COUNCIL OF THE CITY OF PHILADELPHIA2 COMMITTEE ON RULES - - - Room 400, City Hall4 Philadelphia, Pennsylvania Wednesday, December 8, 2010, 10:19 p.m.5 - - - BILL 100079 - Amending Title 14 of the Philadelphia Code, entitled "Zoning and7 Planning," by adding a Subsection 14-1640, entitled "Ridge Avenue Special District8 Controls," under certain terms and conditions. 9 BILL 100753 - Amending Philadelphia Zoning Maps by changing zoning designations of10 certain areas of land located within area bounded by E. Moreland Avenue, Winston Street,11 E. Mermaid Lane, and Germantown Avenue. 12 BILL 100784 - Amending Philadelphia Zoning Maps by changing the zoning designations of13 certain areas of land located within an area bounded by Eighth Street, Somerset Street,14 Seventh Street, and Lehigh Avenue. 15 COMMITTEE MEMBERS PRESENT: Anna C. Verna, Chair W. Wilson Goode, Jr.16 Blondell Reynolds Brown William K. Greenlee Darrell L. Clarke Jack Kelly17 Frank DiCicco Donna Reed Miller 18 Also Present: Councilman Frank Rizzo 19 - - - 20 21 22 23 24 25 2 12.8.10 - RULES - Bill No. 1000791
Good2 morning, everyone. This is a public3 hearing of the Committee on Rules. I4 would ask the clerk to please read the5 title of Bill No. 100079.6
Bill No. 100079, an7 ordinance amending Title 14 of the8 Philadelphia Code, entitled "Zoning and9 Planning," by adding a Subsection10 14-1640, entitled "Ridge Avenue Special11 District Controls," under certain terms12 and conditions.13 (Witness comes forward.)14
Good15 morning. Please identify yourself for16 the record and proceed with your17 testimony.18 (Witness comes forward.)19
Good morning,20 Council President Verna and members of21 the Rules Committee.22 I am William Kramer, Division23 Director of the Development Division of24 the Philadelphia City Planning25 3 12.8.10 - RULES - Bill No. 1000791 Commission, and I am here today to2 testify on Bill No. 100079, which was3 introduced into City Council on February4 12, 2010.5 Bill No. 100079 amends the6 Philadelphia Zoning Code by creating a7 new zoning overlay entitled, "The Ridge8 Avenue Special District Controls," which9 will place new land use height, façade,10 and signage controls for only those11 properties zoned C2-Commercial that have12 on Ridge Avenue between Hermitage Street13 and Monastery Avenue.14 Bill No. 100079 creates use15 restrictions in this district. They16 include certain auto-related uses as well17 as temporary employment agencies,18 warehouses, and wholesale showrooms which19 will be prohibited in the Ridge Avenue20 Special District Controls area.21 Additionally, in an effort to22 permit only active uses on the ground23 floor only, certain uses are prohibited24 on the ground floor only, including25 4 12.8.10 - RULES - Bill No. 1000791 professional offices, funeral parlors,2 laboratories, personal service or3 treatment of patients, radio or4 television studios, and certain utilities5 The new district establishes6 requirements for properties affected by7 these new controls, including an8 8,000-square-foot limitation on the9 amount of net leaseable ground area used10 for commercial purposes in newly erected11 buildings. Newly erected buildings shall12 not be less than 25 feet or more than 4513 feet above grade.14 New regulations permitting roof15 structures and headhouses are created,16 permitting such structures under certain17 terms and conditions.18 New landscape screening,19 lighting, and façade provisions will be20 added for new structures built within the21 district.22 New sign controls are included23 in the bill requiring that signage must24 be accessory to the current building use,25 5 12.8.10 - RULES - Bill No. 1000791 and Art Commission approval will be2 required for projecting signs.3 Prohibited signs include intermittently4 illuminated box and awning signs,5 freestanding pole and monument signs,6 rooftop signs, signs with intermittent7 flashing illumination, and signs with8 digital electronic messages9 In order to maintain an active10 district, vehicular access from Ridge11 Avenue shall be prohibited, and all12 street parking shall be permitted only13 within the rear 50 percent of the lot14 depth. And a parking lot having more15 than five parking spaces must provide16 landscaping which shall not be less than17 15 percent of the area of the parking18 lot.19 The Philadelphia City Planning20 Commission, at its meeting on March 16,21 2010, recommended Bill No. 100079 be22 approved.23 That's the conclusion of my24 testimony. If you have any questions,25 6 12.8.10 - RULES - Bill No. 1000791 I'll be happy to answer them for you.2
Thank3 you.4 The Chair recognizes Councilman5 Jones.6
Thank you,7 Madam Chair.8 The Fourth District is blessed9 with a number of strong, viable10 commercial corridors; one of them is11 Ridge Avenue. In spite of a recession,12 they've managed to grow and maintain job13 creation.14 They've managed to maintain a15 persona of being one of the best small16 towns in the City of Philadelphia. It's17 a place where people know you. The Ridge18 Avenue Diner and other places are19 landmarks up there, where, almost in a20 small-town manner, you can walk down the21 street and still get your shoes fixed and22 things like that.23 This does not happen all by24 itself; it happens with the good25 7 12.8.10 - RULES - Bill No. 1000791 leadership of Bernard Guet, who has2 been the -- who we've been blessed to3 have as our president up there, has done4 a yeoperson's job of holding things5 together in spite of the economic6 climate.7 In order to do what he has to8 do and maintain the quality of the9 business association and the partnership10 with us, but also his membership is11 important, and he has moved the12 boundaries a little bit to include some13 people who actually want to be included,14 and I'm happy that this kind of15 forward-thinking and this kind of16 organization exists within our district,17 and it should be replicated around the18 City.19
Thank20 you very much.21 Are there any questions of22 Mr. Kramer from members of the committee?23 (No questions.)24 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:25 8 12.8.10 - RULES - Bill No. 1000791 Mr. Kramer, thank you very much.2 Our next witness is the3 Executive Director of the Roxborough4 Development Corporation.5 (Witness comes forward.)6
My name is Bernard11 Guet. I'm the Executive Director for the12 Roxborough Development Corporation.13 Our service area is Ridge14 Avenue from Main Street to Domino Lane.15 Our mission is to work together with16 local businesses and residents to support17 economic development and promote a clean,18 attractive, safe, and prosperous19 community.20 Philadelphia is a city of21 neighborhoods, and neighborhoods are very22 much part of the heritage of this city.23 Already several CDCs, which are community24 development corporations, have created25 9 12.8.10 - RULES - Bill No. 1000791 Special Services Districts for their2 commercial corridor.3 The zoning overlays ensure that4 the unique fabric and every5 characteristic of each of these6 neighborhoods is protected. Special7 Services Districts alter the type of8 business usage, signage, building height,9 as Mr. Kramer mentioned just before me.10 The creation of a special11 district enables neighborhood commercial12 corridors to create an engaging shopping13 environment based on the desires of local14 residential and business leaders.15 The Roxborough Development16 Corporation has commissioned Brown &17 Keener, our associate, to develop a18 Special Services District plan between19 Monastery and Hermitage Street. We are20 not talking the entire corridor; we are21 talking a section of the corridor, which22 is a central corridor here.23 In 2004, the RDC developed a24 master plan for the Roxborough Commercial25 10 12.8.10 - RULES - Bill No. 1000791 Corridor and started to implement it in2 2005. To this day, we continue to grow3 the same consistent vision. This4 proposal will reaffirm our master plan5 and is consistent with our vision for6 this section of the commercial corridors7 to become an active, vibrant,8 entertaining section of Roxborough.9 For the past year-and-a-half,10 we have worked with the Planning11 Commission -- Mr. Kramer that just spoke12 before me again -- and they guided us13 with a few recommendations that were14 implemented. It was presented to the15 entire Planning Commission, including16 Mr. Allen Greenberger, who favorably17 approved it.18 We have produced a well-19 illustrated, easy-to-read Ridge Avenue20 rule book to give to future developer,21 and we have one copy for the Council if22 needed.23 Keeping in line with this24 vision, we are asking City Council to25 11 12.8.10 - RULES - Bill No. 1000791 give its stamp of approval.2 Thank you.3
Thank4 you very much.5 Are there any questions or6 comments of this witness?7 (No questions.)8
Our12 next witness is Jo Ann Desper, Roxborough13 Development Corporation.14 (Witness comes forward.)15
Good morning,18 Madam Chair and Councilmembers. My name19 is Jo Ann Desper. I live at 609 Hermit20 Street, in the Roxborough area,21 particularly in the Wissahickon area of22 Roxborough. I'm a founding member of23 Neighbors Enhancing Wissahickon, I'm a24 board member of the Roxborough25 12 12.8.10 - RULES - Bill No. 1000791 Development Corporation, and chair of the2 Promotions Committee.3 I'm here representing a lot of4 people like myself who have put a lot of5 time and attention into helping brand6 Roxborough as a place for fun, family,7 and shopping. We feel it's essential8 that we brand Roxborough as this9 destination for shopping and dining,10 particularly the area that Mr. Guet spoke11 about between Monastery Avenue and12 Hermitage Street.13 The master plan about which he14 spoke has identified this section of the15 corridor as the Neighborhood Downtown16 Central Business District, and it serves17 pedestrian shoppers. Many of the18 building uses in this section of Ridge19 Avenue are commercial, with residential20 units located above the businesses, and21 are situated against the sidewalk. They22 are really geared towards having a23 pleasant walking experience along the24 ridge.25 13 12.8.10 - RULES - Bill No. 1000791 Businesses are accessible for2 pedestrian shoppers. We have two3 municipal parking lots located on4 adjacent side streets that provide 2005 parking spaces offering free two-hour6 parking for shoppers who come to the7 area.8 If the ordinance to permit the9 Special Services District for the Ridge10 Avenue Commercial Corridor between11 Monastery Avenue and Hermitage Street is12 affirmed by City Council, it will only13 enhance the Roxborough Commercial14 District and afford opportunities for new15 businesses and new growth.16 This is an opportunity for the17 Mayor and City Council, along with the18 Commerce Department, to continue their19 mission to support the revitalization of20 the Roxborough Commercial Corridor,21 create additional jobs, and sustain the22 local economy. We ask that you please23 consider extending this.24 Thank you very much for your25 14 12.8.10 - RULES - Bill No. 1000791 time.2
Thank3 you. Thank you.4 Any questions of this witness?5 (No questions.)6 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:7 Again, I thank you.8 Do we have anyone else to9 testify on this bill? Please come10 forward and identify yourself for the11 record.12 (Witness comes forward.)13
I'm Mark Keener of14 Brown & Keener Urban Design. I've been15 working with Roxborough since 2004 and am16 one of the primary authors of this, along17 with the Planning Commission.18 I think one of the things, as19 you know, all of Philadelphia de facto20 main streets have become so over time,21 and the orderly conversion of a road to a22 main street, you know, takes a bit of23 trouble, but it's done by incremental24 investment over time. And even today,25 15 12.8.10 - RULES - Bill No. 1000791 every one of those property owners are2 investing in their properties.3 And what this does, together4 with the guide books that we created, it5 provides a way that every increment of6 investment makes Ridge Avenue a little7 better rather than a little worse.8 Everybody has sort of laid out what is in9 here; Mr. Kramer was very articulate10 about the content.11 I could answer any questions12 about the intention.13
Does14 anyone have any questions?15 (No questions.)16
No?17 Thank you.18 Do we have anyone else to19 testify on this bill?20 (No response.)21 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:22 Seeing no one, we will now consider Bill23 No. 100784 at this point in time.24
Bill No. 100784, an25 16 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007841 ordinance to amend the Philadelphia2 Zoning Maps by changing the zoning3 designations of certain areas of land4 located within an area bounded by Eighth5 Street, Somerset Street, Seventh Street,6 and Lehigh Avenue.7 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:8 Mr. Kramer?9
Good morning,10 Council President Verna and members of11 the Rules Committee. I am William12 Kramer, Division Director of the13 Development Division of the Philadelphia14 City Planning Commission, and I am here15 today to testify on Bill No. 100784,16 which was introduced into City Council17 November 18, 2010.18 Bill No. 100784 will amend the19 Philadelphia Zoning Maps by rezoning the20 block bounded by Eighth Street, Somerset21 Street, Seventh Street, and Lehigh Avenue22 from an existing zoning designation of23 R5-Residential to the proposed24 designations of ASC-Area Shopping Center25 17 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007841 and C3-Commercial.2 This block is the site of the3 old Edison High School, which is4 presently vacant and is in disrepair.5 The developers intend to subdivide the6 block into two portions and reuse a7 portion of the existing building for a8 senior housing development on the one9 parcel, approximately 61,000 square feet,10 and demolish the structures on the other11 parcel in order to construct a new12 shopping center with an expected grocery13 store of approximately 20,000 square14 feet, some other retail uses, and pad15 uses, possibly including a drive-through16 restaurant.17 The Philadelphia City Planning18 Commission will consider Bill No. 10078419 at its meeting of December 14, 2010, and20 it will be presented with a staff21 recommendation for approval.22 That's the conclusion of my23 testimony, and I'd be happy to answer any24 questions you may have.25 18 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007841
