1328 COUNCIL OF THE CITY OF PHILADELPHIA BEFORE THE COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE Operating Budget HEARINGS - CONTINUED - - - Room 400, City Hall Philadelphia, Pennsylvania Tuesday, February 22, 2000 9:15 a.m. - - - BILL 00005 - An ordinance adopting the Operating Budget for Fiscal Year 2001 PRESENT: COUNCIL PRESIDENT ANNA C. VERNA, Chair COUNCILWOMAN JANNIE L. BLACKWELL COUNCILWOMAN BLONDELL REYNOLDS BROWN COUNCILMAN DARRELL L. CLARKE COUNCILMAN DAVID COHEN COUNCILMAN FRANK J. DICICCO COUNCILMAN W. WILSON GOODE, JR. COUNCILMAN JAMES F. KENNEY COUNCILWOMAN JOAN L. KRAJEWSKI COUNCILMAN W. THACHER LONGSTRETH COUNCILWOMAN DONNA REED MILLER COUNCILMAN MICHAEL A. NUTTER COUNCILMAN ANGEL L. ORTIZ COUNCILMAN FRANK RIZZO COUNCILWOMAN MARIAN B. TASCO - - - VINCENT VARALLO ASSOCIATES, INC. Registered Professional Reporters Eleven Penn Center, Suite 600 Philadelphia, PA 19103 (215) 561-2220 1329 I N D E X BILL 000005 PAGE LAWRENCE M. MOY, Commission of Streets Dept. 1330 JOSEPH SYRNICK, Chief Engineer and Surveyor, Streets Department ..................... 1353 STEVE TILNEY, Acting Recycling Coordinator .. 1366 ROBERT DUBOW ................................ 1381 JOE DOYLE, Chief Lighting Engineer .......... 1386 CLARENA TOLSON, Deputy Streets Commissioner . 1394 CHARLIE TRAINOR, Chief Traffic Engineer ..... 1407 ANDREAS PEREZ, Commissioner, Department of Public Property ....................... 1525 JOSEPH JAMES, Deputy Commissioner, Department of Public Property .................... 1532 CHRIS ZEARFOSS, Director of Transit Operations and Planning ........................... 1538 RILEY P. HARRISON, Fleet Manager ............ 1582 RICHARD TYLER, Historic Preservation Officer, Philadelphia Historical Commission ..... 1612 EDWARD J. MCLAUGHLIN, Commissioner of Dept. of Licenses and Inspections ............ 1623 RICHARD FELDGUS, Administrative Services Director, Dept. Of Licences and Inspections ...... 1629 ROBERT SOLVIBILE, Deputy Commissioner, Dept. of Licenses and Inspections ............ 1636 DOMINIC VERDI, Deputy Commissioner, Dept. of Licenses and Inspections ............... 1660 OLIVER THORNTON, Deputy Commissioner, Dept. of Licenses and Inspections ............ 1670 RICHARD FELDGUS, Administrative Director, L&I, testifying for Board of Licenses and Inspections Review ..................... 1701 RICHARD FELDGUS, Administrative Director, L&I, testifying for Board of Building Standards .............................. 1702 EMANUEL ORTIZ, Chairman, Board of Trustees of Community College of Philadelphia ...... 1707 STEVEN CURTIS, President of Community College of Philadelphia ....................... 1711 VIVIAN MILLER, Clerk of Quater Sessions .... 1739 1330 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 P R O C E E D I N G S
Good morning. This is the continued public hearing of the Committee of the Whole regarding the Operating Budget, Bill No. 005. The first department to testify this morning will be the Streets Department. (Streets Department witnesses come forward.)
Good morning. COMMISSIONER MOY: Good morning, Council President.
Kindly identify yourself for the record and proceed with your testimony. COMMISSIONER MOY: Yes, President Verna, Members of City Council, ladies and gentlemen, my name is Lawrence Moy, M-O-Y, Commissioner of the Streets Department. I'm pleased to be here this morning to present testimony on behalf of Streets Department's Fiscal Year 2001 proposed Operating Budget. We are requesting a General Fund appropriation of $166,428,008 and all funds 1331 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 appropriation of our proposed budget reflects a net General Fund increase of $3,707,287 and an All Funds appropriation of $146,678,008. Our proposed budget reflects a net general fund increase of $3, 707,287 and from Fiscal Year 2000 estimated obligations. The overall request for the department for all three major funds to sustain operations General, County Liquid Fuels, and Special Gasoline Tax, is a net $3,720,287 higher than Fiscal Year 2000 estimated obligations. The increase in funding over estimated obligations is a result of full funding of authorized positions, funding of wage increases through FY 2000, anticipated increases in street lighting maintenance and sanitation disposal contracts, and funding for streetscape maintenance for the Avenue of the Arts. The Streets Department authorized position level remains at 2,232. I would like to briefly highlight some of the goals that have been achieved in the areas of refuse collection, recycling, street maintenance and cleaning. Collections and cleaning. Our 1332 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 Sanitation Division has used the addition of more efficient vehicles and improved productivity per crew to increase on-time collections and reduce costs. We project on-time household collections at a rate of at least 95 percent for FY 2000 and FY 2001. We're continuing our staffing at the same 1,480 positions as last year, and I am proud to report that the results of this year's survey conducted for Mayors's Report on City Services showed that nearly 89 percent of respondents said that their trash was collected on time either always or frequently. In addition, the budget request for sanitation funds, the current scheduled street-cleaning program for arterial and commercial corridors and the pilot programs initiated this year. The Department is addressing several impediments to effective neighborhood street-cleaning through the pilot program. We're combining ticketing and education with more frequent cleaning and the permanent posting of cleaning schedule signs to try to improve the efficacy of our neighborhood cleaning program. 1333 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 Preliminary information indicates that the public is supportive of this program. Recycling. The curbside recycling program which was available to only a quarter of the city as recently as 1992 has been available in every neighborhood since March 1994. In November 1996, the Department began citywide collection of mixed paper. This has helped to offset the national decline and tonnage of commingled mixed recyclables as more plastics are used to replace glass. In FY '99 43,668 tons of recyclables were collected. In the current projection through FY 2000 and 2001 are 45,410 and 46,700 tons, respectively. The increased tonnage is anticipated to be a result of our pilot effort and ongoing educational programs. This budget request continues funding for the pilot program. Additionally, recycling has been instituted in 190 City buildings including Municipal Services Building, Criminal Justice Center, City Hall, branch libraries, Police Headquarters, the Fire Administration Building, and a number of health centers. This program will expand to a total of 250 municipal buildings in FY 1334 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 2001. Also in FY 2001, we will continue to support the community partnership program that provides an outlet for citizens to recycle materials not included in curbside collection program.
We are currently working with the Administration to fill the vacant recycling coordinator position. Street repairs. The Highway Division's reengineering efforts succeeded in improving many of the services the division provides. In FY '99 Highway Division employees resurfaces 183 miles of roadways compared to 158 miles in FY '98, plus 28 federal aid municipal miles and 108 miles in FY '97, plus 68 contractor-repaired miles and 8 federal aid municipal miles. In FY 2000 and 2001 the division projects to resurface 156 miles of streets with local funds in 42 and 29 miles, respectively, with federal aid municipal funds. The increase in the number of miles resurfaced in FY '98 and FY '99 results from simultaneously conducting the Hot In Place or HIP asphalt recycling pilot while maintaining three resurfacing crews. 1335 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 In FY '99, in addition to increases in street resurfacing, we restored 8,836 ditches. Having that ditch backlog, our projection for FY 2000 and 2001 is to restore 7500 ditch openings and maintain the zero ditch backlog at the end of construction season. 33 million square foot in FY 2000 and FY 2001. This translates into 2,009 intersections with new crosswalks and 187 miles of streets with new lane markings. In FY 2000 and 2001 we expect to place new crosswalk markings at 2500 intersections. The department repaired 16,202 potholes in FY '99 and projects repairs to 30,000 in FY 2000 and 2001. Also in FY 2000 and 2001, we plan to perform over a million linear feet of cracked ceiling. I am pleased to report that the results of this year's survey conducted for the Mayor's Report on City Services show that 74 percent of the respondents said the streets in our neighborhood were in good or mostly good condition 1336 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 compared to 73 percent for FY '98 and 70 percent for FY '97. Street lighting. Between FY '91 and the end of FY '99, the department replaced over 63,000 lights as part of its 12-year citywide program to replace obsolete fixtures. Under the program, old light are being replaced with energy-efficent high-pressure sodium fixtures. When the entire program completed in FY 2002, the department projects that a total of 75,000 lights will have been replaced. This program is enabling us to see reductions in terms of repair and maintenance that you can see reflected in our productivity measures. Traffic engineering. Between FY '98 and end of FY 2001, the department will have modernized traffic signals at over 500 intersections in Center City and in the Northeast. Modernization includes overhead replacement of lights and the installation of state-of-the-art solid state controllers that electronically communicate with a centralized control center to help improve traffic flow. This is part of our ITS, the Intelligent Transportation System. 1337 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 In FY '99, the Department and the Municipal Energy Office completed a two-year citywide installation program of red light emitting diodes or LEDs and long-life incandescent bulbs in all traffic signals. The LED installation has reduced the annual electric bill 8 by approximately $887,000. Future capital projects will include green and yellow LEDs for additional savings. In conclusion, the employees of the Department of Streets will continue working diligently in the delivery of services to our citizens and neighborhoods and improving the quality of life in our City. I'm especially proud of their tremendous efforts during our recent prolonged snow and ice periods. We will continue working closely with City Council to shape effective programs and, therefore, we request your favorable consideration of this budget. I'm available to answer your questions at this time.
Thank you, Commissioner. In your testimony, you mentioned a 1338 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 pilot program concerning recycling. What is the status of this program and what are the findings? COMMISSIONER MOY: We have preliminary findings in terms of the pilot areas. What we -- and they are positive in the sense that there is an increase in the results primarily in our area four, which is the northwest and in Center City. What we expect to do is to have information to compare this with by June with the rest of the City. The Managing Director had talked earlier at the budget session there about looking at the uptick in the pilot but he was concerned about the downturn in the rest of the City, so we need to look at both of those situations and determine why that is happening and what can be done about it.
I guess my question was, why are you only continuing the pilot program in Fiscal 2001 and not expanding it? COMMISSIONER MOY: Because we -- we need to look at the cost of how much the unit cost is to expand this kind of program citywide. The numbers, the absolute numbers themselves may be up, but the unit costs are going to be significant and we also have to find out why in the non-pilot 1339 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 areas we've taken a general downturn in recycling reduction. We have to really look at this, and I would expect in June, we'll be going over this with the Administration and we would share that with Council, certainly.
I don't understand that, but on of your testimony, has your department maxed out on the average tonnage collected per crew in the Sanitation Division since you are projecting the collection rate to be the same as it was in Fiscal 1999? Why hasn't this increased as the department has increased the number of high-density compactors? COMMISSIONER MOY: We think we've reached close to the optimal range for reduction per crew, Council President. Fourteen is probably our number. We've been on the rise over the last couple of years. Over the last eight years or seven years, we came up from 11, and we are up to 14. We have decided that the 25-yard high density is more of a vehicle of choice for us and we think 14 is about the number for us at this time for the production.
Also on 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 of your testimony, street resurfacing, will your department continue to use the hot in place method for resurfacing? If so, what are the types of resurfacing projects that this method will be used? COMMISSIONER MOY: It is our expectation to continue to use the hot in place recycling. It would be used in -- the areas where it is very beneficial is when we have straight sections of street, long sections of street where there is pave back. When we get into cul-de-sacs and where there's a lot of turning and curving streets, it's not quite as clear-cut. The benefits are there, but it's our expectation and we also do testing where we have streets that have a base that accepts recycling, which is basically what this program is. So we will test those three so you continue to use HIP wherever we can.
Do you really think that that's a successful method to be using? Because I know last year several Councilmembers saw photographs of streets that had been resurfaced through this method. You would never know that they had been resurfaced. I mean, they 1341 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 were damaged as they were before the resurfacing was done. COMMISSIONER MOY: Yeah, the streets that we saw last year, as my understanding, have been repaired. We engaged in another program this past year, and while there were a few bugs here and there, for the most part, that was a successful program for us.
Here and there, but not 100 percent? COMMISSIONER MOY: Not 100 percent, that's right. And we're continuing to work with the contractor here to get it refined to a point where it works for everyone. I mean, there's a lot of pluses to the program.
What are the pluses? COMMISSIONER MOY: The pluses, aside from cost, I think a big thing is that the conventional resurfacing used, we had at least a two-step program where you have someone come in and mill the street if it's existing material. They'd have to then set boxes, and it takes a number of weeks before you're able to come in with 1342 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 the final resurfacing application. So there's a risk involved in terms of the people that have to ride on that surface. The alternative for a HIP is that it is usually done within the same day where they take a milling -- take that material, inject it with an additive, a rejuvenator, and put that material back down in the same day, sometimes within a matter of hours so that people have a new street to ride on. So it's cost-effective and it's fast, and I think in many neighborhoods this has been a welcome kind of benefit to the residents and the commercials.
Why are you projecting your disposal contracts to increase by approximately $2.1 million in Fiscal 2001? COMMISSIONER MOY: I believe that's a cost of living -- a mandated cost of living raise that's in there. I think that's a cost of living raise. UNIDENTIFIED MAN: That's what it is, yeah.
Mr. Moy, on -91 of the detail, it shows $150,000 for Hepatitis B vaccinations. Is this a new program 1343 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 and who will be entitled to receive a vaccination? COMMISSIONER MOY: It is a new program, and we have not worked out the details, but we intend to work with Risk Management and there will be a number of our sanitation workers particularly that we expect would be expected to participate in this.
Okay. Also on of your testimony, you say that "We will continue to repair potholes reported during the peak season from mid-February through mid-April, within four days to six days during the rest of the year." I hate doing this to you. I don't want to embarrass you in any way. But this is a folder that I have had in my office with requests for potholes, for depressions, for any number of types of complaints of that nature. Some of them go back to 1997. I have a couple from 1996. We have written at least four letters. We called the constituents or they call us, and we never get a response. Now, I don't know that your testimony addresses the concerns of my constituents. If 1344 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 they're done within days, these are years. And we don't even have the courtesy of receiving a response from the second highway district. I think it's a disgrace. COMMISSIONER MOY: Yes, Council President, I think you and I spoke on late last week.
I told you about this. I want an explanation. COMMISSIONER MOY: We are in the process of reviewing all of those, that correspondence that you sent over. A number of these had been either addressed verbally, and I apologize for not having written --
They haven't been done verbally. If they had been, the staff would be more than happy to make that notation and notify the constituent. That means that we're not given a verbal report. Consequently, a member of my staff has to write another letter and another letter. And then the constituent calls says that the complaint hasn't been addressed. I mean, we have 60-plus requests here. I just give up -- COMMISSIONER MOY: We are looking into 1345 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 it and we will give you a report on that within the week, Council President.
Will it be this week or next week or sometime next season? COMMISSIONER MOY: It should be the end of this week.
Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilman DiCicco.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Good morning, Commissioner. COMMISSIONER MOY: Good morning, Councilman.
I just want to go back for a moment on the recycling issue. What I'm about to say are basically more comments than anything else. In the areas where there is not weekly recycling, it is my observation because my community, my neighborhood doesn't have it. We opted for the on-street cleaning in the southern end of my district. I notice that the majority of the people are not putting out recyclables at all. 1346 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 So that might be attributing to the decrease in the tonnage for some reason. I think basically people think that if there's not any enforcement going on or we don't continue with education, they kind of forget that they should be putting out recyclables. So I offer that to you as a comment. I think what we really need to do is really increase the educational sides of this. As an example, where I live there are six house, single-family houses, and six apartments and we all share common area for trash. And I observe the area where we have the recycling cans or containers, and the majority of the people in those 12 units do make an effort to put recyclables in the containers, but they often mix up things or put plastic bags, pizza boxes, and things that really shouldn't be in there. So it tells me that there are people who are concerned about recycling but really don't have a full understanding of the types of materials that should be placed in there. And I really think it just goes back to education. I know that from time to time materials are put out, but I don't think it is put out on a regular basis at least 1347 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 enough to get people into the habit of and the flow of doing weekly recycling, or even every other week recycling. So I really suggest to you that we make a concerted effort. I know we have some additional money you're looking for in education, but maybe we need to do a little bit more there. And again, I don't know of anyone in my community who has ever received a violation for not recycling. While I know that can be problematic for me going forward and I've got to be careful what I wish for, I think if we do the proper education, and I think you know about this from the on-street cleaning that we're doing, give everyone an opportunity the first few weeks of that program who are being ticketed some relaxation in the enforcement of that, but after that I say all bets off. You can't have it both ways. And although I still get complaints and people screaming at me that they're getting ticketed for not moving their cars on certain days, I don't care. I want to get the streets cleaned and I think that's what the majority of the people want. So I really would like to see some additional education and then follow-up 1348 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 enforcement. Maybe a warning has to be put out there that you haven't put out recyclables this week, you're mixing with regular trash, and if continues, then you're going to be cited. As District Councilperson, I would have no problem with that type of enforcement. The other thing I just wanted to touch on is that over the last four years since I've been a Councilperson, we've had many heated discussions in this chambers and on the phone and in your office about some of the problems that we have when we try to address the needs of constituents who request different types of traffic signals or signal devices at various intersections. And we generally get the typical generic letter saying, "Thank you for requesting" -- and I'm not going to beat a dead horse. We've had, like I said, some heated discussions in this chambers. What I think like to see as the Chair of the Streets and Services Committee going forward is your department meet with either me, the District Councilpeople, the people who are making these requests, and we know that there's State statutes prohibit signs at certain locations 1349 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 because they're not warranted.
I really think we ought to sit down together and figure a way and work together and figure out what we need to do about changing some of the that legislation so that you and Charlie and others don't have to hear from me and other Councilpeople screaming and yelling because constituents are yelling at us. There has to be a way in which we can begin to look at doing some amendments. " Because for me and there are other people in this chambers have been around here longer than I have been, they've been hearing it much longer than I have. And I think that that's what I'd like to see going forward and maybe you and I and Charlie or somebody can sit down in the next week or so and figure out a way in which we can start approaching this at the State level if that's where we need to go. So when you come into Council, at least every opportunity, every avenue, no pun intended, has 1350 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 been explored. " So I think that we ought to look to do that. The only other thing, I do want to comment and commend your department for, at least in my district, the way that the snow was removed in the last storm. I know that that got caught by surprise. And although everyone is not happy, we'll never make everyone happy, but I think it was a good job and for the most part people were very satisfied with the department's snow removal efforts. COMMISSIONER MOY: Thank you, Councilman.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Commissioner, I have three or four questions I'd like to ask, but I'm going start off 1351 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 with something that has been very, very controversial in the Northwest section of the City of Philadelphia. I just can't understand why there hasn't been any movement in reference to the repair of the Chestnut Hill Avenue Bridge that crosses over the Wissahickon Creek. I kind of lost track now how long it's been out of service one way. For years, Councilman Longstreth reminds me. That you were quoted or one of your staff was quoted that before -- after this work starts, we're looking at 33 months before this bridge is completed, so we're talking about a long time that that roadway has been out of service. Could you bring us up to speed? Because, again, you might have gotten copies of letters from the Chestnut Hill Community Association and other interested parties that just cannot believe it. And I don't mean to be cute here, and I said this before, I said the bridges in Kosovo have all been replaced; and this one hasn't. COMMISSIONER MOY: Yes, Councilman. The situation has been equally frustrating for the department and the residents here. We have been working for some time in trying to come up with a 1352 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 memorandum of agreement which is needed by the Federal Highway Administration before we can proceed the final design. We have been back and forth with the Federal Highway Administration, with PennDOT, and I think they in turn are dealing with the community in we're trying to come to accord. Before we can move into final design, we must get that memorandum of agreement signed.
Are you satisfied with the progress? I can't imagine that you being responsible for these streets and bridges that that's to me not a good answer. I'd like to know what we're doing. If we have to drag the Congress people into a room, United States Senators, but that bridge cannot be left in the condition it's inconveniencing the suburban community who wants to come into the City, people leaving the City of Philadelphia. It's starting to get deteriorated, dangerous, the detour, and I would like to ask the Managing Director or the Mayor personally to get involved in this issue because this is embarrassing to me as a City Councilmember. COMMISSIONER MOY: We do have our chief engineer and he's just going say thing about this 1353 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 to you.
Good morning, Councilman. My name's Joseph Syrnick, I'm Chief Engineer and Surveyor of the Streets Department. As you know, the Streets Department for about seven years has been trying to build this bridge. We've had it in Capital Program for many, many years with the capital project and on that operating project. Because there are federal funds we, need to satisfy some federal regulations regarding environmental and historic processes. In my view, there are some people in the neighborhood who prefer not to see this bridge replaced, and they have been actually very -- this is my view -- very effective in keeping us from doing that. To answer your question, what we need to do is to get all of the people who want to see that bridge replaced, that includes the Streets Department, it includes PennDOT, it includes the Federal Highway Administration, and I believe it now includes a lot of people outside the City in Lafayette Hill who are greatly inconvenienced. It certainly includes the Chestnut Hill College who 1354 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 have been suffering with this bridge being closed in one direction for at least five years. What we need to do is get all the other people who really want to see progress made on this bridge and put some pressure on the people to sign a memorandum of agreement, which I believe is very, very fair which takes into account the environmental and historic considerations of this structure. The City has made all sorts of compromises and been agreeable to putting in all sorts of language that has never been in a memorandum of understanding before. It is not -- I don't believe it is acceptable to some of the opposition parties. They want complete control over all the design details, which is not what we nor the Federal Highway Administration think they ought to have. They have a right to discuss the environmental and historic processes. We believe we're way beyond that and we're into things that are safety issues and we are unwilling to compromise any further as it is any other highway agency.
Mr. Syrnick, you just mentioned seven years the bridge has been out now, one lane for five years. I think at some 1355 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 point you're going to have to exercise whatever power government has to get project moving forward. I understand that there is -- you do have some ability to move this project forward. I don't think we can wait any longer to try to satisfy the needs of people that are not in agreement with your design because you just can't continue to leave this in this condition. I'm going to ask something of you. This bridge has been down now for years, traffic in one direction. It was initially shut because it was deemed unsafe. I would hope that there's ongoing inspections of this structure for the last five years so we don't have a bridge that collapses entering in the City of Philadelphia. Even though it's one way, I notice that a lot of heavy trucks are violating the posted weight restrictions on the bridge because they're coming from Montgomery County and they kind of get trapped once they get beyond Northwestern Avenue. So I would hope that ongoing review of the detour route, the detour route is full of potholes, the signage down. I have to constantly call about that. So I'm concerned about the last five years what's the 1356 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 further deterioration of that bridge because I'm thinking that someday you're just going to have to shut that whole bridge down and that would be a major disruption to the City of Philadelphia.
Councilman, I understand your remarks. Number one, we inspect the bridge every two weeks, we go out and physically look at it. You're quite right, th biggest problem right now with regard to that bridge is the waterway openings which are -- there's like eight spans, but only maybe three of them are in the waterway. When the snow melts and we have our spring floods, there's quite a bit of stress put onto that bridge with the water rushing through. It cannot get through the openings. We do check it every two weeks. You're right, at some point in the future it is very likely that this bridge will have to be closed in both directions. That would only add to the burden of this neighborhood. I think you're right, we need to get together and go to the Federal Highway Administration and just say to them that there is a provision that they can move this thing forward without a memorandum of understanding. In fact, former Mayor Rendell 1357 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 actually wrote to them and asked them to do that. The Federal Highway Administration thought that they could work out a compromise with the community. So far they have tried to do that, but they have been as unsuccessful as we have been. So if people want to get together -- we can't do this alone, we cannot do this alone. We need to get out there and make sure everyone knows that there are people out there that want this bridge replaced. We are working on the design every single day, but we technically cannot move into final design until we get pass this hurdle for the Section 106 process which is the provision under the Historic Preservation Act.
Thank you. Madam Chair, I have additional questions and I'd hike to yield to the District Councilperson Donna Miller, who has a question on this issue.
Certainly. The Chair recognizes Councilwoman Miller.
Thank you, Madam President. 1358 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 Thank you, Councilman Rizzo. Good morning. Joe, I read last week in the Chestnut Hill Local that someone from the interested parties wrote that they're probably one meeting away from coming to that level of understanding that you're talking about. So one of the things we'd like to do is pull a meeting together again. You know, this problem met me when I came to City Council. You were the first department to come over and say, "Hey, this is what's going on." I was here two weeks. And now it's four years later and we're still talking about the problem. Councilman Rizzo lives in the area, so he's more directly affected. I'm affected if I go to the mall out that way or whatever. So we really want to bring a resolve to this so we can move forward with this particular bridge. And you have cooperated in the past and I would appreciate your full cooperation in the future.
Councilwoman, we're certainly willing to meet anytime, anywhere, with anybody to get this thing moving. And I would suggest as a suggestion if perhaps we get together 1359 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 with some of the District Councilpeople and Councilpeople-at-large that are interested in this project. And it's certainly you two and a couple of others, Councilman Longstreth has been involved in this to some extent, and maybe we could sit down and just review in-house where we are, what needs to be done, so that we all have a clear focus as to what we should be trying to get at this meeting and then have a meeting with the interested parties. And if that works, that would be wonderful. If we can get moving on this, I'll guarantee you that we will move this project to implementation just as fast as we can. We have a very attractive bridge design out there. This is a wonderful area. We think we can win an award with structure out there. Let's get together and do it.
How about if I just ask, if it's okay with the Chair, one more 1360 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 question.
One more question and then we're going to do a second go-around because everyone's light is on.
Okay. Commissioner, I would appreciate it -- and I think a policy issue more so than personnel issue. You have an organization in the Streets Department that's, I believe you call it your customer service or your customer -- help me with that. What's the exact? COMMISSIONER MOY: Customer service.
And it's open from 7 o'clock in the morning to 7 p.m. at night and they take calls from constituents for issues that affect the operation of your department. I think you need to -- if you're going to have a meeting about the bridge, I think really you need to have a meeting about what they're charged and what the responsibility of that group is, and I have some very specific notes and situations that have been reported to me and personally experienced where a fire hydrant was knocked down on the highway and the representative there was told and instructed by their supervision to tell the constituent 1361 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 calling giving them the phone number of the Water Department to report the hydrant that's knocked over in the street. In my opinion, if it's in the street, it's your responsibility to take the information and refer it to the Water Department. A person reports a pothole on a highway which they are not aware is a state highway or not. They call from their car, they're interested, want to help, and there's a free number star fixed if they call to report these problems to the Streets Department and they're told that here's the phone number for the State. You call the State. Well, 7 o'clock in the morning, 7 o'clock at night, seven, eight people, six people work there. I think that it would be more efficient, and I know you're interested in making sure that state highways within the City of Philadelphia are well maintained, I think you really need to develop a policy on what that organization does. Just this morning I heard of issue where the person called to report a pothole, a major hole in an intersection, and trying to be helpful said to the person that the gas company was digging in the street there two weeks ago. 1362 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 The representative immediately said to the person, "Well, you better call the gas company," immediately stopped the conversation. They were trying to be helpful telling the person the source of the problem was the gas company. You would think that they'd take the information and if it is the gas company's responsibility to make the repair, communicate with them. So this is just my observation. And again, I don't think it's the people that work there, I think the direction that they've been given isn't clear on exactly what their mission is there. COMMISSIONER MOY: Councilman, I don't think that is the policy, but we will review with our folks there their understandings. And the things that you described, I think we would set up for change. So I'm sorry that you experienced those kinds of things with the customer affairs group.
Thank you, Commissioner. I'll wait till the next go-around. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you. As I said, we have just about every Councilmember 1363 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 that would like to ask questions, so with the next person we'll have five minutes. When the minutes is up, we'll have a second go around. At this point in time, the Chair recognizes Councilwoman Brown.
Good morning, Commissioner. I have just two questions. On of your testimony you speak about maintenance for the Avenue of the Arts North. A, does that include Avenue of the Arts North and South? And, B, discuss or detail what that means, maintenance of the streetscape for those two sections of Broad Street. COMMISSIONER MOY: Well, the specific reference that we are looking at is referring primarily to the Avenue of the Arts South because that was completed. That was all of that work, the streetscape work that was performed, so we have a commitment that Mayor Rendell made to sort of pay for the funding for plannings and all of appurtenances down on the Avenue of the Arts 1364 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 South. There is a plan in terms of Avenue of the art North, however. We have been meeting with Councilman Clarke and a committee to develop what should be done on that whole section of streetscape work on Avenue of the Arts North, but this has not been worked out yet. We just met last week, as a matter of fact, with the committee.
When you say what should be done, that includes maintenance concerns, correct, with regards to the Avenue of the Arts North? COMMISSIONER MOY: Once we decide in terms of what we want to do fold in maintenance concerns also, yes.
Very well. Secondly, I join my colleagues who have expressed both an interest and a concern with regards to the recycling coordinator. In the early days of recycling, the City made terrific efforts in that area and I don't think went to lose any time with that, so let us know where you are with regards to the filling of that position, -100 of the budget says that you currently have a grant that 1365 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 pays for half the salary of the recycling coordinator, so give us some sense of where you are. And then the last part of my question is you mentioned throughout your testimony the need for education. Does that include tapping the generation behind us so that we can get them in the mind-set of recycling and what that means to our environment. And specifically I'm referring interaction, interfacing with the Philadelphia Public Schools in any way around the issue of recycling. COMMISSIONER MOY: Yes, Councilwoman. The first thing with respect to the hiring of the recycling coordinator, as Managing Director had said, he had requested of the Administration that they conduct the search in the same way as they are conducting a search for many of the filling the positions for the vacancies. The second thing with respect to education, the recycling coordinator we had just lost had in a point of fact been a teacher and Joan had spent a great deal of effort doing just what you were saying. They're trying to make that 1366 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 kind of connection with the schools trying to address recycling to the next generation and getting programs going within the schools. As we look to the next recycling coordinator we would try to at least continue that level of commitment in education.
Further detail. Within the schools, was that system-wide or was there a model program happening in one of the clusters? Or any additional details about that so that we know what we can anticipate with the next recycling coordinator as it relates to the schools. COMMISSIONER MOY: Steve Tilney, our acting recycling coordinator may be better to address the specifics of that.
Good morning, everyone. I just want to respond that we did have ongoing program throughout the School District. We've been in touch with the School Superintendent as well as all of the cluster leaders throughout the school and there's a program going on at the 1367 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 Overbrook Cluster which has been, for lack of better words, a model program that's been started within the last year and a half and one that will be ongoing as well as one that we'll be looking at as a model for future activities.
Some assessment on the activity currently in the Overbrook Cluster.
Well, we've done educational outreach in the Overbrook Cluster for school programs with the children. We've done composting bins and warm farming bins.
I'm sorry. We've done small composting bins and warm farming bins vermiculture at some of the schools and areas as well. We have six composting units out in the schools as well as six vermicuture composting bins in the schools, and we're trying to increase our educational average with the schools as well.
Okay. Then I'll be paying close attention to that once I begin to visit the schools, particularly Overbrook Cluster throughout the year. Thank you. 1368 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
Thank you, Madam President. Commissioner, as you well know, we receive tons of information on recycling. There are a lot of advocates citywide who really are interested in expanding this program to more regular pickups in every neighborhoods. I wanted to specifically zero in on tires. Is it true that two tires may be put out by homeowners with their trash every week? COMMISSIONER MOY: That's correct, Councilwoman.
I'll tell you, I just learned that today. And do you make that information available so that if a person feels they can put two tires out it won't be there, that's not a special pickup truck or whatever, it's just with your regular trash? You can do that? COMMISSIONER MOY: It is a special pickup, Councilwoman, and what we asked them to do 1369 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 is to call customer service who will arrange to have that specially pickup in that case.
Because certainly, I think if the public knew this -- I just learned it this morning -- maybe we wouldn't have such a problem with them abandoning them in front of especially vacant buildings during the year. Do you think that we could get more -- I know when we have household hazardous waste at times they put out information on tires, but could we have more information available to the public about that? COMMISSIONER MOY: We will include that in our educational effort, yes, Councilwoman.
Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilman Nutter.
Thank you, Madam Chair. I was just getting an update on the latest in phone technology from Councilman DiCicco. Commissioner, can you get us a list of the commercial corridors on the street-cleaning schedule throughout the City? 1370 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 COMMISSIONER MOY: Yes, we can furnish that to you, Councilman.
And what the day of the particular cleaning is and the frequency? COMMISSIONER MOY: I'd be happy to do that.
And you may have by now answered some questions on recycling. If I missed the answer, you know, just tell me to move along to the next one. When you factor out commercial recycling, what is the recycling rate in the City, what's the household recycling rate? COMMISSIONER MOY: It's about 16 percent, Councilman. Just residential collection is 6.46, I'm told, Councilman.
6.46? COMMISSIONER MOY: That's the curbside collection, the diversion rate for us.
Well, when you say "curbside," that gives me the impression that there's some other system operating. You seem to be making distinction between curbside and something else. 1371 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 COMMISSIONER MOY: Well, there's commercial which is a substantial amount of diversion.
Was that the 6 percent rate? You were saying 16 percent earlier; 7 what's that rate about. 8
The 16 percent rate is 9 after you back out construction and demolition 10 debris from the commercial sector and add in the 11 materials like tires in the City of Philadelphia, 12 organic waste material, household hazardous waste 13 material. So if you're just looking at curbside 14 collecting percentage, you're looking at that 15 6.46. Add materials to it, you come up to 16 approximately 16 percent. And then when you add additional materials to it in the commercial sector is where bring it to a greater percentage. It depends on which numbers you're looking at for which materials that you're putting into the mix.
Can you give that to us through the Chair in a chart form and break out all of those? And then when you say that the residential recycling rate is 6.46 percent, what 1372 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 does that mean? Does that mean that only 6.46 percent of the households are recycling? Does that mean that 6.46 percent of everything you collect in the course of a week is recycled material? What does that number mean?
It is a confusing number. The 6.46 is the amount of material that's pulled from the waste stream over a year's worth of time and moved into a recycling marketplace. So if you looked at what --
If you set a hundred tons worth of trash in a year, for instance, just example, 6.4 percent or 6.46 tons worth of material would be the amount of material that was recycled just from the residential sector.
What does that number mean in the whole scheme of things? Is that a good number, a bad number, average for other major cities? I mean, relative to what?
Well, if we look at Philadelphia compared to the top cities in the 25 country, as reported in Weeks News report which 1373 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 was just recently done in February, Philadelphia ranked ninth of the major cities across the country in its success in the recycling program, and that was the numbers that were -- again, it depend on what numbers you look at, but that's the numbers that are used under the Environmental Protection Agency's comparison methodology.
