The requirement18 of State law is to have for every dollar19 that you receive from the State, the20 local, and they don't define how local21 is, but the locals much match it at a22 15 percent ratio.23
Okay. So24 for every dollar from the State,25 394 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 Philadelphia and surrounding counties2 that participate in the SEPTA have to3 provide 15 cents.4
Right. It's an5 85 percent/15 percent matching6 requirement.7
And we8 negotiate that with the surrounding9 counties and with SEPTA?10
It's been a11 longstanding arrangements between the12 City and the four counties as to how that13 match requirement has been allocated.14
Okay. Has18 the City approached SEPTA or the19 surrounding counties about the counties20 picking up more of the burden during this21 economic crisis?22
Okay. If25 395 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 you could just provide sort of your2 analysis of that to the Chair both in3 terms of ridership, what we contribute4 compared to, you know, broken down by5 type of service, also including regional6 rail, I would appreciate that.7 What would happen if the City8 cut funding for SEPTA in this9 environment, where you're receiving so10 much economic stimulus money and you11 appear to have run a $40 million -- you12 are projected to run a $40 million13 surplus this year.14
I think it15 would jeopardize the receipt of State16 funds. As part of the State law, the17 State requires the local match to be18 available in which the year they provide19 the State funds. So if the local match20 is not available, the State withholds21 their funds.22
What happens2 when there's a surplus that nobody's3 budgeted for that results in extra cash4 within SEPTA?5
The surplus6 issues for the Service Stabilization7 Funds, whenever Act 44 was passed about8 two years ago, the funds that were not9 required to balance the budget in the10 current fiscal year were put aside for --11 in a Service Stabilization Fund.12
That is to15 allocate funds for future operating16 budgets should funding not be available17 and we would have to be looking at either18 cutting service or increasing fares.19 Prior to Act 44, we went20 through a period of probably five or six21 years with great fiscal uncertainty. And22 in my previous position as Budget23 Director, probably every year, we were24 out with public hearings, looking at25 397 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 different options to balance the budget,2 and we don't want to have to go through3 that certainly in the short term.4
So Act 445 restricts what we can do with the surplus6 dollars also.7
Act 44 does11 not specifically direct you as to how to12 restrict those dollars.13
Oh, I14 thought you just testified that they had15 to go into the Stabilization Fund.16
We have worked17 with PennDOT, and they have agreed to the18 use of funds for that purpose.19
Okay. So20 that's not restricted either. So, in21 other words, that's a negotiation also.22 I'm just trying to figure out the moving23 pieces in your --24
With PennDOT,25 398 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 yes.2 (Timer bell rings.)3
Okay. I4 have some more questions. I'll come5 back.6 COUNCILWOMAN TASCO:7 Councilwoman Blackwell.8
Let me13 likewise wish Jettie all the best and14 thank her and thank Frances.15 And, Mr. Burnfield, a special16 thank-you to you for helping us -- and17 good afternoon as well -- on this last18 big issue, on the issue of curbs and19 sidewalks. I'll always remember you for20 that.21 (Laughter.)22
Yes.23 We had a big issues, I'll say to my24 colleagues, on the curbs and sidewalks25 399 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 for the Market Street elevated project.2 And they wanted to pave one-third to3 one-half of a block and the curb and4 leave the other half old.5 And thanks to Mr. Burnfield.6 You know what would happen after one7 winter; it would all look bad, you know.8 And he, with the voice of reason, said,9 If you've spent all of this money, what's10 a couple million more to make it right.11 I thank him for that.12 And I think we're kind of13 almost there. We have those Bilco doors14 to deal with that. Maybe we can work15 together with you and L&I.16 And my last issue, of course,17 will be one that indirectly affects you,18 vendors and parking meters and such.19 But I do want to again say20 thank you. This new leadership team is21 all the difference, all the difference in22 the world. And I'm grateful for the23 final opportunity to be able to work24 together after all these years on this25 400 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 project, which we know started in 1999.2 So it's been a long time coming. And3 we're glad that at the end of this year4 that our major issues will be completed.5 So thank you. And I look6 forward to working with you to finish7 these last bits of it.8
