Well, let me ask you this one last question, 'cause I'm sure my time has already expired. You mentioned earlier in response to one of my colleague's questions, and I took this down, but I may not have written it correctly. You mentioned that when you arrived, there was no 25 reconciliation -- did you say "statement" or 168 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS "document"?
And why was such a document not available? And do any of the people that were there at the time still work at the School District?
I guess your question becomes, why didn't it -- it was physically in a number of different places and not brought together. (Addressing Mr. Doosey.) Do you want to talk about that?
If I can clarify. The District's prior policy was to compare budgeted to actual expenditures on an annual basis at the point in time when the books were closed, each June 30th. That analysis was done on a 169 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS fund-by-fund basis; for example, operating funds, food-service fund --
As opposed to on a monthly or a quarterly basis, unless it was opposed to on a functional basis. An example would be, you, as a division executive, are indifferent as to whether or not your positions are funded from an operating budget or a categorical budget; you're looking for an understanding from a financial perspective of how you're doing at various points along in the year. That document was not available upon the SRC's arrive.
I just want to add a little bit to this to make it clear that -- I mean, this -- this is a problem that the last school board and last administration understood also. I want to remind the Councilmembers that in January 2000 and basically in the year and a half leading up to January 2000, the prior school district administration selected a new suite of financial applications and implemented them in late 170 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS 1999 because the old financial applications were not Y2K-compliant, and that -- and the implementation of those new systems --
This is -- public knowledge was not the most successful implementation ever. And so we're still recovering from that today in terms of being able to deal with the very flawed implementation in December '99. And over the past two years and now in this administration -- and in the new administration now, we are still not there. We do not have financial reports for managers that let them see year-to-date actuals to budget, the way you'd expect in an organization of this size and complexity.
All right, all right. Well, I would say at a minimum, by the time we're back here a year from now, absolutely. And I would hope before that, but I don't want to over-promise. 171 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS
Councilman, quite frankly, we need to have that in place by the end of the current fiscal year.
Yeah, I mean, I was going to say, you know, between the yogurt and the water, I mean, I've really tried to take a little bit of an edge off of my little situation over hear once the noise stopped coming out of the speakers that nobody else heard. I mean, by this time next year, it would just generally be unacceptable. I mean, I can't even get exercised about screaming at you about that because it's so blatantly obvious that, I mean, it's not even worth the energy. So let me hear that date again?
Councilman, from my -- my current plan, frankly, is that that needs to be in place by the end of this fiscal year, this June 30th.
We can't wait a year to have that type of basic financial control in place at all levels of the organization.
I mean, I don't know 172 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS how you could have a legitimate conversation either with us, with Harrisburg, with anybody that might be thinking about buying a bond or anything else from the School District, the SRC, or whoever's going to float of piece of paper out there if you can't tell 'em how you run the operation. So it's June 30th is the goal?
Madam Chair, I have other questions. There may be other members who do too, so I'll --
is there any way we can indulge a brief recess, until the sound comes back?
could we just have five minutes? 173 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS
Council will be in recess for ten minutes. (Break taken.) (Proceedings resume.) - - -
The committee is now back in session. Councilman Rizzo, I believe that you were about to ask a question.
