I'm trying to see exactly where we are going to be so that I'll be able to deal with that.
Is there money identified in this budget for that study? DEP.
For the amount of money that we would need, there is no money that we've put aside specifically for that, but I will be working with both Finance and everyone, because we do need to do that, and we may 133 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET be able to use some grant money 'cause that's something that I want to --
Is there grant money in this budget for that study? (Timer bell rings.) DEP.
So it's -- we have to stop talking about it. Let's budget it and let's do the study. DEP.
Well, I agree with you. I think that we are stopping the talk about it.
Well, if there's not money in the budget for it, you're not going to do it. DEP.
You're welcome. The Chair recognizes Councilwoman Blackwell. 134 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET
Thank you, Madam President. I wanted to ask about EMS billing because we are so concerned about our citizens having the service. Is there discussions about the Water Department or PGW doing it as opposed to it being contacted out? DEP.
We would like to -- we'd like to have the issue considered because our folks need it and can't afford to pay extensive fees for it. And let me ask you, has -- how has that EMS service been affected by the 3-1-1 system? COMMISSIONER AYRES: Well, for the most part, as far as our emergency medical system, 3-1-1 has managed to take some of the calls that normally would come into 9-1-1 and then be handed off to one of our departments or to some other agency in the City. And 3-1-1 has allowed some 135 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET of those calls to come in and reduce the pressure or the call volume on our 9-1-1 operators for EMS as well as -- not for emergencies, but for non-emergency services. So that's the only way that we've been -- we've seen that as far as an effect.
Yes. I know that -- with 9-1-1, we knew what these kinds of services were, what would happen. And I wonder if, with this new system, it is supposed to obviously take other calls that are not emergency in nature. COMMISSIONER AYRES: Right.
I mean, I'm sure that's the purpose of it. But I wonder if, in fact, we have any evidence yet that it has done that? DEP.
Good morning, Councilwoman. It's very early, but we are still studying all of the things that come 136 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET in through 3-1-1. I mean, this is April, and the system went into effect as of December 31. Obviously, once we get the analysis, I'll be glad to forward it to you.
Thank you. Commissioner, I've been with you on many, many mornings, where we've met at the fire stations to go to visit senior homes and to give them these new smoke detectors. COMMISSIONER AYRES: Yes.
And it's really, really important, as you know, and you always talk about it. Whenever I see you on TV, you talk about those homes that have the smoke detectors and those that do not. And these new batteries are for -- I have forgotten the length of time they're four. COMMISSIONER AYRES: Ten years. 137 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET They're ten-year lithium batteries.
Okay. So then what will happen then? It will go back out and -- COMMISSIONER AYRES: Yes. There's a database that's being collected. We're working collaboratively with the University of Pennsylvania cartographic modeling lab. One of the things that they're doing is making a record of each and every home that we go into. So now, what will happen is, as we approach that ten-year mark, we'll know where we need to go back, how we need to talk to the community, that specific community, even that specific household, to let them know, make sure you change out or check your ten-year lithium batteries. So we'll have a record.
Yes. I know that you continued to do a great job in that area of advocating for smoke detectors and helping anyone who would ask 138 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET you and your whole team. We are grateful for that. Finally -- and this goes to our deputy mayor -- the whole issue of a million dollars being removed from the fiscal year budget for flashlights, escape rope and webbing system. Have these -- has this whole issue been dealt with? Whenever there are cuts, we certainly can't afford to lose these vital materials -- flashlights, escape rope, and webbing system. COMMISSIONER AYRES: Yes. That is being taken care of. The flashlights, the webbing, the escape ropes, all of those things are actually being provided -- will be implemented.
And it won't affect any cuts? You'll still be able to do these things? COMMISSIONER AYRES: That's aside from any of the other budget items.
Thank you again, Commissioner. Thank you, 139 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET Deputy Mayor. Thanks.
The Chair recognizes Councilman Kenney. No? The Chair recognizes Councilman Kelly.
Thank you, Madam President. Good morning, Commissioner. COMMISSIONER AYRES: Good morning.
I apologize for getting here a little late, but when I got here, Councilman Kenney was asking about the progress of the hearing equipment for firefighters. Could you give me an update on that? COMMISSIONER AYRES: Okay. Currently, what we have is: In 2007, we were asked if our apparatus met the NFPA standard for the hearing levels. That was 70 decibels inside the cab, with emergency lights and sirens. And one of the things that we talked about was the compliance 140 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET that we had with our apparatus since 1991. But we further discussed the fact that we wanted to get the hearing protection. And right now, we have a pilot where we have four engines that we've purchased that actually have the hearing protection in the -- built into the apparatus. The rest we're looking at retrofitting. It's about $5,000 per truck to get it retrofitted. So we are in the process of getting that done.
