I have to leave at this time and I wanted to leave my vote in support of the bill and of all the bills before the committee on this subject matter and any amendments that may be proposed today by the sponsor of the bill.
May I just say one thing? The good part of the demonstration at the City Committee was that it seemed to me for the first time in my long political history in Philadelphia, I felt the gloves were taken off and people were beginning to address directly without fencing or beginning to face directly the issue. I think until we talk plain and say that if the Mayor of this city, and that's no matter who the mayor is, unless the major of the city under the city's Home Rule Charter, takes a strong position, 130 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 nothing much will happen despite any legislation passed. We ought to pass the legislation to give the framework so that the Mayor can operate fully legally. But if he does that, then everything depends on the will of the Mayor. And the way the Mayor expresses his approval, he has many ways of disagreeing with people if he thinks they're wrong. For example, you don't want to appoint labor leaders who you think are flouting the law and democratic principals to the top positions in the city. You don't wink. You know, when you say we want this law passed and followed, you don't then wink to the building trade and say, Of course there's an exception for you. Everybody must be held to account. And to that end, I'll pledge to continue my work, and before the Lord removes me from the scene, I would like to see success come. And, frankly, I don't have another 32 years. So I don't have the same comfort that some of the younger members of Council have that can take a longer approach. I would like to see this thing done, Wilson, in the next two or three administrations. 131 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 If possible, before the May 20th primary this year would be a great time for success. Thank you very much. (Applause.)
I read your proposed bill. I think one of the things you may want to consider, and I don't know how you're going to do this, is whatever office that's created by your bill to administer this program, that that office has the authority to set goals on every contract led by every agency within the city. Unless you have that, I really believe you're going to have chaos. You're not going to have an effective program. You have to have some mechanism where if your personnel department is letting out a contract, that that contract comes through the office that's created by this program to set a goal on it. Without it, from what I've heard this morning is that the agencies will have too much discretion on where the goal is going to be and whether or not they're going to be complied, what's going to be in the contract. I think, if I may, that every contract that let by a city agency should come through some 132 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 central point and the goals are put on the contract before it's awarded. Thereby you would have greater control and a way of monitoring the participation on each and every contract. Because it's not -- and I've talked to a lot of jurisdictions around the country, and what I've heard is they're always focusing on the big one-time project, the stadium or the bridge. What makes small businesses, minority and women-owned businesses, grow are those contracts that are smaller in dollar amounts but are consistent year in and year out, the curb and sidewalk, the sewer contracts, the commodities contracts to provide the papers and pen, the computer contract, those things that come every day. The business of the city is the biggest business in the city, and it has a lot of money to spend. And if you're consistently putting goals on every dollar that the city spends, the contractors can grow. If you wait for some big project like a stadium and have that one big shot, they only eat for a day. You have to have some mechanism --
That seems like very sound advice you give, but I think you need one 133 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 final ingredient, and that is the support of the top person who controls everything.
The Mayor is a very powerful force. Unless you have his whole-hearted support, unless he makes it the top priority to say, What I want to see when I'm done is agreement by everybody that jobs have become open to everybody, all discrimination has been removed, the quality of life has thereby been improved because more people are working. And I agree with you. You've got to give them the contractual mechanism to do it, but what I think we're lacking currently is the policy of rewarding those who are doing the wrong thing. And they ought not to be rewarded. They deserve to be punished. And I think that's the direction the City of Philadelphia has to go. But there's nothing wrong with the city that the Mayor can't clear, and we're very hopeful he's going to do it.
Well, you know, in the City of Baltimore, we not only have this law, this is the law, but the mayor himself put out an executive 134 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 order to all his city agencies and it says that you will try to spend at least 35 percent of your dollars with MBEs and WBEs over the course of the year. That's not law. That's saying that your raise may be tied to how well you spend your money and where you spend it.
Maybe get a copy of that executive order. I think that's a great idea for the City of Philadelphia.
Well, that's basically it. I did want to say that thus far, we've had what I considered a tremendous amount of success with the program, both in the public contracts that we let and the private development contracts. And last night I took a look at that and I decided to look at some statistics just to see how we were doing on some of the projects. And I've always -- my pet peeve is that if you're going to give money to a developer to build a high rise or a -- 135 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125
Those are big numbers. And I looked at projects, we have about 62 private development projects that are in the mix now that started in year 2000. And they total about $775 million worth of work. And thus far, MBEs have made $126 million of those dollars and the WBEs have made $16 million off it. Now, at the -- and we intend that it happens. At the end of the day, the MBEs will have made $237 million and the WBEs will make $40 million.
As a by-product of that, and you were talking about how you build the small businesses, do you have the number, for example, of small, first, contractors? You started dealing with businesses other than just the construction areas. Do you have one the prior, how many contractors there were prior to this? Has there been a growth in the number of contractors within the city limits of Baltimore City of minority contractors?
Oh, yes. Yes. Right now in 136 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 my database we have roughly 1300 MBEs and WBEs that are certified. That's up from roughly, when I took over the office, about 900. We have more prime contractors that are moving into the area, simply because Baltimore now happens to be a big building boom town. There's a lot of private construction that's going on and so there's a lot of work there.
Of the prime contractors, are any of those prime contractors owned by African-Americans or Latinos and so on?
Oh, yes. Very much so. One of the efforts that we're trying to do, and we have to do it in the mayor's office of minority development, which is different from mine, we are trying to force ways where the prime contractors or subcontractors move to the next level, so that they become prime contractors.
So they become subcontractors and then you're just bringing them up --
Well, at a point, you know, you start making enough money, then you can handle the whole job yourself.
And that's what's happening with some of the contractors. Understand now, some subcontractors have made a conscious business decision to stay at the subcontractor level, because they can still get rich, they just don't have all of the other expenses of a prime contractor.
The bonding, all that sort of thing. But that's what we're trying to do.
What about in the other areas other than construction? Have you seen a growth of minority businesses growing because of the contracts that they have gotten from the city?
Yes. We have seen growth in all of the other sectors, architects and engineers, the service area in particular. That area has seen a phenomenal growth, because we're getting more people in as primes and as subs in IT, the commodities industry, we're getting people in from that area. There's just been a tremendous growth in this area.
