Thank you.
good morning everyone um and welcome to our uh our first in-person meeting after five years
after five years and uh before i start i really want to thank the staff for getting us to this
point and i even kathleen grady i see her in the audience there ian haggerty and everybody who
worked on this and i also want to go back and um you know thank the group that got us to the
to the zoom process um tanya frank duchico the people were here they put that place that
program in place and we really did get to the point where I think we really had it down
but now we're in person and we're going to be better. So we're really glad to hear. So let
me start off by saying good morning and I will, my name is Bill Bergman and I will be chairing
this meeting. With me is our Vice Chair Ismail Shahid. President Mr. Chairman. Our Board Member
Cheryl L. Gaston. President Mr. Chairman. Our Board Member Kenetta Graham. President Mr. Chairman.
Our board member, Michael Johns.
Present, Mr. Chairman.
And our board member, Ty Wynn.
Present, Mr. Chairman.
Also present is Hillary Emerson, our attorney.
Ian Haggerty, our executive director of the zoning board.
And our supervisor, Lakeisha Dandy.
Please be advised this meeting is to be recorded.
Your participation in this meeting indicates that you consent to be recorded.
The video will be posted on ZBA website approximately one week following the meeting.
This meeting is be held in person with remote capabilities, meaning that individuals can
participate either in person, at the hearing room, on one parkway building, or remotely over Zoom.
When you're recognized to speak by the board, please state and spell your name for the court
reporter and then wait to be sworn in. If you are in the hearing room, you must speak into a
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If you're participating remotely, please turn on your camera and unmute yourself when you're
recognized to speak. Once you've been sworn in, please state your name each time before testifying,
whether you're in person or remote, so that the court reporter knows who is speaking.
Please mute yourself or turn off your microphone when you are not speaking. If you're participating
by phone, press star nine to raise your hand and star six to unmute. If you're participating by
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the hearing. You must provide an email address and the address of the property you are interested
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in person, a QR code is available to register your appearance. For assistance, please see a staff
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please contact rcozba at phillip.gov. If you are in the hearing room, please refrain from talking
or engaging in conversation while the hearings are proceeding. Please note, eating and drinking
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testimony or comments any comments related to this hearing operations should be directed to
should be directed to ZBAExecutiveDirector at phil.gov.
zba executive director at phil.gov
Before we begin, Executive Director Ian Haggerty has an important safety announcement.
All right. Thank you, Chair. Good morning, everyone.
For the folks in the room today, just a quick couple of safety notes.
The safety of the meeting attendees is our highest priority here in the room.
In the event of an emergency, if the alarm goes off or otherwise,
please pay attention to the announcements on the loudspeaker,
which will provide detailed instructions if there is no announcement please follow the directions of
security officers and zba staff members the main exit out of this room is the double doors at the
rear of the room the nearest stairway is to the left outside the main exit from this room follow
the illuminated red exit signs to reach the stairway if an order is given to evacuate the
building for any reason the rally point will be at love park directly across arch street from
the main public entrance to this building. Please remain at the rally point so we can
keep track of folks. Restrooms, as a reminder, are located across from the elevators and there's
a water fountain just outside the double doors to the right. Thanks very much. Back to you, Chair.
As our first order of business, we will be adopting revised regulations for the Zoning
Board of Adjustment dated January 15, 2025. Have all members received a copy of the revised
regulation and had an opportunity to review them yes chair yes chair do members have any concerns
for proposed changes pertaining to these revised regulations none no chair at this time do i have
a motion to adopt the revised regulations of the zoning board of adjustment dated january 15 2025.
I motion that we adopt the revised regulations of the Zoning Board of Adjustment, dated January 15th, 2025.
I second.
Hearing a motion that has been properly second, will the members in support of the motion to adopt the revised regulations of the Zoning Board of Adjustment, dated January 15th, 2025, please signify by saying aye.
If members are opposed, please signify by saying nay.
Based on the vote by the members, the revised regulations of the Zoning Board of Adjustment
dated January 15, 2025, have been adopted by the board and will be filed with the Department
of Records for a 30-day public comment period as required by the Home Rule and Charger.
Now, let's look at our schedule for today, please.
number three
mi 2023 002 047 2231 green street that case has been continued the case will be continued to
6 4 25 at 9 30 a.m number seven
number seven mi 2023 0 0 6 6 1 3 50 33 duffield street that case is continued attorney moving
party. Number 17, MI 2024-005-353-4554 Worth Street. That case is continued to 6425 at 9.30
a.m and number 19 mi 2024 005 357 839 airedale road cases continued until 6425 at 9 30.
move to our first case number eight number eight
Number eight, MI 2023-006-909-1443 Tashkar Street.
Do we have the interpreter?
Good morning, Chair.
This is Nadia, and I will be your co-host this morning.
Do we have the interpreter for Haiying Ling?
If you are in a virtual audience, please raise your virtual hand.
Thank you.
Chair, we have three hands up. We have Mike Wang, a Spanish interpreter, and Ha-Ying Wang.
Mike Wang is the Mandarin interpreter for this case.
Thank you. Mike Wang has been promoted to panelists.
Good morning, sir. Could you please state your name and spell for the court stenographer?
Good morning. This is Mike, Mandarin Tepetem.
Did you spell your name for the stenographer, please?
Mike, M-I-K-E, L-A-N-G, W-A-N-G.
Do you solemnly swear or affirm that you will interpret accurately, completely, and impartially
for English to Mandarin and from Mandarin to English to the best of your ability?
Yes, I do.
We'd like to call Hai-Yong Li, please.
Li Hai-Yin, you should.
Hi, you how?
How are you?
Could you ask her, please, to state her name and spell for the stenographer?
请您把您的名字拼一下,好吗?法庭的记录员,要把您的名字记录下来。
好的,我的名字叫海因黎。
My name is Haiying Li.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
您是不是宣誓表示您今天所说的都是实话,讲的每一句都是实话?
Okay. There is a letter of support from Point Breeze Community Development Corporation.
有一封从开发公司寄来的一封支持的信件。
Your place chair has a few questions
我们的副主席有一些问题
Good morning, have you emailed in all the required documents and exhibits that is needed and required to proceed with this case five days in advance at this hearing?
请问你有没有按照这个电邮告诉您需要递交的一些文件
在今天听证之前都有需要递交的文件,您都递交了吗?
I have submitted them all.
Thank you.
You may proceed and share your screen.
So I can start share my screen now?
Should have.
Can you see it?
Excuse me, Mr. Chair, would you like to read the refusal into the record?
This application is for use as a visitor accommodation on the third floor of an existing structure.
今天的请面是神术是想要在这一栋楼的三楼做商业的使用。
With existing single dwelling on the second floor.
现在目前二楼是单独居住的安排。
是我们自己,我们家人住在这二楼。
Yeah, my family lives on the second floor.
And with existing retail sales of food and beverages and groceries on the first floor as previously approved.
那一楼已经核准可以做零售的这个商店。
The proposed use visitor accommodation is prohibited in the CMX1 zoning district.
Prohibited is for the third floor or for the other area in the building?
The proposed use of visitor accommodation is prohibited in the CMX-1 zoning district.
它不允许的意思是吗?
它不允許的意思是甚麼?
What is inhibited means?
It means it is not by code.
按照这边的土地使用的规定,是不可以拿来做商务使用的。
那所以我们有这个诉求,不是吗?
Isn't that why we're appealing here?
所以我现在可不可以称给你我们的东西?
So can I proceed to show my material?
Please, please start your...
好,请开始.
第一张图就是我们的整个外形,整个标准的外形.
The first picture is the exterior of this building.
那第二下面这几张,这一二三四五六,
And this following few pictures is a picture of the third floor after restoration.
and this is the the posting announcement according to the requirement of twenty-one days earlier
然后这两张就是我们跟community meeting,他们给我们通过3比1的比例这样子。
And this is the meeting and approval from the community, they grant us 3 to 1 ratio.
And also following the requirement to send mailing
notification to all the neighbors in the community to prove that we had this meeting with the community.
To the left was the tax clearance letter and the denial of the refusal letter from the
The text clearance letter indicating
we do not owe any taxes.
And these two are project information form.
And the bottom two are the planned way to post.
I need to bring my Chinese copy out.
所以一楼它的作业跟二楼上面完全没关系.
And the first floor has its own restroom and has a full basement.
It is completely independent from the second or the third floor in the building.
然后二楼呢,是我们自己住在二楼。
二楼有三个房间,两个厕所。
And my family.
所以我们家里还有五个人
And my family lives on the second floor
There are total six members in the family
My oldest son is in the college
So there are currently five people
Live in the second floor
The second floor has three bedrooms, two baths
那三楼呢,是三个房间
空间会比二楼会大一点
And the third floor has three bedrooms and three full beds.
So bigger than the second floor.
那我们为什么要做这个游客的就是visitor accommodation呢?
是因为我们确实有家庭的需要
Why do we make this a visitor accommodation property?
Because we do have the need
那我们家这个大哥大的儿子
他其实也住在
也是在我们附近这个大学
然后呢 他也是想
或者说没地方住
回来没地方住
他得跟弟弟他们
跪在一个房间里面
那我们如果做了这个
这个computation呢
我们如果哥哥要回家
我们就把这个date
给他brass下来
然后我们让我们家儿子回来
他也可以有时间
跟弟弟妹妹们在一起
所以这个也是我自己
我因为我也只有我一个人上班
所以我们也没能力
想再买房子啊什么的
如果可以允许的话呢
我是想说我们三楼
可以做这个computation
这个wistercomputation
方便我的儿子回来
有的时候我们家孩子
如果没有客人,他们也可以在三楼上面,玩啊,在三楼上面,做他们的作业啊,因为空间大了,他们就有自己的地方。
Listen, I need to advise Ms. Li just to break it into several sections.
If she goes too long, I may not be able to interpret everything she said.
抱歉,请你要稍微讲的简短一点。
如果你讲的太长,我可能会遗漏。
所以请你一段一段地讲,好吧。
好,要不要我重新再给你讲一次。
不需要了,你先请我来讲,OK。
So, yeah, one personal need or several personal need from our family point of view.
First of all, my son in the college nearby and occasionally he will come back and visit, but he had no place to stay.
He had to squeeze into a room with his siblings.
So if we do have the third floor as a visitor's accommodation, when we know my son is coming home, we can block out those days so he can stay on the third floor and also be close to the family and have time spent with the family.
And also sometimes my younger ones may need more room to do their homework or play.
When there is no guest on the third floor, they have more room.
They can go up there.
We have only one encounter family.
I'm the only one working.
So we don't have the ability to purchase another property to accommodate all this family.
这个是我很大的一个诉求,就是我们是真的是有这个需求,不是说我们为了商业去做这个事情。
This is our, the reason for our appeal. We're not really doing this for business, from the business perspective. It's really for the family, from the family perspective.
然后我也很爱种花,那我的花也因为没地方放,就是经常会死掉,那我其实会惨得心疼,那如果有三楼的话,我其实它又可以做成一个dickery,可以保护我的花不会死掉,所以这个也是我另外一个诉求。
Sometimes I need to clarify one thing she said, one second.
您说可以把花放在三楼当作什么?
这是专事的。
Oh, okay.
Oh, okay.
And also, I...
And also, I enjoy planting flowers, but I don't have enough room, so a lot of time the flower would just die.
So if we have the third floor open up, I can put some of the flowers on third floor as declaration.
Another big problem issue is parking.
I've been living in South Philadelphia for many years.
I understand this is a tough issue.
在2021年到2023年之间,我有做了两年的Airbnb host.
Up to between 2021 and 2023, I was hosting as an Airbnb host.
在这里呢我的经历呢是说很多的客人基本他们都不是在附近开车来的
很多都是要坐飞机啊坐火车啊然后坐那个Uber到我们的这个家里面对
Based on my experience, most of the guests stay in our Airbnb was not people from the neighboring area drove here.
A lot of them flew in or take a train in and then Uber to this property.
About three to five visitors in a year
we're probably driving to this property and plus we only have one car so adding another car
occasionally shouldn't be a big problem okay all right thank you
questions from the board
i have a question um is the entryway to the airbnb the same as to the second floor unit
请问这个到您Airbnb的入口
跟到二楼的入口
是不是相同的
但是我们还有一个入口
Entry 是从
Store 里面进来
另外一个 Entry 是从
反正就是有两个 Entry
Yes, it is the same
But they have two entrants
There's one entrance through the store on the first floor, and there is another entrance.
I guess I'm not understanding why there's a need for a visitor accommodation if it's for family, and they're just, you know, they're coming and staying.
I don't know why that needs to be in a visitor accommodation.
It seems like they can just stay there.
我不晓得为什么需要申请这个给客人居住的这个地方,你们就可以自己使用
我也想啊,但是我们的收入是有限的呀,是不是啊
I also hope we can keep this as a private use, but our income is limited
我也希望这个房子我们可以自己使用
我不想跟别人share我的place
但是我们要try best的去生活好
不想把自己活得那么辛苦
虽然可能需要做一些牺牲
但是至少是说能让我们很平稳的
不要很多的 struggle
I also want to use all the spaces by ourselves, not sharing with anyone else.
I also want to use all the spaces by ourselves
But we also need to try our best to be able to live in a better situation, not struggling all the time.
所以没有一个人愿意把自己的place分享跟另外一个人住在你的家里
但是我们需要另外的income
因为我有两个儿子已经上大学
他们需要我support他们
No one really like to share their living space with other people
but we need additional income
because I have two kids
in college right now.
I need to support them.
And we still have mortgage
for the building to pay.
And because my English is not very good,
so I have to sacrifice in a different way.
Other questions from the board?
Yes, you have one more question.
My question was,
she said she had used it for Airbnb previously.
Were there any complaints?
没有没有 我们跟我们的客人都非常好的关系
他们都很按就是 他们是很follow这个
都是按这个规定来住在我们上面
所以没有我的客人complain 也没有我的laborcomplain
所以我们这次我们的community meeting
他们都给我们过 是他们都知道我们住在这边很浪
所以我们都知道一区阿人
而且我也很喜欢我的邻居
非常喜欢他们
No, we have very good relationship with the guests
No one has ever complained
And also we have very good relationship with the community
And not receive any complaints from the neighbors
That's why when we have this community meeting
They support or approve this proposal
other questions from the board yes um i guess i need to go back again to the question that uh
board member johns asked um i thought in we can we can figure this out but visitor accommodation
i thought was if the uh property is going to be used as an airbnb but it's not owner occupied but
is that is that correct i think so if it's separate units i think then those are accommodations is
the appropriate category it would be limited lodging if somebody was actually like running
a room within the primary residence but it's a separate unit but isn't that what they're i mean
isn't the whole building but it's not like it's a separate so it's two separate units
it's yes yeah but it's in okay all right no i know it's in the same building but it's there's
these two units plus the commercial so if they're running a separate unit then as visitor
accommodations and the one being their residence that that separate unit needs to be visitor
accommodations all right okay so but you you're you're making basically an economic argument
but you said here you had only like three to five visitors per year and the rest of the time the
room is being used by either the college student who may come and stay when I guess they have
breaks or your children who live with you who may want to play in that room and you know and for
flowers so i'm i'm a little i think i'm a little lost as to um what you really anticipate is going
to be um the kind of rentals that would um achieve the goal that you were asking for this for which
is to help supplement the family income here with these rentals.
three-throw can be used to be used to use airbnb
Another one of the explanation is that it is two different types
This is no problem
Next question is you mentioned about the basic demand for the economy
But as you just mentioned
One year only three or five people
And for the rest of your children will be able to use the children
They can be able to get their kids
If only three or five people come here
我不了解这个在经济上面对您会有什么样的帮助。
没有没有可能刚才我没有说清楚我们是说parking的事情停车的这个问题我的意思是说会有三到五个这个guest他们会开车或者会在附近租车的意思不是说三五个客人。
When I mentioned the three to five visitors per year, that was referring to the parking situation.
Not saying that there are only three to five guests visit per year.
There were only three to five guests driving to the property or make a car rental locally.
And then they may need to use, they may need to park somewhere.
Other guests are traveling here through the flight or through the train.
They don't have parking need.
Can I ask that we take this to executive session for more questions?
Yes, I have one more question.
My question is about property management.
So when it's being operated as an Airbnb, do you plan to use a third-party service or do you and your family plan to manage the trash and the cleaning between the units on your own?
In the future, we may consider use a third-party management services.
Thank you. Other questions?
My last question is, is there a limit to how many people you plan to allow to stay in the apartment?
您有没有想过说这个出租最多一次能够住多少人?
Per visit, like at a time.
This interpreter, both of you are talking at the same time.
Can you please repeat your question?
Yes. Is there a limit to how many people you plan to allow to stay in the unit per visit or at a time?
就是每一次最多有多少人能够使用这个LDMD
不能超过五个人
No more than five
Michael, do you have a question?
No, I was just asking if we could take this back to executive session
The only other, I just wanted to confirm that this in fact is a distinct separate unit from the other unit that's in the building
Okay, all right. Questions or comments from our attorney, Hillary Emerson?
Not at this time, Mr. Chair.
Questions or comments from people in the room here?
Questions or comments from the virtual audience?
At the moment, there is no one on this issue.
The president just mentioned that this issue brought to the president's office to discuss.
I'm Paula Brumblo-Burns, and I'm here to testify for the Planning Commission.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
I do. The comprehensive plan recommends no change in zoning at this location from the existing
commercial mixed use, CMX1. There is no unique physical condition or circumstance of this
property that would prevent it from being used in conformance with the zoning code.
A 2020 zoning ordinance passed by City Council, which regulated short-term rentals, did not change
the basic rule prohibiting full-time use of a dwelling unit as a short-term rental. This type
of absentee management where the owner does not live in the unit has been illegal since the first
short-term rental zoning regulations became effective in 2015. What's changed since the
What's changed since the passage of the 2020 ordinance is that there is now a licensing and enforcement mechanism.
passage of the 2020 ordinance is that there is now a licensing and enforcement
The City Planning Commission recommends the board deny the variance for visitor accommodation.
Thank you. We're going to hold the vote on this.
We'll take it into executive session next Wednesday, and we will vote at 9.30 a.m.
So you're denying my application at this time?
No, I said we're going to vote on the next Wednesday at 9.30 a.m., sir.
Do I need to come again?
you should be
you can just dial in
you don't have to appear
we'll vote
and you'll hear the vote
what do I need to do
after your vote
you will be notified
Thank you so much for doing this.
No problem. Thank you for using our service. Interpreter will be disconnecting now.
Thank you. We're going to go over several cases that we don't have exhibits for.
Number two, MI 2023 001.
Excuse me, Mr. Chair. I'm sorry.
Can we just ask if there are any other requests for continuances first
that may get rid of some of the no exhibits. Thank you. Are there any other requests for
continuances?
Do we see anyone?
Good morning, Mr. Chair. Good morning. Could you please state your name and spell for the
court sonographer? Sure, it's Vern Anastasio, A-N-A-S-T-A-S-I-O. Do you swear or affirm
to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Yes, sir.
What case, Vern?
A 10914 Nandina Court, Mr. Chair.
We just had our RCO meeting late last night.
I need some time to go over the feedback from the community
and talk to my client who was not present at the meeting last night.
Okay, thank you.
So, number nine, MI 2024-001-169-10914, Nadine Court.
This case will be continued.
Date will be 6-4-25.
Thank you.
Thank you.
At 9.30 a.m.
9.30 a.m.
Any other requests for continuance?
I see no hands.
You said none? Okay. All right. All right. So, number two, MI 2023-001-026-4353 Paul Street. We have no exhibits for this. There is a Spanish interpreter.
interpreter
Spanish interpreter has been promoted to panelists
good good morning everybody my name is could you please state your name and spell for the
stenographer. Yes, my name is Leonel, spelled as in L-E-O-N, as in Nancy, E-L.
You solemnly swear or affirm that you will interpret accurately, completely and partially
from English to Spanish and from Spanish to English to the best of your ability.
I swear. Excuse me, this is, pardon me, this is the court reporter. May I please have the
interpreter's last name?
Yes, of course. It is
Guillen spelled as in
G-U-I-L-L-E-N.
Thank you.
Could you please call for us
Enrique Garce, the listed
owner, or Rosa Cruz, the listed
applicant?
Estamos buscando a Enrique
Garce, que
está en la lista con Rosa Cruz.
Enrique
Garce.
Garce.
Thank you.
Enrique Garce.
Enlistado también como Rosa Cruz.
Do we see any of one?
This is the interpreter.
Could you please repeat the name just to verify?
Enrique Garce or Rosa Cruz.
al señor enrique garcía o a la señora rosa cruz
enrique garcía o rosa cruz están presentes i see no hands thank you interpreter thank you very
much for your service so beautifully mi2023 001 026 4353 paul street i vote to dismiss
michael johns my vote is to dismiss
sorry gerald guest and my vote is to dismiss
tanetta graham my vote is to dismiss iowen my vote is to dismiss ishmael shaheed my vote is to
dismissed thank you interpreter excuse me mr chair could we have the interpreter just
interpret that into the record that the case has been dismissed thank you
muy bien sebo se pasó a la votación y el caso ha sido desestimado
thank you have a beautiful day
Number four, MI 2023-003-085, 3550 North 6th Street.
Frederick Mann is the attorney.
No exhibits, fourth listing.
Frederick Mann, if you're in a virtual place, please raise your virtual engagement.
I can't hear what you're saying.
I see no hands.
can we dismiss this one or do you want to hold it one more time
we just received notice mr chair uh late last night early this morning that there the applicant
no longer intended to continue with this case but they have not provided the appropriate notice
withdrawal so if we could continue at one time to give them the instructions for how to do that
then we can do MI MI 2023 003085 3550 North Sixth Street cases continued to 6425.
Number six MI 2023 006 439 2528 to 30 South 60th Street no exhibits third listing.
Chair, we have Craig Melodosian with a hand raised, and they have been allowed to speak.
Craig, please state your name as Bell for the court sonographer.
Mr. Chair, we also have an attorney on this case, Samantha Lyons.
I don't know if she is present.
Samantha Lyons, please.
So I know someone also been allowed to speak.
Good morning.
This is actually not my matter.
Zero three.
This is not my matter.
I do not believe that you just called the one I'm listed for as a different street address.
25, 28, 30 South 69th Street.
Craig Maldosian.
or the attorney, Samantha Lyons.
Craig, you have been unmuted, please.
Craig, please state your name and spell for the stenographer.
Craig, C-R-A-I-G, last name Melodosian, M-E-L-I-D-O-S-I-A-N.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
I do, Chair Bergman.
Please proceed, sir.
I'm appearing today, Ward 40 Republican RCO, coordinating RCO for the Southwest Philadelphia Consortium of RCOs. This particular matter has been before us several times starting back in 2018.
we successfully opposed it at that time we tried to work with this applicant again made some
suggestions that we did not get a response to no community meeting was held there's been a prior
continuance at this point in time based on rco opposition we have discussed it we would request
that it be dismissed thank you and mr chair miss uh i think miss lyons did speak she sent
Thank you. And Mr. Chair, I think Ms. Lyons did speak. She sent an email earlier today on this case, indicating that it was going to be withdrawn. Ms. Lyons, can you please come back on?
I believe she needs to be sworn in as well.
Sam Linos, if you're in a virtual audience, please raise your virtual hand.
they have been allowed to speak i could you please state your name and spell for the
sonographer yes good morning my name is samantha lyons first name s-a-m-a-n-t-h-a
last name l-y-o-n-s and yes i did email that we would like to hold on i'm sorry apologies
do you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth yes sir please
proceed. Just on this matter, I actually submitted an email this morning letting them know that we
would like to withdraw this matter. We actually did take the RCO's suggestions into account and
recognize that this application needs to be submitted under a different portion of the zoning
code. So we sent an email to withdraw so that we can set everything up as needed for the community
and as needed for the client and come back when this application is ready to be properly requested.
Thank you very much. So MI 2023-006-463-2528-30 South 69th Street, this case has been withdrawn.
Number 10, MI 2024-001-569-1840 South Camac Street, second listing, David Orfanides is the attorney. We have no exhibits.
Mr. Orphanides has been promoted to panelists.
Good morning, Mr. Orphanides.
Hello, good morning.
Please state your name and spell for this stenographer.
David Orphanides, O-R-P-H-A-N-I-D-E-S.
Do you swear or firm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Please proceed, sir.
Yeah, I mean, I had uploaded these, everything, I believed on Friday. So I'm a little surprised that you don't have them. I did not receive, and looking back through my emails, I received a confirmation on one that I uploaded on Friday that's to be heard this afternoon, but I do not see an email for either of these two cases.
But I'm not certain.
I mean, this case is simply the board granted variances for a project previously, prior board.
Construction commenced on that project.
That developer ran out of money when the project was partially constructed.
My clients purchased their property at Sheriff's Sale, and they're just looking to secure the same relief that was previously granted so that they can finish the project that's been sitting vacant and blighted for a number of years.
Mr. Orfides, we really just don't have any documents.
We're going to have to continue this case.
You have another one following, too.
So, number 10, MI-
Yeah, they're related to each other right next to each other.
So I'm going to do both because we don't have any documents for either one, and we're going to continue both, okay?
So MI 2024-001-569-1840 South Camac Street, cases continued to 6425.
And number 11, MI 2024-001-570-1839 South Eisminger Street, cases continued to 6425.
Thank you, sir.
Number 12, MI 2024-001-692-1108, Hawthorne Street, Joseph Bernardino is the listed applicant.
This is the second listing.
We do not have any, no exhibits.
No one appeared the last time.
Mr. Chair, just to clarify for the record, it's 1108 Haworth Street,
and the listed owner is Washington Caraballo.
And the applicant is Joseph Bernardino.
Is there anyone raising their hand?
I see no hands.
So this is the second listing.
No one appeared the first time.
So MI 2024-001-692-1108 Hawthorne Street.
I vote to dismiss.
My vote is to dismiss.
Cheryl Gaston, my vote is to dismiss.
Tanetta Graham, my vote is to dismiss.
Tana Graham, my vote is to dismiss.
Tywin, my vote is to dismiss.
Taya Nguyen, my vote is to dismiss.
Ishmael Shaheed, my vote is to dismiss.
At number 14, MI 2024, 001-816, 1951 North 4th Street, Christopher Wickham and Valerie Ashford are the listed owners applicants.
No exhibit, second listing.
No one appeared the first time.
i see no hands so mi 2024 001 816 1951 north 4th street i vote to dismiss
michael johns my vote is to dismiss charl gaston my vote is to dismiss
tennetta graham my vote is to dismiss iowen my vote is to dismiss
ishmael shaheed my vote is to dismiss number 19 mi 2024-005-357-839 airedale road david orfanides
is the attorney no exhibits first listing mr chair we continued that matter already okay thank you
all right um quick withdrawals
number five
number five MI 2023 004 271 566 Centner Street
Don Abraham is the owner applicant
there was incomplete request for withdrawal
this is the fourth listing
mr chair i just want to note for the record that the owner applicant has been sent instructions
two times for how to withdraw okay thank you so mi 2023 004 271 566 sentiner street i vote to
dismiss michael johns my vote is to dismiss charles gaston my vote is to dismiss it's not a
Graham, my vote is to dismiss.
Iowan, my vote is to dismiss.
Ishmael Shaheed, my vote is to dismiss.
Number 13, yep.
MI 2024-001-964-2600 Mulfield Street.
Joseph Consul is the attorney.
We do have a letter.
Am I correct, Hillary?
That is correct, Mr. Chair.
MI 2024-001694, my vote is to dismiss.
I believe that's a withdrawal, Mr. Chair.
Oh, I'm sorry, withdrawal.
All right.
Excuse me, Chair, Joseph Consul had their hand raised
and they have to vote it to panelists.
This case was withdrawn.
I got a letter yesterday.
Thank you very much, Mr. Consul.
See you in a minute.
So we're going to go to our add-ons.
Number one, MI 2024-005-238-1353 South Hollywood Street, I vote yes for a temporary variance, expires 1-15-27.
Michael Johns, my vote is yes, with proviso.
Charles Gaston, my vote is yes, with proviso.
Snetta Graham, my vote is yes, with proviso.
Tywin, my vote is yes, with proviso.
Ishmael Shahid, my vote is yes, with proviso.
And number two, MI 2024-005-319-2500 Federal Street, I vote yes with proviso.
Approved use is a sit-down restaurant with two-family household living.
I'll vote.
Michael Johns, my vote is yes with proviso.
Cheryl Gaston, my vote is yes with proviso.
Tanetta Graham, my vote is yes with proviso.
Tyia Wynn, my vote is yes with proviso.
Thank you.
Ishmael Shahid, my vote is yes with proviso.
We're going to go to our regular list.
Number one, MI 2022, 006213, 2551 West Silver Street.
Steve Masters is the attorney.
I understand we do have letters of opposition.
Good morning, Mr. Chair, members of the board.
Good morning.
Could you please, Mr. Masters, please state your name.
and spell for the stenographer steve masters s-t-e-v-e-m-a-s-t-e-r-s do you swear or firm
to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth i do but you identify your client
relationship to the property yes um my client is a latasha turner um she uh owns this property
via a LLC called RL Property Group, LLC.
uh and um she is our client okay our vice chair has a few questions sure good morning counsel do
And she is our client.
Okay, our vice chair has a few questions.
you agree to wave the reading of the refusal or stipulate to its accuracy um i do want to go
through the refusal but i do stipulate to its accuracy understood um have you emailed in all
the required documents and exhibits that's needed and required to proceed with this case five days
in advance of this hearing? Yes, we have. We actually do have some amended exhibits that we
are sending in this morning, but we will go over them as we go through our presentation.
I understand we were supposed to be received a tax compliance letter in prior to starting.
Have we received that? Yes. One of the new exhibits is a payment agreement for the tax
compliance we have not received the rco letter as of yet actually we did sorry we did this morning
we received letters of opposition from strawberry mansion community concern the coordinating rco
and swamp poodle neighborhood parcels association the affected rco thank you
um please proceed and share your screen okay will do
Good morning, Mr. Cherrigan, members of the board. I had hoped to be with you in person
today, but yesterday I got some shoulder surgery down in Methodist Hospital, so I'm doing all
right. The nerve block is still working, so I'm still working.
uh we're here today um on uh property it's it's 2551-2553 west silver street uh there is um
extremely high level of support for this application among the near neighbors but there
also appears to be um opposition to this project from the two rcos uh we have as we go through
our exhibits you'll see we have 42 petitions of support uh we have a hundred percent of all the
community members who who attended the rco meeting seven seven community members um all voted in
favor uh and uh this the opposition that that you'll see um is primarily not related to the
zoning at all but it's related to perhaps some issues that may come up with the building uh with
certificate of occupancy and and perhaps the board of building standards so i wanted to first go
through um our refusal and and talk about um the hardship um aspects of it here so uh we had to go
back to lni to get a revised refusal um the the notice um that's still in atlas for this matter
shows a previous refusal that is not correct. So this is the August 7th, 2024 is the correct
refusal. There are three use refusals. But what this is, this is a property that was originally
two row houses um 2551 and 2553 west silver um back in 2005 uh this pro this property was
was owned by the land bank uh or the vacant property review review committee i'm not sure
which one but it was it was a phcd uh property that was that was um conveyed to a prior owner
and we'll go through that in a second because there's quite a bit of alarmist
communications from the RCO groups about this but it was two single family row houses
it was a lot consolidation into one lot and because of that the single family
So we're looking at the proposal here is a single family apartment that is on the first floor, primarily of all of the, but not all, but most of the first floor of this combined unit.
And then there is another unit that is mostly on the second floor with one aspect on the first floor, and that is a rooming house for two rooms.
the single family apartment is essentially the same as the historic use when this was a single
when these were two row houses but we have a refusal for the single family apartment simply
because there are two uh two primary uses in this building now that it's consolidated it used to be
uh two primary uses in this building now that it's consolidated it used to be two row houses
and uh the the um as you'll see each of the each of the residential facilities does cross over into
into both of the of the previous row house separate row houses so that's um that that is
really the distinction here uh the single room residence with two bedrooms is essentially the
same impact as the historic use as a two-bedroom apartment. We have a couple unnecessary hardships
here. There's a substantial hardship to convert the structure. Our client bought this two years
ago. It was already divided up as it exists today quite a long time before, and for her to convert
it back to a single-family home, which is what the zoning is for this consolidated property,
would be prohibitively expensive, and so the courts have long ruled that that constitutes
an unnecessary hardship. There's a third refusal, though, and that is that when there's a rooming
house use, there has to be a minimum number of parking places. Two is what is indicated in the
refusal. We can't put any parking on this property because there is no open space for parking in the
front in this whole neighborhood there are no driveways or anything this is a row house neighborhood
in the rear there is no alley and there is no access for a vehicle to go into the backyard
so it's it's impossible to put any parking in this property and therefore that's an unnecessary
hardship uh the so i wanted to then um share the petitions of support um and uh this is a caveat
that we presented at the RCO meeting last week as well.
And as some of you know, members of the board,
I'm an election lawyer.
I do a lot of work with petitions at election time.
And you'll see that many of these petitions
have the same handwriting for the category of address and date.
But you also see that the names and the signatures
on the petitions are unique to each person who filled it out. So our client, Ms. Turner, will
explain that she had to go through a few iterations of the petitions because we, at first,
this application was for multifamily. And then when we came into the picture, we discovered that
it wasn't a multifamily project. It was a combination rooming house and single family
apartment. So we had to redo the petitions. And the neighbor said, we'll sign your petition,
but we don't want to keep writing up our address and everything. So that's why we have good
signatures for all the neighbors. But you'll see that the actual addresses, the address part of
the petition are filled out by our clients. So this is 42 signatures in support. These
addresses are extremely close they're they're all within the 250 feet um as provided by the
the planning commission um now uh before i go into the alarmist um arguments from the
from from the rcos i'm just gonna i want to go through um our floor plans um which are somewhat
um somewhat complicated and that and that was that was one of the issues that the that the rcos
uh we're struggling with um so we're going to go down to exhibit five okay
so um we have a basement that's unused it just has mechanicals um in the basement and there is
uh it's a two-story um building so the the salmon color is um is the single family apartment
the entrance to it is at the 2551 uh front door and you come into a living room the bathroom the
kitchen and then when you you do a dog leg to the left and there is the single bedroom all of this
is on the first floor we also have a rear door uh that that uh that opens onto the the backyard
and there's clear there's clearly places for the trash um to be stored in the rear and then to be
brought to the front uh on trash day this is all on one story although originally when this was
a single when when this was its own when 2551 was a row house and 2553 was a separate row house
there was a stairway uh that went up to the second floor um but as it
there was a stairway that went up to the second floor but as it is configured now the apartment
is only on the first floor and it and it's the entire first floor of 2551 and it is the rear
of 2553 now the purple bluish area is the rooming house space and that access is
We'll go back over to the first floor.