Thank2 you.3 Are there any questions for4 Mr. Kramer from members of the committee?5 (No questions.)6
Thank7 you, Mr. Kramer.8 Our next witness is Leslie9 Smallwood-Lewis.10 (Witness comes forward.)11
My name16 is Leslie Smallwood-Lewis, and I am one17 of the partners of 701 West Lehigh18 Partners, which entered into an agreement19 of sale with the Philadelphia School20 District on March 10, 2010, to purchase21 the old Thomas Edison High School site,22 located at 701 West Lehigh Avenue.23 Joined with me today are other24 partners of 701 West Lehigh Partners and25 19 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007841 the seller of the property, the School2 District of Philadelphia.3 We are before you today,4 seeking your recommendation and approval5 for the site to be rezoned from its6 current R-5 designation to a split7 designation of C-3 for the rear portion8 and area shopping center for the front9 portion of the site, as proposed by the10 Philadelphia City Planning Commission.11 The Thomas Edison High School12 has sat vacant for ten-plus years, and13 due to its lack of use and extensive14 vandalism, the building is blighted,15 unsafe, and in need of demolition.16 It is the partnership's17 intention to demolish the school building18 fronting Lehigh Avenue and construct a19 new community retail shopping center. As20 designed, the site will accommodate a21 grocery store, two pads, and an22 additional 12,000 square feet of retail.23 It is also the partnership's24 intention to retain and rehabilitate the25 20 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007841 61,000-square-foot annex building2 fronting Somerset Street into a 60+ unit3 affordable senior housing facility, a4 need that has been confirmed by both the5 community and the Councilwoman's office.6 We have conducted community meetings and7 have been in constant communication with8 the Councilwoman's office regarding the9 project. The community is in support of10 the building being demolished and the11 site being redeveloped into community12 retail and senior residential living.13 Our plan for the site calls for14 the retail center to front Lehigh Avenue,15 which is a four-lane commercial corridor,16 and the senior living to front Somerset,17 which abuts the residential neighborhood.18 Both the partnership and the19 Councilwoman's office believe that our20 proposed design complements and fits21 within the fabric of the community. It22 is anticipated that the project will23 create 60-plus full-time-equivalent jobs24 for community residents and 80-plus25 21 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007841 construction jobs.2 If we are successful in3 rezoning the site, it is the intention of4 the partnership to purchase the site and5 commence demolition early spring of 2011.6 We thank you in advance for7 your support and your yes vote for the8 rezoning of the old Thomas Edison High9 School site.10
Thank11 you very much.12 Any questions from members of13 the committee?14 (No questions.)15 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:16 Seeing none, I thank you.17
Do we20 have anyone else to testify on this bill?21 (No response.)22 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:23 Seeing no one, I would ask the clerk to24 please read the title of Bill No. 100753.25 22 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531
Bill No. 100753, an2 ordinance to amend the Philadelphia3 Zoning Maps by changing the zoning4 designations of certain areas of land5 located within an area bounded by East6 Moreland Avenue, Winston Street, East7 Mermaid Lane, and Germantown Avenue.8 (Witness comes forward.)9 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:10 Mr. Kramer?11
Good morning,12 Council President Verna and members of13 the Rules Committee.14 I am William Kramer, Division15 Director of the Development Planning16 Division of the Philadelphia City17 Planning Commission, and I am here to18 testify on Bill No. 100753, which was19 introduced by Councilmember Miller on20 November 4, 2010.21 Bill No. 100753 amends the22 Philadelphia Zoning Maps by changing the23 zoning designations of certain areas of24 land located within an area bounded by25 23 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 East Moreland Avenue, Winston Street,2 East Mermaid Lane, and Germantown Avenue3 from the existing zoning designation of4 G2-General Industrial to a proposed5 designation of C2-Commercial.6 The remapping will allow the7 Fresenius Medical Center and the Delaware8 Valley Nephrology & Hypertension9 Associates to operate a dialysis center10 with accessory doctors' offices.11 The proposed developer plans to12 rehabilitate existing vacant structures13 and provide parking in the rear. The14 operation will include 34 dialysis15 machines and provide vital medical care16 to the community by providing both17 dialysis treatment and training for18 individuals to manage their care at home.19 This project is the subject of20 a decision by the Zoning Board of21 Adjustment, which is currently on appeal22 in the courts. The decision of the board23 was to grant the requested relief for the24 property, with a proviso limiting the25 24 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 hours of operation. The applicant2 requested the board to reconsider the3 decision, which, at an administrative4 session, the board did. The board5 removed the proviso in executive session,6 and a decision was appealed to the7 courts.8 The predominant zoning9 designation for this block is commercial,10 either a C-2 or a C-1 commercial11 designation; therefore, the rezoning of12 the parcel to C2-Commercial designation13 is consistent with the existing pattern14 of land use on the block. This bill does15 recognize the existence and continued16 operation of an industrial entity17 adjacent to the subject property.18 The Philadelphia City Planning19 Commission considered Bill No. 100753 at20 their meeting of November 16, 2010.21 After consideration, the Commission22 recommended that Bill No. 100753 be23 approved.24 It should be noted that at the25 25 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 meeting, there were several2 representatives of the community raising3 their concerns with regards to this bill.4 The Philadelphia City Planning Commission5 also recommended that Councilwoman Miller6 continue to assist the continuing7 dialogue between all the interested8 parties.9 That's the conclusion of my10 testimony. I appreciate the opportunity11 to be before you and answer any questions12 you may have.13
Thank14 you, Mr. Kramer.15 Mr. Kramer, I know that I,16 along with my colleagues, have received17 quite a bit of correspondence on this,18 and some people are saying that this is,19 quote, spot zoning.20 Would you address that issue,21 please, for the record.22
Yes, ma'am.23 For the record, this is a24 particular block that had a combination25 26 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 of G2-Industrial for a large portion of2 it along Moreland Avenue to Winston3 Street, and further along Winston Street.4 So there was this triangular piece of5 ground that was zoned G-2.6 The primary consideration of7 this block is, it mostly is C-2 and C-1.8 This would rezone a portion of this back9 to C-2 or to C-2.10 With the vacation of industrial11 uses in this existing building, if I were12 to go in and look at the properties13 without a use in here giving the existing14 commercial designation on the other15 ground on the block, we would normally16 consider rezoning this to a commercial17 classification.18 The number of (indiscernible)19 classification depends on the structure20 and how tall it is and how much area21 there is involved with it. In this case,22 it would most likely be a C-223 classification.24 It would not necessarily be25 27 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 considered spot zoning in that in this2 particular instance, it is one property.3 But given the fact that it makes up a4 large portion of the block that is then5 consistent in changing to what the rest6 of the designation of the block would be,7 I would say that it is not spot zoning.8 And we are recognizing that9 there's an ironworks, I believe,10 industrial use just adjacent to this that11 we are remaining as G-2.12
Thank13 you. I just thought that that should be14 placed on the record. Thank you so much.15 The Chair recognizes Councilman16 DiCicco.17 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: Thank you,18 Madam Chair.19 Good morning, Mr. Kramer. Two20 questions. I just actually got one21 answered for it from Councilwoman Miller.22 I notice on the existing map23 and the proposed map, on the proposed24 map, you still leave an area of 45 feet25 28 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 wide; I don't know how deep it is, 982 feet deep, as G2-Commercial. Wouldn't it3 be more appropriate to do all of that G-24 to a C-2, understanding that there's an5 existing business there but they would be6 grandfathered in?7
That is correct.8 We could have done that, but we don't9 normally rezone the property unless we10 are requested to do so, unless it's a11 part of an overall community-based12 remapping bill.13 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: And my14 other question is: As a matter of right,15 give us some examples of the kinds of16 uses that could be permitted if the G-217 classification was not removed.18
The G-219 classification is a classification that20 allows fairly heavy industrial uses on21 the property. It allows manufacture of22 all sorts of different things from their23 base materials.24 As a differentiation in a25 29 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 limited industrial classification, you're2 taking Part A and Part B and putting them3 together, or doing warehousing and that4 kind of thing.5 More heinous is, G-2 would6 permit you to do outside storage of7 materials. So you could take your8 parking lot and turn it into a moving9 place where you store all the pallets of10 stuff coming in and out of the building11 as a matter of right.12 You can do this stuff -- short13 of like a blast furnace, you can do a lot14 of fairly heavy industrial uses onsite.15 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: As a16 matter of right?17
Yes.18 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: Thank you.19 No other questions.20
Thank21 you. The Chair recognizes Councilman22 Greenlee.23
Thank24 you, Madam President.25 30 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 Councilman DiCicco took my one2 question; I was going to ask that.3 But the other one, just so4 I'm -- we are as clear as possible on the5 spot zoning issue that the Council6 President raised, is it basically fair to7 say your answer is that you don't feel8 it's spot zoning 'cause of, first, the9 size of the lot; and also, it is making10 it consistent with the majority of the11 rest of the area. Is that the two12 reasons?13
'Cause I15 know spot zoning, the word gets thrown16 out a lot. And I know it's -- oftentimes17 size-wise, it's an argument. So it's the18 size and the consistency, I guess.19
Okay, all21 right. Thank you.22 Thank you, Madam Chair.23
Thank24 you.25 31 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 Any other questions from2 members of the committee?3 (No further questions.)4
Paul Deegan and12 Kevin Dow from the Commerce Department.13 (Witnesses come forward.)14
Good15 morning. Please identify yourself for16 the record.17
Good morning. My18 name is Kevin Dow. I'm the Chief19 Operating Officer of the Commerce20 Department.21
My name is Paul22 Deegan, Senior Vice President of the23 Philadelphia Industrial Development24 Corporation.25 32 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531
Good morning. I'm5 here to testify today regarding Bill No.6 100753.7 Through our Office of8 Businesses Services Division, Commerce9 has been working with Reno Enterprises10 since last spring. Reno contacted us11 when they began experiencing challenges12 related to their relocation and expansion13 of their dialysis center, located in14 Mt. Airy, to Chestnut Hill, located at 1015 East Moreland Avenue.16 The property they would like to17 purchase and renovate has been granted a18 zoning variance to use the G2-classified19 property as a medical treatment facility,20 with a proviso which limits hours on21 Tuesdays, Thursdays, and Saturdays from22 6 a.m. to 6 p.m., rather than the23 standard hours of 6 a.m. to 9 p.m.24 In addition to a number of25 33 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 other support letters, Commerce provided2 its own signed by the Deputy Mayor for3 Economic Development.4 The dialysis center is a5 $2 million that will create 756 construction jobs and create and/or7 retain 40 permanent jobs. The Department8 of Commerce supports this resolution --9 excuse me, this bill for three specific10 reasons:11 1. It creates jobs at a time12 when Philadelphia is experiencing one of13 the largest unemployment rates in our14 history.15 2. The center itself will meet16 the high need for our population of17 treatment centers of this nature in a18 location that's convenient and accessible19 by public transportation.20 3. Finally, it augments the21 diversity of the business mix on22 Germantown Avenue through the removal of23 a vacant property and an addition of24 pedestrian traffic that can utilize other25 34 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 businesses on the corridor.2 Thank you for your3 consideration of these comments. I would4 be happy to answer any questions any5 members of the committee may have.6
Thank7 you, Mr. Dow.8 Any questions of Mr. Dow from9 members of the committee?10 (No questions.)11 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:12 Again, thank you.13