Why don't you share that with us just for the record, though, who was first what was their rate?
Jacksonville was first with 52 percent, Chicago was second at 47 percent, San Jose was at 45, Los Angeles was at 44, Seattle was at 44, San Diego was at 42.3, San Francisco was at 40, and Philadelphia was at 35.2. Again, that includes commercial sector recycling in addition to the residential recycling.
Okay. Why don't you provide us with some information to explain that information and maybe you can give us your perspective on why we are where we are as compared so some other cities.
Councilman, we'll have to come back to you. Your time is up. 1374 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 The Chair recognizes Councilman Kenney.
Thank you. Commissioner, I'm going to move back a movement to some issues relative to streets, resurfacing and reconstruction and the use of outside contractors. I have received more than a small number of complaints about the interaction between residents and the workers and/or supervisors for outside contracting companies who are doing probably, I would think, almost a hundred percent of that kind of work in the City when comes to resurfacing or to a reconstructed street. For example, if an individual operating a backhoe drives up on someone's curb and cracks it, if the street is resurfaced in a way that has covered curb where it's created a gully in front of the house that collects water, individuals who approach the contractors or employees are often cursed at, treated rudely, told to mind their own business. And then when trying to get a contractor back after there's a pool of water in front of somebody's house for a year is almost virtually impossible is my experience. What 1375 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 requirement do we have in the bid specs or in our policy when it comes to dealing with the citizenry? Part of the problem in addition to the work perhaps not being done properly is that people believe -- have a hard time discriminating between the fact that these are really not even City employees, that these are employees working for private company that treating them rudely even to the point using foul language and telling them to go back in the house, lady, and mind your own business. What is our supervisor responsibility in that interaction? COMMISSIONER MOY: Councilman, on any of the projects with the contractors -- first of all, let me apologize for that unfortunate interchange there. But the contract should primarily be between the City representative on the site, and usually if we have a contractor there, there should be a City inspector on site.
Are they there every day? COMMISSIONER MOY: They're there every say. So if the citizen has a complaint, it 1376 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 probably makes a great deal more sense to try and deal with our inspector who then would have the -- basically has the paycheck there for that contractor and he would then have the ability to direct any repairs that should be made.
What kind of prior interface happens before a major project, either resurfacing or reconstruction? Do people go out and knock on doors, do they meet with the neighbor, do they meet with the committee person? What do they do? They just show up one day and start working? COMMISSIONER MOY: On City projects, I think we put door hangers out. I'm not certain that that is done on all of our contract work. On a major project, we do that. On a small street in South Philadelphia, though, I'm not sure that that kind of advance activity is done with the blocks.
Is there anything specifically in the bid requirements that indicate that there needs to be some give and take when it comes to complaints about damage that was done to existing sidewalks and those kinds of things? COMMISSIONER MOY: There must be a 1377 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 clause there that puts the responsibility on that contractor, and we as the city see to it that -- we must administer that and must see to it that the contractor responds. So that the agency that's responsible is the Department the Streets and then we have to get the contractor to make the repair.
Could I possibly get a copy of a typical street resurfacing reconstruction bid package to see whether or not there's anything in there that would require them to either place money aside or to provide some type of a process for people to complain about work that's being done? See, part of problem is if work not corrected while they're there or if the damage isn't corrected while they're there, once they're off the site it's almost you bang your head against the wall trying to get somebody out there to redo it, especially when comes to areas where the street's been resurfaced and perhaps should have been replaced but is being resurfaced and then you wind up with these little lakes in front of people's homes that drive them crazy and then 1378 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 they in turn drive us crazy by calling us every day. COMMISSIONER MOY: We'll certainly furnish you with not only the spec, but some kind of an explanation, a working explanation of how that works.
Secondly, since 1992 I've asked this question, and I'll ask it again. I ask it every year and I still don't -- maybe it's me, I don't know. What is the fee for a plumber or some other contractor to open the street? Is there a specific fee that they pay? (Witness comes forward.) COMMISSIONER MOY: Councilman, it's $300 for the permit fee to open, and that entitles them to a two square yard opening, and that's $70 additional for every square yard.
What happens to that money? Where does it go? COMMISSIONER MOY: It goes into the General Fund.
Why? COMMISSIONER MOY: Because that's the policy of the City to take all revenues of that 1379 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 sort and put it into the General Fund.
Is not that fee clearly for the opening and then a proper restoration of that particular ditch? I mean, to me, I thought we were required also under City charter and City policy to collect money to do specific chores. We, again, Council President mentioned it in her opening questions, we go around trying to get these potholes and ditches filled when the money was collected for the restoration of the street once the plumber did the work. And since I've been here, I've been asking this question: Why are we not in some way putting this money or at least earmarking it for the specific purpose that it was paid for, and that was the closure of the hole as opposed to waiting for six months to eight months to a year when the ditch now begins to sink, the rest of the street around it gets damaged, and we collected the money from ABC Plumbing Company when we gave them the permit to open the street. This is clearly identifiable money to fix this problem. COMMISSIONER MOY: Councilman, there's two issues, I think. One is the issue of the 1380 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 policy of the Finance Department and why funds aren't sent to a department. The other issue that really is, do we have the funds to repair the ditch. And I think in our budget we do. I think there's a question of your telling us if there is a problem with the timely repair or the proper repair of the ditches.
It would seem to me to be easier to reduce or waive the fee and require the contractor who's digging the hole to fix the street. I mean, it's -- you collect the $300, you collect the $70, whatever it is, per square foot, and then when guy leaves after he's ne the plumbing work or whatever work he was doing there, for six eight months that sits there and disintegrates and deteriorates to the point where we have to wind up spending more money to fix street. To me, it's a very clear connection. You pay the fee to get the street open and the purpose of the fee is to put the dirt and the tar back, but it takes six to eight months to do it and we spend more money, I would think, in the end. It's just a frustration that I've experienced since 1992, and I'm just raising it again just to 1381 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 make myself feel better, but I imagine I'll ask you the same question next year.
Mr. Dubow, do you want to respond to the Councilman's question?
I guess I'd give the same answer that Larry gave which is that I think the Department has been sufficient funding to close the ditches. So I don't think it's really a funding issue, I think we have a timing issue on why it's not done.
Why don't you hire a separate contractor to go fill the holes? It's just -- I don't think there's a person in this room that hasn't experienced this plumbing ditch problem in the middle of the street, in front of the houses. And if you have to take the money that you have that's adequately funding this program, allegedly, and hire a private contractor to do nothing but go around filling holes and then seaming back the macadam and getting the street back in shape. It's just -- to me, it's insanity. COMMISSIONER MOY: It may be helpful to just explain for a moment thre the generation of some of these ditches. Our goal is to get the 1382 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 zero backlog in terms of ditches. We can get there at the end of the season, that is, the construction season which may be around December. The problem is that during that period in the winter, we don't do permanent restoration of those ditches, so many of the ditches that we see now, for example, are temporarily restored. In the severe winter that we've had, we've had a number of them start to come undone. What we do is when we come out of the box in the next month here in March, we not only come on-line with heavy pothole repair efforts, but we also come on with the ditch repair efforts by the City forces.
I'm not going to beat you to death with this. I'm just saying the severe weather is I don't think is an issue. There is a plumber's ditch in the middle of Tasker Street at 12th and you could have sucked in a Volkswagen Beetle into it that got worse after the snow, but it was there for six to eight months before the snow. All I'm saying is, if we're collecting a fee to do something and we don't do it in a timely manner, we shouldn't be collecting the fee. 1383 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 COMMISSIONER MOY: I agree, Councilman.
I would think that the Streets Department has adequate funding to address problems like that, and I understand what you're saying, but it is also my understanding we do not dedicate revenues under the City Charter. So if in fact the Streets Department did not have ample funding, it behooves them to let us know that.
Or stop collecting the fee inappropriately. Because if you're what's collecting a fee to do a service and you're not doing the service, why is the sense of collecting fee? I mean, it just goes back into the General Fund and we can't even identify where it is we're spending the money. COMMISSIONER MOY: Councilman, we will work on that system in terms of getting more timely repair.
Thank you. Good morning. 1384 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 COMMISSIONER MOY: Good morning.
I was trying to think if I had any surfacing -- oh, one question on the resurfacing. Do you know next year where you're going to resurface streets throughout the City? COMMISSIONER MOY: I'm told we're developing that list, and we're about three weeks to four weeks away from having a reasonably firm list of streets.
Can you identify those streets by council districts? COMMISSIONER MOY: We can do that, yes, Councilwoman.
Could you let me know the streets that -- COMMISSIONER MOY: We certainly can.
-- in the Ninth District what you are going to do? COMMISSIONER MOY: Yes.
I appreciate that very much. Let me just go back to my favorite subject. Your department reported that you 1385 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 replaced 5,000 street lights in the last two years. Are they identified also by council districts? COMMISSIONER MOY: We could do that. I believe we replaced 5,000 in your district. Is that what --
Now, let me understand when you talk about street lighting. Is that just the bulb and not the entire pole? Because see, my thinking is that with a new pole, but what is your -- what were you replacing, the bulbs? COMMISSIONER MOY: That in general was the program that we were engaged in was an upgrading of obsolete lights in many cases where you had existing light poles. It was simply trying to get a more efficient bulb that spread more light, and we when went through the City and in the case of these 5,000, I believe that's the case where we've replaced a more efficient bulb.
Would they have been done in replacing commercial districts versus residential or main thoroughfares? COMMISSIONER MOY: Let me ask our chief 1386 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 lighting engineer to speak to the specifics of the program.
Good morning. My name is Joe Doyle, I'm the City's Chief Lighting Engineer. To answer your question, the replacement of the light fixtures throughout the City was an ongoing program that will total eventually about 75,000 lights. They were done progressively from approximately southwest to northeast throughout the City which was the original installation program many years ago. They were used in both commercial and residential areas, but those are the lights that were attached to PECO utility wood poles. Those were the lights that are essentially the residential areas right now, but there are some commercial corridors that continue to have them. So the 5,000 lights that were replaced in the 9th Councilmanic District were replaced in last couple of years as our sweep, so to speak, went through the entire northwest portion of the City and did all of those, but primarily on residential streets. And they were the replacement of the light fixture, the entire assembly that you will see up on the pole, not the 1387 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 pole. Those were utility poles that were already existing this before.
They are a better light, they a better distribution of light. The older fixtures tended to shine the light straight down, so you had a big bright spot under the old fixture and then very dark in between to the next fixture. So as looked down the street there were a whole series of bright spots, dark spots. The newer equipment more uniformly spreads the light out , fewer dark spots, fewer very bright spots so it appears be brighter and it is more uniform as a motorist or pedestrian walks down the street.
Could tell me how you determine where to replace the lights.
The program essentially was a one-for-one on existing locations. So if there was a street light on that wood pole, it was replaced.
Yes. That program, other 1388 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 lights have been replaced in various commercial corridors for different projects.
Specifically the residential neighborhoods were on wood poles and those were the light that were replaced.
I think we had this discussion before relative to lights in terms of the East Oak Lane portion of my district where there are a lot of trees and a lot of complaints about not adequate lighting.
Right. We have had contact with several neighborhood groups in that area to try to mitigate that problem. But you're right, the Northwest has a very preponderance of trees and that clearly has an impact on lighting. Trees are a wonderful thing to have on the street, but as their branches grow and their leaves come out in the summertime, they do obstruct the light coming from there. So we attempt to balance the reality that we all want trees, but we do try to trim them and cut back the branches to help the light spread better. However, trees grow very 1389 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 quickly and we would appreciate any ongoing list or locations that you might have. We went through a year or two ago, I think, and did quite a few tree trims up in that area. Please, if you have some specific locations, we'll look at them again.
Thank you. While you're here, is the alley lighting program completed?
I have one more question, then I'll be finished for the day. Let me just ask. When are the yellow flashing lights program going to start again? We're getting a lot of complaints about these lights not being placed around the schools. What's the status of that program? COMMISSIONER MOY: Councilwoman, we 1390 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 have laid out additional schools and we started construction on 15 of them presently. We could let you know which schools are on that list.
Would you please? 6 I appreciate that very much. 7 And just one other question, Madam 8 President. 9 Relative to the question of what 10 Councilman DiCicco talked about the State 11 regulating installing traffic lights or stop 12 signs. We've had this discussion, I think, ever 13 since I've been here. I know it's an issue for 14 the state, Pennsylvania League of Cities because 15 other counties are complaining about it. So I 16 hope we will moving aggressively. It may protect 17 you in that we might not have to install them if 18 use State law as an excuse not to install them, 19 but certainly I think we ought to find some way to 20 dress address that issue. Thank you very much.
Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilman Clark.
Thank you, Madam President. Good morning, Commissioner. 1391 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 COMMISSIONER MOY: Good morning.
Actually, I have three questions. I'm going to get them real quick within five-minute time. On the Hot In Place pilot program, resurfacing program, you indicate here in your testimony that it's apparently allowed us to surface more streets. My question is as it relates to the cost effectiveness of this program, I've actually seen this take place in the periods, it appears to be like ten machines, it's like a train, is that the one where you have the train in the street? It's like maybe eight, nine different vehicles and takes a substantial period of time to set it up, and I'm wondering is it more cost effective to do repaving in that way? Let me get to other questions. The other one is relatively quickly. Sanitation officers in the Streets Department, is there any coordination between the Streets Department sanitation officers and the Police Department sanitation officers? The last one is more specific to my neighborhood, Ridge and Sedgely, the former 1392 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 highway station, the building has been leveled and the parcel of land has been sitting there for sometime and I'm just trying to get a sense of what's going to happen to that parcel of land. COMMISSIONER MOY: With respect to Ridge and Sedgely, it was leveled and we had not come to an agreement on reuse at all there, Councilman. We can talk further about that. With respect to the HIP program, while there is a train that is extensive, as you say, I think the big -- it is more cost effective first of all. And I think the big cost savings is probably in that there is one operation, one long operation that is fast. It comes in on the same day instead of milling box preparation and then resurfacing, this comes in in one day. It recycles basically the same material in place and finishes usually less than a day.
On that program, are we limited to large streets, major thoroughfares, because of the inability to make the turns. COMMISSIONER MOY: Pretty much, yes. Because of the size of that train, yes, you are 1393 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 limited to that kind of street.
So we will still on the smaller streets continue the old process. Is there any thought into possibly coming up with an additional solution to change the smaller streets such as we're doing -- we did such a great job on the snow removal with the small vehicles. Are we looking at possibly looking at some alternative programs for smaller streets? COMMISSIONER MOY: Well, we were looking at other kinds of things that are called life extenders for asphalting, I mean, where we were trying to put in seals and in something called novachip and other kind of surface treatments that could help some of the smaller streets since the HIP program is just too large for those streets. But we are looking at other alternatives to kind stretch the dollar.
To extend the life of the streets. COMMISSIONER MOY: Yes. With respect to the street program, Deputy Commissioner Tolson might want to respond to that. 1394 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
Good morning. My name is Clarena Tolson, Deputy Streets Commissioner. Councilman, sweep officers, as you know, cover mostly, in general, our commercial corridors, the pilot areas where we had the residential cleaning pilot going on as well as the recycling pilot. Areas outside of those boundaries are covered usually by sanitation police officers. But there's coordination between the two in terms of the calls come in, service requests come in of their policy issues. There's a dialogue between sweep where my office an police to ask for assistance when we're busily working.
Why is that separation? Why use police officers in residential areas and use the sweep program officers in commercial areas? Why wouldn't we just use the sweep officers throughout the City as opposed to using police? In some people's mind, we have a shortage of police to do police work. Do you have a since of that?
Well the sweep program as grown exponentially in the last few years. For a 1395 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 number of years, we had only had one class of sweep officers and they control generally the Center City area and some commercial corridors outside of Center City. It's only that in the last year that we've grown to include areas outside of those commercial corridors. And to do that, you hired additional sweep officers.
Excuse me,Miss Tolson, they can't hear you. Would you move the mike a little closer.
Surely. Because the sweep program has grown a great deal in the last year and a half, we've been able to do additional areas. Additional areas being the recycling pilot areas as well as the cleaning pilot areas as well as the commercial corridors which we already had and in addition to that the commercial recycling efforts that we make.
Could it be possible if can provide me with a breakdown, a cost associated with the sweep officer performing a service in a comparable area as a police sanitation officer so I can gauge what is the most cost-effective way of those people providing that 1396 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 service? I'm sure they essentially do some of the things --
Because I've had this thing about using police officers for, you know, sanitation police and writing up abandoned vehicles and I just don't think that's an appropriate use of a police officer. So if you can give me a sense of the cost associated with the sweep officer versus police officer, that would be very helpful to me.
Thank you, Councilman. The Chair recognizes Councilwoman Miller.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Good morning again. COMMISSIONER MOY: Good morning, Councilwoman.
Commissioner Moy, a couple questions regarding the sweep officers 1397 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 and whatnot. I think there is a law now that says that businesses such as restaurants or coffee shops that sell disposable items have to a trash can in front of that business; is that true? I know I'm a lawmaker here, but I can't remember everything.
I did, I know I did. What's happening, though, with the enforcement? Because particularly when you go to Broad and Erie and Broad and Olney -- I was at Broad and Olney about two weeks ago just walking around, actually shopping in and out of the some of the stores. I could not believe how much trash, of course, is on the sidewalk. And I have sense enough to know that even though there's a receptacle doesn't mean people will use it. But if there's none there -- and I think right on the corner of Broad and Olney they have a Dunkin' Donuts, lots of stores and little restaurants, and also at Broad and Erie the same way. How does the Streets Department coordinate the receptacle issue 1398 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 along with SEPTA such as Broad and Olney, Broad and Erie and some of the other Broad Street stops on the subway that are also SEPTA bus stops? Is there any coordination at all in terms of receptacles between the Streets Department, the sweep officers? Do they ticket the business operators? Do they fine them? And what does the Streets Department or how does the Streets Department and SEPTA work together around the trash issue and receptacle issues at bus stops in particular?
Yes. City Council passed a fine bill with regard to litter baskets approximately a year ago. What we have done in the Department is to develop regulations that support the enforcement of that. And what we completed just in November was a lengthy revision of our sanitation regulations, regulations to support a law. Those were done in November, and we have just most recently completed a survey of the City to determine the locations where baskets are needed. We have over, I think, 11,000 locations that do not presently have baskets that we will be enforcing. We plan for warnings to 1399 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 begin in mid-April for litter cans, so that by the summertime we will have touched a great percentage of the cans that are missing, touched those businesses to let them know that they need to have one. Full enforcement will probably begin in June. When I say full enforcement, a ticket. Prior to that we will have communicated verbally with property owners that there's a need to have a can and we will give them warnings for over a period of time, and then tickets will begin. With regard to the SEPTA issue, this is one as a matter of policy for SEPTA that probably still needs to be addressed internally. Presently, SEPTA, I believe, places cans on platforms and there are a limited number of cans that are placed at some bus stops that have covers. As you know outside of, say, MSB, that type of glass-enclosed bus stop. I do not believe that at any other bus stop in total that SEPTA takes responsibility for providing a can or to help assure that riders have a place to place their trash after exiting a bus or before entering a bus.
Well, who would 1400 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 be responsible for the cleanliness of that bus stop. If it's a store, is it the store operator? If it's a home, is it a home operator? Because realistically they could get a ticket from Sweep, right.
It is a challenging issue. Right now we're in discussions with SEPTA with regard to 52nd street, 56th Street and 60th Street. I think there's a willingness for SEPTA to try to do a little bit more at the locations where the riders may be creating more trash than is fair for the adjacent property opener to be responsible.
Or is it the business operator? When I think about Broad and Erie, it's a large bus stop where lots of people stand catching two buses and consistently people are going there, and it would be -- I guess it would be a disservice to that business operator who also is a restaurant to get ticketed when Dunkin' Donuts who is across the street their cups 1401 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 end up on his sidewalk because people are standing there waiting for the XH or the H bus. Well, I'd be interested in knowing when starts to be enforced. I know you said June, but could just kind of let me know? Because we want to monitor some of these. I personally took about eight guys, eight men down to Broad and Erie one Sunday. I talked to Commissioner Moy, and it was terrible. We must have gotten about bags of 11 trash up. That's how bad it was at that location. 12 And Broad and Olney is not much better. 13 Okay, I have a couple more questions. 14 And this is mainly about trash pickup. We've had 15 some experiences out in our neighborhood and many 16 times we get calls from constituents that are not 17 able to get an appliance picked up in a timely 18 fashion; Three weeks, four weeks and more. And 19 all of these individuals, of course, have said 20 they have called. Many of them, we have called. What is the realistic time line in picking up a refrigerator and tires by your department and other appliances like washers, dryer, etc.?
The goal that we have, Councilwoman, is five days, five business days. 1402 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 What realistically happens, though, is quite different. And I say that is our goal because we want to place the pressure on ourselves to be fair to citizens to get materials up in a timely manner. However, because our resources are shared across the board with sanitation to provide all the services that we provide, in fact, there are some points during the year that we're not able to pick up bulk on a regular basis. Our laws have changed in recent years with regard to what we can put in the trash. We used to pick up refrigerators, tires, sofas, furniture all in the trash truck and they all went one way. Now we are no longer able to pick up tires with trash, we're no longer able to pick up materials that have refrigerants and put them in the trash. And we're quite happy to comply with those laws, but what it means is that it takes extra resources for us to do that. So what we do is we send out a separate complement of trucks to pick up what we call white goods, the refrigerators, the washers, the driers. And in fact, the system is further complicated because the people that take, say, a hot water heater do not take materials that have 1403 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 refrigerants. So that collection is even split. And we don't take tires with either of those things because the guy that takes tires, does not take the metal materials. So our system gets very complex, particularly during the leaf collection season and the Christmas tree season because the people that we normally have to pick up some of those other materials like tires and bulk are instead deployed to pick up Christmas trees and leaves. Usually the delay that we have in bulk collection during that time of the year, we try to jump right back on it as soon as the Christmas tree season is over. However, this year once Christmas tree season was over, we had snow which further thwarted the system. So this year has been very, very bad in terms of what we really get and how long some of the bulk has been sitting out there. We once had a period when bulk as a regular course may have been on the street probably three to four weeks on a normal basis. I think our time period now is probably closer to seven to ten days before it is collected. But as I said, our goal is to get it within five days. And some of it we do get much shorter than that; 1404 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 however, on average we have not met the number that we'd like to meet in terms of timeliness of our collection.
And you want people to call a few days in advance, the day before, the morning of?
What we need citizens to do is to call once they place material out on the street, because we do not have a system wherein we can tell you when the collection will be scheduled. So when the call comes into our customer service center, it's entered into the customer and it's dispatched to each of the collection areas based upon the appropriate responsibility for that group.
And the collection areas are based on your trash pickup day, your regular normal trash --
There's no relationship to trash day and bulk collection or tire collection day. And that is something that we've kind of 1405 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 tied to overcome in terms of -- that used to be the practice many years ago. You know, ten years ago, it was the people understood that you put your refrigerator out on trash day. Well, in fact in today's environment and with collection practices, there's no relationship to trash day and bulk or tire collection day. Bulk can go out on any day of the week, it can be called on any day of the week. We pick it up based upon how we batch the calls as they come in geographically. So though many people would want to call on trash day because that's what used to, that's what they grew up understanding, in reality there is no 15 relationship between bulk collection day and trash collection day in our present environment and within our present collection rules.
Okay. So people just have to call once they put their refrigerator whatnot out. And if in fact a month later it hasn't been collected, should they call you?
They should call if it hasn't been collected within five days.
Oh. You'll get a lot of calls. 1406 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
Well, we're there to receive calls. In fact, we receive 151,000 calls a year. I think it's fair for citizens to expect that and to remind us if we've forgotten it, if we lost it, whatever the case may be and to expect that the service should occur. And sometimes we give an answer that may not be liked, such as, we don't have a truck out. And sometimes when we're honest, that gets us into trouble as well, but those are the facts in terms of what we're working with and how we're trying to manage all of the material that we have out there. But I think it's fair for citizens to call any number of times that they feel comfortable in calling in.
Thank you. I have more questions, but I'll wait for the second round. Or do I have time?
Thank you. We'll come back to you. Councilman Cohen? 1407 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
Is there anything that prevents the replacement of no-truck-parking signs next to parks, say, on the side of park land?
Good morning, Councilman. Charlie Trainor, Chief Traffic Engineer. In answer to your question, 24-hour prohibition of truck parking would require a specific Council ordinance. We do have the authority to post no-truck-parking 6 p.m. to 6 a.m. if there is a residential property within 100 feet of where we're talking about. That would only take a letter from either a resident of the street or from an elected official.
But to ban it 20 hours a day would require an ordinance by the 21 City? 22
And that would be 24 followed by the Streets Department?
We would post the signs 1408 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 on a trial basis AND then prepare the ordinance, yes.
And that no-truck ban would apply to the trailers and tractors?
Currently, trailers, if they are parked on the street more than hours 8 without a tractor attached to it is considered an 9 abandoned vehicle under the State vehicle Code. 10 They are not a vehicle unless a there is a tractor 11 attached to it, but it would include the tractor. 12
Thank you very much. 13 Let me go back to a favorite subject of 14 mine which involves driveways and retaining walls. 15 What's the situation with respect to the 16 availability of contractors? 17 COMMISSIONER MOY: Usually if we have 18 driveways or alleys or retaining walls that are 19 declared hazardous and if that's what you're 20 talking about, I guess where the residents have 21 gotten together and asked the City to go so far as 22 to go into a contract, we have not been able to 23 get contractors to bid and assume the bills, 24 assessment bills, as payment for the work done.
Has the City come up 1409 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 with an alternative proposal? COMMISSIONER MOY: No, but I believe that Councilman Nutter has introduced a resolution 5 that is addressing many of the questions that I'm sure all of us have about what can be done in terms of retaining walls particularly. And we had agreed, I think our department had agreed we would furnish a great deal of information and have an exchange at that time on that resolution. We're doing research right now, as a matter of fact, on trying to get a handle on the number of driveways, the number of retaining walls an so on.
Well, isn't the research really more important, not with respect to the number because there are many, many everywhere in the city, isn't the research needed on how we're going to deal with the problem? COMMISSIONER MOY: I think both answers are necessary. I think that the funding -- there's the issue of the technical piece of how many are there and whether we have to deal with, but in addition to that there is the policy issues of that Finance and the Law Department would have to engage in in terms of various alternative 1410 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 funding options.
Have you ever considered a funding option which would retain the responsibility of the homeowner to pay his or her proportionate share but to back up the contractor with respect to those people who don't pay? COMMISSIONER MOY: The primary problem with that is a budgetary one. Our budget at the present time doesn't provide that kind of funding for the department to advance the money and then have the City try and collect the bills.
Well, has there ever been a study made as to how much that would involve as to what percentage of people don't pay? COMMISSIONER MOY: I don't think there is an official study. I think what you would find is that in different parts of City, it probably would vary. Certainly, where you're in the Center City if you had any kind of situations that required assessment where there was high real estate value, you would probably get a higher compliance rate than you would in some other parts of City where you may have abandoned houses, where you may have absentee landlords and so on. So 1411 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 there's not a specific study that I know of that's been done, though, Councilman.
Is there one being done now? COMMISSIONER MOY: Not on that specific subject. There is data that's being gathered to discuss at the hearing.
The reason I raise it is I don't think there's a lack of data; I think there's a lack of will. Because the cost -- about two-thirds or more of the people on average pay, they meet their responsibilities. A smaller percentage, and it varies, I agree with you, in different parts of City, don't pay. But it seems to me that the cost would not be very high and we could certainly have tried in all of these years while these retaining walls have been increasingly crumbling and creating much more serious problems and the center areas of the driveways have been deteriorating, seems to me we could at least developed a pilot program so that the contractor who is in no position usually to absorb that financial problem that we can develop some kind of a program with contractors to help share the 1412 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 burden. Doesn't the City, when the City performs work on a house on an emergency basis where there's safety involved, doesn't the City have a system for collecting money and forcing judgments against homeowners who don't pay for the work that is necessary? COMMISSIONER MOY: I'm not that familiar with that. I guess that's L&I's area, and I'm not familiar with their specific mechanics, Councilman. But I think this is a legitimate question for the Administration to address, and I think it will be covered at Councilman Nutter's hearing.
Well, Councilman Nutter introduced a bill last year and it passed. Council passed a bill requiring the correction of retaining walls on a specific property. Was anything done by the Streets Department with respect to that Council action? COMMISSIONER MOY: No. I think without the funding, Councilman, we are unable to advance any kind of a program.
Well, it wouldn't take a whole lot of funding would it, to do one 1413 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 single property? COMMISSIONER MOY: I think once we start down that slope, I think it can become a very slippery slope in terms of the precedent. I think we do have to know sort of the universe we're dealing with, and I think that's why we're trying to get that information and make it available and we would share it with Council here as to how many driveways there are, how many alleys, how many retaining walls.
Well, there are thousands of them. COMMISSIONER MOY: Yes, there are. We're talking about hundreds of millions of dollars.
Nobody needs to do research. It's all over the City, and those that are barely decent now are going to, in the next couple of years, deteriorate. The infrastructure wherever there are common driveways and or retaining walls. Sometimes it's both, sometimes it's only one in an area that needs attention. They're just going to continue to get worse. The values, the property values of the homeowners are 1414 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 deteriorating badly. People have told me and we get calls in the office that people can't get anybody interested in buying their home because of the condition. And in addition, when you have broken up center area driveways, they just become a repository for all kinds of abandoned cars and trash because they're no longer able to be used as driveways, and the same thing applies if the retaining walls are deteriorated. And this is not a new situation. Could you tell me, sir, the last time the City approved and proceeded to have center driveways or retaining walls fixed by a contractor? When was the last time the City advertised? And secondly, when was the last time the City got a contractor? COMMISSIONER MOY: The last time the City got a contractor, I believe, was in a curb and sidewalk project in the Northeast.
I'm not talking about curb sidewalks. COMMISSIONER MOY: But that was the last time we had an assessment contract where the contractor accepted bills, which in that case he 1415 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 knew he would be paid for because there was commercial development alongside. But before that, it's many years since we have advertised and actually had bids taken with a contractor for that kind of repair, Councilman.
Because I think this may very well be very heavy legal liability that threatens the City in these cases because the City has been participating in permitting the values of homes to go way down, and I think the City has a responsibility. The City is certainly responsible for permitting dangerous conditions to continue and always the fining of the Streets Department inspection group doing their job, they never approved anything unless it was dangerous, and suddenly there's a halt. I think it's a good ten years, maybe longer, since the City has ever approved. Whenever the City representatives come out, they seek to discourage the people because I guess of the difficulty of getting contractors and in the few cases the people have themselves managed to put it together, but it's very, very difficult to do that. It would seem to me the City is derelict in its duty and I'd like to urge 1416 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 prompt attention on this. How soon do you expect that material will be ready for this hearing? COMMISSIONER MOY: I believe we indicated about 45 days or so we will be submitting it.
Or thereabouts. Well, the City would condemn them in the --
(Inaudible, off mike.) COMMISSIONER MOY: Well, I think the Health Department in point of fact does the actual condemnations of health hazards there with our technical advice.
All right. And that material will be presented at the hearing also when we have a hearing on the resolution that you referred to that was introduced by Councilman Nutter? I'm very much involved with Councilman Nutter in that study because I had to ask him to amend a resolution that he had introduced on a 1417 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 general subject and he recommend instead a separate consideration of a resolution and, in fact, it's a joint resolution by Councilman Nutter and myself because I've just felt the City is very derelict in its duties but nothing seems to have helped. To go on another thing, I've been raising for years. Councilman Kenney reminded me when he said he had raised a favorite subject of his since 1992. Mine might have even been raised before, and that's the absence the street signs all over the City. And we get constant complaints, and I have personal complaints as a Councilman-at-Large going all over the City. I sometimes go to areas where I haven't been in two or three years and if I can't find my way and have somebody with me, we often don't know where we are because there are no street signs. And I've always gotten some kind of promises, but there's never been in any action. Is there any program? Do we know what street signs are missing in the City? COMMISSIONER MOY: The answer is yes and no. I think that there is a program that we 1418 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 have with respect to street designation signs. We have a regular preventive maintenance inspection program where folks will travel different parts of City and check out specific traffic sign omissions and other problems there and report them back into work orders. Having said that, the funding for street designation sign materials is limited in our budget. We have not -- this had been funded out of the Capital this year.
I didn't get that last statement. COMMISSIONER MOY: This had been funded out of Capital.
You say it is funded? COMMISSIONER MOY: There's a small amount of money that grew smaller this year in terms of the funding for street designation signs.
And that's Capital? COMMISSIONER MOY: The material acquisition was funded out of Capital, that's correct.
Wouldn't that be 1419 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 Maintenance and Repair? COMMISSIONER MOY: The people that repair it are paid out of Operating. But in any event, we have the program in place and if you can help us or someone can help us with specific signs that are omitted from locations, we can go out and --
There's no way of doing it. There are thousands of streets that don't have signs. Isn't that the function of the Streets Department, to be responsible for having street signs designated? COMMISSIONER MOY: That's correct. And I had the impression that for the most part that our folks have gone through and they did have signs, but if you have a specific area, we'll go back over that and look much more closely. And if in the Northeast, if you could define a part of the northeast, we will certainly go over that portion.
I find it in almost every part of the City, South Philadelphia, North Philadelphia, Northwest, Southeast, every area of the City has many, many blocks with no street 1420 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 designation signs at all. COMMISSIONER MOY: We will --
And I would like to ask the Streets Department to furnish a list of all streets that are not designated by name. COMMISSIONER MOY: I don't think we have that list, Councilman. I don't think that's the point. If you would help us with some of those omissions, we will address them.
Well, I wouldn't know what street it is, because you look up there and on all four sides there's no street sign. How could I designate it? (Laughter.) COMMISSIONER MOY: Give us an approximate boundary.
Well, I'm requesting because I think it's necessary for the Streets Department to make a study of every street in the City and to make certain that every corner is designated with a street sign.
If Reilly Harrison here from Fleet Management, can we get a global positioning monitor in Councilman Cohen's car and then -- (Laughter.)
NASA will always know where Councilman Cohen is. We do it right by the coordinates. I'm just trying the help out, Councilman.
Yeah, I'd be prepared to do that, but I'm fearful that Councilman Nutter has a side motive. He wants to keep me away from other issues and have me spend my time designating the streets. (Laughter.)
Were I elected to do that, Councilman Nutter, I would be very pleased to do it. But I would very much like to request from the Streets Department a list of all the street corners that are not designated and would like a reply from you with respect to that respect. With respect to the signs that you've 1422 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 designated on the Avenue of the Arts on Broad Street, only real young people like Councilman Nutter can probably read the signs because what you've done is they've made them artistic but illegible to people maybe two or three years older than Councilman Nutter and thereafter. (Laughter.)
