one to advanced.

Ms. Farmbry

Each year since 1995-96, student achievement on the SAT-9 has improved at each level; elementary, middle and high school, and in each subject; reading, math and science. This is a remarkable achievement, one for which our students and teachers deserve our praise and even a round of enthusiastic applause. ) The most successful students on SAT-9 were the students in the lower grades, where the students were the first to experience full-day kindergarten and new programs to improve reading instruction. In Grade 4, 58 percent of students reached basic levels across reading, math and science last school year. 3 percent of 41 3/6/01 - School District Budget 4th graders reached the same levels. Even more remarkable, the achievement gained came even as increasing numbers of students participated in the test, including special education pupils and English language learners. In most large-scale testing programs, such inclusiveness typically results in lower schools while being more selective about who was tested typically results in higher scores. All in all, however, I'm not satisfied. As Chief Academic Officer of the District, I will not be satisfied until every school focuses on the essentials of proficiency in reading, writing, mathematics and science, until every principal, administrator and non-instructional staff member recognizes the classroom as center stage and performs all their duties to support the children as their customers. I will not be satisfied until teachers are provided with the training and tools to implement high quality instruction, and school and District leaders the training and tools to lead and manage effectively. The District's 42 3/6/01 - School District Budget placement on the State's Empowerment list by virtue of our score's rankings in reading and math as measured by the PSSA heightens the challenge to improve. We accept the challenge and commend the efforts of the Empowerment team in producing a strategic plan for improvement. This plan reinforces the need for the continuation of full-day kindergarten and early balanced literacy. The plan invites a revisitation of organizational alignment and supports greater accountability and public disclosure of school progress. The plan calls for a concentrated focus on reading, math and science. In essence, the plan requires that we focus on what is essential and build on what works. My role is clear. I plan to set high expectations, not only for students, but also for staff, and to mandate implementation of educational programs and supports that work everywhere in the District. I will focus on the District's core responsibility, providing all students with effective instruction, instruction that gives them the educational skills and tools 43 3/6/01 - School District Budget needed to become productive citizens. I welcome Council's support and look forward to a productive relationship as we forge a District that builds on what works and recognizes that when our students succeed, we all succeed. Thank you. Now I may introduce our Chief Financial Officer, Ronald Chatzkel.

Ms. Chatzkel

Good morning, Council President Verna, Councilwoman Miller and Councilmembers. My name is Rhonda Chatzkel. I'm the Chief Financial Officer of the School District. Thank you for this opportunity to update you on the financial status of the School District of Philadelphia. You have each received a copy of the School District's Fiscal Year 2002 staff requested operating budget. This budget projects a cumulative deficit of $44 million for the current Fiscal Year ending June 30, 2001. This reflects an improvement of $36 million in the cumulative deficit of $80 million that was projected last May, May of 2000. To put this improvement in perspective, it represents a variance of about 44 3/6/01 - School District Budget one percent of total School District spending. $20 million of the improvement is due to better-than-anticipated operating results for last year, Fiscal Year 2000. Approximately $15 million of the reduction in projected cumulative deficit is due to an overall slow-down in spending for Fiscal Year 2001. This slow-down is indicative of the School District's efforts to contain costs as we embark on the critical task ahead, the difficult but necessary goal of identifying and eliminating unnecessary costs. As Mr. Goldsmith and Dr. Farmbry have expressed, we must focus our limited resources on what is essential, the teaching and learning that takes place in our classrooms. The School District's staff requested operating budget for Fiscal Year 2002 projects an operating deficit of just over $191 million and a cumulative deficit or fund balance deficit of $235 million. 7 million increase in local tax revenues. 71 billion. We should spend a few moments discussing how those dollars are spent, for the vast majority are spent directly on educating children in our schools. 2 billion for fiscal year 2002 are projected to be spent directly on educational programs for students. In July 2000, Philadelphia was designated one of 11 School Districts across the Commonwealth to be placed on the education Empowerment list. The Empowerment team submitted a plan for improving the educational performance of Philadelphia's children. Although the estimated cost of implementing all of the new empowerment plan recommendations in Fiscal Year 2002 is in excess of $75 million, a significant number of the educational initiatives detailed in that plan are already included in the School District's educational program and operating budget. 46 3/6/01 - School District Budget Close to $100 million of the Fiscal Year 2002 budget is dedicated to empowerment initiatives that have already been put in place by the School District, such as full-day kindergarten, reduced class size and extended time for at-risk students. Approximately percent of the 9 School District's operating budget is spent on 10 building, maintaining, securing and operating the 11 School District schools. Another six percent is 12 spent on administrative costs, a percent that is 13 consistent with other large urban School 14 Districts. 15 The School District will dedicate 16 the weeks and months ahead to cutting expenses 17 wherever it can responsibly do so. It is evident 18 that the gap between expenses and revenues can 19 only be closed through a combination of new 20 revenues and cost containment. 21 This year, for the first time the 22 School District has prepared a three-year financial plan. At this point, the financial plan explains the School District's recent fiscal history and provides a forecast for the period 47 3/6/01 - School District Budget Fiscal Year 2002 through 2004. The plan does not yet address how the significant gap that is forecast will be closed. The plan does, however, illustrate that the current budget imbalance is the result of revenue growth that has been only moderate and expense growth that has been driven by legislative mandate, judicial order and sound educational policy.

Ms. Chatzkel

If the recent trends and revenues and expenses do not reverse, the School District forecasts a cumulative fund balance deficit in excess of $785 million by June 30, 2004. An additional $363 million has been estimated as the cost of implementing the recommendations, the new recommendations of the education Empowerment team. The School District has assumed in its projections that these initiatives will be implemented to the degree that funding is made available through a combination of additional Empowerment appropriations by the State, additional grants and a refocusing of current School District dollars. 48 3/6/01 - School District Budget We are at a moment of fiscal crisis. Any responsible resolution of this crises requires that we understand the factors that created it. With your permission, I will briefly review the recent financial history of the School District and will reference a summary of the multi-year plan which I believe was distributed to each of you this morning. You should each have a copy of a financial update with today's date on it. As Secretary of Education Kahn mentioned this morning, the School District has some big differences relative to the other 500 School Districts across the Commonwealth. Perhaps the most significant of which is sheer size. The School District of Philadelphia's current enrollment is approximately 215,500 students. Our enrollment has grown by more than 22,000 students since 1991, more students than attend the third largest School District in all of Pennsylvania. Of this growth, 14,200 additional students have enrolled since 1993; 6,600 additional students have enrolled since 1995. We 49 3/6/01 - School District Budget operate the second largest transportation system in the Commonwealth and the fourth largest police force. Based on the most recent data we have from the Pennsylvania Department of Education, which is as of Fiscal Year 1998, we are four times larger than the next largest School District in Pennsylvania and we are 70 times larger than the average School District in Pennsylvania. 27,000 employees, close to 95 percent, are housed directly in our schools. It's noteworthy as we look at the composition of the School District work force that close to half of our employees are teachers. As Mr. Goldsmith and Dr. Farmbry mentioned, retention and recruitment of teachers is one of our most serious challenges. On , we have a pie chart that shows the composition of School District operating revenues which has been fairly consistent since 1995. About 60 percent of our revenues come from the Commonwealth, about 40 percent come from local sources. We should also mention for Fiscal Year 2001 there's about $258 million of categorical for grant funding. 50 3/6/01 - School District Budget Primary sources of this grant funding include Title One monies for poorer children, Head Start monies and Individuals with Disabilities Education Act, or IDEA monies. What's important to note about our grant funds is that they must be spent in accordance with the terms of the grant. They are not generally permitted to be used to supplant or replace operating funds. They are intended almost exclusively for new programs. Federal grants which comprise about 85 percent of our all of our grants specifically require that funds be used to supplement our existing educational programs. On we have a chart that shows our revenue growth since 1995. 9 percent coming from the City in average annual growth. 2 percent for the same periods. Just looking at revenue growth doesn't begin to tell the whole story. Because during the same period, our student population 51 3/6/01 - School District Budget has grown. 5 percent, which is just above the rate of inflation. We should talk for a few minutes about why our revenues per student have been growing at this relatively low rate of growth. On we talk briefly about the ESBE, or State's basic education subsidy formula. As we've talked about before, this formula was changed in 1993.

Ms. Chatzkel

It was changed so that virtually all of the ESBE funding is on a block grant basis, not particularly sensitive to growth in the student population. But since 1993, this School District has grown by 14,200 students. The cumulative impact of this change in the ESBE formula for this School District has been $655 million over the period from 1992 when the ESBE was in place through the fiscal year 2001 budget. 8 million less basic education 52 3/6/01 - School District Budget funding than would have been calculated under the original formula. Another way to look at the impact of the change in the ESBE formula is to measure what ESBE would have been during this period if it had just grown at the rate of inflation. On the next page we have a chart that illustrates what ESBE would have been if it had grown again on a per-pupil basis just at the rate of inflation. 8 million in additional funding for Fiscal Year 2001 only. 3 percent in the aggregate from the period 1993 to 1998, which places it No. 10 among the 11 urban School Districts that we use as our benchmarks; in other 53 3/6/01 - School District Budget words, right near the bottom of that group. This is all data for 1998, I should mention, which is the latest data available from the State. We've checked our website and there isn't current information yet available for 1999. If you look at this top chart, you'll see that because of the slow growth out of the 501 School Districts across the Commonwealth, we're ranked 186 in the revenues per student we receive from the State. But that's only a piece of our story. The other piece of the story is local revenues. You will note in the same top chart that of the 501 School Districts in the Commonwealth we are ranked 373 in terms of local revenues that we receive per student. I would ask you to turn to the next page, which speaks a little bit about our local revenue growth. Revenues from local sources have grown moderately, as have revenues from state sources, but for different reasons. The primary reason is a weakness in the local economy and tax base as the City attempts to stem the migration of businesses and population. 54 3/6/01 - School District Budget This weakness is particularly evident in local property values which drive 85 percent of local revenues for the School District. The City, with City Council support, has taken steps to diversify local revenues since 1995, including establishment of the liquor sales tax and establishment of the annual grant. 9 per anum. 6 percent. 6 22 percent per year on a per-student basis for 23 reasons which we will explain. 24 On you will see a chart 25 that details the expenditures per student and 55 3/6/01 - School District Budget their growth since 1995. 6 percent per student over this time period, we've reached a cross-over point, as Mr. Goldsmith mentioned. Would we not have taken one time extraordinary measures, we would have experienced a fund balance deficit much sooner. Turn to , there's a bar graph that illustrates what our fund balance actually was, which is detailed in blue, and what it would have been had we not taken, again, one-time extraordinary measures to forestall our deficit, such as refinancing debt, to reduce debt service payments during this time period by $103 million, and a tax lien sale in 1997 which yielded $40 million. 7 million. The reason this chart is important is because it illustrates that our imbalance is embedded. It's embedded in our programs. And just as it took more than one 56 3/6/01 - School District Budget year to occur, it will take more than the span of one year to reverse. 6 percent during the time period when our revenues were two and a half percent? We should talk about that. If you turn to , what we've illustrated are five key drivers of growth and expense, growth and educational expense.

Ms. Chatzkel

In the aggregate, these five categories, which include ESL bilingual services, full-day kindergarten, payments to other educational entities, safety and security and charter schools contribute $150 million more to Fiscal Year 2001 expenditures. ESL bilingual students during this time period from 1995 to 2001 have more than doubled from 5600 to 13,200 students. Full-day kindergarten was implemented Fiscal Year 1996 as mandated by desegregation order to be offered in all of our schools. Payments to other educational entities is largely driven by placements made by social service agencies or the courts. Safety and security, as Mr. Goldsmith mentioned, has increased due to an expansion in the number of 57 3/6/01 - School District Budget school police officers from 342 to 527 as we work to achieve a safer climate for our students. Charter schools were not in existence in 1995. But for this year, 2001, we budget charter school payments of close to $80 million. We expect the net cost of those payments to the District, after taking all savings and all additional revenues, to be over $66 million as a direct contributor to our deficit. 6 billion I would ask you to turn to , which illustrates how those dollars are spent in some broad terms. As we mentioned, more than 72 percent of all of our dollars are spent directly on education in our schools. 9 percent of all of 20 our spending represents all central instructional 21 support and administrative services. It includes 22 every administrative dollar that we spend. Of the close to $1 billion on that we spend directly in our 264 schools, kindergarten through 12th grade, what we've 58 3/6/01 - School District Budget highlighted for you are four key categories of expenditure as basic as you can get, teachers, counselors, books and principals, which together comprise 50 cents of every dollar we spend. highlights how we spend our dollars in some detail. I won't go over them in detail. I will note that the categories of expense that we've highlighted, we've highlighted because they've grown or because the dedicated reimbursement for those expenditures has not kept pace with the expenditures. I should spend one moment and mentioned administrative expenses which are highlighted at the bottom of this page. In total central service departments are $77 million. You will note that there is some growth in administrative department expense between 1995 and 2001. As you will turn to and look at the bottom of that page, however, that expenditure growth is attributed primarily to three things, to expanded student testing, to increase staffing in the Office of Human Resources as we focus on recruitment and 59 3/6/01 - School District Budget retention of teachers, and to design an implementation of a District-wide integrated networking and telecommunications infrastructure. Without those areas of growth, administrative expenses would have grown three percent per year since 1995. 6 percent per student on average since 1995, our spending is still below other urban School Districts. I would ask you to turn to where there is a comparative chart. This chart illustrates that relative to the other Districts in the Commonwealth, we ranked 320 in total spending. Relative to the other large urban Districts nationally, we are in the bottom half. S. 7 percent less than the Pennsylvania average, and yet, based on our currently projected revenues and a preliminary estimate of Fiscal Year 2002 expenses, the School District would need to cut expenses by close to 12 percent in order to achieve a balanced budget. 60 3/6/01 - School District Budget During its fiscal crises just over a decade ago, the City would have needed to close a gap of only four percent in order to balance its budget. The magnitude is much more serious for the School District. 1 million. Before we discuss the projected operating deficit for Fiscal Year 2002, it's important that we talk for a minute about the budget process.

Ms. Chatzkel

6 million for the current year, Fiscal Year 2001. We are now eight months into the budget year and we now have eight months of actual data. Each year in late February and early March when we come to Council and as we prepared the budget for the next year, we use actual data to update our current year forecast. We have concluded that our actual expenses so far this year were about one percent less than was budgeted. Over the course of the entire year, this should result in about $15 million in 61 3/6/01 - School District Budget reduced spending. Some of these savings occurred in areas like employee benefits, where a migration to managed care plans led to a reduction in estimated costs for the year of over $5 million. These savings, wherever appropriate, have been carried forward to Fiscal Year 2002 and are reflected in our projected results for next year. 7 million. 1 million for Fiscal Year 2002. I would like to show you how we get there. 1 million. Again, I would like to preface all of this by noting this is a projection that we have very early in our budget process. It's based on what we have seen in the Governor's proposed budget, what we have seen in the City's projections for next year's revenue, and what the staff has requested by way of expenses. Between now and May 31, we'll be 62 3/6/01 - School District Budget taking a look at all facets of this budget. 7 million is artificially low. It's artificially low because in order to operate the schools for a full year this year, we needed assistance in the form of additional one-time revenues from the State and from the City. Some of those one-time contributions are highlighted. 2 million. That's the base from which we need to build our budget for next year. Some of our expense increases include the cost of the PFT contract, cost of non-PFT salary and benefits increases. We project charter school payments to increase for three reasons; one being increased enrollment in our existing charter schools, the other being approval of new charter schools, and finally the payment we make per student for charter school students is based on current year expenses. As our expenses go up, so do our charter school payments for each student 63 3/6/01 - School District Budget that's educated in the charter schools. We expect to have a full year of operation for community education partners. 1 million increase in CEP costs for next year. Our debt service is projected to increase as we undergo a continual capital improvement program, but also as a result of restructuring debt in the last half of the '90s. 5 million. We offset those increases with increased revenues that we note in the Governor's proposed budget, which aggregate just under $67 million. 4 percent, which is better than the Commonwealth as 64 3/6/01 - School District Budget a whole where the ESBE or basic education subsidy was increased. 1 million. We're very early in the budget process and we will endeavor to cut unnecessary costs and better focus the resources we have. But the size and duration of this deficit is such that only a combination of sustained revenue increases, continued cost containment and most likely some deficit funding can lead us towards regaining our fiscal balance. I'd like to invite questions from any of you for my colleagues.

Council President Verna

Thank you very much. For the first go-around, we'll be timed five minutes and move on. Mr. Goldsmith, what does staff-generated budget mean?

Mr. Goldsmith

At this point, President Verna, what it means is that these are requests that have come in from the staff of the 65 3/6/01 - School District Budget basic reports to Dr. Farmbry and I. While there are guidelines put in place and some priority setting, we haven't gone through those requests with a fine-tooth comb and really shape it to where we think it has to get. It's sort of a bottoms-up budget at this point in time without more of a top down look --

Council President Verna

Can you tell us, does this budget include the savings and efficiencies you have achieved to date?

Mr. Goldsmith

I think it has some of them in and I think that there's more to come in and there's more things that we plan to do that's not totally reflected in the staff's generated budget.

Council President Verna

For the record, can you tell us what the savings and efficiencies that have already been achieved.

Mr. Goldsmith

I'm not sure I can quantify them at this point in time. Things like overtime and travel policies are really just kicking in now. We'll have better details and more information as we move ahead in the months. In addition to the new initiatives 66 3/6/01 - School District Budget that we will have, as I alluded to in my comments, the Mayor has challenged us to come up with $100 million of savings over the four years. Last year there were cuts of about a little bit under $30 million. I think we've got to keep pace with that this year.

Council President Verna

Nowhere in this budget does it reflect what you anticipate the savings will be and efficiencies, nor is there a dollar amount attached to the savings?

Mr. Goldsmith

I would say, and I might defer a little to my colleague, but I would say it's not reflected as much as it needs to be, particularly in things like the overtime, things like that. We really just have implemented those programs. What we have to do in the weeks and months ahead is really scrutinize what we think those savings can do in addition to other initiatives that we have to undertake. So that's yet to come. Which is another way of saying that the 191 million, unless something happens on the revenue side or something happens from an emergency perspective on the expenditure side, 67 3/6/01 - School District Budget will hopefully get better as we go through this process during this month in April and May and the Board obviously has its input in the approval process.

Council President Verna

In your testimony you state that today we present a proposed operating budget for FY 2001, 2002. It contains $191 million deficit. I assume you mean operating deficit since the projected cumulative deficit is $235 million. What are the assumptions with regard to the Empowerment plan?

Mr. Goldsmith

First of all, your assumption is correct, the 191 is the operating and then there's 44 million that Ms. Chatzkel referred to. As of now, and I'll ask my colleagues to correct me if I'm wrong, there is no Empowerment revenues in the operating budget reflected. One of the changes last year when we got about 16 or 17 million in Empowerment funds, they could have been used for any purpose. Those are not the rules of the road in the future, so they have to be geared 68 3/6/01 - School District Budget specifically toward Empowerment plan expenditures. So there are really no revenues reflected in the operating plan in terms of Empowerment plan funds.

Council President Verna

Does this mean in order to implement the Empowerment plan an additional $76 million would be required?

Mr. Goldsmith

I would say that there are many things, or certainly several things that we can be doing with the empowerment plan with our existing funds, but it's going to require us to do, which I think was something that hopefully came across loud and clear with Dr. Farmbry and I, we have to focus our existing revenues on things that we think are important. We think the Empowerment plan is not only important for practical purposes, but an educational blueprint. What we hope to do, for example, literacy interns and balanced literacy and those program which are instrumental to the Empowerment plan, we want to make sure that the dollars we have in the operating budget now get geared toward those programs as we acquire more funds on the Empowerment plan, it will allow us 69 3/6/01 - School District Budget to accelerate the initiatives on the Empowerment plan. Again, it will require us to focus the monies we have now consistently with what the Empowerment plan is saying that we should be doing.

Council President Verna

Can you tell us what are the State requirements for those School Districts that fall under the Empowerment Act?

Ms. Farmbry

Yes. Our placement on the empowerment list is by virtue of our test scores on the PSSA. So the expectation is that by the school year ending in June 2004, we will increase the overall proportion of students in Grades 3, 5, 8 and 11, whose PSSA scores are currently in the bottom cortile to at least 50 percent. So it's upward movement. Right now, too many of our schools are in the bottom cortile, so we to reduce the number in the bottom cortile to at least 50 percent above the bottom cortile.

Council President Verna

Can you tell us what happens if a School District does not meet the required improvements? 70 3/6/01 - School District Budget

Ms. Farmbry

The Empowerment Act, as written, states if the District in this three-year period does not meet the targeted improvements, then there is a possibility of a takeover by the State, unless we appeal for an extension.

Council President Verna

If we did not have the resources to implement the programs required by our approved empowerment plan, how do we avoid a State takeover?

Ms. Farmbry

What we're currently doing is looking at how we are utilizing current resources, how we can construct time differently. For instance, one of the goals of the Empowerment plan is that we will actually increase the amount of time students spend on reading, math and science. That has roster implications in terms of how people are scheduling time at the school level. We're also looking at the extent to which we can change some of our schools to K through 8 schools. In other words, we're looking at the current school organization where there are lines that would support the merging of an elementary school and middle school into a K to 71 3/6/01 - School District Budget school since research indicates the students in K to 8 normally perform better. That's something we're looking at doing. We're looking at use of time, organizational structures. We're looking at actually mandating our curriculum. We're looking at other instructional supports we can put in place.

Council President Verna

Thank you. Looking at the multi-year plan for the projected cumulative deficit, by FY 2002 it's in excess of $750 million. If you included the implementation of the Empowerment plan over this time period, the cumulative deficit would exceed $1 billion. I just don't know how the Administration plans to keep the schools open and solve the financial crisis.

Mr. Goldsmith

The simple and short answer is that we can't. That is the reality before us today. I think we all acknowledge that the only solution here is one that involves the collaborative effort between the School District, and we've got to do our part, obviously, the City and the Commonwealth. 72 3/6/01 - School District Budget I think as Secretary of Education said, we do not think this is going to be something that's going to take place in one year. It's going to be a multi-year plan. So that's the challenge in front of us. That's the reality that we live in.

Mr. Ramos

If I may add to that, as Mr. Goldsmith said, this will require the District, the City and the State all to take measures. I would argue that's the second step, not the first. The first step that we have to take is, first of all, as we move down this road towards the end of May, we all need collectively to determine whether this is a program that we want to take extraordinary measures with. Step One is for us to determine what we want that school system to look like at the end of the day. And then once we've done that, work on how we're going to get there. I would argue that the first step is really having a consensus about whether this is the type of program that we as a City are willing to accept.

Council President Verna

In light of the new census data, we can expect to have a 73 3/6/01 - School District Budget population below 1.5 million people. If that happens, the School District would become a District of First Class A instead of just the First Class. What impact, if any, will this have on the School District?

Mr. Goldsmith

I'm not sure what the answer is to that. It would probably be a rush in Harrisburg for them to amend the law to make one A1. That's probably what will happen. As a practical matter, it will have no impact.

Council President Verna

There are a number of Councilmembers that want to be recognized. Everybody will be timed, including myself for five minutes. The first person to be recognized is Councilwoman Miller.

Councilwoman Miller

Good morning. I have a couple questions. I guess I can start off with the structure. Mr. Ramos and Secretary Kahn, do you believe that the current structure that you have in place is going to end up being more cost effective? It's my understanding that Philadelphia is the only School District to 74 3/6/01 - School District Budget presently have this structure; is that correct?