I would like to go15 on record to say that we support the16 Commerce and Planning recommendations.17 We're also providing financing through18 the City's new, innovative Greenworks or19 Energy Works program to the project.20 It's the kind of project we21 particularly like. It's a small22 business, it's neighborhood-oriented, and23 it hits one of the important sectors in24 Philadelphia's economy, the health care,25 35 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 health services sector. So we support2 the location and the redevelopment of3 this property with the Delaware Valley4 Nephrology & Hypertension Associates.5 I'd be happy to answer any6 questions you may have.7
Thank8 you.9 Any questions from the members10 of the committee?11 (No questions.)12
Carl Primavera and19 LaRhonda Jones.20 (Witnesses come forward.)21 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:22 Mr. Deegan, would you mind returning to23 the witness table. Councilwoman Brown24 has a question.25 36 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 (Mr. Deegan returns to witness2 table.)3
This is9 very much an after-thought.10 Share with us what is your11 standard operating procedure or practice12 as it relates to alerting, interfacing13 with, and informing the community about14 the position that PIDC takes on matters15 like this.16 What is the interface, if at17 all, with the community?18
In this case, in19 the financing deal, I don't think we20 have. I think the community was alerted21 to it initially because of the Zoning22 Board of Adjustment hearing, which had23 posters posted on the property; and also,24 with the zoning bill, which was25 37 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 advertised in the paper.2 We do publish a -- the PAID3 board, which approves the loans, has a4 published list of meetings for the whole5 year.6
But we didn't have8 any direct community contact on this9 particular financing application.10
Okay,11 then. So is that the standard operating12 procedure?13
Yes, yes,14 Councilwoman, it is, for financings deal.15 Yes, it is.16
Okay,17 then, very well. Thank you for your18 testimony.19 Thank you, Madam President.20
Good morning,24 Madam Chair and members of the Rules25 38 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 Committee. I am here as the attorney of2 record for the applicant. With me is3 Dr. Edward Jones; also, LaRhonda James.4 LaRhonda has been with5 Fresenius, which is the operator of the6 renal center, for 16 years, at the7 current location, in Mt. Airy. Dr. Jones8 runs the medical component.9 What we really have in this10 renal therapy center is a combination of11 the actual renal treatment, which is12 owned and operated by Fresenius, which13 has 1500 of these throughout the United14 States; they're a multi-billion-dollar15 company based in Europe, with American16 subsidiaries.17 And then we have Dr. Jones, who18 locally is a very esteemed practitioner19 in renal therapy and many hospitals and20 has a long list of achievements. So his21 patients are able to come to the22 facility, receive care and treatment, and23 then also actually receive the renal24 therapy, which you'll hear more about.25 39 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 We also have Brett Feldman from2 my office and Mike Malone, the project3 manager. They'll be holding up4 larger-scale exhibits of information5 that's in your package showing what this6 reconditioned industrial building will7 look like when it, in fact, becomes its8 renal center.9 We also have Mr. Sidvah here,10 who's the regional manager for Fresenius.11
Madam Chair?12 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:13 Excuse me, Mr. Primavera.14 Councilman Goode?15 COUNCILMAN GOODE:16 Mr. Primavera --17
Does this19 project require an economic opportunity20 plan?21
Yes. And we22 have one signed, which we're happy to23 hand up; it may be in the package. We do24 have it.25 40 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 We also exceed the living-wage2 issue; I know that came up recently. And3 we're happy to say we're good on both4 fronts.5
You're welcome.8 Basically, there's a little9 history here, which, I think, has been10 more complicating than it needs to be.11 This building has been12 industrial; right now, it's used to store13 Porta-Potties and to clean them inside14 the building. It's been an industrial15 warehouse really adjacent to the Chestnut16 Hill commercial corridor, where we have17 Staples, McDonald's, video stores, a and18 lot of other bakeries and things. So the19 zoning has been really out of context.20 So the easiest and fastest way21 to change the zoning is to go to the22 Zoning Board. So we went to the Zoning23 Board, with the support of the Chestnut24 Hill Community Association that met over25 41 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 four months with the developers to make2 sure that they were satisfied as to3 design, landscaping, hours, everything.4 We did receive their support.5 We went to the ZBA; we received6 their support, but then an appeal was7 filed. That appeal could languish for8 three years.9 In the meantime, the existing10 facility that Fresenius and Dr. Jones run11 in Mt. Airy is really -- I don't want to12 say "obsolete," but it's old-school, and13 there's a real pressing need for a14 state-of-the-art facility, and that's why15 they were so excited to move to the16 Chestnut Hill location.17 Fresenius, in addition to18 providing renal care, actually19 manufactures and designs the equipment,20 so this is going to be a showplace for21 them in this region, and they hope over22 the next few years to build at least five23 more in the City.24 So we can't wait for that25 42 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 appeal to be resolved. And in many2 instances, we've done this, where we3 think it's faster to go to the Zoning4 Board an it turns out that it's not, so5 then we remap it.6 We've looked hard at the7 spot-zoning issue. Spot-zoning,8 according to Anderson on Zoning, who's9 the number-one writer in Pennsylvania, is10 where you take one small piece and change11 the zoning so it's entirely out of12 context with all of the surrounding13 properties.14 So an example would be, if you15 have a Levittown neighborhood, a thousand16 homes, and in the middle of it, you have17 a Wawa, which happens to be zoned18 commercial; you look at that and say, How19 did that get to be commercial? It kind20 of strikes you as out of character and21 out of context.22 So we believe that remapping is23 entirely appropriate.24 The protestants who you will25 43 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 hear from really are concerned about the2 hours on a third shift, which will not3 happen immediately and will be limited,4 but that takes us on Tuesdays, Thursdays,5 and Saturdays to 9 o'clock at night.6 They would like us to close at 6 o'clock.7 But, as you'll hear in the8 testimony, the renal therapy is done in9 four-hour increments. So the reality is10 that if we need to go to a third shift,11 they have to stay till 9 o'clock. So12 it's just the nature of the treatment.13 We have no overnight stays.14 So it's a very benign use.15 And, unfortunately, it's one where the16 need is growing, because as we all live17 longer hopefully, the need for renal18 services and renal therapy is becoming19 more pronounced.20 So that's our testimony.21 We have LaRhonda here, who runs22 the center in Mt. Airy, and we have23 Dr. Jones, who's the medical director, if24 you'd like to hear from them. We know25 44 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 there are other witnesses. We have2 patients who are getting therapy, who are3 available to testify. We have Craig4 Shelter, who is both a resident of5 Chestnut Hill and a planner.6 So I don't want to belabor the7 record, but we certainly have a lot more8 to say if you think it's helpful.9
The10 Chair recognizes Councilman DiCicco.11 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: Thank you,12 Madam Chair.13 Good morning, Mr. Primavera.14
Good morning.15 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: The16 Porta-Potty, is that an existing17 business, or is that just a storage area?18
It's a storage.19 The owner is here for the property, and20 he's been trying to sell this property21 for a while. He thought his was a great22 use -- not the Porta-Potty, the renal23 center.24 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: I had a25 45 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 question there, but I won't get into2 that.3
It's been over4 a year, so that use is an interim use to5 provide some income to pay the taxes and6 the insurance.7 The other uses that he would be8 looking to sell would be to some type of9 distributor like a -- somebody who comes10 in, uses the warehouse, and then it's11 truck traffic. Matter of fact, his12 broker is Frank Cullen, who's a13 well-known industrial broker.14 And we think that it would be15 unfortunate if this property were to16 become just distribution. You would have17 the rumbling of trucks, open 24/7,18 outdoor storage of material, and it19 really wouldn't help the other20 businesses.21 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: I get22 that. I just was curious about the23 Porta-Potty. If it's in existing use, I24 assume that there are trucks that come25 46 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 and go --2
And pick them3 up.4 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: --5 probably any hour of the day.6
Right.7 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: I don't8 know how many there. From the9 photographs, it looks like there's a10 considerable amount, and that's a11 permitted use.12
Right.13 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: So I'm14 just trying to get to the issue.15 I did receive, as the Council16 President said, several e-mails in17 objection to this bill, but sometimes --18
A19 slaughterhouse would be permitted as a --20 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: Sometimes21 you have to be careful what you wish for.22
That's exactly23 what I mean.24 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: All right,25 47 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 thanks.2
And the owner3 has no desire to be difficult to the4 neighbors, but if this deal doesn't5 happen, it's been a year, and he's going6 to sell to whomever because, you know, he7 needs to --8 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: Well,9 that's assuming he gets somebody who's10 interested. I mean, I don't want to use11 that as a threat to the community.12
No.13 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: But the14 reality is that there is potential for15 those kinds of uses.16
And there already18 is a use that -- I don't know if I would19 like to live across the street from a20 Porta-Potty warehouse.21 But anyway, thank you.22
Right. Thank23 you.24 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:25 48 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 Dr. Jones, can you tell us the number of2 maximum clients per shift?3
Yes.4 First, thank you for the5 opportunity to represent the 170 patients6 that live in the northwest community that7 currently undergo therapy for their8 end-stage kidney disease. So it's a9 privilege to be here.10
Dialysis13 patients -- and dialysis is their ability14 to stay alive -- dialyze for four hours15 at a time, three times a week: Monday,16 Wednesday, and Friday; or Tuesday,17 Thursday and Saturday.18 At any one time, currently,19 there are approximately 32 dialysis20 patients at the Mt. Airy site that get21 dialyzed in that four-hour period of22 time, three times a week.23 On Monday, Wednesday, and24 Friday, a second shift of four hours25 49 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 comes into the building, and they're2 staggered; they're not all at one time.3 The 34 patients would come in, the first4 set at 6 o'clock in the morning,5 staggered another 34 patients at6 11 o'clock in the morning; and then,7 after four hours of treatment, again8 staggered the third shift of 34 patients9 come into the dialysis facility for those10 four hours.11 On Tuesday and Thursday,12 currently, there's two shifts that go on:13 Again, 34 patients for four hours; and14 then a second shift of four hours of 3415 patients.16
And17 on Tuesday and Thursday, what are the18 hours?19
On Tuesday,20 Thursday, and Saturday -- that's three21 days a week they get dialyzed, twelve22 hours of week now is the standard of23 care -- the hours currently are from24 6 o'clock in the morning to 6 o'clock in25 50 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 the evening.2 The issue -- and one of the3 issues here, to keep it at an appropriate4 level here, because we're trying to5 provide care for patients who need it.6 And dialysis is a local7 problem; it's how they get their care.8 They shouldn't be asked to go miles for9 their care.10 They have four hours of11 treatment, and then they go home; they12 want to go home to their families. Or13 more importantly, particularly the14 evening-shift patient work, pay their15 taxes. Or they also babysit and help16 their children work, and that's why many17 of them need an evening shift.18 But the unfortunate thing right19 now is that the population of dialysis20 patients is growing at a rate of about21 3-and-a-half percent per year; and in22 Philadelphia, PA, it's one of the highest23 in the country.24 And what we don't want is a25 51 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 citizen of northwest Philadelphia to get2 kidney failure and need dialysis. And if3 our unit is full on Monday and Tuesday,4 and now we get additional patients in5 Chestnut Hill who need dialysis, am I6 going to ask them from my office to go7 someplace else?8 And what we're asking is to9 open up -- if it happens -- it's not10 there now. But if it would happen, any11 increased growth of patients could be12 accommodated in their neighborhood.13 Dialysis is not a busy, noisy14 thing. Our patients come in, sit down,15 read, watch TV, and talk to each other.16 This dialysis unit was first at17 86 Bethlehem Pike, in Chestnut Hill, a18 commercial and residential neighborhood.19 It currently is in a residential20 neighborhood. We have a very good21 relationship with our neighbors. My22 patient lives across the street from the23 current dialysis unit; he's not24 complaining about noise and why are we25 52 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 here or why don't we get out.2 So this is a business that3 takes care of patients, patients who need4 it, state-of-the-art therapy,5 unbelievable quality of care being given6 here.7 And what we're saying is, if8 the possibility exists that the9 population grows and our unit is full,10 then we need to open up on that Tuesday,11 Thursday, Saturday to accommodate those12 patients who live in that community.13