And I would like to suggest that I believe there can be signs that are both artistic and legible and would like to ask the Department to consider that in developing the next set of signs. COMMISSIONER MOY: Okay.
Yes, we'll get you for the next go-round. Councilman Rizzo is next, but we have a follow-up question.
Thank you. I just have one additional sign request. I call these signs the of wheel of fortune signs. They're the ones where one or two or three of the letters in the sign is faded as a result rain and elements. 1423 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 It's like, can buy a vowel so I can figure out what sign it is. I asked this maybe last year or the year before. We had a contract with somebody to do that, and I don't know if there was a warranty or what was there, but in a relatively short period of time certain letters on certain signs faded off. I thought originally it was vandalism where people were climbing up the pole and spray-painting green just to confuse people. But the more and more I looked at it, it's clear that certain of the white letters had faded as a result of rain or other elements. Is there some way we can also get a report on whether we're try to get a reimbursement or these signs are being replaced at the contractor's cost because of a defect in the sign?
Councilman Kenney, I believe you were referring to Harbison and Aramingo Avenue which you raised a question about last year. If I recollect our answer at that time, those signs that we have up there, sir, are over ten years old. The life expectancy of --
To me, they look like the newer design size-wise. 1424 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
What you're calling a newer design sign, sir, has been installed since 1973 that I'm aware of.
I've lived in the City my whole life. I'm 41. I've seen all kinds of different signs from the white ones with the black letters on forward. The signs that I'm talking about are not 27 years old.
No. The type of sign that you're talking about, what we call the metro, signs, Councilman, some of them -- we started that program over 27 years with the metro street name signs. The signs that were installed up on Aramingo and Harbison, the ones that we looked at specifically did not have any paperwork behind them still in our records. So they were exceeding the seven-year life expectancy of the engineer grade material that used for that type of sign. Currently, the sign that we're using now is a high intensity material which we expect to last about ten years, and they are done in-house. 1425 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
And this is just anecdotal, just my own personal experience. Growing up, I never remember seeing letters off signs. They were the light color, the white background black letter sign and I've never seen any faded -- I've never seen any of the individual letters off. To me -- well, maybe that's the answer, I don't know. But it's not just Harbison Avenue, it's other streets throughout the City where you see an occasional letter or two that are gone from the sign. And it just -- I mean, maybe there are 27 years old, but they look awful new.
No, the older ones that you were talking, they were paint; they were not a particular material that were stuck on there, but they did not have the reflectivity at night that the current signs do.
So what you're saying for the record is that there's no problem with any of the newer signs that have been 1426 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 installed, they're just fine?
No, Councilman. I agree with you that the lettering does fade over time and it fades depending on the direction that the sign is facing. A sign that is -- a two-sign bracket which one sign facing toward the South and one facing to the north, the sign on the south side will fade quicker, deteriorate quicker than the sign on north side.
Is there some process we can employ to paint them or to do something? Is there reflective paint that's available that would keep this from happening, or we got to keep buying these signs an replacing them?
Even the reflective paint, the parking signs that we use do have some reflectivity and they're a painted sign and they also fade over time.
Thank you, Madam 1427 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 Chair. Commissioner Moy, first of all, I thank you. We received quite a few letters, and I think I've forwarded a few of them to you, for the relief, some relief to the traffic congestion on Germantown Avenue so that went over big I wanted to thank Charlie Trainor for all of the effort that went in resolving that problem. Councilman Nutter in jest was talking about a global positioning system. And I know that you know that the City is about to install a new communications system that's costing well over $50 million, and I see that you requested or it's been proposed to you a global positioning system for the Sanitation Division, and I'd like to know why we need a global positioning system. I think I know we have one customer that might be able to use it, but I'd like to know with this state-of-the-art, and I don't think there's going to be a finer two-way radio system in the world after this is installed and that's not exaggerated, that need a global positioning system to keep track of your employees when they have two-way radios in their trucks and most of the 1428 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 time employees are always behind the wheel. So I don't understand the pilot program and expense of $150,000 for global positioning for sanitation vehicles. COMMISSIONER MOY: I believe a request had been made in the Capital program for global positioning on a pilot basis there, Councilman. I don't think that that was retained in that budget, if I'm not mistaken. But the point had been to try to use this as a pilot to see if it would work on certain kinds of vehicles and whether it would be worth while expanding into the fleet. It was only a small number, maybe we would start with buck trucks or things like that, the ones that were most important to us in terms of communications. Eventually there are things that as we get into more acceptance of GPS that when we go into snow routes and things like that, this kind of equipment may become more commonplace. I think there was a number of jurisdictions that are experimenting with GPS throughout the country.
But, again, where you have this very fine communications system that would be utilized by the Streets Department, so I 1429 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 don't personally see the needs for both. And since it's been knocked out of the -- it has been knocked out of the budget. COMMISSIONER MOY: That's right. That's my understanding.
I hope stays out because I don't really personally see a need for it. If you do, that's fine. My next question is I know that there was a resolution, I'm not sure exactly what it was, but lots of municipalities throughout the country have adopted a rigid container policy on trash being put out at the curb by businesses and residents in a trash can with lid. When I ride through the City, especially in Center City, I see trash just strewn all over the place. People just though plastic bags out at the curb, dogs get in, animals get into these bags, and it just seems to me that trash day is the day that we get our streets the dirtiest where thre's just things just blowing all over the place. Have we ever done a pilot or do we plan to do anything? Have you ever considered a rigid container regulation like any other municipalities or boroughs have? 1430 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
Councilman, in fact, we have tested a rigid container in parts of the City. A few years back, we installed what we call Toter Containers, that's a company that made them, and tested in Mt. Airy and part of Roxborough. The intent of this program was to see whether we could minimize injuries as well as possibly pick up our speed and reduce our crew size. The container that the City provided to residents was 101-gallon container, and we had a truck with a specially outfitted lift that was to come in, collect the container, the truck did the lifting and tipped the container. That process is a lot slower. And also, we found in terms of our citizen use, because of our particular City's culture with regard to trash allowances is that that container was not enough for our citizens to put all of their materials in. In fact, even with a large container, we still get other trash in bags or other cans alongside the large container that we provided. Council has in the past talked having an ordinance which would require that all residences and businesses that have City collection would have a firm container, even if it 1431 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 was a 32-gallon normal size container that you could buy at a Home Depot or Sears or a hardware store. I think, if remember some of the discussion, there was concern that rigid containers don't necessarily meet needs or don't necessarily fit into the life styles of many of our citizens because they require storage space either outside or inside a house. They do take up a significant amount of space and everybody doesn't have that provided to them. There is a lifting requirement that some households cannot handle with regard to carrying a can versus carrying a bag. There's a different dynamic to carrying a can. There is also a cost feature. For many property owners buying cans from a hardware store seems more cost prohibitive because there is an up-front cost that is fairly significant when you compare that to buying a box of bags as well as the fact that in many areas of our City, most areas of our City, cans do get stolen which is why people put their addresses on them and sometimes put their name. However, they still, you know -- I've seen people walking on not the right block with a can going someplace else. 1432 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 Because of that, I think our citizens presently have a choice about how they set their trash out, and we go with whatever choice they have, whether it be bags or cans. In terms of our collection practices, and around the country this has been proven, the fastest way of collecting trash is rear-loading or side-loading with bags. Cans will always slow the process down. However, in the communities where people choose to use cans, it is not a problem. By and large we find that it is generally on a community-by-community basis that people either select cans or not select cans based upon how they feel the cans will be received in their community and their ability or desire to have them in their household.
Commissioner, to follow up on Councilman Kenney's question about ditches, my personal observation is that the City of Philadelphia is one of the bigger violators of the entire ditch restoration process. I know just 1433 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 this morning, I observed a ditch that was dug by PGW and not backfilled properly, just the earth through back in. I noticed that they drilled holes in the entire intersection many weeks ago, did not repair those holes where water can flow and undermine the street. I know the Water Department is, again, a violator of a proper restoration of a ditch. I don't think there's anything worse than a rainy dark night that a person in their vehicle has to run across one of these ditches, so I think that the utility companies, the gas company, the Water Department, really need to get their act together in filling these holes properly. And just to add to that, when the Streets Department or any other agency lends out a contract, I think where some of the contractors pick up a few dollars is where in the contract it says that they're supposed to put barricades up with flashing light, that they're supposed at the ends of the day put covering plates down to properly protect some of these excavations; they don't do that. And in my opinion, there's nobody telling them to do that. So I don't know what 1434 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 kind of project management we have, but I can tell you that today if in a late-model automobile one of our constituents hits one of these ditches, they're going to create a lot of damage to their vehicle. And I know Risk Management, every year it's one of my pet questions, Risk Management tells me that there's supposedly a committee of the utility companies, the water, gas, etc., that have been trying to address this problem, and I have seen no improvement in that situation throughout the City. Example: Hillcrest Avenue, a major project. Every week after a rain storm I had to personally call to make sure that the contractor went back there to backfill that situation, and again, it's just something that I haven't seen any progress or haven't seen any improvement in how we leave the streets after we do work on them. Thank you, Commissioner. COMMISSIONER MOY: Okay, thank you, Councilman.
Question, Commissioner or Miss Tolson. We have some residential blocks, not a lot, but some who want 1435 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 cans. Now, if they can get trash cans, will the City empty them? The residential block, not a commercial corridor.
Councilwoman, I want to offer an answer cautiously. With our block captain program, which I think is a wonderful program that I hope can spread throughout the City --
We do have an adopt-a-basket program, and we actually provide cans to citizens, to our block captains that want them. Usually it's because these blocks have lots of children on the block, they may have a mom-and-pop store on the corner, they may have a school nearby, and they feel this would help them take care of their litter problem. What we really suggest to people with their cans is that they don't use a City container, a wire basket, because what eventually happens is the baskets become magnet for trash. Citizens, when they find out the City has given a basket or there's one that's provided out there, as they see it collected will then place their household trash in them on a 1436 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 regular basis. This is a problem that we have on commercial corridors and corridors that abut residential blocks or even apartment houses or just a few houses in a commercial area. What we suggest to people is instead take, you know, a little can that you get from a hardware store, from a supermarket, and then as you empty it, put it with your household trash and we'll get that on the once-a-week collection schedule. However, any time that we've ever gone in, tried to service cans, the cans are always abused. Citizens will put out, you know, smelly fish debris, you know, crabs when they have them in the summertime, household trash that they don't want to keep in for a long period of time, and ultimately we have people who get turned off with regard to having cans and then they're asking that it be removed. What we found that has works best is when citizens put out a normal-looking household container and their neighborhoods tend to respect that a little bit better with regard to abusing it.
But I think also that once 1437 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 we start to move with enforcing our litter can law on the stores that sell take-out food that we should see a little bit of relief for some of our blocks, our residential blocks, and it should get a little bit better for them.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Commissioner, let me go back to a topic that you covered earlier. With regard to street resurfacing and potential or alleged curb damage, we've had a number of conversations about that, but one of your answers intrigued me. When the job is -- I think usually there's a posting that goes up because, obviously, you want people to move their cars, so there is some level of advance notice, maybe three or four days. Do we put out, I guess, kind of a dear citizen, dear neighbor, this is what we're doing in your block, we're going to resurface it, we expect the job to the start on X date, finish on Y date. The contractor is so and so. This is their contact phone number, and the City inspector on this job is Mr. or Ms. 1438 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 Williams, Jones, whoever, whatever their name is, with a phone number for that person to contact them so that they can tell that person either at the site or know who to go to at the site for these curb damage issues? Do we provide that information up front? COMMISSIONER MOY: I'm told on our resurfacing jobs we do stuff mailboxes with a good deal of the information that you just outlined. I think we need to check and make sure it does all of the things that you suggested. I think we tell them that we're coming in with milling and resurfacing and giving them a point of contact. I'm not sure it addresses curb specifically, but we do have some kind of an overall alert to the residents to --
Did you say when the City is doing that work? COMMISSIONER MOY: When the City is doing it.
What about the private contractors? COMMISSIONER MOY: It goes in before the milling, which is always private contractor, 1439 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 so yes, we do it.
Can you get us a copy of that notice or a sample one that has actually gone out? COMMISSIONER MOY: Certainly.
Let's talk about street lights. How do you measure -- what's the proper terminology, I guess, for the measurement of light or illumination that comes out of the bulbs? Is it lumens, is it wattage? COMMISSIONER MOY: Joe Doyle can probably answer that better.
I'm sorry, Councilman, would you ask that question again? I was moving up here.
What's the technical term for the measurement by however you measure it for light that comes out of a light fixture, is it lumens, is it illumination, what's the technical term?
There's a couple different terms. Probably the one that we would be most familiar with would be footcandles, that would be the measurement of light as it actually falls on 1440 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 the surface that's being illuminated.
Okay. Is that then called footcandle power or footcandle --
Footcandles is a number relatively low 1, 2, 3 footcandles is sort of a typically roadway lighting situation.
So what's the footcandles for an average city street in the City?
That's a good question. It varies. The footcandle reading on the street is a function of a number of factors. One is the total output of the light, what the mounting height of the light is, how far apart the lights are, trees, other things. Probably in the range of a quarter to a half footcandle very, very broad average would be the number.
All right. So let's say, for instance, in an average block in West Philadelphia, 55 houses on the block, parking on both sides of the street, travel lanes in each direction, usually three no more than four cobra street lights on one side of the street, what's the footcandle reading on that block? 1441 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
Quarter to a half footcandle, okay. I notice in the Commissioner's testimony that the department has funds for streetscape maintenance for the Avenue of the Arts; is that correct? COMMISSIONER MOY: Yes.
And what is that for? COMMISSIONER MOY: It basically reimburses the series of contractors that the Avenue of the Arts hires to take care of the streetscape kinds of things, the sidewalk appurtenances there, I think the flower plantings through the different seasons and I think restoring some of the pots that have been changing over some of the street furniture down this.
I'm sorry, I got lost somewhere. Who are we paying? COMMISSIONER MOY: We're paying Avenue 1442 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 of the Arts, Incorporated, which is the nonprofit agency that's administering work along the Avenue of the Arts.
And why are we paying for this? COMMISSIONER MOY: Because it was in agreement with the Mayor to fund the maintenance there.
How long? COMMISSIONER MOY: There's a contract which is a yearly contract.
How long do you anticipate that we're going to pay this? COMMISSIONER MOY: Pardon me?
How long do you anticipate we're going to pay this? COMMISSIONER MOY: It's an annual contract that is recurring.
Do we have contracts of this same type in other parts of City? Is that maintenance contract for streetscape? 1443 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 COMMISSIONER MOY: I don't think we have -- if we have any, we certainly don't have many, Councilman.
What's the footcandle reading on the Avenue of the Arts?
Four to five. What's the footcandle Walnut Street between Broad and 16th.
About the same range, four to five footcandles, perhaps a little bit less.
And the reason for this seemingly great disparity between those areas and the average neighborhood in Philadelphia is what?
They were designed at different times and for different reasons. The design that was finally adopted for South Broad Street looked at having a relatively high light level with a high frequency of poles. As you're probably aware, South Broad Street has street 1444 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 light poles that are probably 50 to 75 feet apart. That's overall at least twice the density of the pole locations that we're used to seeing on residential streets.
I understand that, but we're talking about light power now. So is more light better than less light for pedestrians and other people who are out and about?
Well, you can have a street that's overly lit and creates a glare problem.
I think you can make the argument for that situation it might be considered underlit.
Well, you're the 1445 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 street lighting technical person, right?
Okay. If you had your choice, would you rather walk down a street quarter to a half or one that had four to five.
Okay. And we don't have any of these similar contracts anywhere else pretty much in the City? If we did, they'd probably pop right off the top of your head, right, the maintenance contracts we talked about earlier?
I'm sorry, Councilman. The streetscape maintenance cost was not related to lighting that I'm aware of. That's for other functions.
I didn't make any connection between the two. I'm back to a different question.
Oh, I'm sorry. The only contract that we have for maintenance of street lighting is what we presently have in place with PECO Energy, and they provide a service for replacing defective lights that are out of 1446 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 service.
Do we have -- is there any plan or program anticipated to get the footcandle power up in our residential neighborhoods to some higher, brighter, and potentially safer level?
Right now, we have -- our first efforts have been to replace the older equipment with better lighting to improve that number. As far as the density of lighting, that is not something that we have any large-scale program underway.
Okay. I know the buzzer has buzzed on me a while ago. I'll come back to this particular area. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Commissioner, I was struck by the response to Councilman Nutter's question regarding Philadelphia's ranking with regards to recycling. My notes indicate that Philadelphia ranks 1447 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 number 9? COMMISSIONER MOY: That's correct.
Could you please for the record provide me as well the background data on the other cities, who they are and the ranking, so that I can look to see what they are doing that Philadelphia may or may not be doing? And then secondly, follow-up on the recycling education activities happening in the Overbrook Cluster, I'm unclear on what that is, what that means. So provide to me, preferably by the end of this month because the School District comes before us next month, a program description, what those activities that are happening in the Overbrook Cluster. COMMISSIONER MOY: We'll be happy to do that, Councilwoman.
Please provide the name of the point person on your staff for the recycling effort. COMMISSIONER MOY: Steve Tilney.
Steve? COMMISSIONER MOY: Yes, Steve Tilney who was here is our interim recycling coordinator. 1448 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
You're welcome. Councilman Kenney, did you want to be recognized?
Is Councilwoman Miller still in the room? (No response.)
Are tires being recycled? Or how are they disposed of, is it through recycling or other forms of disposal?
Yes, tires are moved to a separate facility, they are not trashed.
Tires go to the a facility that crumbs them, chips them up, and sells it to recycling firms to power companies and the like.
I'm sorry, I'm 1449 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 unable to hear you.
The tires that the City collects goes to a firm that chips the tires up into very small pieces or crumbs the tires. That recycler then takes the materials an sells it to firms that use recycled rubber or to power companies that use it as an alternative fuel to power their plants.
No. However, the rate that the City pays actually is fairly good compared to a number of cities around the country. Our cost is approximately 55 cents a tire. There are some cities that are paying as much as $1.50 a tire for disposal. We pay by ton, but I'm breaking that per tire cost for you.
Whose responsibility is it to pick up the tires that are on pavements or on streets when they're dumped there?
That is the responsibility of the Streets Department. Someone asked a question about how they should be properly identified, and through a number of mechanisms. 1450 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 We certainly appreciate calls that come from citizens to identify when they set out the materials. However, in Philadelphia -- I should also say that we also identify them when our supervisors are on the street and they see them, they identify them as well and then they're picked up by a separate fleet of vehicles that are trash compactors, however, when they go to work, the only thing that put on their trucks is trash. They're not allowed to take tires with the trash. In Philadelphia we have a big problem, however, with tires that are thrown out on the street after they have been legally dropped off with an auto shop or garage or something like that. When you go in and buy new tires, the vendor receives your old tire, in fact, charges you a fee for it that's allowed by the State, charges you a small fee and the tire is then supposed to be properly recycled. What many of these vendors do, however, is they receive the tire, they receive the fee, and at some later date, the tires end up either in a pile someplace near the auto shop, and that's where many of our tires come from, near a small garage; or some 1451 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 vendors will go as far as ringing fire hydrant in the neighborhood and just spreading them around the neighborhoods. We had that problem in South Philadelphia last summer. It was a very big problem. You don't have household with 20, 30 tires at one time. These are coming from unscrupulous vendors who are taking money for proper disposal and then they are dumping the tires out, in their mind, for free on the street.
Does the City have some kind of campaign against that form of -- it's an illegal dumping isn't it?
It surely is short-dumping. It's very difficult to check. It makes our collection process more difficult because you can, in fact, find tires at any location. It might be leaning against a house, it might be thrown against a curb, on a sidewalk, anyplace other than just the collection site where trash might be normally set out. So the system is challenged in that way. We do have responsibility to get it, which is why we have the separate complements of trucks that goes out and collect them. Right now, because there's no individual 1452 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 market, per se, for tires which would encourage, say, scavengers to get it or anybody else to get it, tires wind up staying on the street for the City to get. What we have done in the past and what we plan to do this year is to have a tire roundup. It's a program that we started approximately four to five years ago. And through this program, we work with block captains, boy scout troops, girl scout troops, and many nonprofit neighborhood organizations around the City, and it has in the past been a public-private citizen cooperative effort. An by that, I mean in some years we have had citizens collecting the tires. The City receives the tires, properly disposes of it, and we've actually had some generous members of our private sector who have funded a bounty for those tires. In the absence of private sector funding the bounties, the City has funded the bounties. We have paid as much as 50 cents per tire for citizens to bring those tires to us. We've supported that program and encouraged it because what it does is it eases the collection system for us. We don't have to hunt for tires. It helps 1453 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 the community groups because they get to clean their communities up. It helps them also from the standpoint of when they are funded 50 cents per tire, they're allowed to collect $250, $500 in moneys for the communities that they then funnel back into community programs such as troops for children in the community, buying trees, buying planters, buying brooms, shovels, and cleaning equipment, whatever is appropriate for that community group. That program will happen again this year in July and August.
Does the City have any power to check the records of these private garages or repair shops? Because they generally charge $5 if you buy a tire from them and they ask you do you want your old tire disposed of, the charge is frequently $5, it may be higher, it may be lower in a few cases. Does the City have any power to check their records? Do we have any supervision over these tire shops.
Not from that standpoint, I don't believe. The manifest system for tires does leave some room for improvement. Unlike, say, some hazardous waste, there's no requirement 1454 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 that's enforced that requires vendors who receive old tires to document and state exactly where each of those tires wind up.
Who they got it from, how many, and who they send it to?
So that we can check with who they send it to whether they received them or not?
Right. There's no strong system in place for that right now, and it probably would require some State legislation, maybe possibly City legislation as well.
In terms of managing tire disposal statewide, yes. Because given that our borders are so, you know --
Along Lindley Avenue, between Bellfield and Old Stenton Avenue, just before Lindley becomes Logan, there's one garage there and there's almost every day a heap of tires that keeps getting bigger and bigger, 1455 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 about 100 yards from the shop as well as right across the street where there's a park.
It's always there. I saw a group of people today trying to clean up near the park side, and that may be one of the volunteer groups that you referred to.
I think the bigger issue there is the fact that, and you're kind of I guess supporting what I said earlier, is that close to a number of garages you're going to find short dumps where they probably collect their tires in a day and then at night before they go home or on the weekends when nobody's looking, they're going to go out and dump the tires. Tires don't carry identifying marks, they're not required, so it's difficult to trace where tires come from.
Neighbors in the area are convinced that comes from this garage on the corner of 20th Street and Lindley Avenue because the tires not on the park side but on the garage side appear about 50 yards from the garage shop right underneath the bridge overpass.
They're probably right and 1456 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 I'll work with the Police Department to keep an eye on this location to see if we can try to determine who's short-dumping there and to put a stop to it.
All right, thank you. Now, could I now go onto recycling? How much money does the City itself put into the recycling budget? I calculate in this budget that we're dealing with that the figure is $900,000 of City money out of the budget of about close to $150 million for the Streets Department. Am I wrong? And tell me if I am by how much.
Councilman, that number's a little off. Substantially, there's a lot more that we spend. I can give you the exact number, but just with our operations and our administration, not including processing costs, things like that, the number's closer to 4.5 million.
And that's State-City money. 1457 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
That supports on-street collections and the planning and program staff.
And then there's the 5 million additional from the State.
The State grant money can vary year by year, but, surely, yes. State grant money would be on top of that.
Would I be able to get from you, say, in the course of this week, a list of all of the City monies and where it's located in the budget?
Because I have trouble seeing anything beyond the $900,000. What 1458 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 I see is million altogether for recycling, of which 4.1 comes from the State grant.
No, all right. If you could work out just the recycling budget for me.
And does that State grant, is that a continuing grant or is that a grant -- could you compare it with State grants in the last, say, two or three years before this current year that we're dealing with?
The pilot program that exists now, do you know what the recycling residential rate was when we had once a week collection? Didn't we have once a week collection throughout the whole City at one point in time?
We had once-a-week at the start of the program ten years ago. And in an effort to try to move to collections throughout the entire City, we dropped once-a-week collections and plastics and moved to every-other-week collections through the entire 1459 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 City.
Now, I missed what you said just before you said, "We moved to twice-a-week collection." Said ten years ago we started once-a-week collection and then when we got to the point of covering the whole City, then I missed something you said, and then you said we went on to twice a week.
We had once a week collection a portion of the city when program started.
Right. Did we ever have -- was there ever a time when we had once a week throughout the whole City.
Never. What was the closest approximation of the whole city? What portion of the City?
Two of our sanitation districts had -- two of our six sanitation districts had weekly, while the rest of City had nothing. We expanded over time to the entire City. Now everyone has every other week. Save for now the pilot program which we started last 1460 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 May.
I'm just not getting what you're -- Yes, I'll yield to Councilwoman Blackwell.
Thank you, Madam President. You said that when it was a pilot program you collected both newspapers and plastics? What did you say?
What did you say you collected on the pilot before you went to every other week.
When we first started the program and after the pilot when the determination was made that we were going to do recycling in the City, we collected newspaper, plastic, glass and metals.
Now we don't collect 1461 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 plastic. In an effort to move from just having collections in two of the six sanitation areas and to have collections throughout the entire City, we've dropped plastics, which are very costly to collect, and we dropped every other week service in those to areas. And we now have any other week through the entire City except for the two areas that we're piloting or testing weekly collections.
Is it the same type of system? How does it go in the municipal buildings?
In municipal buildings we have added -- I guess we added in in '95 mixed paper. City Hall, you're collecting all of those mixed papers.
Do we have a mandatory system within municipal government? 1462 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
Do we have a mandatory system within municipal government?
Yes. City Hall has been recycling now for maybe eight years. There was a big step-up in that effort in the last couple of years.
I know we have it, but I didn't know whether or not it was mandatory. And obviously, because other people take out our trash, we don't do it directly. Then my last follow-up, and I'll yield back to Councilman Cohen is, has any attempt to put into place an educational program in public schools on recycling? Because it would be a great part of an environmental class schedule.
Excuse me, Councilwoman. For the last 13 years that I've been with the recycling office, we've consistently tried to make outreach efforts into the schools. We've tried to step up those efforts over the last couple years, and we also have in plan for the next few years to continue our outreach efforts into the public school system. I will say that there are not as 1463 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 forthcoming as we'd like them to be. If we can get the schools to start notifying us about visits that they'd like, classroom educational programs that they'd like to have take place at specific schools, we'll try to put them into accomodation schedule.
Excuse me, excuse me. I don't believe you identified yourself So that the record would reflect who is speaking.
I'm sorry. My name is Steven Tilney, and I'm the interim recycling coordinator and the recycling program administrator.
Has any effort been made to withdraw recycling from the Streets Department and to some other are or entity to focus more attention on it? Are there any plans to do recycling differently or on a major basis since it's becoming such a big area?
I could only say we're 1464 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 fully supported where recycling is concerned within the City. We have some new initiatives that were taking place, for instance, an organic waste composting program which is just now being kicked off as a backyard composting program. We have some additional outreach into the school systems and we're continuing to do educational outreach in the general public and, again, trying to support the pilot program that's going on as well.
And finally, what about the replacement of the recycling coordinator? Where and when how is that search being conducted?
Out recycling coordinator left a few weeks ago. I think our intention is to do the proper search and find the best and most appropriate person for that position.
With respect to the recycling coordinator, when is it anticipated that there will be a real live full-time recycling coordinator? 1465 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
We have an interim coordinator right now who is quite familiar with the program and he's fulfilling all of those duties presently, so we're not -- there's no lapse in any services.
And he has the full authority of a recycling coordinator?
So that we can expect him to be performing as a recycling coordinator until such time as he is either permanently appointed or somebody else is permanently appointed?
So that means that there will not be funding problem when a recycling coordinator comes in? Are there funds now available for a recycling coordinator? 1466 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
Now, with respect to the pilot program again, now we have a pilot program for every-week recycling, right? What percentage of the City is covered by that?
The pilot program is now occurring in the Northwest section of the City as well as Center City. The genesis for that program, as you might remember, is that we came to City Council last year to --
Could I interrupt because I really do -- I'm not at this moment interested in that. I would like to follow through. What percentage of the City do you estimate is covered by the weekly recycling program?
About 80,000 households out of, say, out of 560,000 households.
Do you have any statistics that give us the percentage of residential recycling currently where the recycling is weekly?
No, no. I'm sorry, sir. 12 Give me one moment please. I'm looking at a table 13 and I'm answering a different question. That's 14 the wrong answer. 15 In order not to slow the process, can I 16 give you that answer after Council and provide it 17 in our response so I can give you an accurate 18 reflexion of all of our activity? Is that you 19 suitable to you? 20
May I give you an answer 22 after session so that -- I'm looking at tables and 23 I'm answering the wrong question. I do have the 24 answer here, but I do not want to delay your 25 proceedings with giving the right answer, and I 1468 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 don't want to give you the wrong answer either. May I give it to you even this afternoon or would you like for it to come in with the replies?
Getting information later usually makes the information worthless because you can't carry through with any thought. It's my opinion that it's very obvious that the recycling rate in a weekly collection is going to be vastly greater than in the twice-a-week, and I don't know why anybody needs a pilot program. If there's done twice a week, you got to remember which week is it, is it this week or is next week that we're going to put out the recycling. It places a great burden on households.
I think we could actually state surely tonnage has gone up which is what the Commissioner indicated earlier. And what will happen in May or June of this year was a full analysis of how that has changed in total, how our tonnage has changed as well as cost per unit to 1469 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 collect those tons. I'm looking for diversion rates, and I have the percentage changes in tonnage, but I was looking to give you the answer to the question that you asked.
Well, could we set up a meeting? I don't really -- Madam Chair, we could go on this, but this seems to me to be such an obvious thing that if you have single weekly collections rather than biweekly collections you're going to increase enormously.
And if you're really interested in the recycling program, it would seem to me that you would have moved quickly to get weakly collections, because then it's fixed in everybody's mind just like the trash collection. The idea of collecting trash and recycling in the same day is a great idea. I don't know why we all didn't think of it initially, but it makes it very easy for households to do both at the same time. And they can plan for it each week. I'd like to see us move into it right away because I think 1470 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 it's quite clear that you can't make recycling economically feasible until get it to a certain level, say, about percent is my understanding. 5 Is that your understanding? 6
What percentage of 8 recycling would be needed at the residential 9 level, say, to make it cost-effective. 10
If you mean in equaling 11 the number of tons per year, I'm not sure of that 12 answer right here and I gladly can find that for 13 you. 14 I do have the answer to the previous 15 question you asked about our diversion rate. In 16 the non-pilot areas, 1999, our the diversion rate 17 was 5.7 percent. 18
In the every other week 20 areas. That was a decrease of 4 percent. In the 21 pilot areas, where we have weekly collection, the 22 diversion rate is 8.9 percent. 23
8.9 percent versus 5.7 25 percent. 1471 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
Seems to me to be a vast difference. Would the Streets Department -- you know, there's always been a question as to whether or not the Streets Department seriously supported the recycling program. And in the recycling community outside of the Streets Department, there is a very grave doubt that has been building and building for a long time. Would it be possible to bring together people from the Recycling Advisory Committee, the Solid Wastes Advisory Committee, the Streets Department and the community adherence and sit down and spend a couple of hours talking about these figures without getting involved, you know, at the budgetary hearings so we could get a cross-pollination of ideas and we maybe can put to rest the concerns in the community and get everybody supporting a program? Because there is lots of suspicion. When I believe that when the recycling law was first passed that Philadelphia was the first City in the nation that had a mandatory curbside collection that we led the country in it, and now we tail behind. Wasn't there a study recently that -- 1472 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
-- nationally that indicated that Philadelphia was way down at the lower echelons of the City, and that's very disturbing because we ought to be out in front. And we can make it economically feasible if we give the program enough support. Would you be agreeable to kind of sponsoring the working together to make it possible to bring all the parties together?
Absolutely, Councilman. I think that the advocates for our environment within the Streets Department are fully supportive of that. In fact, recycling was occurring in the City even prior to there being a recycling office or program. The Philadelphia Streets Department was a front runner on recycling materials such as Christmas trees long before it even became a notion or fully supported within our government. So we would be glad to sit and work with any interested parties to try to move ahead with our program here.
Councilman Cohen, your time is up. Are you finished? 1473 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
Thank you, Madam Chair. I want to talk about street repaving, and I know, Commissioner Moy, you knew I was going to bring this one up. I've been here four years, and four years we've been talking about Chelten Avenue and also Seymour Street from Green to Wayne and we've been talking about Mt. Pleasant, and I know that most recently there was some type of problem on Mt. Pleasant Avenue that you responded to. I think there was some buckle or something in the road, and buses and whatnot had to be detoured. Can you give me an update on the status of Chelten, Seymour, Mt. Pleasant? COMMISSIONER MOY: Yes, Councilwoman. On Chelten Avenue, that's a federal aid street, and I believe that's scheduled for this season in terms of construction. I'm sorry that it's been taking so long and I understand the frustration for getting that kind of federal program moving, 1474 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 but that project is scheduled for this construction season.
So what is season meaning? COMMISSIONER MOY: Well, from March through November. And I believe this is late spring or early summer, like maybe June, July in that time frame.
So by the fall, it should be competed. COMMISSIONER MOY: Yes, I would think so. It's in a group of other streets, but that's a logical time frame, yes. Seymour, I'm not certain what the dates are on Seymour. I'd have to ask our people. I'll to get back to you.
Okay. COMMISSIONER MOY: Mt. Pleasant is also a federal aid project which is 2001. I believe they did the repairs to kind to keep it safe, as you say, in the last few weeks. But that is a project that would be scheduled for next season.
So that means next March? 1475 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 COMMISSIONER MOY: Well, it will be next season. I don't know right now whether we can say March. We would try and get it as soon as possible, but it's something that we don't control directly in the City.
So season, I just want to understand. COMMISSIONER MOY: The season is generally as soon as the weather breaks, and they might start March 15th. Or if it's a bad winter, they might go to April 1 or something, but somewhere in that time frame they can start the prep work.
So we're spring-summer of 2000 and spring-summer of 2001. COMMISSIONER MOY: That's correct.
So Mt. Pleasant could possibly be started spring of 2001. COMMISSIONER MOY: Yes, and I'll try and keep you informed of the progress on Mt. Pleasant in the interim.
We really need to get more information on Seymour Street. I think when I asked you before, it had to do with some 1476 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 other work that needs to be done. I'm not really sure what the delay was because everything around in about Seymour Street was done, and that street was not done. It's two blocks -- actually, it may be three blocks primarily because some other work had to be done, but there's been no movement. I was just recently in that area and decided to drive down, and it's the same, it's absolutely the same. COMMISSIONER MOY: All right.
