Committee Hearing, February 15, 2000

Terrific. You mentioned schools, so there is some linkage, some coordination with Philadelphia Public Schools? COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: That's correct.

Moving now to anti-truancy efforts. COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: Yes, ma'am.

Here you indicate that the department has increased it's efforts to curb truancy. COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: Right.

Should I assume that your role is primarily transport, pick up and then transport and it ends there? COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: Correct.

So then I'll have additional questions for the School District, I presume, around the truancy piece. When you say you have increased efforts, what does that mean? COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: Prior to two years ago, the effort on truancy was sporadic and segmented. Some of it was done in Center City and some was done up in the northeast. It wasn't 741 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 applied equally throughout the City for a whole variety of reasons.

Okay. COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: We now, under Inspector Joe Fox, have a citywide truancy program so safe havens, there are no neighborhoods where you can play hooky and get away with it. It's a citywide effort. We sat down with the Board of Education. In some areas we bring them right back to the schools. Down in South Philly we have what's called catchment area in the Polumbo School. The first year there was some growing pains, some problems. Last year it went without a hitch.

And as a result of a uniformed citywide effort, you've noticed a decrease in truancy? COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: They are finding, and the Board of Directors will be better with the statistics, that there has been an increase in attendance which would be expected.

Very well. Let me draw your attention now to 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 4, last paragraph, the special victims unit. COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: Yes, ma'am.

It indicates clearly that you saw the problem and you fixed it. What linkages or coordinating activity exists with any of the advocacy groups, women and children's advocacy groups which ultimately contributes to the success that you're experiencing? COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: There are at least two things of significance. One is there is a plan afoot to merge about or detectives 13 with the Child Advocacy Center to handle all 14 cases that involve young children. 15

Repeat that. I 16 didn't hear it all. 17 COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: There's a plan, 18 an institution called the Child Advocacy Center 19 where detectives who investigate crimes will 20 cohabitate (sic) with social service providers, counselors, so that when you have a child who's the victim of a crime is being interviewed, they're being interviewed only once. They're not going through three or four different layers of government. 743 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005

Very good. COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: We have that plan afoot. On the Special Victims, the sex crime part we, have been meeting with over the last three or four months various members of a variety of women's groups who have really been quite helpful in our reforms towards the investigation of sex-crime cases. We've also with their assistance established a working committee that meets on a regular basis with the captain and the detectives from the Special Victims Unit because we firmly believe that we have taken as many steps, reform steps as humanly possible and that we have nothing to hide and that as we move into the future, we will have these women's groups there with us saying yea or nay regarding how we're doing our investigations, because we don't feel there is anything to hide, no situations. Clearly there are confidentiality issues --

Sure, sure. COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: -- regarding victims of crime. But how those investigations are conducted, whether they're unfounded, whether they resulted in arrest, whether the 744 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 investigation's completed, we are willing to have a committee outside because we feel that the damage has been so great that we probably need that, and that's fine. We just kind of, if you will, vouch, an independent voice vouching saying, yes, what they're doing is correct.

Very well. Thank you very much. Thank you Madam Chair.

Commissioner. How much does your department spend in court-related overtime? I know that there has been ongoing meetings to try to curtail the overtime of court-related business. COMMISSIONER NESTEL: Court-related overtime for non-reimbursable overtime amounts to in excess of 50 percent of our entire overtime budget.

Repeat that, please. COMMISSIONER NESTEL: Court-related overtime in the non-reimbursable area accounts for 50 -- in excess of 50 percent of our non-reimbursable an overtime. 745 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005

Commissioner, have there been ongoing meetings between you and the District Attorney and the Courts regarding this issue? COMMISSIONER NESTEL: Yes. There are -- in fact we actually meet with Municipal Court every week over prisoner processing and other issues. There have been series of meetings specifically related to the court-related overtime issue. We have a pilot program in one narcotics courtroom that is restricting the number of officers who appear at that preliminary hearing to one. Prior to that, three or four officers were subpoenaed to a preliminary hearing in every case. Now in that one courtroom, there is one officer. And hopefully, that program will be extended to the other preliminary hearings.

Thank you. Commissioner, on of your testimony, you cover the upgrading of police facilities. COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: Yes, ma'am.

What is your overall assessment of the condition of police 746 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 facilities throughout the City? I personally think some of them are absolutely deplorable, however, that's my assessment. Does your proposed FY 2001 capital budget address your needs regarding the police facilities? COMMISSIONER NESTEL: Tom Nestel. The police facilities within the past eight years there has been a tremendous amount of money and effort put into rehabilitating our facilities. In this coming year, we do have money for upgrading air-conditioning in some of the districts, for some other maintenance-type issues. We also have in the budget the monies for a brand-new facility for the 24th, 25th district, a brand-new facility for our laboratory division, and just within the last couple of months, our Internal Affairs Division has moved into a new facility. So there's still a lot of work that needs to be done, but we are addressing those issues.

Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilman Ortiz.

Thank you, Madam Chair. 747 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 I'm going to go back to Operation Cold Turkey because 1100 people were arrested during that time, and I remember that occurred in April of '85. COMMISSIONER NESTEL: That's right.

On May of '85 right after that I think 1100 people were arrested during that period of time where they with a cross violation of civil rights and I think they got a total of seven ounces of grass. And then a month later, the MOVE incident occurred in essence. And today, you go and you take a look at what happens to certain cities, New York is an example today, where you have the Dealo case happening today of an overzealous Police Department. We have the other case in terms of New York. We have a case, a situation in New York City, my daughter lives there. She's Puerto Rican. And between blacks and Latino neighborhoods, there is fear of the Police Department, constant fear. There is no 22 trust, but there is fear. I don't think that's what we want to go towards. I think we can do the things that we need to do, but if we become overzealous, we might do what Benjamin Franklin 748 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 said, you know, we may lose -- if you're afraid, sometimes fear makes you lose your own liberty. And I believe that we have to strike a balance there. But that's not here or there. You know, the frustrations that we have in poor neighborhoods sometimes are overbearing. But we do have to be able not to cross those lines. And I think we managed in Operation Sunrise. I think in Operation Sunrise there has been a sensitivity that has been developed in which people and the corners where people were there, a different methodology has been used and I've been seeing it. Sylvester Johnson can testify to that. That we have not -- I would hate for us to go back to the 1970s in Philadelphia in which there was a sense of fear of the Police Department in black and Latino neighborhoods in this City. And the Police Department really felt that they could go to a corner and if you were Latino or black, you just were moved or beaten or just arrested. And we had a lot of problems with the federal government. We ended up losing federal grants. We ended up losing HUD money. We ended up losing because of the gross violations of civil rights that took 749 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 place. So I think that you came from New York. There was a mayor there that believed in certain strong-arm tactics, and they did not work or at least I don't believe because right now what we have is a system. But, you know, we just have to be very careful that we do not go overboard on that. Commissioner, on the Affirmative Action in terms of minority hiring in the Police Department, how successful have we been in being able, one, to attract minority individuals to take the test? How many have taken the test? How many have passed? And how many have gone on to the academy in terms of blacks, women, and Latinos? How are we doing in that area? COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: Right now the Philadelphia Police Department, probably more than any Police Department in a big city in this country reflects more accurately the population of the people it serves; not gender-wise, but certainly the racial aspect. However, the exam we just administered four or five months ago was meant to do a few things. It was meant to get the department out 750 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 from underneath a hiring consent decree, that it was going to be an exam that was produced that would result in no or little disparity impact in regards to racial minorities. And we administered that exam and we were -- us and I think the last administration and the personnel department are satisfied with the results. Unfortunately, for who knows what the reasons are, we started off with a huge number that applied. That number went down as far as those that actually showed up to take it. The passing mark, there was no 13 significant disparity impact so we were satisfied with that.