Thank you.9 We're also looking forward to the10 completion of the project. And we thank11 you for your support. We know it's been12 a long project, has had an impact on the13 community certainly, but better days are14 ahead.15
Thank16 you.17 And let me also note that you18 are also the first team on cleanup days19 to come out and actually clean and pick20 up trash and work with the community and21 really, really be involved in the22 community, which is what it's all about.23 So again thank you.24
Thank you.25 401 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1
Thank you2 very much.3 I just have one reminder -- not4 even a question. I wanted to be on5 record that we've been working with SEPTA6 to get a bus service from the Lower7 Northeast to travel through Olney and8 East Oak Lane over to the Cheltenham9 Mall, because the people who live in10 Melrose Park in East Oak Lane have to go11 back to Broad and Olney to go back up to12 the Cheltenham Avenue.13 So it's -- we've talked to you14 and sent letter, and we've been talking15 to Frances, and we want that to become a16 reality because we are working with the17 county. Cheltenham and Philadelphia have18 a planning grant from the State through19 State Representative Evans, and we have a20 business improvement district up there21 between the two, so we have great22 cooperation between the two counties.23 And if you all could make that24 happen, it would be very helpful to the25 402 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 citizens over in Melrose Park. You don't2 want me to put Mr. Robison on you either.3 (Laughter.)4
'Cause I5 not only do I have this bus, I got the6 driveway. So...7
We have8 scheduled a public hearing. It's9 tentatively scheduled for June 10th.10 It's our Annual Service Plan, and that11 route is a part of the hearing that day.12
Oh, thank13 you very much. I appreciate it.14 Now Councilwoman Brown.15
Thank you16 very much.17 I wanted to follow up on18 Councilman Jones' question, the Summer19 Internship Program. Just speak briefly20 about that: What it is, how many young21 people does it capture, how long is the22 program, what are the criteria for23 consideration to be a candidate for that24 program?25 403 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1
It's for 282 summer interns. I believe it's a 10-week3 program, and I believe you have to have a4 current GPA of 2.5 and a sophomore in5 college.6
Which is14 another reminder of how anxious young15 people are to get to work.16 Exciting news here. In your17 testimony, you state that we will be18 receiving 120 new hybrid buses. How much19 do you think that will save the City in20 long-term purchase of gas?21
Right now, we22 believe, based on the hybrid buses that23 we already have in service, that the24 diesel buses averaged 2.8 miles per25 404 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 gallon. The hybrid buses will average2 about 3.5 miles per gallon. So as we3 convert our entire fleet to hybrid, it's4 going to have a very significant savings5 in diesel fuel.6
By the end of9 this summer, we will have 260 hybrid10 buses; and then, next year, another 12011 buses; and the year after that, another12 hundred buses.13 The SEPTA Board policy is for14 all future bus procurements to be hybrid15 buses.16
Mm-hmm.17 So then, you expect by 2011 to be fully18 hybrid vehicles?19
Okay.25 405 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 Seniors, paratransit. First, let me say2 thank you. And that SEPTA, through3 Frances Jones, always makes sure that a4 SEPTA representative is at the senior5 citizen forums that I do for eight6 executive weeks every fall. So we7 appreciate that, actually having a SEPTA8 employee up there to speak up close and9 personal about paratransit.10 And each year, there have been11 improvements, I've learned, in what12 you're doing around paratransit. So13 speak to us about what some of those14 improvements have been, because always,15 there's the ongoing challenge to help16 seniors get where they need to be on time17 and with a level of courtesy by your18 employees.19
Well, I think20 the most significant improvements that21 we're working on right now is that we are22 in the process of making major23 improvements to our Control Center, where24 all of the vehicles that are used in25 406 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 paratransit have automatic vehicle2 locator, so that if you're in the Control3 Center, you will know exactly where that4 car, sedan, mini bus is.5
So that if the7 driver is either stuck in traffic,8 delayed, gets lost, that they will know9 exactly where they are and can10 communicate that to our customers so that11 they're not waiting around, wondering12 where their vehicle is, where their bus13 is, whether it's 5 minutes away or 2514 minutes away.15
Do you do19 any type of customer service information-20 gathering; in other words, asking your21 customers to tell you what they believe22 SEPTA can do better, particularly again23 around paratransit and seniors so that we24 can hear from where they sit?25 407 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1
