Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilwoman Brown.
Thank you, Madam President. I had a follow-up and did not write down the type of code violation for those who are not taking care of the lead in their properties. You actually stated the name of that code violation for property owners. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: It's a property maintenance code violation; we don't have that code section with us, but we'll get that information to you. And in our meetings with the Health Department, there may be some joint writing of lead-specific violations. That's the kind of thing that we're working on.
Working on, okay. And at whatever point, you'll get back to me? COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: We'll let you know everything we're doing.
Okay, I appreciate that. Thank you, gentlemen. 1750 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET Thank you, Madam President.
You're welcome. Is Councilman Kenney in the room? I believe he wanted to be recognized again. (Councilman Kenney not present at this time.)
All right, gentlemen, thank you very much. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Thank you.
The Board of L&I Review is next. (Witness comes forward.)
Good morning. Please identify yourself for the record and proceed with your testimony.
Good morning, Council President Verna and members of the City Council. I am Richard Felgus, Administrative Services Director of the Department of Licenses and Inspections, and I'm here representing the Board, as we provide their administrative support. The budget that we are requesting today on behalf of the Board of Licenses and Inspections Review is $210,000, an increase of $2,600 over our 1751 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET FY '02 estimated obligations. In FY '01, the Board has rendered decisions in 791 cases. It is now estimated that we will issue or hear 860 cases in FY '02. In FY '03, we project the Board will again hear 860 cases. Currently an appeal brought before the Board will be heard and a decision rendered within 60 days of when the appeal is filed. Currently, the board is staffed with three civil service employees and six board members. Thank you for the opportunity to provide the Board's testimony.
Thank you. Are there any questions from members of the committee? (No questions.)
Seeing none, the next department will be the Board of Building Standards.
Councilwoman Verna, I am Richard Felgus, Administrative Services Director for the Department, and appearing on behalf of the Board of Building Standards. 1752 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET I am here to request $118,951, an increase of $1,715 over the FY '02 appropriations. This funding will support two full-time employees and four board members. The role of the Board of Building Standards is to advise the Commissioner of the Department of Licenses and Inspections on requests for variances as well as provide interpretation of the building code and make suggestions for standards and regulations dealing with building safety. The Board also reviews new and substitute materials and methods of construction and makes recommendations to the Commissioner to keep Philadelphia up-to-date and competitive with the latest building technologies. In FY '03, it is anticipated the Board will conduct 50 meetings and hear 230 cases. In FY '2001, the Board of Building Standards heard 246 cases and provided recommendations to the Commissioner. The time period for obtaining decisions for the Board is currently approximately 30 days. The Board also provides accelerated hearings to persons requiring quick turnarounds. In FY '01, a 1753 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET total of accelerated hearings were conducted. I thank you for the opportunity to provide the Board's testimony and will be happy to answer any questions at this time.
Thank you. 7 Are there any questions from members of 8 the committee? 9 (No questions.) 10
Yes. I am Richard Felgus, Administrative Services Director, and am here providing testimony for the Zoning Board of Adjustment. The Zoning Board of Adjustment is requesting a budget of $523,973 for FY 2003, an increase of $6,303 over the FY '02 estimated obligation. This is for salaried increases granted to civil service employees of the board. In FY '03, the Board will support a staff of six full-time employees and five board members. 1754 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET During FY '01, the Zoning Board, which is the most active of all City boards, conducted 254 meetings. The Zoning Board provides a vital service to those who work, live, or do business in the City of Philadelphia in that it provides an opportunity to appeal zoning determinations and to request variances from the zoning code where the code imposes unnecessary hardship on the property owner. The Zoning Board also grants certifications for certain types of zoning uses, as proscribed by ordinance of City Council. In FY '03, it is anticipated the Board will hear approximately 1980 cases. In FY '01, the Zoning Board heard 2,031 cases. Currently, the board is normally rendering a decision within 30 days of the date that an appeal is filed. To provide service to the public, we have continued to provide accelerated hearings, which are conducted as soon as possible after a notice posting periods. The cost of special hearings are paid for those persons requesting the accelerated hearing. In FY '01, accelerated hearings were conducted for 360 cases. In FY '02 and '03, we 1755 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET project accelerated hearings will continue at the level of 325 cases per year. As a means of providing interested persons with hearing information, we are now sending out all of our notices electronically, and that system, to my knowledge, has been working very well. Thank you for the opportunity to present the testimony for the Zoning Board, and I will be happy to answer any questions.
Thank you, Are there any questions from members of the committee? (No questions.)
Thank you. We're not going to take a break. I think since we are running ahead of schedule, we just as well go through all of the others. The next department to testify is the Streets Department. (Witness comes forward.) 1756 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET
Good morning, Commissioner. COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: Good morning.
Please identify yourself for the record and proceed with your testimony. COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: Good morning, Council President Verna and members of the City Council. I'm William Johnson, Commissioner of the Department of Streets. I'm here today to present testimony on behalf of the Streets Department's proposed Fiscal Year 2003 Operating Budget. Employees of the Streets Department continue to work hard to fulfill our basic mission or providing clean, safe streets for our citizens. We request a General Fund appropriation of $118,880,151 and an All Funds appropriation of $148,626,151. Our proposed budget reflects a net General Fund increase of $3,251,215 from Fiscal Year 2002 estimated obligations. The overall request for the Department for all funds (General, County Liquid Fuels, Special Gasoline Tax funds, and Grants Revenue) is a net $4,482,715 higher than our Fiscal 1757 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET Year 2002 estimated obligations. This net increase reflects an average staffing level increase from $2,137 in Fiscal Year 2002 to $2,143 in Fiscal Year 2003. However, the actual Council-approved staffing level was reduced from 2,232 positions in Fiscal Year '02 to 2,195 in '03. This is a drop of 37 positions. With this budget, the Highways Division plans to resurface 156 miles of streets and line-stripe 1,750 intersections, one million square feet, both in Fiscal Year '02 and '03. Sanitation will continue to provide timely refuse and recycling and collection service to households. 4 percent. This reduction has compelled the Department to reduce Class 100 estimated obligations by $300,000 in '02 and by $550,000 in equipment rentals in Fiscal Year '03. The results of this year's Citizens Satisfaction Survey shows that 90 percent of 1758 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET respondents said their trash was sometimes or always collected on time, up from 87 percent in the year 2000. The use of more efficient trash compactors has contributed towards the achievement of improved productivity. These include on-time collections of 95 percent in '01 and a projected 96 percent in '02. In Fiscal Year '03's request for sanitation funds, the current cleaning schedule for arterial and commercial corridors, as well as the Neighborhood Cleaning Program, will be maintained. In '02, the Division continued the successful use of two small, versatile "ride-on/walk-behind" sweepers that can safely and efficiently maneuver into and around tight spaces. In Fiscal Year '01, 41,244 tons of recyclables were collected, and current the projections for '02 and '03 are 44,300 and 45,800 tons respectively. In Fiscal Year '01, the Department held six drop-off days and increased the tonnage of hazardous waste collected, from 98 tons to 2000 tons in 2000 to 119 tons in 2001, with a 10 percent increase in the overall program participation. 1759 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET The emphasis on the Sweep Program is on education and enforcement. Three sweep officers visit regulated premises to monitor recycling plans, to provide educational materials, and, when necessary, to issue citations. And special services, in addition to the expanded support to neighborhoods that we are providing through more street sweeping, citywide recycling, partnership recycling, the Sweep Program, and Partners for Progress, the Department will continue to support clean block program. In 2002, as we have for over 50 years, we will continue to fund and support the Philadelphia More Beautiful Committee's Clean Block Program. In 2001, 87,599 volunteers teamed with over 6,000 block captains and completed over 10,000 clean block cleanups. The Highway Engineering and Traffic Divisions all make up the Transportation Services Group. The Highway Division utilizes two processes for street resurfacing: Conventional and hot-in- place, or HIP, recycling.