Thank you. When the first round expired, you were talking about the fact that it has been announced that there's going to be a $25 million reduction based on 325 positions at the Central Administration? I'm assuming that it's all of the central headquarters. And I asked about -- well, let me backtrack for a second. We had an opportunity to have a private briefing this past week, Chairman Nevels, and I think I expressed myself as clearly as I could at that time, and I'm not going to go back 174 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS over those same issues again 'cause I've already done it once, and I don't want to do it just to do it again in public, 'cause we were in a private environment. But a few issues that people want to know and constantly talk about, they understand the importance of the cuts at the central headquarters, but they're also concerned about the way the business is run, the way the light bulbs are put in, and how often we do it, and how we buy these things, the central purchasing, and the way we fix our vehicles, and how much money we spend to do it, and do we have frills over there that we don't necessarily need. And I asked you to identify maybe the top three areas where we could say to the public that they're going to see some change. Are there going to be fewer school buses? are the routes going to be better? are we going to downsize the size of a vehicle that carries 15 students versus a bus that has the capacity to haul 40 people? Again, I'm just talking about some common-sense things that need to be done over there. And the reason you're experiencing the 175 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS frustration from me is that of all of the years that I've sat in this chair, at every budget hearing we talk about certain issues, and everybody shakes their head "yes" in concert when they agree that there's something that needs to be done. And then you sit back, one month, two months, three months later, and you start to check to see if anybody really listened, and you find out that the first year, nobody listened, but they shook their heads "Yes, we're going to take care of that." The second year, the third year, the fourth year, the fifth year, the sixth year, the heads were still shaking and the same heads are still the ones doing the shaking that say, "Councilman, you're right, we shouldn't have this, we should do this better." But the next year, it's still going the same way that it went. So you're a victim of an environment that's not a good one, because we had people that yessed us to death and did nothing. So I'm hoping that you're going to shake your head and do something, because we really need to see a significant change, and the people that pay the freight need to see a significant change. And 176 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS that's why we're -- at least I'm acting today, and it's not normally my demeanor, but I am really frustrated to the point where I don't believe the people that have been shaking their heads, and I hope that we can believe you and the School Reform Commission, that there is going to be a change. Thank you, sir.
You're welcome. The Chair recognizes Councilwoman Brown.
I have one comment and then a question. I just received from a colleague, not in these chambers, Keystone Research Center is a Harrisburg-based, non-partisan think tank and a leading source of analysis of Pennsylvania's economy and public policy, and they've most recently indicated that -- I do know that Councilman Angel Ortiz posed questions about Edison, so I do want to put this on the record as a follow-up, that Edison produced a report claiming, and I quote, that "maintenance and operation costs in the Philadelphia 177 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS School District are exceptionally high," and then it provides back up. On its face, that may be true, but the Philadelphia School District was compared to other rural school districts and not with other like-urban school districts around the State or the country. So I would only fiscal ask as you go forward in making the critical decisions about who the school partners will be, that you will factor in information like that, that is produced by non-partisan third-parties who give us additional insight on what the partners are doing or are not doing.
Earlier during the budget hearings process, we heard a lot about the Beacon Schools. We in the City are excited about this new model, which is new to Philadelphia, but not new to cities like New York City and San Francisco, where schools are the anchor, if you will, or the beacon for the after-school programs. You well know that there's still 100,000 young people not serviced in after-school programs, 178 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS and the City has been lucky to secure a grant that will provide $450,000 to each Beacon School. Their success is, in a large way, tied to the Philadelphia School District. So I would like for to you share with us at this time where you are or where you stand with the Beacon Schools. Is the School District committed to being the partner that it has to be for these to work? How will they be implemented, and when do you see Beacon Schools actually becoming real within the School District?
Thank you, Councilwoman. At the moment, Beacon Schools issued a public press release that they would be operational April 1st. There are a number of business issues that are outstanding, and the School District and the City, as conduit for the Beacon Schools, are negotiating the following issues. Number one is the issue of legal liability.
Legal liability. The beacons are third parties. Any third party that utilizes a School District premises is required to 179 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS post a certificate of insurance naming the School District as an additional insured.
That's something that the Beacons are working on with the City's help. The second issue would be a contract between PHMC, which is one of the agencies of the City and the School District, which would lay out permitted uses in the buildings, what each of the Beacons would be required to commit to financially. We have not yet received the first draft of that contract. It is my understanding that the City Solicitor has various concerns as far as the format of that contract, and it is a issue which may delay the implementation of the Beacons with an April 1st start date simply because School District Council hasn't even seen the first draft. The last item on the list is one of cost, where even where though the Beacons have received grants, the amount of funds that the Beacons have proposed to pay to the School District for the use of the facilities is short of what our internal cost estimates are for the cost it would be to open up schools that would normally be closed during the 180 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS summer and to keep open on the weekend schools that would normally be closed. And the parties are working their best efforts to try and close that gap to come up with a cost arrangement that everyone can live with.
You say that the first draft sits in the City Solicitor's Office?
What we have received the first draft of the proposed contract from the Beacons. What we have received is a memo -- a memorandum of understanding for what they propose the relationship to be, and our legal counsel has commented on that and returned comments back to them and the City Solicitor.
