COUNCIL OF THE CITY OF PHILADELPHIA COMMITTEE ON RULES - - - Room 400, City Hall Philadelphia, Pennsylvania Monday, February 25, 2008, 10:25 a.m. - - - Bill 080027 - Amending Philadelphia zoning maps by changing zoning designation of certain areas of land located within area bounded by Christopher Columbus Blvd., (former) Reed St., Delaware River, and Tasker St. (extended), under certain terms and conditions. Bill 080028 - Approving plan of development for a Commercial Entertainment District in area generally bounded by (former) Reed St., Tasker St. (extended), Christopher Columbus Blvd., and the Delaware River COMMITTEE MEMBERS PRESENT: Anna C. Verna, Chair Darrell L. Clarke Frank DiCicco W. Wilson Goode William Greenlee Donna Reed Miller James F. Kenney Blondell R. Brown ALSO PRESENT: Curtis Jones, Jr., Bill Green - - - V A R A L L O Incorporated Litigation Support Specialists 1835 Market Street, Suite 600 Philadelphia, Pennsylvania 19103 215.561.2220 215.567.2670 2 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 I N D E X WITNESS Carl Primavera, Esquire, Philadelphia 7 Entertainment and Development Partners Jim Dougherty........................... General Manager, Foxwoods Casino 6 Nicholas F. Moles, Vice president and 31 7 Gen. Counsel, Foxwoods Casino Philadelphia 8 Jeff Green, Orth-Rodgers & Associates 55 Mark Brodsky, EwingCole................ 97 Gary Jastrzab, Acting Executive Director 147 City Planning Commission William Kramer, Development Division 185 Director, City Planning Commission Video Presentation..................... 199 Philadelphia Neighborhood Association Reen Goodwin, Pennsport Resident....... 205 Richard de Wyngaert, President......... 212 Society Hill Civic Association Jim Penza, Secretary, Whitman Council 218 Jeffrey Rush, President, QVNA.......... 224 David Hammond, Executive Director...... 274 South Street Headhouse District. Shawn Jalosinski, Executive Director 277 Sports Complex Special Services District Patty Griffin, Pennsport Resident....... 298 (reading Ed Kerlin testimony) (Written testimony of Paul Levy and Cynthia Philo are attached hereto.) * * * 3 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08
Good morning, everyone. This is a public hearing of the Rules Committee regarding Bill No.'s 080027 and 080028. I would ask Mr. McPherson to please read the title of the bills. MR. McPHERSON: Bill No. 9 080027, an ordinance to amend the Philadelphia zoning maps by changing the zoning designation of certain areas of land located within an area bounded by Christopher Columbus Boulevard (former) Reed Street, the Delaware River, and Tasker Street (extended), under certain terms and conditions. Bill No. 080028, an ordinance 18 approving the plan of development for a Commercial Entertainment District in the area generally bounded by (former) Reed Street, Tasker Street (extended), Christopher Columbus Boulevard, and the Delaware River.
Thank you. 4 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 Good morning, welcome, and please identify yourself.
Madam Chair, I'd like to just make a brief statement.
I meant to tell you earlier. Thank you, Madam President. Good morning, everyone. Madam Chair, I do have some very brief remarks this morning. First let me start off by saying that I recognize that the introduction of this legislation has caused some anxiety throughout the neighborhoods that I represent. I want to note for the record that, while I disagree with it, I clearly heard and I'm heeding the Supreme Court's opinion that Council must act. This legislation that is under consideration today sets forth some 5 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 clear and reasonable conditions for Foxwoods to meet prior to receiving its final approvals. The conditions address very serious and very real concerns that I have about this project: Traffic impact; Appropriate city services; Waste water mitigation; An appropriate tax settlement agreement; Public-safety concerns; and The casino's economic impact. These are the same concerns I've raised for several months not only about this project but also about the SugarHouse Casino. Unfortunately I haven't received many answers in the past. I hope that these hearings will provide a forum to get those answers, and I am looking forward to discussing those discussions and making the appropriate amendments, if necessary. Let me be clear: This 6 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 exercise is not an exercise in futility; rather, it is an important process that Council must go through to fulfill its responsibilities as legislators. Logistically, because of Council's budget schedule and the complexity of the issues before us, this process may take some time, but I am committed to the process and I look forward to a full discussion. I also recognize that the court may preempt our decision, but that does not change my desire to work in good faith with the communities impacted and the developer. This is an important discussion and an important process. Thank you, Madam President and my fellow Councilmembers and everyone in the chambers today for your interest and patience in this matter.