Where appropriate, HIP is being piloted and used because it's faster and more economical than conventional surfacing. In 1760 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. 6 million square yards with conventional resurfacing and 718,486 square yards with the HIP process. The Department repaired 24,314 potholes in '01, an increase of over 8,000 from Fiscal Year 2000, and projects to repair 30,000 in '02 and '03. We performed 804,053 linear feet of cracked sealing in '01 and project 1,400,000 in both '02 and '03. Due to the passage of the Telecommunications Act in 1996, the City has seen a number of telecommunications firms seeking to install fiber-optic lines, an increase from 1 to 15. Consequently, over 680 miles of street have been impacted by underground or aerial construction since that time. To address this, the Department is currently working with the Department of Public Property, the Law Department, and the Managing Director's Office to develop new regulatory mechanisms, update regulations, and improve work flows to better coordinate street openings and minimize the number of times that streets are open. The Streets Department worked with the Managing Director's Office and the Office of Fleet 1761 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET Management to revise the City's snow fighting plan in order to increase the City's ability to plow neighborhood streets. The City now plows tertiary residential streets during significant snowstorms. The Department is continuing to work with its regional transportation partners to maximize the use of federal and state funding for infrastructure upgrades in the City. 3 million in federal and state bonds. Some of the major projects through Fiscal Year '07 include reconstruction of Delaware Avenue between Penn's Landing and Aramingo Avenue, Market Street elevated train reconstruction and streetscape, the Avenue of the Arts, North Broad Street, South Street Bridge replacement and the Germantown Avenue Bridge and Chestnut Hill. By the end of Fiscal Year '01, the Department replaced over 68,000 lights, street lights, as part of its ongoing citywide program to replace obsolete fixtures. When the entire program is completed, the Department projects that a total of 75,000 lights will have been replaced. 1762 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET The Streets Department is in the process of modernizing some of the City's oldest traffic signals at nearly 500 intersections in Center City and the Northeast. By the end of 2002, the Department will have modernized 330 signals, including 90 intersections in the southwest quadrant of the City. The Center City portion of this program is scheduled to be completed by Fiscal Year 2005. Once a signal has been modernized, the Department is able to link to it a centralized control center. Citywide, this is a an ongoing program involving City, state, and federal funds to improve over 2,800 signalized intersections in the City. A major goal of the Streets Department is to respond quickly, courteously, and effectively to customer requests for service. We improved our call center by installing a state-of-the-art automated call distribution center. In conclusion, the employees of the Streets Department will continue to work diligently in the delivery of services to our citizens and neighborhoods and to improve the quality of life in our city. Therefore, we request your favorable 1763 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET consideration of this budget request. I'm available to answer any questions at this time.
Thank you, Commissioner. You state in your testimony that your department's average staffing level will increase from 2,137 to 2,143 in FY '03, which is an increase of 6 positions. Your department, however, is budgeted for 2,195 positions in FY '03. Why will you be maintaining an average vacancy rate of 48 positions? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: Well, we're not exactly maintaining it, but through the process of trying to hire and the constant turnover, we find that we have a constant vacancy rate of about that many positions relative to the number that we have approved. So we're constantly hiring, we constantly have people coming into the system and going out of the system, but through the course of the year, we average about that many vacant positions.
48 vacancies? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: Right. 1764 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET
Are they generally in one department? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: No, they spread across the Department.
But you will be hiring the 48? Because I would certainly think that that would have an operational impact on your department. COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: We have what we consider some peak periods where we do more seasonal hirings than others. The spring and summer is a peak period. Right now, we're gearing up to hire a number of positions that we won't necessarily continue to need once we run into, you know, kind of a slower period during the winter months again. But over the average, if you average over the course of the year, we have that many vacancies that we're constantly looking to fill.
On your testimony, you mentioned expanded street- cleaning services. What areas of the City will be impacted? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: The area of 1765 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET expansion may be reflective more of some of the new things that we're trying with regards to mechanical sweepers on some sidewalks. We now -- we currently have, I believe, three sidewalk sweepers and we're planning to increase that up to six in the coming year.
So you will be expanding the areas that you will be cleaning? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: That's correct.
I'm rather curious. On -87, I believe it's the line item 250, it shows Decker Temporary Service, $24,000 for temp -- for temporary helpers, I assume? What services do they provide? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: Decker Temporary Services. We have had a number of short-term services provided, but I'm not familiar with this particular one off the top of my head; I'll have to get back to you with an answer on that one.
I'd be rather curious as to what that's for. Commissioner, can you explain why the proceeds from the sale of recyclables dropped from $312,000 in the first half of 2001 to $54,000 in 1766 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET the first half of 2002? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: Yes. The recycling markets are extremely volatile. Right now, all of the commodity pricing on the market is somewhat depressed, with the exception maybe of aluminum, which we don't get a high percentage of, but all of the fibers, paper products, the rate per ton that we were able to sell those products for on the open market has dropped substantially across the country. And that's reflective in the reduction -- by the reduction in revenue that we received from the sale of those materials.
I don't think we have too many Councilmembers present. I was going to ask you if you wanted to discuss your new recycling program that you hope to implement in the near future. Maybe for the record, you could do that very, very briefly, and at another point in time, perhaps we could have a meeting with all Councilmembers present so that they could all be aware of what you're going to be doing. COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: Yes. We have been 1767 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET successful in working through our Recycling Division and David Robinson, our new Recycling Coordinator, to obtain grant funding from the State to do a media campaign and a public-education campaign around the issue of recycling to try to raise the awareness of recycling in Philadelphia communities and encourage people in our communities and in our schools to recycle more. That campaign is scheduled to kick off in March -- I believe it's March 18th of this year, just in a couple of weeks, and we'll include a mass media campaign and a number of grassroots community-based meetings, education in schools, etc., to try to promote the recycling program in Philadelphia.
And I think you also indicated that trash and the recyclables will be picked up on the same day so that people don't get confused as to what date the recyclables will be picked up? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: That's a goal of the Department. We are working on some programs that would allow us to get more of the City to same-day collection so that it's not as confusing. 1768 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET One reason that people don't participate is because they can't remember when to put their recyclables out, and then there's another huge population out there that's just uneducated about the program. So we've got a program that's going to start in March that will address the education piece, and we're working on some operational changes to try to get more of the City to same day as trash collection.
Would it be your intention to have a weekly recyclable pickup? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: I think weekly recyclables collection is obviously more consistent and easier to remember if it's on the same day as trash collection. We are trying to balance how we can get to that point with the cost of implementing a program like that, and we have some ideas and some recommendations to the Managing Director at this point, and we're evaluating those right now.
Thank you. Commissioner, if hot-in-place resurfacing is faster and more economical than conventional 1769 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET resurfacing, why are twice as many square yards of streets being resurfaced using the conventional method? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: There are a couple of reasons. We haven't made a 100 percent commitment to hot-in-place --
Is that that massive machine that they use? And it's horrible in neighborhoods because the odor is dreadful. COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: It's a massive train of a machine that basically will mill the street on the front end of the train, reprocess the material in the center, and lay that material down on the back end of the street so that you don't have the inconvenience of having a street being milled and then having to wait a number of weeks before a separate crew comes through to do the paving. But we've only tested it in certain areas. We have had concerns expressed because of the amount of heat applied to the street and the smoke that results in tight areas where we have to turn corners or other things, it's not very effective. It's more effective if we use it in straight ways. 1770 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET So it's primarily been used on some of the larger streets at this point.
I know you could never use it in a residential area because, as I said, it's dreadful. Commissioner, how much money have we saved because of the lack of snow? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: Well, that's part of our new snow plan: To have no snow. (Laughter.)
Wonderful. COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: It's been very effective this year. The one major snowstorm that we had, as you know, was forecast to be, you know, a 14- or 16-inch storm, and we had to prepare to handle a storm of that magnitude, but then the storm kind of fizzled out. It didn't come in as quickly as we thought, and it lasted for a longer period of time, and it was more of a sustained storm, an the, at the end of the day, Philadelphia maybe got 4 inches, maybe 5 in some areas. But because of the amount of preparation that we had to do for that storm, it didn't allow 1771 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET us to be as efficient in fighting that storm as we could have if it had occurred as predicted. As a result, I believe, we have, perhaps, $200,000 remaining in this year's snow budget.
How much had been in the budget? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: $2,947,000.
How much? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: We've actually spent -- I'm corrected. We've actually spent 1 million 555.
Well, I'm glad we didn't have more snow. The Chair recognizes Councilwoman Brown.
Thank you, Madam President. I welcome the opportunity to sit with the Streets Commissioner and staff around recycling because I, too, have an interest in that. I want to start off by -- pick up where you left off in your testimony and give you kudos from my staff for the tracking and reporting system that you've implemented under your leadership and let you know how that has helped us tremendously in 1772 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET better serving constituents. So hats off to you. My second question was all related to recycling, the pilot programs you've implemented, the tremendous improvement you've made under your leadership, but I can wait until the briefing is held with all Councilmembers to hear all of the details, but I look forward to that program with much anticipation, and in particular the relationship that will exist, or should exist, with the School District so that we can begin to train the next generation on the importance of recycling. Thank you very much. COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: Thank you.