And prior to the legislation, that wasn't happening? 138 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125
No. It wasn't happening, because now you know there's going to be participation on every contract. There's going to be participation in the sense that in the past there was participation, but -- it was good and it was shaky at times.
No. It was actually the Board of Estimates. The thing is that I now employ two investigators to come out to your shop and take a look at you and see whether or not the people you say that are supposed to be working on the project are actually there. So we show up at any time, sometimes announced and sometimes unannounced.
Thank you. Very quickly, I'm assuming you have issues regarding access to capital and bonding for DBEs --
We've taken a look at some 139 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 of the performance bonds and bid bond amounts and we've reduced that so that a project up to $100,000 you don't have to have a performance bond or a bid bond. We've also brought in a company called Devcor that we send companies over to and they will assist the company with bonding, financing, having to tighten up their structure. And this Devcor company has set up their office in what we call the Small Business Resources Center. And at that center, they can get any kind of technical advice. In fact, you can go there at night and run your entire company, because everything is there for you, the computers, the software, the manuals, everything. If you really want to save overhead and you want to get over for a few months, you can actually go there and run your company for a while. But all those resources are there for you to take advantage of. And that's what we do. We have regular forums where we invite businesses in, minority and women-owned businesses, to tell them how they can do business with the city, where resources are and those types of things.
In terms of financial 140 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 resources, though, in terms of when resources are required, what has the government done in terms of public money and what has the government encouraged the banking community to do in terms of access to private capital?
Well, there are several, what you call, small business financing authorities in the State of Maryland and in the city, particularly in the State of Maryland. And small businesses are encouraged to go to these agencies and seek financing. There is also a fund or an agency in the City of Baltimore called the Development Credit Financing Organization.
So there's a specific financing program set up for contractors?
Yes, by the state. And then there's another organization that's not set up by the city or the state, but set up by the banks whereas if in most instances, you know, we can't -- the minority businesses can't get capital and if they've been turned down by two banks, they can go to this agency and get financing and do it that way. And we're looking at some other ways of 141 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 trying to address that problem through the city. But the state has a lot of different avenues, and we send them there, we give them whatever help that we can to try to help them get organized through this Small Business Resource Center to go and make an application to this. There are even some -- I think there's some venture capital funds there. So those things are available. You just have to take advantage of them.
Thank you, Mr. Corey. Could you send us some of your materials as to how the law has operated so I can distribute it to my colleagues and the success ratio that you're getting in terms of that?
Thank you, 142 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 Mr. Chairman. Good afternoon.
Actually, you may have answered a couple of questions I was going to ask you, because, one, I wanted to find out, have you met your goals, and I heard you say your program has been successful, so I'm assuming the answer to that question is yes?
Yes. You said in various departments you set a goal based on a disparity study, and I guess I'm just asking you, have you met or exceeded -- in one case I saw you actually exceeded a goal on a particular project.
On a particular project, yes. But the way that my office tends to look at it is that since we set a goal on each contract, a success is that the goal that's set on that contract is met. And that may not be the maximum goal that can be set by the law, but it does assure that there's participation on every contract, and that's the success. 143 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 If there's a goal on a private development project such as a hotel and there's a 30 and five goal, then there's no waiver from that, because that's an absolute. You can meet 30 and five. And if not, you have to come, as the developer did two days ago, to ask for a waiver on a particular piece of the construction. And that was a unique steel fabrication system. There are only three in the country that can do it. So it was a million dollars worth of project, so I couldn't allow that part to stay in his goal package. I just took it out, and then they can go on and they can meet the goal there.
Let me understand. In various categories it's determined that there should be certain goals associated with those categories of trade.
Right. And the developer comes in, be it a public contract or private contract, you expect them, at a minimum, to submit a bid package that has those goals in place?
Right. Before the bid for a city-owned contract, before it goes -- before it's 144 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 advertised for bid, my office has determined what the goal is going to be on that contract. So that the bidder then has to have in his bid package --
Right. I understand all that. I'm asking the question in sequence so I can get to the answer.
My question is, based on -- and I don't know if you've done an analysis -- on this legislation, have at the end of the day those developers/contractors/companies met the numbers associated with the goals that you all have pre-determined?
Oh, yes. Yes, very much. Let me add one thing. We keep percent of the 20 contract, so that before we release it, you have to provide proof that you have met the goals. And proof is in this form: We ask for your cancelled check, front and back, your invoices, and we get it from both sides, from the subs and from the primes. And then we also go to the Wage and Labor Commission 145 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 to see if the sub who says he was working on this job had men committed to that job and for how long.
And once we are satisfied with all of that, then we'll release the percent 7 of the money. 8
You didn't say that 15 before, that you keep 20 percent. 16
We've been setting 19 goals here for a number of years and people say 20 okay, and sometimes they get close, never get there, but, you know...
We keep a retainage amount, and then on the private development side, if there's anything that hasn't been paid or disbursed by the city, we hold that back until we have confirmation 146 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 that you've achieved the goal that we set on it. You know, I was listening to the lady here earlier. The money is the thing.
If you keep that, you'll get some compliance. Now, they may be kicking and screaming, but you get the compliance.
Have you ever gotten a challenge on a -- I mean, we in a number of instances do require reimbursements contracts, so we don't pay people -- matter of fact, a lot of contractors say we take too long to pay people. Have you ever gotten a challenge from an individual who did not meet the goals in terms of you holding back the percent contract? 17
Not since I've been in 18 office. I don't know how the challenge would come, 19 because you have a contractual -- 20
Because they're liable to come back and get another contract.
Right. You have a contractual obligation. When the Board of Estimates awards the contract, it's contingent upon you meeting those goals. So you really don't have 147 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 anything to come back. The only way that you can come back and say that you couldn't meet the goals is because the city changed the conditions of the contract while you were performing work. Now, that's something the contractor had no control over. And that it then required that he could not use that MBE or WBE as originally envisioned, then of course he can have for a waiver and we will grant that, but other than that, there's no reason to come back.
I'm telling you, the one good thing is that the contractors already know that if they do that, then they may not get that next contract like that that easily.
