Good morning. My name is Eleanor Meyer, M-e-y-e-r. Last year my neighbor around the corner, the son had one of those motorized. And 54 6/11/03 - Resolution 030403 he ran over my neighbor's son and injured him pretty bad. And there's about -- I live on a little street. And there's about eight or ten of them that ride up and down the street every night, sometimes as late as 1 o'clock in the morning.
Hi. My name is Peggy Hoak. I'm from East Frankford Civic Association. And, of course, in East Frankford, they're proliferating all over the neighborhood. They ride up and down the street, around the block 1, 2 o'clock in the morning. They have no regard for anybody, any car, any truck. They don't move. You move or you stop. And these are young teenagers. These are not adults. And it's not this kind of scooter. It's a regular scooter with a motor on 55 6/11/03 - Resolution 030403 it; that's all. And the noise is atrocious. And I have complaints from all over my Civic Association area of same complaints: Riding, the noise, and all hours of the day and night.
No, I haven't. I'm on the Pedak. But tell you the truth, I haven't heard it during the night. Because when I go to sleep, I go to sleep. But I have all my neighbors, you know, are complaining about it. And so, I'm just, you know -- I think --
Oh, I know that. And a lot of people don't realize that the more police calls you get, you get attention. I've been preaching that for 13 years. If they don't get complaints, they think there's no problem.
People must call 911. 56 6/11/03 - Resolution 030403 They might not get there.
Well, I don't think you should call 911 for scooters. I think you call the Captain of the Police Precinct.
Because I think if you -- 911 you should use just for emergencies.
Well, that helps the Police Department. If they have all these calls, then that raises a flag that there's a problem.
Well, 90 percent of the times you're not going to get a car because they're busy doing other things, but it gives the Captain --
But if the Captain -- I think you should have -- And you're from East Frankford Civic Association.
You should have a meeting with the Captain and bring down the Captain and the inspectors, and tell them about 57 6/11/03 - Resolution 030403 the scooters.
Oh, they're well aware. Last Pedak meeting, that's all everybody talked about. And this is from all over, in the 15th District. That's the first thing that was brought up. And there's not much they can do yet.
Well, you just heard they can. They can stop them, and they can take the scooter away.
I mean, that gives us some consolation that some of this is going to stop. They also use it for drug-running, too. Please.
Thank you. Millie Cappetti, Jim Robb, Betty Huntley and Dottie Quarterman. Please identify yourself for the 58 6/11/03 - Resolution 030403 record.
Millie Cappetti, C-a-p-p-e-t-t-i. I am a crossing guard. I am also Vice President of Juniata Civic Association. I'm also a parent. On my post when I'm there, I have them coming by. They're running on the pavements, knocking over the school children. They pay no 10 regards for any pedestrians on the street. I have had four accidents on that corner, minor fender-benders, from them running the red light, not paying attention, doing what they wanted to do. Even on Erie Ave. I'm at Erie. And they come up and down Erie Ave. like it's nothing, running the lights. Don't care. I've talked to the Captain on numerous occasions to do something about it. I'm constantly told that they're not allowed to touch them. They're not considered motor vehicles, this, that. Now today --
The Captain says 59 6/11/03 - Resolution 030403 they're not allowed to touch them. They're not considered motor vehicles.
Exactly. And when I go home, I plan on calling Captain Mackus to make him aware of that.
Also, with the mopeds and stuff like that, we have that problem going on up in the neighborhood. And I've complained to the Captain on numerous times. And they told us that there's nothing they can really do about that either, if they can't catch them. But it's getting worse. I give them the times, where the kids are, especially in the school yards. After school when the kids are coming out they'll be riding them through the school yards. And still nothing. They're saying it's too busy. They can't get to them places, blah, blah, blah. But it's getting worse. We have already had one person that was killed. 60 6/11/03 - Resolution 030403
She was ran over by a truck and died on one of the scooters. That's the first one in our area so far. But God knows how many is going to go on.