What I do know is that the Beacon Schools are prepared to put $6 million in the School District, and so the question becomes -- that is not true?
I'm not saying that's not true; I don't know the source of the $6 million number.
Okay, and 181 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS so not knowing the cost or the number that Beacon is prepared to put forward, of course, you cannot comment on how much the School District may or may not be charging.
The School District has committed to the Beacons to charge a fixed price per facility, simply because the scope of the Beacons, what they're going to provide is open, and also an acknowledgement that the entire Beacon concept is to the betterment and to the benefit of the children. What we do not know and what we've asked the Beacons to quantify for us is the hours of operation and the scope of operation: Is it a primarily summer program; is it a year-round program; will it be primarily just Monday through Friday after hours during the -- I'm sorry, during the remainder between now and the school year, which we would probably not charge for since the buildings would be open. We're trying to quantify what the true scope on a facility-by-facility basis that they're planning on providing. An easy example might be if there's an entity out there that is proposing that they will, I'll say for the summer, use the School District 182 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS fields and only require to have the facilities open for bathroom facilities, of course, we wouldn't charge them for that. By the same token, if they are proposing use of classrooms on a year-round basis, 7 including a period of time when the school would be 8 closed, we would need that information to be able to 9 calculate what our cost is and then work with them 10 on a discount from that cost so that we can work out 11 a pricing structure that's acceptable to both sides. 12
Okay. We fully recognize that you, as the financial wizard, has to watch the numbers. I'm concerned about the level of commitment from the School District to make the numbers work in such a way that we could take advantage of the substantial grant that has come to the City to benefit the lives of 100,000 young people. So I'm asking the leadership to speak to the level of commitment, knowing that this is a rare opportunity for our city and knowing research has already spoken to the success of this model in New York City and San Francisco.
The Commission is committed 183 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS to the concept. We just learned of it just a matter of months ago, early on in the year
However, as a financially distressed district, we've got to make sure -- you made reference to a $6 million grant, and obviously, we would welcome that, but we don't know that to be the case. So we're confronted with making a determination as to the cost of facilities and the period of time when normally expenditures would not be incurred. So absolutely, we're committed, we're endeavoring to -- we're waiting for the draft of the document, of the legal document and contract, and we'll move expeditiously, but we will not expend monies without the appropriate reimbursement.
Councilwoman, I'm sorry, I think the $6 million might be the gross grant.
But that amount would also have to account for all of the Beacon staff, all of the Beacon operations, the agency's own costs. 184 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS
The amount that has been proposed to the School District by PHMC and by the City is significantly below that. I mean, it is less than $1 million.
Okay. We do have different information, so we'll have to wait to make sure we are all on the same page with regards to --
And to the extent that you may have some information that we don't have, and in tandem, take a look at this matter, because obviously, I think it has great merit.
I'm more than willing to do that. I am paying close attention and would be happy to serve as bridge or a facilitator to make sure that those who are responsible for the entire RFP process and the awarding process sit with you. And I think, too, we may need to have a 185 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS representative from the City Solicitor's Office at the table as well, 'cause I was actually under the impression that the holdup is in the School District, and you have informed me otherwise. Very well.
You're welcome. The Chair recognizes Councilwoman Tasco.
Thank you. I'm trying to find a part in your testimony that speaks to the issue that you would be working with partnership schools, charter schools and --
And traditional. Are the partnership schools these nonprofit schools that were listed -- tell me, I guess in the Daily News, there's a list of people who want to help broaden the schools. Are these some of the nonprofits that you were talking about 186 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS in the briefing you had on Friday, talking about creating some initiatives with nonprofits? Who are the nonprofits you're talking about?
I haven't seen the copy of that newspaper, but the process that we're utilizing in terms of the community-partnership schools is that we have an RFQ out, and there have been respondents that would include certain nonprofits and universities, as well as private entities. And I believe there's been a list of those published.
Okay. What would the nonprofits be responsible for? Would they have to, in their administration of the schools, deal with all aspects of education, particularly special- education students?
