civus
Hearing video

ZBA Hearing - June 15, 2022

Philadelphia Zoning Board of Adjustment (ZBA)Jun 15, 20223h 59m

Due to our close relationship, we considered them an affiliate.

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And in discussion with our in-house attorneys, we thought it was an okay thing to do.

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We put the ad up, and then that ad ran for quite some time before we heard anything.

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I'm going to say it ran for probably a couple of years or a year and a half at least.

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So in other words, even though Mr. Rutter is here to represent the city, the entity or the governmental entity that said anything about what message you were sending on this sign was the Pennsylvania Department of Transportation.

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Is that correct?

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Yes, sir.

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Okay.

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And what happened as a reason?

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What did you do in response to that?

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Well, the letter offered some options to appeal this, that. The other thing, I opted to just reach out to Ms. Parkins and struck up a conversation. And she, after several conversations and emails, she asked me directly, why is it that the union did not apply for an off-premise advertising permit from the beginning?

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And I said to her, well, from what I understood, they were limited and that PennDOT almost never grants them.

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And she said, well, you're correct.

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She said it's almost impossible.

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But nonetheless, throughout our discussion, she had done her own legwork and explained to me, and I could hardly contain how happy I felt in what she was saying.

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But she said from where she's sitting.

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Note the objection to hearsay.

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Say again, sir?

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Just keep talking.

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Objecting to hearsay.

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Tell us. She gave you some advice. And as a result of that advice, how did it change your attitude towards possibly seeking use of changing the message so it would be not only accessory, but also non-accessory?

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You can tell us.

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Tell us.

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She gave you some.

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She said that from where she's sitting, there is no reason why PennDOT would have any reason to deny our project or attempts to get a variance for off-premise advertising.

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She said we were the proper distance from the highway, the signs, residential.

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She went through all of the different things that we had, the criteria that we had to meet.

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And she said she would even, she even offered to help us in any way that she could.

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Okay, now let's show the board 36, 37, 38. Let's go to 36 first. No, that's 34. Go down. 36. There you go. Next to the sign. Next to the picture of the sign. No, go up, Nico. Oh, you got him. You're showing him. You're showing him all. 36 through 41 are your trail of emails with Ms. Parkins. Isn't that correct?

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Yes, sir.

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And that that continued, I guess, through May 6th of 2021.

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Keep going through.

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May 7th, May 10th, May 12th.

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May 12th.

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Wait.

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Go back up.

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OK, so she on May 12th, she says before that,

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Go up to what you wrote in May 10th. Go back down a little. Let's get what Joe wrote in May 10th.

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You know, good morning, Joanne. Thank you for your email. I wanted to let you know that the POND ad has been removed and we are seeing if there's anything on compliance.

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I will keep you the speed on progress and have a great day. And she writes, good morning.

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Then you ask, I just wanted to ask you about the date in your email for our application of 524.

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Would that be an application for an off premise permit and then go up?

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And she responds, yes, if you were to apply for an off-premise advertising, however, I did close the record on the sign notices you indicate the violations were corrected. You then write, yes, everything has either been removed or adjusted, so please let me know if this means no deadline to pursue the 524. She says, yes, that is correct, and keep going.

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then you have good morning joanne's and checking in the things we spoke it's our intention to try

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and get the off-premise off-premise permit we need it appears we will need a variance and i

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believe you might even have stated that my question is will pendot still approve it was done

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by obtaining a variance thanks uh hi it depends what the variance was issued for i knew we do

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not accept zoning variance for zoning purposes otherwise it may be perfectly fine i'll need some

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specifics uh but you're also testifying that uh and that that would uh thanks joanne this would

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be for the zoning district go ahead and it's you sent she sends you that it's in cmx3 correct

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yes okay and then go up i think that's the last one we get or no there's one more

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and then she says may 18th you do not need a variance for zoning for oad which is a

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an outdoor advertising device permitting purposes as long as the zoning is of commercial or

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industrial nature is acceptable. I'm not sure what other issues you're having, but it should

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not affect the permitting process. And how did you take that permitting process with PennDOT?