So it's accessed from the 2553's front door.
You then can either go left into a communal space or you can go straight ahead up the stairs to the majority of where this rooming house is, which is on the second floor.
So as you come up the stairs, you have two units.
One is to the right, where you have a door here that goes into the kitchen area.
The trash receptacles would be, we presume, around here.
Then there's the bathroom, and then you go down a hallway and you go to the bedroom.
That is what we're calling one of the units for the rooming house.
And the other one is you come up the stairs and you go to the left. You get into the kitchen through this door. There's a place for the trash over here. There's the bathroom. And then you proceed down a hallway into the bedroom.
so uh the entrance is as you saw on the first floor um there is uh at this time no exit um
from to there is no rear exit um from for this property the last thing i want to highlight is
the basement
access to the basement is through a stairway
but it is accessible to the
existing single family apartment it is
not accessible for the rooming house
so we came up with a
trash, let me go a little more, let's see we have our
zoning code analysis here
for open areas and occupied areas
that we are all compliant in
this is our elevations
our front elevation
this is the 2551
with the front door, this is the 2553
that, I think that concludes
our plans
Steve, do you have photos?
with it here come the photos so here's the 2551 front door uh the 2553 uh you see it's a two-story
building
this is um this is the
first floor bedroom um this is this is the single family apartment so this is uh this is
all of these are vacant there as soon as um we had a citation from lni for for lacking the proper
zoning permit and certificate of occupancy for this use and so this the this building has been
vacant for several years now um this is a photo of the as i said of the part of the bedroom this is
apologize apparently this is kind of a large file so it's been it takes a while this is the um
um this is the bathroom in the apartment uh this is the living room that as you walk in from the
front door this is the living room area for the apartment and then we have the kitchen
um for that first floor the single apartment on the first floor then this is the um this is the
common room uh on the first floor for uh the rooming house this is a bathroom in that common
room um it was originally used when when the previous owner uh had this uh was using this
property they had a third rooming a room on this first floor but we uh decided that that was uh
that was not it was not conducive it didn't really have a place for a kitchen it was just too small
so we've made this into a common area and the two the two rooming units are going to be on the
second floor here's where you go up the stairway to the second floor this is at the top of the
top of the stairway and here we have um the kitchen in in one of the rooming units unit one
stairway. And here we have the
this is the bathroom and the bedroom um off off of that room in one the room in one
this is the bedroom
and now this is oh this is the second bedroom
the second unit each each of the roaming units is one bedroom
this is the kitchen for that second unit
and the bathroom in that second unit
another view of the bedroom
and the second bedroom has a 20-foot square foot closet
uh this is the unfinished basement that is not going to be used for any residential
uh purposes just for for um accessory storage and utilities this is the rear of the property
here you have the exit door for the 2551 uh single family apartment uh and this also is part
is on that on that first floor part of the single family apartment as i said there is no at this
time there is no uh exit from uh from the second floor for the for the rooming house there's just
the front exit this is um up here is a is part of the rooming house second floor and this is a
window in the bedroom, or I think this is actually the kitchen area for the single apartment.
This is the right side of the backyard.
This is the left side of the backyard.
Our zoning posters for today's hearing.
um for our tax clearance this is the payment agreement that our client has entered into with
the city for 25 51 53 west silver um their monthly payments are 129.91 uh this shows
a voucher of receipt for um payments for uh this was a thousand dollars thousand seven dollars and
35 cents back in december 2024 and another receipt for uh that's the set 1,007 35
uh if that is not sufficient we can provide you with additional documentation for for the tax
compliance uh this is the deed uh that was conveyed to rl property our clients um
the application for appeal the the um the project information form and our rco letter
uh we mail this letter to i believe it's 203
230 uh first class mail proof of mailing so let's go back to now uh the alarmist uh
messages and communications that that started um uh just a few days ago although there was
there was some there was a fairly high degree of acrimony at the at the rco meeting between
the two RCO leaders and the neighbors who were all extremely supportive of this project.
So we received on Monday a communication from the coordinating RCO, and it was sent to not
just the zoning board, but it was sent to the commissioner of L&I, to the managing director,
to a number of city agencies with the allegation that this property
agencies um with the allegation that um this property was uh was unsafe and was um illegally
divided that that portions of the wall between the two historic row houses were illegally removed
so uh here we go that all that um all that is also conveyed in the rco letters
um this is not the this is the one this is an affected rco swamp poodle um in which they
oppose it and say that uh that there's unsafe and multiple conditions that are that are
unproblematic um and then the coordinating rco has a similar uh critique but you'll see here
for the vote count all seven of meeting attendees supported uh the only two that were opposed were
the rco board committees that was one representative of strawberry mansion
community concern and one from swan poodle um and that just happened uh last week
when we received uh this letter uh this was this is i guess a reissue of this letter that was sent
on monday um claiming fire safety hazards structural integrity issues legal and compliance
violations um all of these are really um there if this was true i would be extremely concerned
about this but it's also not within the within the domain of the zoning board these are definitely
lni issues that would be part of the certificate of occupancy uh situation we responded um on january
10th with the history of this property. So in 1996, PHDC applied to L&I to consolidate the two
lots. The lot consolidation application explicitly included plans to, quote, breach walls between
buildings for use as a single-family dwelling. In another document in the zoning archive, it says
first and second floor partition walls will be breached. These plans were approved by Gene
Klinger, who at that point was the head of zoning for the city of Philadelphia on November 20th,
1996. We'll look at the zoning archive momentarily. The zoning archives confirmed that the city not
only has been aware of the breach of the walls between 2551 and 2553 for almost 30 years, the
city requested the walls be breached, and this request was approved by the city zoning director.
So this is not some new situation.
This was the way it was supposed to be.
On July 29th, 2022, an inspector from L&I visited the property and issued a notice of
violation, stating the property for lacking proper zoning, permit, and certificate of
occupancy because it was operating in a rooming house on one side and an apartment on the
other.
After receiving this code violation, our client immediately filed the zoning application,
which is the subject of this hearing, and made sure that the property remained vacant until
these issues were going to be resolved. Very significantly, the L&I inspector did not discover
any unsafe or hazardous conditions when they inspected the property in 2022, and that's the
sole kind of allegations from the RCO that there's something dangerous here, when the L&I inspector
would have, of course, noted that
and not just written it up
for technical violations
of lacking a permit and a CO.
Again, the property is empty.
There are no tenants.
All of the neighbors who appeared
voted in favor of it at the RCO meeting
and 42 petitions in support
have been presented to you.
Here's the zoning archive
in which, this is from 1996, this is the application from Ph.D.C., PCCO and Ph.D.C.,
and it says specifically, I'm going to try to make this bigger, relocate lot lines to create
one lot from two lots, breach walls between buildings for use as a single-family dwelling.
Gene Klinger signed it in 1996, and then in the plans, or in the application, it specifically says
one-family dwelling, one-family dwelling. Both addresses will be merged as one-family dwelling.
First and second floor partition walls will be breached.
and its owner
is the Philadelphia Housing Development Corporation
the violation
the violation in 2022 uh was was um indicates that the inspector went inside the building he
in 2022
didn't just inspect it from the outside or i don't know if it's he or she um it it was and these these
are still uncomplied because we're in the process of of getting them complied rooming house with
three-room units on the left side, one apartment on the right. There is no other citations issued
that concern anything about safety or fire code issues. At this point, I'm going to
ask for my client, LaTosha Turner, to raise her hand and to adopt my testimony.
has been promoted to panelists good morning could you please state your name and spell for the
stenographer uh she may be muted
hi could you please state your name unmute okay my name's latasha latasha turner
could you spell it please for the stenographer um l-a-t-a-s-h-a turner t-u-r-n-e-r do you
swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth yes please proceed
counsel um miss turner you have heard my um testimony today do you believe that it was
correct and accurate and do you adopt it as your own yes um would you thank you um would you please
um tell the board um something about uh why you chose to buy this this building the way that it
was configured and let's start with that um what was your vision um i purchased i purchased the
building back in 2022 um at the time he already had tennis in it and at that time I didn't really
know what I was going to do with it he just was saying like the tennis had nowhere to go at the
moment I said they can stay but um at that time I didn't do no like um I never collect anything
because Ellen and I came out within uh I'd say like less than a month or a month after that and
told me what it was and i immediately he gave them till i think august or something to vet um
evacuate the um premises and then after that i went straight to lna once he gave me the notice
i had a hearing i think march or something other than next year or october that year or something
and they said i needed an attorney and that's when i moved forward with getting an attorney
to, you know, take me through the process of this case, but, um, I haven't done anything
with the property. So you do have other properties that you, that you rent, um, at this point,
right? Right. Um, can you tell the, the board what kind of, uh, what's your process for,
for picking or approving tenants in your properties and, and how do you, how do you
make sure that the tenants are going to uh follow the the rules and and and be good neighbors um
i i put my property through zillow and um once i put it through there i i don't know if it's true
or if you can do that but i i don't rent to young people um i try to rent to like older people like
people of age um just on the fact like i try to be want the place to be as i gave it to them
no nonsense i don't really have complaints i don't really go through nuisance none of them things um
i run the background i do all them things to make sure like they're a good candidate
and basically the the couple i have like the couple people i have they've been tenants for
some years it ain't like they've been on and off they've been there for some years
um so the the the bill the unit on the right side is going to be a uh just an apartment a
one-bedroom apartment correct correct all right and then on the on the on the entry on the left
side um that's a two-person rooming house yes um and uh oh actually let me let me go through the uh
the trash plan on for the for the rooming house because uh i forgot to cover that in our photos
here. Let's see.
Thank you.
i have not seen see what what you're looking for in the front of the house steve or behind
uh yes uh i we have a photo from in front of uh the the the neighboring property let me let me
see if i can hang on a second i think i can pull it up another way
I apologize.
So why don't you explain to us what it is?
Okay, sure.
The neighbors, I have a photo of the neighbor right next door.
They basically put their trash out right next to their stoop and their entryway.
um the we showed you inside um uh the the rooming house area where there's areas to put
the the trash bins in the kitchen and on on trash day they just put it right outside uh there is
there is no trash pickup in the rear so all the neighbors put their trash out uh right next to
their their um the stairway that goes up into their into their homes would you show us on your
plans i mean you have plans here could you just point to it yes
so in the rooming houses the the the trash you know trash um uh bin can be in anywhere
in this area in the kitchen for the unit number two and this is the trash area for unit number
one that's where they can store their trash during the week and then on on trash day they
will take out the trash and put it in this area and in this area that and that's I have a photo
i can probably uh it may be important to just uh locate it uh momentarily and just show you from
the neighbor that that's exactly what i think steve i think we understand okay okay so uh
questions from the board and can you go back to the floor plans sure uh we also apologize are are
the drafts person who made these plans is himself ill, he is undergoing cancer treatment,
and he was not able to appear as far as I know today unless my paralegal tells me otherwise.
Okay, here's the plans.
yeah so i guess my um comment is the plan to me seems fairly easily to be converted
to a duplex where they're two bedrooms or three bedrooms per floor so i don't necessarily see
the hardship of not being able to convert it um to not necessarily to a single family house
because clearly it was probably a four-bedroom single-family house,
but it could clearly be converted very easily
to two-bedroom or two-three-bedroom duplex unit,
which would make it look exactly like a row house from the outside
and not have the issues with the concerns that people have with a rooming house.
Well, let me explore that with you.
There used to be a stairway that was removed.
from the 2551 side because there's so there's no access i understand i understand i understand but
are you saying are you saying keep i'm saying that this entire first floor could be a unit
and this entire second floor could be a unit close off that door create access i mean i'm not going
to redesign it right here but right right there's it's fairly easily you've got kitchens already up
on the second floor you've got a kitchen on the first floor you know so it's fairly easy could be
So it's fairly easy to be converted into two two-bedroom units or two three-bedroom units and not have the issue and the concerns that the neighbors have with it being a rooming house and could provide some housing for a family.
convert it into a two bet two.
um okay i i would need to confer with my client on on that but but but to be just to be clear
we would still need a variance because uh because it's been consolidated it would be two principal
uses on one lot and that still requires a variance from from this board um but it would eliminate
the variance for the parking for the rooming house and for the and for the for how for the
the variance for a rooming house um no other questions more that's it yes i have a list of
questions one um i have a question of any construction has been done in the unit since
your client purchased the property in 2022 no she has deferred all of that until she gets the zoning
clearance okay um i just wanted to point out two things because you mentioned during your testimony
that there were no issues with L&I in 2022,
and Atlas is showing that there was a failed fire safety inspection in 2022
after the detransfer of the property that has not been resolved.
And so is there a plan to move forward with any fire suppression requirements
for the unit if approved?
Well, definitely.
I mean, if there are whatever the fire code requires
for the combination rooming house and apartment
would need to be implemented.
There's no question.
And then just from the photos that you showed,
it did look like work had been done.
There was like evidence of construction materials
and equipment in some of the photos.
Okay, let me ask Ms. Turner,
can you speak to that
if there was any work that you have done on the property?
I haven't done no work.
All I did was clean everything out the house,
out of each place okay and then are there any tenants in the property currently no once they
once ellen i told them they had to august of 2022 no one been in there and then what is the plan for
how many people per room on the rooming house side for tenants in the future i said one and one like
each place would be like one person okay are there other rooming houses on the block or yes
there are yes how many do you know i'm gonna say around like four or five of the houses on
that block alone or the houses on the block already are rooming houses all right yes thank
and then i think the last question i had which um do we know what the fire separation is in
between uh the rooming house unit and the existing apartment on the side where they both
exist on the first floor uh are you saying the the first floor uh let's see so there's a there's
a wall like where you've got the salmon and the purple right on the first floor do you know what
the fire separation is for that wall in between those units um i do not know um the draftsman
might have known that um but unfortunately he was not available today okay other questions from the
yes um can you tell me what size are these units um the single room residences as you're calling
sure okay because we have this the the apartment use oh not talk about the apartment okay so the
purple room residences all right kind of square footage are we talking about for each one of these
the bedrooms are 140 this is 140 square feet room two 130 square feet room one for the bedroom
We have another 20 square feet for the closet.
Maybe I'm not being clear.
Each one of these single room residences, what are we talking about in terms of total square footage?
I'm not talking about the individual rooms.
I'm talking about square footage for the units themselves.
uh it appears to be 140 plus 40 plus 80 for the first one um which is uh 260 and 130 20 90
to 30.
and then there's off there's that doesn't include the the the um square footage for the for the
bathroom okay and i guess um well comment maybe um single room residences i didn't
I thought that the idea of those was that you had to, you know, share some things that were shared, like kitchen, bathrooms, as opposed to these, which look like regular apartment units.
They're not, so I don't see the difference, except for what you're calling it, between these and a regular apartment-type unit, a one-bedroom apartment unit.
and um so you and then you have that other piece which you're calling a common room
common to whom who is going to be using this to the two residents of the room of the rooms upstairs
and what are they going to be don't mean well it would be like a common area for like a could be
there could be a tv there it could be it could be an area where where people can gather with
friends um you know it gives it's a shared space for the two uh living areas up up above
okay that's how she found the configuration when she bought this that you know she wasn't the
she wasn't the one who who created um any of this configuration she just um basically took
it on when she purchased it all right all right questions from our attorney um just one
clarification on the refusal it says three units but you're only asking for two units now for the
part of it correct yeah but um i am i'm curious um um gaston um if you believe that these two
units on the second floor would qualify as as as apartments then are you saying that if we
if we reclassify this application as uh three apartments um that that would that that would
that would be accurate they don't qualify as three separate apartments they just don't they
They don't. They don't. They don't. Okay. Maybe I wasn't clear, but they don't. And I agree with
board member Johns that there's a way to configure this so that maybe you could have a duplex there.
The idea that you have all of these, there's all these kitchens, there's all these bathrooms.
I'm not quite sure what this is really supposed to be, but what you're asking for and what's realistic there is a little different.
Yeah, we have to move this along.
Yeah, we're going to have to, we still have the community.
Questions or comments from the audience here, please?
Questions or comments from the virtual audience?
could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer
um good good good morning morning yeah good morning um mr chairman can you hear me
i can could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer good morning mr chairman
and board members my name is bonita cummings and my spell my name b-o-n-i-t-a c-u-m-m-i-n-g-s
strawberry mansion community concern and rco all right do you swear or affirm to tell the truth
told truth nothing but the truth i do can you turn your video on please my camera is not working
is it please proceed with your comments okay um i just wanted to say that although there
is community support, none of the community or the RCOs would be charged with the duty of
notifying our public safety families of injury and or possibly death in such a misconfigured
property. We did a site visit, and from the information you saw today, the property never
met its original intent, which was to become a single family property from possible.
Its original intent, which was to become a single family property from possibly maybe two bedrooms to each each one of those units, the 2551.
If an emergency situation were to take place, a police officer could go in that side of the building and be blindsided by what's happening down in the basement because he's not aware that there's a breached firewall in the basement that someone could come at him from another side.
But his partner can't help him because you're trapped on N53 with no way to get into the basement.
But the buildings present as if you're going into two separate properties.
So although there's mention of breached walls, there is no indication that these walls were meant to be breached without permits.
There's no permits on the L&I site that demonstrate that the persons getting this property ever met with the intention of what the property was meant to do.
So the property, in terms of just our emergency responders, is a very dangerous situation because even ambulance workers would go into a property that they're thinking is two separate entries, and it really isn't.
there's no egress from 53. When you go into 53, that first room off of that entryway presents
with like this small area and bathrooms and everything is right inside of what would be a
common area. When you take the stairs, you are trapped. It's like being closed in actually.
You can't really see it on the photos, but from a visit, you would be able to see that going from, you go up the stairway and you go across into 21, 2551, but you're in 53, which to the left is like this other little small space.
So it's a property that you could burn up easily because the firewall in the basement is breached.
And if a fire starts in 53, the residents of 51 are trapped or could easily be overtaken with smoke or fire.
Ms. Cummings, I think we understand your position.
So to say you're not in favor of this project.
Well, mostly because, too, it never met with what the transfer from the housing agency intended for it to be. They intended for it to be a single family property. It's never presented as that. And it gives a false impression that you're going into two separate.
Okay, thank you. We appreciate it. Is there anyone else in the virtual audience?
yes chair we have a number ending in 3552 and they have been allowed to speak
hi could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer
hello can you hear me okay i can yeah please please state your name and spell for the
stenographer my name is adrian fernandez swampoodle neighborhood process association rco
and my last name is spelled S-E-R-N-A-N-D-E-Z.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth,
the whole truth and nothing but the truth?
Ms. Fernandez, are you in favor of this project or against it?
Opposed to it.
You do have my written testimony.
I understand you want to keep things moving today,
being the first hybrid day.
I would like to read my testimony, but there's not time.
I just want to highlight the unsafe conditions with two breached walls where there is no engineering report.
We did speak to our inspector, who we are familiar with, and he requested that we call these conditions into 311,
which 311 decided there is a structural construction complaint and also a fire safety complaint with L&I for this property.
um the drawings are very confusing and also the photographs are because um luckily a strawberry
magic concern benita cummings did witness what was inside i don't think i would understand this
um property if she did not actually see what was going on inside and it's extremely unsafe
um as far as boarding houses um since 2014 because this property is two these two buildings
on one consolidated lot are in the swamp little neighborhood we have had no um zoning
are in the swamp little neighborhood we have had no um zoning appeals since 2014 for uh we've had
appeals for silver street sterner street but no none for a boarding house and no boarding houses
have been approved in our boundaries since 2014 they've all been denied so i do not believe there
are any legal boarding houses on this block miss fernandez thank you very much we appreciate your
testimony we're trying to see if there's anyone else in the audience is there anyone else in the
virtual audience planning commission comprehensive plan recommends no change in zoning at this
location from the existing single-family residential rsa5 there is no unique physical
condition or circumstance of this property that would prevent it from being used in conformance
with the zoning code. The planning commission recommends the board deny the requested variances
for single room residences, multiple principal uses, and parking. Thank you. MI 2022-006-213-2551
West Silver Street, I vote no. Michael Johns, my vote is no. Cheryl Gaston, my vote is no.
My vote is no.
My vote is no.
Thank you.
We're going to move to number 18.
If I could interrupt, I'm sorry.
We're going to take a 5 or 10 minute break
for the board at this time.
Thank you.
I know, but this is it. This is what's it's a percent when I get to that.
Yeah, I want to do the per se to get them.
Number 18, MI 2024, 0053563519 Conrad Street.
Kathleen and Joseph Patrone are the owners. This is a pro se.
Kathleen has been promoted to panelist.
Good morning.
Could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer?
Kathleen?
Kathleen, please accept the promotion to the analyst.
Good morning, Kathleen.
Good morning.
Hi, could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer?
Yes, Kathleen with a K, K-A-T-H-L-E-E-N, Petron, P like Peter, E-T-R-O-N like Nancy, E.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
This application is for use as a two-family household living in an existing structure
was that existing business and professionals offices on the first floor
to remain. The proposed use to family living is prohibited
in the CMX1 zoning district. Our vice chair has a few
questions for you. Okay. Good afternoon, ma'am. Have you
emailed in all the required documents and exhibits that's needed and required to proceed
with this case five days in advance of this hearing? Yes, sir.
Thank you. You may proceed and share your screen.
please proceed
okay i have um on this screen the uh notice of refusal we have that thank you uh-huh we have
your application yes we have your project information sheet okay the deed yes so for
clarification i'm sorry i'm do i need to get sworn into this is my daughter she handles a lot of my
uh she is the uh she's the one that has to do the testimony okay okay so just showing okay
doesn't matter that we have the deed why don't you move on why don't you show us photos of the
property and or planning planning you have okay thank you right there yeah that's that's the
corner uh that's on the main secondary business district and i have my zoning notice posted in
the front window thank you and this is the side window right okay that's another photograph that's
of the side on a secondary street.
I did put them in all windows.
I did put them in all windows.
That's a third window.
That's a third window.
Right.
We have...
Got all that.
This is your mailings?
This is the mailings?
My mailings to the neighborhood, yes.
There we go.
Why don't you start explaining what it is you're doing right there, okay?
This is the business that has been established there since 1975, okay?
um we we are zone cmx1 um i have four garages uh and the uh which which are available to
uh you know any tenants that would be in the building um we have occupied it um since 75
this is our family real estate business and um in uh 98 my husband and i purchased the building
from joe and jean machete i currently reside on the second floor apartment
the full length of the building with the deck out back
we have one uh we have three commercial spaces right now on the first floor and one apartment
on the second floor with four garages behind on the side we're asking one commercial space on the
first floor and two apartments one on the first floor to the rear of the business and then the
four garages that would be the change that the the entrance to the apartment would be along the
secondary street which is off the secondary business corridor it's difficult to to rent
these small places anymore and the real does the office remain or it's going to be the office will
remain in the front on the on the corner it will look exactly an apartment in the back
and then on the second floor right yeah i do have one on the second floor yes i think that
uh the one i do want the one in the back where two small offices were uh or are at this point
and um um you know it just there is the um the the entrance to the small offices and it does
look more residential than uh than commercial and i will change the windows with the vhhs in it to
just regular windows that you see at the third juncture which I've done in one office because
it was old but and here's a propose of what it would look like it would be a one small one
bedroom with a kitchen located on the left a kitchen and a small living room and then the
where it says two offices, that will become a bedroom with some closets
and an extension to the bathroom with a stall shower.
Patron, tell me what happened when you went to the RCO meeting.
When you went to the RCO for the East Falls.
Oh, yeah, we had a meeting on. Everything was fine.
I think Hillary's on here.
And you have a letter from them, right?
Yes, I do. Yes, yes.
and uh and uh hillary may still be on there he he's the head of the
is there anything else you want to offer yeah um well you can see that i'm surrounded by this map
here with all multi-family residential um here here are pictures of all of the multi-families
the houses that have been changed or businesses that were changed to multi-family there'll still
be a there'll be a commercial unit in the front absolutely yes yes that will all will remain
commercial yes thank you questions from the board i have no question questions or comments from our
attorney hillary emerson not at this time mr chair questions for comments from people in the room
and questions or comments from the virtual audience
planning commission oh you do okay
the panelists hi could you please state your name and spell for the sonographer
good morning good morning uh hillary could you please just state your name and spell for the
stenographer hillary langer h-i-l-a-r-y l-a-n-g-e-r you swear or affirm to tell the truth
the whole truth and nothing but the truth i do and you're from the east falls community council
I do. And you're from the East Falls Community Council, am I correct?
am i correct i am chair of the east falls
I am chair of the East Falls Community Council Zoning Committee. We held our public meeting.
There were nine committee members in attendance and approximately five neighbors.
There was no objection to the support of the partial conversion to residential use of the commercial ground floor space.
The important factor for us as the zoning committee was that the intent of CMX1 to allow for neighborhood commercial development at the street level is still maintained.
There's still a door, there's still two storefront windows, and the residential unit will be added well back on Amesley Street, as Kathy said, a secondary street.
So we feel the intent of CMX1 is still strongly maintained with this conversion we support.
Thank you, Mr. Langer.
Thank you very much.
And we appreciate you calling in.
Is there anyone else in the virtual audience?
Planning Commission.
The comprehensive plan recommends a change in zoning at this location from the existing
commercial residential mixed use cmx1 to a more dense cmx2 the proposed unit count would be allowed
by right under the proposed zoning the city planning commission recommends the board grant
the requested variants for two families thank you mi2024-005-356-3519 conrad street i vote yes
michael johns my vote is yes and you have a well-maintained and attractive
Cheryl Gaston, my vote is yes.
Snedag Graham, my vote is yes.
Iowyn, my vote is yes.
Ishmael Shahi, my vote is yes.
Thank you.
Thank you so much.
Okay, sure.
Number 15, MI 2024-002-165-1328 Fawn Street.
Jermaine Harris is the attorney.
there's a letter of opposition from protestants on fawn street residence letter of opposition
from burr home community town watch and civic association and there is a petition of support
good i'm sorry good afternoon good afternoon good afternoon
could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer uh sure my name is uh jermaine
harris that's j-e-r-m-a-i-n-e-h-a-r-r-i-s i am the attorney for the applicant uh melvin torres
who's also on this call to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth
i do and is your client the owner of this property he is okay and our vice chair has
a few questions sure good afternoon counsel do you agree to wait to read another refusal or
stipulate to its accuracy i do and we do agree have you emailed in all the required documents
and exhibits that's needed to perceive this case five days in advance of this hearing yes we emailed
it and we uploaded it thank you counsel please proceed and share your screen sure
okay all right so this is concerning uh 1328 fawn street and this is the uh
exhibit packet and i'll just walk you through it so this is a posting of the notice to hearing
today's hearing notice uh but this is what we're talking about right here it's converting uh
this property or getting legalized rather not converting but getting legalized a two-family
dwelling for this particular property so this is the front of the building
uh it has two garages well two garage doors uh this is the rear of it as well
and my client bought this property in 2022 right here and this is a description of it
uh when it was on the mls um he paid 330 000 for the property but this is the
what what it was this is what it was advertised as which was a two plus two duplex in the area
perfect foreign owner occupant and uh basically that's what it was advertised um lo and behold
he purchases the property and then he moves in a few family members and then he just
And then he moves in a few family members and then he discovers, unfortunately, that the property is not that the property is not, in fact, a two family.
It's not zoned as a two family. So, again, it's two by two.
so basically two bedrooms each floor first floor second floor and this is well
this is the these are the garage this is the garage this was this is walking into
the first floor. Walking and continuing. Bedroom, common area. Bathroom. Another bedroom. Well,
no, it's the living room. I'm sorry. This is another bedroom. I'm sorry. It was scanned
sideways somehow and then you go upstairs into the second floor which is
quartered off with an entry door to the second floor you walk in walk in the
door common kitchen hallway common area leading to the uh leading to a bedroom
kitchen this is another bedroom sorry i don't know why it's zoned sideways i mean it's scanned
in sideways right here but essentially we're talking about again two and two
uh this is part of the living room for that second floor
these are the this is the site plan for it again it's
the layout uh which has the front the gar the garage garages and uh let's see
we have the tax clearance right here
we have the purchase of the property shows that my client purchased the property in 2022
may of 2022 um for 330 000
dollars and we also have uh just a history a license history of what's going on on this block
so apparently there is a significant history of two family dwellings on this particular block
That are on the same side, same block. In fact, as this property, 1328, we have 1320, 1330, which is a two family.
we have petitions right here significant petitions signed by nearby neighbors on this
same block 1321 23 25 on the block and we also have the adjacent on the adjacent block 75 28
2524 Whittaker Avenue. We have the following block, which is 1400 block of Fawn Street.
Also, 1336 Fonts has a history of two family. 1334 Font Street has two family. 1332 also has it.
So basically, 13, 30, 32, 34, 36, all have a history of two family dwellings.
So this is not something that is a unique, this is not something that's unique to this
particular block.
Again, we have significant support.
Now, we do have a letter of opposition that was given by the RCO, and the reasons that they cite is, is that there were L&I violations, that is, oh, I'm sorry, here it is, here's the 1332, 34, 36, all of the.
34, 36, all of the two families.
We have the opposing of it because there are violations and that there are, notably that
they're saying are nuisance tenants, but there's no tenants that's there.
It's my client's family members that are there.
the L&I violations are the violations relating to zoning, which were present at the time,
and it's still present, of purchase. And he's trying, he's here now to try to correct that.
And so we would, I'm prepared to call my client to adopt my testimony, and we would open it up for any questions that the board may have.
Counsel, before you bring your client one, the plans include in the exhibit packet that the basement with two accessory garage spaces would be converted to habitable space. Is that true?
i don't believe that he plans on converting it to a habitable space but i will have him
testify as to that i don't believe that that's his plan because that's not
well are you that's not what he's seeing are you doing away with the garages counsel
the garages are there they're still there but he's not going to make it uh a habitable space
for a living. It would just be used
just for car.
So, Mr. Torres,
raise your hand.
Could you please
state your name and spell for the stenographer?
Mr. Torres?
Yes, I'm here. Could you please state your name
and spell for the stenographer?
Yes, my name is Melvin Torres.
M-E-L-V-I-N-T-O-R-R
yes you swear or firm to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth
i swear mr torres could you turn your video on please sure proceed counsel
sure uh first of all mr torres did you hear my testimony that i just made in front of the
board yes i did and do you adopt that as your testimony do you accept that to be true
Yes. Now, there was a question that the chairman made regarding the garages. Is that planned on being used for living space? What's the plan for that?
You mean for the garages? Nothing. It's just a garage for regular cars, regular entry for vehicles.
Okay, so you do not plan on using it to, you do not plan on using that space for living?
No, no, no, not at all.
Questions from the board.
I have a question, a few actually.
So for your client, the property was purchased in 2022, I just want to confirm.
May of 2022.
Okay, and at the time of purchase, was there ever any, like, review of the property status?
I'm just trying to process a hardship.
Oh, so.
Yes, go ahead.
So, well, I'll let my client answer that question, and then I'll answer the question about the hardship.
But I'll let my client answer that, first of all.
Yes, when I purchased the property, the real estate, it was listed as a duplex.
As you can see on the advertisement itself, it was a duplex with real estate and everything.
So she got a background, everything went out good, and I went ahead and purchased the property.
Did you run a title search when you purchased the property in 2022?
to yes that's what that's what i'm on the the which called the real estate title property and
everything was clear she said you got clear title okay yeah and and and and just to answer the
question about the hardship uh it would be significant financial hardship to with the
way that this property is fitted out to demolish this and rebuild it as a single family so that's
the hardship it's not something that was created by my client he unwittingly that was my actual
second question so my second question is what was the condition of the property at sale
it was a duplex of two apartments two apartments already there at purchase and then so i'm just
trying to process timeline so you because you received a few lni violations that looked like
that looked like it was for work that hadn't been permitted.
it was for work that hadn't been permitted and so i just want to confirm that you're stating
And so I just want to confirm that you're stating on the record
I don't know.
that the work was done prior to you purchasing the property.
And then you proceeded to move family members in,
and it looks like you got rental violations for not having a rental license in 2022,
and then again in 2023 for each of the units.
Can you explain to me why you didn't apply for zoning until 2024?
That's right.
The house was baking.
At the beginning, I purchased the house in cash.
I just left the house baking for a few months.
I wasn't ready to get things done.
So when I tried, then one of my family members, a cousin of mine,
moved in the first apartment.
So when I went to apply for the rental license,
that's when I found out that the house was not a duplex.
It was a single family house.
And I was like, no, I bought this house as a duplex.
So that's when I got the rental violation because I couldn't obtain the rental license because it was a single family.
So that's when I hired the lawyers to start the procedure to see what was going on, what was the process.
Because for me, it was a duplex.
I was advertising and I was buying for myself as a duplex house.
And when I went to apply for the rental license, I couldn't receive the rental license because the EFPs said it was a single family.
that's when I got the violations.
So then I had to move the people out from the house
and have the house vacant for more than a year already
and to get this hearing and see if I could get the zoning done
and apply for the rental license and get the procedures done as well.
And then my last question is,
is your intention for this property to reside on property
and then have an additional income-bearing unit,
or is it to have two units rented out?
Two units rented out.
How is it?
It was a duplex, two plus two.
Okay. Other questions from the board?
Questions from our attorney, Hillary Emerson?
I just wanted to know if, Mr. Harris, if you could go back to the plans, because when I looked at your exhibit packet, it showed an existing plan and then a proposed plan for common space in the basement with like a kitchenette and a bathroom.
So it looks like there was a unit proposed down there and that parking, which is required in the RSA 3 district, is being removed.
So I'm just a little bit confused as to why those plans were included in the packet.
Let's see here.
That certainly would have been an error because we have the testimony of the owner that he plans on using this solely the basement area as just parking.
So if a revision is needed.