How many trucks would you be able to do? COMMISSIONER AYRES: We do the trucks as they come in for the new apparatus. That will be ongoing from now on. I'm not certain how many can be retrofitted, say, per day or per month right now, but it is being looked at.
What's your best guess as far as completing all of those engines or retrofitting them; do you 141 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET have any idea? COMMISSIONER AYRES: Yeah. I can't project the completion of each and every apparatus right now, but I can work that and get that for you.
So that's an ongoing project? COMMISSIONER AYRES: It's an ongoing project. Two things: Identifying the funding for it to make sure that it gets done, which we've talked about, and then the scheduling, how long --
How much has been budgeted this year, this coming year? DEP.
We would have to get that information. I don't have that, but I will get it back to you.
Thank you. 142 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET
Another question I had is, I know Councilman Jones, I think, was asking you about the source capture for diesel exhaust emission systems. COMMISSIONER AYRES: Yes.
Could you give me an update on that as to... COMMISSIONER AYRES: Yes. We have three phases of the point source capture project. One phase is completed. We're working at finishing up Phase II. We expect I and II to be done by the 30th of June, with the crashing of the project. We're actually hoping to finish all three phases by June 30th. But at the outside, it should be mid-August.
Okay. 143 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET Another thing I had heard is that in your paramedic vehicles, the ambulances, where people are put there to transfer to a hospital, that there's a sticker on that says, "For information or complaints, dial 3-1-1." COMMISSIONER AYRES: Yes, sir.
What's the purpose of that? What would be the purpose of asking people to start complaining about the service, I guess? COMMISSIONER AYRES: We don't ask people to complain. We make sure that folks have an opportunity to have a number to call about anything. We receive calls about billing, we receive calls about excellent service. So it's just a collection point or feedback from our citizens that we serve. It is not meant to be anything negative.
Yeah. Well, I just -- I don't like the word "complaints" on there. That's the point. 144 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET COMMISSIONER AYRES: Mm-hmm.
In other words, if you're asking people to complain, to me, it's promoting complaints rather than just leaving them out of the vehicles. If people want to complain, they can call -- of course, they can call the fire station, they can call the City Hall operator, they can call 3-1-1. They can call anyone if they want to complain about it, but I just don't see the purpose of having it in the vehicles themselves. Another question I have: You just mentioned that smoke detectors the last ten years -- COMMISSIONER AYRES: Ten-year lithium batteries.
Most of the manufacturers that I know -- I know at one time it was five years. The lifetime of the smoke detector would last about five years. They don't recommend keeping it for that length of time, I don't know, 145 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET unless these are new. DEP.
That are -- COMMISSIONER AYRES: The technology has evolved. (Indiscernible; parties talking over each other.) COMMISSIONER AYRES: The technology has evolved.
The ones that you're getting now are probably the best units or the -- COMMISSIONER AYRES: They have the latest technology. Yes, sir.
They have it updated? Okay. All right. I have other questions but I'll wait. All right. Thank you, Madam President. Thank you, Commissioner.
Thank you. 146 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET The Chair recognizes Councilman Green.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Commissioner, could you describe how the Fire Department works with L&I? COMMISSIONER AYRES: Yes. We work with L&I on a regular basis. One of the ways that we work with L&I more frequently is through our Inspection Program. We go out and inspect businesses throughout the entire community, the entire city. And if we find violations, we note the violation and forward it to L&I for processing.
So you actually issue violations yourself? COMMISSIONER AYRES: We note the violation and we forward it. It's called "a referral." So we refer the fact that we found a violation to Licenses and Inspections.
Are you authorized to issue a citation? 147 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET COMMISSIONER AYRES: I'm not certain. I believe the fire marshal can, a person from the fire marshal's office can issue that citation. As far as a regular firefighter, I'm not certain. I don't believe so.
If we authorize you to -- the people who are referring it to issue a citation, wouldn't that save a lot of time and money? COMMISSIONER AYRES: We'd have to look at the process.
Rather than having two separate people, a firefighter in the first instance noting the problem, sending it to L&I, having -- COMMISSIONER AYRES: It could save some time, I believe so, yes.
Yeah, 'cause you're doing the same thing. So how's it going with L&I now that they have no fire -- nobody in their Fire Inspection Department at the moment? COMMISSIONER AYRES: Could you 148 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET repeat the question? How is --
L&I no longer has people who write fire citations. Have been taken out of the budget, inspectors. COMMISSIONER AYRES: Okay. And your question?
