Okay. What was the next contract and what was the minority participation?
Yes. And they are the ones -- I don't know the exact percentage of the minority business contract on that one, but they are the ones with the employment content of 45 percent.
Of the five 179 COMMERCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - RES. 980734 contracts that you let out, what is the total amount of those five contracts? And what percentage of that total amount is minority female? What's the total amount of the five contracts that they have let out, and what's the percentage of minority and female on that?
And what is the minority and female part of that $80 million percentage-wise.
The female content, there's a $12 million contact with Cornell.
So I will say the total of -- 180 COMMERCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - RES. 980734
So that maybe it would be around percent, something like that. 9
Is that the -- you 10 have one contract -- out of 80 million, you have 11 one female contractor. What about -- 12
What's the total of 15 the overall minority and female of that $80 16 million? 17
I'm very bad in math, I'm sorry. I'm a political science major, so I don't know what's the percentage.
And of that minority, could you break it down for me in terms of how many African-American contractors, how many Latino contractors, how many Asian-Americans, and so on. If you can do that because I'd like to get from you a sense -- "minority" is an all-encompassing word, and I'd like to see how that minority piece is divided up in terms of percentages.
Let me ask you one question. Is Cornell certified as a WBE? Is she certified?
To my knowledge, she's certified with the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania. I believe that she's applying now for certification with the City of Philadelphia.
I, like Councilwoman Clark, supported this legislation because we wanted to bring jobs in and increase 182 COMMERCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - RES. 980734 our economic viability here in the City of Philadelphia. So I, too, have no pleasure in trying to prevent the project from proceeding. I would request that your reports that you submit to the PSDC board be submitted to this committee through the chair so that we can keep apprised of what's going on in terms of this project. I don't know how the miscommunication came about, but certainly, when we had this discussion early on, when this legislation came before us, it was the spirit and the will of this Council that this project include a broad-based coalition of people that represents the diversity of this city, and we still want that to happen. And we're not sure whether or not there is any ability to sanction, but I will tell you, we will look for it.
Mr. Sjursen, there's a follow-up question by Councilwoman Clark.
Thank you for your indulgence. There are people here who have to 183 COMMERCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - RES. 980734 leave, and I need to ask this question while they're here. With respect to training, training for shipbuilding, including some people who are going to be sent to Europe and given some hands-on, almost apprentice kinds of training. How are you doing in finding minority firms and institutions to do that training? Specifically now, I refer to Berean Institute, a very old manual training school. OIC, which was founded by Leon Sullivan and his international school of training the hard-to-hire structural underclass of unemployed. And then there's another group called ITTI Welding. These three companies have come to me on an insistent basis saying, We feel excluded, we can't get in. We've got the experience, we've got the will, and we're not being considered for the training opportunities for Kvaerner. Your words on that, please.
I'm not personally familiar with those companies and I'm not also personally familiar that they have been in touch with us, but I will certainly ask the responsible people that they are to take a look at that. 184 COMMERCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - RES. 980734
Fine. I know that Mr. White and Mr. Hankowsky are aware of all three organizations and can speak of their reputation in the community. We need to be certain that they have a fair opportunity at the training, at the whole training -- not the little icky-picky pieces that are left over. We want them to be able to go into it before the piece has already been allocated. Bill, you know what I'm talking about, don't you? Ron White, you understand what I mean, don't you?
Thank you, thank you very much. And I thank you for your forbearance, Mr. Chairman.
No problem. Mr. Sjursen, I do want to ask very directly that between now and the next hearing, I would ask you to be responsible -- if you have Mr. Thompson or Ryan do the actual work, that's certainly fine with me, but I'm going to ask you to be responsible for follow-up and contact with 185 COMMERCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - RES. 980734 the various people who have already testified and illuminated their issues and their problems. And what I would request is that there be direct contact with those individuals by either yourself or your direct line staff people. That as a part of the larger report that you're going to give us about implementation and the like, that there be a detailed analysis of who made the contact, what was it about, when did it happen, and if there's any follow-up or potential for those individuals to participate, whatever it may be. I cannot tell you whether they are eligible or not eligible, but I think one of the things that has to be rectified out of today is that most of them indicated that they have called someone and could not talk to anyone. And I would ask you to be personally responsible for making sure that those contacts and the follow-up does in fact take place for people who came to this hearing today.
