COUNCIL OF THE CITY OF PHILADELPHIA2 COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE3 Room 400, City Hall6 Philadelphia, Pennsylvania Tuesday, October 26, 20107 10:25 a.m. PRESENT: COUNCIL PRESIDENT ANNA C. VERNA10 COUNCILMAN DARRELL CLARKE COUNCILMAN FRANK DiCICCO11 COUNCILMAN W. WILSON GOODE, JR. COUNCILMAN BILL GREEN12 COUNCILMAN WILLIAM K. GREENLEE COUNCILMAN CURTIS JONES, JR.13 COUNCILMAN JACK KELLY COUNCILMAN JAMES KENNEY14 COUNCILWOMAN JOAN L. KRAJEWSKI COUNCILWOMAN DONNA REED MILLER15 COUNCILMAN BRIAN J. O'NEILL COUNCILWOMAN MARIA D. QUINONES-SANCHEZ16 COUNCILWOMAN BLONDELL REYNOLDS BROWN COUNCILMAN FRANK RIZZO, JR.17 RESOLUTION 100587 - Resolution authorizing City Council's Committee of the Whole to hold19 a public hearing to investigate and determine the cause of the ongoing problems with the20 rotational towing program in the City of Philadelphia.21 - - -23 2
Good2 morning, everyone. This is a public3 hearing of the Committee of the Whole4 regarding Resolution No. 100587.5 Theresa, would you please read6 the title of the bill.7
Authorizing City8 Council's Committee of the Whole to hold9 a public hearing to investigate and10 determine the cause of the ongoing11 problems with the rotational towing12 program in the City of Philadelphia.13
Everett Gillison.16 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:17 Everett Gillison, Deputy Mayor for Public18 Safety.19 (Witnesses approached witness20 table.)21
Good24 morning.25 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:2 Please identify yourself for the record3 and proceed with your testimony.4 DEPUTY
Thank5 you. Good morning, President Verna and6 members of City Council. My name is7 Everett Gillison. I'm the Deputy Mayor8 for Public Safety. Thank you for the9 opportunity to appear before you today to10 testify on Resolution No. 13 I was present before a14 committee of this body last week15 testifying on these same issues. Much of16 my testimony will be duplicative, but I17 want this record to be clear. Councilman18 Rizzo's legislation creating the19 rotational towing program was designed to20 rectify serious problems that existed and21 still exist, to a certain extent, in the22 towing industry in the City. Many of23 these problems, such as wreck chasing,24 impacted public safety. Many of these25 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 problems, such as improper licensing,2 setting reasonable fees, requiring towers3 to maintain secure storage facilities,4 impact consumer protection. 8 The rotational towing program9 implemented by the Police Department and10 the Department of Licensing and11 Inspections helps to alleviate some of12 the problems that existed with the towing13 industry in the City. Many abuses,14 however, still exist, and some towers15 have even found ways to work around the16 rotational system. As I testified last17 week, we have all heard countless18 complaints of citizens who have had19 encounters with tow operators who seem to20 take advantage of the drivers' difficult21 circumstances. 24 Certain tow operators do not operate25 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 trucks suitable to perform towing and2 fail to carry the necessary safety3 equipment. We've all heard the4 complaints about tow operators failing to5 heed a vehicle owner's instructions on6 where to take their vehicle or tow7 operators who take vehicles to certain8 body shops where the owner's vehicle is9 essentially held for ransom. We know10 certain tow operators fail to accept11 credit cards for payment, fail to provide12 safe and secure storage and a host of13 other failures. 23 In response to some of the24 problems that still exist, the25 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 Philadelphia Police Department has made2 changes to the way in which it operates3 the rotational towing system. Police4 officers are no longer dispatched to5 accident scenes via police radio where6 the broadcast may be intercepted by a tow7 operator with a scanner. Officers are8 now dispatched via their mobile data9 terminals, to which the public has no10 access. For instance, when the11 responding officer arrives on the scene12 and is in need of a fire rescue for a13 crash victim, that call does go out over14 police radio. 23 Another change that the24 Department has made is that once police25 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 radio dispatches an officer to an2 accident scene, the dispatcher calls the3 tow operator next in line on the4 rotational list. Before the change,5 police officers at the scene of the6 accident would make the determination as7 to whether or not a tow was needed. 11 These changes have helped to12 curtail wreck chasing and the inherent13 dangers of that practice. For most14 accidents where police respond, the15 vehicles are not impeding traffic, so the16 rotational system does not apply. The17 rotational towing program only applies to18 non-consensual tows, those situations19 where the vehicles are not movable and20 are blocking the highway. So currently,21 despite dispatching a rotational tower to22 every accident where the police respond,23 the law actually only applies to those24 situations where vehicles are impeding25 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 traffic. 5 The Police Department assumes6 that every accident it dispatches meets7 the legal standards, but clearly they do8 not. Too often officers at the accident9 scene are left refereeing disputes10 between towers.
14 Since the Police Department is15 dispatching a rotational tower to every16 accident that were thought to initially17 fit the criteria of the non-consensual18 tow, many rotational towers are being19 sent to assignments where they are not20 needed. Because there are large number21 of towers on each list, this has become a22 strong financial disadvantage for the23 towers. We are exploring options as to24 how to reconcile this situation, since25 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 3 To reiterate our position, the4 Police Department is committed to the5 rotational tow system. The Department6 desires that the system operate in a safe7 and efficient manner, and will continue8 to monitor the system and make9 operational changes when necessary to10 achieve these goals. 14 I thank you for the opportunity15 to testify, and I'll be happy to answer16 any questions from the Committee. 21
Thank22 you.23 The Chair recognizes Councilman24 Rizzo.25 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871
Thank you,2 Madam Chair.3 Thank you, Deputy Mayor4 Gillison, for your testimony. I know in5 your testimony you did mention additional6 changes, but could you or your colleagues7 talk about what some of the additional8 changes by regulation, not by ordinance,9 are planned to enhance the rotational tow10 system that we have today.11 DEPUTY
Well,12 the ones that I testified to are the ones13 that, what I call the departmental policy14 changes, that have already been enhanced.15 We've talked about and have already16 changed the way that we dispatch. So now17 we do it by way of the mobile data18 terminals. As I've indicated to you and19 to other members of Council, we are20 looking to expand our mobile data21 terminals now even into the Fire22 Department so that we will, in essence,23 take all of the dispatch, both for Fire24 and for Police, and make it just one part25 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 of the public safety network that we're2 building. So that's one of the matters3 that we've done.4 There are a couple of others.5 If Mr. Healy wants to comment on it, I'm6 sure that he can.7 LIEUTENANT HEALY: As I had8 mentioned previously, the two primary9 issues that we have concern is, one,10 legislatively, is the bright line when11 this law actually takes effect, from a12 police officer's perspective. The way13 it's written, as we explained, is, it's14 when the cars are actually blocking the15 sidewalk or the highway. At that point16 in time is when the non-consensual tow17 takes effect.18 What we've done is to alleviate19 or actually to create a self-created20 bright-line rule, we dispatch tows on21 every one of these jobs. As the Deputy22 Mayor mentioned, that's not absolutely23 correct, but nonetheless, it's the24 Department's effort to make sure that we25 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 overcome that hurdle of making sure that2 every tow gets the proper response and3 there's not wreck chasing.4 The second side of that is the5 disadvantage for the towers, which has to6 be addressed as well. As the Deputy also7 mentioned, without the towers, the8 program will not succeed. I mean, they9 are the integral part of it, the honest10 towers in the program. The thing is,11 we're starting to send so many towers to12 jobs that aren't founded, it becomes13 financially not in the best interest to14 be part the wheel of one of these15 rotational wheels. So we need to16 reevaluate from an administrative17 perspective on how to better manage the18 wheel, much more akin to the recovered19 stolen auto program, which is basically a20 template that we tried to replicate21 because of its efficiency. It absolutely22 works very well, but there's very small23 number of towers on the list.24 So we're trying to balance the25 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 interest of keeping this open for the2 consumers as well as for the business3 towers, but also having it from an4 efficiency perspective of what is the5 most manageable side for this wheel. And6 internally we're going to try to fix7 that. That seems to be the biggest8 problem, because we do get complaints9 from the towers, legitimately so, that10 they are not getting called enough times11 on the wheel or they've been passed. It12 is a problem and it needs to be13 addressed. And I think the heart and14 soul of it is the size the wheel, the15 number of people on the wheel. From the16 Department's perspective, we want to make17 sure that the cars that are taken under18 this program are secured, protected,19 along those lines.20 So administratively we're21 looking to address the wheel, but from a22 legislative perspective, it's the23 bright-line rule is where we could24 possibly need some more help.25 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871
So we'll2 obviously address those concerns. And3 you hit it. Many of the towers that have4 communicated to many of us indicated5 they've been on the rotational towing6 program for a long time and some have7 never received a call, some have received8 calls rarely, one or two a month, and9 others receive a lot. And I know that10 the industry is concerned that some of11 the rotational towers that are on the12 wheel are, let's say, dispatched by AAA13 to the scene lose their spot on the14 rotation.15 So these are the kinds of16 things that we have to look at. It's not17 fair for a tower that represents AAA to18 lose their spot on the rotation if the19 consumer or the member calls them20 directly.21 So I'm sure now with the change22 in the regulation or the internal change23 of all calls being dispatched, you24 indicated that, yeah, there may be some25 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 false alarms, but I would assume now that2 more people are getting calls to respond3 to clear the highway.4 LIEUTENANT HEALY: Yeah. I5 believe so, yes.6