Yeah, I was going to say, so I believe that's the existing, and then there was the next page that was proposed plans there.
Yes, I, yeah, I see that.
Can you make that bigger?
Hold it.
Jermaine, you're saying that
that plan was a mistake?
Hold on.
I am...
Well, it certainly shows it as a common area.
Yeah, it has it as common area.
It shows it as storage and.
Yeah, common area storage.
That's what I'm looking at.
And not garages.
It appears that the required parking is then being removed, which is not included on the current application.
The current application is only for a duplex.
so if if your client is proposing to remove the parking and replace it with storage space that
will need to be done with a separate application right there's storage space and common living
area too because that's a kitchen and a lounge yes also these plans should be updated to reflect
the current condition and not a future condition right so if you need the plans reflected to
to go with I guess to be consistent with what the testimony of the use of the intended use
is going to be we can submit that we can submit the plans for that
We can submit that. We can submit the plans for that.
But that's that. I believe there was an existing plan, though, that showed the go up back up one slide.
I believe it showed the existing conditions, but then it shows proposed conditions, which are not listed on the refusal.
Let's see here. So it's more an elimination of the proposed.
right because it has the garage here
but that's
and I believe
and Mr. Torres is that what the
intention
of this is to be is to remain
as just this garage right here
yes the basement
has two doors garage it's still empty
everything is clear at the bottom
of the basement everything is
And it's a two-door.
I just wanted to legalize the regular duplex two plus two.
It's nothing going to be done on the basement.
It's nothing going to be there because I'm even having a problem with the zoning
because when I purchase the house, I repeat again,
I'm not doing nothing with the basement.
It's going to be two-door garage for each apartment for each first floor,
second floor, and that's basically the basement is going to stay empty
because there's nothing else I can do there.
So it's nothing on the basement and nothing's going to be done on the basement either.
Well, Mr. Torres, I mean, how did we get the plans that you submitted?
Whose idea was that?
Because at the beginning, I thought it was going to be legalized as a duplex.
And I was like, okay, let me try to get an engineer and do a plan to see if I get approved for the basement to also have another unit.
but since I couldn't do anything
because it wasn't one single family
then I can't do nothing else so I just
stopped everything
Other questions from the board please
Questions or comments from people
in the audience
and questions or comments from the
virtual audience
Yes Chair we have Alex Udovic
with their hand raised and they have them
promoted to panelists
Good morning, Ms. Udovich. Please state your name and spell for the court stenographer.
Alice?
Is Alice's head still up?
chair alice is a part of the can you hear me chairman alice could you please state your name
and spell for this photographer sure good afternoon count uh chairman uh alice udovich
on behalf of councilman brian o'neill last name is u-d-o-v-i-c-h you swear or affirm to tell the
truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth i do please proceed uh chairman i did uh look
up the lni archives and clearly this property as well as the neighboring property were built
in the 1950s as duplexes there was never a conversion but we are concerned about that
third unit on the garage level because the neighbors are reporting that that work was
already done and that someone is living in that third unit basically treating this as a as a triplex
thank you so the councilman has no objection to it being a duplex
but only a duplex thank you um anyone else in the virtual audience
yes chair we have richard s with their hand raised they have been promoted to panelist
hi could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer
hello hi could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer
hi my name is richard shea r-i-c-h r-i-c-h-a-r-d-s-h-e-i
do you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth
yes i do could you turn your video on possible
I believe my video is on.
Oh, I see.
Please proceed with your testimony.
I'm here to protest this.
Just to reiterate what Alice said, we don't know that it's not more than two units.
And at the RCO meeting, we weren't presented with these photos.
We were presented with old photos.
And I'm also questioning the names on that petition.
Thank you very much, and we appreciate your time.
Is there anyone else in the virtual audience?
Yes, Chair, we have
Yes, Chair, we have
the master of our
with their hand raised and they have been promoted
to panelists. Could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer?
Could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer?
can we see the hand here they are part of the panelists okay could you please yes name and
spell i was the stenographer hello yeah please state your name and speak for the stenographer
okay my name is damaso last name rodriguez it's spelled d-a-m-a-s-o
so i'm the contractor and the advocate wait a minute sir sir you swear or affirm to tell the
truth nothing but the truth yes sir please proceed okay um i was in the meeting for the
community and i also on the applicant and the contractor on the project so to clarify
that the client didn't have no knowledge about the process on philadelphia so he hired us
to provide that information.
That's when he found out that the property
was a single-family home.
And the property is only occupied for a duplex
after he had purchased the property.
And the basement is no apartment on the basement.
He went and had that as a storage for himself,
but it's not an apartment.
I can confirm that myself.
All right, thank you for taking the time to call us.
Is there anyone else in the virtual audience?
Planning Commission the comprehensive plan recommends no change in zoning from the existing
residential single-family RSA 3 the proposed use is consistent with documented prior use
and appears to have been constructed as a two-family dwelling the planning commission
recommends the board grant the requested variance for two-family household living
with the required two parking spaces to remain thank you
mi 2024 002 165 1328 fawn street i vote yes proviso
two family living only parking places parking garages to remain can i request an additional
proviso can i request revised plan stamps okay no we cannot because it's a change of use application
Can we require a certificate of occupancy?
We can require that, yes.
Thank you.
So we'll go back.
Duplex, I vote yes to this.
Duplex, two units only.
Parking garages to remain.
Certificate of occupancy to be obtained.
So Johns, my vote is yes with provisos.
Cheryl Gaston, my vote is yes with provisos.
Tanetta Graham, my vote is yes with provisos.
Tywin, my vote is yes with provisos.
Ishmael Shaheed, my vote is yes with provisos.
Thank you, counsel.
Thank you, may be excused.
Yes, number 16, MI 2024-005-351-4242 Cotman Avenue.
Joseph Consul is the attorney.
Unanimous opposition from the Taconi Civic Association.
Letter of opposition from Council Member Driscoll.
letter of opposition to state representative
Patrick Gallagher and letter of opposition
from the state senator Joe
Pacozzi
Mr. Consul
good morning Mr. Consul did I swear you in
earlier when you came on? I don't
think you did I think I just
state your name just for the record Mr. Consul
yeah it's Joseph Consul
it's J-O-I-C-P-H last name Consul
C-O-N-S-O-L-E
you swear or firm to tell the truth the whole truth
and nothing but the truth
Would you identify your client in a relationship to the property?
My client is Bing Jing and Ping Jing, and they should be on here, I believe, under a Zoom for DaFung Chen.
And we should have an interpreter, Mr. Wang, hopefully still on the line.
No, we don't.
Hold it.
Mr. Consul, if you if your clients needed an interpreter, you need to make the request
to the zoning board so we can provide one with the name of the interpreter and they've
been participating in the Q&A.
That was an error.
We didn't realize they were not an interpreter that had been requested by the CBA.
I got an email from you saying that there was one that was assigned to us.
I got an email from you saying that there was one that was assigned to us.
There was, I got an email with two.
It said, it mentioned the one that was here earlier, the Mandarin interpreter, and it
mentioned my interpreter as well.
Did you put in a request for an interpreter with the ZBA?
Here, I got the email from fatigua.l at phila.gov.
yes an interpreter by the name of kate wang is assigned for bing jang at 4242 cotman avenue
okay all right thank you i did not realize there was two interpreters thank you
i'm not certain if please come on
chair we have boone wang with their hand raised not mike wang
would you like them to speak let's let's see who they are
you have been allowed to speak hi is this the interpreter yeah this is um kate's yeah i'll be
your interpreter today yes okay um could you state your name please and spell for the stenographer
dare they are coming in as a panelist thank you very much
yeah um my name is yeah bun wang w-a-n-g is my last name okay um do you solemnly swear
or affirm that you will interpret accurately completely and impartially from english to
is this mandarin yes english to mandarin and from mandarin to english to the best of your ability
Okay, would you please call your client?
Our client, please come on forward.
Bing Jin, BJ, Jen, 你在吗?
你好,你是讲国语吗?
你在这里吗?你在场,你要出现哦?
okay i don't hear anyone responding mr council is your client do you believe your clients in the
audience they've been texting me saying that they're that they're here um it's difficult
because we have to use google translate to go back and forth with it um but could you try
One more time, please.
I heard a noise.
对,你听得见吗?你在现场吗?
你好,你在吗?
Has been promoted to panelists.
Please accept the promotion to panelists.
请你接受,按可以那里哈。
Interpreter, could you have them state their name and spell it for the stenographer?
你可以把你的名字讲出来,然后把你的姓拼出来吗?
Okay, I don't hear anyone responding.
Excuse me.
请你可以把你的名字讲,然后把你的姓拼出来吗?
Okay,我的名字叫兵,我的姓叫J-I-A-N-J
你在这里宣誓所知的所有东西都是真实物所知的全部
Okay, everything will be true.
Thank you.
Mr. Consul, start your case, please.
Good afternoon, Board.
Joseph Consul here for the applicants.
The property in question is 4242 Cotman Avenue.
I'll preface this by saying we have immense opposition.
we believe, spearheaded by one neighbor who is not ever going to like my clients owning this
property. I don't know how to get around that. I'm going to present my case, which to me seems
like a fairly straightforward case. And then there's going to be immense opposition, which
I don't believe is warranted based on the facts of this case. 4242 Cotman Avenue.
Sorry, excuse me, Mr. Consul. Mr. Chair, Sean Ward did just enter his appearance in four.
um mr chair um sean ward did just enter his appearance in for neighbors for um i believe
for council member uh driscoll and as well as a neighbor so we should bring him on as a
panelist as well and swear him in thank you mr ward thank you
and mr consul does your client wish to have your presentation interpreted as you go
I don't, I don't know. Perhaps the interpreter could ask that.
Okay, so then you'll just have to break your interpretation into smaller pieces.
Excuse me, I'm sorry, this is the court reporter. I apologize for the interruption,
but I did not clearly get the applicant's name.
There was some crosstalk.
Could I please have his correct name?
Your name is written in the same way, right?
It's clear.
B-I-N-J-I-A-N-G.
The first name is B as a boy, I-N as Nancy.
Last name is J as a James, I-A-N-G.
Yeah, J-I-N-G.
Thank you.
Mr. Ward, are you the one?
yes i am mr chairman hi mr ward could you please state your name and spell it for the court
stenographer my name is sean s-h-a-w-n last name ward w-a-r-d do you swear or affirm to tell the
truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth yes i do mr ward could you identify your client
a relationship mr chairman i just uh issued my or submitted my appearance statement i represent
City Council, District 6, Councilman Michael Driscoll, the 41st Ward Republican Committee,
and Joseph McHugh, who is adjoining neighbor directly behind the subject property.
All right. Mr. Council, please start.
Okay. 4242 Cotman Avenue.
The zoning records for the four properties at the corner of Cotman and Walker all indicate that these four properties, that's 4242, here is the property across the street, and there is two more that match identically across the street in that they were built as multifamily properties with commercial uses on the first floor.
An important note for this property, 4242, there is no connection whatsoever by steps or any other mechanism, and there never has been, between the ground floor unit and the two floors above.
The zoning archive, going back to 1946, is two-family dwelling and a doctor's office.
Going forward through time, as you can see in this photo, and I'll zoom in a little bit, there was a doctor's office on that first floor, and I'm told by the RCO and the near neighbors that the doctor's family lived above that, and so it functioned as one residential unit and one commercial unit.
My clients, should he be interpreting?
That is actually according to the rules of the law in 1947,
it is already started from this way.
So the next one is a doctor's hospital.
The next one is where they live.
None of the properties on those four corners
are single family homes.
If we go back, this is an 1800 square foot property.
The other properties are similar in size.
uh 4249 um there was a hair salon and a one-family residence um the other corner 4301
uh was a um storage an office space and a single family and 4300 at one point was a four-family
dwelling with a tailor shop and an accessory garage so we're dealing with four corners that
have never been, ever been single family homes. And I think that point is salient because the
And I think that point is salient, because the way the properties were built, there is no connection between the floors to say that it could be easily converted back to a single-family home.
way the properties were built, there's no connection.
We look in the back of the property, we see that there is parking, and there is room for trash storage.
My client...
Yes, no, please continue.
So this is the house, it's the design of the building.
From the beginning of the year, it's already a design.
The inside is a shop, the inside is a living room.
Like 4249, it's a repair shop.
4301, it's a repair shop.
43100, it's a repair shop.
So it's all this design.
It's not time for him to do it.
You can't speak now, it's not your time.
windows, entrances on the side of this building that provide light and air to this space.
The previous use of the property was a six-office doctor's office.
It's a somewhat large space, and so what they're seeking to do is a one-bedroom apartment.
那之前是六个办公室给那个医生用的那现在就是把它改改成这个样子
然后旁边有空有的那个窗子各方面也有可以拍车的地方
所以是有这个考虑想要这种改变
对我的这个人他是想要做就是把下面改成一个一个房间一个厕所的一个那个客厅的一个方式
but yes um there's our certificate of mailing
the photos that we submitted showing the posters
exterior
back at the property
the interior photos of the property
and the deed showing my clients took possession in June of 2023
regarding other two families in the area while we fully agree that the properties off of Cotman
Avenue, our single family, such as the Protestants property. On the same block as this property and
across the street, we found two unit approvals for 4242. And granted, some of these are quite old,
but just to give an impression that Common Avenue does support many two unit properties, 4249,
to unit 4301, as mentioned before.
There's 4300, 4234, 4228, 4224, 4222.
That was a three unit.
What number is this?
And again, these are on the same side of the block
or directly across the street.
This is 4-2-2-5
4-2-2-3
There's two more
If you'll humor me
4-2-1-7
And 4-2-0-9
Interpreter
I'll continue
If you want to summarize that
This is the form of the file
We provide all the information
And there are all the photos
In front of the photo
And the photo
In the house
裡面的照片還有外面外圍的所有東西我們都提供了
然後在旁邊的那周邊的那些房子好像都有4242
旁邊好像有4249 4301 4243 4228 4224 4222
4228, 4224, 4222, 4237都是同一條街或者是對面街的
然後還有4225, 4223, 4217, 4209
這些都是在這個方面的,旁邊或對面的一些房子的架構
Mm hmm. And just to conclude, we understand there is significant opposition. We don't understand the basis for it specifically at the RCO meeting when asked what the neighbors wanted here.
There was no conversation for anything to go into that lower space, the space that is not connected to the home upstairs and never has been.
They simply did not want to accommodate this use.
In addition to that, there are unfounded allegations.
While I didn't get the letter to Kony, I did get an email.
There are unfounded allegations about there being an increase in rodent activity related to this property, some issues regarding parking, and we believe that these are just things being brought up to create a case against my clients, which we don't believe exists.
之前好像我们有开过会好像在RCO里面都是讨论这个问题的时候
我们不明白为什么就是对方会有就是不同意
有相同的相反的看法
那好像提出一些的意义
觉得好像说不够那个停车位或者是其他的原因
我们都觉得是不合理的
也是不合常就是那个根据我们刚才看的照片
各方面来讲都是不合我们刚才看到的事实
So we think this is not correct.
So we also have to say this,
and this is the next one and the next one
is not connected.
This is all divided.
So we have to have our own rights,
and we don't think that the other
same thing is to agree with.
Yes, I agree.
With that, I'll have my client adopt my testimony.
So Ward, would you want to present your case,
and then we'll open it up to the board for everyone?
i'll i'll turn off screen sharing to the extent that sean's interested in doing the same joe joe
before you do that can you hear me yes sir uh could you go back to the floor plans for me
yeah i i i just want to clarify um can we let can we let the testimony client's testimony or client
and adopt the attorney's testimony first, please,
and then we'll move on to any questions.
Oh, sure.
Sure, Hillary.
Interpreter, please ask my client
if he heard my testimony today regarding his property
and whether he adopts it as his own
for the purposes of this hearing.
Yes, I agree.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Joe, good to see you. I know it's been a while. Could you curse her up to,
you know it's just for my own edification i'm just trying to understand what what's going on
with the uh first and second floor i mean let's uh the former doctor's office is ground floor
yes sir right and then and then you got first and second floor what
do we have floor plans for the first and second floor or no there's no work being done on those
floors. My client can testify to the contents of them if you'd like. All right. And for
clarification purposes, Mr. Chair, I just want to get to the point of it all. The first and
second floor is a single family dwelling, or are you submitting today that that's a two-family
dwelling, first and second floor, and we're looking to add a third unit at the ground floor
level, the former doctor's office? Oh, certainly not, Sean. The two-unit approval I showed from
1946 was just to elucidate that, because several neighbors said that, oh, there was never any
multifamily approvals, and I flashed a ton up, including this property, which was two units.
I flashed a ton up, including this property, which was two units.
No, the first floor.
No, the first floor is a single family.
The doctor's family live there by all accounts, and it's not separated.
I just wanted to be clear that we're talking about a two-family dwelling, not one family to an existing two-family.
And so it's it's purely a two family, one unit in the former doctor's office and then the second unit occupying first and second floor of the existing structure.
That's correct. OK. All right.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. If I may proceed, I am here on behalf of Councilman Michael Driscoll, 6th District.
I also am entered my appearance on behalf of the 41st Ward Republican Committee, which is the Republican ward that encompasses this property.
In addition, I represent Joseph McHugh, who is the adjoining property owner directly to the rear.
We are here.
Can you just pause for, so the interpreter is interpreting the proceedings, so if you could just pause at different points, but if you could let her interpret who the clients are, that would be helpful. Thank you.
My apologies, Hilary.
Okay, this white man, he just wanted to ask you
your house, what kind of house you live in there?
He said, you changed the house after the bottom,
it's just one house, and the other house is just another house,
so it's all just two houses together.
So his meaning is that.
He also said, yes.
And he said, it's also代表了第六区的居然会,
and the member of the group,
and the member of the family,
so it's just the third part.
So he didn't speak his opinion.
He just wanted to check the details.
You want to your opinion first?
Well...
We don't need testimony from him.
sure okay all right thank you mr chair uh uh uh yeah again i represent uh the the three uh
parties uh previously identified and uh we are obviously opposed to this application and
And I believe at this point, if Joe McHugh could raise his hand, I don't have any testimony from district council and I don't have any testimony from 41st Ward at this point.
However, they are interested parties as protestants to this application
But Joe McHugh as an adjoining property owner
Who has previously submitted a letter
Or if I email to the board
I believe on January 9th
If the chair can confirm that the board has that letter
I would appreciate that
I'm going to take three parties today
I don't have a record of a letter.
I haven't seen one other.
In any event, I would ask that Joe McHugh raise his virtual hand and be sworn in.
Mr. McHugh.
Mr. McHugh.
Yes, sir.
Could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer?
Joseph, J-O-S-E-P-H, McHugh, M-C-H-U-G-H.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Please proceed, counsel.
Joe, you've been sworn and your testimony here today is under oath.
Are you testifying truthfully and honestly today?
Absolutely.
uh could you please identify uh where your property is uh with respect and location to the subject
with respect and location to the subject? My property is the official address is 7248
my property
Walker Street. I'm adjacent to that property. There's an alleyway that divides us. So
I basically face the rear of that property. How long have you been a property owner
on Walker Street? 41 years. And you are well familiar with the property located at 4242
Cotman? Yes, sir. In your experience, all right, strike that. Let's back up. Joe, you provided me
a copy of a letter dated, or an email dated January 9. And to whom did you send this email to?
I read this letter at the community meeting, which was chaired by the Taconi Civic Association.
and i think i may have given it to joe the attorney also i received i received the one
the photo uh mr mccue but not not a copy of your letter yeah i did read at the meeting yes sir okay
joe joe console uh you acknowledge receipt of mccue's uh yeah at least a picture of his email
correct oh no no it was a just a picture of two cars parked at the property
Okay, I'm sorry. Do you mind if I interpret this?
I'm sorry. I'm so sorry. I keep forgetting that we're translating.
I thought I spoke fast
My God. OK. Why don't we concentrate on your witness here now, Joe?
OK. Back to Joe McHugh. All right, Joe, you're well aware of this application.
And could you please describe for the board in your own words to get to the point as to what you observed at this site?
And we'll address the at least the four items raised in your email dated January 9.
Mr. Chair, I will upload a copy of that letter
and I would ask a board counsel to accept it as one of our exhibits
as I was just retained an hour ago in this matter.
All right, Joe.
Joe McHugh, I would advise you
speak slowly
take pauses
so the translator can
translate your words
into the
required language
for the applicant
对 请你一点一点讲
现在是让我讲
然后有空间让那个翻译员翻译
Sean, why don't you have your client start testifying, please?
Joe McHugh, back to you.
All right.
So basically, 41 years residing at the property.
You showed a really nice picture in the beginning of the property, which don't exist today.
I have photos, and you saw some of the photos that were shared, that were downloaded, and they scrolled pretty quickly.
And I'll put some pictures up also.
Also, there is steps that lead from the doctor's office to the kitchen area of the first floor.
They've been there forever.
Now, if they took them out, I can't help that.
But I've been in that property more than once.
They were my neighbors.
They were my friends.
They gutted that first floor doctor's office in the cover of darkness, I don't think with any permits.
And they also installed electrical panels for meters in the cover of darkness.
Thank God no one was injured.
And today there's one meter with three open holes for additional meters that are covered with cardboard, which is.
uh holes for additional meters that are covered with cardboard which is an absolute atrocity
because someone's going to be end up getting injured
object to that just in the sense that there are electrical permits on file that are public
for the public to view yeah but they're for inside not the outside all right joe joe pause uh
mr consul pause so the translator can
So Mr. Ward, if you would,
Could you focus in on why your client doesn't want to see this happen?
I mean, I think that's where we should be with it.
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Joe McHugh, as suggested by the chair, let's get to the point.
What is the history of this property and why are you opposed to it?
I'm going to bring them up now.
He's been one of the reasons they think it's so good to get the run.
Counsel, do you have these photos?
I have one photo of two cars parked in the back of the property.
I received the top photo at the RCO meeting.
Right.
Right. So that's that's the problem we're having with his clients parking.
The renters already started parking on the sidewalk blocking the highway.
And also you can see additional pictures of how they're maintaining the property.
They're absentee landlords. The back door of the doctor's office has been broke for probably over six months.
It just swings back and forth in the wind
And all you hear all night long
Is banging from the door
Joe, let me interrupt
Let the translator go
And then I have a question
对,就是我反对的原因
就是首先两个车停在那里
就是首先两个车停在那里
然后挡着那个高速公路上的那条路
然后挡着那个高速公路上的那条路
然后另外就是
你没有好好的管理你的那个房子
然后另外就是你没有好好的管理你的那个房子
到处都是数月
到处都是数月
然后而且后面那个办公室
然后而且后面那个办公室
就本来是医生办公室的门
就一直没有关好
就一直打打打
那些风吹来的时候造成很多的噪音
你没有好好的管理
Joe McHugh
Yes, sir
Let me direct your attention
and it is requested by the board chair.
You are the owner and occupant of the property
directly behind this property, correct?
I would like to ask you,
is he the owner of the property behind the property?
He said yes.
During the doctor's tenure of ownership and occupancy of that property,
What has it been used as?
Pause.
Translator.
This has been a doctor's office from the day I moved in, 41 years ago.
That would be the ground level, correct?
And what were the upper floors used as?
That's where the family of the doctor lived.
That's where the family of the doctor lived.
So, Sean, I think I understand that.
Could you go back again and focus on why is it that he doesn't want that here?
I know the reason.
Joe McHugh, what is the opposition to converting the doctor's office into
What is the opposition to converting the doctor's office into an additional dwelling unit?
为什么你反对呢?改建?
To begin with, we have no parking on the block.
They want to put a total of five or six bedrooms total in the place.
um septa just put in front of the property on cotman avenue a no stopping bus only that
encompasses four houses and all the people on cotman have to park elsewhere so this is what
we're living and dealing with they they they i've never saw this owner at the property you can see
to the condition that it's in, you want me to pause so they can translate?
Okay, yeah, first of all, he was talking about the停車 problem, he just said that there was a problem.
And then he said that he hasn't seen you there, he hasn't seen you there,
he hasn't been able to take care of your house.
I've been there, but when I was there, he didn't see you there.
No, you can't say that.
All right, all right, Joe McHugh, back to you, in your opinion and in your experience,
is there any reason this corner property cannot be occupied as a single family dwelling?
Well, we continue to have pest problems there. We've never had...
Joe, Joe, please answer my question.
In your opinion and your experience
As an adjacent property owner
Do you see any reason
Why this property cannot be occupied
As a single family dwelling
In accordance with the zoning code
And other adjacent properties
刚才他就问他那个原因是什么
他说有那些虫的问题
但是那个人又问他
你可不可以直接讲
为什么你反对他改建
It never has and should never be
Which was going to create more parking issues in the neighborhood
And the current renters are total disregard to the community
There's trash everywhere
因为一直以来就是从来都没有这样改建
一直我们都是这样用的
然后如果你这样给它改建的话
会造成停车的问题
然后另外就是这个现在这个拥有者
从来就没有很好的去照顾这个地方
你可以讲讲到底现在你的经历是什么
你要不要讲一讲
不是你 是他
uh we've never had issues with trash we never had issues with mice uh roaches and you could see
the photos i have taken versus the photos from the initial um display that joe the attorney put
on those bushes don't even exist anymore they cemented the front area took the brush out now
Now it's cemented area.
That's what they're leaving their trash.
It's just, it's creating havoc to the neighborhood.
For 41 years, this has been a nice place to live.
Right, pause.
Okay,对,就是主要的原因就是我们从来没有看过这么多垃圾,
然后有老鼠,有蟑螂,就是那些地方本来应该要放垃圾的,没有放,
然后到处都是乱糟糟的,41年以来都是很好的地方居住,
Now we're going to make a very bad situation.
Thank you, Mr. McHugh.
Mr. Chairman, I would just have some summary comments regarding applicants' burden and based upon the feedback from the community.
Questions from the board.
I have a question.
This is for Joseph Council
And I was just wondering
Council, could you have your client
Share what their plans were
With the property
When they purchased it in 2023
Do you want to ask
Your Chinese people
When you bought this house
In 2023, what did you buy this house?
What did you decide to do?
What did you say?
To do it, right?
rental property
okay and then understanding that
that purchase it was RSA 5
that purchased it was RSA-5,
so it was owned a single family
so it's owned as a single family.
did they intend to rent it as
Did they intend to rent it as a single family home?
I'm planning to make it as two single units.
So two different, you know, like family or people can live in there.
I didn't understand the current plan, but I was just wondering, at sale, what was the plan, knowing that the basement, or the first floor, sorry, the ground floor had been previously used as a doctor's office, but it is on a single family residential.
Okay, I'm sorry, I need to clarify something with him, this interpreter.
他的意思就是说
你租给就是一个租约
还是两个租约
就是你下面只是一个租约
一个租约就是一个家庭住
或者一个租约一个人住
那两个租约就变成两个分开的
所以你到底你是要做什么
我就是楼上一个家庭
我就是想把诊所改成
也是一个租给一对夫妻这样子的
What I was thinking about is
you know, the upstairs, I will rent it out, you know, for a family, and then downstairs will be
like also maybe a couple, right? So maybe a couple up there. So it would be two units, different.
Okay, and then what is the property maintenance plan at the site?
I'm sorry, I can't hear you. I'm sorry, what is their property maintenance plan for the site?
那你想打算怎么去管理这个单位呢
因为如果我租出去
我会要求楼下这个人
他门口的卫生他要搞清楚
因为他一到秋天的时候
风很多都吹过来
很多人过路没有数字
垃圾都是扔在我那边
我会要求客人把我门口清理干净
但是因为我下面没有租出去
也是停在那里
然后我有过去搞一下为什么
是后来没有看到
但是他没看到
风一直往那边吹
那边地势很低
风一直把垃圾往这边吹
为什么很多树叶都吹到我家门口来
就是这样子嘛
Yeah, because now what happens is
What's happening is
No one lives there now, it's vacant
So no one can do the cleaning work
I go there sometime
But they didn't see me, okay
But you know, once I lease it out
i would talk to the tenant and ask them to clean up to do things right because now no one's there
so the wind will blow everything to or that direction and accumulating you know all type
of trash but um i i did i i went there sometime but they didn't see me i don't know i understand
that he's not there now i think my question is more so what is the intent and plan when there
are tenants i think also understanding that when this was purchased there was a commercial space
that was not at the time legal under its current state on the first floor
and just wanting to understand like what was the plan for the property and purchase
and what is the plan for it for maintenance moving forward
given the comments that have come from the community
对 就是你应该买的时候你就知道下面就是一个商用的
那现在有很多人投诉嘛 说不干净
然后当你买你想租租的时候
那你到底是你的计划说要怎么去维持那些整洁干净呢
你的计划是什么要怎么做
就是确保那里是干净
我确保就是我有计划把它租出去以后
如果它下面变成一个竹琴
我把盘贴那个土变成了水泥
然后以后它直接那扫会比较干净一点
因为中间那些土嘛
它很容易滋生,很多人就是过路把垃圾都是扔在那边土里面嘛,然后如果把这些变成了水泥,然后看过去会清洁一下,然后分吹那边呢,我肯定就是也要把后面那个门给换一下,因为不行的嘛,分的就是吹在那里嘛,很多垃圾分吹过来,再说这里人来人往,很多人都是不知道为什么都是垃圾随处扔,
So, a lot of people don't know why.
They don't know why.
They don't know why.
They don't know why.
Now, I'll forgive you
They don't know why.
They don't know why.
They don't know why.
So, two things I'm going to do.
One thing is, you know, the muddy area, I'm going to change it, turn it into like concrete,
you know, cement, right?
Make it like easier to manage and make it very clean.
And then another thing is I'm going to fix that door, close it, and also like make sure
my tent will clean up well.
And also like, because now, because, you know, a lot of wind blowing.
So, you know, keep pushing all the trash to it that way.
So we'll definitely do something to make it nice.
The question is from the board.
Oh, okay.
Actually, I have one more question.
So my last question is, as far as you understood,
what was the last time that the doctor's office was in active use?
I really don't know
I didn't ask them
when they were still practicing
so after I bought it
but I didn't ask him so I don't know
questions from our
attorney Hillary Emerson
not at this time Mr. Chair
comments from anyone in the audience
can I speak again
Sean can I speak again
that's up to the chair
Mr. Chair
I want to speak to you
stay your name
how are you
first laugh of it
excuse me this is the court reporter i'm having difficulty hearing i know we don't have it on yet
we should have now there we go i could you just state your name
from the taconi civic association the rco spell your name please l-a-b-o-v-i-t-z right okay all
right all right hold on hold on do you swear or affirm to tell the truth told truth nothing but
the truth i do please proceed sir and we've had a lot of testimony about this let me ask you this
are you for or against this project i am the rco okay all right okay all right all right we we go
into the meeting as a mediator uh which i believe is how we're supposed to do that right um there
was substantial opposition from the neighbors i think a lot of the problem was communication as
can see with the translator it's difficult we had no translator at our rco meeting right so
the issue that taya brought up about property management was something that
we tried to address at the meeting i'm sorry
and we couldn't get clarification about that because that was a concern okay uh
are you in favor of this project so we were opposed to it because we couldn't get
clarification on how the property would be managed because the main complaints were
that there was a rodent issue that was trash which to me sounds property like a property
management issue okay uh so that's why and because we couldn't get a clear answer
it was tough to go on an assumption that someone promises that yeah we're going to do that but we
really don't know because the communication just was not there so so i mean we appreciate you
waiting around. A lot of what I would have said
was what we said. I know. I just have to
go ahead. Give me one more. I have to
break soon. All right. A lot
of... I waited since
9 o'clock, so I'm good here. I know you did.
I'm going to take a minute, so
not long. A lot of properties similar
to this from that area
and west
are CMX1 properties.
This property across the street
that you notice is a CMX1.
The only multifamily
properties that are on the Atlas
are about two blocks away now joe the attorney for the applicant said there's other properties
across the street i just checked on my phone there are some that say that they are not exempt
from home uh taxes so my guess is they're multi-family and not owner-occupied the atlas
isn't very clear about that and i don't take you i i just contacted someone to find out how i can
do a better job at that. But the other end of this block, 4,200, I believe, or 4,222 is CMX1 also.
And the first floor is a rented apartment. It's not commercial anymore. So I think a lot of that
fear is that this property will turn into a triplex. Okay. Thank you. I just want to make
that. Thank you very much. Thank you for your time. I appreciate you staying around. Is there
anyone else in this? I'm sorry, Mr. Chair. This is the court reporter. I apologize. I did not get
the witness's name clearly okay sure we'll do it again yeah i kind of brushed you that i apologize
Chris Labovitz, L-A-B-O-V-I-T-Z, just like it sounds, thank you very much.
chris labovitz l-a-b-o-v-i-t-z
First name again? Chris, is there anyone? Sure. An interpreter, can you please interpret?
類型的房子規格的
就下面本來都是那種商用
你的律師說隔壁其實也有一些
那後來看到有些是有
但是在過去幾個條街啊
也有一些是改過的
但是那些地方就是也是啊
稅收稅的情況也不一樣啊
所以其實這個東西就是說
沒有很好的溝通啦
那主要就是解釋一下這個啊
Thank you very much
Thank you very much
Is there anyone in the virtual audience?
I see no hands there the word Mr Ward I I'm really gonna have to break I mean we're getting ready
for the next group to come in uh I was gonna ask the chair do you need anything else for me other
than the fact that I think we understand where you are we understand where your witnesses were
all right uh chair members of the board I thank you for your attention and uh you know consideration
of this application planning commission the comprehensive plan recommends no change at this
location from the current residential single family rsa5 the previous use for this proposed
conversion was an accessory doctor's office in the lower level unit granted in 1946 this proposal
would create a new residential unit in a space that was not previously used that way the planning
commission recommends that the board deny the requested variance for a two-family residential
use thank you very much chair chair just one other uh matter for the record uh could could
you keep the record open for me to submit uh supporting documents for our position and only
that yeah um or are you ready to decide this right now so hillary is is the board prepared to vote on
this now, or is it going to hold it first?
Mr. Ward, I think we understand this
case. Okay, very good.
What I want to do, listen to me, what I'm going to do is
there's been a great deal of testimony.
I'm going to take this to an executive session next
Wednesday, let the board go over this,
and we'll vote 9.30 a.m. next
Wednesday. All right, and in light of that,
in light of that, Chair,
may I submit
through the web portal
opposition supporting documents
to this case?
