civus
Hearing video

ZBA Hearing - October 23, 2024

Philadelphia Zoning Board of Adjustment (ZBA)Oct 23, 20246h 7m

I do.

Similar wording

Could you identify your client and relationship to this property?

Similar wording

Yeah, my client is Letitia D. Scott.

Similar wording

She should be on the call at this time we spoke prior to, so she should be hanging around on the call at one of these.

Similar wording

And our vice chair has just a few questions, sir.

Similar wording

good morning counsel do you agree to wait to read another refusal or stipulate towards accuracy

Similar wording

yes have you emailed in all the required documents and exhibits that's needed to

Similar wording

proceed with this case five days in advance of this hearing i have i have thank you counsel

Similar wording

good to see you please proceed and share your screen okay i believe you should be seeing my

Similar wording

screen at this moment yes we're good okay all right so we're here to talk about um 7201 mars

Similar wording

Street. This is a property in the Northeast area of Philadelphia. This is the, as you see on my

Similar wording

typical exhibits, this is a picture of the outside as you can take a look at it there.

Similar wording

Our, my typical exhibits have 14 tabs. I'll move through them and we'll discuss the property

Similar wording

alongside. This is a refusal for an assembly and entertainment. This is a, in this particular

Similar wording

zoning code of the property is zoned currently CMX1, and it requires a zoning variance to use

Similar wording

it as a catering hall. It's a small, one-story property, as you've seen, and in an existing

Similar wording

structure, no repairs need to be made, no modifications of it. The property was previously

Similar wording

used as a dance studio. I think the previous tenant was a dance studio before my client

Similar wording

purchased the property. She saw that during that time it was the uses as a dance studio had, of

Similar wording

course, children in and out, back and forth. They were doing events of all kinds there during that

Similar wording

time. My client purchased it with the belief and understanding that it could be used in a similar

Similar wording

way. She does not want to use it as a dance studio per se, but she wants to use it as a small catering

Similar wording

hall, no more than 75 persons. Her hours of operation will be in the neighborhood of eight

Similar wording

in the morning to no later than 12 pm at night and she will have this uh operated as a there's

Similar wording

no there's it's not a bar as neighbors have thought it's not a it's not going to be a

Similar wording

speakeasy it's going to be exactly what she said it would be a small neighborhood catering hall

Similar wording

and that is what she's desiring so as i'll move through our exhibits number one we have our deed

Similar wording

i'll push through that uh our second her application for appeal she initiated this

Similar wording

project this um application pro se and engaged me in the last hearing after last hearing as she

Similar wording

desired the need for representation at that time our project information sheet is here attached

Similar wording

uh exhibit number five kind of shows you exactly what we're looking at here in this particular

Similar wording

area cmx1 you can see there are cms1 properties on many of the corners as this area was developed

Similar wording

there would be corner stores or neighborhood use type of properties at the corners with residential

Similar wording

of homes in the in the interior and that's what we see here this is no different um so here it's

Similar wording

it's right there at the edge um and and because she wants to do a neighborhood serving catering

Similar wording

hall a small neighborhood serving catering hall it kind of it fits within the character of what

Similar wording

was envisioned when the cmx1 was was actually uh permitted in these corners of this of this

Similar wording

neighborhood let's look at a visual of an aerial as you can see here this is the property here with

Similar wording

this blue balloon and the property has a even though it has a small driveway in the back

Similar wording

my client owns also this property at the front that faces on torsdale avenue

Similar wording

and so basically this parking lot that's already paid will be servicing

Similar wording

and so basically this parking lot that's already paid will be servicing any particular parking

Similar wording

that might be needed for those coming to the catering hall um in addition additionally any

Similar wording

trash that will be stored will be stored back here out of view and out of the presence of anybody

Similar wording

that potentially could um you know none of the neighbors can see or or experience any visual

Similar wording

of any trash that will be stored in the back so parking um trash are basically taken care of as

Similar wording

far as that there will be security lighting as well as security cameras around the perimeter of

Similar wording

the property so as we go into the inside of the property this is what we look at this is the um