Thank you, Councilman. 7 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 Again, good morning. Please identify yourself for the record and proceed with your testimony.
Yes, Madam President. Carl Primavera. I'm here with my clients. I'm the attorney for Philadelphia Entertainment and Development Partners, which has been awarded a gaming license to operate a Foxwoods casino on the waterfront in South Philadelphia. To my immediate left is Jim Dougherty, who's the general manager; next to him is (indiscernible) Armentrout, whose title is chief development officer for Foxwoods Development Company; and to his left is Joseph Colbert (sp?), who's chairman of Foxwoods Development Company, Board Of Managers. And, again, I would like to thank both the committee and Councilman DiCicco for allowing us the opportunity to present our plan of 8 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 development to City Council. We're pleased to be able to present a detailed plan. We have the architects, engineers, and other professionals who have been working with the Planning Commission and various City agencies over the course of the year. And we have received, as you will hear from the Planning Commission, a plan development, and we're asking City Council to ratify that as part of the CED, or Casino Entertainment District legislation. We hope and trust that the hearing and those which follow will lead to a cooperative partnership between Foxwoods, the City, and the community, which will reap huge benefits for everyone. So, again, thank you, and I'd like to introduce Jim Dougherty.
Thank you, Carl. Good morning, Madam President 9 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 and members of City Council. My name is Jim Dougherty. I am the general manager of Foxwoods Casino Philadelphia, and I'd like to thank you for the opportunity to come before you today to present our project. Before I get into the details of the Foxwoods project, I would like to take a moment to know why this project is very personal for me. I was born and raised at 27th and Dickinson, St. Gabrielle's parish. For me, this project is about contributing positively to the place where I grew up, and so I welcome the opportunity to be here today to address any questions and concerns about this project. The Foxwoods team understands that there will be questions about any development of this magnitude. We have been working to ensure this project is something that makes sense not just for us but for all of 10 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 Philadelphia. To that end, we have been working for at least two years with professionals at the State and local levels to alleviate concerns that some have voiced. This has been a collaborative process on many levels. We firmly believe we have come up with a well planned development not only in terms of the site plan but also the benefits, protection, and the enhancement of the surrounding communities and the City as a whole will receive. Much has transpired in the 14 months since Foxwoods has been approved to receive a Category II slot machine license. During that time, Foxwoods continued to develop and refine our plans consistent with the CED zoning provisions of the City Charter. We have worked with the City administration and various departments, including the Planning 11 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 Commission, the Streets Department, and Water Department. We have also met with State agencies, including PennDOT, the Department of Environmental Protection, and federal agencies, including the Army Corps of Engineers. Since February of '06, we have conducted a grassroots community outreach campaign with residents, civic organizations, churches, nonprofit agencies, and businesses in the Philadelphia area. Foxwoods's employees and representatives have either hosted or attended more than a hundred meetings. In addition, we have established a community telephone number, an e-mail address for residents to direct questions, make comments, or schedule a meeting. A Foxwoods representative responds to each and every call and e-mail. Throughout [sic] our efforts, 12 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 substantial support has been identified throughout South Philadelphia for this casino. As of today, we welcome this opportunity to present the merits of our project to you, the members of City Council. We are participating in this hearing in good faith, out of respect for you, and with the hope and expectation that, together, we can move this project forward. I must add that while Foxwoods does not agree with the proposed conditions attached to the ordinance 16 as such conditions have never been included in zoning ordinances for other large-scale projects; and, moreover, most of these issues have already been addressed in the development agreement Foxwoods reached with the City. We nonetheless appreciate this chance to appear before you in the hopes that you will view our project objectively. 13 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 We do believe, however, that Foxwoods and City Council are in agreement philosophically on the vast majority of the core issues the conditions attempt to address. As I indicated, most of these issues have been addressed in the development agreement Foxwoods reached with the City following protracted, good-faith negotiations that began over a year ago, in January of 2007.