Right. If you the compliance or enforcement provision in our law and I see some in your law, is that if you have some company that does not meet the goals and did not put up a good-faith effort, then we have the right to take them before the Board of Estimates and ask that they either be suspended, barred or we get the money back or whatever. And usually the threat of that you'll bring them in line, because then they're looking at not having any business from the city. 148 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125
Mr. Corey, if you send us whatever documents you have so that I can send it to my colleagues and --
Oh, I'm sorry. I thought you were. Sorry, sir. Go ahead.
Thank you. In the City of Philadelphia -- and I don't know if it's in the State of Pennsylvania -- when we list -- and that's one of the things that I found out working on the stadium, oversight committee. When we list a minority contractor on a project, if that company has 51 percent or more minority participation, we list them as a minority contractor. What is the qualification to be determined a minority contractor in Baltimore?
That's a good question. Because, here again, we have our certification program, and we do not accept certification from any other jurisdiction, from the state or from any other city. And the requirements or the criteria is that you have to be 51 percent owned and controlled. And 149 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 controlled is a very important issue, because -- you know, people are very smart. You can have the 51 percent ownership, but have no say-so in your company. So we look for the control as well. So you have to have the 51 percent ownership criteria, meet the 51 percent ownership criteria, the control criteria. And then we take a look, for instance, at what I call the pillow companies. The pillow companies are where the husband rolls over on the pillow at night and says, Honey, if you get certified, we can make more money.
I've never heard it referenced that way, but we know about it.
I'm actually looking at a couple of the ladies in the audience. I don't think they like that reference. You may want to change that.
But what happens is that you 150 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 will on paper, for the most part, see the 51 percent and maybe the controller issue, but then you can take a look at, let's say if it's a woman-owned business, allegedly a woman-owned business and controlled business, the resume of the woman owner. And then as a recent application had, this president and CEO of this electrical company that grossed $700,000 a year, her duties were typing, faxing, and I forgot the other, but it wasn't consistent with being president and CEO of a company that grossed nearly a million dollars a year. So that company was not certified. And the other thing is that my investigators will go out and conduct an interview with you whenever it looks as though that there's something askew, and that's whether it's a woman-owned business or a minority-owned business, and we have that situation. The problem and the challenge for any jurisdiction now is that the folks are getting much smarter, more sophisticated, they're hiring very expensive lawyers. They charge fees way above what I used to charge to do these packages, and so they're coming in and on paper they're looking like 151 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 everything that you want to see. And sometimes you have to dig deeper to find that they're a front for a non-minority company. And that's a big challenge.
But assuming that all of those things are in order in terms of control, in terms of ownership, participation, at 51 percent you're then certified as a minority?
Yes. We then will certify them as an MBE or WBE, whichever the case may be.
So the numbers that in terms of your goals that are set reflect?
If you got a 40 percent success rate, in actuality, the majority of the 40 percent could be minority?
Yes. They're minority-owned companies. To the best that we've been able to determine, they're minority-owned companies or women-owned companies.
21 percent could be actual minority-owned out of the 40?
If you got a 40 percent participation on a contract and technically 152 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 based on that formula percent of that contractor could be owned by a minority, but it would be listed as a 40 percent participation because 40 percent of the contract went to that particular company.
Let's see. If we have a 7 contract and all of the subcontractors on there are 8 certified by our office as an MBE or WBE, then the 9 participation on that contract is 100 percent, 10 because we certified them as MBEs and WBEs. And if 11 we find anything differently, then we would go back 12 and disqualify that participation rate, and also it 13 gives us grounds for taking back some of the money 14 from the developer or the prime contractor. 15
I hear what you're 16 saying. I'm giving you this line of questioning 17 because that came to me from some individuals who 18 were interested in some particular contracts as it 19 relates to what the ultimate number came out where 20 the contracts because of the certification of that 21 contractor as a minority contractor, although that person only owned 51 percent of that contract or that company, that joined venture company at the time --
A quick point of order. I have to leave to go to an informal hearing on the PGW senior citizen discount. I assume I will be back. If not, I would like to leave my vote as voting in favor of all three bills and any amendments authored by the sponsors.
This has been a subject matter both privately and in some public hearings with respect to the certification of a contractor when it's a joint venture partnership. They form a company. This company owns 51 percent of that new company. The other one owns 49 percent. It's then certified as a minority contractor.
I follow what you're saying. This is a joint venture that's participating on a contract.
The way that we do that in Baltimore, let's say it's a joint venture and it's a concrete joint venture. If 51 percent, the minority part of that joint venture, performs part of the concrete work, let's say 50 percent of it, then credit is only given for that 50 percent of a joint venture toward that goal. The other 49 percent, there's no credit given. So maybe we are saying the same thing.
Yes, actual work product. Whatever that minority firm contributed to the project is what's counted. Not the entire --
So you then wouldn't certify that that contract was given to a 100 percent minority company?
Well, even one of them that came down and played the game was from Philadelphia. 155 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125
You earlier said that -- there was a question about prevailing wages requirement. You said yes to that, and then a question was asked about is there a union requirement. You said yes to that also.
There's not a union requirement. There are union shops, and I hope I corrected myself. There are union shops, particularly with the electrical union, the steamfitters and plumbers. They are there, but --
It's not required. You can bid on a contract whether you have a union shop or not.
Oh, very much. I just wanted to make sure. You said --
I mean, we don't have a union requirement here. It's just --
-- part of a history. 156 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 I'm sorry?
There is a union requirement. There's an executive order that says in old public Rendell's executive order that's still in effect it says that in all public projects, all city projects, you have to have union labor.
And that's between the sponsor and the union, not a city requirement. There's only a city requirement to have prevailing wage and ultimately it ends up being a union job.
One last question. Right-to-work states. Is Maryland a right-to-work state? Are you familiar with that?
It's an at-will right-to-work state, yes. It's an at-will. That's what it is.
In my understanding, my limited knowledge of this issue, is in right-to-work states, and they tend to be south of the Mason-Dixon line, is that there is a stronger likelihood of entities outside of the traditional union work force to get opportunities. And I know in Atlanta -- because we've now just hired a gentleman from Atlanta who ran the Atlanta Redevelopment Authority and he talked about the fact that he had -- it was a right-to-work state and it enhanced his ability to reach out to various minorities and contractors. So Maryland is, in fact, in a similar situation?
Maryland is an at-will state or right-to-work state. And generally you're right, they're usually found south of the Mason-Dixon line.
