COUNCIL OF THE CITY OF PHILADELPHIA2 COMMITTEE ON TRANSPORTATION AND3 PUBLIC UTILITIES4 - - -5 Room 400, City Hall6 Philadelphia, Pennsylvania Tuesday, June 16, 20097 10:10 a.m. 8 - - - 9 10 PRESENT: COUNCILMAN CURTIS JONES, JR., CHAIR11 COUNCILWOMAN JANNIE BLACKWELL COUNCILMAN WILLIAM GREENLEE12 COUNCILMAN BRIAN J. O'NEILL 13 14 RESOLUTION 080959 - Resolution authorizing Council's Committee on Transportation and15 Public Utilities in anticipation of the incoming federal administration's commitment16 to invest in urban infrastructure building initiatives, to conduct an independent17 investigation of the Water Department... 18 19 20 - - -21 22 V A R A L L O Incorporated Litigation Support Services23 Eleven Penn Center 1835 Market Street, Suite 60024 Philadelphia, Pennsylvania 19103 215.561.2220 215.567.267025 2 1
Good2 morning. The City Council Committee on3 Transportation and Public Utilities is4 now in a public hearing to hear testimony5 on Resolution No. 080959.6 In attendance with me to my7 left is Vice-Chair, Councilman Bill8 Greenlee, and to my right, Councilwoman9 Jannie Blackwell.10 Can the Clerk please read the11 title of the resolution.12
Resolution 080959,13 authorizing Council's Committee on14 Transportation and Public Utilities in15 anticipation of the incoming federal16 administration's commitment to invest in17 urban infrastructure building18 initiatives, to conduct an independent19 investigation of the Water Department, so20 that the City will be prepared to21 effectively utilize any additional22 funding streams in the most efficient and23 strategic manner and pursuant to Chapters24 13-100 and 13-200 of The Philadelphia25 3 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 Code.2
Before we3 begin the hearings today, I would like to4 acknowledge the service of a civil5 servant, a Water Department employee,6 Loretta Palmer, who was shot in the foot7 yesterday morning while doing a job in8 North Philadelphia. While her injuries9 were not life threatening, they were10 serious. 14 Every danger exists for people that work15 out in the public. 22 It's been a while since we've done that23 and it's certainly been a minute, but24 it's almost ten years since we last25 4 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 5 We believe firmly that our6 efforts here have far-reaching benefits7 to the City of Philadelphia. 16 Third, it will create an17 opportunity for economic development and,18 more specifically, create the opportunity19 for jobs - jobs stemming from the20 improvement of our infrastructure, jobs21 that can expand the middle class and give22 many of our graduates a chance for new23 and exciting careers as we start talking24 about the expansion of the green25 5 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 2 On February 17th, 2009, Obama3 signed the American Recovery and4 Reinvestment Act, a $787 billion plan to5 create jobs, revitalize the economy and6 make significant improvements through the7 nation's infrastructure. 15 Perhaps one of the greatest16 needs of infrastructure funds is to17 improve the infrastructure that provides18 us one of our most valuable resources, a19 natural resource, it's called water, and20 to produce that product and take -- at21 times the City takes that product for22 granted, and virtually around the country23 they do the same. Yet, while water is24 generally and the quality of our water in25 6 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 4 Our Water Department is one of5 the first in the nation to ever publicly6 deliver water to citizens. 22 Second, with our water mains23 and the rate of breakage, this causes us24 to waste water in a time where we should25 7 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 be trying to find common ways to improve2 that service delivery and systems around3 the country. 6 Now, let us be absolutely7 clear. The Water Department is doing a8 good job, but we can improve and we can9 use this as an opportunity to create jobs10 for small businesses and employment in11 our neighborhoods. 24 With that as a goal, I'd like us to25 8 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 remember that this is an asset that has2 the potential to do innovative things,3 not just things that we've always known4 and done. And today I think we'll hear a5 lot of that from the testimony that we6 have lined up. 8
Thank you.11 (Witnesses approached witness12 table.)13 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Good14 morning --15
17 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: --18 Councilman Jones and members of the City19 Council's Committee on Transportation and20 Public Utilities. I am Bernard21 Brunwasser, Water Commissioner, appearing22 before you today to testify on Resolution23 No. 080959 regarding an independent24 investigation of the Water Department so25 9 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 7 Before I go on, I want to8 introduce on my right our Deputy9 Commissioner for Operations, Ms. Debra10 McCarty, and on my left, our Division11 Head for Public Affairs, Joanne Dahme,12 and they will be among the many folks13 that assist me in answering your14 questions today. 18 As you know, the Philadelphia19 Water Department, besides being a large20 City operating department, is a municipal21 utility serving the citizens of22 Philadelphia and the region by providing23 integrated water, wastewater and storm24 water services. Our primary mission is25 10 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 11 Part of our history, the Water12 Department, as presently constituted, was13 established by the City pursuant to the14 Charter with the power and duty to15 operate, maintain, repair and improve the16 City's water and wastewater systems. 22 Such standards must enable the City to23 realize from rates and charges an amount24 at least equal to operating expenses and25 11 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 debt service charges on any debt incurred2 or to be incurred for the water and3 wastewater systems, and proportionate4 charges for all services performed for5 the Water Department by all officers,6 departments, boards or commissions of the7 City. 22 The Water and Wastewater Funds23 are funds required by the general24 ordinance to be established and25 12 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 7 The City's Department of8 Revenue performs all functions related to9 meter reading, customer accounts and10 collections for the Water Department11 through the Water Revenue Bureau. The12 Department of Revenue and the Water13 Revenue Bureau are under the direction of14 the Director of Finance, the City's chief15 financial officer. Audits of all City16 departments, including the Water17 Department, are performed annually by the18 Office of the City Controller. 22 In addition to review23 internally within the City by the Budget24 Bureau and the Mayor's Office, the City25 13 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 Council has annual review of the Water2 Department's operating budget, capital3 budget, capital program and Five-Year4 Financial Plan. 12 Each time the Department seeks13 to raise or refinance capital through the14 issuance of revenue bonds or to borrow15 funds through the state's revolving loan16 fund for water and sewer infrastructure,17 known as Pennvest, it subjects itself to18 a comprehensive study of the condition of19 its infrastructure and its financial20 feasibility to repay the bonds or the21 borrowing. This Bond Engineering Report,22 which is required by the First Class23 Revenue Bond -- City Revenue Bond Act of24 1972, is prepared by a nationally25 14 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 11 The Department goes far beyond what is12 normally done by other publicly owned13 non-profit water and wastewater utilities14 in this state or in the region, as we are15 obliged to fund many of our opposition16 attorneys, witnesses and experts to lay17 out the case against the Water18 Department's rate filing. 24 Department officials deliver testimony25 15 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 and offer themselves for2 cross-examination. Court stenographers3 prepare the transcripts. 11 Now, more importantly, talking12 about our drinking water. Our drinking13 water is safer than ever, substantially14 better than what state and federal15 regulations require. In Fiscal Year '09,16 the period of Philadelphia's drinking17 water, as measured by the industry18 standard of turbidity, was better than19 EPA regulations by 83 percent.
Actually,20 six times better than what EPA21 regulations require, and also 50 percent22 better than the most stringent industry23 standards contained in the Partnership24 for Safe Water, a voluntary program25 16 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 between the EPA and the drinking water2 industry. 9 The Water Department is also10 treating wastewater to award-winning11 levels, overseeing the cleanest water12 environment in more than 150 years, and13 making progress in protecting our14 watersheds to keep our streams and rivers15 clean. This year the Southeast and16 Southwest Water Pollution Control Plants17 will receive Platinum Awards. One has18 nine consecutive years of perfect19 regulatory compliance and the other one20 has six years of perfect regulatory21 compliance, and they're receiving these22 awards from the National Association of23 Clean Water Agencies, also known as24 NACWA. The Northeast Plant will receive25 17 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 19 The Water Department has not20 been immune to the national economic21 turmoil. Problems in the credit and debt22 markets, difficulty with collections and23 cost increases and energy and chemicals24 have conspired to create extremely tight25 18 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 financial conditions for the Water2 Department. 8 In February 2009, the Water9 Department submitted five applications to10 Pennvest, the state revolving loan fund11 for water and sewer infrastructure, and12 we placed these five applications in for13 grants and/or loans, and they were14 considered in the April Board meeting of15 Pennvest. 2 million, were for17 traditional water and sewer18 infrastructure repair, replacement and19 upgrades. One project, totalling $3020 million, was for green infrastructure21 projects, primarily related to flood22 control and combined sewer overflow, or23 CSO, mitigation. On April 20th, 2009,24 three of the traditional water and sewer25 19 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 1 percent for7 the remaining 15 years. These are total8 20-year loans. 12 The Department did not13 originally anticipate the funding of14 these projects through additional15 borrowings. Additional debt service for16 these loans had been included in the17 Department's Fiscal Year 2010 budget, the18 Department's five-year plan projections19 and the Engineering Report. 22 The Water Department remains23 committed to providing utility services24 consistent with the highest level of25 20 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 customer service as set forth in the2 City's Strategic Plan. 21 Councilman, you have struck a22 nerve with us and we agree that we should23 enter a strong partnership with City24 Council over the next -- well, from here25 21 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 on out, because it's clear that the2 Philadelphia Water Department will be3 spending considerable amounts of capital4 for the foreseeable future in order for5 us to meet the federal regulations that6 are coming down the road for us,7 particularly when they involve combined8 sewer overflows and storm water9 management. 16
Before you17 do, I'd like to acknowledge the presence18 of Councilman Brian O'Neill, who has19 joined the Committee, and thank him for20 attending.21 Also, in that presentation, is22 it going to talk a little bit about the23 history of the Water Department and how24 the --25 22 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER:2 Certainly, a little bit. You know, we're3 the first water utility, true water4 utility, in the United States. We began5 in 1801.6
8 It was highly successful, and I hope you9 have some hard copies there, which make10 it a little easier to see. 14 So we were the first Water15 Department in America to supply an entire16 city with drinking water, and that goes17 back to 1801. 19 Also, some years later, I guess20 about 140-some years ago, it became clear21 that the City of Philadelphia would have22 to protect its drinking water sources,23 which was mainly the Schuylkill River in24 those days, and so it was decided that25 23 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 the City would buy up property along both2 banks of the Schuylkill River, and this3 became known as Fairmount Park. 9 So the Water Department and the10 Park have always had this close11 relationship, which continues to this12 very day and, in fact, is probably going13 to be increased, because we see the Park,14 parkland, as partnering with us and15 helping us to handle some of the storm16 water and runoff from City streets. 19 One of the things that we have20 done with our history is to put that21 history into the Fairmount Water Works22 Interpretive Center down below the Art23 Museum. And the Fairmount Water Works, I24 think everybody -- many people are25 24 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 familiar with the restaurant, but we have2 a wonderful Interpretive Center right3 next to it in the home of the old Water4 Works, which dates back to the early5 1800's. 16 And these things are at the Fairmount17 Water Works, and I urge everyone who has18 a chance to go down and see it. 22 So education is very important23 to us, and this Interpretive Center let's24 us reach out and get the young people to25 25 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 understand how important water is, and,2 in turn, they can teach their parents and3 grandparents how important it is to keep4 trash out of inlets and so forth. 6 Historically, as you may know,7 the water in Philadelphia was kind of a8 disgrace. It was allowed to deteriorate9 over many decades back into 1930s and10 1940s and -- well, you hear the term11 "Schuylkill punch," et cetera, and12 meanwhile, finally with the Charter in13 1951, the framers of the Charter decided14 let's make -- we have to professionalize15 the organization. Let's give it its own16 commissioner. 25 26 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 The next shot is a very recent2 article showing how our education system3 works out there at the Water Works, and4 they're showing these folks in the5 picture how water is actually monitored6 there. You may be familiar that we have7 just opened up a new rebuilt fish ladder8 on the -- or fish throughway, fish way,9 we now call it, on the west side of the10 Fairmount Dam and that allows fish in the11 lower Schuylkill to go back up river to12 spawn, which is their natural habitat,13 their natural spawning area. And we did14 that with a lot of money from the federal15 government through our federal16 delegation. We're very grateful for17 that. 20 The next slide is basically a21 statement of our mission and obviously --22 the obvious we know, but we are also here23 to promote economic development of the24 City. We understand that we have some25 27 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 influence in that area, and we want to do2 what we can, and we do -- we have3 expanded our role over the past ten years4 to be an environmental steward of our5 rivers and our environment. So we6 started an Office of Watersheds about ten7 years ago, and the folks in that office -8 the scientists, engineers and technicians9 that are part of that Office of10 Watersheds - have applied a holistic11 approach to both the water and the12 wastewater side of our utility and have13 helped the natural stewards of our14 environment. 21 And, again, the next slide just22 basically shows us the customer service23 that we provide, maintenance of hydrants,24 storm water management, and we monitor25 28 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 industrial pre-treatment.