In fact, when we first started that, my daughter was in there elementary school. Now in high school, so that's how long it's been a problem. So I really would like to get that information. COMMISSIONER MOY: We'll get you an answer on that.
I want to talk a little bit about special services districts. What is the trash pickup schedule for a special service district?
The districts usually run along the same lines on whatever surrounding community is for trash collection. 1477 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
So they don't get special pickups once a week or, I mean, every day? What does Center City get?
Center City Special Services District has collection once a week?
Oh, the businesses that you collect, okay. So whether you're in a Special Services District or not, trash pickup doesn't matter? I mean, it's still once a week?
That's correct. Say for the portions of the City, they have twice-a-week collection. 1478 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
Okay. Because people are under the impression that with the Special Service District you get additional trash collection, and that evidently is not true; that's what you're saying?
Okay. Also, what about additional trash cans in a Special Service District?
We work with the Special Services District to address their needs and concerns. If they're concerned with regard to the number of cans we spoke with them to survey the district. In the commercial areas, we supply the cans and we'll service them. In some of the districts as well they work with us -- I shouldn't say some of them; all of them. Many of the cans they will empty as they clean their corridors and replace liners.
If they're cleaning every day and emptying the can, then that means there's bags of trash along commercial corridors all week if you only pick up once a week. 1479 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
Yes. We service cans on multiple days of the week, but we only collect trash on normal trash collection day.
Germantown and Chelten is every day? Germantown Special Services District.
Every day. And in fact, on a couple days it may be twice a day because it gets so much -- there's a lot of abuse there. By abuse, I mean businesses are putting out their trash as well because they know that we come to collect the can and they know that we do it overnight so when close up at night you'll find non-trash can trash out at the corners with the trash can. You could find cardboard boxes and bags and many others matters and debris.
Okay. You know that I was a part of putting together the Germantown Special Services District.
There seems like there's trash receptacle -- trash can issue has been one that's been ongoing. I think they right now need additional cans between Germantown and Wayne on Chelten, so that's 100 up to 300 block of Chelten Avenue. You know, other groups up there are really working hard to help keep that area clean, but it's going to take a while. I mean, after all, in the Center City budget was great and our money is not even a drop in the bucket compared to what Center City has for their district. So we have people such as the Y and other groups of people that are helping out to try and impact the cleanliness of that district.
I think in that block, too, there may be some food vendors as well. So we will work with them to get the cans that they are supposed to have as well as we will survey for the cans that we should be putting out and we'll take care of that.
Can I ask one more question? 1481 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
Basically, it's about whose responsibility is it for park lighting, like the various parks in the area? Who puts up their lights?
I'm Joe Doyle, City Street Lighting Engineer. It varies. The parks are owned by numerous different City agencies. The lights within those parks are sometimes owned by that agency or they overlap with two agencies. The Streets Department itself maintains some lighting in some parks. There's no clear simple answer to your question. Specifically, we know where our lights are on specific parts. If you have a location and you want us to look into it, we'll be glad to do that.
I know we requested you do a survey in one particular park. What I think I'd like to do is get a list of the parks in our area, only because a lot of these people that work in the park, different programs are coming to me to ask me to fund their lighting 1482 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 out of Capital money. And if that's your responsibility, I don't want to use my money to do that.
Well, it's difficult to answer. It may be Recreation, it could be Fairmount Park.
Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilwoman Tasco.
Madam Chair, can I just a follow-up on something the Councilwoman said?
Thank you. Commissioner, a question about something I've noticed occurring more so following up on what the Councilman said. I've noticed at various locations, especially on asphalt-covered 1483 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 streets, that the asphalt is starting to get like wavy. Giving a example of a location, Umbria and Leverington, when you make that right turn from Umbria Street to Leverington, it's like -- it's just incredible. The roadway is just got big waves in it. And I've noticed it now occurring in other locations throughout City. Is that result of tractor-trailer traffic or improper installation of the roadway surface? Are you familiar with this phenomenon I'm talking about where the asphalt just has just like waves in it? If ever negotiated that particular intersection, it is very, very -- you could actually -- if someone is exceeding the speed could actually lose control of their vehicle there. What's causing all that to occur? COMMISSIONER MOY: Well, there's something in asphalt that occurs frequently at bus stops or where you have trucks stopping there were you shoving or shovelling that occurs due to the breaking action. And it occurs more in the summer months as the asphalt gets soft. We'll take a look if you have specific locations.
That particular 1484 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 location is to the point where it's very, very dangerous, but I was just wondering what could be done. Why, and you answered the question. I was more concerned that the surface wasn't being prepared or the subsurface properly, but I could understand on the turn a heavy vehicle, and that's where a lot of our , I believe, Streets Department trucks use that back way out, and that might be contributing to it. Just wondered about that. Thank you. Thank you for the --
Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilwoman Tasco.
In keeping with that line of questioning, is there any evaluation given to the contractors who are successful in getting the bids through the Procurement Department for their quality of street work? If you receive a number of complaints about work that's being done by any one particular contractor or several and they continue to receive these bids, I mean, what coordination is there with the Procurement Department to see that they may not 1485 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 get the bid? COMMISSIONER MOY: There is a rating system that is used. As projects develop, there's a final rating of the contractor's performance. And this contributes to the decisions as to whether a contractor is qualified to bid again. If there's a series of unsatisfactory performances by a contractor, particularly in more than Streets, if we can get a series of departments, we have been able -- it's not easy, let me say this, to disqualify a contractor from bidding. But we have been able in certain situations to disqualify contractors.
Have you ever disqualified a contractor? COMMISSIONER MOY: Have we? Yes.
Based on the poor rating? COMMISSIONER MOY: Yes. Now, as I said, it's not easy because you must get some very, very strong documentation, understandably, to prove that someone is not able to perform the work.
Let me talk to you 1486 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 about this commercial trash pickup in neighborhoods, say, Fifth Street something, Wadsworth. At what point are these merchants required to have their own dump and at what point does the City pick up their trash?
The facilities that we service have to come into the volume and type requires for the materials that we pick up from households. So we pick up businesses to the extents that they can put out the same amount that households put out or the volume that we allow for households and put out similar type materials. Hairdresser shops and even food establishments that can put out the appropriate volume, which is no more than four cans or twelve bags. We allow them to have City collection. In all cases in Philadelphia, we have been lenient from time to time for people who on occasion need to put out a little bit more, not house clean-outs, but just a little bit more because of what may go on in an individual week. For businesses that need extra set out more than that on a regular basis, we ask them to move over to private collection and then they can 1487 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 have the volume that they need to set out collected and they can have the frequency that they need as well, something other than once a week.
I'm going to talk to you, not today, but I want to talk to you about Fifth Street. As you know, we have had increase in a number of wholesale businesses on Fifth Street, and there is a lot of trash that's being generated and I see City trash trucks picking up this trash. Of course, we have moved to curb the increase in the number of wholesale shops on that street because it's really a commercial strip and it's causing us a lot of stress on that street, not only in terms of the traffic volume with the tractor-trailers double parking and with the increase in trash and then lack of the ability of neighbors to purchase in those stores. So I want to talk to you more about that because there has to be some way to determine that they use private dumpsters.
The other question in keeping with that is the pilot sweep cleaning 1488 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 program that's going to start soon, I believe, in March.
At what point do you think that may go citywide. Because now people are picking up on it and they're asking me when -- I know the pilot hasn't started yet, not in my district but maybe some other district, do you see that this kind of cleanup program will be citywide soon?
This is a pilot program to determine whether or not it can really be successful in Philadelphia. It's a partnership program between the City and citizens. The City has installed numerous signs and poles to identify areas where we will be providing weekly mechanical cleaning. We're also providing education and enforcement for our sweep officers. What we're asking citizens to do is to move their car, to be more diligent with their sidewalk sweeping and cleaning, and place the recyclables and trash out on the right days so that we can do better job. Our hope is in the end between our partnership that the neighborhood is cleaner more beautiful, 1489 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 pride is developed. The way the pilot is designed right now based upon the input that we got from City Councilmembers in figuring out where we went to, we have maximized the resources that we have within the Streets Department in terms of mechanical brooms. So if the pilot were to be successful, we would have to evaluate how we would look to doing any expansions.
Councilman Mariano and Councilman Nutter and I constantly get complaints about driveways and neighbors who want to repair driveways, but we also know that a number of the driveways are used for trash public. Now, have you ever thought about -- has there been any discussion held around addressing the deterioration of the driveways?
The driveways are private property and we're there at the consent of the private property owners. These driveways are used by any number of vehicles, whether it be cars, oil delivery trucks, as well as trash trucks. Whenever there is a concern by the citizens that the trucks are doing damage to the driveways, we have asked our Highways Department to investigate 1490 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 it analyze it. If there's a real issue or sometimes even if there's not a real issue, we will vacate collects in the rear. Quite honestly, if I were to just look at the sanitation collection process, it's faster and safer for us to collect in the rear. However, as a system on a whole, it may be something that we have to look at to determine whether or not in future we should continue to do that if the driveways -- and many of these driveways are 40 to 50 years old at this point -- if there's some concern that there may be deterioration to the those driveways because of trucks or other vehicles that travel on them.
It's more of a request as opposed to a question. The other day we had the Police Department in, and we get a lot of complaints about tractor-trailers, large tonnage trucks parking on residential streets and also school buses that are being parked illegally on residential streets. The Police Department will say to us or to the individual making the complaint that there are no-truck-parking signs. Your department will tell us that there is no need for a no-truck-parking sign or no-bus-parking sign 1491 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 because the state law or the code requires that trucks over a certain tonnage should not be parked on residential streets and school buses can only park in the school bus zone. All I'm asking in more than a question is what better coordination you can have with the Police Department to keep them informed of the code so that we can get them to enforce the no-parking in residential areas of tractor-trailers? And I pointed out Stenton Avenue. It's not for you to enforce, it's just that there needs to be a better exchange of information between the Streets Department and the Police Department in terms of what the law requires.
As far as specific locations and the interpretation that we have of the codes, we will convey that information to the Police Department if we know that they're interpreting it wrong or what we think is wrong. A bus, whether it's a school bus or a regular commercial bus, is only allowed to park in a bus zone that's been authorized for them to park. They're not allowed dollar to park in a residential street at somebody's house while 1492 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 they're wait to pick up kids that afternoon or something like that. A truck prohibition, we can post -- a sign is required for a truck prohibition. Again, we can post no truck parking 6 p.m. to 6 a.m. within a hundred feet of a residential location. For to us prohibit parking 24 hours a day requires a specific ordinance for that block. We also receive complaints regarding trailers that are not attached to a tractor, and that may also be a boat trailer which is not attached to a car. They are not vehicles. If they're on the street for more than hours, they 15 are illegal and they're abandoned. Again, we can 16 convey that information specifically to the 17 district if someone lets us know where they're 18 talking about. We normally ask, though, that 19 especially for boats that the complaintee talk to 20 the community relations officer at the district so 21 that you don't have two neighbors going head to 22 head that you'd have a police officer involved in 23 it. But we would be glad to inform the captain or 24 community relations officer of any district.
Well, I think it 1493 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 just should be uniform piece of communications to the Police Department, period, without having us having to call because to let them know what the law is and so they can pass it on to their officers because we are constantly, you know, writing you and complaining to you about these and you'll say, "Well, you don't need a sign. And we say, "Well, the Police Department is saying there's no sign there so they can't enforce the law unless there's a no-truck-parking sign ther or no-bus sign there. It's very frustrating.
We'll convey that information to the Police Department through their chain of command.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Commissioner, you or one of your staff called to our attention a new initiative tire roundup, and I want to seize the moment to 1494 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 register for the record and for your department one area of the City I know Councilwoman Blackwell worked on diligently even while I was a resident of that area, and that is Mantua Avenue from 34th that runs up to 32nd and Spring Garden. Can you tell us if there's been -- my experience was that there was always a disconnect with Conrail. Conrail saying, no, that's the City's property; and the City's saying, no, that's Conrail's problem. So what improvement, if any, has happened with regards to that area of Mantua Avenue? Because that was a heavy tire-dumping area and the residents there, of course, were outraged. COMMISSIONER MOY: I believe that Drexel also took an effort in cooperation with Conrail and we helped with the cleanup there with Drexel along that same strip, if I'm not mistaken. I believe it may be Conrail's property, a good deal of it is. But it usually ends up as a partnership between the community and Conrail and ourselves.
Okay. Then so that strip will be added to this tire roundup 1495 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 initiative?
I may have not been clear about the tire roundup program. Citizens can cut the tires from any illegal dumping location. We don't tell them where to go. However, let's say a boy scout troop or block captains in the Mantua area want to participate in the cleanup, they can go to Mantua Avenue clean it up, bring us the tires and then we'll give them the money for it.
Brochures or whatever exist on that? Is it so new that you don't have printed material yet?
Okay. Could you please forward to the Chair so that Members of Council can get that?
Yes, the material will be ready for this year -- and we do announce it to the Councilmembers every year when we have the program. They probably will be ready in May.
Thank you very 1496 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 much. Thank you, Madam Chair.
You're welcome. The Chair recognizes Councilman Nutter.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Commissioner, let me run through a couple of things rapidly so we put you out of your misery. Commissioner can you coordinate with the Commissioner of L&I, who I know L&I will be coming up shortly. I have received over the years conflicting information about who is responsible for enforcement as it relates to dumpsters. There seems to be some level of cross-jurisdiction between Streets and L&I. It seems to revolve around whether the dumpster is in the street or whether the dumpster is on the pavement, but it has never been particularly clear who is responsible for what starting with the permitting process of the approvals as well as enforcement depending on what's going on with the particular dumpster. And I don't want to use up my precious few minutes trying to get a response to that. If 1497 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 you could have a coordinated, clear, detailed response, cite chapter and verse in the Philadelphia Code as to who's responsibilities for what that would be helpful. COMMISSIONER MOY: We'll do that.
Let me go back to street lighting for a second. It seems at times exceedingly difficult to get a new street light at a location that did not already have one. I'm not talking about a bulb burned out or defective light on pole. I'm talking about there may be three lights or three poles on a block and for whatever reason the neighbors believe they need more light. At times there's a pole available that doesn't have a light on it, but there seems to be a long arduous process. What is the policy of the Department to increase the number of lights on a street, first with a pole that's available, and secondly, without a pole? COMMISSIONER MOY: Do you want to go ahead?
Councilman, this is Joseph Doyle, Street Lighting Engineer. As a result of the decision that was 1498 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 made last year, some additional funds were provided for adding street lighting in the City. Right now, we do investigate the location and make a determination whether that light is appropriate there or not. And if it is appropriate and kind of practical, we'll install it.
Well, if there was a request for light that was, let's say, feet 12 from an existing street light, that's normally the 13 spacing on there would not really justify having 14 an additional light in that block. 15 One of the elements that we attempt to 16 do is uniformity. 17
That's why we would look at 20 the location and make determination whether it was 21 appropriate, either the specific location that was 22 asked for or somewhere nearby which would be a 23 better design. 24
Okay. Mr. Doyle, I 25 would like to put on the record that over the 1499 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 years from time to time we've had exceeding difficulty getting responses back when letters have been written with regard to street lighting requests. I was recently contacted by a constituent who represents the Umbria Street Neighbors Association. They wrote to us sometime last year. I wrote to the Commissioner last year and have not received, to this day, a response with regard to the request for a street light that would light up some steps in the Umbria Street area. I'd be glad to give you a copy. These are the Fountain Street steps. The Umbria Street Neighbors Association, it's a longstanding request. Recently Susan Syrnick (ph) on behalf of the Umbria Street Neighbors Association wrote to me asking what the response was. To the best of your knowledge and records, we've never received a response to that particular request. I'll give you a copy of those documents. I'd like to talk about traffic signalization and signs. Commissioner, can you give me a current status on the City's efforts to coordinate with Lower Merion Township and PennDOT to change the timing of the lights at the Green 1500 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 Lane Bridge and the Schuylkill Expressway? COMMISSIONER MOY: Charlie Trainor's on his way up here.
Councilman, regarding the PennDOT and Lower Merion Townships changing of the timing at Belmont Avenue and the Schuylkill Expressway, I have no knowledge as to where they're at on that. I believe they're waiting for a PennDOT contract to come through. They need to change the control box to accept a third program, which it only has two now. That's the best I can give on that. We can find out where it's at, where their project is.
Well, I'd appreciate an update. I mean is this a money issue? Is this a contracting issue? Why is this taking so long?
Councilman, it's a -- it could be a combination of them both. From what I understand, this is not just the intersection of Belmont and the expressway that they're looking at, they're looking at the full Belmont Avenue within Lower Merion Township to upgrade their traffic signals. And the last word I heard was 1501 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 that was where they were going to attach it to.
Have we offered to provide any additional support or funding to help assist in this particular project?
Councilman, no, because this is totally outside the City of Philadelphia. We would not be --
Well, what is the nature of our agreement with Lower Merion Township as it relates to traffic signalization on City Avenue? Don't we have an agreement with them either for operating or maintenance costs or the hard costs of signals on City Avenue?
The traffic signals along City Avenue from the intersection of Presidential Boulevard West are a shared responsibility as far as Pennsylvania Department of Transportation is concerned. We have taken the responsibility to operate and maintain the traffic signals along City Avenue from Presidential West while the Township pays the power for those traffic signals.
So if a signal goes out on City Avenue, whose responsibility is it to fix it? 1502 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
They're an actual border street, they're halfway in the City and halfway out of the City. The traffic signal on City Avenue --
Well, if I stand at the intersection of City and Bryn Mawr in front of what used to be the Van Sciver or the Firestone Store, aren't I, in fact, in Lower Merion Township and isn't the signal that's on that corner, in fact, in Lower Merion Township?
And don't we fix it if there's something wrong with it?
So what is the difference between that signal and one on the Green Lane Bridge if you are standing on the other sides of the street, aren't you in fact in Lower Merion Township?
The signals on City 1503 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 Avenue are shared -- City Avenue is a border street.
The border of the City and the Township is the center of the street.
Don't we border right over there at Green Lane and Main, one side of the street ours and one side of the street is theirs?
Green Lane and Belmont is totally within the township. I was going to refer to the City Avenue and Schuylkill Expressway off-ramp. That signal there, the signal west of Presidential Boulevard --
That signal is totally within the township and it is their signal, it is not our signal.
I understand that. But the problems created by their signal clearly impact tremendously Philadelphians. Our own 1504 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 traffic study which we paid for told us that. So in the City, out of the City, border street, non-border street, in the reality of what happens out there, there is not that much difference between the signal at Belmont and the Schuylkill Expressway location and Green Lane and Main versus City and Bryn Mawr in the City or out of the City. We are still ultimately talking probably about 50 to 100 feet, right?
No, Councilman, you're talking a further distance than that and you're also talking about at Belmont Avenue -- or Green Lane, you're talking about two distinct specific intersections, whereas on City Avenue you are talking about one intersection where you have corners of that intersection and that signalization separate.
But Mr. Trainor, notwithstanding this discussion which could go on forever, you clearly understand that I am making the point that all of these areas are border areas. We share a border with Lower Merion Township. We have various agreements with them about signalization. And the fact that this 1505 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 particular location is solely within the jurisdiction and boundaries of Lower Merion Township does not negate any level of concern or responsibility on behalf of the citizens of the City of Philadelphia to get resolution to that particular problem. You wouldn't disagree with that, would you?
I will not disagree with that, sir, but the only thing we can do is what we have been doing in the past, which is to ask PennDOT and Lower Merion to move this along.
I'd like to get a specific answer to what the problem is. And if it is in fact a funding problem, I'd like to know the answer to that particular question; and then I'd like to know whose funding problem it is; and then like to know if funding was made available, how soon can the signalization change be made.
Thank you. What's the status of the installation of various stop signs and traffic signals at intersections in Philadelphia? These are all in 1506 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 Philadelphia, I can assure you. The various stop signs and traffic signals that have approved by ordinance of this City Council and signed by the various mayors of Philadelphia? What's the installation on those?
With the stop signs, the installation is within the next month. The traffic signals, we have had a contract that has been let and there will be installers as a part of that contract.
So all of the stop sign and traffic signal bills that were passed by this Council and signed by the Mayor are all being taken care of?
The stop signs should be installed by the end of the month, and I cannot give you a specific date on the signals, but the signals were a part of a contract that has been let, we have received bids on it. We have not -- we are in the process of awarding that contract and we have not started it. 1507 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
Thank you. Commissioner, what is the Department doing to comply with Section 5-500d of the City Charter to institute and conduct an educational and public information program for the purpose of promoting the safety and unimpeded movement of vehicular and pedestrian traffic? COMMISSIONER MOY: There is a program, Councilman, that we've worked with the Mayor's Office in terms of streets and pedestrians, and I'd have to check and get you a better report on the specifics. Is there something specific that you have in mind?
I'd just like to know what the Department is doing to be in compliance with the City Charter in that particular section. If you have materials, I'd like to see them. If they are promoted in different places, I'd like to know what the activity is. If there's an educational program, I'd like to see what that is. COMMISSIONER MOY: We'll check and get back to you.
The last question, 1508 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 Commissioner, is there's been a lot of discussion about retaining walls. Again, this question has been asked. I would like as much detail as possible, both in written form as well as in a map form, of a listing of every known retaining wall in the City of Philadelphia broken out by Councilmanic District. I'd like to know what information the department has compiled over the years with regard to complaints about those retaining walls, either any that have already been deemed dangerous or been condemned by the Board of Health or any other reports that you have about dangerous or damaged conditions of the retaining walls throughout the City. I'd like the department's estimate on what it would cost to fix those retaining walls and any other information you have with regard to driveways or blocked or damaged alleys in the same information, in format as the retaining wall information. COMMISSIONER MOY: We're preparing something along those lines, Councilman.
Great. Thank you very much. Thank you, Madam Chair. 1509 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilman Cohen.
Just a few follow-ups. On paving the streets, what's the situation on Ogontz Avenue between Chew and Cheltenham where only the center areas were paved and the sides were not? Which makes traffic on Ogontz always extremely heavy because cars can only go in the paved areas. COMMISSIONER MOY: I believe that is a federal aid project, and I'd have to check on the specific status as to when and get back to you on that, Councilman.
Promptly. Thank you. Second, on the street signs, I'm coming back to the question of the signs on the corners of the street. You mentioned that in the Capital budget there is an appropriation for materials. How much is that appropriation and how many signs will that produce? COMMISSIONER MOY: I believe it's 1510 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 250,000.
Councilman, the appropriation in the Capital budget, I believe, is for $100,000.
Why? COMMISSIONER MOY: That was not our decision, Councilman.
Whose decision was it? 1511 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 COMMISSIONER MOY: We made a request to the Planning Commission of our budget, and the final outcome is $100,000.
What was it that the Streets Department requested of the Planning Commission? COMMISSIONER MOY: For this item it was $250,000.
Could you check that? Because I don't want to be dealing with them on a misnomer. How many signs did we bring budgeting for? 1500? It sounds to me like it would be about 4,000 on the 250,000.
$50 to $100 depending on whether we have to put a pole in. So there's two sets of signs, so it's $100 an intersection.
For each blank. We put signs up at mid-block intersections, four signs up 1512 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 at hundred change intersections.
Where the address range changes we four signs up, two signs designating each street.
What portion of the Streets Department deals with that? Is there a separate unit that has the responsibility for it?
It is part of the Traffic Engineering Division's responsibility.
Traffic Engineering 1513 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 Division. Is there a sub unit?
The investigation is made by the engineering section which investigate all signs, whether the street name signs are regulatory signs, the signs are made up at our traffic sign shop and are install by the sign installers.
There is a work order issued for each intersection where we are installing signs, yes.
There is a master index, digitized index. I believe that's about 12 months to 18 months old. Prior to that, there was no 1514 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 master index.
The database that we have 6 only has about the last 12 to 18 months' worth of 7 information knit. 8
That is when we started 10 the database. Prior to that, when the work order 11 was finished, it was installed into the file 12 system by location. 13
Well, that looks 17 like maybe some progress, having a master list. 18 Or am I wrong?
Yes, that is what the database to some extent is leading to so that we know when we installed those signs the last time.
And how many signs approximately are in your database now?
That, I do not have any idea. I really can't tell you on that. 1515 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
Do you have any database that could tell you what percentage of the City signs exist in accordance with the formula what you expressed, the two and four system?
Not specifically, no. We only have a gut feeling as to what we're looking at out there, and I believe we're probably down to about 10 percent where we need to either install signs because they are missing or replace signs, maybe another five percent for replacing signs.
No. We have a preventive maintenance program where visiting each intersection approximately twice a year throughout the City, and one of the areas that are being checked is the street name sign, whether it's there, the visibility of it, and the condition of the street name sign. Besides the street name signs, they are also checking out the stop signs, one-way signs, the no-turn-on-red signs, etc.
And the name-of-the-street signs. 1516 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
That is one of the areas they're supposed to be checking out, yes, sir.
So you're saying that somebody from the Streets Department twice a year visit every corner in the City?
Well, can't you ask them to note where there is a failure of the two or four signs?
That is one of what they're supposed to be doing when they're out there, but we can reinforce that issue at our next staff meeting.
With that information, the investigator will write up a work order to replace that particular street-name sign. That work order then is sent to our shop where it is entered into the database. A sign is subsequently made up and then installed.
There's a big gap somewhere. How long has the visitation been going on twice a year. 1517 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
The visitation, the preventive maintenance program started, I believe, really back in 1993. The initial thrust of the preventive maintenance program was for control signs, specifically stop signs and one-way signs. This was the first time that it has been ever been done to the City where we did a preventive maintenance program. It was not until, like, 1995, '96-ish that we felt comfortable with the regulatory signs at the intersections that we are able to expand to start looking at other non-regulatory signs, including the street-name signs.
You know, I'm amazed that it's never -- as far as I can recall, I've never heard about this, and I've been asking every year about these signs and always got met with a total blank, that we don't know about any missing signs and we don't really think there are any we're talking about.
Well, I know I have approximately -- I have over a thousand work orders sitting at our shop right now for street-name signs. 1518 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
To make sure that you meet the two and four combination?
Could I get a list of your work orders? Could you put them together what's being covered?
I believe I can give you a list of our database as to what we've done and also a list of what we still have outstanding.
I would very much appreciate it, because I think maybe we're going get somewhere on that because the Capital budget can be amended. Sometimes it doesn't even need formal amendment if there's a transfer of capital funding or even operating funding, you know, within the category, within the classification. I'd very much appreciate getting that material. I heard your response to Councilman Nutter asking about the traffic signals and the stop signs. Does that mean now that when an ordinance is passed by City Council, it will require an ordinance but that the ordinance will 1519 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 be carried out with respect to the placement of traffic signals and stop signs? COMMISSIONER MOY: I think there was also a conversation or a statement made by Councilman DiCicco which I think made a lot of sense, and that was to convene a meeting so that we could go over our next steps, where we go from here in terms of making both our lives a little easier in terms of complying with State law or if we have to change State law addressing that and finding out just how we can work something out with Council, and we agreed with Councilman DiCicco that that made a lot of sense, to meet and develop a procedure.
Well, what was the procedure used with respect to the ordinances already passed. COMMISSIONER MOY: We've agreed in this case to work with Councilman Nutter on his ordinance. And what I'm suggesting is in the future, you asked for in the future --
Yes. We've been holding up some. I've had about four revolutions at York Road and Champlost because of what 1520 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 appeared to be senseless decisions by your department denying either stop signs or lights in which the people are terribly upset and feel that there's a need for signalization. That's a new large word I learned today. And we've never been able to understand why it's been turned down. You're saying the direction is at least to move in the direction of honoring the ordinances? COMMISSIONER MOY: I said we would do that, certainly, with Councilman Nutter's and then we are going to meet with Councilman DiCicco to address the subsequent --
Just remember, I'm vice-chair of the Streets Committee and would like to be included in those meetings.
Commissioner, when that meeting is scheduled, I'd like you to notify me because I think we would like someone from our technical staff also present. COMMISSIONER MOY: We certainly will, Councilwoman.
Thank you. And whatever information that you're 1521 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 providing to Council as a result of the meetings today, if you would forward them to me, I would make certain that each of the Councilmembers receives a copy. COMMISSIONER MOY: Fine. We will do that.
I'll make it brief, Madam Chair. Commissioner, I'm pleased, but I was aware that the department conducts an audit of facilities that are installed, signs, etc. And that leads me to a question that I think I've asked you to consider before. Can you explain who's responsible for seeing the things that I see on my way to work, my constituency see every day, stop signs knocked down, one-way signs that are not lagged properly or vibrate loose? In the Streets Department if we had a position in each of the highway districts that would be out there inspecting these Streets Department facilities to see the sign that's missing that Councilman Cohen pointed out or to see the damaged sign. I've 1522 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 reported now numerous occasions a sign that was knocked down by a vehicle. A member of Council had to see it and report it. But why can't we have a person in each of the highway districts whose responsibility is to be out in that highway district to observe the conditions that I know you see and I know that your top staff see every day, to be proactive rather than have a member of City Council have to call four days in a row to report a stop sign that's being run over by traffic, laying in the street, or other Streets Department property? I think it makes sense to either assign that additional responsibility to a supervisor of the Highway District or supervisors or create a position that puts a person out there in the field dealing with these issues that are constantly -- that you're being nagged. It would be great for me to call -- and I think you're already on to this. I think it would be great for me to call and someone say to me "Yeah, we know about that and we're on our way out there." I get that answer anyway even if they don't know. Why can't we give that responsibility to see the things that the citizens and visitors of Philadelphia see and 1523 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 take care of them or create a position? COMMISSIONER MOY: I don't disagree with anything you say, Councilman. And we are looking to our highway inspection force that is available, as it's available, to call those kinds of things to our attention. But I would say whereafter everyone else, all the citizens and the Council themselves to help us because there's such a large inventory, which you acknowledge, of street furniture and it's always something on the way down. If you call it to our attention, we try and get it as promptly as we can.
My final concern is something that really needs to be dealt with, and I don't know whether the Streets Department can adopt this type of regulation or you'd need Council. It's in the area of dumpsters. Does a dumpster that is being used by a contractor that's being left to remove construction debris that's placed out on the roadway require a permit or notification of the Streets Department. COMMISSIONER MOY: Yes, I believe it does, Councilman.
It does? 1524 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 COMMISSIONER MOY: Yes.
What I would like to see is that you develop a specification that requires reflective devices on these dumpsters that people that are driving, especially when they're left in area that is not normally a parking area, I see dumpsters, 40 cubic yard dumpsters, left along the curbline with no -- I don't mean to go to the extremes -- battery powered flashing lights or at least reflective tape on those. Is that something that you can require all suppliers of dumpsters within the county of Philadelphia to make sure that these Dumpsters are visible? COMMISSIONER MOY: We'll look at our permitting. It sounds reasonable to require that in the permit, and we will do that.
A contractor just can't call ABC and have a dumpster dumped on the street without a permit? COMMISSIONER MOY: Right.
You're 1525 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 welcome. Are there any other questions from members of the committee? (No further questions.)
At the request of the stenographer, we're going to take a ten-minute break. (Break taken.) - - - (Proceedings resume.)
Committee of the Whole is now back in session. The next department to testify is Public Property. (Public Property witnesses come forward.)
Good afternoon. Kindly identify yourself for the record and proceed with your testimony. COMMISSIONER PEREZ: Good afternoon. My name is Andreas Perez, Commissioner of the Department of Public Property. Council President Verna and Members of the City Council, it's a pleasure to appear before Council today in support 1526 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 of Public Property's budget request for Fiscal Year 2001. With me today are Joseph James, Deputy Commissioner for Communications; John Herzins Deputy Commissioner for Administration, Joan Schlotterbeck, Facilities Management Director; and George Hee, Fiscal Officer; and Chris Zearfoss, Director of Transit Operations and Planning Division. In my testimony I just want to briefly skip through the submitted written document and touch on a few highlights.
The stenographer will get a copy of your testimony so it will be in the record. So if you could just summarize what you've given us, it would be appreciated. COMMISSIONER PEREZ: The Department of Public Property Fiscal 2001 budget request totals $204,462,938 in all funds. An increase of $7,347,120 from your our Fiscal Year 2000 estimated obligations. In the General Fund in Class 100 we're requesting $9,380,423, an increase of $258,160 from Fiscal Year 2000 obligations resulting from 1527 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 the contractual pay raises which are scheduled in the spring. 2-plus million dollars from Fiscal Year obligations resulting from increases in our telecommunications costs, increases to the SEPTA subsidy, both of which have been partially offset by decreases in our space rental expenses. In Class 400 we're requesting $123,000, which is a decrease of $1 million from the Fiscal Year 2000 obligations resulting from the deletion of the City's non-recurring equipment expenditures for the Republican National Convention. We're requesting $16 million in Class 800, which is unchanged from prior year, from Fiscal Year 2000 obligations. 6 million for court departmental operations. In the water fund we're requesting $3,339,572 in Class 200, An increase of 320,000 1528 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 from Fiscal Year 2000. 5 million, which is unchanged from fiscal 2000 obligations. 5 million from Fiscal Year 2000 obligations. Very briefly, we've completed the final phase of the real estate plan where the bulk of our savings has occurred. There are still a few small moves and relocations that will be taken care of during Fiscal Year 2001, and the expenses represent the estimated lease costs and those related costs that are running borne through the leases for those improvements that we anticipate. 3 million since we began this in about Fiscal Year 91-'92 and over the length of the Five-Year Plan, projected into the Five-Year Plan. We have continued the program of 1529 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 improving facility maintenance operations. Y2K problems did push us into converting our computerized maintenance system, so we're beginning the new Fiscal Year, the current Fiscal Year moving into the new Fiscal Year with an improved computerized building maintenance systems database an system, more user-friendly, again, with the intent of continuing the improved maintenance support of our major facilities. With the full collaboration of the Capital Program Office, the department and the CPO were able to acquire the former PECO Energy Philadelphia Operations Center and convert that into an operations building for the Police Department Internal Affairs Bureau. That was largely completed in the main building this year. They're occupying it presently. There are two other aspects to that project which will be completed by CPF with the department's support through the balance of the year and going into the first quarter of the next fiscal year. The contract services program, which we began some years ago, goes forward in another cycle of renewed contract, rebid ,or new proposals 1530 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 submitted in another cycle of support. We estimated that the current package of contracts is saving us a million dollars in the coming fiscal year against prior-year expenses and projections against prior-year expenses. The communications division has, of course, since our last presentation before Council, actually moved ahead with the 800-megahertz program, the replacement of the radio system and related support elements. We are approximately on track to continue that implementation through into the next fiscal year. A number of departments have also been, as a consequence of those smaller moves, been provided with full communication systems conversions, as has been our program since the upgrade of facilities began.