Thank you. Mr. Corey, it's been a pleasure having you here. Thank you very much for your testimony. 158 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 Thank you for your assistance in developing the process that we did -- that we have developed. And your office was very helpful, it seems to us. So thank you very much. Say hello to the mayor, and I will call you when I go eat some crabs over there.
Thank you very much. I have Reverend Bruce Edwards, because he has to go, and then Bruce Crawley, Jihad and Anthony Fullard right after Reverend Edwards. Reverend Edwards. You know the drill, Reverend. Identify yourself for the record.
Good to see you again so soon. I just saw you Tuesday when we were here to talk about another matter. And I did submit testimony in writing and so I'll try to get through what I came to say today very briefly.
Thank you for being patient and waiting. And thank you all for being patient and waiting, by the way. This is --
I will state for the record who I am. I am Reverend Bruce M. Edwards and 159 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 I'm the president of the Urban Leadership Council. After reading the bill that is being discussed currently, Bill No. 030125, and after having the opportunity to read the transcripts from previous hearings on this matter, and based on the merits of the question, the member organizations stand with many others, member organizations of the leadership council, stand with many others in full and complete support of this measure. However, just to come here today and say that we stand in support of this bill is simply not good enough. To say that we support the bill 14 demands that we speak forthrightly and honestly as it relates to the various dynamics that have fostered a system that reminds me of the apartied system that existed in South Africa until just a few years ago. In that system, the majority population was being ruled and disenfranchised by the minority, and that's what we have going on here in our own city, in our own neighborhoods, and to a great degree, this system is being aided and supported by many of those who claim to be community leaders. You say that you're the leaders and the 160 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 representatives of the people, but here in 2003, blacks, Latinos, Asians and others and women, who are the majority of the residents in this city as far as population is concerned, are still in a minority role when it comes to job training and employment. Mr. Chairman, this is an outrage. This is a disgrace. This is really unconscionable that we have to sit here today and talk about an issue that we thought would long ago have been solved. We know many of the players that bring us to this table once again, those people who know about the construction projects long before the contracts are let. It takes a lot of years before these major public projects get underway. The SEPTA project in West Philadelphia, that didn't just come over night. That took a lot of years of planning and deliberation. And we said that we had representatives of the people in Harrisburg looking out for the people. Those stadiums, that didn't get built over night. That didn't just pop up. That was many years in the making. Penns Landing over and over again, how many times have we said we're going to 161 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 build that?
Thank you, sir. So that won't pop up over night. What bothers me is that even the Mayor's people, and I'll say it -- you can tell him I said it -- even the Mayor's people came before you and hung their heads in shame because of the dismal record as far as inclusion of the majority of the people who pay the taxes and live in Philadelphia. That's a shame.
So do I, because that is, in fact, the case. We're not in South Africa. And South Africa has moved that problem off the table. And here we are, the cradle of liberty, the birth place of the nation. We ought to be embarrassed. We ought to be ashamed of ourselves. Yes, I know the players well, many who I've read testified here in the transcripts; MBEC, GPUAC, the Work Force Development Corporation, the building trades unions and others. And they've all 162 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 come here and given you all the reasons why the majority of the citizens of this city are still locked out when it comes to city contracts, real training programs and good-paying construction jobs and business opportunities. That's not good enough. Understanding the legal challenges that you talk about when it comes to the initial set-aside goals that were established in the 1980s and in the mid 1990s. It is still a shameful reality that we are right back at the table for the same reason, demanding the same respect, the same rights that people of color were asking for 30 years ago. The question is, how do we continue to find ourselves at this table? Why is it that in 2003 in the midst of a city-wide building boom people of color and women are not on the job in a number that represents their majority status? Few people really want to directly answer that question, but let me say this: As the late Herman Rice used to say, what we have going on here is the Philadelphia shuffle. But the time for dancing around the issue of inclusion as it relates to hiring our people on major construction projects that are funded with the people's money is over. 163 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 There is a legal challenge that may come to this legislation, but I've come here this afternoon to remind you that there is a higher law, that there is one that supersedes the law of men. It comes down from above, and it makes each and every one of us accountable. There is morale law, and what is going on here is simply immoral. That law demands justice in the face of what might be perceived to be the strongest of opposition, the fiercest of foes and the power of any institution. Philadelphia likes to say, and we prided ourselves for many years saying, that we were a good union town. You see the signs all over the place that we're a good union town. Well, we might be being good to the unions, but many of the unions aren't being very good to us. Union wrangling at the Convention Center has caused 14 major conventions to leave the city and millions of dollars in tourism-related business that now will affect the stability of the workers who depend on that industry to provide for their families. You know, not only the Convention Center, but now word is coming out that the same unions are 164 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 now wrangling over at the brand new Kimmel Center, and they are chasing business away from that over a hundred-million-dollar-public investment. The unions must be made to open their doors relative to opportunities for those who seek training in work. And, you know, it's been mentioned, and I'll mention it again, those politicians who depend upon union contributions to fuel their campaigns cannot be found to be hamstrung and compromised for fear of losing union financial support. If they want the continued support of the people in this city, the unions and, yes, the democratic party better get its act together. Our support of this bill demands that you bring the unions into the 21st Century. We're not impressed by some small grants or other niceties. We demand full inclusion as it relates to working in the City of Philadelphia. Let me say another thing: Back room 21 deals and establishing an additional layer of monitors who will monitor the monitors is not satisfactory, is not a satisfactory solution to this seemingly intractable problem.