As part of our2 new Customer Service Division that the3 General Manager established last year,4 when he became general manager, we5 created a new Customer Service Division.6 And as part one of the7 priorities of the Assistant General8 Manager for Customer Service is that we9 put out a poll on our Internet site every10 two weeks, asking for information from11 our customers. We have picked different12 subject matters that we believe are13 important to our customers, asking for14 feedback as to how we can improve our15 customer service.16 And taking information from17 that, we look at programs that we can18 initiate. One of the suggestions that19 came in last year that we have since20 implemented is the quiet ride car on our21 regional rail cars.22
So we believe24 it's been very good information that we25 408 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 get from our customers. They're riding2 the system every day, they are our eyes3 and ears, and we thank them for really4 giving us a huge response to our survey5 so far.6
Surely.7 The only recommendation or suggestion I8 would offer: For those who are not9 fortunate enough to have computers and10 cannot access the Internet, a lot of our11 seniors, if you could confer with the12 head of senior citizen centers around the13 City who are relying on paratransit to14 move their seniors in and out. I know15 that would be helpful just based on16 informal discussions I've had with them.17
Then20 lastly, with your 4 percent increase in21 ridership, have you thought about a Rainy22 Day Fund to invest those dollars back23 into services where riders can benefit?24 (Timer bell rings.)25 409 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1
That's exactly2 what we did last year. Last year, when3 ridership increased significantly when4 gasoline prices went up, we took the5 additional revenue, which was about6 $10 million, and we added that right back7 into the budget for service initiatives.8
We had 65 new10 service initiatives. Because of that11 additional ridership, we noticed that12 there were a number of bus routes that13 were experiencing overcrowding. So14 rather than retiring 40 buses that we had15 planned to retire, we kept those 40 buses16 so that we could add more service during17 the peak hours. And then also, we tried18 to fill in some of the gaps off-peak.19 So that's exactly what we did20 when we saw the increase in ridership.21
Thank25 410 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 you.2 The Chair recognizes3 Councilwoman Sanchez.4
Thank5 you, Madam President.6 I don't have a lot of questions7 because we had an opportunity to talk8 during a briefing session that9 Mr. Massaro had, and I found that to be10 very informative. But there were two11 issues during that discussion that we had12 that I want to back to and see where your13 updates are.14 And one is to remind you I15 represent a district that is 10 of the16 blue line el stops. And one of my17 questions and concerns at that time was18 the availability of purchasing tokens or19 token machines in all of those stops.20 And the reason is that in, for whatever21 reason, the policy decision, tokens are22 not sold during peak traffic times, and23 those are some of my poverty areas. It24 goes counter to what we're trying to do25 411 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 in terms of having people have access to2 public transportation.3 So where are we with that?4
It's Frances Jones.5 Councilwoman, we got that6 recommendation and we really are looking7 into it. Some of the stations are still8 under -- I think the last station to be9 done is -- I think it's Margaret Orthodox10 that we're working on, and we're looking11 at that at this point to see what we can12 do to accommodate to you around the13 tokens at the stations.14
Thank15 you, Frances.16 But it's not me; it's the17 riders, and it's a particularly poor18 area. So this is very important to me19 because I hear it all the time. So it's20 real important that we make tokens21 available 24 hours to folks on those22 lines.23
Let me25 412 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 thank you. I know that the renovations2 of all the el stops have been very3 important to the neighborhood, and I4 thank Frances for working with us. I5 know we're working on the Berks Street6 piece right now, which I appreciate7 SEPTA's help.8 The other that issue I brought9 up during that time was the issue of bus10 shelters and trash receptacles in large11 bus stops, because that adds to some of12 the trash problems. Where are we with13 looking at that?14
The shelters are15 installed by the City of Philadelphia16 through the Office of Transportation, and17 that request should be made through the18 Office of Transportation around the19 shelters as well as trash receptacles.20