How's it going? Do you follow up to see that the citations are being issued? COMMISSIONER AYRES: Yes, we do follow up. We have a system that -- we have a system that if the fire violation isn't followed up on, it will remain. We look at it monthly. And any violation that hasn't come back to us from L&I, we'll talk with L&I to find out what happened. That's a part of our system.
Okay. So can you -- what system is that? COMMISSIONER AYRES: The one I just explained. It's in --
What's the name of the system? Does it have a name? COMMISSIONER AYRES: It's the 149 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET referral system.
The referral system between the Fire Department and L&I. COMMISSIONER AYRES: That's correct.
Okay. So can you please provide us with, for the last months, the number of referrals from 11 the Fire Department to L&I, and then what 12 the backlog is on a monthly basis in terms of things that haven't been resolved within one month? COMMISSIONER AYRES: Yes.
You're welcome. Are there any other questions from members of the committee? (No further questions.)
Seeing none, thank you, gentlemen. Thank you very much. 150 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET COMMISSIONER AYRES: Thank you. DEP.
The committee will stand in recess until 1:30. Thank you. (Lunch break taken at 1:15 p.m.) * * * (Proceedings resume at 1:56 p.m.)
Good afternoon. The Committee of the Whole is now back in session. The next department that we'll hear from will be the Prisons. (Witnesses come forward.)
And welcome. Please identify yourself for the record and proceed with your testimony. COMM. GIORLA: Council President Verna and members of Council. I'm Louis 151 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET Giorla, Commissioner of the Prison System. I'm accompanied by several members of the Prison administrative staff. We're here to take care of in regard to our 2010 Operating Budget. The Philadelphia Prisons mission is: To provide a secure correctional environment that adequately detains persons accused or convicted of illegal acts; To provide program, services, and supervision in a lawful, safe, clean humane environment; and To prepare incarcerated persons for reentry into this society. In the 2008 Fiscal Year, the Prisons Daily Average Population (ADP) was 9,133. 9 percent. For FY '10 the Prisons Budget is as follows: In Class 100, Salaries and 152 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET Fringe Benefits, $126,158,000. In Class 200, for Purchase of Services and Contracts, $116,675,000. In Classes 3 and 400, in Material and Supplies, $4,798,000. And in Class 500, Contributions, Indemnities and Taxes, approximately $1,201,000. For a total of $248,635,000. This request represents a 2 percent increase over the Prisons FY '09 obligations. It includes a proposed reduction in Class 100 of $178,000 realized from overtime savings and redeployment of personnel. An increase is being sought in Class 200 of $6,045,000. PPS obligations in this category consist of food services, medical and mental health treatment of inmates, private inmate housing contracts, and educational as well as vocational training. An additional $115,000 increase is sought to Class 300 for supplies and materials related to housing the inmate 153 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET population and maintaining our City-owned jail sites. The request for additional funds in and 300 Classes are based on a Fiscal 2010 project population increase of nearly percent, or 480 inmates to a daily census of approximately 10,000. Class 500, which primarily consists of inmate pay for institutional work assignments is essentially unchanged. During FY '09, the Philadelphia Prison System contracted for more than $82 million in private-service contracts. percent of total contracting. There is a table below that summarizes the Prisons contracts in minority participation for FY 2008 and 2009. And just to summarize that, you can see that the departmental goal for the Prisons was between and 35 percent minority participation. In FY '08, the 154 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET minority participation was percent -- or more than 26 percent. 88. The City's Five-Year Plan incorporates projected prison population based on past experience and does not include personnel or other funding reductions. For FY '10, the Prisons has relinquished 40 unfilled positions, the positions of which 35 are correctional officers, and 5 are support personnel. These position carries duties which would be absorbed by existing staff and the use of technology. Intact are vocational training and soft skills training and support programs for ex-offenders. Understanding that Mayor Nutter has given fiscal responsibility of first priority in the Philadelphia Plan and acknowledging that Philadelphia's jails have higher per-citizen incarceration rates than most major cities, we are committed to reducing our impact on the 155 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET budget while upholding our responsibility for contributing to public safety. In order to do so, we consider it an obligation to develop economical and safe alternatives to incarceration. The Prisons did not sustain budget or personnel reductions during the rebalancing in November of 2008 or in the Five-Year Plan FY 2010 to 14.