If the law was used to disrupt the 165 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 city's initial set-aside efforts in the past, then it is incumbent on us to now use the law to seek redress on behalf of those who have been excluded, to expose the corruption wherever it might exist. I suggest to you that when federal mandates are ignored, the people have a right to invoke the rule to show cause. We want to know what is the cause of the systemic racism and disenfranchisement as it relates to public-funded construction and publicly funded activity. I'll conclude. I don't want to preach too hard. But let me say this about some things that are going on: When I think about the things that are on the drawing board, the things that are about to happen in this city, we should be getting our people ready right now to be involved in the building of Penns Landing when that finally comes, the expansion to the Convention Center when it finally comes, the continuing expansion of our airport, the IKEA store, the planned school building initiative announced by Mr. Dallas and all of the other projects that are on the drawing board. Training those in need of work must be a major priority and not an afterthought that can be 166 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 used as an excuse as to why people don't meet union or any other requirements related to getting gainful employment. In the most affected areas of our city, the current administration's NTI initiative is underway. And it frightens me and it saddens me because the people that we say we want to help and the neighborhoods that we say we want to rebuild, the brothers and the sisters are standing on the corner watching other folks bulldoze their damn houses and then the Mayor stands up and says the brothers and the sisters are running the city. It makes absolutely no sense. It is disrespectful to the voter. It is disrespectful to the citizens of this city. There's no dumb people here. We have lived here. We're Philadelphians, and we have watched the game since we've been on the planet. We've heard the campaign promises. And I hope these aren't campaign promises. I hope this isn't campaign posturing to sooth the savage beast that's rising out there.
Because those 167 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 people --
Because as those people begin to come out into the neighborhoods, into our churches and into our community centers and ask us to vote for them again, it ain't going to be so easy. It's not going to be, because you gave us some walking around money, what's that activity grant?
That was $1500 worth of nothing. That ain't good enough. Our people are not working. And there is no excuse for it. You cannot tell me that you just became aware of this situation. Some of the same people who occupied these seats have been occupying seats of power in this city for 30 years. I'm not happy about it. Our churches are complicit in the same mess. You go by churches being built and can't find a black man or woman or a Latino on a church construction site. And then you're going to tell me about a black clergy. You ought to be ashamed of yourself.
I'm glad it's a 168 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 reverend talking.
You ought to be ashamed of yourself. So, no, we can't just point fingers at the politicians and we can't just point fingers at the unions. Look in the mirror. Look around what all of us have found ourselves complicit in establishing in this city. Don't stand up and tell me how you were raised on a damn farm. I wasn't raised on a farm. I was born in North Philadelphia, 21st and Dauphin Street, and I thought it was bad then, but, hell, it looks like hell now. I got some privileges that came my way. My church sent me to Atlanta in 1970 to Moorehouse College, and some of my classmates were Maynard Jackson and others of that ilk, and I worked on Maynard's first campaign. You know the first thing that Maynard Jackson did in Atlanta? And there were some differences. It's not a big union town. But you know the first thing the man did before he took the oath of office was, he started to implement training programs for his people. So that when that Atlanta Hartsfield Airport began to be built, his people were trained and ready and in place. And you tell me here in the 169 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 sophisticated north that we can't do equally as well with all of the black leadership and empowerment. Check yourself, my brothers and sisters, and do better. Let me finally say -- and I'm getting out of here -- the training programs, many of them that are in place, are a joke and a sham. You can't take a welfare mother or a brother that has some other problems with drugs and alcohol and send him through an eight-week training program and expect him to be able to go out and get a job. They don't even know how to get up. Those eight-week training programs are a waste of the people's money. You need to create some real training programs that have a wholistic approach that will take these people and train them for real over a period of time that makes sense. Do you know what happens when you send them to an eight-week training program and then send them to a job? They last 90 days on average and then they employ and let's him go and tells Work Force Development to send me another one so they can keep on getting the tax breaks and the tax credits. It's a hoax. It's a joke. 170 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 Finally, since we're at war, when the black men and women and the Latino men and women and the Asian men and women and the women come home from this war that will end like all wars do, unless they blow up the world, I hope when they get back here after serving their country, I hope they find a city that has changed in the blink of an eye and that they'll have job opportunities, that they won't be treated like the Vietnam vets, they won't be treated like those who were in Desert Storm I, no medical followup, people don't care about them, yet the president gets on the TV and says we've sent our best young over there and we appreciate their sacrifice. Well, damn it, if you appreciate their sacrifice, have a job waiting for them when they get out of there. I've spoken as earnestly and, yes, even as angrily as I have strength to do here today, because I do this work every day. I work with community groups by the hundreds all over town, been ridiculed, lambasted for doing so. I don't get paid for doing it. I do it because it has become my ministry. I started preaching in Philadelphia when 171 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 I was years old. I pastored three churches that weren't in this city and I returned home. And when I got back home, I just couldn't believe what had happened to the city that I love so much. We've got to do better, from the poor pit to the door, from the political powers to those who are the least among us. And it is our obligation, it is all of our obligation, to serve the least among us, not to keep on playing smoke and mirror games, raking in all kinds of money. We have agencies that get plus million dollars a year that say they're the people's agencies. Biggest BS I ever heard.
Look at their payrolls. They got 250 employees. The executive director makes $150,000, and the same executive director sits on the Redevelopment Authority, and you're going to tell me you don't know your people ain't got no jobs? You know, and I conclude, coming up in the '60s I marched in all kinds of riots, all kinds of marches, and I was coming in here today and I saw those young children, those young people standing over there crying out about a war. I was so glad to see that, because we often hear that the modern kids 172 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 don't care, they've had it too easy, they didn't have to struggle. But you know, we live in a modern age where communication is instant, and these young people are on the Internet, these young people read, these young people are plugged in and they're tuned in. And we will reap what we sew if we don't decide and decide now. If it's a legal matter, then take it to the court. If it's a union matter, then get the unions to the table and make them do the right thing. Our people deserve it. Our people demand it. And I appreciate you allowing me to say what I had to say. )
Thank you, Reverend. Thank you for your thoughts. They're well shared. Bruce Crawley, Jihad, Anthony. Thank you all brothers of the struggle. Who is going to go first?
