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Hearing video

ZBA Hearing - April 10, 2024

Philadelphia Zoning Board of Adjustment (ZBA)Apr 10, 20246h 50m

Now, I'm not sure about rescheduling and things like that.

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I'll check. But I don't believe that we can get through this today.

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And that's why I'm trying to, you know, do what's right by everybody.

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You know, if Mr. Masters has witnesses, you know, that that are going to be waiting and then we get to the point when it's his turn.

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there's no time left i mean i i gotta put a timeline on this i mean you know and i and i just

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um and mr chair i want to say earlier today and while you were in proceedings so you may not have

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seen the flurry of emails that were exchanged back and forth i think someone's mentioned it

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to me a little bit i think hillary i think hillary saw it i think hillary saw them all i'm i'm

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confident of that because she's on the ball with everything um so uh we for the record um while

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i have been known from time to time to prolong proceedings and in favor of objectors i have not

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done that in this case we have not objected to any of the expedited um dates that that um darwin

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has asked for. We did, though, spend a considerable amount of weeks that we outlined

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in our correspondence with you looking for an expert. And we had quite a... It was one of the

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more unusual kinds of searches for experts that I've ever had, and it's because this is a very

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specific use this 3.1 3.5 residential substance use disorder treatment facilities and virtually

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every expert that we interviewed or we encountered felt that they were conflicted out of testifying

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because they were themselves part of a rival provider and they didn't want to seem to be

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complaining about a newcomer and and you know that they were fighting over the same clients

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The other people that we had pursued were at one point available because they had worked for the state general assembly, but they went back into the Shapiro administration and they were conflicted out because they were.

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Steve, I understand what you were looking for, and I knew one of the subpoenas of somebody, and we turned it down, but what I want to do is get through today and figure out where we are.

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And the way I see this is, you know, even if the expedited time we just talked about, we're past six o'clock, and I don't think we have time to put on Steve's case then.

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That's where we are.

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And I'm saying that now because I don't want Steve holding witnesses here.

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Mr. Masters holding witnesses here.

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And then they're not going to go on.

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It's just not where we want to be.

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So what I think we want to do today is, Darwin, you put your case on, Mr. Master's crosses, and the next time we get together, Mr. Master does his case.

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It will have to be this month.

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Well, I will talk to Tanya and we'll figure it out.

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And I just, if you, Steve, if you would also let me know what you think the length of your

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case would be.

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Yeah, sure.

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I am more prepared on that question, Mr. Chair.

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So, yes.

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So, Mike Harrell, I believe that his testimony is going to be very extensive.

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And I imagine that Mr. Bovee's cross-examination will also be somewhat extensive.

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So I don't see him having direct and cross-examination any shorter than an hour.

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And we do have four witnesses who are among my clients, who are the near neighbors, and they all have unique areas that they want to bring forward.

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One of them has a PowerPoint presentation that may itself take 10 to 15 minutes.

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And so I would imagine that the other a total of the other four witnesses would be between 30 to 40 minutes.

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So we're talking about an hour and 40 minutes.

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So why don't we do this? We're going to start today.

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Darwin, you'll put on your case. Mr. Masters will have an opportunity to cross.

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And then the next time we get there, Mr. Masters does his case.

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And that's fine with the understanding that we have to do this this month because.

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My understanding would be is we'll do what we can.

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I can't answer that question now.

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Then I also would like the board to consider a break because with the flurries of emails all day up to up until just an hour ago.

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Then I also would like the board to consider a break because with the flurries of emails.

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But I completely object to him presenting any witnesses given the length of time.

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Well, he's not doing it today. He's not doing it today.

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i i understand right but i still want my objections to be noted because i and i'm

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hoping that the board can rule on it prior to time prior to like let me finish let me finish

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i'm sorry that i interrupted prior to time because what i have sensed at the time that we

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even started that um and even with the good councilman's help that mr masters was representing

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neighbors who wanted to be more involved and review the cba or more on an individual and

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private basis than what the rco did we do have executed cba and then as it turns out the now

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Now, the neighbors didn't even give us language, and they just changed their mind.