My concern about that is that then we, I mean, we, we can do that,
but Mr. Consul would also need a chance to respond to that.
So Mr. Consul, what's your comments here?
Besides everything I've said, I'm fine. If Sean does that, I don't know.
My response would take me to submit. You can submit them if you want.
Yeah. And, and, and, and listen to me, listen to me, listen to me,
listen to me and make sure Mr. Consul gets a copy of it. Okay.
Yeah, I mean, they're a matter of public record.
They're not generating.
I know.
We don't have to make an argument.
We understand.
All right.
We're breaking.
We got to get ready for the next group.
Can I do the interpretation?
Give them an idea of where we are.
What we're going to do is take it to executive session Wednesday, and we will vote next Wednesday
at 930 a.m.
And, Mr. Chair, I would just recommend that any documents that Mr. Ward wishes to be
submitted by close of business on friday thank you no objection okay no objection i'll interpret yeah
提议就是说否定你的申请但是后来那个委员主席就说还是把它拿到
那个行政机关下个礼拜三九点半早上全部投票来通过看看结果怎么样
uh对就是刚才整个东西就是说大家决定怎么样那本来那个秘书就是说
And the teacher said that he will send more information and documents to make sure he will send you to the court.
And he will send you all the information on the 5th of July.
And next week, it's 9 o'clock in the morning, he will vote.
Next week.
Interpreter, thank you very much.
I'm sorry, is it next Wednesday? Just wanted to make sure to clarify the date.
Next Wednesday at 9.30am we will vote.
This Wednesday or next?
today's wednesday next one next one okay all right
today's wednesday next one next one okay all right and but it's
interpret we do appreciate the work that you do with this we really do
is there anyone in the virtual audience whose case has not been called
okay everybody have a nice long lunch we'll see you at two o'clock
no hands mr chair okay thank you for using our services you have a good day
and thank you we really do you did do a great thank you thank you
good afternoon everyone uh my name is bill bergman i will be hearing the meetings and i
would tell you this is the first time in five years that we've had attorneys in a room we
don't have anybody here this morning. First time in five years, I guess it is. Sound right?
Okay. So, good morning. Oh, afternoon. I'm sorry. We'll be changing this meeting
at the Philadelphia Board. I will be chairing this meeting at the Philadelphia Board of
Adjustment. With me is Cheryl L. Gaston. Present, Mr. Chairman. Tanetta Graham. Present,
Mr. Chairman.
And Taya Nguyen.
Present, Mr. Chairman.
Also here is Hillary Emerson, our attorney,
Ian Haggerty, the executive director of the zoning board,
and Lakeisha Dandy, our supervisor.
Please be advised this meeting is being recorded.
Your participation in this meeting indicates you consent to be recorded.
The video will be posted on the ZBA website approximately one week following the meeting.
This meeting is being held in person with remote capabilities,
meaning that individuals can participate either in person at the hearing room in one parkway
building or remotely over zoom when you are recognized to speak by the board please state
and spell your name to the court reporter and then wait to be sworn in if you are in the hearing room
you must speak into a microphone so that everyone in attendance including the court reporter can
hear you. If you're participating remotely, please turn on your camera and unmute yourself
when you are recognized to speak. Once you've been sworn in, please state your name each time
before testifying, whether you're in person or remote, so that the court reporter knows who is
speaking. Please mute yourself to turn off the microphone when you're not speaking. If you're
participating by phone, press star nine to raise your hand and star six to unmute. If you're
participating by phone, please call 267-270-5548 to register your appearance by the close of the
business day after the hearing. You must provide an email address and the address of the property
in question. All others can enter their appearance through the Zoom registration. For individuals
participating in person, a QR code is available to register your appearance. For assistance,
please see a staff member at the back of the hearing room. If you have any questions about
how to enter your appearance please contact rcozba at phil.gov if you're in the hearing room
please refrain from talking or engaging in conversation while the hearings are proceeded
please note that there is no drinking or eating in the hearing room in addition verbal and
physical aggression will not be tolerated if you're participating remotely remember the q a
on the zone platform is not for testimony or comments. Any comments related to the hearing
operation should be directed to ZBA executive director at phil.gov. Before we begin, our
executive director, Ian Haggerty, has important safety announcements to make.
All right. Thank you, Chair. Good afternoon, everyone. For the folks in the room, just want
to remind you the safety of everyone here in the meeting is our highest priority. In the event that
there is an emergency alarm or other type of emergency in the room, please pay attention
to the announcements on the loudspeaker. Those will provide detailed information
and instructions. If no announcement is heard, please follow the directions of security officers
or the ZBA staff. The main exit will be the double doors located at the rear of the room where you
came in. If an order is given to evacuate this room, the nearest stairway is to the left outside
those double doors follow the illuminated red exit signs to reach the stairway if an order is
given to evacuate the building for any reason our rally point will be at love park directly across
art street from the main entrance to this building please remain at the rally point so you can be
accounted for and as a reminder restrooms are located across from the elevators and there's
a water fountain just outside the double doors to the right thanks so let's look at our schedule
So, let's look at our schedule. Number 11, MI 2024, 006-181-6649 Tulip Street. That case is continued. Are there any other requests for continuance?
Number 11, MI2024.
Good afternoon, Chair. This is Jason Hand. I will be standing in temporarily as co-host. I have a hand up from Mr. Vernon Anastasio. He's been allowed to speak.
Good afternoon, Counsel.
Good afternoon, Mr. Chair.
Just for the record, state your name.
I believe you've already been sworn.
Yes, sir.
It's Vern Anastasio, A-N-A-S-T-A-S-I-O.
I have two requests, Mr. Chair.
One is number two, MI 2024-006-123-1329 Princeton.
That's correct.
Excuse me, Chair.
Was Mr. Anastasio sworn?
He was sworn this morning.
Thank you.
um burn could you tell us what the status of this case is yeah mr general we were prepared
uh i did not get information from the rco uh thanks to attorney emerson uh i was able to receive
rco feedback just about an hour or so ago there are items in there that need to be addressed
As a result, we're going to need to continue this so that we can re-engage based on the feedback that I was unexpecting.
So that's where we are with that.
So this case will be continued to 5-7-25.
Thank you.
Are there any other requests for continuance?
I have one more, Mr. Chair.
Go ahead.
2068 East Somerset, please.
There was the RCO first assigned was unable to to accept us on their agenda.
It was reassigned at the sort of the 11th hour and they have been unable to meet with us.
Right. So that case is going to be continued also to five seven twenty five.
And that's MI twenty twenty four zero zero six one seven seven twenty sixty eight East Emerson Street.
Thank you.
Thank you.
I'm going to go start with number 13, I believe.
Right?
So, MI 2024-006-961, 1501-13 North 9th Street, Augusta O'Neill is the attorney.
Counsel, could you please state your name and spell for the court's sonographer?
You swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Could you identify your client in relation to this property?
I apologize, Mr. Chairman.
I am not hearing attorney O'Neill.
Can you hear me now?
Yes, I can.
Sorry, it was deceptive.
it looks green so i thought you do it one more time please sure my first name is augusta a-u-g-u-s-t-a
last name is o'neill o-n-e-i-l-l with the law firm claire harrison harvey bransburg
you stipulate to the reading of the refusal and agree with its accuracy i do um please uh start
your presentation thank you so much mr chair uh good afternoon members of the board i'm here this
afternoon representing f-e darien llc they're the owner of the property at 1501 north 9th street
this is an rm1 zone property it's in the fifth district overlay currently it is a vacant lot
this is an application that's in partnership with turn the key it's an application to consolidate
four parcels to then adjust lot lines to create 14 separate lots and construct a single family home
on each lot with a roof deck uh i'll be recusing i'll be recusing i'm sorry i'll be recusing from
this from this project michael johnson has recused himself from this
um we did receive a refusal which i've provided at tab one of my exhibit package
the refusal that we received related to the lot size of the proposed lots as you can see in the
refusal we're required to have a lot size of 1440 square feet the lot sizes that are being proposed
range from 784 being the smallest and go up to 850 I'm sorry 862 is the largest lot these are
generously sized houses despite the lot size despite the fact they're requesting a variance
despite the fact they're requesting a variance for the lot size.
for the lot size as you can see from the
As you can see from the zoning plan that I provided at tab 8 of my exhibit package,
each of the homes that are being proposed range from 1,400 square feet to 1,659 square feet.
Just as an aside, that's actually larger than the house I live in now.
so just for the boards um just to take the board through the project that's being proposed um tab
nine of my exhibit package i provided an elevation just showing what um typical houses look like
that are constructed by the frankles they frequently partner with turn the key on these
applications i believe the board has seen me here several times before on similar applications
provided at tab 10 these are again just pictures showing the kind of prototypical projects that
the frankles have constructed in partnership with turn the key there were interior pictures
provided just showing again samples of the kind of high quality work that they're doing
on these single-family homes they have stainless steel appliances beautiful flooring they have
three bedrooms um and also included in those pictures just again for the boards edification
um was a picture of the typical kind of a backyard that um the frankles are providing with these
projects my clients um and again another picture of the typical exterior of one of these um single
family homes that they're providing at tab 11 of my exhibit package i did provide the board with
some sample floor plans as you can see you walk into the house and there's kitchen dining room
area living room on that first floor the second floor the typical floor plan has two bedrooms
a bath two fairly large sized bedrooms then the third floor there's an additional bedroom
bathroom, a bath, in addition to the roof deck.
Can we kind of catch up with the presentation here?
What's on the screen?
It's not what you're talking about.
Oh, I'm sorry.
I thought it was...
Yeah, I was looking at my paper.
Yes, you were looking at your paper.
Sorry, I thought it was good.
So, lesson learned.
next time i'm going to bring my computer so that i can navigate this so apologies i think i was
misled you about what i was going to go through beforehand so you're probably trying to
catch up um so this is just a typical um project that the frankles have done this just shows the
good quality work the exterior is a beautiful brick facade um if you go up
this is typical backyard of some of the other projects that the frankles have done in partnership
with Turn the Key. These were just exterior pictures. I'm sorry, interior pictures. Again,
just showing the bedrooms. This is a picture of the kitchen. See the beautiful stainless steel
appliances. This is a picture of typical dining room area. Living room. Oh, that's a bedroom.
Again, just a larger size of the appliances. Another picture of the exterior.
and then if you want to go to oh and this was a picture of the the rendering
was rendering it just showing again um typical to what frinkle enterprises is doing and then
if you want to pull up tab 11 i'll just go through the floor you said something about a floor plan
yeah oh um you're right there
so it's probably 73. there it is yeah
all right if you you're just there yeah those three i think okay so if you can blow that up
74 there we go
okay so if you walk into the first walk into the front door you immediately walk into the living
room then there's that kitchen dining room and then there's a door that leads out to the backyard
typical to the backer that i just showed pictures of if you want to go to page 75
that's a typical second floor two bedroom two bedrooms two pretty oversized bedrooms
the bath and then if you go to the third floor
there's a bedroom a bath and then you get out onto the roof deck from there
um my clients did meet with the affected rco for this property the jefferson manor um
on december 11th they did receive a letter of support thank you they received a letter
on december 11th they did receive a letter of support thank you they received a letter of
support which i provided to the board a tab two of my exhibit package um also provided which would
probably be page three or four there we go great perfect um that's just a letter of support that
was provided by the affected rco tab three we provided a letter of non-opposition from councilman
Jeffrey Young's office. Just to briefly run the board through the variant standard. The application
that's being presented today is not going to injure the use of adjacent property. Currently,
this is a vacant lot that we're going to be constructing these single-family homes on.
It will not increase the congestion in the streets. These are single-family homes that
neighborhood is in support of it will not burden the public facilities nor negatively impact the
public health in fact or the general welfare the contrary we're taking a vacant lot which
can frequently be a site of drug use or other crime and we're going to be putting these beautiful
single-family homes on it the fact that it's supported by the rco and the affected council
person i think speaks the fact that this is clearly something that the community and the
council person views as a benefit to the community um with me this afternoon is uh zach frankel
frankel enterprises if the board would like me to come forward yep uh zach are you listening this
afternoon or max frankel i have been about to speak i am here yes i could you please it's
could you please state your name and spell for the sonographer my name is zachary frankel that's
spelled Z-A-C-H-A-R-Y-F-R-A-N-K-E-L.
Do you swear or affirm that tell the truth,
the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Please proceed, counsel.
Mr. Frankl, did you have an opportunity
to hear my testimony this afternoon?
I did.
And was everything that I said true and accurate?
It was.
And is there anything that you would like to add to the board?
I would ask, would you like to adopt my testimony as your own?
if the board has any questions questions from the board i have a question so considering that all
the refusals are around the light lot line consolidation do you have the lot line
consolidation plan that was presented for opa i do i have the lot line consolidation
relocation is at tab 12 okay yeah oh i do not know what page of the pdf that is i apologize
us. It's tab 12. So it would be after me and Hillary, can we, can we in the future have
appellants tab their PDFs so that they have a table of contents and you can jump to each
April Lincoln.
I think I saw something.
There it is.
Thank you.
Can we just zoom out a little bit?
So understanding how the properties are laid out
and that you're asking for a smaller than typical lot,
do you know how big the backyards are?
backyards it should be on the zoning plan and i believe also that our project engineer
is on um just because it's going to be hard for me to on this pdf that i've printed out
pull that number for you um let's see
zach would you happen to know the size of the backyards yeah they're fairly generous our homes
are 33 feet deep so you would have a backyard that's at least 15 feet deep in the smallest
instance or 13 feet deep in the smallest instance by 16 feet wide so in the smallest instance the
backyard would be um be 200 feet which is pretty big
and then just wondering was there any thought when um doing the consolidation plan to do less
units to try to get closer to the 1440 square feet per lot no the rationale behind the lot size
is that the city's goal is to maximize affordable housing um this this plan maximizes affordable
housing on site while still providing a really generous quality of outdoor space and space
for each lot.
I mean, we are still providing wider than your typical row.
We are still providing wider than your typical row home, larger than your typical rear yard, as well as a roof deck.
So there's no lack of quality of light and air.
And then again, the city's goal on this site conveyed by the land bank was to maximize the number of affordable housing units.
We responded to a city-issued request for proposals
and were awarded that by the land bank based off of this proposal.
Okay, I also see the proposed alley on the plan.
I'm just wondering, is the plan to run utilities in the alley or in the street side?
No, no utilities get run in the alley.
All utilities come in through the street.
So the alleys are really just for, like, security?
Legal egress.
No, legal egress.
Oh, that's for the legal egress.
any other questions from the board
questions or comments from our attorney hillary emerson not at this time mr chair
questions or comments from anyone in the audience
questions or comments from the virtual audience
planning commission do not see any further hands mr chair
no hands planning commission
thank you chairman and good afternoon david vecto f-e-c-t-e-a-u with the city planning
commission do you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth
yes sir i do please proceed thank you uh chairman and board members the comprehensive plan recommends
no change to the rsa5 residential single-family zoning at this location the city rezoned ludlow
in 2017 and a community supported map change at that time these parcels were zoned rm1
residential multi-family the appellant requests relief from the minimum lot area requirement in
the rsa5 district the proposed lot sizes are in keeping with the lot sizes in the 1500 block of
north 9th street this part of this project is part of a city sponsored turn the key program
which provides enforceable affordable dwelling units the city planning commission recommends
the board grant a proposed dimensional variance for minimum lot size mi 2024 006 951 1501 to 13
north night street i vote yes with proviso revised plans one page stamped by zba january 15 2025.
cheryl gaston my vote is yes with proviso tenetta graham my vote is yes with proviso
tya win my vote is yes with proviso uh council yeah i just question um i don't didn't submit
revised plans was this 1501 oh i did because the lot lines were off okay thank you
apologize i got a little nervous okay so m number 14 mi 2024 007 224 just for the record could you
please state your name sure augusta o'neill that's it 1538 north darien street there's a letter of
support from jefferson manor a letter of non-opposition from council member young our
vice chair has a few questions good afternoon council do you agree to waive the reading of
the refusal or stipulate to attack i do um any update or refusal was issued this morning thank
you uh have you emailed in all the required documents and exhibits as needed uh and required
to proceed this case updates and answer this hearing i did thank you council already shared
your screen thank you so much i'll try and go a little slower this time just to give you a chance
to catch up um again my name is august o'neill with the law firm of claire harrison i'm here
this afternoon representing fe darien llc the owners of the property at 1538 north darien street
This is an RSA 5 zone property. Currently, it is a vacant lot. It's an application, again, in partnership with Turn the Key, similar to the application that the board just heard.
This is an application to bring new affordable homes to the city. The board has seen me here several times with similar applications.
This particular application is to adjust lot lines to create two lots from three lots and to construct two single-family homes with roof decks on those lots.
This project did receive a refusal pursuant to Section 14-5292A of the Code because the minimum required lot size at this location in this overlay is 1,440 square feet.
As you can see, we're proposing 723.384 square feet.
Again, the property is comprised currently of three separate lots, those being 1538 North Darien, 1540 North Darien, and 1542 North Darien.
Despite the smaller lot sizes that we're proposing here, again, similar to the last application, these are still fairly large houses.
fairly large houses. As you can see at tab eight of the exhibit package that I provided,
As you can see at tab 8 of the exhibit package that I...
which is my zoning plan.
you're going to see a tax clearance certificate there we go perfect okay so as you can see
from the zoning plan that's up on the screen these homes are each about 1500 square feet in size
tab 9 the next tab on this presentation again just has that typical rendering showing what these
affordable projects look like that the frankles have partnered with turn the key for
tab 10 again has those sample exterior and interior pictures again showing beautiful
brick facade of a typical frankel home you go down one these are just pictures of the interior
this is that first floor as you're coming into the home on the left that's what you're seeing
the stainless steel appliances that are provided there again on the right you can see the
stainless steel appliances. This is the typical bedroom, typical dining room, and
another picture of the living room area slash kitchen. Another standard bedroom.
And here's just a picture of that larger sized yard. And just another sample
picture of what an exterior project of these projects look like.
Tab 11, again, just has those typical floor plans.
You come in the front door, and you're immediately in the living room.
Then there's a kitchen and a dining area in the back.
And after the kitchen, there's a door that leads you into the backyard.
You go down one.
Typical second floor, two bedrooms and a bath.
And then this is the typical third floor, the bedroom, a bath, and access to the roof deck.
um provided tab 4 which you don't have to go to um i did provide some information about the turn
the key program that the partner the frankles have partnered with um there's a lot of philadelphians
who do benefit from these affordable homes um there's quite a long waiting list to to be able
to benefit from from this program um i provided also at tab five um tab five just added some
information about the frankles and the good work that they're doing in the city in partnership
again with turn the key my clients did meet with the affected rco for this property the jefferson
manor rco they met with them on december 11th i did provide a letter of support a tab two of my
exhibit package as well as a letter of non-opposition from councilman jeffrey young
just to briefly again go over the variance standard similar to the last application that
I have in front of you. This is not going to be anything that
introduce the use of adjacent properties. Again, this is a
vacant lot that my clients are putting these beautiful,
affordable homes on. It's not going to increase congestion in
the streets or be a burden on the public utilities. It is like
the last project, clearly a benefit to the neighborhood,
which is why both the neighborhood and the councilman
were in support of this application. We're taking a
vacant lot which i did provide pictures of my exhibit package but which um leave to the board's
imagination it's just just a vacant lot but like i said earlier these vacant lots are usually what
the land bank or i'm sorry um yeah the land bank likes to have developers develop on because they
can be the site of crime um in the city so with that being said i would like again to call mr
frankel forward to adopt my testimony mr frankel you've already been sworn just for the record
state your name mr frankel just for the record state your name zachary frankel z-a-c-h-a-r-y
f-r-a-n-k-e please proceed counsel uh mr frankel did you have an opportunity to hear my testimony
related to this application i did and was everything that i said true and accurate
it was and do you wish to adopt my testimony as your own i do questions
It was.
And do you wish to adopt my testimony as your own?
Questions from the board.
All right, similar to the last one, I do want to ask a question.
Like, given that these are coming in smaller than the 1440 square feet, what are the dimensions on the rear yard?
It's going to be the same as it was for the...
They're smaller, though, so it's the same width, but it can't be the same depth because it's less square.
this is actually an instance where we're taking three existing lots and rather than making three
small homes we're making two larger homes with larger backyards that part i understood i think
i'm just asking because it's less square footage per lot what the actual dimensions are between
i can tell you yeah because the other ones were about 50 square feet larger at the smallest so i
I just want to...
I'll just tell you if the...
I will tell you.
There's a little over 100 square feet for the rear yard.
And then for this one, is the roof deck the same square footage as the previous project?
It is.
And then my last question about this site is, unlike the 9th Street site, Darien Street has no current sidewalk or curbs. Is there any plan to address the fact that there's no public right-of-way sidewalk and curb, or is the house going to start immediately at the beginning of the legal lot?
No, of course we'll be repaving the sidewalk.
Are you doing the entire block or just the three parcels?
No, just in front of our homes.
Can you go to the exhibit with the backyard photo?
Looking at the HVAC unit at the bottom of the rear steps, what's the measurements between
that and the bottom of those steps?
Looks like they're right in front of them.
people let off
the picture
yeah the picture in the backyard
that would be tab
that should be
tab 10
so Zach
I'm not sure you're in front of a computer
right now but we're
I understand the question
I'm sorry?
I think I understand the question
he understands he's okay are you able to answer that i had included some standard i think that
yeah the the air handler unit or the condenser is set off from the home um toward to the bottom
of the stairs um usually as much as yeah if you scroll up a little bit so it's you know you want
to set the air handler unit as far as as far off of the home as you can so it allows um for air
circulation to come into the condenser unit this this photo is a little bit misleading it looks
like it's it's kind of blocking the stairs it's not there's it's it's set against the fence and
um there's there's room for the unit there yeah so just a suggestion it might not be wise to put
it that close to the bottom of steps if you're trying to move things in and out of the rear door.
But as long as it's out the way, I can see it a little bit better now.
Yeah. All right. Other questions?
Questions or comments from our attorney, Hillary Emerson?
I just wanted to note, Mr. Chair, the amended refusal is dated 1-14-25. Thank you.
questions or comments from anyone in the audience in the room
questions or comments from the virtual audience
no hands mr chair any commission
thank you chairman and good afternoon david effecto with the city planning commission
chairman and board members the comprehensive plan recommends no change to the rsa5 residential
single-family zoning at this location the city rezoned ludlow in 2017 and a community supported
map change at that time these parcels were zoned rm1 residential multifamily the appellant requests
relief from the minimum lot area requirement in the rsa5 district proposed lot sizes are in keeping
with the lot sizes in the 1500 block of Darien street this is part of the city's
in the 1500 block of darien street this is part of the city's a city-sponsored turn the key program
which provides in for enforceable affordable dwelling units city planning commission recommends
that the board grant a repose dimensional variance for minimum lot size mi 2024 007 224 1538 north
Downey Street, I vote yes. Proviso, her refusal dated 1-14-25.
Cheryl Gaston, my vote is yes with Proviso. Tanetta Graham, my vote is yes with Proviso.
Tywin, my vote is yes with Proviso. Ishmael Shaheed, my vote is yes with Proviso. Thank you,
counsel. Thank you so much. Mr. Chair, I, yeah, no, but before we go to number 10,
we just had to vote that one matter okay thank you thank you so we're going to do a quick add-on
mi 2024 006 305 2557 west sterner street i vote yes with proviso interior trash storage
commercial trash pickup hours of operation monday to friday 7a to 5p michael johnson my vote is yes
with provisor. Cheryl Gaston, my vote is yes with provisor. Tanetta Graham, my vote is yes with
provisor. Iowen, my vote is yes with provisor. Ishmael Shahid, my vote is yes with provisor.
We're going to number 10. MI 2024-006-178-140 North 2nd Street. Rachel Pritzker is the attorney.
There is a letter of unanimous support from Old City District RCO and a letter of non-opposition
from Council Member Squillard.
Good afternoon.
Good afternoon, Council.
Could you please state your name
and spell for the court stenographer?
Yes, it's Rachel, R-A-C-H-A-E-L,
Pritzker, P-R-I-T-Z-K-E-R.
Right.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth,
the whole truth and nothing but the truth?
Could you identify your client in the relationship to the property?
Yes, it's 140 North 2nd Street, LLC.
Ryan Harsh is here representing the LLC.
And our vice chair has a few questions for you.
And if you don't mind, sorry, chairman members, I had eye surgery on Friday.
So if I can turn my screen off, I would appreciate that.
Please turn your screen off.
Thank you.
Good afternoon, counsel.
Do you agree to wait to read another refusal or stipulate to a tax?
Have you emailed in all the required documents and exhibits that's needed to proceed with this case five days in advance of this hearing?
Please proceed and share your screen.
Thank you.
Can you see my screen?
We can.
So just for clarification, this is 140 North 2nd Street.
this is a referral, so it'll be for a special exception. I'm going to just scroll down to the
referral. This is a CMX3 property. We are requesting a special exception for use of an
eating and drinking establishment takeout restaurant in an existing attached structure.
The only referral that we have for the special exception is that the eating and drinking
establishment takeout restaurant requires a special exception approval as it's located in
the CTR, Center City Overlay District, Old City Residential Area. This is our application,
our appeal, tax clearance, deed.
Sorry, you can stop me if I'm going too fast, but I believe the board has this information.
this is the zoning map as mentioned this is a fourth property it's a cmx3 so commercial
mixed use three zoning classification on second street and quarry street in old city
aerial photos of the property as mentioned it's an existing building it's an existing
new boutique hotel and we're looking to put a takeout restaurant in the rear of the property
or sorry, in the front of the property in this commercial space. And then there's a boutique
hotel in the rear. These are the zoning posters and refusal. Provision of the code, this is
basically generates a referral based on sort of an antiquated overlay that requires a special
exception for the old city residential area for eating and drinking establishments.
We met with the community back in October 16th, which was the Old City District, and they provided a letter of
um district and they provided a letter of non-opposition um i will show you we sent out
the mailers so you can see we met with them um the old city district and there was unanimous
uh well eight in support from the rco committee 10 in support from all meeting uh attendees and
uh one i guess opposition from but essentially 18 to 1 in support we also have a letter from
councilman squilla's office with non-opposition um i'm going to just go through the floor plans
really quickly um this is the first floor so enter in um from the front of the building on
Second Street. There is an existing common hallway. As you can see, it's a pretty small
space. There's going to just be smoothies, no real room for seating. That's why it's a takeout
restaurant. And again, it requires a special exception. This overlay is the reason for the
relief, and it's not going to cause any additional impacts more significant than any other by right
uses. It's directly adjacent to other commercial uses. Wax and Wine is on the corner at 144 North
2nd, which is retail sales of consumer goods and business. There's also an insurance company and
retail at 142 North 2nd Street, retail sales and insurance, respectively. This will add to the
vibrant nature of the commercial mixed-use area. There's adequate transportation in close proximity
with SEPTA along Arch Street and won't cause any additional congestion, according to the city's
2035 comprehensive plan, the central district plan, does note that there's adequate off-street
parking and this district is heavily walkable. We're not requiring any dimensional variances
either. It's all within an existing structure. And we believe that this use is in character
and warrants relief, given it's a special exception in an already commercial corridor.
I would love to bring on my client, Ryan Harsh, to be able to adopt my testimony and then happy
to take any questions that the board may have please bring them on
how do we see him
ryan harsh is coming in as a panelist yep i'm here can you guys hear me your name could you
Please state your name and spell for the court stenographer.
Ryan Harsh, R-Y-A-N-H-A-R-S-C-H-E.
You swear or affirm and tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth.
Please proceed, counsel.
Ryan, have you heard my testimony today?
Do you believe it to be true and accurate, and do you adopt it as your own?
Yes, and I do.
Thank you.
Nothing further.
Questions from the board.
uh yes what is it that you're making in here just smoothies and any other kinds of drinks
we're not doing anything in terms of heating of any sort is that what i'm hearing
ryan um are you able to answer uh the board member's question i believe if you look at
the floor plans it's like a prep table and um freezers but um there's there's not any more
It would, it's acai bowls, smoothies, coffee, that sort of thing.
Okay. So you're not, you're not making like sandwiches or anything like that?
Okay. All right. Just liquids and, okay. Thank you.
Other questions from the board?
Questions from our attorney, Hillary Emerson?
Not at this time, Mr. Chair.
Questions or comments from the audience?
questions or comments from the virtual audience
no hands mr chair planning commission
thank you chairman and good afternoon david pecto with the city planning commission
chairman and board members the comprehensive plan recommends no change to the cmx3 commercial
mixed-use zoning at this location the appellant has shown the proposed eating and drinking
establishment will have no detrimental impact to the neighborhood beyond what might be expected
the city planning commission recommends that the board grant a proposed special exception
for an eating and drinking establishment thank you mi 2024 006 178 140 north 2nd street i vote yes
for johns my vote is yes cheryl gaston my vote is yes
Tannetta Graham, my vote is yes.
Tanetta Graham, my vote is yes.
Iowyn, my vote is yes.
Iowyn, my vote is yes.
Shemesh, my vote is yes.
Tino Shaheed, my vote is yes.
Thank you, counsel.
Thank you.
Number one, MI20, do I see Alan out there?
He was here.
So MI2024005747351313N23rdSt.
Alan Notkinson is the attorney.
There's a letter of unanimous support from the Allegheny West Civic Association.
could you just state your name for the record and spell for the court stenographer
good afternoon members of the board alan knockamson of knockamson pc a-l-a-n the last
named Nothamson, N-O-C-H-U-M-S-O-N.
Excuse me, sir.
Chair, before you swear him in, could I please ask Mr. Nothamson to pull the microphone closer
to him?
Is that close enough?
That's fine.
Thank you, sir.
Excuse me, chair.
I'm also battling my laptop.
Do you swear or affirm the tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
But you identify your client in the relationship to the property.
Yes, my client is HHS Realty LLC, and Mr. Hussain, the member of the company, is to my right behind me.
And our vice chair has a few questions.
Thank you.
Good afternoon, counsel.
Do you agree to weigh the reading of the refusal or stipulate to its accuracy?
Have you emailed in all the required documents and exhibits that's needed to proceed with this case five days in advance of this hearing?
I have.
You may proceed and share your screen.
Thank you.
I'm trying to find.
Hold on.
I apologize. Let's see what I got here.
I'm trying to share my screen.
Where's the share button here?
And by the way, while we're dealing with the technical difficulties,
I'm glad to see everyone in person.
thanks it's been a while a long time what yeah exactly i'm a lot taller in person
oh i just did sorry i was just like smiling too much all right
all right perfect
all right share screen
assume this is the one
here we go all right there we go and by the way i do have tabs to the right of my
documents as well so with table of contents we do that he did it real quick i i no no no i asked
i i actually stepped out i asked the younger member of my staff alex goldberg i always say
please put tabs on there because it makes it so much easier for people to go through the materials
it does and we even make sure that the tabs match the actual table of contents i'm very particular
about that. We're here for 3513 North 23rd Street. During my presentation, we'll first review the
notice of refusal, then the letter of support from the Allegheny West Civic Association.
Then I gave you an example of a nearby apartment building. Right now, we're proposing 12
residential units on a lot that's almost 5,000 square feet. On West Venego, there is a larger
property, but also has an apartment building nearby. Then we'll have an aerial view of the
property, zoning map, maps of the area such as Google, photographs of the property and surrounding
area, our plans and drawings, our RCO meeting notice, which it was a very well-attended meeting,
and we did get unanimous support there, our applications for appeal, our deed to the property
showing that HHS Realty LLC is the owner of the property, and our Certificate of Tax Clearance
showing that we're in good standing with the city of philadelphia with respect to real estate taxes
for this property at the conclusion of my presentation i will turn around um it can he
i'm gonna ask for just i don't know the answer to this is this the spot for witnesses okay i will
ask that mr hussein come to my left uh be sworn in and i'll have a few questions for you all right
so first a notice of refusal this is an rsa3 property but it's rather large in size it's
almost 5,000 square feet. We're looking to put 12 dwelling units here, and we have two refusals.
The first is for the use. Because this is RSA3, we're expressly prohibited from providing for
Um, because this is RSA three, we're expressly prohibited from providing for, um, multifamily
living and then the parking, like, you know, because we're RSA three, we're supposed to
provide multiple, uh, well, 12 units, 12 parking spots.
And that would be out of character.
And, you know, again, not in conformance to the surrounding neighborhood.
Um, I would also say that there's ample public transportation there.
There's the 1, the 56, the 447, the H, the R, the H, XH, and the 33 bus routes nearby.
So we did present in front of the Allegheny West Civic Association, and there was unanimous support.
They were very excited about this property because what you'll see architecturally what we did, we mimicked the architecture to the property to the left of us, which they were appreciative of.
They were also appreciative of the fact that we're not putting a roof deck on there.
We are respecting, again, the architecture, the porch nature of the neighborhood, and then everyone in that property is going to have access to the rear, so it will be a common area in the rear, substantial common area of 2,500 square feet, and then garbage would be stored as well.
So we could agree to two provisos, commercial trash pickup, as well as trash stored inside, and you'll see there's a garbage room, I believe, on every single floor.
So, again, unanimous support of seven to zero.
There were more people in the audience.
I believe that these were the people within the 500-square-foot radius of the property, the affected property owners.
And then, you know, an example of nearby multifamily at 2112 West Benango Street.
There's a 106-unit property there.
Again, not all of character to have that type of density.
We're near public transportation.
And just as – I know this is not enforceable from an affordable housing standpoint, but Mr. Hussein's model is completely affordable housing.
All he does is PHA housing, and they were appreciative of that as well.