I would like to add in the letter -- 186 COMMERCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - RES. 980734
Well, I would ask you to furnish me with the names and addresses of those people.
I'd be glad to -- I can, one, give you the agenda here, it has everyone's name on it. Some of these people are, I believe -- at least as articulated by one of my colleagues, some of these people are apparently on some lists that are floating around within your own shop, but I'll at least give you the list. I think all of these people can be found. Most of them are still here. And I would anticipate that the moment you walk through the railing there, they're going to be right next to you. So I don't think you'll have to go looking for them. All right?
What I would like, since one group who brought this issue before us 187 COMMERCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - RES. 980734 feels that they are not included in the information-sharing process, we wanted the United Minority Contractors Coalition to be made a part of the information-sharing, that you share with them what contracts are coming up, how you do it through the Urban Coalition, but they'd be a part of the list and not be excluded.
Yes. I think if our intent is that we send all of this information. Both the bid lists and bids to both MBEC and to OHCD and that all that information should be available to them there. And if they need anything else, then they should contact us directly.
Okay. Councilwoman, any other questions for this panel?
No. I thank you very much for your -- I think you've been a very good panel, and I think we got some understanding that in the past we didn't have quite to this level of this detail. I thank you very much.
Thank you very 188 COMMERCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - RES. 980734 much. Now, I believe there are possibly more business owners and contractors to be heard. Reggie Anderson; a representative from Omnitech; Jessie Merrill; a representative from E. Johnson Company; and Jerry Stein, from M.F. Stein Corporation. Those are the only -- And Luis Cruz from the Latino Contractors Association; Chisholm Electrical Contractors; Robert Dickson. If we can start getting all of those individuals up to the table. (Above individuals come forward.)
Now, as they're coming up, are there any representatives still here from MBEC or GPUAC? Ladies and gentlemen, I know that you've been here a long time. We appreciate your indulgence, and we think that you may have also benefitted from the break that we took to get in the people who are responsible for implementation, and we respect your time as well. So you can go right into your testimony. We can start with the gentleman on the 189 COMMERCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - RES. 980734 corner. And as go around, please just introduce yourselves and start your testimony. (Jessie Merrill comes forward.)
My name is Jessie Merrill, and I'm an engineer -- I'm a structural construction engineer. And I want to thank Donna Miller, who's my Councilwoman, who had my resume.
Okay. She had my resume for the last nine months. I work at the shipyard. I'm a project manager in construction, and I want Councilwoman Clark to know that one of the questions she asked is called "liquidated damages" when you want to receive money from a contractor who passes time in not doing what he's supposed to do. That's the legal term. At the same time, I'm going to let you know that I'm at the shipyard, and I'm watching. I'm a president of a union, which is mostly minority -- the National Federation for Federal Employees. And we've been giving our applications and resumes to Kvaerner for the last over a year, 190 COMMERCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - RES. 980734 and no response, and that's why I'm here. I listened to a lot of things that were said about the charts and all of this about the bidding process. The bidding process did not work, it hasn't been working. And the reason why is because of what the Councilwoman brought up. I think the Council here has to not only make them narrow that person, they named the person, but really, I don't know where that person is in the chain of command that really has the responsibility to do the things that you asked for. And, one, me being here as the project manager, what I got out of it was very frustrating. The process is not working because, first, it's not organized. And the other thing that's going on is that it's not being worked.