In the case of the community programs -- and I think that's what you're referring to -- there could be a number of services that could be provided, and that's one of the things right now that the Commission is working on in terms of -- with its -- its consultants and advisors to determine what that role would be. For example, it could involve community outreach in terms of the solicitation of parents and 187 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS children that come to schools that are operated by a nonprofit or private provider. The additional -- there are other additional factors that could be actively involved in participating in the educational program, but outreach, direct involvement in the educational program, and anything else that the partners, if you would, would agree to in terms of the functioning of those schools.
The -- wouldn't they be responsible -- if they contracted to manage a school, I guess that's what this would be doing, right?
Wouldn't they be responsible for the ongoing concern? As the school presently exists, they could not turn way special- education students, they would have to deal with students, as we looked at yesterday in the paper, who have delinquents returning to school. I mean, do they get the cream off, and send the special- education students and the problem students someplace else, or do they manage the school as it presently exists?
They would manage the school 188 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS as it presently exists, subject to all of the rules and regulations. For example, you can't turn away special-education students. They would have the same functioning. There would be an application process possibly. They would be located in a given vicinity. And parents would opt to have their children attend those schools.
What's the incentive for a partnership to operate within the system if we're not going to provide any additional funding? Where do they get their funding from to run the school? There has to be some benefit for them to want to manage the school, and I'd like to know, if we're not going to provide additional funding to them, what do -- what do they get? What does it cost us and what does it cost them?
The incentive for the involvement of anybody, whether it be a nonprofit or if it is a private company, the incentive would be to have certain things in place. And what I mean by that is, for example, if you have a charterized environment, that's one of the great things, Councilwoman Tasco, about the legislation, which is 189 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS that it allows for independent school, it allows for different types of schools that allow different staffing. So, for example, you might have fewer teachers that are covered by the collective bargaining agreement, and that would afford potential, possible opportunities for savings and would incent [sic] the involvement of a partnership group to, if you would, beat the pavement to try to get folks involved.
Well, I don't know if the partnership schools are going to be relieved of the relationship with the union.
Are you inferring that the one way the partnership grouping would have a profiting from their relationship would be to obviate the bargaining, the collective bargaining agreement?
That's not what I said. 190 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS What I said was the -- under the act, there are several categories of schools that are not in any other legislation, and they include reconstituted schools, independent schools as well. And that's what I'm referring to.
Let me just give an example. The Martin Luther King cluster, we know there's an interest by State Representative Dwight Evans to manage that Martin Luther King cluster. What does that mean in view of what you just said about collective bargaining? Wouldn't those schools still be a part of the collective bargaining agreement related to the schools? Those people, would they still not be employees of the School District?
So if they're employees of the School District, then they're still subjected to the collective bargaining, unlike the charter schools. The charter schools are like independent schools, and I don't believe they have a labor union relationship in some of them.
In some of them, they do; in some of them, they don't 191 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS
But the partnership schools are the schools that these individuals are asking to manage. And what is the incentive of managing the schools if we are not going to give them additional funding? And what do we get?
What is the incentive for them to manage the schools?
The incentive for them to manage the schools are to be in a position to provide either through curriculum or other services in a better way --
All right, one of the better ways is smaller class sizes. If they have smaller class sizes, they need to have expanded facilities. Where do they get the money from to operate the schools if we're not going to provide them with additional resources?
In certain instances, you will have start-up costs at the very beginning that will be committed by the partnership schools between the community groups and the provider. There are always up-front costs that have to be confronted. 192 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS
So who is going to monitor these partnership schools?
The School District will, and we will do that in much the same way that we would monitor the charters and our own schools.
So what are they promising? That's what I wanted to ask, what do we get? What is the promise by the managers of these partnership schools to the School District and to the City? What do we get? What is so different that they're going to provide that the School District can't provide?
They're going to provide an -- a means of direct intervention in a way that is clear that we're not providing currently, and what I mean by that is --
And what I mean by that is, there are certain providers -- for example, let's 193 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS say that there exists a university group that is located in a certain portion of the City, and by virtue of their educational -- their graduate school of education, they can do recruitment very effectively and get teachers to -- young teachers to stay in that area. In addition, they have the power of their endowment to --
Well, why can't we do that? What's wrong with us doing that? Why can't the School District do that?
I would that hope at some point, we would be able to do that.
What track record do these people have in doing all of that?