Okay. I7 would like to ask L&I to just briefly for8 the record and for people here today to9 talk about -- we know the Police10 Department's role. Mr. Haigler, could11 you please talk about what L&I's role is12 in the rotational towing program, please.13
Good morning. My14 name is Otis Haigler, Jr., Director of15 Legislative Affairs for the Department of16 Licenses and Inspections.17 L&I's role with regard to the18 rotational towing system is to receive19 applications from individuals who wish to20 be placed on the list for rotational21 towing. What we do is, once we get a22 request, we send out a packet to the23 company indicating the -- with the24 application in there, as well as the bill25 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 of rights, the consumer bill of rights,2 as well as frequently asked questions, as3 well as a letter from the Commissioner4 detailing what the requirements are.5 I have a copy of all of the6 information that we send out. I'm sorry,7 I don't have enough copies for everyone,8 but I believe if the Sergeant-at-Arms9 would make copies of the packet, this is10 the packet that we send out to all of the11 towing companies.12 It indicates in the packet13 itself all the requirements. We also14 include in the packet a copy of the15 regulations that were promulgated and16 adopted back in 2005, as well as the17 amended regulations that were adopted in18 2009.19
Mr. Haigler,20 you heard the Police Department's counsel21 indicate some changes that they want to22 make. Is there anything that L&I sees23 needs to be changed? You described the24 role. Do you know how many towers that25 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 we presently have? Is that L&I's -- does2 L&I keep track of that?3
The number of4 total towers or the number of towers on5 the rotational list?6
Is there11 anything that L&I desires changed in the12 system or is your role basically13 administrative?14
Our role is very15 administrative. We really are not on the16 scene to deal with the dispatch of the17 towers. Our role is to take any18 applications, to make sure that the19 information that's required on the20 application is filled out and to prepare21 lists for distribution to the Police22 Department.23
Deputy Mayor24 Gillison, constantly we get complaints or25 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 at least input from the industry2 indicating that the process of bringing3 someone into the rotational system might4 not be as tight as it needs to be. Do5 you anticipate or the Police Department6 anticipate any changes in making someone7 eligible to be part of the rotational8 program?9 DEPUTY
Well, I10 think that that's part of the data that11 we've been collecting over the last12 couple of months to see how we can make13 the program better and to see how we14 might be able to "up" some of the15 standards to make the program better. So16 that may affect eligibility.17 There's a lot of very good18 suggestions that are out and we've been19 in discussion for a number of months, and20 I hope to continue with those discussions21 with you, with other members of Council22 to be able to come up with what we23 believe will be the fairest way to adapt24 the program.25 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 So the short answer to your2 question is yes, but I don't know what3 the exact form that will take at this4 time, but we're still working and working5 forward.6
Thank you.7 Madam Chair, I thank you for8 that opportunity.9 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:10 You're welcome.11 The Chair recognizes12 Councilwoman Sanchez.13
Thank14 you, Madam Chair.15 I wanted to continue the line16 of questioning to Otis in terms of L&I,17 and I don't have a copy of the packet in18 front of me.19 When we talk about the criteria20 for licensing and L&I taking care of the21 administrative role, does that mean that22 we are cross-referencing to ensure people23 have BPT licenses? Is that part of the24 criteria?25 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871
Yes, it is. At2 the initial application for the license,3 there's a requirement that you have a4 business privilege license. We do check5 for that in the initial application6 process.7 As you know, the business8 privilege license is a lifetime license,9 so they're really -- at that point it's10 not renewable, and any renewed license we11 would check at the time of renewal, but12 business privilege licenses are not13 renewed.14
Do we15 check to see if they owe the City any16 taxes?17
Do we20 check to see that their establishment is21 appropriate for what we are licensing22 them to do, their location?23
Appropriate in24 what way? The location?25 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871
If we're2 licensing someone to be part of the tow3 operation, do we know if their physical4 location meets the standards to allow5 them to, one, tow the car and potentially6 store the car?7
The10 Chair recognizes Councilman Kenney for a11 point of information.12
Thank you,13 Madam Chair.14 Councilwoman, the problem with15 the adequacy of the facility is, there's16 no qualifications for the adequacy of the17 facility. There's no requirements for18 the size of a storage lot to be secured19 to any -- so anyone who has a business20 privilege license and does not have to21 prove any facility can get at least22 approved for the rotation tow. The23 problem is is that some of these towers24 will use their business privilege license25 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 to access the rotation tow list without2 having a tow license. So they will3 bypass the Police and L&I process, apply4 under the business privilege license and5 get on the rotation list without a tow6 license or a facility.7 Thank you.8
I wanted9 that on the record, because I think,10 again, going back to the discussion11 around this, there are some regulatory12 things that we could quickly enhance that13 would help us do this.14 (Off-the-record discussion.)15
Say it16 on the record. We're having a public17 discussion.18 DEPUTY
I think23 Councilman Kenney's point is if we know24 the loopholes -- people are using the25 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 loopholes, isn't that a regulatory matter2 that you can quickly resolve, because3 you're the licensee?4
All tow trucks8 have to be licensed in the City. As part9 of the rotational towing, though, the10 only requirement is that you have a11 business license in order to be on the12 rotational tow list. If the truck13 itself, once it's inspected by the Police14 Department, that's a separate entity for15 towing. They're two separate, I guess,16 entities where you have general towing17 and you have rotational towing. The only18 thing we're dealing with here is the19 rotational list, and the application20 process for rotational towing require21 that you have a business license.22
Right.23 And I guess that's my point, because I24 haven't heard in the discussion around25 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 how we're going to enhance -- I'm very2 concerned around this issue of qualifying3 towers, because I think part of the4 problem with the rotational towing is we5 have too many folks on the list, as you6 said, between 87 and 90 folks, and I7 think part of the issue has been how we8 qualify towers, and I think you heard the9 industry at our hearing last week say10 that in other places where this11 rotational towing has worked, it's been12 because the criteria and the bar is set13 higher.14 So is there any plans in15 enhancing the criteria for the licensing?16 Because ultimately we control who is17 licensed. So if there are bad guys out18 there, we're at fault because we're not19 going after them. So I haven't heard us20 talk to -- and I know some of these21 pieces were in Councilman Kenney's bill,22 but a lot of those could be done23 regulatory, and I haven't heard that24 mentioned.25 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 DEPUTY
Thank you,8 Madam President.9 Councilwoman Sanchez, my10 question goes to the same perspective.11 In addition to licensing, what are the12 insurance requirements and/or bonding13 requirements, if you would put that all14 in the answer.15 Thank you, Madam President.16 Thank you, Council Lady.17
The insurance18 requirements for towing is, you need19 $100,000 personal liability insurance,20 $300,000 aggregate amount, $50,00021 property damage and $100,000 garage22 keepers insurance.23
There is no25 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 bonding requirement.2 (Microphone not on.)3
A way of4 ensuring the taxes are being paid by5 the --6
What9 measures are in place to ensure that10 taxes are being paid by all of the 89?11
At the time of12 application, there is a check to see13 whether or not their taxes have been14 paid. That's a Revenue Department's15 function, to give the Department the16 information regarding taxes at the time17 of application. Just like for any18 license, we do a record check or a19 cross-reference with the Revenue20 Department to ascertain whether or not21 there are any taxes owed or if there's an22 agreement between the party and the Law23 Department to pay the taxes.24
Thank you,25 27 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 Madam President.2 Thank you, Council Lady.3
Thank4 you.5 Going back to the issue of the6 qualifying of towers, one of the things7 we heard mentioned at the hearing last8 week was the issue of requiring that9 people be in business for a certain10 amount of time. Again, I guess my issue11 is, last week we had a pretty lively12 discussion. This week I expected for the13 Administration to at least come forward14 and say these are one, two, three, four15 things we can do right away that don't16 require legislation that we're not17 enforcing. So has anything other than18 the dispatch piece changed?19 DEPUTY
Not in20 the last week, Councilwoman. We have21 continued our review of certain internal22 processes. Quite frankly, between last23 week and today, there's been two24 additional meetings about certain25 28 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 suggestions, but obviously one thing that2 I don't want to do is change something3 from week to week without really thinking4 the entire matter through and also being5 able to have an opportunity to talk to6 each of you about your concerns and how7 we can end up working together to meet8 those concerns.9 So the answer is yes, we are10 looking at making some changes to the11 matter. Where we can take action, we12 will. But we want to make sure that we13 just don't do it in a week-to-week,14 almost knee-jerk way. We want to make15 sure we get it done right.16
When you17 say that there have been some meetings,18 are we meeting with some of the industry19 folks as we vet these, or these are20 internal meetings to vet some of the21 suggestions?22 DEPUTY
Some of23 the suggestions have to be vetted first24 to see exactly how our internal folks25 29 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 believe it will work in the long run, and2 then we will actually begin meeting --3 not begin, but continue to meet with4 people from the industry.5 Quite frankly, I've been6 approached by a number of persons in the7 industry who have asked to meet with me8 or members of my staff about certain9 suggestions that they have, and we're10 open to everyone meeting at the same11 time.12