Good morning. My name is Dottie Quarterman. I am a citizen of Philadelphia, also as well as Legislative Aide to Representative John Taylor. As a citizen and as a representative to Representative Taylor, we have had and I have had numerous complaints about scooters. My personal opinion as a citizen is, they should be immediately confiscated. They are running -- Yesterday, for example, I was coming down my mother's street which is in Juniata Park, on Nielson Street right down the street from McCauley Playground. I go -- usually come down the street 15 miles an hour. It's a very active street, many children on the street. This boy came out from the sidewalk. 61 6/11/03 - Resolution 030403 I almost hit him. Now, I was going miles an hour. Had I been flying down the street, I would have killed him. He was all of 11 years old. What's happening with these scooters is, number one, again, they don't have turn signals. No one's wearing helmets. And they're driving them like idiots. They are up on the sidewalks. They're in the rec centers. I can say that I was at one softball game at Juniata Park where I did see two 24th Police District officers confiscate two scooters off kids. But that was the only time I did see that. It seems to be getting worse day by day. We have kids who now are taking lawn mower motors and attaching them to the scooters that used to pedal with your feet. And they're selling them for, like, 45 bucks. So now you have not only the scooters that you can buy for $295, but one you can buy out of somebody's back garage for $45. They're on a sidewalk. They're threatening seniors. They're threatening just communities in general. 62 6/11/03 - Resolution 030403 I believe that the police really probably are a little desensitized to the issue itself. But I believe that they should be, when they see them -- because they are not legal -- they should be confiscated immediately, period; end of story. Someone -- There is going to be a serious disaster with these scooters. It frightens the death out of me when I see these kids, because most of these kids on the scooters are kids from the age of 9 to maybe 18, because most of them by then are driving. These are young kids. None of them have helmets. They're hanging off them. They're going against traffic. They're up on sidewalks. They're just completely, you know, no regard, no 18 common courtesy, no regard for any law. I don't know that they know that there's any law. As Councilman Reynolds Brown had said, maybe you could go through the Black Clergy. I don't know if that's your answer. I think your best, I guess, action for this, in order to show kids how dangerous it is, and parents, is to go through the School 63 6/11/03 - Resolution 030403 District, to go through the rec centers.
And chop them in half. COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: We can't wait a whole summer. And I appreciate your being here today. The neighborhoods are literally under siege right now.
You can't -- If You confiscate them, a parent wasted $300. That's education.
It's education. It certainly is. 64 6/11/03 - Resolution 030403
Hello. My name is Betty Huntley, a Committeewoman, 33rd Ward, 9th Division. I have two schools on each of my corners, L and Huntingdon Park and L and Lycoming. And the problem I have in my Division is, I have approximately 2500 kids that walk in the morning and in the afternoon. These scooters, when the kids getting from high school around o'clock, o'clock, they have a tendency of coming out with these scooters. And at o'clock when the children is released, between 2:30 and 3 o'clock, they are speeding through the neighborhoods, going through the school yards, having disregard of the children, hitting crossing guards or almost hitting crossing guards. It have became a problem where I'm out the door screaming all the time, asking them be careful. I think some law need to be made 65 6/11/03 - Resolution 030403 where, when there's school hours -- Something need to be done because, I mean, we have had so many children has almost have got hit, you know, trying to cross the street by the crossing guard.
The law is there. It is illegal to do this. It is illegal to ride the all-terrain vehicles. All that has to happen is, the police have to implement this. COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: Councilman, question for the lady. Are any of these people who are operating these vehicles, are they coming from school with that or just that, as you're saying, after school hours?
After they get -- The high school gets out. COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: They're not taking them to and from school.