Mr. Ramos

There are other School Districts that have adopted the CEO structure or some form of it. The ones that you read about most are certainly Chicago, and I suppose New York is called a CEO. In LA they have a similar structure, they don't call the Governor a CEO. I think that it will result in a better focussing of School District resources into the classroom. We usually talk about resources in terms of money. I'd like to talk about resources in terms of time, people and money. Because I think, you know, one of the most precious things we have is time. In the long term, I would like this School District to move to a point where a greater proportion of activities is the business of teaching and where you can have educators running an educational institution and where you don't need the managerial expertise of a CEO to operate the second largest transportation system, the fourth largest police force, enormous health and social services operation, a law firm, accounting firm, all those things. 75 3/6/01 - School District Budget We, I think, over the long term would like to, unless new extraordinary revenues are committed over some long period of time, over the long term, the School District is -- part of the job of the next CEO is to help us get more into the business of teaching and find other ways of providing the services that kids need.

Councilwoman Miller

Mr. Goldsmith, I think you used to be a deputy mayor; is that correct?

Mr. Goldsmith

Yes.

Councilwoman Miller

Do you think, just in regards to our search for a new CEO, do you believe coming from the public sector and combining it with your private sector experience helps you as a CEO, interim CEO, understand the dynamics better, and would a CEO just with private sector experience not have that capability to be as flexible and understanding?

Mr. Goldsmith

I think that's an excellent question. Part of my job in this interim position is to evaluate and help the Board evaluate what I think the characteristics are. I think it's important that someone certainly understands the political 76 3/6/01 - School District Budget process in the better sense of the word in public policy. I think it's interesting that the School Districts that Mr. Ramos has referred to do have CEOs that have had public sector experience. I think in Chicago it was a former budget director; San Diego, former U.S. attorney; Los Angeles, former Governor. And New York, while the chancellor has been primarily private sector I think he was on the Board of Regions. So he has clearly an understanding. I think a blending of the two and certainly a sensitivity to the two because it is a different world than just, you know, running General Electric.

Councilwoman Miller

Well, I just want to say that to me the structure seems to make sense. I know that if it's academic, I call the CAO. If it's building related, you now have a COO, and so on and so forth. For me it does make a lot of sense. I really hope this model is very successful, of course, because the bottom line is the product that comes out of the classroom and that's our children. I have a lot of questions. I know I can't ask them all right now. I do want to touch base on a couple things. When you say you're going 77 3/6/01 - School District Budget to look through every nook and cranny to find money, what is happening with the book budget? We've had a lot of discussion here in this Council about books. We still have children that come here from time to time and testify that they don't have books or they have old out-dated books. That personally worries me and all Members of City Council. I'd like to, before these budget hearings are over, get an update on what is going on with books. Do principals have the authority to use book money for other things other than books? Does each school have a designated budget for books? Where are we with the whole book piece? Do we still have the book hotline?

Mr. Goldsmith

I'll show you how this new structure works. That's an academic question. Dr. Farmbry.

Ms. Farmbry

The issue of textbooks continues to remain an issue. I'd like to refer to it, however, as access to information. One of my missions is to try to help the public understand that the issue isn't only textbooks, but also technology. The reality 78 3/6/01 - School District Budget is that the most up-to-date information nowadays is not in textbooks, but on the Internet. How do we really begin to get the public to understand that it's both textbook access and information access via other ways. I would like to say schools do receive a textbook allocation each year in their budget. If they want to use a textbook allocation for other things, they must actually sign off and have their school council president, their home and school president, their PFT representative sign off that every single student does have a textbook in every single subject. We do maintain centrally a textbook fund so that during the year if principals again are told by parents or students they do not have enough textbooks, we do have supplementary funds we can offer to schools throughout the year at the principal's request for additional textbooks. We do have a textbook hotline. The number is 1-800-447-1169. I will say, however, that calls to that textbook hotline have dramatically declined. The textbook hotline is operational with calls from parents, concerns 79 3/6/01 - School District Budget about a lack of textbooks for their schools have practically ceased. The hotline received over 300 calls in its first year of operation, and two years later it's rarely utilized. I don't know if that's a need to publicize it more. Again I'll say the number is 1-800-447-1169. We're still very much committed to make sure that every child does have access to a textbook, and in addition, access to information via technology.

Councilwoman Miller

My time is up. But I do want to say that I do have questions around technology, computer instruction. Not how many computers are in a school, but what are the children being taught as it relates to this whole computer instruction. My time is up. - - - 80 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET (Hearing now being stenographically recorded by Josephine Cardillo, Registered Professional Reporter.) - - -

Councilwoman Brown

Debra Kahn mentioned in her opening comments that there are enormous challenges. I want to focus my series of questions around school safety, school security, those kinds of issues. Let's start out with an update on the school uniform policy. We know that this is the first year it is voluntary, with the expectation that it will be mandatory effective September 2001. I'm curious to know, where are you with it? and what are you doing to foster and ensure uniform disciplinary action for principals who do not enforce the uniform policy?

Mr. Ramos

There's probably some tag-teaming on this.

Councilwoman Brown

Sure.

Mr. Ramos

I can talk about the Board side of it. As you know, the Education Committee of the Board has had a working group that's been chaired by Chris James-Brown, who's involved with 81 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET students parents and a number of representatives. And one of the -- and a fair amount of discussion has been given to the issue of how do you know from school to school that -- that schools are being consistent. And it's an issue that comes up in any type of discipline or policy issue. I mean, you've got general guidelines out there. In the course of the day, professionals around the School District, every principal is exercising the discretion, and you don't know how consistent they're being. We are in the process of laying out some of the -- on the disciplinary side, some of the progressive nature of the discipline that's expected that leads up to what we call a "Level 1" infraction in our school code.

Councilwoman Brown

Okay.

Mr. Ramos

And, you know, part of this is also communicating and training principals so that, you know, frankly, the most effective strategies that are being used in schools with high levels of school uniforms are the positive things -- the rewards, the pizza parties and the certificates and the recognition over the PA 82 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET system or the discount -- in the high school level, the discounts on the proms. So that, you know, those types of efforts are really what's driving it. I don't know if Dr. Farmbry's got, you know, anything to add to that on the implementation side. And, in fact, Mrs. Rush reminds me yesterday was -- we were scheduled to have another meeting on school uniforms, which we have been having pretty regularly, and Phil Goldsmith closed the schools so we couldn't have it.

Councilwoman Brown

Do you anticipate that you'll have some level of closure on what that uniformity will be prior to September 2001?

Mr. Ramos

Yes. I mean, I think we're pretty much -- Chris is gone. The first time I looked around, everybody was still there. Chris -- yeah, I think so. I mean, I think there's been a lot of closure. You know, there's -- I think very soon, if principals haven't already been told, I think pretty soon, they'll start getting communication on how -- on the guidelines for that. 83 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET And I don't know. Deidre, is that consistent?

Councilwoman Brown

That's sufficient. I just wanted an update because I know the process that you endured last year to bring it to where we are now. Given the backdrop with the tragedy in California yesterday and the recent incident as well yesterday in our schools, and looking at one of the key expense drivers that Miss Chatzkel talks about, where you say that there's an increase of school police officers from 342 to 527. Do you their that presence have made a difference? And what I mean by that question is this: Has there been an analysis that says given this increase, the number of incidents have dropped, if you will, given the substantial dollar increase in the number of school police officers that you have on board?

Mr. Goldsmith

Well, I think the other driver of that expense, in addition to the school police officers, is also metal detectors.

Councilwoman Brown

Okay. 84 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Mr. Goldsmith

And the swipe cards that are in 52 of our facilities, primarily the high schools and annex.

Councilwoman Brown

Okay.

Mr. Goldsmith

And so it's a combination of the two, and the metal detectors, the cost of the metal detectors is not as significant as the cost of the staffing of them. It's always hard to say what would happen if you didn't have it, but I think -- I mean, I can tell you, this year, for example, weapons confiscation is down about 6.9 percent.

Councilwoman Brown

Great.

Mr. Goldsmith

I believe that, you know, there's -- you know, kids are going to be a little bit more reluctant to bring weapons into schools; that's not to say they don't. But if they got to go through a metal detector, you know, it's going to be a deterrent. So I think we see positive impacts, and we take -- and you know, we do confiscate a lot of things, you know, whether they be knives or, you know, cutting instruments and stuff like that. So I think it's a deterrent. I think the other factors is that we 85 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET are -- Dr. Farmbry and I, we have met with every principal in the system in the past four months at least twice. And one of our messages -- you know, our major message is really to hear from them and what their needs are in really trying to say what can we be doing to help them. But part of the message is, as I referred to in my comments, is that we've got to report these incidents and we've got to do it promptly and so forth. So it wouldn't surprise me to see a little bit of spike-up, frankly, in incidents, so it's hard to keep everything, you know --

Councilwoman Brown

Equal.

Mr. Goldsmith

-- equal.

Mr. Ramos

Yeah, I'd like to add one thing to that, Councilwoman, 'cause, I mean, the -- I was getting asked about this before we started in session this morning. And I think that an important part, as we know from the experience with weapon confiscation, is it can't -- you know, a large part -- you know, in addition to machinery in high schools and staff, a large -- a large part of our 86 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET successes depend on students themselves and the reporting by students.

Councilwoman Brown

Okay.

Mr. Ramos

Students who feel a sense of responsibility in their schools and also students that have been told by teachers and parents what to report. And I don't know whether, you know, frankly within our school, I don't know whether we've got a formal program or whether one is required, but the teachers seem to be getting them -- teachers and parents seem to be getting the word out to students that they're to report situations. And, in fact, we had a contrast yesterday. On the evening news, one situation that went very bad, where students had heard rumors and not reported it, and one in an elementary school here, where an 8-year-old child was given access to a gun by adults.

Councilwoman Brown

Right.

Mr. Ramos

And where another child reported them. And that's how we get most weapons, is because students are a very active participant in school safety. 87 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Councilwoman Brown

Madam President has indicated that my time is up, and I would just echo that the analysis on TV with regards to California was that you have to begin to change the culture, and the culture that you're talking about is the example that you've just given, where parents and students feel comfortable in bringing that to the attention of Administrators. So I'll continue my line of questioning on security next round. Thank you, Madam President.

Council President Verna

Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilman Goode.

Councilman Goode

Thank you, Madam President. Good morning to everyone assembled at the table. PANEL AT WITNESS TABLE: Good morning.

Councilman Goode

Good morning to Mr. Ramos and Mrs. Rush in particular. Let me first start off by applauding you and the Board for your leadership in terms of management reforms at the top level of the District. But as Mr. Ramos knows, I am probably a lot more concerned 88 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET with the management reforms at the most local level in individual schools. It's where I believe that the rubber meets the road. So I will direct the first part of my questioning really toward school-based management. What were we really seeking in the last teachers contract in terms of reforms in school-based management, and what did we get?

Mr. Ramos

Well, there are a number -- a number of areas. I'll start off with some of the ones that are probably the more obvious. First of all, defining, you know, the size of the pie, or the size of the thing to be managed, in terms of the time, the important resource of time and adding time to the student day so that children have more time to not only study but, in many cases, to catch up. An important matter was also the flex -- you know, the flexibility in staffing, and we have underway the opportunity for schools, as I said in my testimony, to flip the usual selection process from teachers selecting schools to schools selecting teachers. And by "schools," I mean schools as a community, including teachers at that 89 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET school. And we -- although there was only, you know, a two- or three-month window to figure all of that out and implement it, schools are on 5 the way to doing it, and we expect to have more. 6 We -- in terms of the, you know, the 7 labor law aspects of this, or the normal labor -- 8 the textbook labor management stuff, you'll note 9 that there's a management's rights clause in the 10 contract for the first time in the history of the 11 School District. You'll notice that the contract 12 is probably like 140-something pages of regular 13 font, you know, with margins, as opposed to 14 300-something pages, small print. And so, you 15 know, somebody familiar with labor management agreements, you'll notice that as well. I mean, I guess those are the highlights, and I'd be happy -- I know you've also gotten the summary of the contract.

Councilman Goode

You refer to 15 schools volunteered to serve as pilot sites. How many were you seeking to volunteer?

Mr. Ramos

We hadn't set out a specific number. The initial report that the media got really almost at the same time or ahead 90 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET of the Board, which I wasn't particularly pleased with, but that's life, had reported six -- I don't know whether it was six or seven sites. That turned out to be wrong, that release, and the initial number, in fact, had ended up at around 11, and then 2 middle schools were added after -- I'm sorry, it turned out to be around 13, and 2 were added. So we're up to around 15. And then I think -- and I was on record as being very disappointed with the first news of how many schools had volunteered for this, 'cause I know from experience that a lot of schools, a lot of faculties around the City, you know, had -- I thought, would welcome this. In the time frame that we're talking about, 15 schools, I think, is good. It's not a bad proportion, given the timing. It's also an opportunity to learn from it, and as we learn from it, to make sure that as we expand, we do it right.

Councilman Goode

Do you view that as a resistance to school-based management, and do you think that accounts for some of the increased growth in popularity of charter schools? 91 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Mr. Ramos

No. I think that there' is a -- I mean, I don't -- I don't think that there is a huge resistance to school-based management in the School District. The School District, in some ways, has been ahead of other districts, including New York, by having school-based budgeting for many years, which people sometimes don't appreciate. So principals have been involved in some level of school-based management, and now principals and faculties are having the opportunity to define criteria and play a role in selecting teachers that come to their schools, and I think that that's something that as faculties and staffs and schools learn more about it, they'll continue to embrace. It will also depend on how, you know, from region to region in the City, you have different levels of receptiveness by, you know, some of the players. But in terms of the impact on charter schools, I mean, I think charter schools are largely driven by some sense of -- particularly on the part of community-based organization and agencies in the community to think that, you know, 92 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET that there's a better job that can be done. I don't know that in practice, we are at a point yet where you see a whole lot more parental involvement in the management than you would.

Councilman Goode

Under this reform contract, are principals actually empowered to manage individual schools?

Mr. Ramos

I think they're -- yeah, they're empowered to manage more. There is still -- in any labor situation, I mean, the labor contract, almost by definition, limits the, you know, the managerial prerogative, and it's all about a balance between that and flexibility.

Councilman Goode

But you talk about the selection of teachers by schools rather than the selection of schools by teachers, but only 15 schools volunteered. Whose decision was that?

Mr. Ramos

Those were -- that was in the time -- I mean, let's go back to -- when the did this contract get settled?

Dr. Rush

November.

Mr. Ramos

I mean, we -- this contract was settled very late, well until into the 93 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET academic year, you know, and schools has to essentially before -- under the contract had until, I think, December 31st to go through a process where the faculty would vote. So that in that span of probably, you know, probably less than two months in practice, schools had to find out what this was all about because there was a whole new contract to learn, had to figure out what some of the rules were, and some of the rules weren't that clear to start with. The school had to organize enough to express some interest and want to do it. They, you know, they -- the -- the -- and you would have different levels receptiveness by principals, teachers, union representatives all played a role in how receptive and how quickly they moved. I was really impressed, you know, that some schools moved so quickly into uncharted territory to do this. I think the real test is this year, when there's a whole year and everybody knows that from right now through December 31st, they can go this route if that's what's right for them. So I think this year will be the truer measure because 94 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET right now, schools could be choosing to go through this process through the end of this year.

Council President Verna

Councilman --

Councilman Goode

Could I just --

Councilwoman Verna

Councilman, I'm sorry, your time has been up.

Councilman Goode

Okay, thank you. I have questions later on regarding student transportation, but I think you know my concern that if there are teachers in schools that don't wish to revert to school-based management in its truest form, then looking at a $1.7 billion budget, it's really hard to determine how we move forward, 'cause I actually believe that it doesn't make a difference what you do at the top if it doesn't impact the principal's ability to manage individual schools. Thank you, Madam President.

Council President Verna

Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilman Kenney.

Councilman Kenney

Thank you, Madam Chair. Let me just stick for a moment with the line of questioning that Councilmember Goode was 95 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET pursuing. Mr. Ramos, how long is the contract, this historic groundbreaking contract that we signed with the PFT? How long is it, what's its duration?

Mr. Ramos

It's a four-year term.

Councilman Kenney

And while I recognize and understand the explanation as to the schools participating in what is touted as to 11 be a cornerstone of this reform contract, which is 12 the issue of seniority and teacher assignment, in 13 the event that hypothetically, over the next four 14 years, over the next year or 2 years, that no more 15 15 or 20 schools out of 264 opt out for this, have we accomplished anything? and, you know, where are we as it relates to this historic contract that needs to be voted on as far as teachers pursuing this concept of removing seniority or diminishing seniority as a way in which they are assigned? If they reject it hypothetically over the term of the contract, where are we?

Mr. Ramos

Well, the -- I think, first of all, the -- this isn't just about hiring, it's also about setting the academic agenda for the 96 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET school by people selecting criteria, and we've also done a lot to address the issue of faculty stability. But just to address your question head-on, four years from now, if all we have is, you know, stuff on paper that we haven't been able to implement, even with the CEO structure, and we are exactly where we are today without a lot of change, I think, you know, we would have failed.

Councilman Kenney

Well, what's the plans on getting more of these teachers engaged in the process of making this decision to vote in favor of where you want to go?

Mr. Goldsmith

Councilman, if I may, I think the -- from a change perspective, just from my perspective as someone that's been in the change business, the worst thing that you can do is try to rush something, and I think it's got to be controlled. And so I think the answer to the question is how do we get more teachers to participate, is to make sure that we knock these 15 schools dead: that they work well, that people see the results of it, that people see that this 97 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET is a way to go. And I think one of our concerns was to have too few schools, and the other concern was to have too many schools, because there's no way -- there's no better way to ruin change than to try to do too much. And so --

Councilman Kenney

President Ramos indicated in his answer to Councilmember Goode that he was, frankly, disappointed with the number of 15.

Mr. Ramos

No, I'm sorry, Councilman.

Councilman Kenney

I'm sorry.

Mr. Ramos

What I was referring to -- I think Councilman Goode will back me up on this. I was referring to my initial reaction when it was reported that the number of schools I had chosen was, like, 6 or 7.

Councilman Kenney

So you're -- so 15 is a number --

Mr. Ramos

I'm more satisfied with 15 than I was at 6, and I --

Councilman Kenney

Well, what was the --

Mr. Ramos

What we have done is -- 98 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Councilman Kenney

What was the number you were hoping for?

Mr. Ramos

Well, I wasn't -- I wasn't, but if we would have gone -- if the answer would have been 264, I would have said oh-oh, because I'm not sure that we were --

Councilman Kenney

Well, in fairness, the way this contract was reported was that this particular cornerstone of this particular reform contract, this particular portion, was a major element in the reform contract that was touted throughout the City and Harrisburg --

Councilman Kenney

Let me finish. And I, as a citizen at the time, when it was announced, had expected that this was going to happen, and not that it was a process over four years of convincing teachers and having them vote in a democratic process as to whether or not they were going to, in fact, participate in this cornerstone of reform.

Mr. Ramos

Well, let me let Secretary Kahn add, but also, just all along, including in all the written summaries, we have said that the 99 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET site selection process -- what we did was give schools the ability to choose site selection. And that's as we've always spoken about it and reported it, where two-thirds of the school faculty would have to choose it. And --

Councilman Kenney

I don't know if that's what the average parent of a school student in this city thought that was as part of this contract settlement.

Mr. Ramos

Well, it's as we discussed it even before the contract settlement that -- but -- and for good reason, because what you're saying is, you want the faculty to be able to shape the faculty, and if you don't have a faculty that's willing to do that, it's not going to work. And so --

Councilman Kenney

What are you anticipating the success rate for next year, this coming year? What do you expect? How many schools do you expect to vote two-thirds in favor of this plan?

Mr. Ramos

We haven't set a goal yet.

Councilman Kenney

What are we doing to try to educate, conciliate, whatever? 100 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Dr. Farmbry

Councilman Kenney, what I'm looking at this year is an opportunity to really focus on the and initially why these 15, 5 what was happening inside of the walls of these 15 6 schools terms of their state of readiness, because 7 to me, what stands out is that those 15 schools 8 were at a state of cultural readiness to say that 9 we want to have some hand in terms of who comes 10 into this very unique culture that we have 11 designed at the school. 12 And what I would like to see is that 13 some of the other provisions of the contract, such 14 as the additional 30-minute -- the time block, the 15 initial 30 minutes becomes a time when similar cultures can be built, whether that's through professional development, through greater teaming within schools, through teachers having time to sit down and really analyze what is the culture that we're trying to establish in this school. So my perspective is really looking at these particular 15 schools in terms of what did they have in place that made them so receptive to this idea and then what can we begin to replicate across the City. 101 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Mr. Ramos

I think there are two phases, Councilman. One is looking at what works, why it worked, why it doesn't work. And we have the benefit of doing some of that, you know, now and as we go through the process for the first time. Then the objective is to take that knowledge and apply it. And the Board hasn't had a discussion with the administration yet about what the goals would be for next year. I think it's a fair question and a fair expectation for everybody that we have -- that we express, you know, some goals for that 2002-2003 year, which is what we're really talking about because we're talking about a vote at schools on December -- you know, by December of this year.

Councilman Kenney

While I recognize that a negotiated teachers contract is much different than negotiating any other municipal workers' contract, and I know there's different elements, the concept of having a workforce once the contract is, quote/unquote, settled still voting on elements of the contract throughout the course of its life is a hard thing for people to understand in the community. I mean, it's like 102 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET taking the police force and saying, Well, we've settled your contract, these are the terms of your contract but, by the way, each district is going to have a two-thirds vote as to whether or not, in fact, those terms are in effect.

Mr. Ramos

I think in general, you know, you're probably -- you know, you raise a good point about the distinctions between schools and municipal workers, but you also will remember that schools through -- I mean school communities are -- it's not that unusual in schools. When we did a mission criteria, you had the school council and the school councils voting on things.

Councilman Kenney

Well, in past contracts --

Mr. Ramos

No, I'm --

Councilman Kenney

In past contracts, have we ever done this type of voting process?

Mr. Ramos

Well, this isn't about what's --

Councilman Kenney

And on what issues?

Mr. Ramos

And this may be a technical thing, but it's not about what's in the contract. 103 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET This is about whether the contract provision is that the school has an option, the school has an opportunity.

Councilman Kenney

The teachers have an option, the teachers have an option, not that the school community has an option; the parents don't make a two-thirds vote on whether or not seniority is an issue in assignment. I mean, when you describe it as the school community making a decision, it's not in fact the school community making a decision; it's the workforce making the decision.

Mr. Ramos

Right. And if a school --

Councilman Kenney

And I do think that the terms and verbiage of that contract are important.

Mr. Ramos

Well, that's right.

Councilman Kenney

And if these votes, these two-thirds votes are not made over the course of the next three years, this historic contract is somewhat flawed.

Mr. Ramos

That's right. And if the contract's not implemented and we don't take up -- take advantage of the flexibility that we fought 104 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET for, it will fizzle.

Councilman Kenney

But that's not the way it was portrayed -- in my opinion, of course -- to the citizens and taxpayers and parents of this city, that in fact this is, in fact, an historic, breakthrough contract that's going to move forward over the next four years, and what we're being told now and what you've said you've told us all along was that this was going to be a two-thirds vote --

Mr. Ramos

Yeah, I mean, Councilman, that's just not accurate. I mean, the -- what we have said all along was that --

Councilman Kenney

Well, I watch television. I mean, all I can see is what I saw from announcements that were made from press conferences and from other types of very celebratory events on television that this is, in fact, a reform contract. In fact, out of 264 schools, only 15 to date have opted out and we have no set goals at this point for who's going to opt into this concept of school reform.

Mr. Ramos

Stated that way, Councilman, you make it -- you know, I'm afraid 105 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET you're not doing it justice.

Councilman Kenney

Well, we can spin things any way we'd like to spin it.