First of all, my name is Ron Armor. I'm a community activist. When I look at this, what's set up here today, it is an insult and a disgrace. There's snickering when anyone is 173 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 making comments. You show your hand. And I'm saying this because you know here, Mr. Ortiz, you know what commitment is. And you have come through that process. You have come through the process. Your behavior and body language is out of order. Let me get into the business of growth and development vital to our community. You can be a representative and say you represent every time we speak. We talk about the inclusion of Hispanics, but at the same time, you have a responsibility and an obligation to make sure as many Hispanic people that you probably can to come from out of your community to be on those lines with us. That's another thing. And let me say this to you, Mr. Ortiz, to you and the democratic party, ya'll saw, all of ya'll -- you was with us. You have certainly indicated that, but the indication is only as good as reality. And the reality is that you yourself must make sure we have to stop seeing, we have to stop seeing -- when I say "we," myself --
Don't agree until I get it all out. Let me conclude my thoughts. 174 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125
You have to make sure that those Hispanics reflect those numbers on those lines with us. It's one what they call the conscience, Mr. Ortiz. I'm here to say to these people that's not here, and ya'll will tell them, I say this: When you look at the people that stood up the other day, people from the community -- I'm from the 37th ward. Councilman can bear witness to what I'm about to say. When he come up there at any time in our community, he see all those men standing on the corners, standing inside the center. He sees that you have a person that is up in that community that is a voice in that community. That voice is not a leader or nothing like that. And what I am saying, it is like self-hatred. It is self-hatred to the representatives of this city, especially if you are black. It is self-hatred if you do not have these representatives -- not making sure that there's jobs. And the jobs reflect the community. When you look at the Hispanic community -- I go through the Hispanic community. I see Hispanic contractors and things taking place. 175 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 But we don't see them in our community. We don't see the work force like the blacks -- like we don't have in my ward, in my community, in my ward. I'm here to go back now as a representative. I'm here to go back to the community and tell the people, just like we come out and we support -- we get out and we support the representatives, and we'll be out here to say to them. And this is what I'm going to say to the people: Wake up. We have to stop making these public servants. We must stop having leaders and -- let me slow down. And in doing so, to raise the conscience. And even with these organizations, we must not let people use black people, using Hispanic people to become the new class people. That's the same thing what's happening in the democratic party. You was there. The reason that the party is that way, you know why it is, Mr. Ortiz. It is because it had become class. Because they need to revisit their community activists and they need to get back in their community. I don't mean to get down and do the labor. And I'm saying this to the democratic party. I'm saying this to the City Council that's here -- 176 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 put your attention over here, Miss. I'm over here. That's insulting when you do that. Listen. Listen. I'm here to say to you, I'm going to be a voice in this city to try to make all people of conscience realize and understand the significance. It is us, the people. We must not make privileged characters. There is something that's in place. Let's say, for instance, if you don't win an election, do you know how you exercise the power of the people? You go there and you filibuster in that office to make sure that the office represents and reflects our community. The days of leadership is gone. Representation. You are not a leader. You're a representative. And I'm going to close out by saying this, I'm going to say this: We have to represent ourselves. We're appreciative -- we're very appreciative of what you have done. We say to Councilman Clarke, let us make sure, Mr. Councilman, that we get some of them applications so I can give it to some of them guys in our community. Mr. Councilman, if you do that, 177 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 in doing so, Mr. Councilman, I believe that you will --
Don't you worry about me drinking water. Listen. Hey, Mr. Councilman, let me say this: If you do that, Mr. Councilman, I believe that you will have a group of people there, Mr. Councilman, young men and women, that will be very appreciative. And I believe when someone is very appreciative, Mr. Councilman, it will reflect of your office. And I'm going to close out with you, Mr. Ortiz. It's not that I'm angry at you, but when I look at you, Mr. Ortiz, and I see you display the behavior you displayed up here, that is insulting to me.
I'll remember that. Well, let me tell you what I'm talking about.
Any time that you're a councilman -- and I have to say this: Any time 178 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 you're a councilperson and you would sit there when a man is speaking with that type of body language, that is unheard of. It's very unprofessional. And I close out with that.
Thank you. Good afternoon. It's always an honor to follow Ron. You talked earlier -- I heard a reference from the minister who talked about the savage beast.
My name is Bruce Crawley and I come to you today as chairman of the African-American Chamber of Commerce and as one of three conveners, together with Zacari Rose and Reginald Bryant of a new organization here in town called Renaissance Philadelphia. And as I was saying, there was reference earlier made by the minister to the savage beast, and you said you hope that the savage beast don't stop. And Ron is one of those, quote/unquote, 179 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 savage beasts. He's one of the people who has been on the forefront of this struggle. A lot of people come into these rooms and do dialogue about the problem, but Ron is a person who is there on the front lines in his community and wherever he is necessary to help drive this issue home. He was there at the Phillies front gate a couple of weeks ago when the injunction was filed against us to stop us from demonstrating and making the issue clear to the city as a whole that rampant segregation in this economy is still ongoing. So it's always an honor to follow Ron. As many of you are well aware, Renaissance Philadelphia will function as a coalition of ordinary citizens, civic, community and business leaders and municipal, state and federal level elected officials who are making written commitments to work together outside of any longstanding party affiliations to improving the quality of life and the economic diversity within the City of Philadelphia. The goal of Renaissance Philadelphia is to maximize the collective power of elected officials and civic leaders to break down finally 180 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 the barriers that have caused the city to underutilize all of its economic and human resources and to produce expanded access to business and employment, trade union membership and economic opportunity for Philadelphia residents. As a result, Renaissance Philadelphia fully expects that the city will become a national model for inclusion, public and private sector diversity management and economic growth. In our opinion, this is a most timely initiative, one that is entirely consistent with Bill 030125 and the related bills that are being considered today, and one that will ensure that even in these most desperate economic times for Philadelphia, for the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania and for the nation as a whole, that we do all that we can to throw off our city's racially based impediments to economic growth once and for all. I am especially proud of the 13 members of the City Council, including President Verna, Councilwomen Blackwell, Tasco, Reynolds-Brown and Miller, Councilmen Ortiz, Nutter, Cohen, Goode, Kenney, Clarke and Rizzo, who have all signed our coalition's declaration of economic inclusion, which 181 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 commits their support to a new more inclusive approach to development, to contractor allocation and to employment at work sites across the city, both publicly and privately funded. And I mentioned the names of the Council people who have signed the declaration of economic inclusion who express their commitment to ensuring that no project comes to this city ever again unless there is a commensurate plan for involvement of people in the community, for including the new majority of this city, but I also would have to mention that there are four Council people who have not signed. One who we would surely understand, and that's Councilman Thacher Longstreth, who, as we all know, is sick, and certainly he has not had an opportunity to sign. But there are three other Council people who have not signed, and for the record, we want to emphasize that there appear to be in this body three people who don't believe that the City of Philadelphia should have an inclusive economy, don't believe that the majority of the people in this city ought to be fully included in all that transpires in this local economy.