It is a young Industry, Councilperson,and I don't deny that, but there are certainly college and university groups that do have the experience, and there are privatized groups that have the experience as well. We're going to evaluate those and additionally hold them to accountability standards.
I don't understand how it works, and I don't understand why we have to give up our public schools to individuals who have 194 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS no track record in running schools, and I don't know what we get for that relationship.
And that is why we have an RFQ process in place, to evaluate their qualifications and made it -- we're not wedded to making any decisions as to a particular provider.
There are some areas in your briefing on Friday that you have put some RFPs out for supportive services such as teacher recruitment, procurement, principal training, food services, transportation, information technology. Now, the School District is presently -- they do these functions right? They perform these functions?
So you're going to contract this stuff out. 195 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS
We didn't say that we're going to contract those out. What we asked is that individual firms come in and consult with us and tell us what the best practices are in respect to these functional areas. We will take those recommendations, and I believe I can say for the Commission that we will evaluate those recommendations and make a determination as to whether or not they should be adopted or not.
So, you're saying that the School District will still perform the recruitment task, but you will be looking at better ways of doing it based on some information provided by a consultant?
We may, depending upon the recommendation of the consultant and the cost benefit of it.
Are the people who I read in the paper, who are going to be laid off, do they fall into these categories?
They do not. 196 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS
They do not fall into -- I guess the easiest way to say it is, it's not part and parcel of the RFQ process. There may be reductions, for example, in curriculum support for the headquarters as part of the announcement Friday, but we have not received any responses from any of the providers, so those reductions would not be the result of any of the providers' recommendations, nor any potential outsourcing in the future; they're distinct and separate operations.
So if you decide that you're going to take a -- respond to the RFP on teacher recruitment and contract that job, that function out to a private consultant, what happens to the people in the teacher recruitment department?
They would either be redeployed if they were unionized under the collective-bargaining agreement, or they would be released.
Has there been any cost analysis? I guess you will do that once you 197 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS get the RFPs back to compare whether the cost is more feasible for you to maintain that function or to contract it out?
My term is seven years, and I suspect that at least seven years, given that that's the longest of terms, but I believe that the SRC in this legislation has a life of its own until such time that the courts or the legislature decides that that life should end.
Well, who puts this back together after Humpty Dumpty has fallen off the wall? (Laughter.)
I said who puts Humpty Dumpty back together again after if falls off the wall in seven years? Where do we go? I mean, where are we going to be? 198 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS 'Cause this is just -- the bottom line, there is no real interest in funding the School District, and all of this stuff and all of these proposals, it's just a sham to negate the responsibility of the politicians to fund the School District. And like with Kenney, it's not personal with you or anyone on the Commission; it's just the way I feel because, 'cause I don't think all of this is necessary. In the end, I don't think we save any money; in the end, we're going to spend more money. And it's not going to be with children; it's going to be on contracts, it's going to be on all of these other things that get funded in the process, and children will not benefit in the end. (Applause.)
But it's not personal and you're doing your job; I don't want you to take it personally.
There's a press conference at a school dealing with all of these 199 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS issues up in the Barrio, and I have to go and attend that press conference, but I know that you're going to be here when I get back like in 45, 50 minutes. By the way, one of the things that got me is, I thought we had a very successful recruitment year. I thought our recruitment of teachers was really going in and working very well, that we didn't have to hire consultants for that, because if anything, we have brought down the fact that we're not starting every school year now with 300 teachers less than before, and that during the last two years, our recruitment of teachers has been quite successful, and the in-house people that are there probably are very good, and before you consult, you should look at them.
Okay. Dr. Farmbry, I would just like to ask a question, if I may. Are any academic programs being reduced in the proposed '02-'03 budget?
Well, I see that Latin is being phased out and apparently --
Yes. 200 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS
There are two independent items. In relation to programs being reduced, yes, there is one: It is high school Latin as a foreign language, and the budget states the proposal that no 10 new students will be accepted in that program, that those currently in the Latin program will finish In reference to the bilingual --
Kindly speak closer to the mic; we're having difficulty hearing you up here.