Mr. Ramos

That's right. I mean, you have -- you have schools in the course of a few 7 months and you have, you know, a board and 8 leadership team management team that is trying to 9 do things right, not just do them for the sake of 10 doing them, but make sure that we do it right. To 11 have, you know, to have probably, I guess, a 12 little bit more than 5 percent of your schools in 13 a couple of months decide to do something 14 radically different, to say that you're going to 15 learn from that in this part of the year so that you can apply it in the beginning of the new school year for the remaining three years of the contract, I think, is a responsible way of approaching it.

Councilman Kenney

Well, I think if the Board and the Administration had explained that in those terms at the time the contract was settled, I wouldn't be asking you this question now.

Ms. Kahn

Well, Councilman, I also 106 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET have to say that there was never a time when anyone involved in this negotiation pointed to only that provision in the contract and said that this was the breakthrough and --

Councilman Kenney

Well, let's be fair. Is it not a cornerstone of this reform contract?

Ms. Kahn

It is one of the cornerstone. I would say, having a longer school day is another one and --

Councilman Kenney

I never said anything else but "cornerstone." I used the word "cornerstone."

Ms. Kahn

I would say that having a pay-for-performance system is another one, and there are a number of provisions, and the sum total of them added up to it being the kind of breakthrough contract that it is.

Councilman Kenney

What I'm asking about now is seniority and teacher site.

Mr. Ramos

Well, the other aspect of seniority, Councilman, was greatly reducing the window in which teachers could put in for transfers, which is -- you're really familiar with 107 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET it. You have a big window in which people can put in for a transfer, that person gets a position, that creates another vacancy, and you've create a big ripple effect, and we set -- and we narrowed the window and there's a date by which if you're assigned to a school, you're no longer considered a temporary appointment and still a vacancy, you're still considered assigned to the school. And that was another aspect of reducing the impact of seniority in the contract.

Councilman Kenney

Thank you.

Mr. Goldsmith

Let me just say two things if I may. On the site selection, one of the things that we're doing now is going through the training of the staff and how you go about the interview process. There's a whole bunch of laws and rules and regulations. You just can't go and ask anyone -- any potential employee a question; otherwise we're all going to get sued. And so it's very important that --

Councilman Kenney

I'm sorry, Madam, I know I'm over time but, Mr. Goldsmith, I don't understand what it is you're saying about being sued. 108 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Mr. Goldsmith

Well, there's all types of questions that you are not allowed to ask during an interview process.

Councilman Kenney

Like what?

Mr. Goldsmith

Well --

Mr. Ramos

Such as, how do you -- I mean, there -- I mean, basic employment law. For starters --

Councilman Kenney

I'm not a lawyer, Mr. Ramos.

Councilman Kenney

I just -- give me an example of --

Mr. Ramos

But I know you're familiar enough that you wouldn't ask 'em in your own hiring. I mean, you can't ask people about questions that relate to race, gender, national origin, disability, sexual preference.

Councilman Kenney

That's common in hiring across the board.

Mr. Ramos

And that's what we're talking about.

Councilman Kenney

Is there --

Mr. Ramos

You're now putting people 109 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET in a position where they're having a more active role as an employer and subject to all of the rules that apply to you in your role more as an employer.

Council President Verna

Councilman, I just wanted you to finish your line of questioning on that issue.

Councilman Kenney

I'm finished.

Council President Verna

And we will get back to you. The Chair recognizes Councilman Ortiz.

Councilman Ortiz

Thank you, Madam Chair. Pedro, I want to thank you for all of the attention you are giving. But, you know, you stay around here long enough and you just grow cynical about a lot of things that are supposed to be happening. Friday I went to the Hunter School to inaugurate really a new setting up of the library, which is not a new library, but the realization of how much people accomplish with little, all right, of how much is done at certain schools with just a little bit of materials and so on. And you get 110 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET tired of doing that. And then you read stories of (indiscernible) Hernandez, the little girl who hears music in her head, you know, and she goes to Potter Towers, and you just say that is happening. And her father's name, by the way, is Rafael Hernandez, who happens to be probably the greatest Puerto Rican -- not her father, but Rafael Hernandez is the greatest Puerto Rican song writer. So I imagine that the spirit of Rafael Hernandez is living through this little girl. My wife's cousin came in very excited, and she said that she was going to start teaching at Shepherd, and she took her favorite niece -- my daughter, who goes to Greenfield -- to Shepherd to show her the school. And my little girl said, You're going to be teaching there? You know. And not knowing the environment that is there. 3 billion for two stadiums, and we approve it really without any questions asked, any rationale for it, and very little discussion as to how it's going to benefit Philadelphia. " In which stadiums prompt some questions. And in it, he quotes this lady from the Baltimore Oriole Park at Camden Yards, Miss Janet Marie Smith. And she said you just can't put a dollar value on what it feels like to be a major-league city. And he quotes how the arguments about stadiums went from being an economic development machine to maybe creating employment, and when none of that really showed up to be true about any of that, that there was going to be very little benefit, really, to Philadelphia and to Philadelphians as such, other than the intangible feeling of you can't put a dollar value on what it feels like to be a major-league city. And it comes out that -- they asked this economist at this conference where this lady was, over here at the Convention Center, Mr. Coates, and they asked him, they said, how much really does it cost to feel like a major-league 112 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET city? Can you put a cost to that? And Miss Smith could not, but Mr. Coates could. See, Mr. Coates said it would probably cost every citizen in the City of Philadelphia about $10 each a year to feel in order -- 'cause that's what we're giving probably the Phillies and the Eagles. And to me, just having a kid in 1st grade in public school and another one in 5th grade, what do I tell her, what do I tell him, right? And you grow cynical being here because we do this constantly over and over. And you come here and you talk about a structural deficit right now of $41 million, and forget the deficit later one into the hundreds. And when we talk reform, we don't talk about getting rid of -- to me a reform means -- because I really believe we've got great teachers, I see 'em every day, I see 'em every time I go to a classroom at Hunter, at Shepherd, at Greenfield. To me, reform means tearing down Shepherd and putting up a brand-new school. To me, reform means that we create a classroom with 20 students per class, and that when I walk into a library like I walked into at Hunter, I see it plugged 113 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET into the Internet, I see computers, and I see all of the other benefits that you can see when you go to a school like my cousin's kid goes up there in New Jersey. It has all of these little things that make it. So I just -- you come in here and you really -- I mean, we have -- I like charter schools as a pilot, but we have 14,000 kids and that's plus the 215,000 or not?

Mr. Ramos

Included.

Councilman Ortiz

But we have 14,000 kids in charter schools, and I don't think there's anyone that can tell me that this charter's doing better teaching than Hunter School because I don't think there is, I don't think there's anyone that can tell me that there are many more kids who can hear music in their heads, and we produce that because we have a charter school. I don't think we can say that. However, I do see it in which a lot of money is being diverted and no monitoring and no 24 supervision and really no standards being placed. So I have questions about that. And even though 114 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET my wife is the chair of one of those schools and -- but I just don't know why we don't ask, why we don't spend $1.3 billion at one point over a 10-year period for the Philadelphia public schools. I mean, instead of coming here and talking about -- because if you're going to feel like a major-league city, you're never going to be able to attract the businesses just because you have the Eagles, you're never going to be able to attract the new millennium of young people just because the Phillies are playing, and they still won't be able to win the pennant, all right? And you will not have a major-league city until we do this. So until we can do that, until we begin establishing that area, I don't see -- everything else we discuss here is cynic, cynicism. It's all about plugging holes, it's all about not going in the right direction. But when we can sit here until 2 o'clock in the morning and discuss the merits, like we did for the Eagles and the Phillies, and pass a program that does that, I would rather be indebted passing bonds for the 115 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET school system than indebted passing bonds for the Eagles and the Phillies. Thank you, Madam Chair. (Applause.)

Council President Verna

Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilman Clarke.

Councilman Clarke

Thank you, Madam Chair. Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen. PANEL AT WITNESS TABLE: Good afternoon.

Councilman Clarke

Before I ask my question, on the schools that volunteered for 15 the pilot program,, would it be possible for to you send a list of those schools? I would be interested to find out where they are, the demographics associated with them.

Mr. Ramos

Yes, we'll do that.

Councilman Clarke

For the Chair, please.

Councilman Clarke

Thank you. I had a question about charter schools. On of the CFO's testimony, I think it says $79 million, and the text talks about 25.6 million 116 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET budgeted for children who were previously not enrolled in public schools. You all know that there's been recent discussion about whether or not we can maintain the middle class or stop the flight of individuals from the City of Philadelphia, hopefully using charter schools. Is, by any chance, any of that million, did it fall under the realm of those 10 people who might potentially leave the City of 11 Philadelphia? Or were these just new applicants 12 to the school system, or were they transfers from 13 parochial schools? Can you give me a sense of 14 where these children came from that are a part of 15 these now public-school enrollees. 16

Ms. Chatzkel

Of the 14,000 in 17 students that are enrolled in charter schools, 18 fully 20 percent of the whole population is coming 19 from non-public schools, from private and 20 parochial schools. Ten percent are entering 21 charter schools at the kindergarten level, so that 22 the School District was never responsible for 23 educating them. 24 Those are the numbers. 25

Councilman Clarke

Okay, so the 117 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET 20 percent are coming from private or parochial schools?

Ms. Chatzkel

That's right.

Councilman Clarke

And this may be early on in the process, but do we have a sense of why, what it was? Was it financial primarily, or was it the thought that it would be a better education than the chart school?

Ms. Kahn

We don't really have that information in a comprehensive way, certainly, no 12 economic analysis of the students who were coming in. You know, there's anecdotal information, but, you know, we don't really have that in a comprehensive way. But you can look at the different areas around the City, you know, and maybe make some economic assumptions. But other than that, we don't have that. And the numbers I think that Rhonda cited are actually growing. I mean, that was the population overall. But in the last round for the current school year, I believe that the number of students who were not in the system has risen to. . .

Ms. Chatzkel

37 percent. 118 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Councilman Clarke

37 percent?

Ms. Kahn

Closer to 40 percent, right.

Councilman Clarke

Are we looking at doing an analysis to determine why these people are making the decision to take kids out of private school and take kids out of parochial school to go into charter schools? 'Cause I'd just be interested in -- I'm assuming that primarily, it's an economic decision, but the question is, do they think that the educational opportunities are as good as, if not better, than the private and parochial schools? I'd like for us to do some sort of an analysis on that.

Mr. Goldsmith

I think that's an excellent idea for us to do the type of research to find out why students are attending charter schools. Frankly, one of the issues we have right now is just staffing the whole charter school process in terms of the numbers of applications and reviewing them and so forth, and that doesn't undermine the importance of what you're asking for. I think that's something essential that should be done. 119 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Councilman Clarke

Thank you. Parental involvement. As I was growing up as a child, and I think most of us in this room, there was substantial parental involvement in the schools and even after the school day with the child as it related to the children's education. What is the School District doing to attempt to increase parental involvement to get it either closer to the level that it used to be in the past? 'Cause I think without that, realistically, you can throw all of the money in the world at it, but if we don't have some level of parental involvement, we won't get where we need to get. What are we doing officially or formally to --

Dr. Farmbry

In addition to the more traditional home and school associations, which are in most schools. You know, in some schools, they're much more involved and active than in others, but in addition to the traditional home and school associations, every school is charged to have a school council, which is another way of having the parents involved in the governance 120 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET structure. Many of the grants that we apply for have parental components where parents are supposed to be receiving instruction to make them better parents in terms of being able to support the child's instructional program. Many of our reading grants that we received have a component for parental engagement in helping children become better readers. We find that our C tech labs, which are our technology labs, computer technology labs, in each cluster have also developed another way for parents to get involved. Many -- as we all know, many students are much more technologically astute than their parents, so it's a way for parents to come into schools and to become much more computer literate. So we're looking for ways to involve parents, not only in the traditional routes, where we think of parents helping to sell cookies and bake sales and so forth, but also ways for parents to be much more involved in terms of real decision-making through governance and also in terms of the instructional upgrades that all 121 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET parents need to stay contemporary in terms of helping their children.

Councilman Clarke

Who the individual school is responsible for parent engagement? I mean, it's one thing for the Board level to talk about the need to do that, but at the end of the day, particularly as we talk about schools making decisions for that particular school, who in that school is it? Is it the principal or is there a staff member assigned?

Dr. Farmbry

Yeah, most principals have assigned a staff member to really take the lead in terms of parental involvement and parental outreach. So in most schools, there is a staff member -- it may be an assistant principal, it may be the home and school president, but in most schools, there is one person whose primary responsibility is parental and community outreach.

Councilman Clarke

And does that person have a threshold that they should meet? Is there an analysis done? After six months, if the home and school association still has those same three people coming to the meeting, do we look at that person and say, You're not getting the job 122 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET done? 'Cause, I mean, to be frank, I mean, in a lot of our schools, we have, you know, really poor participation and you can't be soley dependent.

Councilman Clarke

'Cause if that person's not a great person, you know, you don't have much to work with.

Councilman Clarke

So, I mean, is there some threshold that that person should meet, or do we just kind of like let it go along?

Dr. Farmbry

Right. Currently, parental involvement is not a part of a school's performance index, which is pretty much the measure that's used to define a school in terms of how it's improving, but in terms of the principal's performance process, there is a category that talks about public engagement, and parents are viewed as part of the public and community outreach. So to that extent, principals are currently pressured to increase their level of parental involvement, although it does not, at this current time, show up as the measure on the performance index. 123 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Councilman Clarke

Mm-hmm. One last question with respects to charter schools. Do you get a sense that the parental involvement is at a higher level at charter schools versus the non-charter schools?

Dr. Farmbry

In some cases, more so than others. I know in some charter schools, it is a part of the charter that parents be involved and to the extent that, you know, lack of parent participation means that a charter school may opt to say, Well, your child cannot attend here anymore, we cannot do that in the public-school sector; we take children whether or not their parents opt to be involved.

Mr. Ramos

Well, the other thing, Councilman, is that -- I mean, in a sense, you know, the -- you know, I think some -- most of us have experience just from visiting charter schools, you know, and knowing people in charter schools of what the parent experience is. I think it varies a lot. It depends on the philosophy of the school that it's -- you know, I could propose a charter school that says, you know, all decisions will be made entirely democratically by 124 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET parents, or I could propose a charter school that says parents will have no say and everything is completely in the purview of educators, and that might be, you know, acceptable, and when parents choose that charter school, they will be taking that mode of operating. One of the things about the relationship is that, you know, we try to do with them -- what we're going to try to continue to do them as we have more experience with them is to try to learn from 'em, you know, where you have extraordinary levels of participation by parents, you know, because that's a value we have, we can learn from that, but we don't try -- we don't necessarily measure them -- we don't measure them by parental participation. It's up to their own boards of -- you know, their own school boards, their own board of trustees for each charter school to set the goals of parental participation for their own school.

Councilman Clarke

But I think I heard in this last question, I think I heard that you can mandate some level of participation as a requirement of the charter school. Did I hear you 125 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET say that, Doctor?

Dr. Rush

Dorothy Sumners Rush. The board of trustees that operates that particular charter school can mandate that if the parents don't participate in a certain amount of percentage of time or energy or planning or preparation, they can then look at not having that child among their students, but the School District, whether the parent comes or doesn't come, we do not have the authority to exclude a student or keep a student from participating. That is the difference. They have a separate board which can determine that. We cannot. We must accept all children, whether the parent comes or doesn't come.

Councilman Clarke

But as a part of the issuance of the charter school, we cannot -- the School District cannot require that?

Mr. Ramos

That's a different question.

Dr. Rush

Yes, that's a different question. We do look at that particular part of the community support and the parental support and what they say to us. What they say to us usually 126 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET satisfies us after they understand what it is that we're seeking we. Do look at that very seriously as a reason to either accept or reject the charter, as to whether they do have parental involvement.

Councilman Clarke

Okay, all right. Thank you. Thank you, Madam Chair.

Council President Verna

Your time is up. Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilman Rizzo.

Councilman Rizzo

Thank you, Madam Chair. Mr. Goldsmith, in an effort -- in your effort to control costs at the School District, I'd like to talk to you about something that you said today. When were the -- when were the additional 185 school police officers added to the District?

Mr. Goldsmith

I think they've been added over the past several years. The force has grown. I'm not sure I can give you a -- I can certainly provide for you a year-by-year breakdown. 127 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Councilman Rizzo

It went from 342 to 527. I have no problem with that, I have no 4 problem with that, but I believe that that was almost -- I don't believe that that took too long a period of time for that to occur. And I have no problem with enhanced security, but it's interesting, we add 185 officers to the School District, and today, you state in your presentation that you think the Police Department can do a better job at doing this. Well, I believe in the last few months, officers have been added, and we're going to probably have to maintain those officers that have been newly hired for a long period of time until attrition clicks in or whatever, and many of these officers would have to go back to the Police Academy because they're not sworn officers, so there would be a lot of training. My point here today is that year after year after year, we sit here, we talk about ideas. You leave here -- not you, but the School District leaves here saying great idea, and we never hear anything about it. Today you say that the Police Department -- the Police Commissioner can do a 128 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET better job. Why did we hire 185 more police officers, why do we have a force of 527 if the Philadelphia Police Department can do a better job?

Mr. Goldsmith

Well, I think there's a couple answers. I want to make sure that I say that I think it's an issue that we should look at. I'm not subscribing that we do it without, you know, the appropriate analysis. I was recently in New York visiting with School District officials there and discussed the process that they went through. It's a laborious process, it's not something that happens overnight, but I do think that it's something as we're looking at how do we leverage our resources and expertise, it's something that we should be looking at, and we should be looking at it seriously, but we have needs now that we have to take care of and we can't wait till for idea to happen. And the other thing is, in New York, and I would presume the same thing would happen here, it would be the school police officers that would be managed by the police district. It's not 129 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET converting those officers into regular policemen.

Councilman Rizzo

If I check the record of previous budget processes, we identified the fact that your School District police, and I'm not suggesting that we put armed police officers in our schools, but we have uniformed police that patrol in nights, find an open school, and the first thing that those police officers have to do, they have to call the Philadelphia Police Department to come to give them support, and it is something that could happen quickly. If you -- if the Police Department assumed certainly responsibilities, and we have classes going in and out of the Police Academy all the time, that a segment of that department could be designated as having police officers trained at the Police Academy. We talk year after year. And just out of curiosity, I checked the record in the area of school transportation. Tell me, we're going to spend over $45 million, 45 million on transportation. Year after year after year -- and no fault of yours -- the School District has been asked to talk to SEPTA about a relationship to try to save the School District 130 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET money. We've asked you to work with the Archdiocese about certain economy of scale. And I ask people, Has anything ever been done about those things? No. You walk out of here, happy as can be to get your taxing authority, and nobody follows up or does anything that suggests to me, or that I see, about trying to save the taxpayers of this city money. I hope under your and this new leadership that some of the things we talk about here you really do. Because, again, I don't see a whole lot of that going on. In the area of energy conservation, I ride by schools that every light in the place is on 24/7. Would you do that at home? I don't think so. I know I wouldn't. So, again, I'm frustrated when we talk about monies and these millions of dollars add up to, you know, to big money, that some of these small items be addressed very, very carefully. And I know -- and I've had private conversations with you -- that you are interested in some of these things. But, again, you mentioned it here today, that basically I can assure you that 131 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET Commissioner Timoney knows a lot more about security deployment than I do, so that suggests that you should be out of this business. Thank you.

Mr. Goldsmith

Thank you.

Council President Verna

Thank you. I don't know if Councilwoman Tasco is in the room. Her light is on. If she is not here, the Chair will recognize Councilwoman Blackwell.

Councilwoman Blackwell

Thank you, Madam President. I would like to say before I ask a few questions, I have many, but I will only ask a few that I think in all of the years I've been here, this is the best presentation that we have ever had from the Board and the first time that I feel that we're in good hands. So let me say thank you to all of you.

Mr. Goldsmith

Thank you.

Mr. Ramos

Thank you, Councilwoman.

Councilwoman Blackwell

Maybe it's because we have extra women this time. (Laughter.) 132 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Mr. Goldsmith

I'll withdraw my thank-you.

Councilwoman Blackwell

Thank you. I was glad to read in your report that you are adhering to Judge Smith's recommendations, and we're glad to hear that. With regard to West and Southwest Philadelphia, do you think that we can get a truancy center there for West and Southwest Philadelphia? I know right now, we have one at Palumbo School. Do you think we can get a truancy center for West and Southwest? The President and I would be glad to share.

Mr. Goldsmith

We will certainly look into it. It's actually one of the things that I inserted in the budget at this point in time because I meet with the police commanders, six police commanders, on a regular basis as well as our own safety folks. And one of the things that I heard in the course of those meetings is the value of the truancy center, so I exercised my executive prerogative and sort of inserted that in the budget. And -- but I -- we haven't determined 133 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET where that would go, but obviously we will listen very carefully to you.

Councilwoman Blackwell

Thank you very much. Also, rumor has it that clusters, some will be cut back. Is that true? And how will that impact on your overall educational or academic plan?

Mr. Goldsmith

Well, I think, as I alluded to in my remarks, is that we have to look at the organizational structure, and that's something that we're doing and that we're going to continue to do. I really, truly believe that the focus has to be on the classroom, i.e., the schools. And I know there's a lot of talk and a lot of rumor about clusters, and I really prefer to focus on what's going on in the schoolhouse and how do we support that. I think one of the things that I think we have to be mindful of is that: in 1969, there were 8 districts; in 1977, there were 7 districts; in 1990, there were 6 districts; in '95, there were 4 districts plus the 6 new clusters; and in 134 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET 1996, we went to 22 clusters; and actually, at the turn of the century, not this most recent century, but the century before that, there were 15 districts. So I guess I'm saying there's a time for all regions, and we have to look and see, you know, what makes sense. My point isn't necessarily the number; it's how do we take people and put them in the classroom where they are desperately needed, and we're going to do that analysis. I want to do it with Dr. Farmbry because these are fundamentally academic issues, but do it in a thoughtful manner, because the last thing we need to do is turn the system topsy-turvy. But clearly, we've got needs in the schools and in the classroom, and to the extent that that's where people should be, that's where we have to put 'em.

Councilwoman Blackwell

Let me say thank you. We've asked the same questions over the years about the whole organizational structure, even when clusters first started, so we're glad to hear your response. And one more issue on crime before we 135 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET ask our next question, and that is, we have been involved with Tigerman, and we know that he works -- in fact Christine James-Brown is aware of the work does in terms of crime with the School District, and we certainly recommend his program. We had -- many people know I'm very close too Lee School, and we had an incident there. I taught there, it's two blocks from my house, and I'm just -- Lee School is special to me, I just have a relationship there. And certainly, we think that he does a good job and would recommend him to the Board. My next question is about summer school, and I'm encouraged to hear that with 75 percent of the students failing and -- will we be able to -- and I'm really, really excited to hear that we want to use summer school more. Will we be able to offer students in various subjects what they need to bring them forward for the next school year?

Dr. Farmbry

Our plan currently is to offer summer school at the same level that we did last year, and in that summer school, the emphasis really was on remediation and equipping students 136 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET with the skills to pass the test to enable them to get to next grade. There's always been a real focus on 9th-grade students for summer school on our 3rd- and 4th-graders really making sure that the grade of and the grade prior to our testing years, the students get an extra dose of the instruction that they need to be successful. We're always interested in the extent to which our summer programs can be used to equip high school students with the credits that they need for graduating, particularly since the Board just passed its commitment to really maintain our 23.5 expectation for students graduating next year. So we will be looking at how students can use the summer months to make sure they're on track for acquiring the credits necessary for graduation as well.

