saying when you say you can get it well i can ask you a question to uh one of my colleagues
let's move on and i want to finish up with your testimonies i think we'll we'll leave that off
for the moment um uh if if uh mr smith um signs up uh or or takes if mr smith takes the piece of
paper um he can go back to his family at the restaurant uh portion of chickies and pizza is
that correct i think you're referring to the bet slip after the transaction he's placed on an event
yes he can okay and after after he downloads the app and signs on he can also um of course
bet from the table um with his family on the in play betting is that correct yeah he could bet
with he could bet around anyone there's no no laws preventing that from happening with any
or anybody i'm not suggesting it's breaking any laws thank you um so he can bounce and he can
also bounce back and forth into the sports book as much as he wants throughout the game is that
correct uh you mean physically at chickies and pete's walk through yes security and walk up to
the counter is that yes well you can go to the counter or he could go to the kiosk if he chooses
yes thank you um but will will parks at this sports book offer or have on hand um
uh like an ipad or a tablet if mr smith wanted one of those or wanted to borrow one of those
no we're not offering that okay so he can off so he can bet with cash he can bet on the kiosk he
can bet on his own smartphone there are no other devices that he's that he could bet on well i
guess he could bring his own ipad in if he wanted to and connect to the wi-fi or or to uh you know
if he has uh if he has cellular data on it okay well is there a chickies and peats if they want
to allow that which i would assume they would there's nothing nothing wrong with that does
parks have its own um proprietary wi-fi inside will parks have its own proprietary wi-fi
inside of chickies and peats not available to the public i'm not i'm not sure what you mean
well we we have to all of the all of those systems um are connected to the internet
kiosks our otc terminals uh just just like everything these days is connected to the
internet sir will parks have a wi-fi that um goes through the building of chickies and peeps
we will have internet connectivity not available to the general public when you say general public
It'll be a closed system so that we can power all of our equipment within the sports book.
Okay, but Joe Smith, who has just signed up for an account, and he's just signed up, he's just downloaded the app on his smartphone, can he access that Parks Wi-Fi?
Okay, so it's for Parks employees only, basically.
Well, no, it's for Parks equipment. It's so that we can run the sports book.
Excuse me, this is Sharon Seletik.
And Mr. Bonny, I'm sorry to interrupt,
but this seems very far removed
This seems very far removed from the kinds of broader general impacts that would be considered in a special exception case.
from the kinds of broader general...
I mean, if you are arguing that the people who choose to use this facility, who choose to go there and to gamble, that it presents a danger to them, is that really something that can be considered in a special exception case?
isn't the decision to allow that rather preempted by state law that has made gambling legal um
no can we focus on what how this will affect the broader community yes and that is true but i don't
think that um once you're i think the nature of an addiction is that once you become addicted
you don't have the choice that's the problem excuse me but wouldn't that be the same argument
that could be made that bars shouldn't be permitted or establishments that offer alcohol shouldn't be
permitted because of the potential for people to become addicted to alcohol. Fast food restaurants
shouldn't be permitted because of the health hazards associated with eating fast food.
Well, it's, it just seems as though you're focusing on something much narrower than that,
which should be considered in a special exception case.
But, Ms. Zoletta, you're making my point. An alcoholic bar, a bar that serves alcohol, is allowed by Wright at this location, or he has a variance for it.
And a takeout restaurant for fast food is allowed by Wright wherever it exists, or they've gotten through the variance or this special exception process.
So that's the question. You can't start it by answering the question. You have to first ask the question, is this facility harmful to the neighborhood? That is what the legislature and the city council is asking you to do. It is not just asking you to check off the seven boxes. Is it going to cause traffic? Is it going to cause a fire hazard? It is also asking you, this zoning board, to make sure that this facility doesn't cause harm to the neighborhood.
No, that is not the standard for a special exception. The standard is, will this cause harm beyond what could normally be expected from an assembly and entertainment use?