We have an2 industrial waste surcharge. We charge3 industry that puts in too much -- very4 strong sewage. 8 The next slide is just one to9 kind of show you where many of our10 facilities are. And we try to be good11 neighbors, because we're in the12 neighborhoods as well as just at our six13 plants and Center City. So we try to be14 good neighbors. 17 These are some of the details18 of the water system. It's incredibly19 large. We have the three plants. We20 pump approximately 250 million gallons a21 day of water. And we have much greater22 capacity than that, because our water23 system was designed in the 1950s and the24 three water plants were built in the25 29 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 1960s. We've done a really good job of2 keeping those plants in top condition and3 modernizing them as the years have gone4 by, but they are sized larger than what5 we would normally think we would need6 because they were designed in the 1950s7 when we thought that as many as two and a8 half million people would be living in9 Philadelphia. 20 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER:21 Right. That's a good point. We have to22 partner with others outside of our23 borders for the sale of water. We have24 the franchise in Philadelphia, of course,25 30 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 4 We would love to sell more. We5 are going to have to operate, though,6 with some of the utilities bordering7 Philadelphia in order to push water8 further away from our borders, and we9 have in fact looked at New Jersey in10 years past. We were the cheapest option11 for them, but politically that was not12 going to happen. We have looked at13 Delaware, and New Castle County, Delaware14 came looking for supplies of water. 18 What will happen if we are19 successful, if we can partner with an20 Aqua or a Bucks County Water or some21 other provider in the suburbs to wheel22 water north, west, south, whichever23 direction, we'll be very happy to supply24 them. They will have a plentiful supply25 31 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 5 Some of those in the suburbs have6 groundwater sources, and groundwater, as7 you know, has been deteriorating at8 times, and during periods of drought,9 there can be intrusion. Groundwater10 supplies near rivers can have salt water11 intrusion at times. 15
So, in other16 words, from a non-engineering layperson's17 perspective, we have the capacity to18 exceed what our demand is in Philly?19 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Yes.20
We currently21 have relationships with the surrounding22 counties to supply them water, but also23 process some of their wastewater?24 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Yes.25 32 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 Yes.2
And with the3 potential in the future of piggybacking4 through the infrastructure already5 developed by some of our counterparts in6 surrounding counties to send it further7 west, further south --8 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER:9 Exactly.10
-- to11 markets who don't want to invest in the12 infrastructure to produce it themselves?13 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER:14 Right. If the far suburbs continue to15 grow and depending on what kind of16 sources they have out there, we certainly17 have the capability of partnering with18 one of the two water companies that we19 deal with or others to provide good20 Philadelphia water all the way through.21 Now, typically what will happen22 is, our water will supplant our partner's23 water in a certain area and the partner24 will push out their water further. So25 33 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 that's the way -- there's some2 similarities with other utilities, like3 electric, but the water has -- water4 isn't going to go too far or then it5 becomes too expensive to buy.6
I guess one7 of the outcomes this Committee might like8 to see, not necessarily in today or9 tomorrow but in longer-term planning, to10 look at what it would take to actually11 take advantage of that market12 opportunity.13 The other thing -- you14 mentioned other challenges because our15 fluoridation versus non-fluoridation used16 in other municipalities, mixing that17 water can cause some potential for18 problems and working that out chemically19 is a challenge before us.20 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER:21 Right. Right. As a matter of fact, the22 fluoride is one of those things, and Aqua23 Pennsylvania does buy fluoridated water24 from Philadelphia and does use it. But25 34 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 there are certain differences in2 qualities of water and pH that makes3 mixing -- but these are all overcomeable.4 These are not the difficult issues for5 us. It really is a matter of do they6 have the need for water. And we7 certainly have the supply.8 It's a shame. So many parts of9 the United States, especially in the10 Southwest, as you know, and the South are11 having very, very difficult times with12 water supply, and here I joke around13 sometimes and say we're the Saudi Arabia14 of water.15
That's a16 good point.17 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: But18 it's here and we'd love to sell it and19 spread our capital costs over a larger20 and larger base, and we certainly are21 looking at any opportunity.22
I don't want23 to jump around on your presentation, but24 while we are here, we provide this25 35 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 valuable service to our colleagues in the2 surrounding counties, but we are limited3 as to what we can charge them based on4 what governing body, if you could explain5 that for the record?6 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Well,7 as you know, we're not overseen by the8 PUC, but what we do as a utility and as a9 utility that belongs to all of these10 other agencies - American Water Works11 Association, the Water Environment12 Federation - we're guided by13 cost-of-service rates or that kind of14 program whereby we charge our full cost15 of service, which means depreciation on16 capital, debt service, of course, and17 then we are permitted to charge a18 management fee over on top of that total19 recovery of cost to us. In other words,20 that's something in it for us.21 Now, remember, one of the22 benefits is simply that we have now -- we23 have these big plants and we are24 spreading that capital cost over now not25 36 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 only Philadelphians but also2 suburbanites, but we have to have a3 system whereby our rates can stand up in4 court as being fair and equitable to all5 customers. And so we've adopted6 cost-of-service rates inside City7 customers and outside City customers.8 The outside City customers, however, have9 to pay a fee on top of -- a management10 fee on top of all costs to the11 Department. The minimum charge that we12 have out there for a management fee is13 ten percent. We have now begun to14 increase that fee by several percentage15 points, and, again, these are governed by16 contracts, many long-term contracts. And17 we do get pushback from some of our18 township customers when we increase their19 rates, and sometimes they want to appeal20 them to arbitration or even to court, we21 have to have the -- we have to have -- we22 have to be on solid ground so that we do23 not lose the appeals and that the appeals24 are always upheld by our reviewers. This25 37 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 is a way to do it. We use cost of2 service, which is recognized by the3 industry as being the best way to go in4 these matters.5
I'm going to6 let you finish your presentation, but I7 understand their concern about not8 allowing us to become the OPEC of water9 and forcing the counties into an10 unmanageable situation by us increasing11 their cost of providing water. However,12 conversely, as we look at deficits, as we13 look at increased costs to deliver the14 same service, they have to be fair to us15 to make sure that we are at least16 recouping our costs and not going in a17 hole for their ongoing municipal18 operations.19 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER:20 Right. Absolutely. So we have to be in21 a position where we can honestly say that22 the inside City customers are not23 subsidizing the suburbs and the suburban24 customers are not subsidizing the inside25 38 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 City customers. That is kind of the2 standard that we operate under, and it's3 done well for us in the sense that we4 have not had appeals that have been5 upheld against us.6 So these are -- we've skipped7 ahead a little bit. We have three large8 water treatment plants, again. These9 were, again, designed in the '50s and10 built in the '60s primarily, and they are11 the jewel of our utility.12 Pumping stations, we have a13 number of water pumping stations also14 around the City. And, you know, both the15 water system and the sewer system are16 based on gravity. We use gravity to its17 utmost to help us move water and sewage18 through our system so that we don't have19 to expend tremendous amounts on20 electricity. And water is held by21 pressure in the pipes as well. But these22 are our water pumping stations.23 Now we'll move to the waste and24 storm water part of the utility, three25 39 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 award-winning wastewater plants as well,2 and we service a great many people on the3 wastewater side, more so than on the4 water side. All of the townships,5 communities that touch Pennsylvania -- I6 mean, excuse me, in Pennsylvania that7 touch Philadelphia's borders are our8 customers, and we don't have much excess9 capacity on the wastewater side because10 those plants were designed after the11 Clean Water Act in the late '70s and the12 early '80s and built, and by that time,13 we already took note of a declining14 population inside of our borders. So15 those plants, we don't have great16 capacity left in those particular plants.17 We're going to -- we can certainly do18 some capital improvement to gain19 additional capacity, if necessary.20
So as our21 suburban counterparts in some cases22 expand population, that has an impact on23 our ability to process increased24 development --25 40 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER:2 Exactly.3
-- waste and4 supply them on the supply side of the5 water?6 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER:7 Exactly. We have been in situations8 where the contracts that some of the9 townships signed have gotten old. They10 were exceeding their capacity, and we11 have -- we don't want them to exceed12 their capacity, and if they do, we do13 have rates that will punish them for14 that. So they have to come in and redo15 the contract, and we stopped development16 in some of the suburbs at times when we17 were not getting the cooperation that we18 wanted.19
Certainly20 that is not our intention --21 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: No,22 not at all.23
-- to stop24 progress in a recession. We want to25 41 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 build our way out of it, but also we want2 to be justly compensated for the services3 that we provide.4 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER:5 Exactly. Exactly.6 So here are our three7 wastewater treatment plants. They're8 kind of at the bottom. Philadelphia is9 at the bottom of all of these drainage10 areas in Southeastern Pennsylvania and so11 these are sort of natural places for the12 wastewater treatment plants to be.13 We also have a number of14 wastewater pumping stations to get the15 sewage up to high points so that gravity16 can do the rest.17 Our wastewater service area, as18 you can see, is very large and extends19 into areas in Pennsylvania that are not20 highly populated.21 We're very in tune with asset22 management and water accountability. We23 have driven down our unaccounted for24 water. Any distribution system, water25 42 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 distribution system, has leaks. As you2 know, a lot of the problems that we have3 are -- I mean, these are all underground4 and not always obvious to us. The water5 main break is kind of a surprise and it6 generally is surprise, and we get about7 700 or 800 of those surprises each year,8 but we actually have a better record than9 the national average.10 I think if we move to the next11 chart, we aggressively began replacing12 our water mains in the early '90s, and13 because of that, we are now, even though14 we may be one of the oldest, if not, the15 oldest system in the country, we actually16 are doing quite a bit better than the17 national average, which is 270 water main18 breaks per thousand miles of water main,19 and we have been running in the 230 per20 thousand miles of pipe. So for us, with21 over 3,000 miles of water main, we will22 on a typical year have 700 main breaks.23 Now, this kind of data varies24 very much, as you might imagine, with25 43 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 where you're located. Someone in2 southern Florida or Arizona is not going3 to have as many water main breaks as we4 have since they don't experience the5 freezing/thawing temperatures that we6 have here. So we're in that temperate7 zone where between, let's say, December8 1st and March 15th we've got a lot of9 days where the temperature goes above or10 below freezing. And since water expands11 when it freezes, if there's any flaw, any12 cracks in our pipes, that's when we often13 find out about it in the wintertime. We14 can have as many as 20 main breaks at any15 given time. Fortunately, most of them16 are not in those big 48-inch water17 transmission pipes. When those break,18 everybody knows about it.19
What is your20 average mileage of main replacement21 annually?22 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: We do23 have that chart, and I think we've been24 running about -- the 13-year average is25 44 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 19.4 miles, as shown at the bottom of2 this chart.3
Is that done4 primarily in-house or is it contracted5 out?6 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: The7 actual replacement of water mains is8 basically done contracted out. Some of9 our own forces do some of the other10 fixes.11
What would12 that represent by way of dollars in13 contract opportunities, roughly?14 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER:15 Roughly, we have in our capital budget16 approximately $25 million a year for17 water main replacement and a like amount18 for sewer main replacement. The sewer19 mains you do not get as much miles for20 the dollars, because when you think about21 a water/sewer system, the sewer pipe is22 the one on the bottom in the deepest23 hole, the deepest part of the trench, and24 the pipe is large, especially those25 45 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 sewer -- the sewer pipes that have to2 handle -- they handle the storm water as3 well. So they're large pipe, deep4 trenches, and so they have to be --5 gravity is something we also have to take6 into account. This is -- so you get7 maybe ten miles of sewer pipe as opposed8 to maybe -- well, it's almost like a9 three-to-one ratio. I think a rule of10 thumb that we use is for one mile of11 water main, it costs us about $1 million12 to replace one mile of water main on13 average. Sewer main, you're talking14 about $3 million per mile on average.15 And, again, these averages change with16 the size of the pipe you're really17 dealing with.18
It's some of19 the strangest things that people don't20 write about what you get to do as a21 Councilman. I actually watched your22 repair work on Allegheny Avenue, which is23 about a mile from its high point to where24 it comes out on the river, and I actually25 46 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 went down into the main, which is an2 interesting proposition, to say the3 least.4 My question becomes, did I5 understand you to say you do about 256 million in main and about 25 million in7 sewer repair annually for a combination8 of about $50 million?9 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Yes.10 That's historically what we've been11 doing, and, of course, that was a step up12 from what we had done up until the early13 1990s. Fortunately for us, our water14 mains and our sewer mains, our15 infrastructure, although we grapple with16 the aging system that we have, they're in17 reasonably good shape. We are not -- and18 the reason they're in reasonably good19 shape is, beginning in the 1990s, we20 really focused on our infrastructure.21
I'm going to22 recognize Councilman Greenlee. One quick23 question. It seems to me just24 commonsense logic that these types of25 47 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 pipe repair and replacement, $50 million,2 would have been shovel-ready projects3 available for the stimulus package. What4 was our position as a municipality in5 offering projects like this for the6 stimulus dollars? And then I'll7 recognize my colleague, Councilman8 Greenlee.9 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Well,10 we were told -- we were approached by11 Pennvest initially, because in the early12 days, we knew a stimulus package was13 going to be -- was being put together by14 President Obama and the Administration,15 and we didn't know at that time whether16 funds would be directly sent to the17 cities. I know Mayor Nutter certainly18 was one of the mayors that was hoping for19 the money to come directly, since the20 cities are the ones that really know21 where the money is needed.22 But anyway, as far as water and23 sewer infrastructure projects, the24 federal government decided to use the25 48 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 state revolving loan funds, which in2 Pennsylvania means Pennvest, and the3 reason they did that is because they're4 already set up to distribute both federal5 money and their own money. And so this6 was a way of vetting the federal dollars.7 And so when we met with Pennvest, we were8 told because it's stimulus money, we want9 shovel-ready projects. We happen to have10 a lot of shovel-ready projects. That11 means plans and specs were already --12 were almost ready for bid.13
What was14 your estimate of that availability by way15 of dollar amount in contract16 opportunities that could have been put on17 the table and just shovel ready?18 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Well,19 we had approximately -- we were only20 going to -- we didn't know we should put21 in for all of them, but we were told,22 Well, put in for all of them. We were23 shocked with the results. But what we24 did is, we put in for about $240 million25 49 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 of shovel-ready contracts.2
Two hundred3 and forty million, which would then be4 replacement of mains?5 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Yes.6
Sewers?7 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Yes,8 because we design these all the time.9
So you10 already had a pipeline?11 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Yes.12 Yes.13
So what was14 the response? How much did we get?15 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: We16 received overall 215 million of our 24117 million, I believe, request, which18 knocked our socks off. We did not expect19 this.20 Now, the difference is, these21 are low-interest loans and they are22 administered exactly like Pennvest loans23 have been in the past. The true stimulus24 dollars that attach to this $215 million25 50 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 only amounts to $200,000.2
Say that3 again.4 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER:5 Technically, $200,000 of stimulus money6 is part of the $215 million loans from7 Pennvest. Almost the entire amount is8 actually Pennvest loan money.9
I'm going to10 let -- I'm going to digest that a minute.11
Thank12 you, Mr. Chairman.13 Good morning, everyone.14 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Good15 morning.16
Just to17 get back a little bit on the basic, on18 the water and sewer main replacements.19 Are most of that based on problems that20 arise when you decide which ones --21 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Yes.22
-- or a23 lot of it is just age? Do you check to24 see how long --25 51 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: It's2 a combination. We aggressively check our3 system. On the sewer side, we typically4 actually inspect maybe 1,200 to 1,5005 miles of sewer each year. And we had a6 major sewer assessment program just7 recently, and we've continued that.8 Fortunately for us and almost9 surprisingly, our sewer system was in10 much better condition than we had11 anticipated. These brick sewers that12 were built 100 or more years ago have13 held up beautifully in many cases.14
They were15 built to stay.16 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: But,17 yes. We have a point system internally18 that we've used for many years to19 determine -- it's a combination of age,20 combination of material that was used,21 combination of main breaks that we've22 experienced, maybe small main breaks, and23 other things that -- a few other things24 that give us a point system for how to25 52 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 rank the next group of water mains or the2 next group of sewer mains to be replaced.3 So it's served us quite well.4
Do you5 have to change that much given -- is6 there any increase in breaks recently7 given the age and any of that or does it8 stay about the same?9 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: The10 biggest single factor that affects the11 number seems to be the temperature of the12 water inside the pipe. When the13 temperature of the water inside the pipe,14 in the sewer pipe -- or excuse me; water15 main approaches 40 degrees, we see quite16 an uptick, and it makes some of the pipes17 a little more brittle. If there's a flaw18 already, it tends to expand. And that's19 kind of the way we operate.20 Sometimes a pipe that's 11521 years old is perfectly fine and has an22 excellent history. There are a lot of23 determining factors. Soil condition is24 another. Stray electric currents is25 53 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 another, and also truck traffic on some2 roads are also a factor.3
I4 remember years ago somebody from the5 Water Department saying at a hearing many6 years ago that, in a sense, everybody7 just hopes that a lot of these just don't8 break at one time, it could be a big9 problem. But it doesn't seem to have10 changed that much over the years from11 what you're saying.12 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: We13 have our forces -- we have seen14 improvement, as the chart will show you.15 We were above 270 some years back, and we16 drove it down really by becoming very17 aggressive.18
Okay.19 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER:20 Again, it's hard to dig up 20 miles of21 street in the City. It's hard on folks22 and neighborhoods, but fortunately, if we23 put it in properly with -- we use the24 best materials we can get, because that's25 54 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 the cheapest thing -- that's the best2 thing to do. In the long run, the3 cheapest thing to do. We use ductile4 iron. And if that pipe goes in the5 ground without getting bumped or cracked6 or whatever, that pipe might be in there7 indefinitely. And that's the way we're8 managing it, because we don't have the9 kind of money to replace, let's say, one10 and a half percent of our stock per year.11 That would be just too expensive --12
Too much13 to handle.14 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: -- in15 Philadelphia.16 So I think all of these things17 are in balance. All of these things that18 we do are balanced between what's19 affordable to the citizens and what we20 should be doing. If we had all the money21 in the world, we'd love to do more,22 but...23
I got24 you. All right. Thank you.25 55 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 Thank you, Mr. Chairman.2
Thank you.3 What I want to do is summarize4 the rest of your testimony, because5 you've agreed to be around for different6 portions of this, and we've segregated7 this out to hit different -- because you8 are such a major department and major9 resource in the City of Philadelphia, we10 broke it out, and I want to usurp the11 schedule to allow Mr. Shabazz from12 Overbrook Environmental to come up and13 testify and get his needed testimony in.14 One other quick question while15 he makes his way up, you mention on the16 stimulus money only 200,000. That does17 not include the 30 million for rainwater18 runoff?19 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Yeah.20 The green actually --21
Can you put22 that on the record?23 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Yeah.24 The green is entirely Pennvest loan25 56 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 funds, which actually is a benefit to us,2 because stimulus money projects have a3 tremendously fast timetable, and with the4 green projects, since we don't have a5 long history of doing green projects in6 the City by the Water Department, we7 would like to take enough time to make8 sure we design a proper program for us9 here that will do the most benefit for us10 and give us the most bang for the buck.11
Well, thank12 you, and I'd like you to stick around. I13 want to get the other testimony in, and14 then we're going to call on you to15 proceed again, and I appreciate your16 patience.17
Our next witness is18 Jerome Shabazz, Overbrook Environmental19 Center. Will Mr. Shabazz and those20 accompanying him please take the witness21 stand. Thank you.22 (Witnesses approached witness23 table.)24
Good morning,25 57 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 Councilman.2
15 Again, my name is Jerome Shabazz. I'm16 the Executive Director of JASTECH17 Development Services, Inc. 20 JASTECH is an acronym for21 Juveniles Active in Science and22 Technology. JASTECH was established in23 1998. It's an all-volunteer,24 not-for-profit, 501(c)(3) organization25 58 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 dedicated to fulfilling four principal2 objectives. 11 The OEEC was initially tasked with12 developing an academic curriculum that13 promotes environmental awareness and14 stewardship for urban communities. 18 In the spring 2002, under the19 stewardship of Overbrook High School's20 principal, Ms. Yvonne Jones, and their21 Service-Learning Coordinator, Ms. 25 59 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 The goal of this curriculum was2 envisioned to promote active student3 participation and improved academic4 performance. Within months of engaging5 in our programming, students at Overbrook6 were buzzing with activity and a sense of7 renewed purpose towards environmental8 education. Their English teachers were9 teaching their students how to journal on10 environmental issues. Their math11 teachers were helping students calculate12 rain flow. 15 And for all of this time, our16 students were working within their17 classrooms and never really had a chance18 to go out of the classroom to explore the19 richness of the environment. As a20 result, the high school, Overbrook High21 School, students were engaged to both22 physically and mentally leave the four23 walls of their school to think about24 their environment and to develop25 60 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 solutions for the environment surrounding2 the school. 6 It was at this point in the7 curriculum that we began to engage8 community partners. 13 Our students were able to visit14 water and wastewater treatment plant15 facilities. They participated in16 labeling programs where they labeled17 storm water catch basins. 20 In short, the success with our program21 was in part made possible because of our22 partnerships. The Philadelphia Water23 Department was a great community partner,24 with talented and engaged employees such25 61 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 5 After supporting 95 students6 over the course of 24 months at the7 Overbrook High School, administrators8 were convinced that their students9 benefited from both the visual and10 participatory learning style that was11 offered in the OEEC program. The results12 were impressive and were reflected by13 improved grades and renewed student14 performance. "16 As such, we built on the17 success at Overbrook High School and18 JASTECH obtained control over a19 dilapidated 45,000 square foot20 brownfields facility at 6130 to 615021 Lancaster Avenue, which is in the 4th22 Councilmanic District. This site used to23 be a former A&P Market and Philadelphia24 Building Supply Center. The site would25 62 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 3 All phases of the Center's4 restoration became a learning opportunity5 for our students. Issues related to6 environmental justice, brownfield7 remediation, storm water management,8 community restoration and renewable9 energy were all embodied in our new10 curriculum development. And, again, our11 community partners became an essential12 part of our developmental success. In13 this instance, we partnered with agencies14 such as the PA Department of15 Environmental Protection, Coastal Zone16 Management, EPA, Fairmount Park, Penn17 State University's Extension Services,18 the City's Brownfield Redevelopment and19 Watersheds Departments, and a very key20 partner for us was the American Institute21 of Architecture's Community Design22 Collaborative. 25 63 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 In addition to our community2 partners, JASTECH was able to assemble an3 excellent design team with background in4 renewable energy, conservation and5 sustainability development.