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Is that how you understood it? Yes, absolutely. Okay. Great. Thanks for your help. And she said,

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of course, you're very welcome. That was May 18th at 925 a.m., correct? Yes, sir. Okay.

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so I can't the chairman is speaking but I can't hear him oh we can't yeah chairman you're muted if

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you're we didn't hear you at all chairman you were muted

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you're still muted Mr. Chair you're still muted there you go Mr. Park let me ask you this how

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many more witnesses do you have um two I have our engineer yes so I think I'm I'm

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I think what we're going to do is we're going to have a resumptive hearing for this.

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We have several other cases today.

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And the other thing is, could you make sure that anything you have, you send to Hillary?

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We've never seen that squill a letter.

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Well, it just came in.

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I mean, it was addressed to you, not to me.

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I understand.

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I understand.

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I understand.

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And I'm just asking you, could you please, whatever you have, please send to Hillary.

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And we'll be in touch.

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And, Mr. Coach, I appreciate your time, but I think we're going to have to move on and we'll continue this at a later date.

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and Mr. Coach, I appreciate your time

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but I think we're going to have to move on

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and we'll

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All right, Mr. Pollack.

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Oh, that's fine, Mr. Chairman.

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As I said, we just want to we just want to have a chance to make a record.

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That's right. You'll you'll get a chance and we'll continue that.

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OK. All right. Thank you. Thank you very much, sir.

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Chair, Mr. Chair, I would ask it just as a courtesy.

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So it's on the record, Mr. Pollack, to the extent that the city would be in the case.

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uh if if we we would ask that uh whatever was submitted to the board that we all that the city

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oh absolutely absolutely absolutely hillary will send you everything we have okay great thank you

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very much thank you very much okay that concludes my business uh wait i think there may be one other

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case so so what we're going to do is we have one more case on the uh on the two o'clock list and

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we only have one or two cases on the 330 list we're going to take a five minute break court

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reporter can get straight things like that and we'll be right back what what letter what one do

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you have uh it might be continued it's very similar to the last one 2901 uh south randolph

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street i think that was going to be continued it is they they've requested to continue they

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request okay yeah we wouldn't yeah i don't have an objection to that okay so then five minutes

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everybody we'll be right back that concludes my business uh maybe thank you appreciate you

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Thank you.

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Thank you.

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Thank you.

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Thank you.

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Thank you.

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Thank you.

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Thank you.

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You

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Thank you.

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Thank you.

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okay you're sure i changed my i changed my entire location

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i carried everything throughout the house you got your lucky thing behind you again

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all right i just can't do it in that other room we got we got we got one here and then

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we got one or two and then we're done we're going to move pretty good here

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Number 10, okay.

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good afternoon hi hi how are you good area we should be starting in a few minutes sorry for

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as you like. My presentation is super simple. I don't know how I always get stuck behind the

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longer cases. Two minutes, I'll be done. Maybe people should put up their hands. I have a

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simple one. Can I say something? Yeah, yeah. Gosh, we'll knock on wood. Hopefully it remains a simple one.

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lakisha how do we look

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we're ready when you are chair i'm ready

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Okay, number 10, MI 2022-001-340-8258 Tarsdale Avenue, letter of support from Upper Holmesburg

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Civic Association. Counsel, could you state your name and spell for the court reporter?

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Sure. Augusta O'Neill, A-U-G-U-S-T-A. My last name is spelled O-N-E-I-L-L.

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Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?

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I do.

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Could you identify your client and relationship to the property?

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Sure. My client is Gene Starin. He is the owner of the property.

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Our vice chair has a few questions.

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hi do you agree to waive the reading of the refusal and stipulate to its accuracy

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i do have you emailed the exhibit packet with required documents consisting of proof of

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ownership tax compliance refusal referral photos under plans of the property five days in advance

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of this hearing and have you met with the rco and do you have a letter yes to all the above

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okay you may proceed you have two minutes thank you so much

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members of the board i'm here this afternoon representing the owner of the property at 8258

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torsdale avenue this application is to legalize an existing auto repair business that's at the

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property my client has owned the property since 1992 but there's been an auto repair business

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at this location since probably about 1958, as best we can tell, which is when the building was

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first constructed. So an auto repair business has been operating the whole time at this location

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An auto repair business has been operating the whole time at this location since my client

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since my client has.