Okay.21 So I'll ask Rina Cutler when she comes22 back up, where are we with that? Okay,23 I'll save it for that time.24 Okay. That's all of my25 413 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 questions. Thank you.2
Thank3 you.4 The Chair recognizes Councilman5 Green.6
Thank you,7 Madam Chair.8 Perhaps we missed it, but my9 office did not receive any budget detail10 for SEPTA. Did you send around binders11 like you normally do?12
It was my13 understanding that the testimony that was14 requested we sent over to the Budget15 Office, as is the normal procedure. And16 it was my understanding that the17 testimony was distributed. However, we18 brought over copies of the testimony.19
Not the20 testimony but there's no -- the budget --21 your detailed budget. I mean, I guess I22 could go -- is it available on your23 website or --24
I actually have25 414 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 a copy of the SEPTA 2010 operating budget2 here with me today. I can leave a copy,3 and I can also provide additional copies4 for members of Council.5
Okay.6 That's great.7 How much State funding are we8 getting that requires a local match this9 year?10
For fiscal11 2010, $517 million of operating12 assistance.13
And the 1514 percent you mentioned, does that include15 operating and capital, or is it separate16 categories?17
The 15 percent18 match is just for operating assistance.19
Okay. So20 what is the total amount of dollars that21 we spend that is contributed by the22 counties added all up together? My23 recollection was, it was 80 million.24
It's25 415 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 approximately 80 million, correct.2
Okay. But3 the matching requirements is only4 77.55 million if it's 517. So can you5 tell me what all of the funds are?6
I don't have7 all of the specific numbers in front of8 me as to how much each of the counties9 provide along with the City, but I'd be10 happy to get that information to you.11
Okay. I12 mean, in other words, if the -- it sounds13 like we can appropriate you less money14 than we did last year based on the total15 number according to the matching formula.16 And we may or may not have to negotiate17 with the surrounding counties since we18 appear not to be increasing the wage19 taxes of their residents about whether or20 not, you know, how much of the savings in21 the local match we can take advantage of22 here in Philly versus surrounding23 counties.24 But that would be a discussion25 416 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 with those counties; is that correct?2
No. I would3 say that if the City provided less match4 than what was requested, that could5 jeopardize the State grants.6
Well, no.7 What is -- I'm sorry. We provide 808 percent of the match?9
I don't have13 that in front of me but we'd be happy to14 provide that.15
Okay. Well,16 you've requested $64 million for us, but17 80 percent of 77.55 million is actually18 $62 million. So it sounds like you need19 $2 million less from us than you're20 asking for, and you can still comply with21 State law.22
I'd have to23 check exact numbers. I don't have the24 percentages. You know, 80 percent is my25 417 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 recollection in round numbers. It could2 be 81 or 82; I just don't know that3 exactly.4
Okay.5 Please provide that information to the6 Chair. I think we've found another7 $2 million, Madam President.8 I have lots of questions about9 fiber optics and other things in the10 subways. I'm going to go offline with11 those so that -- and just set up a12 meeting with you after the budget process13 so we don't take time today.14 Thank you.15 (Timer bell rings.)16
Thank17 you.18 Councilwoman Blackwell, your19 light's on; did you want to be20 recognized?21 COUNCILWOMAN BLACKWELL:22 (Shakes head.)23
Thank24 you.25 418 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 Councilman Green, are you2 finished?3
Thank6 you.7 Are there any questions from8 members of the committee?9 (No questions.)10 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:11 Seeing none, I thank you. Thank you very12 much.13 (Witnesses come forward.)14
Good15 afternoon. Kindly identify yourself for16 the record.17
Good afternoon,18 Madam President and members of Council.19 My name is Charlesretta Meade. I'm20 Chairwoman of the Board of Revision of21 Taxes.22 With me today are Harvey Levin,23 our Vice Chairman of the Board; and24 Enrico Foglia, our Executive Director.25 419 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 Also we have Board Member James Dintino2 present and our also esteemed judge, Alan3 Silberstein are present today.4 In addition, I was asked to5 mention that Board Member Robert Nix III6 regrets that he's not able to appear; he7 is serving as the alternate to the Board8 of View today, which is also the9 responsibility of the Board of Revision10 of Taxes. And also the regrets of11 Justice Russell Nigro, who is in12 Pittsburgh, attending the funeral of13 former Justice Caffey.14 COUNCIL PRESIDENT VERNA:15 Caffey.16