18 The OEEC project provides for19 the public an active model of pollution20 controls and storm water management21 processes as they work. Students enjoy22 and benefit from the urban environmental23 educational laboratory, and the community24 can witness in a simplified way the25 64 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 3 The Philadelphia Water4 Department was also helpful in5 identifying regional issues related to6 storm water management. 17 In addition, the reduction of18 rainwater on Lancaster Avenue's combined19 sewers in turn reduces non-source point20 pollution while slowly returning storm21 water back to its aquifers, creeks and22 streams. The basins filters pollutants23 and traps them in the pavement stone24 course, cools storm water temperature and25 65 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 7 And our environmentally responsible8 design, in time, will permit healing of9 the aquatic ecosystems of the tidal10 Schuylkill River. 15 To date, the Overbrook16 Environmental Education Center currently17 harvests and collects hundreds of18 thousands of gallons of storm water on19 its site. This reduces the burden on our20 city's combined sewers, the need for21 superficial irrigation, and supports22 indigenous plant growth. The OEEC has23 served over 600 school students from six24 area schools and it is in walking25 66 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 3 The essence and purpose of this4 testimony is to support the role of the5 Philadelphia Water Department as a6 partner in supporting urban7 sustainability. 16
Can I also17 ask Ms. Sandra Glenn from American Cities18 to join you so we can combine this?19 Because I'm going to ask the same20 question over, and rather than ask it21 twice, I can ask it one time and the22 panel can respond.23 (Witness approached witness24 table.)25 67 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591
Oh, I'm sorry.6 Todd Woodward.7 I would only add to Jerome's8 comments. The idea that one of the9 things that's truly innovative here I10 think is the connections that Jerome and11 his group see between things, the idea12 that storm water management is connected13 to other environmental issues, that14 environmental issues are connected to15 education, that education and the16 environment are connected to economic17 development. I think that sense of18 connection between things that sometimes19 we see as independent is one of the20 strengths of his program. And that's21 really the only thing I'd like to add to22 that.23
I'm going to24 hold my questions. I'm going to allow25 68 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 Ms. Glenn, if you wood, to provide2 testimony, and then I have -- I kind of3 know what you guys do, so, therefore,4 when I ask the question, it can be5 answered by either of you.6 Ms. Glenn.7
13 Before starting, first of all,14 let me just introduce myself. My name is15 Sandra Dungee Glenn and I'm President and16 CEO of the American Cities Foundation. 19 Before starting my formal20 remarks, though, I would like to extend21 wishes for a speedy recovery to a22 Philadelphia Water Department employee,23 Loretta Palmer, who was injured while on24 the job yesterday. Very few of us25 69 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 realize the tremendous service that these2 workers do, often under very dangerous3 conditions. I had the pleasure as one of4 my first jobs to be a health and safety5 trainer with PhilaPOSH, Philadelphia Area6 Project on Occupational Safety and7 Health, and I did health and safety8 training for members of Local 394 of9 AFSCME. 22 Since 1992, American Cities23 Foundation, or ACF, has worked to improve24 the quality of life for urban children,25 70 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 youth and families through systemic2 change. 9 In 2004, ACF created Project10 NEAT, Neighborhood Environmental Action11 Team, a program designed to educate12 residents in West, North and Southwest13 Philadelphia about storm water best14 management practices through the15 implementation of physical improvement16 demonstration projects conducted in our17 targeted areas. 21 Many were conducted in partnership with22 the Philadelphia Water Department and23 with JASTECH, and one example of our work24 and partnerships is around the Mill Creek25 71 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 9 To deliver these services,10 Project NEAT included a green-collar job11 training and job placement program for12 low-income men and women, many of whom13 were ex-offenders. 18 In 2008, we expanded Project19 NEAT to include Dr. 24 Dr. Pinderhughes defines green-collar25 72 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 jobs as blue-collar jobs or manual labor2 jobs that directly improve environmental3 quality. 25 73 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. " The15 Philadelphia Water Department recognizes16 these low-impact development strategies17 as storm water best management practices18 and encourages their incorporation in19 land maintenance and redevelopment20 strategies. ACF supports the Water21 Department's Green City program and its22 planned investment in green23 infrastructure as a way to lessen the24 strain on our sewer system and protect25 74 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 our rivers and streams. 19 ACF strongly urges City Council20 to ensure that the Philadelphia Water21 Department develops regulations and22 processes that require the investment of23 public and stimulus dollars in a way that24 yields improvements in water quality,25 75 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 21
Thank you.22 Panelists -- and the reason why23 I bunched you together is, I happen to24 have the advantage as Chair having talked25 76 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 to all of you and kind of have a sense of2 what your mission statements are and what3 your contributions have been, and my4 questions will be as follows:5 In commonsense language,6 everybody has been waiting for this green7 revolution, and I kind of see that it8 kind of connects with some strategic9 partners such as the Water Department,10 such as what you do within your11 respective organizations, the unions, the12 contractors to create what I will call a13 real stimulus for real people that are14 looking for this work.15 Define for me what a rain16 garden, a retention basin can mean by way17 of a job description for people in this18 green-collar revolution.19
Well, what we are20 looking at is ultimately trying to reduce21 our dependency on fuels that are not22 renewable, and as such, in order to23 mitigate our dependency on fuels, fossil24 fuels in particular, there are a variety25 77 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 of best practices that can be used that2 will enable us to go into that direction.3 As it relates to storm water,4 on the simplest and most passive means by5 which you can improve water quality is6 through retention on site as opposed to7 the rainwater running off into municipal8 systems.9
They cited10 90 percent of our pollution comes from11 that rainwater runoff.12
And as such,13 encouraging more pervious surfacing14 within the City is a very simple idea.15 In so doing, jobs can be created around16 the idea of establishing pervious17 services, of installing rainwater18 barrels, rain barrels, so that you can19 collect storm water, cisterns so that you20 can collect storm water and, more21 importantly, the educational22 infrastructure that allows people to23 understand that water is a resource and24 there's value in such.25 78 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591
I would just2 add that one of the things we found, for3 example, by participating on the tree4 plantings just as one example. I think5 we were able to work together in6 partnership with a number of groups and7 planted over a thousand trees in roughly8 three years that we ran our Project NEAT.9 Each tree required, because we live in10 concrete neighborhoods with pavements,11 concrete cuts, where you physically had12 to go with these -- and I'm not the13 expert, but the heavy-duty machinery that14 we trained our workers to use, and we15 gave them the OSHA training so they could16 do that safely, to remove the concrete,17 move that out, physically plant the18 trees. That is a -- if you do that over19 and over and over again -- and the Mayor20 has plans for planting, I believe,21 30,000, a very large number of trees over22 the next five to ten years. Each of them23 are going to require manual labor, if you24 will, to get that done.25 79 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 We have thousands of acres of2 vacant land that need to be maintained,3 again, for better retention of storm4 water, but they have to be maintained,5 grass has to be cut, shrubs have to be6 pulled up, and they can be replanted with7 certain types of plants that make them8 even better retainers. That, too,9 landscaping, land care type jobs, are the10 result of that.11 So there are thousands of12 opportunities around this City, not just13 through the stimulus but really just14 through good practices, that really15 become viable jobs, easily trained for16 that are going to need to be sustained17 for the foreseeable future.18 COUNCILMAN JONES:19 Vice-President Biden -- and I'll let you20 respond. Vice-President Biden in an21 example of just using one window produced22 in the United States showed all of the23 jobs that were created, from the chemist,24 to the glazer, to the installer, to the25 80 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 person who provided the rubber around the2 rim of the frame of the -- and showed all3 of these jobs and how it could be an4 economic development stimulus. And I'm5 wondering when we start talking about a6 rain garden, you're talking about someone7 who has to know something about plumbing,8 someone who has probably some brick mason9 skills, someone who has to know about10 botany, somebody who has to know about11 water and chemical and what kinds of12 plants will absorb certain types of13 chemicals. So all of these skill sets14 are combined into someone that can be a15 high school graduate and work towards16 maintaining, installing and developing17 designs for these rain gardens. And I'm18 just excited about what that can mean to19 a high school student that might even be20 trained to be able to maintain these21 things for decades in the future. And22 that's, I guess --23
Actually, that's24 in line with the kind of thing that I was25 81 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 going to say, that a lot of the work2 involved in creating a rain garden is not3 all that different from creating another4 landscape or another kind of garden.5 It's just about how you do it, what6 plants you select. The mix of soils7 might be slightly different, but the work8 is not difficult to train for or9 difficult to sort of shift to if you've10 been doing traditional, quote,11 landscaping work in the past. So the12 design might be different, but I think13 the actual work involved in installing is14 very similar and also not difficult to15 train for.16
So, I mean,17 are you working with the Water Department18 to create these type of pathways that --19 eventually it's my understanding -- and20 they'll speak to that later -- that we21 are going to be seeing these beautiful22 rain gardens in Philadelphia's green23 future. The question becomes, is there a24 connection with the public schools or the25 82 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 parochial schools that says to a young2 person in ninth grade that if you take3 the following courses in botany and4 general plumbing, that at some point5 you're going to wind up in a union hall6 or you're going to wind up in a7 contracting situation or as an employee8 of the Water Department? Is there a9 pathway for those skill sets and is10 there, at the end of the rainbow, a11 subcontracting opportunity being12 developed from your vantage point as13 concerned folk in the green revolution?14
Well, the short15 answer, from our vantage point, that we16 can do better. We can create better17 pathways. There are schools in the18 Philadelphia school system that have19 academies that focus on very specific20 outcomes for their students. We should21 have a water quality academy. There22 should be a school that specifically23 focuses on water quality and landscaping24 and the kind of best practices that25 83 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 relate to retaining and protecting storm2 water.3 However, as an existing4 low-hanging fruit type of response, we5 can upgrade the level of actual6 in-classroom participation with7 information related to these subjects. I8 think that's something that we can9 encourage right away.10
Councilman,12 if I may add, I think that was one of the13 things we were hoping that through your14 hearings and through the testimony that15 you're gathering, you might help us to16 encourage and then sometimes be the17 facilitator. We look forward to18 opportunities to talk with the19 Commissioner and members of the Water20 Department about what a workforce21 development pipeline might look like as22 well as educational development, but I23 think that thinking through those24 strategies and thinking through these25 84 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 pending investments and how they may be2 used to demonstrate that is how Council3 could help us think about what does a4 model look like and do we now take this5 opportunity with these large investments6 being made to test it out, if you would.7 And so that may be -- that's hopefully8 one of the things that may come out of9 this gathering.10
That's a11 part of the reason why we're doing this,12 but I was pleasantly surprised when I met13 with the Water Department about their14 eagerness to actually do this. One of15 the challenges before them is creating a16 pipeline of skilled tradespersons to17 fulfill jobs now but also into the18 future.19 So we're excited about it, but20 the kind of -- being excited and being21 action oriented is two different things,22 and one of the parts of the reasons for23 hearings like this is to get us on track24 so that we work together and kind of25 85 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 establish a record that we have2 intentions of doing so.3 So I thank you for your4 testimony.5
Would the10 representative from Bond Construction and11 Lynne Williams from the African American12 Chamber of Commerce please take the13 witness stand.14 (Witnesses approached witness15 table.16
Thank you so17 much for your patience. Can you state18 your name for the record.19
Thank you as20 well. My name is Lynne Williams, the21 Program Manager from the African American22 Chamber of Commerce. Thank you so much,23 Councilman, and your committee for asking24 us to testify.25 86 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591
I'm Joe Derry from2 Bond Construction, and I'm pleased to be3 here, Mr. Chairman.4
Thank you. The7 African American Chamber of Commerce8 would like to thank the members of9 Council and again Councilman Curtis Jones10 for the opportunity to testify on behalf11 of the small businesses in our city. As12 you know, the Chamber for 16 years has13 historically advocated for small14 businesses in every industry. 23 The Philadelphia Water24 Department for the last 200 years has25 87 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 5 However, time has evolved and the need to6 upgrade and provide a new and innovative7 way to offer services has come through8 the ARRA Act of 2009. 16 Environmentally, the Philadelphia Water17 Department is the greatest asset to18 partake of the stimulus dollars. 25 88 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 7 The stimulus act of 2009 gives small8 businesses an opportunity to participate9 in history. 14 The goal of the new government15 spending is to create new jobs, with16 heavy focus on renewable energy. Many17 small businesses in industries such as18 transportation and renewable energy are19 the kind of businesses that will benefit20 from the stimulus act of 2009. In21 addition, to name a few jobs where our22 small businesses will have an impact23 environmentally are stream cleanup, water24 quality monitoring, restoration projects,25 89 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 storm drains and parks, as has been2 previously mentioned. The trillions of3 dollars offered by our government will4 enable that development and the creation5 of jobs for many MBE, MBE and DBE6 certified contractors and subcontractors7 in our region. I know I have made this8 statement many times before to those of9 you that have heard me speak. However,10 let it be known the City of Philadelphia11 has certified, ready-to-work contractors12 waiting for the call from PWD. 22 PWD will benefit from utilizing small23 businesses as consultants and private24 contractors who are experienced,25 90 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 6 Environmentally, we need to7 take conscious measures to reduce the8 negative impact on our communities by9 creating an infrastructure to overhaul10 our antiquated water systems, although I11 did hear the Commissioner say that we're12 on point. We understand not all small13 businesses will be in a position to14 benefit from this opportunity. 17 Depending upon whether you are18 a provider and/or user in these economic19 times, the benefits of job creation and20 its long-term impact is gaining momentum21 with the impetus originating at the22 highest level of our country's23 government. With the legislative acts,24 this new green economy is expected to25 91 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 boom with revenues projected at more than2 $4 trillion by the year 2030. 8 Additionally, with increased9 profitability comes an opportunity to do10 what they have not done before, and, that11 is, delving into products and services12 for renewable energy and modifying their13 own business infrastructure. While these14 steps will not guarantee success, it will15 increase their chances to be in the16 running. A suggestion for those17 interested can be the establishment of18 more watersheds, some of which are19 already set up in surrounding20 municipalities. 25 92 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 4 The African American Chamber5 will participate actively to ensure6 qualified contractors and subcontractors7 are given a fair opportunity to apply8 when the time comes, for our small9 businesses can take advantage of the10 stimulus money. 18
Yes. My name is22 Joe Derry. I'm with Bond Construction.23 I have been actively involved in24 construction in and outside of the City25 93 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 of Philadelphia for approximately the2 last 40 years. I think when I first3 started, Mr. Baxter was the Commissioner4 of Water and --5
Very good. Thank8 you.9 I have not done a lot of work10 with the Water Department. I have been11 involved in buildings that have tied into12 the water system as well as the storm13 source.14 Some of my background prior to15 coming to Bond, I was the Founder and16 Chairman of Parametric Construction17 Management Company, and engineering and18 construction. We worked pretty much over19 the East Coast of the United States. In20 Atlanta, we provided a survey for the21 City of Atlanta for their Chattahoochee22 River Control Project, where they did23 orthographic surveys and mapping of the24 city's five water basins, and we did the25 94 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 surveys for the ground control for that2 mapping.3 For the United States Corps of4 Engineers, we surveyed the Mississippi5 River, from Louisiana all the way up into6 Arkansas, some 900 miles of Mississippi7 River crossings -- cross sections.8 In West Africa, we designed and9 built an earth dam on the Niger River,10 which was used to impound border -- they11 have a rainy season that goes from about12 June 1st to the 1st of October, which13 generates about 128 to 130 inches of14 water over that period of time, and we --15 the purpose of the dam was to capture the16 rainwater and extend the rice growing17 season by five months. That was done.18 It was about nine meters high and about19 1,200 meters long, and it impounded a lot20 of water, but we did do that about 14, 1521 years ago.22 I am very much interested in23 the Water Department's program with the24 stimulus money, and we think that there's25 95 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 a tremendous opportunity to upgrade both2 the sanitary and wastewater and domestic3 water program, and we look forward to4 working with the City in that effort.5 Thank you very much.6
Thank you7 for your testimony. I have a few8 questions.9 As head of the African American10 Chamber of Commerce, have a lot of your11 members done business with the Water12 Department?13
No, we have not.14 We do have a list of -- as you know, we15 have a member database, and we have just16 recently been given the opportunity to17 segment those industries out. And to18 date, we have engineers, we have19 landscapers, we have some of the small20 businesses that are ready to go. But to21 answer your question, again, no, we have22 not.23
Well, I24 would like to challenge all of us to do a25 96 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 better job of that kind of communication2 and the Water Department.3 Do you get regular4 communications from them about job5 opportunities?6
We want to8 improve upon our ability to do that.9 Do you work with the EEO?10
And have12 they made mention to you about13 opportunities within the Water14 Department?15
We are -- I18 can assure you one thing for sure and two19 for certain: That communication process20 will improve.21
We're going23 to make it a kind of outcome of this24 hearing to pull together a working group25 97 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 that ensures that.2 In your opinion, have the3 number of members within your Chamber4 grown by way of that green-collar5 opportunity? Are there more members6 trying to establish themselves in that7 field of endeavor?8
Yes, it has.9 And also they're inquiring a lot about10 the LEED's training that is available,11 and I understand that there is a waiting12 list. So we have at least four that is13 on that waiting list now to have that14 training. In addition, we've worked with15 OEO to ensure that our members that are16 interested are eligible and that their17 certifications, they're insured. We're18 working with Mr. Jerry Valerie with19 contract support and Jaymar Insurance to20 make sure they're insured and bonded so21 they're ready to go.22
Will you23 provide the Chair, myself, with a list of24 the green-collar firms that are really25 98 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 interested like yourself in doing that2 type of work, and in particular with the3 Water Department, so we can make sure4 that happens? And I would encourage a5 subcommittee developed to meet regularly6 with the Water Department.7 We are talking about8 significant amounts of works, significant9 amounts of new innovative types of work10 that the benefit to your members is11 advanced knowledge of the types of12 opportunities that they make themselves13 available and breaking down some of the14 old barriers to doing business with that.15 And I think one of the reasons, one of16 the worthwhile reasons, of having a17 hearing like this is to encourage that18 kind of dialogue.19
I'd like to22 touch on -- you talked about irrigation23 that provided an extension to the rice24 growers. Can you talk about that? And25 99 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 is there a potential application for2 rainwater runoff diversion for kinds of3 non-traditional crops being grown urbanly4 in the City of Philadelphia?5
I'm not too up to6 date on urban farming now, other than I7 have heard of fish farming, but I don't8 know too much about urban farming.9 The agricultural experience we10 had was primarily in West Africa. It11 goes from a very high level of rainfall12 to zero for six months, and in that13 instance, the -- in the particular14 project we did for AID, the purpose was15 to extend the rice growing season out of16 the rainy season into the dry season,17 which we were able to do.18 As that might apply here, in19 areas where they currently use20 irrigation, if you have the elevation21 differentials to impound water, it22 certainly could be used, but I'm not too23 familiar with what area that might24 include. I cannot see it in an urban25 100 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 setting, however.2
One of the3 things good cities that are establishing4 themselves as green cities, the urban5 garden is one of the aspects that they do6 it by way of less miles traveled from7 your food source to the table.8
