to the property are they on a lease are they paying rent they do pay rent um but we don't
have any leases no leases so sort of like honor separate contractual agreements yeah so when
people move in uh the people that live there will like interview new people potentially and then
they'll decide together whether or not um this person should should move in or not um and then
uh yeah that's that's how it's happened what's the process if there's an issue with someone that
moved in um there has been people where as a community everyone else has decided that someone
was a bad fit and they have been asked to leave and they've left they've just like there's never
been any issues no squatters no no no need for ejectment there there's is there a regular meeting
yeah we meet once a month um and have for i don't know 14 years i guess at this point so sort of
like a community agreements everybody so just like honor code lives it's a communal house
everybody gets that part but that doesn't mean that but they act they act communally and in in
how they govern themselves and then are there any like rules or requirements for the people that are
staying in the house like chores or how they participate that has evolved over time currently
there's a chore chart that people fill out when they do chores and but you know it's had all we've
had all sorts of models over the years to try to find the best way to share to share chores we also
do a once a week work day I mean once a month work day on the house and then once the weather
gets nicer there's a big garden in the back that is also a once a month like common work someone
elected the lead person that makes the decisions or um nobody's elected i guess i have a little
extra sway as the longest member and as the property owner um but i i you know i'm a i'm a
quaker and i believe in consensus um and so i i practice that in the house so you do realize that
the city's definition of
this is
you can't have more than
can you speak up just a little
I said you can't have more than
three people unrelated by
blood marriage or adoption
and a property so
that's why you need
some kind of
variance
approval for
maybe not variance if they're calling it
special exception. This is not your usual model for what you would call group living either.
living either exactly which is why we wanted to distinguish with that court opinion
Exactly, which is why we wanted to distinguish with that court opinion.
that this is really but you this is really a single family dwelling with with an expanded
definition of family that sounds that sounds nice but the the opinion you're citing to
is from what 2005 2004 2004 and the definition that the city adopted with respect to
what is considered to be a family, okay, came into effect after that. And the city's
statutes, the zoning code is like a statute. It has the force and effect of a statute.
So it does, but this is about the definition of family and the Supreme Court has precedence over
the zoning code when it comes to a definition.
They might if they had said this.
Yeah, if they had said this before.
You know what I mean?
The city came up with their definition of what is a family,
and that hasn't been challenged.
And this case is not an appeal against Sal and I.
It's not about the interpretation of the code.
So we have to focus on the special exception and what L&I is deciding to characterize this as, and whether you meet the special exception standards.
So we are asking for the special exception, but I wanted to emphasize the newer understanding in the courts of what a family is to highlight that it makes no sense to put a temporary special exception in this matter.
i i mean i i know it's getting late so so tell me why you think councilwoman bass is wrong
uh i think that she well we'll hear from charles richardson in particular but i want to know what
i mean because i think i mean i i understand both sides yeah i do but i mean if he leaves
or sells to somebody else the person that comes in is not like him he's he's really tough to deal
with for the whole thing the zoning state with the property it does it does but what what has
been happening more often is that if if someone like ross would would sell his house and someone
would buy it they would try to put multi-family apartments and they would break it up um many
houses in germantown who that are these mansions they've been breaking them up and so what we're
doing here is preserving the architectural heritage and and also the communal um the
the communal what the communal yeah but the architectural heritage could also be preserved by
getting the building landmark there's other ways to do that so i think like to put that in place
i think everyone can understand and appreciate an expanded use of the word family i think
specifically what i think chairman bergman was trying to ask you is what's the pushback around
what councilman bast has decided because it's it's not based on any evidence whatsoever it's
purely subjective conjecture and and and that shouldn't be the basis for a special exception
there has to be something tangible some reason why there's some why there's something because
this is that this is a permitted use as long as we have a special exception yeah i think and yeah
so there's literally since since it started and there are other houses on the same block
this has just been a positive um positive yeah i'm not saying it's not right all i'm saying is
so you what you're objecting to is every five years you'd have to go back and get that again
right right and no one does that for a single family house and it's really the same um so
it's just if you had it could not be the same so i think the difference of this instance
is that you are asking us to judge the continued permanent use of a property based on the seven
individuals that live there currently we might agree with mr hennessy and his his housemates
current version, right? Nobody's questioning their familiarity to each other. I think the
question is what happens in the future? What stops this from being something that could be considered
more nefarious in purpose, right? There's nothing that could stop this house from any of those
other uses under the current definition if it's granted in perpetuity. We're asking for a proviso
that takes out all those other options and just leaves in... Your proviso does not address a
brothel, your divisor does not address
a cult, there's multiple things that
could happen in the same group
setting under that definition. A brothel?
I'm just saying.
Under the vague
definition. I don't think
there is a brothel section
in the zoning code.
Let me bring this back in.
I think you...
I guess my concern
is, this is
If this is considered a special exception type use, they run with the land just as variances.
They run with the land just as variances.