Similar wording

the front door and that's all you got here you have an open space with mirrors um on on the first

Similar wording

floor here's a reverse of the same of the same room already done it was done like this before

Similar wording

this is a hallway outside of that main catering hall area and then also as you move down this is

Similar wording

a this is a sort of a back this this is a side door um behind that um big that main room this

Similar wording

is the other side uh like a little lounge area outside of this main room this is a view of what

Similar wording

the bathrooms look like and going downstairs this is what you see there um again mirrored room just

Similar wording

a small room um with nothing there there's no fixtures there's no um by no means will this be

Similar wording

any kind of a speakeasy type of place this is going to be a catering hall a large smaller

Similar wording

units smaller occasions will be upstairs larger occasions might occupy the up and the downstairs

Similar wording

depending and that is exactly what you have just a small room here utilities are downstairs as well

Similar wording

one of those closets and this is the rear um the driveway is right here and the driveway opens to

Similar wording

this door which leads to that we saw the space earlier in a different picture sort of a prep

Similar wording

area in the back that can also be used for small um gatherings if if need be so that is that is

Similar wording

the picture of the property again this is before she got involved it's all cleaned up now and not

Similar wording

like this as we can see but this is the this is what we're looking for now as far as plans let

Similar wording

me make this a little bit smaller so you can take a look we just we've just seen it nothing major

Similar wording

here the plans that we've got basically lay out the exact same space we've seen pictures here is

Similar wording

the first floor here's the lower floor is just a single open room the top floor is a again a single

Similar wording

open room with a side lounge and a staging area envisioned and this is the driveway very simple

Similar wording

straightforward and not much more um to be you know to be seen so as we move down through this

Similar wording

we have our we sent our rco notices out to the community this is our notice exhibit nine shows

Similar wording

the 112 applicants that we sent it out to these are the addresses of those folks exhibit 10 shows

Similar wording

the proof of mail goes on for many pages proof of mail for all of those this is the

Similar wording

The zoning notice is our exhibit number, our exhibit number 11, and our exhibit 12 is basically showing the proof of posting of that hearing notice of this ZBA notice at the community.

Similar wording

So let's talk about what happened at the actual RCO meeting. Now, the RCO meeting for this particular property was not very well attended.

Similar wording

There was the board and there was, I think, one neighbor from the community, which is a woman who lived immediately next door.

Similar wording

During that RCO meeting, there was lots of talk from that woman about the previous person.

Similar wording

She had no complaints about my client in particular, just the previous use and the corner property where the building has been abandoned, will close for many years.

Similar wording

And there's been intruders in the building that faces Toursdale that my client also owns.

Similar wording

So much of the talk was not about this structure at all or about the use at all.

Similar wording

It was more that.

Similar wording

And so with only one person from the near as a neighbor there, she voiced an opposition, but there was not any other members of the community in opposition of this very simple and normal use.

Similar wording

Now, the now the one of the members of the board of the RCO had a lot of conversation about the parking lot and whether or not the parking lot needed to be a part of this application and him misunderstanding what we were here for.

Similar wording

and our issue because my client owns both properties that are contiguous and adjacent

Similar wording

and that parking lot will be used for any overflow needed there was a question there was talk of that

Similar wording

but other than that we feel that there should have been opposite there should have been a support

Similar wording

from the community from the rco standpoint um surprised that they went with a split but i can

Similar wording

from what i can see and from what the rco meeting presented there was only one single

Similar wording

and from what the rco meeting presented there was only one single family and there was two i guess

Similar wording

two persons who were in that in that same household it should have counted for a single vote um in

Similar wording

opposition other than that it was just the board so we don't have a scenario where there's much

Similar wording

opposition as though as the letter of opposition might might show but we would like at this time

Similar wording

um to bring on my client to talk a little bit about her experiences with this catering hall

Similar wording

what she's envisioning there to adopt my testimony and to ask any questions that the board might have

Similar wording

so mr toppen before we go on there's no cooking in the in the location no no cooking no cooking

Similar wording

there's this food will be brought to the location food will be brought uh outside caterers will be

Similar wording

if for the event is basically a hollow space so as you can see your honor i mean mr mr chair

Similar wording

and uh any food service will be brought there and and warmed up there in sternos if you will

Similar wording

Why don't you bring your client on?