Okay.13 One last thing. I want to get to the14 issue of the Police Department's vehicle15 inspection, because this is actually one16 of the areas that there's some agreement17 is done well. I wondered if for the18 record we can speak to the car19 inspections -- the vehicle inspections20 that we're doing and if there's any21 changes expected in that area.22 LIEUTENANT HEALY: There's no23 anticipated changes, because actually24 what we're doing is actually very good.25 30 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 This was initially an L&I function to2 inspect the trucks, but we all realize3 between the agencies that the Police4 Department had better capacity and5 resources and knew what needed to be part6 of the vehicles.7 So right now the vehicles get8 approved to the general towing -- this is9 just general towing -- go through10 annually through Neighborhood Services, I11 believe, and they're the ones who12 actually do the inspections. It's done13 rather efficiently. The question after14 the fact, people bring in different type15 of towers that aren't part -- like if I16 have a tow truck, I bring in my one truck17 and everything is lined up in order, but18 I also have two pickup trucks that have19 like the winches in the back, which are20 not, but they still have my name on them,21 so when they show up, they look official,22 but they're technically not.23 So we're working, from the24 Police Department's perspective, to come25 31 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 up with an enforcement guide, because2 it's been a little fuzzy for the officers3 on the street, when can they enforce4 things and when they can't, because the5 rotational tow program doesn't kick in6 all the time. So it's really when the7 officer gets on scene, if the cars are8 blocking something and they can't be9 moved, only then can the officers really10 start to enforce the law if anybody is11 violating it. Up to that point,12 technically if a tow truck driver drives13 by and just happens to stop, he's not14 soliciting per se and he didn't violate15 the rotational tow, that's pretty much16 where my officers get struck.17 So we're looking to come up18 with a more bright-line rule for them19 when to enforce from the accident side of20 it. But from the inspection side, they21 do a very good job. They process -- all22 the tow trucks in the City get processed23 through the Police Department24 inspections, and everyone that gets25 32 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 approved for the stickers on the side2 have been approved by the Philadelphia3 Police Department.4
Well,5 one of the things that was clear last6 week in the discussion was the issue of7 the training of the Police Department,8 and you're saying you're coming up with a9 manual. So when we implemented the10 rotational, we didn't do any training for11 the police officers?12 LIEUTENANT HEALY: What I did13 is, personally I put together an14 instructional thing of what the law was,15 what the officers' expectations were, but16 kind of the law of unintended17 consequences were, my officers really --18 they had to get on scene to make the19 determination of whether or not it was or20 was not part of the rotational tow21 program. So, in essence, the towers kind22 of got on to that real quick. They23 realized they needed to get on scene24 prior to the Police Department. So if25 33 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 they moved the car, whether they drug it,2 pushed it, whatever, it was off the side3 of the road and my officer showed up,4 it's not blocking the sidewalk. Now --5
Because6 that takes it from a forced tow to an7 optional tow.8 LIEUTENANT HEALY: Correct.9 And that was some of the things we --10 that the purpose -- or the law was11 actually designed to prevent, it actually12 expedited. So that was the way the law13 is drafted, and that's why I recommend14 maybe tweaking it, so there's a bright15 line when it actually takes effect, like16 upon the dispatch of a police officer17 versus upon the -- because theoretically18 that's a public safety issue. A police19 officer is dispatched and, from my20 perspective, it's a Police Department21 concern at that point whether or not22 something is blocking the sidewalk or23 not, because I need a police officer24 there. Maybe that could be a bright25 34 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 line. That's up for debate, but this way2 here, my officers don't have to make the3 decision when they get on scene. This4 way, we can activate the system much5 sooner. But, like I said, the downside6 of it is, some towers will be going to7 jobs where they won't be needed. So8 that's where we, in tandem, we need to9 work with not only the front end of the10 problem but the wheel on the back end.11 Like I said, if you have a12 person and there's 60 people on one13 wheel, the chances of them getting14 called, very few, but when they do get15 called, now they're getting called to16 jobs that they're not making money off17 of, sooner or later they're going to all18 jump off the wheel, and that's not what19 we want. We want an efficient wheel and20 we just have to balance.21 In the previous Administration,22 this was a very big issue. We initially23 wanted to basically model this program on24 the recovered stolen auto program, which25 35 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 has, I believe, six to eight towers on2 each wheel, making it incredibly3 efficient, but the bottom line is, the4 Administration wanted to open this up for5 businesses, and we didn't want to6 restrict business either, but we're kind7 of balancing now what we've seen as the8 inefficiency of having such large wheels9 and we need to kind of retool.10 So we've learned from11 experience that the large wheel isn't12 working, despite the efforts or the13 motive behind it. We are going to have14 to restrict it somehow, and I think15 administratively through regulations, it16 would be the way to go. But that was the17 most contentious part of the previous18 Administration, is we wanted the smaller19 wheel initially because we knew what20 would work, but everybody wanted it open21 to everyone, and that's caused a problem.22 So we need to somehow balance23 the two, and that's what we're in the24 process of doing.25 36 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871
In2 addition to the copies that Otis is3 providing us on the L&I protocols, I'd be4 interested to see what the Police -- you5 said you put a packet together. Because6 this isn't rocket science and it doesn't7 have to be as complicated as it's become,8 and part of the reason it's become9 complicated is because we've allowed some10 loopholes. And obviously the industry is11 ahead of us on this, but to me it would12 appear that if we did a basic script on13 an accident scene, assuming we tweaked14 the legislation to institute the law15 quicker, can we do that locally or is16 that at the state, on the accident scene17 on the towing rotation? Is that an18 amendment that would have to go on19 Rizzo's initial legislation?20 DEPUTY
Yes.21 That would have to be -- it's a local22 ordinance, so it would be within the23 power of City Council to act on.24
So one25 37 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 of -- that's one of the things being2 reviewed right now.3 DEPUTY
There's4 a lot of different things that we're5 reviewing. There's a lot of suggestions,6 and I think that we're all working7 together to try and improve the program8 in order to make sure whatever we do, it9 answers the problem and it answers the10 questions that are out there. And we11 always have to kind of look at the law of12 unintended consequences as well to kind13 of think through.14 The good thing is, we've had15 some experience now and we can see how to16 tweak this and how to -- or make some17 changes that, in a major way, will help18 us get to where we need to go. But I19 think that we need to just continue to20 work together to get there.21
Okay. I22 have some additional questions, but I'll23 let my colleagues and I'll come back.24
Point of25 38 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 information.2
The3 Chair recognizes Councilman Rizzo for a4 point of information.5
I just want6 to go back a few years. When we first7 initially passed this legislation in '05,8 it was very, very stringent. Matter of9 fact, there were requirements for10 storage. To become eligible for the11 rotational towing system was very, very12 stringent. You really had a guideline13 that you had to follow to even become14 eligible. But because we did not want to15 knock out a lot of people that were in16 this industry, many of my colleagues said17 please could we amend this legislation to18 allow everyone to be involved, and,19 again, I think that that also was a20 mistake, that we allowed too many people21 without the appropriate credentials to22 become part of this program.23 One of the other things people24 have asked is the fact that there is no25 39 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 flow for a person that would like to file2 a compliment or a complaint. To this3 day, if I had to tell someone who do they4 call if they feel as though they were5 abused by a tower, who do they call?6 DEPUTY
And that's14 information that's in our packet as well.15 If there are any complaints related to16 towing, they're directed to contact 311.17 That would be the resource where they18 would have the information recorded. Any19 complaints that would come in would be20 recorded. They will send it out to the21 proper agency for response, and they22 would be given a tracking number so they23 could follow up on the complaint.24
Could you25 40 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 for our record tell me -- and if you're2 not prepared to do it at the moment --3 how many complaints have we gotten?4 DEPUTY
I'm not5 prepared. I'd have to provide that to6 the Chair.7
I realize8 you wouldn't be prepared. That's why I9 said -- but I would like you to come10 back, Mr. Haigler, or whoever the11 appropriate, 311, to let us know how many12 complaints they've gotten and how they've13 been adjudicated.14 Thank you, Madam Chair.15 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:16 You're welcome.17 The Chair recognizes Councilman18 Kenney.19
Thank you,20 Madam President, and thank you to21 Councilman Rizzo for asking for this22 hearing and for everyone who is here23 today, because this issue is, in the24 scheme of things, probably moderately to25 41 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 more important than the average issue,2 because it affects people's consumer3 rights and public safety, and this issue4 has been going on for quite some time and5 it's multi-faceted. It has issues6 relative to application, to inspection,7 to qualification, to the establishment of8 the rotation tow list, to the dispatch,9 to the list.10 But, Mr. Haigler, in the end,11 does L&I mind giving up the application12 process for tow licensing? Do you have13 some other buildings that may be14 teetering or tottering or other issues15 you may want to deal with rather than16 inspecting -- or taking applications for17 tow truck licenses? Because we've had18 these discussions before, and L&I has19 been very clear that they don't mind20 giving it up.21
What we24 talked about before?25 42 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871