Councilwoman Blackwell

That's great. And I think it's really good what happens to get 9th-graders ready for high school. I think that's made a big, big difference. I know it has in my area for University City High School, and certainly we support using summer school that way 137 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET as well. Let me make one comment about charter schools. I think that -- my opinion is that charter schools really started and became popular out of the frustration with some neighborhoods schools. We support them. We have found them exciting places for learning, we've supported them from the beginning. As you know, we've done a lot in terms of newsletters and the fact that public libraries asked for ours when there was nothing else. And we support them and think that they are great alternatives. We support World Communications Charter and other charter schools, Dr. Jean Brown's charter schools and many that do a great job. Not all are great, and we're finding the more we have, the more we have the same problems that exist with public schools. Some are great, some are good, and some are okay, and that's -- you know, that's life in the big city. But certainly, we wanted to say -- I think they grew out of a frustrating time in our school's history, and I think they are important places and for our city, important schools, and 138 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET absolutely, we support them. Madam President, I'm willing to wait. I have a lot of questions, but I'm willing to defer mine.

Council President Verna

Thank you. I think at this time, we'll recess until 2 o'clock.

Mr. Goldsmith

Thank you. Thank you very much.

Council President Verna

Thank you. (Break taken.) - - - (Proceedings resume at 2:15 p.m.)

Council President Verna

The committee is now in session. And the Chair recognizes Councilman Goode.

Councilman Goode

Thank you, Madam President. Good afternoon. I have a few questions about student transportation issues. The first question that was found in the budget documents, but for the record, could you state how much the School District pays SEPTA for tokens and 139 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET transfers?

Ms. Kahn

(Nods head.) (Witness comes forward.)

Mr. Lombardi

I'm sorry. I didn't hear the question.

Councilman Goode

I know the figure is accounted for in the budget documents, but for the record, could you state how much the School District pays SEPTA for tokens and transfers. We pay SEPTA 8.8 -- last year, we paid them $8.8 million.

Councilman Goode

8.8 million --

Council President Verna

I'm sorry, excuse me. Please identify yourself for the record.

Mr. Lombardi

I'm John Lombardi. I'm Administrator of Transportation Services. And for Fiscal Year 2000, we paid SEPTA $8.8 million for tokens and transfers.

Councilman Goode

And what is the State reimbursement?

Mr. Lombardi

Approximately 65 percent approximately, Rhonda, 65 percent?

Mr. Goldsmith

I think it's 140 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET 68 percent.

Mr. Lombardi

Approximately 65, 68 percent.

Councilman Goode

Of the token and transfer?

Mr. Lombardi

Correct.

Councilman Goode

Okay. You said 65 percent?

Mr. Lombardi

65 percent.

Councilman Goode

And how much is recovered from the sale of tokens to students?

Mr. Lombardi

The subsidized tokens are purchased by students throughout the City, both public and non-public. Students spend approximately $5.5 million of their money purchasing tokens, subsidized tokens. We subsidize those tokens for a quarter. Students pay 90 cents, SEPTA charges $1.15. We subsidize 'em for the quarter.

Councilman Goode

You pay 8.8.

Mr. Lombardi

Right. So in that 8.8 is the 25-cent subsidy as well.

Councilman Goode

Okay, follow for me a second. 141 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Councilman Goode

You pay 8.8.

Mr. Lombardi

Right.

Councilman Goode

You get 65 percent back from the State?

Mr. Lombardi

Right.

Councilman Goode

That's 65 percent of 8.8?

Mr. Lombardi

Correct.

Councilman Goode

And you then charge the students 5.5 million?

Mr. Lombardi

No. We don't charge -- the students pay -- the students --

Councilman Goode

My question was, how much is recovered from the sale of tokens to the students?

Mr. Lombardi

65 percent of the $8.8 million. The money that the students spend is not recovered. The 90 cents that they pay for the tokens, the $5.5 million, that's not recovered.

Councilman Goode

You're not following me, you're trying to tell a story. I want you to answer the question as outlined.

Mr. Lombardi

Okay. 142 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Councilman Goode

You pay SEPTA $8.8 million.

Mr. Lombardi

Correct.

Councilman Goode

You are reimbursed 55 percent of that from the State.

Mr. Lombardi

Correct.

Councilman Goode

How much of that do you recover from the sale of tokens to the students? I'm assuming there's 35 percent.

Mr. Lombardi

None. We don't recover any of that.

Councilman Goode

So you charge students for what purpose?

Mr. Lombardi

We don't charge students. SEPTA charges students to ride their lines. These are students who are not eligible for free transportation. The students pay the 90 cents to SEPTA after the School District.

Councilman Goode

So you sell tokens to students.

Mr. Lombardi

At public schools, we sell tokens to public school students. Non-public schools sell tokens to non-public school students.

Councilman Goode

I'm referring to the 143 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET public schools.

Mr. Lombardi

Correct, we sell them.

Councilman Goode

You sell tokens to students.

Mr. Lombardi

Correct.

Councilman Goode

And you purchase them from SEPTA.

Councilman Goode

And the cost of that is. . . ?

Mr. Lombardi

$1.15 to the District. We pay $1.15.

Councilman Goode

What's the total cost?

Mr. Lombardi

$1.15 per token for --

Councilman Goode

And what's the total cost?

Mr. Lombardi

I don't have my book here with me. I can get it.

Mr. Goldsmith

I think it's $5 million. Does that sound right?

Councilman Goode

No, that's the student cost.

Mr. Lombardi

For free tokens with 144 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET transfers, it costs $5.6 million. That's what it costs the District for free tokens. For subsidized tokens, it costs us $3.1 million. That's what we pay quarterly. We pay them quarterly for that.

Councilman Goode

So the 5.6 and the 3.1 account for the 8.8 figure?

Mr. Lombardi

Yeah. There's a $98,000 expense that we incurred last year for a pilot program that we initiated last year at William Penn High School, which was discontinued this year.

Councilman Goode

So the 5.6 is the cost that goes directly attributable to the students. The students pay the 5.6.

Mr. Lombardi

No, no that's what we pay. The students pay an additional 5.5 million.

Councilman Goode

On top of the 5.6.

Mr. Lombardi

On top of it. The total revenue for SEPTA is about $14 million.

Councilman Goode

So the 8.8 that you pay SEPTA does not include the tokens that you purchase. So you pay the 8.8, and then you purchase another 5.6. 145 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Councilman Goode

Explain it.

Mr. Lombardi

The students pay -- the students pay the --

Councilman Goode

Explain it.

Councilman Goode

Don't break down the costs per trip, don't break down the costs per token per student.

Councilman Goode

Break down how much money you give SEPTA.

Mr. Lombardi

8.8 --

Councilman Goode

How much you --

Mr. Lombardi

Go ahead.

Councilman Goode

How much you recover from the State.

Councilman Goode

And what cost you pass onto the student, if any.

Mr. Lombardi

Okay. We spend $8.8 million a year for tokens. That includes free, subsidized, and transfers.

Councilman Goode

So you don't give 146 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET SEPTA any money for tokens or transfers beyond $8.8 million.

Mr. Lombardi

Correct.

Councilman Goode

Okay. What do you get back in terms of State reimbursement?

Mr. Lombardi

65 percent of the $8.8 million.

Councilman Goode

Okay.

Mr. Lombardi

There's an additional -- did you have a question?

Councilman Goode

Go ahead.

Mr. Lombardi

There's an additional $5.5 million approximately that students pay for subsidized tokens that is not reimbursed by the State. The revenue to SEPTA is --

Councilman Goode

Don't use term "subsidized tokens" for a second. The students pay that amount, you purchase 'em from SEPTA for that extra price --

Mr. Lombardi

Right.

Councilman Goode

And sell 'em to the students for that price.

Mr. Lombardi

For -- not the exact -- for 90 cents. The students buy them for 90 cents. 147 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Councilman Goode

So your purchase price in terms of tokens and transfers that you sell is what?

Mr. Lombardi

$1.15 per token, $8.8 million total.

Councilman Goode

And you discount it for a quarter, per token.

Mr. Lombardi

Correct.

Councilman Goode

Okay, what is the process for reviewing token prices?

Mr. Lombardi

What is the process for what, sir?

Councilman Goode

Reviewing token prices. How often to you review token prices, who reviews token prices, who decides what the cost of tokens are?

Mr. Lombardi

SEPTA does. SEPTA indicates to us what --

Councilman Goode

The School District purchases the tokens.

Councilman Goode

They then sell them.

Mr. Lombardi

Right.

Councilman Goode

Who determines the 148 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET price that they sell them at?

Mr. Lombardi

Some time ago, the Board decided to subsidize tokens for cents, probably 5 5 years ago. So it's been a long-standing 6 practice of the Board to charge 90 cents and -- 7

Councilman Goode

I got that. What's 8 the current process review of token prices? 9

Mr. Lombardi

SEPTA tells us what the 10 price is. 11

Councilman Goode

I'm talking about 12 how much you're going to discount to the students. 13

Mr. Lombardi

There hasn't been a 14 review in quite some time, if that's your 15 question. 16

Councilman Goode

Okay. Is -- do you 17 view any connection between token prices and 18 truancy? 19

Mr. Lombardi

And truancy? I 20 personally can't answer that. Perhaps someone 21 from the instructional side can, but there may be. 22

Dr. Farmbry

There may be some 23 connection between token prices and truancy, but 24 I'd probably venture to say that there's probably 25 a greater connection between a student's lack of 149 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET ability to read and truancy that leads to frustration and just not being in tune with the instructional program. And we know that there's a correlation between truancy and dropping out, and very often, students who are prone to drop out are those who had reading problems early on.

Councilman Goode

In terms of the connection that may exist between token costs and token prices and truancy, would the Board and the Administration be willing to consider further subsidizing or eliminating the cost of student transportation related to truancy?

Mr. Goldsmith

Well, let me speak from the Administration. In terms of the truancy issue, we don't have any quantifiable data to really answer the question. I think occasionally, we hear stories that would underlie some indication that obviously it's an impediment.

Councilman Goode

I'm not making a claim.

Mr. Lombardi

Right, I understand.

Councilman Goode

I'm asking whether you see --

Mr. Goldsmith

I would say -- 150 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Councilman Goode

-- a connection between truancy and token prices at all.

Mr. Goldsmith

Well, I'm sorry, could you repeat that.

Councilman Goode

Is there any connection, relationship between token prices and truancy?

Mr. Goldsmith

As far as I know, we don't have any quantifiable information to say yes or no on that.

Councilman Goode

So the answer is "I don't know"?

Mr. Goldsmith

The answer is we do not know, yes.

Councilman Goode

Okay, thank you. Thank you, Madam Chair.

Councilwoman Miller

Okay, thank you. I have a few questions here. I think, Miss Kahn, in your testimony you talked the fact that lines of communications are better now between some of your major stakeholders like the State reps, the State's Education Committee. When they came down, did the entire committee come? and what did they find that was 151 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET different about Philadelphia schools and about some of the schools around other parts of State?

Ms. Kahn

This was actually the second time in about six months or so that we had invited them and it just worked out members of the House Education Committee could come to Philadelphia. The first time was actually last August, and then again most recently, about ten days ago. No, the entire committee wasn't there, but there was a representative sampling, including the Chair. They had specifically this time requested to visit two of our schools, the Saul High School and then also the new Grover Washington year-round middle school. I think -- and again, with the weather, what had happened was, you know, we early-dismissed that afternoon and we went to Saul and schools wee closed the following morning, but that didn't deter them at all. And we had principals and teachers who, you know, who certainly stayed just so that they show the schools. I think -- you know, and we got a letter to that effect, that they were very impressed with what they saw. But more than that, as we just talked 152 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET about larger issues. We gave them, in fact, the financial presentation from the plan that Miss Chatzkel shared this morning talked, and we talked about issues that affect us, particularly when we looked at the key expense drivers, issues of special education, issues of charter schools. There was commonality, as well as the impact and problem in local communities about the reliance on the property tax to fund schools. They also pointed out certain things, and this is true as well, in their communities that they would like to have that we don't have in Philadelphia -- or that we have in Philadelphia that they don't, for whatever reason, like full-day kindergarten, for example, and that's something that we believe is a better statewide policy, you know, is something that would be great to say in Pennsylvania. So, you know, it's a matter of getting to know one another more, both as individuals as well as understanding each other's communities and trying to build that consensus.

Councilwoman Miller

I think that's important because I guess the more -- I believe 153 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET that the more people at the State level understand what the 1.6 or $7 billion is being spent on, then it increases our probability of accessing additional resources. So I'm really glad to hear that that's happening, and I hope some other visits are planned for the future.

Ms. Kahn

Thank you.

Councilwoman Miller

I was out of the out of room, and I don't know whether my colleague -- Blondell, did you ask technology-based questions when I was gone earlier? I don't want to be representative.

Councilwoman Brown

(Responds off-mic.)

Councilwoman Miller

Okay, all right, thank you. I have a couple questions as it relates to technology, and I'd like to know, what is the overall technology mission and technical-based educational plan for the District, and what is being done to ensure that it will be successful? Is there a plan?

Dr. Farmbry

Our instructional plan is to make sure that now that are schools are wired, 154 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET that both teachers and students are adept at really using the computer to access information. We are also interested in the whole field of technology as it is a career option for students, making sure that students have good information relative to career development in fields where proficiency and technology does open the doors of access to those careers. As I said earlier in my response to the textbook question, we're very interested in making sure that students are aware that not only do they have textbooks as a resource for information, but they also have the Internet. We're interested in making sure that there's responsible use of the Internet, that we have at our disposal good software that will help students not only in a remedial sense of trying to catch up and be on top of their academics but also in terms of the use of good software for enrichment an advancement. So it's a comprehensive plan that is tied very much to standards for best use of technology, making sure that students are aware of how to use technology, how to access information, and then how to use it to show a better product, 155 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET how to use technology to show -- to give presentations, to make sure that they can use it proficiently when they have to give presentations, give talks, make convincing presentations, and so forth.

Councilwoman Miller

Okay. So the development and the design of that curriculum and the development of that plan comes out of that office. I know you have a COO and you have -- what was that -- Ron Daniels, was that his name?

Dr. Farmbry

Right, who's here.

Councilwoman Miller

Right.

Dr. Farmbry

And if Ron would like to come up and make any statements at this point --

Councilwoman Miller

And while he's coming up, every school pretty much has access to the Internet?

Councilwoman Miller

There's, what, classrooms set up where computers are required?

Mr. Goldsmith

Yes. And Mr. Daniels can speak it. Last year, his office really completed a major, major accomplishment, I think, which is the wiring of all of our schools so we 156 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET are able to go into this, you know, technology age and our students are able to have access to the Internet and be able to network, and he may want to talk more about that.

Mr. Daniels

Yeah. The technology plan is basically two parts. We're moving into the next phase of wiring which allows all of our schools to access the Internet, e-mail, that type of thing. Working in conjunction with the curriculum folks now, how do we train our kids, how do we train our teachers on use that technology. And, again, that's training our teachers on how to use it; and then secondly, how do you integrate that into the curriculum. And that's part of what the Curriculum Office is doing on conjunction with our office. How do we present that technology, first of all, from a infrastructure standpoint by having these schools wired and having the computers in the classroom, and then how do we train the staff to use that to make sure every student has a foundation of technology in their curriculum.

Councilwoman Miller

Okay. What about the schools that the School District -- what about 157 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET the buildings that the School District does not own, such as some of the alternative programs? Example, Parkway in the Northwest, up in New Covenant. Now, I know that Parkway rents space in those very old buildings, and I don't believe that that school and maybe some other programs like that are wired. And I'd really like you to look into that if it's not, and is there a plan? 'Cause someone said about a year ago that they weren't going to be wired because the School District did not own the buildings, but you have 250 high school children attending that program, and I'm not really sure whether it's been wired or not. I did raise this maybe in a private meeting maybe one-on-one, I'm not really sure, and I haven't checked.

Dr. Farmbry

Yeah, we would really need to look into that 'cause I think some are and some are not, 'cause I know in that same campus where Parkway is, that New Covenant campus, Parkway may not be, but I know Amy Northwest on that same campus is.

Councilwoman Miller

Right, right. 158 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET Well, they're in a newer building now. Amy is located in one of the newer buildings, the Parkway program is located in one of the older programs, so that may be the issue, I don't know, okay. And I --

Mr. Daniels

If I may add, some of our schools, although there is 259 approximately schools, there approximately 400 buildings, if you include annexes. Not all of those are wired, which may fall into that category. However, there is access to technology at those sites via phone modems that each site has, whether it be a private school or a day care, or even some of our charter schools has access into our main system based on the technology we've provided, so even if they're that wired on our physical infrastructure, they do have phone-up access.

Councilwoman Miller

Okay, I'm not real technical.

Councilwoman Miller

So when you say "phone-up," it doesn't mean much to me.

Mr. Daniels

It's pretty much the same thing. It would have the same capabilities -- 159 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET Internet access, that type of thing. It's just not as quick as what the infrastructure --

Councilwoman Miller

So they can still access the Internet, then, whether it's wired or not.

Councilwoman Miller

Okay.

Dr. Farmbry

There are two other areas of technology that I think that we're interested in really making sure that we take advantage of, and that is, as we look at teacher shortages, the use of distance learning for some of our courses, and also technology as it facilitates management for teachers, the use of computerized records and so forth so that the teacher can be more freed up to teach with their management system done via technology.

Councilwoman Miller

Yes. I'm glad you said that 'cause that was going to be my next question, about the use of computers to supplement in the areas where you don't have a lot of teachers, such as math. When we visited Houston, the CEP program, and one of the things that we saw there 160 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET was that all of those students there were basically -- their teaching was supplemented on the computer. So I was just wondering if Philadelphia was moving in that area also, particularly for math. I know that math teachers and science teachers are hard to find. I'll stop and call on some other Councilperson in just a minute.

Councilwoman Miller

Councilman Kenney.

Councilman Rizzo

Madam Chair, I'm next.

Councilwoman Miller

Oh, this is my first time using this. Please allow for errors. SERGEANT-AT-ARMS; Councilman's Rizzo's next.

Councilwoman Miller

Okay, Councilman Rizzo.

Councilman Rizzo

Thank you, Madam Chair. Talking about technology, we have to get it down pat here too. I'd like to talk about a program and 161 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET many of the people watching and you're real aware that this hearing is being televised today. And I just received a call as a reminder from a constituent watching, asking about the Parent Cooperative Nursery program. As you're all aware at that table, there's some controversy associated with that program, a fee structure that you're talking about establishing. So could you discuss the program, the Parent Cooperative Nursery, the controversies associated with that, and how you plan to resolve the fee structure issue, please.

Dr. Farmbry

Yes. We are actually examining the whole Parent Cooperative Nursery issue in the context of early childhood in general in the District.

Councilman Rizzo

Could you please describe exactly what the program is.

Dr. Farmbry

Okay, yes. The Parent Cooperative Nursery program is a one-year program serving four-year-old children. It is a program where parents volunteer for part of the day. As part of the agreement for their participating, that volunteering is to help to provide parents 162 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET with additional support in terms of instruction for children. The Board of Education is currently reviewing a fee for September, which will be determined by March 12th. The history of it is, last year, the District attempted to require a flat fee for PCN users and later a sliding-fee scale. But, you know, this was not to the parents' liking, so they contacted various elected officials. City Council then sent a letter to the Board of Education on behalf of the parents. And in the fall of this year, we suspended the fee for this year, with the understanding the Board of Ed would review and appropriate a fee for next year. And we have been meeting and planning. There was a meeting with parents recently to get their input regarding a fee, and it is the Board's expectation on March 12th to have some determination.

Councilman Rizzo

So on March the 12th, we will know the fee structure as -- what is the -- what's the dialogue going on with the -- with the community, the parents that use the 163 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET program? Are they a part of the -- are they a part of this process?

Dr. Farmbry

Yes, they are.

Councilman Rizzo

Could you describe the process, please.

Dr. Farmbry

Okay, yes. The parents were issued a survey and a representative group of parents met last week to give their input regarding what should be the scale, what should be the fee. We have taken the input that we received from then and we're reviewing it in the attempts of having a determination by March 12th.

Councilman Rizzo

So March 12th is just a few days away.

Dr. Farmbry

Yes, correct.

Councilman Rizzo

So I'll take advantage of having the President of the Board here. Could you comment on what you're planning to do here? So I think a lot of folks would like to hear exactly where this program is going and what they can expect to pay.

Mr. Ramos

Yeah, Councilman, I think that where we are as of right now, there has been this process -- maybe I ought to step back. There 164 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET was a board resolution that had a few pieces to it. One piece said that the sliding-fee scale that the School District had tried to impose last year would be suspended until this year, that was part one of the resolution. Another part said that the School District would work with stakeholders in the City to take a broader look at early childhood services generally. And what we've done is, one, we've been looking at options for what a fee scale would look like; and, two, starting a process that is going on in the City generally, looking at early childhood. I think it's a Carnegie grant that's funding the City and the District, and I think United Way is leading the effort and looking at early childhood generally. Specifically for PCN, the guidance that the Board has been giving the staff is that we want -- it is a different approach than last year. We said we would do a sliding scale and -- but things that had been overlooked before that we'd learned from really community and parent input were that we had to take into account the length of the school day. We had really last year keyed 165 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET the scale to the other program called Comprehensive Day Care, which is a program targeted at -- that we have to have a certain income to be eligible for and that -- where everybody -- where parents pay. So one of the things that we asked this year was, take into account the differences in the length of day 'cause PCN is, I believe, a shorter day; take into account, as parents told us, that they do contribute $25 a month for food, snacks, and supplies; and take into account that parents do staff the PCN. Now, that's not to say that parents don't volunteer over at CBC, but in PCN, it's a -- part of the program assumes that parents are going to be there. So value those things and come to us with a reasonable scale. What was reported to me from staff, after meeting with the parents, was that the feedback that they received was that there was some apprehension about a sliding-fee scale instead, if it would require income verification, and that -- and thus, our folks ended up recommending -- are in the process of recommending 'cause the Board doesn't have a recommendation in 166 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET front of it yet, I believe, a flat fee instead of a sliding scale that would avoid having to probe people's income. It would also -- so in a situation like that, I would expect that if the -- if someone's income was below, you know, a certain level, that they probably -- the proposal would probably be that you not charge the way you wouldn't charge in the other programs. But this is all -- right now, this is not the -- my understanding is that the staff and some folks who were having to look at this for us on the outside of the School District were still putting together the final touches in that proposal, and I expect the Board will have it in the next couple of days.

Councilman Rizzo

So, again, there will be a --

Mr. Ramos

But that's the approach that's being taken.

Councilman Rizzo

That the next Board meeting, which is the --

Mr. Ramos

Monday, the 12th.

Councilman Rizzo

Monday the 12th, 167 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET that there will be a decision on this issue --

Mr. Ramos

And it will -- it will take into account those things.

Councilman Rizzo

Wonderful.

Mr. Ramos

And we've also asked in the process to look at similar programs around the City to find out whether -- where -- you know, to make sure that we're not providing -- that we're pricing people out of the market.

Councilman Rizzo

Thank you. Thank you, Mr. President. Thank you, Madam Chair.

Councilwoman Miller

Thank you, Councilman Rizzo. Councilman Kenney.

Councilman Kenney

Thank you, Madam Chair. Mr. Goldsmith, excuse me. Back to the $191 million projected deficit, and I know we've had some initial discussions about clusters, but there is an item that says "Central Service Department," and the item is almost it's almost $78 million. I think that -- I may be wrong -- that clusters are part of that Central Service 168 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET Department number. Can anyone tell me what -- how much the cluster office is, the offices are, as it 5 relates to that $78 million? 6

Mr. Goldsmith

Councilman, the amount 7 is $12 million. 8

Councilman Kenney

Okay. Also, just 9 for information, just for clarification sake, on 10 the handout that says -- on , it says, 11 FY 2001 budget expenditures for school-based 12 programs, there is a item at the bottom that says 13 "All Other," $12,900,000. Is there a -- I'm 14 sorry, 12,000, $12,000. I'm sorry, $12 million. 15 What is that? 16

Ms. Chatzkel

It's a composite of a 17 lot of smaller items, including, to some degree, 18 books, supplies -- things, which in the aggregate 19 total that, but weren't large enough to equal even 20 $1.2 million, which is where we stopped with the 21 breakdown. 22

Councilman Kenney

So each individual item in there represents less than $1.2 million.