Similar wording

Okay.

Similar wording

We'd like to invite Ms. Letitia Scott, if she could be advanced to panelists as well.

Similar wording

They've been allowed to speak.

Similar wording

Good morning.

Similar wording

Could you please state your name and spell for the court stenographer?

Similar wording

Good morning, everyone.

Similar wording

My name is Letitia D. Scott, L-A-T-I-S-H-A-S-C-O-T-T.

Similar wording

Well, how do you do?

Similar wording

Tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth.

Similar wording

Yes, I do.

Similar wording

Please proceed, counsel.

Similar wording

Yes, Ms. Scott, you've been listening to my testimony, and I just wanted to ask you a few questions before you adopt what I've said thus far.

Similar wording

You will be the owner and operator of this catering business. Is that correct?

Similar wording

Yes, it is.

Similar wording

And currently, what is your business activities? What is your background?

Similar wording

Currently, I am a child care provider. I've been doing so since 2011.

Similar wording

So I've been caring for children for roughly 14 years.

Similar wording

Prior to that, my focus was I worked in the financial business and banking for 15 years.

Similar wording

I left that to start to care for children.

Similar wording

I've always been in some type of service of business.

Similar wording

So like when I worked in banking, people trusted me with their money.

Similar wording

I've educated people with credit.

Similar wording

I've always poured in or taught people, always made an impact with my clients and in my community.

Similar wording

So that, you know, led to when I became a parent and I saw the things that I saw for my children in child care that empowered me to want to open my own daycare facility.

Similar wording

So I left the financial institution field and opened my own business.

Similar wording

And it's been great taking care of children. I have encountered hundreds of children, family, mothers, friends, so forth and so on.

Similar wording

And I have learned that there's a need and a lot of people want to have parties for their children.

Similar wording

they look for places to have baby showers um and their houses can't you know fit everybody

Similar wording

we have families and they don't have enough space so back in the day shall I say we used to use like

Similar wording

the churches or like maybe our gyms and community centers and unfortunately there's not many of

Similar wording

those things still available to us so with encountering those things being invited to stuff

Similar wording

um caring for children and they're having a bunch of parties and I'm hearing the parents communicate

Similar wording

Like, oh, my God, do you know anybody that has a place?

Similar wording

I really want to give her a party.

Similar wording

I really want to have this 60th birthday dinner for my mom where, you know, I'm turning 30.

Similar wording

I wish I had somewhere to have it because my house isn't big enough.

Similar wording

Hearing those things over the years, that led me to my next venture.

Similar wording

OK, so you own this property and the property adjacent to it that fronts on Toursdale as well.

Similar wording

Yeah, so what's very unique about that is that I purchased this property first.

Similar wording

and then um i saw the parking lot and i saw the i didn't know that the house was connected so

Similar wording

maybe a year and a half later the owner um came over to me and was like you know introducing

Similar wording

himself and i was talking to him and lo and behold he was about to sell the property so i'm like oh

Similar wording

my god like that would be awesome if i get parking to pair with this event space when people have

Similar wording

something they'll even have somewhere to park that'll be like so much more convenient okay let

Similar wording

Let me ask you about the hours of operation. When do you envision the hours to be of use for the catering space that you're interested in doing?

Similar wording

I honestly don't think anything would occur in the early morning from my experiences with baby showers and like dinners, maybe like a brunch.

Similar wording

So I don't foresee anything before 10 a.m. I don't really have people that get up that early.

Similar wording

They want to have a bit that early. So maybe it might be decorators coming in around 10 a.m.

Similar wording

But most of the time people have like brunches, baby showers.

Similar wording

I've had a couple of calls for like repasses and things of that nature.

Similar wording

So I would honestly say probably around 10 a.m. in the morning.

Similar wording

And absolutely nothing will occur after 11 a.m.