No, not as far as I know. I mean, anything possible. They driving cars to school now. COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: They're young people. I was young once a long time ago. They want to look cool. It's the in thing to do. We 66 6/11/03 - Resolution 030403 all understand. We all went through this. But, you know, even when I was a kid driving a bike, you know, your parents always said: Stay out of the street. Be careful when you get to an intersection. It's just a different situation now, because now motorized vehicles, these things are much more dangerous than bicycles because you can continually go at a certain rate of speed. The bicycle, you pedal, you get a little tired; you slow down. This, you know, it's a car. It's a vehicle. And so, I think the Chairman is right. And we all said this earlier. We just need a zero tolerance. Sometimes we abuse that, that saying, that phrase. But we need to get the message out. It's too late for education. Parents are irresponsible. They need to be held accountable. And the only way you hold them accountable is by letting them waste their money, if in fact they bought it in the first place. But they're so inexpensive, if a kid has a part-time job, he's going to be able to buy 67 6/11/03 - Resolution 030403 one on his own. So somebody -- It's got to be taken off the street. I would suggest to the Chair that as a result of these hearings, in addition to the Resolutions that Councilman Mariano and I introduced -- Mine called for the Police Department to get active in this -- that we, you as the Chair, write a letter to the Police Commissioner, spelling out what took place here and asking that they make full enforcement. This could be another part of Operation Safe Streets. I mean, Operation Safe Streets doesn't only have to deal with drugs. It's got to deal with nuisance and other quality of life issues. And this is a dangerous situation. It's out of control.
We will do that. COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: And I want to thank all of you for coming.
I agree with my colleagues and to call for strong enforcement, but I'd also want to make sure that people, number 68 6/11/03 - Resolution 030403 one, know that these are not toys, and that people -- that the City gives people the education necessary so they will fully understand, particularly parents of minors, will fully understand that those children are breaking the law, and they won't go out and buy those things. But I agree that we do need strong enforcement, even to the point that at some point maybe parents should be fined, once they know. But I just want to make sure that they do know, that purchasing these and letting minor children drive them, they're breaking the law. And I do have sense enough to know that there are many teenagers that will go out and buy something without their parents' consent. I'm the mother of a teenager. However, I'd at least want to know. I want to make sure people know. So, I know that the Police Department did testify about the public education that they're developing right now, and over with the Managing Director. And I'd like to see that put in force, but I'd also like to see stronger enforcement also. Thank you. 69 6/11/03 - Resolution 030403
Thank you. Are there any other individuals to testify? Please identify yourself for the record.
My name is Jack Laurilliard from the Juniata Park Older Adult Center. My last name, L-a-u-r-i-l-l-i-a-r-d. Laurilliard. Rhymes with billiard.
I'm a little bit disappointed. It seems... What can I say that hasn't already been said? You know what you have to do. When are we going to do it? What do you have to do to put into effect everything that was talked about today? Make it illegal to sell these. Go to the -- And do your confiscation and destroy them. I don't know who made that suggestion. Destroy them.
That they're going to do. We can't prohibit selling them.
Why not? Don't you have to have a license to sell handguns? Isn't this a dangerous thing? 70 6/11/03 - Resolution 030403
I wish we could prohibit selling handguns. You can't prohibit selling handguns. Handguns get sold. Handguns get sold in this City. I hope I wish we could prohibit selling guns.
My question is, when are all these things going to go into effect? Somebody said we're going to send a letter to the -- Why do we have to wait for a letter? Can't we call the Commissioner up? Sit down. This is what we want you to do. And then tomorrow he'll do it.
His representative was here. His representative said that they're implementing this immediately.
Thank you very much. I didn't mean any disrespect to any Council Members.
Hi. My name's Chris Lang. I'm the Committee person from the 33rd Ward, 11th Division. And I just need to relate to something I saw just to further on how dangerous 71 6/11/03 - Resolution 030403 these are. A scooter comes down a one-way street the wrong way, pulls out onto a two-way street, a car swerves to avoid the scooter. Another car coming the other way swerves to avoid this car. And here is a group of young children walking to the Seven-11. And thank God nobody was killed. It was one of those hold-your-breath moments. You're like: Oh, my God, all caused by this one scooter that's flying down the street. And as far as if these laws are out there, and they're already in effect, I think one of our most... good weapons that we can use is our local media, such as the Juniata News, Aldia, these small papers that you know that everybody reads their own little neighborhood newspapers faithfully. And I would just like you to consider that. I don't know if Council has a repertoire with these people that they can send out notices to these small papers and get it printed up as a community service. 72 6/11/03 - Resolution 030403
I think that should be the responsibility of the neighborhood people, to get in touch with all of these, you know, media and newspapers. Yes, sir.