I agree. And that's what I'm here today to talk about. And so I'm going to be talking about that, you know, in my argument. And I agree with you. I agree with you. And that's what we're establishing.
so um let me just look over my notes i don't think i have anything more for mr cullen at this time
oh you mentioned marketing um i assume you have a healthy marketing um uh unit or department at
parks casino we have a marketing department i i would i would argue that our marketing budget is
much much smaller than that of our competitors in the market today okay but you you market and
advertise on radio and print what does this have to do with the application i i i apologize for
allowing this to continue i keep trying to to get to the point where where the harm is being
done to the community i your your objection system well will will parks market this facility
objection really
will parks market this
we'll allow him to answer that question i would imagine we would market it in a manner that we
market our south philadelphia location today okay i have no further questions for this witness
mr marionne you have any questions for your witness no further questions from the thank you
thank you um i'd like to uh call mr shiraki to the stand please and thank you mr cullen have a
good day thank you
mr shiraki if you can raise your hand
and matt cullen please mute yourself
and mr peter is ready yeah mr chiroki please identify yourself with the record
spell your last name i'll swear you win my name's peter chiroki
i apologize i interrupted you please spell your last name c-i-a-r-r-o-c-c-h-i
You swear or firm to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
I do, Mr. Chairman.
I do, Mr. Chairman.
Thank you.
Mr. Bonney?
Okay, sir.
Hello, Vice Chairman, and hello, Mr. Marcioni and Mr. Bonney.
Good morning to you.
Good morning to you, too, sir.
Do us a favor and pronounce your last name one more time.
It's Cherokee, but a lot of people say Cherokee because of the TV personality.
His name was Cherokee, same spelling.
It's different ways that the family says it.
Right, but that did jump out at me, so I'll try and do it correctly. As someone who has an unusual last name, I hear Mr.
Okay, well, he's the same guy, so let's move on.
Mr. Shiraki, you submitted a petition of many letters to this board, or your team submitted many letters to this board of people who are supportive of this endeavor. Are you familiar with that?
I'm not familiar with the exact letters. I didn't read them all, but I am familiar that they did submit them.
okay how did you go about getting those letters
staff members ask neighbors we have a lot of staff i think i said in my last testimony
how many people worked from that zip code in the area and uh that's some of the ways we did it
okay so is it is i'm sorry go ahead okay that's fine okay so is it fair to say that
that a number of the people
that sign those letters
are employees of your organization?
No, not necessarily.
They're neighbors of the employees also.
But they're all,
and they're also employees.
I don't know.
Let me ask the question.
I think this is what he's asking you, Pete.
Any of those petitions
that were circulated,
were they circulated by employees of yours?
Thank you.
are any of the people who signed um is it fair to say that some of the people who signed it
are relatives of yours yes yes yes i have a lot of relatives that live in that neighborhood
um this support letter from uh kathy masciatro at 3511 prima court she's your first cousin is
that correct? That is correct. Can we stipulate, Mr. Bonney, we'll stipulate that some of the
signatures are either employees or relatives of Mr. Turok. I have no further questions. Thank you.
I have no questions, Mr. Chairman. Thank you. Next witness. Okay. Well, thank you. And I'd like to
call my first witness. It's going to be at some length, but this is the most lengthy witness we
have. So they're not all going to be like this. But my first witness is Mr. Les Bernal, B-E-R-N-A-L.
If he can be found and promoted to the panel, I would appreciate it.
He would just have to raise his hand and he's available chair.
Good morning, sir.
Please identify yourself.
Spell your first and last name and I'll swear you in.
Good morning.
My name is Les Bernal, B-E-R-N-A-L.
The first name is L-E-S, correct?
Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Thank you.
Please proceed, Mr. Barney.
Okay, thank you.
Mr. Bernal, good morning.
Thank you for being here.
If you can describe your, you know, tell the board your, what is your job?
I am the national director of Stop Predatory Gambling, which is a national 501c3 nonprofit based in Washington, D.C.
And I'm going to share my screen, if that's okay.
Let's see here.
Share.