But when we began to call people down to get qualified to go into the academy, we have a declination rate, that's people declining to come down or when they come down opting not to sign up of equally 50 percent on both sides, on African-Americans and on whites. It's resulted in us putting in one class. We were hoping to put in three classes out of this last list. We've put in one. We may get half of a second class. We just announced another exam, I guess, a week or two ago. We're having a huge problem nationwide getting people to enter right now the police 751 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 profession. I was at a meeting last week of the major city chiefs. And while we're having a difficult time, in places like Los Angeles, Honolulu, and New York they're having a desperate time. Los Angeles has 600 vacancies that they cannot fill. Honolulu has 300 vacancies that they cannot fill. New York City just spent $10 million administering the exam and was hoping to realize between 2500 and 3,000 finalists. They wound up with about 1300. They just announced a new exam. Across the board in every major city throughout the United States, there is a huge problem regarding police candidates. So when you add on top of that its impact on racial minorities, it's almost at this stage a secondary issue that we have to get people to come in and take the job. It's gotten that bad.

What is the percentage of African-Americans right now on the Police Department and Latinos and women? COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: On African-Americans, it's 35 percent; 5.5 percent Latinos; and females, 24 percent female. 752 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005

What is the breakdown in terms of captains, lieutenants, inspectors, by ethnic group? COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: I can get that for you. I don't have that handy, but clearly the upper ranks of the Philadelphia Police Department --

I can tell you from the top of my head. COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: I was going to say there's very little at the top. (Laughter.)

I knew you would have the answer.

Chief inspectors I think out of 12 we have Afro-American. And inspectors, I believe we have 40-something. There's Afro-Americans, one Latino.

How many women?

Excuse me?

How many women?

As inspectors, I believe there are two, two women. Captains, I believe we have like 753 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 approximate 110, 114. Anyhow, I can tell you the Afro-Americans there, there's nine.

Nine captains?

Right.

Nine captains out of 109.

There might be a little more than that. I mean, there's nine captains, but there might be a little more captains. There's nine Afro-American captains. I think there's one Latino captain. Lieutenant, I believe we have in the area of close to 300 and something lieutenants. Afro-Americans we have approximately 25, 28, I think 31 at this point. I'm not sure how many Latinos we have.

I think it's three?

Three?

I think there's three, I think. I'm not sure. Mr. JOHNSON: I'm not sure of the sergeant figures, but from lieutenant up those are the figures.

Thank you. I have no more questions. I think my five minutes are 754 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 up.

The Chair recognizes Councilwoman Miller. I'm sorry, because of the time I'm going to have to insist that everybody be given five minutes, and then we'll have a second go-around if we have to. But I think everybody should be given the opportunity to ask questions. Councilwoman?

I have a question regarding on of your testimony, the racial profiling. COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: Yes, ma'am.

I have a young man that works at a store in my district. I happened to go in that store last week and he has this wild hair. His hair is like really big. It's a huge, huge bush-type hair and he's constantly stopped by police. He asked me last week if I could help him, and I am going to help him set up an appointment to go up and talk to the captain at the 35th. And I think also he drives a coworker home from work who living in Kensington. So I'm not quite sure whether it's the 25th 755 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 district or what district he's speaking of there. Now, I see that we've created a new policy or a new form, the newly created form where officers are supposed to write -- now, isn't that a situation where they should write up if they're stopping kids just because they look different? COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: Well, they shouldn't be stopping anybody because they look different. So if doing that, they're wrong.

But if they're doing that, if they stop him, they should be filling this form out, am I not correct? COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: That's correct.

Well, I don't know whether filled it out. That's something that we're going to work on. But if in fact they haven't filled it out, what would be his next step? COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: Discuss it with the captain at the 35th, and if he's not satisfied with him or his explanations, then by all means, come to myself or Commissioner Johnson. There may, in fact, be very easily satisfactory answers. I have no ideas. 756 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005

Well, neither do I. I'm just glad to see this form has been created, that there is now a process that hopefully will track these types of stops. So that's one question. I have a question. I'm not really clear. Are you going to keep and upgrade or get more mini mobile stations or that's it? COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: Not so long as I'm here.

Well, I didn't think you were too crazy about them when we, you know, questioned you before. COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: Yeah.

I didn't think you liked them. COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: I don't know.

But I just wanted to be clear since it was mentioned in your testimony. Another question, I know that there's an effort to revise the disciplinary code by shortening the grievance in arbitration process. COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: Mm-hmm. 757 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005

I think right now you can grieve anything above a reprimand which leads to hundreds of grievances each year. Could you talk for a little bit about what you think would be a fair grievance and arbitration system for our officers. COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: We're limited to five minutes. Let me just say, we actually have made some progress. Sitting down with the FOP, we've come up request command discipline system that allows the district commander to administer discipline up to five days. The officer must sign off on those disciplinary case, and therefore, they are not appealable, you can't grieve them. That has reduced the number of grievances. However, I would like to see that expanded to 10 or 15 days. Really, the ideal for me would be that when it comes to grievances that it be limited to cases of termination. I know I'm not going to get that, but you asked me what I'd like; that's what I will like.

Okay. And while I'm asking you what you like, what would you like me to do to help you keep Chris DePasquale from 758 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 getting his job back? COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: That case, I think it would be unfair for me to comment on that case right now. It's being heard, it's being litigated, and so I think that's inappropriate in a public forum like this.

Okay. We can talk about that later. And one other question -- I have some other questions, but I can always talk to you about them later. Like we have some people that have concerns about how much the bikes costs for bike patrols, and if they can buy them all through you, maybe they can get a better price. And, you know, when they raise the money to buy the bikes, raise the money to buy the uniform, then an officer is transferred then that uniform sits there unused. So those kind of things we can always talk about later. But I did want to bring this one topic up. For about the past year my office has been contacted by police officers, both white and black, concerned about the treatment they have received by their fellow officers when they are 759 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 addressing racist remarks and behavior by fellow officers, being threatened with job loss, promotion, in some cases, more serious threats. What steps are being taken to solve the most serious of abuse of authority? And I wanted to add that some officers in Internal Affairs have also been mentioned as collaborating in these type of situations. Where can an officer go for help when this type of behavior is evident? COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: Well, I'm not so sure that type of behavior is evident. But if somebody has a complaint regarding being harassed because of their race or gender, then there are appropriate mechanisms. Every officer knows about that. I think I know, though, the folks that you're complaining about, and this has been an issue. Before I got here there is a certain group of police officers who have maintained this issue that there is racism, disparate treatment, some cases have been investigated, some have been sustained by Internal Affairs. But since every case hasn't been investigated and sustained they've concluded wrongly, I think, that somehow Internal Affairs is incompetent or racist also. I 760 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 think it runs whole gamut, my sense is while there was some cases where we found merit, in an awful lot of those case they were just disgruntled employees.

Okay. COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: And by the way, they weren't just African-American, they were African-American and white.

They were African-American and white. COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: Yes.

And my five minutes are up. I understand. Thank you, Madam President.

Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilman Rizzo.

Thank you, Madam Chair. My question today, I believe I'll ask this of Commissioner Brennan if that's okay since it's a question about technology. It pleases me and at the same time it troubles me when I hear about a situation where a person calls 911 and it's a prank call. Would it be -- I think it 761 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 would beneficial to the Police Department to publicize the fact that you have technology that identifies caller ID? many people that commit these pranks are not aware that they can be identified and apprehended for making these prank calls to police radio. I constantly hear stories that assist officers, etc. Now, my question: When a person calls police and falsifies a report like a police officer's in trouble, a police officer's been shot, I thought that we had some follow-up process where we would dispatch a supervisor to the location from where the call came from to try to make an apprehension of a person that's falsifying a police report, especially when it's endangering police officers responding to go an assist. So there are my -- one's a comment, and my second one is a question that I think we really need to publicize to the public that their phone calls to police radio, and especially the young people that might think that this is cute to see police cars responding at high rates of speeds, that they can get in a lot of trouble, that you have the technology to know who they are or at least know where the call was 762 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 originated from. That's something that I would like to see happen. And secondarily, I'd like to know how we're using that technology to apprehend people that are making prank calls to 911? And also, are we to the point where we can identify cell calls on the caller ID at police radio?