Thus far, in 2009, the Prisons, along with the District Attorney's Office, the First Judicial District, and the Defender Association, has and will continue to explore ways to sensibly and safely reduce our jail population. To date, the place of confinement for nearly 200 inmates -- sentenced inmates has been changed, allowing the Prisons to transfer them to the Pennsylvania Department of Corrections supervision. The population reduction resulted in the removal of all Philadelphia inmates from housing in Passaic and Monmouth Counties in New 156 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET Jersey and avoiding a cost of nearly $5 million in other jurisdiction housing. While the aforementioned forecast of a prison population of 10,000 may be anticipated, it will by no means be considered acceptable. The removal of State-sentenced inmates is one of the -- only one of the efforts underway to reduce the population. The creation of a mental health court to provide intense supervision of mentally ill offenders on probation and parole is underway. The relocation of drug and alcohol treatment evaluators of the Forensic Intensive Recovery (FIR) Program from Center City to the prison complex has just been completed. Having FIR evaluators onsite will shorten the length of time it takes to place offenders in court-ordered community drug treatment. Initiatives to automate recordkeeping and data transmission from the courts and to the Prisons and from the Prisons to the Defender Association will 157 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET shorten the length of a stay for a portion of our pretrial population. Also, the anticipated use of video for court appearances in prison facilities will contribute to the security and efficiency in the public safety arena. The necessity to transport hundreds of defendants to daily court and preliminary hearings throughout the City is costly and risky to the Prisons, the sheriffs, and the police. Although each of these initiatives has the potential to reduce the Prisons average daily population, none has been fully implemented, so their expected success is cautionary at this point. With that in mind, the $10,000 figure is still a potential reality. Thank you for the opportunity to testify today. We would be happy to answer any questions you may have at this time.
Thank you, Commissioner. 158 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET What is the status of the lawsuit concerning the overcrowding? COMM. GIORLA: I believe the lawsuit you're referring to is Williams versus the City of Philadelphia? The current status is, the case has not been heard; it's pending certification of the class of claimants, and there are several motions pending before the federal court.
Commissioner, I hate to ask this question, but I think several of us have heard the same rumor, and that is that you're paying inmates a fee per day if they sign a waiver from the overcrowding situation? I find that hard to believe, but I think you're going to have to answer that. COMM. GIORLA: I'm happy to say that I'm glad to answer that, Madam President.
Please do. COMM. GIORLA: That is a rumor, 159 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET and just that.
Great. COMM. GIORLA: We don't pay inmates for triple-cell housing. We were the subject of a lawsuit about two years ago because of crowded conditions and in our intake operations that held inmates there for upwards of 30 to 48 hours in intake, in holding cells. That situation has been corrected. There was an award in that case, but we don't routinely pay anyone, and we don't have them sign waivers or take payments for triple cells.
I just thought that should be made a part of the record because -- COMM. GIORLA: Thank you.
-- several of us have heard that, and we wanted to make certain that it was clarified. COMM. GIORLA: That rumor may have started because in some other 160 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET jurisdictions -- I know in New York City, some years ago, if inmates weren't processed in hours, they were paid a 5 premium of $100 to $150. 6
I 7 think we're being told that if an inmate 8 sleeps on the floor, he's now being paid a 9 fee per day. 10 COMM. GIORLA: That's incorrect. 11
And we 12 thought that that was really stretching 13 it. 14 COMM. GIORLA: And I'm happy to 15 say that's just a rumor. 16
Thank 17 you, thank you. 18 Commissioner, why does your 19 department spend 25 percent of its 20 personal services budget on overtime? And 21 wouldn't it be cheaper in the long run to 22 hire additional personnel? 23 COMM. GIORLA: This is another 24 one I'm happy to answer, Madam President. Last year -- 161 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET
You're a happy soul, aren't you? COMM. GIORLA: Yeah, I'm happy today. Last year, in January of last year, we had a substantial vacancy rate among our correctional officers, our social workers, and our maintenance staff, our City Civil Service maintenance staff. We've been able to hire over the last year about 110 correctional officers, which has given us a yield, after attrition, of about 94 additional correctional staff. We've been able to hire in the neighborhood of social 17 workers, which has given us approximately 18 16 more than we had last year. 19 We haven't been as successful in 20 hiring or recreating maintenance staff, because some of the trades in the community can earn more than a Civil Service employee. And we have approvals from the City to recruit and hire those individuals. 162 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET Now, the bulk of our overtime is paid in the correctional classes -- the correctional officer, sergeant, the lieutenant and captain. We've been able to reduce those expenditures through that hiring to where -- I'll give you an example. In the last pay period, which ended on April 5, 2009, we spent $124,000 less than on overtime than we did last year at this time. So we've been able to reduce the overtime along with making the new hires.
Commissioner, with the hiring of the additional personnel, then why is your budget obligation for '09 the same as 10? For overtime. For your overtime. COMM. GIORLA: Our overtime? Because of the fact that we haven't hired to fully staff, we anticipated -- we anticipated the overtime expenditures to be roughly the same. We've taken steps to reduce our 163 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET sick time as well, 'cause that added a big impact. And the hiring has caused a reduction of our sick time, which will contribute to the overtime. If we continue at this pace and we're able to reduce the overtime, we'll be asking to revise the budget.