And that would take16 us to 9 o'clock at night. We have17 consistently said -- and we'll sign a18 binding, legal document -- that we will19 not dialyze after 9 o'clock at night.20
And we have an21 agreement with the community association,22 and their representatives are here to23 that effect.24 So there have been rumors that25 53 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 it's 24/7; that's not the case. The2 treatment stops at 9 o'clock at night.3
Thank4 you.5 Again, I'm going to go back to6 some of the correspondence so that many7 of the questions can be answered.8 How about parking?9
Yes. As you'll10 see from the plan, I believe we have 4311 parking spaces, which is twice what we12 have at the current location.13 Everything happens within our14 property. So whether people come by a15 van or by their own car, they come in to16 the property. We've made arrangements17 with the community association to have a18 single point off -- or actually a19 single-road access so that it won't20 disturb anybody.21 People can come in, they can22 park. If they're waiting for the little23 transportation units, they'll be able to24 do that all within the parking area.25 54 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 So we believe that this will be2 excellent in terms of available parking.3 We don't see any need to park on the4 street or to block anybody's traffic or5 to be in any way inconvenient for the6 neighborhood.7
Thank8 you.9 The Chair recognizes Councilman10 Greenlee.11
Thank12 you, Madam President.13 If I could just touch on the14 hours thing again, 'cause, again, I want15 to be clear, 'cause it seemed that that16 was the main thing we were hearing.17 And as you said, you -- I know18 on a number of letters, it used the term19 24/7. You're saying you're willing to20 make a written agreement that 9 o'clock21 would be the end of your hours?22
Yes, that's23 correct, Councilman. That was part of24 our agreement with the community25 55 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 association. It was debated by the2 association, because the people who are3 here today in opposition wanted it to be4 closed on Tuesday, Thursday, and5 Saturday, at 6 o'clock at night.6 And Dr. Jones explained that we7 need to have that extra capacity. So the8 community association supported us in9 that. But we do have an agreement with10 them, and we are signing an agreement11 with anybody.12 I told some of the protestants,13 through their attorney, that we'd be14 happy to give them their own agreement if15 they are not willing to accept the16 community association agreement.17 But we have no interest, no18 desire to go beyond 9 o'clock at night,19 and we are legally bound by that.20 And also, quite frankly, it's21 the business model that both Dr. Jones22 and Fresenius have. We hear other23 companies do run night shifts; that's not24 the model that we have, and that's not25 56 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 where we want to be.2
So even3 though the zoning might allow that, you4 you'd be willing to limit it.5
And I7 know one of the concerns that I heard was8 that people -- ambulances would be coming9 in at 1 o'clock in the morning or10 something like that.11
No. And15 also -- well, Doctor, you can --16 ambulances don't really come to a renal17 center.18
Let me clarify21 that.22 It's not annual an emergency23 procedure.24
I mean, emergency2 procedures go to the hospital. If we3 have anybody who we even think is sick4 and they call LaRhonda, we send them to5 the hospital because it's not built, nor6 is the manpower there to take care of7 emergencies.8 There are a small number of9 ambulances that do come. One-third of10 our patients drive, one-third get11 delivered by CCT or Paratransit, a few12 will have an ambulance.13 And one of the concerns,14 appropriately was that when an ambulance15 backs up, it makes a lot of noise, or the16 dieseling. The way the parking lot is17 built, that allows for the CCT and the18 ambulance to circle around as opposed to19 what it -- you know, now in Mt. Airy,20 it's not good because it's a small lot,21 and they can't get in and out.22 So this is not an emergency23 facility where a lot of ambulances are24 coming to; it's a few. And usually it's25 58 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 a patient that recently was in the2 hospital, and until they get a little3 better, they may need a recliner.4
It's only till7 9 o'clock.8 And, again, we will, both from9 a physician point of view, as a medical10 director, and Fresenius will legally sign11 that.12 And, remember, as a practicing13 physician, I don't want a phone call14 after 9 o'clock at night, you know? I15 don't want a phone call on Saturday night16 after 9 o'clock. I don't want a shift17 after those hours, you know.18 So we don't want it, as19 physicians who take care of the patients;20 the patients and staff want it. And21 Fresenius's model, at least in our22 facilities, is not to dialyze at that23 time of night.24
One last25 59 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 question, if I could.2 Mr. Primavera, on the whole3 Zoning Board scenario, if you will, I4 know, again, the other thing that has5 been raised a lot was the process of how6 it happened. There was an original7 decision, then it was reconsidered.8 Could you talk about that and9 talk about whether that is an unusual10 situation or how it came about, that kind11 of thing, please.12
Yes.13 The hearing at the Zoning14 Board -- you know, the Zoning Board hears15 30 cases a day. So I think what happened16 was, some of the confusion over the17 hours -- 'cause they are confusing --18 resulted in the Zoning Board approving19 the center but limiting the hours on20 Tuesday, Thursday, and Saturday to 621 o'clock at night.22 I sent a letter of23 reconsideration explaining how we needed24 that additional time. Attached to the25 60 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 letter were letters from PIDC, Commerce,2 and the Planning Commission in support of3 that.4 I sent copies to everybody who5 entered an appearance. We had 30 people.6 Many of the people who entered an7 appearance at the Zoning Board all8 received copies of that request.9 The Zoning Board granted the10 request, but for a reason best known to11 the Zoning Board, they didn't contain the12 hours that I requested; they just removed13 the entire proviso.14 My only suspicion is, they15 said, Look, since you have an agreement16 with the Chestnut Hill Community17 Association, which is a private18 agreement, we're not going to get into19 the hours. I think that that created20 some concern.21 When Dan McElhatton, who's the22 attorney for at least two of the23 neighbors who are concerned, contacted24 me, I told him that I would be willing to25 61 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 stipulate to put the hours back in the2 zoning decision so the Zoning Board would3 ratify the hours that we seek now.4 We tried everything possible to5 reach some accommodation with the people6 who were concerned. And if, in fact,7 that process made them skeptical, I'm8 sorry for it, but it was above-board in9 the sense that reconsideration is done10 generally; and second of all, everybody11 who was at the Zoning Board was copied on12 my request.13 So it wasn't as though they14 woke up one day and were surprised by how15 this happened.16
I think17 that's the thing, the reconsider -- you18 said reconsideration is done generally.19 You do obviously a lot of zoning stuff.20
What -- I22 mean, how often do you do that as an23 attorney? I mean, what --24
I would say 1525 62 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 to 20 percent of the cases.2 Typically what happens is this:3 Typically, the Zoning Board will approve4 the case, and somebody forgot to add to5 the sign. So what we do, is we'll send a6 letter back to the Zoning Board saying,7 Can you please approve the use but also8 now this sign? 'cause otherwise, we'd9 have to go back for a whole new zoning10 case for just the sign.11
Or sometimes13 the Zoning Board forgets to include some14 other stipulations, or that there has15 been a change in what's happening. Maybe16 the restaurant is going from 6,000 square17 feet to 4,000, or vice-versa.18 So it's typically used not to19 basically change the decision yes or no,20 although that's happened too, but it's21 basically done to modify the decision,22 either to clarify a mistake that's been23 made or to give them a chance to24 reconsider some aspect of what they25 63 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 approved.2
If they want8 to, if it's a big enough change, they9 could invite everyone back. But10 typically, they figure after you hear one11 of these cases, you know what's going on,12 and they're able to decide whether they13 want to modify it or not, without a14 second round of hearings.15 As a matter of fact, if you16 have a second round of hearing, then17 people are going to bring more issues up.18 You kind of --19
It never gets21 resolved. So typically, the board does22 not have a hearing on reconsideration.23
Okay,24 thank you.25 64 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531
Thank2 you.3 The Chair recognizes Councilman4 DiCicco.5 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: I think6 Councilwoman Brown had her light on7 first.8
Thank you,11 Madam President. Thank you, Councilman.12 Councilman Bill Greenlee13 touched on the notion of support. You14 stated in your testimony that there was15 support, so my follow-up question was:16 Was there support in writing? And the17 answer is yes.18
Okay. I20 just learned, looking at testimony up21 here, that there are a number of --22 support came from -- just for the record,23 did it come from the Chestnut Hill24 Community Association, the Chestnut Hill25 65 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 Residents Association, or the Chestnut2 Hill Historical Society? Which?3
I wasn't aware15 of that, but I'm told that they also16 approved it.17
Would it21 be fair to say, then, that this22 modification has led now to a23 misunderstanding and/or a divide with24 regards to the -- I won't use the word25 66 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 "inability" but the challenge to come to2 come common ground?3
Well, I think4 that there's been some recent history.5 The community association has6 been around forever, and it has a very7 elaborate process. You'll hear from8 them. As a matter of fact, some might9 say it's too elaborate. You have to go10 through a landscape committee, a traffic11 committee, an esthetic committee, a use12 cheat.13 And being in Chestnut Hill, we14 have architects and engineers and lawyers15 galore, so they monopolize these16 committees. So it's a very belabored17 process, but maybe that's why people feel18 confident that it does a good job.19
Because of some21 dissension with a few residents who22 didn't win seats on the community23 association, there's a movement to create24 a splinter group, and they want to be25 67 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 against anything the association is for.2
So we're having4 that.5 The community association feels6 that its years and years of proven7 service and its standing in the8 community -- and it represents residents,9 businesses, institutions --10
-- that they13 have to hold the line and say, We're not14 going to let a runt group or a splinter15 group divide our community so that we16 lose what we have.17
So that's19 what's really going on here because it's20 not about three hours; it's about control21 and it's about politics, you know,22 neighborhood politics.23 And it's about people who, you24 know, have -- the last case they opposed25 68 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 they -- you probably saw it in the paper.2 A lady had a little grocery store that3 was wonderful, and she had takeout4 coffee, and they closed her down because5 they didn't want the takeout coffee.6
And the7 "they" would be the Chestnut Hill8 Residents Association?9
So that's what12 we're dealing with here.13 So there's always the big14 picture, which we're talking about; and15 then there's the little picture, which16 is, you know, people's agendas.17
Mm-hmm.18 Did this revelation of facts, as you just19 described it, reveal itself during the20 zoning hearing process?21
I think it22 started back with the community23 association process, where there were24 four or six meetings of the community25 69 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 association, and there was a certain2 group of people who couldn't find a way3 to get onboard with the larger4 association.5 They then went to the Zoning6 Board and said, Well, we don't want the7 community association to speak for us.8 They then filed an appeal to the Zoning9 Board.10
And now, they12 came to the Planning Commission, two or13 three of them, and now they're here14 today.15 So it's an ongoing struggle for16 what they believe is the proper voice.17 We clearly believe that the association,18 the Chestnut Hill Community Association,19 has been the voice for years.20 And, you know, if you want to21 be on the voice, you got to run and you22 got to win. If you lose and you can't23 get a seat on that board, I don't think24 you take your bat and ball and go home; I25 70 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 think you just run again next year, and2 you spend more time convincing people3 that your view is the right view. You4 don't create your own association.5