Let me interrupt you for one second. Let me put on this record. And Mr. Sjursen, Mr. Sjursen. If I could just get your attention for one second. I would strongly encourage you -- as you well know, this hearing is being 191 COMMERCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - RES. 980734 stenographically recorded. And I understand that you may in fact leave the chamber, and you have excused from the table. I would strongly encourage you, though, that as soon as the transcript of this hearing is available and prior to your reappearance -- I assume you're coming back on the 16th with Mr. Rafdal. I would strongly encourage you to get a copy of this transcript so that you are fully prepared to respond to the issues that have been raised, there are a lot of issues. And I'm sure you're very good at what you do but it may be virtually impossible for you to keep track of all the issues that were raised in this public hearing, so I encourage you to get a copy of the transcript. All right? If you have any trouble, contact my office, and I'll get you a copy. Mr. Merrill, I'm sorry.
That's okay. One of the things I strongly suggest is that the Council keeps track exactly on the minority hiring, professional people. At this date, Kvaerner has not hired any black engineers 192 COMMERCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - RES. 980734 that I know of. And I'm sitting here with two degrees -- a master's degree in engineering and a license in project management. And I'm telling you now that I haven't heard anything at all, and I'm at the shipyard.
Mr. Merrill, I think you heard me ask the question about the composition of the workforce, and I think it was indicated that there were maybe four or five individuals. I don't know at least who they are or what they do.
Okay. Well, we expect them to follow up with a report to get a detailed update on who the folks are and what they do, okay?
Good afternoon. My name is Trina Woodson. I am president and founder of Scoops Promotional, and I'd like to introduce myself to everyone and go on record to let them 193 COMMERCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - RES. 980734 know that I am a female minority business in Philadelphia that can promotional items, uniforms, and signage. So I just came here to introduce myself to them so that they don't have to look for me.
Very good, great testimony. (Nancy Santana comes forward.)
My name is Nancy Santana, of Nancy Santana's Cleaning and Maintenance Incorporated. I'm here representing the LCA (Latino Contractors Association) as well as the Philadelphia Hispanic Chamber of Commerce, of which I'm a board member of. I have also met with Kvaerner and PIDC a number of occasions. I've sent enough flyers and brochures and introduction letters to wallpaper this entire room. And I haven't as of yet had any return correspondence from them. (Dwayne Ming comes forward.)
My name is Dwayne Ming (ph.), and I'm with Chisholm Electrical Contractors. And I guess I'm one of the few people who did -- was able to get a response from 194 COMMERCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - RES. 980734 Kvaerner Shipyard. I talked to Mr. Ryan in terms of their prequalification package that was sent to us our office. We filled it out and sent it back, and we didn't get any response. So what our family did, I stayed on it, and our family got in touch with Mr. Ryan. And what I came back with from his answer, the way that they qualify -- prequalify contractors to participate in their particular project was solely based on the dollar amount at. Chisholm Electrical, we do approximately 2 million, and presently, we're doing about a million and a half. And we were told in so many words by Mr. Ryan that we don't do enough in terms of a dollar amount to be considered as a prime contractor. So when they look for prime contractors, it's solely based on the dollar amount. And hopefully from this process, things will change and we can all participate. (Louis Cruz comes forward.)
Yes, sir. I'd also like to 195 COMMERCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - RES. 980734 thank the Chair and the Councilpeople for being here till this hour and for having this presentation for us. Also, I'd like to thank Handford Jones. Because of his persistence and information to the contractors in this room and in the city, we have been able to know that there was something happening at the Navy Yard. My name is Louis Cruz. I represent Cruz Construction. We're a contractor here in the City of Philadelphia. We do excavation, demolition, and site development. I also represent the Latino Contractors Association. And for the record, I'd like to verify that there is Latino contractors that can handle all of the trades, okay, noted by Kvaerner and were available to do this. And, basically, we're used to fast-track jobs because, basically, all of the job are fast track.
Okay. You want it done now if not yesterday, right? It's on the fast track. (Laughter.) 196 COMMERCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - RES. 980734 (Jerry Stein comes forward.)
Are there any slow-track projects out there? Just do it whenever you feel like it or what?