The development agreement provides for a number of things, including: Full funding of the cost of traffic-mitigation measures required for Phase I of our development plan; An economic opportunity plan that will embody the commitments already made in the diversity plan approved by the Pennsylvania Gaming Control Board and additional commitments to assure diversity in our operations, construction workforces, as well as our purchasing function. 14 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 Foxwoods has already committed to exercising good-faith efforts to ensure that at least 30 percent of our permanent and temporary workforce made is made up of minorities, at least 7 percent of our employees are women, 8 and at least 25 percent of our 9 construction jobs go to minorities, 10 and 10 percent go to women; 11 A commitment to ensure that a 12 significant percentage of our 13 workforce and contractors are hired 14 locally; 15 Funding of a Special Services District at $1 million annually and a payment of up to $50,000 for organizational and startup expenses. We have worked with the City to facilitate community access to the Delaware River waterfront, and we've made a commitment to fund up to $5 million of the cost of improvements to the sewer/storm water system to alleviate problems with the City's 15 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 existing system. While Foxwoods has specifically engineered our plans to ensure we do not burden the City's sewar/storm water system, we have nonetheless agreed to make these additional improvements to help the City alleviate existing flooding issues in South Philadelphia. We have made these commitments voluntarily and in good faith as part of our licensing conditions as well as being interested in being a good corporate citizen and a good neighbor in South Philadelphia. But this is not all. Foxwoods will make contributions well beyond what has been committed to in the development agreement. In first five years of operation, our project is expected to generate sufficient revenues to fund wage-tax reductions for all who live and work in the City of Philadelphia. The City will reap $15 million 16 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 annually in host fees, million of which will directly benefit the Philadelphia public Schools. The City schools will also receive an additional $5 million in revenue annually through a variety of taxes, and the City will receive 4 million annually in addition of local taxes. 3 million a year, from its share of the tax take. While it's not just taxes that are being delayed, our project will generate thousands of direct and indirect jobs. Construction experts forecast this project will generate about a thousand new construction jobs Phase I of the casino will bring nearly a thousand more new casino jobs, at least 65 percent of which will be filled by City residents. We already know there's a 17 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 tremendous excitement and enthusiasm for these positions. Foxwoods hosted a job fair in the fall of '06 that drew more than 400 people, the vast majority of who live in Philadelphia. M. Ward, in the spring of '07, which drew more than 200 local vendors. As we take steps forward to begin our operation, thousands of other indirect jobs will be created, from vendor opportunities to increased tourism. Foxwoods is committed to working with local vendors to support the community in which our casino will be built. I'd like to close with one final comment that really separates Foxwoods Casino Philadelphia from any other development this Council will consider. Our lead local partners have irrevocably committed a hundred 18 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 percent of their properties to charitable causes in perpetuity. This commitment by the lead local partners means that all profits attributed to 42 percent of the casino's present ownership will go to charitable causes. This amount is projected to be between 200 and 300 million over a ten-year period.
The primary focus of these trusts will be underprivileged children in the Philadelphia and South Jersey area. This commitment is unprecedented and will be groundbreaking for the region. It is our belief that the success of our project would not come on the backs of any of the constituencies; and, in fact, we have worked to ensure that Foxwoods Casino Philadelphia contributes positively to South Philadelphia and to the City in general. Based on this information I've presented and the fact that Foxwoods 19 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 has attempted to work collaboratively with the City, there's no reasonable justification for further delays. This is now -- the time is now to move forward together to generate jobs, additional tax revenue, significant funding for those in Philadelphia who need it most. We look forward to your cooperation and support to make this happen. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Dougherty. Excuse me, sir. Are you going to testify? (No response.)
Are you testifying? UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: Not at this time.
Thank you. Mr. Dougherty, are the traffic improvements that you are proposing 20 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 being made pursuant to a traffic study? If so, who conducted the study, and do we have a copy of their recommendations?
Yes. The Orth-Rodgers, a local Philadelphia firm, was hired as our traffic consultants. I believe you should have a copy of all of the reports that were done by that firm.
(Addressing fellow committee members.) I don't have a copy; does anybody have a copy?