The City net program, which again was gun some years ago through the Department of Public Property, has matured to the point where not only have all the City's agencies mounted their technology seen as a platform, but we've also expanded that to support the Philadelphia Housing Authority, the Philadelphia Parking 1531 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 Authority, and the School District of Philadelphia. The 911 call answering and dispatch infrastructure for police and fire continue to be supported again, as in years past, by the Department of Public Property. And in the most recent couple of years and moving again into the next year continued technology upgrades with the collaboration of police and fire as well as the eventual tie-in to the 800-megahertz system. Franchise agreements, of course, with Council's support, have been renewed for all the areas of the City at this point. The approval was also obtained for the acquisition of Greater Media by Comcast, and we expect the following year to be primarily a transition year because current franchise is still run for about another fiscal year before the new franchises actually take place. We continue estimating revenue from the cable franchises to be in the amount of $8,800,000. The subscriber base for -- the aggregate subscriber base for the franchises is approximately 313,000 accounts. 1532 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 We, again, continue to support special events, activities which have increased in the last couple of years. We are looking forward, of course, to the spin-off activities providing some increase demand, spin-off activities from the Republican National Convention coming to the City. The transit operations and planning division is where historically the SEPTA-related funding, which is funneled through the Department, is contained; and as in years past, I don't comment on the detail other than that what has been provided in the written testimony. However, Mr. Zearfoss and a representative of SEPTA is available for questions, if necessary. And that, in fact, closes my overall testimony, and I'm available for questions. Thank you.
Thank you, Commissioner. Commissioner, can you tell us what the total cost to your department for the Republican National Convention is in FY 2000 and 2001?
Good afternoon, Council President. My name is Joseph James. 1533 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
Deputy Public Property Commissioner. The total cost has not been determined yet, but I can tell that you in our 2000 budget, we have approximately $2 million that was put into budget to cover the costs for equipment, hardware, and supplies as part of the City's commitment to the Republic National Convention, and there is no 12 funding in 2001 for the Republican National Convention.
So you do not anticipate that you're going to need any money in the 2001 budget?
I believe there will probably be some carryover expenses in 2001, but they will probably be absorbed in our Operating Budget. Since majority of the work will be done prior to the convention, we anticipate there won't be a substantial amount of expense to the department.
Thank you. Commissioner Perez, why is the cost of 1534 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 the prison contract maintenance presigning by $1.3 million in Fiscal 2001, and can you also tell us what services are provided under this contract? COMMISSIONER PEREZ: Generally speaking, it's a replica of the triplex contract. Although it's a different vendor where a full package of overall maintenance services are provided except they're provided in the prison environment and specifically in the current Fromhold facility.
What are those services? COMMISSIONER PEREZ: Mechanical support, repair services, general repair services. I believe we don't provide custodial because that's an inmate -- I believe that's an inmate provided activity. But full support of the building, it is a three-quarter million square foot building and it does include a massive food preparation facility that supports the entire prison complex with a capacity of 41,000 meals a day. The details of it, I could ask Mrs. Schlotterbeck to come forward and explain it in a little bit better detail what the general package 1535 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 of services is. The increase that we're looking at is anticipation of, I believe, the combination of a rebid and including some forecasted experiences related to the construction of the new women's facility. So as the women's facility comes on line near the end of our Fiscal Year 2000, we of course have to be ready long before then to take over the building and support it in the same fashion.
Thank you. On of your testimony, you mentioned that you would like to create a master redevelopment plan for the Suburban Station and the adjacent Penn Center concourse area. Will such a master plan require City Council approval? And will the City be providing any operating and/or capital funds in this area? And if so, how much? COMMISSIONER PEREZ: The master plan language is actually referring to SEPTA's master plan for the concourse, which has been evolving over a number of years. Several years ago the concept of combining spaces under one management agency was developed. That is, there are Public 1536 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 Property jurisdictions in the concourse as well as areas that are exclusively SEPTA jurisdictions. Often they butt each other in purely hypothetical boundaries and the ordinary citizen doesn't know the difference from one or the other until they try to make a complaint about something that needs to get fixed. The concept was that the funding that Public Property and perhaps some other City-related agencies may have been spending and may continue to spend in supporting the concourse overall conditions, at least those that are entirely ours, would be combined with SEPTA's resources and the revenue produced or a portion of the revenue produced by the new rental arrangements by private owners and SEPTA throughout the concourse into an organization which would be a replica of the Mall Maintenance Corporation which engages in those activity on the east side underneath the gallery. That was the concept and it's taken years to advance itself. It goes back to a policy consideration for the current administration to decide how we're going to move forward. I don't believe that I've got targeted funds in my budget 1537 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 or in my future-year budget to support that other than what I would ordinarily do through maintenance activity if it ever comes to being transferred to this Concourse Management Corporation or proposed Concourse Management Corporation.
Thank you. Can you tell us why the SEPTA subsidy is being increased by $2.8 million? COMMISSIONER PEREZ: It's being increased to meet the City's required match of the anticipated increase from the State.
The State. COMMISSIONER PEREZ: And, of course, the number is generated from the Finance Department in collaboration with SEPTA.
Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilman Rizzo.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Commissioner, could you state for the record the policy that you have for advertising on the SEPTA shelters, the passenger shelters specifically as it pertains to alcohol and 1538 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 tobacco? I understand you are the final say of what goes on in those shelters. COMMISSIONER PEREZ: It's a concession agreement, it's a ten-year concession agreement. The language is buried in the contract and -- Chris. I'm going to ask Chris Zearfoss to help me with this one. It's been a few years since the contract had been renewed. My recollection is that the Commissioner of Public Property as the implementing agency for the contract has a limited control over the advertising content.
You can as the Commissioner of Public Property reject or suggest rejection of any particular advertising; is that correct? COMMISSIONER PEREZ: I believe that's correct.
How come, then, we accept alcohol and tobacco advertising?
Good afternoon, Councilman. I'm Chris Zearfoss, Director of Transit Operations and Planning. As the Commissioner stated the, shelter 1539 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 program operate pursuant to a concession agreement which is about ten years in length. It will expire in December of 2001. The contract does has a provision where the Commissioner can have an ad removed which was libellous, obscene, offensive -- I forget the other terms of art that are used. That has only been invoked maybe two or three times over the years. The tobacco ads have been removed from the shelters pursuant to larger bans that have been imposed at the national level. The shelters, however, do continue to have ads from time to time for alcoholic beverages.
Again, for the record, tobacco is no longer advertised at all in any of those.
We almost 270 citywide with commercial ads and we have about another 22 in Center City that have public service cultural 23 posters only. 24
The Center City 25 District? 1540 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
So tobacco is -- COMMISSIONER PEREZ: Tobacco is out because of the national ban.
But alcohol is still -- COMMISSIONER PEREZ: Alcohol is still legal and the definitions over my discretion don't include it. However, Chris, Mr. Zearfoss did mention that it's up for rebid in about a fiscal year's time.
Yes, that's correct. COMMISSIONER PEREZ: And the time to close any widows or loops that we feel we've got is actually now as we begin preparing the paperwork for that competition.
Great. Commissioner, my last question. In the budget in the Operating Budget there is a proposed $16 million and it's payments to other funds. Could you explain what $16 million payments to other funds is? COMMISSIONER PEREZ: Well, it's basically the -- excuse me for a moment. I'll ask 1541 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 Rob Dubow to support me on this one, but there are -- (Rob Dubow comes forward). COMMISSIONER PEREZ: That particular pot of money, the million, is really the 7 receipts from the 911 surcharge, and it's always 8 presented in the budget for appropriation 9 authorization. 10
Say that one more 11 time. 12 COMMISSIONER PEREZ: It's the 911 13 surcharge receipts from the 911 surcharge. 14
That's titled 15 payments to other funds? 16 COMMISSIONER PEREZ: I guess that's the way it's categorized, yes.
So you can understand why I question it. COMMISSIONER PEREZ: Yes.
You're welcome. 1542 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 The Chair recognizes Councilman Nutter.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Good afternoon, Commissioner. COMMISSIONER PEREZ: Good afternoon.
Your testimony talks about a redevelopment plan and a multi-phased concourse improvement initiative. I don't get a chance to ride the City Transit Division a lot. Every now and then from time to time, I ride the commuter rail lines as well. And it is clear to me that there is a distinct difference between the areas where the commuter railline comes in and people come up a set of stairs that if you're going to City Hall that lead to the City Hall area versus coming up out of the City Division areas and a whole -- I don't know what the area is called, but generally in the Dilworth Plaza area and then underneath the overhang, if you will. Can you provide us a map of the entire concourse area, the open area and the covered areas of Suburban Station to show, I guess, in different colors who's responsible for cleaning what area? Because in the City Transit 1543 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 Division area under the concourse, it is clearly one of the most disgusting areas of the City. And the fact that it's attached to this building or to the triplex concourse or however you guys characterize it, I mean I am literally afraid at times that you're either going to catch something down there or something's going to catch you. And I really think that it's just not the way you want to start your day getting into the City Hall area. Between the smells, the fluids, the trash, the debris, and all kinds of other stuff that you have to jump around, it's just -- it's not presentable. So if you could show me on a map who's responsible for what and then what the cleaning schedule is and what the maintenance schedule is, I would like to know that. COMMISSIONER PEREZ: That shouldn't be a problem at all.
Thank you. In the same area, your testimony indicates that SEPTA's going to fund the initial $11 million for the $46 million concourse project. Who's paying the other 35? COMMISSIONER PEREZ: I actually don't 1544 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 know the factual answer, but it's SEPTA funds. Whether it's SEPTA receiving State, Federal funds or even other City capital funds directly to their budget, I don't know how that sorts itself out. You'll probably get a much better answer when they're here for their budget presentation.
Well, I'd be more than happy to ask them, but why don't we do this: As Commissioner of the Department of Public Property, and if this is situated within your technical jurisdiction, is raised in your testimony, you could touch base with SEPTA, get a detailed explanation of the source -- COMMISSIONER PEREZ: We'll get you an explanation.
That would be great. Thank you. COMMISSIONER PEREZ: The Planning Commission is also very much involved.
All right. With regard to surplus property, the notices that we get about the availability or the request to determine whether a piece of property is surplus property, the lead time on those notices is not 1545 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 particularly conducive to trying to be responsive. I received a notice sometime last year, for example, a memo dated September 22nd, which was received on September 29th, and required a response by October 8th. Now, I mean, I certainly can't know all of the circumstances -- COMMISSIONER PEREZ: Certainly, that timetable was tight and it's not standard because we do try to do it on a 30-day response basis, and I don't know if there were particular reasons why we accelerated that particular property.
Well, the other issue is, on these lists, how often are they updated or do people check to see what the real status of that particular property is? I get lists from time to time for property that is under a current lease with one of our authorities for an active operating parking lot. COMMISSIONER PEREZ: That -- I know the notice you're referring to. Unfortunately, a recently hired employee was given a task of go put together a list of surplus properties to sell, wasn't given a lot more instruction, and a number of active, in-place, in-use facilities ended up on 1546 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 that list. Of course, it was -- I won't say recalled, but no action was taken.
But you can imagine the confusion, if not the anxiety that results when people find out that the property that they've been using or have under active lease has now ended up on a City surplus property list. COMMISSIONER PEREZ: That's right.
Which once get in computer system from which it can never been extracted, it's never clear whether you're off the list, still on the list, somebody's thinking about you, or there's, you know, the usual conspiracy that goes with any of these things that it's only a matter of time before they get you. COMMISSIONER PEREZ: In this case there was a compound error. I've been around a long time and I require those lists be reviewed by me personally before they get circulated to departments, agencies, and officials. I saw the errors at my first glance, and it got ahead of me. And I apologize to you and I've already apologized to a number of other individuals who were very distressed by that situation. 1547 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
I appreciate that. Let me now focus on an area of particular interest which has to do with your communications side of the house, and specifically cable television. I believe that last year around and about this time, I had asked for a relatively detailed memo and explanation for a step-by-step plain-English explanation of what is needed and what's require and who has to do what with whom and where -- COMMISSIONER PEREZ: Yes.
-- on the establishment of Public Access Television Corporation, which naturally go from an ordinance, articles of incorporation, full establishment of the Public Access Corporation. That's a kind of quick, general overview, but naturally, there are steps and many details between those steps. To the best of my knowledge, I've not received that kind of detailed documentation for what needs to happen to go from start to finish. Can you tell me where things are on that and who's working on it? COMMISSIONER PEREZ: It had been -- the 1548 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 response had been worked on, of course, not only by Mr. James and Mr. Costello from my department, but also the Law Department. My recollection is that the Administration, through the Law Department, was going to provide, you know, the final response to Council. I'm sorry to say I didn't know that that didn't happen. I don't know if it actually didn't happen, but there's no 10 problem going back and readdressing that issue one more time.
Well, I would certainly like to have it. And as I said, it's the kind of thing that, you know, would have kind of stood out in the mail. If it had come on a particular day, I actually would have probably read it a couple times, so I didn't notice it coming in. If we could get an updated copy of that, I would greatly appreciate it. Along with that, were there ever articles of incorporation for the Public Access Corporation drafted and developed back at that time.
May I interrupt for a moment to tell to you to speak directly into the 1549 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 microphone. COMMISSIONER PEREZ: I'm sorry, Councilman.
When you're faced in that direction, your voice goes there and it's -- COMMISSIONER PEREZ: Certainly. I'm going to ask Joe James to respond.
Councilman Nutter, if I could just verify your question, are you're asking about whether articles of incorporation drafted last year when you made request for memo or are you talking about initially? Initially, when the issue the public access was before Council when the franchises were first being established there was a bill and there were articles of incorporation drafted. They did not go to the State and they did not get formulated.
Well, as a part of the earlier information request, I would like a copy of those articles of incorporation attached as attachment exhibit tab whatever you want to call it as a part of that particular package.
Thanks. Now, what is the Department's current estimate on the cost to operate a full-blown public access TV system here in Philadelphia?
I believe last year, it might have been a little bit longer, when we first looked at this issue and this issue was very prominent during cable renewal discussions, we looked at a budget and forecasted a budget anywhere from half a million dollars depending on how minute we would like to operate it, anywhere from a million and a half to 3 million depending on if we went to the full that was in the renewals or in the actual cable documents of nine studios throughout the City with vans and so forth.
And did any -- how did you do this research or information? Who did you talk to to try to figure it out?
I believe much of then information we researched with other cities, Chicago, Boston, Washington D.C., other cities who already have public access and looking at their budget numbers as far as the positions and the salaries that they were paying, the type of 1551 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 equipment and what it would cost.
Have you had any meetings or discussions with the Philadelphia Community Access Coalition?
Would you have some meetings with the Philadelphia Community Access Coalition as a group of people here in Philadelphia who have probably more than any other group of people and probably with the exception of Councilman Cohen, maybe Councilman Ortiz, have spent more time and effort working on this issue than anyone else in the City? You're not adverse to meeting with them, are you?
I don't think the department is adverse to meeting with them. We have been assisting maybe a year or so ago when it was then-Council President Street had meetings with the members of the organization you mentioned. We provided some technical information and sat in on the meeting to answer some of the background questions on the history. And certainly at those discussions, we would be glad to participate in. 1552 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
Okay, let me go back to the earlier question. Notwithstanding that earlier discussion, you will be glad to sit down and meet with that group of people to talk about these particular issues on an expedited basis.
I don't think we're adverse to meeting with that organization. COMMISSIONER PEREZ: We will do that, Councilman.
Could I hear that answer again? COMMISSIONER PEREZ: We will do that.
Would you agree at that meeting to have Councilmembers present, at the meeting?
I don't -- COMMISSIONER PEREZ: I have no 25 objection to doing that. 1553 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
Thank you. Last question, Madam Chair. The general programming on the government access channel, which as we know during the budget hearing process and every Thursday, naturally, for Council sessions, the Department makes arrangements to broadcast these particular sessions. But once a Thursday and for a couple months during the budget hearings is when you have primarily have live broadcasts; is that correct? COMMISSIONER PEREZ: That is correct.
During other time there are various screen displays, or I think your more technical language might be kind of be a scrolling screen and then you have all of the fade-aways. COMMISSIONER PEREZ: Bulletin boards and other kinds of information.
Has there been any discussion within the department to put public 1554 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 access on hold for one second, just the City's general use of that particular channel as, I guess, a medium to communicate with the public in a variety of different fashions? I mean, you have, I mean, the power of television for the government, and I'm not saying the government should do anything inappropriate or try to influence people, I'm not talking about reviewing scripts or trying to get a message through different TV shows, but I mean we have ten operating department, Fairmount Park, and a wide variety of entities, the alphabet soup agencies and the like. Has anyone had any discussions about getting out more information about those entities, maybe having someone interview the Commissioner of Streets or the library person or anybody to talk about in a kind of a more direct person-to-person fashion about what those agencies are and what they do and how to communicate with them and what services they provide and all of that kind of stuff? COMMISSIONER PEREZ: It's occurred, it's occurred rarely from time to time where that kind of a short presentation has been put on. 1555 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 And, of course, those are not necessarily advertised ahead of time. They're used, again, to fill in time between the scrolled information. We can try --
If you're just kind of a surfer -- COMMISSIONER PEREZ: We can try collaborating with the other departments to see what we can come up with.
I mean, other than if you wanted to watch a rebroadcast of a Council session at 7:30 on Thursday or watch it live at 10 o'clock in the morning or see this activity, you're just kind of left to -- if you can surf up to 64, take a chance, you might kind of maybe see something that might possibly be of interest to you? COMMISSIONER PEREZ: We can explore that. The limitations in the past with the other agencies when we've tried to do this in a sort of coordinated, collaborative way has been the time available, the staff with the interest for it, and the eventual cost of producing materials. I would dare say that probably in 1999, if we revisit 1556 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 that, it might be easier and cheaper to do it than when we first tried it almost eight years ago.
Or if there was just a philosophy and perspective. I've never had a cable TV discussion with Mayor Street, but it seems to me that if the philosophy and the perspective of the Administration is "we want to do these things," I couldn't imagine that any Commissioner would show anything short of joy and glee when directed properly to allocate a half hour, 45 minutes to putting on some program for taping that's going to provide good information for citizens of this City. Since the people who are watching are the people who are paying the bill, right? COMMISSIONER PEREZ: Yes.
Okay. So you'll get back to us on that? COMMISSIONER PEREZ: Yes.
Councilman, I think this would be a great avenue also to use. We keep talking about an educational program regarding the recycling issue. Why couldn't we use the avenue of TV? We could talk about any 1557 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 number of things. If people have to go into L&I for a permit, how much it's going to cost; the type of information they will have to provide when they go for their permit. I mean, there are a lot of issues that can be explained to people before they attempt to even come to City Hall or the MSB Building, and I think a lot of cities do that.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Last June the Law and Government committee, of which I'm the Chair, held a meeting on public access and invited the City. We were under the clear impression that your department was coming, and then right toward the very end, we received notice that you were not coming. Was there any reason why your department stayed away from the hearings? You were the most important City department involved in public access. Did you get instructions from the then-mayor not to appear? Was it a decision of your department? 1558 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 I'm not going to embarrass you. COMMISSIONER PEREZ: I'm on the record and I'm trying to recall. I recall the hearing, I recall the issue of the hearing, I just --
I think it was the last public hearing that Council held. The room 8 was packed with adherence of public access. It was by far the largest group that had ever appeared at a Council hearing on behalf of public access. The testimony seemed to me to be directly on point and very important, and the most important people who should have been in the room 14 were not there. COMMISSIONER PEREZ: My recollection is that we were present, but not testifying.
You were what? COMMISSIONER PEREZ: We were present, but not testifying.
Why would that have been? COMMISSIONER PEREZ: I don't recall.
You recollect that you received any instructions from the then-mayor not to participate? 1559 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 COMMISSIONER PEREZ: No, not specifically. I'm sorry.
Well, the reason it's important is we're trying to find out why a law passed by City Council in 1992 is totally unenforced, whether it was stalled by your department, and as you've testified, you've been the Commissioner for many years; or whether it was stalled by somebody else. And that's the reason for the question. Could you give an answer to that? Is your department in favor of public access? COMMISSIONER PEREZ: I don't believe I'm at liberty to take that kind of a broad public policy statement entirely on my own. I can answer your question a bit differently by saying that in my budget submissions, I have not included the expenses estimated to support public access.
Is that your own decision? COMMISSIONER PEREZ: It has been for the past couple of years.
Why. COMMISSIONER PEREZ: Because it hasn't 1560 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 been supported and provided in the past.
I don't understand that. COMMISSIONER PEREZ: Budgets are target figures. When I received my target figure and the things I feel need to be done exceed that number, I've got to eliminate items or reduce expenses where there's discretion to reduce expenses. It ends up being a fruitless endeavor for me to add a million dollars -- I'm just picking a number of right now -- on a budget where I already know that my instruction is to keep it at 1.5 percent lower than the prior years. And so there is that element of the process where, you know, I have other priorities that I can't get in there that I'd rather take care of now than later. And so supporting public access at the expense of what some of those other priorities may be doesn't make any sense to me.
Well -- COMMISSIONER PEREZ: I don't mean that is a policy statement, just as an operations manager with a fixed budget forecast.
Well, didn't the 1561 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 original agreement provide for payment of funds by the cable companies to whom we gave permits? Didn't it include funding for public access? COMMISSIONER PEREZ: The funds that keep being referred to are not available to us as a department to staff and operate and support.
But you were aware of, weren't you -- COMMISSIONER PEREZ: Yes.
And how much funding was that on a yearly basis? COMMISSIONER PEREZ: Let me ask Mr. James. 300,000.
Is that what came from the are 5 percent fee? COMMISSIONER PEREZ: Yes.
And when this -- let me refer to Mr. James a moment. When you refer to making studies as to what the cost would be for public access, when were those studies made?
Councilman, that information was collected over about a year or so, 1562 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 maybe around the time when you're referring to the hearing or maybe a little bit before that. We've been collecting information on the topic for the last two years.
And did you, as a result of those studies, decide that the 5 percent fee was not enough, that it would only generate $300,000 and that therefore you would want to increase that amount coming from the cable companies?
I believe what was in the franchise agreement is for a fixed amount of dollars to come directly from each franchise area to fund public access operating costs as well as a fixed amount of dollars for the capital cost. The operating dollars could be recovered from the revenue collected from the 5 percent franchise fee. So one could argue you could make it as much as you want, you're just deleting those revenues that would go into the General Fund.
You have 5 percent to work with, so 5 percent of whatever gets collected. 1563 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
Five percent is the franchise the City receives from the cable operators. That money goes to the General Fund. You can then dedicate the 300,000 out of that 5 percent or more if that's the decision, but it would all come out of the same source of funds which would be that 5 percent franchise fee.
Now, does the 300,000 figure that Mr. Perez refers to, is that the cumulative amount from all of the companies together at the time we have had the four companies?
Well, as I said, the original documents envisioned nine cable studios with a cable van in each area and studio facilities. 300,000 is not going to cover, I would say, the operating cost for the salaries for the people you need to operate it, let alone the 1564 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 equipment cost and the utility cost for running nine different studios.
Depending on the operation, you could size it down to a smaller scale maybe one studio with limited resources and maybe not as fully staffed as you would want. It's a matter of how you design the studios that's going determine the operation cost.
Well, why wouldn't the City when it negotiated this new contract that it just negotiated, why wouldn't the City have asked for what it considered an adequate amount? Did the City feel rich enough, knew it was going to have this big surplus, therefore, wanted to add the money and didn't want to charge the cable companies more? Wasn't this a perfect time to ask for more funding?
Certainly it was. At the time we went through the cable renewal negotiations with all the cable operators, we basically carried forward the obligations that were originally established from the original 1984 1565 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 franchises, and through that process of negotiations, there was no impetus on our part to increase that amount and there was no direction from Council to increase that amount as we went through the process, so the amount did not get increased as part of those negotiations.
They really got a good deal, didn't they, the cable companies.
Well, it's not really a deal for the cable operators. The cable operators will pay what we determine as what we want to spend on public access. It's coming out of the 5 percent franchise fee. It really doesn't make a difference to them. There's really no hardship to them because all we're doing is using the revenue that gets generated from the franchise fee to fund the public access.
Is there anything in the agreement that would prevent the -- you mean the cable companies really weren't paying anything, they were passing it on to the consumer? COMMISSIONER PEREZ: In the end that's correct. In the end there's a bite out of the City's revenue. 1566 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
The cable companies seem to be rolling in wealth, aren't they? They have tremendous cash flows.
Well, yes, their income is up, but the obligation really it doesn't depend whether or not they are successful or wealthy, it's the obligation that's in there to fund public access. The City has to make a decision whether it wants to do public access and then decide what's the right amount of funds and what's the right amount of operations that the City would feel to be appropriate for that particular activity.
But a good negotiator for the City would have made the cable companies pay something for public access. We're giving them a license to do things, so didn't we have a right to say that out of their profit should come a franchise fee?
Well, as in most cases throughout the nation and through the Cable Act at the federal level, there's really not a lot of leverage municipalities or cities have and in imposing any sort of additional obligations on 1567 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 cable operators for public access, any fees that we collect from them that we use for public access is going to come out of the revenue that they pay us. They're not going to be putting out any money other than the capital costs which is one obligation that we maintain which is directly their are dollars to be spent for the capital construction cost of the studio.
Well, they have, as we mentioned many times before, it's a line obligation in the franchise agreement. There are no monies set aside, there's been no money put in reserve, and there's been no money being expended. They will appropriate those funds when we tell them that we're ready to do public access.
I think the total number for all four franchise areas is around $2 million. Now $2 million dollars is probably not going to build you nine cable studios with vans. So if the City wants to go forward with public access 1568 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 initiative, there's going to have to probably be some refocus on how either there will additional City dollars put in there to build the nine studios or a lesser scaled-down model of what that should look like that is more appropriate to what we have to spend.
Well, I think I would have -- it seems to me as if the City did an extremely poor job of negotiating. I would have to be convinced to the contrary that you somehow negotiated to the maximum ability of the law. But it seems to me that we would not be limited for operational purposes for public access by federal law to a measly sum of $300,000 a year.
Well, not by federal. We negotiated based upon what were the priorities at the time to be negotiated. Public access was not a priority. What we did was maintain an obligation and carry it forward. We did not increase that obligation because this is no public access, there was no public access, and at the time that they were negotiating, there was no 24 immediate impetus on anyone's part to do public access. So we negotiated what was in our best 1569 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 interests for the City, the best things that would be of value to the City. And I think we did a very good job in negotiation. Maybe not to public access point of view, but some of other things that were negotiated, I think we did quite well in comparison to a very competitive market and to an arena where federal regulations or more to the industry's favor as they are to the municipalities. In a lot of cities, public access is funded out of the citizens in addition to the money that they collect.
Mr. James, you have a lot of convincing to do to convince me. It seems to me that what happened was that the Mayor of the City, whoever the mayor was during these periods of time, found this as a good source of separate income for which he decided -- I can say he because there was no female mayor at the time. He decided he just wanted to appropriate that money. And that in the private business world had that been done, it would have been pure theft, the taking of money that had been granted for one purpose was being used for an entirely different purpose despite the existence of a law which 1570 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 required the creation of public access. I'm not holding the department responsible for that, because I don't believe you had anything to do with it. But the franchise fee has been paid each year?
That's years. 13 COMMISSIONER PEREZ: Nearly 15 years. 14
15 years times 15 $300,000 plus interest that that money would have earned if it had just not be tampered. That looks to me like a pretty good kitty of maybe better than $5 million in the Operation Fund which the City has diverted although the money came to it. I question the legality of the City using the money for other purposes because I don't think we're permitted to use a tax that we levied on some private company for one purpose, I don't think we're permitted to use it for another purpose, but we'll let that he go for the time 1571 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 being. Secondly, how about the Capital Fund, that's just never been paid?
It's never been spent, but has it ever been turned over to the City?
No. It's an obligation, and the money would be given by the cable operators when the City was ready to be public access.
So the City in enabling the cable operators in addition to utilize that money in any way they want for any purpose and they've had that also for 15 years?
Well, I don't think we've allowed them to use that money. There is an obligation in there for them to make an expenditure when the City decides to do this activity. If the City does not do the activity, they don't appropriate the money or make the expense. But it is not like there is money that was given to them or money that they held in a reserve just for this activity never to be spent. 1572 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
Mr. James, I think some people in the financial world would say that in effect we gave them a gift of $2.5 million and have permitted them to be using it at a time when they were under a legal obligation, the City had the right to collect that fund. It seems like a strange, strange tale for Philadelphia to want to hide from the ability to notify people because the public access would not be only of great use to the community, but as Councilman Nutter pointed out, but of great use to the City to publicize information about the City, to develop constructive programs on its own behalf because we know so many people don't know things about the government and we often have great difficult reaching them. We spend millions of dollars in various outreach programs, and we could safe a lot of that money or cut down the cost of it and probably be much more effective if we had a public access program. We don't know how to get information about lead problems in the homes to people. We have all kinds of delinquencies in gas and water bills, and the City has no means of getting any information as to why these bills are 1573 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 delinquent. There's so many different needs we have for reaching people, and just to be friendly to cable operators and/or to use a few hundred thousand dollars each year for its other uses, it just doesn't make any sense at all. How long is this -- do we have any right to renegotiate any part of this new contract that we just entered into last year, I think it was? Was it done many years in advance? COMMISSIONER PEREZ: The process was started at different times by each of franchises. I believe Comcast started two years ahead, and we just completed Wade, so they're both renewed. Our options for reopening the contracts, best opinion is going to have to come from the Law Department. My layman's opinion is that we probably don't have any options that are already built in there.
How many years? COMMISSIONER PEREZ: It's a 15-year agreement.
Looks to me like it 1574 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 was a real sweetheart agreement from the point of view of the cable companies. Has there been any discussion between your department and the Mayor with respect to public access? COMMISSIONER PEREZ: The Department of Public Property at this point early in this Administration has not had a policy and plan review session in any aspect of any part of my department's responsibilities. We expect that that will, you know, happen at a not-too-distant date, but the simple answer is no, not yet.
In the new franchise agreement, is there a timetable for building public access facilities?
Yes. There was, as in the original, there were forecasted time frames for meeting those obligations.
Was there any discussion during the negotiations with respect to 1575 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 the building of those facilities?
The only discussions through the negotiates was ensuring that the obligation was carried forward and that all of the language that was in the original was carried into the new agreement, and there was agreement by the cable operators to meet those obligations and they understood as we understood that it depended on certain actions on the City's behalf, and once those action would occur, then the City would be asking the cable operators to expend those funds.
What is the nature of that agreement? What are the cable companies going to pay? There are just two cable companies in the City now? COMMISSIONER PEREZ: Legally it's still four franchises, but yes, there's one corporation that owns three franchises.
And is the payment supposed to be equal amongst all of the companies?
Yes. It's by franchise area, the public access obligation is by franchise area.
So that one company 1576 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 would have to pay three quarters of whatever is paid. What is to be paid? How is that to be determined?
There is a fixed amount. I don't have the actual numbers in front of me, but I can certainly provide you a copy of an appendix that spells out specifically what it's for, but there is money set aside for each one of those obligations as the cost for a studio, the cost for a van, the cost for camera equipment, the purchase of that, that is the capital portion of it. And then each franchise in the original agreement annual renewals call for a two access studios in each of the four franchise areas and the cable operators who own those franchise areas are funding the cost for those facility and then they're funding a fourth of the cost for one central studio which would be centralized between all four franchise areas.
And does the -- I'm talking capital costs now. What is the obligation 1577 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 of the cable companies? Do they have the obligation to provide all of the equipment?
They have the obligation to provide the funds. They don't provide the --
Spelled out in the appendix how much they have to provide for each segment of the funds, the cost for studios, the cost for the van, the cost for the camera equipment.
And the City would be obligated to provide them with a statement of the costs?
That's correct, up to the dollar limit that's in the agreement.
And agreement lists the equipment that the franchise-holders would have to pay for?
It spells out in general terms the type of equipment. It's not saying 1578 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 that's the exact equipment that --
Well, in your judgment, would their capital contributions pay for the full costs of capitalization aspect of the nine studios?
I don't think the amount of money will cover the cost for nine studios. I said that before. There's not enough capital costs in there if you include the cost for bricks and mortar and finding a building and building the building from ground up and then putting in all the equipment. I don't believe there's enough capital cost to --
Well, was the intention originally to cover all the costs?
Well, why isn't there coverage now if it's the same provision?
Well, I think if you look at the cost of money -- and as we said, we rolled forward the obligation. There was no difference made for time value of money, there was no 25 increase in the amount of money, it was just kept 1579 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 the same obligation carried in.
You mean there were the dollar amounts put in the original?
You mean dollar amounts for years ago were put into -- 8
The same dollar amounts 9 that were in there 15 years ago were put in the 10 renewal documents. 11
Well, as I said, there was 14 not an impetus to do public access, there was no 15 clear direction that public access was going to occur, and the only discussions we had was maintaining what was there in case the City at some point in time in the future decides to do it, knowing full well that if it hasn't occurred in 1985, those dollar values are probably not going to cover what's going to be needed. But then again maybe we don't need nine studios in the year 2000.
Do you really think this was right? You know, you say there was no 1580 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 priority, no push. There was all of those years, there's been a push to get public access. The only way we didn't know about it was you shut the door. When I say "you," I mean the Mayor and the people under the Mayor, just shut the door so isn't hear anything. And you could say, well, there was no this was great demand for it. There's great demand for it all this time.
Well, I said as we went through the process, as you recall, we had a public hearing, we came before Council, we gave the terms to Council what was negotiated. There was no change by anyone made to change any of the dollar amounts or numbers or anything, and Council voted on the franchise renewal document as we submitted it.
But this was a Council during those years that was bewildered by the charisma of the Mayor and therefore paid no 21 attention. Between the Mayor and the then-City Council President, there was never discussion or disagreement with anything the two officials agreed on and the public was secluded and laws were just cavalierly disobeyed, like the law 1581 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 against billboards, just paid no attention to it, the law for public access paid no attention to it.
Not to disagree, but I -- through the process, the Public Access Coalition folks made themselves very well known through all of the renewals from Comcast and Greater Media and Wade. They participated in all the community meetings and spoke and went on the record so that their voice was heard throughout entire process. They were not excluded, they were a part of the process. They had an opportunity to voice their opinion and make a record, and the renewals were approved as we negotiated them.
Mm-hmm. It's a shame thought to say, but I think in the history of the City to have a law passed in 1985 providing for public access and here in the year 2000 nothing having been done except that articles of incorporation having sat on then-Mayor Goode's desk for a long time, and then following that, Mayor Rendell's desk a long time, and just being totally ignored even though it had been passed by City Council and directed to take place. Madam President, I have no further 1582 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 questions at this time.