So thank you for17 having us here today. 21 We submitted the tentative22 numbers to Council and to the23 Administration last week, and we also24 presented a briefing. That information25 420 5/4/09 COMM. 4 So we'd just like to say that5 the budget is our basic budget. 11 The Class 100 employee12 compensation: 125 full-time positions13 for FY '10. That is a reduction from our14 current status of employees, which is15 137, and from our allowance of 14516 employees. 18 The total of the General Fund19 request of the budget this year is20 $7,816,024. 24 The BRT are carrying on our25 421 5/4/09 COMM. 6 We've given you a synopsis of7 our Citizen Service Center. The Citizen8 Service Center is our fully-staffed9 customer service center, with the purpose10 to provide efficient, quality,11 professional services and assistance to12 consumers. The services are provided by13 use of the BRT Call Center, an14 interactive voice response system, our15 BRT website, and there's also walk-in16 assistance. 20 Our Information Technology21 Division operations. We gave a brief22 update when we were here in March for the23 Transfer Ordinance, and Allan Frank, the24 head of the Department of Technology, was25 422 5/4/09 COMM. 3 Basically, we called the4 Department of Technology, with the new5 head, Allan Frank, to request his6 assistance in October, because we just7 were having problems, and it was multiple8 problems, getting the system fully up and9 operational. 21 We've -- the Actual Value22 Initiative I spoke about earlier, and we23 did the briefing on that last week. So24 the information that's contained here has25 423 5/4/09 COMM. 12 Also, the 30,000 values for the13 commercial properties were values that14 were done by the Commercial Unit. 16 We've included the statistical17 information Council often asks for on the18 abatement and exemption program. 21 And, in summary, we'd like to22 say that the Board of Revision of Taxes23 plans to continue its efforts to improve24 levels of performance in all areas. Our25 424 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 ultimate goal remains: The establishment2 of fair and equitable property3 assessment. 13 We know that we, like the rest14 of the City, will have to sustain some15 serious cuts to our budget. 24 Thank you for your25 425 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 consideration. 3
Thank4 you very much.5 Miss Meade, you have a6 reduction of 13 employees from your7 adopted budget?8
Excuse me one13 moment. I want to verify it.14 Yes, it is 13.15
Very16 well. Thank you.17 The Chair recognizes --18 (Witness comes forward.)19
Excuse us for one20 moment. This is Veronica Daniel, our21 Administrative Services Director.22
Hi. Madam Chair,25 426 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 it's actually on our current budget. The2 positions budgeted was actual 145, but we3 never really reached that number in the4 hire. So the dollar-amount attributed to5 the --6
Our actual hire17 got up to 139 in Fiscal Year '09, but18 prior to my arrival, the Chair had come19 to Council and asked for additional20 positions, and we eventually got a budget21 of 145 positions.22
Maybe I could25 427 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 expand. In 2007, we were cut, I believe,2 it was by seven positions. And during3 the change in the administration -- we4 had requested from the previous5 administration to have that funding put6 back into the budget, which would bring7 the number of employees back to 1458 employees.9 We were given the allowance to10 do that, but that didn't occur until the11 transfer ordinance of March of 2008. And12 then we began the hiring process for13 those employees.14 Testing was done, we hired a15 number of those employees. But then once16 the freeze came on toward the end of last17 year, we had to stop any further hiring.18
Well,19 I think you were allowed to train20 employees, and that's how you got to the21 145.22
I24 believe that many of your -- several of25 428 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 your employees were leaving, and you were2 able to take several employees on so that3 they could be trained properly; is that4 correct?5
And I7 think that's how you got to the figure of8 145.9
The 145 was16 actually what was on our budget for the17 appropriations for FY '09.18
I'm looking23 at Page -- I'm sorry -- 5 or 6 of the24 budget detail. I'm sorry, of the25 429 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 budget detail. And it shows FY '092 budgeted positions of 145. The increment3 run is 138.4 How many people -- I'm sorry.5 So just how many employees are there6 right now, at BRT?7
At this very8 moment, there are 135 positions because9 we just had some recent retirees and a10 couple of DROPs.11
How many12 people are expected to retire between now13 and FY '10 and in FY '10?14
We have two other15 employees scheduled to DROP prior to the16 end of FY '10. During FY '10, we have17 two people scheduled to DROP.18
