(Spanish translation). INTERPRETER: I have been having a situation from five or six years ago. After they applied the law in 2016, City changed. The business of selling of counterfeit tobacco products increment in the city.
(Spanish translation). INTERPRETER: Those irregular stores, they don't ask for ID to the children. They are located in my neighborhood because we are a low-income neighborhood. Even in front of school, if they are a store that open hours and 7 is selling to everyone. They don't 8 care. 9
(Spanish 10 translation). 11 INTERPRETER: I'm 12 worried about it. I'm worried 13 about the situation. I am a 14 mother. I have children. And 15 would like for the City to regulate 16 those store as they regulate us. I 17 pay taxes. I have all my licenses 18 and I do all I have to do. But 19 they are over there. Every corner 20 is one of them. 21
(Spanish 22 translation). 23 INTERPRETER: I 24 understand that the City has earned less money, but we also have. So those stores are not regulated. They have no inspections and they operate overnight and they use the children, can go to the store anytime. We are regulated. We do what the City asks us to do and we pay our taxes.
(Spanish translation). INTERPRETER: So I would like for the City to inspect those stores like the Africans, the other nations, also Dominicans, but all the convenience stores they don't have the adequate license. So just inspect them. And if they have this regular license, it's okay. So I make this comment because my clientele they are asking me, why are you asking for ID if the other store are not asking for ID.
Listen, thank you very much. We have a time limit, but I hear you. That's why we asked the Health Department how many unlicensed stores are there. We are going to look at that. As you know, we have not enough police and not enough L&I, Licenses and Inspections, people to go and look at all these criminal activities, and the Health Department doesn't have enough resources who are supposed to go monitor. But we hear you that you're doing the right thing and you make sure your business is doing the right thing. And we hear you. But there are businesses who got their license, who are not doing the right thing so that's why we want to make sure everybody's doing the right thing. And we have to go after those who are completely unlicensed, the smokeshops that pop up. We are aware of that problem. INTERPRETER: (Spanish translation).
Please state your name and begin your testimony please.
My name is Leonardo Sanchez. (Spanish translation). INTERPRETER: I have been working this for years and during 23 years of those I had license. I received those two fines. I talked to my accountant person and he said pay them. I did pay them and then I received my license back, but not my permit. I have always followed the rules. I have always asked for an ID. I had years having a 11 license. But then one day an 12 inspector show up late afternoon. 13 So the inspector came at 7:00 p.m. 14 and she said, you sold cigarettes 15 to a minor. 16 And I asked her, okay, 17 when, when I did it? I can show 18 you the camera. And she said, no, 19 you have your summons, here's your 20 ticket, and left. That customer 21 bought something at the gas 22 station. She saw that he has the 23 product in his hand and she said 24 that I sold it to him. Thank you.
Well, thank you. So again, like that other person who was found to be not having sold but was ticketed, I would like to get your information so we can follow up with the Health Department to see how the investigation was done, because they're supposed to -- before issuing the ticket, they're supposed to verify and I want to understand that process. So we'd like to make sure we -- I think we have your information. We'll follow up with you on that and with the Health Department. INTERPRETER: (Spanish translation).
Rolfin Rodriguez and Renny Mezquita. (Witness approached Witness table.)
(Spanish translation). INTERPRETER: My name is Rolfin Rodriguez. I'm the owner of A&J Mini Market. If the interpreter can ask the panel, I can read the statement that they have so it will be easier and shorter. (Spanish translation). I want to express my disagreement with the new legislation, as I believe the City is imposing overly drastic measures on a small business. As the owner of a business that serves our community, I witness firsthand the challenge we face daily, especially after the pandemic. We have not yet fully recovered from the financial losses we suffered during that time. And now, we are facing new regulations that threaten our financial stability. I understand and support the importance of preventing the sale of tobacco to minors, as it is a crime that should be penalized. However, fines being imposed are excessive and do not take into account the economy reality of small business owners. Currently, the minimum fine is 250 already present a heavy burden on business like mine, which operate on very light profit margins. If these penalties increase or become stricter, many small business will not be able to stay open. Bodegas and small business play a fundamental role in our communities. We don't just sell products. We provide an essential service to those who, for various reasons, cannot travel to large supermarkets. Many of our customers are already elderly people, low-income families or workers who rely on the proximity and accessibility of our establishments. If the authorities continue imposing regulations without consideration their impact on a small business, we will be forced to close our doors, affecting both business and ordinance and the communities as a whole. We ask these penalties to be reconsidered and that more equality solutions are explored, such as educational programs for owners business, warning before using fines and penalties that are proportional to the severity of the violation. Small businesses are the backbone of many communities and we need to support the authorities to continue operating. We are not asking for the regulation to be removed, but rather for them to be implemented as they are reasonable way without engaging the livelihood of hundreds of hardworking business owners who dedicate himself daily to serving the neighborhoods. We appreciate that our concerns are being heard and hope that measures will be taken as long as to move forward without harming the economy of those with effort and education to keep our business alive.