That's very true.9 I think the big thing I see is the10 wastewater use in the urban garden11 setting, which eliminates the amount of12 rainwater that has to be processed. I13 think that's the largest thing I can see14 that it does provide.15
The other16 thing that I would encourage and we're17 going to hear more testimony on this is,18 one of the challenges that a lot of new19 businesses have by way of the Water20 Department's increased need to reduce21 rainwater runoff is providing systems22 that can catch water and be reused also23 for the greening of their landscaping,24 and designing systems that can capture25 101 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 that water and allowing less of a2 reliance on tap water and spring during3 the summer is one innovative way that you4 can provide that service to the private5 sector.6 As they start to submit plans7 and get permits based on rainwater8 runoff, that's an innovation that you and9 your members should kind of work with the10 Water Department to get a better sense of11 what their specs, what their expectations12 of the private companies that are13 providing these services but asking for14 permits. You can design those systems.15 And this is a cutting-edge industry,16 cottage industry, that will be developed,17 and the sooner that information gets to18 your members, the quicker they can gear19 up, tool up to satisfy that demand.20
All right.22 I want to thank you both for your23 testimony.24
Thank you,25 102 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 Councilman.2
I want to4 enter into the record that the Asian5 American Chamber of Commerce has6 submitted written testimony, and I want7 to acknowledge Local 690 here of the8 Plumbers Union and their President, John9 Kane.10 Would you please stand and be11 recognized.12 (Applause.)13
I would like14 to also state for the record this isn't15 the first time the Plumbers Union have16 come out in force. I hope nobody gets a17 leak today, because we'd be in trouble.18 But I would also like to say that they've19 been going to local schools, trade20 schools, to look at how we can connect up21 within the public school system and22 create these pipelines of job23 opportunities. So I really appreciate24 their support and concern for this25 103 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 important public policy issue.2 Can the Clerk recognize the3 next panel and group to submit testimony,4 please.5
We have Mr. Peter6 Wernsdorfer, Integrated Water Resources7 Consults.8 (Witness approached witness9 table.)10
Thank you,11 and would you state your name for the12 record, please.13
Yes, sir,14 Mr. Chairman. My name is Peter15 Wernsdorfer. 19 If I might keep my remarks20 brief today. I may hear at the behest of21 Rob Stewart, who I notice has abandoned22 me to go make sure his batteries in his23 toys are available for our next24 assignment. But I do appreciate the25 104 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 2 We're a small consultancy in3 the Lehigh Valley. 13 We're 600,000 people. 22 But I'm here mostly to talk23 about innovation in terms of water24 agencies. And in my previous roles in25 105 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 6 I've been involved in water conservation7 since I was an undergraduate at the8 University of Arizona in my hometown of9 Tucson, but I've been working in trying10 to do a lot of these things that are11 involved in innovation itself, and I'm12 not sure exactly how everybody defines13 that. 24 The elimination of silos is the common25 106 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 3 If it's operational, it usually4 means implementation of technology,5 gathering data and using them to design6 and improve system -- implement system7 improvements. But it's very seldom that8 people think in terms of innovation as,9 especially of water resources, as it10 relates to neighborhood revitalization11 and community development. And that12 specifically is what Mr. Stewart and I13 are talking about. 25 107 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 In the -- I believe I submitted2 a slide presentation to Ms. Bricklin3 yesterday via e-mail. It's somewhere4 lost in cyberspace, but in that5 presentation, there is copious6 information about street beautification7 using storm water as a resource instead8 of treating it as a waste product or an9 undesirable product of development. And10 it's exciting for people involved in the11 water services arena to see that12 happening. But what the slides will tell13 you, especially in terms of improving14 streetscapes, it gives you some nice15 visuals. 23 That's something that parents are24 concerned about. And it meshes well with25 108 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 11 There's a reason the Mayor's12 target is to plant 30,000 trees. Trees13 in an urban environment, grassy areas,14 lead to improved management of water and15 they lead to better air quality and they16 improve the public health. 23 And smart growth gets thrown around in24 the suburbs and in the country like it's25 109 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 11 If you don't have to pump water, you12 don't have to pay for the power to turn13 the pump, and it's a significant14 improvement to anybody's budget line. If15 you look at any municipality in the16 United States, their biggest contribution17 in terms of budget numbers and where18 dollars get used up are commonly found in19 water and wastewater plants. 21 I think it's -- and it's also22 appropriate to include this in a23 discussion that you might be having about24 smart growth, and I heard some -- there's25 110 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 been some very good testimony today. I2 think there's obviously some very smart3 people working on this. I'd encourage4 you to continue the efforts that the5 neighborhoods have already begun and to6 expand it when and where you can. And I7 know there are many facets to innovation8 and water resources, and certainly some9 of it has already taken place in the10 water resources arena right here in the11 City. You have some very smart people12 that work in the Water Department. 15 But active public involvement16 at all levels I think is probably the key17 to success, because I think that an18 informed public and an educated public is19 going to make decisions that are the best20 for them. 25 111 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 Anyway, I wanted to keep my2 remarks brief. I tried to fit that in there.
Thank you7 for your testimony, and, yes, I do.8 A couple of things you9 mentioned about breaking down silos and10 that it's not traditional for a big11 utility like this to be thought of in the12 sense of neighborhood economic13 development. As we start specifically14 talking about catch basins and rain15 gardens, what do you see as the economic16 development potential for these things17 and what will the impact be by way of18 that development?19
Well, I think20 the first thing is it's -- can I say it's21 part of an effort to relocalize your22 infrastructure and your efforts directed23 at your infrastructure? First of all,24 the design of the systems requires some25 112 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 engineering, some landscape architect --2
What are3 some of the best practice? I know we4 don't have your slide show. Are they5 elaborate? Are they big? Are they6 beautiful?7
A lot of them8 are small efforts in terms of the big9 picture. Like streetscaping, using10 inlets and outlets and islands and11 chicanes and using grassy -- enlarging12 vegetation strips and putting in trees13 and those sort of things are some of the14 very basic ones.15 Rain gardens are some of --16 which are, in theory, simple things to17 do, but because there's a significant18 number of soil/plant/water relationships19 that are involved in that, they are20 relatively complex scientifically, but21 easy to install.22
If you were23 looking at a city and said, Ah, that's24 the city that has the best practices for25 113 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 this, who would you point to?2
I'm from3 Tucson. I don't like to say too much4 good about Phoenix, but they've done a5 good job with this, and they're mostly --6 it started in the American west, it7 started in the western cities, because8 they're so pressed for water itself.9 It's not like it's abundant and it falls10 out of the sky. So whatever you have,11 you tend to try to conserve.12 Now, conserve in the East13 versus the West means two different14 things. In the West it means use every15 available drop of water you can wisely,16 and in the East it means build abundant17 reservoirs and supplies and those sort of18 things, which I think we have.19 But they began it with20 xeriscaping and having to put in and21 switching landscaping. Las Vegas is not22 a good example of anything that you might23 do with water resources, because they24 have an abundance of it from the Colorado25 114 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 River, but other western cities have done2 things like they've eliminated vegetation3 strips with grass and they've installed4 lower-used water -- lower water-using5 plants, cactus, native species and those6 sort of things. So there really are a7 lot of examples.8
Closer to9 the East Coast, what would be a closer10 example? We're not going to use cactus,11 for example, so --12
Who can we14 look to as a good example, or are we in15 fact on the cutting edge of this?16
I would say17 that if you begin this, you are amongst18 the first, yes, absolutely.19
It's good to22 be on the edge and the leading edge, but23 not the bleeding edge. And so I think a24 lot of the bleeding has probably been25 115 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 done and there are some significant2 opportunities for you.3
Lance Haver, Office8 of Consumer Affairs, Rich Giordano and9 Phil Bertocci.10
And after11 that we're going to call the Water12 Department up just to kind of catch up on13 some of the different aspects of things14 that have been talked about.15 (Witnesses approached witness16 table.)17
Could you be18 seated. State your name for the record19 in whatever order you'd like.20
Councilman, my name21 is Lance Haver. I just bumped into two22 water consumers. We're wondering if they23 could have a moment just to tell you24 their story. Could they come forward25 116 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 just for --2
I think I6 know what part of town they're from. So7 definitely.8 (Witnesses approached witness9 table.)10
My name is11 Pauline Rosenberg. Thanks for letting me12 speak.13 I'm talking as a consumer and14 I've had just enormous problems with the15 Water Revenue Bureau. I've been getting16 outrageously high bills on an investment17 property that I own. I mean bills of18 like 500, 600, 700 dollars a month. We19 can't get this resolved. I mean, I've20 had my plumber come into the house and21 scour every pipe in the house for leaks.22 There's nothing -- there's no problem.23 There's no justification for the bills.24 You can never get through to25 117 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 the Water Revenue Bureau. The line is2 always busy, and if you want to deal with3 the problem, you have to come downtown.4 You have to take a day out of work.5 I finally got through to6 somebody by phone, because someone in7 your office gave me a name, thankfully,8 and what they want was for me to give9 them the reading of the water meter. And10 if I had gone downtown without knowing11 that that was the information that I12 needed, I would have had a wasted trip to13 go downtown. I mean, the fact that I've14 got to go downtown to give a water meter15 reading is outrageous. But what's16 outrageous is that now this thing is17 being investigated and I continue to get18 like notices that they're going to shut19 the water off. I mean, I'm ready to sell20 the house. I mean, I can't deal with21 these outrageous bills and with this22 outrageous service. I mean, there's no23 cause for it.24 So that's basically the issue.25 118 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 I mean, I have all my bills here. I2 thought there might be someone here that3 can deal with it, but obviously this is4 not the venue, but --5
No, no, no.6 Let me say this: There's no line in the7 back of these Chambers. If you'll give8 us a second, we'll let somebody right on9 that.10
My name is Donna13 Sterling and I have properties too and14 I'm having the same problems. And I've15 been working on this problem for almost a16 year now, and all I keep on getting is17 letters saying that they're investigating18 on the situation. But my problem hasn't19 been resolved. One month I got a water20 bill for $800. Next month I got a water21 bill for $700. Then a water bill went up22 to $1,500. And they're trying to resolve23 this situation. They've been trying to24 resolve this for one year. And I'm25 119 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 constantly paying on them. I'm paying a2 hundred-some dollars every month on it,3 because they threatened to shut the water4 off. And, like I said, this is a rental5 property, so I can't have the water shut6 off. So I went along and I made the7 payment agreement, and the situation yet8 has not been resolved.9 They put in water meters, new10 water meters, three times for me, three11 times, and it still hasn't been resolved.12 We can't find no leaks. We had a plumber13 to check out to see if we had leaks. We14 don't have no leaks.15 So I don't know exactly what's16 going on. So I've called your office and17 then I got a call saying that you was18 having a meeting here today. So I19 decided I'd better come down.20
Listen,21 we're glad you came. Now, this wasn't22 quite what we had in mind, but we're23 going to accommodate both of you right24 away. And if you follow this gentleman25 120 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 right here, we'll get somebody from the2 Water Department to address your issues.3 And we appreciate you taking the time to4 come down to straighten it out.5
All right.7 Lance, I can always be sure8 you're going to help us solve a consumer9 problem and take every opportunity to do10 so. That's fine.11
No problem.14 State your name for the record15 and please submit your testimony.16
Thank you for this17 opportunity to testify. My name is Lance18 Haver. I'm the Director of the Mayor's19 Office of Consumer Affairs.20 I'm privileged to also mention21 that we have one of the leading experts22 on utilities in the Commonwealth. Former23 Commissioner Wendell Holland I believe is24 in the Chambers, and perhaps if he's25 121 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 listening and I make --2
Would you3 please stand and be recognized.4 (Applause.)5
Perhaps as I6 testify and I make a mistake, the former7 Chairman would correct me.8
Now we're9 under a lot of pressure with that much10 expertise in the room.11
I'd like to start12 my testimony by explaining that as public13 employees, I believe we should strive for14 continual improvement. I do not want my15 testimony regarding the Philadelphia16 Water Department and the Water Revenue17 Department to be taken as a condemnation18 of the departments. The Philadelphia19 Water Department continues to provide20 safe, reliable water at a comparatively21 low price. It continues to meet all of22 the environmental standards set by the23 state and federal government and is24 committed, as you've heard, to protecting25 122 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 our watershed. 3 The last time improper management led to4 water shortages? Or the Water5 Department -- our Water Department is6 something the City can and should be7 proud of. 10 It is, therefore, my hope that11 my testimony will help the Water and12 Water Revenue Bureau get the resources it13 needs to continue to improve. 18 Management audits often pay for19 themselves by finding savings and20 efficiencies. Because of the unique21 nature of the Water Department, that22 rates are proposed and set by the Water23 Commissioner himself, I believe there is24 much that can be gained by a management25 123 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 audit. 4 There are two reasons. The5 first is simple. Management has6 full-time responsibilities running the7 Water and Water Revenue Department. 11 The second reason may be hard12 to understand, but I believe most people13 will find it true. 15 If a management audit were to16 be undertaken, I would hope the auditors17 would be authorized to look at the18 following issues:19 Customer service: How long20 does it take for the phone call to be21 answered? Is that time within the22 acceptable norms for a utility? 25 124 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 The low-income plan: How many2 families are on the low-income plan? How3 does that compare to PGW? To PECO? How4 many people know of the Water5 Department's low-income plan? How easy6 or hard is it to qualify and how7 successful is the plan in helping8 families stay in their homes? 11 Billing disputes: Is the best12 way to handle a billing dispute to send13 it to a tax review board, as we currently14 do? Would the Water Department be well15 served by having evening or weekend hours16 for consumers? 18 Broken laterals: The Water19 Department continues to require20 homeowners to pay to correct broken21 laterals despite the fact that no other22 utility asks consumers to be responsible23 for service outside of the homeowner's24 house. It is true that in certain25 125 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 situations the Water Department pays for2 the repairs and there are help loans3 available to consumers to cover the4 costs, but is this the best system? Is5 it a fair system where some repairs are6 paid for and others are not? 9 Would combing meter reading,10 billing and collection with the City's11 other municipally owned utility lead to12 greater efficiencies and drive down13 costs? 19 Looking forward as almost all meter20 reading and billing will be done through21 remote meter reads and computerized22 billing, does it make any sense to have23 two separate departments? Couldn't the24 same car that receives meter reads from25 126 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 the gas meter receive meter reads from2 the water meter? Couldn't one bill go3 out for both gas and water? 6 The Rate Stabilization Fund:7 The Water Department keeps a Rate8 Stabilization Fund that more often than9 not has tens of millions of dollars more10 in it than what it projected during the11 water rate cases. I believe currently it12 has roughly $150 million, but that, of13 course, is something the Water Department14 would be better able to testify to than I15 would. Is this the best use of16 customers' money, to keep millions of17 dollars in a rate stabilization?
Is it18 best to raise rates when there is over19 100 million sitting in a fund that was20 established to stabilize rates? Could a21 better use of the money be found? 25 127 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 The Water Department as an2 economic development tool: As water and3 water treatment becomes more and more4 important to us, is the Water Department5 using our resources to the fullest extent6 possible? You've already heard how the7 Water Department wants to sell water to8 the surrounding areas, but that's not the9 only type of economic development that10 might be possible. We may be able to11 bring businesses into the City who use12 water and need water for their processes13 because the Water Department's ability to14 bring in and use much more water than15 what we're currently using. 20 Use of untapped resources: Are21 there by-products created by treating22 water both before it is used and before23 it is returned to the rivers that can be24 utilized? Can the methane gas produced25 128 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 by the water treatment system be used for2 cogeneration to keep operating costs3 down? Can the movement of water both in4 and out of treatment plants be used to5 create electricity using what is commonly6 referred to as low head hydro electric7 production or micro hydro? 11 Philadelphia's abundant water12 supply is a valuable asset that we should13 be utilizing in the years to come. I14 believe we can only make the most of it15 if we make making the most of it a16 priority. 25 129 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591
Always2 enlightening. You never cease not to3 disappoint by way of your intellectual4 property that you put forth, and I'm5 going to give them an opportunity to6 respond in writing to much of this, but7 they're also going to respond today, to8 the degree that they can, on some of9 these worthwhile issues, Lance.10
Good14 afternoon. State your name for the15 record, please.16
19 I come here today and it's a20 pleasure to see you, Councilman, but not21 on a pleasurable mission. 24 The early morning hours of25 130 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. m. 11 In the immediate aftermath, the12 City replaced our heater and hot water13 heater and brought in a clean-up crew,14 which removed many of our possessions,15 what had been under water, as well as our16 basement paneling, ceiling and powder17 room. As you might imagine, this was a18 pretty traumatic experience, and what I19 recall most about it is the next day20 bringing home breakfast and finding my21 wife sitting in the middle of the living22 room crying because she had discovered23 that a cedar chest that was under water24 had contained most of the pictures of our25 131 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 now adult children when they were kids2 and almost all of the pictures she had of3 her now deceased parents and brother. 5 We spent several days pulling6 those apart. They were all matted7 together, laying them out on paper8 towels, drying them on our radiators over9 the course of several weeks. 11 But while those days were12 difficult, it's what's happened since13 then that has really made me incredibly14 angry and increasingly infuriated. We15 initially had difficulty even finding out16 how to fill out a form, where to get a17 form. 23 After trying several more weeks24 to determine exactly what we were25 132 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 supposed to do and how to do it, the head2 of Risk Management came to a meeting of3 Upper Roxborough Civic Association in4 February and gave us answers that at5 least made me feel we could fill the form6 out and submit it, which I did. 15 Six weeks went by. No16 response. Not even an acknowledgment17 that our form had been received. 21 Two days later, I received a22 call from the Water Department23 representative saying our form was24 missing a form saying that our insurance25 133 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 3 Now, Councilman, in what I sent4 to Ms. Bricklin, I included the cover5 letter that I sent with our form, with6 our claim. In it I expressly indicated7 that if anything else was required, we8 would provide it and we are prepared to9 discuss any of the details with whoever10 was assigned to evaluate it. 24 Since the water main break, we25 134 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 had to purchase a new washer and dryer,2 pay to have a second bathroom replaced,3 just recently have our lawns and plants4 redone. We had a number of other items5 that had to be replaced that have to be6 put on hold. And I tell you this because7 while our real indignation is about how8 we've been treated, it is also about9 money. 16 We were finally contacted again17 and offered a sum for our possessions and18 repair of our basement, which I could19 only identify as insulting. As you can20 see by the other attachment, which is an21 e-mail I sent to the head of Risk22 Management after initial discussions and23 we had heard nothing again from the24 initial discussions after three weeks, I25 135 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 said, Look, we give. 5 I didn't hear anything again6 for two weeks. 9 The amounts we suggested were10 agreeable, but in the course of the spill11 and repair of the street, a lot of heavy12 equipment was used. Part of our curb was13 gouged, broken, cracked, and for whatever14 reason when they did other repairs, they15 never did that. 16 Also, our sidewalk was17 repaired. Parts of it had been buckled,18 it had been cracked, but they poured the19 concrete in late November, early20 December, and I was told by the person21 who had to give us an estimate for the22 rest of our driveway, it's too late for23 the concrete to really cure properly. Lo24 and behold, after the first snowfall, we25 136 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES.