And they include Councilman Mariano, Councilwoman Krajewski 182 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 and finally Councilman O'Neill. To date, they have not signed the economic inclusion commitment. Why is this important? Because the Philadelphia economy has suffered a long history of race-based and gender-based exclusion and segregation. While this segregation is most visible recently in the construction industry and in local trade unions, this pattern is also at work in virtually every industry segment and in the sale of virtually all goods and services in the City of Philadelphia. 2 billion in annual receipts that flow through those businesses. While people are uniformly outraged --
The U.S. census, economic census, 1997, the last available data for Philadelphia and its region. While people were uniformly outraged by 183 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 that data, the information about the non-construction sectors of our economy is just as bad. How much of our racial and ethnic imbalance do we have in our local economy? There were 62,894 businesses in Philadelphia County, according to the most recently available census data. Those businesses generated $86.6 billion in sales and accounted for 556,055 employees and a payroll of $17.9 billion. Of the total gross sales, black-owned businesses generated 0.8 percent, less than one percent; Hispanic businesses, 0.3 percent; Asian businesses, 0.8 percent; and businesses owned by white women constituted 2.1 percent of the gross receipts of Philadelphia businesses. Businesses owned by white males, therefore, in the city, whose population is 55 percent comprised of African-Americans, Hispanics and Asians, represented 96 percent of all sales generated. Businesses owned by blacks, Hispanics and Asians collectively generated just 1.9 percent of all receipts by Philadelphia businesses. Remember, they represent 55 percent of the 184 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 population. If we continue in this direction, our economy, of course, is headed for self-implosion. It's no wonder that when we walk or drive through our black, Hispanic and Asian communities we see blighted conditions, run-down houses, poverty and unemployment. Given that this emerging majority of our city's population has been virtually excluded from full economic participation, no one in this room should be surprised by those conditions. A great African-American man once said, They cut off our legs and then they criticize us for not being able to walk. That is pretty much a description of where we are in the Philadelphia economy. They go to our neighborhoods and say they're run down and they're blighted and we're unemployed, we don't have jobs, and then they systematically exclude us from an opportunity to earn the money that will restore and build our neighborhoods and send our kids to good schools. These bills being considered today, in our opinion, are critically important because they represent the codification finally of a new awareness that including people of color as 185 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 participants in our economy is too important, far too important, to be relegated to discussions of affirmative action, set-asides and single digit participation. We are dealing now with an opportunity to change the mindset of an entire city, to be more inclusive, to create business and implement opportunities where precious few have previously been created, and to situate Philadelphia to include all of its neighborhoods finally in its economic game plan. Goals need to be established. Finally, there should be comprehensive monitoring of whether those goals are achieved, and the bills should convey the full authority of the city to terminate any contract or revoke any support provided to those who don't meet those goals. A bill without teeth, in our opinion, is absolutely useless. The result of all this will be more stable families, less blighted communities and a stronger Philadelphia economy overall. The African-American Chamber of Commerce, the Contractors Roundtable, Renaissance Philadelphia support these bills and the economic 186 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 rebirth that they represent. The time is now. Any other approach at this late date is simply unacceptable. Thank you very much.
We are going to wait for Jihad and Mr. Fullard to speak and then we'll ask questions of the panel.
Good afternoon. My name is Jihad Ali. I'm with the African-American Contractors Roundtable and proud member of the African-American Chamber of Commerce. I'm also a member of a union carpentry company. Listening to some of the testimony earlier in regards to the earlier bill, 20816, on the task force, it's my personal opinion that we really don't need another task force. Because if we remember, if we go back in time when we first had the problems with the Caverna, we had the Caverna shipyard and every major job we talked about task forces. Then we fell for the idea they could get a task force implemented on the Eagles and the Phillies. When originally that task force was formed for the Eagles, there was no black 187 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 representative from the union. So we made a strong stand and we asked for them to include the representatives from the laborers union, Sam Staton. So that was done. But then having fast forwarded in time, we find out how the county was done, had the task force, how we just went through -- we had the brother come up here from Baltimore and he clearly had a way to count. And one of the things that our chairman had always had an objection to was how they were counting those minority dollars. You can't just give the task force -- they weren't completely innocent in that. They had a big hand in trying to dupe City Council, in our opinion, because that's really what happened. Nobody -- since my last years' involvement in 18 this struggle, I've always seen Council to have a 19 desire to make sure that the people that elected 20 them in the positions, their people was included in the construction contracts. And it was only because they bought in agencies like GPUAC and then through some of the representations of MBEC we thought that things were going to be worked out, but it really wasn't. So looking over that now, we see that those 188 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 task forces really were used against us. And then I'd like this committee to keep in mind, when the actual Crossen decision was decided and the local decision was decided here in Philadelphia, one of the main persons on that lawsuit for the GBCA, the General Building Contractors Association, was a person that sat on MBEC's committee. So sometimes just by being all inclusive, you're also opening the doors for things that harm you later. In regards to Bill No. 20827, it appears that the bill is talking about Section 3, but the language needs to be reworked, because in Chapter 15 17-900, Paragraph 1, they use the word to submit an affirmative action plan, but this same paragraph is almost a duplicate of the Section 3 paragraph, and that wording shouldn't be affirmative action plan, it should be business utilization plan. So I think the language in that should be watched out. In regards to Bill 3125, I think it's clearly evident from after having the testimony of the Baltimore representative, after having looked at the disparity study, after being very familiar with the case that was bought here in the City of 189 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 Philadelphia, this is the only way to do it, is to take the bill 30125 and enact that bill, because we spent a million dollars for that disparity study, and one of the reasons that we lost that case was because the disparity study that the city eventually produced in court couldn't stand up to the merits of the case. So we find that after going through all of that, that there is no other alternative but to repeal 17-500 and make a new ordinance. We spent a million dollars for that study. We know that by having the disparity study in place, by repealing this ordinance, that that's the only way to go. One of the things that Councilman Goode talked about was having the department under the Law Department, but one significant point was, the fellow that testified from Baltimore, he was a lawyer. So maybe we should look at that. Maybe we should look at just empowering a lawyer to head MBEC.