We don't know.21 Well, we do have one; we have one person22 who has mentioned that they would leave23 in the next month -- I think it was the24 next month. And then two people who are25 430 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 on the DROP Program.2
Thank3 you.4 The Chair recognizes Councilman5 Jones.6
Thank you,7 Madam President.8 In the Sunday Inquirer, it was9 reported that approximately 750010 commercial properties would realize a11 37 percent decrease in overall tax bills,12 equaling about $74 million.13 In that same article, it said14 that a single-family homeowner would, on15 average, receive about overall a16 40 percent increase of a total of about17 $85 million.18 Can you explain why this is,19 that commercial properties are going to20 go down and residential homeowners'21 properties are getting to go up?22
Okay. Councilman23 Jones, I would like Barry Mescolotto, who24 is our Acting Director of Assessments to25 431 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 address that question.2
The reason for3 the change is -- the difference is4 because the commercial properties are5 generally assessed higher than the6 citywide average. They are closer to7 their actual values to begin with, so if8 you are closer to your actual value, you9 will probably get a reduction when this10 program is finished.11
From what I12 understand, you used one or two methods13 to determine for commercial properties a14 market rate based on sales prices or what15 the property generates by way of revenue,16 and you could use either one of them to17 determine the value of a commercial18 property.19 What is the determining factor20 for you to take one set of methodology21 versus the other?22
Speak into25 432 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 the mic, please.2
There's3 actually three approaches to value:4 The cost approach, which we5 don't use, except on -- usually on6 special-purpose properties;7 And the income approach, which8 you mentioned, which is an approach that9 uses the income of the property and minus10 expenses to get to net income, which is11 capitalized into a value;12 And also, the sales comparison13 approach, which you're most familiar with14 because we use it mostly all on15 residentials, but it is used on some16 commercial properties when the income17 information is not available.18 Property owners are under no19 compunction [sic] in this state or county20 to give up this information voluntarily.21 We do get some of it based on appraisals22 that are followed with the board during23 the appeal process. We gather other24 income information and expense25 433 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 information from commercial services,2 such as the CoSTAR Services and IREM, and3 we also get information from the4 marketplace when we can get it.5
So let me6 get this right. The same property can be7 valued three different methods.8
And so,10 there's no standard way you approach it.11 So how do you make a determination:12 Which one, for which customer, for what13 purpose?14
Generally for15 residential properties, it's the sales16 comparison approach, because it is the17 one approach that yields the most18 reliable measure of value. And we look19 at what properties have sold for after we20 make a determination and we can see the21 sales comparison approach when we compare22 a property to other properties that have23 sold that are similar to it.24 For residential properties and25 434 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 some commercials and industrials, that2 does generally yield us the best3 indication of value for those properties.4 However, when people are buying5 commercial properties that generate6 income, they're buying an investment and7 they're buying a -- something that is8 going to yield a profit for them, so that9 they need to be valued, using the income10 approach. Things like office buildings,11 hotels, large investment properties.12 You will -- you can do all13 three approaches, and that is the14 standard for appraisal, but you will find15 that the one that gives you the best16 results in those kinds of properties are17 generally the income approach, because18 that is what the marketplace uses to19 value these properties, not just people20 that are mass-appraising them like we21 are.22
Is this a23 national standard industry-wide? I mean,24 are these same three options all across25 435 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 the country, what other cities do?2
Yes. They're3 the standard appraisal approaches that4 are used by all appraisers, certified5 appraisers, state certified appraisers,6 in all states of this country.7
Are8 appraisers in your office currently9 allowed to serve as independent10 appraisers?11
There are some12 of our staff that are -- they are13 certified appraisers, state-certified14 appraisers. And if you're asking, do15 they practice appraising outside of their16 job? there are some people that do.17 (Timer bell rings.)18