9 So beyond the fact that this is10 now going on for more than seven months11 without resolution and we continue to12 deal with the leftovers of it, I am13 really, really angry, because I feel14 we've been treated at best with15 indifference, if not with outright16 destain. What I get from this process17 is, the attitude has been to delay us and18 frustrate us so that in the end, we'll19 settle for a much lower dollar amount,20 because we're desperate, than our damages21 actually would call for. 24 When you entered the first25 137 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 meeting in this in November -- and I2 don't know if you recall coming in there,3 you were a little bit late -- what's the4 first thing that you did? You apologized5 to the people from the City of6 Philadelphia. 8 Now, Councilman, as you know, I9 deal with victims on a daily basis in my10 job, and they sometimes are looking for11 compensation, sometimes they're even12 looking for vengeance, but what they all13 want and need is to be acknowledged, to14 know that their concerns and what has15 happened to them is important and needs16 to be addressed. 18 My wife and I are lifelong19 residents of the City. In our former20 neighborhood, I volunteered to be on the21 District Attorney's Youth Aid Panel,22 which is a group of citizens which takes23 youth who have had a first non-violent24 arrest and just sidesteps them from the25 138 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 criminal justice system, mentors them for2 60, 90 days, tries to help them get back3 onto a different path, without having a4 criminal record. After that, my wife and5 I ran a town watch in Southwest6 Philadelphia in the 12th District. Now7 that we moved up in Roxborough, as you8 know, I'm the Vice-President of the Upper9 Roxborough Civic Association and the 21st10 Ward Community Council. I'm also the11 President of an open space preservation12 group, the Roxborough Green Space13 Project. 17 However -- I never thought I18 would say this, but we are so embittered19 by the way we've been dealt with in this20 process that when my retirement comes up21 just under four years from now, I have22 determined that I need to live in another23 city. And I hate to say that, but I feel24 I have no choice to say that, because25 139 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 otherwise what am I saying? 3
Well, what4 we want to do is -- and I do acknowledge5 the first day when I came up to see the6 devastation that was done -- and these7 things do happen as a part of an aging8 infrastructure -- it is what we do next9 that matters the most to citizens. And10 when I came up that night, you were the11 first person I saw surveying the damage,12 and we went in the basement and went,13 looked at all of that and started to talk14 to other neighbors, and I was15 wondering -- and we'll deal with the16 specifics of this today and see what we17 can do to resolve some of the issues.18 But out of the people on the block that19 were impacted, how many of them have20 actually settled and gotten back to some21 sense of normalcy?22
Well, that's23 saying they settled and got back to some24 sense of --25 140 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591
I believe we are4 the only ones who have now settled.5 However, I can tell you that some people6 settled for precisely the reason that I7 said: They got tired, they got8 disgusted, and they said something is9 better than nothing after seven and a10 half months.11
And so what12 I'm trying to say is -- and I'll let the13 Water Department come up later and talk14 about the process and why sometimes it15 results in the frustration, but in16 general, many of the people on the block17 have been dealt with. They responded in18 a fairly quick manner. Sometimes I think19 we all can do a lot better in our20 customer service response.21 We were up there at night. You22 guys were inconvenienced. People were23 moved out of their homes. I saw what it24 meant. You talked about the loss of25 141 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 photos. Nobody can ever replace that.2 No monetary compensation will ever3 replace a photo of a loved one lost.4 But what I will say is that we5 need to kind of look at this system, and6 a part of what the hearings is to do is7 to evaluate how we can do it better. So8 what we will do is take a look at that.9 And, Lance, I appreciate you10 guys coming up and commenting. I want to11 just get for the record, so that we can12 get through the hearing, all of the13 testimony that is scheduled for today.14
Good afternoon,19 Councilman Jones, Chairman Jones, Council20 Chairman Jones, I guess it is. I'm21 Philip Bertocci. I am the Supervising22 Attorney in the Energy Unit at Community23 Legal Services. We represent low-income24 clients with utility problems. We serve25 142 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 as the public advocate in water rate2 cases. We also serve as the public3 advocate before the Gas Commission. We4 have myself and Thu Tran, my associate,5 have a lot of experience dealing with6 different regulatory regimes. We know7 how things are done before the PUC by8 regulators of utilities, and we also have9 direct experience with the way things are10 done in Philadelphia with regard to the11 Philadelphia Water Department, which is12 not subject to the Public Utility13 Commission. And we think that that's an14 advantage, because we get to see a number15 of different ways in which utilities are16 regulated. And I think we generally17 recognize that utilities should be18 regulated, because a utility is not the19 kind of business that should be operated20 on a free-market basis, a competition21 basis. It's a monopoly. It sets its22 own -- it's a monopoly, and because it's23 a monopoly, then there has to be somebody24 providing checks and balances to be sure25 143 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 13 I've heard a lot of wonderful testimony14 about where we should be going in the15 future and programs that should be16 developed, and I'm sitting here basically17 representing, first and foremost, the18 40,000 people in Philadelphia that are19 shut off each year for non-payment of20 water service. And that doesn't tell me21 that they are deadbeats. That tells me22 that water rates, water sewer rates in23 Philadelphia, regardless of how they24 compare to other places in the country,25 144 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 12 I've had the pleasure of a tour of, I13 think, almost all six plants. It's14 really awesome. 22 What we're dealing with here is23 an enterprise which has $5 million in24 revenues each year, which spends $30025 145 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 million -- I mean 500 million, which2 spends 300 million in operations, which3 spends 200 million in debt service. 16 I think generally from a policy17 perspective, we look for checks and18 balances. We don't look for checks and19 balances that are going to bring all the20 machinery to a halt, but we look for21 something that's reasonable, something22 that seems to work in other places. And23 one of the things that seems -- and in24 Philadelphia, the checks and balances25 146 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 that we see normally with utilities are2 not there. 4 First of all, the way rates are5 set. Most utilities, the setting of6 rates is kind of a pressure point. 15 In Philadelphia, we don't have16 that kind of system. PGW and PECO have17 to demonstrate that their rates are18 reasonable to PUC. In Philadelphia, the19 Water Commissioner, who is the regulator20 and the CEO of the Water Department,21 essentially looks at the proposals that22 are made by his department, and although23 there is a hearing process and although24 there are recommendations by a hearing25 147 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 officer and although there's a public2 advocate who receives some resources to3 hire an expert, whatever the hearing4 officer says can be just placed aside,5 and without very much in the way of6 reasons, the Water Commissioner can say,7 Well, this is what I think it is. We do8 very good work, which really no one can9 test, but this is the rate that's going10 to be set. 15 But I've read the testimony of budget16 processes over the years and I've looked17 at the documents that have been18 submitted. I know that City Council19 reviews the capital budget and the20 operating budget of the Water Department21 every year, but really for the size of22 the enterprise that it is, it's one of23 many different budgets that are reviewed24 at best -- I don't know.
My guess is, it25 148 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 5 But I think the critical thing about the6 review --7
Point of8 information. You should always pay9 attention to Council because --10
12 The critical thing for the13 Water Department is that when the Water14 Department budget comes before City15 Council, the City Council people, in my16 imagination looking at them, are looking17 at this budget and they're not saying,18 Well, if we give this much to Water, then19 we can't give so much to Fire, we can't20 give so much to Streets, we can't give so21 much in other areas, because the Water22 Department's funds don't come from the23 General Fund. The Water Department is24 solely funded by revenues from rates. So25 149 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 4 Sure, the Administration looks,5 but it doesn't look in the same way. It6 doesn't go through that critical effort7 to kind of balance and keep a sense of8 proportion that might otherwise exist if9 you had to, say, close a library in order10 to keep that admirable center there down11 on the Schuylkill River, the Water12 Education Center there. 17 So that gets us down to the18 next element, and this -- I mean, City19 Council at some time had the wisdom to20 put this in the City Code, and, that is,21 that about every four years, there should22 be -- City Council should in fact23 initiate an investigation and an24 investigation based on independent25 150 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 outside consultants or using independent2 outside consultants to audit or to review3 or to investigate all aspects of the4 Water Department and even the Water5 Revenue Bureau, because the reference in6 The Philadelphia Code suggests that this7 should focus in addition on collections8 and accounts receivable and things of9 that sort. Not exclusively on that. 14 Now, there's precedent for15 that. The PUC that does these management16 audits requires these routinely. PGW --17 and they don't require it just of18 utilities that are basket cases. When19 PGW first came onto the PUC's20 jurisdiction, of course the PUC ordered a21 management audit, but four or five years22 later, sure enough, there's another23 management audit. And a company like24 PECO has management audits. Everybody25 151 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 has management audits. It's a standard2 way in which their checks and balances3 are maintained to be sure that best4 practices are followed, that operations5 go more efficiently than they otherwise6 would. And I'm just going to give you a7 little bit of the sort of operational8 speak that you find in management audits9 generally. I apologize for it. 21 Number two, the second is to22 identify opportunities for improvement23 and develop recommendations for24 improvement or further actions. And25 152 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 usually the management audits also2 require that when the management auditors3 come in and look at the whole picture,4 they don't just sort of do this stuff5 which might be called kind of egghead6 type stuff. Well, we think you ought to7 do this, you ought to do that. If8 they're going to make a proposal or9 identify an area, then what they should10 be doing is supporting their proposal by11 at least a preliminary cost-benefit12 analysis. The management auditors aren't13 supposed to be sending the Water14 Department on a wild goose chase,15 something that, We'll propose it, but16 it's up to you to execute it. 19 The third -- and I think this20 is very important, certainly to me from21 the point of view of consumer advocate22 involved with rate cases -- is that23 management audits provides an outside and24 systematic base of information so that25 153 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 12 So that's in a nutshell what I13 have to say, sort of complementing what14 Mr. Haver has said. 17
Well, first18 of all, I would like to thank all of the19 members of the panel for their testimony.20 And I want you to understand sincerely21 that all of these comments gives us food22 for thought and then an incentive to act.23 As Chair of Transportation and24 Public Utilities, when we found this part25 154 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 of the Code that begs us and drives us to2 do these independent audits, we decided3 that the hearing would be the first step4 and that there will be an independent5 audit to comply with the City Code, but6 in doing so, to get the best of ideas, to7 talk about what is going right, because8 there are a lot of good things, as you9 even stated, that is right about this10 department, this City resource, this11 asset, but there's some things, as you12 mentioned, that we need to by way of13 customer service maybe improve upon. But14 arguably, it begins with this hearing.15 And I think we've raised some16 good questions, some of which we're going17 to ask the Water Department to respond to18 now, but others that need a more19 elaborate answer that they will respond20 to the Chair in writing and we'll share21 with people who have testified and people22 who are interested in.23 But let me say this to you,24 that as it goes, this is a beginning of a25 155 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 process that we are looking to outside2 resources far beyond the means of Council3 to help us implement and that at the end4 of the day, we will take a good asset and5 make it a better asset. We'll take a6 good department and make it better at7 what it does by way of impacting both the8 individuals that actually pay our9 salaries to dealing with the counties.10 You raised an interesting11 point, that if we can do and justify some12 of our costs, then maybe we have a better13 case to make for increasing maybe some of14 our fees to people who take advantage of15 this outside of Philadelphia and being16 able to justify those rate increases.17 So all of this stuff is taken18 within the context of which I hope it's19 meant, to improve an asset that we have.20 So I want to thank you all, and I want to21 allow the Water Department to actually22 respond to some of the specifics and ask23 them to come back up to the panel. And24 we're getting through this in a timely25 156 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 fashion, which I'm impressed with.2 Commissioner, would you join us3 back at the table.4 (Witnesses approached witness5 table.)6
And after7 this, we will have our last panel. And8 we may have to call you up, but I wanted9 to kind of do this in segments so that I10 can at least remember all of the great11 stuff that was put forward.12 Specifically, some of the13 testimony -- I will allow some of your14 consumer relations people to deal with15 the specific request dealing with some of16 the Risk Management issues.17 I was out on the site. You18 went to the subsequent meeting, and19 generally 95 percent of the people on20 that block have come to some kind of21 agreement. Nobody probably is ever going22 to be totally satisfied with remuneration23 on damage done to the house, but it was24 responded to, and we're going to try to25 157 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 even get 100 percent out of this.2 But to what Lance Haver talked3 about, there were some interesting issues4 that were raised, and one of them was in5 what other municipalities do, they6 combine some of the utility services such7 as meter reading and billing, and is8 there room for at least looking at that9 as a possibility for Philadelphia?10 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: I'm11 sure there are places in the country that12 combine -- I know in Los Angeles they13 combine electric with water as far as14 utilities are concerned. We certainly15 have no objection to finding some16 economies of scale between us and the Gas17 Works. We both use Itron automatic18 reading equipment.19 I think sending out a combined20 bill would actually possibly hurt Water21 collections, which are not exactly robust22 as it is, but during the winter months,23 our $40 or $50 monthly bill would be24 added to a gas bill perhaps of $300 or25 158 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 $400, and if a customer has trouble with2 that large gas bill and now it's a3 combined bill, it may actually lower some4 of our collections.5 So we have thought about these6 things, and we do --7
So the up8 side might be efficiency. The down side9 might be actual rate by which you get10 your collections because it's coupled11 with another utility. Is that your12 concern?13 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: With14 a utility that in certain months is going15 to have a very considerably higher bill16 than what is typical for a water17 customer, and, therefore, you have -- we18 already have need to improve the19 collections that we have of our $40, $50,20 $60 typical consumer water bill, and to21 add it to the Gas Works bill,22 particularly during the winter months,23 may actually lower the collections that24 we have during that time.25 159 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 I should also mention that2 during that time, we also have a3 four-month moratorium on service4 shut-offs. And I think the 40,0005 shut-offs I think referred to sounds high6 to me, because most of these folks who do7 get shut off get turned on reasonably8 quickly, often times within the hour as9 soon as they -- within the same day if10 they make a payment agreement and so11 forth.12
What is13 your -- describe for us and the record14 your low-income plan and how does it --15 what are the qualifications.16 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: These17 are actually administered by the Revenue18 Department, the Water Revenue Bureau, and19 I am aware that the discount and20 low-income programs that the Water21 Department has in total, many22 administered through the Water Revenue23 Bureau, are in excess of $16 million a24 year. So we have our senior citizen25 160 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 program, as you know, a 25 percent2 discount to eligible seniors,3 income-eligible seniors, who if their4 household income falls below, I believe,5 something along the order of $29,000,6 they qualify for a 25 percent discount7 each month on their water, wastewater and8 storm water components, their entire9 bill.10
I understand11 to say that was for seniors who qualify12 under an income scale?13 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Yes,14 for income-eligible seniors.15
Are there16 low-income programs for non-senior17 citizens?18 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Yes.19 Yes, there are. There's WRAP.20 There's -- we have the Water Revenue21 Assistance Program called WRAP, and there22 are grants of up to $200 given on water23 bills that are available to prevent24 shut-off for low-income customers. Now,25 161 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 these are customers at or below 1752 percent of poverty.3 We also assist in these4 customers obtaining federal energy5 assistance, LIHEAP, and Mr. Haver is6 certainly very knowledgeable about that,7 as is Mr. Bertocci. So there's8 assistance given in that manner.9 The Utility Emergency Services10 Fund, UESF, it's also a grant program to11 prevent shut-offs for low-income12 customers at or below 150 percent of13 poverty, and it provides up to $500 every14 other year, which is $250 coming from15 UESF, a grant, plus $250 matching Water16 Department credit. Now, this program is17 administered by the non-profit Utility18 Emergency Services Fund and their budget,19 their operating budget, is budgeted20 one-third by PECO, one-third by PGW and21 one-third by the Water Department. So we22 also pay 33 percent of the administration23 of that program. There's also a24 Homeowners Emergency Loan Program that25 162 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 actually the Water Department2 administers, the HELP program.3
And what4 items fall eligible under that activity?5 Is that for laterals?6 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Those7 are for customer water lines and customer8 sewer laterals. And we understand when9 these things happen, when they break,10 it's a surprise, and it can take anybody11 by surprise. You don't necessarily have12 to be low income to qualify for these,13 and these are zero interest loans where14 the Water Department has a team of, I15 believe, 15 or so registered licensed16 plumbers that we have approved to be the17 ones to actually do the repairs under our18 scrutiny, and the customer gets a19 five-year zero interest loan and so --20
What is the21 average cost of a repair for a consumer?22 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: I23 think I'll let our Deputy for Operations,24 Debra McCarty, give you a little more25 163 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 information.2
I know they3 vary, but an average cost of replacing --4 DEPUTY COMMISSIONER McCARTY:5 Probably around $3,000.6
Okay.7 That's the number I heard, actually. It8 was more like $3,500.9 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: And10 sometimes they need both lines replaced.11 So that more or less can double, I mean,12 the cost. Actually, it's somewhat13 cheaper because the plumber digs one14 trench, and so it's probably a little15 less expensive than doing both16 individually.17
Now,18 wouldn't some of those -- I mentioned19 that one of the issues that was raised20 was that because the utility, you, take21 no responsibility for the line connecting22 to the house, could you speak to that?23 That was raised by Mr. Haver and I24 thought -- when I go out in the public,25 164 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 that is a big issue. Can you just give2 us your rationale as to why, and then3 I'll come back with a question about4 possibly a fund from the federal5 government to kind of cover that cost.6 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER:7 Right. We actually have depicted some of8 this in our -- as Joanne tries to get9 that particular slide back, it kind of10 shows where the customer's responsibility11 and the utility's responsibilities lie.12 And this is a subject that Councilman13 O'Neill had raised with us, oh, I'd say,14 about half a dozen years ago and had15 thought that it would be best if the16 Department took over these laterals and17 water lines. Now, we don't think that's18 necessarily a bad idea. It will, of19 course, require more funds.20 What happens here is, we21 lose -- a lot of this water loss that we22 also have other slides on --23