Because MBEC -- if this ordinance is passed, then it will be a successful operation. And instead of putting that under the Law Department, perhaps we should put a lawyer to be the director of that. But this is the only way to go, because 190 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 as long as we don't have the ordinance in place, like the gentleman said, it's a part of the contract, and one thing all contractors understand are contracts. And I want to applaud all of the Council people here on your questioning. Because some people are going to be embarrassed when they come up here, because the obligation is to expose the truth. So if they're going to be -- like in this time of war, there's going to be casualties. And if they're going to be here to perpetuate a false on our people, then they are going to be the casualties that are going to be sacrificed. Their good name, their representation has to be sacrificed. And it's up to the Council to pull the trigger on them. So I applaud you on your questioning. I applaud you for getting down to the truth. Because if you would have knew what you know now years ago, you wouldn't have voted for none of that stuff that you passed. So I applaud you for all of the things that you're doing.
Thank you. My name is 191 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 Jamal Johnson. I'm a member of the Contractors Roundtable, and I'm here to express my sentiments. One of the things that I find that we need to address is an economic timetable for this hearing and this activity and this mode of thought that we're in in terms of inclusion. I think we need an economic timetable that needs to take effect immediately, because we've been talking about and we've known about this exclusion for many years, and we talked about it. We finally got to the point now where we're trying to draw up some legislation, but we don't know how long that will take. Because presently I feel as though I've been robbed of an economic opportunity, particularly when it comes to Public Works jobs. I can't get none of them. I'm excluded through all kinds of hurdles and obstacles. And I'm qualified and I'm competent to do the work in the construction industry, but I find that there's a lot of situations and regulations that you got to adhere to that I haven't been able to overcome. And I'm not a lone person in these hurdles in the construction industry. Some of them are racial, some of them are legitimate. But the 192 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 mere fact that some of them are racial, that's the fight that we're having. And as a result of these obstacles, we're being robbed an economic opportunity. And I think because of this lapse, I think we need to incorporate something effective immediately, because we don't know -- do we have a timetable, Councilman Ortiz? Do we have a timetable when we're going to start seeing some results as the result of these hearings and legislation? Has a timetable been established?
Well, let me say in terms of timetable, I think there's -- I think the bills will get passed and approved, but I think the process that has been begun by Renaissance, by the Contractors Roundtable, what Jihad Ali and all of you are doing is putting forward the issue on the front burner of this city. I think right now this issue is -- or this movement that has been begun, because I think what you got now finally is spreading across every area in terms of the majority community of this city, and that means us. I'm talking about, when I talk majority, I'm talking about us. I think that movement is spreading. And 193 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 I don't think -- I do not believe that the leadership of this city is going to remain passive and allow the practices that have been happening to continue on happening. So we will pass this. We will monitor what happens, but what I think has happened with what Bruce and Jihad Ali and the contractors have come together and more or less the majority of majority legislators in the city, I think this is putting it on the table. And, like I said, we will bring the building trades to Council. We will invite the contractors and the developers to Council. And we will continue. Now, this is a struggle that has been joined, and thanks to you guys, thanks to you guys. And what we would like to put on the record, Mr. Small, is your history of getting blocked, of discrimination, of not getting the contracts, although you're competent, you're capable. We want that on the record today so that that goes -- because when this law or any of these laws get challenged in court, and you know they're going to get challenged in court, we want to establish that there has been testimony of exclusionary practices 194 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 done, a pattern of exclusionary practices done in the City of Philadelphia.
I would appreciate it, Mr. Ortiz, if we could expeditiously get something in place immediately while we're going through the legislative process of putting these bills together, because we need something to take effect immediately. And one of the problems that I found, particularly with MBEC, is that you might have one contractor who is a pretty reputable contractor, you see him satisfying a lot of the Public Works jobs in terms of being a minority. Now, if this happens for five or six and seven to ten years, you got the same contractor who is satisfying all the minority goals, the minority participation goals, I think that we should be a graduating process. I mean, if he's for a number of years, a substantial number of years, the major contractor that's satisfying a large percentage of the jobs, I think that he should have graduated or get to the point where he should have became a prime. If you see one name on all -- a substantial amount of all the Public Works projects time after time after 195 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 time, he really takes away from the small contractor that's coming up that the MBEC program is really designed to help. It's designed to help a small contractor come up, I guess you could say graduate, and then he should be able to stand on his own. But if the one same contractor keeps utilizing MBEC and he becomes the preferred minority contractor on all the jobs in that particular division of construction, then it really hurts the guy that's coming up that wants to participate ad utilize the program.
Well, if you heard Mr. Corey, you saw that in Baltimore they have been able to do that. They have been able to take in this all contractors and they have grown and they have become prime and they have been able -- and other small contractors have decided to stay because they don't like to deal with the overhead. So we're trying to -- that's exactly what we're trying to do and set it up. But the only thing is, we can put the framework together. You guys are the guys that got to make everybody else do it and implement it.
Well, I appreciate that. 196 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 But in closing, I just think that if we could somehow expeditiously get this declaration of economic inclusion to take effect immediately, I mean, even if it's just -- we could put forth a propaganda to do this now --
We're trying to. You got Bruce there, and you know he's going to be able to make that declaration of economic inclusion, it's going to be everywhere.
And in closing, I think that like a lot of the Public Works jobs, like, for instance, Freedom Theatre, Phase I, I worked on that job also. And the reason that job was so successful is because the owners had stipulated that they wanted to see a large percentage of African-Americans on that job. And I had a couple problems with some of the unions. They came in, particularly the electrical union. They came in and caused some problems with me, but I overworked them, but, you know, they -- still there was no need for them to bother me. I was just a small-time contractor trying to come up. But, you know, we need to push -- the owners have some responsibility also in putting 197 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 forth and promoting the use of small African-American, Hispanic contractors.
But, you know, when you stand up, Councilman, you pay a price. And contractors like Jamal, myself and all the other small disadvantaged contractors, eventually when you stand up, they go around you, and that's really -- what we came here to do is to tell you about some of the cases that we had.
Well, there's a project that was funded by the city called Dockside, which was under the Redevelopment Authority's control that's located on Delaware Avenue. The city put in maybe $20 million worth of funding on it. On that project, I had bidded that project to a company by the name of Dale 198 3/21/03 - Commerce - BILL 030125 Construction, who is one of the bigger contractors here in the city.