Thank you, Councilman. Are there any other questions of the Public Property Commissioner? (No further questions.)
Fleet Management will testify next. (Fleet Management witnesses come forward.)
Good afternoon, gentlemen. Thank you for your patience. We do have a copy of your testimony which has been given to the stenographer, so if you would just summarize it, we would appreciate it.
Thank you, President Verna and distinguished Members of City Council. My name is Riley P. Harrison, Fleet Manager for the City of Philadelphia. With me today is Robert 1583 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 Fox, Director of Administrative Services, and Nadine Glover who is my Budget Officer. Submitted for the record is my written testimony, and I'd like to now just summarize key points therein. The office of Fleet Management for Fiscal 2001 is requesting $57.6 million for the General Fund, with an additional 6.4 million for the Water Fund, and 8.9 for the Aviation Fund budget request. OFM continues to develop and implement best fleet management practices and policies while maintaining active fleet size of approximately 5920 vehicles at an average availability rate of 92 percent. Furthermore, OFM is meeting or exceeding all vehicle targets for our client departments. The City of Philadelphia has a very diverse fleet in terms of its size, complexity, and function. In fact, if we were rated with the top 100 transportation companies in the United States, we would be rated No. 15. Amongst all municipalities, we are rated No. 4 in size. With an asset value exceeding $238 million, the fleet represents a significant investment of public 1584 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 funds. We are also requesting for Fiscal Year 2001 an additional $18 million for vehicle replacement. Of course, two-thirds of that is directed annually to the purchase of public health and safety equipment to meet their daily needs for their delivery of critical services. OFM has always emphasized preventive maintenance as important of effective fleet management. To maintain high availability and reliability, OFM will continue its preventive maintenance schedules and compliance program. Some of our major accomplishments include implementation of a fleet accounting computer tracking system and a fuel management system, a continuing education program and a high school internship program, expansion of the automotive service excellence master's certification program, and a workplace safety program. In conclusion, the Fleet Management will continue to provide quality service in a fiscally prudent manner and continue to make Philadelphia a world-class model for Fleet 1585 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 Management. Thank you again for the opportunity to appear before you, and I'll be happy to answer any questions you may have.
Thank you, Mr. Harrison. What is the recommended life cycle for police and fire vehicles and what is the City replacement cycle for these vehicles?
There are many opinions relative to life cycle on different types of vehicles. Some municipalities use a three-year life cycle for marked patrol vehicles. Some municipalities use a 40-month life cycle. Some municipalities use a 50-month life cycle. Our position is that we have a flexible replacement cycle in that with good preventive maintenance we have allowed our radio patrol cars to benchmark a five-year life cycle. And on fire apparatus, we've benchmarked front-line service application with an additional 10-year reserve status. On sedans and other vehicles, it depend on the class or the mission of the vehicle, but we prefer in Philadelphia a flexible life cycle policy based on specific missions and based on maintenance 1586 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 required for that equipment.
Thank you. On of your testimony, you indicate that you will be looking into regional facilities that would reduce overhead expenditures and mitigate the need for probable capitol renovation costs at existing facilities that continue to require significant structural maintenance. Does the proposed capital program contain these funds? And if not, why not?
It does, Madam President, contain the start of the funding for infrastructure to our current facilities. We basically maintain the same structure as we've had eight years ago, 17 repair facilities. So we have requested and receive, you know, authorization to start the process of rehabilitation and adding safety facilities, fire alarms and ventilation to those targeted facilities.
With the jump in diesel fuel and gasoline that we have experienced in the last few months, how are you planning at spending the same amounts in Fiscal 1587 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 2001 and you spent in this current year?
Diesel and fuel prices concern us. Last year when I sat before this Council, I made the statement that a gallon of gasoline -- a cup of coffee costs more than a gallon of gasoline. I sit in front of this Council today saying that we are concerned about where these fuel prices are going into Fiscal Year 2001. We have budgeted approximately $4.6 million for gasoline and diesel fuel for Fiscal Year 2001 as oppose to I believe it was 3.4 million for the previous fiscal year. We will in essence have to manage our resources if the fuel prices become uncontrollable in that we would have to shift resources from our other classes to protect our fuel expenditures or our fuel purchases.
Can you give me the status of the transfreight location and when you anticipate that you would be moving at that location?
My understanding on the transfreight site is that this April, there will be Phase I of a movement Seventh and Pattison repair facility as well as the Streets Department 1588 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 operation into that facility at transfreight.
And at our previous public hearing, I think a question was asked, will there be any painting done at that location?
Can you tell me exactly what will be done at that facility, for the record.
For the record, at that facility the same type of repair activities that are being conducted at Seventh and Pattison.
Well, tell us what they're doing at Seventh and Pattison because the record doesn't know what you're doing at Seventh and Pattison.
We do preventive maintenance on light, medium, heavy-duty trucks that includes oil changes, grease jobs, tire 1589 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 changes, washing, preventive maintenance activities. We may do transmission repairs and replacement there or rear ends. We would mount salt spreaders or mount plows, depending on what season it. We would have refueling capability at a site. And that's basically -- basically, it's preventive maintenance and repairs.
We are looking at five days. We're also planning, if it's necessary, when our Streets Department has to slip their mission to a Saturday pickup. We move our operation to support them on Saturdays. We anticipate that it will be an initial five-day, two-shift except for when the Streets Department has to work Saturday because of a Monday holiday.
Approximately 7:00 in the morning until midnight. 1590 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilman Rizzo.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Just I have to comment, and I think Mr. Fox smiled when you were talking about replacement cycle. I had a detective in the Police Department, Mr. Harrison, call and ask me if I could use any of my influence to get him a classic car tag for his police car, his unmarked unit. I say that in jest because I know we've dumped a tremendous amount of money into some 1988 and '87 vintage Plymouth Grand Furies. To me, that's beyond the realm of trying to manage a fleet, and I'm hoping that your budget reflects some money to replace some of those old vehicles. Some of them may already be gone and replaced, but I hope that never put ourselves in a situation again where we have to keep vehicles on the road. You mentioned five years. We're talking decades in this City sometimes that we keep some of our cars. Just spot-checking to see some of the money that we've spent in trying to keep those cars on the road is just horrendous. But I know you were under a 1591 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 situation where you couldn't buy any replacement vehicles to replace some of those older -- especially those police cars, those unmarked police cars. The other point that I'd like to make, I don't think it's any secret that I like cars and have been interested in cars and trucks my entire life, and I can tell you, and I want to say this publicly, before I came to City Council, I was responsible, indirectly responsible, for a fleet of vehicles, a large fleet of vehicles. And I can tell you, looking at the new compactors and our fleet of fire engines, the police cars are in a different world of their own, but I don't think I've seen a more attractive, well-maintained fleet anywhere in the country. When I see a Philadelphia fire truck at a parade, I feel good about it because I don't think I've seen even comparing to some of the volunteer companies out in the suburbs. And I think that reflects the people also that you've got working at Fleet Management. I visit the shops and I'm glad that you're modernizing and enhancing some of the facilities in those shops because your people 1592 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 work, I think, under some of the worse circumstances that you could even describe. I walked into a facility where there was a picnic bench actually in the center of the shop where they had to eat their lunch. You quickly, when I brought that to your attention, corrected that situation. So I just tell you, the attitude, the concern about the fleet of this City is obviously the people that work with you do a great job in keeping this fleet on the road, and I'm proud to be associated with it. It's an excellent fleet. I know you've had your problems. I just kidded with you about the age of some of the equipment, but on -- just what I described, I think you should be very pleased with what's going on, at least from my perspective.
Thank you very much. We have some of the best technician and professional people that I have ever worked with in the last 35 years. Under some of the conditions initially, like you said, Councilman, eight years, A, I've made the statement that this was one of the worst fleets that I have ever seen as far as maintenance repair. And all it took was giving people an 1593 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 opportunity to be trained, challenged, provided the resources even under some of those conditions. And today I'm very proud to look back. Hindsight, I guess, is 20/20, but some of the finest people I ever had to work with has been here in the City of Philadelphia.
It's obvious. So thank you from me. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you. Mr. Harrison, I'd like to read this at the issue of the transfreight site. We were told very emphatically that the hours of operation would be, I believe, from 7 a.m. to 5 p.m. Your testimony today indicates to the contrary. You said that they would be in operation from 7 a.m. till midnight?
That's the present operation for Seventh an Pattison operation.
That will never do. There was an agreement that was reached and it was supposed to be from 7 to 5. Now, if that's been changed, I want to know it.
I will go back to the 1594 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 drawing board and rethink and relook at our operation.
Well, you better rethink about that very soon. Certainly, before they make settlement on that property.
Madam President, if that is the agreement then, that is the agreement that I will adhere to on behalf of the Office of Fleet Management.
I want that in writing. I want that in writing from you, if you don't mind.
Just one major question. Mr. Harrison, can you explain the genesis of the high school internship program that's mentioned in your testimony? It wasn't clear when that started. But I first just really want to commend you for having such a program and it's certainly something that would be most interesting to try to replicate in some of our other departments. It's a tremendous opportunity 1595 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 for a young person. And again, according to your testimony, 67 students have participated in the program, of whom have become employees. It's a 5 great way, I guess, from your perspective to 6 literally train an grow your own talent. 7
Thank you very much, 8 Councilman. The genesis was back in 1992 when I 9 first met with District Council 33 and Local Union 10 1637 where a concept of developing a mentorship 11 program, an internship program. They asked me 12 would I support such a program, and I said 13 absolutely yes because I'm a product of a type of 14 academic program back in the '50s and '60s, which 15 I couldn't be a rocket scientist, I couldn't be, 16 you know, a doctor or lawyer but I was interested 17 in automotive mechanics and it gave me an 18 opportunity to get in on an mentorship program and 19 work as a hands-on intern. And here I am 40 years 20 later a fleet manager for a large city. 21 We worked out the details with the 22 District Council 33 and developed different 23 criteria and skill sets, and the principal high schools that we approached, Edison High School and other these high schools already have an 1596 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 automotive program and it was natural for us to select, you know, candidates that really want to be a part of our profession, mentor them with skilled master auto and master truck technicians, and give these young people an opportunity to see light, as I call it, at the end of the tunnel. No 8 more part-time programs where it's just summer school, summer work and then go back to school. We wanted a program that if they dedicated themselves to our profession, we would encourage and see that they receive a full-time civil service position. And the nice part about it is that we can train them to our standards on compliction and diversity of equipment that you never will find in the private industry. And the skill sets that they are developing, they are become a tremendous resource to us. And these 19 persons that are now full-time civil service 20 employees represent 7 percent of our technical 21 workforce, and that gives us additional resources 22 considering that it's a technician market in the 23 United States. There's approximately 61,000 automotive and truck technicians positions that remain vacant because of the economy and because 1597 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 of the cost it takes to enter our profession. So it's a way for us to draw from Philadelphia's resources in the high schools, give young people an opportunity to have a full-time position in Fleet Management. And I'd like to call upon Christine Derenick who is my personnel officer who has talked to other City agencies as well as to SEPTA as well as to even some other municipalities within Pennsylvania and outside of Pennsylvania. This is the only successful internship program in Philadelphia or in the State.
I was going to ask you, have you had an opportunity to share this information or this program, for instance, with some of the other operating departments for whatever it is they do? Thre may be young people who want to have an opportunity. For instance, I saw L&I Commissioner Ed MacLaughlin come in. There might be some people who want to get into that kind of work, and with the exception of having them maybe going around with Dominic Verdi or Richard to some of their nighttime activities, there might be some good learning experiences for 1598 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 young people in a wide variety of departments in the City. So I'd be interested, not necessarily for the record, but if you could maybe give us a page or two or three on how you put together such a program, what were the details, the meetings, the discussions, and give us some indication of how we might be able to expand this throughout the city government.
Thank you. Lastly, just a technical question. Mr. Harrison, when I call you either early in the morning or very late at night with some emergency, does Fleet Management have any particular role in the removal of abandoned vehicles?
Right now, Fleet Management does play a minor role with supplying records and the car carriers to support the Operation Sunrise project, and Fleet Management has been a part of the task force that the Managing Director has put together in planning the next phase of the abandoned vehicle program, but basically we're limited to the support of the 1599 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 Operation Sunrise in providing input for further task force organization for the citywide abandoned vehicle project.
This will actually be the last thing I say on this topic. Your testimony also indicates on after the internship program that you are apparently aggressively pursuing educational opportunities for current employees to get their automotive service excellence master certification award as well as a bonus I guess they get for getting that master certification. You seem to indicate that, one, you were able to pay for this by redirecting some savings from your budget and the administration cost on this was $37,000?
That's correct, Councilman. In fact, it was a way to encourage our existing automotive and truck staff to seek this master certification which requires a lot of home study and correspondence work and it gave them an opportunity to improve their troubleshooting an diagnostic skills. Therefore, instead of what I call witch-hunting a problem with an electrical system, they were able to 1600 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 quickly identify it and only replace the parts that are needed to be replaced rather than a multitude of parts and try to guess at what the failure is.
So with those savings we were able to redirect it into, not only paying bonuses, but for recertifications purposes to pay us a small pittance there.
Thank you very much of. You're doing excellent job really, that's really, really great, great work and we appreciate your great service to us. Do you work with west Philadelphia High School by chance?
I understand they won awards last year and up this year for some of the work that they do in automotive training which is not well known.
We visited their workshop looked and at some of the vehicles that 1601 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 they were working on and we keep encouraging them to, you know, put student into the internship program. Not that we are a lost art, but we are a proud profession that requires the same skills as someone that, let's say, wants to further themselves in computer technology or any of the other professions.
Thank you, Madam Chair. I want to echo the compliments of Councilman Nutter and Councilwoman Blackwell regarding finding a tangible way to involve young people. I missed the answer to the question on how old this initiative is. How many years old is it?
We started discussions 1992, and it was in 1993 that we came together with the District Council and Local 1637 and we launched it in July of 1993, and it's been a program that we've expanded within our organization, not only to the automotive technical 1602 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 side. But to the body repair side. And we're also looking at other career professions within Fleet Management as well as outside our department or agency.
You've mentioned two schools, Edison and West Philadelphia. Are there others?
Yes, there is, there's Simon Gratz and there's Swenson's Skill Center in West Philadelphia, and Edison.
As you move to prepare the information that Councilman Nutter requested to the Chair, I'd also be very interested in the makeup of that program, the details so that he, I, and others can advocate how those kind of initiatives can be multiplied throughout school system. Thank you.
Councilman Rizzo. 1603 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
Thank you, Madam Chair. I just have one operational question that I let slip by, and this is something that's been on my mind for a lot of years. Are there any major fleets -- I guess I'll ask the question this way: Are there any major fleets that operate their own car wash facility? I know that SEPTA has a bus wash, and I've mentioned this to you before that it is a bit complicated. You can get a police car washed over here, but you can't bring a Recreation Department car to that car wash and you can't go over here because they only do police cars. It's very discouraging to a person that would like to take care of their vehicle that they use to get it washed, and I'm wondering is it a better deal to subcontract like we do or would there some day be some consideration of having a car wash? I'm not talking about elaborate. All these car rental operations have their own right on premise right up here on Market Street. At one of these fueling locations, would a car wash that could provide that type of service, is that feasible or is that something you've ever looked 1604 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 at? And if haven't, I'd appreciate you at least looking at to see.
It's an absolutely great idea, Councilman. In fact, when we were doing some renovations at our public safety facility at Front Street and Hunting Park, we put a drive-through car wash here to support on a limited basis marked patrol vehicles and other small vehicles after they refuel. Unfortunately, the other facilities that we have are so limited in space that we're using what was once 20, 30, 50 years ago a quasi-wash bay as a work bay to, you know, sustain our maintenance repair operation. And I agree with you, there should be a blend of in-house car and truck washing even though it may seem minor in terms of, well, doing a car wash or a truck wash, we get an opportunity to see the vehicle, we get an opportunity to talk to the driver and some get feedback on how the vehicle. It's almost like a pre-, during-, post-trip inspection right there at a car or truck wash. As well as use commercial vendors to supplement that activity.
Councilwoman Miller 1605 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 was just asking me a question, and I'll give her the answer in a second. I'm glad to hear that that's something that may someday may be, but I'm just talking about today. If you could just fix the problem of a City employee -- and I've asked this question year after year after year and it's still, in my opinion, not fixed because I saw some very dirty vehicles right after the storm and I said to the people operating it, "Why don't you go run that thing through the car wash and get the mud off it?" They were down in the park. It was really some rough service. And they said, "They told us we can't get the car washed here. The police cars can get washed, but the Department of Recreation, the Fairmount Park Commission can't get their cars washed at that location. If you could just fix this problem where a City vehicle can get washed at any location, it makes sense that that happen.
We have citywide contracts with many car washes. I will make sure that Recreation, Park, or any department can utilize that car wash facility as well as the Police Department. I didn't know that was 1606 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 happening.
One other comment is that, again, it's a big operation and on occasion, the fueling locations especially for the police cars -- I'll give you an example. The 5th District has been without fuel now four weeks. Those cars have to go to the incinerator, which they weren't welcome, believe it or not, six months ago they couldn't get in there to get fuel. They had to go all the way down to the 39th, leave their district to go to the 39th to get fuel. You would think that any fueling location, especially for a police car, they'd be able to go anywhere to get fuel, but they can't. And the lieutenant mentioned to me at the 5th District that the gas pumps shut down at Domino Lane on the weekend. These are automated systems. They shouldn't ever be shut down. They should work hours a day, 7 20 days a week, because if you have an automated 21 system at the 5th, why is the Domino Lane facility 22 shut down? They have to go now because they can't 23 get fuel all the way down, like I mentioned, to 24 the 39th District. There's apparently an underground tank problem at the 59th, and it's 1607 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 obvious why that isn't operational. But I don't understand why they shut fuel off at the Domino Lane incinerator.
I'll speak to the Streets Department that has the watch person that attends that facility and see if we can get that reopened again as an automated site to support --
I was told that person is a Fleet Management employee. If you could work that out, it would be appreciated.
Okay. The watchman is manned by the Streets Department; and during the working hours, we man the fuel site, so we will speak to the watchman to make sure that the gate is accessible to anyone that wants fuel.
They shut the electricity off to disable them for some reason; I don't know why.
We will cure that problem, Councilman. 1608 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilman Cohen. I would just like to remind my colleagues that we're really behind schedule.
I'll be very brief listening to the Council President and adhering to her direction. First, I wanted to say that I think the work your department does is excellent. I've never failed to get superb service both time quality. Now having said that, let me ask you one question that may be helpful. I sometimes sit in the front of the car, sometimes I sit in the back. Invariably when I sit in the back, I bump into something in the head and I think somebody has struck me but it's that little light that is in the back of our cars and it's always sticking out so that it always hits me and I'm never prepared. Is this any way it can be connected? I put it into the notch each time, and invariably if ever 1609 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 sit in the back it hits. Do you have any thoughts on that?
There is one there. And I carefully put it into the clip after it hits me.
Well, I think it does for the trip. But invariably if I come back later again, it's going to smack me again.
We could look at other alternative lighting. I mean, we're not locked into that what we call the gooseneck light I think is the flexible light, and we retrofit or rework another type of lighting device for you.
Well there's several brands on the market. This particular brand was 1610 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 just something that we were using in police cars, so we just transferred that concept over into, you know, other types of administrative vehicles so this could be some reading capability. It's what we call a map light or little spotlight in the rear seat. But we can look at other alternatives that would maybe protect you or other people from hitting head as they move around in the back seat area.
The last question is I've got this phone from the City, cellular phone. It doesn't fit the attachment in the car. It's too big. Is there any way of getting -- are there other kinds of attachments, or is that the only one that they have that fits a smaller size? But I get this from the Property Department in the City.
Right that is by Public Property. I can contact Public Property for you and they can adjust the holder to the type of phone that you're using. There's probably three or four different styles of cellular phones and they constantly change every six months. So that requires the holders that are in our vehicles to 1611 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 be changed over also. So I'll make a note of it and ensure that your vehicle, again, through Public Property is given its appointment and the holder is changed over to reflect the cell phone that you personally use.
And at the same time, we'll look at the gooseneck lighting and try to come up with a fix.
Your welcome. Are there any other questions from members of the committee? (No further questions.)
The Historical Commission. (Historical witness comes forward.)
Thank you so 1612 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 much for your patience.
I am Richard Tyler, Historic Preservation Officer for the Philadelphia Historical Commission. The proposed budget for Fiscal 2001 requests $260,364, an increase of $5,954 above the current estimated obligation which result from neighborhood contract negotiation. This budget will fund a staff of five, and with this budget and staff, the Commission can reasonably expect to meet the major objectives of creating or designating two historic districts, a concern of many of the members and constituents and five individual buildings as well as expeditious permit review and expeditious handling of the federally mandated historic resource assessments. I'd be pleased to attempt to answer any questions the Councilmembers may have.
Thank you, Madam President. Good afternoon, Mr. Tyler. 1613 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
In my area, particularly in Germantown, there are historical buildings or buildings that have certified historical that have just been there for a long, long, long time and no one is buying the buildings. The ones that I'm talking about specifically are abandoned, but we can't get them demoed. Some of them are falling down and the structures are bad, but we can't seem to get them demoed. Just at the point that they're maybe going to be demolished, someone from your commission steps in and then everything is stopped. What do you plan to do with some of these buildings?
When it comes to demolition, we have several circumstances. The ordinance provides for demolition in the public interest or if the owner can demonstrate financial hardship, that is, that the building is no longer economic. The only way which buildings come down quickly is without going through one of those due processes is if the Department of Licences and 1614 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 Inspections determines that the building is systematically or systemically imminently dangerous, that is, could collapse. Some of the ones involved with demolition may have been with a program funded with Community Development Block Grant funds. In that case, we have to apply federal standards and criteria which, again, have to demonstrate there's no feasible and prudent alternative to the demolition. If you have specifics, I'd be glad to attempt to answer them for you either here or --
We do have specifics. I was actually hoping that -- and I'll give this to you. I won't talk about all of them right now, but there are many -- not many, but there are enough buildings, historical buildings that have been certified historical in Germantown specifically that were blighted 20, 30 years. Every time we moved to get L&I to come out and demolish it, the Historical Commission stepped in and it was stuck and it was still blighted.
I will give you 1615 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 that, and we can set up a meeting to figure out what to do. Some of them are very old mansions abandoned years and years and years.
There have been a few demos taking place following its determination by L&I that they were imminently dangerous.
If they're certified historical, does that mean it cannot be demolished?
No, ma'am, it does not. They can be demolished if it's not economic to rehab the building or to use the building.
Sure. The building can be demolished if it is shown that there is no 18 economic value in the building. Say, the cost to maintain the building would far exceed its value. Also, in the public interest. We haven't had a public interest demolition since 1984 when the ordinance was passed. What I envisioned that to be is, say, with the expansion of the Convention Center, there are one or two historic buildings there, I would hope that the Historic Commissions 1616 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 would approve the demolition in the public interest to facility the development of the Convention Center. Now, some of what's going on in Germantown may involve not the local ordinance and action by the commission as commission, but rather to the use of federal funds. And there we locally, although of much of the federal and state authority has been delegated to us, which I think is a great benefit to the City, if we can conduct these reviews like that and keep those dollars flowing. Some of you have experienced, as President Verna has, in working with us in that way. But we cannot sign off on demolitions under our agreements with the state and federal governments. That may be the root of the problem here. I'm sorry I don't know. I'd be very pleased to meet with you in your office.
Okay, we'll do that. Do you also have the resources if it's one you can't certify for demo, do you have the resources to renovate them?
To renovate the 1617 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 building, to rehab the building?
Okay. We'll just talk about it later, but I did want to bring that to your attention because it's important to us, too.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Earlier when the Streets Department was here, we talked about the Germantown Avenue Bridge over the Wissahickon Creek that five years that bridge has been closed to northbound traffic. Is there any issues that you're involved in or the Historical Commission's involved in that's delaying that project?
Not the Commission itself, Councilman. Just as we have with HUD monies, we also have Federal Highway Administration monies. 1618 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 We assess what is on or eligible for the national register. If there's a federal involvement in a project as there is with that bridge and then what would be the effect of the project on the historic resource following federal guidelines spelled out in their regulations. On the bridge in question, I undertook personally the initial assessment of that bridge, determined because it was in the Chestnut Hill Historic District and boundary of the Fairmount Park Historic District is along the bridge, it is historic. The piers go back to 1786, as I think you're probably aware. The demolition by definition is an adverse effect and that would require a memorandum of agreement, again, part of the whole federal process. Normally they go through in a routine manner. And what would come out of that agreement with the appropriate state and federal agencies is, yes, the bridge cannot be salvaged, and it can't be. We'll record it, that is photograph it to Historic American Engineering records standard, and the design of the new bridge will be compatible with its setting. I have complete confidence in the Department of Streets and its consultants, because 1619 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 done it repeatedly, to produce a high-quality design. This project, in part because of the community and other things, has been held up. As I understand it, we're now at the stage where the Streets Department absent this memorandum, which I recommended seven years ago and drafted one version of it, it's been through several since, until state and federal officials sign that, the City can't even spend any more planning money. And I think you're aware of some of the circumstances holding up the signature of that document. But we made the initially call it's historic, it's in an historic district. Demolition is an adverse effect, but there are always resolutions to that. I'm amazed and at times appalled that this one has been delay the way it has. And I would say it's not on the Historic Preservation people that it's been delayed.
Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilman Cohen. 1620 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
Thank you, Madam Chair. Was the problem of a 17th Street garage ever resolved?
The Commission by vote 6 to 5 approved the owner's application.
By the time of that final vote, had there been a dismissal of one of the members of the Commission?
Had there been a dismissal from the Commission of one of its members by the Mayor?
Prior to the vote, or was it after the vote? 1621 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
After the vote. So -- but I think your victory level is still pretty good, isn't it, your victory percentage? Isn't your victory percentage at the Historic Commissions quite high?
Now, didn't I read 13 in the last couple weeks about a member of the 14 Commission how who has a case before the Commission?
No, the case is not before the Commission, Councilman. If you're referring to the 1600 block of Sansom Street --
Those buildings, although on national register is part of the Rittenhouse District, are not locally designated and are not subject to Historical Commission review. The only way we would see it is if there were federal funds involved and back to the memorandum of agreement 1622 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 we have for local review which I mentioned to Councilwoman Miller, this project has no federal funds in it that I know of. The owner obviously is not going to use the federal tax incentives for rehab, and thus, the National Register listing is meaningless. It's only if there's a federal involvement, it's expressly a federal planning tool, not a regulatory tool. But the Commission's not involved.
Okay, thank you very much. I think the work of the Commission is extremely important.
Because so many people push aside questions of historic concern, and your commission serves constantly to remind people that there are other considerations than just the economic ones. Thank you very much.
Thank you, Mr. Tyler. 1623 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
Are there any other questions from members of the committee? (No further questions.)
Seeing none, I would ask that the Department of Licenses and Inspections please proceed to the witness table. (Licenses and Inspections witnesses come forward.)
Good afternoon, Commissioner. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Good afternoon.
Thank you for your patience waiting. The stenographer does have a copy of your testimony. It will be printed in full. If you would simply summarize your testimony, we would appreciate it. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Surely. Good afternoon, Council President Verna and other distinguished Members of Council. My name is Edward J. McLaughlin, I'm the Commissioner of Department of Licenses and Inspections. Accompanying me today are my Administrative 1624 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 Services Director, Richard Feldgus; my deputies, First Deputy Commissioner Robert Solvibile, David Perry, Dominic Verdi, and Oliver Thornton. We appreciate this opportunity to present our Fiscal Year 2001 operation budget request to City Council and to provide you with information about the department's recent accomplishments and our plans for the upcoming Fiscal Year. The Department of Licenses and Inspections is requesting a total Fiscal Year 2001 budget of $31,652,530, of which $29,591,057 will be provided through the City's General Fund. In our General Fund budget, we have requested a net increase of $470,287 from our Fiscal Year 2000 estimated obligations to provide for negotiated salary increases for our employees. We are requesting full funding for the General Fund of 452 positions for the department. I would like to summarize our presentation by first speaking about our responsibility for life safety. There are -- there were 35 fire deaths reported in Fiscal Year 1999. The National Fire Protection Agency says 1625 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 that the key to effective life safety is to get people out of the buildings. In that regard, L&I in Fiscal Year 1998 and '99 inspected more than 25,000 multiple-family dwellings requiring smoke detectors an fire alarm systems in those properties. We enforce generally across residential and commercial properties the fire code requiring smoke detectors and fire suppression systems in residential and commercial buildings. In the last eight years, we've demolished 10,615 residential and almost 200 commercial buildings. These are sites for potential crime and fire tragedies. They would no 15 longer occur at those -- obviously, they would no 16 longer occur at those particular locations. In the last Fiscal Year we've cleaned and sealed 2100 additional properties. In Fiscal Year 2000, we conducted a vacant property survey, identifying and issuing violations to seal those properties, for owners to close those properties. We have the best Fire Department in the country. L&I's job is to make sure that you are outside on the sidewalk pointing them to where the fire is. We consider ourselves equal partners in celebrating the fact 1626 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 that we have reduced fire deaths to 35. For our management initiatives, I'd just like to say that we have adopted Harvard Business School's management by walking around theory. What I mean by that is we've reorganized the department so that in the concourse where I'm sure that any elected official in this room would agree, we a long way to go in providing friendlier, more efficient service, we have changed the structure so that where before we had three deputy commissioners responsible for what happened in the concourse, now we have one deputy commissioner who is not sitting in the comfort of the Commissioner's cluster on the 11th floor. That Deputy Commissioner David Perry is walking around in the concourse improving services all the time in the concourse. In addition to that, we have taken 85 percent of all field inspections and put them under, again, one deputy commissioner in the one facility where we had those inspectors, and that deputy commissioner is making improvements. And also fine-tuning the way we treat people on the street. We have a keen sense of awareness that 1627 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 that's a big part of the job ahead of us. Finally, I'd like to talk about technology.
We have applied for a productivity loan to automate the department, to fully automate the department. We have a productivity management meeting -- the productivity loan committee meeting scheduled for March 10th, but really what I'd like you to know is that through the efforts of Deputy Commissioner Oliver Thornton, we have laid the groundwork to receive the automation that we're asking for the loan for. What I mean by that is my experience is sometimes people are so focused on this new computer technology, this new program that's going to solve all of their problems, that by the time they get it, their infrastructure is not ready to accept it. Just the opposite in L&I; We are ready to accept technology that will move us into the 21st century. That's all, and we're here to answer your questions.
Thank you. I have a couple questions, but before I ask them, I want to publicly thank you, Commissioner, and the members of your staff for always, always being 1628 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 very responsive to the requests or complaints that my office receives. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Thank you, Councilwoman.
I wish all of the other departments were as responsive as your department is, and I just want you to know that I personally appreciate it. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: I will pass that on.
Mr. McLaughlin, how will the Mayor's blight initiative impact your budget? Will the department be handling all of the City's demolition and clean and seal activity for the City during the Fiscal Year 2001? COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: I'm really not sure because we don't know what the blight program is yet. You know, I do expect that we have the expertise to assist in that and we do want to stay involved in it, but it will depend on how the Mayor defines that program.
Thank you. On of your testimony, when are 1629 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 you planning on submitting to City Council a proposed permitting fee schedule? And why is this not being done as part of the budget cycle?
Councilwoman Verna, I'm Richard Feldgus, Administrative Services Director for the Department of Licenses and Inspections. The permit fee proposal that we will be submitting will be submitted during this term of Council before you recess in June. The reason it's not part of the budget process is that it is the incident of the department to make sure that this is revenue-neutral so that it will not have any impact on the budget. What we're trying to do is equalize our fees. Right now our fee structure favors new construction over rehab construction. What this new fee permit structure will do is equalize that so that there is no favored treatment given to new construction. And that's particularly important right now in our mind and in the department because we do have a lot of rehab construction going on in the City, a lot of older unused office buildings are being turned into housing, and we want to try to encourage and stimulate that by having this new fee structure. 1630 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilwoman Tasco.
Thank you very much. Good afternoon. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Good afternoon.
I just, too, want to say thank you so much for the support your office gives. I just think you're one of the most important departments, if not the most important department in the City. I just wish we could give you more staff because I think part of the problems we might experience is because you just don't have enough staff to follow through on a lot of concerns we have. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Thank you.
And I must say special thanks to Bob Solvibile because you know I work very closely with him in the Logan area and he's extremely responsive, as well as your staff in Permits Department who work with my staff, Marion Johnson, she's my zoning czar, and we want 1631 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 the thank you for your services. I just have a couple questions, not very complicated. I just want to call your attention to something. We did a walk-through in the Logan area, not in the sinking area, but the targeted area above and we noticed that you all had done a very good job of sealing the homes that were vacant, but I notice that the tops of the buildings were not sealed. I think if going to preserve those properties, because we're trying to get developers to come in and rehab those houses, it could save money in the long run because we do get subsidies from the City if they are closed entirely so that we will protect them from the weather. So that's just a comment. You don't have to respond to that, but that's something that I see. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: I would just like to tell you that we have identified the two census tracts just above the Logan triangle.
Mm-hmm. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: We have mapped that area. I'm working with Carl Green at the Philadelphia Housing Authority. We have now a 1632 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 map of that area with all of the publicly owned buildings identified on that map.
Could we get a copy of that? COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Yes, absolutely.
Okay. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: We'll work with you very closely on that because we're at the stage right now where Carl and I were trying to schedule a meeting with Stephanie --
Franklin Suber? COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: No, I'm sorry. Joyce Wilkerson. Joyce Wilkerson to propose to her that this area would be a logical area to, you know, spend some of the blight money.
We're having that ongoing discussion, too, so I'd like to have a copy of your list because it may overlap the list that we have and help us better to identify those that are public and those that are not. 1633 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Absolutely.
Thank you. The other thing is, I have -- one of the concerns we have when we go before Zoning, when individuals go before the Zoning Board that are requesting a variance for a multifamily home, they have been given a license to -- for a multifamily home. I hope I'm asking this question correctly. But then they find out that they have to have a variance in order to convert the home into a multifamily dwelling. They will apply for a license -- I have it backwards, I think.
The way that works, to expedite the license process a number of years ago, the department stopped doing the zoning checks prior to issuing the licenses to make sure that process went faster. We then back-check to do make sure that they have proper zoning. That's why they get told that after they have applied, they brought it to our attention now that the property is going to be a multifamily and if don't conform with the existing zoning, then they have to go to the Zoning Board to get a variance.
That causes us 1634 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 problem in the Zoning Board because we don't want single-family houses being converted to multifamily housing. So I would think if you could check to see if the area is zoned residential or if there's a restriction on multifamily dwellings that you don't issue the license.