This is the24 20 percent loss we're talking about?25 165 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER:2 Thereabouts. The water loss comes, we3 believe, in leaking water lines. Now,4 these are thinner pipe, I guess5 five-eighths of an inch pipe, by and6 large, and they would tend to freeze up7 first before a big water main in the8 street. So there may be -- we believe9 there's any number of water lines within10 the City that may be slowly leaking, and,11 in some cases, faster.12
Is that13 causing or could that be a source of14 erosion --15 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Yes.16
-- by way of17 why we see sinkholes?18 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Yes.19 Absolutely. Absolutely.20 And so we came up with a plan21 to take over not the entire line, because22 there are some other issues with that,23 but the line that is in the street, in24 the public right-of-way. We believe that25 166 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 that is the utility's interest and the2 City's interest to perhaps take over3 those lines, take over responsibility4 from the customer. What we had5 anticipated at least initially was this6 was going to be a $20 million per year7 operation.8
Is this in9 line with, in conjunction with your10 mileage replacement of the main? Would11 that figure --12 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: This13 will be in addition to.14
Yeah, but is15 the amount tied to -- are you making the16 repairs right along when you replace the17 main?18 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Yeah.19 It depends on the situation, but --20 DEPUTY COMMISSIONER McCARTY:21 When we replace the water main, we do --22 for the water service, we put in a new23 service from the water main to the curb24 stop or the valve in the footway.25 167 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591
So that's at2 a rate of your annual main replacement,3 which was, what, 17 miles?4 DEPUTY COMMISSIONER McCARTY:5 Nineteen miles, thereabouts.6
So that's7 where that 20 million comes from?8 DEPUTY COMMISSIONER McCARTY:9 No, no, no. The 20 million is above and10 beyond the capital money we currently11 spend.12
Yes, but is13 it tied to the replacement of mains in14 the --15 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Not16 currently.17
All right.18 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Not19 currently. So the $25 million or so that20 we have in our capital fund, the capital21 budget annually for water main22 replacement, that 25 million also goes23 towards replacing the water lines in the24 street up to the curb, up to the curb25 168 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 stop.2
I'm clear3 that this would be an additional amount4 of money.5 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Yes.6
I'm saying7 the mileage, the rate -- the doubling of8 this amount of capital expenditure is9 based on your average replacement rate10 over a year?11 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: I12 think these water lines would actually be13 done on the basis of either inspections14 by the Water Department --15
So16 independent of?17 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Yeah.18 (Continued) -- and calls from homeowners19 or neighbors who see a hole or a20 depression being created along where the21 water lines and sewers lines would be.22
I guess my23 question was, when you come in and24 replace a main on a street, couldn't you25 169 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 also just replace this as a matter of2 course if you were to receive the extra3 resources?4 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Well,5 you mean replace the whole water line to6 the house?7
Yes.8 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: I9 think that would depend -- I mean, it10 would depend on several things. We would11 have to do an inspection and say, Okay,12 this is a -- this line is in bad shape13 and it should be replaced.14 Now, then the question becomes,15 should the homeowner replace it or should16 we replace it. And then that's where17 you're going with who is funding this.18 But at the same time, we would say, Okay,19 this is in good shape, no replacement20 needed, and other times we'll say, It21 should be replaced. Do we force the22 owner or do we do it ourselves? Things23 of that nature, yeah, that remains to be24 worked out.25 170 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591
Okay.2 DEPUTY COMMISSIONER McCARTY:3 Currently, when we see a problem with the4 water service, this portion that we're5 not repairing as part of the capital6 program for the water main replacement,7 we will issue a notice of defect to the8 property owner, saying your water service9 leaks. If we see the pipe is a lead10 pipe, for instance, a lead service, we'll11 notify the property owner that you have a12 lead service, and it's up to them if they13 want to replace it. But that's the14 golden opportunity, when there's a15 contractor already in the street, it's16 dug up, it's identified, they can get a17 plumber fairly quickly and get it18 repaired.19 The other thing I wanted to20 point out is, as we've previously21 mentioned, we're very aggressive in22 looking for leaks in our system, and as23 part of that, we do about a thousand24 miles, a little over a thousand miles, of25 171 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 surveying our water mains a year. So we2 get to every mile of pipe once every3 three years approximately, and as part of4 that, when we're doing this leak5 detection throughout the City, we do pick6 up leaks on water services and, again, we7 would serve a notice of defect to get it8 repaired, and then that property owner,9 of course, is welcome to participate in10 the HELP program.11
Just as a --12 if you take the leak number percentage,13 20 percent, and reduce it to less than14 ten, the Water Department benefits from15 that savings, correct? If we were able16 to as a system reduce that leakage to ten17 percent, that would be a savings. So18 there is some incentive for us to kind of19 do it as a municipality.20 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: There21 is. Now, leakage before the meter,22 basically, Councilman, we do not have to23 pay for the raw water that we use from24 the rivers. So taking that raw water and25 172 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 making it potable, drinkable and the2 quality that it is today takes chemicals,3 as you know, and it takes electricity to4 pump this water through our system. So5 the real losses here would be -- the real6 loss is electricity and chemicals when we7 lose water before the meter, before the8 customer meter. And absolutely, we9 would -- by lowering the amount of lost10 water or unaccounted for water, certainly11 the less cost we will have in those two12 areas of electricity and chemicals, which13 are significant costs for us.14 We've been very successful in15 reducing our lost water over the years,16 particularly over the last 15 years, and17 we have one of the very top-noted experts18 in this field that works for our19 department and is in charge of that20 aspect.21
One other22 point was mentioned about by-products23 produced by the sewage treatment and how24 that could be used as a profitable --25 173 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 profit stream to your utility. One of2 the reasons why we have this type of3 hearing and ultimately may do the audit4 portion is to look for opportunities such5 as this and to be able to kind of -- I6 know from day to day you're trying to7 keep a system running, but when you take8 a step back and look at an asset and say,9 Well, here's some potential profit10 centers, maybe this is one of them, and11 you spoke about by-products. Can you12 speak to that for a moment?13 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Well,14 certainly. Councilman, we do have -- one15 of our major divisions is Planning and16 Engineering, and under that division,17 there's a Planning and Research Unit, and18 among their jobs is really to see what is19 happening out in the industry and to read20 all of the material, all the relevant21 material, and we have a ton of journals22 that we read and other reports, seeing23 what's being done in other jurisdictions.24 Some of it doesn't make sense25 174 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 for us, being an eastern water-rich2 environment, whereas -- but others are3 right on point as to what they're doing4 with new science and new technology.5 We also, as you may imagine,6 get vendors, potential vendors, giving us7 presentation -- wanting to give us8 presentations and showing us new products9 that they have.10 So we do a great deal of that.11 Now -- and this unit -- and you're right,12 many of us here are struggling in the13 day-to-day world, but we want to have our14 folks -- and some of our best minds are15 in that area, in watersheds and some of16 the other divisions of the Department --17 looking for ways to improve on a daily18 basis.19 One of the things that's20 happened to this utility, I would say,21 over the past 15 years has been a steady22 improvement in all that we do. It's23 been -- and the steady improvement has24 been reflected by our steadily improving25 175 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 bond ratings by Standard and Poor's,2 Moody's and Fitch. The three large bond3 rating agencies have seen our4 presentations, have looked at our5 numbers, our reviews, have seen the way6 the Department is run operationally and7 financially, and have given us very big8 kudos in their write-ups and as well as9 increased rates.10 The thing that keeps our rates11 from being even higher, Councilman, is12 that the City itself is looked upon as13 the backstop if anything goes wrong with14 the water utility that it owns. So as15 the City hopefully gets -- will get16 through this immediate crisis and begins17 to get stronger, begins to improve its18 financial status, begins to impress that19 upon Wall Street, then we believe our20 rates will also get even higher.21 So we've had a steady stream of22 about 15 years of continuous improvement.23 That's the way we operate. We did have a24 management review within our department25 176 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 in the 1990s. It led to a new strategic2 plan, and it led to this kind of3 philosophy that we have grabbed at and4 held on to for these past 15 years, and I5 think it is showing off. I was very6 sorry to hear about the customer service7 complaints that we had. I felt very bad8 about what happened to Mr. Giordano.9 Things like this do happen.10 Sometimes -- I mean, we have -- we're a11 big bureaucracy in the City and, as you12 know, sometimes departments do work13 together, and we obviously want to work14 together closely with all of the15 departments that affect us, but sometimes16 things fall between the cracks. Yes, we17 have improved a great deal and we18 continue to want to improve, and we'll19 certainly consider the request made by20 Mr. Bertocci and Mr. Haver.21
Could you22 speak to some of your energy cost23 reductions that you've experienced and24 where you're going with that?25 177 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 And I'm going to allow my2 Vice-Chair to take over for a second.3
Sure.4 Absolutely.5 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Okay.6 On energy costs, we have over the years7 had many initiatives to adopt more8 efficient ways to use energy. Energy for9 the Water Department is a huge expense.10 We are obviously one of PECO's largest11 customers, and through the negotiations12 that the City had through its energy13 office, I believe, and PECO some years14 ago, they negotiated rates that have been15 very favorable to us. We understand that16 that, of course, will be going away17 shortly.18 But in any event, many of the19 other things that we're doing on energy20 is using bio-gas and we already use21 sludge gas at our Northeast Plant and our22 Southwest Water Pollution Control Plant.23 Those two water pollution control plants24 have sludge digesters as part of their25 178 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 operations. And the sludge digesters2 produce a lot of methane gas, which we3 have been using to heat those facilities4 for many, many years. So we've been5 involved in using sludge gas for heating6 our facilities for a number of years.7 We actually put in cogeneration8 facilities at both of those plants, with9 85 percent federal money, because during10 the planned expansion program, because it11 was considered innovative technology, the12 federal government upped the grant to us13 to 85 percent and we built cogeneration14 facilities that helped us save additional15 energy throughout the '90s and well into16 the 2000's.17 We have a project -- oh, we are18 going to incorporate sludge gas, bio-gas,19 into the BRC contract that we have. It20 is incorporated. We are going to be21 providing about 25 percent of the power22 to that new plant that will come online23 in a couple of years with the bio-gas.24 And also we are looking at a program up25 179 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 at Northeast to turn bio-gas directly2 into electricity to pretty much run that3 entire plant. But Ms. McCarty has a4 little more detail than I have.5
Sure.6 DEPUTY COMMISSIONER McCARTY: I7 just want to point out that with taking8 the gas and making electricity, it will9 provide a good portion of the power10 demand that we'll need, but it also --11 we'll be able to recover that heat and12 use that heat for heating the facility as13 well as those digesters, so we can14 continue to produce methane gas for15 reuse. So it's a nice cycle and a reuse.16
Okay.17 Thank you.18 I obviously came in -- I was19 out for a little bit. So I don't know20 where you are in your presentation. I21 have a feeling it keeps getting22 interrupted.23 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: We24 were, Councilman, we were at capital25 180 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 fund - sources of revenue and capital2 improvement program, which, of course, is3 the same as the rest of the City, one4 year of actual capital budget, five years5 of projected programs. So it's a6 six-year plan. And here are sources of7 revenue. What I'm proud to be able to8 tell you is that less than 75 percent of9 our sources come from borrowing; in other10 words, getting revenue -- selling revenue11 bonds on the market. And we just did one12 of those a few weeks ago and we did it13 without bond insurance for the first time14 since 1986 because of the whole15 disruption of the bond insurance16 business, and we went out and we were17 able to sell $140 million worth of18 Philadelphia water and sewer revenue19 bonds at just under 5.19 percent. And in20 this market, that's a pretty good21 showing, and it does show that the22 investment community still has confidence23 in us.24 But be that as it may, we also25 181 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 have -- part of our -- almost 12 percent2 of our source is coming from operating3 revenue, because we have a one percent4 net property plan and equipment transfer5 from our revenue fund to our capital6 account each year, and that over the7 years has saved us almost $300 million in8 borrowing, because we have picked that up9 ourselves. This is more of a10 pay-as-you-go approach. And we also have11 been adding residual fund money, which is12 one of the accounts that's used for13 coverage, and these are dollars that --14 once we use dollars for coverage, they15 then have to go to the residual account,16 because they can't be used for coverage17 again, and from the residual account, we18 also put that money into capital as being19 the wisest thing we can do.20 And the next slide basically21 talks about what we're doing. And we are22 proactive in our infrastructure23 maintenance. We have some major capital24 projects. The Dobson's Run, which is25 182 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 primarily flood relief program and also2 addressing an overflow problem, that is3 the one on East River Drive right below4 the twin bridges. We hope that will be5 completed perhaps before the end of the6 year, by the end of the year.7
I have to8 sneak in. A lot of these look like9 they're in the 4th Councilmanic District.10 Is that a coincidence or what, given who11 the Chair is? Not that I'm complaining,12 at-large.13 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: I14 don't know that anybody really wants to15 have these major -- some of these major16 projects in their district, because it17 does, as you know, have some effect on18 traffic and quality of life, but the19 permanent improvement at the end is20 important.21
Is the22 goal. Sure.23 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: But24 the second from the bottom, Northeast25 183 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 biomethane cogeneration project, the $152 million, that's the one where we are3 going to try to get most of our4 electricity from our own sludge to power5 most of that Northeast -- that large6 Northeast Water Pollution Control Plant.7 And the payoff for that is probably about8 five years, I believe.9 Now, here comes the10 interesting, more interesting, part of11 the presentation, Pennvest and green12 infrastructure. The way the Department13 thinks about the green infrastructure is,14 how is this going to help us with our15 combined sewer overflow program and16 integrated watershed management and17 handling of storm water in general, and18 these are the topics that we are19 approaching this with.20 As I had said in my earlier21 testimony, in February we submitted five22 applications for grants or loans. Four23 got approved. And out of 241 million, we24 received about 215 million. Of that 21525 184 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 million, 30 million is for green2 infrastructure projects. These are3 low-interest loans. Unfortunately, we4 have to pay them back.5 Next slide we're kind of6 showing -- this next slide kind of in a7 nutshell shows you the improvement in the8 environment with natural versus urban9 storm water drainage. And I think I'm10 going to have Joanne Dahme, who is head11 of our Public Affairs group and late of12 the Watersheds group, kind of go through13 these slides, because she knows these14 very well.15
17 So I think you have all seen18 some of these before. We talk about the19 types of sewer systems we have in the20 City. Essentially we have combined21 sewers where we are looking to address22 overflows into our streams and separate23 sewer systems. For both these systems,24 in dry weather they're working well. The25 185 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 wastewater from homes and businesses go2 to our sanitary facilities through a3 wastewater treatment plant. 7 When it's raining is when we8 actually have some problems with these9 systems, and that's what some of these10 green infrastructure programs and our11 other capital projects are looking to12 mitigate. So essentially when it rains,13 we have rainwater getting to our combined14 sewer systems and we have an overflow15 that occurs at our rivers and streams,16 because the systems can't hold the amount17 of volume that's coming over the storm18 water. But our separate sewer areas also19 have some challenges too, because storm20 water by itself is not clean, and when it21 runs off across streets and across22 buildings, it carries pollution with it,23 and also a pollution that is not always24 as recognized as the volume, the amount25 186 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 of storm water that's coming through2 these pipes directly into our rivers and3 streams. 5 So certainly our goal is to6 control overflows to our rivers and7 streams, and essentially this is what you8 may see if you're walking along a creek9 or a river. You see an outfall pipe, and10 this is where these combined sewer11 overflows or the tainted storm water12 comes out of these pipes, and this is13 what we're looking to mitigate. 15 The Commissioner had mentioned a little16 earlier that we take a very regional17 integrated watershed management approach,18 because we're downstream in the City of19 all our rivers and stream systems. 24 So how we're looking to address25 187 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 this is through a combined approach. We2 have traditional infrastructure, which3 includes what we call sort of the gray,4 the pipes, the undergrounds storage5 tanks, the tunnels. 9 So we look to do -- the Water10 Department's approach is going to be11 through a mixed approach. 25 188 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 Our goal for all of these2 projects is to manage the first one inch3 of storm water as it hits these parcels,4 and we'll be doing this through a number5 of ways. 15 One of the ways we are reaching16 out to the public are through these model17 neighborhood programs that we're working18 on. We recognize this as a new way for19 the City to go out and capture and manage20 storm water. So essentially we want to21 make sure that residents are on board and22 they sort of like the greening approaches23 that we're talking about. So we have a24 number of great partners, which include25 189 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 11 Essentially, they're helping us to12 recruit neighbors who want us to come and13 green their street. 16 This is an example of what a17 green street can look like. This is18 before it's green. This is Dickinson19 Street in South Philadelphia. And so we20 take a street like Dickinson Street and21 essentially we take a look out and see22 how we can retrofit it or redo it so that23 when it rains, that rainwater is being24 captured through vegetated practices, but25 190 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 there is often also an underground2 infrastructure component to that. But3 the greening approach, besides capturing4 the storm water in ways that keep it out5 of our sewer system at least during the6 time of the storm event, also provides a7 number of other potential benefits. When8 you look at a street like this, there9 were no trees, and now there's shading,10 so the temperatures in the summer are11 cooler on their block. 14 There's air quality, air benefits like15 that. So a lot of additional benefits in16 addition to the screening.