Thank you very much for your testimony. I hear you. We want our small businesses to thrive. All we're asking, just like my colleague Councilmember Cindy Bass said, card everybody, no fine, no 3 fine if you don't sell to minors. INTERPRETER: (Spanish translation).
(Spanish translation). INTERPRETER: Can I ask you a question?
(Spanish translation). INTERPRETER: So what happens with an adult that purchases cigarettes for a minor? They can purchase for them in the store and they go outside and give it to them maybe a block later or outside?
Yeah, you should not be ticketed for that. If an adult does that, that's an adult problem. That's their problem, not yours. Totally understand, yeah. INTERPRETER: (Spanish translation).
Absolutely. Thank you for your testimony. We have our last witness. INTERPRETER: (Spanish translation).
Actually we have two. Renny Mezquita. (Witness approached Witness table.)
(Spanish translation). INTERPRETER: My name is Renny Mezquita, owner of Banner Street Food Market, Inc., and I am proud to be a bodega owner. I want to express my strong disagreement with the new legislation, as I believe the City of Philadelphia is unfairly targeting small business owners like us. Lately, all we have received are fines and constant inspections from officials who do not recognize the hard work we put in every day. Bodegas are essential business for our community. We open our doors more than hours a day providing 13 essential products, services to our 14 neighborhood. We pay taxes, create jobs and, most importantly, we have established our business in areas where no one else was willing to invest due to high crime rates. Thanks to our presence and commitment, many of those areas are now safer. Bodegas are the heart of our neighborhood. Every morning our community gathers in our store for coffee, breakfast or to prepare their children before they go to school. We don't just sell products. We contribute to the well-being of our neighborhood and community life. As a small business owner, we demand that. We demand to be treated fairly with respect. We do not ask gain regulations, but we need them to be fair and acknowledge the vital role we play in the city. We urge the authority to recognize our hard work and reconsider these measures that only harm us instead of supporting us.
Thank you for your testimony. And I'll just say it again that this is -- and I told one of your colleagues that this is like the red light camera on Roosevelt Boulevard. It makes you slow down. This fine is to make you think and make sure you card everybody. If there are issues that you didn't sell to minors, those are things we must pay attention and improve the process. But this increase is for helping protect our children. When they ingest this -- inhale the vaping product, it hurts their lungs forever. We can't fix it. So I want all of us in our community to take responsibility and say we will make sure we are not selling to minors. That's all. You don't sell to minors, no fine. INTERPRETER: (Spanish translation).
I agree with the fine, but take us in on consideration.
I hear you. I hear you. And we've already have an amendment to reduce it, so it's not 5000. It's 2. INTERPRETER: (Spanish translation).
Gracias. Call up the last witness. Juli -- where did Julian go? (Witness approached Witness table.)
Oh, okay. She's here. Please state your name and begin your testimony.
Hi. Good afternoon. My name is Delfina Arias. I want to express myself. I want to express my strong disagreement with the new legislation as I believe that the City of Philadelphia is unfairly targeting bodegas, while turning a blind eye to the largest business that commits similar violations. And when I said that, I'm talking about big establishments like supermarkets. Because the bill that you guys passed I think was in 2015 or '16, they take the license away from a lot of us, especially the new owners, not just the old ones. When you buy a business, you're not allowed to have a cigarette license, but we're still paying for the state license. So it's no way that we're being teach because we didn't receive any letter or anything to each store saying that you're not allowed to use the state license while you don't have the city license. And I bring that point because my I work with my father. And as a grocery store owner, the City was like four years they didn't go to inspect the store, but the state usually go every year. So the first year they go, they saw cigarettes and they put a fine to my dad for the cigarettes. But they never told us to remove the wraps, which is including tobacco retail license. And the City came this year and they closed us down 48 hours because we have a ticket from 2021, which I think was unfair. Because if you don't have the amount of people to do the job but they supposed to do, we don't have to pay for that. And especially, they do random inspections. They go during hours when we are crowded. Like, how you expect the fridge to be in the right temperature when you go 11:30 or 12:00 or 1 o'clock in the morning when it's the rush hour. No fridge is going to have the exact temperature. So she marked that down in the report. And normally that's what they do. They go in the hours and they check the temperatures. What is -- it doesn't make any sense to me.