I think, Councilman, you're probably referring to an article that appeared in the paper. I don't know if you saw it recently about the cellular phone caller who called us 5,000 times. He called us 5,000 times, 911. It was very difficult to track him down. What happened in that particular -- he used the a cellular phone company that does not sends us their phone number. There is one in the City that does. Bell, for instance, now sends us the phone number of the cellular phone from which you are calling. The other cellular phone companies do not. So when we get a cellular phone call in which -- they are becoming, by far, our biggest headache. The numbers of them are growing quite a bit every year. So what we did in that particular case is we got detectives involved and we used a 763 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 tremendous amount of manpower to track him down through the cellular phone company. What he did was he bought a phone that you pay like so much up front and you get a phone and then when the time runs out, you go back and pay again and you get the phone recharged. He used a phony name and a phony address to buy the phone. He used a reference on there that was his girlfriend, and luckily for us she was a spurned girlfriend so when we contacted her, she gave him up very quickly and we were able to find him. Now, took us probably about a month to track that one guy down. It was very difficult. And we had another one right after him, believe it or not. Both those cases are now in court. We do get a lot of prank phone calls in the area of about 6,000 a month. Many of them are by -- as a matter fact, we know the time of day when they come in; they come in when school lets out. When school lets out, you know, 2, 3, 4 o'clock, they hit the phone booths and they dial 911 and they're either yelling obscenities or something else and then they hang up. You can see the peak in the day is right there and then they 764 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 go away. What try to do is on the ones from private residences where become issue, like they continue over and over again, we started to track those and send them out to the captains for some remediation. Most of the times it's kids. But I'll tell you that it's difficult sometimes to figure out what a prank is. If someone calls up a man with a gun and we go there and there's no 10 person with a gun, does that mean it was a prank? Maybe not necessarily so. Maybe the guy's just not there anymore. I will tell you it is a big problem. We're trying to do something about, but at 6,000-plus a month, they are very difficult to track that individual.

Commissioner, I believe there's federal registration that's going to require all the cellular providers to provide 911 calls the data in the very newer future.

Yes.

To use that example, the man with the gun, rather than dispatch a police officer, do we ever call people back and say, "You just called from this phone number and 765 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 reported a man with a gun." Do we do any kind of follow up at all?

No, we don't. And the reason we don't is that the way the 911 call-takers are trained is basically to get the information. We do assume that it is true and we dispatch it. Now, if I had them call back in the volumes that we see in 911 -- keep in mind we're talking about anywhere from 6, 7,000, up to 15,000 calls a day that we get, plus we get a lot of the fire calls, too, come through us, or the MS calls they come through us. The time we would need to call everybody back I think would prohibitive and we would tie up that line from other people getting in.

Obviously, a call like, an assist officer, might warrant some investigation that if it's unfounded.

I think, and I think the Commissioner would agree that an assist officer I think for the officer's safety that we dispatch, and we do that very quickly.

No, I meant if it's unfounded. In other words, if you have somebody 766 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 call in saying that officer's been shot or needs help --

And we get there and it's unfounded. I agree with you that we probably should do better follow-up on those. I agree with you.

I know we're running out of time, but --

Time's up, Councilman.

Can we publicize that somehow that the technology now can catch you?

Yes, yes, we will.

Thank you. Thank you, Madam Chair.

You're welcome. The Chair recognizes Councilwoman Brown.

Commissioner I inadvertently forgot to ask you about PAL. I know it's in the material you provided that the PAL centers increased by one, but number of young 767 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 people served dropped. Help me to understand that. It's Page -- actually, it's next to the last page of your testimony. And while you move to that, if a community is interested in starting a PAL center, who on your staff is the point person to call to determine if that's possible and/or if there are dollars there to make that happen? COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: The commanding officer is Jacqueline Daly, Lt. Jacqueline Daly. And we are in the process of looking for two of the sites, including one in West Philadelphia, but was I'm looking for that reference you're making because there was no indication to me -- I may have glanced over it, but it usually fluctuates between 24,000 and 25,000 children being served by about to PALs. 19

Currently, it's 20 actually 9, 10, 11 of the materials you provided 21 on the next to last page. Let me hear the name of 22 the lieutenant again. 23 COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: Jackie Daly, she's the commanding officer. I can get all the information over to your office, Councilwoman. 768 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005

Great. I'm just curious to know why there's a drop in the number of children served. You see the very last column all the way over to the extreme right, service level impact statement? COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: Oh. I'm looking at the text narrative.

Forgive me. COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: Forgive me.

FY 2001 projected. COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: I will get that information for you.

Thank you. COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: I'm sorry. I'm sorry. COMMISSIONER NESTEL: I think I can clarify that, Councilwoman. When that initial project was made for FY 2000, there was an anticipation there was going to be one or two additional PAL centers entered, so therefore, we had projected there would be more people served than there actually were. Actually, there has been no decrease, it's just there had not been the increase that we had expected. 769 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005

Okay then, thank you very much. And then lastly -- well, no, because another question was sparked by Councilman Clarke. With DARE and GREAT, the federal funding for those programs go out through 2000 -- help me out, 2001, 2000, how long does that -- COMMISSIONER NESTEL: Actually, that grant for the past, I'm going to say approximately five years, has been renewed each year and our anticipations are that that will continue.

Excellent. Coordination of other various police departments like PHA, the universities, is there a policy? Is that commission directive? Has there been any conversation about the value in blending your work force since you're in the same business? COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: As far as a merger, a merger is out of the question right now because there are civil service issues, there are pay issues and a whole host of things.

Sure. COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: But that is not to say that we don't work close. We work ver 770 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 close with PHA, with Penn, with Temple. And every Thursday morning, in addition to the informal and formal meetings at the local level with the district commanders, at our level every Thursday morning at the police academy in our COMPSTAT meetings, depending on which district is up, for example, if it's the 22nd, 23rd, and those in North Philly, Temple and Temple Police will be in attendance. If it's the 18th, Penn, Drexel, they'll all attend. St. Joe's if it's the 19th. So we do meet at least once a week at my level and then almost daily on an informal basis down at the district level.

And I guess to share information about how your -- COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: The crimes, the deployment. In our narcotics enforcement, Commissioner Johnson has a team of police officers from PHA assigned over to his the Narcotics Unit that does narcotics enforcement in PHA properties. So there's a lot of close cooperation with PHA. And let me tell you, Rich Zeppeli (ph) does not sit on his laurels, he pushes it every day.

Thank you very 771 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 much. Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilman Kenney.

Thank you, Madam Chair. So that the record's clear, based on Councilmember's Ortiz's comments about Latino communities experience during the '70s with the police, I can assure him that some Irish-Americans standing on the corner at Second Street drinking beer from time to time were told to move by the police. And if not moved too quickly, you often got a rap to the back of your head, sometimes to the back of your legs. That didn't come anywhere close to how bad it would be if your mother or father found out that you didn't do what the police told you to do. I think you get worse than the cop gave you. So I just wanted to make sure it was across all ethnic and racial lines that we were all banged around a little bit, but maybe we were better off for it, I don't know. (Laughter.)

Police chases. And 772 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 I don't know whether this has been covered or not. We seem to be in a bit of a no-win situation here. In Philadelphia it's becoming more and more likely that if you steal a car or leave the scene of a crime that's not involving a gun or some violent act, the chase, the pursuit will more times than not be called off by supervisors on the street. COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: Mm-hmm.

Granted, we've had terrible situations where being -- just recently a young hard-working pizza delivery man was killed -- COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: Right.