Thank you. Good morning, Commissioner. COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: Good morning.
I have a couple questions, and also the Chair was very kind in holding, or asking, the L&I Commissioner to come back, who I'll want to ask some questions after your testimony. I just have a couple questions here. Did I understand from an earlier response, which is 1773 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET probably a part of Page, 2 expanded street-cleaning, I heard you talking about sidewalks. Are you talking about in commercial corridors or where? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: Well, at this point, it's been very limited and only in commercial corridors.
Okay. COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: We have actually two machines, and we're purchasing three more machines this year.
But the sidewalk activity is primarily in commercial corridors; is that what you're planning to do? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: Only in a commercial corridor
A commercial corridor. COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: That's correct.
All five of them are going to work in a commercial corridor? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: It's a very long commercial corridor on North Broad Street right now, and it's just been tested. That was the initial location where we decided to test it, and 1774 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET it's been working quite well.
Okay. From where to where is it presently? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: We don't have the exact boundaries, but it's between Erie and Ogontz.
Okay. Yeah, that would be a long commercial corridor, Erie to Ogontz. I need you, Commissioner -- and some of this may have started slightly before your arrival or maybe around the time of your arrival. I need for a fairly detailed, but not too long, explanation of where we are with regard to the 15 miles-an-hour school flashing zone lights. It's a program that started some years ago. I have some of my constituents who are very, very concerned about the status of the program and its continuation. There's one particular school in West Philadelphia, Our Lady of Lourdes, that has had ongoing concern, and I have a number of other schools in the district, and I know a list has been established. Can you tell us what has happened with the program over the past year or so? I think there 1775 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET was one year where we had no activity, and we're now planning to have activity. Unfortunately, Commissioner, it has put me in a position of giving people information that I've been given, and then deadlines not being either met or fulfilled, and a concern about whether they're ever actually going to get the light. So could you explain what has happened over the past couple of years and what the project is for when work will actually start? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: I know that we've been looking very closely at the school flasher program and the construction schedules. As recently as last week, we talked about how we could try to accelerate some of the work that's being done. My understanding is that in November of last year, we completed the schedule for the year 2000. That was in November of 2001; the actual construction was completed under the 2000 contract. The 2001 contract construction schedule is underway. There is a new contract that we'll be 1776 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET issuing within the next few months, and what we're going to try to do is find a way to accelerate construction under this new contract so that we can get caught up. It seems like we're running about -- between the appropriation period and the actual construction period, there seems to be like a six-month delay. Now, what I have --
Commissioner, I'm sorry to interrupt you. When you said the 2001 construction schedule has started, where has it started? 'Cause, I mean, I'm not aware that there was a 2001 schedule or at least that one has started. I know about what's supposed to be happening in the next month or so, and maybe that's the 2001 schedule, but I'm not aware of any activity going on right now COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: Okay.
Other than finishing up a bid process. COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: Yeah, there is a current bid process that's being finished up and a set of school flashers to be done under this 1777 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET upcoming contract. What I have is a list of all of the locations that are going to be done under this next contract by district, so I have the list for your district.
I understand. COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: I also have been in discussions on how we can accelerate construction to get not only those planned under the current contract, but those that would be scheduled under the next contract accelerated.
Right, right. COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: I don't have an answer on how that's going to be accomplished yet, but we do have some ideas about how we could get it done, but we have to check with Law and Procurement to see what we can do with that.
Yes. I'm left at -- least with the impression that the information is we need to have whatever's going to be done under a certain contract, we have to have all of the information in from every part of the City or whoever is asking for one from the various Council districts around the City, and that no work takes 1778 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET place until all of the lists, or all of the locations, are in. And, I mean, that, from my perspective, seems at some level to create at least part of the delay, and I don't know where -- what people have to do to get all the lists in. I mean, we tried to come up with a relatively simple process. You fill out your application, you send it to whatever your respective school jurisdiction is, get the approval send it in to the Streets Department, go from there. But somewhere in the, I guess in the bidding process, there is this notion, or concept, that you have to have all of the locations already determined before a contract even goes out to bid. Now, I mean, look, I don't mean to tell you how to buy and procure things, but, I mean, if we had to wait until every office put in their pencil order, we'd never have pencils, and we certainly don't do it for heavy equipment, and machinery. I mean, we pretty much -- my experience is, you have a master contract, you go against that contract, you get what you need at the time that you need it. 1779 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET And I understand that these are not things that you go into a store somewhere and pick up off of a shelf; I mean, I understand it's specialized, or somewhat specialized, equipment. But, I mean, I think there are three or four different versions of a flashing light, and if we have a contract with someone to get what we need at the time that we need it, then we shouldn't be sitting around waiting for everybody to put their list in. I mean, it's like if all the kids aren't good in school today, nobody gets recess. I mean, it just doesn't make any sense to me. And we basically lost a year, as best as I can tell, and there may have been funding issues along with that, but I think we basically have virtually lost a year of activity while we have people who filled out applications a while ago, we keep telling them they're on the list, you know, you're at this place, you're at that place, you're at the other place, and then in the meantime, I have no answer, and I've got no light. And, I mean, obviously, you know -- well, I won't even go into yesterday. 1780 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET But tragic events like yesterday's just exacerbate the entire situation, and I just need to better understand why we have these gaps in the construction activity. COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: Well, in response to your comment, we don't disagree that there has been a delay in construction and that -- and we recognize that, and we're working on trying to correct it, looking for opportunities to try to accelerate construction schedules to try to get more work done under the next round of contracting so that we can get caught up.
Okay. COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: And when I say "get caught up," I mean we'll be in a position to contract for all of the flashers that we've been approved and funded for.
Under the current process that we're in now, do you know when the work will start, or do you have an estimate of when work will start for the known locations, the approved sites, as you called them, where people have already put in their applications? Do we know when the actual construction will start? 1781 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: My understanding is that we should have a new contract in place within the next month and a half, maybe two months, which would put us into the summer and starting the actual construction. Now, I'm not sure if we have historically done one site at a time or two sites at a time, but those are the kinds of things that we're looking at. If we're hiring contractors to do work, I'm not sure why we couldn't do more than one site at a time, unless there's only one light available at any time and one pole to do it. So we're looking and talking internally about how we can accelerate the schedule specifically for school flasher installation.
Okay, I'll just mention one last thing just from a coordinating standpoint. I mean, obviously, when they're available, people will take them, and nobody's going to stand out there but, I mean, part of the program is the coordination between the City and the various schools -- public, private, parochial, whoever is getting the light. You know that there's a maintenance responsibilities as well as 1782 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET the timer issue with regard to building engineer or some designated person at the location. Obviously, schools are not open in the summer which, you know, adds to a whole other issue. Now, the funding for this -- I mean, didn't that funding become available July 1 in the 2000 Capital Budget? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: As I recall, there was some delay. The funding was approved, but it may not have been available on July 1 last year.
Do you know why that was? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: I remember having the discussion but not the details right now.
Okay, all right. If -- I know that the Budget Office is present or listening. If we could get a better explanation as to why money that is supposedly available to July is not available especially for something that's a safety -- COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: Councilman, this was a one-time issue, it was just a timing issue, that was all. 1783 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET And as I recall, we were working with Budget to make it available sooner. I'm not certain that it was available on July 1, but if it was not, it was probably available shortly after that.
All right. Well, Commissioner, I mean, the only thing I'm left, I guess, to say is -- is to pretty much state a little bit of the obvious, which is -- I mean, July 1 was eight months ago, and now we're basically saying, if we get a contract in place in two months, we'll be doing work in the summer. I mean, we will literally be in another fiscal year. I mean, it just cannot take that long, it just can't. I mean, whether for this one or for future ones. I mean, yes, we will have lost a year from the start of one fiscal year to the next with literally no production activity going on. And I just, you know, strongly emphasize and appeal to you that we need to correct this. COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: I think we're in agreement and we're committed to correcting that.