So that23 couldn't possibly be a conflict of24 interest?25 436 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1
I'll hold my4 round of questions.5 Thank you, Madam President.6
Can I further add7 that there are some safeguards? And that8 is that we require employees to complete9 an outside employment form. And on that10 outside employment form, we request that11 they include the information of all of12 the licensing that they possess in the13 real estate area. Also to state where14 the -- what offices that hold their15 licenses from which they work and their16 home addresses.17 That is to be matched to assure18 that the assessors are not working for19 the Board of Revision of Taxes in any20 area in which they actually hold a21 license and are practicing.22 The other issue is that we23 request that they list the hours that24 they're working in this outside25 437 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 employment so that it's clear that that2 does not conflict with your normal work3 schedule at the board.4
Madam5 President, I'll hold the rest of my6 questions for the next round 'cause I7 know --8
Thank9 you. There are quite a number of10 Councilmembers that want to be11 recognized. And at this time the Chair12 recognizes Councilwoman Brown.13
Thank you,14 Madam President.15 Good afternoon.16 All of us for sure have been17 waiting with baited breath for your18 report. And you live and breathe this19 issue every day. Everybody has an20 opinion.21 What grade would you give your22 agency, given where you are and where we23 all know we want to move to?24
At this time,25 438 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 I'd have to answer that I think we're2 about a B+ right now, because we haven't3 finished all of the work that we intend4 to do.5 There are several -- like the6 Chairman was mentioning earlier, the7 phased approach that the Department of8 Technology and the BRT have agreed upon9 means that there are parts of the new10 system that are going to come online11 several months apart, things like this12 Apex Drawing Package that we have, which13 we'll be able to have a sketch, a very14 good digital sketch, of every house,15 every building in the City. Things like16 that enable us to do other -- to17 fine-tune values with capabilities that18 we did not have in the past but nor19 online yet.20 As far as other -- there's21 other tools that are also coming online,22 some --23
Let me24 just ask you to pause right there. So25 439 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 you're suggesting that because of2 technology and the tools that technology3 brings, that is enabling the department4 to operate in a different way?5
Yeah. I think6 we will maybe get to that A at some7 point, the rating that we're looking for.8 A lot of what is going on at9 our agency is not just producing the10 actual values, which we released this11 week. It's about changing workflows,12 it's about making our staff more13 productive and more efficient.14
And it's about16 adopting new technologies such as pen17 table computers that can be used in the18 field so we operate completely19 paperlessly and are able to easily gather20 things and bring them back for valuation21 purposes in a way that we were not very22 efficient at in the past.23
And so my24 only last follow-up question would be:25 440 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 Because of the lack technology, we ended2 up with the severe discrepancy and3 inequity in the process?4
I would say5 that that is partially a major part of6 the reason why we ended up where we were7 because the legacy system, we could not8 react fast enough to cover the market.9 The market moves at all different speeds10 all over the City, so that when we had a11 wild runup in the value in the last12 several years, our systems were not -- we13 were not able to adequately follow that14 and reflect it in the values of the15 properties.16 Our new system has the17 capability of us revaluing the City in a18 matter of hours once we finish the work19 to validate all of the characteristics20 about the properties and to -- and21 calibration of our models.22 So we didn't have that23 capability in the past. It would take24 weeks and weeks to do that. And there25 441 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 would be times where we would have to2 have people in on the weekends in order3 to accomplish it.4 This becomes a very easy task5 for us to do now.6