Right.
Right.
I've never, I don't know of a temporary special exception as opposed to a temporary variance.
I've never, I don't.
I mean, I don't agree with the concept of a temporary variance.
We've had long conversations about this.
But I would just say, let's say you had a single family house with people related to each other.
and let's say some of the young people in that house are are more or less juvenile delinquents
and they're terrorizing the neighborhood there's no recourse there you can't say well we should
have put a temporary temporary special exception on this house i understand these people i understand
listen i understand everything you say yeah um what i want to do is take this back to the
executive session so we can have a a conversation about okay where we stand with this and and i
don't you know i'm not saying where i am either way and i think that hillary will be part of the
conversation we'll talk about the law and things like that uh and i'm and i'm not so that's where
i think okay i'm gonna be with it i do want to get my testimony absolutely could you why don't you do
all right ross um you've been sitting next to me the whole time you've heard um the testimony that
i gave do you believe do you do um believe that it was true and accurate and do you adopt it as
your own yes i do um and the the final argument is that um we we urge you to to give us a special
exception without without limit because there are no negative impacts of the special exception on
the surrounding neighborhood in fact this is one of the biggest assets that this block is filled
with these with these communal letters yeah letters yeah so thank you and i'm gonna see thank
Thank you.
Hillary, can we hold this for two weeks?
If you'd like, Mr. Chair, we can hold this.
Why don't we hold this for two weeks?
We'll vote on it that Wednesday in two weeks at 2 p.m.
It's Wednesday, March 5th.
Do you want the Planning Commission's testimony, or are you going to wait on that?
Yeah, why don't you do it?
Sorry, take the public and the Planning Commission, so then we can close the record.
Questions from the public?
um yes mr chair i have charles richardson with the hand raised
mr richardson
are we coming back in as a panel shortly
i'm just laughing myself mr chair so so mr richardson you so you know since i've been here
this is the latest you've been here.
Yes, sir. This is true.
We're past 630. This is the latest you've been here,
sir. This is true.
Could you please give us your word?
State your name, because you've already
been sworn, and give us your words of wisdom.
Charles Richardson, Office of
Councilwoman Cindy Bass, room 508
in City Hall.
I have on the phone with
me, and he's on speaker right now,
Mr. Ted Stones,
who is the chair
of the 12th Ward
RCO. I had a conversation with him yesterday.
Well, first I talked to Steve, and I needed to find out what was going
on with this, because I had questions.
And when I spoke to Ted Stone
a little later on, the question came up as to, okay, so
and they actually were trying to push for
the special exception to expire if the house was
sold or anything along those lines, which can happen because of the fact that it doesn't work
that way. But I did speak to him further and let him know that he could ask for a temporary
special exception because of the fact that we don't know what can happen. God forbid that
Mr. Hennessey passes away or anything along those lines. Where does the house go? And then
you know what about these people and then number two well ted do you have anything to say real
quick before i finish up mine so i would have to swear him in okay
hey mr chair could you state your name please
i i can't hear it theodore stones he said
i'm trying to get it up as loud as i can but it's not it's not going up um i think i think
I think what we should do is we've heard your testimony.
And I got something else.
I got something else, too.
All right.
He's taking rent.
He's accepting rent.
And from what Mr. Stone has told me a little bit, because he found a letter.
Somebody wrote a letter of support, but they wrote that he takes in $400 to $600 per person.
There is no rental license on this property at all.
no licenses no permits no nothing it's just you know it's it's it's it's like
No licenses, no permits, no nothing.
It's like he's running a rooming house there and just benefiting from that and then calling it what he wants to call it.
This is just, it's egregious.
And, you know, I just can't, I was going to do non-opposition, but at this point in time, you know, we're going to go opposition to this.
because they don't want to accept something that would have helped them out
and something that the community wanted.
Not so much that, you know, and Steve has brought in all the subterfuge with regard to, you know,
the law, this, the law, that, let's call it what it is.
It's a glorified rooming house at this point in time.
And if somebody else took it over, nothing would stop them from being able to turn it into a rooming house.
All right.
Mr. Richardson, thank you for staying late.
We appreciate it.
Do you have any questions for him?
i don't have questions but i'll give you a chance to respond all right mr richardson thank you very
much mr hennessey lives in the house this is his house you can't have a rental license when it's
your own house your own there's no other units in the house this is this is one house and it's
a family of people who are unrelated to each other and he lives there so that it's not eligible for
rental license it's a rooming house i will i think what we'll do is you know we'll uh okay
um so like when i go on to eclipse to sign up for a rental license the first question asks do you
live here and if you put yes it says you can't get a rental license okay thank you uh for your
comments we will do this what was it hillary the fifth planning oh thank you chairman i appreciate
it all right thank you chairman uh and board members uh good evening david fechter with the
city planning commission the comprehensive plan recommends no change to the rsa3 residential
single family zoning at this location the appellant has shown the proposed group living