Area view of the property, as you can see, there is a lot of vacant land nearby, and I believe this is the property on Benango Street.
but like there's a lot of vacant land and we're trying to activate parts parts of the community
in in a positive manner and then maps of the area again there's a there's a mix of zoning uh more on
the other side of west huntington park pike but even across the street is cmx2 there's some rm1
there's some cmx3 so there's definitely a mix of zoning nearby um and i believe that this may be
the property on venango which is also an rsa3 box excuse me i don't know i don't know whether
it's the mic but you're still a little low okay here is that better mr johns that is better yep
all right well hopefully i won't choke on this mic
all right um then the photographs of property we have a vacant lot here uh proof of posting
uh for today's hearing um and then this is the front of the property has been a vacant lot for
some time based on you know google street view and then this is the property how i looked in 2012
right so you see uh you know the unique architecture that's there it's very pretty and
we're trying to emulate that through our design which you'll see this is north 23rd street to the
right of the property to the left of the property and then there are plants and drawings um you know
i'm gonna i know mr johns is going to ask this question how deep are we in the lower level um we
are a little over nine feet deep in the lower level. It also, if you look at these drawings,
it slopes downward. So we're 33 feet 8 inches up in the front, and then if I can move my
page. Oops, it's not doing it. Let me go back. Go back to the next page.
let's see page up page up page up all right let me try to do it this way
right here we're at 29 28 feet 7 inches so if there's a it definitely the the grade changes
five feet from the front to the back of the property so there is some light in the air here
here in the front part of the property, and then we're on gray towards the back end of
the property.
And then you can see from the architecture, we try to mimic as much as we can what's left
of us.
This is just a rendering.
This is not actual what it looks like, but you can see we have the dormers.
We have the stone facade.
We keep the stone in the front too.
We have an ample front porch, which I believe is eight feet long or deep, and you can see that this is the opening for front to back, where people can go from the front to the backyard, and you can see it's an ample backyard of over 2,500 square feet.
And you can see it's an ample backyard of over 2,500 square feet as well.
So there's a lot of common area in the back.
Developing a sense of community back there, and that's not elevated, which is a problem with a lot of these, you know, some of these projects.
And then, you know, the floor plan is this.
You walk through the porch area.
You see here a trash room, by the way.
And then you have, let me just look at my notes, but you have eight two-bedrooms and four one-bedroom apartments.
So again, it's hard for me to see on this smaller screen, but this looks like a two-bedroom here, and then you have here, every floor has three bedrooms on here.
And then these are two one-bedrooms.
You go to the lower level.
It looks like a two-bedroom down here.
And then here, it's also one one-bedrooms.
And then you go to the second floor.
There's a two-bedroom here.
And by the way, you can see there's a trash room on every single floor.
And then these units are two two-bedrooms.
And then finally, you go up to the third floor and a two-bedroom here, a two-bedroom here, and a two-bedroom here.
So like I said, there's eight two-bedrooms, four one-bedrooms here.
RCO meeting notice, we met with the community in person December 17th at 6 p.m.
We emailed that notice a few weeks ahead of time to give ample notice to the community organizers that we sent out that notice.
and we gave them proof of mailing in that notice,
and we showed them that we sent it to 93 addresses.
These are the addresses.
Proof of mailing to those addresses,
our application for appeal that we filed on behalf of HHS Realty LLC,
our notice of refusal, our project information form,
our deeds of property showing that HHS Realty LLC is the owner of the property,
and finally, our certificate of tax clearance.
While there's a balance of $775.49 technically due, it's not really due until March 31st of 2025.
I'm going to stop sharing my screen.
I would ask that Mr. Hussein stand to the left of me, turn on the mic, so he can then be sworn in.
Sir, could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer?
Hussain Hussain, H-U-S-S-E-I-N, H-U-S-S-E-I-N.
Do you swear or affirm that tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Yes, I do.
Please, why don't you sit down, and Mr. Nakhlinson, please proceed.
Yes, Mr. Hussain, you heard everything I had to state today about your zoning matter.
Yes, I did.
And is it true and correct?
And do you adopt it as your own testimony?
Thank you.
So what's that block look like?
There is some multifamily.
There's next door, there's multifamily.
The problem is there's not a lot of active properties there.
So that's what we're looking at.
We're looking at, as you saw with the aerial view, there's a lot of vacant land there.
Questions from the board.
I have a question.
Can you go back to the basement plan?
And I just want to know how many units are in the basement.
and if there's any storage anywhere in the building?
There are three units per floor, which includes the lower level.
That's how we get to 12.
So there's three units in the lower level,
three units on the first floor, three units on the second floor,
and three units on the third floor.
In terms of storage, let me take a look.
I mean, each of the rooms have closets.
Can you enlarge the basement part?
Oh, yeah, sure.
It may make it easier not to go full screen here.
It's easier for me to maneuver.
So here's an example of the two-bedroom down there.
So you walk in, you have an open living area, 745 square feet.
That's unit number 10 as an example.
You have a kitchen, a living room, and you have a bathroom,
and then you have two bedrooms next to each other.
each of them have closets in them and the back units oh yeah sure and you also see the trash
room and then each of the units also have their own laundry facility and that's where the
mechanicals mechanicals are stored as well for each of the units and then if you go to the other
units let's just say unit number 12 you walk in living room kitchen laundry room here there's
here there's actually an office space i i that's why i don't call it a bedroom but there's an
actually an office space i that's why i don't call it a bedroom but there's an office space
office space because it and then they have one bedroom here in the bathroom and here's closet
Peace.
and i think this is just a twin of that they're both you know about approximately 1620 1647 square
feet yeah i i've got a serious concern when we see units where their living room
areas that have no windows, no
and not one of these units show a window in a
living room. In addition to that, the basement
units only are getting light from the light
wells on either end of the
unit. And I assume there's probably going to be some borrowed light
from the bedroom but again they're all internal living rooms no natural light no natural ventilation
and it's subterranean for the units that are in the basement no i i i i agree with you and
you know if the board feels so inclined i would you know respectfully request that
this project be limited to a maximum of nine units with a proviso no living in the basement
well i don't know that we can provide so that every living room has a window and no i'm talking
about we're gonna we would get rid of all the apartments in the basement well there's not just
the apartments in the basement if you look at your plans every floor there's not one living room
that has a window um you've got the ones that are on the right are on the property line so you can't
have a window there and then the ones that are on the left although they're set back you don't
sony windows uh let me take a look
so i understand i mean we can re it looks like we can reconfigure the the front portions to put
the bedrooms towards the back and the living area towards the front. I can't speak to that
as to the rear ones. Again, my client wants to put good housing together. This was
you know fleshed out i understand but when we say good housing and we don't have windows and
natural light and ventilation in the living room the main living space of a unit it's kind of hard
to argue that yeah um i can't speak to the right because i don't know if there's let me take a look
if there's a building a property to the right of us let's see so the address is according to your
property line the that wall is on the property line so you can't have windows no no to left yeah
i'm just looking to the right right to the left it looks like you've got some space because you've
got a door out that side so i don't know why you didn't put windows maybe no well to our left we're
a twin we're the right side of a twin okay yeah that's what i'm looking at the left um i'm trying
to look at from the deed section. I mean, either way, again, I can't speak from a building
code perspective, but to our right, there's no properties to the right of us technically
on 23rd. They intersect with Tioga. Again, I can't speak to whether we can put windows
on there. I would have to defer to the architect in that respect.
Again, we want to make these functional floor plans as well. We thought putting light and
air in the back. Again, we have ample open area too for this property of 2,500 square
feet on the 5,000 square foot lot. We actually purposefully conformed to the RSA 3 zoning
to to provide the least variance possible under the circumstances we have no dimensional variances
so that's apologize keep looking up but like you know you know that's we try to keep within that
mindset like we did we wanted to keep this from a building structure standpoint to amassing that
made sense under rsa3 i understand and we had unanimous support you know from the community
And I think they really embrace this because that block, it's a lot of open area that's been open area for some time.
It's a lot of open area that's been open area for some time.
So, again, I hear you about the lower level.
I express those concerns to my client, too, and I told him.
I said, the board's going to say, listen, you can't do this.
And, you know, I looked at him and I said, told you.
And so, you know, let's go back down to nine units.
But I think nine units is a really nice project.
and again what i pushed was not to have a deck up there i didn't think that's appropriate because
of the amount of size we have in the rear yard and everyone has access to rear yards there's a
trash room on every single floor like we took space there's no window in the living room there's
no light and natural air in the living room okay it's not a den it's a living room yeah
And don't we have a habitable, isn't it that we're supposed to have
what they call habitable rooms with the idea of being windows?
Natural light and ventilation.
Carcoded bedrooms, not the living room.
The living room, technically.
So what I can do is I can maybe, if the board feels so inclined to hold it,
maybe I can talk to the architect, see what we can do.
i can't guarantee that we're going to do any better but i always say let's try why don't we
get all the questions down yeah does anybody else in the court have a question yes i do want to
double down on what mike said i agree with all those same comments additionally i have a question
is this an all-electric building yes yes okay um where are the meters being placed
well again i now that we have like the the base we would have the basement level like you know
so there's no well true now you do but i was like there was no mechanical room in the basement and
where the mechanical rooms were placed on the current plan you can't put meters meters have
to have access to the exterior of the building so one i think like just having a question about how
it was being metered just the way it was currently drawn it didn't seem feasible that the utilities
would be easy to run um so i think that's like the first comment i have i think the second comment i
had it is i think just doubling down on the way that the basement was laid out um i think uh having
no light down there and everything being below grade but i did like that uh the first floor was
at grade which does open up potential for it to either at least be visitable which is really great
but i think because this is a single family residential property and you're asking for 12
units and to get rid of parking i think uh to make sure that what you've proposed you know
actually seems livable because you're getting a lot more units on it than the one so yeah and
and even hypothetically if we had living in the basement because we have a pass through like from
front to back we could put you know put the meters back there because they would be accessible out
there i would say practically speaking we don't control like you know where the meters grow we
can ask but you know ultimately the city and decides that and i agree with you i think when
I walk by properties in the city of Philadelphia, and you see like six meters on this beautiful
brick front facade, it's like, wow, that was a waste, right?
So I agree with you that.
I think that's a bigger issue that goes beyond zoning, and that's a conversation with the
utility companies where they could do a better job.
Tonetta?
I'm good.
That's just the basement.
No basement living.
I like that proviso.
Questions or comments from our attorney, Hillary Emerson?
i just want to briefly note that we did receive a letter of support from swamp poodle on this
matter was provisos they asked for a limit of six units no basement living interior trash and
recycling storage as well as a co to be obtained which of course it would need to be this new
construction yeah so i mean swamp who was one of the rco is not the coordinating rco um you know
who i don't believe attending the meeting but you know you know that's a difficult organization in
terms of multi-family and if if they're in support of multi-family it seems like this is a property
that should go multi-family the only objection what i would say would be the six i think that's
a little bit light um because again it's you know the hardship here is you know we can't build
something like with six units it just wouldn't be cost effective like and again again i don't
know if that goes into hardship so to speak but that's practical and i again we would have no
objection to a proviso or we would request a proviso of maximum six units no living in the
basement questions or comments from the audience questions or comments from the virtual audience
yes mr chair i have a hand up from uh mr charles richardson i've allowed them to speak
good afternoon mr richardson good afternoon mr chair charles richardson sure
Good afternoon, Mr. Chair. Charles Richardson. Charles Richardson, R-I-C-H-A-R-D-S-O-N, Office of Councilwoman Cindy Bass Room, 508 City Hall.
The Councilwoman does not like...
Hold on, woman. Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth, sir?
Please proceed.
Okay, the councilwoman does not like basement living. And hearing that Mr. Knockamson has been trying to convince his client to remove the basement living, it sounds like they might be moving in that direction.
If they can hold, if you guys can hold this and they come back to the community, I would ask, request that they come back to the community and let them know whatever changes that they are making to the property.
Since they got a unanimous letter from Allegheny West, I think they still need to come back and talk to the community about whatever changes that they're going to be making.
We understand that.
Anyone else in the virtual audience?
Yes, Mr. Chair, I have a hand up from a number ending in 3552.
This may be Adrian Fernandez.
Adrian?
Ms. Fernandez?
You've been unmuted. You don't have to speak.
Ms. Fernandez.
i'm sorry you can proceed okay thank you um anyone else in the virtual audience
planning commission do you want to hold your or do you want to vote
that's all right sure we can testify if that's okay with you sure all right uh good afternoon
chairman and board members david effecto with the city planning commission chairman and board
members the comprehensive plan recommends a change in zoning at this location from rsa
residential single family to RTA 1 residential 2 family the appellant requests 12 dwelling units
and no accessory off-street parking spaces this is a 4157 square foot lot the previous building
had three dwelling units there are other multi-family dwellings on the block face with
up to six dwelling units but not the 12 that the appellant requests and off-street accessory
parking would not match the character of this block face the city planning commission recommends
that the board grant a proposed variance for not including accessory off-street parking
and the use variance for multiple dwelling units but limit the unit count to three
in keeping with the previous building so uh mr chair can i just respond sure um so according to
our records and maybe our records are faulty um i believe that the lot's a little bit larger than
the 4,100 square feet. According to what we saw in Atlas, it was 4,967 square feet. So it's a little
bit larger than what Planning Commission has stated. And I don't know who's right, but that's
what we see. And I think that may affect, again, how many units. And in terms of the amount of
units, again, the practical matter is this. We can't build it with three units. Both groups
agreed that multifamily should be here.
One group had six units.
One had agreed to 12 units.
Again, even six units, I don't think it would be feasible.
But we would like to have an opportunity to present this again
in front of the community and see what we can do here.
Okay, so Hillary, we'll make this a resumptive hearing?
Yes, and we'll leave the record open,
especially if there's further communication between the parties.
Thank you.
All right, thank you.
Just a note, though, the deed does have all the parameters
of the site so i would have your engineer architect pull the square footage from the
dean i will so the result of hearing will be four two twenty five at two p.m
thank you and mr notkinson uh would you please stay there so
thank you sir mi 2024 006 167 7600 germantown avenue
There is amended refusal, a letter of support from the Mount Airy Business Improvement District, which was an affected RCO, but at this point, we don't have a letter from the RCO.
Actually, we have received one, Mr. Chair.
Just give me one second.
We received a couple.
Mount Airy Improvement District?
So, no, the West Mount Airy neighbors, the coordinating RCO, they sent a letter of support.
However, Councilmember Bass has taken the position of opposition and did submit a letter.
Thank you.
Just state your name for the record.
Just state your name for the record.
Alan Nockamson.
Alan Nockmson.
You identify.
You identify your client and relationship to the property.
My client is Cresham Green Associates LP.
And behind me in the audience is one of its partners, Scott Sieber.
And our vice chair has a few questions for you, sir.
Good afternoon, counsel.
Do you agree to wave the reading of the refusal or stipulate to its accuracy?
Have you emailed in all the required documents and exhibits as needed to proceed with this case?
five days in advance of this hearing yes other than the the correspondence from uh the council
member's office um i did not see it yet so i i'll look through my emails to see you know what
correspondence may have been submitted to the zba okay what about that rco letter i see we're still
we have we have two letters we have one from the coordinating rco and one from the bid
Okay, thank you. We have them, Helen. Yes, we have both of the letters. Thank you.
May I present? Yeah, please proceed. Thank you.
So I'm here to present 7600 Germantown Avenue, if I can get to the full screen. Okay,
Okay. So very unique property. It's an RSD3 property. The lot size is almost 51,000 square
feet. The opening of it is, I would say, no greater than 90 feet across. Why is that important? This
is a regular shaped lot. It's very unique. In the front of it, and you'll see this in the rendering,
and we'll go through it there is a one-story historic property and this is not the first city
board that has reviewed this project the historic commission reviewed this and approved like what
we're showing you today so it's not like we just you know decided you know this six-month period
to present this project this has been fleshed out by the historic commission as well as the community
and this is the true undue hardship just because of the configuration law and the fact that we
We have a one-story historic structure in the front where, again, according to RSD3 zoning, the lot width has to be 50 square feet.
So basically, we're stuck with a non-conforming building structure on a 51,000 square foot lot, which that's the only thing that could be built on it.
And it's non-conforming because the front sack back has to be 25 feet from the front, and it's not there either.
So what we're trying to do is put seven single family homes here, RSD3, which, again, with 51,000 square foot lots, given the lot area requirement of 5,000 square feet, you can actually build 10 single family homes here.
we're only looking to build seven. So we're choosing the least modification possible under
the Philadelphia zoning code. So during our presentation, we'll be reviewing the notice
of refusal. We'll also see a letter of support from the West Mountain Aries Neighbors Association.
And then after my presentation, I'll look to see if I had that email in my email box,
but it wasn't there at two o'clock. And then this property and this project has gotten a lot of
notoriety. If you look at the next exhibit, the Chestnut Hill local had a whole article about the
new homes for the historic coal company sites. And they speak glowingly because they should,
because my client is well known in that area for both adaptive reuse and sustainable projects,
which is a mix of both. And we'll talk a little bit about Bancroft Green, which is in the
presentation materials. We'll also look at the aerial view of the property. We're also next to,
hopefully, a reinvigorated trail called Cresham Trail, which will complement, you know, our
project will definitely complement that trail. And we'll then review maps of the area, showing
the zoning classification and showing the unique configuration of our property photographs of the
property in the surrounding area our plans and drawings and in the in the hearing room i have
to the left of me i have jim cassidy the architect and we'll go through it from a more architectural
standpoint um again beautiful project you know this is something that it's going to be really
nice for the people of, uh, the, uh, Mount Airy, uh, Chestnut Hill area. Uh, and then we'll review
the meeting notice that we sent again, a very well attended meeting. And as many board members know,
the West Mount area neighbors association is very distinguished. I mean, you have former members of
the, uh, former council to the ZBA, I think too, you know, on that board.
former counsel to the zba i think too you know on that board so again this is someone they're
very knowledgeable trust me it's it's more technical in nature and they fully embrace this
i mean they even they said well we don't usually vote in front of people but you know what we love
this project that much we're going to vote in front of you and they voted unanimously they
really embrace this project uh you know ralph pincus heads that organization and as you know
he heads another city board here and he really embraced this project so we have our applications
for appeal we have an agreement of sale I know that there was a note that like we didn't have
a countersigned copy of the agreement of sale but we I know my team emailed it I haven't had a chance
to pull up the newer version so that part is not part of my exhibit package just want to let you
note, but we have an active agreement of sale. And, you know, Mr. Seibert's been working on
this for years, this project, going through historic, going through much community comment.
And we're here today and we're excited for this project. It's really pretty. It's really amazing
project. And then our certificate of tax clearance, right? Showing that the property owner
is in good standing. Again, at the conclusion of my presentation, I'll have Mr. Seibert, like,
um you know be sworn in i'll have a full questions for him and i'll ask mr cassidy as well to come up
here um and then from a technical standpoint we'll can go through the project um notice a refusal
right so we're an rsd3 uh property and you know we are going to put proposing to put a prepared
food shop in that historic structure and it's going to have four parking spots near it um there's
a huge apartment building going across the street with very limited parking. Unlike us, where we
have parking dedicated to each of those units that are single family structures. So we're stuck with
that historic property, but not really because we're going to hopefully create like a coffee
shop there where the people across the street, the people in our development and the people that
walk nearby can, you know, just grab a cup of coffee on the way to wherever. And then behind
that, there's a driveway with eight single-family homes, again, with parking in each of them.
We have a couple of refusals here. The first refusal is no more than one principal use is
allowed per law in RSD3, RSA, and RTA zoning districts. We have two principal uses. We have
the commercial use in the front, and then we have all the residential in the back. We can't get rid
of that. We don't want to. We embrace it, but we can't get rid of that front commercial property.
It's historic. Historic won't let us get rid of it. So there's our hardship, right, for that.
The second, no more than one principal building is allowed per lot. Let me just move this thing
down here. And we have multiple per lot. Now we have the commercial building in the front.
We have two additional buildings in the rear. And the reason why we have that is to provide
access where we have turning radiuses in different parts of the plan community. Again, we fleshed
this out with streets department, the fire department. They wanted to make sure that this
is a safe plan community. And for garbage removal too, to make sure it was thoughtful. And from a
safety perspective, God forbid there was a fire, the fire trucks could get in there, they can move
to the side, they could turn around. Same thing with the commercial haulers of the trash.
That's our second refusal. Our third refusal, and we caught this one. Originally, the zoning
examiner did not. We're on a steep slope, but the steep slope is really minimal in minimal areas.
That's really not affecting the situation. Again, this is a property that was used originally as a
coal site. Again, we can't affect the fact that we're on a steep slope, but our buildings are not
really near the steep slope purposefully as part of our design. Then fourth, we have a refusal for
the multi-family living and the prepared food shop. Because we have a skinny front,
we can't subdivide that. We have no street frontage. That's our hardship right there.
We have no choice. We have street frontage of 93 feet .66 feet. We have no choice.
Otherwise, we have one single family, 50 feet wide, right, from RSD3, we would be allowed one single family home there on a lot that is well over, well, it's almost 51,000 square feet.
So we did get a letter of support from Westmount Area Neighbors Association. It's a very well-attended meeting. And again, the people on that board are serious about zoning. Not that others are not, but again, we have two
know, serious about zoning. Not that others are not. But, you know, again, we have two former
counsel to the ZBA. I think we had a former city attorney that worked,
that represented LNI. So, you know, we had people that know what they're talking about.
And then we also have a letter of support from the Mount Airy Bid, and they're in support of
this project, right? We're using a site that has been underused for many, many, many years.
And then, again, a little bit about, like, the project is in the article that we found that was
written in the Chestnut Hill Local. But, you know, people are really excited about this project.
And it talks a little bit about Bancroft Green. And, you know, a little bit about Bancroft Green,
you know, Scott and his brother have been doing this for well over 20 years. They believe in
sustainable development and adaptive reuse. You know, Scott, like, lives nearby. Like, you know,
I know you hear this a lot, but, like, he may even be, like, living in one of these units himself.
And, you know, this is just a little bit about their portfolio, but if you look at,
it's off their website, 520 Carpenter Lane. They got a lead platinum certification,
and they were the 2017 Mount Airy USA Project of the Year. They have their offices in there too.
And then they were a 2018 finalist for Green Building United Groundbreaker Award.
And this is more their adaptive reuse, but at 7111 Germantown Avenue, which they completed in 2021,
uh they also had a certification so they know how to take historic properties which we have historic
in the front which we're going to preserve but they also know how to make sustainable development
which we're going to do in the back so that's a blend of exactly what they know how to do and
know how to do very very well and then the aerial view of this property we're this so here's the
trail but we're right here and you'll see it better from some other maps but it's a very unique site
and a lot that is non-traditional in nature.
So you can see from here, very small opening goes very, very, very deep.
The length of the lot is 904 feet long.
And then this is where we are on Germantown from a Google Maps perspective.
And there are photographs of the property from different angles.
this is from the existing carriage house that's in the front this is kind of looking at the existing
drive aisle that we're repurposing uh and this is like kind of seeing the the carriage house
if you're towards the back of the property and then this is kind of like who we're bound next
to and then this is we're next to the covenant church of philadelphia uh who's also supportive
of this project, and then this is our hearing notice poster, and then this is Germantown to the
right of the property, to the left of the property, and then these are our plans and drawings. Well,
not really, but here's something I found online. This is the St. Martin's Coal Company, and then
this is the Carriage House, the historic Carriage House. So just look at the massing and the way
the building lines are going. Keep that in mind because that's what the architect tried to
replicate through their design. So we're going to completely clean up this historic property
in the front. Again, we're proposing a prepared food shop. And then you can see this from a
different angle, but we wouldn't have anything left in terms of putting any other building but
this one, but for the fact that we're asking for this variance. And that's the true purpose of a
variance. That's a hardship. But here's the beginning of the of the drive aisle that we're
repurposing. And then this is just looking at it from Germantown. And here are the two building
structures. And then this is the parking that I was talking about. There's four parking spots,
including a handicapped spot in there. And then this is the trail, the beginning of the trail
that we that we hope we're going to collaborate with that community to like rebuild. Like we're
embracing that trail you'll see through our art design and then this is more of an aerial view
from the back of our property and you can see we try to do as much landscaping as possible
and then this is from the back of our property that's the trail very very pretty very natural
our backyards kind of face here and then this is another angle of the trail how we kind of
incorporate our plan community into that trail to a degree. Again, green route.
planned community into that trail to a degree.
Again, green roofs.
And a different angle with the trail
and our property and our proposed building structures.
And then again, just from a different angle as well.
And a different angle.
And then you can even see from the architecture,
again, remember that's from the Cole picture
of how those roof lines act like that
and even the building structures.
but then if you look at the architecture here we mimicking the architecture of that church the
roof lines and such so we just want to make it blended in like it's been there forever to a
degree with a modern twist and then again just taking a look again looking these roof lines and
such with the trail and our backyards and how we just incorporate ourselves on a lot that's 93
feet wide, approximately, and 904 feet long, and we, again, using the least amount of variances
that you would expect under the Philadelphia zoning. Again, from the trail in the back,
and then the front, and then you can see, and we can talk, you know, Jim can talk to you about this,
of how he set back some of these buildings
to provide like a stoop mentality to a degree
and a lot of light and air.
And you can see the garages here.
And again, the materials are stone, brick, and stucco.
And, you know, again, Jim could kind of tell you
the inspiration behind that.
And then you can see here from the site plan
about like, you know, what we were talking about
in terms of we creatively created these open areas
rather than having these one building structure
across the way,
we worked with the fire department
and streets department and historic
to create something that was thoughtful
where we have some openings here.
So you can have turnarounds here.
You can have a turnaround here.
And then again, because we realized
that the zoning examiner missed
the variance regarding the steep slope,
we got an earth-moving.
We asked to update the refusal.
We got that refusal,
and then we provided an earth-moving plan.
Just as a note,
stamped by Ian Haggerty,
formerly of the Planning Commission.
Well done, then.
Yeah, yes, exactly.
He's done better things.
But you can see here,
this is where the steep slope is here.
It's here, it's a little bit right here, and it's right here.
So it's really small right here, right here, and in the back,
really not affecting much at all with regards to this project.
And then the floor plans.
So we have a couple of different types of floor plans here.
Units one and two are three-bedroom, four-and-a-half baths.
So you can see two-car garages, everything on grade.
you come in the front door there's an entryway you're kind of a flex space which a kitchenette
some people are still working from home guess we're not so but uh you know some people do and
they want that extra space so you have a flex space here with a bathroom you go up a flight
of steps you go to a second floor open floor plan you have the primary bedroom here en suite
you know, walk-in closet, half bath here, go up another flight of steps, another flex space,
another office, a bedroom with a bathroom, another bedroom, not connected to a bathroom,
but another bathroom. And then this is a unit number three, a different type of variation of
it. But again, two car garage, right? Like, you know, we have to, I mean, if you think about we're
on Germantown Avenue, we want to be smart about that. So it was important for us to provide not
just off-street parking, but two cars for every unit owner. And again, you walk in, there's an
entryway, there's a mudroom, there's a flex room, there's a bathroom. Go up a flight of steps,
open floor plan, very interesting angler version to make it architecturally interesting with a
dining room, a kitchen, a living room. You have a primary bedroom suite. You go up another flight
of steps. And by the way, you have some outdoor space too with some of these units with exterior
decks, flex space, office, a bedroom with a bathroom in it, a bedroom without a bathroom in it.
And then the other version of this is, again, two-car garage. You enter in, you have, because
of the sloping, you have the living on the first floor, but it's sloped. You have the ability to
get in the garage on the ground level or the lower level. And then we even have an in-law suite here,
And then we even have an in-law suite here, our laundry facilities down here, again, flex space, again, set back, a little front courtyard.
our laundry facilities down here.
And then you have the primary suite, you have the living room, dining room, living room, kitchen, and again, another roof deck area, a lot of, you know, again, embracing the outdoor nature of this trail.
and then the final floor again is two bedrooms up there and two baths and again to brace the
outdoor area and the fact that we're near that trail is another roof deck and then these are
units five through eight another version of it two car garage front courtyard flex space again
another bathroom on the ground floor, primary suite, open floor plan, living room, dining room,
kitchen. You have a roof deck again to embrace the outdoor nature of this area. You have three
bedrooms up here and one bathroom in a laundry facility. So we met with the community on
December 4th virtually. We sent that notice to the community November 21st. Now there was
wasn't a lot of people within the affected area. There's only 13 properties within the
affected area. Again, there's not much going on in terms of properties, but it was a well-attended
meeting because I would say there was 15 people there, but they have a large board, and this is
proof of mailing to the community at large. But again, the bid that represents that community
to support a very well-established sophisticated RCO supports this as well. Here's our applications
for appeal along with the notice of refusal and the project information form. Our agreement of
sale which includes an addendum which you're not seeing now but I presented to the zoning board
administrator which shows we have an active agreement of sale and our certificate of tax
clearance there are taxes due but they're not um in arrears until mark after march 31st
2025 with that being said i would ask that scott you know you know be sworn in just a quick point
was mr richardson at the meeting that we you were no okay maybe he'll be on yeah okay thank you
sir could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer
Scott Seibert, S-C-O-T-T-S-E-I-B-E-R-T.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Please proceed, counsel.
Scott, you heard everything I had to state today.
Is it true and correct?
Do you adopt this your own testimony?
I would be remiss because we have opposition from the city council member, and knowing how passionate you are about this project,
I would just, you know, you've been dealing with this project for a few years now, right?
Yeah, I first started talking with the current owner, John Mascaro, about 10 years ago when he was thinking about winding down operations.
He's a general contractor.
He wasn't quite ready then, but if you saw the agreement of sale, in the end of 2021, we got under agreement.
and since then we've been really thoughtfully in a lot of regards working backwards on getting
the approvals because it is a very complicated site and Alan did a wonderful job presenting it
the one thing that you didn't touch on which has really taken the most of our time is coordinating
with the water department because there's a storm soar interceptor that runs along our driveway
and then cuts underneath the old train berm and then under the Cresham Creek and then meets up
that's um you know we made lemonade out of it with the turnaround for the fire truck but we
can't build there there's a 25 foot row on either side of the interceptor so that was about a year
and a half of work coordinating with them um and because of our commitment to sustainability and
our wonderful civil engineers the studio sustenna we worked out a solution that worked for everybody
uh whereby 95 of the site will be pervious uh so it's not just the green roofs all of the
landscaping you see there has been thoroughly developed so that we're we're really decoupling
you know it's not officially a brownfield but it was a brownfield it was it was a coal site
for 60 70 years and it was an fc hob had it and it was a oil site it's never been residential
ever that front building has always been an office supporting those business uses
And then John Mascara bought it in 1993 and has been using it for storage.
So we worked with the water department to say, okay, look, if we do something that's really important to us anyway,
something that's really important to us anyway in terms of stormwater management can we say
in terms of stormwater management, can we say,
tie into existing laterals in the street that are on our side of the trolley tracks which as you
know are temporarily closed since 1994 and it's a big onus so you know it's those kind of creative
solutions that we've been working on and getting all of our ducks in a row before coming to zoning
because you know if we should get through zoning and we didn't do that we were really concerned
that it would be an unbuildable project we might have zoning but we wouldn't have any any any anything
we could build so we've really uh through that process also built a lot of consensus so i'm i'm
kind of surprised i we just learned about this just now you know in terms of this opposition but
we've you know we've worked with we man we've worked with the bid uh we've worked with historical
commission got unanimous approval from them you know worked with streets worked with the water
department fire department um you know engaged uh the uh the executive director of the new covenant
church who's really the only actual property that's mainly impacted by this and they're
very supportive of this and and you know warm my heart to hear that and so um yeah in short this
has been a real passion of ours for the last few years getting it to this point um and as a resident
of Mount Airy for the last 14 years you know I'm excited you know to have something at the very
least in the front there where we have another place for people to come together and and you
know a third place to sort of hang out you know we need more of that especially out out there so
and then these houses I think are going to be a real model for an adaptive reuse which is something
we're really proud of Jim will be talking I think in a little bit but you know his firm is is has a
real long track record of doing that as well so i think between the two of us and my brothers
on the zoom you know we're really proud of the work we've we've done in that department
right thank you questions from the board yes i have a few questions one i know this is an
incredibly complicated site um so i do have some complicated questions um alan you mentioned in
your presentation that this is being planned as a pud and i just want to confirm is the plan to
than sell or to condo the units in the PUD? So I can hopefully answer that. It would be a PUD.
You know, we have not talked at length about that. We didn't want to put the cart before the horse,
but I would think it would be a PUD that would be sold. Okay. And then, because typically when
you have a PUD, there's something that retains back that's owned by the owner of the entire
development because you have to have somebody that's managing all the common spaces. So in
In this instance, is the thought right now that Cresham Green or Bancroft Green is going to retain the site forever and be the manager of the commercial space in all the public areas?
So what would happen, this would turn into a nine. Again, I don't want to speak out of turn, but, you know, again, and I'm sure there's different ways to do this, but I would envision this would be a nine unit pod, right?
commercial on the front eight in the eight units in the back actually you probably could have it
one of two ways that drive aisle can either be in an easement area where each of the actual units
have like you know a portion that's beyond their building structure or you can have essentially a
unit which is that driveway yeah and and the the association owns that he wanted the the ownership
group want to do that it's run by the actual unit owners themselves you know more likely than not
and i don't want to speak out of turn here but for the commercial unit you know scott's uh company
would would probably remain for the time being at least in the beginning to be the owner but
scott's not going anywhere he lives down the street now and as i indicated we've had discussions
and again you never know but there's interest on scott's behalf to like live in one of these units
no i just wanted to ask because the very specific amended refusal based on the assumption right now
that it's two condo buildings within the pud of five units and four units and that if it's broken
in ten like that's it's a different structure and i just wanted to state that on record because i
wasn't sure if that would have to change any of our approvals today no it wouldn't and so you see
this quite often well and this is the hardship too it's not like we can break this up we have
no street frontage. Even if we wanted to, we couldn't. The only way to make this work is to
create it as a PUD, which goes further to our hardship. I just want to say I had the letter
from Council Member Bass's office or Council Member Bass. I'm honestly shocked. We really
did a lot of hard work within the community. And this is not like just going through the zoning
variance process. And this pre-exists me, but there was community input during the historic
commission process right there was much community there was much input through a lot of the
through a lot of the stakeholders within city government streets department water fire department
stakeholders within city government streets department
and to say that after careful review and consideration this project raises significant
concerns that conflict with the interest and well-being in the surrounding community
is shocking i i'm i'm floored i mean honestly i was going to do a victory lap after giving
my presentation i expected that i was like out of all of my projects today i was like wow this
is the easiest one and i jinxed myself of course but i honestly i'm really shocked i mean from a
legal standpoint this is one that would so i i know i know but maybe you should hold up a little
but i would think mr richardson will be on yeah i would yeah yeah if mr richardson could i did
have two more questions one um for the historic carriage house in the front is it what is the
historic designation do you know if it's city state federal just the city just city okay and
then has there been a historic structures report yet for the carriage house well how about this
mr cassidy why don't you come up and and provide some uh professional guidance here
so mr uh could you please state your name and spell first it's james cassidy j-a-m-e-s c-a-s-s-i-d-y
You swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth.