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And I think it does come into play with Mr. Masters' inability to get an expert, because I do believe there are other people who are watching this case who would rather not see this case, see this activity here.

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Okay, so why don't we do this? Mr. Masters, your witnesses, you can let them go for the day, right? And we're going to, Darwin, you'll start, and we'll get through your case today, and Mr. Masters will cross, and then we'll figure out where we stand in the future.

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Very briefly, Mr. Chair, I wanted to put on the record a response to Mr. Bove's objections. As you said, Mr. Chair, his objections are now going to be moot because his objection was that he didn't see our expert outline and he didn't know about the identity of our other witnesses within four or so days before the hearing.

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Now he's going to be able to see them many more days than that before the next hearing.

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But it was very concerning to us and basically shocking that Mr. Bovee was asking this board to completely shut down any objectors from making any testimony.

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And it was it was just it was very, very shocking and frankly, un-American.

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and i've never seen i've never seen i've never seen that kind of emotion all right thank you so

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why don't we do this mr bobe yes why don't we start your case yes i i i will i will and and

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and i still don't know who your clients are steve so i'll share my screen

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Uh, if I think of this.

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Can you see?

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No, we don't see anything, Darwin.

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Hey, Argo.

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It's coming up.

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You've got a bunch of email.

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You've got messages you're putting up here.

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You might want to.

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That's not bad.

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There we go.

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There we go.

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You can see that, right?

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Oh, we can't.

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Okay, great.

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All right.

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Mr. Chairman, members of the board.

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My name is Darwin Beauvais.

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And before you is an application for 3.1 level type recovery house to be located in our RSA

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5 Residential District in the Dickerson Square section of South Philadelphia. Like I mentioned

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earlier, we have the applicant, 3R Ventures, LLC. The principals include Michael Daly and Harvey

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Schmidt. Also, we have to discuss operations. It's Bridget Daly. And also, because time is of the

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essence we do have our expert courtney what what we'll we'll

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We do have our expert, Courtney Woldalowski, and she'll better pronounce her name.

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She's an expert, and I'll bring her on in just a minute.

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In just a minute, I just want to give the board some quick background.

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A 3.1 level recovery house is the essence of our application.

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Our intent is to have 56 residents.

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Our original intent is also to include the required number of parking spaces, to which I'll explain in a few.

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This combined site, and if possible, let me see.

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Can the board see this?

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We can.

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All right.

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The combined site is 23,000 square feet with a three-story building and two existing lots.

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You can see my cursor hovering around the building and my cursor now hovering around the lot.

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Just here's an overview.

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Here's the building on Moore Street.

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And here are two lots adjacent that belongs to the applicant.

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Well, belongs to the project.

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so our applicant our application right now doesn't include any additions and it's just

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internal renovations we intend to use the three floors to create living space with a main commercial

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kitchen and ground on the ground floor meeting spaces and a fitness center like i mentioned

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before, the program will be owned by the applicant, which we have Michael Daly and Harvey

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Smith. And at this time, I just want the board to see Exhibit 11, our prior permits, just

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to give you further background.

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this was the home for the elderly and aged this has this property has always focused on group

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living and and it was as recently and currently owned by the

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i'm sorry i'm just going to object briefly um darwin because while it's true that it was group

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living at some points in its time the property is not historically a group living property and you

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you need to show the documents my presentation okay so and this was owned by the mother of good

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council for several years and it is now owned by the taoist temple

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now we did receive a special exception as well as a refusal

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the board can see here group living and i believe what mr masters was trying to uh orient the board

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was that our the place has been vacant for quite some time and therefore it needs to get the

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It's zoning classification refreshed, if you will.

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Now, with this, I do want to discuss what is called a low-intensity residential treatment facility.

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And I think because of time she has to go, we will call Courtney Wondolowski.

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If she could raise her hand.

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Okay.

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Courtney has been allowed to speak.

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I would you please state your name and spell for the courts and honor.

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Hello, everyone.

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Yes, it is Courtney Wondolowski.

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There we go.

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C-O-U-R-T-N-E-Y-W-A-N-D-E-L-O-S-K-I.

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You swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?

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I do.

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Please proceed, counsel.

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Thank you.