Let me supplement that response, Madam President. We have handed up today to members of the committee an overview brochure, which is a small booklet of the project. We've also handed up a booklet in red from the project engineers. Each of the large boards has been reduced in size for your 21 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 convenience. And then, also, there's what we call "the Bible" or "the mini Bible," which is a condensed version of some of the reports. We have engineering reports, we have a lot of information. The entire traffic study is not in here, but we can have it available to any Councilperson who would like it. We also have Jeff Green from Orth-Rodgers; they prepared the traffic study. I know that there are suggestions that there may be a full hearing just on the traffic issue prepared, but we're prepared to address it at any time during these proceedings. And there is a summary, I believe, of our traffic study and improvements in the Bible, or in this February 25th handout. And, again, if anybody wants to see the larger report, we certainly can make that 22 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 available either during the testimony of Mr. Green or in advance of that so you can be prepared.
We don't have a copy of it. Our independent traffic engineer does.
I think that the members of the committee should meet and certainly be knowledgeable about the traffic study, so I'd appreciate it if you could arrange that --
Mr. Dougherty, do you know what type of commercial uses will be incorporated in the casino project? At this time, do you have any idea what type of commercial uses will be incorporated? 23 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08
The project is a multiphase project. Phase I, which has been approved by the Gaming Board and the Planning Commission will have 3,000 slot machines; we will have 4 food and beverage outlets; a parking garage of approximately 4500 spaces; and a multipurpose room, where we would be able to do shows, entertainment banquets.
The construction costs alone were in the 24 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 neighborhood of around $300 million.
There's also a parking component; I don't know if you mentioned that as well.
"Councilman Primavera," thank you very much. (Laughter.)
Mr. Dougherty, tell us, because I'm rather curious, who are the investors in the Washington Philadelphia --
Mm-hmm. What are their ownership interests? if you could share that with us.
The Washington partners comprise 70 percent of the overall project. The structure is 25 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 broken into three charitable trusts: the Rubin Family Charitable Foundation, the Silver Family Charitable Foundation, and Ed Snider. And then on a smaller degree, the investors include Mr. Peter DePaul, Mr. Fred Tisi (sp?), Mr. Quincy Jones, Mr. A.J. Agawall (sp?), Mr. Robert Levy, Mr. Billy King, Ms. Dawn Staley, Mr. Gary Maddox, Miss Sylvia DiBono (sp?), and Miss Joan Steinberg.
And you say that -- did I understand you to say that these investors would be willing to contribute a hundred percent of their --
The lead local investors, the charity trusts, the Rubin family, the Silver family, and the Ed Snider Foundation have all contributed a hundred percent of their profits back to charity.
And is that 42 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 percent of the ownership entity the local owners?
So the 42 percent ownership, which are the three charitable trusts, would be the ones that have committed irrevocably to donate all of their revenues to charity. And that's information that's been imparted to the Casino Commission upon which the license has been granted; am I correct in that?
Sixty percent of the local charity, the Washington partners, which is 42 percent of the overall project.
All right. So basically, the joint venture with Foxwoods and local partners --
-- is that the structure? 27 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08
And then the local partners of that, you say some 60 percent --
Of the Washington partners' side, 60 percent of the Washington partner investors, which is equal to 42 percent of the overall project.
All right. So 42 percent of the overall equity ownership is composed of the three entities that are contributing all of their proceeds to charity.
Would that be indefinitely or is it just for Phase 1, or...
And I think the 28 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 background has been that the three principals have been historic Philadelphians who really have decided that this would be a meaningful legacy for them to give back, and it's an exciting thing, obviously, for the young people who will benefit from these proceeds.
Thank you. Mr. Dougherty, your handout states that the project will provide public access to the river. Will the public have access to the 4500 garage-parking spaces that you are proposing?
How does Foxwoods' diversity plan compare to the diversity plan for the 29 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 Convention Center expansion?
Well, that's maybe a question that we need to get more information on. What we can tell you is what we have in our diversity plan. There was a diversity plan, which, I believe, was submitted and approved by the Gaming Board?
And then, obviously -- Nick Moles, who's the general counsel, and I'd like to just introduce him and maybe have him answer that. He's negotiating with the City right now for the formal EOP, which will be a part of this legislation. I think he has until the end of March to complete that under the master agreement with the City.
All 30 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 right. If he will, I'd like him to please come up to the witness table and testify.
Nick, would you want to address that? (Witness comes forward.)
Thank you, Madam Chair. For the record, it's probably one matter that we can resolve very quickly in terms of what's contained within these documents. The economic opportunity plan has employment goals but it has no contracting goals; am I correct?