Ms. Chatzkel

Yes, yes.

Councilman Kenney

Okay. What 169 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET analysis is going on now, or should be going on, relative to the discussion on the elimination potentially of the cluster administration offices and the expenses related to cluster administration in an effort to trim this $191 million hole?

Mr. Goldsmith

There are, you know, conversations that Dr. Farmbry and I have had, certain analysis that we're doing through the budget process. Again, I think it's establishing some basic concepts, and one of the concepts is to recognize the importance of the classroom in the school and try to get as many people as possible back into the schools and the classroom where we, you know, desperately need the help. So we're looking at a bunch of different variations. It may not necessarily be the elimination of clusters, maybe fewer clusters or certainly fewer people in the clusters. And we're trying to really figure out, you know, what's the best way. Again, I think the key principles are -- is to get people teaching, you know, hands-on teaching and learning, and what the best way to do that and, you know, who's got to be at central 170 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET headquarters, who's got to be at clusters, and who should be at schools. And it's really trying to figure all of that out. And it's also keeping, you know, the feeder pattern concept, which, you know, we think there's some sense to, but whether it's, you know, or fewer, that's what we have to figure out. 9

Councilman Kenney

When do you expect 10 that analysis to be completed? 11

Mr. Goldsmith

Well, you know, I'm -- 12

Councilman Kenney

Excuse me, I don't 13 mean to interrupt, but should it not have been 14 part of the last six months of consideration 15 relative to this upcoming budget process? 16

Mr. Goldsmith

Well, Councilman, I've 17 only been here four months, so -- 18

Councilman Kenney

Four months, I'm 19 sorry. 20

Mr. Goldsmith

So, you know, I think 21 obviously, a lot of thought has been given to it, 22 but clearly, it's something that we got to resolve between now and the final budget.

Councilman Kenney

When do you think that that would be done without -- 171 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Mr. Goldsmith

Well, I will hope within the next 30 to 45 days.

Councilman Kenney

Okay. In your testimony, you indicate in some areas -- and you have to understand our historical context here.

Mr. Goldsmith

I understand.

Councilman Kenney

I mean, some of us -- I know I have been and I know other people here longer have been sitting here now for nine years and listening to the issues concerning the administration and the cuts in the administration. And we've gone from the full gamut of, you know, School District cars with drivers, all the way up to administration and administrative issues. But in your testimony, you mentioned issues like travel, overtime, telephone lines. I mean, when you, as an outsider, come in here and raise those issues to me, I get a little bit concerned because in the last administration, I kept hearing terms like "we've sawed the administrative cost to the bone" and "there's absolutely nothing that we could possibly left that cut on an administrative level," and you're talking about issues like travel, overtime, and 172 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET telephone lines. Now, I don't I find a problem with you talking about it. As a matter of fact, I find it refreshing. I just wonder how much accurate information we've been getting over the last number of years every that absolutely every possible administrative issue has been cut, and now we're talking about travel problems and overtime and things of that nature.

Mr. Ramos

Before Phil responds to that, I also want to point out that -- I mean -- that one of the -- you know, I think that underlies our decision to go to a CEO model at this in the history of the School District. I mean, one of -- you know, I suspect that and believe that what you get is the answers that people -- the best answers that people can give based on what they know and what they are able to do, what they know how to do. You bring out manager --

Councilman Kenney

(Inaudible.)

Mr. Ramos

And even after looking at it, looking at, you know, various reports. When you bring somebody from the outside who's got a 173 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET different perspective, whose background is in management and not education, you get the benefit of a different -- of a fresh look and a different perspective. And I'm hoping that -- if we don't do that, then there's no purpose in going to the CEO model.

Councilman Kenney

But understand from my perspective, at least from my perspective, speaking for myself, I thought we did this already, I thought this was all done. And if I took people at their word on the last few budgets, there was nothing left to cut, it was all done already. And that situation does create a bit of skepticism, frankly, at least on my part, and I don't know, you know, if any other members feel the same way, but, I mean, we're talking about cutting travel expenses, I mean -- let me get for the record, the automobile drivers, that that's gone, right? We're not having people driving people around anymore, right?.

Mr. Goldsmith

For the most part, yes.

Councilman Kenney

For the most part, yes.

Mr. Goldsmith

Yeah. I mean, we do 174 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET have drivers, yes.

Councilman Kenney

And what do they drive? Are they driving trucks, are they driving cars? What are they driving? I mean, we're not talking about the bad old days of chauffeur-driven City cars? They're all gone, right?

Mr. Ramos

The days of Town cars with chauffeurs for each Town car have been long gone.

Councilman Kenney

Do we have anybody riding executive cars?

Mr. Ramos

One of the things that we did in the last year or so was to, even though we ended up with a new board putting in enormous hours as volunteers and going to and from jobs, we've done it with about half as many drivers, with cars that hadn't been bought probably in five, six years. And to the extent, you know, that there was any purchase in the last five, six or seven years, I think it's been Tauruses, so there's been a real effort at it, recognizing that you still have -- you know, while we're on the Parkway and until we move to someplace else --

Councilman Kenney

That's another issue. 175 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Mr. Ramos

Until we move to someplace else, I mean, we are trying to get the most out of the people we have.

Mr. Goldsmith

Sir, let me say that in my only contract, I explicitly removed any right or, you know --

Councilman Kenney

Entitlement.

Mr. Goldsmith

-- for a car and chauffeur.

Councilman Kenney

Well, I was asking -- I was only throwing that out there 'cause I thought that was a thing that was long gone, and now you're telling me that it's just about long gone.

Mr. Ramos

Well, we said it's been reduced a lot certainly from, you know, what it's been, and we've been trying to be driven by practical concerns. I mean, this is a -- you know, this isn't a status or glamor gig.

Councilman Kenney

No, I'm not suggesting it, but I do think people should -- if they have a car should drive it themselves. What is tis issue of travel, overtime, telephone lines? I mean, it seems -- 176 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Mr. Goldsmith

Well, I think that's a function of a number of things. Number one, I can't speak to the past, and I really think my job is to --

Councilman Kenney

No, I'm glad you're speaking to the future.

Mr. Goldsmith

Yeah.

Councilman Kenney

'Cause I think this is maybe one of the first times we're getting a business at this district generally.

Mr. Goldsmith

It's to speak to the present and the future. And I'm pretty cheap, I think my wife and children will tell you, and probably some members of the School District will tell you right now. And, you know, I just believe we need, you know, controls in place so we're able to monitor. Overtime is a function of our business. And, you know, if there's a hurricane, you have overtime, and sometimes overtime is actually cheaper than going out and hiring new employees, but I do think we do have to watch what we're doing and make sure that it doesn't creep into people thinking it's an entitlement. So I'm just 177 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET putting in what I refer to in my testimony as good, old-fashioned "blocking and tackling." The travel and overnight conferences is always a delicate issue. The Board looked at it a couple years ago and tightened up. I looked at it again and thought we should tighten up some more, primarily because we have a financial problem, but more importantly, I think it's important that the conferences that we go to and so forth really be directed to what our educational focus is. I mean, there's a lot of conferences that are good and valuable, but they're not really geared toward what our educational focus is, and I know Dr. Farmbry feels strongly about this, and we want to wrap our arms around it a little bit more. And that's one of the reasons we've done that. The phone lines is, frankly, you know, to me, it's a simple thing. It costs no one a job, it costs no one anything, but why have a phone line when we don't need it.

Councilman Kenney

Frankly, I'm quite glad you're bringing these issues up because over the last four months -- and I'm sorry I put you in there for six, but over the last four months, 178 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET these seem to be things that haven't been looked at in the last eight and a half years, at least not since I've been on Council.

Mr. Goldsmith

Let me say, I've never -- and I've been in a lot of organizations 'cause I jump around, I guess, a lot, but I've yet to be in an organization where I do not believe that you cannot improve the effectiveness and efficiency. There's no organization around, and I think good organizations are continually looking at how to improve. So even if did everything perfect for the past years, I would still come in and say, 14 what can we do better to improve it? 15

Councilman Kenney

Well, you weren't 16 here for the past nine, and it's been a 17 frustrating experience to have past 18 superintendents, past testimony here, being told 19 -- telling us that we just can't afford to do -- 20 everything's been done that can be done. "The sound you hear is saw against bone" is what one of the -- to paraphrase a prior superintendent. But I'm happy you're here and looking at this in a businesslike way, because when we're being asked to pony up the additional 20, 179 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET $25 million plus the $15 million grant in a General Fund balance that's diminishing quickly, an issue of travel and overtime and telephone lines and automobiles and drivers are still on the table, it concerns me.

Mr. Goldsmith

Thank you.

Councilman Kenney

I'm done?

Council President Verna

Your time's up. Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilman Ortiz.

Councilman Ortiz

I cede to Councilman Cohen who has not had a turn yet.

Council President Verna

You're yielding to the Councilman?

Councilman Ortiz

He has not had one turn yet today, so. . .

Councilwoman Verna

Okay. He was supposed to be next, but I think he walked out of the room.

Councilman Ortiz

Right.

Councilman Cohen

Looking at things from a business point of view, I just want to express my opinion that I think that the ability of School Board members to travel freely with 180 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET cars, if it's more efficient to have a driver, I favor that. I'm not interested in seeing the travel expenses cut to the bone so that Board members who don't get paid a salary can't even get around to schools. I believe going to conferences is not a frill, not a waste of time. Some may be, but we leave it to the judgment of the CEO. I think it's important that our teachers be up to date, that the administrators be up to date and be skilled. So I'm just suggesting we all want a businesslike approach, we don't like conventions that are held for social reasons and not for business reasons, but if they're held for business reasons, I hope the School Board encourages attendance at them. And with respect to getting around, I believe there ought to be cars available. There are to Councilmembers because we need them in our work. We hope they're not being used for other purposes, but we trust that the CEO will adopt whatever policies are necessary. But I don't see any advantage, and I see a lot of harm, if circumstances are set up so 181 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET that people are not able to do their job effectively. I hope despite the questions that will come in a moment or two, that the Board members are able to do what they conceive as their work effectively. But I would like to -- I'm just stating my opinion because there was another opinion and --

Council President Verna

Councilman Cohen, there's a point of information. Councilman Kenney?

Councilman Kenney

I'm sorry. I would like to make a request based on that comment as a point of information -- I need a microphone. Considering that comment, Councilman, I would respectfully request that the Chair be provided with the last two years worth of travel information relative to conferences or any type of locations where people have had to travel on the School District budget, what the purpose of it is, how many people went, how much it cost, and what was accomplished. And I appreciate Councilman Cohen yielding. Thank you. 182 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Council President Verna

Thank you, Councilman.

Councilman Cohen

Fine. I was concerned earlier by questions that indicated that parental involvement was not considered in evaluating a school's performance. I remember vividly the tremendous work done by Marcus Foster in encouraging parental involvement at Simon Gratz High School, who was here in Philadelphia before he made the mistake of going out to the West Coast, with tragic consequences later. But he just did a tremendous job in rebuilding the image of Simon Gratz High School and rebuilding the substance of it so that it became a very valued school, maybe near the top in the City, as a result of his determination of getting parents involved in the schools. He used to go out with teachers sometimes, visiting the homes of people, to get parents involved. It seems to me that parental involvement is extraordinarily important if we're to raise the level of performance in the schools, and I wonder, is there any legal reason why that 183 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET cannot be considered in the performance of schools?

Mr. Ramos

Well, I think Dr. Farmbry said earlier, and I'll ask her to clarify it 'cause I'm not sure I know that it's a factor in the evaluation of principals. Is that right?

Dr. Farmbry

Yes, it's a factor in the evaluation of principals, and principals do receive merit pay, so to speak, based on an evaluation. And parental community engagement is one component; however, parental involvement is not a part of school's overall performance index, which is the ultimate measure of success for a school, because what goes into that are test scores, staff attendance, student attendance, and persistence to graduation.

Councilman Cohen

Well, why would it not also be considered as a part of the evaluation of the school itself? Why is it limited to an evaluation of the principal?

Dr. Farmbry

I think initially, it was just a the question of, you know, how many measures are you going to put on the scale, and I think the underlying assumption is that, normally, 184 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET if there's increased parent participation, you do see other measures improve accordingly, such as student attendance, such as test scores. So I think the assumption was that, you know, if you have high scores in some areas, then the assumption could be that you have active parental engagement. And that's why we really are pushing citywide for all schools to have a school council, which is the newest vein for parental engage. You know, there's always been the home and school associations, but school councils present a different level of engagement 'cause it is more around school governance and how the school's going to operate and what the discipline procedures will be and so forth.

Councilman Cohen

I think the great thing that attracts most people to charter schools and often to private schools is the school official encouragement of parental involvement, and I'm not going to belabor longer, but it seems to me that it ought to be a factor in considering the whole school's performance. I'm not objecting to it being 185 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET considered with respect to the principal, but I think in addition, it ought to be a factor, 'cause I think maybe it's one of the most important factors that could be involved in a potential turnaround to the school system in the direction we all want it to go in Philadelphia. Tell me -- this is probably directed to the chairman of the board -- what has been the effect of the amendment which changed the nature of the School Board? How has it affected the School Board's operation? How do you see your functioning before and after? Is there any change, is there any impact? And if so, what is it?

Mr. Ramos

Well, I think that -- I mean, there -- there is probably an impact in a couple of different levels. For starters, I mean, it is clear from the very nature of the charter change and the new relationship that this is, you know -- well, let me back up. Under the previous -- before the Charter change, as Councilman Cohen knows, the board members served staggered terms that were six years long, so that at any given time, you had the 186 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET appointee of multiple mayors as well as -- and represented on the Board as well as what other interests were being balanced by the mayor at the point that the Mayor appointed any one individual. So you had -- you know, we are not an elected body, and we were appointed by sometimes mayors that were long-gone. And with the Charter change, the accountability, if you will, the political accountability to the electorate ends up with the Mayor and all of the Board members serving at the pleasure of the Mayor. And so I think to that extent, the Board does feel that -- that -- a responsibility to act as a team, to act cohesively. The Mayor had an opportunity to pick a team that he thought would do that, you know, that would bring a range of interests but who would all stay on the same team trying to get to the same place. And I do think that that's happened. This board -- I mean, you know, we're nine for nine in terms of the amount of work and the dedication of each of the Board members. We've been -- this -- just in the last -- I -- I guess this board was -- is today the 6th? 187 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Dr. Farmbry

I think this board was appointed a year ago -- was sworn in a year ago today, sworn in on the 3rd. And to think what has happened in that year, and I think a lot of that wouldn't have happened as effectively if we weren't a cohesive group that solved -- that, by definition, was constructed as a team, as opposed to a representation of factions, and I mean factions in a political science sense, you know, not in any other. So I think it's been -- I think it's -- it's enabled us in this extraordinary year to perhaps get a lot more done than we could have if we -- if we were under a more factionalized body. In the long term, you know in the long term, I think, you know, the -- you know, we have to continue to make sure that there is a balance between politics and the legitimate role of the Board, and this board is very appreciative that we've been allowed to function as a school board and to have the -- while getting the political support necessary from outside, from this body, from the Mayor's Office and other places, to enable us to serve in our roles. 188 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Councilman Cohen

Let me put it a little more directly. Before the Board -- before the change, the Board was seen as an independent board, responsible largely to the community. The community felt it was talking to a board that had power to act one way or the other on requests, or to modify them. Now, is there any change in the sense that the Board's powers are limited to those powers granted to it by the Mayor, a limitation which did not exist before?

Mr. Ramos

The Board's powers are the same. I think what's difference is that -- you know, as a non-elected body, I don't think we were accountable to the community. We were accountable to -- you know, except what I call "the Thriftway factor" or "the Acme factor," where you're, you know -- and that's still true. When you go to the supermarket and you deal with your peers, there's always -- you always get a lot of feedback. But under the previous system, you weren't accountable to anybody. You could -- and in fact, I would say that what the public, you know, sometimes -- you know, that the public now 189 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET at least knows that there is one person that's taken responsibility for the School Board and its members. And at any given time, I think it would have been hard to calculate how many different factions were being represented on the Board. Now there's one, with a range of views and an opportunity to focus on education while the politics is done outside the District.

Councilman Cohen

Why would it not be more effective, say, for a community group that had questions about the education system in Philadelphia, why wouldn't it be more appropriate for them to talk to the person who really makes the decisions rather than to talk to a body which is subordinate and which has to transmit a message, message that can be most effectively transmitted by the people, you know, who are sending the message?

Mr. Ramos

Well, I think because people continue appreciate that the Board is functioning as the School Board. It's not trying to be anything else and not being asked to be anything less or be anything more, so that the, 190 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET you know, educational policy and the regular oversight of the District is over at the Board. Now, it's true that on the broad issues such as funding, such as general direction, that the Mayor has a lot more direct power than the Mayor had before, but I would say that the incumbent mayor has always had at least that level of influence, if not that direct power, which the Charter gave to this mayor.

Councilman Cohen

But I wonder about the budget, for example. Before we in City Council said we really have no power to do anything about a budget, the Mayor has no power, the School Board presents a budget based upon presumably its best adjustment, but we don't have the power, neither the Mayor, nor the Council. Now the budget is presented to us, it's in effect the Mayor's budget, because I assume -- tell me if I'm right or wrong -- that before the School Board adopted its budget, there had to have been approval by the Mayor.

Mr. Ramos

Well, this is the first year where -- you know, our budgeted process goes through May 31st, and generally on educational 191 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET issues -- educational discussions in general, the Board is making policy. We are in an extraordinary time financially, I mean, just to pick on the budget situation specifically, where unless at the end of the day, the City Council, the Mayor, the General Assembly, the Governor, and the School District are on the same page, you know, we're not going to be able to get beyond this year in any way. So I think it's more that, you know, part of what you're alluding to is really also a function of where we are in the School District's history. I mean, at this fiscal moment of fiscal crisis where, I think, you know, we're all, including City Council, in this, because the bottom line is that the basic needs of the students being served by the District exceed what we're capable of providing with the revenue sources that we have right now.

Councilman Cohen

These questions that I've raised will continue to concern me. I'm not trying to develop them beyond this, but these are questions which I think many people throughout our communities are considering and debating, and at 192 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET some point, we would like to know whether or not the Board is seen as the same strong advocate for education as it had been in the past and whether communities see it in that light. I'd like to know, for example, that at the end of about another year or so, have community groups come as frequently as they have before? have they come to the Board looking for assistance? And how have they felt when they left; have they felt that the Board has been as responsive as in the past? In the past, many groups felt the Board was responsive even if it rejected the proposals because the Board listened, there was a freedom of discussion. So this is going to be a continuing interest.

Mr. Ramos

I think one early example or test of that, and Councilwoman Blackwell could probably talk to it more, was the enormous number of community groups that were involved in the discussion around the Penn Assisted School. We literally had meetings in the School District, and Councilwoman Miller, I know, is aware of this too, where probably 400 people attended -- I don't know 193 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET if that's an exaggeration, but hundreds of people in the School Board room, all with a different opinion. And we -- and I think what people are finding is that we do listen, that we are being respectful, and that we're all trying to -- you know, we're not pretending to have all of the answers or try to preach to people. We're trying to listen and learn as we go along.

Councilman Cohen

Do you see yourself as a board as developing educational policy?

Mr. Ramos

Yes, and in trying to -- and a partner with the City and the State around how to deal with the bigger structural problems, which we've -- you know, and some people may think that we've been going along with our head in the sand about the big picture financially, and --

Councilman Cohen

Well, I think -- aren't there two problems? Isn't there a problem of educational policy and then separately a question of fiscal policy?

Mr. Ramos

Yes. And they have to inform each other.

Councilman Cohen

And isn't it the 194 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET responsibility of the Board, without consideration of fiscal policy, first to discuss educational policy and then try to work with groups to develop an educational policy that is sound, and seek to find ways to support that fiscally?

Mr. Ramos

I think that's right. I mean, we have to set out where we think we can responsibly go and then engage in a discussion about how to get there. If all we do is talk about where we want to go, whether you're a school district or a health system, that can lead you down a very tough road, because the reality is, at the end of the day, you have to be able to implement your education policy.

Councilman Cohen

Well, there might be some argument that could be made on that because the School Board can get so immersed in the fiscal problems that it does what I see the School Board doing today, and that is abdicating in the field of educational policy and being concerned almost solely with fiscal policy. For example, for example, it would seem to me that everybody would be in general agreement 195 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET that the heavy drain of people leaving the City for -- the major reason for that beyond all other reasons is that basically, the middle class, the working families have decided, because they're younger, you know, their children are growing up, they're looking for a school system that they feel is preparing their children for the future maybe somewhat better than the kind of preparation they themselves got. We've talked about that and we all agree, but all we do is fritter around the edges, always worrying about, Well, this costs too much and we can't do it and maybe it's good to cut class size, but we can't afford to, to fight for all-day kindergarten for all of our youngsters, to fight for pre-kindergarten training. All has come very slowly. And we keep complaining about people leaving the City. Sure there are issues of wage tax, there are issues of crime, there are other issues, but the fundamental overriding issue is that if we had a school system -- and I think everybody would agree that if we had a school system that parents fought to get their kids into, that the population drain would be the problem in 196 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET the suburbs because people would flock to our schools. When we think that for civic pride we need a stadium, a question of a billion and a half is nothing. But when we talk about the schools, we pinch pennies every inch of the way. And I don't see the Board doing what I think an educational board would do, and that is the lead the fight for what's really needed for the school system, and then leaving -- sure, the Board will play a role in the fiscal policy too, but leading the charge. I think, for example, we ought to have the issuance of a bond (indiscernible) to the bonds that we're talking about for the stadium at the same cost for the school system. Think of what told be if we had $500 million more for your current operating budget, $500 million more just in the way of capital improvements, and maybe an extra $300 million -- I'm trying to equate the cost of the stadiums and the school system -- and 300 million for contingency funds if you needed more for operating or more for capital. And why -- it seems to me the only on 197 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET way we'll ever get that commitment is if the School Board as an educational policy board sounds the clarion call, saying, We've got to have smaller class sizes, we've got to have other things, like there's some schools that have almost no ability for the youngsters to play sports. At the Jenks School up in -- I guess it's in Chestnut Hill, they have cement floors, so it's very difficult for them to even play basketball there. They have no specific reasons why anyone would want to send a child to school there. Why doesn't your board develop policies that get people excited about the notion of what the schools can be? And that's the reason I raise all of these questions, 'cause I think you have a great opportunity.

Mr. Ramos

You know, we've gone -- I think that our educators --

Councilman Cohen

And I'd say stop worrying so much about the money and include the President of the United States because the federal commitment, as I noticed in your preparation, I think, is almost less than a percent contribution to the Philadelphia school system. 198 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Mr. Ramos

Well, I'd like -- I mean, I believe that our educators need to be given the opportunity and the support to do their jobs to educate our kids. I think that our deficit isn't one of good ideas or good educational policies. Our problem is that you need to be able to channel enough resources so that that can get done. And as a parent in the Philadelphia public schools, I do care about whether school opens and whether the teacher is able to provide the services. I do care more than just about the ideological, and I do care about what actually ends up happening and how we're able to implement. And it would be, you know, at least my view of the Board, and it is that -- you know, part of what we're fighting for is to provide the educators the support and cover to let them do their jobs and let the rest of us do the battle to provide the support and the resources that they need to do that job. But I think that, you know, one -- we -- we know and we've certainly had repeated lessons that to have the plan and the right idea is not enough if you can't get it implemented, if 199 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET you can't make it real in the classroom.