Please proceed, counsel.
Why don't you answer the question regarding the question by...
I'm not aware of that.
Is that something that would have been in the packet from the historical commission?
No, you would have had to conduct...
So either the current owner or the previous owner would have had to do a historic structures report,
but typically that's the first step to doing any type of renovation to anything that's landmarked.
So I just wasn't sure if it had happened yet.
we haven't done that yet okay do you can you talk or attest at least to like the current condition
of the carriage house sure it's um as if it's an office um it's pretty pretty run down but actively
like legally open technically i guess i mean he's he's got a couple desks in there and just lots of
shelves with building materials on it um he just has a you know a couple desks and uh storage for
building materials um and we don't you know obviously we don't plan to change anything on
the outside uh so the only renovations we were planning to do would be it on the interior
and gotcha and then just so the historic structures report would just determine if
anything needed to be like conserved in a very specific way but it would start to talk about
anything that was required of the outside um but then i think my last question is are there any
existing easements on the site due to some of the environmental considerations there's no um
easements regarding environmental um when mascaro purchased it in 1993 uh fc hob did a very thorough
phase two uh which i have access to and the land was very clean back then it's the only reason i'm
was even willing to entertain purchasing this then and obviously we'll do an updated phase two
um the only easement on the site and it's a significant one is this row for this interceptor
uh which runs if we pull the site plan it runs about 350 feet back and then curves so you know
it is um and you can't build you know within 25 feet of either side of it so it's you know it's
pretty significant easement but we worked around it you know so yeah it's got i apologize you have
one question you know the historic structure is structurally sound yeah oh yeah yeah there there's
no way that we can argue anything to be able to to uh demolish that historic structure no nor would
we want to i mean it's it's a it's i was i was happy that it got uh historically designated it
was only designated maybe two three years ago it happened sort of right around when we got under
contract by Oscar
Breitbart, who's been leading that charge, and we
support those kind of things.
My last question is, just on average, what is
the square foot of each property, and
what is the proposed
selling price?
I would say on average, and
Scott, correct me if I'm wrong, it's a
little over 3,000 square feet
other than unit number
four, which is 4,000 square feet.
Yeah, I was actually working on it today,
and the average overall
is about 2,900 square feet.
uh for each um they'll be sold you know we don't have the exact price points but
they're comparable with other high-end developments in the neighborhood which is what this is
other questions yeah i have a question um could you just review the pedestrian access from the
sidewalk okay uh and i i would ask that mr uh cassidy uh talk about that but there's uh can
can you explain what the pedestrian access would be from the sidewalk through the
might be helpful to put up the site plan helpful to pull up the site plan yeah let me uh do that
right helpful to pull up the site plan yeah let me uh do that hold on let me just share the right
hold on let me just share the right screen
screen let's see are you doing that are are you looking as far as with regards to sustainability
are you looking to do any third-party certification likely um so uh as uh alan did his uh presentation
we've done a number of lead projects um and we've started moving away from lead we haven't built
any differently uh we've been focusing just more and more on uh type building envelopes if we went
for a third party uh it would be passive house um perhaps living building challenge but probably
passive house um so jim's office has done a number of those types of projects um and we're always
interested in talking about it so um yeah yeah so so i want to just make sure i i understand
jim there i'm i'm putting my cursor from the back of the property to the front of the property and
there looks like there's a pedestrian walkway that you have created for each of these units
that leads from front to back there is that's the different uh hatch markings so that people would
know how to move through into the building and visit the neighbors okay can you go to the front
and the driveway i want to know what the pedestrian access is from the front the drive
from the germantown avenue yeah so right right here i just it leads always from front to back
this this this walkway and then you created these additional areas yeah that's just um
um you know so you can move on to both sides of the you know the way there and some of it's just
graphic yeah but um but it's open to germantown avenue there's not you know a gated area or
anything yeah so uh council member graham uh council member sorry uh board member graham
give you a raise uh you know something we don't
uh uh here's the walkway so this one i didn't mean i should have just went from front to back
but here it is it's straight through so and again can you just explain a little bit about
the the patios in the in in this part of here uh the second building structure yeah sure sure i
mean i think one of the things we're always trying to do is when you're building residences i mean
we see it all over the city where you see new projects and it's really just like a block a mass
and so what we were trying to do is to make sure that we broke these buildings down so that they
don't feel overwhelming to neighbors to the people who are living there and also by breaking down the
building you're able to provide more light and air and outside space so when you're i mean most
people come to live out in the northwest it's it's because of the green space and i think that's
really important i mean i live there scott lives there and you know we want to make sure that the
people who live in this community have opportunities to be outside and so you see that especially the
ones in the back that they have this ground floor patio as well as um roof decks so that they can
you know entertain hang out play kids can play outside and and to add add to that there's
actually in the back of these um rear patios so every unit at least units three through eight
have a front patio a rear patio and a roof deck a roof patio uh and units one through two one and
two have rear patio and a roof patio. That's mainly the steep slope against the berm is we're
actually infilling the berm where, you know, it used to be an old train line and it ran off with
the dirt that they built up. We're going to fill some of that dirt and use the rear of the first
floor of those homes because the elevations change one and two are lower. That concrete will act as a
diaphragm to hold back um that dirt so that you can walk out of the first of the the second floor
which is where the kitchens are on units one and two and three uh and walk right out to an actual
patio that you're directly interacting with this uh trail um you know we really hope that we can um
help activate this this and this crepling trail has been a dream in the community for about 30
Mike, do you have any questions?
Michael?
There was other question?
Do you have any?
So I was just going to ask about trash pickup mail
and if there was a market study done.
And I'd like to, I know we'd all want to hear
from the council person's office.
uh trash will be private um mail will be at each home um which is why we have that second
Trash will be private.
Mail will be at...
turnaround in the back so that uh you know mail more practically amazon can turn around and such
um market study uh can you elaborate what you mean by that
and he said the last one he wanted to hear from the council person so i have one question
chair uh so on the property where the slopes are the peaks and valleys um that are closer
to the property have y'all added any additional footers to prevent flooding or anything of that
nature uh the i mean the foundations we haven't gotten to the structural portion of this but the
foundations would be designed by a structural engineer um they've looked at this and don't see
any issues and there's no issues with flooding no yeah there's there's none uh and we worked
with the technical review with the water department um and they were satisfied with that
thank you questions or comments from our attorney Hillary Emerson not at this time
Mr. Chair questions from the audience questions from the virtual audience
yes mr chair i have charles richardson with their hand raised they have been allowed to speak
mr richardson you have already been sworn just for the record state your name
charles richardson r-i-c-h-a-r-d-s-o-n office of councilwoman cindy bass room 508 call
uh thank you sir councilwoman thinks that this is a horrible location
uh the fact is that it's 7600 block of uh germantown avenue is a speed trap for the most
part uh from gowan east gowan avenue and if anybody that knows anything about coming up
germantown avenue you pass by the wawa then you get to gowan and gowan is from there it's a quarter
mile s type of curve and whatnot and it's the speedway it's directly across the street their
egress is directly across the street from a property 7611 through 17 Germantown Avenue,
which is going to have 114 units. And if they're in the midst of finishing that property off,
but their egress is right across the street from the other egress where they have a garage
and it's on an S curve. And there's a very bad location. It's already, like I'm saying,
It's a speedway and it's very dangerous. We've had several meetings with regard to that property, which was actually a by right property.
So we had, you know, the neighbors were totally up in arms and they see that 13 individuals were only contacted because of the fact of their address.
But had East Mount Airy neighbors been included with that, it would have been a lot more folks that would have been involved in it or had it been further advertised because it's not a great location.
And that's one of the main concerns is the fact that there's too much traffic and too much density in that area.
So the councilwoman is opposed.
You know, the fact that you guys put a lot of thought into it and everything is good, but it's not a great location for that type of type of development.
Mr. Nockman, do you have any questions?
No, I have comment, though.
Well, why don't we do this?
Why don't we see if there's anyone else in the audience needing to respond to anyone else in the virtual audience?
No further
hands, Mr. Chair. Please. So this is a single-family
zoning classification, RSD3.
Yes, and we're allowed, if this is a regular
shaped lot, we would be allowed 10 units as of right. We're only asking
for eight single-family units. So based on the Philadelphia Zoning
Code, we're providing the least modification possible
under the circumstances we have a situation here given this the configuration a lot where it's very
narrow in the front and the fact there's a historic structure we cannot move where we're getting many
of these variances in terms of you know again we have a density issue we have two parking spaces
per unit that for per single family unit you know that's very thoughtful like this is not the first
time that a board in the city of philadelphia has heard this project they heard a historic
Commission. They gave unanimous support where they're saying that stakeholders had no idea
about this. This has been a project that's been going on for years. It was in the local newspaper.
That's why we gave the local newspaper article more so, again, to show how much support the
community has shown and embraced this project. We have a very sophisticated community board
that reviewed this project.
Again, two former attorneys
attorneys that represented the zoning board of adjustment. This is a case that screams of undue
that represented the Zoning Board of Adjustment.
This is a case.
hardship that would survive not only this board, but any subsequent court. And forget about the
legal standards. This is a great project. This is the type of project we as a city should embrace,
especially in times where our city's kind of taken a punch in the gut the last week or so.
You know, we need to have like some victories here as a city. And this is a victory. This is like embracing great architecture under some duress of a property like this. So for all those reasons, I really do respectfully request that the board grant this variance. And if we have to go in front of another body, we feel very, we feel very strongly encouraged that based on the circumstances, we will survive appeal. Thank you.
planning commission
thank you chair bergman and good afternoon david vecto with the city planning commission
chairman and board members the comprehensive plan recommends a change in zoning at this location
from rsd3 residential single family to spins special purpose institutional the current building
on the site has a documented history as an office an apartment and a lunch room a lunch room is not
fundamentally different than the proposed prepared food shop this is an unusually deep lot but not
unusually narrow for the context of this block face there appears to have historically been more
than one building on the site this is a 50 428 square foot lot rsd3 requires 5 000 square feet
for one dwelling unit if the appellant were able to meet all of the dimensional requirements
it would be allowed 10 dwelling units considering the other restrictions on the property including
easements and steep slopes the city planning commission recommends the board grant the
proposed use and dimensional variances mr chair one other thing i would like to move my exhibits
into the record agreed um we're going to take this back to our executive group our executive session
we'll do that next wednesday morning and we will vote on this at 2 p.m next wednesday thank you
okay thank you thank you for presenting pardon me mr chair i've got it why don't we take a
10 minute break for the board all right
She could also pay for it.
I just feel like...
Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you.
It's just like that.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Okay, are we ready?
Everybody ready?
Yes, Chair.
Johnny Kelly, you ready?
Yes, Chair.
Okay, so number four, MI 2024-006-168-2901 South 56th Street.
Murr Trego is the attorney.
there is a unanimous support from the southwest philadelphia district services
um counsel could you please state your name is spelled for the stenographer
hi yes my name is meredith trego with ballard spar spelled m-e-r-e-d-i-t-h last name trego
t-r-e-g-o um we are here on behalf of all right do you swear or affirm to tell the truth the
whole truth nothing but the truth yes could you identify your client the relationship to
this property yes our client uh we're here on behalf of bartram's garden um who's the lessee
and operator of bartram's garden uh the park located at 2901 south 56th street the property
owner is the city of philadelphia the vice chair has a few questions good afternoon council do you
agree to weigh the reading or the refusal or stipulate towards accuracy yes sir have you
emailed in all the required document documents and exhibits five days in advance thank you please
Please proceed and share your screen.
Come on up.
Mr. Chairman and members of the board, we are here today with a minor variance request
for the expansion of a 10-foot-tall chain link fence, which will be erected around a
small area of a community garden which is located within bartram's garden the community garden is
expanding to accommodate increased demand for the community garden we did receive a variance for
this application due to the height of the fence the zoning code requires that fences be four feet
tall in front yards and six feet tall inside and rear yards we are proposing a 10 feet tall 10 foot
tall chain lick fence which is actually the height of the existing fence that's around the community
garden the garden itself is expanding slightly north and west um and so the new fencing that
will be 10 feet tall is to match the existing fencing that's there and also to ensure the
security of the garden and the safety uh of the crops that are grown in there from wildlife as
well as uh you know no one getting in and getting hurt by the equipment and tools that are kept
inside that community garden i'm here today with tom reber who is the director of landscape and
facilities for bartram's garden bartram's garden as you may know a little bit of background is a
public park spanning nearly 50 acres in southwest philadelphia it offers access to public spaces
environmental education and nature to 100 000 visitors annually we have filed all of our
required exhibits with the board shown here in our exhibit list including our proof of mailings
in exhibit 10 our posting of notices shown in exhibit 8 our zoning plans in exhibit 4
and our tax clearance certificate in exhibit 15. we have also received community support from the
rco specifically we have a letter of support from the southwest philadelphia district services rco
which is included in exhibit 12. we also understand that the council person's office
has sent a letter as well in support of the project so given the minor scope of this variance
which is just the expansion of an existing 10-foot fence.
We're happy to do an offer of proof,
or I can go into questions with Mr. Reaver.
Why don't you just show us what the site looks like?
Waterfall.
The existing fence.
Great.
So I'm turning to Exhibit 2, which is our maps.
This shows the Bartram's Garden site overall.
I'm moving my cursor around the existing community garden,
i'm moving my cursor around the existing community garden which is right here
which is right here.
it uh is located at the intersection of a rail line and south 56th street
here's an aerial view of uh the same area again my cursor is showing uh the
the community garden area in the south southwest corner of bartram's garden
and a zoning map of this parcel uh the entire bartram's garden site is uh zoned sppoa for
parks and open space in which a community garden use is permitted i'm turning now to exhibit three
of our exhibit package the first page shows the precise location of the community garden within
the bartems garden site the current community garden is 24 000 square feet in size it's expanding
roughly 7 700 square feet in size due to the demand for additional garden space these plots
are used by residents of the community and there's demand from community residents nearby for
additional plots i'm turning now to some existing photos inside the community garden space
and as part of the project there will be a little bit of a rehabilitation of the gardens
and new greenhouses going in as well but the the refusal we were issued is limited to the height
of the next so here's the existing fence here another shot of the existing fence
um still in exhibit two uh pages four and five of our exhibit package this is an aerial view
showing kind of excuse me can you speak up a little louder you can we can barely hear you oh no
i'm sorry is that better sorry about that okay sorry about that um this is an uh aerial shot
of just the community garden space south 56th street is the public road that runs along the
southern edge of bartrams garden and the community garden is flanked to its west by this rail line
and one of the reasons that the fence needs to be 10 feet high is due to the slope so coming
down from the rail line on the western edge is a significant slope down to the site of the community
garden so any shorter of a fence uh and really deer and other animals would really be able to
pop that quite easily and so the 10 foot high fence is really to keep out the wildlife that
exists in the garden um and ensure the protection of those crops as well as we mentioned to you know
keep out any persons who you know are not invited in just keep them safe from the equipment and the
tools that are stored inside the garden space here is another view of the community garden
from the western edge we also just want to point out that the garden itself is
set back from South 56th Street and separated by significant vegetation
along the roadway and so the fence line along South 56th Street is not visible
from the public right-of-way due to the dense vegetation located there and then
lastly we have just a site plan showing the expansion so the it's a little hard
to see in this but the the yellow and the red are the expanded areas of the community garden
and the blue line around it is the new fencing that will go up and so most of the new fencing
is along that western edge uh abutting the rail line and the steep slope where that 10 foot height
really is necessary to protect the garden um and so lastly we'd like to state that the proposed
project satisfies the criteria for a variance because there are unique physical circumstances
at the property specifically the steep slope and the surrounding land that prevents the property
from being developed in strict conformity with the zoning code there is no detriment to the
public health safety and welfare and this request represents the least minimum variance
i'd like to elevate uh tom reber who's the director of landscape and facilities of bartram's
garden as a panel can you make sure your mic's on yep and could you please state your name and
spelled for the stenographer yes my name is tom reber t-o-m-r-e-b-e-r do you swear or affirm to
tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth sir i do please proceed counsel mr rebert
you just heard what i said can you affirm what i've said is new and accurate and adopt it as
your own testimony i can and i do thank you we uh questions from the board
questions or comments from our attorney hillary emerson not at this time mr chair
Okay. Questions or comments from the audience?
Questions or comments from the virtual audience?
Yes, Mr. Chair. I have a hand up from Craig Melodosian.
They have been allowed to speak.
Craig, you were, just for the record, state your name.
You were already sworn once today.
Craig Melodosian, C-R-A-I-G, last name M-E-L-I-D-O-S-I-A-N.
Last name, M-E-L-I-D-O-S-I-A-N.
Please proceed, sir.
Please proceed, sir.
With the award 40 Republican RCO, we were jurisdictional and participated in the adjacent affected neighbors community meeting hosted by Mike Ross from Southwest Philadelphia District Services.
uh we think they're uh based upon the presentation uh the presence of another design professional
mitra roy at that meeting who i've worked with uh in the regarding the bellwether district for
over a year now and a site visit on 1231 uh not only is the application de minimis
but it will secure what's being grown there and protect it.
It is adjacent to a Chessie Railroad Freight Spur.
They don't think that we're going to have kids climbing over or around it to get down to the spur.
But in fact, with the planned increase of Bartram Village up to 600 units,
which was part of which was before the board uh last year uh again this is a de minimis request
doesn't interrupt with any visual pathways and uh of the two rcos that were there uh there was
unanimous support thank you very much thank you craig for calling in we appreciate it is
there anyone else in the virtual audience i do not see any further hands mr chair thank you jason
planning commission thank you chair bergman and good afternoon david effecto with the city planning
commission chairman of board members the comprehensive plan recommends no change to
the special purpose parks and open spaces zoning at this location the appellant requests relief
from the fence height requirements in the zoning code the appellant has shown the proposed height
a fence height will not injure the use of adjacent properties bartrams provides an essential community
service to the surrounding neighborhood the city planning commission recommends that the board
grant the proposed dimensional variances for fence height thank you mi 2024 006 168 2901 south 56
Street, I vote yes. Michael Johns, my vote is yes.
Cheryl Gaston, my vote is yes. Tanetta Graham, my vote
is yes. Iowyn, my vote is yes. Ishmael Shahid, my vote is yes.
Thank you, counsel. Thank you. One last thing, I'd like to just move our exhibits into evidence.
Yes. Thank you. Thank you for your time today.
All right. Number five, MI 2024
006169, 1900
hundred South Broad Street. Eric Bodson is the attorney for the owner.
There also is a letter of unanimous support from the South Broad Street
Neighborhood Association with unenforceable provisos.
Council, Bodson.
We've been promoted to panelist. They should be rejoining shortly, Mr.
Chair. Sure. Thank you.
good afternoon mr chair good afternoon members of the board good afternoon council could you
please state your name and spell for the stenographer yes my name is eric e-r-i-c
last name bodzin b-o-d-z-i-n a blank room do you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth
and nothing but the truth yes i do do you identify your client the relationship to this property
yes my client uh hold up if you give me a second i'll pull up our slides can you all see that
yeah yes wonderful um so my my client is uh 1900 south broad street owner llc which does business
as maestro development and owns the subject property of 1900 south broad street uh with me
here this afternoon is Max Silverstein from Ownership, as well as Eli Storch from LARK
Architecture. Our vice chair has a few questions, sir. Good afternoon, counsel. Do you agree to waive
the reading of the refusal or stipulate to its accuracy? Yes, I do. Have you emailed in all the
required documents and exhibits that's needed to proceed with this case five days in advance of
this hearing? Yes, I have. Thank you, counsel. Please proceed. Thank you. And Mr. Vice Chair
members of the board. Welcome back. With me, as I mentioned, is Max Silverstein from Ownership and
Eli Storch of LRK. I understand we may also have a representative from SBSNA, the South Broad Street
Neighborhood Association, in attendance with us here today. SBSNA is the coordinating RCO in this
matter. And as mentioned, we are pleased to share that we have submitted in our exhibit package
a letter of unanimous support from SBSNA for this redevelopment.
a letter of unanimous support from SBSNA for this redevelopment of a 10,000 square foot site
at the corner of Broad and Mifflin Streets in front of the 150,000 square foot Constitution
Health Plaza that fills the rest of this entire city block. You may recall that the board recently
approved redevelopment plans at this site. That was on July 27th of 2022, also with extensive
community support. This application today is to update those redevelopment plans from medical
offices to mixed use, but to preserve ground floor commercial, to preserve the same height
as previously approved by this board, which, as you can see, matches the adjacent rear property
on Mifflin Street. And also, today's application maintains the same neighborhood agreement,
which I'll pull up in a moment, with the same provisions for ample additional parking,
limited loading zone hours, maximal landscaping, and community-approved limitations on ground
floor use. Given this history, I will aim to be very brief with your time this afternoon and focus
on what's new to the redevelopment plan, particularly the 41 residences that SBS&A
worked with the owner this past year to design well before submitting this permit application
and to design them specifically to suit long-term family-oriented living in this amenity-rich
neighborhood. As you'll see in the floor plans, these units are notably fewer and larger than
originally proposed, and then what you've typically seen in the area, about half two bedrooms of about
1,000 square feet and about half one bedrooms of about 800 square feet with no studios.
I'll pull up some context. As you can see here from the zoning map, the issue that brings us
here today is also the same as it was in 2022. That is that this jagged looking 10,000 square
foot parcel remains in the single-family residential district RSA 5 despite the mixed zoning,
commercial mixed zoning on the rest of the block at Pass Station Health Plaza,
on the surrounding Broad Street and Pass Young Avenue corridors as you can see,
and even on the other corner properties here on Mifflin Street.
It's also zoned at RSA 5, despite the longstanding commercial use of this building you see here in the upper right corner, that has lived well along its functional life, and the neighbors and owner are eager to move forward with redevelopment plans.
Here is a map of local amenities in the vicinity. You can see several schools, health care, and transit lines. You have the broad street line and four buses within minutes of the redevelopment site.
again, supportive of the commercial and mixed use suitability of this parcel. And we understand
that the Planning Commission is waiting on that, or waiting on that back in 2022, and
we'll do so later this afternoon. Here is the refusal, again, highlighting the RSA 5
district's restriction on non-residential, multiple and or accessory parking uses.
And here are the variants from the code's dimensional standards for lower density residential
districts, which are minimally modified for the rear yard and occupied area facing the interior
of the campus. And for height, as I mentioned, consistent with this board's prior approval,
all designed in a non-adverse and, in fact, beneficial manner to reactivate this important
corner of the neighborhood and its main corridors. I'll quickly run through the plans. This is the
ground floor at grade with a bright and light design, thanks to our architect, Eli, really
designed to reactivate this underutilized corridor. In red, you'll see the Broad Street commercial
entrance, which leads into 2,500 square feet, fitted flexibly for one or two tenant occupancy
for use as office, retail, and or medical practitioner space. All is limited by those
All is limited by those community-approved uses I mentioned, which are memorialized in an executed agreement with SBS&A, along with provisions for on-site janitorial, private commercial trash pickup at least three times a week from the interior and out of public view, and detailed landscaping, lighting, and security features.
community-approved uses I mentioned, which are...
In blue, you'll see the Mifflin Street residential entrance located near the corner.
It leads into a bike room, a package room.
There's a lobby area.
It's a bit small, but again, bright, light, and open.
Next, the elevators is a direct entrance to parking that is enclosed for 15 vehicles,
accessible by a roll-up security door on Mifflin Street.
street. And there are also 32 additional spaces directly next door, secured by a long-term lease,
as well as the neighborhood agreement. Here's a typical upper floor plan. As I mentioned,
the unit mix is a near even split, 22 one-bedrooms in green, 19 two-bedrooms in yellow. Again,
larger than what you typically see per Max's goal and SPSNA's goal alike of larger units that are
well-suited for long-term family-oriented living in an amenity-rich neighborhood.
And here's the top floor plan. Another piece of feedback that the community provided to Max and
his team before submitting the permit application last spring was to add some amenity space to
encourage longer-term tenancy. And here you see a roof deck as well as an amenity lounge.
Deck is set back five feet from both Broad and Mifflin streets, not only as a buffer,
but also to reduce the felt mass from Broad Street. So the building actually feels or will
feel smaller than uh the originally proposed redevelopment act in 2022 um yeah i'm good
oh break hello yeah quick yeah quick break thank you yeah of course
there you go
take it
oh sure that's okay
Wait, I can't hear.
Okay. Councilor, proceed.
Proceed?
yeah please thank you Mr. Chair so I'll conclude in a moment but here are the renderings
from the from South Broad Street and here are the elevations from South Broad Street
you'll see a simple window grid subtle inset lighting at the base here you see the renderings
from Mifflin Street and again the elevation plans with a step down in scale with the brick
moving to a lower elevation. Here's a rendering from the evening. As the CDR committee noted,
you know, these base interior lighting, these tasteful sconces amplify the red brick pattern
that I know our design team really spent a lot of time to contextualize from the neighborhood.
This, speaking of the design team, this is a recent collaboration between the owner
and the architect, Max and Eli, at the corner of York and Jasper,
recently obtained a certificate of occupancy.
As you can see, it's near complete.
And, you know, it is most certainly a testament to the attention to detail
and facades and streetscapes that serve the community in Max and Eli's work.
here is the CDR completion letter dated December 6, 2024. As noted here, the committee was
complimentary on the project's design, scale, density, and unit mix, as well as the incorporation
of detailed community input regarding everything from the building mass, the placement of street
trees on the sidewalk. Here is the unanimous letter of support from the South Broad Street
Neighbors Association following their November 19th meeting. As I mentioned, Max and his team
As I mentioned, Max and his team further met with SPSNA earlier in the year to present
further met with SPSNA earlier in the year to present.
and make changes to the initial proposal before submitting for this permit.
Here are highlights from that executed neighborhood agreement I mentioned regarding not only parking,
but street trees, loading zones, private trash pickup, additional use restrictions,
including community approval of all new uses.
And here is the vote count, which was 14 to 0 in support of this variance with the conditions I mentioned.
And as a last note, I would be remiss not to add a final note here that Max lives in the neighborhood.
So hopefully he's posted this letter of unanimous support on his refrigerator.
In conclusion, and for all these reasons and further upon the additional plans and photographs and filings,
YOU'LL FIND IN THE FULL SET OF EXHIBITS WE'VE SUBMITTED.
WE ASK THAT WHILE THE GRANT OF THIS RELIEF FOR MIXED USE DEVELOPMENT OF PREVIOUSLY APPROVED
HEIGHT WITH MINIMAL DIMENSIONAL VARIANCE HAS NOT CONFIRMED WITH THE RESIDENTIAL SINGLE
FAMILY ZONING DISTRICT, THIS REQUESTED RELIEF IS CONSISTENT WITH THE BOARD'S PRIOR APPROVALS.
It represents the minimum variance that will afford relief and the least possible modification of the regulation at issue, and it will certainly not alter neighborhood character, increase congestion, endanger health or safety, endure or impair adjacent properties, burden public facilities, or create environmental issues, all as per the code.
To the contrary, as I mentioned, the proposed use will substantially improve and reactivate this gateway corner of Broad and Mifflin in a manner that is not only compatible, but complementary with and beneficial to this amenity-rich neighborhood as underscored by the coordinating RCO's unanimous support for this application.
For all these reasons, we respectfully ask that you join in support of this application,
and we are pleased to answer any questions from the board.
Mr. Chairman, this concludes my presentation.
Max Silverstein, the owner, is here with me to adopt my testimony
and can also answer any questions you may have.
Mr. Silverstein.
Mr. Silverstein, if you're in the virtual audience, please raise your hand.
And he's been allowed to speak, Chair.
Silverstein, could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer?
Mr. Silverstein?
Hi, how are you?
you hear me yes i can thank you could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer
my name is max silverstein m-a-x-s-i-l-v-e-r-s-t-e-i-n you swear or affirm to tell the
truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth yes i do please proceed counsel thank you sir
thank you mr chair max uh good afternoon good to see eric max have you heard my testimony this
afternoon? Yes, I have. Is it true and accurate to the best of your knowledge? Yes, it is. And would
you adopt and affirm that testimony as your own? Yes, I do. Thank you very much. Thank you.
Thank you. Questions from the board. Yes, I have a few questions. So understanding that this is
residential single family, but you're surrounded by CMX properties and the sort of scale and massing
the building would match that of cmx i was wondering um what has the hardship that required
this to be at the 98 percent of the maximum occupied area as well as going up to 72 feet
if it had been like the other commercial properties they would have had a much lower
height maximum at 55 and just wanted to understand the justification around the 41 units
Sure. And I should mention our design professional, Eli Storch, is also available with us today to answer any specific questions about the design of this property.
But as I mentioned, the previously approved height was designed to be contextual to a directly adjacent building, which I think is still pulled up on the screen of 72 feet in height, given the institutional longstanding use of this property.
long-standing use of this property as medical office building, the use of the entire block
commercial and institutional peace uses dating back to the St. Francis Hospital,
and the use of both of these commercial corridors. Back in 2022, the Planning Commission
mentioned that the comprehensive plan recommended this lot for CMX3 zoning and certainly to
redevelop property of this scale. We submit that the height is befitting and the design
was very narrowly tailored to minimize the relief we're seeking here. Those two other
dimensional issues are, we are facing, actually face the interior of the Constitution Health
Plaza. So I can understand an aesthetic justification and I also can support that
as an argument, but just wondering what is the actual hardship that required the additional
units and the height increase? Sure. So the hardship is that the ability to develop this
project other than for commercial use, for this type of mixed use is something that the owner
thoroughly explored. And when we came before the board two years ago to present a medical office
proposal, a lot of marketing and diligence followed from the owner for the development
of this property. It's just simply not something that, as a matter of practicality, can redevelop
as an RSA-5 property.
And so, you know, with the commercial dimensional standards in mind, this property was developed
back then in 2022 and is being updated now to fit those more reasonable commercial dimensional
requirements of the code.
And then, so my last question is, given that you are asking for the increased maximum allowable
area. Has there been any consideration at the site for any type of income restricted or subsidized
units? No, there is not. Okay. I have no further questions. Council, what's that behind you?
Behind me? No, no, no, no, no. That's pretty funny. I got it. The building right behind there.
The building to the rear on Mifflin Street right here. This is one of the buildings that comprise
the Constitution Health Clause. I believe I can pull up an additional exhibit. We have
an aerial. Here you can see the buildings that comprise this 150,000 square foot complex
that takes up the
rest of the block here.
Okay. All right. Other questions
from the board?
Questions or comments from our attorney,
Hillary Emerson?
Not at this time, Mr. Chair.
Questions or comments from the audience?
Questions or comments from the virtual audience?
Chair, I have a hand up from
a Catherine Norris. I have
allowed them to speak.
Hi, could you please state your name?
It's spelled for the stenographer.
Yes, it's Catherine Norris.
K-A-T-H-E-R-I-N-E
N-O-R-I-S.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth,
the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Please proceed. Are you a neighbor?
I am a neighbor, yes.
Okay, please proceed.
I live just on South Rosewood there, and I was wondering if someone could speak about the alignment of the driveway.
I am wondering about cut-throughs, drivers proceeding straight if the driveway is aligned with Rosewood and taking it as cut-through to turn west.
Council?
If I may, bring up our design professional, Eli Storch.
to address that question okay could you
what's his last name uh stork s-t-o-r-c-h okay
okay thank you sir could you please state your name is spelled for the stenographer hi my name is
hi my name is eli storch uh e-l-i-s-t-o-r-c-h do you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole
Eli Storch, E-L-I.
truth and nothing but the truth yes i do please proceed council good afternoon eli can you hear
me okay yes i can and were you able to hear mr norris's question regarding the driveway
council hold on a minute could the architect please turn his video on
I do not see where I am being allowed to. I only see an audio option.
Hold on. I'll promote them to panelists right now, Mr. Chair. Please assist me.
All right. How's that?
That's great. Thank you. Proceed, counsel.
Wonderful. Eli, were you able to hear Ms. Norris's question regarding the orientation of the driveway?
Yes, I can. And to answer it, there is an existing curb cut. We are moving it only a couple of inches just to accommodate the building structure and make the property work.
The area directly across the street from Rosewood is not part of our property. It's part of the Constitution Health Plaza. There is a rear alley there that serves the back of the Constitution Health Plaza. So it's simply not part of our property to get access via that section of land.
Thank you.
anyone else in the virtual audience
no mr chair no further hands planning commission
thank you chairman and good evening david fechto with the city planning commission
chairman and board members the project completed its civic design review in december 2024
4. the civic design review committee's advisory recommendations are not an expression expression
of the city planning commission's recommendation or opinion regarding zoning variances special
exceptions or other discretionary approvals associated with this proposal the comprehensive
plan recommends a change in zoning at this location from rsa5 residential single family
to cmx3 commercial mixed use the proposed cmx3 zoning would allow this proposal to be built by
right the city planning commission recommends the board grant the proposed variance for parking
and all use and dimensional variances thank you mi2024006169 1900 south broad street i vote yes
My vote is yes.
My vote is yes.
My vote is yes.
My vote is yes.
My vote is yes.
My vote is yes.
Thank you, council.
Thank you, members of the board.
MI 2024
006170
649 North
17th street alan knockamson is the attorney
mr knockamson you've been here several times today could you just state your name you won't have been
sworn sir alan alan knockamson and could you identify your client the relationship to the
property yeah my my client is lisa blot black the owner of the property she's to my left behind me
Okay. Our vice chair has a few questions.
Good afternoon. Counselor, do you agree to read another refusal or stipulate to his accuracy?
Have you emailed in all the required documents and exhibits that's needed to proceed with this case five days in advance of the scaring?
Yes, we have.
Please proceed and share your screen.
And, by the way, there's a letter of support here from the Spring Garden Civic Association, and also the appellant also has a petition of 18 signatures and also nine letters of support.
Just rejoining the webinar.
All right.
Do you have your tabs on?
do you have your tabs on me too all right it's a long day all right uh some let's see um let's get
Me too.