19 So just a few examples, and20 I'll do these really fast. 24 Councilman, you keep talking25 191 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 about rain gardens. 3 Essentially, it takes a lot of the roof4 runoff from the school, infiltrates it5 back into the soil, keeps it out of the6 combined sewer system and provides a7 great outdoor classroom for the children8 who go to the school. 10 In the lower pictures, the kids11 are actually installing the green12 infrastructure. This is a project we13 worked on with the Councilwoman, Mill14 Creek Recreation Center. It was one of15 our -- it is the City's first porous16 asphalt basketball court, and17 essentially -- and it's been there for18 about four years now, and essentially19 when it rains on this court, it's a20 porous asphalt, it drains into that21 asphalt and there's an underground basin22 beneath. So it handles a lot of the23 runoff in the area, holds it during a24 storm, allows it to infiltrate. And the25 192 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 4 This is Cliveden Park, which is5 in Germantown. This was an example of a6 great partnership again with the7 Recreation Department. We took street8 runoff from both blocks on both perimeter9 blocks adjoining this park and10 essentially disconnected the storm11 drains, took it right into this park,12 created like a step-pool system so the13 rainwater runs down into a rain garden in14 the park. 16 This last one is the Waterview17 Recreation Center, which is in18 Germantown, something very similar. So19 what you see is tree trenches. We have20 storm drains on the street. The storm21 drains connect to this porous concrete22 that's along the sidewalks of the23 recreation center. There's an24 underground basin, also feeds the trees25 193 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 14 Our challenge is, we get a15 certain amount of money, we have capital16 dollars and we have operations and17 maintenance dollars that go into the18 assets that we create from this. We19 don't have the kind of funding to provide20 for actually putting people through21 training for these green economy jobs,22 nor for sustaining that, especially if23 these practices are done in private24 property. But we would love to work with25 194 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 you to sort of explore the ways we can do2 this. And I know we talked about the3 Energy Coordinating Agency had received4 about a million dollars in federal5 funding to do something very similar,6 weatherization on private home7 properties, on homes. 10 We talk about rain barrel11 installation, training to do that,12 helping properties make sure that they're13 maintained properly, rain gardens. We're14 looking at all sorts of options on15 residential properties, even something16 like the replacement of laterals, which17 people mention time and time again. We18 don't have the wherewithal or the ability19 to do that, but if there's stimulus20 funding to really get people out there to21 provide that asset or that assistance to22 private property owners, that would be23 fantastic. 25 195 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 So we did talk a little bit2 about the defective lateral program. We3 have these cross connections that we're4 working in sections of the City and our5 separate storm water areas. That's a6 huge problem, and residents, as we7 mentioned, don't often know that it's8 happening. This is an example of a cross9 connection. 16
Well, I want17 to say a couple of things. One, I told18 people in the early part of this hearing19 that when I had my initial conversation20 with the Water Department, that you were21 enthusiastic. This was my proof that22 enthusiastic --23
We are24 enthusiastic.25 196 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591
Absolutely.2 And one of the things that comes to beg a3 question, if we are fortunate enough to4 get a second round of stimulus dollars --5 and there is some thought that that may6 happen for Philadelphia, because unlike7 other municipalities, we have a higher8 percentage of shovel-ready projects to9 go. What I'd like us to do as a10 follow-up to these hearings is give some11 thought as to where and how we can apply12 those dollars and in what way to generate13 the maximum amount of economic14 development, both for small business but15 ultimately for people to be employed. So16 if we can do that in a way that is17 thoughtful, that allows us to be both18 Roman and Greek, to build the aqueducts19 that we need to keep the system going,20 but also be green enough so that there's21 some aesthetic value to it as well.22 One question that I'd like you23 to answer specifically, what's the24 average cost of a rain garden to install?25 197 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591
We've done a few,2 and these are larger rain gardens. So3 there was about $2,000 for one at two4 local schools. These are gardens that5 are much larger. We do have a contract6 out right now, a consultant who is7 working with us on creating just what8 you're asking for, like looking at, as an9 example, a twin, residential twin, which10 doesn't have such a huge space, but may11 be able to create a garden that's like12 ten foot wide by ten foot long, what13 would be the cost of that. So we're14 aiming to make it very affordable,15 between $2,000 to $3,000.16 A lot of that is involved with17 the plant material. It's getting the18 vegetation, the native plants in order to19 have a landscaper doing the excavation20 and the planting materials that are21 involved, but not real challenging, not22 really difficult to implement. And the23 more -- if you can sort of ramp up the24 program so that you're doing many, many25 198 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 rain gardens, the cost could2 substantially come down.3
So a low-end4 rain garden can be as little as?5 Complete the sentence for me. $2,000?6
And that's probably7 still a little expensive. I mean, I8 think the most expense is in the native9 vegetation that we're looking at. I10 mean, essentially it's taking out an area11 for a green economy job, somebody would12 be trained to sort of recognize drainage13 patterns, looking at a house, looking at14 the downspouts, where is the water15 running naturally, looking at the grade16 of the property, picking the low spot on17 of the property to dig the rain garden,18 making sure it's about six to eight19 inches, depending on how much volume it's20 going to be handling. The goal for the21 rain garden is essentially to allow the22 water to sort of hold and then infiltrate23 over 24, maybe 72-hour period just to24 make sure we don't have problems with25 199 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 insects and that sort of thing, and2 manning the soil a little bit so that the3 infiltration works really well, that the4 plants can thrive and picking out the5 right vegetation.6 So it's not really complex.7 It's just a matter of being taught to8 have the right skills to go along with9 that job.10
So you said11 the Volkswagen of rain gardens is 2,000.12 Give me the Cadillac of rain gardens.13 What does that cost?14
I'm going to see if15 Chris Crock is in the room with us. He16 might know the Cadillac.17 It's certainly --18
It is very site21 specific. It depends on how big it is.22 And I'm trying to think. The ones that23 we have worked with like partners in24 Montgomery County, they installed a rain25 200 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 garden that was probably $5,000. That2 was the highest that we heard, and it was3 essentially treating about a quarter4 acre. So it was a large site.5
So in your6 estimate, in the next year, in the next7 five years, how many rain gardens should8 we see around the City of Philadelphia or9 retention basins?10
I think it's going11 to take us a little bit of time to ramp12 up. Here's where we are with like the13 smaller neighborhood project: Penn14 Future, who is our partner in this, they15 are joining with us because we're looking16 to create this design and say, Okay, we17 have three different types of residential18 properties, we'll have three different19 size typical rain garden sizes. Their20 goal is to go with us to the William Penn21 Foundation and say, Can we get some22 funding to implement these rain gardens.23 They're already starting to24 collect a list of people who would love25 201 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 to have something like this with them.2 We need to sort of have a sense of how3 much funding do we have, because we don't4 have -- the Water Department doesn't have5 the funding to do this work, because we6 can't make those improvements on private7 property. So we're looking sort of for8 the outside funder.9 We're creating the design.10 We'll create sort of the technical11 resources. We're hoping that William12 Penn or some other foundation joining us13 with Penn Future will be able to provide14 some seed money. So if we got $200,000,15 could we do 500 rain gardens throughout16 the City. That's sort of where we're17 looking right now. We're still very18 early in the process.19
So if I'm a20 neighborhood person and I want a rain21 garden, there will be a model for me. If22 I am a bigger, more independent single23 house, there'll be a design for me?24
What about2 the commercial component of it? Are we3 drafting -- based on your need for plans4 for rainwater runoff, will there be5 designs that they can draw from, so,6 therefore, a private --7 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: We8 certainly have designs that they can draw9 from, but they will already have an10 economic signal when we implement the11 parcel-based storm water charge for the12 large customers, and they will understand13 that they can greatly reduce their storm14 water bill by adopting some of these15 methodologies and keeping the storm water16 out of our system, and by doing so, we17 will be able to offer them credits to18 acknowledge those changes that they've19 made to their parcel.20
Will that21 also apply to homeowners? Will there be22 incentives for them to invest in rain23 gardens since they're doing their part24 to --25 203 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: At2 this point, we have not gotten that far.3
But4 something in the future?5 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: It's6 certainly something we can think about in7 the future. It certainly pops up, but8 administratively it may be a little bit9 difficult at this point in time. We're10 going to -- we certainly encourage folks11 to do what they can, but at this point in12 time, we cannot offer incentives.13
Fair enough.14 Sometimes the questions get an honest15 answer. That's okay.16 Finally -- and I'm going to let17 my colleagues if they have any questions18 for you, but one last question for19 myself. Can you describe the Rate20 Stabilization Fund a little bit? That21 was one of the last issues that was22 brought up.23 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Yes.24
And one25 204 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 more, what happens in cases of disputes2 on billing, what that process is for3 consumer redress.4 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Sure.5 The billing, again, is a Revenue6 Department function, but we realize that7 this has to be improved to some extent.8 I think the biggest single effort from my9 vantage point is, we have to be able to10 get those customers who are calling and11 answer those calls quickly, and I don't12 think right now the setup is quite right13 for that. A lot of calls come in through14 3-1-1 obviously now, and that's operating15 the way it should, but there may not be16 enough fire power in the system that's17 being used at the Bureau to answer phones18 quickly. That may have to be beefed up.19
Has there20 been any time motion analysis of from the21 time it takes a call to the time of22 response? Do you do that kind of --23 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: There24 has been in the past. I have not seen25 205 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 anything of that nature for a few years2 now. But I think they have a pretty good3 idea of how many calls are missed, and4 what we are learning is that sometimes5 people aren't even getting in the cue.6 So those may be additional folks who7 are -- if they can get their question8 answered the first time, then they don't9 have to redial and call again and again,10 and that may be -- it's one of those11 catch 22 problems. If you don't solve it12 early, it just feeds on itself, because13 people have to call back over and over14 again.15
Because16 actually the consumer that gave testimony17 earlier, who is one of my constituents,18 actually if you look at holistically how19 you guys responded to that, it was -- and20 I observed the process -- it was pretty21 good. It's the one that gets away that22 kind of haunts you that had a bad23 experience that we need to improve upon,24 because then it kind of slants the public25 206 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 perception of what the Department is2 doing, and I know, quite frankly, that3 you were trying to be as responsive as4 humanly possible.5 So we need to do a time motion6 analysis of what those times are. As we7 start to look at it as a result of these8 hearings what some of the follow-up steps9 are, how can we be more efficient in our10 greening, what opportunities present11 themselves through a reduction of12 rainwater runoff by way of an economic13 development stimulus for neighborhoods14 and the greening of neighborhoods, also15 some efficiencies by way of the mechanics16 of how we deliver our service and17 evaluating them in a real sense of what18 it takes, how long it takes to get a19 response to an inquiry, both from a leak20 to a customer billing dispute. So these21 are hard pieces of data that we need to22 kind of research and then hold ourselves23 accountable for. And I said it in the24 beginning. I'll say it again. We're a25 207 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 good utility. We can become a better2 utility by this kind of analysis. And so3 why don't we -- do we have any questions?4
Thank8 you, Mr. Chairman.9 Just one question, and this may10 have been asked. As I said, I was out11 for a little while. But on the billing12 issue -- and I know that's Water Revenue,13 but when it comes to the meters, I14 remember years ago in my previous life15 with Councilman Cohen, one of the16 complaints always used to be, My meter is17 not working right, the meter is wrong.18 Since it's been the new system, the19 automatic meter reading, I generally get20 the feeling that there's a lot less of21 those kind of complaints. Am I right?22 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER:23 You're correct. I mean, I shudder to24 think how many calls, additional calls,25 208 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 there would be if there were still meter2 disputes. In the old days we got on3 average one actual read for every ten4 months of -- you'd have nine out of ten5 would be estimated reads. And let's face6 it, they're estimates and they're not7 always right, and folks complain.8
Well,9 sometimes those meters didn't always work10 properly, too. I mean --11 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: We do12 test them and we do change them out of13 regular intervals, and now with the use14 of AMR, we get readings if there's --15 that lead us to believe there may be a16 meter problem.17
You can18 pick up the problem quicker.19 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: If20 there's no registration for a month or21 two and maybe very simple answer, maybe22 somebody is on vacation or has a second23 home somewhere else, but for the most24 part, it triggers a response a little25 209 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 sooner rather than later.2
And is3 there still a lot of complaints about the4 reading just being wrong? I mean, do you5 get much of that at all?6 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: To7 tell you the truth, Councilman, I get8 calls in my office as well, and that's9 about my best gauge. And, of course, I10 get calls from some Council folks who11 have a constituent that's had a problem,12 but that doesn't seem to be nearly as13 frequent as it used to be.14
It's kind15 of what I get, too.16 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: The17 Department is the -- was the biggest AMR18 user when we entered that project and we19 were able to really go from in less than20 two years to get over 90 percent of our21 customers an AMR device. So it was a22 highly successful program. It's still a23 very good program. The pressure has24 remained on the contractor to perform,25 210 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 and it's worked out beautifully for us, I2 think.3
I would4 agree. Thank you.5 Thank you, Mr. Chairman.6
Thank you7 very much.8 We're going to go to our next9 panel. We'd like you to stick around.10 We have one more to go and I think an11 exciting panel about to come up, and we12 can respond to some of the environmental13 questions and issues that they have.14
Representatives15 from Clean Water Action and PA Action.16 (Witnesses approached witness17 table.)18
Good19 afternoon. Can you state your names for20 the record and please proceed.21
My name is Brady22 Russell. I'm the Eastern PA Director for23 Clean Water Action. Thanks for having us24 here today, Chairman Jones, and good to25 211 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 see you, Councilwoman Blackwell and2 Councilman Greenlee here as well.3 I stepped out for a second4 during the beginning of the combined5 sewage overflow piece. Has anyone6 actually defined combined sewage overflow7 yet?8
21 And the reason that happens is through no22 fault of the Water Department. We just23 have an old system that can only take so24 much water coming through it. It mixes25 212 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 both the human waste that goes into the2 sewer system with storm water, and in3 normal conditions when it's not raining,4 there's no overflow, but when it rains,5 like it did yesterday, I feel fairly6 confident that we probably had a combined7 sewage overflow event yesterday when the8 sky exploded. We have raw sewage in our9 rivers and streams. 14 So I just want to go really15 quickly through our testimony. 17 I want to say that on balance,18 Clean Water Action has been happy with19 the progress made and the vision that the20 Philadelphia Water Department has been21 putting forward, particularly as it22 relates to storm water. We do see a few23 shortcomings, a couple of them that have24 come up at this hearing so far, but in25 213 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 24 The shortcomings that we see --25 214 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 and we've said these to the Water2 Department before. They know -- and it's3 one of the things you, Councilman Jones,4 kind of highlighted a moment ago -- is5 that there's no way right now for the6 residential customer to get a reduction7 in their storm water bill for managing8 storm water on site. So right now, the9 Philadelphia Water Department offers10 carrots, so if you come to programs that11 they do on storm water, you might get a12 rain barrel out of it. They can help you13 out with that. I'm sure they have other14 programs as well. It's carrots like that15 that are good, but that's a lot of16 hurdles for a customer to jump. They17 need to figure out where the18 presentations are happening. They need19 to decide if they want to do it. They20 have to go. They have to get the money21 together. Whereas, if any at any time a22 resident was able to find a way to lower23 their storm water costs, they could --24 that could make a big difference for the25 215 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 2 I can tell you for myself, I3 own a house and two vacant lots right4 next to it. Working for Clean Water5 Action, I constantly feel guilty that I6 haven't installed a rain garden on the7 two lots next to my house. But I've got8 more land than the average residential9 customer has. 17 Another thing that we haven't18 seen so far -- and this is really forward19 thinking, but we could lower the pressure20 on our storm water systems by doing21 something about gray water. So having a22 way to separate out the water that just23 goes down your drain from the water that24 goes down your toilet, there's a lot of25 216 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 ways that that can be used that's2 beneficial for the City. Obviously you3 can't drink it, but a --4
Could you on5 the record speak to some of them? Just6 like you graphically painted the picture7 of our dual system, could you also give8 us some suggestions by way of what9 we're --10
Sure. Two11 examples is -- I think in a lot of cases12 gray water is fine to use for irrigation.13 So it might be something for some of our14 urban farming areas. Another way any15 industry that is using water for cooling16 in any form, they could definitely use17 gray water as opposed to potable water.18 So those are just two quick examples. So19 any place where we're using water for20 cooling of any kind, we could use gray21 water. And there's also -- there's no22 reason not to separate out gray water and23 have it just get infiltrated into the24 soil without much treatment. In most25 217 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 cases, that's fine.2 So those are a few examples3 there. Again, this is -- there isn't a4 lot of that happening in the country at5 this point, but it's always worth6 highlighting.7 The last thing I would just8 highlight is, on April 19th, the9 Associated Press came without a report on10 federal research into pharmaceuticals in11 wastewater, and there was strong evidence12 in that report that a lot of the13 pharmaceuticals that we find in our14 drinking water and our wastewater streams15 actually seem to be coming from plants16 that make pharmaceuticals. And so we17 just call on the Philadelphia Water18 Department to continue to monitor19 emerging contaminants in our wastewater20 stream. And if we do seem to be finding21 high incidences of a particular22 contaminant, especially one that we23 manufacture here in Pennsylvania, to do24 some of that detective work and try to25 218 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 figure out where it's coming from,2 because there is strong evidence based on3 this federal report that manufacturers4 are dumping it down the drain. So we're5 concerned about that.6 We do know that they're aware7 of the emerging contaminant issue, that8 they are watching it. We just want to9 continue to put that pressure on that10 they watch this as closely as they can.11 And I guess the last point that12 I would make before I wrap up is, it's13 exciting to see the Philadelphia Water14 Department look for as many15 public-to-public partnerships as they can16 to improve our green infrastructure and17 to lower the level of impervious18 surfaces. We also call on you on Council19 to help them out. The City owns a lot of20 concrete, and the more that we can move21 that to pervious concrete or we can tear22 it up and put in plants where we can,23 we're going to be helping the City24 overall manage its storm water costs and,25 219 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 of course, also beautify the City.2 Our chief concern looking3 forward on storm water is just making4 sure that we do enough fast enough. And5 just remember, every time there's a6 massive rain event, our rivers in the7 City that we all sometimes hang out8 nearby or in get kind of gross.9 Thank you very much.10
Hi, Councilman12 Jones and Councilwoman Blackwell and13 Councilman Greenlee. My name is Karen14 Kennedy and I work with Action PA. It's15 a statewide environmental group based in16 Philadelphia. I'm here to speak about17 cost-effective alternatives to18 chlorinated water, the disposal of sewage19 sludge, as well as the implementation of,20 as stated earlier, an aggressive21 monitoring of our water systems and22 inclusion of public notices of health23 risks and dangers. 25 220 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 But the first thing we suggest2 is that there be a phase-out of chlorine3 from water systems and the introduction4 of ozone or other disinfection methods,5 and the reasoning is is because one --6 although chlorine is a good thing and we7 swim in it all the time, it also kills8 good bacteria as well. When adjusted at9 high concentrations, it can counteract10 Vitamin C and A within the human body,11 also create an imbalance within thyroid12 hormones. It's caustic to the skin and13 hair at times, and it causes an14 overgrowth of a bacteria in the15 intestines called candida. 20 So just a few things. Because21 of that, in 2000, the Olympic Committee22 banned chlorine from all pools for23 Olympic competition. So since the Sydney24 Olympics, all swimmers when competing25 221 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 10 Secondly, we ask for the use of11 ozone or ultraviolet light sludge12 reduction systems. 22 Currently, the City uses digesters, as23 was what was mentioned earlier, to24 process the sludge, and I was actually25 222 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 glad to see that they were creating a2 gas, that they actually do use the gas,3 because I have mentioned here that the4 flames that you see off of I-95 is kind5 of a waste of energy, because that6 methane can be used for electricity7 purposes. 9 But the other concern that we10 have is that some of the residue that's11 left after it's flamed is created into12 agricultural products, which are placed13 on top of baseball fields and put on top14 of foods and vegetables and things like15 that. And so it's been cited a couple of16 times. In '94, '95, two boys were killed17 due to the exposure of Philadelphia18 sludge. This was reported in the Journal19 of United Mine Workers of America. And20 also a microbiologist named Dr. David Lee21 from the EPA noted that one of his22 patients, who was from Clearfield County,23 died of a staph infection after riding24 his dirt bike through an area that had25 223 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 been treated with sludge, and another2 young boy thought of the exact same3 condition after the land next to his4 house had been treated. 8 Not only that, but it's9 important that Philadelphia resolve its10 sewage sludge problem in a way that11 doesn't contaminate our food supply or12 harm our state's rural residents. 24 Thirdly, and one of the things25 224 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 that is really important to me, is the2 mandate of dental offices to include3 amalgam separators. Luckily, in The4 Philadelphia Code, we were able to get5 something passed that allowed for a6 dentist to have to let their patients7 know when their fillings have 50 percent8 or more mercury. Mercury is something9 that is very toxic to the human body when10 exposed to it. It's not scrubbed out of11 sludge and definitely is not scrubbed out12 of water, and it creates a problem for13 our fisheries and our water system. 17 The Environmental Protection18 Agency has stated again that it's a19 neurotoxin. And one of the things that20 we could do by mandating the separators21 is, one, the City wouldn't have to pay22 for it. It only costs between $800 to a23 thousand dollars per dentist to install24 it. Also, we are the first place in the25 225 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 United States to provide public drinking2 water, and it would be nice for it to be3 even safer.