Councilman Cohen

But there's only one thing, it seems to me, a board of education can do in that situation, and that is to make the goals very clear to the public. Beyond that, I think the City Council has a major responsibility. I think the Mayor, the Governor, you know, and the President -- the President talks and preaches about education, yet the federal contribution in terms of dollars is minuscule. Now, nobody wants the federal government to take over control of the school system, but they don't have to take over control because they give the money, but they ought to be giving much more, maybe a thousand times more than they do give. They support other things at the state level and the city level. So I think the clarion call has to come from the School Board. And your policy work, I think, is much more important that your fiscal work. The fiscal work is the responsibility in Philadelphia, I believe, of the Mayor and the City Council. At the State level, it's obviously the General Assembly and the Governor. At the federal level, it's the President and the Congress. 200 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET But if you ignite the flames which indicate what has to be done so that Philadelphia can kind of be really revived as a place that parents want to live in so their kids can get to the schools in Philadelphia, I think you will have done a marvelous job, and I think you're going to create the kind of support base that will get us the funds. And so, I raise that issue with you. I hope you think about it because I think that's the role of a school board, to tell us why a public school system is not only necessary so that all kids get educated, but why it can't provide a superb education, because I believe in my own personal experience, all four of my children, my wife, myself, we all went through the public school system and I don't think I've done too badly. And so that's what I'm pleading with you to do, because I think you can get Philadelphia excited, but you can't get it excited if you're going to be worrying, as you have been so much, on the fiscal point. That is not your main responsibility; that's ours.

Council President Verna

Councilman 201 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET thank you.

Mr. Goldsmith

Councilman, just -- just as a matter of accuracy, just so our documents are understood, the federal contribution that you see that shows less than 1 percent is for operating funds; in fact, most of the federal contributions, not to say whether they're adequate or not but just so we understand for the record, that most of the federal funds are coming in through the categorical amount, and I think that's about 85 percent of our categorical funds, or $217 million, so I don't want to -- you know, I want to make sure that we're talking --

Councilman Cohen

But not for the overall general purposes.

Mr. Goldsmith

That's correct. (Unintelligible, parties talking over each other.)

Mr. Goldsmith

It's a supplement, such as Title I --

Councilman Cohen

I believe the federal government has the responsibility, and what the President is talking about is the whole 202 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET future of education for those who don't -- particularly for those who don't fall into the categorical areas.

Mr. Goldsmith

Right, I understand. Thank you.

Councilman Cohen

And that's the reason I feel -- and I think the City ought to take advantage of what he did the other night, having the Mayor of the City sitting next to the First Lady. That ought to be more than just a symbolical touch. He was attempting to indicate that he understands the problems of the cities and he thinks that --

Council President Verna

Councilman Cohen --

Councilman Cohen

The problem of the cities are national --

Council President Verna

Councilman Cohen, you're really way beyond your time. Would you please --

Councilman Cohen

But this was my first, and maybe only, opportunity to discuss the --

Council President Verna

You'll have 203 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET to wait for the second go-around, so can -- (Unintelligible, parties talking over each other.)

Councilman Cohen

. . . and I want some hundreds of millions of dollars to come from the federal government for this purpose.

Council President Verna

All right. Councilman, we'll recognize you on the next go-around. Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilwoman Tasco, who has not been given the opportunity to be recognized.

Councilwoman Tasco

Thank you very much. I missed my turn this morning, and I'll try not to ask any questions that have been asked. And if they have been asked, just let me know and I'll read the record. But I want to go back to the -- where is the young lady that was sitting here?

Dr. Farmbry

She'll be right back.

Councilwoman Tasco

I want to go back to her testimony on the financial update. (Miss Chatzkel returns to witness 204 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET table.)

Councilwoman Tasco

On and 9, you talk about the per-pupil basic educational subsidy formula. On , could you explain those charts to me? I mean, what do they mean? Particularly the change in State in total-revenue- per-student charge. Does that mean that the State has increased the support for these other towns and not necessarily for Philadelphia? And if so, what was that based on?

Ms. Chatzkel

Okay, the chart on the bottom of speaks to the State revenue per student.

Councilwoman Tasco

Yes.

Ms. Chatzkel

And what it does show, and I think you read it correctly, is that over this five-year span that's being measured, from 1993 to 1998, the revenues per student grew for Philadelphia 12.36 percent. And yes, it's true that some are some of these other districts, the revenues per student over that same period grew more quickly.

Councilwoman Tasco

Was that because of the -- what does revenue -- define "revenue." 205 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Ms. Chatzkel

In -- for this --

Councilwoman Tasco

Would this be revenue from the State or local revenue or what?

Ms. Chatzkel

This bottom chart speaks to -- and on the right-hand side, which is what we're looking at, it speaks to revenue from the State.

Councilwoman Tasco

So what will cause the Chester Upland revenue to be high -- as high as it is compared to Philadelphia?

Ms. Chatzkel

I don't know the composition of Chester Upland revenues. I know we get 60 percent of our revenues from the State. And for Chester Upland, I would imagine that that growth is due largely to the basic -- the ESBE formula that we talked about. That's a key driver of State revenues, if you're looking on the right-hand side of that chart.

Councilwoman Tasco

Right. I don't know anything about that, so I don't know what you're talking about.

Ms. Chatzkel

I don't know, I can't speak to it.

Ms. Kahn

Yeah, I mean, some of the 206 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET factors in the formula. So, for example, you know, because our population, our student population, had been increasing than our revenues per student, you know, relatively have been declining. In other cases, again, because of the formula change, it hadn't been so sensitive to the enrollment. So in some ways, those districts that declined in enrollment might have actually done better on the revenues per student. The other thing is, there are whole bunch of factors within the formula that just haven't worked to our favor. I think some of the local effort in the increase was there, you know, being one of those factors as well.

Ms. Chatzkel

There are lots of components to State revenues. One of the factors that is fairly sensitive is when poverty increases. Again, I don't know Chester Upland, but my guess is, over that five-year period, their poverty increased. There are other kinds of State revenues. There are revenues for special education and debt service. Any of those could have driven the revenues to go up as well. 207 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET This is all State revenues.

Councilwoman Tasco

Okay. On , the last bullet point. Subsequent to the adoption of the Fiscal Year 2001 budget, an ordinance was introduced in City Council to provide an additional $25 million grant. Is that a one-time grant? Or do we give it to you every year?

Ms. Chatzkel

We've assumed for next year -- and this last page in project deficit assumes a grant of $15 million from the City.

Councilwoman Tasco

So that grant becomes an entitlement?

Ms. Chatzkel

Well, the $15 million grant has been an annual grant.

Councilwoman Tasco

Okay. Let me see. . .

Ms. Kahn

Councilwoman, that 19 million makes reference to, as it says, after the 20 adoption of the budget. That was the 25 million 21 that grew out of the settling of the PFT contract, 22 and those ordinances, as it says, had been 23 introduced, but there has not yet been a public 24 hearing on those, and we're hoping that can follow 25 soon after this process. 208 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Councilwoman Tasco

And if we don't do -- if we don't grant the amount, what does that do to you? That increases your deficit?

Ms. Kahn

Well, our cash flows for this year are based on having that million in 7 addition to the previously committed by the 8 Administration 20 million, which has been budgeted 9 in the School District's budget. So both of 10 those, the 20 plus the 25. 11

Councilwoman Tasco

So you're looking 12 for $45 million from the City. 13

Ms. Kahn

Right, and the ordinances 14 had been introduced for that. 15

Councilwoman Tasco

Okay. On on the charter schools -- this may have been asked 17 -- what does the State contribute in terms of the 18 cost to the charter schools? Do they give any 19 additional money for charter schools? 20

Ms. Chatzkel

There is very little. 21 There is about $800,000. That's a transition 22 fund, and that's to support school districts as 23 they take in non-public students into the charter 24 schools. 25 But, again, for that portion of our 209 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET population, our charter school population that comes from non-public schools, we spend about 4 million, we make about 25 million in payments. 5 And the offset in total, if we added everything, 6 is less than a million dollars. 7

Councilwoman Tasco

Mm-hmm. So at 8 some point, though, and that's just the beginning 9 of the charter school program, where you can 10 identify that they are non-public school students, 11 but at some point, you won't be able to identify 12 those students, right? Because the transfer out 13 from other schools will level off, and then you 14 will start getting 1st-, 2nd- or 3rd-graders going 15 right into charter schools, where they might have 16 gone to another private school or a parochial 17 school. 18

Ms. Chatzkel

The transitional funding 19 -- there's a pot available from the State. The 20 total statewide is a million dollars, and the 21 portion that the City of Philadelphia gets is 22 based on a presumption of the percentage of 23 non-public students that we would get in in that 24 year. 25

Councilwoman Tasco

Okay, and I 210 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET understand that. What I'm trying to say -- I'm not making myself clear -- is because this is a new program, the charter school program is new, so there are a certain number of students who are now trying to get into the charter schools.

Ms. Chatzkel

Mm-hmm.

Councilwoman Tasco

And at some point in time -- they're like maybe 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th 6th grade, going up. Now, in about three or four years, the transfer will stop because those young people will just come immediately into the charter school program without having to go to a parochial or private school and then transfer, and that transfer will level off.

Ms. Chatzkel

Mm-hmm.

Councilwoman Tasco

So what does that do to you? Do you still get that money?

Ms. Kahn

Yeah, I believe, Councilwoman, the transitional funding is only applicable to the students in their first year of charter school enrollment, those students who have not been previously in the host district's school system. So regardless of what age, you know, they would enter, that would be the case. 211 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET But because that is a fixed pot of money, what Rhonda is saying is that -- and Philadelphia's share is, I think, something right now like about $600,000 or something.

Ms. Chatzkel

It's 80 percent.

Ms. Kahn

It's 80 percent of the total. Even that makes it a fixed amount. So even, you know, if the number of students, for example, coming into charter schools from outside our system were to increase, the amount per student, again, that would be available for those students would be declining. And that money does need to be appropriated each year by the State legislature, and it was included in the Governor's budget but without an increase this year, so at that same statewide funding level.

Councilwoman Tasco

I know you all are trying to maintain a very nice placid and working relationship with the State, and I think that's important, but at what point do you make the challenge that the drain on your budget is, I mean, is to have a real impact on the School Board budget. I mean, there's a point that the State has to, if they want these charter schools, to 212 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET provide more money to the charter schools.

Ms. Kahn

I just think on the charter schools in particular, I mean, we have -- we are on record now with -- Philadelphia along with many other districts around the State are on record about a number of changes that we would expect to see in the charter school law; certainly, the finances being, you know, high on that list, but not the only changes. There are issues of accountability, you know, issues of governance regarding charter schools that we think that the law really needs to be improved along those lines. But the finances -- and this is, again, one of those areas of growing concern that Councilwoman Miller asked about. School districts across the Commonwealth, we are obviously the largest, we have two-thirds of the charter school population in the State, but everyone who's hosting charter schools is telling the same story, about the impact that it's having on both their operations as well as on their bank accounts.

Councilwoman Tasco

What -- and I'm sure this has been asked. You mentioned the issue of accountability. Are the charter schools held 213 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET to the same standards in terms of testing and other requirements of the School District the same as public schools? I mean, they are public schools, but are the standards the same? Does it have the same testing, I mean? And who monitors them? I mean, is that your role to do that? Just what happens?

Mr. Ramos

Let me try to answer that but also start off by stepping back a step because I think it's important -- we often talk about, you know, some of the flaws in the way that charter schools are funded and that the way -- and the way we are funded and our ability, and we often talk about the financial impact because we think there's a flaw in how the funding mechanism works for charters. I think that shouldn't distract from why, you know, why Philadelphia's probably, you know, one of the top two or three districts in the country, if not number one, either in terms of the number of charters or in total enrollment. I think we're pretty high up there. And one of the reasons is that we see it as an educational program. You know, there are several educational 214 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET programs that we're pursuing that in the sense, if it were just a financial decision, you wouldn't do, but we think that charters are affording the City an opportunity to try different things and to, in some cases, do something -- try some things that we would like to try faster, in some cases hopefully avoid making some of the same mistakes that we make in the district. So I think there's educational value there, and we have to remember that they are children from the City of Philadelphia in these schools and to the extent that, you know, and they're increasing the enrollment of public schools in Philadelphia, and what we should be focusing on is how do we support public education in Philadelphia, you know, and make sure that there enough resources to provide for all of them. The charter schools in terms of what rules do they have to follow, they're required to follow law, and there's -- you know, they're subject to the school code, but there are some exceptions made for charter schools. They also have to abide by the terms of the charter which they are granted, which is like a contract. 215 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET And it's my understanding, and someone may be able to correct me, that a -- that that charter has some specifications in it. Some of them duplicate the intent of the State law in terms of having -- having a certain level of certified teachers and things like that. But also, they agree to take the Stanford Achievement Test, which is the same tests we give, just so we have some comparison. The State requires that they take the PSSA in their charters. We also, through the performance index, also look at things like student and staff attendance and how much -- and measure progress. We don't try to judge it according -- you know, just as we've done with School District schools and not comparing one school to another, we like to compare schools to themselves in terms of terms of how much progress they make. So we've -- but on a day-to-day basis, their oversight from their own board of trustees, which, under State law, sit in the place of the Board of Education. It's like a board of education for each school. Each school is like another -- is an LEA. And the type of oversight 216 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET that we have for the School District schools, there's a board of trustees that are public officials, just like we are, that have responsibility for that particular school, and have responsibilities, presumably, for going beyond whatever it is you're required to do in setting policy for the performance of staff and for the performance of students.

Councilwoman Tasco

Have there been any studies done on the performance by students in the public schools as opposed to the public charter schools?

Mr. Ramos

I mean, I think it's too early to reach any big conclusions. I mean, we are still -- this is still -- the charter school movement is, you know, is maybe -- I would say it's a baby but maybe moving into adolescence here. So it's still -- you know, we've got over -- we've got many -- we've got more than 100 years, probably closer to 200 of School District history and we've got 4 of charter school history. The -- I guess we have PSSA data, State test data for those grades that are tested, and we have SAT-9 data for those grades that are tested. 217 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET And we have a little more -- we have more detail for the first four charters, which were the ones that just came up for renewal. The -- you know, the overall -- if I recall the data correctly, you know, some schools are doing -- I mean, it's what you expect: some schools are doing better, some schools are doing worst, and most are probably doing around the same, but that's very preliminary. Among the ones we have the most years experience with are the four that just came up for renewal, and three of those four made progress on their student scores, and two of 'em did better, you know, did better than expected, better than their targets on student scores. When we looked at renewals, we also -- we not only compared charter school scores to citywide, but we also looked at the schools from which students were coming, and we kind of did a weighted average, you know, so that -- so you would not only compare it to the City but compared to the schools those students would have otherwise attended. And I think, you know, generally, we 218 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET judge from that first cohort. It's not a bad story. I mean, we've got two that did very well, one that made progress, and a forth one we're looking at the data. It seems that they've -- that they didn't go in the right direction, but we're having a hearing to review, you know, the data more carefully with -- in the end to consider whether that charter gets renewed or not.

Councilwoman Tasco

I have one final question, then I'm done. To Miss Chatzkel, on the last page of the financial update, you have a $10.5 million reduction in your retirement contribution. Does that -- does that leave your retirement fund unfunded?

Ms. Chatzkel

We participate in the public school employees retirement system, which is statewide, and the State sets the rates. The market, maybe up until recently, had done very, very well, which is why there's a reduction in rate.

Councilwoman Tasco

Okay. Thank you very much.

Ms. Chatzkel

Thank you. 219 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Council President Verna

Thank you, Councilwoman. The Chair recognizes Councilwoman Brown.

Councilwoman Brown

Thank you, Madam President. Councilwoman Marian Tasco spoke in detail to the charter school phenomena, which is, based on my limited experience, is one reason why there has been an explosion in mandated expenditures by the School District, and though I sit here without the benefit of seasoned experience like my colleagues Councilman Kenney and Councilman Cohen, one thing I am mindful of is that with your chart on , you mention five categories, and three of the five of these are mandated, which means they were put on the plate of the School District with no dollars to then help make full-day kindergarten real, meaning there was additional money that had to be spent by the School District. And then, let me see, there were an additional 15,000 students eight, nine years ago. Those were not line items, if you will, that the School District had to deal with, 220 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET and consequently, reality was very, very different. So I just need you to know that I'm mindful of that. And then to get to the more practical matter, which is to what is actually happening now, again, I want to talk about the safety and security notion. Enlighten me on the summit that is coming up, and where do School District police security activities intersect with the Philadelphia Police Department?

Mr. Goldsmith

What I'm calling "the Safe School Collaborative" is going to be a series of at least three meetings. The first meeting is going to be what I call "School District Family."

Councilwoman Brown

School District. . .?

Mr. Goldsmith

Family.

Councilwoman Brown

Family.

Mr. Goldsmith

And that means representatives of the PFT, representatives of the principals union, our own administrators, representatives of the Home and School Council, representatives of our board, and also some students representatives that sit on our board. 221 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET And the reason for keeping the first one, which is what I call "School District Family," is because I think that if we're going to really work at this problem, we've got to work at it together and be talking together about what the issues are and what's our common agenda. My goal, my dream, frankly, is that we have a common agenda that we work at. And it's not something that any one of us can do alone. I think we've got to do it together. So it's to sort of get us all in a room, come up with that common agenda, get the levels of trust up, understand what each other's perspective is, and go from there. At that meeting, I also hope to have the members of that meeting agree on and decide who we want to hear from other agencies and organizations. If it's just me sort of saying, This is who I think we should hear from, I think it's going to carry a lot less water than if we all sort of have input as to who we want to hear from. So out of that, I hope that we get a common agenda, we get some prioritizations on some of the issues that we want to work on, and also 222 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET hear from other organizations and agencies and groups that we want to find out what they're doing that works and enlist their support. So that's sort of the overall framework of those series of meetings, which are coming up. In terms of your question of how we work with the police, we have a very close relationship with the City of Philadelphia's Police Department. I meet -- have met with Commissioner Timoney several times. There are six district commanders under the supervision of Chief Inspector Frank Pryor. My staff and myself meet with them, we just had a meeting last week. We try to get a sense of what's going on out there, what the hot spots are, what do they see, what are they hearing, what do we hear, what are the things that we can be doing together. And that type of dialogue is constantly happening. So I think it's a good relationship. Obviously, we're responsible for what goes on in the schools. We call upon the police when there's something of a criminal nature, where we need their assistance, and I think it's overall, you know, it's a good relationship. 223 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Councilwoman Brown

It's working. Who do the NTAs report to?

Mr. Goldsmith

The NTAs that are in the schools report to the principals.

Councilwoman Brown

They report to principals.

Councilman Rizzo

Point of information, Madam Chair.

Council President Verna

The Chair recognizes Councilman Rizzo.

Councilman Rizzo

Thank you.

Councilwoman Brown

Point of information, yes.

Councilman Rizzo

Yes. Thank you. Could you go back to what Councilwoman Blondell Reynolds Brown was discussing. If I can recollect, the Mayor appointed Commissioner Timoney as the Secretary of Public Safety to oversee, I believe, the School District security and also -- also, I believe, SEPTA. What you just described didn't sound like someone that was overseeing the security at the School District. A few meetings with the Commissioner pointing out hot spots doesn't sound 224 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET like someone who has a title of Secretary of Public Safety, with the oversight of the School District.

Mr. Goldsmith

He has assigned Chief Inspector Pryor and six district commanders to work, you know, closely, you know, with the School District, and that we do on a regular basis, and they work with our security folks. Our people go down to the -- sit in on the --

Councilman Rizzo

COMPSTAT?

Mr. Goldsmith

-- COMPSTAT meetings. We share information and so forth.

Councilman Rizzo

But his title now is Director -- or Secretary of Public Safety. What does that mean to you?

Mr. Goldsmith

It means to me that he's got overall responsibility in the City, and I don't want to speak to his full job responsibilities, 'cause I frankly don't know, but the day-to-day management of our security force is a School District matter until that is changed. But a lot of the activities that go on go on outside the School District, they go on in the neighborhoods and so forth, and that's where 225 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET he has responsibility and works closely with us.

Councilman Rizzo

Does your Security Director report to Commissioner Timoney?

Mr. Goldsmith

No. 6

Councilman Rizzo

Well, then I'm really confused on why the Mayor appointed Police Commissioner Timoney as Secretary of Public Safety over the School District and --

Councilman Ortiz

Madam Chair, may I? May I say something on that?

Council President Verna

Point of order?

Council President Verna

There are questions that involve fiduciary responsibilities that the Board has that cannot transfer out to Timoney because of charter situations. So the -- I think the relationship between even SEPTA, the School Board, and the Police Department have to be performed in an informal basis because there are certain Charter considerations that cannot overlooked. Thank you.

Councilwoman Brown

I'll continue with my questioning, please, Madam President. 226 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET Boy. Thank you, Councilman Ortiz. (Laughter.)

Councilwoman Brown

Leadership in the schools, 'cause I ask those questions, and they're really leading to this core concern. Based on personal anecdotal experience, I have visited the schools over the past year, and one observation I've made is where you have a strong principal, there are a series of other positives, and you can pick that up without anything even being said, initially walking through the door, and then you can do the probing and the questioning and discover that attendance is up for both students and teachers, the success of students from academic standpoint is better, there's greater parent participation, there's less school violence, and on and on and on. So, of course, the issue that it raises for me is, procedurally, what does the school system do with regards to the recruitment and training of principals? Because where you have strong principals, you have students doing better.

Mr. Goldsmith

Let me just say one thing, and then I'll turn it over to Dr. Farmbry 227 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET because I think that your point is one that I share and I think it's important leadership in every organization, particularly a school, I think, is critical. I think one of the things that I've spent a lot of time on with Dr. Farmbry is meeting with our principals. As I indicated, we met with every principal probably -- I think it was in November. We just had another series of meetings with principals. We've done focus groups with them to understand what their needs are and so forth. One of the issues that we have, and I think it raises the whole leadership development issue of what you're talking about and I'll turn it over to Dr. Farmbry.

Councilwoman Brown

Yes.

Mr. Goldsmith

We basically have a young --

Councilwoman Brown

Force?

Mr. Goldsmith

Maybe "young" isn't the right word, but in tenure, a group of principals. The average principal's tenure, I think, is six and a half years. Two-thirds have been in their positions less than five years, and I think 228 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET twelve percent are in their first year of service as principals. So that imposes upon us, you know, many --

Councilwoman Brown

A series of challenges.

Mr. Goldsmith

-- major leadership development challenges, which, I know, are really at the heart of what we want to do educationally. So I'll turn it over to Dr. Farmbry.

Dr. Farmbry

Thank you. I am very interested in the whole area of principal leadership development, having been a principal and also just watching the growing numbers of people in the system who want to be principals, some for the very right reasons and some for reasons that are very questionable, and just making sure that people get a firm handle of what it really means to be a principal in this day and age, where the focus really is on instruction, should be on instruction, but a lot of other issues are there to deter your focus from instruction if you let it. I think it's very important that we as a district really look at making the right match 229 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET between the person and the needs of the site. As you are probably aware, we have a site selection process that does involve members of the community in picking a principal for a school, and then making sure that once the principal is identified, that they really do stay on top of the instructional needs of the school and really begin to galvanize the resources of the community to make school work.

Councilwoman Brown

So again to my question -- I appreciate that -- what happens with regards to training? Because there is a learning curve.

Councilwoman Brown

And while that learning curve is happening, you have teachers who may or may not be measuring up.

Councilwoman Brown

And consequently, where you don't have teachers measuring up, you have students who are not reaching their full potential.

Councilwoman Brown

What strategies 230 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET does the school system have in place, knowing that that reality is in our face? Separate from the teachers shortage, which is another phenomena that has to be reckoned with.