I'm sorry. There is one program elimination in the budget that is proposed, and that is to eliminate Latin as a foreign language for high school. The proposal is that --
I don't know, but in my day anyway, if you were interested in going to medical school, you had to know Latin, and you wanted to go into other fields, you certainly had to know Latin. Has that changed? 201 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS
I can't respond to either question as far as professional development. It's really a situation where the --
Well, why would we do away with Latin if we don't know what the repercussions would be to a student?
The number of students is small and has been declining; I can get the exact numbers to you by close of business today.
And why are we doing away with the 32 bilingual --
I'm sorry, we're not doing away with the 32 teachers; we are correcting an allocation error in prior years. I guess I should say the bilingual program is not a pull-out program. It is a program where teachers speak native languages other than English are in front of students for the entire day, just as if they're English-speaking teachers. The allocation methodology in the budget in prior years allocated teachers to schools excluding bilingual teachers and then added bilingual teachers in at the end. The impact in prior years was that those schools with bilingual 202 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS programs had a lower student-to-teacher ratio than other schools in the District. What the current plan is, frankly, is it adjusts the budget for that effect so that each school in the District, whether it be bilingual, whether it be English-based, uses the State formula for the allocation of teacher resources.
Would you repeat that. I couldn't understand the last part of it. (Inaudible)
That's okay. The reference to bilingual teachers was, it was inferred that it was an elimination of bilingual teachers, and my comment was that it is not eliminating a bilingual program nor bilingual teachers.
But you're reducing, are you not, 32 teachers, bilingual teachers?
I am reducing the number of teachers by 32 because student counts in the District are dropping as well. It is a pro rata change for students. And it's correcting a process where in 203 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS some schools with bilingual teachers, they had, I guess, what is called "a floater teacher" floating around or an additional teacher in those facilities that was not the same in other districts. For equity purposes, we felt it was important that the same formula be used District-wide.
If I may just respond that these are all proposed at this time because in the proposal stage, we will be looking carefully to see, as you said, the impact of the student's access to other careers or options should certain things be cut out, and also the extent to which any kind of shift would alter the integrity of a program.
How many bilingual teachers do we presently have?
Thank you. Are we going to get that information now or are you going to get it to us later?
I'll get that information to you now, and if you would be kind enough to give me ten minutes or so, I will have that information for you. 204 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS
Certainly. And in the interim, the Chair recognizes Councilman Cohen.
Thank you, Madam President. During one of the responses Chairman Nevels had to a question raised by Councilwoman Tasco, he referred -- you referred to the legislation creating the School Reform Commission, you referred to it in a very positive way, saying one of the great advantages is that it offers certain opportunities. I'm not sure what they were, but I have to tell you, I think the conclusion is clear that what Councilwoman Tasco said in her closing comments seems totally accurate. It seems that this whole process is a sham for the purpose of enabling the State to avoid its financial responsibilities, and you are performing those functions, I believe, with respect to the question of the bilingual teachers, the effort was not to achieve equity, but to achieve a reduction of staff members to cut costs. I call to your attention the existence of Governor Schweiker's statement in the proposal he 205 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS presented to Mayor John Street on October 31, 2001. "This is after many months of discussion in which Philadelphians have made clear they feel that the City is being shortchanged in finances." This was the Governor's response on the last page of his official statement given to Mayor Street. It's entitled "The Bottom Line." And what is the bottom line? Are we going to get more money to the Philadelphia schools? The answer is that in Fiscal Year 2002, cost-saving initiatives are going to reduce the School District budget by $5 million; in Fiscal Year 2003, the reduction is going to be $159 million; in Fiscal Year '04, the cost-saving initiatives, meaning less money for the School District, is going to be $207 million; and in Fiscal Year '05, it's going to be $235 million; and in Fiscal Year 2006, it's going to be $227 million. For a total of $833 million. So that what the State is doing is saying, "Philadelphia, yes, maybe you think you need money, but what we think you need to do is to cut and cut and cut." To our plea for fairness with the suburban areas that we compete with to enable us to 206 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS give the excellent brand of education which we've shown we can give in certain areas, but to spread that throughout the whole system instead of giving us the approximately 2,000 to 3,000 more per student, your answer is to cut immediately. You don't care about the problem raised by the President with respect to the impact in admissions to medical schools and, I may add, admission to law school, because much of the law contains many Latin phrases. And what you do is to prepare Philadelphia for just certain kinds of jobs and not to professions. I think you're doing your job admirably but your job is to cut and cut and cut, and not to deal with sound academic initiatives. And my question that I raised with you in the form of a statement, I haven't heard any answers, and I would like to ask you, isn't it true that the State put a cap on the amount of money it would pay to Philadelphia after 190,000 students? Wasn't that cut made?