Okay. What does the Prisons spend for inmate health services? (Witness comes forward.) CHIEF HERDMAN: Good afternoon. I'm Bruce Herdman, Chief of Medical Operations. The inmates spent $65 million in Fiscal Year '09.
And what do we have budgeted for '10? CHIEF HERDMAN: An increase of 2.1 percent.
What 164 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET health services does a detainee receive? CHIEF HERDMAN: A detainee or a sentenced individual is eligible for all of the health services that you would receive in the community.
Can you tell us what the average stay of the detainee is, Commissioner? COMM. GIORLA: The average stay of an inmate, we currently don't break that out for detention versus sentenced. We're in the process of conducting a length-of-stay study based on subsets. But in our population overall, 91 it's days.
Can you tell us what percentage of your population are detainees? COMM. GIORLA: Yes. It's 76 percent, and it varies somewhere between 71 and 79 percent on a daily basis.
Does the Prisons receive any reimbursement for detainee health services? 165 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET CHIEF HERDMAN: Of the total budget, $3 million comes through the Department of Behavioral Health for behavioral-health services.
I think that we've been inquiring for many years: Why can't the City receive medical-assistance payments for detainees? CHIEF HERDMAN: So have we.
Well, there has to be an answer. CHIEF HERDMAN: The answer is that the City --
It's every year we ask the same questions and we get the same answers. CHIEF HERDMAN: The state regulation removes inmates from eligibility the minute they come through the front door.
I'm sorry. Do you mind repeating? CHIEF HERDMAN: The State removes inmates from eligibility for 166 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET medical assistance the minute they come through the front door of the prison.
So it's a state issue? CHIEF HERDMAN: Yes, ma'am.
Yes. Everett Gillison, Deputy Mayor for Public Safety. Yes, we have. We've been in negotiations with the State over this very issue. We thought we had a pilot program that we were going to try and do just to show the efficacy of it, especially if we could get a waiver for the first 30 days. We thought that we would be able to show that because of the inmates coming in and going out, a certain percentage of 'em would -- if they don't lose their benefits from medical assistance, we could get 'em into a program and not necessarily be in a secure bed. We're still negotiating. 167 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET
I do have a number of questions that I want to ask. Commissioner, on -19 of your budget detail, you're requesting $3,750,000 for provisional housing. Where's this housing located? COMM. GIORLA: Transitional housing?
Provisional housing. COMM. GIORLA: Provisional housing? Well --
That's what it says on -19. COMM. GIORLA: These housing areas are areas not in our City-owned facilities. They're made necessary by the current population levels. Some of them have already been -- we've already withdrawn from. The Passaic County, New Jersey, we've withdrawn inmates from that site. Monmouth County, New Jersey, we've 168 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET withdrawn inmates from that site. The other ones listed are either treatment facilities, work-release facilities, or sentence custody facilities within the City.
Where? COMM. GIORLA: I can run down the list. CEC is a --
What is provisional housing? COMM. GIORLA: This housing is based on our population levels. It's outside of our complex at the Prisons in the Northeast.
And I think our question is: Where is the location for the provisional housing for $3,750,000? Section 52. DEP.
52-19. COMM. GIORLA: Oh, okay. These are contingency dollars for additional housing, depending on whether or not 169 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET there's a population increase. DEP.
So the basic -- let me see if I can help you, Madam Chair. The -- because of the growth -- and this committee has known, and the Council has known, that over the last number of years, the population has gone up on average 8 percent. We've just had another population last year going up by 4.9 percent. This line items, the $3.7 million, is put there because we don't have any space up on State Road or within any other facilities. If we have to actually contract with someone, we would need to be able to do that. And, obviously, if the people come, we can't -- you know, we'd have to take them in. The Prisons are not one of the things that we can say, "No, please don't come." So these dollars are there. And we already have relationships with what you see above. CEC, Lehigh County, 170 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET Liberty Management at 17th and Cambria, all of those things are there. And if we needed additional space, we would have to go to not only them but to others that we would be able to say, "We need additional space as a result of the spike. Can you put those beds available?" So, as I sit here right now, and as the Commissioner sits here, those provisional housing dollars are there so that if we get a spike and we have to provide money for something, we have a line item to draw against.
At what policy population would you have to start using that? COMM. GIORLA: At approximately 9700, 9800, in between.
And how many do you have today? COMM. GIORLA: 9440.
Okay. I know there are several Councilpeople 171 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET that want to be recognized. I just have a couple of other questions I would like to ask. What does it cost to house an inmate in our facilities? COMM. GIORLA: At the end of FY '08, it was 95.70 a day.