No, sir. We are working on having contractor goals for our -- T.M. Ward, our general contractor, has committed to having goals also that we will try to obtain. 31 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08
But the economic opportunity plan contained within the documents that you've submitted to us today have employment goals but no contracting goals; is that correct?
Within this document? If you could point them out, that would be great.
I'm sorry, sir. You're going to have to identify yourself for the record.
Thank you, Madam President. For the record, Nicholas F. Moles. I'm vice president and general counsel for Foxwoods Casino Philadelphia. In answer to your question, sir, we have not as yet executed an economic opportunity plan. The 32 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 development agreement that we signed anticipates that document being signed by March 31st of 2008. However, through the development agreement, we have implemented various aspects -- or committed to various aspects of diversity hiring and also local hiring as well.
I know you were walking to the table as I asked the question. I said, to resolve this matter quickly in terms of what has already been done and what has been submitted to this committee, your economic opportunity plan, as submitted to this committee, only has employment goals; it has no contracting goals. Is that correct?
There has not been an economic opportunity plan submitted 33 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 to the committee, sir, because it has not been executed.
Okay. If you want to play games, you'll see how this will go. All right. Within your testimony, you referred to an economic opportunity plan. Within this big, thick document you've submitted to us, is there any mention of an economic opportunity plan?
Is there any mention of an economic opportunity plan within these documents, yes or no?
Well, you know what? There are a lot of documents. What we do have that we're going to hand up, and I think it's in the package, there was a letter that general counsel sent to the City 34 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 Solicitor confirming that, as per our written agreement with the City, there will be a plan by March 31st. It's just not completed yet.
No, I do believe the Chair will allow me to ask the questions that I've asked. I do believe the questions I've asked are very simple. Within this document that you've submitted to this committee, is there a mention of an economic opportunity plan, yes or no?
If you turn to Exhibit 5... 35 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08
I'll just -- the question that you've asked is in the book under --
Mr. Primavera, if you're going to answer the questions, then you should testify, but I think that this back and forth is not going to work.
I'm sorry. I think that what's been pointed out is that in our booklet, under paragraph 12, there is information that went to the Casino Gaming Board regarding requirements for economic opportunity plans, and we said that we would be willing to both have one with the City, which is a requirement, and also have one with the Gaming Board. It's being negotiated, everything is on the table. We want to hear from this Council as to your direction. We know that every ordinance will have an EOP, so it 36 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 needs to meet your approval. We want to have robust numbers, we want to be as aggressive on those numbers as we can be. It's being negotiated with the City, and because of a lot of other things happening, it's not here today, but we're hopeful to set a new standard for this --
If you turn to Exhibit 5 within this document, there's a November 23, 2007 letter to the City Solicitor -- from the City 37 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 Solicitor. If you turn past that document, there's another letter from the City Solicitor and then there's a confidential, I'm assuming, document. On of that document, there is a number 2.
Okay. So my question was: In the documents that you've submitted to this Council, the economic opportunity plan only includes employment goals; it does not include contracting goals. Is that correct?
Insofar as that's what it says, yes. If that's -- I don't have it committed to memory, but if that's what it says, then that's what it says.
You can read 38 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 it. It doesn't take that long to read. I just got the document this morning.
It says we have an economic opportunity plan, employment commitments...
And that was part of the testimony, that we would have vendor commitments, but I guess it's not in this document.
-- in the document you've submitted to us, in terms of economic opportunity plans, it has employment goals but no contracting goals; is that correct?
That took a 39 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 long time. Thank you.
You're welcome. All right. Mr. Dougherty, what is the amount of money that is available for wage-tax reductions?
The City will receive approximately $15 million, ma'am, in Year 1.
What amount of the revenues mentioned in the first paragraph of is also included in the $40 million in the tax revenues to the City?
He said to 40 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 repeat it, Ann.
Yes. What amount of the revenues mentioned in the first paragraph of is also included in the $40 million in tax revenue to the City?
I'm not sure where you're getting the 4 million, ma'am. Is that in the testimony?
Yeah, let's go through and see how that's broken down. It may well be that it's -- let's just talk about the first-year revenues and what goes to the City by way of the development agreement and the other components.
The 4 percent 41 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 that the City will receive in Year 1 is $14.5 million, ma'am.
Let's get back to the 40 million. Is that $40 million a total or an annual projection?