Why don't4 you nudge the guy to your right and see5 if he's at liberty. We've had these6 discussions.7 DEPUTY
We10 recognize the length and breadth of the11 issues facing L&I, and licensing tow12 trucks seems to be kind at the bottom of13 the pile.14 DEPUTY MAYOR GILLISON:15 Councilman, as you know, we've had a lot16 of discussions about where we're going to17 come out on this and where we end up.18 Whether it's L&I or not, I think it will19 be part of a general fix on this20 particular issue.21
Let me ask22 if you're at liberty, the Police23 Department on the other side, the24 right -- check our liberties to see if25 43 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 we're allowed to answer or not.2 Truck Enforcement, what is the3 mission of Truck Enforcement, the main4 mission of Truck Enforcement?5 LIEUTENANT HEALY: Highway6 safety.7
Highway8 safety. And what are some of the things9 that Truck Enforcement does to ensure10 highway safety?11 LIEUTENANT HEALY: They make12 sure that the trucks that are operating13 through Philadelphia are --14
Not tow18 trucks.19 LIEUTENANT HEALY: All trucks.20 COUNCILMAN KENNEY. No. I'm21 saying but --22 LIEUTENANT HEALY: Oh,23 non-trucks? The weight class, make sure24 they're properly weighted, not25 44 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 overweighted in some form.2
Safety3 issues on the trucks themselves?4 LIEUTENANT HEALY: All safety5 issues.6
Appropriate9 lighting, covers for the debris on the10 demolition trucks, all those kind of11 things?12 LIEUTENANT HEALY: Correct,13 everything.14
Do you know15 the average fine for an overweight truck?16 LIEUTENANT HEALY: I don't17 know.18
I've19 heard --20 LIEUTENANT HEALY: It goes by21 weight.22
I've heard23 some of the numbers and they're pretty24 astounding. I was surprised at how high25 45 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 they are. I've heard anywhere from 8 to2 10 to 12 to 15 thousand dollars a stop.3 LIEUTENANT HEALY: I don't know4 particularly. I know they go up by5 class, just like a speeding ticket goes6 up by how fast you're driving.7
But they're8 pretty substantial fines.9 LIEUTENANT HEALY: They're very10 substantial.11
How many12 people are in Truck Enforcement?13 LIEUTENANT HEALY: I don't14 know. I can get back to you on that.15
I think16 there's eight.17 LIEUTENANT HEALY: There's not18 a lot.19
Eight or20 ten.21 Do you know what percentage of22 time the members of Truck Enforcement23 spend inspecting the safety of tow trucks24 in the City?25 46 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 LIEUTENANT HEALY: I believe2 they do it annually when the new3 licensing. How long that takes? A4 couple weeks, I believe.5
Percentage,6 what percentage of their time?7 LIEUTENANT HEALY: I don't8 know.9
But is it10 safe to say that if they weren't doing11 that, they would be out weighing and12 inspecting trucks on the highway?13 LIEUTENANT HEALY: There's an14 opportunity, yeah, of course.15
If they16 didn't have that role to play, they would17 be out on the highway potentially writing18 10, 15 thousand dollar fines as opposed19 to inspecting tow trucks.20 LIEUTENANT HEALY: Potentially,21 yes.22
The23 implementation and creation of the24 rotation system and the dispatch, again,25 47 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 is something that comes down to the2 ability for us to appropriately provide3 the personnel. Right now the dispatch of4 a rotation tower to an accident scene is5 done by whom?6 LIEUTENANT HEALY: Police7 radio.8
And how11 many folks in 911 are assigned to12 dispatch tow trucks to accident scenes?13 LIEUTENANT HEALY: Well, no one14 is specifically assigned. It's the15 divisional dispatcher. So the wheels are16 broken up by division. So if you're in17 the East Division, it would be whatever18 is on that wheel to dispatch or just look19 up the next name, and if you're20 dispatching an accident, you'd also now21 dispatch that, too.22
Who makes23 the telephone call?24 LIEUTENANT HEALY: Pardon me?25 48 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871
Who makes2 the phone call?3 LIEUTENANT HEALY: The4 dispatcher.5
So the6 dispatcher gets the information, picks up7 the phone, dials the tow company?8 LIEUTENANT HEALY: Correct.9
Gives them10 the information, whatever information11 they take back, and dispatches the truck?12 LIEUTENANT HEALY: Correct.13
Why?14 LIEUTENANT HEALY: That's the15 system we have.16
Does it17 seem, considering the volume of calls18 that 911 receives in a year, that I19 should have anybody from any divisional20 desk taking a telephone and calling a tow21 truck to send it to an accident scene?22 Does it seem the best use of that23 dispatcher's resources?24 Deputy Mayor Gillison?25 49 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 DEPUTY
I would2 suggest that the answer to that question3 is, it's part of the efficiencies of what4 we do in the Department. I mean, a5 dispatcher is going to have to make a6 call, and whether we call one person or7 call three people, we're there to do the8 job.9 And so I understand the point10 should a dispatcher make the call to a11 tow truck or should it maybe go to12 another person or party.13
I'm not14 even suggesting where it should go. I'm15 just asking --16 DEPUTY
-- from a19 stretched city's resources, a stretched20 L&I and a stretched 911 system, wouldn't21 I want to maybe move those items22 somewhere else? I'm not saying where in23 government, because I don't want to bring24 up the dreaded words, but I just want to25 50 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 say somewhere else in government so that2 a busy East Division desk on a Saturday3 night, one or two dispatchers are not4 making telephone calls to tow truck5 operators. That seems reasonable?6 DEPUTY
We're7 always open to trying to find8 efficiencies anywhere and everywhere, and9 that would be something we can also talk10 about.11
But12 let's -- these are the administrative and13 enforcement issues relative to getting14 into the system. Let's get into what the15 system and the argument is all about,16 because since we started this whole trek17 in dealing with this new iteration of18 legislation, I've come to the conclusion19 that the main argument, the main rub, has20 very little to do with L&I or the Police21 or the rotation list. It has to do with22 the storage of vehicles. It comes down23 totally to the storage of vehicles, and24 that's where the rub is. And the problem25 51 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 4 Now, I just want to read a5 letter that was a response to Councilman6 Rizzo's inquiry, I assume, relative to7 this resolution from GEICO. It's dated8 October 22nd. 12 GEICO is the sixth largest13 private passenger auto insurer in14 Pennsylvania and the third largest in the15 country. 19 While towing expenses are often20 initially paid by insurers, consumers21 ultimately bear the brunt of excessive22 fees in the form of higher premiums. We23 applaud the Council's ongoing efforts to24 protect Philadelphia consumers by25 52 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 8 The current ordinance 9-605 is9 commonly ignored by Philadelphia towers10 due to non-enforcement. 15 Towers regularly charge storage16 fees that exceed the $25 limit under this17 code. 22 This is what it is. 24 It is about who gets the car. Because we25 53 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 have a system that does not require a2 specified location to take the car, it's3 wide open. I have compared it in many4 ways to tuna fishing on the Pacific. The5 tuna boat goes out and the tuna boat6 picks up a nice new Lexus that's smashed7 up on the drive and now we take the tuna8 around and we sell it to the highest9 restaurant, the highest body shop. If10 the car is required -- I don't care what11 the rotation system looks like. I don't12 care who inspects the trucks. If the car13 is required to be taken to an impoundment14 lot controlled by the government, then15 the pristine nature of the car in its16 condition, damaged or not, will be17 insured. 23 In the recent tow surveys by GEICO, 9024 percent included an administrative fee,25 54 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 56 percent included a winching fee, 492 percent included a gate fee, 19 percent3 included a garage keeper fee. 20 Unless that little green gecko works for21 the Parking Authority, which I would have22 to confirm that he doesn't because I'm23 not sure, possibly he could, but24 considering that, but unless the gecko25 55 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 works for the Parking Authority, this is2 a pretty clear indictment of the system3 that we're dealing with now. It is4 inflated, overcharged and gouging, and it5 serves no one. And the real problem here6 in the whole debate, last week and this7 week, has to do with the storage of the8 car. 19
Thank20 you.21 The Chair recognizes22 Councilwoman Miller.23
Thank24 you. Thank you, Madam Chair.25 56 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 I'm actually going to ask some2 questions about rotation towing, because3 that's what the hearing is about, because4 I think that's where it starts. I mean,5 if there's a problem with rotation towing6 and then wherever the car ends up, such7 as in Councilman Kenney's bill, we need8 to -- I think the purpose of the hearing9 is to take a look at the rotational10 towing issues and how we can make them11 better.12 Deputy Mayor Gillison, I have a13 question, because I think that some of14 this is an assumption that everybody15 knows what the problems are with the16 towing industry, and we all don't. And17 in your testimony, your last sentence18 states that, "We know certain tow19 operators fail to accept credit cards for20 payment, fail to provide safe and secure21 storage," and I understand that.22 Does the lack of -- does their23 inability to accept a credit card, what24 does that indicate about the tower? I25 57 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 mean, is this a convenience or does it2 impact public safety?3 DEPUTY
Well,4 actually, public safety can be impacted5 in two ways. One is that if there is6 a -- if they don't accept credit card7 payments, it goes to the nature of the8 business and the permanency, quite9 frankly, of the business. So it's one of10 the things that we use as a criteria or11 at least just finding some insight into12 how to judge the business that we're13 dealing with.14 So it is a convenience, but it15 also can tell you a lot more about the16 business, and I know that that's part and17 parcel of the evaluation that L&I does.18 It's part and parcel of the evaluation19 that we're looking at to see how we can20 help make some changes to require certain21 additions. So it's not just convenience,22 but it also impacts safety overall.23
Okay. Is24 your mike on?25 58 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 DEPUTY
That's4 better, much better. Okay.5 And this question, I guess, is6 either for you or for L&I. Can you7 explain the current process that a tow8 truck company has to go through in order9 to get on the rotational list?10 DEPUTY
I11 believe that Mr. Haigler explained that12 and he actually passed out the packet.13
That16 pretty much details everything that they17 have to do.18
It's good19 when we get it, but if we get it during20 the course of the hearing, you don't21 really have time to read it.22 DEPUTY