Okay. And6 so then, for a restatement of the facts7 so that I get it, the Chestnut Hill8 Community Association supports it.9
The11 Chestnut Hill Historical Society supports12 it.13
Okay, all25 71 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 right then.2
As a matter of3 fact, we can't think of any constituency4 or group that's not in support of it5 other than the people you'll hear from6 today who describe themselves as "The7 Residents Association."8
Thank14 you.15 The Chair recognizes Councilman16 DiCicco.17 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: Thank you,18 Madam Chair.19 Good morning again.20 I want to get back to the21 parking issue. On the chart here, it22 shows 42 spaces. I believe it was23 testified to that 10 percent or 1224 percent, was it, of the patients arrive25 72 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 by private vehicle on average?2
About a third.3 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: A third,4 I'm sorry, a third. So it would be about5 12, roughly 12 vehicles.6
Yes.7 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: How many8 of the 40 permanent employees would be on9 -- are they shift work, or are you going10 to have 40 maximum at anytime, or would11 there be less than 40?12
There are variable13 periods of time. The doctors may come14 and go the, social worker may come and15 go.16 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: Give me a17 make number at any one given time of the18 number of employees --19
I'm being told 22.20 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: Okay, 22.21 So that gives us 34. If every employee22 came to work by vehicle, you'd have 34 of23 the 42 spaces --24
Yes.25 73 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: -- taken2 up between patients and employees,3 correct?4
And I think it may7 have been in the handout.8 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: Roughly.9 I'm just using rough numbers.10
Yes.11 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: All right.12 That could obviously go up and down, but13 you're still within at least eight to ten14 spaces that would be still available if15 you maxed out on employees and the16 one-third of the patients.17
Yes.18 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: Also, I19 notice that you have a lot of20 improvements in terms of greening. Is21 there, or will there be, any lighting22 attached to the building or pedestrian23 lighting that would light up the24 perimeter of the property in this plan?25 74 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531
I'm going to2 ask Mike Malone just to come up3 because --4
(Inaudible,7 off-mic).8 ... with the community9 association, too.10 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: Thanks.11 (Witness comes forward.)12
Yes. And Carl13 just testified --14 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: Identify15 yourself for the record, please.16
Michael Malone.17 We do have lighting in the18 parking lot; there are several poles. So19 the parking lot will be lit.20 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: I'm21 talking about the perimeter of the22 building, on the face of the building or23 on the sidewalk.24
I do not believe25 75 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 that there is lighting planned for the2 perimeter of the building. And, you3 know, that was one of the things that was4 discussed at the community association.5 I don't think that the neighbors wanted6 to look at lights at night.7 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: Well, I8 would think the opposite. I would think9 they'd want it lit because right now what10 you have is a very dark warehouse. I11 would think that some sort of lighting12 either washing the wall or the side, but13 I'm not talking about a fence of14 lighting.15 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:16 Dr. Jones, I think you want to add17 something?18
Thank you, Madam19 President.20 Yes. I don't know whether you21 know much about the Chestnut Hill22 Association, but we have gone through23 five meetings over the last -- since24 February 14th, lengthy meetings and have25 76 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 worked closely with the association to2 work on the building and what the3 building looks like, what the lighting4 will be, what the inside lighting will5 be.6 So we will work with the7 community in all of these efforts to make8 sure the building is appropriate for the9 community. We will landscape it. And10 we've even volunteered to put a committee11 together that would include the12 physicians, Fresenius, and the community13 to help oversee what goes on. On the14 parking, if it's an issue, we'll get15 those things resolved.16 But the lighting piece, we will17 follow the lead and work with the18 association, where there are a lot of19 architects and folks on those committees.20
And I was just21 given the Chestnut Hill document, the22 community association document. And one23 of the things that we need to submit24 before construction is the lighting plan25 77 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 for their review and comment.2 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: The other3 --4
Madam5 President.6 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:7 Councilman DiCicco.8 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: The other9 question, the community benefits10 agreement, Mr. Primavera, is there one in11 place, you said, or is that still a work12 if progress?13
No, there's a14 community agreement. It was prepared --15 and you'll here from Mr. Walter Sullivan16 and Larry McEwen, and it's in our17 package, 11A. And it goes through most18 of the issues that were discussed in the19 various committees and subcommittees of20 the Chestnut Hill Community Association.21 So it's in the letter format.22 And then it says, "May 27, 201023 Conditions for CHCA Support." And it's24 between Mr. Sullivan, who's the president25 78 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 of the association, and actually Mike2 Malone.3 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: Okay. I4 don't need the details; I just want to5 make sure that there's some work in6 progress.7
There are,8 like, 20 issues, and it's all the usual9 things: materials; colors; mechanical10 equipment being disguised so that you11 don't look at a vent; window treatment,12 shades preferred. It will get pretty13 detailed.14 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: Okay.15
As a matter of16 fact, there was even concerns about17 fluorescent lights. People don't want to18 look in and see what looks like hospital19 lighting. So it's going to get pretty20 detailed as we go.21 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: Okay. If22 you decide to expand, Doctor, let me23 know. I have some places in my district24 that would be more than welcome to25 79 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 support you. Plus I need to create some2 work for my friends from 989, you know,3 electrical work and stuff like that.4 (Laughter.)5
And one8 of the other, I think, good features is9 that the company has decided to put up10 video surveillance cameras.11
Yes, that's12 correct. That came up in our13 discussions. And I know Councilman Rizzo14 also mentioned that.15 So we'll have them. They'll be16 discreet because we don't want it to look17 foreboding, but I think it's a good idea18 both for the safety of the community and19 for the employees.20 And LaRhonda was in on that21 discussions, and she says, Fine, you22 know, that works for us.23
Okay.24 And one other thing I would just like to25 80 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 add before we bring other folks up is2 that right now, where they're located in3 Mt. Airy, it really causes a big sort of4 traffic issue and parking issue.5 So with this off-street6 parking, it really will help. Relocating7 from Mt. Air to this new site will really8 help with the parking issues on that9 particular block.10
We're11 fortunate, Councilwoman. I mean, it's12 rare in Chestnut Hill -- and you know it13 'cause you drive it all the time -- to14 have a parking lot that big that's close15 to Germantown Avenue.16
The only18 parking lots that really are available19 are run by the community association, and20 they're shared by all the businesses.21 But this is a freestanding lot soley for22 this center, which is really a home run.23 Also, people can walk from here24 to McDonald's, to Staples, to the Sin Sin25 81 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 restaurant, so it's going to help the2 local businesspeople. And it's just very3 convenient.4 So, really, we think taking it5 from the Porta-Potty place -- and, look,6 that needs to exist somewhere but it7 doesn't need to exist right off of8 Germantown Avenue in Chestnut Hill.9 And this is something that is10 not only an improvement of the building,11 but it's a need that's growing. We have12 a lot of seniors in the area, as you13 know. And, unfortunately, as the doctor14 said, the demand is going to continue to15 grow.16 And, hopefully, at some point,17 they're looking for other facilities. So18 that's one of the reasons they don't want19 to go beyond 9 o'clock, because they20 always want to build the next facility.21 If there's enough demand, they'd rather22 have a new facility in addition to what23 they have rather than trying to operate24 overextended hours in a single location.25 82 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531
Thank5 you.6 The Chair recognizes Councilman7 Rizzo.8
First, I'm a14 resident of Chestnut Hill. Second, I15 served as an elected member of the board16 of the Chestnut Hill Community17 Association, so I know your pain,18 counselor, when it comes to process.19 But, again, I -- you also said20 that it's respected because of their21 thoroughness. And we in the community22 appreciate their hard work.23
One of the25 83 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 things that I appreciate, 'cause it was2 my suggestion to Council Lady Miller,3 that cameras be installed. As you know,4 they're very effective not to just5 protect the patients and the employees6 but also your property. So I appreciate7 the fact that you've accepted my8 suggestion on that.9 The other suggestion that I10 have is that even though you have the11 circular driveway that we all know and12 have been exposed to backup alarms, which13 these vehicles have. There needs to be14 consideration so that at o'clock at15 night, o'clock at night, when children16 are put to sleep, that vehicles use every17 effort to not have those alarms sound.18 And then there are devices that can, on a19 particular cycle of reverse, stop those20 alarms from operating at least on that21 one cycle. And I understand that that22 should be at a minimum because of the23 configuration of the drop-off point.24 And the other thing is, you did25 84 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 mention something that just got my2 attention. I would hope that the parking3 lot would be secured and not be able to4 be used by the people after the operating5 hours of the facility to go to other6 venues, because, again, I think that7 could develop into a problem for the near8 residents of the facility.9 I spent a half hour there10 yesterday, and the building is in very,11 very dis -- it's in disrepair. And the12 quicker it gets rehabbed, the better.13 And I believe that the input14 that you're going to get to make that15 building fit into the community is16 appreciated by me as a resident and also17 as a councilmember at-large.18 So I look forward to you doing19 what you need to do there, but I would20 hope that you could address the vehicles21 that are going to be used and that there22 isn't a nuisance in the community.23
Dr. Jones says24 he has information on that.25 85 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:2 Doctor?3
Thank you.4 Councilman Rizzo, thank you.5 Just to give you some context6 again, when we dialyze patients in the7 evening, they are the most stable8 patients that we deal with.9 And when you look at the10 ambulances, those who do come by11 ambulance are more likely in the daytime.12 So it's unusual to see it in the evening13 period of time; there might be one.14 But we'll be, again, attentive15 to this in, you know, our concern about16 the neighbors' issues. We want to be17 good neighbors, so we will work with the18 neighbors. And if those issues come up,19 we'll address them with the ambulance.20 We have a full-time social21 worker who has very good relationships22 with the ambulance companies, CCT and23 Paratransit, and is constantly on the24 phone with them, and she will help work25 86 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 in that regard.2
If, on a3 Sunday morning, at 7:00 a.m., you've ever4 been sleeping and been awaken by a backup5 alarm, you can understand people not6 being happy.7 The other question I have:8 Will the building -- not that I'm9 suggesting that it be open to the10 community, but if there was a need for a11 conference room for a community meeting12 or something like that, would you extend13 that offer to the community to use the14 facility for appropriate meetings that15 might come up that affect the community?16
There will be a17 conference room; it's not very large.18 But, again, we want to be good neighbors.19 We'll work with the neighborhood20 association, and if that's something21 possible that we can work out, we'd be22 attentive to that.23
Terrific.24 Good luck.25 87 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531
Thank6 you.7 The Chair recognizes8 Councilwoman Brown.9