Dr. Farmbry

Yes. Initially principals go through a training period called "Lead," where they, in essence, get to do an apprenticeship principalship at two different sites. Then once they are appointed, in ongoing conversations with their cluster leader or whatever the organization is going to evolve into, there really is a real nurturing around what the developmental needs of that principal are. And then we as a district are putting together a program of ongoing principal leadership development, in concert with some of our local universities.

Councilwoman Brown

Okay.

Dr. Farmbry

And as you may be aware, Act 48, which now says that anyone with a professional certificate must acquire credits in a five-year period, we're making sure that we as district are going to be able to have rich offerings for our principals. 231 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Councilwoman Brown

Lead is a mentoring --

Dr. Farmbry

Lead -- yes. Once a principal passes both the written and the oral portion of the qualifying test to be a principal, they go into a program called "Lead," where they have two six-week internships at very different kinds of sites.

Councilwoman Brown

Okay.

Dr. Farmbry

So that they can understand that being a principal at this site demands a whole different set of skills than maybe being a principal at this site.

Councilwoman Brown

Absolutely. Two final questions. What standards are used to measure Principal A from Principal B? How do you determine who's excelling and who's not? What factors use to consider that? And then, finally, what penalties, what reprimands do you have in place to take care of principals who are not living up to the job?

Dr. Farmbry

Okay, principals are evaluated like any other category of employee. Currently, the cluster leader is their first line 232 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET of evaluation. Over the past -- this is really, I guess, the third year of implementation of the principal performance appraisal model that is based on non-domains.

Councilwoman Brown

You said this is the first year?

Dr. Farmbry

This is the third year.

Councilwoman Brown

Oh, okay.

Dr. Farmbry

We're going into the third year.

Councilwoman Brown

Okay.

Dr. Farmbry

They're a cycle. And principals will sit down, and in consultation with their cluster leader, identify the areas that they really do need to address in terms of their own personal needs relative to the job according to these nine domains. And then the principals are rated and they are given pay increments based on their final evaluation. Of course, there's always the need for some people to be counseled out of a position.

Councilwoman Brown

Mm-hmm.

Dr. Farmbry

And the need is always there for people to be aware of when that is 233 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET occurring and then to have the paperwork indeed substantiate the need for that person to be counseled out of that position.

Councilwoman Brown

Okay, then. I'll close by saying that I was invited to attend a Philadelphia Federation of Teachers workshop, where I heard -- you know, I was in the trenches and got a chance to hear from teachers who are living and breathing what it is like to have a strong principal. And their concerns were very compelling, and it really affirmed what I have picked up over the year in visiting schools myself, that where you have a strong principal, the school is receiving stars in so many other areas as well. So that's a signal that that portion of this management structure may require additional nurturing, and all of that comes with getting principals where they need to be.

Dr. Farmbry

Absolutely.

Mr. Goldsmith

Let me just say, if I may, about a month ago, Dr. Farmbry and I went out and toured a couple of schools with Ted Kirsch and Jerry Jordan, sort of like the odd couples doing the routine. But, you know, we really said we 234 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET wanted we wanted to see schools through their eyes. And I let them pick the schools and I didn't know what they would pick. I thought they would pick, you know, some of the, quote, the worst and so forth. And they picked, you know, two really good schools, you know, inner-city. And I said to 'em, you know, Why did you pick these schools? And they picked those schools because it was not only a strong principal but it was a strong principal with a good working relationship with the staff. That's my dream, that we have a partnership.

Councilwoman Brown

Yes.

Mr. Goldsmith

Because I can assure you of one thing: Unless we have a partnership, I don't care what size the deficit is, the educational deficit is going to continue. And so I think it's really important: strong relationship, good working relationships with teachers. And that's what I think we have to do.

Ms. Kahn

I would just add, Councilwoman, to follow that through is that as we 235 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET look at that, think about the reorganization of the cluster system, it's so important to be able, again, to bring home to the schools to what good principals and principals who need a little more help and teachers how to create those environments, and the School District organization should only exist in order to help strengthen that and to facilitate that. So that's the focus, and we have to keep looking down instead of up.

Councilwoman Brown

I can continue, but I'll do that which is correct, Madam President. I will honor the rules and put a comment here, with the understanding that there will be another round of questioning.

Council President Verna

Thank you so much. The Chair recognizes Councilwoman Blackwell.

Councilwoman Blackwell

Thank you, Madam President. I mentioned, I think, the truancy support center earlier. And, you know, we visited E.S Miller School recently. I think I mentioned 236 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET it this morning, but the day is so long, I just don't remember. And we have a new principal there and there's an excellent workforce at that school. And certainly, we are concerned that they don't lose out because of the CEP program 'cause, obviously, we need more than one facility to deal with our kids in trouble. And this was one of the sites that we suggested as maybe a place we can use for a truancy support center since you don't have a lot of students in their now and they are a discipline source. And we would certainly hope that the Board and the Administration would certainly realize that that's a good school there, we can do a good program and make sure that it stays. Okay, thank you. That's all. Thanks.

Councilwoman Miller

The Chair recognizes Councilman Kenney.

Councilman Kenney

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Councilman Kenney

Did you say Kenney or Ortiz?

Councilwoman Miller

Kenney and then Ortiz. 237 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET (Councilman Ortiz responds inaudibly off-mic.)

Councilman Kenney

Hold your horses. Thank you, Madam Chair. Last week, I think it was, there were two articles that appeared in the Philadelphia Inquirer. One was characterizing the Mayor's position on charter schools, according to the Mayor's comments, that he believed -- and it's a new position for him and I'm happy he has it -- that the charter schools are a major component, or should be a major component, in the retention of middle-class and working-class families in our city. Do you agree with that position? Anybody?

Mr. Ramos

I'll take a first crack at it. We've been saying, I guess, since -- really since before charter schools really got started that we thought that one of the -- in addition to helping the School District learn from the innovation and experience of other schools that the potential was to build constituency for 238 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET public education. I think you would agree, Councilman, that one of the challenges we face as we try to secure greater funding for public schools is that -- that, you know, we sometimes hear this data and I'm not sure where it got started, that only percent of Philadelphians have kids in public 9 schools and that -- and the charter schools 10 present an opportunity to expand that 11 constituency. So we want to -- we want to do that 12 and we want to, you know, continue to develop it 13 as part of the public school experience in the 14 City of Philadelphia. 15 Along the way, we want to make sure that even though we're at the forefront nationally, that we do it in a way that's responsible academically so that we don't -- you know, we don't -- we avoid as much as we can the mistakes that we're making with School District schools.

Councilman Kenney

But do you agree with the Mayor's position that charter schools, according to the article -- and maybe he was misquoted -- but according to the article, charter 239 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET schools in his opinion are a major component in retention and the halting of middle class migration to the suburbs.

Mr. Ramos

As School Board President, I would say that I agree that charter schools certainly give us an opportunity and a potential to attract more middle-class parents and more parents generally into charter schools as well as the opportunity to provide the students who are not middle class with educational alternatives.

Councilman Kenney

And I would suspect that you would at least understand some people's view that the irony of the story that appeared below it, wherein the District rejected out of 16 25 charter applications. Considering the fact 17 that this is the Mayor's board that's been 18 appointed in full by the Mayor and that the 19 Mayor's position is that charter schools are a 20 critical component to middle class retention, can 21 you explain to me the problem there? 22

Ms. Kahn

Yeah. A couple of things. First of all, certainly I, you know, agree with what the Mayor had to say, but I also think that that was, you know, part of the answer, and he and 240 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET I have discussed this. I mean, it's my view, and I know he shares it, for any community, any community to be strong and have a healthy tax base requires a rich educational environment, and means a strong public school system, of which charters can certainly, you know, be an important component of that. It requires a strong, independent school system and it requires, in fact, even a strong parochial school system and whatever else. So, I mean, it's all of those, you know, sort of different strokes for different folks. And I think it's important to have all of those varieties of K to 12, and then certainly higher ed as well, offerings which help attract and build strong communities.

Councilman Kenney

Without being specific to each of the that were rejected, how 19 bad were they? 20

Ms. Kahn

And the second point is that 21 there was nothing in what the Mayor said that it 22 contradicts attention to quality and attention to fulfillment of the intent of the charter school law, which is expressly stated in the law what the legislature's intent was, which was to provide for 241 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET better public educational opportunities. And given that, as well as all of the regulations that are pursuant, which the Board President can explain, in the Board's application process, the Board has a responsibility to be consistent and committed to the requirements of that process.

Councilman Kenney

Do you know what the overturn rate is from the Board to the State appeal process, what rate of charter applications there are rejected by the Board initially are, in fact, -- given approval at the appeal process level?

Mr. Ramos

I don't know precisely the statistics. I heard it's about a third.

Councilman Kenney

What do you attribute the difference in opinion with the State appeal process vis-a-vis the same criteria that -- or similar criteria that you're judging these applications on initially?

Mr. Ramos

I mean, it's hard to tell at this stage how -- I mean, we're all still learning as we go. I know that -- you know, I don't want to get into specifics, but I -- but you have -- I 242 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET can say this anecdotally, that among those overturned on appeal, you do get -- you know, there's at least one of them that I'm getting a whole lot of complaints about from elected officials about -- there's a lot of complaints about the school itself, and there are probably complaints about ones that we've approved too. I think at this early stage, we don't have a good read on the appeal board. What we've done is every year try to improve our process. And now, you know, we're still -- and by the way, we're still kind of in our process. What we've done at this stage is, we've given -- we've voted on approvals and denials, but the next step is that charter schools have an application for a rehearing or to go straight to the appeal process. So that this is still, you know -- you know, the School Board part of the process isn't completely over.

Councilman Kenney

Well, I just recently went on the board of a charter school that was initially denied. I don't think --

Mr. Ramos

Which one?

Councilman Kenney

Independence, which 243 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET initially, we're --

Mr. Ramos

I voted for that one.

Councilman Kenney

Well, the reason I bring it up is to illustrate for you the concern that I think you share, but I just want to make sure it's on the record. The individuals that established the school are people who live in Old City, Society Hill, Queen Village. I would argue that none of them, absolutely none of them, need to live in the City, and that none of the people who are applying for their children to attend the school also need to live in the City. And the one thing -- while I recognize and understand your concern about the drain of resources from the District, I can assure you that the drain of resources from the City is what's put this city and the School District in the condition that it's in. The loss of 185,000, 170 or 185,000 people in 7 years, tax payers, real-estate tax payers, wage-tax payers, you know consumers. You know, so the choice, I guess, is to try to help this happen in a real way or to take the chance that these people are going to be waving good-bye 244 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET out 76 or over the Ben Franklin Bridge.

Mr. Ramos

Yeah. I mean, a lot of good points there. One, you know, recognizing the loss of residents, the loss of the tax base at the same time that our population has gone up by -- the School District enrollment has gone up by around 22,000. And you pick a good example. I know that particular charter school. That case also points out another thing for the School District in terms of it -- you know, our capacity to improve. A lot of those people, 'cause I remember, you know, the application in some great detail. They submitted the addresses -- I looked at all of the addresses of people that had signed on there, and I was amazed by how many people were in the (indiscernible) for the Baich Martin School, which is a school that -- and some of those people are people that I know too on that list. And one of the things, you know, that surprised me, even from people that I knew on that list, was that they hadn't really even thought about the jewel that was kind of in their own backyards, and that's our fault because we need to 245 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET do -- you know, we need to do a better job of marketing -- part of retention issue is also a marketing issue, that there are schools that people need to know the good as well as the bad. The final point, Councilman, is that we're also -- as we wrap up this process, we start looking forward, again, towards next year and how we're going to do that, how we can do it better. We're also looking to whether we can work with the State on some other solutions. We've talk about the financial one. There's some policy direction we'd like to able to have. If there are parts of the City that are more overcrowded than others, we'd like the opportunity to have policy objectives, drives where charters are set up on the grade configuration.

Mr. Goldsmith

Could I just add one thing, if I may, Councilman? I think just in perspective, a lot of issues that we're facing with charter schools here in Philadelphia and in Pennsylvania are national, are issues that are taking place elsewhere throughout the country. So we're not alone. I think we have a great opportunity to -- 246 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Councilman Kenney

I'm sorry. We may be alone in the degree of our population loss, though. In that, we may be almost number one, and I think we are in major cities in the percentage loss of population in seven eight, years. We may be number one there.

Mr. Goldsmith

Yeah, and that may be. I think the issue -- and like many things, the devil's in the details here. And I think the opportunity here that we have as a city is using charter schools as a strategic complement to what we're doing. And I think if we can resolve some of these issues around funding. But even more importantly, I think it's important to realize, you know, next year, we'll probably be close to 15,000 students. That makes the charter school enrollment the forth largest school district in this state. In many ways, as a practical matter, we're being asked to administer a system the size of Reading. You know, and I think we all know in this room, we're having enough problems getting our arms around our 264 schools. So I think if we can resolve with the 247 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET State some of these issues both financially and administratively, we can really use charter schools to do what you want to do, and that's to keep people in the City and really to be a strategic complement for -- (Unintelligible, parties talking over each other.)

Mr. Ramos

I'd like to correct the record on my answer to you earlier, Councilman, when I referred to Baich Martin. The school I was thinking of particularly was Meredith, that a lot of those folks where in Meredith McCall's (indiscernible).

Councilman Kenney

Okay. Based on Mr. Goldsmith's answer about relations with the State, and I know earlier in the testimony, there was some testimony that the District believed that there was a better relationship now with the legislature than there has been. Could you tell me kind of who you've met with and what leads you to believe that the relationship with the Senate and the House are better than they were? I understand the governor and the Mayor have, you know, a widely reported personal relationship and 248 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET seem to be getting along than maybe Dr. Hornbeck and the Governor did. But could you tell me who in the legislature has been cultivated and who you've met with or what staff you've met with? I mean, I'll through -- I'll give you a list of people who I think are important to have been met with by now, and maybe you can tell me whether you have. Matt Ryan or his staff? John Perzel or his staff?

Councilman Kenney

John Bartley -- John Perzel, you have?

Ms. Kahn

(Nods head.)

Councilman Kenney

John Bartley, who's the Appropriations Committee Chair?

Councilman Kenney

Dwight Evans, I assume?

Councilman Kenney

Senator Jubelirer? Senator Tilghman?

Ms. Kahn

His staff. 249 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Councilman Kenney

Senator Fumo or his staff?

Mr. Goldsmith

Yes, staff.

Councilman Kenney

Could you --

Ms. Kahn

We -- we --

Councilman Kenney

And Senator Brightbill, who's now the Majority Leader of the Senate?

Ms. Kahn

Right, and his staff as well.

Mr. Ramos

Along with the Appropriations staff.

Ms. Kahn

Yeah, we've been meeting with the Education Committee and Senate and Appropriations Committee staffs and members on -- in both houses, both parties, and in fact, doing this financial briefing, the House Education Committee, as we indicated, have been here a couple of times in the past six months. You know, the Mayor has his conversations certainly. In fact, he was slated to be in Harrisburg yesterday and today to meet with some of these leaders, and then because of 250 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET the weather, that has to be postponed and we're hoping to reschedule shortly. And, you know, it's members of the Board, it's myself, it's our representatives, the Mayor himself who are in contact.

Councilman Kenney

Are you talking about the lobbyist representatives?

Councilman Kenney

I'd be interested in knowing when meetings took place over the last, say -- is this a period of four, five months that this has been going on?

Councilman Kenney

I'd be interested in knowing who you met with and when it happened, 'cause, just from my information, some of these offices may be surprised that they've had a meeting already. So I'd be interested in knowing --

Ms. Kahn

We'd be happy to provide you with that calendar.

Councilman Kenney

Thank you. Thank you, Madam Chair.

Council President Verna

Thank you. 251 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET The Chair recognizes Councilman Ortiz.

Councilman Ortiz

Thank you, Madam Chair. How are you guys doing? (Laughter.)

Councilman Ortiz

Let me say that I have quite a different viewpoint as to charter schools, and I'd like to see each charter school come here and face the grit that you guys face, and do the stuff and rationalize each and every little bit of expenditure that they make. And I believe that since we do have two public school systems in the City of Philadelphia, I believe that we may have to have two hearings in order to have each and every charter school come before us. Because I don't think charter schools will keep the middle class in here. Public schools will keep the middle class in Philadelphia. And unless we create a public school system that functions -- and like I said, before it's first-class and major-league, we won't have a city to look at, because Puerto Ricans will start to leave, because they'd like to have good 252 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET public school systems, and they will not tolerate Shepherds and the Hunters and so on. And as we grow into affirmative and good-paying situations, you know, and I -- I don't believe that keeping on building is in order because you know, we should change the name from public schools to 264 charter schools, then maybe people will begin to believe that actual learning is taking place. And I'm -- I'm -- I'm impressed by the fact that your report that from K to 4 and 5, an upward curve is going on. Is that true?

Councilman Ortiz

And, you know, everybody kicks David Hornbeck around, but I think David Hornbeck really deserves some of the credit. And, you know, playing "nicey-nice" with Harrisburg, unless it translates to some real money, not the money that they added in this last budget, means crap. It means absolutely nothing. And I'm glad that Rhonda put it in terms -- if I may call you Rhonda. I don't know you that well. I know most of the other ones so can call them by their first name. 253 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Ms. Chatzkel

Certainly.

Councilman Ortiz

But, you know, when you go down and you say that since '93, the (indiscernible) impact -- 'cause we've gone up, we have gone up in terms of students, we haven't gone down. People may have left the City but the school population has grown, people have come into the system. It's $655 million less, and for 2001, it's 71. million dollars (sic) less in basic education, and that is -- if the ESBE had grown at the rate of inflation, we would have received $351 million and then the School District would have received an additional $50.8 million for this current year. Unless Governor Ridge and Perzel and Ryan and all of these guys begin saying -- because good education is not really hard to do. Kids want to learn you. Just go to any neighborhood school in the most poverty-ridden area. And David Hornbeck received a lot of kicking around, but the fact of the matter is, some more money is coming through and to the City because of lot of the things that he gave and a lot of kicking and screaming. And he may not have been the most 254 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET political individual in the world, but somebody had to tell the truth about what goes on in the public school system in Philadelphia. And Baich Martin is a jewel and Kearsey is a jewel and I think Hunter is a jewel, okay? And so, you know, I would like us -- because Ben Franklin had an idea, and Ben Franklin believed that there had to be something that was public. That's why we have the public library because the rich have their own library, and that has to be sustained by government, not by private money. And, you know, I'm not going to go at you about certain things because I do know that the people that are on the board are really honorable individuals. I know most of them, and some of them are very close friends of mine. But to keep on saying that the charter schools are -- and then putting them up. I'd like to have every charter school here, Madam President. I think we've got to have two different educational hearings. I think we should scrutinize the 42 schools that are out there. I think we should ask them the same thing that we 255 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET ask these individuals and their board members. Because it is a drain on our system, no 4 matter what the Mayor says. I disagree with him on other things, I disagree with him vehemently on public schools. We need to be able to establish and build a system and -- and I'm glad that we're having an impact. And like I said before, David Hornbeck, thank you for your tenure. You put us on the right track, and I think we should give credit where credit is due. But right now, the State owes us. And every time we go away -- every time we go away from the word of the use public and privatizing, and it becomes very easy to begin saying that government should not be subsidizing public schools when the majority of the kids are becoming black and brown. And if the public school was good in the '30s and the '40s and the '50s and then we had no problem appropriating money for that, I don't think we should have any problem appropriating money. And like I said, we don't have problems finding money for rich developers. But until Harrisburg and all of the these other politicians and Ridge and so on -- I 256 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET agree with Vince Fumo when he said the other day after he announced his budget, Philadelphia got crap once again. And I know you can't say that because that would be too "Hornbeckish." (Laughter.) (Applause.)

Councilman Ortiz

Okay? We are now in the politics of being the "anti-Hornbeck," leaning over backwards to make "nicey" with the -- because the people in Harrisburg do not like us to be mean to them, but we don't get the money that our kids deserve, and we have to keep on saying it, and some of us have to keep on saying it. And Harrisburg giving us extra million dollar and 16 then with the threat of takeover if we don't improve, God darn it, you know. Give us money to build schools and to put kids per classroom, 19 and then we'll improve, then judge us, then judge 20 the public school system. Put the same level conditions on it. And, Madam Chair, I really do believe that we should bring each charter school here because I don't think -- and let me tell you something, all of the charter schools are going to 257 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET go through the process of unionizing and they're going to have a union and they're going to have a contract and they're going to have to go through collective bargaining because no worker in this society can work without a contract and at the whims of some local community board and politicians. And that's what we have. I mean it seems like (Councilman Ortiz speaks in Spanish here). You know, we want every one of us to have our own school. I get five people together, I'm dissatisfied with the public school system, I write a proposal. It's very easy to do that, by the way. I go before you, and then if you don't endorse it, if you don't fund it, I claim that you are driving me out of the City, you know? I'm glad you didn't fund it this time, I'm glad you put some requirements, I'm glad that you're putting some limits. And I think you should scrutinize, and you have to, because that is taxpayers' money that is going through there. And, you know, I would love to see you put a cap on it and tell the State, No more until you do certain things. 258 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET I have nothing else to say, ma'am, but like I said, I'm glad you're making improvements. If you were not making improvements, my kids would be in private school and they're not. And thank you to David Hornbeck once again.

Council President Verna

Councilman, what is your purpose in wanting the charter schools here?

Councilman Ortiz

What?

Council President Verna

What is your purpose in wanting the charter schools here?

Councilman Ortiz

Because they get money from us, Madam Chair. They are public schools. The charter schools are not private schools, the charter schools are public schools. And some of the money that they get from property tax, the liquor tax, all of those taxes goes to fund those schools. So shouldn't we be having the same sort of relationship with them as we have with these individuals? They are -- let us get it in mind, charter schools are supposed to be public schools. They are publicly funded, they get tax 259 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET money. It is not David Rockefeller who's coming in and giving us so many millions of dollars to fund those charter schools. And I believe if we do this, we should have -- and not just let a public press release about charter schools guide us. But I think we should have the charter schools here, because they're saying that they're doing a better job than Potter Thomas. I'd like to see if they have kids in the charter schools that they hear songs in their head. I'd like to see teachers as committed as I see at Hunter. I'd like to see teachers as committed as I look at them in Greenfield and the other schools I go to. They get public money; we should hold them at the same accountability basis as we try to hold the School Board. And I think they're trying to do certain things, which I applaud them, and I think Hornbeck started on the right course, but unless they get the right amount of money and the funding, everything that's been accomplished in the last six, ten years will go back. But I would like to see. It is 42 260 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET charter schools, right?

Councilman Ortiz

What?

Councilman Ortiz

It's 34 with 34 different boards, Madam Chair.

Mr. Ramos

Well, there are 34 in Philadelphia, one that Philadelphia students attend at Bensalem, two or three that were approved but on hold either by us or the --

Councilman Ortiz

34.

Mr. Ramos

There are three that were on hold and three --

Councilman Ortiz

There are 34 with 34 different boards. That's 34 different standards of teaching, 34 different standards of measuring accomplishment, 34 different standards of hiring teachers, okay? And 34 different standards of who knows what. And like I said, listen, you're talking to someone whose wife is the chair of one of them. (Applause.)

Councilman Ortiz

Okay? I am not -- okay? I disagree with certain things that go 261 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET down, okay? My wife and I have a discourse about this at home.

Mr. Ramos

Then you've got a bigger problem now.

Councilman Ortiz

I probably lose the argument, but it is a problem. And that, I think, is one of the best ones, okay?