And how much do we spend to house inmates at non-City-owned facilities? COMM. GIORLA: It depends on the type of facility. If I could draw your attention back to the -19.
Yes. The Chair recognizes Councilman Jones for a point of information.
According to the Daily News, today's article about how much does it cost -- "What is the True Cost of a Con?" it says it's $98.49 per day. Did you see the article? COMM. GIORLA: Yes, I did, 172 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET Councilman.
Do you dispute any of these costs? COMM. GIORLA: Excuse me?
Do you dispute any of the costs? COMM. GIORLA: No. I think they're slightly, marginally high, but I think they're relatively correct.
So we're topping in -- closing in on a hundred dollars a day per inmate. COMM. GIORLA: Yes, sir.
If we don't depreciate equipment or something like that, it's about that. COMM. GIORLA: Yes, sir.
Okay. COMM. GIORLA: For instance, the CEC, the Erie site, the inmates housed 173 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET there, we pay $62 a day per inmate. In Lehigh County, we pay $90 a day per inmate. At Liberty Management, which is a work-release facility, we pay $35 a day for inmate. But I wanted to clarify some of those charges. Although they're different, they offer a different range of services. And, for instance, at the Liberty site, at 17th and Cambria, we provide full-time security at that site as well as health services. So there's a hybrid of services, some that are charged directly by the vendor and some that we provide out of our operating budget.
With the detainees, how long could they be kept in prison before they can -- before they receive a hearing? What is that -- DEP.
There is a rule in the criminal court that talks about -- depending on your charge, you have to -- you're supposed to be tried in 174 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET Municipal Court within 120 to 180 days. After that, then you're supposed to be eligible to be released. Attorneys routinely will go to court as they are going up to that in order to force the case on because they want their client out of jail. If you have a felony, you have up to 365 days to have your case to be heard before the case is ultimately dismissed under the rules of criminal procedure. So it just depends on the status that you have, whether it's a municipal court case or a felony case.
Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilman Goode.
Thank you, Madam President. Good afternoon, Commissioner. Good afternoon, Deputy Mayor. COMM. GIORLA: Good afternoon. 175 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET DEP.
We often ask questions year after year either because those answers have not been given or because we need an update. I think the Commissioner and the Deputy Mayor can pretty much guess what question I'm going to ask about, but I'll start out with reading from the article in the Daily News today. It says: "Our approach to criminal justice has become so criminally dysfunctional that it may no longer shock to learn that in Philadelphia, we spend twice as much housing each prisoner as we do educating each child." A separate Daily News article 20 talks about a report from the Philadelphia Workforce Investment Board that was released today. This says: "Just 39 percent of City dropouts were employed." If we can expect that over 60 percent of dropouts will not be employed, 176 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET shouldn't we, on an annual basis, if not more than an annual basis, be concerned about the dropout rate among our prisoners? More specifically, how can we ever expect to reduce recidivism or improve our reentry efforts if those efforts don't begin in jail. And so the question I ask every year is: Of the population, do we know what percentage are high school dropouts? COMM. GIORLA: We don't keep data on how many are high school dropouts. What we do interview is to try and determine who have high school diplomas or GEDs. It's self-reporting information. About half of our incoming population claim that they have high school diplomas or GEDs. For sentenced inmates, if they --
I'm still looking for a clear answer. It's why I ask the question every year. And the question is: 177 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET Whatever the population, whether it was last year or next year, whether it's 10,000 next year or whether it was 9,000 last year, do we know or don't we know what percentage are dropouts? And then the second question is: What are we actively doing about it? And that question is not just posed to the Prison Commissioner. And I'll say this as a matter of a statement. There are those who believe that a good prison commissioner is probably part warden and part social worker. What I know is that, nationally, there are some that just view themselves as wardens, and there are a few that probably just view themselves as social workers. But I know our efforts go beyond the prison. But our reentry efforts have to begin in prison. And so if we know that 60 percent of dropouts will not be employed, why aren't we tracking the number of dropouts in terms of those that are within 178 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET the prison? COMM. GIORLA: We do -- we do interview the inmates when they come in, as part of the intake process, to determine whether or not -- what their level of educational attainability is or what the level of education they had attained.
So what percentage are high school dropouts? COMM. GIORLA: Fifty percent.
Okay. Deputy Mayor Gillison, beyond that interview process, what sort of an assessment process is actually taking place to reduce recidivism and improve reentry efforts? DEP.