I'll be happy to24 explain it again. It's not a problem.25 59 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 Anybody desiring to be on the2 rotational list, they contact our3 department. If they're a licensed tower,4 they are given a packet. In that packet5 includes the application. They have to6 complete the application. And also7 within that packet includes the consumer8 bill of rights. That's a requirement9 that's in the regulation that they have10 to be given that.11 They also are given a letter12 from the Commissioner detailing what the13 requirements are for rotational towing,14 that there are six rotational towing15 areas, that you can be placed on four16 lists, but the list that you're on, it17 has to be contiguous, where if you are on18 a list, it has to be right next to19 another area. It can't be one area of20 the City and then all the way to the21 opposite end of the City on another list.22 They're given requirements. In23 that packet it also includes what the24 fees are, what the fees are you're25 60 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 allowed to charge for towing, as well as2 storage. Other requirements are in that3 packet. There's frequently asked4 questions, a fact sheet in there as to5 certain questions that might be asked and6 some of the answers to those questions.7 It's pretty comprehensive.8
And we check to10 see whether or not, once you complete the11 application, you have to -- there's a12 place on there for your business license13 number. We check to see whether or not14 that is a valid business license number.15 And there was questions that were asked16 before about taxes and those types of17 issues. We coordinate with the Revenue18 Department to make sure that the taxes19 are taken care of or at least you have an20 agreement to take care of the taxes at21 the time of the application.22
So last23 week when we had our hearing, I know that24 you've broken the City down into, I'll25 61 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 just use the word, zones. If you only2 have one tow truck, can you be on the3 list, and if you are, does it mean that4 you can only tow within a certain zone?5
All8 right. Good.9 About how many accidents do we10 have a day?11
About how14 many auto accidents do we have a day that15 needs a tow?16 DEPUTY MAYOR GILLISON:17 Councilwoman, we would have to get back18 to you on the approximation, but we feel19 that it's about 700 accidents thus far in20 the last ten months. So we'd have to do21 just an approximation to see what that22 comes down to.23
I just24 ask that question because last week when25 62 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 people were in, they said -- some people2 said they hadn't been called, and I3 believe some towers were called more4 frequently, a lot more frequently than5 others, and with 87 folks on the list,6 then I was wondering why some people7 never got called.8 LIEUTENANT HEALY: Ma'am,9 Lieutenant Healy from the Police10 Department. If I could answer that very11 quickly. I asked that very same question12 this morning to some of my radio folks,13 and basically the answer is this:14 There's 87 people, but they're not all on15 the same list. Some wheels are six16 wheels around the City, just like there17 are divisions, six police divisions. The18 wheels correspond with every geographical19 police division.20 Some wheels may have 20 on21 them, some may have ten. The bottom22 line, some may have 60. Depending upon23 what wheel you're on, it depends on how24 often you're called. And, more25 63 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 importantly, I asked, Well, what2 happens -- you have to understand,3 there's a time limit of them to respond4 in 20 minutes. That's part of -- you5 want to be part of the program? There's6 no restrictions, no limitations. If you7 have a tow license, all you do is fill8 out the application and you're on the9 list. There's no additional requirements10 other than you're promising that you'll11 show up within 20 minutes. We need you12 to show up in 20 minutes. Basically you13 promise that, you're part of the program.14 The problem is sometimes when15 we call, if we get a voice mail or if we16 don't get -- if it rings a certain number17 of times, we hang up and go to the next18 one. This is a public service emergency,19 so we can't sit here and leave messages20 for people. So a lot of times these21 people on the list, if they're smaller22 players and if they don't have a live23 person answering the phone, that could go24 to their detriment. So if I don't get a25 64 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 live person, I need a tow truck en route,2 I'll go right to the next person on the3 list if you don't answer.4 So that's the reason why some5 people have been passed. And what I just6 asked this morning, I said, is there a7 possible way to let me know how many8 times certain people have been passed9 over and for what reasons.10 So I'm trying to get that11 report now to figure out -- so I do agree12 there's some problems, but if you're on a13 list with 60 people or 30 people, your14 likelihood of being called is less than15 if you're on a smaller list. And some16 people that are on a list may have four17 and five trucks, so they can respond18 quicker and they get more jobs.19 So it's not a perfect system,20 and that's where we're trying to fix the21 wheel. The wheels are really too22 unwieldy right now to actually manage,23 and that was some of the problems when we24 initially started the program, but we25 65 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 opened it up and it's time to tweak it2 and it's time to fix it and make it3 better. But the bottom line, originally4 everybody wanted to be -- it should be5 open to everyone and anyone who has a tow6 license should be able to participate,7 but we're seeing from experience that's8 not necessarily the most efficient model.9 So we're looking to balance the10 efficiency with the right of the business11 owners to participate, and that's what12 we're trying to work out now.13
Okay.14 Well, that's why I asked the question,15 because I want to thoroughly understand16 the actual problem. So I'm glad for your17 explanation. Thank you.18 What is the penalty if, say, a19 driver just doesn't show up? You've20 called him, they've responded and they21 don't show up. Are there any penalties?22 LIEUTENANT HEALY: According to23 the program, you can be dropped from the24 rotational tow program. That's part of25 66 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 the administrative stuff that L&I would2 actually be responsible for. We would3 notify them. They would give them a4 warning letter, and that is an5 administrative burden. But they could be6 dropped from the rotational list. That's7 a penalty.8
And if it's three9 infractions, I believe -- I think that's10 what the criteria is, if there's three11 infractions, then they're removed from12 the list.13
Okay.14 That's it. Thank you.15 Thank you.16 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:17 You're welcome.18 The Chair recognizes Councilman19 Jones.20
Thank you,21 Madam President.22 Still morning. Good morning.23 DEPUTY
We have a3 reality TV show called, what is it,4 Parking Wars, and I saw something on5 Lifetime with wreck chasers, Scavengers,6 or something like that. There's no7 reality TV show being planned for tow8 truck drivers, is there?9 AUDIENCE MEMBER: Yes.10
There is?11 There actually is?12 AUDIENCE MEMBER: I can't wait.13
This is14 amazing to me.15 So this has obviously captured16 the imagination of not just this Council17 but a wide audience of viewers. But I18 have a couple of questions.19 In the process of the rotation,20 it's my understanding that from time to21 time a tow truck driver will be on the22 scanner and then jump ahead. What is the23 penalty and/or fine for doing that24 infraction, jumping ahead of somebody,25 68 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 getting to the scene before the actual2 rotation driver is there? Is there a3 penalty?4 DEPUTY MAYOR GILLISON:5 Councilman, Everett Gillison, Deputy6 Mayor for Public Safety.7 There's two things in order to8 answer your question. One, you have to9 remember that it has to be part of the10 rotational tow first. So that11 determination currently has to be made on12 the scene by the officer.13 If it is a rotational tow and14 someone tries to, quote/unquote, jump in15 and take the vehicle over top of that,16 that is about a thousand-dollar fine that17 can be written up at the time and to be18 given at that point. But the issues that19 we detailed earlier about trying to20 figure out whether or not once the21 officer gets to the scene, securing the22 scene, determining whether it is a23 rotation tow, all of those other things24 have to be addressed before we could25 69 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 actually get to that point.2
I don't5 believe there have been any, but I will6 have to ensure. But from what I7 understood, I do not believe that there8 were -- there was not one that was9 written.10
That piques11 my interest as to why. I mean, we tend12 to do this, we put laws on the books that13 we don't or can't or won't enforce, which14 suggests to me that we need to look at15 that particular aspect of it. And then16 the question I have is, does the state17 have any mirroring regulations regarding18 tow truck drivers in the other counties19 around the state? Does the state govern20 this at all?21 DEPUTY
The22 state regulates different aspects of what23 goes on here in Philadelphia. I mean,24 obviously you know that the state is the25 70 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 one that provides towing off of 76 and2 the highways.3
Has anybody4 analyzed their regs and how closely do we5 mirror what they do in the surrounding6 counties? Has there been an analysis of7 that?8 DEPUTY
That would11 be number two issue I'd like this body to12 at least get some information on.13 And has anyone done an analysis14 of -- and I think -- let me just first go15 on the record saying that not just16 because of the reality TV shows, but the17 reality of everyday citizens having to18 deal with this, that this is a good19 process, no matter how painful it is to20 go through all these hearings, but out of21 it may come some good.22 But I'd like to know, has an23 analysis been done on the cost benefit of24 all of these proposed changes from one25 71 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 side to the other, from a private sector2 kind of addressing of a consumer need of3 tows to a more regulated analysis by the4 Parking Authority? Who wins? Who loses?5 And what does the treasury of the City of6 Philadelphia stand to gain?7 If you look at that we have a8 law on the book that says that if someone9 jumps ahead of another person, that's a10 thousand dollars and we're not collecting11 it, what does this mean? Any of these12 shifts have a budgetary impact from who13 has to enforce it, who is employed to do14 so and who loses a job in the private15 sector? Has anybody kind of looked at16 that to determine where these shifts will17 have us?18 DEPUTY