Mr. Ramos

Councilman, the only -- I mean, I'm not sure we -- I mean, I think there is a place for charter schools. And I would also just caution, and I mean I haven't -- you know, we haven't talked about this before so I haven't thought about this all the way through, but I would just caution, as we talk about charters, to think about -- you know, to be mindful of the better for worse, the Board's responsibility in the charter school process and the responsibility for the charter schools. And an exploration like that, I would hope, would be some kind of collaboration, because at least while the School Board has the responsibility for charters, I know that we -- you know, we would -- as long as we have the responsibility for them, we think that -- that the 262 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET -- you know, we'd like to -- you know, we don't want to throw -- you know, we don't want to treat charters unfairly. We wouldn't have our schools and the School District schools individually coming, subjecting them to questions of Council and boards, and charter schools are subject to their own boards. They're responsible to some extent, although it's not always clear, to the School Board. And I understand your concern about tax dollars but there is a body here --

Councilman Ortiz

Anything that, I mean, we would, I think we would like to do it collaboratively and as responsibly as possible. But I just -- it just --

Mr. Ramos

And I think we have to be careful not to beat up on charters.

Councilman Ortiz

And putting up certain things. And the reality of things never come through, and I think it's about time that we had reality checks.

Mr. Ramos

I think the biggest --

Councilman Ortiz

And one of --?

Mr. Ramos

I'm sorry. 263 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Councilman Ortiz

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Mr. Ramos

I think one of the biggest issues, Councilman, is really something that's not the charter -- the making of charter school administrators or boards, and that's the flaw in the way that the law is set up to fund them that creates a tension. I mean, I don't know that there's anything inherently bad, and in fact, there's a lot of good being done out there by charter schools. I mean, I know that, you know, one charter school that you hear more about that frankly, from what I understand and just from anecdotes in the community, that board has been very on top of things. And there's -- you know, when they need to make changes, they make changes rather quickly. And that's an advantage that some of our schools sometimes don't have.

Councilman Ortiz

Thank you.

Council President Verna

Thank you.

Councilman Ortiz

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Council President Verna

The Chair 264 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET recognizes Councilman Rizzo.

Councilman Rizzo

Thank you, Madam Chair. Mr. Goldsmith, earlier in our conversation, we had -- you offered some information that I would like to take you up on. I don't know if you're prepared to discuss it now, but maybe someone in your staff can. In reference to the additional 185 school police officers, I'd like to know when the decision was made to go -- and in this report, on , under "Safety and Security," it says -- and it must have just recently occurred -- that safety and security has increased due to an expansion in the number of school police officers from 342 to 527. I'd like to know also the process on how those officers were employed. Was this a competitive examination? Could you describe, please, the process on how this 185 school police officers were hired and the timetable associated with that?

Mr. Goldsmith

Okay. Councilman, I'm not sure I can do that in detail and I'll see if 265 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET anyone from staff. . . Marge, can you talk about the -- I'm sorry? (Mr. Goldsmith and staff member confer off the record.)

Mr. Goldsmith

In September of '99, they were hired; is that correct?

Councilman Rizzo

December of '99? Why would it be -- are you talking about December of 2000? (School Board staff member addresses Council off-mic.)

Council President Verna

I'm sorry, you're going to have to come to the table and identify yourself if you have information.

Councilman Rizzo

On , you point out --

Mr. Goldsmith

Councilman, I think one of the reasons it occurred then is because this was in conjunction with the implementation and the installation of metal detectors in the high schools.

Councilman Rizzo

And the personnel that staff those are all School District police? 266 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Mr. Goldsmith

Not all, but they're also School District employees.

Councilman Rizzo

Here it says the number of school police.

Mr. Goldsmith

Yeah. And initially, they were School District police. We have a mix in the schools where we use School District police and we release them to go to other schools. And it's a mix of School District police as well as School District employees.

Councilman Rizzo

I hate to split hairs, but you presented us a document and it says that the expansion in the number of school police officers from 342 to 527. Are you correcting the record that this is not police --

Mr. Goldsmith

No. 18

Councilman Rizzo

These are not School District police?

Mr. Goldsmith

No, they are School District police?

Councilman Rizzo

Do they all make the same amount of money? Are they all paid the same pay scale or --

Mr. Goldsmith

I don't know the answer 267 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET to that.

Councilman Rizzo

My point is, when was this decision, because it's one of the best secrets that I think ever -- not many people were aware of this expansion in the security of -- in our schools. So I'd like to know when the decision was made to increase this number of personnel.

Mr. Ramos

I may be able to provide some extra history. The Board decided to increase -- to provide scan and walk-through metal detectors in all high schools, and that required a big and sudden increase in staffing to staff that machinery. So the big bubble here -- these are all school police, and most of it was driven by the new security measures in the high schools. Since then, my understanding is that we've mixed -- the people that we have at the machines has been mixed a little bit and freeing up school police away from the machines. So we don't have -- initially, I think it was almost all or all school police, and I think it was like seven per scanning station. 268 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET So that was a big that was a big jump when we went to the scanning stations in the high schools.

Councilman Rizzo

So at that point, you believe that a school police officer was required in to do that task?

Mr. Ramos

I think at that initial time, it was like seven, if my memory serves me right. And we've since then have found other ways of managing those stations so that you can free up school police to do other things and perhaps use other staff for that purpose.

Councilman Rizzo

So are you telling me then that we have presently 527 police officers, and then we have another number of people that aren't in this number --

Mr. Ramos

That are not school police.

Councilman Rizzo

That are not school police but do the security --

Mr. Ramos

That may in the morning be involved in that process.

Councilman Rizzo

Then what are we doing with 527 police officers if in fact you've replaced them with lesser, I would assume, paid 269 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET personnel?

Mr. Ramos

In some roles, some roles. I mean, you still have a big presence of school police at the machines. They are also deploying them. One of the things that the Board learned from the Harnett (ph.) report, which is the report that -- the consultants that have been hired to look at our school police. Some of those findings went to how the School District could better deploy the police that it has and manage and supervise. One of the things that didn't keep pace was also the supervision. The span of control for supervisors has really widened, and one of the criticisms of that report was that you didn't have enough supervisors.

Mr. Goldsmith

Councilman, let me just say that, obviously, the utilization of the metal detectors takes place during the morning hours when students coming into schools. When that process is done, depending on the school, depending on what the situation is, we keep a certain complement of security officers, depending on what the need is. And what we have been doing 270 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET is releasing those that are not necessary, so we have them in every middle school and in every elementary school. So what we're doing is, they're there for there for a certain period of time when they're needed for the metal detector, so every school in the School District is now covered by a School District police officer.

Councilman Rizzo

Could you describe the process to get one of these 185 jobs?

Mr. Goldsmith

Well, part of the process is driven by what the school principal believes they need. And in some cases, they make a request and they can actually, quote, purchase a School District police officer. And then that request goes to Human Resources, and there's a hiring process that's undertaken to hire this -- that officer. I'm not particularly comfortable with the process we have in place, and I'm frankly in the process of rethinking -- rethinking the process. And I think one of the problems is that, you know, the force has grown exponentially, and to make sure that there's proper management of the 271 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET force, I think there's got to be a little bit more control over deciding when, in fact, we have to hire, what the requirements are, and make sure we have the proper training and so forth. And right now, it's driven by the schools for the most part. And as I said, it's one of the things we're looking at as we go through the process.

Councilman Rizzo

And this --

Mr. Goldsmith

I personally believe that we as a school district have the obligation to provide proper security, and we shouldn't have principals feeling that they've got to trade in, frankly, textbooks or counselors to buy a School District officer. So we're looking at that, and hopefully, that will be changed.

Councilman Rizzo

And also, I was reminded that we still have a deployment of Philadelphia police to patrol the perimeters of many schools. And prior to your administration, there was some hesitancy, and police officers in some cases were reprimanded for being inside the schools, here they are walking around outside the schools, and if they're caught inside, that could 272 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET be a big problem. One particular district commander pulled those police officers from the school and was ordered to put them back because he didn't think they were being best utilized because he couldn't staff the cars in this particular district because he had police officers assigned to the school. This is a perfect example of coordination. And then I'd like to turn -- and I'll come back to you -- to Debra Kahn, the Secretary of Education. How come we don't better coordinate the school, the security, and police activities? And I asked the question a few minutes ago about Commissioner Timoney becoming the Secretary of Public Safety. And did Commissioner Timoney get a raise when he got that title?

Ms. Kahn

I don't know. I'm not aware of that.

Councilman Rizzo

Could you check on that?

Councilman Rizzo

Could you, please. Because Councilman Ortiz said that Commissioner 273 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET Timoney has no authority. It's an informal basically relationship he has with giving you direction on certain aspects of security. So I'm a little confused on really what Commissioner Timoney's title means to the Board of Education as Secretary of Public Safety.

Ms. Kahn

Well, I can't right now speak to all of the legalities of that, but I would say rather than maybe having it be informal, I mean, I'd say it's evolving. I think it's been very helpful to us both under the previous Superintendent and now with Mr. Goldsmith, I mean, to have the Secretary available, to have him have assigned the officers that he has assigned and to have participating in his COMPSTAT meetings, to have evaluated this Harnett report for us, and in fact, to have helped facilitate getting that done by recommending the consultant himself. And we may, in fact, be exploring and will be, you know, other closer collaboration, everything on up to including that New York arrangement, which, of course, he is well aware of, because, I mean, that consolidation happened -- I believe it actually came into effect even 274 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET when Secretary Timoney was still in New York. So, you know, it is evolving. I think that he has become, I think it's fair to say, you know, much more involved than he was, you know, prior to that change and probably prior than other police commissioners had been. And we just need to figure out, you know, what the right balance is.

Councilman Rizzo

Well, we don't have too much time to figure out --

Ms. Kahn

No, we don't.

Councilman Rizzo

-- how to deal with the $192 million shortfall, so I think we really got to get ourselves in gear here.

Ms. Kahn

That's right.

Councilman Rizzo

And that's why I'm interested in also talking about some of this consolidation of services. We talked about for two years now, two years, and I hate to -- it bothers me when people point toward stadiums and point towards all of these other projects that we've been able to pull off in the click of a finger. We've been talking about the fleet that you have at the School District. 275 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET I remember, when I first came to Council in 1995, we were talking about consolidation. Personally, I have asked about -- and, again, I'm not speaking out of turn here. The City's about to spend $75 million on a communications system. For three years, I've been asking Mr. -- do you know how much the School District spends on their communications requirement, two-way radios, walkie-talkies, all of that?

Mr. Goldsmith

I don't have the answer. I can get it for you.

Councilman Rizzo

Okay. I'll bet you it's a lot of money, and I understand we rent a system for the two-way communications at the School District. I have asked many times about the School District becoming a partner in this communications network that we're about to roll out here in the next -- it's going to be operational in the next few months. Are we anywhere with that? And where are we with some of the other consolidation of services like the Procurement 276 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET Department that we have. Lou Applebaum told me here, the Commissioner of Procurement, that he'd be willing to take over your purchasing at the District. And, again, from what I understand, there's been no serious attempt to do that. I'd like to hear it. Tell me about the communication, and if you need to bring one of the staff that knows up, I have no problem with that. Where are we with putting the School District -- and I'd like to get a figure, a number. How much do we spend, whether we own, maintenance contracts, whether we rent, radio, cell telephones, all of the gadgetry to communicate in the School District? And where are we today with joint -- he can come up, you know, if he has the answer. I'd like to know how much we spend and where are we today at seriously trying to consolidate services in the City government and in this School District?

Ms. Kahn

Councilman, let me just say before we get into the detail on that, you know, I'm not sure I can take this back to 1995 as you can. 277 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET But the most honest answer is that this has been one of those capacity problems. At the same time there is an absolute urgency to do it, there has been great difficulty getting the attention, the talent, I would say, you know, focused on it to be able to make it happen. And I think that sometimes having this kind of very, very serious situation is what's going to propel us to do that. It's very difficult.

Councilman Rizzo

Well, let me see if this will get your attention. How much money do we spend on communications needs in the School District of the City of Philadelphia from cell telephones to pagers to two-way radios?

Mr. Lombardi

Two-way radios, Councilman --

Council President Verna

I'm sorry, you're going to have to identify yourself for the record, please.

Mr. Lombardi

John Lombardi, Administrator of Transportation. I can speak on the two-way radio system, Councilman.

Councilman Rizzo

Take into the mic. 278 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET

Mr. Lombardi

Okay. About one and a half years ago, a representative from the City approached us regarding consolidating our resources. We have ten frequencies that were given to us by the Federal Communications Commission, and they talked about doing a new system for the police and firemen, and they asked if we would be willing to share our frequencies with them. We told them that we would. The system that we had in place is an analog. The system they were looking to put in is a digital system. And they priced it out and they came back to us and told us that they were going in a different direction and they didn't want to use our system.

Councilman Rizzo

So what you're telling me is we don't have a deal here, and I'm being told something just the opposite, and I'm not going to name names. I cannot imagine that this city is about to spend close to $100 million for a new communications system, state-of-the-art digital, and the School District is willing -- do you rent that system or do you own it?

Mr. Lombardi

No, we were given that 279 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET system by the Federal Communications Commission. They needed -- we were told that they needed our frequencies to do what wanted to do. We agreed. They said that they wanted to use our frequencies, they would share our towers with them, it would make our system better, it would be better for our school security, who could communicate within. So we were all for the system.

Councilman Rizzo

So you're telling me that the Department of Public Property lost interest in joining the School District with the City of Philadelphia.

Mr. Lombardi

Their communications office --

Councilman Rizzo

How much do you spend at the School District for your communication requirements?

Mr. Lombardi

The two-way radio system, there's no cost for the system for making --

Councilman Rizzo

Excuse me, there's no cost for the system, you don't maintain the system?

Mr. Lombardi

We bought the system in 280 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET 1987. The towers we put up, the antennas we bought in 1987. We have not replaced it since. There is some maintenance that occurs each year, probably to $30,000 for removing equipment and 6 to replacing and other vehicles, but the system 7 has no recurrent costs because -- 8

Councilman Rizzo

All right. You 9 bought the system, or the system is how old? 10

Mr. Lombardi

In 1987 we bought the 11 system. 12

Councilman Rizzo

A brand-new system. 13

Mr. Lombardi

Brand-new system. 14

Councilman Rizzo

And it was never 15 leased at all? 16

Mr. Lombardi

No. 17

Councilman Rizzo

Never? 18

Mr. Lombardi

No, we -- 19

Councilman Rizzo

You lease no radio 20 systems -- 21

Mr. Lombardi

Two-way radio system, 22 Councilman. I can't speak about the Nextel system 23 telephones. I'm talking strictly two-way radio 24 systems. 25

Councilman Rizzo

So in '87 -- you're 281 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET talking about a system that's getting -- it's not old-old, but it's starting to age. I'm going to call the Managing Director as soon as this meeting is over because I was told something different than you just reported to me today.

Mr. Lombardi

All right.

Councilman Rizzo

That's fine. Let's go from communications to procurement.

Mr. Goldsmith

Tom, do you want to come up? (Witness comes forward.)

Mr. Ramos

While he comes up, I'll try to provide some additional backdrop here, which is kind of the way the School District sees the relationship with the City, and that too has evolved. I think we're now at a point where we're having -- we're -- I think more and more interact -- the City and the District interacting not as two, you know, complete -- as two strangers, as we sometimes did, but as siblings. And an example of that is that there is a fair amount of communication about a lot of these things with the Managing Director. And, as 282 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET Secretary Kahn noted, to some extent, it's been a matter of capacity, the ability to move on it. I mean, you talk about Fleet Management's initiative. You know, there's been active discussions about, you know police, is another one where it's kind of evolved but we're not there yet. So, you know, we're also very -- you know, we understand that there's -- that there's history that sometimes predates us and predates our roles, but our interest is in continuing to find opportunities. So, you know, if through this process or anything else, we can we can identify new things or move things forward, I mean, that's our interest. And I know you've mentioned the communications -- you've mentioned that one to me, and I've tried to find out -- I still -- I was interested in the answer too because I still don't know. But those are, you know, those are all things we're looking to do because they do add up as you say.

Councilman Rizzo

Well, I certainly -- I appreciate that and I appreciate this new 283 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET review, this new approach to try to deal with these things but, you know, it gets very frustrating sitting here, and I assume where you sit, even more so, to hear the same questions asked, the same answer, and then zip happens. So I'd like to hear about what doing to consolidate the procurement operation.

Mr. Goldsmith

I would also ask Tom to talk about Fleet Management.

Mr. Mcglinchey

My name is Tom McGlinchey, and I'm the Chief Operating Officer for the School District, and excuse my back, Councilman.

Councilman Rizzo

No problem.

Mr. Mcglinchey

In June, I believe, of 2000, or nine months ago, the Mayor convened a task force to look at the possible combination of services with the School District and the City in an effort to streamline the operations as well as save money. At that initial meeting, we identified several areas of immediate interest and other areas that we would pursue at a later date. The areas that were identified for immediate attention were Fleet Management, Procurement, Risk 284 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET Management, and Information Technology. Of course, after June of 2000, the Managing Director and the City were involved with, number one, the negotiations with their own labor unions, and then following that, the Republican Convention. So the work of that committee was somewhat delayed. The District did provide the Managing Director's Office, as requested at the initial meeting, with key people in the various departments that were going to be scrutinized, key contact folks that, when the effort got underway, that the City and the School District would have the particular teams identified. Our first look, and that just started recently, has been with Fleet Management. The Managing Director, myself, the CEO, Mr. Goldsmith met, I believe, a couple of months ago and I have since met with Mr. Martz as well as Riley Harrison, the Fleet Manager for the City. Our own transportation director and me accompanied Mr. Harrison on a tour of his facilities and met with his management team to discuss the potential combination of services. 285 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET We have not at this date actively pursued the other three areas. However, it is our intention to pursue them with the City.

Councilman Rizzo

Thank you. In all due respect to the School District, Lou Applebaum told me that there's some things you even do better in the area of procurement than the Procurement Department.

Mr. Mcglinchey

He is correct, he is correct. (Laughter.)

Councilman Rizzo

I had a feeling that you'd respond that way.

Mr. Mcglinchey

Well, I think the Managing Director made a point at the initial meeting that it may be that this process identifies areas where the City can benefit as well as the School District. So that was the focus of the Managing Director's Office was to look at what we can benefit in the process.

Mr. Goldsmith

Let me just say one thing, and I'm all for this effort, I'm behind it, I support it, and I will do my best to implement it. 286 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET The one thing that scares me is that we combine things that neither of us do very well, and we've got to be very careful of what we decide to focus on that one of us, you know, does very well and we're really adding some value-added expertise as well as cost savings. But more importantly than simply the cost is that we're adding value, and I just don't want to us rush to do something which we're both strained to do right now particularly well. And the Managing Director and I have talked about that and I think we're on board. We think Fleet Management is a good one to go to. I think Risk Management is another good one to go to, where we have some needs, and from what I understand, particularly on Risk Management, the City does a nice job with it. I have no proprietary interest in holding on to something at all. I want to shed things so we can focus on what our mission is. And that's the responsibility of the person to the right of me, and that's educating students. So philosophically and every which way we're ready to go, we just have to make sure we pick our spots, don't bite off more than we can 287 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET chew, and get the job done.

Council President Verna

Excuse me, may I please.

Councilman Rizzo

Sure.

Council President Verna

Mr. Goldsmith, I think your remarks are right on target. Can you tell us how many vehicles you have in your fleet, how many automobiles?

Mr. Goldsmith

I don't know that offhand. Mr. McGlinchey may know.

Mr. Mcglinchey

We have approximately 400 non-bus vehicles that would be maintenance vans, utility-type vehicles and sedans for supervisory staff in both the facilities and the Transportation Department. We also have a fleet of -- I'm going to look to John Lombard. It's 450 non-bus vehicles that I just described and 650 school buses.

Council President Verna

And if we were to consolidate, my question is, who would pay?

Mr. Mcglinchey

Well, I suspect that consolidation with the City in terms of the maintenance of the fleet would be at a cost to the 288 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET District for the service provided. We did not talk about the maintenance of the bus fleet, we were really focusing on the -- talk about the potential service of the non-bus fleet. And certainly, the City doesn't want to get into scheduling buses, school buses.

Councilman Rizzo

Thank you, Madam Chair. Can I follow up?

Council President Verna

Please proceed.

Councilman Rizzo

My final question to Mr. McGlinchey is --

Mr. Ramos

And we do take in-kind contributions.

Councilman Rizzo

We can start clipping coupons for Jiffy Lube from the Sunday paper. What I would appreciate, Mr. McGlinchey, I had a minute to reflect on the statement that Mr. Lombardo made about the frequencies. I'm starting to recollect that -- these are two different issues. The frequencies at one time, I believe, were necessary to try to accomplish the entire build-out of the new 289 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET communications system, and I think that there was a need because of the, at the time, the technology, but I think the engineers developed a way to split some frequencies and do some things, some innovative things to give the City. But I don't think it suggested that there still wasn't an interest in, as you go forward, rather than to go continue to maintain an antiquated radio system, to start your migration towards coming on to this new system. And in the last conversation I had with the Managing Director, he thought that you were a obvious customer for the system. And I'm going to talk to him, like I mentioned shortly after. But I would appreciate you initiating the call if he doesn't call you. And, again, I'm not suggesting that you just throw everything you have away on this free system that you have that doesn't cost you any money to operate, that going forward, that based on a system that's 1987 vintage, that we start maybe putting those 450 non-bus vehicles that have two-way radios, as those radios break, onto the new system. I know that's complicated, but I 290 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET would hate to see you here ten years from now saying that you need $50 million to buy a new radio system for the School District, when in fact, we have a system that is going to be the state-of-the-art, not just nationally internationally, for its design. I'd like to see you start planning to come aboard that system rather than just saying, Well, there's no interest they didn't need our frequencies, it doesn't cost as much to operate. I think you'd be really surprised on what that system costs you to operate or when a radio breaks and you have to buy a new one to replace it. So I think there's an opportunity here, and I would appreciate you exploring that. And as a matter of fact, I'm going to ask the Managing Director to make sure that that conversation occurs.

Mr. Mcglinchey

I'd be happy to talk to Mr. Martz about that. I should mention to you that we did have two-way radios in non-bus vehicles, and we removed them in favor of the better technology that exists right now, in particular the two-way 291 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET phones and Nextel phones. And the advantage there is that once you get out of the car if you have a two-way radio in the car, unless it's portable you're stuck, and our radios weren't portable. And with the system we use now, we can get in touch with anybody at the click of a button, no 8 matter where they are.

Councilman Rizzo

And the new radios that the Police Department and the other municipal departments have will also be removable from the vehicle to be portable. So I think you really need to be what is available to be demoed, what's available because I'm sure that to be dependent on a private carrier isn't bad, but I don't think it's the most desirable thing. And not to belabor this, I would appreciate you revisiting that issue to see what opportunities you may have. Again, this is the part that frustrates me, to hear that all of this is going on right now and the School District was satisfied with being told that, you know, there's no interest, and I don't believe that's accurate, and I'm not challenging what was said earlier, but I believe there's obviously some confusion here in 292 3/6/01 - SCHOOL DISTRICT BUDGET what the interest and what the interest may not be, okay? Thank you, Madam Chair.

Council President Verna

Thank you. Are there any other questions from members of the committee? (No further questions.)

Council President Verna

Seeing none, this committee will stand in recess until 10 a.m. tomorrow. Thank you. (Adjourned 5:10 p.m.) 293 C E R T I F I C A T E WE HEREBY CERTIFY that the foregoing proceedings of the Council of the City of Philadelphia of Tuesday, March 6, 2001, were reported fully and accurately by us, and that this is a correct transcript of same. RE: COUNCIL COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE BILLS NO. 010001, 12, 13 __________________________________, MAUREEN BRODERICK, Registered Professional Reporter __________________________________, JOSEPHINE CARDILLO, Registered Professional Reporter