Can people see our exhibit package on the screen?
i'm going to assume that's a yes yeah okay and i'm going to show you exhibit a which is
the curriculum vitae of mr burnell i'm just going to walk the board through it quickly
you graduated college in 91 you have a master's of public administration 2000
you've been the executive director of stop predatory gambling since 2008
late. You were chief of staff for a Massachusetts state senator. You worked on campaign.
You are chief of staff for a Massachusetts state senator.
You worked on campaigns before that.
You chaired the city planning board in a town in Massachusetts for a number of years in the late 90s and early 2000s.
You've testified before the U.S. Congress.
Is it fair to say, Mr. Burnell, that you've also testified in front of state legislatures and city councils in this country?
If you've been quoted and cited more than 600 times in newspapers and magazines of the
highest order in this country, is that correct?
And same thing, you've appeared on national TV and radio of the highest order of news
outlets in this country.
Is that correct?
You were honored by a newspaper.
You also have some civic and educational positions, including many years as a high school, as a
basketball coach, is that correct? Yes. Thank you very much. I want to go over some work that
you've done to prepare for this testimony. You've looked at the park's presentation materials?
Yes, I have. You've talked to the president of the neighborhood group? Yes, I have. You've
looked at Packer Park neighborhood on Google Maps and Google Street View? Yes, I have. Is it fair
to say that you've been to philadelphia a fair number of times yeah i've been to philadelphia
many times in my life and i have family who lives in the area although i haven't been to this
specific part of south philadelphia before okay same with chickies and pete's you've never been
to this location before is that correct that's correct but i've looked i've looked at chickies
and pete's online i've visited their website and i've watched the esbn story about the sports
restaurant. And obviously, it's an impressive place and they have an impressive business.
Thank you. Let's dive into your testimony, Mr. Burnell.
Talk to us at a very high level, just a few words about a gambling addiction or problem
gambling. Also, if you could sort of define your terms, what do you mean when you use,
you know, either of those terms? Excuse me, this is Sharon.
Before your answer. Yep, Sharon, go ahead.
I'm sorry. Mr. Bonney, you're obviously offering him as a witness.
Could you narrow what his specific area of expertise is?
And also, maybe if you could question him with regard to whether he has ever any of his testimony had to do with land use matters or zoning specifically.
well uh he's going to talk about the link between sports gambling and gambling addiction
and the threat and the harm that this uh facility will pose to the neighborhood that's what he's
here to talk about and now there's some background information because he's gotta
you know talk about what is gambling addiction and um and what is in play betting and and we
have some we have some studies to beyond mr i'm sorry yeah i have shower and finish
mr bonnie would it work to simply stipulate that this and all gambling facilities
uh carry the risk of gambling addiction for some people um if we agree to that can you get on to
the is it really necessary to have this testimony i think it is i think it is because i think the
nature of this type of sports gambling is um more dangerous than other forms of gambling and we'd
like to get that into the record this as far as nothing not about the specific location but simply
this specific offering this specific type of gambling is that what you're saying yes which
is available but but even if this facility never got approved but but i would say i would say miss
Soletta, you know, that this facility is proposed for this particular location is part of our argument about why it's so dangerous.
Is there an argument that this is preempted by the state, which obviously considered all of these factors at the point that they made this type of gambling legal?
No, because they don't have, because, well, for a number of reasons. But first of all, the parks does not have approval yet from the state to be at this location. They will be, you know, they will probably, if they will probably be seeking that at some point, but they don't have it at this, at this point.
So, you know, it's a factual matter.
So, you know, it's a factual matter. The state has not approved this location.
The state has approved the sports book, though. The state has approved the sports book, and the city council, by making this a special exception, has conditionally approved it as well.
So, at this location, and part of what we have to do is go through an application process, but sports gambling and sports books and race books are legal in the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania.
I agree. The question is, does it meet the standards for a special exception at this location? I'm not trying to, we're not trying to prohibit sports gambling in the Commonwealth. We're not even trying to prohibit sports gambling in Philadelphia.
we're trying to hit and we're not trying to prohibit people from doing it on their phone
mr chairman um at their homes um or while they're sitting in the library or whatever