That's19 all a part of the analysis that we are20 doing and have been vetting with not only21 members of Council but also internally to22 see how what any changes, from increased23 training to increased MDT, MDT sending24 them out from both Police and Fire, what25 72 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 the various costs are of doing something2 like that, what is the cost of changing3 some of the regulations. I mean, we4 really wanted to take a comprehensive5 look at how to get it done, what's the6 cost, what's the benefit to the City and7 where do you come down in trying to8 improve the situation that where we are9 at present.10 So, yes, we are doing that.11 That's why there hasn't been an12 immediate, quote/unquote, fix put in.13 It's really more of a deliberative14 process that we are engaging in and15 engaging with partnerships all over.16
So number17 one is service to the public.18 DEPUTY MAYOR GILLISON:19 Absolutely. And the public safety.20
Safety of21 the public.22 DEPUTY MAYOR GILLISON:23 Absolutely.24
But also as25 73 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 we start to peel the layers of -- and I2 think Councilman Kenney said it best,3 that it's a multi-layered issue. One of4 those layers is where following the money5 and the change, cause and effect, of6 where those dollars wind up is something7 I'd be interested in taking a look at.8 DEPUTY
And so9 will we. We'll share everything that10 comes up obviously, and we thank you very11 much.12
We are15 trying to move as quickly as possible. I16 know that there's a lot of suggestions17 that we've made to various parties, and18 I'm hoping to continue that discussion.19 I don't have a set timetable. There are20 some hurdles to any of this. It is21 complex, but the sooner that we can22 resolve this, the better for all of us, I23 believe.24
Thank you,25 74 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 Madam President.2
Thank3 you.4 The Chair recognizes5 Councilwoman Brown.6
Thank you,7 Madam President.8 Good morning, gentlemen.9 DEPUTY
Much12 discussion has been given to the rotation13 process. I'm curious to know about where14 many of these cars ultimately land, where15 they get stored, of which Councilman16 Kenney gave great detail. So to Curtis17 Jones' recommendation, has any analysis18 been done to see what percentage of the19 89 actually own the lots where they're20 taking these cars?21 DEPUTY
I don't22 know that offhand, Councilwoman, but --23 LIEUTENANT HEALY: Very24 quickly, the answer is no. The25 75 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 requirement of having a lot was taken2 away from the initial design of this3 program. So you don't need a lot. I4 mean, you could contract with someone or5 theoretically you could put it in front6 of an auto body shop. Therein lies some7 of the problems that we see.8
Yes. So9 you go exactly to where I'm headed, and,10 that is, there may be indeed different11 incentive for those who own the lots and12 how they treat their customers that they13 see, consumers that they have out or meet14 out on the street, and those who don't15 have lots who are inspired for a16 different set of reasons, if you will,17 for the consumers that they're dealing18 with.19 So I think in the analysis,20 that would be useful to know, useful to21 know that information, number one. And,22 number two, what requirements exist for23 those lot owners, given the list of fees24 that persons are charged? Are those fees25 76 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 universal? Are they uniform across the2 system of the 89?3 LIEUTENANT HEALY: Well, the4 fees, when you're taken as part of this5 program, are set by statute. Now, here's6 the problem: The statute takes effect7 theoretically when a car is blocking a8 sidewalk or a highway, but if no one is9 there to figure out whether or not it's10 actually blocking it, who makes that11 determination? It's the police officer12 when he gets there.13 Now, if a tow truck gets there14 before I do, police officer, and takes it15 and pushes it off to the side, I get16 there, the car is not blocking the17 sidewalk, then it's now a consensual18 situation that the tow fees and the19 situation, all those exorbitant fees,20 that's a private contract between a21 businessowner and a person that the City22 has no right to deal with. That's why we23 have the rotational system. It's a24 public emergency service, and based upon25 77 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 that is the only reason why we can2 legally set fees. So that's why we want3 cars in these situations to be4 incorporated or encapsulated into this5 program to protect the consumer, but it6 also helps the police officer clear the7 scene as quickly as possible.8
Sure.9 Sure. And to further protect the10 consumer, it's useful to know if where11 they're taking the car, if they have an12 L&I license, do they have insurance, are13 they bonded, or are they just a shoddy14 operation and everything that comes with15 that.16 LIEUTENANT HEALY: Originally17 the vision of this program, we modeled it18 on the recovered stolen auto program,19 which has lot requirements, lot size20 requirements, insurance requirements, for21 that very same reason. If someone's car22 gets stolen, we recover it, we put it in23 a secure lot so it doesn't get re-stolen,24 vandalized more. So we put it in a25 78 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 secure lot. To be a member of that2 program, you have to have all of those3 requirements, which are above and beyond4 just a tow license. That's what we5 wanted originally here, but what it did6 is, it cut out too many small players,7 and we understood that and we tried to8 come up with a happy compromise, and it9 just didn't sell. So we basically opened10 the door to everyone, and what we're11 seeing now is that we need to re-tweak12 that. And I think administratively13 through the Deputy Mayor's office, we're14 going to revisit that idea, but I'm sure15 many of the small players that get cut16 out will be calling you and your --17
So then18 the further challenge of the team of you19 all that work this magic, so to speak, is20 to figure out a common ground where you,21 for those small players that are doing22 the right thing, trying to feed their23 families, that they are kept whole while24 we deal with the rotten apples. And so25 79 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 enforcement, I think, becomes a factor in2 this as well. Like of those lots where3 these cars are taken, what enforcement,4 what review is done of those lots to5 ensure that on every four year -- we have6 to renew our license every four years.7 Are they looked at every four years to8 make sure they're in compliance? I don't9 know the answer to that, but those type10 of oversight operations, it seems to me11 based on what I'm learning, have to be12 instituted to get rid of the bad apples.13 DEPUTY MAYOR GILLISON:14 Councilwoman, you've hit on a number of15 matters that are correct, and we agree16 with you, and that's why this entire17 process is one that requires us to make18 sure that we anticipate where we want to19 go and what we're trying to do and, at20 the same time, balance the various21 interests that are going on here. So we22 agree.23
Okay. So24 then let me underscore, while we look25 80 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 very carefully at the rotation part of2 this equation, let's also look at where3 these cars are ending up --4 DEPUTY
-- to7 ensure that they are legitimate and8 honoring whatever you have in place9 around standards, et cetera.10 DEPUTY
Thank you.13 Thank you, Madam President.14 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:15 You're welcome.16 The Chair recognizes Councilman17 Kenney.18
24 Again, I don't want to get into another25 81 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 piece of legislation, and I won't, but at2 this point now, we don't have the3 wherewithal to inspect those private lots4 and to make sure that they're doing what5 they're supposed to be doing, and in an6 effort to be as expansive as possible in7 who could be on the rotation tow, we8 unwittingly let ourselves in or expanded9 the opportunities for these people who10 don't have lots to take these cars11 directly to body shops. And understand12 the body shop dynamic, and it varies13 based on the age of the car, the luxury14 value of the car, whether the car is good15 for parts, whether the car is good for a16 good insurance settlement. You take a17 pretty expensive luxury car to a body18 shop, you're going to get 15, 2 thousand19 dollars cash for the get-go of that, so20 that that person ensures that that body21 shop gets that car and does that22 insurance fee, does that insurance claim23 and gets paid. 25 82 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 On the older cars where the car2 may be not worth as much as a Lexus or3 Mercedes or BMW, but it's a car that is4 needed for parts and it may be5 underinsured, so the car only has minimum6 liability insurance. So the owner has it7 smashed up, I'm not coming to get it. So8 in addition to racking up the storage9 fees, which never may be paid, there's10 another process after a certain number of11 months where the lot owner files a piece12 of paper with PennDOT and winds up owning13 the car. Now, all of the individual14 parts of that car are part and parcel of15 the profit. 17 My concern with having a18 secure, consistent storage, whether you19 like the people, whether you like the20 entity that's storing the cars or not --21 and nobody likes them anyway -- at least22 I know where they are. I know that23 they're not in the corner being24 sledge-hammered into another $5,000 in25 83 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 insurance damages. I know that they're2 not being rifled through and ripped off3 inside the car. I know that when AAA4 comes or the dealer comes or the5 appointed body shop person that the owner6 wants comes, it's going to be released7 without a fight, it's going to be8 released without 3, 4 hundred dollars in9 fees. Because, remember, when the body10 shop guy has your car and you don't want11 him to have it and your brother-in-law12 has a body shop and you send his tow13 truck to get it, there's like a little14 battle there. 16 I think we can get rid of all17 of the storage issue by having one entity18 that's licensed by the government or19 maybe is the government to do the20 storage. And as far as -- if my intent21 of my bill was to get the Parking22 Authority the world, I would have gave23 them the towing. I would have got the24 private people out. But I said, as we25 84 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 talked when we were developing the2 legislation, let's keep the private3 people in so they can do the tow, but4 they have to take it to one specific5 consistent place, and that's really where6 we were and where we are in this. 9 As far as the Police are10 concerned, I feel somewhat sorry for them11 and sometimes angry at them on the scene,12 because they're really not given13 direction that they need to make the14 decisions, and sometimes they may be out15 there free-lancing. Who knows. 19 If you show up on the scene of20 an accident without being designated21 there, you're in violation, and that22 police officer will now know to issue a23 fine the first time, the second time, and24 the third time your license is suspended25 85 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. There are no fines. I was telling some of my colleagues5 recently, I was sitting at an6 intersection at 7th and Packer about a7 month ago and I saw a blue streak coming8 from my east to west.