We have started a number of different things. One is that we have finally been able to put together a prerelease center up at the prison, which just started just last month. We are trying now to work with our partners in the criminal justice 179 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET system so that we will be able to almost mandate it so that we will be able to do a true assessment of the individuals much like they have to go through an assessment in order to get ready to come back to society from the State. We're going to try and do the same thing here in the county. Right now, we're doing it on a volunteer basis, and we don't like the numbers that we're seeing just volunteering. So we want to be able to see that in order -- and work with our partners. In order for people to get ready to come back, we want them to go through the prerelease center. That has always been a problem because people go through the county system so quickly, we very rarely have that much time to grab a hold of them and to help them reorient and go back to society. They're coming in and they're leaving. So now we have persons that are 180 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET dedicated at the prison, through the reentry effort, to identify and work with them and also hook them up with what we're trying to do on the outside, which is to get them jobs. So we're doing two things. Working inside and then --
Could you describe specifically what is the assessment process and when does it take place? DEP.
There is -- I know that the prisons are putting in the electronic assessment, but they're using -- and Mr. Cuey is actually the one that is doing this inside. They are using a hybrid of the LSIR, which right now is escaping me what it stands for. But it is a tool that the State uses for assessments that allows you to get a very quick analysis of who the person is who's sitting in front of you and what their deficiencies are. And then we're trying to match that with the 181 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET various programs that are currently available at the prison. We're also trying to wait for the opportunity for direct providers to come in to provide additional services at the prison as well. (Timer bell rings.) DEP.
So it's a two-pronged matter. And we're taking that assessment tool and expanding it going forward so we can hook people up as they come back from the county.
Thank you. I'll wait for the next go-around. But just a quick follow-up. The other 50 percent, what are we doing about them not having a high school diploma? COMM. GIORLA: We have two programs. One's administered by the Philadelphia School District that provides GED training and testing to our juvenile and adult population -- adult basic education, pre-GED, GED testing, and post-GED education. 182 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET There also is a -- for those whose educational level doesn't get them into the pre-GED training, we have an independent-study program known as the Plato Programmed Logic that is computer-based. Students can learn at their own pace. Once they complete the program, they're eligible -- or they will be suitable for the pre-GED program. All three of those have enabled us to increase the number. We've also become a certified GED testing site and trained for additional GED examiners this year. In Calendar Year 2007, we issued 250 GED certificates at the Prisons. And in Calendar Year 2008, we issued 313. And we hope to exceed that even more this year.
You're welcome. The Chair recognizes Councilman Greenlee. 183 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET
Thank you, Madam President. Good afternoon. Actually, the Council President asked a lot of the questions I was going to ask about the population issue, but you talk about, in your testimony, near the end, about the anticipated use of video for court appearances. COMM. GIORLA: Mm-hmm.
How close is that? 'Cause that would seem like it would have a good effect, 'cause you hear a lot of stories, you know, about cases that get continued 'cause there was some mix-up in bringing down a defendant to court. How close are we to that, would you say? COMM. GIORLA: We are partially operating a video court system at Curran Fromhold.
Okay. COMM. GIORLA: Some pleas are negotiated. And there detainer's hearings 184 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET often heard by video at Curran Fromhold.
Mm-hmm. COMM. GIORLA: We're selecting sites in each other facility so that we don't have to transport inmates so that, you know, they will be available. Sometimes they get stuck in traffic.
Sure. COMM. GIORLA: And we don't want to add to any delays. We're hoping to reach a point where, in working in conjunction with the courts, where all the courtrooms at the CJC wired for video, all of the jail facilities located on State Road are wired for video. And, virtually, every court appearance, other than a trial, could be held on video.
Mm-hmm. That's what I was going to say and that's what Mr. Gillison -- COMM. GIORLA: That's what we're trying to do, that's correct.
There's no 185 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET problem, no legal difficulty in doing that? DEP.
Well, right now, we're working on the protocol. We're working on it actively not only with the courts but with the Defender Association and with the District Attorney. I know that there has heretofore been an objection, but I think we have already overcome that objection. And right now, we are all in CJAB, or the Criminal Justice Advisory Board. We are talking about and actually implementing the protocol.
There are some criminal procedure rules that say that a defendant has the right to a face-to-face encounter --
-- with his accuser. However, since a lot of 186 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET these cases that we have are hearings, where we're just talking about procedural matters, I know that there is no real objection if we could handle those matters, because a lot of them are to the benefit of the defendant.
So I think we have now reached a compromise there. What we have to do is work on the technical, and I know that the First Judicial District has been a wonderful partner, saying that they were willing to put dollars, if they can, to help this matter going forward. Justice McCafferey was at a CJAB meeting and suggested that they would help out. And we're trying to meet that same fervor to help us move in this matter. So this has been one of those success things that people don't know about but we're really working very well together to try to get this accomplished.