Not anymore. My name Stein my name is Jerry Stein. I represent Stein Corporation. We're a structural fabricator and erector in the city since 1923. The problem that I see down at the Navy Yard is that the process for bidding has gotten so complex that between the prequalifying and qualifying of primes, subs back and forth, everybody's getting confused on where we're supposed to be. It's a pretty cut-and-dry situation. I've been on major projects a lot larger than Kvaerner's project here. It's run a lot smoother as far as the bidding process goes. It's not a complicated issue. You put the thing out for bid. Qualified contractors bid on the job. You send financials. You send all your company 197 COMMERCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - RES. 980734 information. You're evaluated within minutes. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to decide if you're a qualified contractor or not. It's summed up rather quickly. In the Philadelphia area, everybody knows it's a small community with contractors. Everybody knows who's legitimate and who is not. On Kvaerner's side, I would say that Richard Ryan has accepted my phone calls and has helped me get in touch with primes after going back and forth. He has helped. The only thing he hasn't helped is getting signed contracts, which is the bottom line, okay? I've bucked heads with the best. I've bucked heads with the Keens, the Driscolls -- they're tough, a lot of tougher than Kvaerner. These people just don't seem to go with the flow. It's not a complicated issue. We're making it all very complicated and it's a simple process. And the more that we get involved in complicating this, the slower this fast-track job becomes.
That's about all I have to say. If you need any more advice on the bidding 198 COMMERCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - RES. 980734 process, I'd be more than happy to enlighten anybody on the procedures. And I've been in this business 28 years and. . .
Just to reiterate -- and I apologize for the reiteration -- but we also received all the information on who the major contractors were bidding the project and were given the project. Although we contacted them several times than the ones that were awarded the projects we contacted didn't seem like there was enthusiasm in them using any minorities, so it's not only Kvaerner, but it's trickled down to the contractors that they're using.
That message has to 199 COMMERCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - RES. 980734 come from the top. I think there's no question about that. If the party that has the ultimate responsibility -- in this case Kvaerner -- sends the message that they are serious about this, then the contractors will get the message. And, you know, unfortunately, it may mean that they not be able to do all of the business they want with their buddies. Nobody likes, you know, slicing off a piece for somebody else. But if we're serious about this, then that is what has to happen. The pie is fairly large. No one's trying to take any food off of anybody else's table, but it's got to be spread around. And that really kind of becomes the bottom line. If they're serious, the contractors will become serious because they want the work, they want the work.
I also want to reiterate the role that the City plays in all of this because the Hispanic Chamber of Commerce had 200 COMMERCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - RES. 980734 two meetings with PIDC, meeting down at the Kvaerner, the shipyard, with a representative of PIDC and the Commerce Department. And where the assurances were given that no contracts, no notice was going to go out without full minority advisement as to how, where, and for how much to be able to bid and participate. And Nancy and Louis, you know, you can give me an answer, but none of the Hispanic Chamber of Commerce has received "nada," right, zero?
And through the -- you know, through the Hispanic and Latino contractors, has received nothing. But the City has a role to play in this.
May I just say on that point, one of the things that since we've been listening today is that Kvaerner right now seems to be just overwhelmed, but there's so many layers of people that are supposed to be having the best interests in doing this. 201 COMMERCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - RES. 980734 It would look like Kvaerner's at that point with the kind of money we have allocated to 'em that they should have one office that they have people that are designated for minority contracts. They should have the listings of when it comes to the contractors -- like this gentleman was talking about, where they have an allocation for a small, what they call "special projects," and you have large projects. Unless they do that themselves, you have too many layers now. You named all these organizations and it's the reason why one hand doesn't know what the other hand is doing.
That's one problem. The other thing is that when you go to the unions, the unions are going to take care of themselves, all right?
And they're not going to look at the best interests when it comes to minority contractors.
I could tell you that 202 COMMERCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - RES. 980734 'cause I know the fight that we've had in the shipyard for years with that. So my suggestion now is that when the Council talks to Kvaerner and the suggestions that you give them, they should have an office that they should be taking care of 'cause right now, they talking about this person, but I really don't think he has full power, allocation or anything. You had the project manager, who's under the director, all right? This guy is the third tier. That's the other thing that I wanted to say. A third tier is not going to help you. It's not going to get what you the goals that you wanted to --
He only collects data. He doesn't make any decisions.