And Councilperson,7 what that allows us to do it, allows us8 to use the professional staff in their9 professional capacity. The use of the10 CAMA system and numbers generated by the11 computer are a tool. It allows us to12 quickly value projects, as Mr. Mescolotto13 said, across the City, and then allows14 the evaluator that's assigned to review15 those values and to then go out to pay16 particular attention to those values that17 seem askew, to make the necessary changes18 to files because of changes that have19 occurred due to the market, and then to20 provide that professional acumen that's21 needed with the professional assessments.22 The problem we had was the23 mandate to try to do the entire City.24 And it was just very difficult to keep25 442 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 up.2 One of the reasons that two3 years ago, when we came before you, we4 talked about the need of going forward5 with the actual-value project, which was6 at that time under Mr. Glancy, the Full7 Value Project. One of the reasons was8 that the constitution mandates uniformity9 throughout the City. And there should be10 equity and fairness in all assessments.11 We finally had determined and12 had to recognize that the best way to13 achieve that was to do actual value, the14 uniformity issue. That by doing the15 fractional assessment system and trying16 to cap those assessments, we were17 literally defeating the purpose. And so,18 you had people within the City who could19 not read or understand --20 (Timer bell rings.)21
-- their values,22 even if they wanted to contest a bill.23 So they weren't able to do that.24 Now the goal with actual value25 443 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 is that you can, because what you look to2 is to look at your valuation notice, and3 you can then determine fairly easily, is4 that what properties are selling for in5 the area?6 And it may be not be a7 professional look, but you wouldn't have8 to pay. You could look that information9 up, it would be available on our website.10 You could look in the papers, you could11 go to neighbor brokers, and you would12 have an opportunity then to have an13 appreciation of whether your property is14 valued appropriately, not only compared15 just to your neighbors, but you would16 know that you proportionately are valued17 in such a way that proportionately, you18 will pay your share, not more and not19 less, of taxes.20 It also puts us in step with21 the law so that we do not have to cringe22 when we reach this point with23 (indiscernible) and with, is the City in24 compliance? because we would know that25 444 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 the City is in compliance. And when it's2 not, we can be cited exactly where the3 problems are and address those problems.4 It also allows us to know5 whether one specific area -- as you're6 aware, different areas of the City sort7 of take off during a boon. So one area8 may expand greatly and the market may9 rise greatly, and other areas may stay10 relatively stable.11 This type of system allows us12 to use the technology. And when we know13 one area is expanding greatly, if there14 needs to be additional evaluation staff15 in that area to address the changes so16 that we can keep up and allow that to be17 done.18
Well, I19 have a number of follow-ups, but the bell20 has rung.21
Thank25 445 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 you.2 The Chair recognizes Councilman3 green.4
Thank you,5 Madam Chair.6 Going back to the President's7 first question, could you just provide us8 a chart that walks us through the number9 of employees that you've had all year.10 This is -- you were appropriated for 14511 employees, you got a transfer ordinance12 for more. You appear to be spending in13 this year more than was appropriated,14 even though you were appropriated for 14515 and you have 135 employees right now.16
So I just18 need to understand the discrepancy19 between, you know, the appropriation.20 And unless you've given people bonuses or21 raises --22
-- this24 year, the estimated obligations appear to25 446 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 be overstated.2
Right. We'll3 provide that because -- we can provide4 the chart. You're requesting it to be in5 a chart form, correct?6
I'm Veronica11 Daniel. Again, I'm the ASC.12 Councilman Green, the original13 appropriations of the 145 were those14 additional positions that Council gave to15 the Chairman back at the beginning of16 '07, I think it was. At some point17 during Fiscal Year '09, there was a18 freeze in the hiring, where we had to do19 a --20
No, no. I21 understand the question. Let me restate22 it.23
The question25 447 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 is: You appropriated 145 employees with2 a total appropriation of 8-million-128.3 Your estimated obligations, as of the4 January increment run, is 8,251,000,5 which is 120,000 more than was6 appropriated to you, yet you have ten7 fewer employees.8
The 123,00 is the13 bonuses that the union members got in the14 beginning of the fiscal year.15
Still, you19 have ten fewer employees than you20 appropriated for, and you're spending the21 same amount that was originally22 appropriated to you.23
How are you25 448 5/4/09 COMM. OF THE WHOLE - FISCAL '10 BUDGET1 doing that?2
So how much5 are you going to spend? In other words,6 every dollar that you tell us is not7 actually going to be spent --8