I ask that of you, Chairman Nevels, because you're coming here and 207 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS indicating you believe, and it's very difficult for me to understand that you could say that, that you believe that your purpose is to improve education, when your purpose clearly here is to save the State from putting in money. Isn't it true for example that you talk about the State being ready to put up 75 million? Well this year alone, you've taken $130 million out of the City's budget for schools for charter schools. Hasn't the amount of money that the City of Philadelphia School District was supposed to get been reduced by $130 million for the payment to charter schools?
I mean, let's be honest in the discussion. These are difficult questions, but the first thing we've got to do is to deal honestly with the facts, and the facts are that the State is cutting money from the school system in Philadelphia, not spending more money, and that your job here, when you talk about fiscal control and fiscal responsibility, is to reduce the budget. When, in fact, what we need are more 208 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS things, you're going to cut Latin. We need much more in the way of language. We need many more bilingual teachers, not fewer bilingual teachers 'cause I think the sole thing that guides you is the fiscal results, and your job is to cut the amount of money that the State is contributing to the City, or at least in the alternative, to limit the amount of additional funding that we get from the State. You ask us to give 45 million for the current year and 45 million for the next year, $90 million, while the State in that period of time only contributes $75 million. Is that true, Chairman Nevels?
That is correct in terms of the agreement between the City and the State.
Well, what is your comment about Governor Schweiker's bottom line? That's the bottom line, that means what we're looking for. That's why the whole program exists, is to achieve the bottom line.
Councilman Cohen, with all due respect, this is not a document that's generated by the School District, and my testimony yesterday in a specific question in the House Appropriations 209 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS was, for the second line item, cost savings initiatives, where are those monies coming from? And I had to answer quite honestly, I did not know, because in my own experience with the School District, what's labeled in here for Fiscal Year '03 is $159 million in savings, and frankly, I can't find it, I don't know where they are.
Where did you find the $25 million savings? Whose great idea was that, that you're going to find $25 million from the present headquarters staff? You don't even know what people you're talking about, you don't even know where making the cuts, yet you're coming in here and saying you've identified $25 million in cost savings. Tell me, what's the cost going to be to the pupils? Have you made this great new discovery yourself and no superintendent before, no financial officer before understood that these people were just living off the public monies? Is that what you're telling us, that they did not contribute to the education of the pupils?
I am unwilling to say to you, Councilman, that there are no instances in 210 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS which there can't be cost efficiencies. I will tell you that an organization that does not have first-rate financial practices is a tipoff to me that there may be other things wrong as well, given my business experience, and I'm relying on that.
Well, I don't know what you mean by "cost efficiencies," Chairman. I mean, it's a very nice phrase to use, but I see it as reducing the programs offered to the children in Philadelphia.
Absolutely not, I disagree you with you, and we will continue to disagree.
Well, when you take away Latin and you take away bilingual teachers --
Those areas, they are the hearts of a modern -- (Unintelligible, parties talking over each other.)
With all due respect, Councilman, there have been remarks about the importance of Latin, the importance in terms of foreign languages. We're blessed on the Commission 211 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS to have an educator who tells us that in terms of Latin and Greek anymore, that it's not required for graduate school. In my day, it certainly was for purposes of going to law school, it came in handy. But what we're talking about are circumstances where there are fewer and fewer young people taking those -- taking that language.
So then you ought to be encouraging more of them to take it instead of helping along to eliminate the study of Latin or the use of bilingual teachers.