As best I could understand and get out of that is that he was responding to a particular question, but now the central guy seems to be Richard Ryan, the project manager of construction is what I took out of it.
Right, but his boss is 203 COMMERCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - RES. 980734 the director --
Right. And what I'm saying is that the gentleman that they named is the third tier, and he's actually out of the picture. And unless you have a person that's a project manager and his total responsibility is to do the cost analysis, putting the charts together, and making the direction of exactly how these projects are being allocated, you'll never know -- that should be done on a daily basis. He should have people working for him, actually doing schedules on that. So when these gentlemen ask questions, they have a person to go to, that they can talk to every day, and it's a listing that the Council can look at and see a schedule. And you should know what the critical path is, and nobody's brought that up.
They're talking about fast track. I understand what they're saying. No 204 COMMERCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - RES. 980734 one's talk about a schedule. Have you seen the schedule? Not only A&E firms, construction, the planning, the design, all these things have been said, you know, I've been hearing all of this, but none of this -- that chart up there don't even mean anything, I have to agree with the Councilwoman on that.
One thing. There was omission with disabled. Has anything addressed as far as where we're at with the disabled issue?
I don't think that was raised. I'm aware, Mr. Stein, because of other information that I have up here, some letters going back and forth, I think, from you to somebody from the chief of staff to -- I think the path was maybe you wrote to Councilwoman Verna, she wrote to the mayor, the chief of staff wrote back to her to explain what had happened in a particular matter. But you are correct. I don't think 205 COMMERCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - RES. 980734 that issue specifically came up today.
And where are we at? Is it included? It was just language, it was just the wording that wasn't in there? Or is there disabled?
I believe all of our contracts require it. I cannot tell you for the $80 million, for example, that was mentioned -- Councilman Ortiz asked for a specific breakdown of all of the areas, and I believe that we should have that on the 16th or before the 16th.
Sir, that's a good question because on all projects that are allocated that go out, there should be a percentage breakdown on each project, no matter what the dollar amount is.
All right. Are 206 COMMERCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - RES. 980734 there any other civilian, nongovernment or quasi-governmental agency people here to testify? Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for your testimony. And if there is anyone else, regular citizens not involved in the government, please come up to the table and give your testimony. I know you've been here all day and labored through this with us but if you could be relatively brief, we would all appreciate it and, you know, will be commended at an appropriate time. (Tyrone Reed comes forward.)
Good afternoon, Councilman Nutter, Tasco, Ortiz. My name is Tyrone Reed, and I'm here representing the Berean Institute, who's one of the partners with OIC, ITTI, and the United Minority Enterprise Association.
Excuse me, I have to go pick up my child at the after-school program before they close it, pardon me.
Before I give my comment, before I give the written comment that Dr. Spencer, who is the president of Berean Institute, 207 COMMERCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - RES. 980734 wrote for me to deliver to the body, I would just like to personally just make a comment, Councilman, if it's possible. You know, when the vice president, the governor, the mayor, (unintelligible) and the other parties signed that agreement this summer down at the waterfront, one of the things that each one of them said was that this was good for the city, this was good for the state. They said that this was an opportunity to revitalize an area that really needed to be revitalized, that it was an opportunity to bring jobs into the City of Philadelphia. And I'm telling you, I am truly appalled that I have to sit here and say to the vice president of these United States, to say to the governor, to say to the mayor that they have participated in a process that is truly discriminatory. They have contributed over $400 million to a process that is totally discriminatory. And I would like to go on record letting it be known that when we talk about affirmative action, that people has a problem with 208 COMMERCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - RES. 980734 it. When we talk about quotas, people have a problem with it. But still in this country, discrimination is against the law. And for those parties to engage in any process that is discriminatory, that is not only a slap to the my not community, but to the Afro-American community, you know, as a whole. It was said on the agenda that we were going to read into the testimony the agreement that the full body have. But since you already have it, I won't take the time to read it into the testimony because of time.