Yes. My name is Jesus Soto. I am representing the 33rd Ward. I'm also a child care center director. And many occasions we have our children coming out. I deal with zero to five year-olds. And this is in the Norris Square Community, which is on the lower end of Mariano's District. And I can count to every day, almost: Kids on the pavement, off the pavement, flying from one corner. And I'm right there on the corner of Mascher and Norris where there's no 19 stop sign. And you can just see an accident waiting to happen. And I'm glad that there is law out there. However, I was one of those people that called the cops, the police, and stood in front of my stoop, and stood in front of I Street, 73 6/11/03 - Resolution 030403 because I live at I and Juniata. And I said: No, you're not going to do this at o'clock at night. Now I waited and 5 waited. And called again. And then I called 6 again. I called three times that evening for a 7 vehicle to come by. 8 Lo and behold, an hour later they 9 came by, but the children decided it was time to 10 go to bed at 12:30. But I was one of those 11 residents that just stood on I Street and said: No, no, no. 13 Now, we can have these laws implemented. We can have these nice juicy things that people say. But it has to go to the rank and file. It has to get to the bottom. It has to get to the people that are actually going to do the work. The morale... I don't know what the morale is, but... I don't know. At this point you can have a million laws, but if you don't implement them, then they're useless.
That's right. I suggest you talk to the Captain. Thank you very much. Thank you. 74 6/11/03 - Resolution 030403 Anybody else? Yes, ma'am.
Good morning. My name is Kate Clark, and I am a resident of the Juniata Park Section of the City of Philadelphia. I have one question. That is, can we find the places that are actually selling these and confiscate them from them?
You can get the illegal places that don't have licenses on the corner, but if they're a business...
Such as the one that's selling them on the 44 and 4500 block of Castor Avenue.
If they're selling them without a license, we can, yeah. Go ahead.
I would wonder, though, if... You know, my 12 year-old 75 6/11/03 - Resolution 030403 nephew can't go and buy a car. I don't think any car auto dealer would sell him a car. So I'm wondering if when you go to buy one of these whether I.D. is required so they won't be selling this to a minor. Is that where you're trying to go with that?
I'm trying to go with that. I'm trying to go with something in that respect, something.
Well, for a minor that would be different. I don't think a minor can buy a motorized vehicle.
No, I don't think so. UNIDENTIFIED VOICE: If he's got 300 bucks, he's going to sell it to him.
They can buy it from the guy that -- (Many people began speaking simultaneously, not reportable.)
I don't think a minor can buy a motorized vehicle in this City or the Commonwealth. 76 6/11/03 - Resolution 030403 Thank you.
So that means there's some adult purchasing, and that's where the fines are coming.
How you doing? My name is Candido Silva. I'm one of the Democratic Ward Leaders of the 33rd Ward. And I think the important thing is educating. We're missing one factor. I think we should start at the schools. I think we should start at the recreational center. I think picking up the vehicles, and chopping them up, and burning them, and tearing them apart, and confiscating them is not the issue. We have people in our community that don't understand the law or the system. So we need to take part in educating. I think the easiest way and less [sic] cost effective is starting with the school districts setting first, as well as the recreational center. And what better time to start now with the recreational centers, when you have kids 77 6/11/03 - Resolution 030403 going to recreational center camps within the City system. And this is the best time. If you just confiscate these motor vehicles or these scooters, you're not only depriving somebody from knowledge, but if you taking the necessary steps by step one, step two, step three, and so on, then you have the parents not coming back being rebellious of you confiscating these scooters from the children, where they say: Oh, we'll pay the money just to keep you quiet because somebody else's kid has it? No. I think we should start at -- plant the seed within the schools and the recreational centers, and then we can move on, and then we can do the confiscating. Thank you.
This Committee of Public Safety stands in recess until the call of the chair. (Hearing concluded at 12:18 p.m.) 78 CERTIFICATE I HEREBY CERTIFY that the proceedings and evidence are contained fully and accurately in the stenographic notes taken by me upon the public hearing of The Philadelphia City Council, taken on June 11, 2003, and that this is a true and correct transcript of same. _____________________________ DAVID A. DEIK, RPR and Commissioner of Deeds (The foregoing certification of this transcript does not apply to any reproduction of the same by any means, unless under the direct control and/or supervision of the certifying reporter.)