Thank you. 1784 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET Tell me about -- there was a bill passed a while ago having to deal -- having to do with issues affecting driveways and retaining walls and a proposal to, even if in a pilot program, fund the rehabilitation or reconstruction of these areas, which, in many instances, notwithstanding the fact that technically they are private property, they are certainly of a public use, City vehicles, specifically sanitation vehicles, in some instances, although we've had some relocations of pickup recently in at least some areas of my district to the front. Putting that aside, these areas are clearly used by many members of the public, not just the individual abutting homeowner. And does the Department have any plans or proposals to try to at least initially fund the proposed pilot program through the funding mechanism that was created by Council ordinance last year? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: The Streets Departments does not have funds appropriated for that program, either in operating or in capital.
Can you give me any sense of the Department's intention going 1785 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET forward -- well, let me ask the question this way: What is the Department's position about working with citizens on these kind of issues? What's the City's position dealing with these kinds of issue? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: Well, Councilman, the Streets Department worked diligently a year ago to try to help find a solution for the deterioration of retaining walls and driveways, and worked with your office in some instances as we developed a conceptual plan of how we may be able to mechanically get it done. Subsequent to that, we have not been able to find funds to prime the pump, if you will, to start or to initiate that program. We just haven't been able to get funded for -- find the funding for that program. But it's a program that we think would work mechanically. We assisted in developing that program, and once it's funded, would be able to work with citizens on addressing some of these problems.
All right, I'll have further discussions with the Budget Office about that. 1786 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET Do you have updated information with regard to a proposed new signalization, a computerized, maybe digital signalization plan for City Avenue, as well as the signalization program for the Green Lane Bridge, has that been completed? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: I'm going to defer that question to Charlie Trainor. (Witness comes forward.)
Charlie Trainor, Chief Traffic Engineer. Councilman, I know of no plans, I have not seen any plans for modifications to the traffic signals along City Avenue. Regarding the Green Lane Bridge --
Well, let's stay on that point. Are you aware of the, I believe, that the City Planning Commission, at least two, probably three and maybe even four years ago, conducted a study of signalization issues on City Avenue and produced a report with regard to the need for an upgrade and change in the signalization on City Avenue obviously affecting both Philadelphia and Lower Merion? 1787 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET
I don't know of any study on that. I haven't seen any report on that
Okay, I'll have the Planning Commission get in touch with you about that. Tell me about Green Lane Bridge
For the Green Lane Bridge, the traffic signal modifications on the City side of Green Lane and Main Street have been completed. I am not sure what the situation is on the township side regarding the exit ramps from the Schuylkill Expressway.
Well, isn't, I mean, the more comprehensive solution to the whole Green Lane Bridge situation, doesn't that require changes in signalization not only on the City side at Green Lane and Maine but also on the county or township side at the on-ramp to I-76?
Yes, it does, and that was a part of a PennDOT county project stretching along the full length of Belmont Avenue in the township. I believe that their contract has started, but I don't know where they are within that contract or in the improvements to the exits. 1788 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET
Okay. Lastly, Mr. Trainor, let me put on the record here, and I think anyone who's within listening distance should take note. It is my understanding that in a recent conversation with a member of my staff, not only did you admit, possibly for the first time in your government service, that you were wrong on an issue, but also --
But also that in response to a question you actually said "yes." Commissioner, let me commend you for all of your efforts in the short period of time that you have been here to turn Mr. Trainor around. I think the government is clearly headed in the right direction, and I want to commend you. (Laughter.)
Councilman, has he now lost his title of "Dr. No"? (Laughter.)
No, Madam Chair, that test is yet to come over the next few months, 1789 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET but he is weakening over time. Thank you, Mr. Trainor. Thank you, Commissioner.
Commissioner, getting back to the blinking lights for just a moment, I know we appropriated $5,000. How many lights could be installed with that amount of money?
Oh, gosh... I believe... I believe that they -- hang on one second. (Commissioner confers with colleague off the record.) COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: Yes, it's between and 30, depending on the costs of the 16 construction. 17
Thank you. 18 The Chair recognizes Councilwoman Miller. 19
Thank you, Madam 20 President. 21 Good morning, Commissioner. 22 COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: Good morning. 23
And good morning to 24 the Streets Department staff. I just have a few 25 questions here. 1790 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET One, what is the construction -- completion of construction date for the Chestnut Hill Bridge? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: It's better to give you a start date than a completion date. The bridge in Chestnut Hill, I believe some utility work may be underway. The bidding process for the major construction has not been completed yet, but we anticipate starting construction this year on that bridge.
Okay. All right, thank you. We'll have a meeting, you know, about this a little later. And I'd also like to know when you talk about the -- with the Sweep Program and people are out getting citations, you said that you've written -- you project to write 21,000 citations in '02 and, of course, with the increased amount looking at '03. I'd just like to know from you the same I asked from L&I. Can you get a record of those 21,000 and how many have been paid? 'Cause one of the things that happens is, I don't believe people pay citations and they 1791 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET continue to just get 'em for almost the same reasons, and this is really a quality-of-life issue out in neighborhoods. And with those citations, the citations that the Sanitation officer from the Police Department issues, those are two separate citations? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: Those are separate citations.
Okay. COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: Now, we'll have to get you a breakdown of our revenue or the number of those citations that get paid on an annual basis /I know that it's a number that's probably being tracked in Finance, but it's a number that we can probably get for you.
Okay. And I'd also like to get information on the modernization and repair of street lights. Are you replacing the lights as they get broke or as a pole -- someone told me that the lights were being replaced if they were broken or if a car ran into the pole. Do you have a systemic plan for replacing the streets lights? 1792 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: We're trying to modernize as we do repairs, but I believe Charlie does have a plan where there are certain areas of the City that he's working on systematically.
Okay. COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: But we do have the occasional knock-down or a signal that's going to go out or that goes out that has to be replaced, and where possible, we will try to upgrade it.
Do these lights give a better illumination? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: Well, there are two things that we are doing. One of the things that's being done throughout the City is that we're replacing the red, yellow, and green lights with an LED light that gives an equivalent illumination but is more energy-efficient. And through that process, we've been able to save money, and project to save money, on our energy bills in the future. The other type of modernization is where we are eliminating a lot of the old electro- mechanical-type device signals and going into more solid-state controllers that could be centralized 1793 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET and controlled from a central location. So to answer your question, there are a number of things that we're doing to improved the quality of signals throughout the City, and at all locations, we are not actually going in and putting in fiber optics and tying them into the system. Some locations right now just, we're just upgrading or changing the type of actually light that we're using to more energy-efficient lighting.
'Cause in a lot of the neighborhoods, particularly in my district near Temple, you know, when you ride up Broad Street and it looks like it's daylight no matter what time you ride because of the lights at Temple Hospital and Children's Hospital. So many of the neighbors, you know, of course, want that type of bright light, and we understand, you know, I don't needs to talk about why it's like that there and why it's not like that in neighborhoods. But that just tells me that most people want a brighter street light, you know, for public-safety reasons. So I think that's all my questions, Council President Verna. And I want to thank you 1794 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET and thank the Streets Department. I do have some issues, but I'll be meeting with the Streets Department separately to go over some of the other things that concerns the 8th district.
Very well, thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilman Clarke.
Thank you, Madam President. Councilman Nutter, I just want to add to your first; this is a second. Mr. Trainor, Commissioner, I'd like to thank you for the 19th and Rittenhouse Square situation. Things are changing, Councilman Nutter. You all both know what I'm talking about. Thank you. Getting rave reviews for that light. I got a couple of quick questions, kind of follow-ups to earlier questions in a earlier hearing. One is my North Broad Street street-light issue, Avenue of the Arts North. I know it was maybe only a couple weeks ago that I talked to you about that, and can you give me a sense of any movement on that issue? Have we advanced that 1795 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET discussion on that issue? As that as I look on where you talk about modernization, and there are a substantial number of lights that will be replaced, and I'm wondering, are they being replaced with the traditional brown rounds, the traditional brown rounds, or can you give me sense of that and where we are with the Avenue of the Arts North? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: Yes, Councilman. Typically they are being replaced with the -- with what we call "brown rounds," which, I've discovered, was a Streets Department-coined term to describe the difference in the type of pole that we're using versus the old aluminum pole, and there are some brown square poles. So these are what they call "brown-round poles." With regards to your question on North Broad Street, we've evaluated the cost of the lighting that had been planned to go in, which would have been the traditional brown rounds that we are replacing throughout the City and compared that to what's currently on South Broad Street and found that it would just be too cost-prohibitive to do that. 1796 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET However, we did look at a light fixture that was recently installed on Kelly Drive, and we believe that we would be able to put a fixture on North Broad Street similar to the one that we just installed on Kelly Drive specifically because it's the Avenue of the Arts and it's just kind of an area that we're trying to revitalize and continue some of the efforts that were done on South Broad Street. So this is not something that we would typically be able to do, but in this case, I think we're going to be able to do that if that will be satisfactory.