13 Also, we also would like to14 have a fluoride education campaign15 created for new parents. Mike Ewall last16 year testified about the dangers of17 fluoride in the water, but one of the18 things that was noted by the Center for19 Disease Control and the American Dental20 Association is that fluoride introduced21 into children under the age of one can22 permanently damage the tooth enamel and23 also causing dental fluorosis. So we24 just want to let parents know they25 226 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 3 And then, lastly, we again call4 for the active monitoring of toxins and5 heavy metals within our water system. 18
You know, we19 were sitting up here saying we didn't20 know whether to be scared or at least21 feel confident, and so I'm going to ask22 this question: Do you drink Philly tap?23
Yeah, definitely.9 I try to filter it, but, yeah,10 definitely.11
Hey, listen,12 that gives me a degree of confidence,13 because you're knowledgeable consumers14 and so that's important to me.15 A couple of things --16
Can I just say17 one thing? I also just want to -- I've18 liked this since before I worked for the19 Water Action. The Water Department's20 Philly Tap, the bottled water that you21 guys give out, I say it's a great name.22 I wish they filled it more places,23 because if people have got to buy bottled24 water, I wish they'd buy it from right25 228 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 here. Anyway, I love Tap.2
We agree on3 that.4 One other thing, ultraviolet,5 can you explain that process a bit6 because --7
Sure. I don't8 have a good background in those9 particular processes and I can have the10 presentations definitely sent in to you,11 but essentially what happens is is that12 the sludge is put through a process where13 ultraviolet light is concentrated on it.14 It then basically breaks it up and breaks15 it down. So it's a reduction process.16 And so at that point, once you go ahead17 and flare it, you have the methane gas18 and then you have a smaller amount of19 sludge that's being pushed out to the20 landfills. And so it just reduces that21 amount of toxins that are released22 afterwards.23
Well, a24 couple of things, and closing out will be25 229 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 the Water Department to respond to a2 couple of these, but are you familiar3 with some of the dual system replacement4 or solutions that they're coming up with,5 such as the tanks that they're putting6 in, and are you comfortable with their7 efforts to try to reduce some of that8 rainwater runoff in raw sewage going into9 our streams? Are you familiar with it at10 all?11
The overall plan12 that they've talked about with the slight13 mix of gray and overwhelmingly green,14 yeah. We've been watching it for a while15 and are happy with the overall vision.16
Okay. I17 mean, and that's important to me. I18 mean, I actually -- do you do canvassers19 still?20
I spoke23 to -- I was one of the motivational24 speakers that went out.25 230 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591
I did the4 briefing.5 So I'm glad to hear that we are6 making progress, and I want you to be a7 part of, as we go forward to design some8 of these solutions, to get your input9 from it. And it's an educational process10 for us, because sometimes we in11 government don't know these options12 exist. So we can't put forth options if13 we don't know. So that's why these14 hearings are important, and we thank you15 for your testimony.16 Do my colleagues have any17 questions?18 (No response.)19
Thank you.20 And I'd like to ask in the21 final ten minutes closing this out for22 the Water Department to come up.23 (Witnesses approached witness24 table.)25 231 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591
And thank2 you so much for your endurance during3 these hearings, and for you to kind of4 touch on some of the things by way of --5 and I know you're familiar with the dual6 system and some of the challenges when we7 get a big flood, when we have those8 incidents, but I want you to focus more9 towards what we're doing to remediate the10 problem.11 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: I12 think maybe Deputy Commissioner Debra13 McCarty could give you some of the14 details.15 DEPUTY COMMISSIONER McCARTY:16 I'm sorry, Councilman. I was --17
You weren't18 listening?19 DEPUTY COMMISSIONER McCARTY:20 Yeah. You're looking to --21
What I want22 to do is talk about -- we understand the23 problem with the rainwater runoff and the24 raw sewage combining when we have25 232 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 increased instances of rain, how that can2 create an overflow into our streams.3 What I wanted you to focus on is some of4 the steps being taken to deal with that5 problem, such as your storage areas and6 then the pumping out of that at a time7 when we have less rainfall.8 DEPUTY COMMISSIONER McCARTY:9 Okay. Well, we're looking at a long-term10 control -- I mean, we're in the midst of11 preparing a long-term control plan to12 address the combined sewer overflows,13 which is, I believe, what you're talking14 about, where sewage combined with15 rainwater does get to our waterways.16 What can't get to one of our three17 treatment plants gets to our waterways.18 So as Joanne and the Commissioner have19 spoken about, we're looking to address a20 lot of that by keeping the water from21 getting to pipes and capturing it in rain22 gardens, tree pits, mostly green23 infrastructure, the impervious paving in24 playgrounds, things that Joanne25 233 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 highlighted earlier in the PowerPoint.2 The other things we're doing is3 giving incentives through the rates that4 should go into effect in Fiscal 2011,5 which would be beginning July 1st, 2010,6 where it will be a parcel-based rate7 process. And the Commissioner could8 speak to that probably better than I.9 Something else is, the folks10 that develop more than 15,000 square feet11 of -- create more than 15,000 square feet12 of earth to surface in the City as of13 January 2006 have to capture that first14 inch of rain and manage that and keep it15 from getting to our system.16 And so those are some of the17 issues we're working on.18 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER:19 Right. I think that was -- Debbie just20 gave you a nice summary of the direction21 we'd like to address these problems. And22 the final determination of whether doing23 most of this work through green24 infrastructure and new laws, new rate25 234 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 tariffs and structures that encourage2 industrial, commercial customers to do3 something on their parcel rather than pay4 a higher storm water charge, these are5 some of the best practices, best ways to6 handle the problem.7 We recognize, however, that8 over 60 percent of the City has the one9 sewer pipe that has the dual purpose of10 sanitary sewage conveyance to the11 wastewater plant and also storm water12 conveyance during rain events. And I13 know one of the pictures that we had up14 there before, you see a little sewage15 running out of a very big pipe, and that16 is typical in dry weather. It's the wet17 weather overflows that we worry about18 when that pipe exceeds its capacity and19 we have to offload that diluted sewage20 into the rivers.21 The other things that we are22 looking into because we have to, it's23 part of -- this is something that most24 other older cities have done in the25 235 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 country. They have signed up and are2 digging deep wells and tunnels to store3 the storm water. This is exactly your4 point. This is something that we are5 trying to do as little as possible, and6 by using green and by using the new7 regulations on redevelopment and8 development of property, it diminishes9 the amount of storm water holding tanks.10 It diminishes the size of having to build11 these things and --12
14 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Yes,15 they're capital intense. In fact, back16 in the 1970s after the Clean Water Act17 was enacted and the Water Department had18 to build pretty much three new wastewater19 treatment plants -- there were treatment20 plants there before, but they basically21 were completely rebuilt at a cost of22 almost $900 million, and almost 600 of23 that million came from the federal24 government. We were very fortunate to25 236 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 aggressively go after the federal dollars2 and we got them. But before we built3 those plants, we had to undergo a4 storm -- I mean, a sewer assessment, an5 infiltration inflow assessment, because6 if your system isn't tight, you're7 letting a lot of rainwater/storm water go8 to the sewage plants that don't9 actually -- that doesn't actually have to10 go there. And so the plants would be11 oversized. So the federal government was12 not going to pay 75 percent for oversized13 plants. We had to do -- we had to reduce14 infiltration inflow within our system15 before we could size the plants16 appropriately. And just like this, we17 are trying to do and get the approval of18 EPA and DEP to do as much green in our19 long-term control plan as possible to20 avoid having to build these major tanks,21 and the bottom line is that at the end of22 the day, even if we build tanks for two23 or three billion dollars or more, the24 river quality will not be increased very25 237 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 much. 17 And we already know that they like what18 Philadelphia has been doing as far as19 green is concerned, as far as the20 watersheds are concerned. The holistic21 process has been a model to many cities22 across the country. The problem is23 meeting the letter of the law. Do we24 have to build -- I mean, green won't do25 238 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 18 One thing, the good news is,19 bottom line is, Philadelphia's water20 environment is so much better than it21 used to be already. 23 They're award-winning plants every year,24 but environmentalists say there's still25 239 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 pollution getting into the river. It's2 not from the factories. We know how to3 clean that up. The big problem is now4 runoff the land, runoff from the land,5 and our combined sewer overflows. So6 that's what we're targeting. 13
Well,14 hopefully as we look to Washington for15 some relief, that may change, and I think16 we have a President that is sensitive to17 the environment and has a commitment to18 resolving some of its issues.19 Two quick questions as we draw20 this hearing to a close. Some of my21 other colleagues are moving a plastic bag22 ban in the City of Philadelphia. Can you23 briefly touch on what plastic bags have24 meant to the Water Department by way of25 240 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 an environmental hazard?2 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Well,3 I may not be the best one to speak to4 this, but clearly, a lot of plastic bags5 end up in our inlets, our storm water6 inlets, our catch basins, and these7 inlets are tied to our creeks, streams,8 rivers, and so a lot of this material9 will end up in the creek. If it doesn't10 mess up the mechanics of -- the11 hydraulics of our system, our inlets and12 sewer system, they do clog up different13 areas, and eventually much of this14 material ends up coming out one of the15 outfalls into our creek or river. But,16 again, I think we're supportive of17 anything that reduces that.18
I just19 wanted to touch on that.20 I just wanted to say for the21 record that I am thankful to you,22 Commissioner, your staff and the23 professionals in the Water Department for24 what you do. I think that this Committee25 241 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 should be looked to as a partner to2 analyze where we have, evaluate where we3 can and improve where we must the4 operations of this department. That's5 the purpose of this hearing. We should6 do it.7 I would say that we've learned8 a lot today by way of the operations and9 its capital budgets, by way of dual10 systems and a need to improve them, by11 maintaining laterals and mains. I mean,12 we learned a lot about that. We talked13 about a need to improve our DBE/WBE14 minority participation in the process.15 We want to try to look to the green16 revolution to create jobs through17 replacing impervious surfaces with18 pervious surfaces and rain gardens and19 catch basins. We also are exploring the20 possibility of new markets for your21 product, whether it's through our various22 relationships with other companies to23 export our water.24 So all of these stand as great25 242 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 potential, and I just am excited about2 the ongoing process and the possibility3 of an audit, that we shouldn't kind of4 fear it. The auditors are our friends,5 to some degree. I know that's a6 difficult concept at times, but we should7 always do this to get better.8 We should look to a second9 round of the stimulus package as an10 opportunity to move some of our11 shovel-ready projects ahead. Ultimately,12 you're part of a green solution for this13 city. As we start to reduce some of the14 rainwater runoff and its contaminants, as15 we start to look to green roofs as a16 solution, I think you'll be the17 beneficiary of some of that work that we18 do. And I'd like to hear from my19 colleagues as we close out.20
Just very21 quickly, Mr. Chairman. First of all,22 thank you for putting all this together.23 I know that was a lot for you and your24 staff, and I think we did learn a whole25 243 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 lot today. And one other thing I would2 like to say directly to the Water3 Department.4 I think the first time we dealt5 with each other, Commissioner, was on6 that shut-off bill. We didn't7 necessarily agree with each other, but I8 will say that I think one thing we9 learned almost on every subject today was10 that the Water Department is moving in11 the right direction, and I think all of12 you deserve tremendous credit for that.13 Obviously we don't think everything is14 perfect, and what some of us may think is15 perfect, somebody else doesn't. But I16 think on environmental, on customer17 service, on a whole lot of issues, you're18 going in the right direction, and I think19 certainly that's maybe not the most we20 can ask, but certainly that's a21 reasonable thing to ask. So I just want22 to get that on record and thank you for23 what you've done.24 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Thank25 244 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 you.2
Thank6 you very much.7 I note that that pervious8 school water issues that were shown that9 we all praise was at Penn Alexander10 School, Mr. Chairman. That's in the 3rd.11
And13 also we are trying to work out something14 next with the Salzberger School at 48th15 and Fairmount, and we really would like16 to see a program expand with the17 Salzberger there on that land that we18 can't build on. So we want to expand19 that program with students at Salzberger.20 And we would like to invite those who are21 interested in continuing a Mill Creek22 Farm to consider that site. It would be23 ideal for it. It would be much -- it24 would be community friendly, and they'd25 245 6/16/09 - TRANSPORTATION - RES. 0809591 also have a chance to work with the2 students at that school.3 Thank you all very much.4
Well, thank5 you.6 This will conclude our hearing,7 and we will recess at the call of the8 Chair the Committee of Transportation and9 Public Utilities.10 Thank you all very much.11 COMMISSIONER BRUNWASSER: Thank12 you.13 (Committee on Transportation14 and Public Utilities concluded at 2:1515 p.m.)16 - - -17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 246 1 CERTIFICATE2 I HEREBY CERTIFY that the3 proceedings, evidence and objections are4 contained fully and accurately in the5 stenographic notes taken by me upon the6 foregoing matter on June 16, 2009, and that7 this is a true and correct transcript of same.8 9 10 11 12 13 ______________________________14 MICHELE L. MURPHY15 RPR-Notary Public16 17 18 (The foregoing certification of this19 transcript does not apply to any reproduction20 of the same by any means, unless under the21 direct control and/or supervision of the22 certifying reporter.)23 24 25