Thank you,10 Madam Chair.11 A follow-up question on the12 hours. Is it customary for medical13 facilities like this to have those hours,14 as described?15
That's pretty much16 the state of the care throughout the17 country. Many places are opening up on18 Tuesday, Thursday permanently. But the19 standard of care in the Delaware Valley20 is three shifts: 6 o'clock in the21 morning to 9 o'clock on Monday,22 Wednesday, and Friday; and the 6 to 6 on23 Tuesday, Thursday, and Saturday. That's24 standard.25 88 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531
Okay.2 Thank you.3 And no way to mischaracterize4 this challenge that you're facing, but is5 this wrinkle unprecedented?6
We had that9 conversation yesterday. Mike does this10 all over the country, I'm told.11
Mike,14 please identify yourself for the record.15
Michael Malone.16 I'm involved in the approval17 process in several of these and elsewhere18 in Pennsylvania and in New Jersey and in19 Oklahoma.20 And, typically, they are21 welcomed in communities as a much-needed22 health care service and receive the23 support of the community. I mean, all of24 the issues that we addressed with the25 89 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 Chestnut Hill Community Association are2 typically addressed. But at the end of3 the day, it's considered an inherently4 beneficial use and fairly benign in terms5 of traffic.6 COUNCILWOMAN BROWN:7 Demographics. Have you done the study or8 the back homework that drives the9 decision that a facility at this location10 indeed becomes beneficial for those11 citizens, residents, patients, period? I12 mean, because you mentioned that many of13 those in that part of the world may have14 to travel X-number of miles to some other15 location.16 So do you have demographics17 that say to you, Yes, a location like --18 a facility like this in this location19 will be needed but just based on need?20
Yes, Councilwoman21 Brown. We have done that. We've got22 details of the numbers of patients that23 have end-stage kidney disease in each of24 the zip codes that are there.25 90 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 And, again, in northwest2 Philadelphia, there's a high penetrance,3 unfortunately, of patients with end-stage4 renal disease.5
But we know the7 number of patients in each one of the zip8 codes, and that's why this area is an9 ideal location for a dialysis community.10
I think the12 doctor's affiliated with Chestnut Hill13 Hospital.14
Yes. I'm the head15 of the Department of Nephrology at16 Chestnut Hill Hospital. I formerly was17 Chairman of Medicine at Germantown18 Hospital, which, unfortunately, doesn't19 exist.20 But I've been in the community21 for 30 years.22
Okay.23 That's important testimony as well.24 Thank you.25 91 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 Thank you, Madam President.2 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:3 You're welcome.4 Dr. Jones, in the event that5 you cannot find any location in6 Councilman DiCicco's district, you're7 also more than welcome to come into mine.8
Thank you.9 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:10 LaRhonda, do you have anything to add to11 the testimony?12
No, ma'am. I was13 here in case you guys had any questions14 for me.15
Okay,16 thank you.17 The Chair recognizes Councilman18 Kelly.19
Thank you,20 Madam Chair.21 Dr. Jones, I just want to22 commend you for the work that you've been23 doing to help these poor people who have24 this disastrous affliction. And I know25 92 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 of many people -- I know a few people who2 need this service. And by you providing3 this service up into that community, I4 think, is a plus. I know that most of my5 Council colleagues have people who6 probably have the same affliction and the7 same services that they need.8 And I just want to commend you9 and, of course, your counselor and10 everyone else who has tried to do11 whatever they can to make sure that this12 service is put into this community.13 Okay, thank you.14
Thank you.15 And LaRhonda is one of the16 major reasons why this facility has won17 national awards for the quality of care18 that it delivers for the patients,19 national awards.20 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:21 Wonderful.22
Thank24 you.25 93 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 Our next panel?2
Current dialysis3 patient, Louis Incognito.4 (Witness comes forward.)5
Good morning.8 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:9 Please identify yourself for the record.10
My name is11 Louis J. Incognito, and I am a dialysis12 patient in Mt. Airy right now.13
Did14 you want to testify on this bill, or are15 you in favor?16
Are18 you in favor of the bill before us this19 morning?20
Am I in favor21 of the moving of the building?22 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:23 Mm-hmm.24
Yes. Both are25 94 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 close to our home. We live in Mt. Airy.2 And the other building, the3 building we're about to move in, if it's4 approved, and we hope it is, we'll have5 much better parking.6 And I think that it will be7 another plus. I think it's an asset to8 Mt. Airy, and it will be an asset to9 wherever this operation goes.10
Thank11 you.12 Any questions?13 (No questions.)14
Community20 Association: Walter Sullivan, Rob Remus21 and Larry McEwen.22 (Witnesses come forward.)23
Good morning,24 Council President and members of Council.25 95 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531
4 Sullivan. I am the president, and I've5 been privileged to be for almost two6 years, of the Chestnut Hill Community7 Association. 10 For well more than 60 years, we11 have been the authentic representative of12 the people of Chestnut Hill. We13 represent and serve them. 16 Now, we have -- let me say17 incidentally, and this is only18 incidentally -- that I am a dialysis19 patient. 24 The place in Mt. 10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 fine place, but it's old, there are2 problems, and there sure as heck are3 problems with parking. If I were from4 Chestnut Hill and I were wondering about5 the place coming into Chestnut Hill, and6 I took a ride down to Mt. 11 The Chestnut Hill Community12 Association, over decades, has developed13 a review process. There are a number of14 committees. 7 Where appropriate, the traffic,8 transportation, and parking committee9 reviews the matter. Where appropriate,10 the esthetics committee reviews the11 matter. 15 This process in this instance16 took a number of weeks, and Mr. McEwen17 can detail it. But every one of these18 meetings was published. We want the19 public to come to the meetings. 23 And some of them did come. 10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 the end of all this -- we felt we were a2 little bit blind-sided -- that there were3 petitions and all kinds of things. 10 Now, they were okay with a11 third shift until about 9 o'clock on12 Monday, Wednesday, and Friday, and they13 didn't want one on Tuesday, Thursday, and14 Saturday. 15 But, in any event, we represent16 folks. So if the developer had been able17 to live with that, we would have added18 that condition, even though it doesn't19 make in my mind a particle of sense. 4 And the -- we have a concern5 when there are neighbors who don't agree6 with the decisions we make 'cause we7 represent all of the people of Chestnut8 Hill. But we have to call it as we see9 it. 13 And it is because the place14 looks like -- the place is not appealing,15 as Councilman Rizzo has pointed out. 20
Thank21 you. Thank you, Mr. 22 MR. McEWAN: My name is Larry23 McEwen. 11 This particular issue was12 brought to us mid-February. 17 There were -- we review a18 number of things running from the19 architectural design and, in this case,20 the renovation proposal relative to the21 historical property, the Willet Stained22 Glass studio, which was of interest to23 the historical society. 14 Traffic. 16 That Winston Road, I think the daily17 traffic is 1200 cars. One block over on18 Germantown Avenue, the daily traffic is19 12,000 cars, same road width. 10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 Public safety was the second2 one. 10 The third issue was hours of11 operation. m. 10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 to that. 9 We then looked at the10 operation. We felt that the operation is11 very internalized to the building in12 terms of the work itself, that the13 traffic is actually -- we felt that this14 lot actually is ideal for the traffic15 because it does allow for the vans to be16 stored on the property, not on the17 street. 10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 community to have the building restored2 in this manner that they proposed. 10
Excuse me. My name16 is Rob Remus, and I'm a director on the17 Chestnut Hill Community Association. I18 also serve on the executive board. I'm19 also a nearby neighbor who lives and20 works in the immediate area. I've lived21 in Chestnut Hill for 11 years.22 I live about a block away, me23 and my family, but I do work right across24 the street from the dialysis center. And25 105 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 for the last three years, I have been2 appalled by the look of the building.3 Having known the previous4 owners of the building and the previous5 operator of the building, I was very6 vocal to him on some of the matters that7 were concerning me and my family, of8 which I was concerned of the exterior9 look of the building because I understand10 it's a very limited use and it has some11 really archaic windows. And, you know, I12 usually notified him when windows were13 broken.14 But routinely, there was broken15 glass on the sidewalk, there was16 McDonald's bags of food dropped off by17 contractors, there was contractors'18 trucks parked on the sidewalk, diesel19 trucks running. And I had to maneuver20 around these things as well as my kids.21 So I was very concerned when I22 understood that this building was to be23 converted from G-2 into another use.24 I am very much for this. I do25 106 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 not want to see another -- I would not2 like to see another G-2 use of this3 property. The Porta-Potties are4 horrible, but at least there's -- nobody5 sleeping on the sidewalks in pickup6 trucks, as far as I'm concerned.7 So I've been to almost every8 meeting from the DRC to the historical9 meetings to every community association10 meeting with this matter. I have read11 the details, I have studied them. I have12 studied the company Fresenius. I have13 forwarded it on to colleagues and my14 neighbors. I have met with my neighbors15 on three or four separate occasions as16 frequently as -- excuse me, as recently17 as last Sunday, to address some18 questions.19 And one of the points I want to20 make is, I'm often shocked on how little21 we talk about the various facts versus22 what we hear as rumors. I try to address23 them as best as I can, and I go on from24 there.25 107 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 So that's pretty much my2 opinion of the situation.3 People have asked me, am I4 happy about a dialysis center moving down5 the street from me? I don't have anyone6 in my family that suffers that needs to7 be dialyzed. I would very much love to8 see that entire block be beautiful homes,9 but that's not in the cards.10 I am very happy to see that11 building converted into the dialysis use12 and to Fresenius's use and Dr. Jones.13 So I still stand by that.14
Thank15 you.16 Hello, welcome. Good to have17 you back.18
Good morning,19 Madam President. Craig Shelter. It's a20 delight to be back before you and the21 committee. It's been quite frankly.22 I'm here this morning both as a23 42-year resident of Chestnut Hill, and I24 was also hired by the developer in this25 108 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 situation to make testimony before the2 Zoning Board regarding the history of how3 this site got zoned.4 I've also been recently asked5 by the community president to serve on a6 negotiating committee of the civic7 association, dealing with an expansion8 plan for Chestnut Hill College.9 And in my years at the City10 Planning Commission, I was the deputy11 director when all four quadrants of12 Chestnut Hill were rezoned.13 So I think I've brought a lot14 of institutional memory to the situation.15 I point out here that I think16 this is probably the best win/win I've17 seen of a reuse of an industrial property18 in the City. And I say this, having19 spent 19 years at PIDC and 10 years as a20 private consultant.21 And what usually happens with22 industrial properties like this is, you23 will get successive users there, as we24 did in Chestnut Hill. When Willet25 109 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 Stained Glass left and Curtis Roofing2 came in, it was an industrial use; it3 wasn't a terrible use, but there wasn't4 sufficient income from that business to5 really fix it up.6 So the idea to have somebody7 come into this building and fix it up in8 a way where the exterior got improved,9 where the parking got improved, where10 then the access to the site is easy for.11 Five years of my 42 years, I12 lived one block away, on 7910 Winston13 Road. And the thing we worried about as14 neighbors was the fact that it's the15 widest commercial Street in Chestnut Hill16 and was a speedway. So the fact that17 there's easy access in and out, I think,18 is a given.19 Also, the fact that when you go20 pull into this facility, the wall of the21 existing building shields noise from22 going further to the northwest, where23 more of the neighbors are.24 So the question was then: What25 110 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 was the original zoning on this site?2 And this went back to February of 1977.3 It was Bill 342. And that was a rezoning4 that was done in coordination with the5 civic association and the Planning6 Commission.7 And at the time, the idea was8 to keep the businesses in place, keep9 them happy, keep jobs in the City, and10 so, it's why the area -- why that was11 zoned G-2.12 The area right next door to it13 is Philippe Ironwork. They've been14 there, I think, for 60 or 70 years. And15 these are tradespeople that everyone in16 Chestnut Hill uses. There's Roxy Auto on17 the other side of it, if you want to have18 your car repaired.19 So the idea was, keep the20 industrial uses there until a more21 appropriate use came along. I think22 that's its case here.23 And in light of the time, I'll24 stop and answer any questions you may25 111 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 have.2