Because we did get additional funding from the State for that project. COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: We haven't been able to get additional funding from the State. We think that this fixture will be about to 20 25 percent more than the traditional brown rounds, but we may be able to find that money in the project.
I mean, you're saying that -- and I understand it was a problem with respects to the original appropriation lapsing, but 1797 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET we in fact went back to reignite that appropriations on the State level. Are you saying that we are not going to be able to get that money from the State? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: No, no, I'm not saying that. I'm saying that the process that we went through to do the evaluation didn't incorporate going back to the State at this point.
Okay, that's using the allocated amount from the State. COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: Right. We might be able to find it within the monies that were allocated from the State.
Okay, okay. Thank you. The other issue, as a follow-up, I'm going to keep banging on this one. The public relations campaign on anti-littering, are we any further along on that one? And every time we come here and talk about NTI or Streets Department, I'm going to bring it up. I think we got to do something. COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: We have designed a conceptual campaign for anti-litter. We have initiated a litter indexing process throughout the 1798 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET City in support of that campaign but, again, we are still trying to identify funding to support the campaign. We thought we may be able to get funding from the State. The State has agreed to fund the recycling campaign that we alluded to earlier. They may in future years allow us to incorporate a stronger message against littering after we've shown some success and progress in the recycling campaign. But as of today, we don't have funding identified to support a campaign.
Well, are there any foundations, any nonprofits? I mean, I don't think we should limit ourselves to government. COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: Yeah, we were looking for both government funding and private funding source, and we just haven't been successful in finding any funding sources right now.
You need any help? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: Yes, yes, we need help.
I mean, whatever I can do or whoever I can corral into supporting this 1799 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET particular initiative 'cause I know that a lot of people, a lot of my colleagues are -- we have a real issue about littering and debris being put in our streets, and we are increasingly being asked to add to our budget to provide a workforce to clean up after individuals, 'cause that's essentially what we're doing. And I think at some point, you know, we've reached a limit in terms of our willingness to increase our workforce to clean up after people, and I think we need to work on the front side as to change people's attitudes towards their community so we won't have to continue to ramp up our workforce on that. Ready, Willing and Able. I went to New York maybe four or five years ago when we initially started talking about it. Are you familiar with the program? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: No. 21
It's a program that started in New York, was a -- it started in a transitional housing initiative where individuals who had substance-abuse problems or other problems got into a program, and the program actually 1800 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET created an initiative that individuals who were in this transitional housing development had to work and they had to pay rent and they had to become educated to become marketable. And in New York what they did was incorporated these individuals, particularly in business corridors, where they got contracts, went directly to the organization, and the individuals actually worked in the business corridors, cleaning the streets and the sidewalks. And I asked that question, and you mentioned earlier that the City was looking at an initiative on North Broad, and I was wondering if there was some discussions with that organization, particularly given the fact that they've already started working, I believe, in Fairmount Park and maybe West River Drive. And I was wondering -- I'm not looking to, you know, take any work from our great workforce in the Streets Department, but I think that as an addendum to the potential of us cleaning up that we need to look into the possibility of having them add on to a part of our process here. You may want to look into the New York 1801 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET model because they've been very successful there, and actually, my understanding is they actually got in the business community to buy into funding substantial portions of the contracts up there. Commissioner, I think actually it was last year, we talked about the potential of having multiple tasks for sanitation workers on their routes. Have we had any further discussions with the unions and the membership about that, or is that just a dead issue? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: We have broached the issue with them and, in some cases, are able to get them to help us to identify, you know, if there are obvious problems on issues with the street in the field as they're going about doing their work. But their work is pretty intense and it's -- it's not something that I would say has been openly received in terms of adding additional responsibilities to the crew that's out there picking up 14 tons of trash during the course of a day.
Mm-hmm. COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: But wherever possible, they do cooperate with us, and our 1802 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET supervisors do cooperate in trying to help us to identify any problem areas or obvious problem areas in the field.
Okay, there's no 6 formalized agreement? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: No. 8
Okay, that's fine. Lastly, earlier in your testimony, you talked the about snow removal budget. What did you say that budget was? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: I believe it's 2.9.
2.9. COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: 2.9 million, and we've used 1.5.
The 2.9 was based on what, the anticipation of how many snowstorms? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: I think over the years, it's just kind of been what's been appropriated for snow-fighting. As you know, it's kind of hard to predict what a snow season is going to look like, and that's kind of just been the amount that's been carried over the years and appropriated for snow-fighting efforts. 1803 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET
So this year, we had one storm, not a major storm, and we spent half of the 2.9 allocation? So in prior years, I'm assuming that when we had the traditional winters, we went beyond the 2.9? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: There have been more years that the Department has gone over on its snow-fighting budget. I know last year, we had -- people keep telling me it was a mild winter last year, but we had over 11 events, 11 or storms 12 that we were called out for. And we did exceed the appropriated budget. But the process is that if we have a mild winter, like we've had this year, there may be funds left over. If we exceed the budget, then we work with the Budget Bureau and the Budget Department of Finance to appropriate funds to cover the cost of fighting snow at the end of the year.
Councilwoman Miller, you had a question about the extra money, the leftover money from the budget, the snow-removal budget?
There wasn't much left. 1804 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET
The Councilwoman wanted to know if we could use that money for school flashing lights.
We didn't have snow and we didn't that much left. I think we only had what, $200,000 left? COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: I think the school flasher program has been funded, I believe, at $500,000 for the current year. We still have a number of sites, though, probably the full complement of sites yet to be constructed under last year's appropriation. So I don't believe that the issue or the concern with the flashers is as much a funding issue as it is a process issue, and we're working on accelerating that process right now so that we can get more school flashers done.
Yeah, I think it's both, because in the City, we have Catholic schools, public schools, private schools, charter schools. Every year, my list grows every time a new school opens up, everybody, everybody wants a school flashing light now. So it's not so much -- so I just think we 1805 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET need more money so we can do more lights in terms of volume. Instead of three a year per Council District, we would love to do six a year. I mean, maybe some districts don't have as many schools, but I think we have a waiting list in my office of about schools. And at three a year, we'll never 8 get to that. 9 And then as new charter schools open, you 10 know, they want flashing lights, and this just 11 continues to grow and grow. 12 When I first came to City Council in '96, 13 it was a very short list, but now we have -- I have 14 a very long list that just continues to grow 'cause 15 everybody wants that. 16 COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: We have another 17 tool that we can use in situations like that. If 18 it looks like we're going to run out of funding 19 before we're able to get school flashers and it's 20 going to be a long period of time for the first year, we now have funds appropriated for what we call the flourescent yellow-green program. If you notice on Roosevelt Boulevard where we have the flourescent yellow-green pedestrian crossing signs, that's the type of sign that we can 1806 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET also use in school zones to kind of supplements our school flasher program. So we do have some funds appropriated to install flourescent yellow-green signs in addition to the school flashing program. So we can work with your office on looking at locations that are going to be out there in terms of the amount of time that it's going to take to get to their installation and look at the possibility of installing flourescent yellow-green as an interim step.
Okay, good. Thank you. COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: I would also like to add that I have here packets for all Councilmembers that would reflect, in addition to what streets we're planning to resurface in your districts, it would also reflect those areas that are scheduled for school flasher installation and a list of schools that are waiting to be scheduled.
Thank you very much, Commissioner. Councilman, are you finished? 1807 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET
Commissioner, thank you. COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: Thank you.
Thank you very much. At the request of Councilman Nutter, we're calling back the L&I Department. (L&I Department members return to the witness table.)
Thank you, Madam Chair. And first, to the L&I Commissioner, thank you for staying. I apologize to you and to your staff. I was delayed by other City business, so I know that we're taking you out of turn. To Commissioner Kishinchand from the Water Department, I apologize for any delay as well, but I do have some questions that I need to ask of the L&I Commissioner and his team, so I apologize to both and I thank you for your cooperation. Commissioner, let me start on 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET your testimony. The first bullet is encapsulation. Your testimony talks about in FY '03, under the auspices of NTI and working in conjunction with the Housing Authority, you're anticipating doing 350 properties for encapsulization, which I think is up from -- what is it, 72 in '01 and how many in '02, 100? Is that on the service report? COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: We're estimating about 60.
60? COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Obviously, we missed it in the report.
Okay. Do you know at the moment how or where and when for the encapsulization for '03 where the activity will take place, what's the schedule, the timetable, and the location?
Councilman, the NTI staff, along with the contractor hired, Hill, will work with each individual Council District Councilperson to arrive at what will be done, when and where it will be done in their Council districts.
All right. Deputy Commissioner Solvibile, do you know when that will 1809 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET take place?
The prototype in Strawberry Mansion is being worked on now, and I can't say when it will be done in each district, but I know the start of it will be -- they're putting out the package for Strawberry Mansion for demolition in April, I believe.
Okay. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: I'd just like to emphasize something that we said before, and that is L&I does exist outside of NTI, and we'll be making those same decisions that we've always made in other neighborhoods besides the NTI project neighborhoods.
All right. I appreciate that, Commissioner, and I know that the folks in Strawberry Mansion will be very happy about the prototype or the pilot, and I'm sure they'll be talking to Councilman Clarke about that.
I'm sorry, Councilman. The further answer to that is that initially the intent is for every two weeks, a package of demolition/encapsulation to be put out after April.
Okay. The second 1810 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET bullet point on is about the Vacant Lot Cleaning Program. Your testimony says, in January '01, you did a vacant property survey, and there are 30,729 vacant lots in the City. In the spring of '01, you started cleaning the lots, and the City was going to start to bill people for the cost. Do you know if that component has taken place?
Absolutely. It's ongoing. The Managing Director's Office was gracious enough to let us hire an additional clerk that was placed with our Clean and Seal Unit, where the billing takes place for cleaning of vacant lots. And that has been done and it is being done presently
I'll have to get back to you. I'm not sure of the answer today. It would have to come from the Managing Director's Office, I believe.
And who's going to do the follow-up to make sure that people pay?
The Revenue Department. And/or if they don't play, a lien's placed again 1811 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET the lot that the City then tries to use -- that the City uses to put up for sheriff's sale and for community use and/or to become part of a redevelopment package. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: That's a standard practice within Revenue for all of our liens.
Later on in the same section, FY '01, you cleaned and sealed 1693 buildings in FY '01; 3132 this year; 4,016 in FY '03. Now, is that -- again, the FY '03 number, is that with the anticipation of NTI funds or how are your clean-and-seals increasing over the past couple of years?
We're not doing lots. Presently with the Managing Director's Office doing lots, our crews that used to do lots and buildings now can concentrate on just doing buildings -- with one exception. We still work with a first- offenders group who does lots for us, but we do that -- we coordinate that with the Managing Director's Office.
So you're saying that 1812 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET now you'll be able to do more clean-and-seals because you're not focussed on vacant lots?
Yes. The crews that were at one time -- at least half of our crews was working Lots; now they can just concentrate on doing buildings.
And can you provide, through the Chair, a list of the vacant lots throughout the City, the 30,729 by address, by Council District?
The Biannual Cleaning Schedule, what is it? I mean, when will the various lots --
Okay. With regard to the tours, FY '01, FY '02, $2.5 million to correct problems that were 1813 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET identified in various tours. Do you have a list of the various problems, the corrections that were made and the costs?
Yes. We can provide that to the Chair. We track it. The costs we would have to add to it for some of it, but yes, we can do that.
Okay. Well, I assume that you knew the costs based on --
We know the total but we didn't -- I'm not sure that we had it broken down individually for clean and seal. The 2.5 cost was mainly for encapsulization and demolition.
Okay. On your testimony, Fire Safety. What's the inspection program as it relates to school buildings?
As far as the inspection program, we try to get into each school on a yearly basis.
And, one, I guess is, do you get the level of cooperation that you need from the School District? And what exactly are you checking for, and is it only a fire safety inspection? 1814 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET
In the school district, in the school buildings, we look for fire safety as far as egress, fire alarms, any part of the fire system. As far as level of cooperation, we just had a meeting recently, our Chief of the Fire Unit had a meeting with their maintenance people, and we have been in touch with their Chief of Security, Dexter Green, and have an ongoing dialogue with him also now.
What about the other various codes in, I guess, what's generally either the building code or the property maintenance code? What level of inspections do we have again at the various school buildings regarding plumbing, electrical, building and other various codes? What is our schedule? what are the requirements? and under what provision, if any, are school buildings required to be inspected?
The buildings are required to be for fire safety. If our fire inspectors are in the building and notice anything out of the ordinary in reference to the plumbing or electrical system, they'll notify the appropriate unit. 1815 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET A school building is not -- we do not inspect for property-maintenance issues on a School District building.
Basically, when a building is constructed, it comes under that code at that time. If there's issues as far as, again, fire doors hanging or things of that nature, we'll be involved with that, but as far as the structure itself, we don't have jurisdiction over inspections.
Councilman, David Perri, Deputy Commissioner. In terms of the building, plumbing and electrical code, the School District does secure permits anytime that they're doing that type of work. Those codes are not retroactive; they're only enforced at the time that a permit is obtained, and the Department has been doing ongoing permit inspections to make sure that building, plumbing, and electrical provisions and permits are being adhered to.
Well, I understand that. Well, let me ask this question: How do we know on an annual basis from school year to school 1816 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET year that any of our school buildings are safe and appropriate for children or adults to spend six, seven hours a day there?
Well, in general, the fire code deals with retroactive requirements and ongoing maintenance requirements for school buildings as well as other buildings in the City. And the fire code is pretty extensive, especially as it deals with school buildings in terms of making sure that panic hardware is in place, the fire alarm system is operational, the stair towers are operational. So as long as they're not altering the building, the building would have been deemed to have been safe at the time it was constructed and/or any additions on that particular building. So then you're into basically a maintenance-type inspection after the building has its initial occupancy. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: I think to answer your question, we have no program for monitoring those issues other than fire issues inside those building. They're the responsibility of the people in charge of the building. If we got 1817 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET a complaint, we would answer the complaint within that discipline.
Is there an annual certification or a report made about, again, specifically all of the school buildings with regard to the either fire-safety inspection or any other inspection? COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: We have not done a report like.
Does anybody sign a document saying that there has been such a safety inspection and whether the building passed or failed? COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: There are certifications that come from each inspection of the fire system by certification companies, companies that actually look at and test those alarms. They supply us with certifications.
Okay. Let's talk about code violation notices. It appears that -- I guess the number is going up, more code violation notices issued. What is your experience with regard to either compliance of paying a fine or the stopping 1818 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET of certain behavior that was the reason that the violation was issued in the first place?
We already stated that we're going to get a report from Administrative adjudication to see what our rate of compliance is or our rate of payment of those tickets are. In most cases, the tickets, we found in a few cases where the tickets actually work where they're given out on a daily basis. We go back on the third day and most of the time, it's complied, the situation is complied.
Commissioner, I need to mention to you -- and then I'm going to talk about some nuance activities. I received a response to a request to a question about enforcement activity, and you and I and various members of your team have had discussions in the past about enforcement and when the matter proceeds to court and who takes the matter to court. I have -- and I've not had an opportunity to talk to them. I mean, I have a virtually unintelligible, although English-based, response from the Law Department as to who's responsible for 1819 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET taking what to court under what circumstances, whether it's the Law Department, whether it's L&I. Now, I did learn to read a long time ago, and I know what all of these words mean, but as they are phrased or put together in sentences, I'm left slightly perplexed as to whose ultimate responsibility it is to take a matter to court, what court do they take to it, and who has to carry that ball in terms of follow-up. The Law Department says L&I has all of the various powers and duties and abilities to move things to court. The last I checked, most of you are probably not attorneys, and so the ultimate argument in court is probably an argument that needs to be made by the various attorneys. And so there seems to be from time to time a shifting back and forth of who has what responsibility and what jurisdiction, and to just get something to court is one thing or have it lined up to go to court, but to actually have it proceeded upon and action taken and a prosecution, it seems to be an entirely different issue, and at times, a less than enthusiastic response in terms of what matters actually go to court and who does 1820 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET what. So I'm going to tell you -- and I'll be glad to give you a copy of this. I mean, they cite chapters and verses of the City Charter, the Philadelphia Code. They left out, you know, the Constitution of the United States and the Magna Carta. But it is not crystal0clear to me as to who actually does enforcement in the City, which then leads, from my perspective, to no enforcement and a complete breakdown of anybody's belief that something is actually going to happen to them. There is a mindset in this city that says it is clearly easier to either avoid the government or, at a minimum, ask for forgiveness, rather than to ask permission, the result of which is a whole host of things that go left unchecked. What are we going to do to not only issue the violation notice, which I commend you for, but actually have some action taken? COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Part of the issue is our fault and part of it lies with the court system. To address the court system part of this, 1821 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET we met with Judge McCaffrey regarding Municipal Court. You know, the problem with writing a violation, doing a follow-up inspection, finding out that the person did not comply, and then sending it to Municipal Court was taking the issue, the community issue, and sending it into an abyss just where the complaint just languished. Judge McCaffrey recognized that and brought us to a meeting where both he and Judge Silverstein suggested that from that point on, and that about a month and a half, two months ago, that we ask for $10,000 conditional fines on all of our Municipal Court cases. Councilman, I assure you that we have been getting better compliance, a lot of reaction to that. And, of course, that goes away right back down to court costs if people pay attention to it. The other side of this, and this is the issue of...