All right.
to that one I so 649 North 17 Street. This is another
beautiful project. It's really I want to live here. And by the
way i don't live far from here um think about like taking a pilot house and putting on steroids
uh and that's what it is it's really really pretty it's um the architect has evolved like a
an up-and-coming architecture firm in town and with the help of the community like we changed
the color of it i think it looks a lot nicer as a black material and stuff lisa lives in the
property with her husband she's the plant whisperer in the neighborhood i didn't know that at the
time i live in fairmont she lives a little bit closer to broad street um and you know this time
of year it's really hard to keep her plants outside so she's storing she even told me at the
you know in the hearing room she's keeping two mango plants in one of the closets and her husband
was like okay we need to find another spot for that and she's hoping through this greenhouse
on the fourth floor and you look at this picture too there's a smokestack this is an adaptive reuse
but there's a smokestack to the right of us for a property like a little small apartment building
and all we're doing is hugging this little greenhouse structure to the left of us so no
we're not taking anyone's light in there the property to the left of us they're in support
of it they have a and they're the ones most directly impacted and they they're in support
of it they have a letter of support and sort of the people across the street so i'll try to make
this short uh we have a notice refusal review correspondence from the spring garden civic
Association. They're fully in support of it. We worked with them. Another sophisticated group
where, again, we worked through just the design aspects of this. We have a petition, which includes
neighbors to the left of us, across the street from us, and many others. Zoning permit. I wanted
to show that given the refusal that we have, we have two refusals. We have a non-conforming
structure that we're increasing that structure. That's one of the refusals. And the heights.
Like typically you're not going to get a height variance here. We're looking for 46 feet, six inches, but to the right of us, it's much, much higher. So, and we're like complimenting that use again from a shadow effect. We're not really taking the person to the left of us launch and they're in support of it and we're collaborating with them. So, and this is for someone who lives in a neighborhood. And again, we want to embrace people wanting to stay in Philadelphia.
of you. So the zoning permit has all to do to the property to the right of us. Zony map, maps of the
area, you know, photographs of the property or plans and drawings or meeting notice along proof
of mailing that notice or application for appeal or deed to the property showing that Lisa is the
owner of the property and our certificate of tax clearance. She's here behind me. You know, we'll
I'll ask her to be sworn in and adopt my testimony as her own.
But we also have Sam Turner from Evolve Architects who can answer any technical questions you may have.
Notice refusal, again, two of them.
We're expanding a non-conforming structure by just, again, putting that fourth story on there.
The three stories already are non-conforming from a rear-yard setback.
And the second refusal has to do with the fact that we're going forty six feet, six inches high.
Again, not out of character. The property to the right of us is even higher in some respects.
Correspondence from the Spring Garden Group, again, fully in support of it.
They worked with us diligently and just, you know, softening up the project to make sense.
uh petition from nearby neighbors which includes the neighbor to the left of us
a few neighbors in front of us along with the like letters of support from some of those individuals
our zoning the zoning permit to the property to the right of us and we got this off of atlas but
you'll see the heights the height i think here saying 50 something feet high uh maps of the
area so we're 17 we're considered 17th street property this is 17th street um but uh there
it's really really on melon street it's kind of weird and you know what we're not taking anyone's
light in there because there's a parking garage right here on going on fairmont street and then
there's this there's a really interesting uh historic building here uh which has a bank and
which has a bank and apartments and a brewery in there, which is much higher in height.
apartments and a brewery in there which is much higher in height
So contextually, we're really good in that respect from a variant standpoint.
And you can see here, we're really on Mellon Street.
But for whatever reason, when this, I guess, this property got split from other properties, they gave a 17th Street address.
Photographs of the property.
So here's our property.
Here's that parking lot on Fairmont.
So even if we go high, we are not taking anyone's light and airway.
And here's some commercial buildings on Fairmont, which are higher in nature than even us.
Maps, excuse me, proof of our posting for today's hearing.
And then this is our property right here.
But you can see adaptive reuse to make these single-family structures.
And you can see this building structure to the right of us, which we try to complement.
and then this is from Fairmont
this is our property back here
and then just some pictures
of Lisa and what she does
this is older obviously
they took down the railing
they're hoping to get this approval
and those plants are not here today
because it's 20 something degrees
and then this is her rear yard
again she's again
known in the neighborhood
for her growth of
exotic plants
and vegetation.
And then this is her project.
She's going to have a green roof here,
a little area, a sitting area.
And again, I think the black is a much better use
than what was like, it was more of like a beige.
So it complements the front of the property.
And I think it's even more of a dark gray.
You see a lot of vegetation inside.
You can't see her property from Fairmont.
You see the other property.
You see the back of her property from Fairmont.
Yeah, I'll show you a picture back.
I'll go back.
This is her property right now.
This is the pilot house that's currently existing right now.
So what she's doing is she's demolishing that pilot house
and just expanding it to a whole floor.
So it's...
and then this is just the floor plans um you know very interesting she's actually even gonna
have a tree you're gonna have a tree right she has trees plant plant to be in in this in this
greenhouse um you know it's like a feng shui type of place like you know have a shower in here you
have a sauna and the green roof, like, you know, she has some some skylights in here
to allow for the vegetation to grow.
There's just some elevations here.
And then, you know, we met with the community on December 5th, we emailed notice to the
community a few weeks beforehand, to community organizations show proof of mailing of that
notice that went to 114 addresses.
Those are the addresses we mailed it to. That's the proof of mailing, the application for appeal, the deed to the property, and the tax clearance certificate.
Technically, it's not overdue yet, so she's in good standing with the City of Philadelphia.
I would ask that, Ms. Black, if you can hit the green button, if it's not green already, or hit the button so it is green, then you can be swearing.
Could you please state your name and then spell for the stenographer?
Lisa Black, L-I-S-A-B-L-A-C-K, just like the color.
You swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Oh, yes.
Proceed, counsel.
Ms. Black, you heard everything I had to state today about your zoning matter.
And is it true and correct?
It is.
And do you adopt this as your own testimony?
Thank you.
Questions from the board.
What's the setback from the street?
Let's go back to the plans.
And I have Mr. Turner on if you want to virtually raise his hand.
All right, let's see what I got here.
And is the structure the same height as the building to the right, or is it slightly shorter?
My understanding from looking at the, it's slightly shorter because we got from Atlas the zoning permit for that adaptive reuse.
you know we got from atlas the zoning permits for that adaptive reuse of into an apartment building
to the right and the elevation was over 50 feet according to uh that drawing and ours is 46 feet
six inches and the setback is is five feet according to this site plan in the front
other questions from the board yes um since this is a greenhouse that's going on the roof i was
wondering if you could talk to how water is being managed at that roof line and how it's being
sealed for weather during the winter yes um well i think the architect would probably have a little
bit more technical details but um we already have a hosing up there we already have pipes
and we we have a pretty extensive plant collection um we've got a really great
drainage on that roof the original architects who developed it and then partners did a fabulous job
of that and we're using some pretty innovative techniques to incorporate cooling and and warmth
without completely blowing an electrical grid we're trying to incorporate as best as we can
some of these greener aspects.
I would ask
if Mr. Turner can
virtually raise his hand and maybe
elaborate as further.
Mr. Turner?
I better not to speak.
Could you
state your name as spelled for the stenographer?
Hi, Samuel Turner
here. S-A-M-U-E-L
T-U-R-N-E-R.
do you swear or affirm to tell the truth
the whole truth and nothing but the truth
could you turn your video on please
oh sorry
proceed counsel
yeah Mr. Turner you heard the questions about
storm order
and things like that can you just elaborate
on what Ms. Black stated
just to clarify I'm in any water
not just storm water since it's a
greenhouse
some of the details still need to be worked out during construction but for all the storm water
be reusing what's existing there's an internal drain towards the back towards the fair amount
facing side of the property so all the storm water can be gathered there and as far as the
internal like drainage it would all be kind of handled by the planner system and diverted
appropriately but like i said the the details will still need to be figured out on that understood i
mean obviously we're at zoning but uh when you talk about the planter system are you talking
about the green roof system specifically or is there a specific planter system that's being
built into that occupied section of the of the addition in the green portion the green roof can
be self-sustaining um but internally that's the part that we're still kind of working through the
details on yeah i wasn't asking i was actually not asking about the green roof i'm asking about
the greenhouse portion understanding that she has a lot of plants and that it's going to operate as
a greenhouse oftentimes greenhouses have lots of condensation condensation at roof planes on
contiguous properties are generally not something that's uh welcomed and so i just want to understand
what provisions or plans have been put in place to manage any water accumulation or condensation
that might happen at that upper level
so that it doesn't cause damage
both to their property
but also to the neighboring properties
from a material standpoint.
I would just defer to, you know,
the plumbing engineer
during the building permit phase
that will be looking at this
to kind of come up with a strategy
for any out, you know,
out of the ordinary circumstances
for like the moisture accumulation.
And we have been in direct communication
with the neighbors to the owners to the left.
We're actually making modifications
to their deck at their request.
So we're working collaboratively with them.
And I would anticipate that would be
along these lines as well
to obviously make sure we're not damaging
any properties to the left and right of us.
There are also, just to jump in,
there are also specific skylights
that have vents
in them, and
these are things that we're exploring.
Further along
in the design, if you are
amiable to this project, we'll be
looking at all of that. It's a concern, and
I'm glad you brought it up.
Any other questions?
Council, you said it was
46 feet?
That's right.
uh so any sprinkler system i know it's 45 in the city of philadelphia i defer to the architect if
So any sprinkler
system? I know it's 45 in the city of Philadelphia.
Thank you.
there's requirements about sprinkler system you know i don't know to provide you know from a
building code perspective obviously we have to comply with that so i'm going to defer to the
architect in that respect um mr turner uh yeah for a fourth story typically we'll we'll have those
called for um so yeah yeah okay any other questions from the board questions or comments
from our attorney not on time mr chair questions or comments from the uh virtual of the uh audience
questions or comments from the virtual audience
here i have a hand up from justino navarro i've allowed them to speak
hi could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer justino navarro j-u-s-t-i-n-o
n-a-v-a-r-r-o do you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth
i do you're from the rco right that's correct mr chair please so thank you thank you mr chair
members of the board it's great to see you guys again uh hopefully i'll get a chance to see you
guys in person one of these days when i'm feeling a little bit better but i just wanted to call in
and reiterate the support of the spring garden civic association i am here in representation of
the spring garden civic association and the zoning committee and commend the uh the attorney and and
and miss black our neighbor uh and architect for their flexibility in terms of design and for making
adjustments recommended by the his by the zoning committee that will make the property of the
project more compatible with the spring garden historic district i also want to commend her and
thank her for being one more member of the community that is once again committed to the
sustainability that we here in spring garden are fully committed to and as i like to say we heartily
believe in putting the green back in green street and putting the gardens back in spring garden so
i would urge the board to approve the request as presented today thank you so much for your time
thank you very much is there anyone else in the virtual audience
planning commission no further hands
thank you chair bergman and good evening david fecto with the city planning commission
chairman and board members the comprehensive plan recommends a change in zoning at this location
from cmx2 commercial mixed use to rsa5 residential single family there is no unique physical
condition or circumstance of this property that were prevented from being used in strict
conformity with the zoning code and the appellant has not shown that they will suffer an economic
detriment if they are forced to comply with the maximum height and rear setback requirements in
the zoning code the city planning commission recommends that the board deny both dimensional
variances uh i just really like to respond sure um if you look at where it's situated it's very
unique property in that it's labeled 17th street but it's on melon which is one of those side
streets. Behind us is a parking lot, which is a commercial corridor. The properties that are
surrounding us, if you, I live around there. So in Fairmont, those are higher properties
in terms of height. We kind of are in scale with those properties on Fairmont. The property to the
right of us, again, that stack is even higher than what we're proposing. So contextually,
I would believe that, you know, this falls in line with what the board should, you know,
granted in terms of a variance. Thank you. Thank you. MI 2024-006-170-649-North 17th Street,
I vote yes. Michael Johns, my vote is yes. Cheryl Gaston, my vote is yes. Tanetta Graham,
my vote is yes. Iowan, my vote is yes. Ishmael Shahid, my vote is yes. Thank you.
Number seven, MI 2024-006-171, 1417 South Broad Street.
Andrea Solomon is the attorney.
Here's anonymous support with the proviso from South Broad Neighborhood
and a letter of non-opposition with proviso from Council Member Squillett.
Applicant also has support of 10 signatures, four from the neighborhood.
counsel salomon mr chair members of the board um andrea solomon from claire harrison harvey
bransburg land use and zoning attorney here on behalf of the owners of 1417 south broad
could you spell your name for the stenographer yes uh a-n-d-r-e-a s-a-l-o-m-o-n
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
I do. Could you identify your client, the relationship to the property?
Could you identify your client, the relationship to the property?
Yes, my clients are Debbie and Bill Lutz, the owners of 1417 South Broad.
Okay, our vice chair has just a few questions.
Counselor, do you agree to either read another refusal or stipulate to its accuracy?
I do. Have you emailed in all the required documents and exhibits that's needed to proceed with this case five days in advance of this hearing?
We did. Thank you, counsel. Please proceed and share the screen.
Thank you.
Not, oh, there it is, the sheer screen.
You're up.
Okay, thank you, everybody.
I'll get into the details later in the presentation, but this application is for the erection of a one-story addition with a deck atop an existing garage.
of a single-family home for use as the private home gym. We met with the community back in
November, and we're happy to have received the unanimous support from the coordinating RCO,
the South Broad Street Neighborhood Association. Ultimately, they understand that this is a solid
single-family home on Broad Street and understand the family's need for additional space,
And they would actually, they're actually particularly in support because this addition, they believe, will add eyes on the street, on Watts Street, in the rear of the properties, increasing safety and security on the block.
the letter they issued did include two provisos to ensure that this addition is not used as a
second dwelling unit as the board is aware if that were the case the applicants would need
additional relief because this is rsa 5 zoning so uh that's not part of this application that's
not the intended use as i mentioned it's for uh the an accessory gym to the single family home
The family loves their home. They want to stay in it. They have four kids and just want extra space. So they're not opposed to either of the provisos, the Saquon being that no kitchen be installed from SBSNA.
They also received support from many of the near neighbors, including the property directly adjacent to the south, 1419 South Broad Street, and directly across Watt Street at 1410 South Jupiter Street.
the refusal is a highly technical one there was a bit of back and forth um whether the existing
garage already constitutes a principal building or whether the addition would turn the garage into a
principal building but um the addition is atop the rear garage uh so the condition of the two
buildings exist already um in fact like i mentioned with the addition would be improving
the safety and security on the block and as to the roof deck if it were above the existing home
it would be permitted by right in the zoning district but since it's atop the garage it
requires this board's approval however the roof deck is dimensionally compliant
This is an aerial image of the property. You can see the garage is separated from the main
house structure and we'd be building on top of it. Like I mentioned, the 1419 neighbors are in
support. The neighbor is directly to the north. It's already a multifamily unit that has a second
story above the garage and that one actually is used as a dwelling, a separate dwelling unit.
This is another aerial image. You can see that the majority of the
blocks have a garage in the rear on Watts Street.
um this is the subject property the one with the basketball net we the for the requested relief is
to construct a second story uh a first a one-story addition atop the garage it would match the roof
line of the adjacent actually be a little bit lower than the adjacent property
this is an image of the existing conditions again the second story of the property above the garage
directly adjacent to them 1419 is in support you can they want to preserve their open space and
They want to preserve their open space and the dish end would be accessed from their interior yard.
Another view that shows the second story and the extent of their rear yard.
They want to preserve the open space.
This is their current home gym.
It's in the single family residence.
As I mentioned, the Lodzes have four kids. They're getting older. They want to be able to
use the space for additional bedrooms, but are very health conscious and want to also
maintain a space for working out. And that's why they're wanting to move this
setup that is their home gym to the addition of the garage.
Here we have the elevation. You can see what I mentioned, that the roof line will be below the one that's existing in the adjacent property, the floor plans.
You can see that the access to the addition will be solely from the interior courtyard,
so you'll actually have to go through the single family home to access the additional space.
These are images of the property from Broad Street. That's a beautiful
row home on Broad Street that they want to be able to stay in as a growing family.
And more views of the rear.
More views of their existing gym which they're seeking to relocate to the addition.
As I mentioned the property is zoned RSA 5.
we have the zoning poster and the photos of the posting on both street frontages
application for appeal and the project information form the notice to the
near neighbors and rcos certificate of mailing the code provisions relevant code provisions
the deed
and their tax compliance
which shows the tax balance
is only for the 2025 taxes
which haven't come due
and with that I'll ask
that my clients Bill and Debbie
Lutz be promoted
as panelists so they can adopt my testimony
how could you please state your name
they've been allowed to speak sir
thank you uh my name is deborah lutz could you spell please for the stenographer yes d-b-r-a-l-u-t-z
do you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth
yes please proceed counsel hi debbie were you able to see and hear my presentation
yes i was was it true and accurate yes it was and would you adopt it as your own testimony
yes i would and just from the board i think bill is here as well if he could be promoted
as panelists who's that uh bill lutz to speak as well man uh is bill lutz here okay he's going to
say the same thing she did or that's correct oh okay um um state your name please and spell for
the stenographer bill let's b-i-l-l-l-u-t-z do you swear or firm to tell the truth the whole truth
nothing but the truth i do please proceed counsel bill did you see and hear my presentation today
i did was it true and accurate yes it was would you adopt it as your own testimony yes i will
thank you questions from the board what's the height of the pilot house above the second floor
roof line I'll also ask that Graham Baylor he's the project architect be promoted as
panelists so he can answer any technical questions but I'll also flip to yeah
do we see his hand
yes they've been promoted to panel sir but could you could you please state your name and spell
Could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer?
for a stenographer
They'll be coming back soon.
So the pilot house is the 10 feet.
From what the roof line looks like, it's at 22 feet total.
And then the pilot house is an additional 10 feet above that.
so the whole the total height of the entire structure is 30 feet
i believe so it's a little bit small on my screen oh is the architectural
yes okay do you please could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer
yeah sure graham baler uh g-r-a-h-a-m-b-a-i-l-e-r you swear or firm to tell the truth
the whole truth nothing but the truth i do you heard the question i did i'm pulling up the right
thing it just kicked me out for a second let me pull up my pdf and i'll give you the exact dimension
um the quick answer to the pilot house is that it would conform to code as less than
10 feet above the deck level um but i don't know if that's the question i i was kicked
out for a minute so i don't know if there was a follow-up question
no that was the question i was just trying to reconcile the fact that it was said that the
height the tallest height matched the building next door and it does not because the pilot house
is actually taller than the building next door yeah yeah and i was wondering if you could explain
why the pilot house is so big because it doesn't need to be as wide as it is to be honest the way
that it's drawn as wide as it is you mean the three feet or the length the length um it can
certainly be shorter it was just drawn um schematically staying within code but
i would imagine it would be tailored to be a little bit smaller that's that's fair
that the uh any other questions just just to make to confirm that street uh that's the back street
there are no um houses that front on that street correct
I know that street pretty well okay so it's a back as a back street all right thank you
sorry my question why the exterior stair from the first floor to the ground
yeah do you want me to field that
yes yeah um sorry i was talking to andrea i didn't want to cut her off um the interior stair
would use up the parking space to be honest um in the floor plan those you have very very minimal
amounts of space to um to to fit a stair interior to that so we decided to bring the stair out to
the courtyard okay and this would be from the garage into the unit or how are we
the stairs goes from the the yard to the home gym on those above the garage okay
and we need that because if there was an interior stair inside the garage that sort of traditional
like traditional details was was breaking through the existing roof you would not have the the height
to get in there going across the property and if you went um for a parallel let's say from watts to
broad you would essentially eat up the entire parking space kind of rendering the garage
useless
getting rid of one of the parking spaces
Okay, thank you
Questions from our attorney, Hillary Emerson
Just briefly, there was a couple of
provisos listed
in the RCO's
letter
that would be enforceable
and I wanted to know if your client was in agreement
with them. One was
no change of use from single family household living second no kitchen and new addition above
existing garage yes they're in agreement okay thank you
okay um
questions or comments from the audience questions or comments from the virtual audience
i do not see any further hands mr chair planning commission thank you chair bergman and good
evening david effecto with the city planning commission chairman of board members the
comprehensive plan recommends no change to the rsa 5 residential single-family zoning at this location
rsa 5 residential single family zoning at this location the appellant requests relief for multiple
principal buildings and for a proposed roof deck property already has a rear structure as do most
of the properties on this block face so this variance for multiple principal buildings is
supportable however the appellant has not shown that the roof deck is necessary to enable viable
use of the property the city planning commission recommends the board grant the proposed variance
for multiple principal buildings but deny the use variance for the roof deck
mi 2024 006 171 1417 south broad street i vote yes with proviso no household living
and no kitchen in addition no well no change of use from single family household living
and no kitchen in new addition above existing garage.
No change of use for single household living
and no kitchen on top of garage.
Michael Johns, my vote is yes with proviso.
Cheryl Gaston, my vote is yes with proviso.
Tanetta Graham, my vote is yes with proviso.
Tywin, my vote is yes with proviso.
Ishmael Shahid, my vote is yes with proviso.
Thank you, counsel.
Thank you very much.
All right. Number eight, MI 2024-006-174, 911 East Westmoreland Street, Darlene Treat is the attorney. No letter of summary, but notice was sent. Meeting was held December 19th. Applicant provided a petition of support, 27 signatures, six from the immediate block.
And just an update on this one, Mr. Chair, there was a letter of support received from the Kensington Independent Civic Association.
Thank you.
Counsel?
Counsel?
do we see darlene's good afternoon commissioner can you hear me
hello can you can you hear me i can hear you can you hear me yeah sure all right could you state
your name please and spell for the stenographer darlene threet d-a-r-l-e-n-e threet t-s and
thomas h-r-e-a-t-t do you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the
truth? Yes, I do. Could you identify your client a relationship to the property? My client is RS
Express. Today, representing RS Express is Sandra Martinez. Counselor, do you agree to
read another refusal or stipulate towards accuracy? Yes. Have you emailed in all the
required documents and exhibits that's needed to proceed with this case five days in advance
this hearing. Yes, I did receive the civic letter this morning and I did upload the civic letter
this morning. Understood. Please proceed and share your screen.
commissioners can you see my screen yes
a good afternoon i represent uh rs express um for 911 east westmoreland street i've turned in a
bevy of documents uh including a refusal the appeal the property information form d tax
information, map, activity license, petition, letter of support, electrical permit, affidavit
of continuous use, pictures, community letter, photograph, and a proof of mailing.
Commissioners, we filed this application to legalize an existing duplex.
Commissioners, this property has been existing as a duplex in this community for over 20
years, as will be evidenced by the Civic Association's letter. I did research the
zoning archives, and I can tell you I was not able to find that the prior designation of this
property would have allowed it to be a duplex as a matter of right. Nonetheless, it has been used
as a duplex for the last 20 years.
I'm just going to scroll down a little bit past the, I'm just going to show you the deed.
And you can see that my client purchased this property in 2023.
She was under the impression that this property was a duplex and she started to renovate it.
Here is the tax information here.
Here is the tax information here. You'll see there's an outstanding balance for 2025, but
the taxes have been paid for 2024. I'm just going to scroll all the way down now just to show you
a picture of the property. This is the picture of the property. This is our property right here.
It is a corner property, 9-11, and here is the posting whereby I posted this property.
I'm going to go to the Plans now, and I'm going to reduce it a little bit,
and then I'll enlarge the portions that you want to see.
So I'm going to start out by just going over the site plan for this property.
as you can see it's a corner property and it sits on the corner of Westmoreland and Rand Street
I'll let you know that there are only four properties on Westmoreland Street here and
most of the houses are on Rand Street there is an error in this site plan you have the rear
stairs here that go down to the left when actually the rear stairs actually go down that way. And if
the board requires, I can submit a new plan showing the direction of the rear stairs. But this is a
two-family corner property, which sits on the corner, again, of land in Westmoreland. I'm going
to go to the uh floor plan now basically we are asking the board to legalize a duplex basically
we have a one apartment on the first floor it's a two bedroom apartment with one bathroom and then
we have i'm just going to blow it up a little bit so you can see the first floor dimensions a little
bit better. Here we go. So, as you can see, you would enter the property here from the front.
When you enter, you have a combined living room, dining room area. You have a kitchen here.
You have a full bathroom here. You have a closet, and then you have two bedrooms.
the second floor apartment is laid out basically the same you enter from the rear here you enter
into the living room you have a dining room area you have a kitchen area you have a bathroom area
and you have two bedrooms there's a one closet for one bedroom and there's one closet for the
second bedroom since it is a corner property there are windows all along on the side of the
building, and there's a window in every single room here. Now I'm just going to
flip to show you the length of the property. This is a very long property
that sits, again, on the corner of this block. Most of the corners, as I'll show
you later, have additional uses in them, some grocery stores, some additional
units. I took this picture to show you that we have two electrical boxes here, and I'll show
you later on that we actually have an electrical permit that was issued before I filed for zoning
for two units. Again, this property had been an established two-family dwelling.
It lost its zoning somewhere.
I couldn't find any documentation.
I showed you on the plan that the stairs seem on the plan to have come out this way, but
the stairs actually come down out into the yard there.
That is a discrepancy in the drawing that I submitted today.
This is looking down Westmoreland Street.
It's a pretty busy block.
Parking is an issue here, but I will submit to you on our block, there's only three houses here.
This is a long view of the property, so you can see the entire length of it.
This is the other half of the block of Westmoreland Street.
Our property is at the corner here.
There are two other dwellings on this block, and the rest of the block is open.
I believe Esperanza owns this lot here.
They use it for different purposes.
again another picture of the posting and the property and here are just some additional
pictures to show you what the area looks like there are corner stores on most of the corners
and on all of these blocks, they have additional uses.
So in this area is existing two family at 606 Westmoreland.
We have a grocery store diagonally across the street in the corner property.
And we have some additional duplexes on the block.
I did take some interior photos of the property to show you what the interior currently looks like.
We did notice a meeting for, I believe it was December 19th.
The meeting was not very well attended, but Ms. Marnie Laurie did run the meeting and they did support our project.
and write a letter of support for us. I did send out the required notices. I sent out 213 flyers
and we also circulated a petition with 27 signatures and all of these signatures
are from Rand Street and from Westmoreland Street. Rand Street is the intersecting block.
here is the letter from the community association indicating that the property has been used in the
community as a two-family dwelling for many many years and that they don't have any
objections to it i also just wanted to show you some additional information there was a point
of time where this property actually did have a zoning violation but actually before i filed for
zoning um the violation was cleared um on august 28th 2024 but in an abundance of caution and really
because i couldn't get a rental license um i filed the zoning application
and uh that's all i have commissioners thank you you want to bring your client on
miss martinez are you on the line today
Sandra
They've been allowed to speak
Yes hi
Could you state your name
State your name and spell for this sonographer
Sandra Martinez
S-A-N-D-R-A
Martinez
M-A-R-T-I-D-Z
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth
The whole truth and nothing but the truth
Please proceed counsel
Ms. Martinez
are you a member of the Corporation RS Express? Yes. And do you own 9-11 Westmoreland Street?
Yes. Did you and I attend a civic association with the Kensington Independent Civic Association?
Yes. And did they support this project 100%? Yes. Did you hear my testimony as given to the
board this afternoon? Yes, I did. And if you were to testify today, Ms. Martinez, would you adopt
my testimony is true and correct yes that's all i have commissioner thank you questions from the
board questions or comments from our attorney hillary emerson not at this time mr chair
comments from the virtual audience no hands mr chair army no hands mr chair thank you planning
commission thank you chair bergman and good evening david fechto with the city planning
commission chairman and board members the comprehensive plan recommends no change to the
rsa5 residential single family zoning at this location this property has a documented history
as single family use dating to 1973. at some point after that date an owner added a dwelling
unit without the benefit permits through no fault of the current owner the city planning commission
recommends the board grant a proposed use variance for two dwelling units. Thank you. MI 2024-006-174-911
East West Moreland Street. I vote yes. Charles, my vote is yes. Cheryl Gaston, my vote is yes.
Sonetta Graham, my vote is yes. Iowen, my vote is yes. Ishmael Shahid, my vote is yes.
Number 12, MI 2024-006-220-2123, Catherine Street.
David Orfanides is the attorney.
There's a letter of deferral from South of South Neighbors, SOSNA.
Vote was eight in support, six in opposition, four were near neighbors, and one in absentee.
Also, a letter of opposition from North Washington Avenue, NOWAC, are willing to support the application if it's only a third edition and not a third and fourth.
are willing to support the application if it's only a third edition and not a third and fourth.
Mr. Orphanides.
Good evening, Mr. Chairman.
Would you please state your name and spell for the stenographer?
Certainly. David, D-A-V-I-D, last name Orphanides, O-R-P-H-A-N-I-D-E-S.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Do you identify your client, their relationship to this property?
Certainly. My client is Matthew Berman, the owner of 2123 Catherine Street. I'm sorry.
Our vice chair has a few questions, sir.
Certainly.
Good evening, counsel. Do you agree to wait to read another refusal or stipulate to exact accuracy?
Good evening, sir. And I say yes to both.
Have you emailed in all the required documents and exhibits that's needed to proceed with this case five days in advance of this hearing?
I did.
Thank you, counsel. Please proceed and share your screen.
So good evening, Mr. Chairman, members of the board.
Again, my name is David Orfanides from the law firm of Orfanides & Toner, and I'm here for 2123 Catherine Street on behalf of Matthew Berman, who is the owner of the property.
The proposal here is to take the existing two-story dwelling at 2123 Catherine Street and to place upon the top of that a two-story addition.
As you can see here in the rendering, the third floor portion is a mansard roof that extends to the front building line at its lowest part, the part that angles forward the most.
As you'll see on the plans, but as you can also see in this rendering, there is a deck above that because that's stepped back at least five feet, or stepped back five feet from the extreme front building line.
And then beyond that, which you can barely even see up in the upper left-hand corner there, there is a fourth floor.
The only variance that we have in this situation, and you have it here at tab 3A, is one that
I was just before you on for back in November for 1918 Cater Street.
I believe you just had one last week, 1608 South 12th Street, where property owners have
look to not comply with the requirements of setting any floor above the second floor back
eight feet from the extreme front building line when there are structures with two stories of
inhabitable space to either side, which is what we have in this case. And you can see it right here.
So there are two two-story buildings to either side, which is why that requirement kicks in.
um what's interesting about this block though is that and here i have photos which are a tab five
you can see the two-story building that's next to us to the east and then what happens is there's a
three-story building that goes doesn't honor the cornice line of the two-story buildings like our
building will do goes up full three stories with the bay at the second and third floor level
It drops back down to the two-story structures similar to my client's property, but then at the end of the block, you have three-story structures, flat front with bays, without bays, all the way down to 21st Street.
there is a structure here that looks to have the eight-foot setback. We would argue that even
though that looks like in checking with the zoning code or zoning archives, that that was built by
Wright, that that is less desirable and less good for the fabric of the block, the aesthetics of the
fabric of the block, than what we are proposing. What's unique also about this block, aside from
the three stories to the east, and as you'll see the three stories to the west on our side,
is that the south side is completely three stories and you can see as i scroll through
some have bays including the this is at the top photograph is the property directly across from us
but three stories straight up so this is not a block where seeing a three-story structure like
you might see on some of the smaller uh named streets in this graduate hospital section of
philadelphia where they're largely two stories catherine street is a wider street and you have
a lot of three-story structures that exist. In fact, all of them on the south side, as you can
see here, panning all the way down to 22nd Street. And then panning around on our side, the north
side of Catherine Street, you can see three stories again. Flat front breaks the cornice line
of the two-story building that leads into these two buildings down at the northeast corner of
22nd, and Catherine. And then you can actually see here at 2141 where variant
And then you can actually see here at 2141 where variance was granted exactly like the
variance that we're looking for today.
And I have a copy of the zoning archives for 2141 in my package at tab six.
That variance was at calendar number 37819.
The notice of decision was dated October 2nd, 2019, application number 97390.
so there is you do have situations where this is this variance has been granted on this very block
here in this situation it looks to be newer construction so the cornice was above was
closer and there is a cornice that's closer to the two-story cornices but not in line like ours
will be when this is done we also have photographs of the rear of the property that you can see here
we are building straight up in the back above the existing one and two stories as you'll see
on the section plan that i'll show you in a minute in a minute um we we comply with the
open area requirements um at every level of the building um in building in this fashion
you can see here what what what are your what's the what what variants do you have what do you
Again, the only variance is the same one that you've granted relief from for me back in November last week on South 12th Street.
And again, so the notice of refusal, which I showed you, was simply for that setback.
And we believe, and I know it's getting late.
I'm not going to go on and on about this.
And what we did here is we actually, like we did with the one I presented in November, we did the comparative study, both in section view and in a rendering view.
of what could be built as a matter of right where you have the eight feet back straight up so our
fourth floor is actually um a little over 15 feet back 15 feet six inches back um so basically what
you're doing is you're pulling the third floor front doing the mansard and then pushing the
third floor back um the building is 45 feet deep um with the eight foot setback at that third floor
It eliminates, it makes it very difficult to have a second room along with the bathroom at that level.
And it basically eats up almost all of a front bedroom.
So you're left with essentially one bedroom and a bathroom at that level.
And then speaking real quickly to SOSNA, it is a letter of deferral.
If you take a look at their letter, the zoning committee, first of all, they make it clear that the thing that is before the board right now,
the third floor mansard is what's preferred. They do speak to a number of issues that were
raised by the near neighbors, and none of those are zoning issues. They are things that we can
address. I was not at the community group meeting, but they're not zoning related. They're more
construction related. And even NOAC's letter is regarding the upper floor, the fourth floor,
which is a matter of right because it's below 38 feet. But you can see the zoning committee
voted 4-2. The neighbors were split. We actually had a better zoning committee vote for this one
than we had for the one that I presented to you in November. It's just in this case,
the near neighbors were more split, which hence led to their position of deferral.