One of the things we hope to be able to do with the productivity loan that we've requested is that those two operations will be brought together by the computer so that we will not have to manually check. That will be an electronic check and it won't delay the license process, but it will guarantee that people are not given a multifamily license unless they do have required zoning before get license. So that's something we are working on, Councilwoman. Once have the productivity loan in place and we get out new system in place, we should be able to do that, and we hope that will be within a year.
One of my favorite questions is Fifth Street. As you know, Fifth Street has been a real concern of mine in that we get a number of zoning variances requests for 1635 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 wholesale. The community has definitely stated they wanted that area to remain retail, one for their use and the other because the community can't stand the tractor-trailers, the parking is not adequate and all of that. But we're constantly fighting illegal shops that are set up for wholesale and they'll add retail, but you can't go in and buy retail. They just add it as a way to cut down on any check. I would hope that you all will give us your strong support in trying to keep that corridor a retail corridor as oppose to a wholesale. Every week there's a request before the Zoning Board for a change in the variance to wholesale, and it's not in the interest of the community to do that. It will just destroy the whole character of that neighborhood. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: That's another thing that this software that we hope to buy will do for us. It will allow us to flag certain things. If Councilpeople call us and tell us that they want us to screen something for them, to notify them when something is happening, you know, or to put some other process internally in 1636 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 place, this software will allow us to do it. Right now we can't do that electronically and it's very hard, you know, with the numbers of people who are coming to the counter and the different issue to screen effectively in that way.
Okay. I think that's it. I think that's it. Thank you.
Thank you. Commissioner, I just have one question to ask, if I may. When we ask for a house to be cleaned and sealed, can you give me the reasoning why we just seal the first floor and not the second floor of the building? (Witness comes forward.)
Good afternoon. Identify yourself for the record.
My name is Robert Solvibile, Deputy Commissioner of Licenses and Inspections. A lot of times, Councilwoman, it's a matter of safety. You can't do it from the inside, for whatever reason and they can't do it by ladders and we do not have lift equipment to put the workers in a bucket so they could do it 1637 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 from the outside.
So it's not the regular course that we just do the first and not the second floor?
No, it's a matter of fact. As a matter of fact, my instructions to them are to do second floors all cases because if we're trying to preserve it, it makes no sense if we let the weather in.
So it's where they safely can't do it we'll not seal the second floor.
Because I have seen many properties where they have just sealed the first floor and the second floor is wide open so. . .
A lot of times, Councilwoman, when they open the building, they have a better view of the building inspector and the flooring system is missing and they report it back to us and we attack it from the dangerous building front. And they will seal the first floor to keep people out, though,. 1638 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilman Nutter.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Good afternoon, Commissioner. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Good afternoon, Councilman.
Commissioner from our testimony and in other various documents, you're sharing with us, I believe, the department anticipates the cleaning of 2400 lots this fiscal year and I believe the same number for next year; is that correct? COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Yes, that's correct.
Now, what's involved in the cleaning of these lots, and on average what does it cost to clean a lot in Philadelphia?
The cleaning process itself is fairly straightforward. It's a matter of going in -- we typically go in with our laboring crews and just remove all the debris off the lot, bag it and then take it away in City 1639 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 vehicles. The average cost for that is approximately $1500 per lot to clean up.
Based on the amount of time that our people have to devote and put a crew out there and then fringe benefits and so forth. so that it's a matter of the bags and the vehicles that we have to have the support the employees the fringe benefits and then costing all of that out.
So it's about $1500 for an average-size lot. What's an average-size lot.
Well, an average-size lot, the typical lot is, you know, your North Philadelphia row home that was demolished. It may be a couple of those put together, so you're talking typically anywhere from about 30- to 50- 60-foot dimensions; 30-foot wide, 50-, 60-foot deep.
Does that vary at all from your average rowhouse in West Philadelphia or South Philadelphia, Northwest, Northeast. 1640 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
I mean, nothing particular special about North Philadelphia, is there?
No problem, sir. I see you out the corner of my eye, I saw you jumping up and down. It's okay.
Larger lots where you're talking about the bigger ones, we would go in with machinized equipment frontend loader and have to utilize that.
The number that you are planning to do this fiscal year or next fiscal year, is that more or less or about the same that you've done over the past few fiscal years.
Roughly the same. The mix may be changing slightly towards lots, but the total aggregate number is basically the same.
You're talking 1641 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 about the aggregate of about 4200?
And the mix being between the vacant lots and demolitions?
Now, over the past few years, has the Department ever had occasion to revisit a vacant lot that had been cleaned in a previous fiscal year?
And of the 2400 that you plan to do or will have done at the end of this fiscal year, are you able to determine how many of those had ever been treated before?
30 percent, preproductivity guesstimate, 30 percent. 1642 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
Of the lots that you plan to do this year you had done in the previous year?
In some lots, Councilman -- there's a synagogue, I believe, in Southwest Philadelphia, we work with them yearly to help them clean it out. So there's some things that we work with community groups on an annual basis, you know, to clean the neighborhood so that's counted in the repetition.
Because the weeds still continue to grow, things like that.
Oh, absolutely. That's the nature of weeds. So if you do 30 percent a year are from previous years and that's about 600 times $1500, we're now up in the $900,000 range of repeat activity at these lots; is that a fair estimate?
The answer I gave you for the average cost was for both cleaning an sealing 1643 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 buildings and lots.
The average cost I gave you was for cleaning and sealing buildings and lots.
Lots are much cheaper to clean on average. Lots are about $500.
Okay, fine. Because that was my question. My question was, how much does it cost to clean a lot. I didn't say anything about a building.
So the real number is about 600 or so lots a year from previous years times $500.
Okay. Has there ever been any discussion about how to cut down on repeat visits to the same lot? I mean, it's nothing particularly special that drives the 1644 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 personnel to just want to have to go back to that particular lot, I mean, it's not that they have a unique experience there or they just love that location or something. I mean, why wouldn't we want them going to 600 other lots?
We found, Councilman, that a program that was initiated by the Department several years ago involving the community, community clean and seal, we supply them materials tools on Saturday, and actually we'll do it in the summer, in the spring, in the fall. We assist the community group. We supply the material, they clean it up. This has been very successful because they involve the children of the community and they don't trash it as much as they used to.
So we found that successful in having them work with us to do it, and that has cut it down.
I appreciate that. I'm also, though, trying to figure out how to make sure that we cut down to the greatest extent possible our requirement to revisit places that 1645 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 we've already done work on, whether it's through vegetation management plans, some kind of barrier, whether a fence, bollards, trees or anything else. I mean, the long-term strategy here obviously can't be that we're going to keep going back to these same locations as we continue to demolish 1800, 1900, 2000 buildings which adds to the inventory -- not that we own them, but the areas that we have responsibility for in terms of vacant lots. This is before we even get to blight elimination.
I agree. That's why answered the way did I before, Councilman. I found the most effective way, whether you have fence, Jersey barrier, is community involvement. Somehow the community being involved in the cleaning of the lot and the keeping it clean, otherwise it continues to be just a debris-laiden piece of land.
Gotcha. Now, Commissioner, in Appendix 3 of the five-year plan on there is a line item that says Licenses and Inspections demolitions, and projected for FY '01 is the amount $10,827,743. 1646 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 In FY '02, that number is 0. In FY '03, that number is 0. In FY '04, that number is 0. In FY '05, that number is -- take a guess.
Zero. I get the impression, at least from reading that document, that you're about to go out of the demolition business because your budget is apparently being zeroed out in terms of the five-year plan beyond this year. Council President asked the question with regard to how might blight elimination program affect your department, And I heard your answer. I didn't hear you say anything about that. So I'm trying to understand is there a connection between the blight elimination program and the zeroing out of your demolition budget? Do you have any information on that? COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: I don't have any official information on that except to say that we do expect to be involved in the blight program and the money that we'll be using there would be blight elimination money.
Well, how are you going to deal with emergency demolitions? A 1647 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 building goes up flames, Bob Solvibile is running around at night trying to find out what's going on telling everybody out at the site what to do except the fire marshal and the fire commissioner, and then you've got this piece of hulk building left. He wants to get a contractor during the next morning, do a curbside demolition for emergency purposes because he wants a crane out there 8 o'clock because I'm bugging him to death. How are you going to pay for that? COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: We'll just do it the same way we do it now. The money's going to be someplace in the City. We'd have an emergency type of bid, and then when it came time to pay, we'd go into whatever bucket of money we will be drawing from.
But your earlier answer was it's not cheer to you for the moment why this is the way it in the five-year plan, is that your response? COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: I'm saying that we in our department don't have a real clear picture yet and I imagine because the Mayor hasn't told any of us, you know, what the program is yet. 1648 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
Gotcha. I see you. You know I want to talk to you. (Rob Dubow comes forward.)
Dominic was hiding you there for a while but... Mr. Dubow you, know what Joe Lewis said, right?
I try to find the biggest person in the room and sit behind them.
Can you explain the information in the Five-Year Plan and why the demolition budget has been zeroed out.
It is under the assumption that demolitions will be handled through the blight removal plan. Obviously, the details of that program haven't been sorted out, so it might 1649 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 be that by the time you get to 2002 it will look slightly different from the way it looks in the plan now.
You don't necessarily know the details, but you've made the assumption that the money's going to be somewhere else, and where is that somewhere else? Where did that $10 million go?
The theory was that it would be housed in an authority, maybe the RDA, but we've never really gotten to specific so I'm not sure. I mean, it's not clear how it will actually work in the end, but that was the assumption.
How would we have -- what was your phraseology? How would we house $10 million of General Fund money in an authority, would we transfer it to them?
No, the assumption was they were going to issue debt, and so through the debt, they would have funding through that debt.
So the real housing location would really be over in the Sinking Fund item? 1650 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
We have a draft of the letter and it should be over within a few days.
All right, thank you. Commissioner, why has the encapsulation program, at least from the testimony, expected to drop from 259 properties in FY '99 to 75 properties in '00?
The 259 represents the number of contracts that have been let. Some kind of confusion in that number. We apologize for that. When we're talking about contracts, we could issue multiple contracts on the same building so that the 75 will actually generate more contracts because we'll do one contract for the roof, another contract for the drainage, possibly a third contract to seal up building. So the 259 is the total number of contracts.
So it's not really 259 properties, it's 259 contracts?
And what do those 259 represent as it relates to properties?
About 150 in two years, so we'll be pretty much commensurate with what we're doing. I should point out to you that --
Well, hold on for a second. If the other part of the testimony is 75 properties in FY '00, does that now mean that -- it doesn't really mean 75 properties? Did you mean 75 contracts? COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: No, I mean 75 property.
Well, then you just said that the 99 which is 259 contracts, really represents 150 properties.
Since we started, yes. 1652 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
Okay, all right. What would the department need -- I mean, I'm appreciative for the 75 properties, but, I mean, I think we have a half a million residential structures in the City, you're demolishing 1800 or so a year, and through this program I guess we're saving 75?
The current funding mechanism for that encapsulation program is utilizing money from OHCD.
We have a limited budget. Total for all of our repairs programs in the department is approximately $450,000. That includes our tenant repair program which covers heat and drainage repairs and tenant-occupied building.
Out of that same pot. So what happens is that the monies that we don't use for that program, for tenant repairs, we typically are able to shift over and use for encapsulation. That's been our funding mechanism up to this 1653 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 point.
And that would include a roof, sealing up the building, drainage.
And in one of your service-level documents, it seemed to indicate that average demolition is now running in the $10,000.
Correct. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: That's exactly what the blight program is going to address.
What do you mean by that, Commissioner? 1654 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Well, the encapsulation, I've talked to Joyce Wilkerson about that, the encapsulation is part of what the Mayor is talking about when he's talking about addressing blight. It's not just the demolition, it's not just the clean and seal, it is about encapsulation and further to shorten the process so that people can actually get into those encapsulated houses.
How are they going to do that? COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: I don't know how he plans -- he plans on shortening whatever the -- the process that's in place to allow the City to dispose of a property takes a year or two years.
So they're going to shorten that as a part of the blight elimination program? COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: I have heard that there's people looking at that process, trying to shorten that process. That's an issue that gets brought up at the town meetings that the Mayor is currently holding. 1655 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
I'm glad you mentioned that because I've generally been under the impression that the bulk of blight elimination was primarily geared toward demolition.
Councilman, and also the encapsulation program which started two years ago is meant to stop the spread. The houses that are being demolished, it's too late. We're trying to get a block, to refresh everyone's memory, with one or two vacants in good repair and stop that one vacant from spreading to others. That's the intent of the encapsulation program. Now, sometimes we'll stretch it depending on the block.
It's meant just to do just drainage, roof, and a good seal job with painted wood.
Okay. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: I would just like to mention that met with the Board of Realtors trying to get them. We're working with the three CDCs on a pilot program to increase the number of encapsulations we do. The Board of Realtors, we suggested that if they're having 1656 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 trouble selling a house on a street that maybe they would be agents for us in reporting the house that needs to be encapsulated and then actually participating in trying to sell that particular property.
Okay. Madam Chair, I will not take further advantage than I already have. I have other questions, but I'm way beyond my time.
Thank you. The Chair recognizes Councilman Clarke.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Good afternoon, gentlemen. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Good afternoon, Councilman.
A couple of questions. Let me get to the easy one first. How many vacant properties are currently in the City of Philadelphia, structures? COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: 22,512 smaller properties, residential properties -- I'm sorry -- right. 841 large vacant properties and 730 large nonresidential buildings. 1657 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
How did you get at those numbers? Was it through inspections, visual inspections? COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: (Nods.)
You sent out inspectors on the street, took pictures or just wrote down vacant, vacant, vacant, vacant? COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Inspectors went from block to block throughout the entire City.
Some information has recently come to me based on the Board of Revision of Tax's estimate, and they have numbers upwards of 50,000. Can you explain the disparity in those numbers? Where are the real numbers at? Particularly given the blight removal program that we hopefully will embark upon soon and that will obviously be a substantial change in numbers. Are you familiar with that number at all? COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Yes, I am. I'm not sure what the problem is except to say that our inspectors actually walked block by block with sheets that told them what properties were on that block. I'm kind of at a loss to explain why 1658 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 they came out with that particular number. All I could -- yeah, and we're also testing the numbers just to make sure that we have every expectation. We tested ourselves during the process and our error rate was very good, very understandable. Now we're actually retesting. We're going back out and counting a few selected sites again just to make sure. That was what we're doing as a result of that number coming out. I'm not sure I'm not sure what the base of Board of Revision of Taxes is.
Have talked to them about it? Have you asked them why they have 50,000 and you have 25. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: I take them for their word that that's what they got in the system. That's why we're checking our numbers. I would have more confidence in our numbers. We have people that are used to walking the blocks, are used to identifying buildings.
My question was -- COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: And we are talking about computers where maybe records aren't updated. 1659 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
My question was have you talked to the Board of Revision of Taxes as to how they came to that 50,000 number specifically. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: The answer to that is no, we haven't talked to them, but I don't know what they do about demolitions. In the last ten years -- eight years we demolished more than 10,000 properties, and I don't know if they've been subtracted out of that database or not. They're vacant lots now.
How soon do you anticipate we'll get accurate reading based on what projection is and -- COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: I think you have one.
So you're going to go with your numbers as it relates to the blight removal program? COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Yes.
Okay. Stop-and-goes, these take-out delis with the malt liquor is something I've been on a miniature crusade on recently. And in talking to some state 1660 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 individuals who regulate the Liquor Control Board, it's my understanding that these facilities are required to have separate locations for where they sell malt liquor versus where they sell the other goods like candies and the other things that children may purchase. They said that that is law and that L&I is responsible for enforcing that. Can you give me a sense of why we're not enforcing that and it doesn't appear that that's being done anywhere? (Witness comes forward.)
Dominic Verdi, Deputy Commissioner Councilman. Councilman, we do enforce that issue. We have been working along with the State to help us identify certain businesses. And when we do identify it, we're trying to enforce it the best we can.
Can you give me an example as to where? Because I've never seen a location that has a separate selling point for the malt liquor and a separate location for --
The state regs indicate that you cannot sell malt liquor -- you know, like right now a lot of these places they have these glass cases, glass fronts and they have a little drawer. They're saying that you cannot sell malt liquor and other goods and services such candies and things that kids may purchase out of the same station.
The only thing we enforce is the issue as far as the zoning -- as far as the sale of malt liquor. As far as being sold separately, no, the State may have a regulation but it doesn't fall on us.
No. We had a with LCE, we had a discussion in reference to that one time with LCE and it was somewhat their jurisdiction. We never heard back from them at all.
Their jurisdiction as it relates to policy or the enforcement officer? 1662 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
So the Liquor Control Board is responsible for the operation of the store.
The Liquor Control Enforcement Unit would -- if there's any State regulation involving a liquor establishment which beer and malt liquor comes under, Liquor Control enforcement would have jurisdiction over that issue if it's a State law. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: We don't enforce State laws.
I understand that. What I'm not understanding is that if there's a stop-and-go, take-out deli, whatever you want to call it, that sells malt liquor, you're saying because they sell the malt liquor, you no longer as L&I have any responsibility for any regulations associated with that store?
We have regulations on the licenses business, privilege license, associated licenses and sales licenses, but liquor license itself comes under the enforcement of unit of LCE. 1663 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
No, there's regulations under their liquor license. In some cases, the liquor license -- their regulations under the alcohol or the sale of alcohol, there's certain regulations that do follow that they have to apply to, all liquor establishments do. Those are strictly enforced by Liquor Control Enforcement. What we'll do is look for any City licenses that are involved or any zone-related issues.
Okay. I hate to belabor the point, but the part of store that sells everything else, that's your responsibility.
So that's why I'm asking you. If the entire store is your responsibility, then you have some level of enforcement as to what's sold in that store regardless of what it is. What I'm asking you is if the Liquor Control Board is telling me that you're not supposed to sell malt liquor out of same station that you sell everything else, then 1664 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 you're somehow responsible for enforcing that.
No, they're responsible. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: They're responsible for enforcing it.
Liquor Control Enforcement, if the Liquor Control Board is telling you, yes, we have a regulation that says you can't sell malt liquor in same location as sell other alcoholic beverages, well, that enforcement comes under Liquor Control Enforcement. There's two agencies, LCB is the one that issues the license; LCE is the one who enforces it. LCE would regulate that issue. We have no control over how he sells his merchandise. We just make sure it's licensed.
If you're aware of this particular regulation, your guy comes in and he inspects the store for whatever reason and sees that they're selling this malt liquor in the same station as they're selling everything else and you know this not to be legal, do you then contact the Liquor Control Board and tell them to come down because we have an illegal operation taking place?
When we see irregularities in liquor establishments, we a very good rapport 1665 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 with LCE. We just give them a call or do a fax to them and say we need this to be looked at, and they'll send an agent out. How fast they send the agent is beyond our control.
So basically what I need to do is make sure you have this particular law because it seems like you're not familiar with it.
Thank you. Question with respect to information an technology. A year or so I was actually meeting with Deputy Commissioner Oliver Thornton and they were trying to get a productivity loan, talking to Charley McPherson, and it's my understanding that this was going to afford an opportunity for inspectors on the street to have some sort of process, some sort of a hand-held computerization. First of all, where is that at? And second of all, how would it help enhance ability of these inspectors to do a better job on the street, a more efficient job and to basically service us in the district? Can you give me a sense of where we are with that. 1666 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: We've had a process that we've been going through defining our productivity loan application. We're to the point now where we think we've got that done, and on March the 10th, there is a productivity loan committee meeting, you know, where our application will be discussed. Aside -- and that is to buy the software to automate the department which is something that you kind of have to do before you get the hand-helds to operate. With one exception, Hanson Technologies has offered for a pilot program for us. We're buying five hand-helds to pilot the whole issue of hand-held devices for our inspectors to use on the street. Those five hand-helds are approved by everybody that has to approve them and they're in the purchase process right now. We have the money for them. It's just a matter of getting them through the system, to get the actual hand-helds in our position. Hanson Technologies has volunteered to put the software in place so that we can test, field-test the five hand-helds. The reason that we think that our enforcement people will be better off, that the process will be improved, is 1667 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 because part of what will be in the officer's hand will be the entire code so that if it is part of the Philadelphia Code that there be two points of sale in a stop and go that that information would be there for our inspector.
So right now, your priority is purchasing the systems that will be in the MSB or wherever they are, the general systems, and you'll get the hand-held as we go, or you're going to try this pilot program with the Hanson model you said? COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: I would say that we have many priorities across the surface of our technology efforts. And the hand-held pilot program, we're just not sure that inspectors will benefit. The other part of what would happen is the inspectors have census tracts that they're responsible for. So the inspector would download everything or upload everything into his hand-held device that pertains to those particular census tracts where inspector is going to work, like who has permits, who has violations, that type of thing. So we'll make inspector more efficient. That sounds good, we're just not sure that that's 1668 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 the way that it will eventually be done. That's why we ordered five of those hand-helds and that's why we're calling it a pilot program. That is not holding up our effort to automate the whole rest of the department.
Has that been done in any other municipalities with the hand-held system? I mean, do we have a basis for even attempting to do this? COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Other departments in the City are using hand-held. Other inspectional forces are using hand-helds. The Police Department are using mobile data terminals in their cars. We don't have cars. We're talking about people walking around.
Are they working in the other departments? COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: I think everybody's happy. But if you want Oliver Thornton to come up, he can talk to you about our efforts to look, not just in the City, but all around the country and, in fact, around the world. 1669 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
The reason I'm asking those question, my understanding is this is not something that we invented and this is apparently happening in other locales and you're now telling me, which I didn't know, that we're using it in other departments. Why aren't we using it in L&I since this is one of the departments that probably get more complaints than any other -- I don't know, maybe the Streets Department after the hearings. But this is one of the departments that receives the most complaints out of any department in the City, and I'm wondering why we just don't go ahead. And if you want Mr. Thornton to respond to that, that would be helpful. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Yeah, I'd like Oliver to come up, but there is an issue of the complexity of L&I and, you know, the need for us to have that. It's very complicated, The whole process. And I think maybe I have a lot of experience on the police side and the police enforce the crimes code, one code. L&I enforces the building code, the zoning code, the electrical code, the plumbing code, and I could go on with 1670 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 weights and measures issues and things like that. So that the complexity level is high. That's why we're proceeding more cautiously, doing a pilot program just to see if all of that complexity can load into one of these little things. (Witness comes forward.)
Oliver Thornton, Deputy Commissioner. Councilman, the idea behind the hand-helds is that right now the inspectors go out to locations and they have a limited amount of information with them when they go out. The hand-helds having a sufficient storage would give them the ability to take most information. It goes hand in hand with a another part of the project which is taking all of L&I's property-based information, whether it be permits licenses, or what-have-you, and put that information in one single place, On a database. Then the inspector being able to go out to that location, have that information with him when he or she does that inspection so that would help to facilitate inspection. The other thing is the delay time that it takes to get that information, 1671 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 the results of that inspection back into the system so that any questions can be answered and things that need to be handle in an expeditious manner can be done. So the hand held device has a docking station back at the office which allows them to come back in and that information can be immediately downloaded into the database. Right now system is such that that piece of paper that the inspection is on is given to a clerk who then has to enter that information in. And depending on the time of day that it comes back or the workload of that particular clerk, there could be some delay in the time that it takes to get that information into the system so that things can be acted on immediately if they have to be.
So you get that, you're out in the street, you punch it in, you come back, plug it into the main --
It's a windows-based. Touch it and the information is stored and that result then is held in the computer and can be downloaded immediately into the database. The product that we're using is being used in 100 cities around the world, and the 1672 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 different modules that we intend to purchase will give all of our units the ability to have that information. And in other cities they're using this hand-held device with the same product and that was part of the research. Our proof of concept here is that the five hand-helds the Commissioner spoke about is that we wanted to get into our system, give them to our inspectors and add an ability for them to dial into our network immediately so that in an emergency situation, that information can go over the cellular system and immediately be downloaded into the system so that any emergency situation that arises, we would then have that information.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Good afternoon, gentlemen. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Good afternoon. 1673 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
I believe some of the answers to Councilman Clarke's questions may speak to the question I have here. The last of your testimony, the impact statement, The area of complaints received. If you look at the details you provided for FY 1999 and then what's the original goal for FY 2000 and the estimated goal for FY 2000, upwards of $85,000, that's an 80 percent increase in a couple of years. So can you speak to what is driving the increase? And I'm curious to know what are the top three levels of complaints that you get in that area? And then, finally, what are you doing internally to manage that tremendous amount of complaints from the customer service side within your office?
Well, the increase in complaints has been mostly the area of vacant buildings. That's always been a primary area where the department has received a lot of complaints. The other areas, of course, your tenant complaints that we typically get particularly related to heat problems, drainage problems, things of that nature, the failure of landlords to maintain properties. That's the 1674 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 second area of major concern for the department. Those are areas, quite honestly, we would hope that, one, the blight program will be addressing to some degree when that is announced by the Mayor. But we think that that will go a long way in terms of doing what we have to do. At this point in time, the Department is reactive in terms of those complaint are, in fact, the basic source of how the department functions. We get the complaint, that generates inspection activity. So that a lot of our work -- we rely on the public to keep us informed as to conditions out in the neighborhoods so that our people can be assigned to make inspections so we use that as an integral part. We we say a complaint, it's a request for services, it's a need and so forth. So that we're not necessarily trying to minimize those. What we are trying to do is make sure that our people react to them and we don't have to react to the same compliant over and over again. But, in fact, actually complaints are an integral part of the process that drives the department' operation.
Given the gap 1675 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 between what tenants believe a landlord's responsibilities and what landlords believe their responsibilities are, what, if anything, does the department do to educate landlords who probably already know that they need to be doing the right thing and help tenant understand their role or lack thereof?
The department has a number of publications that we put out. Partners in Housing being the foremost of that which we try to direct to both landlords and tenants to acquaint both of them with the laws and regulations of this City. The City's housing code is a minimum code. It establishes minimum standards, not maximum, optimal; minimum standards so that we do insist that people try to adhere to those codes. We have had stakeholders meetings with the various groups of people. In fact, we just had one last year, a major thing where we tried to get the message out and we brought in a cross-section of the community, both tenants, landlord groups, homeowners associations people, people who are in the real-estate industry, and we have tried to bring those people together and have 1676 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 a dialogue with them and be able to sort of get our message out to all of them to cooperate and to meet the needs, the common needs that exist because it really is not in the interest of an owner to allow his property which is his asset to go downhill. He should be trying to maintain it in a fashion that is going to give him a return on his investment for many years to come, not just in the short term. So we try to get that message out. As I said, we do have regular meetings with stakeholders. We do have a number of publications that we put out. One of the things we talk about that we're trying right now is come up with a computerized version of the license and permit requirements which we would eventually hope to go out on the Internet so that everybody would be aware of all requirements are on a citywide basis. So these are all kinds of things that we've been doing in the department, Councilwoman.
You say publications that you put out. Define what that means. The mailing that your office sends out to constituents for some designated reason? Help me understand how that happens. 1677 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
We generally have those available in our offices. We have made mailings. We have done mailings, for instance, with water bills over the years where we would put stuffers in water bills to let people know what various requirements are of the City Code and different specific requirements. So, yes, we've done that. We publish those, we give the out to community groups. We do meet with community groups on a regular basis and give out those pamphlets and booklets to them. Organizations like TAG, they work closely with us. We give a lot of the publications to them and try to get the word out through them.
That's helpful to know because I come with some experience from the Tax Review Board where you hear over and over how tenants are not properly or appropriately informed about their rights. And, of course, there are three sides to every story. Landlords have their view of instances like that as well. So that testimony is very helpful. Thank you.
Thank you, Councilwoman. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: I would just 1678 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 like to add one thing, Councilwoman. You've heard us talk about the technology improvements that we want to put in place. The first area that we went ahead and actually purchased a module from this Hanson Technologies, that was the complaint intake module so that complaint intake now is automated. When you call to register a complaint, you're given a number. The system automatically assigns a number. Now, that number is not too valuable to you right now, but when we get to the rest of the system, that number will allow our people to tell you where in the system, where in the court system, anyplace in our inspectional system, anyplace where that particular complaint is at that time will be able to update you just by asking you what that number is. That will also solve the problem of addresses, where people are calling up and using one address. We go out on the complaint, we establish the correct address, so now the address that you think in your head and the address that we have in our system are two different addresses. The one thing that does remain the same now is that number that you'd be instructed to call. So, you know, we're hoping to 1679 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 lower the complaints by being more efficient in handling the complaints.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Commissioner MacLaughlin and your entire staff, I want to also compliment the department on the fine work you do. Just based on what I get, how overwhelmed your people must be with the requests for service. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Thank you, Councilman.
I also want to tell you that you run your place, obviously, like a well-run business because I send a letter, I get answer. People are willing to hear, "no" or "we can't help you" or "it's take six months." But at least we have the ability to tell them that and people are reasonable. Again, I want to thank you for making my job as at-large member a lot easier because I'm able to at least give people honest 1680 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 responses. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Thank you, sir.
Now, question that I have is, could you please explain to me, does L&I have role in tree removal? If a constituent or a neighborhood has a dangerous situation, they consider it a dangerous tree, we constantly refer these to the Fairmount Park Commission and the Fairmount Park Commission deals with the situation. But, again, they're stretched pretty thin and trees aren't being removed for years, especially trees that on the curb. Private property trees are a different issue. Could you tell me if a homeowner has a tree that's on private property and it is imminently dangerous that it could fall on another person's property, what action can L&I take? But to go a step further, removing a tree is an expensive proposition today, and a lot of people would love to be able to pick up the phone, call to get this tree removed, but financial they're putting meat and potatoes, hopefully, on the table and just can't afford to deal with tree issue. What can 1681 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 you do to help people that have situations like this, if anything? COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Well, the only type trees that we have are the ones that you have identified, the ones on private property. They're the only trees that L&I is responsible for. And when I say "responsible," I mean that we would issue a violation, you know, to the owner of the property for the tree if we thought it was dangerous. If the tree fits into an imminently dangerous-type situation where it's -- like, we had a situation where a branch had fallen off of the tree, a branch large enough to do significant $20,000 in damage to two cars that were parked and then the balance of the tree was precariously hanging over the bedroom of two children in the house next door. Some $12,000 later, we abated that problem, but that came out of our demolition money. So that's $12,000 less I have to address a dangerous building. You know, so we're kind of in the same position as the person who's watching their money, you know, to say that, you know, what dangerous situation do you -- that was a no-brainer. But for most of the tree complaints 1682 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 that we get, there's not too much that we can do in the way of abatement.
In that particular case $12,000 in City money to make that a safer situation or did you remove the whole tree? I assume you did with $12,000. Did that house get liened? COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Yes, absolutely.
So in most cases if there's a dangerous situation L&I is not in a position to help or you can help and lien the property? Maybe I missed the answer. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Well, if it fits into a life safety type situation, then just like when do in every other circumstances, we go into action.
Just another example, during the recent storm a tree fell, fell across the back door of a person's property and the person was basically locked in their home, they couldn't get out the back door, and for some reason, they couldn't get out the front door. L&I went over and made it safe for them. I think they 1683 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 just cut the branches just so the person could get out of the house. But again, you'll responds to absolutely dangerous situations or life-threatening situations but there's not a routine where you can get involved in -- if a person complains, you'll respond and do what you can do, is that basically it? COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Again, it goes back to the property owner having the primary responsibility. So for us in that situation I talked about, the owner refused to take action. We took him to court and the judge ordered us to, you know, abate that situation.
All right. Well, again, thanks. It's, again, appreciated, all of the work that all your people do. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Thank you for saying that. Thank you.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Good afternoon. 1684 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Good afternoon.
First like to thank you for working with me over the year, and I think I've gotten a lot of cooperation out of L&I. Just wish you had more money for demos and all the other things. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Us, too.
What can we do on City Council to help L&I -- what recommendations can you give us that would -- what to we need to do with the court system to help with the enforcement around troubled building, multifamily dwelling issues? For example, I know that we're getting ready to go to court with the 15th and Allegheny case. When the First Judicial Court System court system comes here I think one day this week or next week or next Monday, I think that's really an important issue to talk to them about because so much -- I know that you go out and you cite and you cite and you cite, but you can't enforce. So we really need to come up with a way to see what we as Councilpeople can do and the residents to 1685 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 get judges to take some of these issues more seriously around enforcement. I know that when I was a part of the Vacant Land and Review Committee or whatever, that special committee that was going on, I talked to Joe Dworsky (ph.) and he said that they were in Harrisburg looking at a way to put those types of buildings in receivership. Do you know whether that research or whatnot is still going on? Do you know if they ever made a final decision to move that way on multifamily dwellings that are troubled? COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: I'm not aware of that particular effort. Although, I have heard the Mayor talk about one of his transition committees looking at that ownership issue, that conveyance issue. So we should be looking forward to hearing some of the solutions to those issues. But as to what Councilpeople could do, it's the old equation of getting the people who are victimized by whatever that problem is to appear in court and make themselves known in court to -- it's the best way I know to influence a judge's decision to let -- all the judge hears is the 1686 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 textbook presentation from L&I, what the rule is and that person has broken the rule. That's kind of dry. And then as far as the defense, it's one-sided.
Mm-hmm. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: And, you know, the issue I think where Council can influence people in the community to get out there and make sure that the judge knows that this is a problem in the community.
All right, because it is an ongoing problem. When you look up the properties and they've got a ton of violations and that's where it stops. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Right.
And before the buildings are falling down on people's heads and all kind of things. Because that's an area, of course, you know that I'm very interested in because we have a trouble building properties in the 8th Councilmanic District. Well, I'm going to start -- I'll question the First Judicial Courts when they come next week regarding that. I wanted to talk a little bit about the 1687 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 encapsulation program. Now, I know you use it to stabilize a particular block if it's maybe one or two properties vacant, but there are several blocks -- more than several. There are lots of blocks that maybe there are four or five properties vacant. However, it's a rowhome or it's a semidetached home and that vacant property is now causing internal damage to the house that it's attached to and someone is living in. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Right.
I see you only have a projected. You're projecting to do just 75, and I know it's probably hundreds of properties in the City that could use encapsulation, particularly on the rows and the semidetached. Can you up the number? Do you think 75's going to be enough? I sure don't. I could probably find 75 right in one part of my district. And that's 75 for the whole City? COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: We're using housing money for this project, and my goal is to spend every last dime and then ask for more money. I believe it's federal money. And Joan Kromer, I think, is amenable to that. For us to show him 1688 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 that we're efficiently using that money and he has been increasing the money up to the amount that we're reporting to you now, but that's about -- that amount is about double than what we historically have had because all we were doing out of that particular fund was the emergency repairs.