It was going --9 and I'm not a police officer, I can't10 gauge the speed, but it was going faster11 than the speed limit, I can tell you12 that, and it was barreling frighteningly,13 blew the light at 7th, blew the light at14 10th. And I was on my way to the Navy15 Yard, so by the time I got to the Navy16 Yard, there was an accident with17 injuries, which means that they monitor18 fire radio, because MDTs now preclude19 them listening to the police radio. 22 So now I have two blown lights,23 probably the third blown at Broad Street24 and a couple blown lights down Broad, and25 86 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 the truck that was barreling down Packer2 was sitting there. 6 But it's just -- it's the wild west. And7 it's not -- you know, people say this8 whole issue got raised because people9 shooting each other and people were10 killed and arguing over cars. 14 So I appreciate the15 Administration's ongoing look at this16 situation. 22
Thank23 you.24 Any other questions from25 87 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 members of the Committee?2 (No response.)3 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:4 Mr. Gillison, do you mind waiting until5 after the hearing, please.6 DEPUTY
Ronald W. Kosh,11 Vice-President, Public and Government12 Affairs, AAA Mid-Atlantic, please.13 (Witnesses approached witness14 table.)15
Good16 morning. Kindly identify yourself for17 the record and proceed with your18 testimony.19
Hi. Good morning,20 Madam President and members of City21 Council. My name is Ron Kosh and I'm22 Vice-President of Public Affairs for AAA23 Mid-Atlantic. Councilman Rizzo was24 gracious in extending us an invitation to25 88 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 4 For 110 years, AAA has advanced5 the interest of motorists. Today, at6 least one in every three licensed drivers7 is a AAA member. 24 Had a rotational system signed25 89 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 into law by then-Mayor Street in January2 2008 been implemented as intended, the3 wreck chasing-related incidents that took4 place this past July would likely never5 have happened. 9 AAA views the creation and10 proper execution of a rotational towing11 system as both a safety and a consumer12 issue. 16 Members of the public, including the many17 AAA members and all those others who have18 prepared for emergency situations and19 prepaid for roadside assistance, should20 be able to use their respective provider21 in the event that need arises. They22 should be able to do so as long as their23 vehicle is not unduly obstructing or24 impeding traffic and blocking an25 90 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 intersection. 12 In addition, AAA also wants to13 be certain that the rights of those14 towers who provide service as part of a15 rotational system are protected. If a16 motorist calls AAA or another similar17 organization, of which there are many,18 for emergency roadside assistance and AAA19 or one of our towing contractors who also20 happens to be a participant in the21 rotational system responds, we believe22 that tower should not be penalized by23 then being moved to the bottom of a list24 for responding. Rotational contractors25 91 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 responding to calls for tows outside of2 being dispatched from the rotational list3 should, quote, not lose their place in4 the line. 15 We appreciate the opportunity16 to present our views. 25 92 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871
Thank2 you.3 The Chair recognizes Councilman4 Rizzo.5
Thank you.6 Thanks for taking the time to7 be with us today. In your testimony, and8 I'll quote, had a rotational towing9 system signed into law by then-Mayor10 Street in January 2008 been implemented11 as intended, the wreck casing-related12 incidents that took place likely would13 not have happened.14 Could you point out some of15 the -- and I know you've analyzed this16 very carefully -- some of the areas that17 you believe the rotational system has not18 been implemented based on the legislation19 that passed and signed by the then Mayor.20
Well, I think the21 objective obviously was to use a list22 that for whatever reason -- and a lot, I23 guess, had to do with the fact that how24 that dispatching was taking place.25 93 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 That's now since been addressed by moving2 off of clear radio onto the MDTs. I3 think we've addressed that. The Police4 Department has addressed that very5 effectively.6 I think there are still a lot7 of folks out there who are still8 operating under the other assumption, and9 I think it was pretty aptly described by10 Councilman Kenney a moment ago that11 people are still blowing lights because12 they're still finding a way to get that13 information, whether it's -- since the14 Police have gone off MDT, they're still15 getting it off the fire radios, emergency16 radios. So obviously there's operational17 issues that I think are being addressed18 as time goes on. I think we still have a19 little ways to go there. It's pretty20 obvious from today's testimony earlier.21
Well, I22 think today this hearing is putting a lot23 more ideas out there, and I think that24 this Administration is committed to25 94 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 making this work, whether some storage2 issues need to be changed, but by3 regulation, many of these problems that4 are being discussed today can be dealt5 with, and I think that the tow truck6 operator that operates his vehicle or her7 vehicle recklessly needs to be ticketed8 by the Police Department. Because,9 again, what Councilman Kenney described10 is not a unique situation in our city.11 Tow trucks operate recklessly all the12 time, and I think once there's some rigid13 enforcement on that conduct, the Police14 Department really needs to crack down on15 these people that are conducting their16 businesses in this manner. There's a way17 to get to the scene of an accident if18 they're called, but going through red19 lights and driving down the shoulders of20 roadways recklessly is not the way to do21 it.22
Thank you.25 95 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 Thank you very much, Madam2 President. I appreciate it.3
Thank4 you.5 Any other questions from6 members of the Committee of this witness?7 (No response.)8
The next witness is15 Jose Giral from Derkas Towing.16 (Witnesses approached witness17 table.)18
Good19 morning. Kindly identify yourself for20 the record.21
My name is Jose22 Giral from Derkas Towing, and I'm here in23 support of the towing rotation. I think24 it hasn't had time to completely run25 96 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 efficiently, but I think it's the right2 thing to keep in place.3 I just have a question for the4 Police Department. Is it okay if I ask a5 question?6 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:7 Certainly.8
The towing9 rotation, it's been in place for about10 two years right now, right, more or less,11 right? How long did you go to the MDT?12 LIEUTENANT HEALY: About three13 months ago.14
My question is why15 they started three months ago when the16 rotation system was in effect for two17 years already. That just shows that18 there are some methods that could be put19 in place in order to make the program20 more efficient.21
Hi. Good23 morning. My name is Mikina Harrison, and24 I have a question. Well, I have a25 97 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 statement, but first I have a question2 that I'm not clear on, and it refers to3 what AAA had just spoke about.4 We also do roadside service for5 companies like GEICO and Cross Country6 and different motor clubs, and I'm not7 clear on if the law says that we are8 allowed to tow that car still if it's in9 an accident and not blocking the road or10 if we have to forego that tow because a11 rotational person does it. Is that --12 I'm not clear on that.13
Would14 somebody come up to respond to that15 question, please.16 (Witness approached witness17 table.)18 LIEUTENANT HEALY: Good morning19 again. Lieutenant Healy.20 From my understanding of the21 question is, if a car is not blocking the22 sidewalk or the highway, it's not part of23 the rotational tow program, period. So24 none of the rules and regulations25 98 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 applying to this program apply. It would2 be a consensual agreement between a tower3 and whoever is involved in the accident4 or disabled vehicle, and whatever fees5 and arrangements they made, it's6 irrespective or outside the scope of the7 City.8
Point of9 information.10 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:11 Councilman Rizzo.12
Madam13 President, I want to restate that -- and14 I appreciate what Councilman Kenney was15 trying to communicate, but if a car is16 towed by the rotational tower, it is17 protected by the rules of the18 legislation. It's when a car is hooked19 by other than a rotational tow it's fair20 game. If one of the rotational towers21 tows the car, and a tower is here, will22 be protected by law, fee structure, et23 cetera; am I right?24 LIEUTENANT HEALY: Correct.25 99 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 Correct. That's the heart and soul of2 the rotational tow system, is to quickly3 move cars that are creating a public4 service emergency and quickly move them5 in an efficient manner, and that's what6 the rotational tow system is about. The7 problem with the rotational tow, as I8 testified, is when does it take place,9 when does it kick into place. That's a10 bit of a problem that needs to maybe11 probably be tweaked.12 The thing is, for the officer13 on the street, before he gets there if14 the cars are moved or drug off to the15 side of the road and I get there, does it16 really apply, does the rotational system17 apply? Technically, theoretically, yes,18 it does, but how does the officer that19 comes to that scene enforce that20 provision? How do I know for a fact that21 that car was blocking the sidewalk? So22 what he does, he handles whatever23 paperwork he has to do and goes on to the24 next job.25 100 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 So that's part of the problem2 with where's the bright line, and that's3 what the Police Department has done.4 That's an inherent problem with the5 statute as drafted. It's a minor6 problem, but what we've done is, we've7 taken the very aggressive position of8 creating that bright line. We now assume9 that every call that a police officer is10 dispatched to is a rotational tow. Quite11 honestly, they're not going to be, and12 that's a problem. But this way here, at13 least we got a bright line in the scene.14 When my officers are dispatched, if15 someone else other than who is supposed16 to be there is there, then they're17 actually in violation. But still, even18 that's a little bit of a technical flaw,19 because even though we both get there on20 scene and the cars are -- everybody has21 got four wheels and they roll it to the22 side, I can't then force that tower to23 take that tow or I can't force the24 individual to take that tow, because it's25 101 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 a consensual situation. It's not2 blocking the sidewalk.3 So it is not a perfect system.4 What we've done in the Police Department5 is a temporary fix until we can come up6 with a more permanent and solid solution.7 But we're trying to resolve some of those8 issues administratively, but they are9 problematic, and it's problematic for the10 towers.11 A lot of these towers will be12 going on scene and, like I said, if13 you're the fifth person of the wheel and14 you've only been called in two weeks, you15 get called to a tow and it's not a16 legitimate tow, you don't need to be17 towed, it's kind of a waste of their18 time. But right now it's the best way we19 can do the system until we can work out20 the bugs.21
I just have another25 102 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 statement. I think what's happening is2 basically what -- the Police Department3 and L&I are trying to do this by4 themselves. I think what they need to do5 is sit down with industry, because I've6 been in all these meetings and I never7 sat down with any of these individuals as8 far as to create something that will9 work, because without industry input,10 nothing is going to work.11
And by that I mean14 that maybe these guys should put together15 a task force with Police Department, L&I,16 Managing Director's Office and also17 industry to try to resolve some of these18 issues, because they've been resolved in19 other places, similar issues.20 LIEUTENANT HEALY: If I may21 very quickly, when this legislation was22 first passed, Councilman Rizzo did23 convene meetings with all the players and24 all the stakeholders, and we went back25 103 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 and forth for quite some time creating2 what we created, and I think it's a great3 testament to everybody coming together4 that we did get it done, because there5 were a lot of conflicting interests and6 people had different points of views to7 how this program should be run. The fact8 that it's not working as we planned does9 not mean we didn't participate or we10 didn't try.11 I think the meetings and the12 efforts we're doing today with the13 Department and through legislature14 recognizes some of the minor problems15 that we've addressed and we need to16 address them and we're on the right page.17 We're all on the right page. But we did18 include industry. Industry was included.19 I don't know if the gentleman was20 included personally, but, like I said, we21 did the best we could to include22 industry, because we understand the23 towers are the heart and soul of this24 program. We need good, honest towers to25 104 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 be a part of the rotational system for2 this to work. And the problem is,3 there's some players out there that4 aren't such, and that's the problem. But5 nonetheless, I think administratively and6 collaboratively with City Council we will7 come up with a good resolution.8