-- in an accident. How do we find a balance between really catching these people and not putting our citizenry at risk? And also not only involving the money involved in paying out the settlements on these lawsuits, but the human tragedy of loss of innocent life. COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: There are two extremes. One extreme, you have no policy at all and so you wind up like a small Police Department outside of Washington, DC. Actually, it's not, 773 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 it's right up here in the outskirts of, what is it, Montgomery County, John Norris? They just paid out $2 million on a high-speed auto pursuit just on one case. That's where you have an insufficient policy. On the other extreme is what Newark, New Jersey had upwards of five years ago. Under no circumstances would you pursue. So you had teenagers ramming police cars knowing that the cop cars wouldn't chase them, running all over Newark, New Jersey. The balance is, you take into consideration was is the crime committed. Clearly, if it's serious violent felony, you do the pursuit, but again, do it with care. You should stop at red lights. It can't go on forever. There should be a supervisor monitoring it. If it's a situation where there was some shoplifter robs something from a store, jumped in a car and now takes off, as happened up in Montgomery County or in King of Prussia and they come down here and they have an accident in the 18th District over somebody stole a $10 item. It's up to the sergeants or the CIB commanders or 774 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 the district commanders working to monitor and then call them off. And so I know the police officers get displeased when these situations get called off, but that's the way it has to be. We've got a balancing act we've got to do where the danger to the public outweighs the propriety of continuing that pursuit. You have to call it off, you absolutely have to call it off. The very fortunate thing that we have here, especially at night is we have the helicopters. I didn't read the statistics, but a couple times a week helicopters are involved in vehicle pursuits where we call off the ground unit, the chopper takes them, and then when we finally get them into an area, either a dead-end street or some secluded area then we call the ground units. That's been quite effective. But it's an ongoing battle. I mean, I just wind up in federal court of a case that happened before I got here where we paid out, I think it was 1.7 million. We have an obligation to the public for their safety, for their lives, and then a fiduciary responsibility also. 775 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005

This is an issue facing, I assume, every major city in every -- COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: It's every single city, it's a serious, serious issue.

But you think the helicopters have been a substantial -- COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: And as I say, when I'm wrong, I'll admit it. That's one of the cases where I was wrong. I was not a big fan of the helicopters coming in here because I didn't have such a good experience with them in New York. We've used them entirely different down here.

Let me ask you a lower level of pedestrian and vehicular safety issue. Is there any statistics that we can compare with the number of red light and stop sign moving violations that have been written, say, over the past year or two as compared to maybe the past five years? I notice outside, just outside this building alone outside City Hall, no one pays attention to red lights anymore. They just seem to have very little meaning. And I think in the list of broken window theory problems, this continual violation of law is putting people in 776 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 jeopardy. That one, for example, the northwest corner of City Hall where there's that's blind spot coming around that turn, I mean, someone's going to be killed there or seriously injured. But I notice that not only in Center City, but in just about every neighborhood that red light, stop sign, has very little meaning. Do we ask our people to pay attention to that, to write them up to try to increase in certain areas where we have these complaints? What's the status? COMMISSIONER NESTEL: Tom Nestel. Councilman, yes, we do stay on top of that. As a matter of fact, as part of the COMPSTAT process, one of the -- there is a form that we go over, their activity. We compare the moving violations and look at the number of accidents that have also occurred in those areas. And if their accidents are up, and I don't just mean police accidents, meaning accidents in general, then we want to know what are you doing as far as enforcing the law, because that certainly is a problem related to that.

So that's one of the things the commanders are taken to task for in 777 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 their own districts? If numbers begin to rise, they need to show some way that they're going to solve that problem? COMMISSIONER NESTEL: Absolutely. And we identify top problem corners throughout the City, and that's distributed to the officers and we look to see what kind of enforcement there is in those specific areas.

Thank you. Have your commanders responded to you in any way about the effectiveness of night court in their district, whether they felt that night court program has had any positive effect? It certainly has had a good public relations effect, and I'm wondering whether or not that they've noticed any on the lower-end crime, vandalism, corner-hanging, drinking, public urination issues, whether or not night court has been effective and would you recommend that we try to find ways in having it funded it on a regular basis? COMMISSIONER NESTEL: Again, that topic has also come up at our COMPSTAT meetings, and the majority of the commanders do feel that there are good benefit to having that night court that 778 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 they're able to enforce some of these quality-of-life issues, get those offenders before a judge immediately, and it does appear to have a positive effect.

So the department would support an effort to have this funding institutionalized as long as it doesn't come out of your budget? I'll say that before you do. (Laughter.)

But there would be a supportive attitude about trying to find a way to institutionalize? Because right now what it is is it's staff people volunteering, judges volunteering, and we really need to find some way to fund an institutional court at night. But that would be something you would support? COMMISSIONER NESTEL: Yes, sir.

Thank you. Thank you, Madam Chair.

Commissioner, I think we're going to have to offer you a cot soon. We still have other questions. Councilman Clarke.

Yes, thank you, 779 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 Madam President. I'll be brief. I just wanted to get some clarification into my earlier statements with respect to the response by Councilman Ortiz and a discussion with him in the hall and the chairperson of the Police Advisory Commission which I spoke to in the hall, and actually, some comments you made. I'm not asking for us to do what New York did, that was referenced on a couple of occasions. And I'm definitely not asking to elect Giuliani to be our mayor. With respect to the fear issue, I understand that there was -- because I've worked here during Cold Turkey and I understand the concerns associated with what happened in Spring Garden and I don't want our residents to fear the police, but I do want the criminals to fear the police. And with respect to the potential of doing some legislation, I would like to look at it just as we are looking at the rethinking of the accents decree as it relates to abandoned vehicles where the problem has changed so maybe we need to rethink that position. So it's clear, I want everybody to understand I'm not asking for storm trooper tactics, but I just need to see something 780 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 happen. COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: I didn't suspect that. What I was saying is I understand your frustration. I mean, but, you know, that's kind of the way it is.

I understand. Okay, thank you.

Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilman Ortiz.

Thank you, Madam Chair. Commissioner, crossing guards. How many are we budgeted for this year? COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: A thousand.

You have met and we had public hearings here in which we had representatives from across the City. COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: Right.

And from the alliance organizing project. And they identified a series of other corners and other schools that were needed and were desperately seeking to have crossing guards on those corners because of those kids. Obviously, a thousand will not do in order 781 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 to fulfill this. They have identified across the City over 37 corners. And after a study, those 37 corners were justified because of the traffic and the movement and the children. And given the guidelines set up by the Police Department, those corners qualify for a crossing guard. COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: Mm-hmm.

The need has grown. What can we do to satisfy those communities and those schools and those parents? COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: As you're well aware, sir, we are constrained by budget. We have budgeted 1,000 school crossings that have been analyzed and, you know, allocated as we think in the most appropriate manner. If there is a possibility of going through those one thousand, reviewing them, and finding something that maybe no longer meets the criteria, then reallocating that money or that position --

We're not asking to eliminate any of the corners because that only would send one neighborhood to complain and we don't want that. We don't want parents from one school in West Philadelphia or North Philly coming 782 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 in here and saying -- I think we have a thousand corners that need crossing guards. COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: Mm-hmm.

Parents across the City have identified at least 37 more. What would it cost to have those covered? As every Councilperson here knows, crossing guards are very, very sacred. COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: I know. I get letter all the time. Each school crossing guards costs a little over $15,000; $15,288.91. So do the math, if you do 37, you know, it is what it is, that's what I costs. You know, in defending our budget, you know, we make these calls all the time. Would I love to have 1,037 or 1,050, I would, but I'd also like to have -- yeah, but there's a limited budget. I'm sure Commissioner Hairston, he would like some more firemen and fir officers and what have you. So you know, it's an issue of prioritizing, managing the budget you're given with, and that's part of the charge. It's not that I'm insensitive to those requests, but there also seems to be an insatiable appetite for cops, 783 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 school crossing guards, a whole host of things.

Well, it's not insatiable. It's just that these parent groups that have come before us in City Council have kids, And these kids go to schools that have a volume of traffic and accidents have happened. So they have they have come in and they have said to us -- we held hearings last year on crossing guards. You were there. We asked them to go out and identify what corners across the City were the priority ones, and they did their work. They identified 37 corners that meet the criteria set by the Police Department. And that's not a big addition to make to accommodate 37. COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: It would cost about 600,000 for the 37 guards on a per annum basis. I mean, I wish I had it in my present budget. I'm being quite frank that there isn't an extra penny in this budget. You know, there are certain other initiatives in regards to crime and quality of life that we use in the budget in addition to grant money. If I got a million dollar grant tomorrow and I could afford to purchase those 37 school crossing guards, I'd do 784 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 it. But right now in the budget I have and the grants money that I have, they're allocated out to the penny.