Okay. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: And as far as making a decision to do more than one or two houses on a block, that depends on the block.
Right, right. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: That depends on the viability of the block, and we have done that.
All right, very good. One other question, and this is a technical question and I'm not real technical but I'm going to try to ask this question. You know how we can go into the computers to the real estate program and get information? COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Yes.
Will the vacant 1689 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 property data -- will we also be able to access the vacant property data from our computers in our office on the survey that you took last summer?
The answer to your question is that that information is in our L&I database now. The existing Licenses and Inspections database commonly known as LIMS. So if you can access that, you can do that. All of the information that we input from the vacant property survey that we did this past summer was put into that stadium system so that we can actually show all those 22,500 vacant residential buildings, which is why we're confident or somewhat confident that our numbers are correct. We don't know the numbers that have been bandied about are, but our system you can go in, you can identify where vacant properties are, and I believe Council does have access to the LIM system.
Well, I know that we have access. The person in my office that uses this -- I've never used the system, so I'm trying to get this question clear here. He said he went over to L&I and asked them to give him a copy of 1690 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 the abandoned properties in the 8th Councilmanic District and they were not able to do that from that survey.
We should be able to do that. We, in fact, actually even mapped it out geographically from the survey so that there's no 8 reason why we should not be able to give him a map showing all of the locations in your Councilmanic District.
Councilwoman, in answer to your question, we're in the process of cleaning up the data so that it's in a clean and accessible way for the other agencies, offices, in the City to be able to access that data. We're in the process of putting it into something that we'll be able to put it out on the city's Web site at Phila.gov so that you'll be able to go to the Phila.gov site and see that information. I would say in the next few months you should be able to do that. 1691 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
Great. One other question, Madam Chair. You know, Commissioner, I've talked to you, and I know you're very troubled by this, too, about these shoddy contractors that are performing these demolition jobs and really making it a public safety issue because they leave their trash, they leave their debris, they leave buildings half-done. Is there some way that we can permanently get them off your list as a contractor? Because in my district, it's the same ones over and over and over and over again. Why are they still eligible? Why can they even continue to get City contractors? They're just so awful.
We, along with the Philadelphia Police Department, have been monitoring contractors and the bad ones for the last several years. We agree. It's a matter of at some point in time all of our contractors will be taken off the list mainly because of the numbers we were putting out. From the beginning of five years ago, we had about six contractors on our list, of approved contractors. Right now we 1692 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 have approximately, I believe, 17. I can get the number over to you, Councilwoman, or the names also. A lot of our efforts have been going in increasing the number of contractors so that there's more -- so each one has less work and they don't abandon job like you're describing.
At one point, though, weren't you contracting out to community development corporations to help with the demos? Was it you or OHCD?
You use Greater Germantown Housing Development Corp.
Yes, but it's not CDC part, it's a separate for-profit part.
And we've reached out and advertised over the years, and it's one of our 1693 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 things to have more contractors, more, better. And we do monitor the quality of the contractors.
Also, Councilwoman, one more thing. In the Logan area, and we've tested it and we believe that we'll go and increase us. We bid the area the Logan triangle which is partly in your district, and one contractor has the balance of the buildings there to demolish. We can monitor him a easier. As a matter of fact, myself and my boss, Mr. MacLaughlin, visit there often. The contractor is starting to complain about us being there. He has too many inspectors with him and I. It's $4,000 a unit there because of this effort, and if there's any damage to that neighbor, we know who's done it. And we want to expand on this, and the Commissioner is going to work with the blight czar and try to get this built into process. It's really very, very effective. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: I'd just like 1694 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 to say, Councilwoman, if your constituents have any complaints about the way a site was left, I'd appreciate knowing about that.
I really appreciate the quickness of when I did call about that one particular one on Midvale Avenue that, you know, I was really happy to ride by and see that everything had been taken care of. I didn't know that Risk Management got involved at this level. I didn't know that until I was reading their testimony last week because it then presents public safety and people's ability to sue the City and all kind of things. But I know that that would take away a lot of the problems that we have and hearing from constituents when it comes to demos because some of those contractors just leave it terrible.
The horrible part about demolition is before it gets better, it gets a lot worse. That's the problem. You know, it creates dust, debris, and unsightliness in the community.
I'm going to give som of my time to Councilman Rizzo.
Councilman 1695 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 Rizzo, you have a follow-up question?
Yes, please. It was in response to something that you just said, the conversation that you just had with Councilwoman Miller, the best way to whip a contractor into shape, after they do a demolition, how long does it take them to get paid? How long does it take them to get paid, 60 days, 30 days, 90 days?
Well, doesn't someone from L&I go out and sign off on the demolition and say, "Hey, this job's done properly, pay 'em." I mean, if they're just getting paid no matter what the situation is, then I understand you've got a problem.
They only get paid when we approve the demolition. So if we do not approve of the demolition, they will not get paid.
So then how does this exist? They're satisfied with doing a sloppy job and not getting paid.
It exists if they can only tear down 20 buildings a week and we bid 40, 1696 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 that's why it exists because there's just more work than they have the capability at the lowest responsible contract price.
Don't you know the capability? Why would you give a contractor that doesn't have the ability to demolish 40 buildings 40 buildings to demolish?
Well, it's not one contractor, but several. But -- go ahead. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: I think Bob's statement was -- his prior statement was more telling, and that was that it gets worse before it gets better. And the problems that the Councilwoman is talking about is leaving the site to go to something else before they finished doing what they're supposed to do. So that by the time we get to the site to inspect it, by the time they tell us they're done, it looks decent. It looks the way it's supposed, but that could take months if they're prioritizing and going to other places and not completing the job.
Then I suggest you put in your contract that they have X-number of days from the minute they start to the minute the 1697 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 finish so they can't play the game where I start one -- it sounds like my carpenter. He starts to build a closet over here and runs over here to do four more.
That fits with contractors, Councilman. They give you "I'll do it tomorrow," but tomorrow never comes.
Or they rip everything apart and they got you and you're at their mercy. But I'm sure you could -- COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: These contracts are under review and I'll make sure that that gets addressed.
Once they start that they've got X-number of days to finish it up, and then this problem might subside. Thank you. It's easy just to talk about it. COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Yeah.
Thank you. Councilwoman Brown. 1698 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
My colleagues raised important questions about this issue of civic responsibility when it comes to contractors who care more about getting paid for their service and less about the community in which they're conducting the work. Are contracts awarded within your department, you oversee that process from beginning to end who these contractors are? 10
We work with the 11 Procurement and Law Department advertise to 12 approve the contractor for their ability to do the 13 work based on their experience. The Law 14 Department makes sure they have the proper bonding 15 and Procurement makes sure they have the 16 business-type questions that need to be answered. 17
As a footnote, does that include MBEC? When you say Procurement, is MBEC implicit in that process, Minority Business Enterprize Council?
You would have to ask the Procurement Commissioner. I'm not sure if they -- they probably are because I believe MBEC and Procurement work very, very closely together.
We have over the years worked really hard to work with MBEC to get qualified companies that bid for us that minority female-owned, we've worked very hard with that.
And I believe we've been somewhat successful, but not completely.
So back to Councilwoman Donna Reed Miller's question, I don't know if I heard an answer. What becomes a defining circumstance where contractors are no 13 longer considered for doing business with the City? An example? Because it is something wrong with continuously giving contractors business with the City and they don't honor up to cleaning up their act.
Councilwoman, in concert with the Philadelphia Police Department, myself and Commissioner MacLaughlin met with them about two or three weeks ago. We worked with them and the contractor has been removed, one and I believe two others under investigation as we speak has been permanently removed. Matter of fact, they have them up for criminal charges, but we 1700 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 have removed him permanently from our list. And two others right now are under investigation.
So then that answers the question that there is something internally that addresses circumstances like that. Final question. On the awarding process, is this some criteria or amongst your criteria, do they have to be Philadelphia-based, in other words taxpayers of Philadelphia or Philadelphia region or Delaware Valley?
They have to be taxpayers to make sure business privilege license, but they do not have to be Philadelphia based. And you'll have to ask Procurement as to why. I don't believe we can seclude anyone that's not in Philadelphia.
We had Councilman Nutter. I assume he stepped out. Are there any other questions? (No further questions.)
Again, thank you for the excellent job. 1701 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 COMMISSIONER MCLAUGHLIN: Thank you Councilwoman.
Board of L&I Review. COMMISSIONER MCLAUHGLIN: Before we go I would just like to thank Council for their cooperation that Council gives us.
Councilwoman Blackwell, Members of Council, I am not Pamela Esposito. Richard Feldgus, Administrative Director for the Department for Licenses and Inspections, and I'll be presenting testimony for the Board of Licenses and Inspections Review. Unfortunately, the Board has scheduled hearings this afternoon. They will not be able to attend since they're conducting own hearings. The Board of Licenses and Inspections Review is requesting a budget of $207,709 for Fiscal Year 2001. This is an increase of 4846 over the FY 2000 estimated obligations. The increase in funding reflects monies to fund the wage increase for support staff. 1702 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 The budget we are requesting will continue to provide for full-time staff of three employees as well as six board members. In 1999, the Board of Licenses and Inspections Review has heard and rendered decisions in 758 cases. It is now anticipated that in FY 2000 the Board will hear 1120 cases. We project the same number in 2001. The number of appeals filed with the Board increased in Fiscal Year '98 as a result of changes in laws regulating guns. That number has now stabilized, and right now we're taking approximately 60 days for the Board to issue decisions once cases are brought before the Board. I'll be happy to answer any questions.
Thank you. Are there any questions? Any questions? (No questions.)
Again, I am not Bart 1703 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 Kligerman, I am Richard Feldgus, Administrative Services Director for the Department of Licenses and Inspections. I apologize. Mr. Kligerman was here earlier, but because of the lateness and other commitments, he could not stay. The Board of Building Standards is requesting the budget of $117,125 for Fiscal Year 2001. This is an increase of 3191 over current appropriation. Funding will provide full-time staff of two employees and four board members. The role of the Board of Building Standards is to advise the Commissioner of the Department of Licenses and Inspections on requests for variances as well as to provide interpretations of the building code and make suggestions for standards regulations dealing with building safety. The Board also reviews new and substitute materials and methods of construction make recommendations to the Commissioner to Philadelphia up-to-date and competitive with latest technologies. In 2001 we will conduct 50 meetings and hear approximately 180 cases. In 1999, the Board heard 161 cases, made recommendations to the 1704 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 Commissioner on 126 cases. Time for obtaining a decision from the Board of Building Standards is currently approximately 30 days. The Board also provides accelerated hearings to persons requiring quick turn-arounds on variance decisions. In 1999, of those accelerated hearings were 8 conducted. 9 I should point out that for the 10 accelerated hearings we do have the people who 11 want those hearings pay the cost of the special 12 hearings that they're granted, but this does 13 accelerate the opportunity for those people to do business in the City and it's worked out very well for both the people coming before the Board and the City. I'd be happy to answer any questions.
Are there any questions? Are there any questions? (No questions.)
Thank you very much. We will now hear the Zoning Board of Adjustment.
Again, I am Richard 1705 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 Feldgus, Administrative Services Director for Department of Licenses and Inspections. I'm here to present testimony for the Zoning Board of Adjustment. The Zoning Board of Adjustment is requesting a budget of $517,262 for FY 2001. This is an increase of 11,728 over the current obligations. The increase in funding reflects cost for salary increase granted to Civil Service employees of the Board. The FY 2001 budget that is being requested by the Zoning Board will provide full-time staff of six employee and five members. During 1999, the Zoning Board of Adjustment, which is the most active of all City boards, conducted 250 meetings. The Zoning Board provides vital service to those who work, live, or do business in the City of Philadelphia, and it provides an opportunity to appeal zoning determinations, request variances where the Code imposes unnecessary hardship on property owners. The Board also grants certificates for certain types of zoning uses as prescribed by the ordinances of City Council. 1706 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 In 2001 it is anticipated the Board will conduct hear 1618 cases. In 1999, the Board heard 1906 cases and rendered decisions in 1491 situations. Currently, the Board is rendering a decision within 30 days of it being submitted to the Board or the Board having a hearing. To enhance service to the public, the Board has adopted an accelerated hearings program similar to the Board of Building Standards where persons wanting quick action before the Board may petition the Board, and by paying cost of Board hearing can receive a hearing as quickly as the notice posting requirements are met. In 1999, there were 358 zoning cases heard with accelerated hearings. We project that that number should be consistent for both the current Fiscal Year and 2001. I'll be happy to answer any questions.
Thank you, Mr. Feldgus. Are there any questions? Any questions? (No questions.)
Thank you very 1707 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 much.
Next will be Community College. (Community College witnesses come forward.)
We certainly welcome you. It's always a pleasure to see our friend Mr. Schrager (ph) who's a great fighter for Community College. Lynette Brown, I'll get you soon, welcome. You may pull up whatever chairs you need. Thank you. You can proceed and identify yourself for the record and begin.
Good afternoon, Councilwoman Blackwell, Members of City Council. My name is Emanuel Ortiz, I chair the Board of Trustees of Community College of Philadelphia. To my left is our new president, Steve Curtis, Dr. Steve Curtis, and to my right is someone you know very well, Mr. Isador Schrager. I'm honored to have colleagues on the board, a group of dedicated civic and business leaders in Philadelphia like 1708 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 Mr. Schrager who recognize importance of Community College of Philadelphia to our great City. With your permission I would like to introduce those others who are here in attendance, and that is Dr. Edward Kohn (ph), Dr. Marciene Mattleman, Representative James R. Roebuck, Jr., and, of course, you met Mr. Isador Schrager. Let me first express our appreciate to the Mayor for recognizing the excellent work of faculty administrator, staff, and students by recommending a $1.5 million additional allocation to the budget this year. We're most appreciative of the investment in the educational future of our City. Community College of Philadelphia was founded in 1965 and opened with an enrollment 700 full-time and part-time students. Today your City College is one of the 10 largest community colleges in the nation with over 1,000 full- and part-time faculty and more than 41,000 credit and non-credit students enrolled in programs throughout the City. We are proud to be the third largest degree-granting institution in the City of Philadelphia. 1709 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 On August 1, 1999, as a result of a national search for a president to advance the institution and its student successfully into the 21st Century, Steven M. Curtis was appointed president of the college. Although many of you have either spoken with or met Dr. Curtis, allow me for the record to note that he is an academic leader with a proven commitment to cities and to urban education, having spent most of his academic career at community colleges in St. Louis and in New York City. While president of Hudson Valley Community College in Troy, New York, he advanced strategic plan, launched a campus-wide student retention effort, initiated innovative approaches to instructions such as on-line courses, developed a long-range marketing plan, and expanded the college's service to the community through a range of workforce training and economic development projects. President Curtis also served as acting president of the City University of New York's Queens College, which is a four-year master's degree granting institution with over 16,000 students which is in Flushing, New York, and the 1710 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 Borough of Manhattan Community College in New York. Our college's board of trustees is pleased that President Curtis is leading the college at this significant time in the history of our City. We believe that he has the right combination of experience and dedication to ensure the realization of our shared vision for Philadelphia's city college. Let me also note that his formal inauguration as fifth president of Community College of Philadelphia will be on Sunday, April 2, 2000. We sincerely hope that your schedules will permit you to participate in this significant event. At this time and with your permission, Councilwoman Blackwell, I would like to ask Dr. Curtis to present the formal testimony to Council on the budget for our college.
Thank you very much. We certainly welcome him. I'm sure he knows of the fine legacy that has been at Community. It's wonderful. We love it here, and there has always been great presidents, so we 1711 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 assume you follow in that a tradition. Let me also -- I see Marciene Mattleman left and thank her for her work with Philadelphia Reads for which she has recently stepped down and certainly our own State Representative Jim Roebuck who's always been devoted to Community College. We thank you all for coming. You may proceed, Dr. Curtis. Thank you again.
Thank you, Councilwoman Blackwell. My name is Steven Curtis, and as indicated I'm President of Community College of Philadelphia, and it is my, not only pleasure, but my honor to testify on behalf of the college today. I'll make my remarks brief. First, I do want to thank the Council for the support that this body has extended and provided to the college throughout our 35-year history. While I am relatively new to the position, I know from my own initial meetings with a number of Councilmembers and also everything that I've heard from my board of trustees, members of academic community, that there has been a strong commitment for the Community College of 1712 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 Philadelphia over the years. Over. The years, the college and this Council have shared many opportunities and many challenges. When the City faced a budget shortfall, so did the college. When the City was forced to tighten its budgetary belt, we also tightened ours. Two years, for the first time in five years, we were able to produce a balanced budget. And this was achieved, however, at some cost to the college since it required us to place a number of critical initiatives on hold. 8 million. We respectfully urge Council to support this allocation. As the City's only public institution of higher education and the third largest degree-granting post secondary institution in Philadelphia, we share with the Mayor and this Council a commitment to the City, a commitment to neighborhoods, to education, to job creation and retention. The recommended allocation will allow 1713 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 us to make significant progress in a number of efforts, in our efforts to decrease the level of unnecessary increase in tuition and fees, to improve our technology infrastructure, to introduce new degree programs and other curricular changes that will meet the needs of City's emerging industries, to develop new business and industry training facilities in our regional centers, to support economic development within communities, to expands student services at offcampus locations throughout the city, to replace worn-out and/or obsolete equipment used in our laboratories, to strengthen our ability to offer instruction using distance learn strategies and to remain current with technology, to enhance our partnerships with the School District of Philadelphia, and to address key deferred maintenance issues. We touch the lives of students long before they ever enter the college. Our programs with the Philadelphia School District are helping high school students improve their academic skills, access college credit courses, and experience college. We help middle school 1714 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 students begin to engage in career exploration opportunities and we help to develop new teachers in such critically important areas as mathematics. We have forged partnerships with Philadelphia business, industry, government, higher education, public and parochial schools, and nonprofit organizations to develop educational programs and services to address the educational and economic needs of Philadelphia. Together we are working to prepare, train, and educate students, employees, leaders, and contributing citizens for our City. Having said all of that, I think the biggest impact that we make in Philadelphia is in the lives of our individual students. And to conclude, I'd like to briefly city three examples. First, three of our most recent graduates are sisters Alejandra, Alexandra, and AnnaMaria Cintron (ph). The first members of their family to earn college degree, they are now taking typical Community College of Philadelphia paths. Alejandra and Alexandra, both graduates of diagnostic medical imaging program are now licensed radiologic technicians. AnnaMaria is 1715 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 pursuing a baccalaureate degree in business administration at Temple University.
They exemplify the diligence, persistence and achievement of our students. A second example, Renee Dapney (ph) is a single participant in the Mellon Minority undergraduate fellow program in english at Cornell University. She is a graduate of our education program and she was also a member of our Phi Beta Kappaa Honor Society. With the encouragement of her curriculum coordinator, she transferred to Cornell is currently one of five minority undergraduate fellows who work closely with faculty mentors. She, like her four undergraduate peers is now highly sought after by graduate programs across the country. Eileen McCabe (ph), a mother of six is yet another example of how our college helps residents of this city achieve their potential and their goals. When two of her older children enrolled at Community College of Philadelphia, she enrolled with them. In between exams, reading assignments, and studying, she found time to serve in student government, to volunteer as a student 1716 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 ambassador, and sew quilts for student fund-raisers. These experience raised her confidence and helped her to realize the academic success that her professors knew was possible. Eileen graduated with highest honors and $7,000 in scholarships at Beaver College where she's now enrolled as an education major. Eileen frequently speaks at college career fairs and counsels other mothers who dream of launching careers later in life. It is our students who matter most of all. And what we have been able to accomplish on behalf of our students has occurred within restraints of an increasingly restricted budget and with the reallocation of current resources rather than extensive new revenues being the primary source of funding. These accomplishments have occurred because we manage ours in highly cost-effective manner, we pursue strategies to make productive and efficient use of available resources, and we actively seek new revenues. We have tightened our belts, secured supplemental grant funds, and advocated in Harrisburg for additional resources as well. We now need to 1717 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 ensure that this city college is positioned to continue to respond efficiently and effectively to the needs of business, industry, government, and its citizens for high-quality affordable educational opportunities. To do this requires the resources of the proposed budget. And finally, as an overview for the context of the budget, that proposed support represents approximately half of the projected increase in our Fiscal Year 2001 budget. With our sister colleges across the State, we have requested the remaining increase in funds from the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania. For your information, the Governor's proposed budget recently released recommends an increase in the State allocation, but not at our requested level, and therefore, not sufficiently large enough to probably avoid a tuition increase of some kind for next year. While raising tuition appears necessary, it's an action which will only be taken by the college as a last resort. We are committed to working toward public financing that will keep tuition affordable and higher education accessible. 1718 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 Community College of Philadelphia has superb programs in business, science, engineering and technology, health care, social and human services, liberal arts, liberal studies, arts and communications. We have experience an expertise in workforce development and training. We have talented faculty, dedicated employees, a visionary board of trustees, and the collective talent to ensure success. I appreciate your remarks about those that have preceded me. I certainly intend to do everything I can to keep this college on track and making the same kinds of contributions to the City that it has in the past.
We appreciate your continued support, and I look forward to working together with the Council so that we are even a more vital contributor to the City of Philadelphia. Thank you.
Thank you, Dr. Curtis. Councilwoman Reynolds Brown.
Let me first start by saying that I fully support the proposed increase in the city college subsidy. And it goes without saying given the, I would say, miraculous outreach that you do throughout our City is certainly deserving. On of your testimony, 5th paragraph, you speak to a number of -- in this instance you speak to the involvement of 11th and 12th graders, and I put a question in the column, what are you doing by the way of early intervention because we know to the extent that you touch young people during those middle school years, 6th, 7th, and 8th grade, they are better prepared in terms of the academic requirements on what to do 9th through 12th which get them in shape for two-year and four-year institutions. Could speak in some detail to the early intervention efforts?
I'll be happy to. What I'm doing right now is going around cluster by cluster meeting with the leadership to talk about, in some cases, programs that we already have underway in a given part of the City and seeing if 1720 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 there's some interest in replicating it; and in other cases, asking what it is that we can do as a partner with a particular school or a cluster that can make the kind of difference that you're describing. I'll give you a couple of examples that relate specifically to the middle school experience.
We're talking in some cases now about -- in fact, we are putting on a series of career fairs so that we can begin talking about career opportunities down the line and what kind of educational experience it takes to get there.
That has to do, obviously, with the need for math, science, other kinds of things. We're talking about some potential teacher training opportunities in the middle schools, again, focused in some cases on math, science, technology, as the School District has increased its technological capability, there are still training issues. And again, that's something that I think we can be helpful with. By 1721 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 9th grade, approximately, we are now offering the opportunity, so it's probably more on a high school level, but still early, not before 11th or 12th grade, the opportunity for us to come in and do assessment in terms of basic skills, the kind of assessment that we do automatically, not for admission to our institution, but for placement purposes so that, again, we can have the discussion with students or the School District can have discussions with students early on about what needs to be done before we get to the end of high school.
So you're saying Community College is actually offering that service?
We are offering that service, yes. We're at the moment doing it kind of on a school-by-school basis, but as I make my way through the clusters, we're talking about all those. And we're trying to adapt. We're assuming one size may not fit all. But those are the kind of things that we are discussing and in some cases 1722 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 now implementing.
And that ultimately make difference with regards to the number of young people that go on to two- and four-year institutions.
Because they've been adequately alerted early on what the requirements are.
You mention in your response the word "partnership" and you discuss partnerships at length throughout your testimony, particularly on . And you've spoken to the recruitment process whereby you are serving as an ambassador and going around to the clusters. The qualifications for enrollment, what is that? Is there any need to have any since the outreach is to all 6th, 7th and 8th graders, and the programs currently in place at optimum level, meaning, is there a need to fill any gaps in terms of participation of young people?
Okay. For the examples given on , the dual enrollment program, for 1723 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 example, yes, there are criteria. It generally is based on a writing sample and that kind of thing. We're not looking to put a student in a college credit situation, because that's what that offers.
If student isn't sufficiently prepared. That would not lead us to a positive kind of outcome, so for that, yes. For other things that we're doing the answer is no. Again, some of those are still preliminary discussions. I don't want to mislead you. We're setting some of those things up now, but some of those will be much more generic for participation, for participation in the career exploration activities, for example. There's a career fair coming up at the end of March that we're doing with a couple of middle schools and that's wide open, so there's no criteria in that case. But for enrolling in a college-level course, there will be some criteria, yes.
A couple of more questions. The career fairs happen because Community College of Philadelphia sees a need and is responding to need and the partner on the other 1724 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 end, the principal or the cluster leader philosophically is where you're at, is that how that happens?
Yes. The first one that's coming up, we were actually approached and ask if we would do it, and we said yes. We're taking that as a model, as said earlier, and now asking would others like to replicate that model.
Yes, because that would be the optimum circumstance, to see that go system-wide. One question on funding. On your testimony, third paragraph, you speak to a new funding formula for the State's contribution and mention a number of entities that are needed to move towards that end. And this is redundant, but I'll say it for the record anyhow. There are always -- and I'm sure members of your team know that the members of the Philadelphia delegation who believe as you do who are advocates for Community College efforts and need to know early on what your efforts or what your strategies are to see what role they can play in making it real. So I share that with you because they're not 1725 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 mentioned in this paragraph. And they, I believe, since they are at the State and living and breathing that three days a week, need to know what you're trying to do in their world.
Right. I appreciate that. The reason there aren't some specific there because as a community college sector I don't think we've come to closure yet on what we think an appropriate funding formula would be. This is an attempt to let you know that that's definitely a discussion that's underway, but I don't think we have the specific answer yet so we're not out there advocating a specific formula until collectively we've agreed on what that should be.
And finally, the middle schools you mention, tongue-in-cheek question, might they be in West Philly? I'm just curious.
I've been to meet with Janice and we have talked specifically about middle schools there. We have not set that one up yet, but that discussion going on, yes.
Congratulations to Mr. Curtis and good afternoon to you and members of the board and members of your administration. My question is really related to workforce development and job training activity. I've noticed of your testimony a grant from Department of Community and Economic Development for customized job training. Can you tell me what the level of that grant was and what type of activity you were involved in?
I'm not sure which specific one that refers to, but the customized job training is done in cooperation with Department of Community and Economic Development. We have about three active ones right now, I think, and we have probably a couple more in the preliminary stages. The active ones, I think, are Jefferson, Smurfit, Freeman and SPD Technologies. 1727 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 And then there are others in the works. Generally, a Philadelphia company that's interested, we can refer or they can go to the Department of Community and Economic Development and then be referred back to us and then we set up the contract and work out the training with them.
So companies have approached you regarding customized training?
Let me ask you more general questions leading toward really what I want to see as an increasing role for community colleges of in-job training from the community college system. I know a lot of other cities are utilizing community colleges a lot more for job training. What do you think the role of community colleges are in workforce development?
Our particular goal is to expand that, if not exponentially, certainly greatly. In other states with that exists to a 1728 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 greater extent, it's often because by public policy community colleges are the places where the state typically directs that kind of effort. In this state, it's not a matter of public policy so much.
It's not a matter of public policy or not on the state level?
I think it's not a matter of public policy. In a number of states, community colleges are "the" training entity.
It's built into the system. That's not the case here. It takes what just described a moment ago, a company must go and ask and maybe directed to us. So I think we have to be much more aggressive.
I guess my response was, was it not just a matter of state policy but also not a matter of local public policy?
Is to the student? 1729 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
A full-time student I think spends about $2,000 a year. Is that correct? So for a two-year degree if it were full-time, it would be about $4,000.
Related to some of your workforce development that you're doing, you have done, my understanding, specialize in associate degrees because those people are being trained in areas they needed to be trained.
Yes. And then some of it is non-credit training, too, not necessarily toward a degree.
What would you foresee in terms of developing specialized programs so that people would be encouraged, not only just be trained for a job, but to have the associate degree to have other educational training that might lead them toward further advancement.
We look at it as a continuum, and the continuum can include a number of things. It can include the non-credit kind of 1730 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 training. We'll call it training for this purpose. It can move to a certificate kind of level. It can then move to an associate degree level an beyond. We try not to see ourselves as the limit here. And in fact, we have, obviously, the kinds of articulation agreements in some cases related to career programs, in other cases obviously in terms of our transfer programs that allow students to move past the associate degree level. So we do look at it as a continuum, and ideally I think a student should be able to enter at a given point on the continuum and in some cases may already come to us with a degree. We have students in our health programs, for example, that may already have a bachelor's degree. So now they're coming back for another kind of training that will result in an associate degree but will get them into the RN field, for example. So we need to be as accessible as possible, I think, in those terms. And what we're trying to do, have already done in many cases, is to create that kind of articulation, whether it's with an institution that a student may move to after he or she leaves us or even within our own institution moving, 1731 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 let's say, from a strictly training kind of activity into the degree program.
Have you engaged in discussions with this Administration about increasing role of Community College in workforce development? Let me preface that.
Let me preface that by saying I know the previous Administration concentrated all the resources under the control of the Mayor's Office and then directed them toward what is now the Philadelphia Workforce Development Corporation and there's a tendency to want to keep under that one very large bureaucracy. Have you yet engaged in conversation with the Administration about why that doesn't necessarily make sense in terms of guiding people along that continuum that you talked about?
We're starting some of those. It's still early in the Administration, so a there's a lot of dialog to be had yet. But we're definitely looking at -- well, you've already mentioned the CJT kind of example. We're 1732 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 looking at welfare to work. We're trying to find a number of instances where we can become even more proactive than we have been. So that, again, the result that we're looking for is to take residents of this City, in some cases put them into jobs, in other cases move them upward in the job market and allow them to achieve their individual goals.
So with two new administrations, we might be able to do it right.
The Welfare Reform Act, what type of impact has it had on student enrollment in terms of women and individuals who 1733 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 were on welfare and since this is a work-first state has had -- has that had some impact on people being able to maintain both work and study at the same time?
Well, I wasn't here when that went into effect, but I presume based on my own experience elsewhere that it has had some impact. But we're looking for ways to mitigate that. As an example, last semester there was a very creative opportunity made available to us by a local church who gave us a scholarship, created a scholarship fund. But I put "scholarship" in quotes because the scholarship money is specifically to go toward work-study so that students who are receiving public assistance can come to the College and do their work experience on-site at the college so that it makes it easier to have that kind of experience, both the education and the work. So yes, again, I'm not sure I know the numbers. I wasn't here.
I'm really interested in seeing if we can get some numbers maybe because I was working with your predecessor.
We'll get that for you. 1734 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005
Your predecessor and I were very interested in seeing what, if any, the impact was going to be on the accessibility of Community College because of the Welfare Reform Act.
I know that Community College had built and structured and offered a day care center for students. And I want to know if the population has decreased or increased in the day care center because that could also be a barometer of accessibility of individuals and so on. I know that you may not know.
I don't the exact answer, but will be happy to get you the answer.
I'm just putting the question so I can get the answer later on.
It's part and parcel of what we're trying to do in terms of changing State policy as it relates to poor people and people that are coming off the welfare rolls, really misguided, misdirected policy from the 1735 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 governor an so on. If you're going to raise tuition, have you measured what impact that may have, again, on accessibility to Community College? Because that's why Community College is there.
To be able to permit everybody who has the desire to go to it.
First, let me reiterate the decision has not been fully made yet, that has not gone to our board and they have not approved that. But in terms of our projections, I mentioned that so that you'd understand that between City support and State support, the total amount that we project we need hasn't come through yet. The answer is --
What is the difference that has not come through, what's the amount?
Possibly about $650,000 overall. We had requested an increase in base funding from the State of about an additional $100 1736 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 per full-time equivalent student, and the Governor's budget includes about $60, so that difference represented in there. If there were to be a tuition increase, it would a fairly small one, but typically for those students for whom the financial issue is the greatest, that tuition increase would typically be picked up in terms of financial assistance. So I think that would not provide an accessibility barrier.
So $600,000 around that would prevent the tax increase from going forward (Sic)?
As a community college sector, we have requested an amount from the State that at the moment is not forthcoming, yes.
The City, at least the Mayor's proposed budget met our request for this coming year, but the City does not meet the 1737 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 overall theoretical model. You know, the theoretical model is one-third of support from the State, one-third from the City, one-third for student tuition. The City's contribution this year is about percent. 7
I know that you're 8 new and this question I ask individuals that hold 9 your position every year. The level of minority 10 at present at different levels of your 11 administration, Latinos, females, blacks, what are 12 the numbers at the current level that we have at 13 Community College in terms of that. 14
I don't have the number 15 with me. I can't answer that numerically. I 16 think there has been a strong commitment at the 17 college to make all levels, faculty, staff, 18 administration, as diverse as possible. It's a 19 commitment that I've had everywhere that I've 20 worked and continue to have. So we are moving 21 forward in the various normal searches that we 22 would have. That is part of our commitment. 23
Yes. That commitment is 1738 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 there. Particularly in recent years, I'd say the last three or four years, we have seen the percentage, for example, of faculty hirings person's of color increase. Again, if you want numbers I'd be happy to get them.
Thank you very much. Are there any other questions from members of the committee? (No further questions.)
Clerk of Quarter Sessions Court. (Clerk of Quarter Sessions Court 1739 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 witnesses come forward.)
Thank you very much. Thanks for your patience. Thank you very much.
Good afternoon, Madam Chair and Members of Council. My name is Vivian Miller. You have my budget before you and in the interest of time I would like to just summarize it for you.
It is with a sense of excitement and hope for a bright and progressive future for our City that I appear before this distinguished body requesting your approval of my Fiscal Year 2001 budget in the amount of $4,313,424. Once again, our budget does not meet the desired goals and visions for the Clerk of Quarter Sessions. However, I anticipate working with the new Administration in moving our department into the 21st century. Also, let me conclude by extending my best wishes to each of you for a rewarding and successful future as a member of this elite body. Thank you. 1740 2/22/00, Operating Budget, Bill 000005 Are there any questions?
Thank you. Thank you for the job that you do. We do appreciate you. We appreciate your brevity. Are there any questions from members of the committee? Councilman Ortiz.
Thank you very much. You're seeing brevity has its rewards. All right, there being none, this committee will be in recess until Wednesday, February 23rd at 9 o'clock p.m.
Thank you, Madam Chair, and extend my wishes to the President.
I will, thank you. (Adjourned at 5:16 p.m.) - - - 1741 C E R T I F I C A T E I HEREBY CERTIFY that the foregoing proceedings of the Council of the City of Philadelphia of Tuesday, February 22, 2000, were reported fully and accurately by me, and that this is a correct transcript of same. RE: COUNCIL COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE BILL NO. 000005 __________________________________, JOSEPHINE CARDILLO, Registered Professional Reporter