Thank3 you.4 Are there any questions from5 members of the committee?6 The Chair recognizes Councilman7 Kelly.8
Yes. I just9 have one question to the panel, and I10 just want to know how many residential11 properties are located adjacent to this12 property or across from the property, and13 how many of 'em are there?14
I think there are15 three. If I could go up to the map.16 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:17 Certainly.18
Yes, three19 properties.20 (Mr. Shelter moves to chart on21 display, away from microphone, and is22 inaudible at this point.)23
Three24 residential properties?25 112 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531
I guess there2 would be four. I stand corrected. So3 there are four properties.4
Thank8 you.9 The Chair recognizes Councilman10 Rizzo.11
Thank you,12 Madam Chair.13 Also, I'd like to point out --14 and I don't think it's been mentioned --15 that the westerly neighbor is a16 Philadelphia electric substation. So if17 you want to talk about a site, that18 site's going to be there forever as far19 as I'm concerned. But I just wanted to20 point out that that substation is the21 near neighbor to the property in22 discussion.23 Thank you, Madam President.24 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:25 113 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 You're welcome.2 Thank you, gentlemen. We3 appreciate your coming in to testify.4 I really want to thank all of5 you for coming in. You've all been6 extremely patient, but I just want to say7 that when you come up to testify, if you8 could just be as brief as possible,9 because we do have another hearing that10 has been scheduled for 11:30 for another11 committee.12 So with that being said, I13 would ask the clerk to please call up the14 next witnesses.15
Good19 morning, welcome. Please identify20 yourself for the record.21
Good morning. 3 I have lived in Chestnut Hill,4 in the same house, paid taxes all these5 years, way back when oil was 17 cents a6 gallon. 8 A couple of things. 11 It's really about rules. 17 Despite what's happened, you18 know, we feel as though the judicial19 process is being circumvented here. 7 Now, this is very, very8 troublesome to me. The Chestnut Hill9 Residents Association is all about10 neighbors. If the majority of the11 neighbors don't want something, then we12 support them. 16 Elfant Wissahickon Realtors came in, they17 had to redo a building and spent18 $2 million on Germantown Avenue. They19 called us and said, you know, Do you20 object to this? I said, Do the neighbors21 wants it? Yes. 10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 There have been so many2 inconsistencies in the testimony you've3 heard from PIDC, from Mr. 10 Mr. Rhodes said that they want11 a business like Fresenius because they12 want small businesses coming in. And13 then, Mr. 17 We were not aware, until we18 heard it from him, that an agreement had19 been reached for no 24/7 operation. This20 has always been the thing that really21 affected the near neighbors, the hours of22 operation, and it still does. 4 But I want the committee to5 know that this was put before them right6 from the get-go. The Residents7 Association wanted to negotiate the hours8 right from the beginning. But, no, they9 went before the community association,10 Dr. 11 And what did they do? 21 I mean, is this the way you22 treat your constituents, the people23 sitting back there that vote you into24 office? I don't understand it. 5 When the Chestnut Hill6 Community Association, you know, got7 involved with this from the beginning, we8 all sat back and said, Let's follow9 procedure. We'll go to the Zoning Board,10 which we did. The Zoning Board ruled11 four-to-nothing in favor of the residents12 limiting the hours. 14 But one other point that I'd15 like to make, and then I'll defer to16 whatever questions you may have, and that17 is that the near neighbors -- and this is18 one of our biggest mottos. 21 They have over 60 signatures22 opposing not Fresenius per se, but they23 want to go back to the standard hours24 which were originally presented. 10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 is the case, they don't have a problem2 with that. 4 The standard hours were5 presented by Dr. Jones right from the6 get-go, and he said it even today. You7 know, the standard hours originally --8
The standard hours,11 which they said would be 6 to 6 three12 days a week; and 6 to 9 three days a13 week. The neighbors -- near neighbors14 don't have a problem with that.15 And that will be heard in court16 in March only because that was decided by17 the Zoning Board, and then the18 reconsideration, which took place behind19 closed doors, without any input from the20 near neighbors. And that's what we're21 arguing here, due process.22 And the last statement I have23 to make, because they took a cheap shot24 at the Residents Association. I served25 120 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 on the board for the community2 association for nine years. I was3 president of that organization. When I4 was president, I found misdeeds going on.5 There was money unaccounted for.6 It was reported to the Attorney7 General's Office. And this has all been8 published a matter of record. The9 Attorney General's Office fined them and10 said, You better start complying;11 otherwise, we're going to have you back12 here again.13 Thank you.14
Thank you. My21 name is Ann Ward Spaeth. I've lived in22 Chestnut Hill since 1960. I am a23 resident there, and I have been a member24 of the Chestnut Hill Community25 121 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 Association since 1967. When I first2 became a board member of that group, as a3 -- as the first president of the4 newly-formed Chestnut Hill Historical5 Society, I was one of the incorporators6 of that group, one of three7 incorporators.8 Throughout the following years,9 I have been on the board of the community10 association multiple times for -- been11 elected to it. The last election in this12 last year, there were not -- there was no13 formal vote for the people who ran for14 the board because there were not enough15 people running.16 The membership of the community17 association is currently down. And one18 of the reasons is that, in my view and in19 others' views, is that the community20 association no longer represents the21 interests of the residents but primarily22 those of the institutions and the23 businesses.24 It's very disturbing to hear --25 122 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 the Residents Association, of which I am2 also a member, was formed because in so3 many instances in perhaps the last ten or4 twelve years, when there has been a5 problem between residents' feelings about6 a development and the business or7 institution, almost routinely -- in fact,8 I cannot think of an instance where the9 community association took the part of10 the residents.11 We are not a splinter group.12 We have been ridiculed by Mr. Sullivan13 and called --14
I22 think we have to talk about the bill23 before us.24
Yes. The bill25 123 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 before us and the fact that it -- the2 neighbors were not called again to3 testify, when they were told at first4 that their request was reasonable, to not5 allow them to testify the second time6 seems unreasonable.7 It was suggested at the board8 meeting -- I was at the board meeting in9 May when this was presented to the CHCA10 board. It was suggested by a CHCA board11 member that there could be a -- they12 could come back in two years to reapply13 for the extra hours if that was needed.14 In that period of time,15 neighbors would have had the opportunity16 to know whether, in fact, Fresenius was a17 good neighbor and whether they could18 trust them.19 The fact that three times at20 that meeting, they said, "In 30 years,21 we've never wanted to go to a third22 shift," and the board voted -- not23 unanimously by any stretch -- to support24 them.25 124 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 But one -- when the2 reconsideration came about, the3 neighbors, and I too, came to wonder4 about the intentions and the veracity5 actually of what we have been told was6 agreed to.7 I -- I -- I hope -- I -- I8 couldn't come to the first hearing9 because I was just returning from10 Germany, where things were beautiful, and11 I know they can do a beautiful job. But12 we don't know what will happen in13 Chestnut Hill.14 And while the committees are15 wonderful in their professional status,16 they cannot know intimately, unless they17 live in that section, the impact on the18 lives of the people there. And that is19 what the neighbors want to know and to20 assess before granting the full hours.21 Thank you very much.22
Thank25 125 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 you, Madam President.2 Very quickly. Look, I3 understand that there certainly is4 disagreements on the process; I5 understand that, with the Zoning Board6 and all. Also, it's quite clear that7 there's some disputes with the groups in8 the neighborhood.9 But Miss Spaeth, I know in your10 letter, you say, "We count on you" --11 that's us -- "to support the residents."12 I think I heard that13 Mr. Primavera said that the organization14 would sign an agreement on the hours, and15 I think that's what the residents want,16 is to limit to 9 o'clock, right? on three17 days a week, six on the other.18 So when you get past everything19 else -- and what's before us today is20 whether to change the zoning or not.21 We're not the Zoning Board, we're not22 either association.23 But if it meets what the24 residents want, then I guess I don't25 126 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 understand why we shouldn't support it.2
This is the first3 time I've heard that. And when we were4 presented with the case at the board, we5 did not get the final agreement, which6 was four pages, single-spaced, until it7 was placed on the table. It had been8 sent at noon that day via e-mail. People9 are at work during the day.10
Are you a11 nearby resident, ma'am? Do you live12 nearby?13
Okay, I19 understand that, I understand that.20 But I guess just my question21 is: When you get past everything else --22 and I know that's hard to get past23 everything else -- if those hours, as was24 presented today, my understanding is,25 127 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 that's what the community wanted, that's2 what was in a lot of the communication we3 got, 'cause that communication said about4 24/7 operational. It was stated that's5 not the way it's going to be, there's6 going to be these hours.7 So I mean, I don't think, with8 all due respect, we're here to settle9 disputes between community associations10 and all that. We just want to know if11 this is the right thing to do. That's12 all.13
Thank you.17 If they go back to their18 standard hours, which is 6 to 6 three19 days a week and 6 to 9 three days, which20 the ZBA approved, fine.21
Okay.22 And that's what they said they were going23 to do.24
No, no, that's not25 128 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 what they say. They keep flip-flopping.2 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:3 Mr. Primavera, can you respond to that,4 please.5 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: Madam6 President, point of order on that7 question.8 What is the concern two days9 versus three days or three days versus10 two days?11
I12 have no idea.13 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: I'm just14 curious about that. Why is it that on15 certain days, it's accepted up to 9 p.m.16 and other days it's not? I'm -- what is17 the objection to that? What's to gain by18 only doing it three days or two days?19
The near neighbors20 will speak to that. I'm not a near21 neighbor.22 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:23 Excuse me, sir. We're really running out24 of time.25 129 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 (Addressing Mr. Primavera.)2 Would you please make it imminently clear3 what the hours are?4
Yes. The5 agreement with the community association,6 and the agreement we're stating here7 today, is that we will be running from 68 in the morning till 9 at night as the9 maximum hours.10
That doesn't12 mean we'll run the third shift regularly,13 but means if, in fact, there's critical14 demand, we want the ability to run from 615 in the morning till 9 at night.16 Right now, we'll be running 617 to 6 Tuesday, Thursday, and Saturday,18 which is what the neighbors want. But we19 can't put 2 or $3 million into a facility20 and, all of a sudden, find that, as21 Dr. Jones said, we're turning people away22 when we have a brand-new facility because23 people think that we should close at 6.24 The three hours may be life and25 130 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 death for some people; whereas, for2 others, it may be a matter of pride or a3 matter of getting the last word.4
Okay.12 I'm sorry about that. I misunderstood.13 So we're talking about --14 really what you're arguing about -- the15 dispute is three hours, three days a16 week.17
Okay, I20 understand that, and I think Councilman21 DiCicco asked this, and I was distracted.22
What is25 131 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 the difference between going to 92 o'clock, I think it's, Monday and3 Wednesday and only to 6 o'clock Tuesday4 and Thursday? Why do those days make any5 difference? I mean, any major6 significance.7