Mr. Reed, what we can do is if you hand up that statement, all of those statements are going to be handed to the stenographer, they will be included into the record as if they had been read directly into the record, we can do that.
Okay. Well, Mr. Chairman, may I just ask that I deliver this statement tomorrow, the statement for the president, because I don't want it delivered -- you know, I don't want to hand it in in the state that it is in, and I will bring it down and bring it to your office 209 COMMERCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - RES. 980734 tomorrow.
That's a statement from our president of Berean Institute, Dr. Norman K. Spencer.
Then that statement will be added to this record as if it were read into the record.
Thank you, Mr. Nutter. My name is John Thomas. I want to thank the members of Council for the opportunity for allowing all these disgruntled members of the African-American community to come out and voice 210 COMMERCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - RES. 980734 their disenchantment, disenfranchisement with the processes that are going on to -- in my term, it's emasculate the black community, that's what it amounts to. It's economic emasculation, plain and simple. My point, my one and only point that I want to bring forward today is this: I've heard repeatedly members of the Kvaerner organization say that they could not, did not -- couldn't find the time to dispense drawings and plans and what have you. And the only question I have is: Has anyone heard of computer? I mean, we live in an age of computer technology today where information can be accessed via computer, via e-mail all over the bloody globe. And yet nobody, never once did they mention you can access this information via computer. That's all I have to say.
Thank you very much for your testimony. Are there any other individuals who wish to testify?
I'd just like to make a comment. 211 COMMERCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - RES. 980734
The gentleman is right. Inasmuch as we were told during the course of the briefing that the ships would be built by computer and not by skilled labor. So it's interesting that we don't and can't access the plan by computer. Your point is well-taken.
Thank you, Councilwoman. I wish to add to this record these letters, and these letters will be handed to the stenographer as if the letters had been read into the record. A letter from Cheryl McKissack, Chief Operating Officer of McKissack & McKissack, to Councilwoman Tasco; A letter from Salaam Muhsin to Richard Ryan at Kvaerner; A letter from Vallahra Renita El Harre Bey from Omnitech, to Councilwoman Tasco A letter from Mr. Charles Ang to Mr. Benko, from PSDC; There is a letter from Mr. Dickson to Councilwoman Tasco; 212 COMMERCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - RES. 980734 And a letter from a Donna Wiley to Kvaerner Philadelphia Shipyard, Inc. A letter from Frank Gallo to Councilwoman Tasco; And a letter from Mr. Craddle to -- actually to me, to Councilman Nutter, from Hannah & Sons Construction Company. All of these letters will be handed to our stenographer, and they will be included in the transcript, including the letter --
And the sense of the letters, as I have read them, all are pretty much consistent with the testimony that we heard earlier from people who testified at the table, expressing concerns about the bid process, lack of ability to get information, and other obstacles to participation in this project. All of these letters will be included as part of the record as if they had been read directly in the record. Seeing no other business before us and no one else to testify -- 213 COMMERCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - RES. 980734
There are -- I'm sorry -- two last letters. One is from Ramon Rucci, of the Latino Contractors Association, to Councilwoman Tasco; and a letter from Rod Herrera Jr., from RCH Architects and Engineers, to Councilwoman Tasco. There's no further business before the committee at this time. This hearing is recessed until Monday, November 16, 1998, at 1 o'clock p.m. Thank you very much. (Applause.) (Adjourned at 5:30 p.m.) - - - 214 C E R T I F I C A T E I HEREBY CERTIFY that the foregoing proceedings of the Council of the City of Philadelphia of Tuesday, October 27, 1998, were reported and accurately by me, and that this is a correct transcript of same. RE: COUNCIL COMMITTEE ON COMMERCE AND ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT RESOLUTION NO. 980734 __________________________________, JOSEPHINE CARDILLO, Registered Professional Reporter