Finally, my9 statement is, I agree with this gentleman10 right here. There are a lot of dishonest11 towers. And my company is one of the12 honest towers and we have a one-acre lot13 and I insure a small number of trucks,14 six, and when we do roadside service and15 tows, we have to -- we actually asked16 GEICO to write a lot of those letters17 that Councilman Kenney referred to,18 because what happens is, the wreck19 chasers do get the car first and they're20 supposed to come to our lot because we're21 contracted with that person that was in22 the accident through GEICO, and we have23 to then pay a fee for GEICO because they24 have to release the car to us, and25 105 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 sometimes it's 700, 800 dollars and the2 tow is not even 24 hours old.3 So I agree that it's a bad --4 some of the people in the business are5 bad and they do bad practices, but we all6 should not be punished for those actions7 of those individuals. They should be8 fined, fined highly actually, but we9 should not have to send the car to an10 assigned lot. I have a secured lot and11 I'm capable of not causing damage to a12 car that's stored on my lot and -- I13 mean, that's basically what I wanted to14 say.15
Madam22 President, thank you.23 I am in receipt of a fax24 transmission. This is for the record.25 106 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 The witness indicated that GEICO sent us2 a communication, so I'd like to read it3 into the record.4 I am in receipt of a fax5 transmission of a letter dated October6 22nd from John Taylor, counsel for GEICO7 Insurance Company. No one from GEICO8 will be here to testify today, but I am9 submitting a document per Mr. Taylor's10 request as part of the record of today's11 hearing. The letter essentially outlines12 GEICO's concerns and suggestions13 pertaining to the rotational towing14 program. Mr. Taylor has indicated in the15 document and has copies of all members of16 Council, so I'd like to give the17 stenographer a copy for our record.18
Thank19 you.20 The Chair recognizes21 Councilwoman Sanchez.22
Thank23 you.24 I wanted to take an opportunity25 107 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 to ask Mr. Giral, one of the summations2 that my colleague Councilman Kenney made3 was around the storage situation, and I4 wanted to know what financial impediment5 that creates if for some reason we6 decided to go in a different direction7 and force the tow into another location.8
You're talking9 about forcing us to tow the car back to10 the Parking Authority?11
Well, basically13 that's going to -- we're not going to be14 able to make any income based on the15 storage and maybe even possibly towing16 the vehicle a second time if it doesn't17 go back to our lot. And I just want to18 say there's two things going on here.19 There's the wreck chasers that are taking20 the cars and storing the cars and21 overcharging, and there's the guys like22 me that are on the rotational system and23 want to see it work and are charging a24 fair rate that's regulated by L&I and25 108 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 which we follow.2
Yes, there will be5 a loss of income if it gets towed back to6 the Parking Authority.7
Just one8 more thing, because I think part of the9 discussion obviously when we say PPA, PPA10 has been doing 95. I'd like to get your11 comments on how that has functioned and12 how PPA has coordinated with the industry13 as it relates to 95, first of all.14
And then17 I'd like to get Healy's kind of response18 to how the 95/PPA in coordination with19 the City has happened. So first you and20 then...21
Well, basically22 what PPA has done on the expressway is23 created a monopoly. They exclusively tow24 on the expressways. They don't allow any25 109 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 private tow companies to tow up there,2 and they set their own rates. And they3 actually -- they tow every car back to4 the Parking Authority. They do not give5 the option to the consumer to have the6 vehicle towed any other place.7 LIEUTENANT HEALY: To be honest8 with you, I really wouldn't have a9 comment. It's a State Police matter.10 We're not involved in it in any way. So11 I really wouldn't even know anything12 about the contract per se. It's13 completely up to the State Police.14
It was15 done through a memo of understanding, and16 I think it's important as we look to17 fixing the towing rotation that we look18 at that, because my understanding is,19 it's just not on a memo of understanding20 between State Police and the Parking21 Authority. And I think that has created22 some of the hostility that you see with23 the towers saying, Here comes PPA coming24 into our industry again. And I want to25 110 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 put that on the record because I think2 it's an important part of what's3 happening and why this has transpired and4 people feeling like we set them up to5 fail on this. We've already taken 956 from them. Now we set up a system here7 that we didn't enforce properly and here8 again we're going to impede on private9 industry. So it's the undertone, and I10 think it's important.11 LIEUTENANT HEALY: I agree with12 you completely, but the difference I13 would say on the highway, PPA is taking14 actually the towing as well as the15 storage, and what's being presented here16 would be that we're trying to still keep17 it open for the small towers that they18 could still have the business of doing19 the towing. It's just where the cars are20 being stored by PPA. That would be the21 distinction, but I understand where22 you're coming from.23
But I24 think that took a lot of business from25 111 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 the tow operators already. So when we2 talk about taking -- we already took all3 of the highways, 76, 95. So now we're4 talking about potentially giving the rest5 of this over to PPA, and that's why6 there's a hostility back and forth,7 because it is a private industry piece,8 and the fact is that there's a monopoly9 there. You give them the rest of the10 City, it's a little bit too much power11 sometimes.12
I just have one13 thing to add. Originally when Rizzo14 presented the towing rotation, it was15 supposed to include the expressways. Is16 that true?17 LIEUTENANT HEALY: Pardon me?18
Originally --19 LIEUTENANT HEALY: Maybe the20 Councilman can answer that.21
It was all22 towing that was conducted within the23 County of Philadelphia. What happened24 was that there was a move to have the25 112 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 Philadelphia Police reassigned from the2 I-95, the Vine Street extension and the3 Schuylkill Expressway. That patrol was4 taken over by the Pennsylvania State5 Police and at the same time, what my6 colleague Councilwoman Sanchez said, that7 that then became the responsibility of8 the Philadelphia Parking Authority,9 because the State Police by that letter10 of understanding indicated that the only11 tower that would respond to a wreck on12 any of those three highways would be the13 Philadelphia Parking Authority. No other14 towers, other than if your car became15 disabled, would be able to go and16 relocate the vehicle.17
That's18 all, Madam President. Thank you.19 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:20 You're welcome.21 Are there any other questions22 from members of the Committee of these23 witnesses?24 (No response.)25 113 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871
Thank2 you. Thank you very much.3 Our next witness?4
Samuel R. Marshall,5 President and CEO of the Insurance6 Federation of Pennsylvania, Incorporated;7 John R. Doubman, Secretary and Counsel of8 the Insurance Federation of Pennsylvania,9 Incorporated.10 (Witnesses approached witness11 table.)12
Good13 afternoon. Welcome. Kindly identify14 yourself for the record and proceed with15 your testimony.16
Thank you. 22 First, an introduction. The23 Insurance Federation is a trade24 association for the insurance industry25 114 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 here in Pennsylvania. 10 Councilmember Rizzo's11 resolution and the changes to the City's12 rotational ordinance proposed by13 Councilmembers Kenney and Jones reflect14 two traits we've noticed in the attempt15 to address towing abuses. 20 Second, towing laws are only as21 good as they are enforced. Abusive22 towers are a brazen group, and laws23 preventing their most egregious and most24 profitable acts only work if rigorously25 115 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 2 I'll confess a bias. First, we3 and our policyholders are the ones who4 get ripped off by towing abuses. 7 Second, whatever the weaknesses8 of the Philadelphia towing ordinance, at9 least you have one. We just finished a10 legislative session up in Harrisburg with11 a fairly mild towing consumer protection12 bill. It was sponsored by a democrat,13 House Insurance Committee Chairman Tony14 DeLuca from the Pittsburgh area. It was15 supported by the AAA. It was supported16 by Attorney General Tom Corbett, as you17 know, a republican. 24 So at the state level, we don't25 116 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 even have a law. Consumers, whether2 they're insures or individuals, have3 nowhere to turn for help. As a city,4 you're way ahead of that curve. The5 current ordinance you have is better than6 nothing. 9 That said, I think you're10 seeing two things with your own11 ordinance. 21 Second, and probably most22 important, the ordinance needs better23 enforcement. We don't have enough24 experience with City agencies or with the25 117 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 District Attorney's Office or the Parking2 Authority to give you any great advice on3 who is the best staff outfit to enforce4 the protections, but you need more5 protection. We can offer some experience6 as insurers, because we're pretty heavily7 regulated. The best enforcement comes8 before a violation occurs. 14 We also think and we urge that15 the City's efforts be enhanced by having16 a state law. We mentioned the efforts17 from a geographically and politically18 diverse group came up short in our19 legislative session. It may have been20 more of the clock running out than any21 substantive differences. I'm not sure22 what the objections to the statewide23 protections were, but in any event, we24 and the AAA and public officials ranging25 118 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 from Tom Corbett to Tony DeLuca are going2 to be back next session. We hope that3 the City of Philadelphia gets involved at4 that state level. 12 So as you improve your own13 ordinance in both updating and enforcing14 it, I'd ask that you get involved in the15 state effort, working with the16 Philadelphia Delegation in both the17 Senate and the House and in working with18 others in the Legislature. That will19 help the rest of the state,20 Philadelphia's muscle being considerable,21 but I think it is also going to help22 Philadelphia by gaining another23 enforcement agency to clean up the24 problem that has plagued consumers too25 119 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. Thanks.
Thank5 you.6 Are there any questions of this7 witness?8 Councilman Rizzo.9
Madam10 President, I want to thank everyone today11 both from the Administration side, you12 personally and my colleagues in Council13 for taking the time to hear this14 important issue, and I'm confident that15 we will be able to resolve the issues16 associated with the current rotational17 towing system. And, again, Madam18 President, thank you for your indulgence.19 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:20 You're welcome.21 It is my understanding we don't22 have any other witnesses from our list.23 Is there anyone in the audience that24 would like to be recognized?25 120 10/26/10 - WHOLE - RES. 1005871 (No response.)2 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:3 Seeing no one, again, I thank you.4 This resolution will be5 continued until the call of the Chair.6 Thank you all very much.7 (Committee of the Whole8 adjourned at 12:05 p.m.)9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 121 CERTIFICATE2 I HEREBY CERTIFY that the3 proceedings, evidence and objections are4 contained fully and accurately in the5 stenographic notes taken by me upon the6 foregoing matter on October 26, 2010, and that7 this is a true and correct transcript of same.8 9 10 11 --------------------12 MICHELE L. MURPHY13 RPR-Notary Public14 15 16 17 18 (The foregoing certification of this19 transcript does not apply to any reproduction20 of the same by any means, unless under the21 direct control and/or supervision of the22 certifying reporter.)23 24 25