That would 187 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET sound like it would make a big difference if it works. Okay. Can I just ask one more thing on the whole issue of what you call provisional housing. Now, that's not the same thing as what we call "halfway houses," is it? COMM. GIORLA: No, no. The provision is based on our population levels.
Right, okay. So this is really people that are in there, they don't go back and forth in the community, right? COMM. GIORLA: No. 17
Okay. COMM. GIORLA: We have a work-release program where inmates go back and forth in the community.
That's not. And the 17th and Cambria site, is 188 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET that fully -- totally just provisional or is that -- COMM. GIORLA: That's -- we've had that -- been contracted with a landlord there. We provide security and medical services.
Right. COMM. GIORLA: We've been contracted with the landlord there since 2001.
Mm-hmm. COMM. GIORLA: That's a full- confinement facility. The inmates don't leave.
Now, as far as halfway houses, has the use of them increased over time? What kind of effect has that had on the population? DEP.
Yeah. 189 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET DEP.
The bottom line is, every study and everyone who has been in corrections will tell you that 95 percent of the people are coming back.
And they're coming back to where they left. And unless we can provide programs where they are living, then we're really opening up this vicious cycle, and that's the insanity of this whole thing.
And I'm aware of the matters that we have where people in the community necessarily have fear.
I think 190 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET it's our obligation to speak to that fear and to meet that fear head-on so that we can say that the people who are coming back are people who are their neighbors who just left, and they're coming back anyway. And I'd rather have it in a productive sense rather than in a nonproductive sense.
I hear you. I know that's sometimes a tough argument to make. DEP.
And sometimes we're put in the position where we have to argue with people on that. DEP.
It is literally the 21st century issue that we have to hit. And people have to understand that if you don't want prison 191 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET budgets that are, you know, off the hook, percent increases every year, we've got 4 to solve the recidivism rate in the 5 community. And that's where it's got to 6 go. 7
Yeah, I 8 hear you. Okay. 9 Thank you, Madam President. 10
You're welcome. The Chair recognizes Councilman Jones.
Ah, I couldn't have timed that better. First, let me say and quickly say that ofttimes, this Council is accused of not giving credit where credit is due. I'd like to say, Commissioner, that you've made improvements. And I hear it in the difference between last year and this year, about things you're taking seriously. I know some of my colleagues' concerns still need to be addressed. But it is encouraging to 192 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET me to see that you respond to those kinds of questions, and you don't get asked the same question over and over and over again. And, hopefully, next year, when you come back, you'll make some improvements upon the issue of dropout rates. And so, I wanted to say that to you. DEP.
The second thing is -- and anyone at the table can answer this -- if we were to include Police, Prisons, and the justice system in one category, what would that represent by way of the City's budget? DEP.
24 percent. 24 So it is logical to say -- and we can count all the paper clips, we can turn in 193 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET our keys to the car. We can do all kinds -- I'm not. (Laughter.)
But until we address that large part of our budget, we will be constantly spinning our wheels. DEP.
In so doing, can you answer the following questions: What percentage of that 9700 population in prison is there with a $500 or less bail? COMM. GIORLA: I don't -- I don't know the percentage, but I can give you a number figure. There's about 4 of the 600 with those bails.
So it's more like a thousand. COMM. GIORLA: In single holds. 194 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET
It's more like a thousand. COMM. GIORLA: When you look at those under 10,000 --
Right. COMM. GIORLA: We've looked at under $10,000 bail.
Right. COMM. GIORLA: Single holds, which means that they paid bail, they can get out.
Right. COMM. GIORLA: -- that number's about a thousand.
-- inmates that, under some stretch of the imagination, under some type of supervision, under some type of organized 195 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET effort, would not be charged to our budget of $100 a day. And you said the average stay there is how long? COMM. GIORLA: It's 91 days.
It's 91 days. And that's $9100 per person on -- and arguably, in some people's account, should not even be there technically 'cause it costs us so much and it takes away from the attention of those people who do need to be there. So one of the things that we looked at -- and Deputy Mayor Gillison took a ride up to a place called Red Hook in Brooklyn, New York, where they had community courts. And the Council was kind of enough to have hearings here, and we brought that here. And we have a community court rendition in Center City, but it is not quite the hybrid that would be able to address some of the common, day-to-day, quality-of-life issues in neighborhoods. So you made the comment, which 196 4/20/09 - COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE - FY '10 BUDGET opened the door for community courts, which was that if we could avoid them ever going up there in the first place, if we could keep them kids -- give a sense of justice that was local, if we could involve the community in what that justice and what those priorities were. In the case of Red Hook, they went from a high-crime area to two years straight having the largest reduction in crime of any other precinct in Brooklyn, New York. And you were a part of that presentation. DEP.