But I included at tab six, like we did with 1918, all of the other mansards that were granted
variances in the neighborhood. It's considerable. And for these reasons, we believe that there's
a hardship because of the depth of this lot, because of this requirement, because of how it
impacts the habitable space inside. We feel this is in harmony with the intentions of the zoning
code, given the existing conditions like this throughout the neighborhood. And it obviously
isn't going to have any impact on traffic or transportation. Okay. I want to bring your client
on. Sure. Matthew, architect, who's already been sworn, actually, on another project, and then
Matthew Berman, the owner. So, if Matthew Berman could be promoted to panelist and sworn in.
Mr. Berman, please. They're coming back in as a panelist, Mr. Chair.
All right. Could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer?
Yes. Can you hear me? I can. Matthew Berman, M-A-T-T-H-E-W-B-E-R-M-A-N.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Could you turn your video on, please?
Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Matthew, are you the owner of the Subject Promises 2123 Catherine Street?
And whom do you reside there with?
Currently not residing there, but we will reside there with my wife and mother-in-law.
There you go.
Thank you.
That's what I meant.
You will reside there.
And did you hear the statements I made to the board today?
I did. And are they true and correct to the best of your knowledge?
I did.
And are they true and correct to the best of your knowledge?
Yes. And would you adopt them as your own? Yes.
And would you adopt them?
Okay. Thank you, Matthew. That's it.
Then I would have Samuel Turner who actually has already been sworn in on a prior presentation.
I do remember that. Mr. Turner.
Mr. Turner, just for the record, state your name.
Coming back in.
sorry mr chair i think i cut out while i was joining you've been sworn already please proceed
counsel sure uh mr turner you're you and your firm are the architects for this project correct
and did you hear the statements that i made to the board today yes and are they true and correct
to the best of your knowledge yes would you adopt them as your own yes thank you um from the board
can we see the plans again and walk through what the primary use on the fourth floor is going to
be so sure i can do that in section or a floor plan view which one would you prefer i could
either one i can read both okay so here's the floor plans so i'm gonna and i'm gonna zoom in
a little bit to make it a little easier to see so it's basically like a common a common living area
They've been calling it a four-season room, but it's a common living area with a half-bath.
And what's the depth on the deck that's in front of that unit?
In front of that? Okay, let me just go to the...
Or the total square footage of the deck portion.
So the deck at the third floor level, correct?
The deck at the fourth floor level.
I mean, above the third floor roof.
Correct.
Yeah, so it's 10 feet, six inches deep by 16 feet.
And it's set back to five feet, the required five feet from the extreme front building line.
And you can see it here.
There are stairs that go up to a deck above the fourth floor, but there's no pilot house there.
And then with the total height, what is the total height of the entire proposed addition, including the railing, the parapet and the pilot house above the fourth floor?
So there's no pilot house above the fourth floor, as you can see in this.
And I'm going to go I'm going to use the by right drawing because I think that that really helps show it the best.
Yeah. OK. So let me zoom out.
so what you have that's notated here it's a it's a typical building right that's not
yeah yeah so it's 38 feet plus the the um the deck is going to be fiberglass roof and then a railing
above so it'll be the 41.6 the railing will be the same height as the permitted parapet
height and so it complies with the height requirements for the rsa zoning district
And then in your survey of nearby similar properties, how many of them or what percentage of them had a fourth floor and a roof deck?
The one that was that that are presently existing.
Yes. I don't I think this the adding the fourth floor above within the height limit is a newer design that we're just starting to see.
And again, that was granted, the variance for that was granted in November, in my case
on Cater Street, and then last week on South 12th Street.
But many of the, what's that?
I said, go ahead.
I was about to ask another question.
No, no, no, no.
And again, I know, you know, it's, I wonder as well, I looked at it and, you know, I thought,
well, I haven't seen this before in all the years that I've been doing this.
And it seems to work within the height limits, given the floor to ceiling heights.
And again, the refusal that we're here for is the front of the third floor.
But yes, the fourth floor is a newer design.
And then two more questions.
What are the ceiling heights on the new proposed third and fourth floor?
And then maybe the owner or the architect can answer, is the basement finished?
I'm going to show you on the floor plan.
So I know because that question did come up when I was here for 1918.
and the in the basement is just a storage area but is it is it finished the finished storage
area well when you say finished um just that like the walls are sheetrock heating cool okay got you
yeah is it conditioned space i would have to defer to sam and or matt on that i mean whether they i
think ultimately whether it will be or won't be yeah i think the plan is for the the basement to
be unfinished as a part of this work. Still, again, just in zoning, we're still in a schematic
level. But and then in terms of your question about ceiling heights, it's pretty limited.
And then in terms of your question about ceiling heights, it's pretty limited.
I think we're looking at around seven foot eight ceiling heights for the third and fourth.
So really trying to get within that permitted maximum height.
Okay, understood.
Yeah, and you can see here the floor to floor.
So you're 19 to 28, then 28 to the third.
I know part of that was the original, I'm assuming part of that is the original roof assembly and then the forest assembly, which is why I was asking.
Gotcha.
Other questions from the board?
Questions from our attorney, Hillary Emerson.
Not at this time, Mr. Chair.
Questions from the virtual audience.
Yes, Chair, I have Madigan should come up with their hand raised.
I would like them to speak.
Hi, could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer?
Madeline Shacumba
please unmute and wait to be sworn in
am I unmuted?
could you please state your name and spell for the stenographer
Madeline
M-A-D-E-L-I-N-E
Shacumba
S-I-C-O-M-B-A
do you swear or affirm
to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth
You're a neighbor
I'm part of the RCO
Okay, please, please proceed
Okay, we represent the North of Washington Avenue Coalition
We are co-coordinating RCO with SOSTA
Okay, and we wrote a letter saying
We do not object to having a third story
That's fine
But our objection is to the fourth story
and then he wants to add a deck.
We feel this is too much of a burden on the community.
First of all, he's dealing with an older house.
We're not even sure if that house has capacity to hold all these floors.
We were asking him, asked the applicant,
had he had a structural engineer look at his proposal,
and he said no, and that was another concern of ours.
okay we are in the process now trying to get an nco going that's a neighborhood conservation
overlay we do not really wish to have these four stories and he has indicated that right now it's
him his wife and his mother-in-law and they want a four stories plus a deck and although he might
be within the limits of what
is considered
why these zonings
are cool
that we don't feel that
if he wants four stories,
fine. If he wants his deck, no.
I mean, three stories and a deck,
that's fine. We're trying
to preserve our
neighborhood, give a
distinction, because we live in
southwest center of Philadelphia.
And this is an
area that it has a lot of history. We just recently got the Christian Street
regulated as a Black history thing. And we are very interested in preserving what our
neighborhood looks like. And the building he showed you with the first story was a brand new
constructed building. And we're beginning to see that this is not what we want for our neighborhood.
it. Just because someone else has it doesn't mean you have to have it. And we're asking
them not to destroy the, how do you say, aesthetics or what we want to call the beauty of our
neighborhood. And that's why we are opposed to the fourth story. Because that goes everything
out of the way. Everything else around him is street. He wants the fourth story. And
He claims he's within the boundaries of the zoning.
He probably is.
But he sure can't claim hardship, you know.
And that is one of the reasons why we are opposed to the fourth story.
Can I ask her, if you guys are in agreement with a third story and a deck,
would that be something that you all would consider?
We can consider it, yes.
We can consider it if you sit down and talk,
and he shows us the vendings of it, you know,
because we're not sure how big a deck he wants.
Right now, it's just a
reeling, you know.
That's what I saw, just a reeling.
I didn't see a full-skill,
full-deck thing that you
usually see. So I would like to
see it first before, you know. But we
have no opposition to the third floor.
We have no opposition to it at all.
But we are
concerned about his one.
All right. Thank you. So, Chair, can I ask in response to that comment, is there any particular hardship for not going with a third story and a deck instead of a fourth story and a deck for the applicant or appellant?
All right, thank you.
So, Chair, can I ask
some response to that?
i mean i mean the variance is regarding the setback so there's no hardship criteria regarding
the fourth floor um the hardship criteria is uh involves the setback at the third floor
and whether it's the depth of the house which we feel the eight foot setback takes up a significant
amount of a code compliant dimensionally compliant house on this size lot um whether
it's the existing three stories that surround it, that do not honor the cornices to either
side, the two-story cornices on the north side of this block.
I understand on the south side, where they're all flat front three stories, that's a different
story.
But again, there are mostly three stories on this block.
But regarding the fourth floor in terms of a hardship, I mean, that's like saying, is
there a hardship if I want to build completely by right?
And that's a different story.
I understand, I guess, the concern about the fourth floor.
But the 38 feet was put into play.
Before the 38 feet, it was three stories and 35 feet.
And the 38 feet came into play to allow people the ability, because people were coming in for variances for four stories.
You know, lived through this and practiced through all this.
And 38 feet was put in with the idea that depending on your floor to ceiling heights,
depending on what your average ground level was, depending on what level your first floor
was, that you could get four floors in there.
And then I put up the rendering between the buy right and what we're proposing.
And the reality is, is that, and listen, if you've seen particularly on the wider street
like Catherine, maybe not as much on the smaller streets like Pemberton or Cater, but on these
wider streets you see that flat front and you could even see it in my one in my picture to the
east the two properties at the east end of the block that are set back where you have the flat
front and it goes straight up and it's it's like somebody landed a spaceship on it on top of the
roof and here are here you can on the right you can barely see the fourth floor beyond this much
more aesthetically pleasing, which Chacomba and the community group said they're all fine with.
And you can actually see less of the fourth floor from the street, from across the street where this
image is taken, than you can in the image to the right, where you're going to see all of it
towering narrowly above the building. Again, I understand it's unusual because we haven't
really seen this before but again this is the reason one of the reasons why the 38 feet was
put in and they took away the story limit when the code was the current code was passed in august
or when it affected um planning commission so run for me i yeah that's where she came from right
Oh, there's another hand. Okay. Go ahead.
Okay. Sure.
And good evening, Mr. Chair. My name is Brianna Wakefield. I work for Council President Johnson.
Hi. Could you please spell your name for the board sonographer?
Yes, Brianna, B-R-I-O-N-N-A, last name Wakefield, W-A-K-E-F-I-E-L-D.
Do you swear or affirm that the whole truth is nothing but the truth?
I swear.
Please proceed.
Yes, I'm calling to testify as the Council President Johnson states that he has no opposition to this matter.
Thank you very much for taking the time to close. We appreciate it. One more, please.
so so i think that's while we're waiting for them i think that's telling that the council
president has taken position and not non-opposition rather than deferral on this thank you mr chair i
have a hand up from our murray spencer they've been allowed to speak hi could you please state
your name and spell for this tonight uh yes murray spencer m-u-r-r-a-y s-p-e-n-c-e-r right
you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth i do mr spencer are
you a neighbor i am a neighbor i'm also just sostener's only chair okay please proceed sir
so um nothing um against what mr orphanese said um total agreement however the reason that we
wrote the letter of deferral is because as he stated we're starting this is the second fourth
story fourth full floor story project we've seen and i don't like where this is going which is why
I rewrote a letter of deferral as opposed to non-opposition.
I'd rather the owners be on the ZBA than on us, because people come, I'm the face of zoning in this neighborhood, and people come at me, ask me, well, why did you approve this?
I'd rather the owners be on the ZBA than on us
because people come, I'm the face of zoning.
But I don't know that this is a very good idea of putting three stories of living, two actual living, and then a deck, which, and I'm an architect, and I usually use the per square foot calculation for decks to be stronger than living spaces.
So I use 60 pounds per square feet because people tend to congregate more and more people tend to congregate on a deck.
And that's why you have root collapses. I mean, a deck collapses because more people are on decks than they are inside of houses.
So I'm just worried about adding three stories on top of a two story structure to build a rubble stone.
And I don't want that on us on us. So if you want to prove it, that's fine.
We defer to you. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Spencer. Thank you for calling.
You know, those are very, those are very good concerns. And I can assure you that nobody involved wants that on their shoulders or on their hands. So there will be a structural that will be done and it will have to pass the city's muster to make sure that this building can withstand the loading of the additions and including the decks.
Planning Commission.
So Ron Bednar, City Planning. First name Ron, R-O-N, last name Bednar, B-E-D-N-A-R.
do you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth i do please
proceed ryan comprehensive plan recommends no change to the rsa 5 residential single family
zoning at this location the applicant has not shown that an economic detriment will occur
if the required uh if it's required art or if they are required to comply with the eight foot setback
uh as stated in their zoning code city planning commission recommends that the board deny
the proposed dimensional variance thank you and mr orfinity so i'm going to hold the vote on this
until next wednesday at 2 p.m i just want to have some time to talk to the members of the board
where we stand with this okay and again thank you very much sure all right thank you sure um
is there anyone in the virtual audience whose case has not been called from the two o'clock list
um chair i am i have a hand up from roger perry i can go on him to speak if you will
roger perry's at the next group um okay no other hands anybody need a quick break or do you want
to keep going quick break mr chair please we have a five minute for the staff five by three
Evening. Good evening. My name is Bill Bergman, and I will be chairing this meeting of the Zoning Board of Adjustment. With me is our Vice Chair, Ismail Shahid.
Present, Mr. Chairman.
Our Board Member, Cheryl L. Gaston.
Present, Mr. Chairman.
Our Board Member, Tanetta Graham.
Present, Mr. Chairman.
Our Board Member, Michael Johns.
Present, Mr. Chairman.
Our Board Member, Tyah Wynn.
Present, Mr. Chairman.
Also present is Hillary Emerson, our attorney, and Ian Haggerty, our executive director.
Please be advised this meeting is being recorded.
Your participation in this meeting indicates your consent to be recorded.
The video will be posted on the ZBA website approximately one week.
Excuse me, Mr. Chair, is your microphone on?
All right.
We can't hear.
We're getting.
You can't hear me?
There's no volume in the room from.
Wait, let me start again.
For people who are remote, they can't hear.
All right.
I'll go start again.
This is the reporter.
I could hear the chair for what it's worth.
All right.
All right.
That's perfect.
All right.
Thank you.
The matter is being held in person with remote capabilities, meaning the individuals can participate either in person, at the hearing room, in the one parkway building, or remotely over Zoom.
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Let's look at our schedule for this afternoon.
Number two, MI 2023-004-384-1196 Adams Avenue.
That case has been continued.
Number five, MI 2024-001-812-201 East West Moreland Street, Ann Valesquez is the listed applicant, Jose Garcia is the listed owner.
There are no exhibits, and HACE, the RCO, has requested a continuance.
Anyone in the audience relative to any one of those organizations?
No, Mr. Chair, I have a handle from Helen Bayek.
Helen Bayek?
I believe that was for the case you just continued, Mr. Chair.
Helen, were you?
let them let them speak or back is the attorney for the case we continue
okay let her speak um not necessary all right um anyone from westmoreland street
no hands raised mr chair the rco did file a request for a continuance mi2024
001-812-201
East West Moreland Street
Cases continue
Mark must be heard
Number one
MI 2023
004-084
2337 North 30th Street
Warren Hamilton is the listed owner
No exhibits
Fourth listing
Just to clarify Mr. Chair
Warren Hamilton is the listed applicant
and SWB Real Estate LLC is the listed owner.
Once again, Mr. Chair, no hands raised for this matter.
Okay, we have not yet received an official request for withdrawal.
So MI 2023-004-084-2337 North 30th Street.
That case is continued until 6-4-25-330.
Number four, MI 2024-001-810-3522 Sussex Lane, this case has been withdrawn.
We're going to go to our first case, number three, MI 2024-001-780-2633 Jasper Street.
roger perry is the attorney there's a letter of support with provisors from east kensington
neighborhood association vote was 28 in support three in opposition and a letter of non-opposition
with provisors from council member squiller
they'll be coming back in as a panel shortly sir
mr perry hello i'm here hi mr perry could you please state your name and spell for the
stenographer sir yes my name is roger perry r-o-g-e-r-p-e-r-r-y all right do you swear
or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth mr perry yes i do
could you identify your client in relationship to the property thank you i'm representing
I'm representing Opportunity Atkinson Project Incorporated by Mrs. Jonna Coles,
Opportunity Adkinson Project Incorporated.
who's a representative, and she's also the applicant, and she's the tenant for the property
at 2633 Jasper Street. Okay, and our Vice Chair has a few questions for you, sir. Good evening,
Council. Do you agree to waive the reading of the refusal or stipulate to its accuracy? Yes, I do.
have you emailed in all the required documents and exhibits that's needed to proceed with this
case five days in advance of this hearing yes we have thank you counsel please proceed and
you may share your screen
okay can you see that or we can it's a photo of a street scene okay uh okay so uh my screen is
here. The first one I thought would be appropriate is to show you the property. This is 2633 Jasper
Street on the corner of Jasper and Albert Street. And let me see if I can expand this a little bit.
Okay, there we go. This is the property here. It looks like it was decorated for Halloween at some
point. It is in a CMX1 because it's a corner property. But as you can see, Mr. Chairman and
the board members, this street and the street on adjacent street are all essentially residential
properties. This is a little bit different application here. It has a refusal because
the request is for what's termed supported independent living for four individuals.
And the operating entity, let me see if I can go back here to the refusal.
That's the lease.
And here's the refusal.
We'll just turn it.
So the refusal in a CMX1 district up here is a proposed use, single-room residence.
Here we have it for four individuals as requested and so forth.
So this property was traditionally CMX1 because it was on a corner, and many of the corner properties were utilized for commercial first floors and so forth.
But in this particular situation, all those properties have been residential for a long period of time here.
Supported independent living for four individuals.
Here, these are placements by DHS.
And the corporation, non-private corporation that I'm working with and so forth, provides support.
This particular property, and let me go down and see if I can find some photographs here.
This particular property is set up with two single bedrooms and a double bedroom and so forth for four individuals.
and it has been fully renovated as you can see from the earlier photographs and so forth 2633
it's got a full kitchen and it has here's some photographs of
more photographs and so forth let's see if I can
so this is just what it was renovated and this is these were approximately a year ago backyard
and so forth, front of the property here and so forth and so on.
And what the Client Opportunity Atkinson Project is seeking is to essentially allow a fourth
individual here, but a total of four supported individuals.
And in terms of the support in the DHS, these are currently adult women who would be placed
in this household.
And the nonprofit corporation provides one person support, but they provide it 24-7.
It's three shifts of eight hours per shift for 24 hours, and that's just in case there's, you know, some need for another adult individual and so forth.
Let's see what we got here and so forth.
Everything in terms of lease, special warranty deed, zoning notice that was sent out.
There was a meeting, as the chairman indicated.
and the East Kensington supported the intended use and so forth.
There was a mailing, it was posted, the posting of the premises to show that
to the layout, tax clearance is supported, and then East Kensington supported the use.
And then East Kensington supported the use.
Leases.
Lease is just because that's who I'm directly representing.
And Miss Johnna Coles is here today, I think, and so forth.
The public meeting notice, the tax clearance.
These are all the notices that were sent and so forth and so on.
It was a well-attended meeting at East Kensington.
And they supported this use.
It's essentially going to be similar to just a single-family home
with four individuals residing in there in a supported community environment by Opportunity
Advocates in Providence. If there's any questions, if we can promote Jonna Coles, she's in the
audience, I can ask her if there's any additional information she would like to add.
Hi, sir.
What was the individual we're looking for?
Yeah, Jonna Coles, C-O-L-E-S.
okay they've been allowed to speak thank you very much hi could you please state your name
and spell for the sonographer make sure you unmute yourself johnna good evening everyone
can you hear me yes okay my name is johnna coles that's j-o-h-n-n-a last name c-o-l-e-s
Mr. Perry, hold on a minute, please.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Please proceed, Mr. Perry.
Thank you.
And John, you've heard my presentation to the board this evening?
And was it truthful and accurate to investigate your knowledge?
And if you testified independently, would you adopt my testimony as your testimony?
Is there anything that I'm missing or misrepresented that you need to clear up as the tenant?
We're talking about four adult individuals living in a supported environment?
Yes, we already have three.
We just, what you said, we add and just ask them for four.
I didn't explain this specifically, but one of the reasons to add the fourth individual is because DHS, A, is always looking for additional space if they can get it.
And also you get occasionally get a request to put immediate family members together, like adult sisters or something like that.
A lot of times that'd be the case that we they want family to stay together and we have to separate them because it's only I'm only allowed to have three.
OK, so that would help you. And you have two and a half full baths at this location, I believe.
That's correct. OK, a full kitchen and so forth.
So I'd open it to questions to myself and Ms. Coles from the board.
Questions from the board.
Yeah, questions.
How long have you had this facility?
It'd be two years this June.
And you had an RCO meeting, and what was the outcome?
Oh, it was very good.
They approved on it.
I think it was just one person probably had said something,
but everyone approved on it at the RCO meeting.
How long do the individuals normally stay
when they're a resident at your facility?
Some of them is long-term.
They can stay up to the 18.
I have a person that's been with me
almost a year this April.
Some last six months.
I'm sorry.
Go ahead.
Yeah, Mr. Johns, I put up the East Kensington response to the meeting, and you'll see that there were, it was well attended, there were 28 supporting and three in opposition, and this has been submitted to the zoning board.
And this would be for three adults, or are they adults and children? How does it work?
it's three it's three um youth they well we say 18 so it's adult you know 18 age so it's three we
just asking for additional one more than before and they and so it's they they can be there from
18 to what age they could be there to 21 so 18 to 21 correct and what was you said you had 24 hour
um coverage or how does that work so it's 24 hours it's three shifts you had eight to four
four to twelve and twelve to eight and when the when the when the uh residents or the clients
move out where do they generally go some of them they go to independent living they get their own
places some of them age out and they just want to go on their own and see you know out just want to
leave and um that's it they go to independent living or age out and what what services are
provided when they're there oh we have um groups weekly we they go on a lot of field trips
We have groups weekly. They go on a lot of field trips. We have people that come in to speak to our youth. We do a lot with our youth here at OAP. We also have preventive specialists. I have a director. We care for our youth.
I've been doing this for a long time now. This is my second property of me.
Well, actually third is my third. I have a boy's home as well as the girls.
And I really have a passion for helping my teenage youth.
These are all referrals from through the city.
No, they are actually from out the county. I have children that come from in Pennsylvania.
You know, Washington, PA, you know, Luzerne, Northampton.
I have youth that comes from all over.
Thank you.
Questions for the board.
Yeah, I have a question about what spaces are reserved in the property for your staff?
When you're walking through the rooms, it looked like it was mostly bedrooms and then like public spaces.
And is there any secured space that's either an office or just place for your staff or files?
Oh, yes.
Well, our staff do not stay.
We have the living room is set up.
It's just that you have the pictures of it being empty.
But we have a whole office area is on the first level that we turn to the office area.
They have a living room where they sit.
The kitchen is set up with seats.
So it's all, you know, they have their own area.
The children have their own TVs and everything, or the youth have their own TVs and their own room.
so it's plenty of space for the staff
and ourselves
but there's no like separate space
so technically if it was like
6pm in the evening the staff
and the youth would both be occupying
or could be occupying the same space
that's correct they'll be in the living room
or want to be in the kitchen
or if they sit in the kitchen area
any other questions from the board
and is this
is that the same location where they hold
their medication and stuff at
they hold their medication you mean lock up med medication i'm asking are you storing that right
in the open area that you know that's in a lock that's in a lock box inside our office okay so
it's in an extra lock you know you in the office then we have a security lock box i guess so it is
an actual office yes it's an actual office yes okay i have a oh i'm sorry do we know what the
provisos we're going to be? Yes, I did pull those up. If we choose that. Right. Yes. So the RCO
requested two provisos, one, that there be a maximum of four residents and two, that the
variance be temporary and expire with the tenant's lease term. I did have one more question. My
question is around property maintenance. So is it on the tenants or is it on the staff or is there
third-party entity doing property maintenance both interior like regular cleaning as well as like
when it snows well when it snows when it snows we handle it we take care of it you know what i mean
but um the maintenance we do have a maintenance if something go on if the plumbing go or something
happen we have maintenance that come in but if it's um snow we shovel the snow so your your
organization your staff are responsible for all cleaning and all facility maintenance yes well
not maintenance maintenance is different than the cleaning because they have to make sure the program
stay clean at all times but not maintenance so we have someone come in to do maintenance work
um were you okay with the provisos that the uh rcos uh mentioned yeah i didn't uh they didn't
send me that letter. Unfortunately, I just have what I'm showing on the screen. We would agree
and provide those as long as the lease is in effect, not any particular initial. The lease
rolls over from year to year. As long as we can stay there under the existing lease,
we don't have a problem that when the lease ends, then the proviso would kick in in terms of,
you know, not having four people. Because the only reason there's four people supported
independent living is because we have a lease that allows four people and it's in a supported
residential setting. So I apologize. I didn't get the letter and I didn't know they sent one
with regard to expiration of a permit. But as long as we have a provisor that says, as long as
John Coles or her entity have a valid lease there, we're allowed to continue with four
supported individuals, we're fine with that, I think. Is that okay, Jonna? Yes, that's fine.
yes that's fine so we we can't we can't do a proviso that ties it to the lease we can only do
So we can't do a provider.
we have to set a specific ending date so just to just to be clear on that if the board were to
grant this and were to put a temporary variance on it it would have to send an ending date and if
your client was still leasing the property then they would have to come back and extend the
variance right did they set a particular time frame um no they just wanted it to be coterminous
with the lease but we can't word the proviso okay well that's what i was hearing yeah okay
so why don't we do five years is that okay that that is up to the board thank you okay
let me say three yeah okay um questions or comments from the virtual audience
i do not see any further hats mr chair any convention
but this run been our city planning
second
is he done what was that run we didn't hear it okay
oh he lost oh so we're on bed in our city planning the property is currently indicated
for commercial mixed use on our adopted city plan no change has been recommended to the existing
zoning at this location the applicant's hardship is not supported with unique uh physical
circumstances or condition of the property to prevent it from being used in conformity with
the code recommend the request for uh variance for a single room residence not be granted thank you
um mi 2024 001 780 2633 jasper street i vote yes with provisos maximum four residents
temporary variance expires 116 27
uh michael johnson my vote is yes with uh provisos
Gerald Gaston, my vote is yes
with provisos
Teneda Graham, my vote is yes with provisos
Iowan, my vote is yes
with provisos
Ishmael Shaheed, my vote is yes with provisos
Thank you, Council
Okay, thank you, members of the board
It took me a minute because it's getting late
I had to count those four of my fingers
26, 27, I had to count the years
Number 6
MI-2020
224-006-033-2601-31-North 20 A Street.
William Kerr is the attorney.
This is a resumptive hearing.
Ishmael Shahid has recused himself,
and Tanetta Graham has also recused herself in this case.
And Mr. Chair, I want to...
William Kerr, what did I say?
Oh, William Kerr, I'm sorry.
Mr. Chair, I just want to note, because we have the two recusals,
we'll need to hold the vote until next week
so that Mr. Johns can review the video so we have a quorum for a vote.
Because he did not see the first hearing.
Thank you.
And, Hillary, just for a point of information,
my understanding is where we are with this now is we go to planning, right,
and public first and then planning.
um we'll see if there because there was a second rco meeting that occurred after the last hearing
so we should probably get an update from from mr kerr um i will note we did receive a letter of
support from all in the family cdc um they did note that they would like to see more parking
spaces provided okay and then we can after we hear from mr kerr we can take public testimony
and the recommendation of the planning commission thank you mr kerr could you please state your name
been spelled for this phonographer yeah yes william excuse me william kerr k-e-r-r do you
swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth i do um this is a
resumptive hearing could you give us an update of your rco meeting yeah since the meeting last week
we did uh meet again with the all in the family rco um there were eight attendees uh six of the
voted yes to support the application there were two abstentions uh and that is reflected on the
letter that the uh as uh miss emerson uh referenced that was submitted to the board
um i do have a copy of that we've added to our exhibit binder i can show it if you'd like we
also have a letter of support from a councilman young that you should have received as well
okay um questions or comments from the virtual audience
no hands raised for this matter mr chair planning commission
Plenty, Commission.
Excuse me, Mr. Chair, I'm sorry to interrupt you, but I have a hand up from a number ending in 3552.
This must be Ms. Fernandez.
I've allowed them to speak.
Adrian?
Adrian Fernandez, please unmute and wait to be sworn in.
Can you hear me now?
I can.
Adrienne, you've already been sworn.
Just state your name for the record and then start your testimony.
Adrienne Fernandez, Swampoodle Neighborhood Process Association, RCO.
You've already been sworn earlier today, I believe.
Yes, I was.
Yes, you was.
That was a long time ago.
Please testify.
Okay. For this address, we are opposed to this variance because there was only one neighbor from the block after, I think, two meetings.
We did not receive a meeting summary form.
There were three RCOs present at the meeting.
and the neighbors on the block were not there to give their opinion
about the extensive discussion of parking by neighbors who live further away
and a project of this size really should have met with these neighbors
before doing their zoning application
so the direct neighbors would have had a better idea about the project
and how it was going to affect their area.
And that's pretty much my testimony.
Thank you very much for taking the time to close.
We know it's late.
Is there anyone else in the virtual audience?
Can I respond to that?
No further answer, Mr. Chair.
Is there anyone else?
Jason, no?
No, no further answer, Mr. Chair.
Mr. Kerr, please, what is it?
Okay, I just wanted to respond.
We did meet three times with the all in the family.
We sent out, I think it was 290 notice letters each time.
and we never had more than 8 or 10 or 12 folks that attended each hearing so so i just disagree
with miss fernandez um characterization i think we did what we needed to do um based on the zoning
code requirements okay thank you planning commission ron bednar city planning comprehensive
plan recommends no change in zoning at this location from existing residential multifamily
rm1 the proposed use of a driveway is not on the side street or shared driveway off street parking
is consistent with the previous use proposed project is for affordable senior apartments with
parking in previous existing uh lot the project is aligned with the citywide vision recommended
recommendation to promote affordable housing planning commission recommends that the board
grant the requested variance for off-street parking thank you we're going to hold a vote on
this until next wednesday at 2 p.m um thank you and thank you council mr chair if i could just
reiterate one thing. We do have
an application deadline coming up
in early February, so if you could hold to that
decision date of next
week, that would be great.
Thank you very much, sir. Okay, what date
will that be? That will be... Next Wednesday.
Wednesday, do you know which hearing you will
do the vote at? Yeah.
2 p.m.
2 p.m., okay. I missed that. I'm sorry.
Thank you. Sure, thank you.
Okay, take care, everyone.
here we go all right number seven MI 2024 007 167 610 South Front Street this is a
reconsideration hearing Hillary this is the one we want to change the date am I correct
yes Mr. Chair
it was the word there was a request to change the date Council Hamill
Dorothy Ann Hamill, if you're still in the virtual audience, please raise your hand.
Okay, Mr. Chair, they will be rejoining as the panelists shortly.
Good evening, Council.
counsel
are you there
Ms. Hamill, are you there?
Yes. Can you hear me?
Counsel, could you please state your name and spell for the sonographer?
Sure. Dorothy Ann Hamill, D-O-R-O-T-H-Y-A-N-N-E-H-A-M-I-L-L.
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Hillary, can we adopt all the testimony from the last case
and then just set a date?
Yes, so the evidence testimony from the 7-17-24 hearing
is incorporated into the record for this hearing.
The scope of this hearing is limited to the ending date
of the temporary variance previously granted by the board.
Anything else? Just set the date?
if the if the applicant could put or applicants council could put on the record the date that
they are now requesting and whether they've had any communication with the rco regarding
this new date because the rco is the one that had requested the shorter date previously could you
talk about have you had any more communications with the uh the rco sure uh mr chairman members
of the board i i apologize i had requested the reconsideration because as i said in my petition
um it had taken some time to get the decision and my client was happy to take the year that the board
had that the rcos had agreed to but you know because it had taken some time it really cut in
uh to the amount of time so i had reached out to um board council and said because i hadn't had
frankly i hadn't done this before and said can we you know is there administrative way just to do
this or do i have to do reconsideration i did the reconsideration i sent the reconsideration
and reached out to all three, um, all three members, uh, all three RCOs, um, uh, back
in December, once I got the, uh, reconsideration information, I provided it to them, explained
why we were doing it, asked them if they wanted any further information, explained I'm not
trying to get more than what they agreed to. I, we just want the full year. Um, I didn't hear back
from anybody. I sent a follow-up email to everyone. Um, yesterday I heard from, uh, hold on. I heard
from Ken Silver, um, who's, uh, South street, but he said that there was, he said, there's nothing I
can do it wasn't before us it was before queen village they're the coordinating rco um
and i haven't heard back from them any of the other ones okay um should we take the public
questions or comments from the virtual audience
i do not see any further hands for this matter mr chair
i think planning was against it the last time of my correct we can go on the record again if you
want yeah sure yes um this is run bednar city planning property is indicated for residential
use on the city plan our adopted district plan recommends no change to the zoning at this
location the applicant's hardship is not supported with evidence of any physical circumstances or
condition of the property to prevent it from being
used in conformity with the use
requirements of the code. We recommend
requested variance for visitor accommodation
to not be granted. Thank you.
MI 2024
007 167 610
South Front Street. I vote
yes. Temporary variance
expires 1-16-26.
My vote is yes
with proviso.
Cheryl Gaston. My vote is no.
To the gram, my vote is yes with proviso.
Tywin, my vote is yes with proviso.
Mr. Chair, if we want to give a full year, we might want to add another month to that.
Okay, I should.
I said 116.26 or 116.26, I thought I said.
Right, so that's a year from tomorrow.
if we want to give a year for the variance.
Okay, all right, so 117?
I would say, yeah, 216.
Okay, good.
Yes, then you have a year.
All right, so I vote yes, proviso.
So I vote yes. Proviso. Temporary variance expires 2-16-26.
Temporary variance expires.
Okay, counsel?
Thank you.
Thank you.
I think we have to vote again, right?
Mike, Mike, Mike, Mike, what was that?
Mike, you're going to vote one more time.
Vote again on the new date.
2-16-26.
Oh, I didn't know I needed to vote on it.
So my vote is yes.
With proviso.
With proviso.
With proviso.
All right.
And my vote is no.
To another gram, my vote is yes.
with proviso.
I win.
My vote is yes with proviso.
Just sorry to jump in.
We're giving it a month in order for the decision to be issued so then he'd have the full year,
correct?
Thank you.
I appreciate it, everyone.
Is there anyone in the virtual audience whose case has not been called?
No, Mr. Chair, I do not see any further hands.
Thanks, everybody.
Thank you.