Thank you. Thank you, Madam Chair.

Commissioner, are you aware of the 35 corners that the Councilman's referring to? COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: Yeah, I think we have a list. Commissioner Nestel has the list.

And has your department looked into the locations to ascertain if a school crossing guard is warranted. COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: I know Chief Prior and Inspector Deloqua (ph) who was working on this whole issue have looked at them, have done an analysis. What their findings were, I don't have it handy.

Could you let us know? COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: I will, but let me just say, I was talking to, for example, yesterday Captain Hailey where an issue of a school crossing guard was injured on duty. So the 785 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 community, I understand to be so was complaining up in the 15th district that there are, you know, 180 kids pass that intersection. Turned out it wasn't, it was 40, but we still put a police officer out there. So when it comes to situations like that, if we find a dangerous intersection, then we will on a short-term basis put police officer out there. When I get back tonight, I will speak to chief Prior and I'll speak to Inspector Deloqua and I will get back to you, ma'am.

Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilman Rizzo.

Thank you, thank you, Madam President. Commissioner, I was just handed a phone call from a disabled person that is mobile and can get around, and I don't know whether -- and I tried to explain that maybe it's just as a result of the snow storm. In many of our rowhouse, townhouse neighborhoods, I call it a rowhouse, years ago when these homes were built, the off-street parking was designed for one large car and a garage. Now, during in the last few weeks, 786 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 many people have been parking their cars in their driveway, a small car and a second small car and they're overhanging impeding flow of pedestrian traffic in many of the neighborhoods. I know that that is a violation of the motor vehicle code, I believe, and obviously this handicapped person cannot use their wheelchair to get through the neighborhood to get where going because they have to go out into the street to get around the vehicle that's hanging over the sidewalk. I tied to explain that maybe just a temporary situation that because people can't find when there's mounds of snow piled up in the street to find adequate on-street parking and they're trying to take advantage of every little space they have. But if that would continue, would that be something that the district officers would enforce? COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: We will. You know, I had this conversation with Mayor Street. We've been very fortunate in the last four years that there's been no snow. But as a result of there being no snow, people forgot what you're supposed to do as far as common courtesies, cleaning the sidewalks, and they almost have to be 787 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 retrained, if you will, because we've gone four years without snow and people forgot what's expected of them with regard to the law and then common neighborly courtesies. It's been interesting to watch. We did issue summonses and you saw the outrage that it caused.

Particularly in South Philadelphia. COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: My phone never stopped ringing. They said, "We haven't got a ticket in four years." Well, that's because there was no snow in four years. So it's an issue.

When you drive around, you'll see that many people are trying to crunch two cars into a driveway and block the sidewalk. Many of us that are not disabled don't realize what a burden that puts on some of our constituents. Thank you, Madam Chair.

You're welcome. The Chair recognizes Councilwoman Blackwell.

Thank you, 788 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 Madam President. In night court, there was a time, and I understand the legislation. I understand there is some policy before when the police officers rounded people up the judge could ask them -- could take whatever money confiscated --

Councilwoman, would you mind speaking into your microphone. The stenographer is have difficulty hearing you.

Before the judge could confiscate any monies that the people have when the were shooting craps or suspected of other misdemeanor crimes in night court. And I don't understand why, but the supposedly there's a policy change that they can't do that, that we can't do that anymore? COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: I'm not familiar with that at all.

All right, if you're not sure, then I'll get it from the judge and he will explain it and I'll just contact you after this. Thank you. Thank you, Madam President.

Thank you. 789 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 Are there any other questions from members of the committee? (No further questions.)

Gentlemen, thank you all very much. COMMISSIONER TIMONEY: Thank you, ma'am.

Philadelphia prisons. (Prison witnesses come forward.)

Good afternoon, Commissioner. Thank you for your patience. COMMISSIONER COSTELLO: Good afternoon.

We do have a copy of your testimony. A copy of it will be given at the stenographer, so if you will abbreviate your testimony, we'd appreciate it. COMMISSIONER COSTELLO: I will, Council President.

Thank you. COMMISSIONER COSTELLO: Thank you for the opportunity to be here today to present our brief summary of our budget. With me on my left 790 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 is --

Excuse me. Just identify yourself for the record. COMMISSIONER COSTELLO: Yes, Thomas Costello, Commissioner of Prisons. On my left is Deputy Commissioner Grooms, and you know Ms. Granlund, our director of Criminal Justice Population Management. And today also is Ed Szymanski and Dan Rakowski from our business office. During the first half of Fiscal Year 2000, we provided safe and secured housing for a daily average of 6,761 inmates. The 139.4 million operating budget request for FY '01 is based on a projected average daily population of 6891. The Class 100 request increase includes an increase for positions to staff the any new women's detention facility. Also, this increase includes the wage increase that goes into effect March 15, 2000. The FY 200 request includes a net increase of about 6.5 million. This increase is due primarily to the rise in inmate population and the transfer of the behavioral health services to the prison health system at about $4.5 million. 791 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 As stated earlier, there are a number of initiatives spearheaded by the Director of Criminal Justice Population Management, and I believe she did give us a synopsis of all of the initiatives. And I would just like to conclude by saying that although the City's developed strong population management initiatives, these can only be partially mitigate the demand for prison capacity. All participants in the criminal justice system will need to do their part in order to prevent our budget, the Philadelphia Prison System, from expanding beyond the City's tax base. That basically sums up my presentation, Council President. I'll entertain any questions that you may have.

Thank you, Commissioner. Why has the funding for behavioral health been transferred from the Health Department to your budge? I believe it amounts to $4.5 million. And when did that transfer take place? COMMISSIONER COSTELLO: The transfer is going to take place place for FY 2001, and the reason is to provide complete services for mental 792 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 health with the responsibility of the Prison System in coordination with the Department of Health and other agencies outside of the Prison System. One of the key responsible persons is here today that is coordinating, and that is Deputy Commissioner Press Grooms, so he may have a few comment on that.

Basically, what our concern is is to provide a mental health services and a physical services for the inmate within our care so that primarily we could have one person that reports to the Prison System in dealing with contracts. We would have just one CEO for the system rather than having two different entities.

Thank you. Mr. Costello, what are some of the population management strategies that you are considering in order for the Prison System to stay within the acceptable limit? COMMISSIONER COSTELLO: I think the strategies are set forth under population control. The Earned Time/Good Time program is continuing, and that has been very effective. Continuing on, all the population management initiatives, and it 793 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 will be ongoing for 2001. I believe that as far as the housing for the future populations, we've addressed that, especially with the construction of the new women's detention facility. That will really give the system the beds that they need to control the population, or at least house them properly.

Thank you. On -5 of the detail, it reflects a $1.2 million reduction in overtime for the Prison System in FY 2001. How were you able to reduce your overtime by that amount? COMMISSIONER COSTELLO: By simply hiring staff to fill those positions?

How many staff will you hire? COMMISSIONER COSTELLO: Presently we're running into the same problem that the Police Department is running into concerning hiring. We are probably about 80 positions right now.

How many? COMMISSIONER COSTELLO: Eighty that we would like to hire instead of utilizing overtime. We just gave a test and we'll have a list very 794 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 shortly and we hope to hire those positions in order to curtail the amount of overtime for next fiscal year.

-26 of the detail reflects a savings of over $9.2 million from delay in filling new positions and turnover. What -- COMMISSIONER COSTELLO: I think I'm going to ask one of our business people here. Ed, would you --

When was the last time a test was given? Why did we wait so long? Is there an existing list? COMMISSIONER COSTELLO: We give testing every year, President Verna. The problem is we exhaust the list his then have to give another test and there's certain delays and parameters we have to work within the system as far as putting a new CO class together, putting them through eight weeks of formal training and another additional four months of on-the-job training.