Well, because we8 followed the process. It's due process9 and that was decided by --10
Yeah, but15 the question is: Why are those three16 hours an issue, in reality, to the17 community? I guess is what I'm getting18 at. Why are those three hours on those19 other three days a difference?20
What25 132 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 is the problem?2
Thank7 you Miss Spaeth.8 Our next witness?9 (Witness comes forward.)10
Good11 afternoon, sir please identify yourself12 for the record.13
Hi. I'm Peter14 Burke. My wife and I live at 781115 Winston Road, which is one half block --16 not one, not two blocks like other people17 that have been here.18 Of course, this -- my wife and19 I filed -- are the ones who filed the20 appeal in the Commonwealth Court to the21 Zoning Board decision reversing their22 original decision and doing this behind,23 I'm sorry to say, closed doors; we were24 not permitted to make any personal25 133 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 testimony before that decision.2 I should say, first of all,3 that I'm not a member of the CHCA and I'm4 not a member of the CHRA. I live on5 Winston Road among a number of other6 people who live on Winston Road who are7 also not members of either organization.8 Okay. The timeline of events9 is that we had several community meetings10 with the people who were proposing this11 project. They told us -- Dr. Jones stood12 up there and said, "We only run Monday,13 Wednesday, and Friday till 9. We run14 Tuesday, Thursday, and Saturday till 6."15 You've heard that drill. And he said,16 "Those have been our hours for 30 years.17 We're not going to be very much of an18 impact on your community."19 And we -- although we would20 prefer they not run any night hours, we21 said okay. You know, we agreed that we22 would accept a Zoning Board revision --23 or what do you call it?24
A25 134 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 proviso?2
No, no, we would3 accept their getting permission to4 operate this facility.5 Okay. We asked them to put6 that in writing, like they had put all7 these other two pages of provisos on8 building size, building bricks, building9 windows in a letter to the Chestnut Hill10 Civic Association. And they rejected11 that. They rejected it approximately12 less than one month before the final vote13 before the CHCA.14 So a number of neighbors -- not15 members of either association -- went16 around. We developed a petition asking17 members of the community if they would18 support asking them to continue the19 maximum hours of operation that they had20 said they operated for 30 years. And we21 had approximately 70 signatures on that22 petition. I think someone has sent you23 copies of those petitions.24 Okay, so that's where we are.25 135 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 And you've gotten the history of the2 actions did he ZBA.3 We're upset that the ZBA4 reversed themselves. So my wife and I5 filed an appeal, which is our legal6 right.7 And we feel very upset that8 you're jumping into this once again now9 at the request of the promoters of this10 project, taking away the due process that11 we feel we have a right to have before12 the court of law.13 Okay. What's the problem with14 nine hours? First of all, they told us15 they'd never add them, they never used16 it. That's a problem, okay.17 We prefer no night hours. The18 businesses that exist in the neighborhood19 -- remember, we're not on Germantown20 Avenue; we're away from Germantown21 Avenue. The businesses that exist near22 our properties where we live don't23 operate nine hours. We don't have -- I24 mean, you even have these Philippe25 136 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 Brothers Ironwork; they don't work at2 night. Those guys go out and work and3 they come home 1t 5 o'clock and they4 leave. The same with the auto body shop;5 they come in at 8, they leave at 5.6 There's no business activity, there's no7 trucks, there's no nothing.8 This facility is a different9 animal from what we have dealt with in10 our neighborhoods.11 The other thing I wanted to12 mention is this business about residents.13 There's apartment buildings on the14 left-hand side which face Germantown15 Avenue that back up on this property.16 There are several houses along Germantown17 Avenue down beyond the property that18 also -- they face Germantown but they19 have their backyard on Winston Road, so20 they're really Bonn both streets.21 There's catty-corner across the22 street houses, single-family, twin houses23 up Winston Road. Moreland, same24 situation; there happened to be25 137 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 apartments on the other two corners.2 It's a lot more than four properties of3 residential people that are impacted by4 this proposed operation.5 So I -- I mean -- and the other6 thing, PECO, they have a facility right7 next door, a substation. If there's8 anybody that comes to that facility from9 PECO once a week maybe, maybe twice a10 week, we don't have traffic. These11 businesses are not high-traffic12 businesses, and they are not nighttime13 businesses.14 So that's why we're concerned15 about nighttime hours.16 We said okay, we understand.17 You've got patients that want to be18 dialyzed at night and that you have a19 history of operating Monday, Wednesday,20 and Friday nights, but you have no21 history of operating Tuesday, Thursday,22 and Saturday. So why come to the23 community, tell us all of this, and say24 oh -- at the last minute, Oh, we got to25 138 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 have access to 9 p.m. every night.2
Okay.7 Just a moment, please.8 The Chair recognizes Councilman9 Greenlee.10
Thank11 you, Madam President.12 Sir, I appreciate first that13 you're a resident and you're not getting14 involved in the community association15 versus the Residents Association; I16 understand that. And, again, as I said17 to the other people, I understand the18 process questions you may have.19 But I guess I'm still not real20 clear on what the difference is in the21 nights. I mean, if it's a problem on22 Monday with traffic, why would it not be23 a problem on Tuesday? Or if it's not,24 vice-versa? You know what I'm saying? I25 139 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 guess I just don't see something like2 this that's happening to not allow it to3 happen because of those few hours. It4 just doesn't --5
Why -- okay. We9 said, "We'll let that happen. Just give10 us some peace and quiet three nights a11 week." And if -- and was Ann Spaeth was12 right. Walter Sullivan offered them the13 offices of his organization if, in two14 years or three years, they felt they15 needed that extra time, we would hold16 some public hearings in the community.17 And if there was no problems with the way18 they were operating, okay. But they19 wouldn't accept that either.20
When you21 say "peace and quiet," though, how22 much -- as it was described here, I mean,23 you're talking about cars pulling in and24 out. Is it that much -- I mean, what you25 140 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 have right now under G-2 would have the2 potential to have a lot more of traffic3 and trucks pulling in and that kind of4 stuff, wouldn't it?5
The G-2 that was10 existing there was, again, once again, a11 daytime operation. They didn't come in12 at night.13
And also, it17 doesn't have to be G-2 in that sense. I18 mean, you're going -- you, being the19 City, is going through this process of20 redoing the zoning areas.21
And if that23 property is a G-2 -- I've heard it said24 at least at the zoning committee that25 141 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 it's not targeted for G-2. It's too2 small for an industrial operation.3
Well,4 that's one of the reasons why they want5 to -- I think the idea to remap and it6 change it, yeah, to make it more7 consistent.8
Well, why are you9 doing a special legislative end-run here10 when we have a legitimate lawsuit in a11 court of law and we're getting cheated12 out of our -- out of the due process13 under that circumstances.14
The21 Chair recognizes Councilman DiCicco.22 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: Thank you,23 Madam Chair.24 You know, I've dealt with a25 142 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 number of these types of issues over the2 years, as have my colleagues, especially3 the District Council folks, and I'll just4 give you an example.5 At Broad and Wolf, which was6 formerly a funeral home, a developer came7 to me -- it's directly across the street8 from the Council President's district, on9 the east side of Broad -- and proposed to10 build a drugstore. I forget if it was11 Walgreen's, one of those national brands.12 The site is directly across the13 street from the Methodist Hospital, on14 the same side of Methodist hospital,15 where the emergency entrance and parking16 entrance is to the hospital.17 The neighbors objected to the18 drugstore being developed there. We did19 ask the developer if he would restrict20 the hours to no later than 12 o'clock.21 Where I'm going with this is,22 these are two entirely different types of23 operations. If this were a drugstore, a24 CVS or one of those name-brand businesses25 143 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 that has either 12 hours or 24 hours of2 operation, I can see the flow of traffic3 being an imposition to the community.4 This is really a medical5 facility which is an office building6 that, for the most part, does not do7 ambulatory work or emergency work.8 If this was strictly an office9 building that housed people who did10 clerical work, would there still be11 objections because it's 9 o'clock?12 I mean, I look at this as a --13 and no disrespect to where you live and14 the folks live near you -- as a dead15 zone. I see this as a -- it is what it16 is, a vacant warehouse, with a not-good17 use of the parking lot, turning into an18 attractive-looking building that will be19 somewhat lit, that will employ people.20 And you will have pedestrian traffic,21 there's no question, but not a whole lot22 of that either.23 And see, I come from the24 position that we don't live in Mayberry;25 144 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 we live in a city. And for me,2 pedestrian traffic, with some vehicular3 traffic, is healthy. It's better than4 what's there.5 I guess my question, then,6 would be: If -- hypothetically, if the7 hours of operation for the six days was8 6 p.m., would you and your neighbors9 still be objecting to this proposal?10
I doubt it.11 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: So the12 three hours is the deal-breaker?13
Nighttime,14 nighttime.15 COUNCILMAN DiCICCO: Thank you.16 No other questions.17
Thank18 you.19 Any other questions?20 (No further questions.)21
Do we25 145 12.8.10 - RULES - BILL 1007531 have anyone else to testify on this bill?2 (No response.)3 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:4 Anyone else to testify on the bill?5 (No response.)6
Seein7 g none, this will conclude our public8 hearing, and we will now go into a public9 meeting.10 * * *11 146 12.8.10 - RULES - PUBLIC MEETING1
The2 Chair recognizes Councilman Greenlee3 regarding Bill No. 100079.4
Thank5 you, Madam President.6 I move that Bill No. 100079 be7 reported out of this committee with a8 favorable recommendation and that the9 rules of Council be suspended so as to10 allow for first reading at our next11 session of Council.12 (Motion duly seconded.)13
It's14 been moved and seconded that Bill No.15 100079 be reported out of committee with16 a favorable recommendation and, further,17 that the rules of Council be suspended so18 as to permit first reading at our next19 session of Council.20 All in favor will say aye.21 Those opposed?22 The ayes have it, and the23 motion carries.24 Again, the Chair recognizes25 147 12.8.10 - RULES - PUBLIC MEETING1 Councilman Greenlee regarding Bill No.2 100784.3
Thank4 you, Madam President.5 I move that Bill No. 100784 be6 reported out of this committee with a7 favorable recommendation and that the8 rules of Council be suspended to allow9 for first reading at our next session of10 Council.11 (Motion duly seconded.)12
It13 has been moved and properly seconded that14 Bill No. 100784 be reported out of15 committee with a favorable recommendation16 and, further, that the rules of Council17 be suspended so as to permit first18 reading at our next session of Council.19 All in favor will say aye.20 Those opposed?21 The ayes have it, and the22 motion carries.23 The Chair recognizes Councilman24 Greenlee regarding Bill No. 100753.25 148 12.8.10 - RULES - PUBLIC MEETING1
Thank2 you, Madam President.3 I move that Bill No. 100753 be4 reported out of this committee with a5 favorable recommendation and that the6 rules of Council be suspended to allow7 for first reading at our next session of8 City Council.9 (Motion duly seconded.)10
It11 has been moved and properly seconded that12 Bill No. 100753 be reported out of13 committee with a favorable recommendation14 and, further, that the rules of Council15 be suspended so as to permit first16 reading at our next session of Council.17 All in favor will indicate by18 saying aye.19 Those opposed?20 The ayes have it, the motion21 carries.22 And this concludes our public23 meeting regarding the Rules Committee.24 Thank you all very much.25 149 12.8.10 - RULES - PUBLIC MEETING1 (Proceedings end at 12:28 p.m.)2 * * *3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 150 C E R T I F I C A T E2 I HEREBY CERTIFY that the4 proceedings of the City of Philadelphia5 Council Committee on Rules are contained fully6 and accurately in the stenographic notes taken7 by me on Wednesday, December 8, 2010, and that8 this is a true and correct statement of same.9 10 11 12 __________________________________ 13 JOSEPHINE CARDILLO Registered Professional Reporter14 15 16 17 18 19 20 (The foregoing certification of21 this transcript does not apply to any22 reproduction of the same by any means, unless23 under the direct control and/or supervision of24 the certifying reporter.)25