It says here it's 40 million in tax revenues to the City and more than 300 million in tax revenues to the Commonwealth annually, so that would be 40 million annually just... And then it says "once all three phases of the project are complete," so the 40 million really anticipates, I guess, a total build-out of the development; they wouldn't be Phase 1 revenues.
Is that just Phase I, or is it Phase I, II, and III?
The total taxes that we will be paying to the City, ma'am. This includes wage taxes, taxes 42 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 on the beverages, real estate; that's the total combined taxes of everything that Foxwoods Casino Philadelphia will be paying to the City.
Oh, that's just Phase I; it doesn't include II and III. Let's talk about the employment. You know, we get all of this information as we arrived this morning; I think it's totally unfair. This should have been delivered to us last week.
Well, we apologize for that we know, and we know there's going to be a series of hearings, so we're continually updating it and making it -- 43 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08
Well, by the time we get around to reviewing all that you gave us this morning, it will be certainly a lot more hearings. Let's talk about the employment, in the second paragraph. Is 1,780 the total number of jobs that will be created at the casino site when Phase I through Phase III are completed?
Once all three phases are completed, ma'am, we've estimated 1780 jobs for that facility.
How does this result in the creation of 15,000 jobs in the City and 35,000 jobs statewide, as provided under the heading "Economic Impact"?
The offshoot, ma'am. When more tourists come in, the other jobs, the vendors that we will be dealing with, buying more product from them, they, in turn, will be hiring more employees, and we will get -- the 44 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 ripple effect in the construction industry and in the vendors that we deal with will create those jobs not only in the Philadelphia area but throughout the State.
And we had a report by Econsult, which, again, we can make available, but I think some of it's in our materials where they've done a master analysis of the impact of gaming on hospitality, on small business, and on other businesses. So I think that we look at the ripple effect, as Jim said. So we have direct jobs but indirect jobs, much of which really has to do with tying gaming with Philadelphia's tourism and hospitality industry.
Thank you, thank you, Madam President. 45 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 You talk about spinoff as it relates to other economic opportunities. Could any of you speak to what, if any, economic opportunities have presented themselves to Chester since Harrah's has opened? Have any other businesses started up as a result of that, that you know of?
And also on the Convention Center issue, the Convention Center expansion, and I'm somewhat familiar with 'cause I sit on the board. We were planning to do that expansion regardless of whether there was a casino, or casinos, built in Philadelphia. So I don't think it's -- I think it's disingenuous to kind of tack that on. We never anticipated additional revenues, we never anticipated additional tourists coming 46 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 to the City of Philadelphia that would support the Convention Center expansion, and that was that we needed the tool. The tool would be the casinos -- we never looked at that as a tool. And I think, just for the record, we need to make that perfectly clear. If there are no casinos built in the City of Philadelphia -- and I expect that there will be, and I've said that from the beginning, but if none, we would move forward with the Convention Center expansion regardless. And there's no revenues that will go from the casino revenues, none of those revenues will go towards Convention Center expansion. That's a totally funded entity on its own merits; it has nothing to do with casino operations.
Well, we understand that, but the -- our 47 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 response has been that Philadelphia competes nationally for conventions. And we don't have the sun of Florida or Arizona; we have our history and our hospitality, we have our Steven Starr restaurants. And you will look at item 9 in our package, prepared by Steve 10 Mullin, our former great commerce 11 director, Econsult. And basically he 12 studied this whole phenomenon and said that gaming in Philadelphia can really give people that edge to say, Well, if it's New York or Chicago and I have to fight against Florida, having casinos in Philadelphia will just give us that little bit of a competitive edge to grab some of those big, you know, conventions that we need to sustain our growth.
Well, I don't want to argue this point to death. The reason we're doing the expansion is not because of casinos; 48 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 I'll repeat that.