How long have these positions been vacant? COMMISSIONER COSTELLO: We have not 795 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 been able to fill all of the positions that were allocated for the department. I don't have -- I don't know the exact number. Ed, do you? Dan.

My name is Daniel Rakowski, Administrative Service Director. The delay in filling in this case relates mostly to the positions for the new women's detention facility. There are roughly 230 positions in the budget for that. Since it is not scheduled to be open until sometime very late in the fiscal year, we're providing only about two months' worth of funding for that. So the delay in filling is ten months that they will not be on board because the facility will not be open yet.

That gives us an explanation. The Chair recognizes Councilwoman Brown.

Thank you. Good afternoon, gentlemen. COMMISSIONER COSTELLO: Good afternoon, Councilwoman. 796 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005

of your testimony here under educational services. COMMISSIONER COSTELLO: Yes.

It has here that 150 inmates -- well it shows a decrease, but it also speaks to why the decrease in the number of inmates who have received their GED. What is the total population? So to get a sense of what of the population is indeed participating in educational kinds of activities. COMMISSIONER COSTELLO: The total population today is about 6750. We have about 6450 within our facilities today.

Opportunities like the GED, is that voluntary. COMMISSIONER COSTELLO: Yes. It is only mandatory for our juvenile-aged direct file 19 certified population that are 17 or younger.

For someone who -- well, part of my career was in juvenile justice, and at that point you're able to help young people understand the value for a GED, but do you officer any inducements to help inmates understand that without that, there's very little hope. 797 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 COMMISSIONER COSTELLO: We certainly encourage them in every aspect of the classification, starting from the initial classification at intake. So they are encouraged if they do not have their GED to participate in the programs. That's also affiliated with other programs that we have that may not require a GED or a high school diploma, but we encourage them to attain it in order to pursue that particular vocation.

We know that the library a few years back endured, some might say, criticism that was due them with regards to the matter in which or don't handle their books. Do you have something in place where the Prison System at least takes advantage of the overabundance of books that the Free Library gets rid of every year. COMMISSIONER COSTELLO: We do not have a leisure library, but we do not have -- currently, we are not utilizing the hardback books. Most of those books are hardback covers because of the contraband use that they have used the books for in previous years. 798 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005

I see. COMMISSIONER COSTELLO: Because they do use books for contraband, we restrict right now to the soft covers. However, the Commissioner may want to expand on that point, we are looking to change that policy and try to at least incorporate a portion of those books to the Prison System.

Please do, because again on , second paragraph, you speak to how 80 percent of the -- I'm so inclined to say young people, but in this case it's inmates, who come into the system are former substance abusers and given the reality that you've just outlined, how are you going to reconcile that? You said the deputy could speak to that in greater detail. COMMISSIONER COSTELLO: Well, I wanted him to at least talk about the possibility of the use o hardback books.

If I may, we've had some discussions with all the wardens. As you know, five major institutions that, and of course, of the major institutions, several of them are medium and minimum custody. So what we're entertaining as the start-up is to have hardback books placed 799 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 in those minimum custody institutions.

I see.

And hopefully, if that works out fine, and we think it will, we can also put the hardback books into the maximum security institutions. But we certainly want to do that as a pilot program in minimum custody institutions first.

I'll certainly be interested in seeing how that goes. And so next year, I'll have a follow-up question on that.

Fine.

Thank you.

Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilman Rizzo.

Thank you, Madam Chair. I'd like to address an issue that I get lots of people asking me the question, why in the City of Philadelphia we don't utilize prisoners like other counties do, Montgomery is one that I know that use prisoners to pick up trash, debris, clean strewn lots. I tell many of the people, giving the best answer that I can, that it's a 800 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 labor town and it's difficult to use prisoners to do certain work that other people do. But could you address do we do anything? Do we shovel snow with some of them or do we have -- could you explain why we don't do what Montgomery County does? COMMISSIONER COSTELLO: Basically because of the labor contracts. We are restricted from utilizing inmate labor to do bargain work. We do have various crews that go out in specific areas, such as cleaning the park, things of that nature, very close to the prison campus. And we once in a while we do have work release inmates who are used for special community details, but the main reason why we do not use this labor extensively is because of the union contracts.

If the unions would allow in certain areas -- an example, Fairmount Park is in desperate condition when it comes to clearing bridle paths and downed trees, and I've talked --and I won't name names. I've talked to some folks in the parks that would just welcome having some help dealing with some of the timber that's blocked trails and help restoring some of 801 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 trails. If the labor unions would agree to allow whatever is necessary to do that, could you accommodate them? COMMISSIONER COSTELLO: We could accommodate them, however, there would be cost a cost affixed to that because inmates cannot work unsupervised. So the average detail would be about -- for a minimum, low minimum, or a 10 community custody level inmate work group, we 11 would need at least one staff member for 12 approximately 12 to 15 to supervise them properly 13 if they were classified and cleared to work in the 14 community. So there would be some cost, but 15 again, the obstacle here is the labor contracts.

When a person is charged with DUI they have to one weekend a month report for an overnighter, or I'm not sure exactly. Have what do you do with those folks? COMMISSIONER COSTELLO: We have a group of right now of about 35 to 45 weekenders who come in on Friday night and stay the weekend. They work a normal work week during the week, and most of them are DUIs. And actually, during the day they are given work details in work details around 802 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 the grounds of the prison system. So that during the day they are given the special details to work. They stay for two nights, and then on Sunday night they're discharged and they go home and go back to work on Monday morning.

So obviously, you've been able to deal with your union.

Well, use them around the prison complex. The problem is outside of the prison complex. As long as they're working within a prison facility, it's not an issue. In fact, one of the areas that we've used them for is to keep the area outside of Holmesburg clean and inside, too. Even though that facility is inactive, we store many things in that facility, and it needs to be maintained. We used weekenders basically to do that.

Councilman, I'd like to address that issue.

Excuse me, please identify yourself for the record.

I'm sorry, President Verna. Dianne Granlund. Part of the restrictive intermediate 803 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 punishment program is a court-mandated community service component of approximately 100 or 200 hours, depending upon what the offense is that you were accused of. These people, although, they are not inmates, are required to perform this community service. And this community service component is dedicated to Fairmount Park. So that's already in place; it's just not inmates. But we are already working with people in Fairmount Park.

I'm talking beyond just picking up papers at valley Green. I'm talking about at some significant work which the park -- and I spend a lot of time walking in the park. Most trails are blocked with trees, and what they're doing now is just trying to do the minimum cut and just kick over to the side a piece of that timber. I was told that if this could be worked out, obviously, with the agreement of the labor unions and the prison system, that they could use as many people supervised to perform these, the park would be a better place.

Currently there are -- well, there are Risk Management issues evidently 804 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 with allowing either inmates or parolees to use such things as chain saws.

Well, I'm not -- I'm talking working with people that have that talent. I'm talking about some of labor, picking up a piece of wood.

Sure. And I think that if you look at the community service component, you're going to find that people doing that.

Okay.

Now, if they're not doing enough, I would encourage Fairmount Park people to call me.

I constantly -- again, the buzzer's going off. People refer to Montgomery County and they deal with the same labor unions in many cases that we deal with, that that has been very effective. 422, if you drive up there on a Sunday, you'll see trash bags lined up for miles that those inmates have picked up and waiting for collection on Monday morning. And people ask me constantly why we don't do that. And again, I knew part of the answer, but I think it's something that should be pursued and maybe 805 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 there'd be some agreement between labor to utilize some of those folks and with Risk Management. Because if it works other places, it should be able to work here. Thank you. Thank you, Madam Chair.

You're welcome. Commissioner, in that vein, several years ago Councilmembers had visited the prison, and that was before your appointment. It was said at that time that there was a possibility that the inmates could in the print shop do much of our stationary. Was there ever done, to the best of your knowledge? COMMISSIONER COSTELLO: We have a very sophisticated print shop and available to perform those jobs, quote/unquote, when you're ready to utilize PhilaCorps (ph) for that.