Tracking. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Equity Court, Equity Court, where -- go ahead, Bob.
Yes, Councilman. We're represented by attorneys in Equity Court. 1822 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET
But in Municipal Court, we have our hearing officers that are code administrator ones that represent us. And as the Commissioner said in very plain English, we told our hearing officers, in all cases where there's not compliance we want the maximum fine, which is $10,000. And where a owner comes forward and has complied with the violation prior to having the court date, but a court notice was sent, we told our hearing officers they can make agreements for $200 per inspection that we were forced to make. If Deputy Commissioner Verdi's housing people are out there 5 times, we ask for $1,000 plus court costs. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: The other part of the problem lies with the client relationship of L&I with the Law Department, where they're clients. I've talked to Cheryl Gaston about that, and Cheryl very graciously accepts that role as us being the people to hold them accountable for what they're doing for us. In that regard, we have instituted a 1823 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET process where we're better monitoring the cases that we send into Equity Court. And I see Bob moving again; he wants to talk more about that
We initially were going to check if the request was made to Equity Court every four months to make sure it was moving along, but yesterday, in talking with the Commissioner, we decided to make it every month that we'll check on the status of the cases. And that, I think, affects a couple of the project that were involved with you, Councilman.
You're correct, and I'll get to those. I would like to suggest, though, for the record that there still needs to be greater coordination between primarily L&I and the Law Department. There's been some discussion around here in a different forum possibly about the need to separate out all of these housing and building-related issues and violations possibly into literally a separate court system, similar to what they have in Cleveland, where they have a 1824 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET Housing Court. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Right.
That's what the judge does, they have a whole staff of people that not help people get resolution to their issues, but also action to be taken by that court. They understand the issues, they pay attention to what's going. On in our Municipal Court, and sometimes certainly even in our Common Pleas with the Equity Court, one minute you're dealing with a housing issue, the next minute, you're dealing with some other issue. And, obviously, the judge has to pay attention to a whole variety of different things coming at them. And I think that the more specialized court for these kinds of activities will get you quicker resolution and more direct action as it relates to not just, are we checking on a person to see if there's movement. I mean, you know as well as I do that people play this system, they know the rules and regulations as well, if not better than, we do, and can extend their time doing whatever it is that 1825 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET they're doing way beyond what anybody thinks is acceptable. Let me commend all of you for your work with us on nuisance-type issues, the work that you've been doing and have committed to do for a variety of my constituents, and in particular, the North Light Leadership Team and St. Lucy's, Wissahickon Neighbors, Manayunk Neighborhood Council, some of the activities that we have going on over in the Wynnefield and Overbrook sections. I do want to thank you for that. This is not just, you know, a time to talk about the things that are not working. In this particular realm, we've done a lot of good work together, and do I want to thank you and commend you for those activities COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Thank you.
" I don't want so much to talk about that; what I want to talk about but in that regard is, I'd like to ask you to give thought and work with other appropriate departments of government and the Managing Director's Office, 1826 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET and I have had this discussion before. I think that there is a need for the creation by the government of a small booklet. " I think that anyone conducting business in the City, having a real-estate transaction, that as a part of that transaction, they should have this document so that they understand upfront, day of transaction -- I mean, I'm not saying give them a Philadelphia Code; no one would ever take a look at that, but there are certainly portions of it that could be extracted and highlighted as things that -- the fundamentals that people need to know and understand. When we talk about the Water Department, who's coming up next, I mean, people need to know and understand that a sewer lateral is a part of their responsibility. It's not ours, it's yours. You own, it it's connected to your house, and our responsibility starts at the sewer. And there are a wide variety of things that are a part of Philadelphia Code that people 1827 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET either don't know or claim they don't know, and they're not necessarily going to knock themselves out trying to find out about it, and I think that if we produced a document like that, it might be somewhat helpful to us. I just have a couple of other items, gentlemen, and then I'll let you go I'd be intrigued to learn more -- not necessarily right now -- about what you have on , this LY&I and Law Department Training Program. We just talked about the nature of the relationship between the two departments, and I'd like to encourage us taking that relationship to another step. You talked about simplifying and consolidating permits and licenses. I look forward to the day. " I mean, we -- you know, it is a gauntlet trying to do anything in this city, and the notion of calling something a "business-privilege license" 1828 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET is an insult to anybody to get one. One, it's a privilege generally to have many of them here. It is a major hassle at times to try to do anything in this city, and just when you think you've gotten all of the items that you believe you're supposed to get, we come along and tell you about this one another thing, from which we will now extract either more money from you or force you to fill out another form and possibly jeopardize all of the other licenses that you have. To the extent that some of the licenses have to be separate because they are unique and special, I understand that. But if you're in the restaurant business, you should basically be able to get one license for your restaurant business. The fact that you want to have entertainment or you want to have a dance hall or something like, that should all be included as a part of to a larger checklist. To the extent that the community needs to know that you're going to have dancing, obviously you don't want to obscure that and you don't want to minimize that. On the other hand, making someone get all of these separate licenses, all of which you have 1829 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET to have anyway to be in business, but that they are separate, does nothing but drive people crazy. And so I look forward to this program and to the extent that we can have fewer licenses and fewer permits. Not trying to hide anything from anybody or obscure anything, but cut down on the amount of time and paperwork that people have to spend at various agencies. And I know some of this stuff may eventually go online to make it simpler. I think you'll be doing all of us a big favor. Tell me about lead paint and any inspection processes that the Department engages in. We had a lot of discussion yesterday about lead paint in the City.
We had some discussion, again, in the real estate transaction requiring not only the notification or disclosure requirement but also that the person -- either the seller or the buyer -- actually has to do something about lead paint in the house that they are buying or selling before that transaction can be effectuated. Tell me anything that L&I does with regard to lead payment in either abatement or the possibility of lead poisoning of a person or a child. 1830 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET
A few weeks ago, one of our supervisors from our Housing Unit met with some people over at the Health Department, and we're working back and forth information from our people to theirs in reference to some lead-based paint issues. Basically, it's going to involve our referral over to them when we see any chipped paint in apartment buildings or houses that we get called to. The majority of the violations right now would come from the Health Department 'cause our inspectors not trained in lead-based paint abatement or testing. That would come directly from them. But we have been speaking to them, and we'll be having ongoing talks with them on how to enhance our efforts to help in the enhancement.
Well, let me give you at least one idea. I don't know necessarily at the moment that I'm prepared to call it "a suggestion," but on the last item in the testimony, we talk about this real-estate certification. Now, we have talked about this on a number of occasions. And as best I can understand, in the 1831 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET sales transaction, you ever to get a certification. If there's never been a violation against the property, or there are no open violations that we know of, you basically get a clean bill of health. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Right.
Which, in reality, is meaningless. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Mm-hmm. It just means there's no violations.
There could be 12 against the property, but if no one ever inspects 13 the property, no one will ever know about it, so 14 you believe that you're getting a document that's 15 telling you that nothing is wrong when all it means 16 is that some neighbor, some person, somebody never 17 called the Department, and it has no open 18 violation. It doesn't mean that there aren't any 19 violations; it's a virtually meaningless piece of 20 paper. If there is a violation, tell me what happens. You go to get your certification, there's an outstanding violation on the property, what happens? COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Well, there's 1832 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET two things that could happen: You could clean the violation up, you could do whatever you have to do to comply with the code, and it disappears from the certification; or you could take a certification to closing with that violation on it and debate whether the person who's buying the property will accept that responsibility, because what happens when a new owner takes over, the violation gets put into that owner's name.