Mr. Nevels, before you and the Reform Commission came here, we would have people who had children in the Philadelphia public schools that would come here, we had people to whom we could appeal both as Councilmembers and the community could go to meetings. I heard the young woman, a member of the Commission, talking about you're going to set up advisory commissions. What's the role of the people -- when do all of the people get a chance to meet you? 212 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS You tell us you're going to give consideration, you're telling us we have nothing to say about any of these decision-makings. You're ready to listen here and there to a committee, but you're not ready to permit the people to participate. Before that, we used to vote on issues in Philadelphia affecting the School Board. Are you going to accept -- I raised that question with you privately. Are you going to honor this Council's decision that those schools should be privatized unless there is first a vote by parents?
What we have done is, we have discussed and outlined today the method of public participation, and we have established that.
You've taken away the right to vote from people in Philadelphia, and yet you're coming here, telling us you're doing it in the interest of school reform. That's not school reform to take away rights from people, it's not school reform to take away the right of the public to confront the members of the Board of Education as they've done for many years. 213 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS You're saying you're going to set up certain kinds of committees that will meet once a month. That's not the kind of democratic participation we've had in the history of public education.
We're contemplating three times a month, I believe, Councilman.
Well, tell me, is your proposal aimed at saving the State money? Isn't that going to be the bottom line for you, that you can achieve what Governor Schweiker said he wants to achieve?
Absolutely not. On December 21st, we articulated four goals. We are going to hold to those goals. It is not just about money and it is unfair for you to characterize it that way.
" The proposal before the State legislature, you're very unfair to the rural districts. The State has set up a system which makes it almost impossible for the legislature to vote for the $75 million. " That's the scenario that's been artificially created to make it impossible to get successful legislation through. Obviously, these rural areas are hungering also for assistance, and the State has a Rainy Day Fund, the State gave away lots of money in all kinds of tax deductions. The State has money, but yet you come to us and say to let the citizens of Philadelphia for the next 30 years have this big bond responsibility of spending $750 million to take care of a newly-created deficit of a much smaller amount, maybe even less than one-third of the amount. According To Mr. Osgoode, you're going to be reducing the deficit even more than what exists now. 215 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS I mean, what sense does it make to spend all of this money and burden our residents of Philadelphia and our businesses in Philadelphia with this tax obligation over the next 30 years over a figure of what will be 150, $200 million? Does the State have that money? The State's got a budget of billion. Is this a proposal so that financial 9 companies like your own can get involved in bonds, 10 in the sale of Philadelphia bonds and make a profit? 11 That's the reason I raise it. Let's do 12 it for free, and as soon as the proposal for free 13 comes about, you'll find that nobody needs to have a bond issue, 'cause it makes no sense financially. Why doesn't the State advance the funding as it did last year? This is a temporary period, everybody agrees. It's difficult we have a lame-duck governor who's never been elected by the people who has a gross inability to develop the political strength to get legislation through, or doesn't understand the process, I don't know which it is, but during the short-term period, why didn't the State advance the money? And then let's get to an answer. I think Councilman Kenney was right. 216 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS Politicians like myself, like others, tend to respond to emergencies much more quickly than we respond to long-term problems, and I think he's absolutely right that if we go ahead with the bond issue, two years from now, we'll be back talking about the same thing all over again, except then we'll have the further problem of heavy-bonded indebtedness. So I would like your response to these things. I'm charging that what's being done is not for the benefit of the children, but for the benefit of I don't know who. The lawyers want more fees? They get plenty of fees from the City of Philadelphia. The bankers get plenty of business all the time from the City of Philadelphia. But it makes no sense from a financial point of view, it seems to me, to burden the citizens of Philadelphia for 30 years to remove a deficit that was created over the last two or three years, when we had present quite clearly the likelihood of the deficit immediately being recreated. Because you have no plan. You know, I would mind it difficult, Mr. Nevels to believe that in your business 217 3/19/02 - FY '03 PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL BUDGET HEARINGS arrangements, that you would have a situation like this one that you would have approved of financial, that a business man would come to you or a corporation with the proposal, and you'd say, Well what's your plan? If we loan you this money and clear up your debt, what's your plan for getting out of debt? And he said to you, Mr. Nevels, I can tell you, it's going to give us time to think about a plan, it's going to give us time to try to figure out how to avoid a new deficit. I think you would have shown the corporation or the individual the door because you would realize, how can you make a loan on that basis, if you're asking Philadelphia to do that? I would appreciate your response to that.