Has the City ever taken advantage of that, to the best of your knowledge? COMMISSIONER COSTELLO: Yes. We have several contracts. Dan, did you want to expand on that? 806 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005

Very briefly, Dan. COMMISSIONER COSTELLO: Dan Rakowski oversees the PhilaCorps operations.

Quite simply, the prison print shop has for years printed stationary and forms for many, many City departments.

Really?

We do probably close to a million dollars worth of business a year in printing, and very shortly they'll be able to do the gold seal as well as the standard. But we do printing for most City departments, and Council can just give us a buzz.

Very glad to hear that. Thank you very much. Are there any other questions? (No further questions.)

Thank you very much. COMMISSIONER COSTELLO: Thank you, President Verna.

Fire Department. 807 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 (Fire Department witnesses come forward.)

Our very patient commissioner. Commissioner, we do have a copy of your testimony, so I will give it to the stenographer. It will be printed in it's complete form if you simply want to abbreviate your remarks. COMMISSIONER HAIRSTON: Sure. Good afternoon. I'm commissioner Harold Hairston from the Fire Department. With me to my right is Deputy Commissioner William J. McNulty, and to my left is the Budget Officer Dave Beatrice. Our General Fund calls for $139,963,217. Our Aviation Fund calls for 4,032,400. Grants Fund of $551,893, which really accounts for salary and benefits for five employees which total $268,800, and the remainder is for supplies and EMS equipment for $283,093. That brings for a total of $144,547,510. That's an increase of $1,396,027 over our previous year's budget. That really accounts for a $1,122,027 which really go for salaries, raises, and so forth. That's uniformed 808 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 members got a percent raise as of 9/15/99, and our non-uniformed members received a percent 4 raise on 3/15 of 2000. And we added $240,000 for some additional sets of bunker gear. We automatically buy bunker gear every year. What we're doing is adding this so that we can really kind of speed up our replacement. A set of bunker gear really costs $960 per set, so that's going to give us roughly 450 sets that will be replaced in a year. We need to replace about 1800 sets over the next four years or so. It's going to be state-of-the-art, it's a little bit lighter, and a lot more protective. For staffing, this budget really calls for a total of 2493 persons for our General fund. The Aviation Fund calls for an additional 70. And our Grants Fund gives us five more people for a total of 2568 employees. That present staffing really calls for 40 people that we just started as of Monday, so it gives us a total of $2,565 members. We've been very fortunate over the last few years to see fire deaths come down. If you look at the calendar year, we reduced the 42 809 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 compared to 46 over the previous year. Structure fires have also come down. They've decreased from 2859 in FY '98 to 2797 in FY '99. Our medical runs have continued to go up, though. More and more that's what year responding to. They've increased over last year to 165,234. We project and we hope that we can keep these fire deaths down because right now this month they're kind of out of control. We've had five so far that have been due to arson, which is very, very difficult to control because that's really using fire as a weapon. We had two people that died from fires that were left over from last year and other six really died this year. Our medical runs continue to go up, and we project that in FY '01, they will probably be up to about 174, 175,000. Our EMS revenue has continued to go up. It was probably going to stay just about the same as it was this past year, though, to somewhere around 13.2 million. If you have any questions, I'll be happy to answer them. 810 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005

I've read your testimony. I personally don't have any questions, but I do have a comment. I just want to applaud you and your department for doing an absolutely fabulous job, and I congratulate you on your reappointment. COMMISSIONER HAIRSTON: Thank you very much.

The Chair recognizes Councilman Kenney.

Thank you. Good afternoon. Commissioner, I know you've been a commissioner now for a number of years and you've been a fire fighter for probably three or four times longer. You've taken a little bit of grief in the newspaper and otherwise about this issue of Hepatitis C. I know that the Mayor stepped forward and made some commitments financially, which I know you've applauded that happenstance and that we're going to try to move forward in deal with this. The one issue that keeps coming up that I need your input on or your viewpoint is an issue we raised yesterday with Risk Management as it relates to fire fighters who 811 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 are infected and the process by which they go through to determine whether or not it was work related. Risk Management has indicated through their testimony that they start out trying to at least give the employee the benefit of the doubt and try to work their way through this process and if any possibility of giving leeway to deem this work-related, considering the difficulty that the employee would have in proving it over a 10- or 12- or 15-year period when they may have contracted it and when it really starts to become evident. What's your on this whole thing and where do you stand and what's your department's policy on this issue? COMMISSIONER HAIRSTON: Well, a few years ago, and I guess the person who can probably give you the most detailed information about this is the person who is right to my right, which is Bill McNulty. It used to be that a large part of his job when he was a personnel director was to prepare information for the Commissioner for people that wanted to make a claim for service connection, and that went on for years. But people in the traditional sense are not making a 812 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 claim for service connection because that really falls under Regulation 32. That would be a simple case for me, because the cases that come before me primarily for Regulation 32, unfortunately, deals with people who are severely injured on duty, which is very obvious career-ending kind of things, or unfortunately where somebody dies. It's relatively simple, they die on the fire ground, I've got witnesses to it, very easy for me to make the claim and so for. It's a little more difficult making it to the state or the federal government and so forth. As far as Hepatitis C is concerned, it's very, very difficult to deal with something that really does not come before you, because nobody is asking me to make that kind of adjudication. Nobody has asked me at all to come before me to make their claim. What they've asked to do is to treat me like a funnel, which is for them to make a claim, notify the employer, which is me, and then for me to pass that information on to Risk Management. And so they go through a different process there. I believe that based on the way 813 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 everything has happened with this that what you're going to see is a very, very clear process that really will enable people to err on the part of the employee. I believe that that's what will happen. I believe what happens with these claims, very frankly, is that they're going to fall into three categories: Ones that are going to be very clear because we will have done everything that we could to protect the employee and the employee has a bona fide contagious disease contact and we're going to have a record of it. We're going to have others that clearly, because of the information that comes forward through this process where Risk Management is able to get information to determine based on some basic criteria that the person either had it before and you find out through getting the information. Or there will be others where it won't be clear-cut, it could go either way.

The fortunate part about it, very frankly, is that there's so much attention that has been brought to this that I believe that a person, a referee in this case, will probably err 814 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 on the part of employee. Now, that's probably going to be a difficult process, but that's really what happens. The other half of this, very frankly, really deals with how to look at dealing with the health plan. Because there's some employees that clearly are spending a lot of money out of their pockets and they need help. I believe that's why the Mayor stepped forward gave that money. I believe that there will be a reasonable process that happens out of that where they will be able to work with the unions and come up with some criteria that allows for people to be able to pay for this. That's an imperfect world at best, though, with all of these things because it's the kind of thing you wouldn't wish on your worst enemy. Nobody knows when they're really going to be affected with it. From my own personal standpoint, I want the fire fighters to get every bit of help that they can possibly get. And whatever that means -- I don't really care who they get it from, I don't really care how they got it, from a personal standpoint. They have it, they belong to us, they go out every single day 815 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 and do something that I consider very courageous. I believe that they will continue to do that. But, you know, this is not the kind of job where you make a tremendous amount of money, but you do make a tremendous commitment. So somebody has to decide as to whether or not that commitment really is worth something in terms of dollars and cents, and that's what that really comes down to.