Well, let me mention this to you: We have a little place near us where some Philadelphians flee from time to time. In Lower Merion Township, they have something called a "seller's certificate," and you can't sell your property in Lower Merion Township without a seller's certificate, and you can't get a seller's certificate unless the township has come out and inspected visually the exterior of your property. And if a down-spout is not connected, if your sidewalk is broken up, or if there are other violations against the property, you don't get a certification; no certification, no sale, end of discussion. All I'm talking about is giving some 1833 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET meaning to a real estate certification that has value to, at a minimum, the buyer, and tells the seller, You're either going to do it or the buyer's going to do it, but somebody's going to clear this violation. I mean, there's not much debate about a closing. I mean, you're either doing a transaction or you're not. But at the moment, you know, you've got -- whatever the violation is, I don't think it's going to get resolved at that table. And if the seller agrees, all right, fine, I'll deal with it, and I know it's on there. Virtually nothing's going to happen to him anyway so, I mean, that doesn't get you anywhere, it doesn't get you to get to a resolution, and you haven't caused anyone to change their behavior. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Well, getting back to the $10,000 there, hopefully that got somebody's attention a long time before the house is ready to be sold, hopefully.
I understand. I appreciate it. All right, the last issue for the day is signs, signs out on the highway, signs out on 1834 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET poles -- this is separate and apart from billboards. Now, I brought in today a sign that I took from the intersection of Parkside and Girard Avenue on Saturday. It is a sign for a business in my district -- (Councilman holds up red and yellow sign that says "Furniture Liquidation, Furniture Express. Saturday, Sunday, Monday...") -- which was out in the planning strip on the Parkside of Parkside and Girard. There were about of 'em out there, and there are usually a 15 bunch of them on Lancaster Avenue. 16 Now, I don't understand why people can put 17 signs out in the public right-of-way, signs on 18 poles that say "Call Me If You Want a Job," 19 "Call If You Want To Lose Weight" -- I mean, maybe 20 I should use that one. Call here, call there, roofing, all kinds of advertising on poles, and this stuff's out in the roadway and no one ever grabs it. I don't know that anyone called this business and said, "You don't have a right to do this." 1835 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET But I am sick of it. It is all over the place and stays out there forever. Now, they have no right to put this kind of signage out in the middle of the public right-of-way, in planning strip, or anywhere else. So my question is, what do we do about people who do put out illegal signage for which they clearly have no permit, no right, nothing? Do we ever contact them, do we rip the stuff down ourselves and send them a bill or anything else? COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: The issue is most of the time on those signs is that you can't find out who the offending party is.
I think the offending party in this one is Furniture Express, and they're at 54th and Lancaster, and their building is painted red and yellow.
I'm going to take your sign when we leave, after the Commissioner -- COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Yes. And this is something that L&I does all the time. We take those signs down, we confiscate them, we issue those CVNs for that, but it's back to L&I can't be everywhere, and do I do a programmatic thing for 1836 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET signs? I don't think so; it's way down on the list of priorities on how to use inspectors. But we'll respond to any, you know, to any complaints like that.
Well, I understand that, Commissioner. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: And we have responded. It's just not -- it's not something -- we don't have a detail of people riding around the streets looking for these signs. I'll tell you one thing that's going --
Well, I think we need a detail because, I mean, if you want to talk about blight elimination -- COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: I understand.
This has a serious blighting effect in many neighborhoods throughout this city. And, you know, if people want to advertise, you got a newspaper, you got a radio, various forms of communication, and we'll have a subsequent discussion about billboards. You have a permit, fine, put it on a billboard. I don't even like it but, I mean, if it's legal, that's fine. But in other jurisdictions, you just can't 1837 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET do this kind of stuff, and people do have a dedicated group of people who go around and deal with this. I mean, blight is not just a building falling down; it is a about a quality of life in certain neighborhoods where people think that they can do whatever they want to do, and no one's going to do anything about it. Now, that has a blighting effect on some people, and those people make decisions about where they want to live, because they don't have to live here. They just go. You can't do this kind of stuff in a whole host of other jurisdictions. And I understand that no building falling on someone matches up with this; there's just no 16 comparison between the two. But in some places, it is a very serious issue, and people do make decisions about what they're going to do. This a city that's becoming poorer and poorer and poorer for a variety of reasons, and I'm not saying that anybody moved because this ugly sign was out at Parkside and Girard Avenue; it just contributes to an environment of, It's a sign today, it's another thing tomorrow. It is the lack of civility in many neighborhoods throughout this 1838 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET city that tells people no one cares, because until my neighborhood falls apart, I will get no 4 attention. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: There's a pilot program that's now ongoing in the 24th Police District, and I understand that it's going to go to -- there's Youth Aid Panels in every police district. Youthful first offenders get sentenced by these people. In the pilot program in the 24th District, it sentences those youthful offenders to going out and doing what you're talking about; Going out and collecting those signs. Now, those signs -- they're recording the location of the signs, and I've just talked to the people that are running it regarding getting those signs to us, or at least getting a sample of the sign to us in case we can ever -- you know, in your case, we'll go after the specific individual.
Right. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: But, you know, regarding those Diet Right signs and all that stuff you see --
You've got Diets, 1839 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET you've got, you've got Charlotte's Earrings, you've got Sam's doing this and Joey's doing the other thing. I mean, they have either phone numbers, Websites, something. I mean, someone could spend a little time finding these people. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: We do that.
I mean, the only reason they have a sign out there is because they want someone to call them. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: We do that.
And do we -- we do what? COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: You can imagine, they're trained not to give out any information. I mean, we've sent violations -- go ahead, Dominic.
We've sent violations. I went as far as sending a violation to Sony themselves because we couldn't get -- we had a record label. Over the weekends -- after the weekends in the club districts, especially in the area where we discussed earlier, in Manayunk, you're going to find signs posted all over.
We've asked our inspectors to 1840 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET go through as they're doing their block checks. Business Compliance is in charge of those illegal signs also. So we've asked them to go through certain areas during the beginning of the week to clear out the mess from the weekend.
We've asked the Police Department to keep a lookout for the companies that come along and post these signs. If you looked on Delaware Avenue tonight after midnight, you'd see posters from Spring Garden Street all the way up north; and look south, you'll see the same thing. But what happens is, a lot of these posters are advertising a product. We go as far now as actually writing a ticket and sending it to Sony, who is the recording studio for that artist because we can't get an address for the artist.
The dot-com companies, we've tracked them down, and I've personally sent them e-mails on their Websites. And, unfortunately, I can't send them a ticket over the Website and I can't get their addresses. But they're smart enough to know to get a toll-free number, they get 1841 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET a Website where we can't hit 'em with an address, and they're posting signs all over. So the best we could do is, our people take 'em down, and in some cases, I've asked the Managing Director's help through Tom Conway with anti-graffiti that if they see them, take 'em down and send 'em over to us, and we'll issue the violations as needed.
Okay. Last question. What's going on with -- throughout the City with regard to billboards? What is our policy, what's happening with permitting, and what's going on with illegal billboards? COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: For the last year, I -- for the last year, I have had people working on gathering the information, trying to identify the locations of all of the billboards. We've worked with SCRUB and gotten a lot of information from them regarding billboards are. There's not one billboard that is put up today that has not gone through a legal process, that has not gotten a permit, a building permit, gone through the -- gone in front of the Zoning Board, either been turned down or gotten permission 1842 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET to exist. The billboards that came up over time, when nobody cared about billboards and nobody was paying attention to the h sheets (ph), what they call the signs that are on the sides of the buildings.
I understand. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Nobody was paying attention to the evolution of all of that. We are now trying to get a handle on all of that. We have somewhere in the area of 4500 records on 4500 sign faces. The ordinance 14 regulates sign face rather than the billboard itself.
Okay. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Some of them are double and triple on one structure.
Right. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: So what I'm looking toward in computerizing all of that information, creating inspection forms, we're going back over the record with all of those -- each individual record and putting in a census tract. By the end of this year, we'll be conducting a 1843 3/5/02 WHOLE - CONT'D. FY '03 OPERATING BUDGET citywide survey, using census tracts and having inspections conducted both to verify the information that we have in our record and picking up any additional signs. Our objective in everything doing is to have every sign, piece of outdoor advertising in the City legal, but it's a process that nobody has successfully done before. I know three commissioners that left it on the their successor's desk; I don't want to leave this on my successor's desk; I want to legalize, before I leave, every single sign.