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You've stated your name for the record.

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Can you tell the members of the board what kind of work do you do?

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Yes, I'm the co-founder of Revive Behavioral Health Solutions. We are a women-owned behavioral

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Yes, I'm the co-founder of Revive Behavioral Health Solutions.

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health consulting firm that works with programs nationally to help them navigate state licensing,

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national accreditation, as well as insurance credentialing, in addition to policy and

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procedure development, compliance guidelines, and natures around setting up successful and

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ethically run treatment centers related to behavioral health care.

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Okay. And have you, in your experience, put together 3.1 level treatment care,

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can you tell the board what that entails? Yes, of course. So every state has different

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guidelines when it comes to 3.1 facilities, but as you mentioned, Darwin, 3.1s are low-intensity

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residential clinically managed programs for substance use disorder, and we have helped

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programs get licensed and set up proper procedures as it relates to running and operating the level

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3.1 programs. Okay, and how many, and how long have you been doing this? Yeah, so, oh, sorry.

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Yeah, how long have you been doing this, either through your current firm or throughout your

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career? Of course, so I have been in the behavioral health field now for over five years. I started

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with owning and operating a behavioral health recruiting firm where we helped the staffing

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for many 3.1 and other levels of residential care.

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For the last three years, we have kind of started into the consulting side of things.

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And I would say in that period of time, we have helped open dozens of programs.

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but as it relates to 3.1s, I would say between 8 and 12.

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Great. Mr. Chairman, I offer her as an expert,

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and I'd like to continue my questioning about this particular project.

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I'm sorry. I have an objection to the certification as an expert.

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could I ask Mr. Chair could I ask one or two questions to illustrate why I believe

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that this witness is not an expert please I'm sorry can you can you pronounce your last name

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for me yes it is Courtney Wondoloski Wondoloski okay so Miss Wondoloski

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uh you stated in your testimony that um every state has different uh regulations and criteria

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for 3.1 uh residential facilities is that correct so in terms of state licensing each state licensing

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body operates different in terms of kind of the licensing process but 3.1 is a

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level of care by ASAM, which is the American Society of Addiction Medicine. So 3.1s operate

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across the board following ASAM standards. So the operations don't differ across the board

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while the state licensing might have different requirements in terms of what needs to

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be submitted. The overall operations as it relates to what is expected at a level 3.1

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does not differ. How many 3.1 facilities have you assisted in the state of Pennsylvania?

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I have not assisted with any in the state of Pennsylvania, but I've done extensive...

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Excuse me, I just need to go on. Have you done any training with the state of Pennsylvania

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in licensing of 3.1 facilities in this state? I've not done training, but I've been in communication

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with them extensively and i have extensive emails back and forth with the process and emailed with

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people but you haven't trained in the state licensing procedures correct i was not aware

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there was training if there was i would have sure done that but i have gotten all the information

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from the appropriate uh bodies within the state of pennsylvania in terms of the process and what

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is needed and um that is the information that i have have you ever operated a 3.1 facility

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so i my business does not own any 3.1 facilities but we provide operational support so yes we have

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provided operational support to didn't ask you if you provided operational support i asked you

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if you have ever operated a 3.1 facility well i have i have made i have made clear that i don't own

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Well, I have made clear that I don't own any.

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Right. Have you ever been employed at a 3.1 facility?

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No, but I have worked with them extensively.

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So, Mr. Chair, the expert that we have has operated 70 3.1 and other residential treatment facilities, not just in Pennsylvania, but also in Maryland.

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where we're missing. Hold on. Hold on. Hold on. So I'm challenging her status.

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Both of you listen a minute. Darwin, did she work on this project?

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Unmute Darwin, please. Darwin. Unmute. Darwin, has she worked on this project?

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Yes.

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Okay.

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So here's where we are.

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I'm not going to make her a witness.

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You can let her testify as what she's done on this project.

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Okay.

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I'm not going to make her an expert witness, but she can testify as to what she's done on this project.

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Okay.

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So, Courtney, are you still there?

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Yes, I'm here.

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Yeah.

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So can you explain, based on your time in working on this project, did you see that there was a need for a 3.1 level care facility in this city?

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