Well, I'm glad you had an opportunity to express it for the record and publically, and you've done so eloquently. One of the questions I have is the issue the sick time and vacation time while this process kind of moves forward. And I know maybe Risk Management can kind of -- if they have some jurisdiction in this area can kind of give some input. I know a lot of people that are going through this process of determination and dealing with the disease or at the same time going through a period of using up whatever available sick time there is as a result of the complications and the reaction to some of the medication they're taking maybe even into their vacation time and some of their accumulated comp time and those things. And 816 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 I'm wondering whether or not there's going to be some way to, once it's determined that this was in fact work-related, to restore or give to credit for that. COMMISSIONER HAIRSTON: We have meticulous records. When I tell you we have meticulous record, I think you can go to the bank with them. We can tell you who used sick time, when they used it, how much they used, why they used it. I believe because of the records that we have that should it come to a point where we are to return time to people, that will be a relative live painless process. What happens prior to that, though, is the fact that people do get ill. And while they're ill, a determination is made at present by their own personal doctor in most cases, a doctor decides whether or not they can work or not. What I've been able to do in many cases is if I had a job available, whether or not it was sitting on the desk as close as I can come to not feather bedding, as close as I can come to not doing that, I have allowed people to do other things. I plan to continue to do that unless someone stops me from doing that. So I'm going to 817 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 be as compassionate as I possibly can in order to see that that happens. I will continue to do that as long as the budget allows me to do that. Now, when it comes down to returning the time, that will be a decision that won't be made by me, but be made by others. And when it is, I certainly will return the time to anybody who uses it for that purpose.

Fine. Thank you very much for your explanation.

Commissioner, thank you very much. I think we have aired that issue out and I appreciate your honesty. Thank you. COMMISSIONER HAIRSTON: Thank you.

Are there any other questions from members of the committee? (No further questions.)

And thank you for waiting so long. The next department is Information Technology. (Information technology witnesses come forward.) 818 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005

Good afternoon. Please identify yourself for the record. We do have a copy of your testimony. A copy of it will be printed in full. If you would simply abbreviate your remarks, we'd appreciate it.

Good afternoon, Council President Verna and members of City Council. I am Brian Anderson, Chief Information Officer for the City of Philadelphia. With me here today are key senior members of my staff Karl Bortnick who is our chief program manager; Rich Congo, who is our deputy CIO; and Jacqueline Henry, who is our personnel and administrative officer. The Mayor's Office of Information Services is requesting a total of $12,893,485 from the general refund for Fiscal Year 2001. From the water fund, we are requesting $596,872 in Class 100 for 12 full-time positions; $268,364 in Class 200 for hardware and software maintenance; and $26,967 for materials supplies and equipment. With the Fiscal Year 2000 budget, we will continue to enhance service and support for the City's 819 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 central and departmental computer systems and expand our use of new technologies such as the Internet, mobile computing network based applications, analytical reporting software, and GIS mapping software. In Fiscal Year 2000 we have a number of accomplishments that we'd like to note. One major accomplishment was the year 2000 readiness initiative. Through this initiative we had a citywide assessment of the risk that was imposed to the City by the year 2000 problem. Through our assessment, we identified a number of risks that could disrupt or actually fail critical City services. With that information, we initiated several projects. We upgraded over 400 computer systems citywide. This upgrade not only minimized the risk of disruption to a central City services, but it as well prepared us for future use of information technology and there were a lot of lessons to be learned from the way we approached and managed that initiative. Other key accomplishments include our massive data center upgrade. For the first time, the City actually has a brand-new mainframe 820 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 computer that is sizeable enough to support citywide information, technology, improvements, for the next several years, Many years going forward. A network infrastructure upgrade. We made substantial upgrades to our City's network infrastructure. The City of Philadelphia has the largest integrated network in the country for municipal government. Other cities like New York do not have an integrated network where agencies can communicate with each other. This is another major infrastructure implementation that will prepare us for information technology investments in the future. In addition to the upgrades that we made, we continue to the support and development of citywide business software applications, including several GIS implementations. Another significant implementation and set of activities that we accomplished in the year 2000 was electronic government. As everyone knows, electronic government is changing the way we work, changing our economy, and as many of know, we're only seeing the tip of the iceberg in 821 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 terms of what it can do for government and what it can do for our City. Gov Web sites. Some of the Web sites included a Police Department Web site, a new procurement Web site that provides procurement services to the citizens as well as the fit and free Web site in which in one week we received over, I think the number was 50,000 hits. So that was -- it was a massive amount of people coming in to visit that Web site. It's just a demonstration of what a powerful medium that can be going forward in the future for communicating City Council information as well as other government information. In Fiscal Year 2000, we have a number of initiatives that we plan to complete. One is the electronic initiatives around electronic government services. Gov more useful to citizens to make upgrade information to make it more current.

Beyond providing extending City government to services, we think there's a lot of value in providing more complete and accurate 822 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 information to citizens, more useful information to citizens. So we have several developments under. That we plan to implement a new citywide e-mail upgrade. We've actually begun that initiative and we plan it in FY 2001. This new upgrade will make our central e-mail system more reliable and stable, and we'll also offer new services such as video conferencing and other things that will be built right within our existing network infrastructure. We plan to continue to expand our network. We have major initiatives including networking all of our school systems so that our children we can have educational Internet service that will be provided to our schools. We also plan to continue to expand our geographic information systems. The City of Philadelphia has been recognized as a leader in its use geographical information systems. There are many applications in our Water Department, our Streets Department as well as our Licenses and Inspections Department. One new initiative that we plan to implement is a data warehousing initiative. The 823 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 City has a massive amount of data and information. We plan to use data warehousing technology to make this information intelligent so that we can use it to make business decisions going forward. Key initiatives include our financial data warehouse so that everyone can analyze their budget and we can actually see relationships to contracts and budget information. Other initiatives that we look to implement include data warehouse initiatives in our social services programs so that we can see how residents or citizens go through different services, from our prison systems to our shelters through other human services agencies. One key initiative in our effort to enhance the awareness of 21st century skills throughout the City, we plan to implement 400 computers throughout our recreation centers or Class A recreation centers that will provide computer learning centers. We've implemented it on Martin Luther King's birthday. We actually implement two of those centers where we provided ten computers and created computer labs where children can come and log on and get education 824 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 through CD-ROM educational software. We also plan to make these centers connected -- give them connections to the Internet so that they can get other education as well.

What are the two centers?

The two centers are the Martin Luther King recreation center and -- what was the other? I'll have to get back to you on the other center.

Okay.

Madam President, this concludes my testimony. I want to thank City Council for your ongoing support, and I will be glad to answer any questions that you may have.

Thank you, Mr. Anderson. Over the last eight years the City has made tremendous improvements in its information systems. Has the Administration asked your agency to assess the information systems at the School District and at PGW?

I have not been asked to assess their systems. We have had a coordinated effort related to Y2K, the Y2K initiative. 825 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005

I would request that you offer services to both the School District and PGW and present an action plan to the Administration and City Council, say, within the next six weeks. Do you think that's doable?

I would have to get back to you on that. I think it's something that we can potentially do.

Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilman Rizzo.

Mr. Anderson, you went through a list of many things that you plan to do in the next fiscal year and your budget is approximately close to $13 million. Are there any projects that you really -- and I know you Information System people would like to do a lot of things and all at once, but are there any projects that you really need to get done, like one that's close to my heart, back-up systems and things like that, that you're not able to get done because $13 million isn't enough? Did you have to postpone anything or any major -- these hearings are to put you on the spot, so are there things that you really need to make this City move 826 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 forward in the area? Like the president just asked, if you could assess PGW and assess the School District, well, you might not have the people or the money or the talent to be able to make a first-class assessment or something else would have to suffer as a result of you assessing those two areas. Could you tell, me are there some things -- and I'm hearing that there are some things that you really would like to get cooking here that maybe million isn't enough to make it 12 all happen and you guys take the hit every time 13 something doesn't work, the e-mail takes two hours to go from Point A to Point B or a week. And you mentioned that you're upgrading the e-mail system, and I'm pleased to hear that. But can you tell me, is there some things that you really need to get done to make this a first class system?

Councilman, there are a number of things. I think the major thing that is that it is a challenge for our agency within our target budget to keep up with the demand and growth of the citywide use of information technology, in particular with regard to the support of our network systems. When 500 new 827 2/15/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 computers and locations are added to our network, the system doesn't allow for an increase in our target budget to support all of that, and we have a number of people that are working very hard to try to keep up, but if I had a chance to pick one project that we could get more support on, that would be additional funding to support the growing needs and growth citywide that corresponds to the growth. If 500 computers are added, we should get budget dollars to support that new upgrade.