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has owned it without issue since about 1993.

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There appears to have been some kind of an oversight, which was just caught back in December

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of 2021 by L&I.

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My client was operating under the impression that a previous tenant had gotten all the

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permits in place for the auto repair use.

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I've enclosed a copy of that historic permit with my exhibit package at page five, just

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showing again that this auto repair use have been applied for. And so it was it was an oversight

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on everyone's part. And in fact, OPA has records which also show that this property is an auto

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repair shop. So let me just pull up a picture. So I just got to shrink this down a bit.

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so just for context this is a picture of the outside of the property it's an auto sales

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business but then there's this auto repair shop in here as well because as a natural part of

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selling cars there are auto repairs that have to be done so things like brake work or oil changes

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but I did want to note that there's no auto body work that's done here so there's no use of saws

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or lab machinery to do the type of work.

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It's simply accessory to the auto sales business

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that's operating there.

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The property is zoned RSA 3,

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but I included an aerial in my exhibit package.

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I'm sorry.

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At page 12, just showing that on this corridor

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of Torresdale Avenue,

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there's quite a few auto repair businesses

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and other commercial uses.

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And in fact, we're just down the street from the old site of the Holmesburg prison.

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So we did meet with neighbors of the property on two different occasions.

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At the first meeting that we held with the RCO, the Upper Holmesburg Civic Association,

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some neighbors expressed concerns related to operations.

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And so we met with them again to further discuss concerns that had come up at the first meeting.

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And following those meetings, we did enter into a CBA with the RCO.

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I provided a copy of the CBA to the board solicitor.

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And as a result of entering into the CBA, the RCO has agreed to support our application.

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A copy of the letter of support was provided with my application materials.

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And with that, I would like to call for Jeff Starin, who is part of ownership of the property.

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So, Jeff, if you could hit the raise hand feature to adopt my testimony.

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hi could you state your name and spell it please for the court reporter

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hi could you do it one more time we couldn't hear you sure jeffrey stern j-e-f-f-r-e-y

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last name stern s-t-e-r-i-n right do you swear or affirm to tell the truth the whole truth

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nothing but the truth i do counsel jeff did you have an opportunity to hear my testimony this

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afternoon i did and was everything that i said to the board true and accurate to the best of your

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knowledge yes it was and would you like to adopt my testimony as your own i would thank you um

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i'm sorry questions from the board no mr chair no mr chair questions or comments from the virtual

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audience. Chair, we have someone by the name of Stanley with the last name ending in C.

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Sure. Hi, could you state your name and spell for the court reporter? Stanley Sawinski, S-T-A-N-L-E-Y

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C-Y-W-I-N-S-K-I. Right. Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing

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about the truth? I do. Proceed. I am the president of the Upper Hansburg Civic Association.

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I'm also the zoning director for the 6th Councilmatic District. We did meet with the owner of

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the property, and after multiple sessions, we agreed to a community benefits agreement

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that i believe satisfies most it's not all the requirements the neighbors were looking for

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so um we do support this initiative thank you thank you very much for calling thank you for

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calling in we appreciate it anyone else in the virtual audience so you know the handshake

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planning commission mr chair members of the board this is mason austin representing the

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Planning Commission. The property is designated for single-family residential use in the

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comprehensive plan and its RSA 3 zoning matches that designation. The property is also on a strip

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with several other auto-related uses and the opposite side of the street is zoned for medium

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industrial uses. Given the record of long-time vehicle repair uses on the site and a lack of

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Given the record of long-time vehicle repair uses on the site and the lack of opposition

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opposition by the RC.

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by the RCO, the Staff of the Planning Commission has no objection to the granting of this variance.

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Thank you very much.

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MI 2022-001-340-8258 Torresdale Avenue, I vote yes.

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Harold Tannery, my vote is yes.

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Thomas Howellman, my vote is yes.

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Ishmael Shaheed, my vote is yes.

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Thank you, Counsel.

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Thank you so much.

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i appreciate it thank you we're going to start the 330 list so i'll just go over

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