Similar wording

after 11 a.m my my intention you mean 11 p.m okay so yes I would like for everything to end

Similar wording

My intention.

Similar wording

You mean 11 a.m.?

Similar wording

You mean 11 a.m.?

Similar wording

um honestly by that time to be cleared out and locked up for my own safety I would like to

Similar wording

travel home as soon as possible I would like my staffing and anyone that assists with the events

Similar wording

to be leaving um at the safest hours possible so I don't enjoy being out late so I don't want to

Similar wording

have the type of events that run too late to be quite honest okay and then and RCO meeting you

Similar wording

did have some conversation. You fielded some questions about the use of the space. As far as

Similar wording

your experience there during the RCO meeting, what were some of the comments that you encountered

Similar wording

as you now realize they have sent a letter of opposition? What were some of the things that

Similar wording

concerned you about that proceeding? Well, I actually thought that everything was great. I

Similar wording

was super shocked that I was the only person on the dare. So I was like nervous because like the

Similar wording

whole night was just me. To see the one person show up, I mean, I felt great about that because

Similar wording

I've heard 100 and something people. I have talked to people in the community. I have met

Similar wording

the person that owns the printing company across the street. Him and I are really, really cool when

Similar wording

we see each other. We talk. I've encountered a few people in the neighborhood. It's really hard

Similar wording

to know everyone because I'm not able to be there, which is the goal to be more present once my

Similar wording

businesses I've been running hopefully but um the people that they were happy that I had brought

Similar wording

this but the meeting I felt like the the young lady was a little more frustrated with the house

Similar wording

and I think that when she found out that I was the owner of both she focused a lot of her

Similar wording

frustration on the the the dumping and the intruders and the violations and things of that

Similar wording

nature and as I explained to her even on this particular building you know one of my windows

Similar wording

was broken by children i was not playing and i told her like you know i i clean up everything

Similar wording

i've i've been a victim as well but i am your neighbor and i am in your community and together

Similar wording

if i can get the businesses up and running and we get present in activity um i'll be able to

Similar wording

decrease that stuff because i've had to board up the property i've had to clean it up i've had

Similar wording

weekly trash removal done there i keep the grass cut like she was more concerned about that house

Similar wording

that there wasn't really a lot of attention given to the beauty of the vision that i had for this

Similar wording

particular speak and i felt like that they just didn't um really pay attention to morrison street

Similar wording

they were more focused on the house and we just weren't there for that property that day

Similar wording

so i just i don't i think that it wasn't really fair that they didn't stick to the property that

Similar wording

was asking for because once they roll out I own both properties um it just wasn't fair attention

Similar wording

to the specifics of that debt okay well I appreciate that that feedback and the board I'm

Similar wording

sure could ask any follow-up questions they may have about that but but you heard me testify before

Similar wording

I asked you these questions and I just wanted to know if you if anything if you adopted testimony

Similar wording

that I've made on your behalf up to the point that you began testifying oh absolutely I think it was

Similar wording

very very very honest um exactly executed my vision and what I would like to do for the

Similar wording

community and just everyone I I feel like it is a need um as you stated it was a dance studio with

Similar wording

a ton of traffic and children and you know music activity I'm sure they probably put on shows I

Similar wording

have two daughters and myself that participate in dance so I'm familiar with what goes on um

Similar wording

and I don't think anything that I'm doing is going to be different um probably going to be

Similar wording

less traffic because it's not a daily operation and it'll just be used as needed and as booked

Similar wording

so I'm hoping that the people in the neighborhood will need it um benefit from it and I have a lot

Similar wording

of things that I would like to do for the community as a child care provider that just

Similar wording

naturally comes to me um and I'm actually excited and I think they'll love the things that I want

Similar wording

to do so okay and you you would you'd adopt my testimony as your own um that i said before you

Similar wording

come on is that correct yes well this time there's any further questions for members of the board

Similar wording

questions questions from the board i have one yeah go ahead oh okay um i didn't it was could

Similar wording

you tell me how many exits it is from the basement i believe you said that there were maybe some

Similar wording

events the event space may be expended expanded to the basement if they're large how many exits

Similar wording