We are in a position to do more Convention Center business irregardless of the casinos, and that has been a part of our discussion at the Convention Center Authority for the last five years. We will have some of the biggest conventions coming into our city, whether or not there are casinos. So my point again is, I don't think we should mix apples and oranges here. I'm not saying that you're trying to do that for any nefarious reasons, but that's not the case. We already know, and that's why we had to get our legislation done a couple weeks ago on the Convention Center, that we have a deadline date. If we didn't meet that date, some of the biggest conventions that we have been wooing for a number of years 49 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 would have gone elsewhere, but we passed some bills, we got it done, and we're on track. So, you know, the Convention Center expansion may be built before the casinos are complete, and we already have those big bookings. So people are coming to Philadelphia. And the other thing is -- and we can argue this, I guess, to death -- there be, in my opinion, a lot of that disposable income from conventioneers who will be coming to Philadelphia, whether it's at the current facility or an expanded facility, that may eventually wind up going to casinos, and I'll grant you that. The problem I have is, what will the restaurants and all of the other businesses have to suffer as a result of that disposable income being spent at the casinos? (Applause.) 50 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08
But I will continually -- and you guys can wave Mr. Termini can shake his head, but we all live in Philadelphia, gentlemen, and this is about protecting neighborhoods. It's not about pro-casino, at least not with me, and I've said this a million times at other hearings. It's not pro-casino, anti-casino; it's about protecting neighborhoods. And we'll deal with all pf the other issues, we can deal with that. And I'm off the point of order --
And we're willing to work with local businesses; we have many in support.
And I understand -- 51 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08
We think we're going to make the pie bigger. We don't think we're going to fight over an ever-decreasing piece of pie. We think Philadelphia is ready to grow to a new level of prosperity; we just wanted to be a part of it. (Applause.)
And that has been -- that has been the mission of this Council for the 12 years I've been here and, I'm sure, the preceding years, and will continue well long after I'm gone. Thank you. Thank you, Madam President.
You're welcome. I have just one more question, and that's regarding the charitable convictions. If the total cost of the project is $1 billion and 20 to $30 million, is the projected annual profit on 42 percent of the ownership 52 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 of the project, what is the total projected rate of return on the investment? It certainly appears to us that, at the best projection of rate of return, it's less than 7 percent. Are we wrong?
Ma'am, our projections are -- we are coming out very comfortable with from an (indiscernible) where we'd like to be as a --
An (indiscernible) rate, ma'am. The percentage that we're looking at for this project, we are still making money, we still believe it's a very good project for -- not only for Foxwoods but for the City of Philadelphia. 53 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08
Other projects that -- (Indiscernible; parties talking over each other.)
All right. So we will be operating within industry norms? (Mr. Primavera consults with other panel members.)
I'm sorry. That was Mr. Colbert, who confirmed -- and then, Jim, did you confirm it as well?
All right. So we're projecting that we'll be well. 54 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 Within industry norms, that this is an acceptable rate of return very similar to other gaming institutions.
Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilman Kenney.
Thank you, Madam President. Would it be possible if I talked to the individual involved in the traffic study?
Jeff? And we certainly can weave that into our full presentation when we have it, but we'll address your questions now to kind of set that issue up.
It's always a 55 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 pleasure. (Witness comes forward.)
Good morning, everybody. My name is Jeff Green. I'm a principal with Orth-Rodgers & Associates here in Philadelphia.
Thank you. Thank you very much. I have not had an opportunity to read the traffic study. Obviously, we have somewhat of a summary of it in this presentation. But I wanted to turn your attention a little bit to truck traffic on Columbus Boulevard. Was traffic, container traffic, a part of the study of the existing conditions?
We didn't separate out the container trucks from all 56 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 trucks.
Basically, a truck is a truck, and whether it's going to or from a dock or just passing through, it's a truck, and it is affects traffic in much the same way.
The problem with the "truck is a truck theory" is that the trucks that are carrying containers, that are on their way to a port facility have a different issue relative to time and cost, and I think it's critical that we understand the number of containers trucks, both coming into and leaving the facilities in the Port of Philadelphia, so that we can determine, prior to the mitigation efforts, what kinds of delays these companies are going to experience in time delay from the need to sit on Columbus Boulevard while an additional -- and how many additional 57 BILLS 080027, 28 - RULES - 2/25/08 cars are you projecting?
We're adding, depending on the day of the week, more than 20,000, some days 28,000.
So to 7 30,000 cars potentially in this area in 8 unmitigated -- even though we may do 9 signalization mitigation and things 10 like that, but big PennDOT-type ramps 11 and other things will not be done as 12 this place opens, if it does open as 13 you expect. 14 Don't you think it's important 15 that we know the number of container 16 trucks that are going to be sitting on 17 Columbus Boulevard idling while their 18 ships are waiting for them to be 19 loaded? Or unloaded? 20
The delays that we're projecting in the future, after Foxwoods is open, will be less than they are today -- (Laughter.)