So you're talking about other issues, not about selling to minors?
I hear you that there's some other things we need to address, but right now I'm just trying to focus on making sure our retail establishments card everybody and not sell tobacco products to minor. But I hear you about the other things you mentioned, and we are happy to follow up with you to make sure that you're being treated fairly. We can have a conversation with the Health Department with you about the other issues. But I'm just wanting to make sure everybody here understands I am talking about a bill that will say it will be a fine if you sell to minors. There's a first, second and third time. We're giving three chances for people to not do this. And I am asking all of you, all of you, to participate with us to protect our children. That's all this is about.
I appreciate you understand that, and that is what this is about. And if you have other issues, please get in touch with my office. We are happy to follow up on these other things you mentioned. Sometimes this is why we're having a hearing. When you put out some rules, sometimes the rules look fine for us but not for people who will feel it, right. That's why we're doing this, to hear from you. And that's why I'm going to recess this meeting, meet with all of you and the Health Department and then vote on this. So I'm listening to you.
Yes. When she asked the Department of Health that he says that the numbers changed. She said, no, it's not change. So why having the law stopping us for getting a license and we're doing the right thing. I don't say everybody. Probably any other (inaudible) the law. But my question is you mentioned the red light. You put in that as an example. But I think since 2025 the fine for a red light is $100. They don't increase the fine so high extremely. They probably put it $100 more if they're going to increase it. And you don't see a person transpass the red light, going to do -- they don't make them go to do community service like in a hospital, seeing what can cost when you pass red light.
So the red light analogy is about slowing people down, right. Having red light has proven that it slows people down. That's what we're trying to do with this bill, is slow people down to do the right thing. And in a red light situation if you kill someone, it's a lot of problem, right. And same thing here, you're slowly killing children because their lungs are at risk. So we do not want our children to be exposed to this and that's why we need to work together to stop it. If people follow the law, there's no fine. No one is going to do any fines. And if there's some problems with it, we're happy to look into it. If somebody has unfairly been targeted, all of those we are happy to address. But the issue is that we need a deterrent for people who are selling products to minors to stop it. That's all. That's all this is. Thank you for your testimony and we're going to convene again with all of you so we can have more conversation.
One more thing. And we have the reunion with the Department of Tobacco. And she practically didn't have any answer for us because she was taking notes. And like, you said, that's the best idea to have a reunion with you guys and with the Department of Health. It's a lot of misinformation. Because you guys says one thing, they said another thing and you guys don't get each other, like, together on that and we're paying the price. I don't agree with the fine. I'm okay with the one that is right now, but I don't agree with the fine because if all my colleagues giving complaints with the tickets that sometimes they get it the wrong time, like when people go and buy a tobacco before, they used to give them the fine right there in the exact moment. Like they say, she came and she sell a minor. So the inspector come right after them and give you the ticket. So I don't know why they don't still do it the same way, and they wait like three months. So it's no way --
We will look into that. I heard that very clearly from everybody that that's a problem.
My point is that if they're doing a lot of irregularities with these tickets, imagine if you increase their fine to 1000, 2000, what's going to happen to us? We're going to pay the price and the tobacco company won't pay at all?
So we'll make sure that it is done fairly, it is done equitably and we are going to make sure that that happens. And that's why we're going to have this meeting before we move on things. All right. So we heard you. Thank you very much. Gracias. Can the Clerk call any further witnesses.
Okay. Thank you. So I would like to thank all of our witnesses for joining us today. Very important information was shared and that is going to determine our path forward. We will now recess this meeting and we will not vote on this bill 22 to pass it out of Committee as of yet. But we will reconvene at another point after I have had a chance to meet with all of you, hear more from you and talk to the Health Department to move forward. So I want to now go into recess, and thank you all again. Thank you, colleagues, for sitting through and hearing all this important testimony.
Thank you. (Committee on Public Health and Human Services concluded at 1:40 p.m.) C E R T I F I C A T I O N I, hereby certify that the proceedings and evidence noted are contained fully and accurately in the stenographic notes taken by me in the foregoing matter, and that this is a correct transcript of the same. __________________________________ TANEHA CARROLL